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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg P and L Podcast. I'm pim Fox.

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Speaker 1: Along with my co host Lisa Abramowitz. Each day we

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Speaker 1: bring you the most important, noteworthy, and useful interviews for

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Speaker 1: you and your money, whether you're at the grocery store

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Speaker 1: or the trading floor. Find the Bloomberg P and L

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Speaker 1: Podcast on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, and Bloomberg dot com. Well,

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Speaker 1: we've got an investment professional with us. Elaine Stokes is

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Speaker 1: the vice president co portfolio manager of the Loomis Sales

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Speaker 1: Bond Fund based in Boston, but Elaine joins us here

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Speaker 1: in our leven Thrio studio. Lane, thank you for coming in.

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Speaker 1: Can we just start off with more of a theoretical

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Speaker 1: question passive versus active investing, because that seems to be

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Speaker 1: a debate that continues specifically in the stock market, but

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Speaker 1: has now moved over into the bond market in a

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Speaker 1: in a really big way. Where where do you come

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Speaker 1: down on this and what are some of the advantages

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Speaker 1: and disadvantages of both of those strategies? Okay, um, Well,

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Speaker 1: you know I'm an active manager, so I have to start.

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Speaker 1: I know you you got that bios the bias. Okay, um,

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Speaker 1: let me start there, but uh, you know, this probably

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Speaker 1: room for both UM. But when all of a sudden

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Speaker 1: done UM. I think what we're finding and from our

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Speaker 1: perspective is the more money that's going into passive is

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Speaker 1: going to a lot of it is going into a

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Speaker 1: new kind of passive, right the e t f s,

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Speaker 1: which are which are real fast money territory, and it's

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Speaker 1: going to do things like it did to the high

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Speaker 1: yield market last week. It's going to create more volatility

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Speaker 1: on news and that volatility is going to allow the

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Speaker 1: active managers who are doing the research and doing the

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Speaker 1: deep dives to take advantage of it. So you think

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Speaker 1: that the high old bond ETFs have exacerbated the atility

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Speaker 1: or caused it in the past few days, Is that right?

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Speaker 1: I think yeah, I think they exacerbated it, Yes, because

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Speaker 1: it's so easy in and out when UM of an

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Speaker 1: e t F Where what had happened prior to this

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Speaker 1: is that UM mutual funds, we're making it harder for

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Speaker 1: for timers to get in and out quickly because hey,

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Speaker 1: mutual funds want to invest for the long term. So

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Speaker 1: were you and was Loomas Sales actively buying specific credits

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Speaker 1: last week? And even you know today as the E

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Speaker 1: T F Cell it absolutely when the market is trading off,

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Speaker 1: you can you can expect that Loomas Sales is going

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Speaker 1: to be a buyer. So that means that you think

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Speaker 1: that this is a blip and it's time to have

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Speaker 1: your list of names and which things you like and

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Speaker 1: to get them on the cheap. Yeah, and you know

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Speaker 1: you have to remember when you're a true bond picker,

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Speaker 1: which we are, and your your research driven that even

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Speaker 1: if the market is going down and you think, I

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Speaker 1: think this, well, we think this volatility is going to continue.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot. I mean, look at the number of

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Speaker 1: news stories there were last week that were negative or

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Speaker 1: or created uncertainty. We expect they'll be continued volatility. But

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Speaker 1: if you've done your deep dive research, you take advantage

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Speaker 1: of each of these bouts of volatility to add a

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Speaker 1: little hair, add a little there. You're not spending your

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Speaker 1: last time yet. The notion that as an investor, you

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Speaker 1: hold this inventory and you want to hold it to maturity,

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Speaker 1: I would imagine unless someone's coming along and offering you

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Speaker 1: a huge premium to what you paid, is that would

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Speaker 1: that be accurate? Or Yeah, you know, we are very

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Speaker 1: long term holders you know, um, you know easily hold

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Speaker 1: bonds three or four years. I have bonds that I

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Speaker 1: feel like I bought when they were issued and it's

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Speaker 1: twenty years later. Um. But it's a little bit more.

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Speaker 1: You have to act to the market. Not many stories

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Speaker 1: will last for the life of the bond exactly as

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Speaker 1: they were, you know, the short bonds, the three to

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Speaker 1: five years. Yes, but when you're you do what we do,

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Speaker 1: which is oftentimes we buy the long bond because that's

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Speaker 1: the lowest dollar price and that's where you have the

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Speaker 1: most upside. So we've noticed that the sectors that have

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Speaker 1: gotten uniquely punished over this sell off have been telecommunications

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Speaker 1: and healthcare. Are you buying in those sectors? Yes? Which

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Speaker 1: which do you think has been oversold most? Um, Well,

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Speaker 1: that's a good question. Uh, it's really been which name

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Speaker 1: and not not right now because we're still active in

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Speaker 1: the in the space. Um. But I think that you

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Speaker 1: can easily dig through, um, whether it's in healthcare, the

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Speaker 1: pharmaceutical names, or the health or the hospital companies, and

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Speaker 1: they're all being punished, and you can find the one

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Speaker 1: or two that are going to be long term okay

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Speaker 1: companies just because something gets downgraded. Just because a company

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Speaker 1: um is moving to a different phase doesn't mean as

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Speaker 1: a bond investor you're not still going to get paid.

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Speaker 1: You just might get more carry along the way. Can

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Speaker 1: you give any comment about this seemingly a trend where

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Speaker 1: governments and some corporates are issuing bonds fifty to a

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Speaker 1: hundred years into the future. Yeah. Um, we liked to

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Speaker 1: buy the long glow dollar price bond, but we also

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Speaker 1: also like to have some visibility into into the story,

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Speaker 1: you know, and a bond that is issued fifty hundred

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Speaker 1: years I guess only governments could do that, um, but hey,

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Speaker 1: we've even seen companies countries disappear right uh in in

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Speaker 1: this geopolitical environment would make me really, really nervous. It's

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Speaker 1: hard to envision the world in fifty years. And Elena,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate

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Speaker 1: you coming in. Elaine Stokes, vice president and uh CO

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Speaker 1: portfolio manager of the Lomas Sales Bond Fund in Boston,

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Speaker 1: but she joins us here in our eleven three oh

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Speaker 1: studios lots of interesting things. Lomas is a buyer amid

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Speaker 1: the selling. As I mentioned earlier, we are awaiting testimony

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Speaker 1: from Attorney General Jeff Sessions in front of Congress, and

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Speaker 1: here to give us a preview of what to expect,

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Speaker 1: is Billy Billy House, Congressional reporter for Bloomberg. Billy, what

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Speaker 1: are we expecting to learn? Or is this simply going

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Speaker 1: to be an experience of uh sort of partisan bickering.

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Speaker 1: I love. We're gonna find out. And and actually the

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Speaker 1: chairman of the committee uh in this hearing is is

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Speaker 1: giving his open remarks right now the Attorney General Jeff

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Speaker 1: Sessions will speak momentarily. UH. What we're gonna find is

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Speaker 1: that Republicans are going to try to steer this conversation,

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Speaker 1: this hearing away from anything to do, if they could,

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Speaker 1: with the alleged Trump cooperation collusion with Russian meddling, uh

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Speaker 1: to to other areas, in fact, into investigations of Hillary

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Speaker 1: Clinton and her husband. Democrats meanwhile, we want to stick

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Speaker 1: to the topic and and go after Mr Sessions for

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Speaker 1: what they say are his inconsistent remarks about what he

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Speaker 1: knew about Russian context. Billy. There's also a report that

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Speaker 1: there are six Democratic senators that want an inspector general

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Speaker 1: investigation of Commerce Secretary Wilburg Ross. Why are they doing

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Speaker 1: all this. I mean, is this really substantive to the

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Speaker 1: operation of government or is this just inside the belt

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Speaker 1: Way UH politics? Well, UH ross thing. I think it's

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Speaker 1: quid pro quail. I mean, they've they've sat by as

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Speaker 1: Republicans in particularly in the House, for the last month,

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Speaker 1: have launched investigations into UH two thousand and ten uranium

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Speaker 1: deal involving UH members of the Obama administration, including Hillary Clinton.

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Speaker 1: They've launched new investigations into her email and UH scandal

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Speaker 1: and UH and into her dealings even with Benghazi still so,

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Speaker 1: I guess Democrats are scraping to find something to launch

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Speaker 1: of their own. UH six Democrats, though, won't get anything done.

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Speaker 1: They would need something from the majority. Does any of

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Speaker 1: this end up sticking? I mean, because if these people

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Speaker 1: stick around in Washington, they have to work with each other,

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Speaker 1: at least on the superficial level. Does any of this

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Speaker 1: create even more bad feelings and bad blood to the

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Speaker 1: point where no one's gonna work with anybody because they're

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Speaker 1: not gonna even talk to each other at us create

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Speaker 1: the bad letter does create at tensions that make even

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Speaker 1: the most basic bipartisanship difficult. However, the impact on the

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Speaker 1: American public is unclear. Polls are showing that, uh, the

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Speaker 1: Russia collusion investigation. Really at this point, even uh Special

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Speaker 1: Counsel Robert Mueller's probe hasn't registered much with them yet.

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Speaker 1: But we'll see what his findings are in the end.

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Speaker 1: I'm wondering what actually could come from these hearings, In

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Speaker 1: other words, is anything that will be said actionable? Well? Uh,

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Speaker 1: last night Justice Aspartment released a statement that it would

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Speaker 1: be looking into potentially uh some Clinton administration Hillary Clinton matters,

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Speaker 1: including this two thousand ten uranium deal. Uh. That opened

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Speaker 1: the door for the idea of a potential second special

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Speaker 1: prosecutors since Mr Sessions himself can't get involved. Uh, that

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Speaker 1: may possibly come out of and we'll see some discussion

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Speaker 1: of that this hearing. And just momentarily, Billy, you've looked

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Speaker 1: at the polls for the favorable or unfavorable rating from

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Speaker 1: members of Congress, and certainly they don't need any guidance

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Speaker 1: as to what the public thinks about them. Why do

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Speaker 1: they persist in the constant behavior that has given them

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Speaker 1: such low poll ratings. Uh. Well, Republicans, obviously heading into

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Speaker 1: a mid term election next year, want to hold onto

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Speaker 1: their majorities in both the House and Senate, and are

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Speaker 1: obviously worried about whatever is going to be found about

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Speaker 1: the Trump administration that could help drag them down. Democrats

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Speaker 1: are the reverse of that. They're seeing they're breathing heavy

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Speaker 1: a little bit about next year. Well, I'm just wondering,

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Speaker 1: Billy about the special prosecutor process. My impression was that

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Speaker 1: it was for standing politicians are big political figures. Can

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Speaker 1: you sort of correct me on that, because it seems

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Speaker 1: like if they could open some kind of uh investigation

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Speaker 1: into a former politician that no longer has political cloud

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Speaker 1: in any kind of concrete way, is that is that quit?

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Speaker 1: Is that normal? Well, this with regard to Hillary Clinton

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Speaker 1: and her husband, former President Bill Clinton. Any Uh, this

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Speaker 1: is something that that the the Attorney Journal himself may

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Speaker 1: have brought upon himself. He recused himself from all matters

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Speaker 1: related to the Clintons. Therefore, any investigation at all into

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Speaker 1: wrongdoing by them in the past, by nature will require

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Speaker 1: a special counsel or prosecutor. That hasn't we haven't reached

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Speaker 1: that point yet. But it's it's what Republicans are drumming

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Speaker 1: up to kind of counter the noise over the Russian

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Speaker 1: inclusion investigation into the Trump campaign. Billy, is there any

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Speaker 1: way that you can offer any anecdote or story about

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Speaker 1: the mood that exists in Washington, Because not only do

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Speaker 1: you have the Attorney General testifying before the House Judiciary Committee,

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Speaker 1: but also you have the revelations regarding uh roy More,

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Speaker 1: the Republican candidate to replace Jeff Sessions as a Senator

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Speaker 1: for Alabama, and then you have this constant sniping. What

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Speaker 1: is what is the mood of the people who actually

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Speaker 1: have to live this on a day to day basis

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Speaker 1: of very negative, very negative in the House for instance,

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Speaker 1: Uh Uh, there's even uh upset on the Democrats part

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Speaker 1: that Speaker Paul Ryant, who promised to have one of

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Speaker 1: the most open speakerships in legislative processes in history, has

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Speaker 1: basically closed down any amendment system on the floor. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And this has been countered by uh, you know, absolutely

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Speaker 1: no Democratic buying on on the Republican tax overhaul plan. So,

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Speaker 1: I mean this is having real impact on legislation that

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Speaker 1: needs to get done. And Republicans are still trying to

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Speaker 1: as they did with the healthcare bill, trying to get

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Speaker 1: it done, um, even among disagreements with themselves. And this

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Speaker 1: all playing out against all these other weird developments. The

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Speaker 1: Alabama sent a race Donald Jrs WEEKI leagues communications, and uh,

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Speaker 1: of course the collusion investigations, of which we have multiple

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Speaker 1: panels looking into. Well, Billy, That's what I was gonna

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Speaker 1: ask you about, was we are all waiting whether or

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Speaker 1: not the GOP can get through the tax bill. And

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Speaker 1: I wonder, does this hearing that we're listening in on

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Speaker 1: today does this matter it turns to that policy, you

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Speaker 1: know what I mean? Does this sort of lift up

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Speaker 1: a roadblock for some of these policies, the most important

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Speaker 1: of which is the tax policy right now getting through? Well,

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Speaker 1: in one regard, I think it actually may force Republicans

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Speaker 1: to put their foot on the pedal, I mean, to

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Speaker 1: press down to get this thing done before something they

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Speaker 1: fear might really bad come out about their parties uh

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Speaker 1: elected president and uh uh and the difficulty in getting

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Speaker 1: anything done if parts of his campaign or even his

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Speaker 1: administration come under indictment. So what I think is happening

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Speaker 1: is is this is speeding up the process for Republicans

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Speaker 1: now whether they can agree amongst themselves what exactly they

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Speaker 1: want an attax overhaul bill by Christmas is anybody's guest.

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Speaker 1: Right now, the Senate and the House are far apart. Billy.

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Speaker 1: You've also had the joy of having to write stories

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Speaker 1: regarding Donald Trump Jr. And his relationship with Wiki Leaks

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Speaker 1: and also the Vice president. Could you just enlighten us

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Speaker 1: a little bit. Yeah, yesterday the Atlantic broke news about

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Speaker 1: congressional committees having copies of direct messages between week Leaks

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Speaker 1: and Donald Trump Jr. Both leading up to the election

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Speaker 1: last November and afterwards. This was kind of startling because

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Speaker 1: they've denied that, including Vice President Mike Pence, denied that

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Speaker 1: last year. Well, it turns out there were some communications,

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Speaker 1: not any A lot of it was polite responses from

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Speaker 1: messages from WEEKI Leaks by Donald Trump Jr. But some

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Speaker 1: some eyebrow raising communications that may suggest some coordination, if

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Speaker 1: not legal collusion. And the upshot was the Vice President

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Speaker 1: himself put out statement through a spokeswoman last night that

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Speaker 1: he was completely unaware of these contacts. All right, Well, Billy,

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Speaker 1: I want to thank you very much. Billy House is

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Speaker 1: our congressional reporter for Bloomberg. We're gonna let you get

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Speaker 1: back and organized for this hearing. Alright, for success in

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Speaker 1: retail we of course turned to BERTA. Flickinger. He joins

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Speaker 1: us as he was just speaking earlier during our program,

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Speaker 1: and of course we're monitoring what's going on in Washington

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Speaker 1: with the testimony of Attorney General Jeff Sessions. Bert Flickinger,

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Speaker 1: Managing director of Strategic Resource Group. The topic Walmart and

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Speaker 1: its plans versus. So let's say Target, Walmart will release

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Speaker 1: its results I believe on Thursday, right, and Target releases

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Speaker 1: results tomorrow. Is this really a tale of merchandizing that's

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Speaker 1: gone wrong? Or is there a vision, a strategic vision

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Speaker 1: that has just fallen off the sort of the radar

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Speaker 1: here with when it comes to Target, because they were

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Speaker 1: hot and Walmart was not him. It's the old Janis

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Speaker 1: Joplin a combination the two. Is you synthesize so well,

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Speaker 1: it's merchandizing, its vision and its leadership. Walmart has all

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Speaker 1: of the above, and targets really unbalanced in every area.

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Speaker 1: Why is that? Why? Why is Target not being able

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Speaker 1: to get its act together? I thought they were great

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Speaker 1: getting into the grocery business, and they were doing all

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Speaker 1: kinds of things with RF you know, radio frequency tags

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Speaker 1: and so on. They were, but it really coincides from Um,

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Speaker 1: the passing of Bruce Bliss Dayton, the last of the

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Speaker 1: Dayton brothers and the founding family and the last of

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Speaker 1: the Dayton CEO. She the best combination of family and

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Speaker 1: professional management. And then with Ulric and uh Steinhoffel and

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Speaker 1: now Cornell, you've got the Mackenzie what I call co

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Speaker 1: monarchy coming in. And one of the reasons, ironically best

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Speaker 1: Buy really picked up in the last few years is

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Speaker 1: Target left so many of its best and brightest go

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Speaker 1: they got picked up by best Buy. Walmart pushed out

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Speaker 1: all the politicians from poor executive search and now has

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Speaker 1: all the producers. And so it's like the days of

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Speaker 1: Mr Sam Walton, the founder from nineteen sixty two. Doug McMillan,

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Speaker 1: current Walmart CEO, was his last hand picked person. Doug

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Speaker 1: was banished to China by all all the politicians who

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Speaker 1: didn't want him there to be promoted. Since he came

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Speaker 1: back with Greg Varrant and many other talented people and

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Speaker 1: recruiting Dave Criscione from Amazon, it's they've turned the tables

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Speaker 1: and Target outsources everything, and hence his poor service there.

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Speaker 1: They've been out of stock on cough cold and Walmart

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Speaker 1: like Kroger has its own meteorologists, so they not only

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Speaker 1: have cough cold in stock, but they have it on order.

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Speaker 1: When I asked Target why they don't have it, they said, well,

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Speaker 1: we'll email Robbie the e t M. I said, what's that,

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Speaker 1: they said, the Electronic Transportation Manager. He'll see if it's in,

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Speaker 1: so a lot of people be sick and we'll have

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Speaker 1: to have to go to Walmart and CVS and Walgreen's. Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, the the idea that Walmart has its own

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Speaker 1: meteorologist is amazing. Uh. It also has been incredibly forward

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Speaker 1: thinking when it comes to becoming sort of a lender

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Speaker 1: in many ways or acting in a financial services capacity.

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Speaker 1: It's walpay is set to take over Venmo and uh

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Speaker 1: and even Apple pay uh in the near future just

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Speaker 1: because it has developed such a following with its clients.

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Speaker 1: I'm just wondering, from that perspective, how much do you

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Speaker 1: think Walmart's going to earn from its financial services arm

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Speaker 1: And can you give us a sense of how long

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Speaker 1: this has been in the works. I mean, how quickly

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Speaker 1: has this popped up as a sort of dominant player. Uh, Lisa,

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Speaker 1: all great insights is always in for Walmart. It's something

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Speaker 1: I've been looking at for twenty five years. And as

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Speaker 1: you and PIM have reported well, with Walmart's lawsuits versus

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Speaker 1: the banks, GPC, general purpose credit card companies, Visa Master

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Speaker 1: discover uh AMAX for cheating up the interchange rates on

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Speaker 1: the on the debit cards uh and the and the

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Speaker 1: credit cards. Walmart has been looking at getting into financial

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Speaker 1: services for a long time. Under this administration, it's more accommodative,

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Speaker 1: but at the same time, it's Walmart doing good to

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Speaker 1: raise the standards of livings for society. Because when I

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Speaker 1: go Route eleven, Route fifteen in the rural areas of Mississippi, Louisiana, Boaz, Alabama,

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Speaker 1: et cetera, you see pay day loans, title loans for cars,

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Speaker 1: trailer homes everybody else. People are down and out financially.

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Speaker 1: So Walmart's going with the cheapest loan systems to make

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Speaker 1: their financial circumstances better for their consumers. Lower interchange rate

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Speaker 1: so they can in turn lower prices and lesa to

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Speaker 1: your great power rally of strength on high yield bonds.

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Speaker 1: Walmart's realizing that the vendors are really turning their backs

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Speaker 1: on the reverse category killers and the category dominant retailer.

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Speaker 1: So is the bonds trade down bankruptcy toys r US

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Speaker 1: trade down on pet smart bontan Stein Mart right aid.

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Speaker 1: Walmart's becoming a shopping center unto itself and trying to

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Speaker 1: capture the card data with the financial services. You're referencing

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Speaker 1: with the data and becoming the destination placed financially operationally,

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Speaker 1: UH and click and collectus as well as base basic

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Speaker 1: rhythm of retail and targets out of rhythm at this point.

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Speaker 1: Bert Flickincher always in rhythm, Thank you very much, Managing Director,

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Speaker 1: Strategic Resource Group, giving us some insight into the world

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Speaker 1: of Walmart and Target. Once again. Target will release its

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Speaker 1: results tomorrow. Walmart is scheduled to release its results on Thursday.

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Speaker 1: We have been talking about Venezuela, about the fact that

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Speaker 1: Venezuela put a X drug kingpin in charge of debt negotiations,

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Speaker 1: asked US investors to come down to Venezuela to discuss

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Speaker 1: these negotiations, and then very few of them, if any

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Speaker 1: actually want here to talk about this meeting, which lasted

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Speaker 1: all of thirty minutes. Is Ben Bartonstein. He's Emerging Markets

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Speaker 1: reporter for the America's for Bloomberg News coming to us

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Speaker 1: from Lima, Peru. Ben, thank you so much for joining us.

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Speaker 1: Can you just give us some color from this eating certainly, Lisa, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there was lots of but very little substance from the

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Speaker 1: meeting in Caracas yesterday. Uh, these debt negotiations, which were

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Speaker 1: greeted with much fanfare, President Maduro saying more than four

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Speaker 1: investors planning to attend, and the government literally rolling out

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Speaker 1: a red carpet for investors who arrived to the White

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Speaker 1: Palace um and we're greeted with goodie bags filled the

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Speaker 1: chocolates and coffee, serve a juice, rapaz and cochapas, which

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Speaker 1: are these venezuela and corn pancakes. But inside the White

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Speaker 1: Palace there was very little substance to the meeting itself.

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Speaker 1: The only Venezuelan official to speak was Vice President tark

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Speaker 1: Eli Sami, who, as you mentioned, was designated designated as

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Speaker 1: a drug kingpin by the U. S. Treasury in February.

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Speaker 1: He's been tasked to lead this debt renegotiation committee, and

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Speaker 1: he spent the majority of his talk railing against the

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Speaker 1: Trump administration, which has imposed tighter sank on the Venezuelan

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Speaker 1: government and discussing an international conspiracy that he feels is

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Speaker 1: meant to bring down the Maduro government. He did pledge

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Speaker 1: to continue paying debt both by petias of the state

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Speaker 1: oil company and the sovereign. That's been something that the

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Speaker 1: Madureau administration has taken much pride in doing. But in

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Speaker 1: terms of any significant proposals for how to restructure the debt,

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Speaker 1: there was none of that. Hey Ben, When when does

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Speaker 1: the government run out of money? That's a great question.

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Speaker 1: That is something that traders have been asking themselves for

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Speaker 1: quite a while. PIM and really they have money as

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Speaker 1: long as it partially it comes down to when lender's

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Speaker 1: the last resort China and Russia decide that they no

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Speaker 1: longer will fill those roles. So that's something the market

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Speaker 1: has been looking at, trying to decipher when when they

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Speaker 1: will know long to have an alternative option to bail

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Speaker 1: them out. It's interesting Peta Vesa recently started tweeting, potentially

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Speaker 1: as a sign of them looking further to Asia. They

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Speaker 1: recently started tweeting in Mandarin um eventually a way of

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Speaker 1: reaching out. Oh my gosh, I mean when we start

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Speaker 1: passing through Twitter posts and the bag of chocolates to

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Speaker 1: get clues on Venezuela death situation. It's really quite a time.

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Speaker 1: Of course, last night SMP Global Ratings weighed in and said,

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Speaker 1: you know what, Venezuela, you guys really have defaulted. I

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Speaker 1: know that is DA, which is the Credit Committee of

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Speaker 1: IZDA is deciding whether or not Venezuela has breached credit

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Speaker 1: default swap contract that still is out there. But as

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Speaker 1: far as SMP is concerned, Venezuela is in default already.

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Speaker 1: Can you explain a little bit about what death this

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Speaker 1: applies to and why this matters? Right? So, Fitch had

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Speaker 1: declared Petavesa in default yesterday evening, and SMP, of course

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Speaker 1: declaring the sovereign in default. Fitch his decision came down

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Speaker 1: to delays on principal payments for the Petta Basis seventeen bonds,

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Speaker 1: whereas S and p s decision moving Venezuela sovereign into

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Speaker 1: selective default was due to delayed interest payments which were

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Speaker 1: actually do last month, but their grace periods expired over

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Speaker 1: this weekend. But potentially, based on the circumstances legally speaking,

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Speaker 1: that this could be less of a headline risk than

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Speaker 1: some might expect. There could actually be a lesson taken

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Speaker 1: from the state utility company Electricita de Caracas, which was

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Speaker 1: declared in default by its trustee guests on Friday, actually

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Speaker 1: but actually is rallying significantly today, the most in eight years.

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Speaker 1: Uh and that being the case mostly due to comments

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Speaker 1: made by Finance Minister Simnzerpa over the weekend to Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: telling us that although there were some financial blockages in

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Speaker 1: terms of intermediary banks, they have since been resolved and

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Speaker 1: the company intends to to get that money to bond

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Speaker 1: holders this week. Ben. What you're you're joining us from

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Speaker 1: from Lima? What has been the reaction from other Latin

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Speaker 1: American governments and business leaders about doing business either with

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Speaker 1: Venezuela or in Venezuela Another great question, PIM. Perhaps the

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Speaker 1: most recent reaction that we've had is when Mauricio Mockri,

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Speaker 1: the Argentine President, traveled to New York and made his

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Speaker 1: voice clear that he and a number of Latin American

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Speaker 1: leaders were supportive of the US ratcheting up sanctions, including

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Speaker 1: on Venezuela's oil. Ah. So that that's been something that's

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Speaker 1: been obviously debated within the Trump administration. It would have

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Speaker 1: significant impact not only on Venezuela but on the U

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Speaker 1: S consumer and that's why perhaps the Trump and administration

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Speaker 1: has been reluctant to go that far. But Mackrie's comments there, uh,

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Speaker 1: we're definitely but seen by some in the market as

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Speaker 1: as a bit of a radical statement to make. It's

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Speaker 1: really a radical statement, even after the giving out chocolate

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Speaker 1: and tweeting in Mandarin. I guess it's a trifecta for

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Speaker 1: strange things that happened in the Venezuelan bond market. Alright,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna keep watching, You're gonna keep reporting. Much appreciated.

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Speaker 1: Ben barton Stein is the Emerging Markets America's reporter for

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg News, joining us from Lima, Peru. You know, I

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Speaker 1: just want to point out that Petavasa bonds that mature

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Speaker 1: have plunged today really dramatically, at three billion dollars of

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Speaker 1: debt now trading twenty six cents on the dollar. So

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Speaker 1: it's been a really big market reaction. Thanks for listening

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Speaker 1: to the Bloomberg P and L podcast. You can subscribe

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00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:53,160
Speaker 1: and listen to interviews at Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, or whatever

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00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:56,720
Speaker 1: podcast platform you prefer. I'm pim Fox. I'm on Twitter,

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Speaker 1: at pim Fox. I'm on Twitter at Lisa A. Ramo.

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Speaker 1: It's one before the podcast. You can always catch us

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Speaker 1: worldwide on Bloomberg Radio