Speaker 1: This is the most dramatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio Podcast.
Speaker 1: Welcome to a very special edition of the most Dramatic
Speaker 1: podcast ever. I'm Chris Harrison alongside Lauren Zema from her
Speaker 1: home office in Austin, Texas, we woke to the very
Speaker 1: sad news that legendary Dancing with the Stars judge had
Speaker 1: Judge Lynn Goodman had passed away at the age of
Speaker 1: seventy eight. Lynn was just known as a wonderful, kind
Speaker 1: giving man. Obviously we all loved to have millions did
Speaker 1: watching Dancing with the Stars all those years. He died
Speaker 1: in his home, surrounded by his family. He had been
Speaker 1: battling bone cancer for quite some time and stepped away
Speaker 1: from the show to spend time back home. But when
Speaker 1: so much in this day and age is made of
Speaker 1: people that are divisive, people that are angry, why not
Speaker 1: do a show about someone that everybody just loved. Lynn
Speaker 1: was one of those guys that everybody could just rally around.
Speaker 1: Even when he was being kind of critical of the dancers,
Speaker 1: you knew it came out of a good place.
Speaker 2: They all respected him one hundred percent, and we wanted
Speaker 2: to give a couple of those people who worked with
Speaker 2: him for so long the time to share their memories
Speaker 2: with him. I think we're also in a day and
Speaker 2: age where you know, somebody passes and it's kind of
Speaker 2: a quick blip and then it's on to the next
Speaker 2: And you and I were both just so involved with
Speaker 2: this show. I covered Dancing with the Stars for six
Speaker 2: seven years with Entertainment Tonight. You saw several bachelor people
Speaker 2: go on the show, and you'd attended several times, and
Speaker 2: so we just wanted to reach out to some of
Speaker 2: our dancer friends and former contestant friends and share some
Speaker 2: memories of Len and talk about a show that we
Speaker 2: both loved and a guy who everybody, as you said,
Speaker 2: loved and respected.
Speaker 1: I remember when the show was being pitched and an
Speaker 1: ABC executive came in our control room and said, we're
Speaker 1: talking about so By the way, Lynn was also the
Speaker 1: judge of Strictly Calm Dancing. That is what Dancing with
Speaker 1: the Stars is. It was a BBC show first, same
Speaker 1: thing celebrities, you know, dancing with pro dancers. Lynn was
Speaker 1: on that show and for many years he would go
Speaker 1: back and forth between the BBC show and then come
Speaker 1: to Hollywood and do Dancing with the Stars. And when
Speaker 1: I remember what it was pitched. I'm like, I don't
Speaker 1: know slabs pro dancers. Clearly I was wrong. And Tony
Speaker 1: Bernielli who was also a judge, He came over from
Speaker 1: Strictly Come Dancing and they spent many, many years together.
Speaker 1: But I remember Trista Wrenn. Trista was the first. She
Speaker 1: was our bachelorette, and she was the first person ever
Speaker 1: voted off Dancing with the Stars. She was, Yes, she
Speaker 1: has the dubious honors.
Speaker 2: So when they was the first elimination of the first season.
Speaker 1: And they of the show. So when the show started,
Speaker 1: you know that that started this symbiotic relationship. Obviously we're
Speaker 1: all in the ABC family on primetime and Dancing with
Speaker 1: Air when The Bachelor wasn't on, and so often they
Speaker 1: used people from our show. Well, it all started with Trista,
Speaker 1: our first bachelorette. But yeah, she had dubious honor. The
Speaker 1: first person in the history of the show ever voted
Speaker 1: off was Trista.
Speaker 2: Well, it also sort of became kind of a controversial
Speaker 2: battle between your shows. I guess I would interview pros
Speaker 2: a lot of the time, would say some of them
Speaker 2: that they struggled with when Bachelor contestants were on because
Speaker 2: they would have this strong fandom voting for them that
Speaker 2: wasn't actually watching Dancing with the Stars like the Bachelor Nation,
Speaker 2: fans would vote for the contestants, but they weren't actually watching,
Speaker 2: which bothered the pros sometimes and it also sort of
Speaker 2: held over contestants head sometimes whether they would be able
Speaker 2: to go be on the show.
Speaker 1: Well, like I mean, you remember infamously, you remember Sean
Speaker 1: Loh did so well because he was so beloved. Caitlin Bristow,
Speaker 1: Hannah Brown, those are the people that did so great
Speaker 1: on the show, and they danced really well. Not Sean,
Speaker 1: the ladies did. And he'll be the first to tell you,
Speaker 1: but you're right, I remember you. During the voting, it
Speaker 1: was a lot of well, this is a popularity contest.
Speaker 1: The Bachelor has this built in fandom, and it just
Speaker 1: went to show up about how beloved these people were
Speaker 1: when they came off The Bachelor of bache Arette at
Speaker 1: the time.
Speaker 2: But Lenn rose above it all.
Speaker 1: He did well. And to your point, I was on
Speaker 1: the show quite a bit where I would stop by
Speaker 1: and support whoever it was that was dancing at the time,
Speaker 1: and I spent a lot of time with the judges.
Speaker 1: I knew Carrie and Ama very well and got to
Speaker 1: meet Lynn and spend a lot of time with him.
Speaker 1: We'd be at ABC events. Just always such a kind,
Speaker 1: good man, just a gentleman, Always a smile on his face,
Speaker 1: a twinkle in his eye, always light on his step.
Speaker 1: He looked and carried himself like a dancer, which he,
Speaker 1: by the way, was he in his teens. He was
Speaker 1: a competitive dancer and went on I believe it was
Speaker 1: in his late twenties when he won the British championship.
Speaker 1: He was the best dancer in the UK. So that's
Speaker 1: where it came from. It came from his competitive edge.
Speaker 1: And when he stopped competitive dancing, he's like, I'm done
Speaker 1: with that. But obviously he was perfect for this job
Speaker 1: which was created and then came to the States and
Speaker 1: Dancing with the Stars.
Speaker 2: That's something I love about Dancing with the Stars is
Speaker 2: that the judges have always been people with legitimate experience.
Speaker 2: You know, It's not like when Ellen DeGeneres was member,
Speaker 2: when she was brought on to judge American Idol, right,
Speaker 2: and everybody's like, why is this half right? But you know,
Speaker 2: Lenn had an incredible pedigree, and I think I read
Speaker 2: in one of the obituaries written about him this really
Speaker 2: sweet quote. He said something like, you know, I'm just
Speaker 2: a guy who got lucky. He was always very humble
Speaker 2: as well that he became this dancer, But in terms
Speaker 2: of this fame and becoming this judge and being on television,
Speaker 2: he just viewed that he got lucky.
Speaker 1: He did an interview and he said, I want this
Speaker 1: to be my obituary. He said, you can write it,
Speaker 1: he said, and this is the quote you were talking about.
Speaker 1: He was a dance teacher from Dartford who got lucky.
Speaker 1: Because that's just about the truth of it. The self
Speaker 1: deprecation clearly in that, but it doesn't tell the story
Speaker 1: of how beloved he was. And so Elsie and I thought,
Speaker 1: let's do a show just for a good man that
Speaker 1: left a big impression on millions of people as we
Speaker 1: watched him for the better part of two decades. And
Speaker 1: as Lauren said, we're going to talk to some former
Speaker 1: professional dancers, a couple of the celebrities who danced on
Speaker 1: the show, and just hear their stories, the people that
Speaker 1: were in the trenches with them day in and day out,
Speaker 1: and so Lenn Goodman, this show is for you. Lindsay
Speaker 1: Arnold became a professional dancer on season sixteen of Dancing
Speaker 1: with the Stars. At the time, I remember when she
Speaker 1: came in. If I'm not mistaken, it was about the
Speaker 1: same time Whitney came in.
Speaker 3: Yes, we've all started the same season.
Speaker 1: I remember meeting both of you at an ABC event.
Speaker 1: You were the second youngest dancer and Dance with the
Speaker 1: Star's history. Obviously you heard the story about Lenn passing away,
Speaker 1: and I know he was someone near and dear to you,
Speaker 1: as he was to everybody in that Dancing with the
Speaker 1: Stars family. Can you shed some light on who he was,
Speaker 1: what he meant?
Speaker 3: Yes, I mean, I think the outpouring of love that
Speaker 3: we've seen has just really just paid tribute to him
Speaker 3: as a person. But I don't think there's enough that
Speaker 3: we could possibly say or do to like truly capture
Speaker 3: how incredible this man was. I was somebody who had
Speaker 3: watched Dancing with the Stars from season one, started out
Speaker 3: as a die hard fan, like twelve year old me
Speaker 3: sitting on my couch every single week, and Len was
Speaker 3: always there, like he was a part of the show
Speaker 3: from the beginning, and truly. The best way I can
Speaker 3: discreim is he was the heart of the show, Like
Speaker 3: he really really was. So it was so cool for
Speaker 3: me because coming from a position of being a fan
Speaker 3: watching these judges and watching Len in particular, and then
Speaker 3: getting to be a part of the show and getting
Speaker 3: to interact with him, I have to say, honestly, and
Speaker 3: I think everybody would probably say the same thing, like
Speaker 3: Len gives off this really like mean, like he gave
Speaker 3: off this I'm a grumpy man vibe. But it was
Speaker 3: the coolest thing ever to have that switch from like
Speaker 3: feeling that and being like, oh, I'm so nervous to
Speaker 3: meet Len, to literally be the most welcoming, warm, kind
Speaker 3: person I had ever met in my life. It was
Speaker 3: the coolest shift, Like, and it was that first season.
Speaker 3: I saw it right away, Like it didn't take a
Speaker 3: long time for me to see this incredible man that
Speaker 3: he was. It was pretty instantaneous where I'm like, no,
Speaker 3: he is a kind human and he says it like
Speaker 3: it is, which is what made the show so incredible.
Speaker 3: He never held back and he wasn't going to sugarcoat things,
Speaker 3: and that's why I think people respected about him so much.
Speaker 2: Lin's it seemed to me, And actually I should share
Speaker 2: one thing about Len was he really didn't do the
Speaker 2: press lines much because he usually was like flying back
Speaker 2: to England. And I don't know how much you hung
Speaker 2: out with him off stage, you know, in between when
Speaker 2: the cameras were actually rolling. But was he that same
Speaker 2: person or it seemed to me always like he would
Speaker 2: be the type who'd probably come up to you after
Speaker 2: the cameras stopped rolling and still give you that same feedback,
Speaker 2: and that he was genuine through and through and he
Speaker 2: would even be tough on you behind the scenes a
Speaker 2: little bit, but in a good way.
Speaker 3: That is exactly it. It's that there was nothing like
Speaker 3: him putting on a show. What you saw from Len,
Speaker 3: no matter when it was is what was truly him.
Speaker 3: And I think that was so special about him is
Speaker 3: he was authentic to his core. And it's true he
Speaker 3: would not come off stage and be like sorry I
Speaker 3: had to say that. No he said something, it's because
Speaker 3: he meant it, he felt it, he stood behind it,
Speaker 3: and we all really respected that because we're like, that's
Speaker 3: your opinion, that is what your job is.
Speaker 1: Not to take anything. It all away from Carrie An
Speaker 1: and Bruno who were lovely in their own right and
Speaker 1: added their own little thumbprint to the show. But when
Speaker 1: you're standing there as a dancer with your celebrity partner
Speaker 1: and you're awaiting the judge's words, how much weight and
Speaker 1: what did it mean when Len spoke?
Speaker 3: Oh, that was everything, And like you said, it's like
Speaker 3: no disrespect to the other judges, but Len was like
Speaker 3: you cared so much about Len's opinion and it was
Speaker 3: a universal thing, like we all felt it. And I
Speaker 3: think it's just because of that authenticity that we knew
Speaker 3: was there, Like we knew that what he said was
Speaker 3: what he felt, and like we knew it was coming
Speaker 3: from a place of like, Okay, whatever Len says, I've
Speaker 3: got to listen to that. And it's true. It's true
Speaker 3: for the good and the bad. If Lenn said something bad,
Speaker 3: it hits you a little bit harder than the others.
Speaker 3: And when he said something really good, you were like
Speaker 3: even that much more stoked. And I love that, like
Speaker 3: him getting a ten from Len became this thing that
Speaker 3: like was such a prized possession.
Speaker 1: It meant so much, the ten from Lenn.
Speaker 3: It literally was like prize. And it's funny because I
Speaker 3: feel like, as pros, we would kind of have to
Speaker 3: explain that to our celebs because the celebs come in,
Speaker 3: they're like a ten from Anyone's fine, We're like, yes, yes,
Speaker 3: but yeah, the ten from Len. Because I feel like,
Speaker 3: here's the thing. I feel like Len was one of
Speaker 3: the most known judges to kind of talk to the
Speaker 3: pros as well, to get after the pros if there
Speaker 3: wasn't enough content, and kind of I feel like he
Speaker 3: was the first one to kind of start not like
Speaker 3: like discouraging the pros, but in a way like he
Speaker 3: would be hard on us and it was good because
Speaker 3: we needed it and we needed to hear that. So
Speaker 3: it's like when we got that positive feedback from him,
Speaker 3: I feel like it was also like he was giving
Speaker 3: us a pat on the back, which felt really really good.
Speaker 2: How did he balance that with you, Lindsey? Or maybe
Speaker 2: was it hard in the beginning though, because you and
Speaker 2: Whitney were so young. I mean, you're not even you know,
Speaker 2: full grown, experienced adult professional dancers on stage at that point,
Speaker 2: but you're up there getting the feedback from Len along
Speaker 2: with everybody else.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it was a little bit scary. I
Speaker 3: think too, because when Whitney and I joined the show.
Speaker 3: I feel like it started kind of shifting from being
Speaker 3: just strict ballroom, Like all you saw was ballroom. There
Speaker 3: was never any other styles or anything kind of incorporated.
Speaker 3: And because we were cross trained, we did bring a
Speaker 3: little bit of that, like we'd do a chow job,
Speaker 3: but maybe we'd throw a little hip hop section in there,
Speaker 3: and you know, Len hasn't always loved that, so but
Speaker 3: it was cool because here's the thing, there was such
Speaker 3: a respect between Len and the pros, Like we knew
Speaker 3: what he liked to see, and we knew if we
Speaker 3: were going to go a little different that he probably
Speaker 3: was wasn't going to be on board with it. And
Speaker 3: I feel like he always just paid so much respect
Speaker 3: to the pros for our work, but then at the
Speaker 3: same time was like, this is what I like and
Speaker 3: you know that, and if you're gonna choose not to
Speaker 3: do it, then I'm going to comment on it. So
Speaker 3: it was like this mutual respect. But I feel like
Speaker 3: it definitely shook things up when things started shifting a
Speaker 3: little bit.
Speaker 1: To echo off what LZ was just saying, Lens was,
Speaker 1: was he a bit of a father figure? He was
Speaker 1: probably a bit of a father figure over the entire franchise,
Speaker 1: but to you and Whitney, maybe in a very real
Speaker 1: way because you were so young, did he have that
Speaker 1: effect on you? Did he kind of take you under
Speaker 1: his wing of like helping you along as you were
Speaker 1: so young starting on this show.
Speaker 3: I think the guidance that Len gave from behind the
Speaker 3: table for me personally, I mean, he can't speak for everybody,
Speaker 3: but for me personally was such a very It was
Speaker 3: a driving force for the way that I became as
Speaker 3: a choreographer, as a teacher, because, like I said, I
Speaker 3: came into the show, I had a lot of different
Speaker 3: style experience, and I wanted to be individual, Like I
Speaker 3: wanted to bring a new flavor, something different that everybody
Speaker 3: hadn't seen. But the same time, I feel like Len
Speaker 3: really guided me and helped me make sure I was
Speaker 3: keeping the integrity of the show and maintaining what the
Speaker 3: show is all about, but then also like bringing my
Speaker 3: own flair, and I love that he encouraged but also
Speaker 3: like kept us in line. I think that was I
Speaker 3: think it's very important. I think it's the reason that
Speaker 3: the show has done as well as it has because
Speaker 3: he really helped keep the integrity of the show.
Speaker 2: Well, you've spoken him so well. Uh, Lin's even in
Speaker 2: just these few minutes. And I got to ask you though,
Speaker 2: and I have to thank you because I was just
Speaker 2: looking at your Instagram story before you came on here.
Speaker 2: You're not like heading to the hospital in a minute,
Speaker 2: are you, because.
Speaker 3: I just I mean, we hope not, but it could.
Speaker 4: My du date is.
Speaker 3: Next Friday, so I'm like, we could go at any point.
Speaker 2: Which is exciting.
Speaker 4: Okay, let's do it.
Speaker 3: Let's make it happen.
Speaker 2: You're pregnant with baby number two. And I felt back
Speaker 2: as I messaged you, can you please come do this
Speaker 2: tribute to Len? And then I was looking at your
Speaker 2: Instagram stories and You're like, I'm on one cent of
Speaker 2: your time.
Speaker 1: You're literally sitting here in labor technically who he's talking
Speaker 1: to you right?
Speaker 3: So but it's worth it.
Speaker 5: It is.
Speaker 3: When I heard you were doing this for Lin, I'm like,
Speaker 3: of course, like I I can't like of course, of
Speaker 3: course he was so special to me, to everybody. I mean,
Speaker 3: it means so much that you're doing this too, So
Speaker 3: I'm glad I could be a part of it.
Speaker 1: Well, before I let you go have a baby, do
Speaker 1: you have a goodbye story before before we leave you
Speaker 1: that just kind of encapsulates Len. Something you remember, something
Speaker 1: that you'll always remember.
Speaker 3: I'll never forget this because it was one of my
Speaker 3: worst moments on the show and also one of my best.
Speaker 3: This was season twenty two. My partner was yan Ye Morris.
Speaker 3: It was the semi finals, very important week. Me and
Speaker 3: wan Yer had like a really really great dance, like
Speaker 3: probably one of his strongest dances. We were put last
Speaker 3: in the show, like everything was set up for us
Speaker 3: to be like good, and we had some props in
Speaker 3: this dance and I dropped my prop and wan Ye,
Speaker 3: my partner, slipped on the prop that I dropped, okay,
Speaker 3: and then messed up like the entire rest of the routine,
Speaker 3: and it was my fault. And I've never cried or
Speaker 3: lost it, but I lost it. I was just a mess.
Speaker 3: And funny enough, that same night they did the they
Speaker 3: haven't done this in a while, but they paired the
Speaker 3: judges with a couple of couples and like had them
Speaker 3: to a dance together, and it was me and juan
Speaker 3: Ye Morris, and then it was Val and ginger Z.
Speaker 3: We did a dance and Len was our judge, and
Speaker 3: he actually danced with us, and we had to do
Speaker 3: that shortly after I had just had this full debacle,
Speaker 3: and I remember that I am like in tears, just
Speaker 3: like feeling so miserable. Len walks out. He had like
Speaker 3: a ruffel shirt on, and part of the dance was
Speaker 3: we did like some shimmies with him, and we're backstage practicing,
Speaker 3: and I just had this like surreal moment that I'll
Speaker 3: literally never forget, looking at Len, looking at where we were,
Speaker 3: realizing that I'm dancing with this legend, this person that
Speaker 3: I grew up watching admiring, and now get to work alongside.
Speaker 3: I'm shimmying with him on national television. Like there's literally
Speaker 3: nothing that could get me down in that moment, and
Speaker 3: it was so cool because I needed it and just
Speaker 3: his energy like that was also a really cool time
Speaker 3: for me because it went from that was I think
Speaker 3: my first experience with Len, where it went from like
Speaker 3: we're we have this kind of like student teacher situation
Speaker 3: till we were working together. We quographed the dance together
Speaker 3: and then taught the celebrities together, and it was just
Speaker 3: such a special moment and I'll never forget because it
Speaker 3: was literally one of my worst nights on Dance with
Speaker 3: the Stars, and then he made it one of my
Speaker 3: most memorable things that I will literally never forget.
Speaker 1: Clearly a man that left an impression on you, as
Speaker 1: he did millions of other people. Lindsay Arnold, thank you
Speaker 1: so much. Danced for a decade, ten years on Dancing
Speaker 1: with the Stars. Hard to believe, yes, and even harder
Speaker 1: to believe that she's sitting there in labor right now.
Speaker 1: And let me just say, God, bless you on a healthy, happy,
Speaker 1: beautiful baby.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
Speaker 3: That means so much to me.
Speaker 2: Thanks for having me. We love you, Lenz. Could we
Speaker 2: see you back on the show where I actually haven't
Speaker 2: talked to you in a while, or are you like
Speaker 2: busy at home with babies now?
Speaker 3: So I don't really know. I really like people ask
Speaker 3: all the time, and like I've not closed the door
Speaker 3: at all, Like I definitely have not. I've never said like,
Speaker 3: oh I'm done forever. And when I had the conversation
Speaker 3: with the show, it was really just like timing. It's
Speaker 3: just gonna have to be a timing thing.
Speaker 2: So we'll see.
Speaker 3: I'm sure that two kids is going to rock my
Speaker 3: world even more than one, so we will see how
Speaker 3: those things.
Speaker 5: First.
Speaker 1: Let's just let's take care of the baby this week out, then.
Speaker 3: We'll assess how things are.
Speaker 2: So many congrats and thank you for talking to us,
Speaker 2: and hopefully we'll see in person soon.
Speaker 3: Thanks Linz, guys, Thank you guys, have a good day.
Speaker 1: Joining us.
Speaker 5: Now.
Speaker 1: Another professional dancer, Emma Slater, who kind of came to
Speaker 1: the show maybe a little bit differently. She was part
Speaker 1: of the troupe, uh, you know, the ensemble that would
Speaker 1: dance in the show, and then out of that was
Speaker 1: picked to be one of the professional dancers and has
Speaker 1: gone on to have an amazing career on Dance with
Speaker 1: the Stars. So, Imma, just first of all, the sad
Speaker 1: news about lenn and what he meant to you.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it was so heartbreaking to me. Len is like
Speaker 6: a grandfather and he's been in my life since I
Speaker 6: was about twelve or thirteen. We're both from England and
Speaker 6: I grew up in the competitive world and Len is
Speaker 6: actually a very very very well respected judge from England.
Speaker 6: He grew up he's like the legend of ballroom and
Speaker 6: so he would judge a lot of the competitions that
Speaker 6: I was at so overall, losing him, someone who has
Speaker 6: been a part of my life throughout many different facets
Speaker 6: of it, was really shocking. I was not expecting that.
Speaker 6: I didn't know he was as sick as he was,
Speaker 6: and I hope he wasn't in pain, but yeah, it
Speaker 6: was a real shock yesterday.
Speaker 1: Can you give a little more light on that, because
Speaker 1: we all know Lyn over here in the States is
Speaker 1: Dancing with the Stars and clearly he was strictly come
Speaker 1: dancing with the BBC also though very visible, but maybe
Speaker 1: talk about what a legend he was in dance. You've again,
Speaker 1: he's been judging your competition since you were a little girl.
Speaker 1: And he is the name, and he has a dance company,
Speaker 1: he has a dance school in England, so his name
Speaker 1: still carries on.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, it's still good.
Speaker 6: I mean he is as ballroom, as tight laced as
Speaker 6: they come. He would turn up to these competitions which
Speaker 6: were held every Sunday in England and everybody came, and
Speaker 6: he would come and look so smart and dapper, always
Speaker 6: in a suit. I remember I saw him in jeans
Speaker 6: for the first time at Dancing with the Stars and
Speaker 6: he was just backstage and he had a white t
Speaker 6: shirt on and jeans, and I've never seen him outside
Speaker 6: of a shirt or in any of the pants other
Speaker 6: than trowser pants like soup pounds. So from me, it
Speaker 6: was quite a shock, like I've never seen him so relaxed,
Speaker 6: and he was talking about golf.
Speaker 4: Actually he loved golf. But way back in England.
Speaker 6: When he adjudicating, he was the Lend that you saw
Speaker 6: on screen, only you didn't get to know how you know,
Speaker 6: playful and wise and grumpy he was because he would
Speaker 6: just be standing there with a pen and paper and
Speaker 6: God bless him, he always marked me really well. So
Speaker 6: I remember my parents would take me to every competition
Speaker 6: where they knew he was a judge because they knew, oh,
Speaker 6: Lens on the panel, he'll mark her into the finals.
Speaker 6: So we would drive like sometimes four hours every Sunday
Speaker 6: just to go to a competition where he was and
Speaker 6: I might, honestly, I might even have got his autograph
Speaker 6: when I was maybe twelve or thirteen because he was
Speaker 6: such a legend. That was just the thing to do,
Speaker 6: is you looked up to the people that were extremely
Speaker 6: respected and wise in the field, and definitely Lend was
Speaker 6: one of them.
Speaker 2: Emma, I feel like you have a unique story then,
Speaker 2: because most people say he critiques so harshly. What was
Speaker 2: that connection that you had that he would mark you?
Speaker 6: Well, I know, and well you know when I came
Speaker 6: into the whole Dancing with the Stars realm and became
Speaker 6: judged on national TV by him, he was the judge
Speaker 6: that I absolutely generated the most I don't want to
Speaker 6: say the word fear, but I was the most anxious
Speaker 6: about Len's comment because he had judged me from such
Speaker 6: a young age, and and so I really hung onto
Speaker 6: his every word because he was an actual judge to me.
Speaker 6: He wasn't just a TV judge. He used to do
Speaker 6: that throughout my whole childhood and my whole adolescence. So
Speaker 6: it was quite a shock to see him in this space.
Speaker 6: It was almost like, oh, I couldn't get away from
Speaker 6: like the actual judges of my childhood. But I actually
Speaker 6: I managed to tell him that. So last season, obviously
Speaker 6: he made this announcement or the show made the announcement
Speaker 6: that Len was retiring. Absolute shocked to me. I was,
Speaker 6: I'm very I'm such a sensitive person. I was balling
Speaker 6: my eyes out. And then we went to it wasn't
Speaker 6: a commercial break, but the set was changing, so I
Speaker 6: had a few moments to go down to the judge's
Speaker 6: table and grab his hands and say, hey, I can't
Speaker 6: believe that you're retiring.
Speaker 4: You've been part of my life for so long.
Speaker 6: And I gave him a hug and I told him,
Speaker 6: you know, remember when you would judge me when I
Speaker 6: was a kid, and you were always the best to
Speaker 6: me and so sweet. And somebody called it on camera,
Speaker 6: and so I actually have that video last season of
Speaker 6: me having this moment. And then I walked off and
Speaker 6: I got all tiary and now I'm so grateful for
Speaker 6: that and that I had those few short minutes with him,
Speaker 6: because I mean, I guess time is precious, and I
Speaker 6: just didn't know that he wouldn't be here for me
Speaker 6: to say it to him anymore.
Speaker 1: Good lesson, good lesson, And you talk to him.
Speaker 2: And when was the last time he got an a
Speaker 2: talk to him? Emma?
Speaker 4: It was last season.
Speaker 6: It was around about maybe a week after that was
Speaker 6: the finals, and I congratulated and told him what an
Speaker 6: amazing legacy he has in the show, and just congratulated
Speaker 6: him for being a part of the show and.
Speaker 4: Told him to told him to play golf.
Speaker 6: He absolutely loved golf, so we would talk about that
Speaker 6: quite a bit. Actually, I have no interest in golf whatsoever,
Speaker 6: but I just knew that he would just talk about
Speaker 6: it at the time and he would love it and
Speaker 6: sort of like light up. So told him to do
Speaker 6: all that and that I would be seeing him soon,
Speaker 6: which course isn't going to happen, but he's always going
Speaker 6: to be with us.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you have that moment.
Speaker 4: Yeah, me too.
Speaker 6: I really, looking back on it, it's made me think, God,
Speaker 6: I got to take more of those moments with more people.
Speaker 2: Well, it sounds like he was I mean I even
Speaker 2: in covering the show, I was saying earlier he didn't
Speaker 2: always do the press line. I think he did. He
Speaker 2: keep a little bit of that private boundary even though
Speaker 2: you guys still felt quite close to him.
Speaker 6: Yeah, even backstage, it's almost like you didn't know whether
Speaker 6: you could go up to him because he did like
Speaker 6: to take that line and sometimes you would. Sometimes he
Speaker 6: would absolutely drill you on the dance floor. You'd be
Speaker 6: standing there getting a comment. And I remember with James
Speaker 6: Van der Beeek he said, tooty fruity, what a booty
Speaker 6: and then and then afterwards you would want to go
Speaker 6: and approach him and be like, oh, thank you for
Speaker 6: your comments, or like that was that was such a
Speaker 6: funny remark. Like you would always talk about tea or
Speaker 6: prune Drew's or something quite essentially British, but you would
Speaker 6: never know if you were able to come up to
Speaker 6: him and talk to him, because he did like to
Speaker 6: keep a separation. He loved being in his trailer, he
Speaker 6: loved having his teas, and you know you did okay,
Speaker 6: but sometimes he would sometimes he'd be like, love what
Speaker 6: you did, and then you felt it, you.
Speaker 2: Know, Well, can I ask you, I'm having known him
Speaker 2: so long, what did you take from him about teaching? What?
Speaker 2: What has? What did you learn from him that you've
Speaker 2: brought into the way that you teach, the way that
Speaker 2: you teach your partners, the way that you convey what
Speaker 2: dances to somebody?
Speaker 6: I think, I mean, Lenny's a person of fundamentals and
Speaker 6: he really knows the rule book. So whenever things would
Speaker 6: get a little bit crazy in the dances, he would
Speaker 6: tell you to keep it in line, and he would
Speaker 6: keep you in check and he would be like, don't
Speaker 6: be rolling around on the floor, don't be crazy. All
Speaker 6: these what wafty arm movements. He was a classic man
Speaker 6: who really liked the simple elements and really appreciated the
Speaker 6: quintessential beauty of his craft. And so I knew if
Speaker 6: I wanted to please Len, I would choreograph it very traditionally,
Speaker 6: and I would put a lot of the recognizable steps
Speaker 6: in that I knew he loved and that I knew
Speaker 6: were part of the boring world. And if I wanted to, like,
Speaker 6: you know, make him grumpy, then just don't do any
Speaker 6: of that and just do.
Speaker 4: Your own thing. But you would hear it. You would
Speaker 4: hear about it I get from him.
Speaker 6: I really took the tradition is good, and I will
Speaker 6: keep I will honor that and keep that for him.
Speaker 1: Oh I like that. That's a good line right there.
Speaker 1: Tradition is good, and you'll keep that.
Speaker 6: There's definitely going to be something that I will do
Speaker 6: in the future that will be dedicated to him, for sure.
Speaker 2: And I think even taking the time. What's funny is
Speaker 2: you're not too far from us. You're in Austin, but
Speaker 2: you're only here briefly, so we're still doing this on zoom.
Speaker 2: What are you doing down here? Are you meeting a cowboy.
Speaker 2: What's going on? Can we set you up with a
Speaker 2: nice Texas cowboy?
Speaker 4: Oh, a Texas cowboy would be lovely.
Speaker 6: I've not had the pleasure of meeting on the Texas
Speaker 6: Cowboys so far in Austin, but I'm going to see
Speaker 6: James van Derbeek and we were just talking about him
Speaker 6: on the season, and actually our Fonso is going to
Speaker 6: be here too, so we're actually having a mini reunion.
Speaker 6: It was planned before the tragic news of Land, but
Speaker 6: it will be actually quite nice to be amongst people
Speaker 6: that can kind of celebrate and honor him.
Speaker 4: So I'm just here visiting my friends for a couple
Speaker 4: of days.
Speaker 1: Well, Emma, thank you so much for the time. Truly
Speaker 1: appreciate it in your thoughts of Land and your perspective,
Speaker 1: because you have a perspective nobody has, which is knowing
Speaker 1: him virtually your entire life. So appreciate it.
Speaker 4: Thank you so much, and thank you for honoring him.
Speaker 4: I love that you guys are great.
Speaker 1: It was great talking to a couple of the professional
Speaker 1: dancers to get their perspective and their reverence of Len
Speaker 1: and what he meant. But I wanted to talk to
Speaker 1: a couple of the celebrities, and there are plenty that
Speaker 1: came out of the Bachelor Bachelorette world, and one of
Speaker 1: them joins me now from his home in Iowa. I
Speaker 1: believe he's in Iowa right now. Chris Soles was our
Speaker 1: bachelor and then he was, of course on Dancing with
Speaker 1: the Stars. His dancing partner was Whitney Carson. I believe
Speaker 1: it was season twenty of Dancing with the Stars. You
Speaker 1: were on how you doing, Bud.
Speaker 5: I'm well, Chris, how are you doing? Great?
Speaker 7: Man?
Speaker 1: I appreciate you spending some time to talk about a
Speaker 1: man that meant so much to everybody. And I wanted
Speaker 1: to get a couple of celebrity perspectives on this. What
Speaker 1: did Lynn mean to you guys as celebrity dancers? What
Speaker 1: was his imp act?
Speaker 7: You know?
Speaker 8: The first time I met Lynn was outside a hotel
Speaker 8: I think it's Orlando and in West Hollywood, and that
Speaker 8: was when I just got He asked me the bachelor.
Speaker 5: He had no idea who.
Speaker 8: I was, and I knew who he was, and I
Speaker 8: sat down next to him and I just told him
Speaker 8: what I was going through. And I said, yeah, they
Speaker 8: just asked me to be a bachelor, and whatever and.
Speaker 5: He said, well, you know what that means.
Speaker 8: I means you're probably gonna be in I'm Dancing with
Speaker 8: the Stars like no now a chance in hell. And uh, yeah,
Speaker 8: that was that was my first time meeting Lynn. And
Speaker 8: then you know his impact on me. It was incredible
Speaker 8: just to have a ton of respect for him. And
Speaker 8: he brought a presence to that show that was you know,
Speaker 8: brought a legitimacy to that show, which was remarkable, and
Speaker 8: and uh and uh, just just a brilliant guy.
Speaker 1: Obviously, the professional dancers talked about the reverence they had
Speaker 1: and trying to get a good score and a good
Speaker 1: word from Lend. But you're saying that the celebrities felt
Speaker 1: that as well, even though that wasn't your world.
Speaker 8: I think everyone respected that. I mean, when you go
Speaker 8: into that world, you ark shut. He wanted to be
Speaker 8: professional and and I don't know, I guess that's where
Speaker 8: my heart was.
Speaker 5: And and and you.
Speaker 8: Couldn't you couldn't really argue with his his presence and
Speaker 8: his background. He was the real deal, you know, and
Speaker 8: and there was he wasn't in it to say say
Speaker 8: things that were anything but the truth.
Speaker 1: And when he seemed to, he seemed to appreciate. Uh,
Speaker 1: and I remember you you you know, you and I
Speaker 1: talked about this, if you're going to do it. He
Speaker 1: appreciated when celebrities put their heart and soul into it
Speaker 1: and actually went for it. He knew you weren't professional,
Speaker 1: he knew you guys weren't great, but he really seemed
Speaker 1: to appreciate your effort and your love of dance and
Speaker 1: your love of all of that was dancing with the stars.
Speaker 1: That seemed to be what resonated with me towards the
Speaker 1: celebrities and and you in particular, because you did. You
Speaker 1: were kind of the country guy. It's like, oh, he's
Speaker 1: not really going to do this, but you did, like
Speaker 1: you really sold out for that and you went for
Speaker 1: it with all your heart as you typically do with
Speaker 1: everything you do. Was that something that you felt from Lend.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I know hund percent.
Speaker 8: I respect any person in any profession that that really,
Speaker 8: as you know, has their heart in it, and he
Speaker 8: had his heart in that profession. There was no question,
Speaker 8: as do I with you know, whether it's farming or
Speaker 8: what our experience together on the show on the batch,
Speaker 8: are you're there, enter or you're out? Not those kind
Speaker 8: of things resonate. You know, when you see somebody that
Speaker 8: you just can't deny, that doesn't matter what you say.
Speaker 5: Words are words are just options. When you when you
Speaker 5: see somebody.
Speaker 8: That has you just know, you just know, no, no
Speaker 8: fool fool bullshit, you just know. And that was Len
Speaker 8: and he was a good man. You just could tell.
Speaker 8: And it's a loss to see him go.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, hey, Bud, I appreciate it. It's good to
Speaker 1: see you again. And uh, I appreciate you pulling off
Speaker 1: on the side of the road to share a few
Speaker 1: words and thoughts and memories of uh Lynn goodman. I
Speaker 1: appreciate it. And uh, you're good in life. Life treating
Speaker 1: you well.
Speaker 8: In Iowa, we are planting corn and uh just doing
Speaker 8: God's work over here and one day at a time.
Speaker 5: Man, Yeah, doing well. How are you?
Speaker 1: I'm doing wonderful.
Speaker 5: Thank you.
Speaker 1: Family is good, everybody's healthy and and uh that's that's
Speaker 1: all right. And uh so I appreciate it. Was it
Speaker 1: was good to see you at Well's wedding and I
Speaker 1: miss seeing you and hopefully our pasti across again soon.
Speaker 8: Likewise, like thanks for having me on.
Speaker 1: Good to see you, man, Hi brother, take care. He
Speaker 1: was our Bachelor, and then he appeared on season ten
Speaker 1: of Dancing with the Stars joining me. Now, Jake, Pavelka, Jake,
Speaker 1: it has been a while, my friend, How are you
Speaker 1: doing it?
Speaker 7: Sure? Has Chris doing really well? I missed you.
Speaker 4: How's everything going really good?
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, we're uh, you know, reconvening under these circumstances.
Speaker 1: But I wanted to get, you know, your perspective on
Speaker 1: a guy that we all loved and adored, Lynn Goodman,
Speaker 1: who passed away, and hearing the perspective of the celebrities,
Speaker 1: I think is interesting because he was so revered as
Speaker 1: this godfather and this you know, huge, huge all star
Speaker 1: of dancing. So the professionals loved and adored him and
Speaker 1: admired him. But I'm wondering, what did you think of
Speaker 1: Lynn when you met him or heard of him as
Speaker 1: a judge on Dancing?
Speaker 7: Well, you know my takeaway from dancing as far as
Speaker 7: you know, it's been been many, many years, but he
Speaker 7: you know, Bruno Tagnoli is really funny carry in and
Speaker 7: Abba is just a huge character with a huge personality,
Speaker 7: brings a lot of the show. Lynn. Lynn was the
Speaker 7: you know, the the cutting edge professional and he cared
Speaker 7: about everybody. Uh, you know, he genuinely, no matter what
Speaker 7: your skill level, gave you advice at your current level
Speaker 7: to because he wanted to see you succeed. And I
Speaker 7: think he was always disappointed, you know, when when somebody
Speaker 7: just wasn't quite going to get it, or when somebody
Speaker 7: had a breakthrough, and that's you know, that's that's the
Speaker 7: most memorable takeaway. Something funny though, when when we were
Speaker 7: shooting the show in twenty ten, they keep everybody at
Speaker 7: the you know, at the same apartment complex there in
Speaker 7: Los Angeles, real close to maybe s Television City. And
Speaker 7: I don't know how old Linn was at the time,
Speaker 7: but yeah, he wore a bright speedo by the pool.
Speaker 7: You'd see him down there frequently getting some son.
Speaker 1: A side of Lynn you didn't necessarily need to see
Speaker 1: or or want to.
Speaker 7: But you know what, that's okay because he was just
Speaker 7: as happy as a lark by the pool, didn't care
Speaker 7: what anybody thought. Such a great guy. I'm so sad
Speaker 7: to learn that he's passed away.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I think everybody's sentiment is the same
Speaker 1: of you know, one of the dancers we talked to
Speaker 1: earlier just kind of summed it up as he was
Speaker 1: the heart of the show, kind of this father's figure
Speaker 1: and earning his respect, earning his words meant a lot
Speaker 1: to you.
Speaker 7: Guys, It really did, because Lynn was you know, I mean,
Speaker 7: most of the people that are on Dancing with the Stars,
Speaker 7: including the professionals, you know, they're they're entertainers. Lynn Lynn
Speaker 7: is a dancer and a teacher, instructor, a very effective instructor,
Speaker 7: because you know, one of the big things on that show.
Speaker 7: One of the things that I kind of struggled with
Speaker 7: a little bit is just because you were a crazy
Speaker 7: dancer and just do some incredible things with your body
Speaker 7: on a dance floor does not mean that you can
Speaker 7: explain that to somebody. You know, how to do what
Speaker 7: you're doing and when, and Lynn just had that muscle
Speaker 7: that he could flex in that he could he could
Speaker 7: see what you're doing, you see what you're doing wrong,
Speaker 7: and give you very technical details in a very short
Speaker 7: amount of time while you're standing there, and not make
Speaker 7: you feel judged. You know you were being judged, but
Speaker 7: he just had a very delicate way of putting it.
Speaker 7: And that's so appreciated because everybody on there, most people
Speaker 7: can't dance right unless you're Nicole Scherzinger. But most people
Speaker 7: go on there that can't dance and got two lefts
Speaker 7: to trying to learn it. They're doing it in front
Speaker 7: of America, and it can be it's nerve wracking, and
Speaker 7: he just really understood that.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it goes back to he was a
Speaker 1: very well renowned a judic cater over in Europe and England,
Speaker 1: and so he was used to dealing with kids and
Speaker 1: talking to people that are just learning and so uh
Speaker 1: he he it's good to hear he had this way
Speaker 1: about him and just an amazing man, and it's it's
Speaker 1: good to hear the perspective of people that were going
Speaker 1: through the process of what what he meant to, even
Speaker 1: the celebrities on the show. It's very cool.
Speaker 7: Yes, yeah, absolutely that that's very very well well uh
Speaker 7: well stated.
Speaker 1: Before I let you go, just your your lasting impression
Speaker 1: of Len what you will remember about him forever, you
Speaker 1: know what.
Speaker 7: Uh So they didn't capture this on camera, but Chelsea
Speaker 7: Iwer my partner and I and it was it was
Speaker 7: towards the semifinals. I mean he was episode six or
Speaker 7: seven out of the ten. We had a wardrobe malfunction
Speaker 7: and nobody saw it except Lynn, And then afterwards he said, Chris,
Speaker 7: what happened was, uh, it was a It was a
Speaker 7: move where I was, you know, on my knees and
Speaker 7: I was spinning Chelsea real fast twice and she moves her,
Speaker 7: you know, spins around twice in my arms, and somehow
Speaker 7: my hand got mixed up with her wardrobe and went
Speaker 7: right into the front of her fold, and I got it.
Speaker 7: Bless her heart, you know, it is what it is.
Speaker 7: Nobody saw it. America didn't say anything when it aired.
Speaker 7: She Chelsea and I thought we were the only two
Speaker 7: that actually knew that that happened. Lynn came up after
Speaker 7: the show and said, what did you think about that?
Speaker 7: He said, I saw what exactly what happened. You guys
Speaker 7: gonna start dating right.
Speaker 1: That's a great guy, a great guy, and I appreciate
Speaker 1: you taking the time to share your perspective. It's been
Speaker 1: a while and hopefully we won't wait so long before
Speaker 1: we catch up again.
Speaker 7: My friend, Yes, sir, I'd love that, all.
Speaker 1: Right, Jake Pavelka appreciate.
Speaker 7: It, you bet, Take care, Chris, thank you, My.
Speaker 1: Thanks to the professional dancers. Lindsay Arnold Imma Slater and
Speaker 1: celebrity dancers Chris Sols Jake Pavelka for their perspective and
Speaker 1: their words for Lynn Goodman, who we lost this week.
Speaker 1: We remember him through their words as this adjudicator, this judge,
Speaker 1: this celebrity, and he was a celebrity in the world
Speaker 1: of dance and was huge and the BBC was huge
Speaker 1: on ABC with Dancing with the Stars and did an
Speaker 1: amazing job and touched millions and millions of lives, as
Speaker 1: Lendsay Arnold said, shaped her life and Emma Slater from
Speaker 1: the age of twelve shaped her life. But I think
Speaker 1: if he were here, he would agree that the greatest
Speaker 1: job he ever held was that of husband, father and grandfather.
Speaker 1: And I said this earlier, but to repeat it because
Speaker 1: it is such a Lynn Goodman thing to say. The
Speaker 1: obituary that he had written for himself was he was
Speaker 1: a dance teacher from Dartford who got lucky. Because that's
Speaker 1: just about the truth of it. Well, Len, with all
Speaker 1: due respect, I know those are your words, but you
Speaker 1: were so much more than that. You made such a
Speaker 1: bigger impact than that. And people often say at a
Speaker 1: funeral and at times like this, what is legacy legacy
Speaker 1: is that lasting impression the lives you change when you
Speaker 1: were long gone, and that Lynn Goodman was not luck.
Speaker 1: That was all you. So thank you for a life
Speaker 1: well lived and for all that you gave us for
Speaker 1: this many years. And I appreciate you the listener indulging
Speaker 1: Lauren and I for doing this special episode today for
Speaker 1: Lynn Goodman. Truly appreciate it. And we will talk to
Speaker 1: you next time because we have a lot more to
Speaker 1: talk about. Thanks for listening. Follow us on Instagram at
Speaker 1: the most dramatic pod ever and make sure to write
Speaker 1: us a review and leave us five stars. I'll talk
Speaker 1: to you next time.