1 00:00:01,160 --> 00:00:04,120 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class from how 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: Stuff Works dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:18,759 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V. Wilson and I'm Holly Frying. So our 4 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:21,279 Speaker 1: show has a general rule of thumb. We've talked, we've 5 00:00:21,360 --> 00:00:25,239 Speaker 1: alluded to it relatively recently when it comes to the 6 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 1: more recent past. For the most part, we talked about 7 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 1: history that's roughly, very roughly the nineteen sixties and earlier. Yeah. Yeah, 8 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 1: we want to focus on things that chunk of our 9 00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: listeners did not personally live through and have individual memories of. Uh. 10 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:44,480 Speaker 1: And it also helps us to focus a little farther 11 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 1: in the past because we're able to take a broader 12 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:50,839 Speaker 1: perspective a lot of the time and find multiple perspectives 13 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 1: on things so that we can compare those and get 14 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 1: a like a broader picture of what actually happened. UM. 15 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:00,840 Speaker 1: Our line in the Santa's farther back. But it's very 16 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: similar reasons to the ask Historians subreddit, which has a 17 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 1: twenty year rule about what's acceptable to ask about in 18 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:11,039 Speaker 1: the subreddit. Uh. That is a great resource, by the way, 19 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:12,600 Speaker 1: which A're gonna link to you in the show notes. 20 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:14,959 Speaker 1: So even though our line in the sand is farther back. 21 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: It's very similar to reasoning, the reasoning to how they 22 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:22,120 Speaker 1: frame it. Sometimes, though, we get a lot of request 23 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:25,160 Speaker 1: for something that is from more recent history, but not 24 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 1: necessarily something that listeners are overwhelmingly likely to personally remember. 25 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:32,600 Speaker 1: And that's the case where we are talking about today. 26 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:38,160 Speaker 1: In five following a lengthy standoff, the Philadelphia police bombed 27 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 1: a residential building that was home to the move organization. 28 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,920 Speaker 1: This caused a fire that burned down more than sixty 29 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 1: homes and eleven people were killed. I had never heard 30 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:54,160 Speaker 1: of this until it's thirtieth anniversary and got a lot 31 00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 1: of mainstream media coverage, and that coverage prompted a lot 32 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 1: of requests for an episode, which we both mostly responded 33 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: to you by saying, this is a little more recent 34 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 1: than we normally talk about. But then a year later 35 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:11,320 Speaker 1: we got another wave of requests for an episode, so 36 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:15,320 Speaker 1: anticipating another wave in the anniversary of this year, we 37 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:18,959 Speaker 1: decided to put it on the calendar. Uh And even 38 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: though folks who grew up in Philadelphia or who have 39 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: studied or been part of relevant fields of study and 40 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:29,680 Speaker 1: social movements and that sort of thing are likely to 41 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:32,600 Speaker 1: remember this I never heard of. This has been a 42 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:35,840 Speaker 1: common enough refrain in May for the last couple of 43 00:02:35,880 --> 00:02:39,679 Speaker 1: years that it seems worth it to devot an episode. Yeah. 44 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:44,320 Speaker 1: Articles about the Move bombing since his thirtieth anniversary have 45 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: often pigeonholed the organization as a black liberation group or 46 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:51,520 Speaker 1: a black power group, but this is at best a 47 00:02:51,639 --> 00:02:56,440 Speaker 1: partial description. While the organization is revolutionary and its members 48 00:02:56,520 --> 00:03:01,239 Speaker 1: are and have been predominantly black, the Move organization overlaps 49 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:04,840 Speaker 1: with other movements and philosophies as well, sometimes in ways 50 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:08,880 Speaker 1: that can seem really contradictory. Articles from past decades are 51 00:03:08,919 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: far more likely to call MOVE a back to nature, primitivist, 52 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:16,360 Speaker 1: or counterculture group. To be clear, it is not at 53 00:03:16,400 --> 00:03:20,519 Speaker 1: all unusual for an organization that's connected to racial justice 54 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 1: or any social issue really to have a platform that 55 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 1: touches on other issues that might not seem to be 56 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:31,000 Speaker 1: related at first glance. Sometimes this is because issues are 57 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 1: interconnected in a way that doesn't immediately seem obvious. But 58 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:39,800 Speaker 1: the Move organization's philosophies are disparate enough that they're often 59 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 1: described in words like uncategorizable, with some commentators going so 60 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 1: far as to suggest that it is a deliberate effort 61 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:51,800 Speaker 1: to be hard to pin down. Even the name MOVE, 62 00:03:51,920 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 1: which is normally written in all caps, doesn't stand for anything, 63 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:57,840 Speaker 1: even though it is written that way, and a lot 64 00:03:57,920 --> 00:04:01,000 Speaker 1: of these contradictory philosophies and p actuses were at the 65 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:05,160 Speaker 1: root of ongoing disputes between Move and its Philadelphia neighbors 66 00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:09,680 Speaker 1: in the nineteen seventies and nineteen eighties. Part of moves 67 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:14,920 Speaker 1: general philosophy is that the system which encompasses industry, big business, 68 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:20,000 Speaker 1: the government, the military, etcetera. Is toxic. It's a corrupting, 69 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 1: abusive force that is poisoning the planet and society in 70 00:04:23,960 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 1: pursuit of money. Life, on the other hand, is sacred. 71 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:30,600 Speaker 1: God and nature are the sources of life, and the 72 00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 1: natural law which governs all life is universally applicable to everyone. 73 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:40,040 Speaker 1: Another core belief among MOVE members is that by revolutionizing 74 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 1: themselves through the guidelines left by founder John Africa, they 75 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:48,839 Speaker 1: can revolutionize the world and ultimately end problems like homelessness, racism, 76 00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 1: drug addiction, HIV and crime. This personal revolution has some 77 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:57,960 Speaker 1: parallels with the Back to Nature Movement. Members eat raw food, 78 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 1: they avoid drugs and alcohol. They advocate for things like 79 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 1: animal rights, and clean air and water technology is seen 80 00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: as harmful, with members going so far as to use 81 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 1: wood stoves for heat and to break up the sidewalk 82 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:14,800 Speaker 1: adjacent to their home to restore the connection to the land. 83 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:20,400 Speaker 1: Members also live collectively in communal living situations, all adopting 84 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 1: the surname Africa after John Africa. Based on this focus 85 00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:27,800 Speaker 1: on the sanctity of life, it may seem that the 86 00:05:27,839 --> 00:05:32,080 Speaker 1: next logical step is non violence, but the Move organization 87 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: also believes in self defense, seeing it as a basic 88 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 1: human right and part of the natural law. Archival footage 89 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:43,040 Speaker 1: from the documentary Let the Fire Burn shows members practicing 90 00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:46,280 Speaker 1: physical self defense in the yard and patrolling around their 91 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 1: headquarters with firearms, and the organization's conflicts with law enforcement 92 00:05:51,080 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 1: over the years have more than once stemmed in part 93 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:57,440 Speaker 1: from the presence or the believed presence of weapons in 94 00:05:57,480 --> 00:06:01,839 Speaker 1: the MOVE compound. Law enforced men often approached those conflicts 95 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:04,599 Speaker 1: under the assumption that the members of Move were in 96 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:09,440 Speaker 1: fact heavily armed. Breaking up sidewalks and patrolling with weapons 97 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 1: would have easily been enough to cause a problem between 98 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:15,440 Speaker 1: Move and the neighbors, but this was really just the 99 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:19,120 Speaker 1: tip of the iceberg. Move believes that hair should be 100 00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 1: left in its natural state, uncut and uncombed, and it 101 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 1: discourages any kind of chemical for cleaning bodies and clothing. 102 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: The idea of respect for all animal life includes feeding 103 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 1: rats and stray animals. Uncontained compost piles at the property 104 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,599 Speaker 1: in the seventies and eighties were essentially just mounds of garbage, 105 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 1: and all of this lead to complaints from neighbors about hygiene, odors, 106 00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:48,239 Speaker 1: and vermin. Moves principles for raising children, which includes feeding 107 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:52,360 Speaker 1: only raw food and not allowing toys and encouraging nudity, 108 00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:57,200 Speaker 1: also led to reports of child neglect. Adding another layer, 109 00:06:57,760 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 1: Move members physically fortified to different homes in Philadelphia, boarding 110 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 1: over windows, erecting fences, and in one case, building a 111 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 1: bunker on the roof. They also played political lectures and 112 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 1: other statements through loudspeakers on the exterior of the properties. 113 00:07:14,280 --> 00:07:16,720 Speaker 1: Since part of the core philosophy was that it could 114 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 1: take profane language to fight a profane system, what came 115 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:25,520 Speaker 1: over those loud speakers was often filled with obscenities. All 116 00:07:25,560 --> 00:07:28,760 Speaker 1: of this combined meant that even neighbors who agreed with 117 00:07:28,920 --> 00:07:32,640 Speaker 1: moves core philosophies about the toxicity of the system and 118 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 1: the sanctity of life often did not like having them 119 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:39,480 Speaker 1: in their neighborhood. People understandably didn't want to live next 120 00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 1: to a boarded up bunker with profanity spewing out of 121 00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:45,560 Speaker 1: the loud speakers, which was being patrolled by people with 122 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:49,840 Speaker 1: long dreadlocks carrying what appeared to be functional rifles and shotguns. 123 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:53,920 Speaker 1: Families didn't want their children playing outside when the neighborhood 124 00:07:53,960 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 1: was constantly home to a yard full of trash, profane rants, 125 00:07:58,000 --> 00:08:02,400 Speaker 1: people brandishing guns, and as time went on, constant police activity. 126 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: Compounding things even further was that MOVE members often took 127 00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 1: an aggressively confrontational stance in interactions with police and neighbors. 128 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 1: We mentioned earlier that several commentators have theorized that MOVES 129 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 1: philosophy is purposely hard to define. Similarly, Moves Philadelphia neighbors 130 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: in the seventies and eighties theorized that they were being 131 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:30,040 Speaker 1: deliberately antagonizing and and yet another complicating factor, the social 132 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:32,319 Speaker 1: climate of the time meant that a lot of neighbors 133 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:36,080 Speaker 1: also didn't want to involve police, no matter how antagonizing 134 00:08:36,360 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 1: the situation, and this pitted neighborhood factions against one another 135 00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 1: when it came to how to deal with MOVE. The 136 00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:49,319 Speaker 1: years of confrontational relationships between MOVE and police ultimately led 137 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:52,479 Speaker 1: to a shootout in nineteen seventy eight, and that shootout 138 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 1: became a precursor for the bombing we will talk about 139 00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:06,319 Speaker 1: how after a quick sponsor break in the mid nineteen seventies, MOVE, 140 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 1: which had been established earlier that decade, moved into a 141 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:14,920 Speaker 1: Victorian style home in Powellton Village, Philadelphia. In general, this 142 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:19,360 Speaker 1: was a politically tense time, both nationally and locally. The 143 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:23,400 Speaker 1: United States involvement in the Vietnam War had been hugely divisive, 144 00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 1: and Philadelphia's Mayor, Frank Rizzo, had previously been the police commissioner. 145 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 1: He had run on a law and order platform. Philadelphia 146 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:36,200 Speaker 1: police had developed a reputation for unnecessary force and for 147 00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 1: cracking down on black neighborhoods a lot harder than on 148 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:43,280 Speaker 1: white neighborhoods. This was so much so that in nineteen 149 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: seventy nine, so a year after the shootout we're about 150 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 1: to talk about, the U. S Department of Justice filed 151 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: a lawsuit against the city Moves clashes with neighbors in 152 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:58,880 Speaker 1: Powellton Village began almost immediately, including monopolizing community meetings with 153 00:09:58,960 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 1: profanity laden ants. Complaints from neighbors led to visits from police, 154 00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:07,959 Speaker 1: which led to confrontations, which led to arrests. As members 155 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: of Move wound up being convicted of a number of 156 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 1: offenses and incarcerated, the organization became even more aggressive, basically 157 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,559 Speaker 1: trying to use these confrontations to draw attention to their 158 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 1: efforts to get their incarcerated members released. In May of 159 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy seven, after more than a year of this 160 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:30,360 Speaker 1: cycle of escalations and calls to police, MOVE members were 161 00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:34,240 Speaker 1: spotted on the barricaded porch of the home wearing military 162 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:38,120 Speaker 1: style clothing and carrying weapons. Neighbors called the police, and 163 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:41,040 Speaker 1: the police surrounded the house. This seemed like it was 164 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 1: the last straw from the police point of view. They 165 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 1: insisted that they would maintain a constant presence at the 166 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:50,320 Speaker 1: MOVE house and arrest anyone who left it, and they 167 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:53,439 Speaker 1: would charge whoever left the house with firearm and fractions 168 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:57,360 Speaker 1: and incitements to riot. A lot of the neighbors, of course, 169 00:10:57,440 --> 00:10:59,719 Speaker 1: did not like the idea of the police keeping a 170 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 1: home them in their neighborhood surrounded, regardless of whether they 171 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:06,960 Speaker 1: sympathized with Move or Not, and they started trying to negotiate. 172 00:11:07,640 --> 00:11:11,319 Speaker 1: Father Paul Washington, a minister, and Joel Todd, an attorney, 173 00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: were each involved with both formal and informal negotiations would 174 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:18,720 Speaker 1: Move and the Philadelphia Police to try to bring about 175 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:24,200 Speaker 1: a peaceful resolution. These negotiations stretched on four months, and 176 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:26,760 Speaker 1: in this whole time there was a lot of police 177 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:29,560 Speaker 1: activity in the neighborhood and a lot of altercations, and 178 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:34,400 Speaker 1: eventually Todd got Move and the police to mutually agree 179 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 1: that MOVE members would submit to an orderly arrest process. 180 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 1: They would cycle through the residence of the house so 181 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 1: that there was always somebody at home to look after 182 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 1: the children and feed the animals. Once people were arrested, 183 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:49,960 Speaker 1: they would be released without having to post bail, although 184 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:52,840 Speaker 1: Move wanted a written guarantee of this and the city 185 00:11:52,880 --> 00:11:56,760 Speaker 1: would only provide a verbal one. Move also agreed to 186 00:11:56,840 --> 00:12:01,080 Speaker 1: allow a health and weapons inspection of the premises. The 187 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:04,120 Speaker 1: one point that they absolutely could not agree on was 188 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:08,199 Speaker 1: that Move would ultimately vacate the home. And even though 189 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 1: Move and the city had come to an agreement on 190 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:14,160 Speaker 1: several points, Move was acutely aware that none of them 191 00:12:14,280 --> 00:12:16,840 Speaker 1: had to do with what was for them the most 192 00:12:16,880 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 1: important issue that was getting their incarcerated members, who they 193 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 1: referred to as political prisoners, out of prison. But then 194 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:27,959 Speaker 1: a member of Move heard that one of their incarcerated 195 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:32,439 Speaker 1: members had been beaten in prison. Move cut off all negotiations, 196 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:36,479 Speaker 1: and in response, the Philadelphia Police Department established a blockade 197 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: around the house, including cutting off the utilities. This blockade 198 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:43,800 Speaker 1: was meant to keep people from both leaving and coming in, 199 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:46,520 Speaker 1: and it stayed in place for more than fifty days. 200 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 1: Now at a total impasse, with sympathetic neighbors smuggling food 201 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:54,800 Speaker 1: and water into the Move house, supporters of Move recruited 202 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: civil rights activist Walt Palmer, the Citywide Coalition for Human Rights, 203 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 1: and civil rights attorney Oscar Gaskins to work on moves Behalf. Combined, Palmer, 204 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:08,920 Speaker 1: Gaskins and the Citywide Coalition for Human Rights had far 205 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 1: more power and clout than MOVE had on its own. 206 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 1: Gaskins often appeared in court on MOVE members Behalf to 207 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:19,839 Speaker 1: keep their confrontational manner and use of profanity from derailing 208 00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:25,160 Speaker 1: the proceedings. Gaskins negotiated an appeal for the imprisoned MOVE members, 209 00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:28,600 Speaker 1: with them being released on their own recognizance to await 210 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:32,920 Speaker 1: their new trials. We also renegotiated the arrests and inspections 211 00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:36,400 Speaker 1: that had previously been on the table, and he finally 212 00:13:36,480 --> 00:13:39,720 Speaker 1: got Moved to agree to vacate the Powelton Village home 213 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:44,280 Speaker 1: within ninety days. For the most part, Move followed through 214 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:48,000 Speaker 1: on what was agreed upon during these negotiations. This included 215 00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:51,880 Speaker 1: the sanitation and weapons inspections. The only weapons found on 216 00:13:51,920 --> 00:13:54,920 Speaker 1: the property at the time were not capable of being fired. 217 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:59,400 Speaker 1: The one biggest sticking point was the agreement to vacate 218 00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 1: the premises. It was unsurprisingly very difficult for a Move 219 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:06,480 Speaker 1: to find another place to live, and a number of 220 00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:09,520 Speaker 1: people looked for more rural property, which seemed to be 221 00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:12,440 Speaker 1: a better home for the organization than the city was 222 00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:15,280 Speaker 1: probably would not cause as much of an issue to 223 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 1: be out in the country with their particular sort of 224 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 1: back to nature practices than in the city in very 225 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:28,640 Speaker 1: close quarters with their neighbors. Eventually, a farmer in New 226 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:32,400 Speaker 1: Jersey offered to donate farmland, but at some point Move 227 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:34,840 Speaker 1: got the impression that he was planning to use them 228 00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 1: for slave labor, and after Move refused his offer, all 229 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 1: attempts to find a new location totally broke down, so 230 00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 1: that ninety day window to vacate the house came and went. 231 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:50,720 Speaker 1: A judge ruled that Move was in violation of their agreement, 232 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:55,760 Speaker 1: and police came to evict them on August eight, and 233 00:14:55,840 --> 00:14:59,680 Speaker 1: even though that weapons inspection had found only inoperable weapons 234 00:14:59,720 --> 00:15:02,800 Speaker 1: in the Move house, the eviction turned into a gunfight. 235 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:07,480 Speaker 1: It's unclear who fired first, but Officer James Ramp was killed. 236 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: Move would later maintain that it had been a case 237 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:14,040 Speaker 1: of friendly fire and that Philadelphia police had covered it up. 238 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: After a lengthy exchange of gunfire, as members of Move 239 00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:24,200 Speaker 1: were finally surrendering, three police officers hit, kicked, and beat 240 00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:28,640 Speaker 1: MOVE member Delbert Africa. Most of this beating was both 241 00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 1: caught on camera and televised. Philadelphia delayed releasing the names 242 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 1: of the three officers for nearly a year, and once 243 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,960 Speaker 1: the case finally came to trial, the judge issued a 244 00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 1: directed verdict of acquittal just before the jury was to 245 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 1: come back from its deliberations. Nine members of Move were 246 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:53,000 Speaker 1: convicted of various crimes, including conspiracy and third degree murder 247 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 1: in the shooting death of Officer Ramp. They had all 248 00:15:56,080 --> 00:15:59,200 Speaker 1: represented themselves in the proceedings before the judge had them 249 00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:04,040 Speaker 1: removed for disruptive behavior. Their sentences ranged from thirty to 250 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:07,600 Speaker 1: one hundred years in prison. Two of those people have 251 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:10,960 Speaker 1: died in prison, but the other seven are still incarcerated 252 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:15,920 Speaker 1: as of this recording. In May of the city of 253 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:20,400 Speaker 1: Philadelphia tore down the Move house two hours after the 254 00:16:20,440 --> 00:16:25,040 Speaker 1: eviction and shootout took place. This incident shaped how Move 255 00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: and the Philadelphia Police worked with one another from this 256 00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:30,040 Speaker 1: point on, and we're going to talk about that. After 257 00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:38,080 Speaker 1: we first paused for a little sponsor break. In the 258 00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:41,440 Speaker 1: early nineteen eighties, members of Move moved into a row 259 00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:45,200 Speaker 1: house at sixty one O Sage Avenue. This was a named, 260 00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:49,480 Speaker 1: middle class, predominantly black neighborhood in West Philadelphia. The house 261 00:16:49,520 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 1: belonged to John Africa's sister. By this point, the Philadelphia 262 00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:57,480 Speaker 1: Police and Move each had a huge amount of distrust 263 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:00,600 Speaker 1: and dislike of one another. Each help that the other 264 00:17:00,640 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 1: could not be trusted to negotiate in good faith or 265 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 1: to keep the terms of any agreement. Move argued that 266 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 1: the police in the city were unfairly targeting them because 267 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:13,320 Speaker 1: of their race. The police felt that Move was a 268 00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 1: cult full of unstable, dangerous people whose default mode of 269 00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:22,200 Speaker 1: communication was shrieking obscenities. There's been a lot of analysis 270 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:26,080 Speaker 1: of the whole pattern of arrests, of of MOVE and 271 00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 1: of generally policing in Philadelphia in the seventies and eighties, 272 00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 1: and it seems simultaneously absolutely true, Yes, they were being 273 00:17:35,080 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 1: targeted more because of racism. Also, the style of constantly 274 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:45,320 Speaker 1: confronting people with obscenities was making it worse. Like those 275 00:17:45,359 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 1: things simultaneously true. Even though as an organization, Move had 276 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:56,440 Speaker 1: really started to become embittered and hostile towards the Philadelphia 277 00:17:56,680 --> 00:18:00,200 Speaker 1: government and the police. At this point, they also had 278 00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:02,480 Speaker 1: become hopeful that they were going to have a more 279 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:06,600 Speaker 1: sympathetic ear within that government, because on January second, nineteen 280 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:11,160 Speaker 1: eight four, Wilson Good had become Philadelphia's first black mayor. 281 00:18:11,960 --> 00:18:14,959 Speaker 1: Move hoped that he would help them get their incarcerated 282 00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:17,920 Speaker 1: members out of jail, and that included the Move nine, 283 00:18:18,119 --> 00:18:19,880 Speaker 1: which was their name for the people who had been 284 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:23,880 Speaker 1: imprisoned in the death of Officer James Ramp. They also 285 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:26,520 Speaker 1: hoped that the mayor would get the city to allow 286 00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:30,720 Speaker 1: what they viewed as their free expression of their religious beliefs, 287 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:32,720 Speaker 1: which was essentially a lot of the stuff that was 288 00:18:32,800 --> 00:18:37,520 Speaker 1: causing so many problems within their neighborhoods. The city, however, 289 00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:41,600 Speaker 1: at first wanted to avoid getting directly involved, so the 290 00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 1: situation on o Sage Avenue played out much like it 291 00:18:44,359 --> 00:18:48,119 Speaker 1: had in Powellton Village. Members of Move fortified the house 292 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:50,959 Speaker 1: with boards and built a bunker on the roof. They 293 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:55,320 Speaker 1: collected animals and they fed strays. They broadcast obscene messages 294 00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:59,520 Speaker 1: from loudspeakers, and patrolled with what appeared to be functioning firearms. 295 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:04,639 Speaker 1: There are lots of UH photos and archival footage and 296 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: things like that of this neighborhood before the bombing happened, 297 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:11,280 Speaker 1: and it really is startling, like the camera will pan 298 00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:15,440 Speaker 1: down this row of very neat, well kept, beautifully maintained 299 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:18,960 Speaker 1: row houses where it's clear that like families of middle 300 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:21,720 Speaker 1: class people live, and then all of a sudden it 301 00:19:21,840 --> 00:19:26,919 Speaker 1: is a boarded up, fortified UH structure with a bunker 302 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:29,800 Speaker 1: on the roof, and it was very jarring when you 303 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 1: look at it. So neighbors were making repeated complaints about 304 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 1: the noise and the weapons and sanitation and the bunker 305 00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:41,680 Speaker 1: on the roof and the welfare of the children living 306 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 1: in the house. So police came and at times made 307 00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:48,720 Speaker 1: individual arrests, but no action was taken by the city 308 00:19:48,760 --> 00:19:54,040 Speaker 1: to address the roote situation, which was that this fortified 309 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:58,920 Speaker 1: group of apparently armed people were causing lots of distress 310 00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:02,480 Speaker 1: among their neighbors. Finally, fed up, neighbors went to the 311 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:05,520 Speaker 1: state government for help. This put pressure on the city 312 00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:08,200 Speaker 1: to move and quickly, and they put together a plan 313 00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:12,119 Speaker 1: to evict the entire group. The neighborhood in the vicinity 314 00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:15,040 Speaker 1: of the Move house on O Sage Avenue was evacuated 315 00:20:15,119 --> 00:20:18,719 Speaker 1: on Mother's Day nine five, and residents were told not 316 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:22,560 Speaker 1: to return for twenty four hours. Utilities were shut off 317 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:26,360 Speaker 1: and police established a perimeter around the home. The premise 318 00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:29,200 Speaker 1: for the police being there was to serve four members 319 00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:32,200 Speaker 1: of Move with warrants for their arrest, and to do 320 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:35,639 Speaker 1: this they had arrived with nearly five hundred police officers 321 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:38,399 Speaker 1: in swat gear. They were armed with machine guns and 322 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:41,560 Speaker 1: also had an anti tank gun. They had a helicopter 323 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:43,919 Speaker 1: that was on loan from the state police, and a 324 00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:46,880 Speaker 1: supply of explosives that had been provided by the FBI. 325 00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:53,520 Speaker 1: At five thirty five am on May thirteenth, Philadelphia Police 326 00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:58,480 Speaker 1: Commissioner greg Or Sambor announced over a bullhorn, attention, Move, 327 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,960 Speaker 1: this is America. You must obey the laws of the 328 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:06,120 Speaker 1: United States. Move was then given fifteen minutes to come 329 00:21:06,119 --> 00:21:10,520 Speaker 1: out of the house. They vehemently refused. At five fifty 330 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:14,119 Speaker 1: a m. The Philadelphia Fire Department began spraying the bunker 331 00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,679 Speaker 1: on top of the home with water. Sources contradict on 332 00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,160 Speaker 1: whether part of the goal was to try to use 333 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:23,639 Speaker 1: the hoses to knock the bunker down, but law enforcement 334 00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:26,560 Speaker 1: was very focused on this bunker because it gave Move 335 00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:31,320 Speaker 1: a potential vantage point for an ambush. They were definitely, however, 336 00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:34,359 Speaker 1: using the water from the hoses to increase the humidity 337 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:38,520 Speaker 1: inside of the house, which would make tear gas more effective. 338 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,320 Speaker 1: As all of this was going on, other officers went 339 00:21:43,359 --> 00:21:46,480 Speaker 1: into the adjacent homes this was a row house with 340 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:50,080 Speaker 1: you know, adjoining walls, to try to knock holes into 341 00:21:50,119 --> 00:21:54,359 Speaker 1: the walls to get into the Move house. The exchange 342 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:58,159 Speaker 1: of gunfire began at around six am. By the end 343 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:00,480 Speaker 1: of the day, the police would fire more than ten 344 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:04,679 Speaker 1: thousand rounds of ammunition into the move house. By midmorning, 345 00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:07,720 Speaker 1: the police had used multiple explosive devices to try to 346 00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:10,359 Speaker 1: get into the house and had used tear gas to 347 00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:13,360 Speaker 1: try to force the people that were inside out and 348 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:18,320 Speaker 1: none of it had worked. They kept breaking through walls 349 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:22,119 Speaker 1: and then finding like fortifications under the walls, that type 350 00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:25,600 Speaker 1: of thing. So by noon the situation had turned into 351 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:29,320 Speaker 1: a stalemate. Police decided to withdraw and regroup and work 352 00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:32,280 Speaker 1: out a new plan, and around four in the afternoon, 353 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:34,720 Speaker 1: as the force was trying to figure out how to proceed, 354 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:39,359 Speaker 1: someone and sources contradict on who suggested that they dropped 355 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:43,160 Speaker 1: a bomb from a helicopter to try to destroy the bunker. 356 00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:47,119 Speaker 1: At about five pm, Mayor Good approved the use of 357 00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:53,360 Speaker 1: explosives on the move house. At police dropped a satchel 358 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,560 Speaker 1: filled with four pounds of plastic explosive on a forty 359 00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:00,280 Speaker 1: five second fuse from the police helicopter onto the roof 360 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:04,680 Speaker 1: of sixty one O Sage Avenue. Although it caused an 361 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:10,800 Speaker 1: explosion that reverberated throughout the neighborhood, the bunker was left standing. However, 362 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 1: about twenty minutes after the bomb had been dropped, it 363 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:17,439 Speaker 1: became clear that the roof of Sie Oh Sage Avenue 364 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:22,119 Speaker 1: was on fire. A little laughter six pm, police Commissioner 365 00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:25,880 Speaker 1: Sambor and Fire Commissioner William C. Richmond agreed to let 366 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 1: the fire burn and the hope that it would frighten 367 00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:33,480 Speaker 1: everyone out of the home. Within minutes, though the fire 368 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 1: started to spread to neighboring houses in the row. Only 369 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:42,520 Speaker 1: two people escaped the burning Move house, Ramona Africa and 370 00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:47,080 Speaker 1: Michael Moses Ward, then known as Birdie Africa. Ramona Africa 371 00:23:47,240 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 1: was later convicted of riot and conspiracy and served seven 372 00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:55,000 Speaker 1: years in prison. Michael Ward, whose mother was killed this day, 373 00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 1: was taken into its father's custody. He was thirteen years 374 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:03,920 Speaker 1: old when this half bend. Six adults, including John Africa, 375 00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:07,760 Speaker 1: were killed on May thirteenth, along with five children between 376 00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:12,400 Speaker 1: the ages of seven and thirteen. Ramona Africa has maintained 377 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:14,919 Speaker 1: that other members of Move tried to leave the burning 378 00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:19,119 Speaker 1: home and were forced back by police gunfire. Police have 379 00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:21,680 Speaker 1: maintained that members of Move who were seen trying to 380 00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:24,960 Speaker 1: leave turned back into the fire for reasons that are unclear, 381 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:28,280 Speaker 1: that perhaps they wanted to regroup, or they had decided 382 00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:32,679 Speaker 1: to go back into the home to die. The fire 383 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,920 Speaker 1: that began to spread and there was a deliberate decision 384 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: to allow it to burn to try to force people 385 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:42,720 Speaker 1: out of a house. Was the worst residential fire in 386 00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:47,040 Speaker 1: Philadelphia history. More than sixty homes were destroyed and more 387 00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:50,920 Speaker 1: than two hundred fifty people were made homeless. Since the 388 00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:53,720 Speaker 1: neighborhood had been evacuated with an order to stay away 389 00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,360 Speaker 1: for twenty four hours, most of the residents had only 390 00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,360 Speaker 1: a few of their belongings with them when the fire started, 391 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 1: and they lost virtually everything. This would have been a 392 00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 1: newsworthy event on its own, but by this point move 393 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:10,960 Speaker 1: had a huge reputation in all of Philadelphia, so multiple 394 00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:13,040 Speaker 1: news crews were on the scene, and much of what 395 00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:19,160 Speaker 1: happened one was broadcast live on television. The mayor gave 396 00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:22,639 Speaker 1: an address on May thirteenth, saying quote, as mayor of 397 00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:27,400 Speaker 1: this city, I accept full and total responsibility. He would 398 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,520 Speaker 1: continue to do that repeatedly. He consistently accepted the blame 399 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:33,520 Speaker 1: for what had happened when he ran for re election 400 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:35,920 Speaker 1: a few years later. This, of course, was a huge 401 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:40,240 Speaker 1: part of his opponent's campaign, But his opponent was Frank Rizzo, 402 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:45,080 Speaker 1: who we mentioned earlier in the episode Um and Wilson. 403 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:48,960 Speaker 1: Good defeated his opponent by a narrow margin. In the 404 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:53,159 Speaker 1: immediate aftermath of this particular incident, though, he convened the 405 00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:58,600 Speaker 1: Philadelphia Special Investigation Commission, which held five weeks of public hearings. 406 00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:02,200 Speaker 1: A second in investigation by a grand jury was convened 407 00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:05,320 Speaker 1: on May fifteenth of ninety six, and both of these 408 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:10,920 Speaker 1: investigations agreed that the bombing had been woefully negligent and reckless. 409 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 1: The grand jury report issued on May three called it quote, 410 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:22,280 Speaker 1: an epic of governmental incompetence. The incompetence unfortunately continued in 411 00:26:22,359 --> 00:26:24,960 Speaker 1: the rebuilding of the homes that were destroyed in the fire. 412 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: The rebuilding effort was shoddy and mismanaged, and in nine seven, 413 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:34,119 Speaker 1: two contractors were charged and convicted of stealing more than 414 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:36,760 Speaker 1: two hundred thousand dollars of the funds that had been 415 00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:41,360 Speaker 1: earmarked for that redevelopment. The two contractors and Ramona Africa 416 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:44,760 Speaker 1: are the only people convicted of any crime in conjunction 417 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:49,600 Speaker 1: with the move bombing. Estimates are all over the place, 418 00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:53,439 Speaker 1: but the loss of property, the original rebuilding up effort, 419 00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:56,760 Speaker 1: and the years of repairs that followed that shoddy and 420 00:26:56,840 --> 00:27:01,080 Speaker 1: mismanaged construction had a total cost in tens of millions 421 00:27:01,119 --> 00:27:04,639 Speaker 1: of dollars. The city of Philadelphia was also ordered to 422 00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:07,280 Speaker 1: pay a total of one point five million dollars in 423 00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:13,280 Speaker 1: damages to Ramona, Africa and Michael Ward. In Ramona, Africa 424 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,800 Speaker 1: is still living and Michael Ward died in at the 425 00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,400 Speaker 1: age of forty one, apparently due to an accidental drowning 426 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:25,800 Speaker 1: while on vacation. In two thousand, fifteen years after the 427 00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:29,800 Speaker 1: bombing in the Fire, the Philadelphia Redevelopment Authority decided it 428 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:32,640 Speaker 1: would be too expensive to continue to try to fix 429 00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:37,199 Speaker 1: the ongoing problems from the earlier poor quality rebuilding. They 430 00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:40,560 Speaker 1: bought out many of the area's remaining homeowners, offering first 431 00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 1: seventy thousand dollars and then a hundred and fifty thousand 432 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,040 Speaker 1: dollars to leave the area or to release the city 433 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:51,240 Speaker 1: from any liability for further repairs. By that point, many 434 00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:54,080 Speaker 1: of the houses had been sitting boarded up and padlocked 435 00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:59,160 Speaker 1: for years. In April seventeen, the City of Philadelphia announced 436 00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:01,359 Speaker 1: that a company called the A. J. R. Endeavors had 437 00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:05,200 Speaker 1: been selected to oversee the redevelopment of thirty six houses 438 00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,240 Speaker 1: in the neighborhood of oh Stage Avenue, with a projected 439 00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:11,240 Speaker 1: cost of about three point two million dollars, with some 440 00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:14,280 Speaker 1: of that cost also being dedicated to funds for a 441 00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 1: public work of art in the neighborhood. A historical marker 442 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:22,520 Speaker 1: was also scheduled for placement in seventeen. So all of 443 00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:27,240 Speaker 1: the rebuilding of from this massive, massive destruction, it's like 444 00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: still continuing today, Like this neighborhood is still affected today, 445 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:33,919 Speaker 1: and people who lost their homes and the fire, who 446 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:37,399 Speaker 1: were totally innocent bystanders in all of this, like the 447 00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:42,480 Speaker 1: folks are still living today. There's been a lot of 448 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:46,400 Speaker 1: analysis of the opinion or not the opinion the decision 449 00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:49,160 Speaker 1: to let the fire burn, and how that was obviously 450 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:54,800 Speaker 1: a catastrophically terrible decision, so catastrophically bad that it actually 451 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:57,600 Speaker 1: spawned conspiracy theories from people who were like, you know, 452 00:28:57,680 --> 00:28:59,400 Speaker 1: what I think they were trying to do was burned 453 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:01,800 Speaker 1: down that neighbor hood so they could take it over 454 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:05,320 Speaker 1: all of it and gentrify it. Like that obviously didn't 455 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:08,160 Speaker 1: work out if that was part of the covert plan, 456 00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:11,520 Speaker 1: because the rebuilding was such so terribly constructed and then 457 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:14,760 Speaker 1: led some millions of dollars more repairs. But like, especially 458 00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:17,920 Speaker 1: in that part of Philadelphia, like the effects of this 459 00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:25,280 Speaker 1: event from nine are still continuing today, I'm I'm still 460 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:29,040 Speaker 1: back on UH. I can't help but wonder what it 461 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 1: must have been like for neighbors to basically be told 462 00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:36,240 Speaker 1: by police, hey, evacuate your home. Your neighborhood is going 463 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,520 Speaker 1: to become a war zone. Yeah. Well, and there are 464 00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:43,160 Speaker 1: because the whole thing played out on live television, like 465 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:47,320 Speaker 1: you see you can see in archival footage and in 466 00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:51,200 Speaker 1: the documentary Let the Fire Burn that we referenced earlier 467 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:54,240 Speaker 1: in the show, Like you see people either seeing on 468 00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,080 Speaker 1: television or coming back to the neighborhood and seeing what 469 00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:00,120 Speaker 1: was happening, and people make comparisons to Vietnam and how 470 00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:03,440 Speaker 1: it seems like a war zone. Um. There's a scene 471 00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:09,080 Speaker 1: where John Africa's sister, whose name I unfortunately didn't write 472 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: down in in my notes. She's no longer affiliated with 473 00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:14,600 Speaker 1: Move from what I understand, so I didn't really get 474 00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:17,040 Speaker 1: as much into that part, but there is footage of 475 00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 1: her arriving back in the neighborhood and seeing what is 476 00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:24,560 Speaker 1: going on and just being distraught. Obviously, it was just 477 00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:28,640 Speaker 1: a horrifying event for everybody who was present that day, 478 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:34,280 Speaker 1: a lot of whom are still living. UH. And then 479 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,160 Speaker 1: of course the loss of life including a lot of 480 00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: children during the fire and the shootout itself. What's the 481 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:47,160 Speaker 1: listeners male situation like, No, I would not I would 482 00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:48,960 Speaker 1: not call it depressing, but it is about one of 483 00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:52,080 Speaker 1: our more uh serious episodes we've done lately, which was 484 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:56,120 Speaker 1: on the Cato Street Conspiracy. One of the things that 485 00:30:56,360 --> 00:31:00,320 Speaker 1: came up in that episode was that two different horses 486 00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: had said completely contradictory things about a previous trial that 487 00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:09,240 Speaker 1: Arthur this would had been involved in. So this is 488 00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:11,400 Speaker 1: from Megan. It just came in this morning. It was 489 00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,080 Speaker 1: very well timed and it came in a few hours 490 00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:17,640 Speaker 1: before we recorded this episode. And Megan says, longtime listener, 491 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:21,080 Speaker 1: first time caller, emailer, any who, I was listening to 492 00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:23,880 Speaker 1: your episode on the Cato Street Conspiracy on my walk 493 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:27,000 Speaker 1: this morning when you mentioned that it was unclear what 494 00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 1: had happened in the eighteen seventeen case because of conflicting 495 00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:33,280 Speaker 1: published information, which is fair enough as that case is 496 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 1: hard to find and publicly available for him. Luckily, I 497 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:39,960 Speaker 1: am an ex law librarian and my first law job 498 00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:43,080 Speaker 1: was at one of the ends of courts in London. 499 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:47,280 Speaker 1: We're finding really old and obscure cases. Was about seventy 500 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,240 Speaker 1: of my day as a trainee librarian, and I still 501 00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 1: have access now uh as a system's librarian in academia 502 00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:58,840 Speaker 1: to some of those resources. So Rex versus This would 503 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:01,200 Speaker 1: and others was a series of trials held in front 504 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,120 Speaker 1: of the King's Bench with a jury in eighteen seventeen, 505 00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 1: and the whole thing is a fairly excruciatingly tedious read. 506 00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:10,880 Speaker 1: But basically, after the jury found James Watson the Elder 507 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:13,760 Speaker 1: not guilty of the charges laid upon him of treason 508 00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:17,160 Speaker 1: et cetera in his trial, which was the first one heard, 509 00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 1: the Attorney General decided that they would not continue to 510 00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:24,440 Speaker 1: press the same charges against Thistlewood, Preston and Hooper, as 511 00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:28,680 Speaker 1: this was announced when the court was assembled the following morning, 512 00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:32,880 Speaker 1: June seventeen seventeen for their trials. So the jury declared 513 00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:35,720 Speaker 1: them not guilty and discharged them. So they were acquitted 514 00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:38,480 Speaker 1: under English common law by a jury with a not 515 00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:41,440 Speaker 1: guilty verdict. But that was the usual practice for a 516 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:45,240 Speaker 1: case where charges were withdrawn. So both of the things 517 00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:47,240 Speaker 1: I had said that they were acquitted and that the 518 00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:52,080 Speaker 1: charges were withdrawn were basically simultaneously true. To get back 519 00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:54,680 Speaker 1: to the letter, always enjoy the podcast and thank you 520 00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:56,720 Speaker 1: for giving me the chance to stretch the old case 521 00:32:56,800 --> 00:33:01,120 Speaker 1: law finding skills. Hope it's useful and or interesting. Obviously, 522 00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 1: R v. Thistlewood eighteen twenty is more important piece of 523 00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 1: case law because that is where they found they were 524 00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:10,920 Speaker 1: found guilty of high treason, etcetera, and is still cited 525 00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:14,080 Speaker 1: frequently today. I also found Thistlewood's chance streight case in 526 00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:18,520 Speaker 1: regards to the bankrupt buyer slash annuity and his inherence, etcetera. 527 00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:22,120 Speaker 1: Megan Uh. And then she sent a link to a 528 00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:26,640 Speaker 1: a Google book e book um of a trial record. 529 00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:29,479 Speaker 1: So thank you so much, Megan number one for answering 530 00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:33,240 Speaker 1: that question, because I was genuinely wondering what was correct 531 00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:36,600 Speaker 1: when it seemed like two things said the opposite. Number 532 00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 1: two shout out to librarians. You know it's librarians are great. 533 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:45,080 Speaker 1: In addition to this great email, Uh, one of the 534 00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:48,680 Speaker 1: sources for today's episode was a book that I was 535 00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:54,360 Speaker 1: only able to get thanks to a librarian. So if 536 00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:56,280 Speaker 1: you would like to write to us about this or 537 00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:59,040 Speaker 1: any other podcast where history podcasts at how Stuff Works 538 00:33:59,080 --> 00:34:01,479 Speaker 1: dot com, We're all so. On Facebook at facebook dot 539 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:03,800 Speaker 1: com slash miss in history, and on Twitter at miss 540 00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 1: in History. Our tumbler is a miss in History dot 541 00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:09,520 Speaker 1: tumbler dot com. We're on pan test and Instagram at 542 00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:12,840 Speaker 1: missed in History. You can come to our parent companies website, 543 00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:15,920 Speaker 1: which is how stuff Works dot com and find uh 544 00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:19,160 Speaker 1: information about just about anything your heart desires. And you 545 00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:21,520 Speaker 1: can come to our website, which is missed in History 546 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:24,440 Speaker 1: dot com, where we have an archive of every episode 547 00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 1: ever and we have UH show notes of the episodes 548 00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:31,480 Speaker 1: that Holly and I have worked on. Those notes are 549 00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:34,480 Speaker 1: now part of the actual podcast player page, so everything 550 00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:36,520 Speaker 1: is all in one place. And as we said earlier, 551 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,160 Speaker 1: we will put in a note to our link to 552 00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:42,520 Speaker 1: the subreddit of ask Historians, which is an awesome place 553 00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:46,600 Speaker 1: to add or to ask great questions and have historians 554 00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:50,360 Speaker 1: and other knowledgeable people answer them. Um. One of the 555 00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:53,080 Speaker 1: ones I saw this morning which had a great answer 556 00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:55,680 Speaker 1: was was it really fun to stay at the y 557 00:34:55,800 --> 00:35:01,920 Speaker 1: m c A. I love whoever asked that question, and 558 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,680 Speaker 1: I love the person who wrote the wonderful answer that 559 00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:07,320 Speaker 1: I saw every day this morning, So I can do 560 00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:09,799 Speaker 1: all that a whole lot more at how stuff works 561 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:16,640 Speaker 1: dot com or missed in History dot com for more 562 00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:18,960 Speaker 1: on this and thousands of other topics. Is it how 563 00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:19,960 Speaker 1: stuff works? Dot com