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Speaker 1: Uh, it's behind the bastards the podcasts where I talk

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Speaker 1: about my sleeping habits and Miles talks about his baby.

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Speaker 1: How you doing, Miles, I.

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Speaker 2: Just started recording. But yeah, I'm great. I'm great. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'm good man, I'm good. Thanks for having me. It's

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Speaker 2: been too long. It's been too long. I was wondering,

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Speaker 2: been too long because I would be selfish. Baby. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I know. Well, now that that guy's out of my

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Speaker 2: way and out of the you know, got that obstacle

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Speaker 2: out of uh or my career obstacle out of the way,

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Speaker 2: I'm back. Baby.

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Speaker 1: He hit six months and you're just like locked in

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Speaker 1: now it's like done.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you're old. No find a life exactly. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Just you know, like sit in this cardboard box, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: some of my old Ninja Turtle toys and like an

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Speaker 2: air pod playing or whatever you know, call it home

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Speaker 2: pod playing and you're good. Yeah, Miles. How do you

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Speaker 2: feel about airplanes?

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Speaker 1: However?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I like, as a kid, I like going

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Speaker 2: on airplanes. But you know, you all, you never know

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Speaker 2: when you're on those things, you never know. That's my

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Speaker 2: feeling on them.

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Speaker 1: Like sometimes you get tricked and realize you're on a

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Speaker 1: plane only belatedly you're like, Wow, what an odd, very

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Speaker 1: long house with strange windows, And I'm.

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Speaker 2: Always just thinking they're gonna crash.

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Speaker 1: Oh really, Yeah, I don't think that happens always planes anymore.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, not not as much. But I think I've seen

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Speaker 2: too many like eighties movies that had like plane crashes

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Speaker 2: in them, that like all get on and then like

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Speaker 2: when I look at the other passengers on, like like

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Speaker 2: music starts playing in my head and I'm like, these

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Speaker 2: are the people that lost their lives on this flight. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you know, I think the thing that.

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Speaker 1: I that I find unsettling is less like because planes

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Speaker 1: are pretty statistically safe except for every now and then

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Speaker 1: like that maybe that Malaysian pilot or those guys in France.

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Speaker 1: You get like a pilot who just decides to end

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Speaker 1: it all and take every one with them, And I

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Speaker 1: find that slightly unsettling. You gotta trust them, you gotta

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Speaker 1: trust them, you gotta trust them. And pilots are the

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Speaker 1: kind of people who become pilots. You know, if you've

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Speaker 1: ever known a pilot, oh boy, that's not a trustworthy

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Speaker 1: breed right there.

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Speaker 2: This is an anti pipe.

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Speaker 1: No.

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Speaker 2: I feel nothing for pilots one way or the other.

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Speaker 2: So I feel nothing the.

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Speaker 3: One person I don't know if it's a pilot, Yes,

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Speaker 3: that does I was like, I was like, yeah, okay,

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Speaker 3: maybe maybe it is a.

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Speaker 2: Thing that I think about it. Yeah, I know somebody

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Speaker 2: who has a pilot's license. Uh, and they're kind of

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Speaker 2: like a more like a pirate than a pilot. Okay, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I get the vibe.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, miles flying outside of the occasional,

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Speaker 1: largely irrational fear of death has become both safe and

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Speaker 1: also deeply unpleasant. Like it sucks, Like I think for

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Speaker 1: most people, if you have to get on a plane

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Speaker 1: to go somewhere, the getting the plane part is pretty

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Speaker 1: thoroughly an unpleasant process, right, Oh yeah, and it sucks,

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Speaker 1: like comprehensively, Like it's not just that, like being on

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Speaker 1: a plane sucks because you're crammed in with all these

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Speaker 1: people and like, yeah, it's just this physically.

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Speaker 2: Also, I fucking hate though. Now how basically they want

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Speaker 2: to make seats as uncomfortable as fucking possible. So you're like, well,

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Speaker 2: we have economy plus economy plus plus yeah, economy plus

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Speaker 2: cubed business first Diamond, And you're like what the fuck

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Speaker 2: can I just have like like just slightly more room

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Speaker 2: because I'm over six feet tall, Like, just please.

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Speaker 3: They also have the thing now where like they have

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Speaker 3: the Okay, you can pay less, but you don't.

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Speaker 4: Get to pick your seat. Yeah that that that used

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Speaker 4: to like used to suggest.

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Speaker 2: To be the way the planes worked. Yeah, everything to

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Speaker 2: fucking add on. Now.

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Speaker 1: It's good that we're talking about this because today we're

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Speaker 1: talking about the guy who made it that way, right,

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Speaker 1: We're talking about the dude who made all that be

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Speaker 1: a factor in flying, who like turned it from a

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Speaker 1: process where you just bought a ticket to go to

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Speaker 1: a place and you were treated like a human being

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Speaker 1: to this this bizarre, weird capitalist nightmare where you've got

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Speaker 1: like eleven different options and all of them suck way

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Speaker 1: more than being on a fucking train. That's who we're

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Speaker 1: talking about. His name is Frank Lorenzo, and he made

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Speaker 1: planes suck. Yeah's it was a fun little monster today

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Speaker 1: getting some capitalism bad guy here.

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Speaker 2: So I like this, Okay, so good. I don't have

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Speaker 2: to deal with too much. I can just deal with

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Speaker 2: my own frustrations that are based off of being on

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Speaker 2: a plane rather than something deeply horrifically fucked up like

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Speaker 2: every other time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean he's it's fucked up in that he's

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Speaker 1: like your normal sort, he's like your uber capitalist kind

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Speaker 1: of asshole. But it's also this thing where like the

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Speaker 1: whole airline industry, like all of the pilots and ground

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Speaker 1: crews and stewardesses and stuff who have been working in

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Speaker 1: it for a while like blame this guy for reathing

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Speaker 1: that sucks with air travel, and some of the things

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Speaker 1: they blame him for are like things that they kind

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Speaker 1: of did, Like it's not you know, it's not all

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Speaker 1: on him, right, right, but uh yeah, it's it's an

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Speaker 1: interesting story and it's it's it's pretty bastardy. So that's

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Speaker 1: what we're gonna talk about this week. We're gonna about

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Speaker 1: Frank fucking Lorenzo.

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Speaker 2: Hm uh huh. So.

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Speaker 1: Francisco Anthony Lorenzo was born on May twenty ninth, nineteen forty,

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Speaker 1: in New York City the Wendy Apple but he was

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Speaker 1: the third of three sons, and his parents were named

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Speaker 1: Oligario and Anna Lorenzo. Everything's fine with his name except

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Speaker 1: for the Anthony as a middle name. I don't trust

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Speaker 1: people with an Anthony, right, name. Anthony's a first name,

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Speaker 1: could be a last name. It's never it shouldn't be

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Speaker 1: a middle name.

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Speaker 2: Wait, why do you still feel so fucking strongly about

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Speaker 2: what a middle name? I don't think it's right as

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Speaker 2: a middle name.

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Speaker 4: Why are you being so conspiratorial today?

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Speaker 2: What do you mean? I don't know, it's an interesting

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Speaker 2: I'm just we're gaining perspective and Robert's mind, like, because

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Speaker 2: I think I feel like seventy percent of like Catholic

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Speaker 2: men's middle name is Anthony. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Well, I don't trust the papists, you know.

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Speaker 2: Like, yeah, that makes sense. They're loyalty for Kyles. Yeah exactly. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: what is a good middle name? Like tittlely bop? Anyway,

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Speaker 2: so forgot all the middle names.

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Speaker 1: So his dan ran a beauty salon and his mom

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Speaker 1: worked at the beauty salon, and they were like pretty comfortable,

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Speaker 1: Like they're not rich, but they're pretty solidly middle class.

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Speaker 1: They're doing well enough that his dad is able to

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Speaker 1: play the stock market as a hobby. He's again he's

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Speaker 1: not like, you know, fucking printing paper, but he's got

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Speaker 1: a portfolio that's worth like one hundred and twenty grand

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Speaker 1: by the time he dies. Which you know, you're talking

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Speaker 1: like the seventies, the eighties. That's not bad, that's not

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Speaker 1: like he's doing pretty good.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So one of the things that Oligario teaches his son

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Speaker 1: about is the concept of risk. And when we say

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Speaker 1: risk in this context, we mean gambling, right, Like when

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Speaker 1: money people talk about risk, they're talking about like whether

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Speaker 1: or not you have a good shot of like, you know,

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Speaker 1: winning when you throw your your your dice at that

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Speaker 1: roulette wheel or whatever. Frank was pretty good at this

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Speaker 1: from the beginning. He showed an aptitude for numbers, and

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Speaker 1: he was really fascinated specifically with how he could fuck

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Speaker 1: around with numbers in order to make money. When he

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Speaker 1: was in junior high school, he ran the school betting

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Speaker 1: pool on the World Series, which was illegal at the time.

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Speaker 2: But what are you a cop? Come on? So wow,

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Speaker 2: So he was running just taking bets on the fucking

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Speaker 2: world Yeah, takes bets on the World Series. Whimsical times. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: good stuff.

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Speaker 1: The single most enduring memory Frank had of his childhood

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Speaker 1: was of the family apartment, which sat right under the

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Speaker 1: approach for LaGuardia Airport. As a little kid, he'd spend

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Speaker 1: hours watching the different planes from various airlines land. Now

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Speaker 1: this is a period in which flying is pretty new, right,

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Speaker 1: Like if you're watching planes fly overhead, and like the

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Speaker 1: fifties and sixties, we've been doing that, you know, about

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Speaker 1: as long as today Paul Rudd has been alive, right, Like,

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Speaker 1: that's what you gotta think if you're watching like planes

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Speaker 1: in the sixties, like planes as a concept or about

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Speaker 1: as old as Paul Rudd is to us.

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Speaker 2: Wait, and what do we when we say Paul Rudd,

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Speaker 2: what are we dating that from his birth or his

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Speaker 2: entrance into our sort of pop culture consciousness?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I would I would say from his birth. But like,

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Speaker 1: either way, I don't remember a time without Paul Rudd,

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Speaker 1: do you.

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Speaker 2: I mean, for me, I think Clueless is the the

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Speaker 2: punctuation point that is, like, that is the point where

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Speaker 2: he that's the big bang, I would say.

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Speaker 1: For yeah, that's the big bang for Paul Rudd, or

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Speaker 1: at least for me. Yeah, yeah, the Permian explosion.

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Speaker 2: Exactly. He's still redational waves of that movie from when

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Speaker 2: Paul Rud came on the scene.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so he's watching the planes fly overhead. He doesn't

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Speaker 1: know yet about the movie Clueless because it's the sixties

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Speaker 1: but one day he presumably will watch it. So by

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Speaker 1: the time Frank is making memories, Man had only been

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Speaker 1: taking commercial international trips for about twenty five years. There

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Speaker 1: was still a magic to air travel then, and it

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Speaker 1: was only slightly dimmed by all of the people who'd

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Speaker 1: gotten incinerated from the sky during World War Two. Airlines

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Speaker 1: in those days were run by the same kinds of

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Speaker 1: guys who'd helped invent air travel as like a thing.

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Speaker 1: So these dudes like airlines CEOs today are just like

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Speaker 1: any kind of ceo, right But back in the day,

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Speaker 1: airline CEOs were all former pilots who'd like been test pilots,

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Speaker 1: they'd like flown in wars, and they were often crazy people,

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Speaker 1: right like, that was just the kind of person who

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Speaker 1: could get these jobs. A representative example of the pack

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Speaker 1: was Robert Foreman six, the CEO of Continental Airlines, which

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Speaker 1: was the most prestigious air line in the country during

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Speaker 1: Frank's childhood. Six became the CEO of that company in

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Speaker 1: nineteen thirty six and held the job until nineteen eighty,

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Speaker 1: by which point he was like senile in the company

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Speaker 1: was failing because he didn't know how to do anything anymore.

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Speaker 1: He had dropped out of high school at seventeen and

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Speaker 1: gotten fired from his sales job for taking flying lessons

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Speaker 1: on company time. He'd received his flying license at twenty

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Speaker 1: two and become an air racer. And he got like

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Speaker 1: rich during World War Two because he used all of

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Speaker 1: his airlines planes to take US troops to Europe for

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Speaker 1: the Army Air Corps. Like that was just a thing

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Speaker 1: the big airlines did as they were like I guess

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Speaker 1: we're having a war, Everybody like take your Yeah. It's

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Speaker 1: like it's like if we were like diverting seven thirty

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Speaker 1: sevens to Ukraine so we could like kick explosives out

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Speaker 1: of the back match.

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Speaker 2: I mean why not yet? Yeah with Jet Blue. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: that's when you see Spirit Airlines flying overhead. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: After the war, he got rich, particularly because like he

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Speaker 1: was the dude who started inviting celebrities to take like

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Speaker 1: you know trips on his planes to you know, vacation

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Speaker 1: destinations or to Europe. Like the idea of the jet

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Speaker 1: set is created in part by like Robert six, Like

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Speaker 1: that's the dude that he is. He makes flying sexy.

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Speaker 1: He also beat the absolute hell out of his wife

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Speaker 1: and kids. But like that kind of goes without saying, right,

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Speaker 1: the different time rich maniac and this part period of time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, probably, holy shit, not great, you're saying that whole

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Speaker 2: like I know, like there are these places in la

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Speaker 2: where it's like the inside of an old airplane where

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Speaker 2: people can pretend it's like the glamorous air travel time.

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Speaker 2: That's all because of this.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Bobby six is the dude who like creates that

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Speaker 1: cultural touchstone or helps him and then became a decrepit

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Speaker 1: monkey skeleton in his ladder years. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: for some reason, a lot of guys have trouble giving

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Speaker 1: up power and influence miles wild stuff. Thankfully our generation

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Speaker 1: will never know anything about that.

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Speaker 3: No.

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Speaker 1: So then there was Edward Vernon Rickenbacker. Who, Man, that

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Speaker 1: is a pilot name. That's a hell of a pilot name.

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Speaker 2: He could be Veron. How about Vernon is a middle name.

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Speaker 2: I'm fine with Vernon.

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Speaker 1: Vernon's a fine middle name, you know, a little old timy,

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Speaker 1: but yeah it works for me though. Yeah, no, tittally Bob. Sorry,

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Speaker 1: So obviously Edward Vernon Rickenbacker. That's a World War One

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Speaker 1: fighter pilot, and he was, in fact a World War

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Speaker 1: One fighter pilot. He wins the Medal of Honor. He's

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Speaker 1: actually the most decorated US flying ace of the war.

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Speaker 1: And as a side hobby is a race car driver,

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Speaker 1: because like, why wouldn't you be the coolest dude you

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Speaker 1: could possibly be?

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Speaker 2: It was of the sky.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, every now and then, if he saw one by

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Speaker 1: the edge of the track, he'd just like run him over,

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Speaker 1: you know, get a German blonde hair, let's showio like

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Speaker 1: most grand pilots. Yeah, gotta get the fuck out of

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Speaker 1: that state. And his pin shot for Devil Daredevil read

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Speaker 1: mainly it came from the fact that he was like

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Speaker 1: the least lucky person on the planet. As a toddler,

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Speaker 1: he was hit by a street car and knocked twelve

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Speaker 1: feet down into an open sewer. His brother twice had

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Speaker 1: to save him after he was hit by passing coal

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Speaker 1: cars as a little kid. One time his school caught

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Speaker 1: on fire and he nearly died trying to save his

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Speaker 1: coat from the building. So, yeah, like this d sounds

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Speaker 1: like a really normal When was he born in like I.

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Speaker 2: Don't know, you know, late eighteen hundred something like that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah that sounds like, yeah, that sounds like a very

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Speaker 2: normal childhood. I think back then it's like, yeah, everyone

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Speaker 2: was fucking ran over into an open funting sewer as

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Speaker 2: a baby.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he's just like constantly it like getting maimed and beaten,

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Speaker 1: and it's like, I guess the sky could be worse, right, Like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: German bullets aren't more dangerous than the street in nineteen thirteen,

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Speaker 1: so that the it.

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Speaker 2: Is just such a different time because like, you know,

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Speaker 2: you look at those old pictures of like what jungle

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Speaker 2: gyms used to look like for kids, like in the

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Speaker 2: fucking twenties, and it was just a big gun on

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Speaker 2: the ground. Yeah, exactly. It was like a knife pit

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Speaker 2: with like a bunch of poles that were like twenty

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Speaker 2: five feet high, with like you know, handles and shit

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Speaker 2: on it. So kids could just sit on top and

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Speaker 2: break their fucking necks.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, if they If they die, they die. So

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Speaker 1: after the war, he founded a motor company, and this

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Speaker 1: motor company went very quickly bankrupt, but he was famous

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Speaker 1: because he'd been such a good fighter pilot, so he

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Speaker 1: was still able to create another company. This one was

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Speaker 1: an airline called Florida Airways, which collapsed because would you

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Speaker 1: fly on Florida Airways, Like absolutely not, No, It.

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Speaker 2: Sounds like you're gonna get robbed. Like they're like, you idiot,

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Speaker 2: you really thought this was a fucking airline. Yeah, this

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Speaker 2: your fucking money.

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Speaker 1: Now you're gonna get robbed and you're gonna have to

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Speaker 1: sit next to the guy until it lands in Sarasota, right, Like.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, there's no flight, Robert, there's no flight Florida

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Speaker 2: air that's a euphemism. It's a code word for a

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Speaker 2: fucking like armed robbery breaking.

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Speaker 1: Come on, Oh, yeah, he's flying Florida Airways now yeah.

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Speaker 2: Oh, looks like you got two first class tickets of

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Speaker 2: Florida Airways.

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Speaker 1: So Florida Airways also collapses.

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Speaker 4: Like that's not real. That has to be a fake name.

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Speaker 1: No, No, that's that's the real that's the real name.

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Speaker 1: And it becomes the foundation of a lot of modern

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Speaker 1: air travel because he takes Florida Airways while it's failing,

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Speaker 1: and again largely because he's just got so much famous

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Speaker 1: guy clout, he's able to merge it with Eastern air

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Speaker 1: Transport to create Eastern Airlines, which becomes one of the

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Speaker 1: titans of the first Big age of air travel. He

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Speaker 1: also was a cartoonist. Weirdly enough, basically if you wanted

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Speaker 1: to do it as a job when you were nine.

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Speaker 2: This guy lived it.

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Speaker 1: He was in every way a cooler dude than the

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Speaker 1: subject of our episode, Frank Lorenzo.

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Speaker 2: I just used to be a flagpole center too.

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Speaker 1: So by the time our boy Frank was in his

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Speaker 1: late teens, his family was doing well enough that his

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Speaker 1: father sent him to a super fan and see rich

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Speaker 1: kids school, Forest Hills High in Queen's. In his description

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Speaker 1: of Forest Hills, Lorenzo emphasized emphasizes what a fish out

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Speaker 1: of water he was. He's this blue collar Spanish kid

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Speaker 1: and a school filled with white collar Jewish kids. But

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Speaker 1: like his dad's like playing the market as a hobby

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Speaker 1: and as a business owner. So he's like, it's not

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Speaker 1: that blue collar. Like he over emphasizes it. There's a

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Speaker 1: little bit of like, I don't know, Jewish panic type

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Speaker 1: deal where he's like, well, compared to all of these

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Speaker 1: these Jewish kids, I was real commoner, you know stuff.

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Speaker 1: It's like, come on, man, chill at, chill out, Frank.

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Speaker 2: So the fuck up.

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Speaker 1: It does sound like it was an insufferable school, because again,

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Speaker 1: everybody there is pretty rich. One of his classmates was

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Speaker 1: John Winnekure, who went on to edit Paris's International Herald Tribune.

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Speaker 1: Simon and garf Uncle were one year below him. I

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Speaker 1: wish there was something more interesting about that, but like

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Speaker 1: that's that's the only fact I found about it. The

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Speaker 1: one real warning sign Frank exhibited at this point is

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Speaker 1: that he volunteered to work as a hall monitor, which is, oh, yeah, cop, no,

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Speaker 1: absolutely not.

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Speaker 2: That's uh yeah, I found it acceptable. I found out

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Speaker 2: my partner her majesty was like a hall monitor. Like,

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Speaker 2: when I found that out, it I thought I had

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Speaker 2: like an existential crisis almost where I was like, what

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Speaker 2: the Like, you're a cop and you wanted to do that.

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Speaker 2: It's like yeah, and you got the you got to

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Speaker 2: wear the sash and shit, I'm like, this is fucked up.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's uh, that's bleak, you know I I uh,

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Speaker 1: I feel like hall monitors.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: It's it's like the DEA for not wanting to be

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Speaker 1: in math class. Yeah right, it's it's yeah, it's r

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Speaker 1: O t C for you know, baby whatever, baby cops.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you don't actually get to do anything in

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Speaker 1: r O t C except what looked like a piece

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Speaker 1: of ship and that stupid uniform to get to wear.

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Speaker 2: It though, and fucking salute the flag. Honor the flag, man.

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Speaker 1: I'll have a lot of fucking saluting the flag. Jesus Christ.

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Speaker 2: So did the ROTC kids you have? I had ROTC

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Speaker 2: kids like uh in my school that were basically like

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Speaker 2: have like doing stolen valor, like wearing metals and shit,

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Speaker 2: like on a weird jacket. As they put the flag out,

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Speaker 2: I was like, is.

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Speaker 1: This, Oh man, they got in our ROTC We got swords.

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Speaker 1: We got swords for a while, and then one of

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Speaker 1: the kids drew his to like attack some other kids,

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Speaker 1: and then they were like, I guess we can't have

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Speaker 1: them all wearing swords anymore.

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Speaker 2: Were they super sharp? No? I mean they were.

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Speaker 1: They were like swords, but they were like parades ceremony.

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Speaker 1: They had not been sharpened, but like, yeah it was

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Speaker 1: still a sword.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that was obviously how that was going to go.

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Speaker 2: Of course, yeah that was going to go.

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Speaker 1: And it made me just think that everyone at school

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Speaker 1: should have to wear a full saber at all times.

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Speaker 1: But that's that's a separate belief.

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Speaker 2: So honestly, I joined ROTC for the sword. Like if

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Speaker 2: I heard it's like a lot of people did a

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Speaker 2: lot of people did. I'm doing it for the sword.

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Speaker 2: Do it for the sword, y'all? Do it for the sword.

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Speaker 1: So at this point his life goal, Frank's life goal

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Speaker 1: was to study engineering when he went off to college.

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Speaker 1: He graduated in the late fifties and was accepted to

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Speaker 1: Columbia University, and this right up from Texas Monthly describes

386
00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:19,480
Speaker 1: his time in college pretty well. The making of Frank

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Speaker 1: Lorenzo seems to have begun at Columbia University, where he

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Speaker 1: graduated in nineteen sixty one and later endowed a scholarship

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Speaker 1: in his father's name. He was well known there amid

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Speaker 1: the two thousand students. He joined the top fraternity, Sigma Kai,

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Speaker 1: and served in student government as secretary treasurer of the

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Speaker 1: Undergraduate Dormitory Council.

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Speaker 4: That was worst fraternity at my college.

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Speaker 2: They liked Sigma Kai.

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Speaker 4: They got like removed for doing that shit.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, he's just waite, Sophie. He's a piece of

397
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Speaker 1: shit in this school, all right.

398
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Speaker 4: Cook cool.

399
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Speaker 1: Former classmates use words like glib and slick to describe him.

400
00:19:52,359 --> 00:19:54,800
Speaker 1: He tended to skate close to the edge, recalls classmate

401
00:19:54,880 --> 00:19:59,160
Speaker 1: David C. Furman, Lorenzo's college nickname around his flat Frankie

402
00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:03,520
Speaker 1: smooth Talk. The monikers seemed particularly well suited and lighted.

403
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Speaker 4: Ship up right now.

404
00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:06,880
Speaker 2: No, he was Frankie. He was Frankie Smooth Talk.

405
00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:10,800
Speaker 1: So and and so the thing that he fucking does

406
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:14,200
Speaker 1: in college that's so funny is like he's in this

407
00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:18,359
Speaker 1: campus political organization that's that's linked to all of the

408
00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:21,240
Speaker 1: Christian fraternities like Sigma Kai, to try to make sure

409
00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:25,679
Speaker 1: that the Christian fraternities get a bunch of student officers,

410
00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:29,080
Speaker 1: and they're specifically they're opposed. It's not like a left

411
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Speaker 1: versus right thing. The Christian fraternities are fighting the Jewish fraternities.

412
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Speaker 1: So first off, you could guess there's some problematic shit

413
00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:42,400
Speaker 1: being said in the background. And so yeah, he's he's

414
00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:46,320
Speaker 1: like basically he's there Roger Stone. And the night before

415
00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:48,639
Speaker 1: the final day of balloting for seats on the student

416
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:51,639
Speaker 1: governing board, Lorenzo meets with a bunch of other like

417
00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:55,840
Speaker 1: these Christian frat guys in a dorm room to discuss quote,

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00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:59,760
Speaker 1: the possibility of voting twice. So he and all of

419
00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:02,040
Speaker 1: these other guys like make a list of students who

420
00:21:02,119 --> 00:21:05,200
Speaker 1: probably wouldn't vote and then go vote illegally in their

421
00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:09,400
Speaker 1: names to rig the election. So he's like he's he's

422
00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:12,200
Speaker 1: the Roger Stone, or at least the e Howard Hunt

423
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:16,600
Speaker 1: to like shady kind of bigoted college politics.

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Speaker 2: Wow, what an entry way.

425
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Speaker 3: M h.

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Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, yeah, we had to dilute the Jewish vote,

427
00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:27,120
Speaker 2: but yeah, some voter fraud. What Yeah, exactly, I got

428
00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:30,640
Speaker 2: this shareholder meeting covered what I feel like I'm going

429
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:30,960
Speaker 2: to get.

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00:21:31,119 --> 00:21:33,480
Speaker 1: I feel like I can guarantee you they didn't say

431
00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:36,199
Speaker 1: we're going to beat the Jewish frats. They used a

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Speaker 1: different word.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh yeah, oh yeah, I was doing the version.

434
00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:46,520
Speaker 1: Yeah no, these guys are definitely a slur heavy frat.

435
00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:48,800
Speaker 2: Oh yeah.

436
00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:50,760
Speaker 1: One of the things I find really funny is that

437
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,800
Speaker 1: Lorenzo's like, he's like their Roger Stone, but he's terrible

438
00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:58,240
Speaker 1: at committing crimes. So he is the only member of

439
00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:03,800
Speaker 1: this conspiracy who gets caught voting twice, the student paper reported.

440
00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:05,959
Speaker 1: At first, he denied everything and claimed that he had

441
00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:08,440
Speaker 1: tried it as a stunt to test the election commission

442
00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:10,959
Speaker 1: to see if anyone can actually get away with voting twice.

443
00:22:11,359 --> 00:22:13,159
Speaker 1: So he actually does the whole like I was just

444
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:15,520
Speaker 1: testing to make sure that your guys had good security.

445
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:19,360
Speaker 2: Oh good, good, good to know, good to know. Yeah,

446
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:21,560
Speaker 2: that's like this shit that the fucking guy's on to

447
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:24,239
Speaker 2: catch a predator. Say, yeah, when they get caught, Like

448
00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:27,240
Speaker 2: I was here to warn the kid about what can

449
00:22:27,359 --> 00:22:30,120
Speaker 2: happen when you talk to people on the internet. Yeah,

450
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:34,080
Speaker 2: that's why I came. Uh huh, yeah, he does that.

451
00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:42,920
Speaker 2: You know, guys, you know who else engages an anti

452
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:45,880
Speaker 2: sent note, We shouldn't say that, So how do we

453
00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:55,560
Speaker 2: Let's just pull the ads right now. Oh, all right,

454
00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:59,920
Speaker 2: and we are back. We're back, and we're talking about

455
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:05,280
Speaker 2: our buddy, Frank Lorenzo, the Roger Stone of anti Semitic

456
00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:12,760
Speaker 2: college election shit. So the newspaper continues that story. After

457
00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:16,400
Speaker 2: he pretended to be testing the election system, Lorenzo soon

458
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:19,120
Speaker 2: cracked under the pressure of the board's questioning and admitted

459
00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:21,920
Speaker 2: to voting twice. He and five others were banned from

460
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:25,399
Speaker 2: ever voting again in a Columbia election. So he has

461
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:29,520
Speaker 2: permanently he has a school politics felon. He's permanently lost his.

462
00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:35,439
Speaker 1: Right to vote at Columbia University. It's funny, now, this

463
00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:38,960
Speaker 1: was before culture war politics had become as monetizable as

464
00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:41,760
Speaker 1: they are today. Like, I think there's if this kid

465
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,479
Speaker 1: is going to school in the present, he never becomes

466
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:48,160
Speaker 1: a business guy. He like joins Turning Point USA straight

467
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:52,680
Speaker 1: out of college and like tries to milk this for forever. Yeah,

468
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:57,040
Speaker 1: he has a podcast on Daily Wire. Oh yes, absolutely so.

469
00:23:57,280 --> 00:24:00,960
Speaker 1: Yeah Lorenzo. Because the campus Pressed doesn't have much to

470
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:04,320
Speaker 1: focus on, Lorenzo kind of becomes their Nixon for a while.

471
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 1: When classes start back up in the fall, the paper

472
00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:09,880
Speaker 1: starts a campaign to make him resign from his position

473
00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:12,800
Speaker 1: on the dorm room Council based due to his quote

474
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:16,320
Speaker 1: lack of any semblance of self respect and honor. Now

475
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:22,359
Speaker 1: every someone, especially because it's like you're on the dorm

476
00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,320
Speaker 1: room council. Now. I've never went to Columbia, but I

477
00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:29,040
Speaker 1: did briefly live in a dorm in college before I

478
00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:31,640
Speaker 1: dropped out. And the only thing I know about our

479
00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:34,439
Speaker 1: dorm room officers is that I bought liquor from them

480
00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:35,320
Speaker 1: when I was eighteen.

481
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:38,480
Speaker 2: Well yeah, exactly, yeah, they were selling you. They were

482
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,240
Speaker 2: selling you like diluted drugs basically. But I love that,

483
00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,399
Speaker 2: even for the bar to be basically subterranean, that they

484
00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:47,680
Speaker 2: would still say, Yeah, you're just lack of what do

485
00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:49,439
Speaker 2: you say, so what was it self? Re lack of

486
00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 2: any semblance of self respect and honor. It's so funny.

487
00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:00,480
Speaker 2: So Lorenzo eventually decides to resign, and he writes a

488
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:03,000
Speaker 2: public letter announcing that he's giving up his job. But

489
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,520
Speaker 2: he doesn't give a specific reason for why he quit.

490
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:08,840
Speaker 2: He just says, the political events of the past semester

491
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,280
Speaker 2: make by resignation mandatory. So you can see just kind

492
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 2: of instinctively like this dude, this dude has what it

493
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:17,679
Speaker 2: is going to have what it takes to succeed in

494
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:19,000
Speaker 2: business or politics.

495
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,639
Speaker 1: Totally from the available information. It kind of seems like

496
00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:24,480
Speaker 1: the rest of his time in school goes by without

497
00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:28,159
Speaker 1: anything a podcast about shitty people can make content out of.

498
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:31,120
Speaker 1: At least over the time he was there, Frank's interest

499
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:34,720
Speaker 1: veered from engineering and towards economics, a clear sign that

500
00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:36,880
Speaker 1: he was going to be a shitty person. He also

501
00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:41,520
Speaker 1: started reading biographies of various famous business tycoons, like Andrew Carnegie,

502
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,640
Speaker 1: who once sent an army of Pinkerton detectives to launch

503
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:48,120
Speaker 1: a seaborne invasion of a mill occupied by striking workers,

504
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:50,960
Speaker 1: which sparked a massive gun battle, like a twelve hour

505
00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 1: gun battle that ended with strikers hucking dynamite into the

506
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,439
Speaker 1: Pinkerton boats and rolling a flaming train car at the

507
00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:00,320
Speaker 1: barges in the river to break the beachhead. Now we

508
00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:02,680
Speaker 1: can assume that when he read about this, Frank made

509
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 1: a note of how violence with nothing but money behind

510
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:08,439
Speaker 1: it didn't work for Carnegie. It was only once he

511
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:10,640
Speaker 1: got the government on his side that he was able

512
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:12,720
Speaker 1: to crush the strike. And this is a thing that

513
00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:14,760
Speaker 1: Frank's going to make a note of, right that, like,

514
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:17,800
Speaker 1: you can't just have guys with guns going to break

515
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:20,800
Speaker 1: up strikers, because there's always going to be more strikers

516
00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:23,240
Speaker 1: than you have guys with guns. You got to get

517
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,679
Speaker 1: the Feds on your back because they always have the

518
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:26,719
Speaker 1: most guns.

519
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:30,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, and the best toys, and the best toys for sure. Yeah.

520
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:32,919
Speaker 1: Now, while he was a frat boy, Frank was not

521
00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,199
Speaker 1: wealthy enough for his parents to pay his tuition. He

522
00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:37,800
Speaker 1: had to work odd jobs throughout school, selling ties at

523
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:40,640
Speaker 1: Macy's and at one point driving a Coola truck, which

524
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:43,440
Speaker 1: required him to join the Teamsters union. If he ever

525
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:45,919
Speaker 1: commented on the pay and benefits he received, due to

526
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:48,119
Speaker 1: his union membership. We have no record of it, but

527
00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 1: he does have to spend some time as a union man,

528
00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:53,159
Speaker 1: which will be relevant in a little bit. Once he

529
00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 1: graduated from Columbia, Frank applied to Harvard Business School, where

530
00:26:56,720 --> 00:26:59,479
Speaker 1: he wanted to get an MBA. He was a member

531
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,159
Speaker 1: of it, the generation of young business executives who had

532
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:05,800
Speaker 1: become what we're called corporate raiders in the seventies and eighties. Right,

533
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:08,720
Speaker 1: This is We've talked about this in our Jack Welsh episodes.

534
00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:11,320
Speaker 1: It's kind of period. This transitionary period from like the

535
00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:14,480
Speaker 1: sixties to the seventies is sort of the birth of

536
00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:17,440
Speaker 1: the ideas that we now just see as like how

537
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:18,480
Speaker 1: capitalism works.

538
00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:19,800
Speaker 2: That like private equity.

539
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,959
Speaker 1: Yeah, private equity company's only responsibilities to a shareholders like

540
00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 1: you know, strip mind resources for short term profits, lay

541
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 1: people off, to dig the stock price up so you

542
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: guys can get money.

543
00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 2: You know, people died because the business became so poorly

544
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:36,520
Speaker 2: one because we're extracting all the money out of him.

545
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:38,640
Speaker 2: Yeah whatever was fine, fine.

546
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:40,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is kind of the era at least that

547
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:42,880
Speaker 1: he's going to Harvard in is like the guys who

548
00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:46,359
Speaker 1: are going to preside over that transition in capitalism are

549
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:48,240
Speaker 1: all kind of in school at the same time.

550
00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, the guys who are voting twice in college elections

551
00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:54,919
Speaker 2: set up an intricate system of shell companies to be

552
00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:57,840
Speaker 2: able to dodge any kind of legal liability when people die.

553
00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:01,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly what else you don't want to not dodge

554
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:04,560
Speaker 1: legal liability when people die? Miles think you want to

555
00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:07,000
Speaker 1: be like that genius CEO of Ocean Gate, you know,

556
00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:11,120
Speaker 1: Stockton Rush dodge all liability by imploding. Yeah.

557
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:13,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, doesn't this Stockton. I feel like whenever I hear

558
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 2: that name, it sounds like a fucking arena football team.

559
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:21,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, the Stockton Rushes. Yeah, the Stockton Rushers. I don't

560
00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:24,600
Speaker 1: know if there's a Fort Stockton. So yeah, you guys,

561
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:27,160
Speaker 1: you could like pivot off this. You know, it takes

562
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: take advantage of the SEO opportunity.

563
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:31,360
Speaker 2: Makes some weird joke football.

564
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 1: So where Lorenzo really shined is at social organizations at Harvard.

565
00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 1: He's not he doesn't love the classes, you know, he

566
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,560
Speaker 1: does well, but like he kind of comes out of

567
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:45,920
Speaker 1: Harvard being like, well that was more or less for

568
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:48,040
Speaker 1: the name, right, like to be able to say, like

569
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:52,560
Speaker 1: I graduated from Harvard, but he does do well running

570
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:56,040
Speaker 1: the Harvard Cafeteria news stand, which is the only store

571
00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: on the business school campus. He apparently makes bank doing this,

572
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:02,960
Speaker 1: so yeah, might as well start with grifting other Harvard kids.

573
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:07,239
Speaker 1: His first job after at graduation was at TWA, an

574
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:10,160
Speaker 1: airline that at the time was headed by Floyd Hall.

575
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:13,520
Speaker 1: Like the other airline CEOs we talked about, Hall was

576
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 1: a two fisted Army pilot who had fought in World

577
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 1: War Two and then worked for the airline as a

578
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:22,080
Speaker 1: pilot before becoming CEO. Floyd got hired away to Eastern

579
00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:26,760
Speaker 1: Airlines right as Lorenzo started working at TWA, which signified

580
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:29,880
Speaker 1: like a new era of management, Like Floyd kind of

581
00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:33,400
Speaker 1: leaves TWA and gets replaced by a dude who's not

582
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:36,720
Speaker 1: a pilot, not a war hero. And it's kind of

583
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:40,200
Speaker 1: part of this transition where Americans are starting to see

584
00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:44,080
Speaker 1: airlines not as like these kind of symbols of progress

585
00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 1: and American greatness, but as like, you know, assets to

586
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 1: be mined for profit. Right it's the business is becoming

587
00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:53,720
Speaker 1: more of a normal business. It's losing its kind of prestige.

588
00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 1: And I'm gonna quote from Texas Monthly again as a

589
00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 1: manager of financial analysis. Lorenzo distinguished himself as a man

590
00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 1: who could push past details to the heart of the matter,

591
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,440
Speaker 1: but he was too ambitious to patiently work his way

592
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 1: up the corporate ladder. A year later, at twenty six,

593
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:10,200
Speaker 1: he resigned to go into business with a soft spoken

594
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,840
Speaker 1: a Harvard classmate from New England, Bob Carney, who worked

595
00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: for two New York investment houses. The two formed Lorenzo

596
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,160
Speaker 1: carnean Company. Although the company at the time was a secretary.

597
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:22,320
Speaker 1: We thought we could make some money in airlines, Carnee recalls.

598
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 1: We had an entrepreneurial burge. Each partner put up one

599
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:29,200
Speaker 1: thousand dollars. Lorenzo Carney was essentially a consulting firm in

600
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 1: search of investment opportunities. So they don't really have a

601
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 1: plan for what their business is going to do. They

602
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:36,479
Speaker 1: just like start a business and like, if we can

603
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:38,760
Speaker 1: just get an airline to pay us for something, we'll

604
00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,719
Speaker 1: figure it out. So they try a few things they

605
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:45,480
Speaker 1: struggle to get a start, like leasing out planes and shit,

606
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:47,480
Speaker 1: but they're not able to actually like make a profit.

607
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 1: So they spin off from this business that doesn't work

608
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 1: to yet another business, Jet Capital Corporation, and somehow it's

609
00:30:56,520 --> 00:30:58,920
Speaker 1: kind of unclear to me exactly how this works, but

610
00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:01,680
Speaker 1: like they start a company and I just sort of

611
00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 1: like start going around to investors with money in nineteen

612
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 1: sixty nine and going like and then a cool name,

613
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 1: Jet Capital Corporation, Can we have some money?

614
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:13,120
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, yeah. I didn't want to get in on this. Yeah, yeah,

615
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:15,120
Speaker 2: I wonder was this like the Internet kind of where

616
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 2: enough people kind of knew but probably just weren't savvy enough.

617
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:20,760
Speaker 2: Like they're pretty confident, and they're called Jet Capital Corporation.

618
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's kind of one of those things, right, And

619
00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 1: so they get one point four million dollars and they

620
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 1: don't have really much of a business plan, but they

621
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:30,160
Speaker 1: don't need one. And as soon as they get this

622
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,040
Speaker 1: pile of money, Frank, you know, there's some other stuff

623
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:36,520
Speaker 1: they are doing, some consulting, but Frank pretty immediately is like,

624
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 1: that's all small potatoes. What I want to do is

625
00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:41,440
Speaker 1: I want to like take this money and use it

626
00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 1: as a basis to get more money so we can

627
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:49,479
Speaker 1: just purchase an airline. Now, basically, as he's kind of

628
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 1: like talking this up, he's going around, he's going to parties.

629
00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: He's able to like make friends with some guys from

630
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 1: Chase Manhattan Bank, and these dudes are eventually like, hey, guys,

631
00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:02,640
Speaker 1: you know, we have this this boutique airline in Texas

632
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:06,520
Speaker 1: that's doing really shitty, Like if we can help you,

633
00:32:06,600 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 1: guys put some money together, you can buy this airline

634
00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 1: and try to rescue it and make a bunch of money.

635
00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 1: And it's here that I should probably pause to explain

636
00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:16,240
Speaker 1: how fucking airlines work in this period of time.

637
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:19,480
Speaker 2: Because it's weird flying again.

638
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:22,280
Speaker 1: Like you know, nineteen eighteen is kind of when it

639
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:25,280
Speaker 1: first becomes a business in the United States, because that's

640
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 1: the year the Post Office starts doing air mail routes,

641
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,520
Speaker 1: and air mail is like the first big business that

642
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:36,160
Speaker 1: like planes are involved in in the country. US Army

643
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 1: pilots are all of like the people actually flying the routes,

644
00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:43,720
Speaker 1: and they established this national system of runways and airfields

645
00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 1: that kind of this is what eventually turns into the

646
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:48,760
Speaker 1: airports that are all over the country. It all starts

647
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:52,080
Speaker 1: as like Post Office air mail, like landing strips and shit.

648
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:55,320
Speaker 1: This is all supported by something called the nineteen twenty

649
00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:58,720
Speaker 1: five Contract Airmail app. This gives the Post Office the

650
00:32:58,840 --> 00:33:01,880
Speaker 1: right to award roots to private carriers, which kind of

651
00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:05,640
Speaker 1: creates the private industry for flying and shit. So the

652
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 1: years that follow this are this kind of messy slurry

653
00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:11,280
Speaker 1: of these new airlines flighting for routes and the government

654
00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:14,320
Speaker 1: struggling to make sure there's places for them to land.

655
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,520
Speaker 1: It's really messy. But all four of the major airlines

656
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 1: that dominate the sky today, which are like United, American,

657
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:25,840
Speaker 1: trans World, and Eastern, originate from this period, right, Like,

658
00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 1: these are the guys that all of our modern airlines

659
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 1: are basically the big ones at least are basically directly

660
00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 1: or kind of indirectly descended from right, come off history, Yeah, exactly.

661
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:38,880
Speaker 1: So passenger service, you're not like flying people, right, because

662
00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 1: planes are terrifying death traps, like they can barely take

663
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:44,960
Speaker 1: letters places. But this starts to change by the late

664
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:49,239
Speaker 1: thirties under the watchful eye of Franklin Delano Roosevelt, who

665
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:52,000
Speaker 1: is like, you know, a modern dude, but also pretty

666
00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 1: bullish on regulation. So under Roosevelt, in nineteen thirty eight,

667
00:33:55,960 --> 00:34:00,520
Speaker 1: Congress passes the Civil Aeronautics Act, which gives regulatory authority

668
00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,640
Speaker 1: over air travel to something called the Civil Aviation Authority.

669
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:08,280
Speaker 1: And so the Civil Aviation Authority quickly gets a better

670
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:11,279
Speaker 1: acronym called CAB because they change their name to the

671
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:14,359
Speaker 1: Civil Aeronautics Board, and these are this is like the

672
00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:17,520
Speaker 1: precursor to the FAA. Right, CAB is like what we

673
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:21,920
Speaker 1: have before the FAA. But while today the FAA basically

674
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 1: just it seems like their job is mostly to make

675
00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 1: sure people continue to not die from passenger flights, CAB

676
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,040
Speaker 1: has another role, which is to make sure that there's

677
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:38,480
Speaker 1: not competition in the air travel business. Right Like, that's

678
00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:41,080
Speaker 1: it's it's kind of this it's very alien to modern

679
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,360
Speaker 1: Americans because the government's like, all right, we're gonna have planes.

680
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:46,279
Speaker 1: This is going to be a business, but we don't

681
00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 1: want them competing. Right If planes compete, if like airlines

682
00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:52,760
Speaker 1: are competing, then like a bunch of ugly shit's gonna happen.

683
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 1: They'll be like fighting for the bottom in order to

684
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,399
Speaker 1: be like the cheapest carrier, And like we don't want

685
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,000
Speaker 1: it to work that way, right, Like, that doesn't seem

686
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:02,000
Speaker 1: like a good way for planes to work.

687
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 2: What the kind of parallel reality is this?

688
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:07,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's really strange. It's just like such a different

689
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 1: attitude towards all and part of it's because like the

690
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 1: business is so new, right, there's like a bunch of

691
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 1: government subsidies, like if you're doing certain roots or like

692
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:18,680
Speaker 1: you will get money per flight from the government too,

693
00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:21,120
Speaker 1: to kind of help. Because there's this understanding that like,

694
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:24,920
Speaker 1: well just kind of naturally, like a lot of shit's

695
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,719
Speaker 1: not going to make sense financially, like flying to a

696
00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:30,200
Speaker 1: bunch of different states and shit, there's just not going

697
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 1: to be enough business for it to make sense. So

698
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:35,080
Speaker 1: we want to we want to establish like we want

699
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 1: to establish a network of flights and airlines, and the

700
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:39,640
Speaker 1: only way to do that is if the government kind

701
00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:41,320
Speaker 1: of helps these companies out. But if we're going to

702
00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:44,480
Speaker 1: help them out, they shouldn't just be you know, making

703
00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:47,360
Speaker 1: as much money as possible, right, Like we need to

704
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,239
Speaker 1: put in some limitations so so that like it's it

705
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:52,680
Speaker 1: doesn't get as messy as other things have gotten. I

706
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:54,840
Speaker 1: think they're kind of looking at how all the nasty

707
00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:57,480
Speaker 1: shit that happens with like trains during like the late

708
00:35:57,480 --> 00:35:59,319
Speaker 1: eighteen hundreds, and going, well, we want to avoid some

709
00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:04,080
Speaker 1: of that, so cut too, Yeah, cut to today, so

710
00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:06,160
Speaker 1: things are good for a while, you get your Second

711
00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:09,239
Speaker 1: World War, you know, which means that suddenly there's a

712
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:12,200
Speaker 1: lot of money going into growing the airline fleet, a

713
00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:14,560
Speaker 1: lot of it gets pressed into military service, and then

714
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:17,560
Speaker 1: when the war ends, there's all these pilots, these guys

715
00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:19,880
Speaker 1: who just like got trained up for free by the government,

716
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:24,520
Speaker 1: and then suddenly like nobody's paying them to incinerate cities

717
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:27,000
Speaker 1: in Asia or Europe, and then they're like, well, I

718
00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:29,000
Speaker 1: guess we should find something else to do.

719
00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 2: All right, Oh can I still get drunk while I

720
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 2: do it? Yeah? Yeah, absolutely, No one said you can't

721
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:37,520
Speaker 2: be drunk, you just flying suits?

722
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:37,799
Speaker 3: Now?

723
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 2: Oh okay, for sure, man, poor mea martini. Let's go.

724
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:47,359
Speaker 1: So, because cab was fundamentally pretty anti competitive, it works

725
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:50,279
Speaker 1: out this system with all of the major airlines. So

726
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:53,880
Speaker 1: there's kind of two like types of airlines. There's little

727
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 1: ones where you're just kind of flying within a state,

728
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,680
Speaker 1: and the little airlines they're kind of they're a lot

729
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:03,200
Speaker 1: less regulated, right, the pilots aren't considered to be the

730
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 1: same quality of pilots. But it means that like little

731
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,880
Speaker 1: airlines can do shit like offer discounted tickets and whatnot,

732
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:13,200
Speaker 1: all this shit that's going to become like standard, whereas

733
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,160
Speaker 1: big airlines aren't allowed to do this, right, if you're

734
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:20,319
Speaker 1: flying interstate in international route routes, you like, can't you

735
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:22,319
Speaker 1: just have to kind of like offer one kind of

736
00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:26,600
Speaker 1: ticket for a flight, which makes everything simple, Like when

737
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 1: you're booking a plane, you're just like, well, yeah, I

738
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:31,279
Speaker 1: just want like a ticket, you know, to fucking Sarasota

739
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,840
Speaker 1: or whatever. But it also means the system is horribly

740
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,799
Speaker 1: inefficient because since the big airlines are just kind of

741
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 1: offering one ticket price, you know, for each flight, this

742
00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:42,759
Speaker 1: makes it simple, but it means that like if a

743
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,759
Speaker 1: flight lifts off for like if like you know, it's

744
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:48,719
Speaker 1: all it's about to be fly day and there's only

745
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:50,920
Speaker 1: thirty percent of the seats on the planet been filled,

746
00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:54,439
Speaker 1: they can't stop start offering like cheap seats to try

747
00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:57,400
Speaker 1: to fill it up. So it's horribly inefficient. And this

748
00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,840
Speaker 1: is a big part of why you get every so

749
00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:03,240
Speaker 1: off and these like people posting pictures of old planes

750
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:05,879
Speaker 1: being like wow, flying used to be so nice. Why

751
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:08,840
Speaker 1: can't it be that way again? Well, like, part of

752
00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:11,880
Speaker 1: why flying was so nice is that barely anyone was

753
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 1: ever on planes, right, like, like, yeah, it was a

754
00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 1: lot nicer when nobody was on them, because people suck.

755
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:23,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're just like about, yeah, we have fourteen seats. Yeah,

756
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:25,080
Speaker 2: and it looks like a living room.

757
00:38:25,120 --> 00:38:27,920
Speaker 1: Yeah there are there are five rich dudes on board.

758
00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:33,400
Speaker 1: Everybody is completely hammered, like the the like, instead of

759
00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:36,320
Speaker 1: getting a single ginger ale, you get like a handle

760
00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:38,080
Speaker 1: of gin and a Cuban cigar.

761
00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:40,759
Speaker 2: You know, it was it was nice, right, It's like,

762
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:42,719
Speaker 2: do you have seat belts? They're like, what are you

763
00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:47,439
Speaker 2: a priest? This is laudanum. Take all the laudanum you want.

764
00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:50,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, what the fuck is this? Our pilot made some

765
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:54,880
Speaker 1: bathtub heroine. Everybody chill out. It's gonna be choppy.

766
00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 3: No.

767
00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 1: So a big part of like why flying is nice

768
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:00,960
Speaker 1: is that, like most people aren't able to do it.

769
00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:03,839
Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty five, which is when Frank gets hired

770
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:07,239
Speaker 1: by TSA, only about twenty percent a little less of

771
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:10,319
Speaker 1: the US population had ever been on an aircraft, right,

772
00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:14,120
Speaker 1: And so in sixty five, less than twenty percent of

773
00:39:14,120 --> 00:39:15,840
Speaker 1: the country's ever even been on a plane. By the

774
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:18,880
Speaker 1: year two thousand, half of the US population flies at

775
00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 1: least once a year. So wow, And basically everyone who

776
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:25,399
Speaker 1: gets to adulthood is on a plane at least once right,

777
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:29,319
Speaker 1: very rarely. Yeah, it's just like life now. So the

778
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:31,880
Speaker 1: other thing that's happening, right is the seventies dawn is

779
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:34,920
Speaker 1: this generation of nbas who are Lorenzo's peers, are all

780
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,440
Speaker 1: starting to reach high positions in their field. So a

781
00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:39,680
Speaker 1: lot of these guys are again the first of what

782
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:42,799
Speaker 1: we now call corporate raiders. The best touchdown of this

783
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:45,840
Speaker 1: if you watch the movie Hook, that's who Robin Wilson's

784
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 1: character is supposed to be, right Like, he's this or not.

785
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:55,959
Speaker 1: Robin will Jesus Christ, Robin Williams, Robin Williams, I didn't

786
00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:58,640
Speaker 1: sleep last night. Robin Williams is supposed to be a

787
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:02,359
Speaker 1: corporate raider, right like, he's a yeah, he's like this

788
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:05,239
Speaker 1: guy whose job is to buy up companies and then

789
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 1: like strip them for assets. You know, he's a pirate,

790
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 1: right Like, that's the point of the Yeah. So to

791
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:12,239
Speaker 1: give you an idea of the kind of men that

792
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:15,000
Speaker 1: Lorenzo called colleagues and what they're doing to the rest

793
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:18,439
Speaker 1: of American capitalism in this period of time, I want

794
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:20,320
Speaker 1: to read a quote from a summary of the book

795
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:24,440
Speaker 1: Corporate Raiders and their Minions by John where Close. Quote

796
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:27,799
Speaker 1: the raiders who Close describes are colorful, to say the least.

797
00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:31,160
Speaker 1: Among them, there's Robert Campo, who sought to maintain his

798
00:40:31,239 --> 00:40:34,920
Speaker 1: youth with injections of fetal lambraine cells, and who's blitz

799
00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:37,880
Speaker 1: creak across the department store sector of the North American

800
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:42,000
Speaker 1: American economy ended with the bankruptcy of Federated department stores

801
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:45,440
Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety. Carl Icon, who supposedly said if you

802
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:49,759
Speaker 1: want love, buy a dog and gutted twa, and Robert Maxwell,

803
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:52,759
Speaker 1: who overpaid for McMillan, contributing to the collapse of his

804
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:56,720
Speaker 1: media empire and leading to his suicide by sea. Thanks

805
00:40:56,719 --> 00:41:01,319
Speaker 1: to these characters, companies can't coast anymore. Close likens the

806
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:04,080
Speaker 1: Raiders effect to the West Indian slavery bolts in the

807
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:07,720
Speaker 1: eighteen hundreds, saying the new M and A transformed public

808
00:41:07,719 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 1: corporations the establishment's repositories of power and wealth into very public,

809
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:15,680
Speaker 1: very visible, very vulnerable sugar plantations, open to all with

810
00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:19,520
Speaker 1: the will, the intelligence, and sometimes the personality disorders needed

811
00:41:19,560 --> 00:41:22,799
Speaker 1: to gain entry. The corporate raiders, explains Close. They're also

812
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:26,960
Speaker 1: the ancestors of today's shareholder activists. They don't buy underperforming

813
00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:29,640
Speaker 1: companies they buy into them and force their managers to

814
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 1: up their game. So they're all crazy assholes, right, Like

815
00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 1: that's who gets these jobs?

816
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 2: Feeding sambrain cell in jails. Yes, is like some fucking

817
00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 2: Peter deal shit, Like what the fuck is this?

818
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:46,840
Speaker 1: When you read about these guys, it does make it

819
00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:51,000
Speaker 1: clear that, like, oh, a huge part of like the

820
00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 1: massive PR blitz to make the tech industry feel like

821
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:58,560
Speaker 1: something special was just to briefly convince people that these

822
00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:00,840
Speaker 1: guys weren't the same as it ever was, right that

823
00:42:00,920 --> 00:42:03,560
Speaker 1: like all of these secheads were just like no, there's

824
00:42:04,239 --> 00:42:07,880
Speaker 1: who could code? Yeah, exactly, some of them can't even code,

825
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:10,840
Speaker 1: you know, they're just injecting fetal lambrin And I wish

826
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:14,239
Speaker 1: more of them would would do the suicide by sea thing.

827
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:17,759
Speaker 2: Also, what's what does that mean? Is that like a

828
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:19,560
Speaker 2: is that a specific way.

829
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:23,719
Speaker 1: Or yeah, going out on your yacht to jump off

830
00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:24,240
Speaker 1: or something.

831
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:27,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's let's let's look up Robert Maxwell. Let's do

832
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:29,000
Speaker 2: the research. I should I wonder yeah, or it's like

833
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:30,520
Speaker 2: or is it like a thing where you wear like

834
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:32,840
Speaker 2: a meat suit and then you jump into like shark

835
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:35,560
Speaker 2: infested waters and like just let the sea do itself.

836
00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 1: Oh, man, this guy looks like ship. Look at this dude.

837
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:44,319
Speaker 1: Holy fuck, Sophie Google Robert Maxwell? What a monster? Oh

838
00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:47,640
Speaker 1: this is Gillan Maxwell's dad. Yes, I have heard of this. Yeah,

839
00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:51,000
Speaker 1: he dies mysteriously at sea and there's probably something to

840
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:51,960
Speaker 1: do with the aside.

841
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:55,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is killing Maxwell's dad. Look at this fucking weirdo.

842
00:42:56,440 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 2: Oh my god. Hell yes, those eyebrows.

843
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 1: We'll do an episode on this guy at some point.

844
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:04,839
Speaker 1: He's dressed like Tucker Carlson, but he looks like if

845
00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:10,799
Speaker 1: Tucker Carlson melted in the sun.

846
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:12,320
Speaker 2: Or him, and like John Taffer from bar Rescue became

847
00:43:12,440 --> 00:43:12,960
Speaker 2: one guy.

848
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 1: He does have the look of like a fucking Paul Verhoven,

849
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:19,439
Speaker 1: like secondary bad guy.

850
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:20,560
Speaker 2: It's so funny.

851
00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:27,600
Speaker 1: Anyway, let's all think about Gilan Maxwell. I guess I

852
00:43:27,640 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 1: don't know whatever. Here's ads.

853
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:36,720
Speaker 4: What a wow looking person.

854
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 2: First of all, yeah, it does look like shit. He

855
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:42,200
Speaker 2: looks karma. It looks like.

856
00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:45,839
Speaker 4: When a potato starts to get moldy and sprouts. That's

857
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:46,480
Speaker 4: what it looks like.

858
00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:48,080
Speaker 2: Yeah.

859
00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:51,960
Speaker 1: Ah, we're back and we're talking about Robert Maxwell. What

860
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 1: a what a what a weird asshole? So these corporate raiders,

861
00:43:57,080 --> 00:44:02,360
Speaker 1: these guys who like are are Lorenzo's peers. Sometimes what

862
00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:05,360
Speaker 1: they're doing is they're finding lazy, underperforming companies that have

863
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:07,719
Speaker 1: like a lot of useless positions and have wasted it

864
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 1: basically coasted during the years when the American economy was

865
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:13,640
Speaker 1: like a freebie, right, the rest of the world was

866
00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:16,319
Speaker 1: destroyed by war, and we just like you could do

867
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:19,399
Speaker 1: anything as a business guy and make money. But that's

868
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:22,600
Speaker 1: starting to end by the seventies, right, So some of

869
00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 1: these guys are just like finding companies that were not

870
00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:27,920
Speaker 1: set up well and ending inefficiencies. But a lot of

871
00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:31,280
Speaker 1: them are just like gutting good businesses for short term gains.

872
00:44:31,719 --> 00:44:33,840
Speaker 1: A good modern example of this would be what happened

873
00:44:33,840 --> 00:44:36,880
Speaker 1: to the company that makes instant pots. They merged with

874
00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:39,680
Speaker 1: the maker of pyres in twenty nineteen, right before a

875
00:44:39,719 --> 00:44:43,120
Speaker 1: giant sales spurt due to the pandemic, but since that

876
00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:46,439
Speaker 1: growth wasn't sustainable, like, especially since instant pots, you don't

877
00:44:46,440 --> 00:44:49,719
Speaker 1: have to like buy instant pots, yea every author, Yeah, right,

878
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:54,160
Speaker 1: So if corporations functioned in anything that resembled like a rational,

879
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:56,799
Speaker 1: healthy manner, this would be fine, right, You'd be like, well,

880
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 1: we had that nice year or two where we made

881
00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:00,279
Speaker 1: a bunch of extra money and now we can you

882
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:03,799
Speaker 1: are a nice, steady business. But because capitalism has been

883
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:07,160
Speaker 1: you know, particularly because of like the kind of these

884
00:45:07,160 --> 00:45:09,759
Speaker 1: corporate raidar dudes are the guys who run everything. Now,

885
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 1: what they do as soon as there's this big like

886
00:45:13,200 --> 00:45:15,800
Speaker 1: windfall is they take on a four hundred and fifty

887
00:45:15,880 --> 00:45:19,160
Speaker 1: million dollar loan and they kind of justify this by saying, oh,

888
00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:22,239
Speaker 1: we got to build new production facilities, we got to

889
00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:24,560
Speaker 1: pay for R and D on a new product. But

890
00:45:24,920 --> 00:45:26,719
Speaker 1: that's not what they do. And I'm going to quote

891
00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:31,600
Speaker 1: from Crane's Chicago Business newsletter next. That debt refinanced two

892
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:34,279
Speaker 1: hundred and ninety four million in existing debt, including one

893
00:45:34,320 --> 00:45:37,319
Speaker 1: hundred million tied to the twenty nineteen acquisition, and helped

894
00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:39,920
Speaker 1: support a two hundred and forty five million dollar dive

895
00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:44,000
Speaker 1: it into shareholders. Essentially, none of the debts supported investment

896
00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:46,719
Speaker 1: in the business. So basically, the good luck of the

897
00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:49,799
Speaker 1: pandemic year let them con their way into getting half

898
00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:51,759
Speaker 1: a billion dollars of debt they were never going to

899
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:54,719
Speaker 1: be able to pay off, most of which they gave themselves.

900
00:45:55,160 --> 00:45:58,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's like all that shit. Like even

901
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 2: we were just talking on on aley'zeitg. So this guy

902
00:46:01,239 --> 00:46:04,520
Speaker 2: who talks about like private equity and how Yeah, another

903
00:46:04,560 --> 00:46:06,520
Speaker 2: way they do it is like when they buy these businesses,

904
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:10,080
Speaker 2: they'll force these companies they take over to sell all

905
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:12,880
Speaker 2: of their property to the private equity firm and then

906
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:15,560
Speaker 2: begin leasing it back to them so they can immediately

907
00:46:15,560 --> 00:46:16,600
Speaker 2: start seeing a profit.

908
00:46:16,640 --> 00:46:20,120
Speaker 1: And you're like, that's not really business, You're just running

909
00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:22,239
Speaker 1: a con yeah, which is.

910
00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:25,080
Speaker 2: You're just yeah, you're sucking it dry from the inside. Yeah.

911
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:28,560
Speaker 1: So back to Frank, he and his business partner have

912
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:31,160
Speaker 1: managed to get together the money to buy a Houston

913
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:34,319
Speaker 1: based carrier called Texas International Airlines. A lot of that

914
00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:38,480
Speaker 1: money comes from Chase Manhattan. Texas International air is a small,

915
00:46:38,600 --> 00:46:42,040
Speaker 1: tottering local kind of local. It was basically in terms

916
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:45,279
Speaker 1: of its size, it was a local Texas airline, but

917
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:48,920
Speaker 1: because it does one flight to Mexico, it's an international,

918
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:52,320
Speaker 1: which means it's regulated by CAB, which like fucks it over. Actually,

919
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:54,760
Speaker 1: because they can't do a lot of the shit smaller

920
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:56,960
Speaker 1: airlines they're able to do to kind of like make

921
00:46:57,000 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: a profit. It was nicknamed Teeter Airlines, which is because like,

922
00:47:02,239 --> 00:47:05,120
Speaker 1: it's such a like the flights are so shitty, Like

923
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:08,680
Speaker 1: they have trash planes, they have the worst pilots. It's

924
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:11,920
Speaker 1: just not great. In the last five years, the company

925
00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 1: had lost twenty million dollars over expanding its fleet and

926
00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:18,239
Speaker 1: taking on debt. It was a long shot that Lorenzo

927
00:47:18,280 --> 00:47:20,160
Speaker 1: would be able to write the ship once he bought

928
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:22,880
Speaker 1: the company, but Chase Manhattan had faith in him, and

929
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:26,600
Speaker 1: he was medically incapable of doubting himself. So there's a

930
00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:29,880
Speaker 1: shareholders meeting in August of nineteen seventy two where Lorenzo

931
00:47:29,920 --> 00:47:34,279
Speaker 1: gets elected president and CEO of Texas International air This

932
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:39,919
Speaker 1: makes him the youngest airline president in history. That'szy. He's

933
00:47:39,960 --> 00:47:42,880
Speaker 1: thirty two, so that is pretty young to be running

934
00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:46,120
Speaker 1: an airline. A couple other cool things happened that year

935
00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:49,440
Speaker 1: for him. He gets his pilot's license. He marries this

936
00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:52,160
Speaker 1: lady who had been like a legal assistant and was

937
00:47:52,200 --> 00:47:56,360
Speaker 1: the daughter of a wealthy Florida real estate mogul. Also

938
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,680
Speaker 1: around the same time, his brother, who had been a

939
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:03,200
Speaker 1: stock broker, dies of heart failure. His brother's like forty three,

940
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:08,359
Speaker 1: which convinces Frank to become a marathon runner. Tragic if

941
00:48:08,360 --> 00:48:12,279
Speaker 1: only he had just continued to be very unhealthy and

942
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:16,480
Speaker 1: do cocaine. We need, like, you know how they have

943
00:48:16,600 --> 00:48:20,319
Speaker 1: like campaigns and some vulnerable areas to like have people like,

944
00:48:20,320 --> 00:48:22,080
Speaker 1: oh there's a lot of heart disease in this in

945
00:48:22,120 --> 00:48:25,000
Speaker 1: this neighborhood or whatever. We should like do these ads

946
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:27,440
Speaker 1: trying to keep people away from fast food. We need

947
00:48:27,480 --> 00:48:31,640
Speaker 1: to have the opposite for like Harvard grads, We're like, you.

948
00:48:31,640 --> 00:48:34,440
Speaker 2: Ever tried cocaine? You ever just done like a shitload

949
00:48:34,440 --> 00:48:34,880
Speaker 2: of cocine.

950
00:48:34,920 --> 00:48:37,960
Speaker 1: Mix that stuff with downers too, Like, just grind your

951
00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:39,600
Speaker 1: valum up with your blow.

952
00:48:39,719 --> 00:48:42,800
Speaker 2: You're good man. The best thing to do is probably

953
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:46,399
Speaker 2: smoke like three grams of meth and then just take

954
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:48,879
Speaker 2: a bunch of benzos man to go to sleep. Yeah,

955
00:48:48,920 --> 00:48:51,960
Speaker 2: benze a, you're gonna feel like Superman, dude. That's how

956
00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:54,560
Speaker 2: fucking That's how like Leah Coca used to do it. Dude, Like,

957
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:56,560
Speaker 2: if you're trying to get like next level with it,

958
00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:58,640
Speaker 2: that's how you got to do it, dude. Yeah, split

959
00:48:58,680 --> 00:48:59,920
Speaker 2: your heart in two directions.

960
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:03,759
Speaker 1: We need to pay a new generation of influenzas to

961
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:11,080
Speaker 1: spit pitch speedballs at business guys. So under the rule

962
00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:14,960
Speaker 1: of the Civil Air Board. Truly local airlines are again

963
00:49:15,040 --> 00:49:17,920
Speaker 1: subject to like fewer of these anti competitive regulations, and

964
00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:20,840
Speaker 1: so they can do stuff like offer discount last minute fairs.

965
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:24,400
Speaker 1: Because TI is in this awkward position, they can't really

966
00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:27,600
Speaker 1: do that, and they're up against their big competitors are Southwest,

967
00:49:27,640 --> 00:49:29,920
Speaker 1: which is a small local airline, and so it's got

968
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:33,880
Speaker 1: more room to maneuver and bran if so, Lorenzo succeeds

969
00:49:33,920 --> 00:49:37,719
Speaker 1: in kind of sliding in between these these two competitors

970
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:41,000
Speaker 1: and he's able to like pull together some profitability. He's

971
00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:43,239
Speaker 1: actually pretty good at this aspect of the business. He

972
00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:46,120
Speaker 1: drops markets that weren't profitable, in flights that had a

973
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:49,439
Speaker 1: poor return. He fires a bunch of employees in order

974
00:49:49,440 --> 00:49:52,839
Speaker 1: to cut payroll into something manageable. And in nineteen seventy three,

975
00:49:52,920 --> 00:49:58,240
Speaker 1: the year after he takes over TI, Texas International posts

976
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:01,560
Speaker 1: its first profit in like five or six years. He'd

977
00:50:01,560 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 1: made a lot of big promises to his employees that like,

978
00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:06,440
Speaker 1: once the company was back in the black, he'd ensure

979
00:50:06,440 --> 00:50:08,600
Speaker 1: that they got rewards for all the hard work they

980
00:50:08,600 --> 00:50:11,680
Speaker 1: did to get TIA back into good health. But as

981
00:50:11,719 --> 00:50:14,279
Speaker 1: soon as they start making a profit, he's like, oh, no,

982
00:50:14,360 --> 00:50:16,320
Speaker 1: I didn't mean that you guys are getting any more money.

983
00:50:16,360 --> 00:50:20,840
Speaker 2: Absolutely, I say that. No, that was a lie. See

984
00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:24,360
Speaker 2: you want to get fired for fucking lying? Yeah, okay,

985
00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:26,520
Speaker 2: then shut up. I never said I would never say

986
00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:27,359
Speaker 2: some shit like that.

987
00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:32,400
Speaker 1: So obviously people are not happy. So the ground workers Union,

988
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:34,400
Speaker 1: which is like, you know, the guys, it's pretty it

989
00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:37,120
Speaker 1: should be obvious what the groundworkers Union is for planes.

990
00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:40,400
Speaker 1: They're the guys on the ground doing shit. They start

991
00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 1: agitating and in December of seventy four they decide to

992
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:47,600
Speaker 1: go on strike. So airline workers are at this point

993
00:50:47,880 --> 00:50:50,920
Speaker 1: the most some of the most powerful unionized people in

994
00:50:50,960 --> 00:50:54,440
Speaker 1: the country. And when the airline workers would go on strike,

995
00:50:54,600 --> 00:50:56,920
Speaker 1: the only kind of way, you know. Again, so when

996
00:50:56,920 --> 00:50:59,520
Speaker 1: you've got a strike, right, a company that's going to

997
00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:02,080
Speaker 1: engage in strike breaking is probably going to bring in scabs.

998
00:51:02,200 --> 00:51:05,640
Speaker 1: And scabs, it's understood always do like a shittier version

999
00:51:05,640 --> 00:51:09,080
Speaker 1: of the job that regular employees do. And you know,

1000
00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:11,600
Speaker 1: when it comes to people like that's a problem with

1001
00:51:11,680 --> 00:51:12,240
Speaker 1: air travel.

1002
00:51:12,320 --> 00:51:12,520
Speaker 2: Right.

1003
00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:14,480
Speaker 1: So if you've got like a coal mine and you

1004
00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:16,560
Speaker 1: bring in scabs, the scabs are going to make you

1005
00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:18,839
Speaker 1: less money. Maybe they're a little more likely to die.

1006
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:21,439
Speaker 1: But like, if you get a bunch of scabs killed

1007
00:51:21,440 --> 00:51:23,600
Speaker 1: in a coal mine, the coal miners aren't going to

1008
00:51:23,680 --> 00:51:25,520
Speaker 1: have that big an issue with it because they hate

1009
00:51:25,520 --> 00:51:27,719
Speaker 1: the scabs, and no one else is really going to

1010
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:30,000
Speaker 1: care because it's just shit happening in the coal mine.

1011
00:51:30,040 --> 00:51:32,640
Speaker 1: Whereas if you bring a bunch of scabs in to

1012
00:51:32,760 --> 00:51:35,640
Speaker 1: the air industry and a plane crashes.

1013
00:51:35,280 --> 00:51:37,840
Speaker 2: A lot of people might get angry at you.

1014
00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:41,560
Speaker 1: You know, So you you have as a company in

1015
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:44,120
Speaker 1: this period, you have like less options for kind of

1016
00:51:44,160 --> 00:51:47,920
Speaker 1: fucking over your unionized employees because it's it's air travel.

1017
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:52,600
Speaker 2: You know. You also have to Yeah, what's that pool

1018
00:51:52,640 --> 00:51:54,520
Speaker 2: of people. I can only imagine when you're like, all

1019
00:51:54,640 --> 00:51:58,120
Speaker 2: right now the bottom of the barrel for airline.

1020
00:51:57,680 --> 00:52:01,279
Speaker 1: Workers, illegal plane fuelers, and ship Yeah, they're probably not

1021
00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:01,839
Speaker 1: great at the.

1022
00:52:01,880 --> 00:52:05,479
Speaker 2: Yeah I could do that, Yeah very Yeah I filled

1023
00:52:05,600 --> 00:52:10,520
Speaker 2: up my car. Yeah, I basically do the thing that's

1024
00:52:10,520 --> 00:52:13,760
Speaker 2: the precursor to stealing catalytic converters in your modern times.

1025
00:52:14,120 --> 00:52:19,320
Speaker 1: Yeah. So they also airlines also, if they're fighting a strike,

1026
00:52:19,360 --> 00:52:24,120
Speaker 1: have to contend with the fact that, you know, because

1027
00:52:24,800 --> 00:52:27,799
Speaker 1: running an airline is more expensive than most things. If

1028
00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:31,799
Speaker 1: you're keeping planes grounded, and you're like canceling flights. It's

1029
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:34,440
Speaker 1: like slightly less expensive to do that than it is,

1030
00:52:34,600 --> 00:52:36,680
Speaker 1: just like set fire to piles of money, you know,

1031
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:39,280
Speaker 1: like you are, you are burning so much cash whenever

1032
00:52:39,360 --> 00:52:42,560
Speaker 1: you're you're knocked down by a strike. So for years,

1033
00:52:42,719 --> 00:52:45,719
Speaker 1: the way airlines would handle strike threats is to just

1034
00:52:45,800 --> 00:52:49,080
Speaker 1: pretty much, very quickly concede to the union right to

1035
00:52:49,120 --> 00:52:50,719
Speaker 1: give them at least some of what they wanted and

1036
00:52:50,800 --> 00:52:51,680
Speaker 1: get folks.

1037
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:53,319
Speaker 2: Back to work. It was nearly always worth it.

1038
00:52:53,719 --> 00:52:57,840
Speaker 1: But Frank Lorenzo hates unions, and he's like, I don't know,

1039
00:52:58,040 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 1: why the fuck are we going to concede to these fuckers?

1040
00:53:00,800 --> 00:53:02,200
Speaker 2: Fuck them?

1041
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:05,319
Speaker 1: So depending on who you ask, he's either kind of

1042
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:07,960
Speaker 1: just too proud, right, like he'll burn his airline to

1043
00:53:08,040 --> 00:53:10,719
Speaker 1: the ground rather than lose face to a bunch of strikers,

1044
00:53:11,440 --> 00:53:14,279
Speaker 1: or he's like a calculated risk taker and he's like,

1045
00:53:14,760 --> 00:53:16,640
Speaker 1: you know, doing the math and figuring out, ah, well,

1046
00:53:16,760 --> 00:53:18,360
Speaker 1: you know we can hold out this much longer, and

1047
00:53:18,400 --> 00:53:20,560
Speaker 1: you know these workers can only hold out this long,

1048
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:23,719
Speaker 1: and this is like a I'm not really sure which

1049
00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:26,680
Speaker 1: version of Frank Lorenzo is more accurate. Probably a little

1050
00:53:26,680 --> 00:53:29,680
Speaker 1: bit of a and a little bit of b right. So,

1051
00:53:29,840 --> 00:53:32,200
Speaker 1: for four and a half months after the groundworkers union

1052
00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:36,279
Speaker 1: votes to strike, no TI plane flies they like, they

1053
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:41,120
Speaker 1: shut down traffic entirely. He furloughs the entire workforce pretty much.

1054
00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:44,480
Speaker 1: Executive salaries are cut to the bone, and eventually, through

1055
00:53:44,480 --> 00:53:47,319
Speaker 1: this grinding battle of attrition, he manages to pull out

1056
00:53:47,360 --> 00:53:49,960
Speaker 1: a victory. And the only reason Frank is able to

1057
00:53:50,040 --> 00:53:53,320
Speaker 1: survive is that when the other airlines see him actually

1058
00:53:53,360 --> 00:53:56,520
Speaker 1: going to war with like one of his big unions,

1059
00:53:56,960 --> 00:54:00,600
Speaker 1: they put together eleven million dollars and strike aid. Like

1060
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:03,640
Speaker 1: other airlines are giving him money to be like here

1061
00:54:03,680 --> 00:54:06,799
Speaker 1: you go, buddy, like keep up the good fight, right yeah, yeah, yeah,

1062
00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:07,480
Speaker 1: welcome over.

1063
00:54:07,760 --> 00:54:08,240
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1064
00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:11,120
Speaker 1: Unions do the same thing, right, Like, it's just this

1065
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:13,880
Speaker 1: is like an owner's union, right, it's good.

1066
00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:17,000
Speaker 2: Fucking grim man, Yeah it is. We love what you're doing, man,

1067
00:54:17,160 --> 00:54:23,240
Speaker 2: just vaporizing fucking will to fuck disguis. We've got you. Yeah,

1068
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:24,400
Speaker 2: it's it's pretty cool.

1069
00:54:24,520 --> 00:54:27,920
Speaker 1: Like. Um. So, the union comes to the table and

1070
00:54:27,960 --> 00:54:31,040
Speaker 1: it ends the strike with very minor concessions from TI

1071
00:54:31,480 --> 00:54:34,520
Speaker 1: and Lorenzo is now a hero of the capitalist class.

1072
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:36,560
Speaker 1: He is not only this kind of like daring corporate

1073
00:54:36,600 --> 00:54:40,120
Speaker 1: raider type guy who brought his company to profitability by cutting.

1074
00:54:39,800 --> 00:54:40,560
Speaker 2: It to the bone.

1075
00:54:40,880 --> 00:54:43,759
Speaker 1: But when his selfish workers put his success at risk,

1076
00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:45,759
Speaker 1: he had like gone to war with them and won.

1077
00:54:46,600 --> 00:54:49,080
Speaker 1: In an interview he gave not long after the settlement,

1078
00:54:49,120 --> 00:54:52,200
Speaker 1: he told a reporter, the groundworkers union has demonstrated little

1079
00:54:52,200 --> 00:54:54,400
Speaker 1: concern for the well being of any of us, for

1080
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:56,440
Speaker 1: that of any of our cities, and of course for

1081
00:54:56,480 --> 00:55:01,120
Speaker 1: the company, which must somehow pay the bill. By nineteen

1082
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:04,480
Speaker 1: seventy six, TI was making more than three million dollars

1083
00:55:04,520 --> 00:55:07,560
Speaker 1: in net profits. It was now healthier than ever, but

1084
00:55:07,719 --> 00:55:10,880
Speaker 1: still too small for Lorenzo's liking. He knew that he

1085
00:55:10,920 --> 00:55:13,279
Speaker 1: was going to need to introduce a major innovation to

1086
00:55:13,280 --> 00:55:16,120
Speaker 1: make his companies stand out from the pack. Here's how

1087
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:20,200
Speaker 1: Texas Monthly describes what happened next. If TI was to survive,

1088
00:55:20,280 --> 00:55:23,120
Speaker 1: Lorenzo had to find a way to beat Southwest's low fares.

1089
00:55:23,360 --> 00:55:27,279
Speaker 1: Prohibited from discounting regular fares, TI had experimented with reductions

1090
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:31,400
Speaker 1: on largely unregulated stand by tickets. The airline had, for instance,

1091
00:55:31,440 --> 00:55:34,160
Speaker 1: promoted a new route from Houston's Hobby Field to Dallas

1092
00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:37,239
Speaker 1: Fort Worth Airfield, by offering stand by fares keyed to

1093
00:55:37,280 --> 00:55:39,680
Speaker 1: the day of the month, one dollar for travel on

1094
00:55:39,760 --> 00:55:42,560
Speaker 1: August first, six dollars for travel on August sixth, and

1095
00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:44,879
Speaker 1: so on. Searching for a steady way to fill those

1096
00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:47,520
Speaker 1: empty seats, the company came up with peanut fares, in

1097
00:55:47,560 --> 00:55:50,080
Speaker 1: which the passengers could lock into cheap fares on certain

1098
00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:55,000
Speaker 1: flights with light passenger loads. This is the birth of

1099
00:55:55,080 --> 00:55:57,880
Speaker 1: the modern system we have of like, oh, you got

1100
00:55:57,920 --> 00:56:01,040
Speaker 1: the super saver seats, and you've got like the extra economy,

1101
00:56:01,040 --> 00:56:02,600
Speaker 1: and you've got like the economy plus.

1102
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:04,880
Speaker 4: Let you know, yea, this is where that all begins.

1103
00:56:05,000 --> 00:56:08,080
Speaker 4: This is so triggering to like airport misery.

1104
00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:12,560
Speaker 1: Yeah really yeah, this is like the start of a

1105
00:56:12,600 --> 00:56:15,399
Speaker 1: lot of that, and it is. It's a mixed bag, right,

1106
00:56:15,880 --> 00:56:20,359
Speaker 1: Like this is a good idea. It works really well financially,

1107
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:24,440
Speaker 1: it's also more efficient, but it's against cab regulations, and

1108
00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:27,279
Speaker 1: so Lorenzo has to lobby the agency to make his

1109
00:56:27,360 --> 00:56:31,760
Speaker 1: peanut faars legal and he succeeds. In January nineteen seventy seven,

1110
00:56:31,840 --> 00:56:35,000
Speaker 1: TI gets granted a one year trial to like attempt

1111
00:56:35,040 --> 00:56:37,920
Speaker 1: to do these new kinds of fairs, and it works

1112
00:56:38,080 --> 00:56:40,799
Speaker 1: really well, Like TI passenger loads on a lot of

1113
00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:43,600
Speaker 1: flights go from like thirty or forty percent to ninety

1114
00:56:43,640 --> 00:56:44,560
Speaker 1: percent or more.

1115
00:56:45,080 --> 00:56:46,200
Speaker 2: Booh yeah.

1116
00:56:46,239 --> 00:56:48,239
Speaker 1: And it's it's one of those things where like Branef

1117
00:56:48,320 --> 00:56:51,759
Speaker 1: starts complaining because this starts eating into their business. And

1118
00:56:52,360 --> 00:56:55,239
Speaker 1: TI they're like TIS advertising, you know that all of

1119
00:56:55,239 --> 00:56:58,840
Speaker 1: their seats are discounted and they aren't. And the agency

1120
00:56:58,920 --> 00:57:01,319
Speaker 1: like there's some minor rules against Lorenzo, but it doesn't

1121
00:57:01,320 --> 00:57:05,320
Speaker 1: actually stop him from like basically doing this shit. And

1122
00:57:05,640 --> 00:57:08,440
Speaker 1: the idea as soon as like he introduces these new

1123
00:57:08,520 --> 00:57:11,600
Speaker 1: kinds of like discounted fares and gets away with it,

1124
00:57:11,600 --> 00:57:14,680
Speaker 1: it starts spreading like wildfire throughout the rest of the industry.

1125
00:57:15,200 --> 00:57:19,320
Speaker 1: And I'll say this, what Frank does here is more

1126
00:57:19,360 --> 00:57:21,680
Speaker 1: of a mixed bag than we tend to get with

1127
00:57:21,760 --> 00:57:25,240
Speaker 1: our like corporate bastards. There's a decent argument that Frank's

1128
00:57:25,280 --> 00:57:28,360
Speaker 1: innovation here it leads to a huge drop in pricing

1129
00:57:28,440 --> 00:57:31,040
Speaker 1: for consumers across the market, and that this is a

1130
00:57:31,040 --> 00:57:33,640
Speaker 1: big part of what opens air travel up to groups

1131
00:57:33,680 --> 00:57:35,440
Speaker 1: of people who would never have been able to afford

1132
00:57:35,480 --> 00:57:40,280
Speaker 1: to fly recreationally. Like frequent flyers hate this because frequent

1133
00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:42,360
Speaker 1: flyer the only people who can afford to be frequent

1134
00:57:42,360 --> 00:57:45,520
Speaker 1: flyers in this period are either independently wealthy or their

1135
00:57:45,600 --> 00:57:49,080
Speaker 1: corporate flyers whose companies are paying for the expensive seats,

1136
00:57:49,120 --> 00:57:51,400
Speaker 1: and they love that the planes are empty and nice,

1137
00:57:51,840 --> 00:57:52,240
Speaker 1: but like.

1138
00:57:52,400 --> 00:57:54,840
Speaker 2: Now the barbarian hordes are fucking there.

1139
00:57:55,200 --> 00:57:59,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, the poor have taken to the skies. You

1140
00:57:59,680 --> 00:58:01,760
Speaker 1: get all so argue that, like, well, this is a

1141
00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:04,760
Speaker 1: lot less wasteful and shitty for the environment than flying

1142
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:07,760
Speaker 1: in planes that are seventy percent in empty. Obviously, the

1143
00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:10,920
Speaker 1: fact that this causes air travel to explode has a

1144
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:14,520
Speaker 1: net horrible increase on like, you know, carbon emissions and shit.

1145
00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:16,960
Speaker 1: I don't think you could really morally put that on

1146
00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:18,520
Speaker 1: Frank because he's not He doesn't.

1147
00:58:18,600 --> 00:58:20,560
Speaker 2: I don't think he knows much about it. He's not

1148
00:58:20,560 --> 00:58:23,480
Speaker 2: like any Exxon exec. He doesn't. Yeah, he's any technology,

1149
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:26,560
Speaker 2: it becomes inevitable, like it's your equity, right, Like, yeah,

1150
00:58:26,600 --> 00:58:28,720
Speaker 2: it was always going to get cheaper and eventually would

1151
00:58:28,760 --> 00:58:31,400
Speaker 2: get to a place where other people could fly. Yeah.

1152
00:58:31,680 --> 00:58:34,280
Speaker 1: So at the same time he's doing this, a national

1153
00:58:34,320 --> 00:58:38,560
Speaker 1: movement has kind of coalesced around the idea of deregulating airlines.

1154
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:41,439
Speaker 1: As I mentioned, earlier this the business of big time

1155
00:58:41,440 --> 00:58:45,360
Speaker 1: air travel was deliberately not a competitive industry in the US,

1156
00:58:45,400 --> 00:58:48,280
Speaker 1: and the same way at least that most businesses were competitive.

1157
00:58:48,800 --> 00:58:51,400
Speaker 1: The sheer expense and the fact that these companies received

1158
00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:55,560
Speaker 1: government subsidies, you know, had allowed kind of air travel

1159
00:58:55,560 --> 00:58:57,480
Speaker 1: to get off the ground. But now that we're in

1160
00:58:57,560 --> 00:59:00,720
Speaker 1: kind of the seventies and stuff the late seventies in particular,

1161
00:59:01,000 --> 00:59:04,040
Speaker 1: a lot of these old airlines are kind of hemorrhaging money,

1162
00:59:04,120 --> 00:59:07,160
Speaker 1: and this makes a pretty good case that deregulation is necessary.

1163
00:59:07,560 --> 00:59:10,600
Speaker 1: The cause was opposed actually by the business a lot

1164
00:59:10,640 --> 00:59:13,320
Speaker 1: of the guys that Frank considered peers, and it was

1165
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:16,800
Speaker 1: also generally opposed from owners of airlines because they're like, well,

1166
00:59:17,240 --> 00:59:19,720
Speaker 1: you know, there's shit that's fucked up about the business,

1167
00:59:19,800 --> 00:59:21,640
Speaker 1: but we understand it the way it is, and if

1168
00:59:21,640 --> 00:59:24,080
Speaker 1: you like deregulate, then we're going to have a bunch

1169
00:59:24,120 --> 00:59:27,560
Speaker 1: of competition, and a lot of our airlines are going

1170
00:59:27,600 --> 00:59:29,919
Speaker 1: to die if we won't be getting subsidies, and shit,

1171
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:31,640
Speaker 1: we're not going to be able to make this stuff work.

1172
00:59:32,120 --> 00:59:35,040
Speaker 1: But this kind of alliance of free market right wing

1173
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:40,360
Speaker 1: economists and liberal democrats get together and agree on deregulating

1174
00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:43,560
Speaker 1: the air, and like democrats like it because cheap flights

1175
00:59:43,600 --> 00:59:45,720
Speaker 1: will be good for the economy, and like it'll open

1176
00:59:45,800 --> 00:59:48,280
Speaker 1: up air travel to working people, and the free market

1177
00:59:48,280 --> 00:59:50,680
Speaker 1: guys like it because that's what they fucking do. And

1178
00:59:50,680 --> 00:59:52,760
Speaker 1: I'm going to quote from a contemporary article in the

1179
00:59:52,760 --> 00:59:55,640
Speaker 1: New York Times here writing about deregulation of the air.

1180
00:59:56,520 --> 00:59:59,440
Speaker 1: Equally compelling was the sense of inanity associated with so

1181
00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:02,800
Speaker 1: many empty seats. In nineteen seventy three, airplanes were flying

1182
01:00:02,800 --> 01:00:05,160
Speaker 1: from New York to Los Angeles with thirty seven percent

1183
01:00:05,200 --> 01:00:08,160
Speaker 1: of their seats filled, says Stephen Bryer, then a lawyer

1184
01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:11,480
Speaker 1: on Kennedy's staff and now a federal judge. This assured

1185
01:00:11,520 --> 01:00:13,440
Speaker 1: the business flyer of an empty seat on which to

1186
01:00:13,520 --> 01:00:15,880
Speaker 1: place his briefcase. But look at how high the fare

1187
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:17,960
Speaker 1: had to be in order to make this possible. What

1188
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:20,320
Speaker 1: was really going on was that the briefcase was paying

1189
01:00:20,360 --> 01:00:24,840
Speaker 1: full fare. The expense accounts said, many of them Republican businessmen,

1190
01:00:24,880 --> 01:00:29,240
Speaker 1: who might otherwise have found government economic controls anathema. Loved

1191
01:00:29,240 --> 01:00:32,880
Speaker 1: federal airline regulation. Service was attentive, delays were rare, planes

1192
01:00:32,880 --> 01:00:35,720
Speaker 1: and airports were uncrowded. So what affairs were high the

1193
01:00:35,760 --> 01:00:38,800
Speaker 1: company picked up the tab. An unusual coalition of free

1194
01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:41,640
Speaker 1: market economists and liberal Democrats fought to loosen the reins

1195
01:00:41,640 --> 01:00:44,640
Speaker 1: on airlines. As Brier puts it, the outcome was going

1196
01:00:44,640 --> 01:00:47,160
Speaker 1: to favor the typical middle class individual. It would be

1197
01:00:47,280 --> 01:00:50,280
Speaker 1: very different from the subsequent deregulation of the telephone service,

1198
01:00:50,320 --> 01:00:53,000
Speaker 1: he says, in which the outcome favored business customers at

1199
01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:57,240
Speaker 1: the expense of the residential customer. Despite practically unanimous opposition

1200
01:00:57,240 --> 01:01:00,680
Speaker 1: from airline executives, deregulation was signed into law by President

1201
01:01:00,800 --> 01:01:02,760
Speaker 1: Jimmy Carter in nineteen seventy eight.

1202
01:01:03,400 --> 01:01:03,520
Speaker 2: MM.

1203
01:01:04,280 --> 01:01:07,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, now, this is not going to entirely work the

1204
01:01:07,920 --> 01:01:11,600
Speaker 1: way they want it to, right, there's as we all know,

1205
01:01:11,720 --> 01:01:14,960
Speaker 1: as we're all living through. But it does make air

1206
01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:21,040
Speaker 1: travel a lot cheaper initially. Now we'll talk later about

1207
01:01:21,120 --> 01:01:23,680
Speaker 1: kind of where things go from there, but it does

1208
01:01:23,840 --> 01:01:25,800
Speaker 1: to some extent work the way they want it to.

1209
01:01:26,840 --> 01:01:30,360
Speaker 1: So Frank Lorenzo was initially frightened by deregulation because he

1210
01:01:30,640 --> 01:01:32,240
Speaker 1: doesn't know how this is going to work, But once

1211
01:01:32,240 --> 01:01:34,800
Speaker 1: it becomes clear that this is happening, he starts looking

1212
01:01:34,840 --> 01:01:37,120
Speaker 1: for ways to make it work for him. A lot

1213
01:01:37,120 --> 01:01:38,800
Speaker 1: of guys are doing that at the time, and one

1214
01:01:38,800 --> 01:01:41,080
Speaker 1: of them is a dude called Donald Burr. He's the

1215
01:01:41,120 --> 01:01:44,720
Speaker 1: founder of People's Express, which is like one of the

1216
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:47,160
Speaker 1: first big budget airlines. You might think of it as

1217
01:01:47,160 --> 01:01:50,920
Speaker 1: like Spirit or Frontier, and kind of the big thing

1218
01:01:50,960 --> 01:01:53,520
Speaker 1: for People's Express is that it's a no frills airline.

1219
01:01:53,560 --> 01:01:56,640
Speaker 1: There's no luxury at all, and every seat on the

1220
01:01:56,640 --> 01:01:59,520
Speaker 1: plane has the same low cost point, right, And his

1221
01:01:59,560 --> 01:02:02,640
Speaker 1: plan is to it's this weird hybrid of shit because

1222
01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:05,200
Speaker 1: he's Burr is like, we're going to keep costs low

1223
01:02:05,440 --> 01:02:08,480
Speaker 1: by cutting out luxuries and also not using union labor.

1224
01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:11,840
Speaker 1: But also in order to kind of compensate for that,

1225
01:02:11,880 --> 01:02:14,320
Speaker 1: Burr is like, all of our employees will get stock

1226
01:02:14,400 --> 01:02:17,120
Speaker 1: in the company. That's why it's People's Express, like where

1227
01:02:17,120 --> 01:02:20,200
Speaker 1: all everyone like owns a part of the company. It's

1228
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:22,840
Speaker 1: it's an interesting vision. You don't really have stuff like

1229
01:02:22,920 --> 01:02:24,440
Speaker 1: this that much anymore, is it.

1230
01:02:24,440 --> 01:02:27,880
Speaker 2: Like, so it was legitimately like worker owned airline to

1231
01:02:28,040 --> 01:02:31,920
Speaker 2: an extent, like they had like forty eight percent of

1232
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:32,240
Speaker 2: the tame.

1233
01:02:32,320 --> 01:02:35,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're not going to actually be in control and

1234
01:02:35,080 --> 01:02:37,040
Speaker 1: this doesn't work out in the long run. Although this

1235
01:02:37,040 --> 01:02:39,120
Speaker 1: does I think become frontier, like that is kind of

1236
01:02:39,200 --> 01:02:42,640
Speaker 1: where it anyway, whatever, that's the idea that Burr has.

1237
01:02:43,240 --> 01:02:48,280
Speaker 1: Now Lorenzo sees this, this plan by Burr as fundamentally flawed. First,

1238
01:02:48,440 --> 01:02:51,000
Speaker 1: fuck giving workers stock. But more to the point, he

1239
01:02:51,080 --> 01:02:52,760
Speaker 1: knows that rich people are always going to want to

1240
01:02:52,760 --> 01:02:56,600
Speaker 1: pay more for a nice flying experience. And Lorenzo's like,

1241
01:02:56,920 --> 01:02:59,120
Speaker 1: you know what, it might actually be worth even more

1242
01:02:59,360 --> 01:03:01,520
Speaker 1: to rich people to pay for an ice flight if

1243
01:03:01,520 --> 01:03:04,400
Speaker 1: they get to watch columns of poor people file passed

1244
01:03:04,400 --> 01:03:07,280
Speaker 1: and cram themselves into like a cattle pin, right, Like,

1245
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:08,960
Speaker 1: we might actually be able to make more money on

1246
01:03:09,080 --> 01:03:11,240
Speaker 1: rich people if they get to see poor people.

1247
01:03:11,040 --> 01:03:13,520
Speaker 2: Having a worse style. Of course, Yeah, we've reinforced the

1248
01:03:13,520 --> 01:03:14,360
Speaker 2: class structure.

1249
01:03:14,480 --> 01:03:17,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's going to make these folks thrilled. Here's the

1250
01:03:17,600 --> 01:03:20,680
Speaker 1: New York Times. The wave of the future, Lorenzo insisted,

1251
01:03:20,760 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 1: was a flexible pricing system with a wide variety of

1252
01:03:23,200 --> 01:03:27,040
Speaker 1: fairs and services tailored to different tastes and pocketbooks. Such

1253
01:03:27,080 --> 01:03:30,040
Speaker 1: a system, enforced today, with some passengers paying five hundred

1254
01:03:30,080 --> 01:03:32,480
Speaker 1: dollars seated next to others paying one hundred and fifty,

1255
01:03:32,680 --> 01:03:35,160
Speaker 1: makes it possible to extract a premium from the business

1256
01:03:35,160 --> 01:03:39,160
Speaker 1: flyer while simultaneously offering bargains that entice the discretionary traveler.

1257
01:03:39,440 --> 01:03:43,120
Speaker 1: In Lorenzo's terms, it creates travel. In nineteen eighty, Burr

1258
01:03:43,160 --> 01:03:46,280
Speaker 1: left Texas International to start People Express, taking with him

1259
01:03:46,360 --> 01:03:50,240
Speaker 1: Gerald L. Gittner, the marketing vice president, and several other executives.

1260
01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:53,440
Speaker 1: That same year, Lorenzo established Texas Air as a holding

1261
01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:57,080
Speaker 1: company for Texas International, a symbol of his expansive intentions

1262
01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,680
Speaker 1: and expand he did. His first move was the creation

1263
01:03:59,680 --> 01:04:02,920
Speaker 1: of a low fair carrier, New York Air. Lorenzo initially

1264
01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:05,480
Speaker 1: set about wooing business flyers in the Boston, New York

1265
01:04:05,560 --> 01:04:09,200
Speaker 1: Washington shuttle market, monopolized by Eastern airlines. New York Air

1266
01:04:09,320 --> 01:04:11,600
Speaker 1: usually charged less than Eastern, but offered more in the

1267
01:04:11,640 --> 01:04:14,920
Speaker 1: way of reserve seats, snacks, and beverages, an enthusiastic service.

1268
01:04:15,200 --> 01:04:17,720
Speaker 1: The non union employees earned less than their counterparts at

1269
01:04:17,720 --> 01:04:22,320
Speaker 1: other airlines. So like, you know, he's he's he's doing

1270
01:04:22,320 --> 01:04:25,040
Speaker 1: this mix of cutting shit to the bone and making

1271
01:04:25,080 --> 01:04:27,880
Speaker 1: sure there's special options for people who are willing to

1272
01:04:27,920 --> 01:04:30,600
Speaker 1: like pay banks, so that rich people can like you know,

1273
01:04:30,920 --> 01:04:33,600
Speaker 1: have a reason to be on flights too. And this

1274
01:04:33,600 --> 01:04:36,200
Speaker 1: this winds up being a lot smarter than like this

1275
01:04:36,280 --> 01:04:39,400
Speaker 1: kind of like weirdly sort of communist plan that Burris

1276
01:04:39,400 --> 01:04:43,360
Speaker 1: pushing where everyone has the same seat, and it's just

1277
01:04:43,480 --> 01:04:47,840
Speaker 1: it's more financially successful. So you know, as this is

1278
01:04:47,880 --> 01:04:50,240
Speaker 1: all going on, the seventies are drawing to a close,

1279
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:53,440
Speaker 1: the Reagan eighties are starting up. Everything's coming up. Frank

1280
01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:56,560
Speaker 1: Lorenzo unions are taking hits left and right. He's making

1281
01:04:56,600 --> 01:04:59,440
Speaker 1: more money than ever. Cocaine is flowing like wine, and

1282
01:04:59,480 --> 01:05:02,840
Speaker 1: it was time for another bold move. He was going

1283
01:05:02,880 --> 01:05:06,640
Speaker 1: to take over the grand dam of the sky. Continental

1284
01:05:06,760 --> 01:05:12,440
Speaker 1: Airlines like and Continental is back in the day. So

1285
01:05:12,520 --> 01:05:16,040
Speaker 1: today United Airlines uses their like logo and livery right.

1286
01:05:16,840 --> 01:05:19,720
Speaker 1: Continental back in the day is like when you see

1287
01:05:19,840 --> 01:05:23,000
Speaker 1: like pictures of really nice flights, it's often Continental. They

1288
01:05:23,000 --> 01:05:26,480
Speaker 1: are the fucking Gucci airline. Like this is the nice shit, right,

1289
01:05:26,520 --> 01:05:28,760
Speaker 1: this is Robert Six's airline.

1290
01:05:30,000 --> 01:05:30,680
Speaker 2: Yeah it is.

1291
01:05:30,760 --> 01:05:33,760
Speaker 1: It is like the fanciest airline out there, but it's

1292
01:05:33,800 --> 01:05:37,800
Speaker 1: hemorrhaging money. And fucking Frank Lorenzo is like, I'm gonna

1293
01:05:37,800 --> 01:05:41,240
Speaker 1: buy this motherfucker and I'm gonna gut it, and we

1294
01:05:41,280 --> 01:05:43,840
Speaker 1: are going to talk about that and how he kind

1295
01:05:43,920 --> 01:05:48,680
Speaker 1: of kills a lot of aspects of the way unions

1296
01:05:48,720 --> 01:05:52,480
Speaker 1: had worked and the labor, like labor had successfully like

1297
01:05:52,520 --> 01:05:55,480
Speaker 1: fought for shit, Like he goes to war with these people,

1298
01:05:55,560 --> 01:05:57,960
Speaker 1: and it's a pretty nuts experience. But that's all in

1299
01:05:58,080 --> 01:06:01,320
Speaker 1: part two for right now. What I want to talk about, Miles,

1300
01:06:01,560 --> 01:06:03,439
Speaker 1: is your fucking pluggables. How are they doing?

1301
01:06:04,000 --> 01:06:05,920
Speaker 2: Oh, they're good. You can plug them in, you can

1302
01:06:06,000 --> 01:06:11,320
Speaker 2: unplug them. Check out the Daily Zeitgeist or four or

1303
01:06:11,360 --> 01:06:15,440
Speaker 2: Miles and Jack on Mad boostis that's trash TV, basketball

1304
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:18,040
Speaker 2: and daily news, whichever one you want. Hell yeah, So

1305
01:06:18,120 --> 01:06:18,720
Speaker 2: there you go.

1306
01:06:20,400 --> 01:06:23,720
Speaker 1: And you can also get this podcast without ads at

1307
01:06:23,760 --> 01:06:29,200
Speaker 1: cooler Zone Media if you mail Sophie, I don't know money,

1308
01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:31,320
Speaker 1: probably this is.

1309
01:06:32,320 --> 01:06:34,160
Speaker 4: And we we at cool Zone Media have a new

1310
01:06:34,160 --> 01:06:35,160
Speaker 4: show with Jake Canrahan.

1311
01:06:35,240 --> 01:06:39,480
Speaker 3: It's called sad Oligarc. It's fantastic on all the apps,

1312
01:06:39,760 --> 01:06:41,720
Speaker 3: including cooler Zone Media.

1313
01:06:42,280 --> 01:06:44,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, where you'll get it without without ads. So you

1314
01:06:44,840 --> 01:06:48,040
Speaker 1: want to have to hear about the Reagan coin, uh,

1315
01:06:48,160 --> 01:06:50,480
Speaker 1: which which fits in well with today's topic.

1316
01:06:50,320 --> 01:06:56,840
Speaker 4: It really does. That's another fucking episode. Behind the Bastards

1317
01:06:56,920 --> 01:06:59,480
Speaker 4: is a production of cool Zone Media. For more from

1318
01:06:59,520 --> 01:07:04,080
Speaker 4: cool Zone, visit our website coolzonemedia dot com, or check

1319
01:07:04,160 --> 01:07:07,080
Speaker 4: us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

1320
01:07:07,160 --> 01:07:08,360
Speaker 4: you get your podcasts.