1
00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:05,120
Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media.

2
00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:08,000
Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff,

3
00:00:08,039 --> 00:00:10,280
Speaker 2: which is a show that I didn't just introduce badly

4
00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:13,039
Speaker 2: and then make Ian our audio engineer cut out the

5
00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:16,640
Speaker 2: entire last two minutes of I have a guest. It's

6
00:00:16,760 --> 00:00:18,079
Speaker 2: Jamie Jamie Loftus.

7
00:00:18,280 --> 00:00:20,200
Speaker 3: Hi Jamie, Hi, Margaret, how are you.

8
00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:21,880
Speaker 2: I'm doing pretty good.

9
00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:24,760
Speaker 3: I liked your first intro, but but I kind of

10
00:00:24,880 --> 00:00:27,320
Speaker 3: liked that. Now it's just sort of just between us.

11
00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:32,040
Speaker 2: It's the secret one. It's just us and Sophie, who's

12
00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:36,840
Speaker 2: the producer. Hi, Sophie, I and that's how you were doing.

13
00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:40,800
Speaker 4: But I felt as noted.

14
00:00:40,920 --> 00:00:43,440
Speaker 1: I fell on my face right before we started to record,

15
00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:45,800
Speaker 1: because I was trying not to be like because I'm a.

16
00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:50,920
Speaker 3: Hero, yeah, but my own but my own villain. I

17
00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:56,560
Speaker 3: decided long ago that I would never become injured for

18
00:00:56,640 --> 00:00:59,000
Speaker 3: a podcast. It only has to happen once.

19
00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:02,680
Speaker 1: It really realize for the podcast, it cannot happen. It

20
00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:06,240
Speaker 1: was for you, two lovely ladies who all thanks.

21
00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:08,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, so I bleed for you.

22
00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:09,160
Speaker 4: You're welcome.

23
00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:11,440
Speaker 3: Did you bleed totally?

24
00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:13,120
Speaker 4: Oh?

25
00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:16,440
Speaker 3: You look so you don't look like someone who just

26
00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:19,080
Speaker 3: was bleeding. And I mean that is the highest.

27
00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:23,040
Speaker 1: Bar there are, Like on Zoom, they do have features

28
00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:24,959
Speaker 1: that make you look better looking than you actually are.

29
00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:29,880
Speaker 3: That's while what if you were absolutely gushing blood from

30
00:01:29,920 --> 00:01:31,960
Speaker 3: your head and we just couldn't tell.

31
00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:33,240
Speaker 4: You'll never know.

32
00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:36,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's like a threshold where it brings up a

33
00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:41,640
Speaker 2: little bar like warning, please call emergency services. And until then.

34
00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:49,160
Speaker 3: I went bird watching the other day, brag you. Yeah,

35
00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:53,360
Speaker 3: you know, I was kind of taking in nature, appreciating

36
00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:55,840
Speaker 3: the world for once. But I was with my friend

37
00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:57,880
Speaker 3: who's a big bird watcher, and he had this bird

38
00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:03,080
Speaker 3: watching app that basically runs audio. Wow, it's really cool

39
00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:04,880
Speaker 3: and then you could like hear the birds around you.

40
00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:09,800
Speaker 3: The exchange there, though, is that you that it sends

41
00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:14,720
Speaker 3: the audio to the autobund society, including whatever conversation you're

42
00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:17,640
Speaker 3: having with your friend while you're on a walk. And

43
00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:19,880
Speaker 3: so my friend do is like, I know, like I

44
00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:22,800
Speaker 3: want to catch up, but like, don't talk shit because

45
00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:25,160
Speaker 3: this is going to the autobun society. I was like,

46
00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:28,880
Speaker 3: this is the most bizarre surveillance technology. And then I

47
00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:30,839
Speaker 3: went horror movie brain and I was like, what if

48
00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:36,720
Speaker 3: you killed me right now? And the only evidence the

49
00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:40,680
Speaker 3: autobund society had and they didn't even know because they're like, oh,

50
00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:44,799
Speaker 3: look yet another Canadian goose. You know, not a lot

51
00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:46,120
Speaker 3: of this one.

52
00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:52,320
Speaker 2: Explain why you listeners can't see this, But Jamie is

53
00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:56,800
Speaker 2: actually translucent. I can see the wall behind her right now.

54
00:02:58,440 --> 00:02:59,880
Speaker 2: That actually makes a lot of sense.

55
00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:03,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I was trying to be festive, but.

56
00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:07,960
Speaker 2: Yes, well, oh wait, I'm not supposed to tell. First

57
00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:09,919
Speaker 2: I have to finish the rest of the introduction, which

58
00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:16,720
Speaker 2: is our audio engineer is Ian Hien Hi Ianan. Our

59
00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,280
Speaker 2: theme music was written for us by un woman, and

60
00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:22,200
Speaker 2: you all will be shocked to know that this week,

61
00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:25,840
Speaker 2: of all weeks, we're going to talk about a really

62
00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:31,919
Speaker 2: obscure hipster holiday that no one's talking about called Halloween.

63
00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:33,000
Speaker 2: You ever heard Halloween?

64
00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:37,000
Speaker 3: Oh? Boy? Have I? I was really hoping this would

65
00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:40,200
Speaker 3: be this would be what we're talking about. Yes, I've

66
00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:43,120
Speaker 3: heard of it. But I'm sure there's things I don't know.

67
00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:45,760
Speaker 2: I think there'll be things that you don't know, and

68
00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:48,400
Speaker 2: then ironically, there'll be things that we think we know

69
00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:51,560
Speaker 2: that actually we don't know. But I can't say are

70
00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:54,240
Speaker 2: actually wrong, but I can say are less certain than

71
00:03:54,280 --> 00:03:56,840
Speaker 2: everyone says. Because if there's one thing I have learned.

72
00:03:57,520 --> 00:03:59,880
Speaker 2: It's that everyone who confidently says they know the history

73
00:03:59,920 --> 00:04:00,920
Speaker 2: of Halloween is lying.

74
00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:04,320
Speaker 3: I love that, and I'm sure that I've done that

75
00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:04,960
Speaker 3: at some point.

76
00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:06,280
Speaker 4: It's so fun to find.

77
00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:11,800
Speaker 3: Seemingly innocuous topics that everyone needs to feel like they

78
00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:14,280
Speaker 3: have a grip on, but they can't tell you why

79
00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:16,880
Speaker 3: they need to feel as if they have a grip

80
00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:25,680
Speaker 3: on it. Well, what, kid, when did you learn the truth?

81
00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:28,920
Speaker 3: Contrasted with what did you think that? Were you far

82
00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:30,720
Speaker 3: off from what the truth is now that you know?

83
00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:33,200
Speaker 2: Okay? So I came into it being like, all right,

84
00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:35,000
Speaker 2: I'm going to do a Halloween episode, and I'm going

85
00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:39,279
Speaker 2: to talk about Halloween. I'm gonna talk about Sowin, right,

86
00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:44,040
Speaker 2: the Celtic holiday that, by most popular imagination and with

87
00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:48,159
Speaker 2: some truth, is the precursor of Halloween. Right, But it's

88
00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:53,919
Speaker 2: like not as much, and it's complicated because everything that

89
00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,920
Speaker 2: has to do with like, like most of the shit

90
00:04:56,960 --> 00:05:00,520
Speaker 2: that I research, the problem is that there's like not enough,

91
00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:02,880
Speaker 2: like there's not enough information about it.

92
00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:03,640
Speaker 4: Okay.

93
00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:06,120
Speaker 2: The problem with fucking Halloween is that there's too much

94
00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:10,720
Speaker 2: information about it, and it's all stated confidently by experts,

95
00:05:10,839 --> 00:05:16,479
Speaker 2: and it all disagrees with itself and God, we're just

96
00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:21,240
Speaker 2: going to get into it. We're gonna okay, yeah, I'm curious,

97
00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:22,880
Speaker 2: where are you coming at with it?

98
00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:25,599
Speaker 3: The closest I got, I mean, I think I have

99
00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:30,200
Speaker 3: the general like under I understood it more to be.

100
00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:35,200
Speaker 3: I knew that it had had Celtic roots, like I've

101
00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:38,159
Speaker 3: obviously heard it, but that was not something I got into.

102
00:05:38,279 --> 00:05:41,640
Speaker 3: I had an uncle, have an uncle he's still with us,

103
00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:47,320
Speaker 3: who is a witch. That's how he chooses to identify

104
00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:52,560
Speaker 3: because he found the term warlock to be humiliating and gendered,

105
00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:56,159
Speaker 3: and so he identifies as which he lives in the Carolinas.

106
00:05:56,240 --> 00:06:01,320
Speaker 3: And my understanding being oh yeah, oh yeah, because he's

107
00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:04,799
Speaker 3: been on a podcast of mine, Uncle Dennis. Uncle, Oh shit, Uncle,

108
00:06:07,760 --> 00:06:10,680
Speaker 3: he's there if you're gonna talk, So he's like a

109
00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:14,000
Speaker 3: medium and if you're gonna, you know, commune with your dead,

110
00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:16,800
Speaker 3: you better do it with my uncle Dennis, who has

111
00:06:16,839 --> 00:06:19,760
Speaker 3: the thickest New England accent on the face of the planet,

112
00:06:20,400 --> 00:06:22,560
Speaker 3: where he's like, you're in national in life, you're a

113
00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:23,520
Speaker 3: national in death.

114
00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:24,440
Speaker 4: Whatever.

115
00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:27,760
Speaker 3: But his his whole thing was like this is uh,

116
00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:31,600
Speaker 3: you know, this is a holiday that is important in

117
00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:35,440
Speaker 3: the pagan like to me as a pagan, and it

118
00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:40,680
Speaker 3: was taken from us and turned into corporate bullshit. And

119
00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:43,120
Speaker 3: that was sort of the narrative that I was raised

120
00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:46,440
Speaker 3: in that I'm sure is uh it was.

121
00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:49,080
Speaker 4: It seemed to be an emotionally driven thing for him.

122
00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:53,839
Speaker 3: But I appreciated his punk rock spirit uh in being

123
00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:57,039
Speaker 3: angry at I forget, like there's a specific you know,

124
00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:00,599
Speaker 3: corporate entity that he felt it really take, you know,

125
00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:05,360
Speaker 3: spirit has really taken things from us. But I mean,

126
00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:08,560
Speaker 3: I love I Unfortunately, I'll take Halloween in any of

127
00:07:08,560 --> 00:07:13,120
Speaker 3: its forms, including the corny corporate sense struggle. I struggle

128
00:07:13,160 --> 00:07:17,200
Speaker 3: with my anti capitalist views this time of year.

129
00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:20,880
Speaker 2: I actually think that pretty much all of them have

130
00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:26,280
Speaker 2: a legitimate claim the Halloween. Like I think, Well, we'll

131
00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:27,880
Speaker 2: get into it, and I will also say the one

132
00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:29,320
Speaker 2: thing that will definitely come out of this is that

133
00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:34,000
Speaker 2: your uncle Dennis is absolutely historically accurate to call himself

134
00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:34,320
Speaker 2: a witch.

135
00:07:35,400 --> 00:07:37,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, I'm sure he knows that, and I just

136
00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:40,240
Speaker 3: like I just didn't.

137
00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:46,080
Speaker 2: I didn't until like when I wrote this script.

138
00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:49,119
Speaker 4: Shout out to my witch uncle.

139
00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:53,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, you ever heard of a holiday? Well, okay, so

140
00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:57,160
Speaker 2: we're gonna talk about swin Okay, and we're gonna talk

141
00:07:57,160 --> 00:07:59,720
Speaker 2: about Halloween, and we're gonna talk about Lemuria, and we're

142
00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:02,000
Speaker 2: going to talk about all Hallows tied. We're going to

143
00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:04,320
Speaker 2: talk about witch hunts. We're going to talk about folklore.

144
00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:06,880
Speaker 2: We're going to talk about why evangelicals hate Halloween and

145
00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:10,600
Speaker 2: are actually wrong in the way that they hate Halloween. Like,

146
00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:12,320
Speaker 2: fuck them, they shouldn't get to have nice things.

147
00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:15,600
Speaker 3: But like sure, I mean, but I feel bad for

148
00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:20,000
Speaker 3: evangelical kids that, like you're like this child deeply wants

149
00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:24,640
Speaker 3: to be bluey and yet and yet I'm excited. Yeah,

150
00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:27,360
Speaker 3: because it is. It is an amalgam of like five

151
00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:31,200
Speaker 3: different holidays and concepts. Okay, cool, Yeah, And.

152
00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:32,880
Speaker 2: Of course we're going to tie it into the enclosure

153
00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:34,800
Speaker 2: of the Commons. Don't worry. I know you were worried

154
00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:36,600
Speaker 2: about whether or not I would tie the lead enclosure

155
00:08:36,600 --> 00:08:37,200
Speaker 2: of the Commons.

156
00:08:37,240 --> 00:08:37,959
Speaker 4: I was losing it.

157
00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:42,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, But anything that happens in medieval England I can

158
00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:46,320
Speaker 2: tie into that easy. So normally I go back like

159
00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:48,080
Speaker 2: two thousand years to start off, and I go like

160
00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,320
Speaker 2: as far back to context, But this time I'm actually

161
00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:52,440
Speaker 2: going to start with a really quick overview of like

162
00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:57,720
Speaker 2: where we are now because I only grew up with Halloween, right,

163
00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:01,000
Speaker 2: I didn't grow up celebrating All Saints Day, All Souls Day.

164
00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:06,040
Speaker 2: But it's a three day holiday in Christianity, especially Catholicism,

165
00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:09,720
Speaker 2: called All hallow Tide. Have you ever heard of All

166
00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:10,440
Speaker 2: hollow Tide?

167
00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:11,560
Speaker 4: No?

168
00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:12,880
Speaker 2: No, I had neither.

169
00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:15,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was like and we both grew up I

170
00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:15,760
Speaker 3: know Christian.

171
00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:22,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, yeah, I've heard of its component pieces, which

172
00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:26,280
Speaker 2: is that October thirty first, we have All Hallows Eve, Halloween,

173
00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:30,240
Speaker 2: November one, that's All Saints Day, November two is All

174
00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:35,280
Speaker 2: Souls Day, and it's the Christian holiday for remembering and

175
00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:42,200
Speaker 2: honoring the dead, especially family and ancestors. But the right

176
00:09:42,200 --> 00:09:45,680
Speaker 2: wing evangelicals absolutely fucking hate it for being pagan and strange.

177
00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:50,560
Speaker 2: And only forty nine percent of US Evangelical Christians celebrate

178
00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:54,920
Speaker 2: Halloween like quote unquote fully. The rest either don't celebrate

179
00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:58,800
Speaker 2: it at all or they refuse to celebrate the pagan elements.

180
00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:04,720
Speaker 3: What is when they say fully, do they mean like

181
00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:10,280
Speaker 3: they're not you know, like microdosing like that to me

182
00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:14,040
Speaker 3: is a full Halloween, Like you can do the diet

183
00:10:14,160 --> 00:10:16,480
Speaker 3: version of it, but you know, where's the fun in that.

184
00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:19,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're not watching song and like them.

185
00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:22,680
Speaker 3: Wait, they're not watching every Saw movie back to back,

186
00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:25,640
Speaker 3: no pe breaks allowed. Is that I'm not doing it

187
00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:28,240
Speaker 3: all the way.

188
00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:31,320
Speaker 2: I watch horror movies at the time of year, but

189
00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:34,520
Speaker 2: I don't watch like gore porn ones, and so it's

190
00:10:34,559 --> 00:10:36,280
Speaker 2: like very hard. I keep trying to find the ones

191
00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:39,920
Speaker 2: that are like like and people then if they want

192
00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:41,680
Speaker 2: to show me horror movies, they're like, oh, well, someone

193
00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:43,760
Speaker 2: gets they're face peeled off in this one, And I'm like, look,

194
00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:48,559
Speaker 2: one face peeled off is okay for me. It's a movie.

195
00:10:49,200 --> 00:10:51,839
Speaker 2: If it's called like face Peeler seven, It's like.

196
00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:55,839
Speaker 3: Not for me, right, I used to. It's only been

197
00:10:55,880 --> 00:11:00,280
Speaker 3: in the past five years that I've really gotten into

198
00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:04,440
Speaker 3: it particularly. I mean I really love the Saw movies.

199
00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:06,840
Speaker 3: I think once I once I really locked into the

200
00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:11,079
Speaker 3: Jigsaw lore I tried to make. I was writing for

201
00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:13,640
Speaker 3: a cartoon this year and I wrote a character called well,

202
00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:15,760
Speaker 3: I didn't name the character, but it's called jug Saw,

203
00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:17,800
Speaker 3: which is like big titty Jigsaw.

204
00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:22,559
Speaker 2: And I was thinking jug Head is now Saw.

205
00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:27,720
Speaker 4: No no, no, no, that you were thinking too hard?

206
00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:32,679
Speaker 3: Yeah, what if Jigsaw had big old Jugs was sort

207
00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:34,760
Speaker 3: of as far as I thought. I do, I do

208
00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:36,800
Speaker 3: like those movies, but I but I also think that,

209
00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:40,200
Speaker 3: you know, the holiday. I'm wondering the holiday is like

210
00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:44,480
Speaker 3: inherent conflation with extreme violence, if that actually comes from

211
00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:48,400
Speaker 3: anywhere outside of its association with the concept of death.

212
00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:51,720
Speaker 2: I couldn't quite tell you the answer to that, but

213
00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:54,240
Speaker 2: I can. But there will be a lot of really

214
00:11:54,400 --> 00:12:01,400
Speaker 2: horrible shit happening, oh good from the state, Okay, the

215
00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:05,600
Speaker 2: true horror of all history. Okay, at some point, but

216
00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:07,760
Speaker 2: not right now. I really want to get into like

217
00:12:07,920 --> 00:12:12,440
Speaker 2: talking more about the the feminist implications of like gore

218
00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:16,040
Speaker 2: porn movies and why so many women are obsessed with

219
00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:18,680
Speaker 2: them and like obsessed with movies that focus around misog

220
00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:20,640
Speaker 2: just violence and stuff like that, and how it can

221
00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:23,280
Speaker 2: actually be a vehicle for like really interesting things and

222
00:12:23,320 --> 00:12:28,320
Speaker 2: like like but that's another time, I guess.

223
00:12:28,720 --> 00:12:31,480
Speaker 3: But I mean we could just talk about that on

224
00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:33,760
Speaker 3: the phone, yeah, because okay, great, Yeah, because it's a

225
00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:36,120
Speaker 3: whole like I yeah, I feel like I've not I

226
00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:41,000
Speaker 3: know so many people who have had a bizarre journey

227
00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:44,240
Speaker 3: with that in the last like decade, myself included where

228
00:12:44,280 --> 00:12:46,200
Speaker 3: I used to like this time ten years ago, there's

229
00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:49,640
Speaker 3: no way I would. But then I don't know what

230
00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:52,839
Speaker 3: it is about like aging, where you're like, no, I

231
00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:56,480
Speaker 3: do want to see what Jigsaw is going to do

232
00:12:56,640 --> 00:12:58,000
Speaker 3: to this woman's leg?

233
00:12:58,880 --> 00:12:59,840
Speaker 4: Why?

234
00:12:59,640 --> 00:12:59,800
Speaker 1: Why?

235
00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:03,000
Speaker 3: And why is that my politics have not changed, they've

236
00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:06,200
Speaker 3: grown more intensive anything, But I am open to seeing

237
00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:08,000
Speaker 3: what Jigsaw is gonna do with the leg.

238
00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:12,319
Speaker 2: Right, Okay, there's so much to it, but but yeah, okay,

239
00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:15,840
Speaker 2: so okay. So one of the reasons is really funny

240
00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:18,520
Speaker 2: that the page sorry, the evangelicals refuse to celebrate the

241
00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:22,760
Speaker 2: pagan elements. There's a chance that none is pagan. There's

242
00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:24,880
Speaker 2: a chance that it's like all chriss.

243
00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:27,720
Speaker 4: Okay, oh god, the what a bummer?

244
00:13:27,760 --> 00:13:28,040
Speaker 3: Oops?

245
00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:30,320
Speaker 4: All christian? Uh.

246
00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:33,000
Speaker 2: I would argue that if you're part of a theological

247
00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:35,720
Speaker 2: tradition that worships a dead guy or pagan and strange anyway,

248
00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:41,400
Speaker 2: it's fine, true, but like the weird delineation between like, well,

249
00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:46,240
Speaker 2: I only believe in like one strange supernatural creature who's

250
00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:47,239
Speaker 2: kind of three.

251
00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:53,960
Speaker 3: Yes categories to this ununderstandable being.

252
00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:59,840
Speaker 2: Yeah. So okay, that's the current holiday that evangelicals refuse

253
00:13:59,880 --> 00:14:02,320
Speaker 2: to and some of it probably does come from paganism.

254
00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:07,040
Speaker 2: But it's like it's it's just all messy. Okay, all right,

255
00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:09,760
Speaker 2: Now we go thousands of years in the past, instead

256
00:14:09,800 --> 00:14:12,760
Speaker 2: of immediately tracing into Sowen, the Celtic holiday that looks

257
00:14:12,760 --> 00:14:14,760
Speaker 2: like it should be pronounced sam hayne if people are

258
00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:19,040
Speaker 2: wondering what word I'm saying, we're instead going to it

259
00:14:19,640 --> 00:14:21,800
Speaker 2: gets the modern date from Swyen and some other stuff,

260
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:24,520
Speaker 2: and we'll talk about that, okay, But I'm gonna draw

261
00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:27,680
Speaker 2: on a different lineage first, because Sowyen isn't the first

262
00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:31,400
Speaker 2: place that the Christian holiday drew from. It came from

263
00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:34,960
Speaker 2: a holiday called Lemuria. You ever heard of Lemuria? The holiday?

264
00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:38,240
Speaker 3: No, it sounds if you if you asked me what

265
00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:40,280
Speaker 3: is Lamuria, I would say, I don't know.

266
00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:42,200
Speaker 4: It sounds like a skin disease.

267
00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:47,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, but yeah, no, I don't know what it is.

268
00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:51,160
Speaker 2: The most famous Limuria isn't what I'm going to talk

269
00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:53,680
Speaker 2: about today. The most famous Lamuria. And I'm ranking this

270
00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:58,000
Speaker 2: by the one that gets a Wikipedia page, okay without

271
00:14:58,320 --> 00:14:59,840
Speaker 2: one of them is Lamuria, and then one of them

272
00:14:59,920 --> 00:15:03,040
Speaker 2: is Lemuria holiday or whatever you know. Okay, the most

273
00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:05,400
Speaker 2: famous one is a fictional continent it's kind of an

274
00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:09,120
Speaker 2: Atlantis of the Indian Ocean. Ooh, that was all the

275
00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:12,440
Speaker 2: rage in nineteenth century occultism.

276
00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:19,080
Speaker 3: Nineteenth century occultism just a bottomless pit of weirdo shit. Okay, okay,

277
00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:21,360
Speaker 3: not surprised to hear, Lo Maria. This is also the

278
00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:23,840
Speaker 3: same time where people are like the Acashic Records, the

279
00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:28,920
Speaker 3: Infinite Library, that's vaguely fascistic, and you're just like, sure, guys.

280
00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:33,400
Speaker 2: It exactly, and this thing still the continent still has

281
00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:38,360
Speaker 2: weird cultural influences today. Incorrect people claim this continent is

282
00:15:38,400 --> 00:15:41,360
Speaker 2: where humans come from, that the first humans were called Limurians,

283
00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:45,680
Speaker 2: the continent, it's going to all tie together. The continent

284
00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:49,440
Speaker 2: gets its name from lemurs, which are the cute little

285
00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:50,800
Speaker 2: animals that look like squirrel monkeys.

286
00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:54,360
Speaker 3: Timon, No, that's no way, that's a mere cat. No,

287
00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:55,560
Speaker 3: Timon's a mere cat.

288
00:15:55,800 --> 00:15:56,440
Speaker 2: Oh it's okay.

289
00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:00,680
Speaker 4: So I only understand things out of Gascar.

290
00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:03,480
Speaker 2: I couldn't tell you.

291
00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:10,640
Speaker 3: Oh, they're the little They're like the FBI of Madagascar. Okay,

292
00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:13,600
Speaker 3: I understand the FBI. Okay.

293
00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:17,600
Speaker 2: I think I was gonna pretend like I just got it,

294
00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:18,240
Speaker 2: but they don't.

295
00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:22,840
Speaker 3: As I said, I'm like that's maybe a dishonest. They're like,

296
00:16:23,520 --> 00:16:26,600
Speaker 3: they're well, if you view the FBI as criminals, the

297
00:16:27,200 --> 00:16:30,680
Speaker 3: lemurs they're always you know, pulling little operations. Oh okay,

298
00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:35,360
Speaker 3: and they're generally considered to be you know, negative operations.

299
00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:37,760
Speaker 3: So that's why I think of them as the FBI.

300
00:16:38,040 --> 00:16:40,200
Speaker 2: Okay, see this actually does tie into where they get

301
00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:45,840
Speaker 2: their names. But okay, so lemurs. People were like, why

302
00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:48,320
Speaker 2: are there lemur fossils in Madagascar and also the Indian

303
00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:51,280
Speaker 2: subcontinent And they're not technically lemur fossils, but they're like

304
00:16:51,280 --> 00:16:54,080
Speaker 2: close right and not in the land in between the two.

305
00:16:54,400 --> 00:16:57,840
Speaker 2: And so the answer the actual answers continental drift. Probably

306
00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:01,560
Speaker 2: I lost a good chunk of my life skimming scholarly

307
00:17:01,680 --> 00:17:04,040
Speaker 2: articles about this before realizing this is like a tangent

308
00:17:04,080 --> 00:17:07,800
Speaker 2: of a tangent of a tangent of my point, uh huh.

309
00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:11,320
Speaker 2: But the important thing is it's not there because of

310
00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:13,359
Speaker 2: a mysterious continent that has disappeared.

311
00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:14,399
Speaker 4: Okay.

312
00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:18,760
Speaker 2: The Lemurs they get their name from the Latin lemorez,

313
00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:24,400
Speaker 2: which is ghosts. It is the Latin for ghosts. Whoa Okay, Lemurs,

314
00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:29,639
Speaker 2: like the FBI move at night and our spooky and

315
00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:30,119
Speaker 2: are scary.

316
00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:31,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, they're scary to us personally.

317
00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:36,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly, much like lemurs have fucked with my

318
00:17:36,280 --> 00:17:45,560
Speaker 2: friends and so lemores, the Latin one, right, the Roman one.

319
00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:48,399
Speaker 2: If you have them in your house, If you have

320
00:17:48,440 --> 00:17:51,840
Speaker 2: ghosts in your house, what are you gonna do about it?

321
00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:53,600
Speaker 4: Call a lemur?

322
00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:58,680
Speaker 2: Basically, Yeah, you have to wait till early May for

323
00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:02,200
Speaker 2: the feast days of Lamur. Yeah, which was May ninth, eleventh,

324
00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:03,720
Speaker 2: and thirteenth. I don't know if it had to like

325
00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:05,240
Speaker 2: only be odd days or if they were like we

326
00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:08,080
Speaker 2: need a break between our feasts or what.

327
00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:11,040
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, you sort of need a day to let

328
00:18:11,080 --> 00:18:11,960
Speaker 3: it course through.

329
00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:14,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, I like that.

330
00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:17,760
Speaker 3: I liked maybe it was just pooh days, like all right,

331
00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:19,840
Speaker 3: we're on one day and then we got to really

332
00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:21,920
Speaker 3: just pooh the next day.

333
00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:26,159
Speaker 2: Yeah. But then, yeah, that's pretty much almost certainly what happened.

334
00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:31,320
Speaker 2: There's only one guy whoever wrote about Le Maria. His

335
00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:33,000
Speaker 2: name was Ovid, and he wrote about it a long

336
00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:35,880
Speaker 2: ass time ago, so he actually knew a bit about

337
00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:37,640
Speaker 2: what he was talking about. So we have one account

338
00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:38,320
Speaker 2: of Lo Maurria.

339
00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:44,560
Speaker 4: Okay, are we talking like the ancient poet?

340
00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:45,119
Speaker 2: Yeah?

341
00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:49,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh okay, okay, Yeah.

342
00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:54,280
Speaker 2: So possibly even more apocor foolish. There was a holiday

343
00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:59,679
Speaker 2: called Ramia, which was the celebration of Remus, the brother

344
00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:02,960
Speaker 2: of Romulus, who yeah, like.

345
00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:06,520
Speaker 3: The way that Rome started titty sucker guys.

346
00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:11,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, since Rome's founding myth as two brothers got

347
00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:13,800
Speaker 2: into a pointless fucking argument and one killed the other

348
00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:17,800
Speaker 2: and now here we are, which makes sense for Rome

349
00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:22,639
Speaker 2: and basically all of European civilization that's descended from it. Yeah,

350
00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:25,320
Speaker 2: so there might have been a celebration called Ramuria, which

351
00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,560
Speaker 2: was like after they're like, hey, like remember me, bro,

352
00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:32,000
Speaker 2: you know, don't let people forget me. Like the ghost

353
00:19:32,119 --> 00:19:34,840
Speaker 2: came back and was like, there must be a holiday

354
00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:35,199
Speaker 2: for me.

355
00:19:37,520 --> 00:19:40,480
Speaker 3: I mean that kind of endears me to him, honestly,

356
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,520
Speaker 3: because you're like, I guess if you could, you would

357
00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:44,119
Speaker 3: want to, right.

358
00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:47,719
Speaker 2: Yeah. I spent about three hours trying to figure out

359
00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:51,560
Speaker 2: if there's symbolism between Romulus versus u Rimus in terms

360
00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:53,640
Speaker 2: of like something that I could like tie it into

361
00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:56,920
Speaker 2: some other shit. They both were probably just dicks who

362
00:19:56,960 --> 00:19:57,920
Speaker 2: fucking killed each other.

363
00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:02,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, just brother things. You're like, this happens in litters

364
00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:04,200
Speaker 3: of kittens all the time.

365
00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:07,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly exactly. I was like, well, is it like

366
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:09,840
Speaker 2: a Cane and Abel thing? And then I found out

367
00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:12,960
Speaker 2: that there's just a fuck ton of stories from the

368
00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:15,480
Speaker 2: ye oldie times that.

369
00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:18,560
Speaker 3: Like so wild, Like sorry, can finish your that.

370
00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:21,840
Speaker 2: Oh, just there's so many fratricide stories in like every

371
00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:24,760
Speaker 2: part of everything that we have written down from a

372
00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:25,639
Speaker 2: long ast time ago.

373
00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:28,359
Speaker 3: There's just like so much of history that you're like

374
00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:32,400
Speaker 3: that you it just boils down to like two then

375
00:20:32,440 --> 00:20:34,760
Speaker 3: there were these two guys, and you're like, what, I

376
00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:38,480
Speaker 3: hate that that has impact on my life right now

377
00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:43,639
Speaker 3: that there once there was two guys. Honestly, I learned it.

378
00:20:43,680 --> 00:20:48,720
Speaker 3: I saw this gigantic painting last weekend of the Crucifixion.

379
00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:53,720
Speaker 3: Uh huh lungs. It was while I was bird watching.

380
00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:56,080
Speaker 3: I came across this large paint just in the middle

381
00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,719
Speaker 3: of the field. Yeah. You know, it may have been

382
00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:03,120
Speaker 3: a vision, You've had a christ like vision, but it

383
00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:07,680
Speaker 3: was I was at this at Forest Lawn Cemetery birdwatching

384
00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:11,000
Speaker 3: and they have this huge crucifixion painting for whatever reason,

385
00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:15,480
Speaker 3: and I learned about the two guys that Jesus got

386
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:16,480
Speaker 3: crucified with.

387
00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:19,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're thieves right to God.

388
00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:20,480
Speaker 3: Just two guys.

389
00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:21,760
Speaker 4: I didn't know about these two guys.

390
00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:23,399
Speaker 3: I didn't pay attention in Sunday school.

391
00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:26,040
Speaker 4: But there are two guys. Yeah, the good thief and

392
00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:30,000
Speaker 4: the unrepentant thief. And their name's Rhyme, which is hilarious,

393
00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:33,720
Speaker 4: dismis and guestus. And you're like, and there's just a

394
00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:40,600
Speaker 4: whole exhibit on these two other guys. Anyways, I oppose once.

395
00:21:40,359 --> 00:21:41,680
Speaker 2: There was two culture.

396
00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:45,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a lot of history that people care about.

397
00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:51,640
Speaker 2: Anyways, Well, you know what else people care about. They

398
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:57,679
Speaker 2: care about buying objects instead of finding them in a field.

399
00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:01,320
Speaker 2: Although if you work hard enough at it, I'm sure

400
00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:03,359
Speaker 2: you could find any of the things that are about

401
00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:07,199
Speaker 2: to be advertised to you in the loosest version of

402
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:16,040
Speaker 2: the word find, go steal a car. Here's ads. Okay,

403
00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:16,480
Speaker 2: we're back.

404
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:17,960
Speaker 3: We're back.

405
00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:22,719
Speaker 2: So there's Remula, or the holiday that may or may

406
00:22:22,760 --> 00:22:29,760
Speaker 2: not have existed, but a Ramuria. I'm sorry, Muria, but

407
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:33,440
Speaker 2: we do know that there's Lamuria, which, okay, if they're

408
00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:35,560
Speaker 2: like two holidays and so two guys, and they are

409
00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:38,840
Speaker 2: three days since May set aside for driving out angry spirits.

410
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,040
Speaker 2: And of course, logically, the way that you get rid

411
00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:47,760
Speaker 2: of angry spirits is chanting obviously and black beans clearly.

412
00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:51,199
Speaker 3: Oh this is this is a I'm not familiar with

413
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:52,040
Speaker 3: this second approach.

414
00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:54,399
Speaker 2: Oh interesting, Okay, well let me tell you how to

415
00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:54,639
Speaker 2: do it.

416
00:22:55,119 --> 00:22:55,439
Speaker 3: Okay.

417
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,280
Speaker 2: So the restless spirits lamura's. They also have an evil cousin,

418
00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:03,679
Speaker 2: basically the larvae, which are like, there's a lot of

419
00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:06,040
Speaker 2: uncertainty about exactly what this is, but they're like the

420
00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:08,280
Speaker 2: like actually just kind of like fucked up evil spirits

421
00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:12,720
Speaker 2: that aren't necessarily like dead people. Okay, but the lamuras

422
00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 2: anyone who died in a way that left them having

423
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:17,679
Speaker 2: like a hard time getting into the afterlife, like sudden

424
00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:20,840
Speaker 2: death or young death or no funeral rights. They were

425
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:21,600
Speaker 2: a lemur.

426
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:27,400
Speaker 3: Or are so wait if you like have some sort

427
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 3: of unfinished business or something, as you you.

428
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:35,120
Speaker 4: Are you are a lemur? Yeah, or reincarnate as that.

429
00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:36,879
Speaker 1: You?

430
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:40,879
Speaker 2: Yes, as the animal definitely the definitely what I'm saying.

431
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:42,920
Speaker 2: I definitely took three years of lat and don't know

432
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:46,280
Speaker 2: how to pronounce any of it, so as did I.

433
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:50,920
Speaker 3: Yes, waite so waite omnes.

434
00:23:51,760 --> 00:24:03,360
Speaker 2: A glass discipula pe sum as sums as aramarast arama

435
00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:05,880
Speaker 2: serrata serrunt there.

436
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:08,879
Speaker 3: I always like, I think we just sort of like

437
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:14,280
Speaker 3: got off on being like haha, fatuus puer, which for

438
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:17,720
Speaker 3: anyone that learned a useful language just means stupid boy,

439
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:20,200
Speaker 3: And I would find myself saying that often.

440
00:24:20,520 --> 00:24:23,879
Speaker 2: Excellent. Yeah, yeah, our our Latin teacher just let us cheat,

441
00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:27,120
Speaker 2: so I didn't learn any Latin and then he got

442
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 2: fired for sexually harassing students.

443
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:33,960
Speaker 3: Oh what that was my art teacher, my Latin teacher

444
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:37,119
Speaker 3: was was a buff board. Did you read those books

445
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:39,520
Speaker 3: that were like about the family that got Stuck in

446
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:42,480
Speaker 3: the ditch for like an entire textbook.

447
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:46,720
Speaker 2: I didn't really go to class by the end of the.

448
00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:51,240
Speaker 3: I forgot You're cool, Okay. I was obsessed with my homework,

449
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 3: and so I was really invested in the Cornelia I

450
00:24:56,000 --> 00:25:00,320
Speaker 3: and there are various excellent males. Excellent, okay, Okay. You

451
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:03,280
Speaker 3: continue its reincarnated as a leamur.

452
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:05,480
Speaker 2: Definitely, and that's definitely what I mean. It's not that

453
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:08,560
Speaker 2: you're a ghost with the same similar word. Yeah, yeah,

454
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:12,880
Speaker 2: uh huh, I'm with you, Okay. So you can help

455
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,760
Speaker 2: out the lemurs as well as help navigate the larvae,

456
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:19,440
Speaker 2: the non ghost evil spirits. In a really creepily parallel

457
00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:22,040
Speaker 2: way to some sowin shit later, which makes the lineage

458
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,960
Speaker 2: of everything like super murky. The way that you help

459
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,159
Speaker 2: out your dead pals is you wash your hands in

460
00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:29,679
Speaker 2: spring water. Then you make a fist where your thumb

461
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 2: is under your fingers, like the way you shouldn't make

462
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:33,240
Speaker 2: a fist, you know.

463
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:34,960
Speaker 3: Yep, the scary way.

464
00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:38,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then you were doing that. Yeah. You fill

465
00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:40,880
Speaker 2: your mouth with black beans and then you spit them

466
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:43,200
Speaker 2: out behind you as you walk through your house barefoot

467
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:47,199
Speaker 2: at midnight. And the reason your barefoot, obviously is that

468
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:50,680
Speaker 2: knots can't be anywhere near the ceremony because they prevent

469
00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 2: the natural flow of energy, and so sandals have knots,

470
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:58,680
Speaker 2: So no sandals barefoot makes sense. As for the fist thing,

471
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:03,800
Speaker 2: it's called mono fico or fig hand, and the connotation

472
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,480
Speaker 2: of the word fig means that actual translation of this

473
00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:10,399
Speaker 2: would be pussy hand, because your finger is fucking the

474
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:12,760
Speaker 2: rest of your fingers, that is the connotation.

475
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:15,840
Speaker 3: Is that necessary?

476
00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:20,840
Speaker 2: I've no idea want us to do it, ghosts, it.

477
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:22,679
Speaker 3: Just feels like not relevant.

478
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:26,639
Speaker 2: Nope, the black.

479
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 3: You have to have pussy hand to confront the ghosts.

480
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:32,359
Speaker 4: Or to inter what is when you're doing this?

481
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:32,840
Speaker 3: What are you?

482
00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:34,640
Speaker 4: What are you accomplishing?

483
00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:35,399
Speaker 3: Is my question.

484
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 2: Well, when you spit out the black beans, this attracts

485
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 2: the lemurs and they're behind you, right you can't see them. Well,

486
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:45,439
Speaker 2: that's happening. And you chant, I send thee with these beans,

487
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 2: I redeem me and mine And you chant that nine

488
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 2: times uh huh, while everyone else in the house clangs

489
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:56,200
Speaker 2: bronze pots and says, ghosts of my fathers and ancestors

490
00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:00,800
Speaker 2: be gone. Then you wash your hand and spring water

491
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:04,760
Speaker 2: three times m h and and then you can look

492
00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:06,480
Speaker 2: to see if it worked. And you know how they

493
00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:10,240
Speaker 2: know it worked when you look at the end of

494
00:27:10,240 --> 00:27:12,560
Speaker 2: the ritual. You can turn around and look and there's

495
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:13,840
Speaker 2: no leamurres behind you.

496
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:18,880
Speaker 3: Oh so it does. I would guess that the success

497
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:20,399
Speaker 3: rate is extremely high.

498
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm William Betten. No one saw lamarill around behind

499
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:25,439
Speaker 2: them after doing all this work.

500
00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:29,159
Speaker 3: Well, that's great, that's great. I like that that. This

501
00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:32,520
Speaker 3: is also like, it's necessary to have the support of

502
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 3: everyone who lives with you in order to accomplish this.

503
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 3: Everyone has to be a believer. That's Is there any generally,

504
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 3: is there any point in this ceremony where someone would

505
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,640
Speaker 3: see the theoretical lamoureau where they stand, or is it

506
00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:51,160
Speaker 3: conveniently like.

507
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:55,120
Speaker 2: I don't know, interesting, you know, I mean obviously it's

508
00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,080
Speaker 2: like ghosts and things are things that a lot of

509
00:27:57,080 --> 00:27:59,159
Speaker 2: people have seen in this world, you know.

510
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 3: I mean I I don't even disbelieve it, but I just.

511
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:05,120
Speaker 4: Interesting.

512
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 3: Interesting. I as a lover you know, black beans, that's

513
00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:11,960
Speaker 3: an integral part of my Chipotle order, and I didn't

514
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 3: realize that there was a kind of a cosmic use

515
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:17,040
Speaker 3: of that food.

516
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I wonder what happened if you use white

517
00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:21,800
Speaker 2: beans like right opposite?

518
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 3: Does it do something else? Or you know, we should

519
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:28,440
Speaker 3: try it? It means they stay yeah.

520
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:30,679
Speaker 2: Totally yeah, or if you put ones that are like

521
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,000
Speaker 2: slightly hallucinogenic in your mouth and you do see that.

522
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:37,320
Speaker 2: Limeris immediately after the Limeray holiday where the our Guy,

523
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:40,920
Speaker 2: which are more Roman pagan holidays, and these involved mock

524
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:43,920
Speaker 2: human sacrifices were like straw dummies were tossed into the river,

525
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:48,480
Speaker 2: which is possibly like the main suggestion people have around

526
00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 2: this is that basically, like every culture eventually was like

527
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 2: what if we stop sacrificing people and they're like, well,

528
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 2: how would we do that? And you're like, well, what

529
00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 2: if we fake sacrifice people? And you have this like

530
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:03,360
Speaker 2: transitional period where they fake sacrifice people, okay, and which

531
00:29:03,440 --> 00:29:05,320
Speaker 2: is kind of you know, they want to symbolically kill

532
00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 2: some dudes, which is a lot like majority voting. It's

533
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:10,680
Speaker 2: a symbolic war where you see which side with win

534
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:13,120
Speaker 2: would win without actually stabbing each other to death.

535
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:14,120
Speaker 3: It's very true.

536
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 2: This whole sequence of events meant in May was at

537
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,080
Speaker 2: the unluckiest month to get married. So keep that in

538
00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 2: mind anyone who wants to adhere to Rouman pagan social norms, right,

539
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:30,680
Speaker 2: which you should absolutely Fortunately, very few people get married

540
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 2: in May. It would be very.

541
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:34,760
Speaker 3: Yeahluck No, I've certainly never been to a wedding in May,

542
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 3: much less officiated one.

543
00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 2: I've never been married in May. I've never rented that

544
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:41,760
Speaker 2: sentence a little bit earlier, but.

545
00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,520
Speaker 3: I only became amenable to getting married recently when I

546
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 3: found a novelty halloween band played weddings, and now I'm like,

547
00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 3: maybe I should think about it.

548
00:29:54,160 --> 00:29:58,560
Speaker 2: I once hitchiked across the country with some crosspunk I

549
00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,200
Speaker 2: met at a Rainbow g when we were twenty and

550
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:02,680
Speaker 2: we were decided we were going to get married in

551
00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:06,360
Speaker 2: Vegas on the way, but then we couldn't hitchhike very

552
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,040
Speaker 2: well together because we were both scary looking and she

553
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 2: had a very large dog. Mm hmm, so we didn't

554
00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 2: get married.

555
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 3: Well that's the breaks. I feel like we both just

556
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,360
Speaker 3: said sentences that are very true to who we are

557
00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 3: at our.

558
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 1: Core, and I silently laughed in the background.

559
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 2: Okay, so that's Lameriam okay. And then there's Sowen. Yes,

560
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 2: Sowen is the Celtic holiday that shares all Saints' Day

561
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 2: November one, and it starts the night before October thirty. First,

562
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:43,440
Speaker 2: what exactly Sowen is is argued about constantly. There is

563
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 2: some stuff we do know. For example, we know that

564
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:49,160
Speaker 2: almost everything written about it was written by medieval.

565
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:51,320
Speaker 3: Christians, famously trustworthy.

566
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly. I was like when I was like learning

567
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 2: about dramatic paganism like the Norse gods and stuff, and

568
00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,040
Speaker 2: when I realized it was like all written by a

569
00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:01,440
Speaker 2: Christian monk, I was like, is any of this any good?

570
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:04,040
Speaker 2: Does this work can get? And then it turns out

571
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:10,479
Speaker 2: everything's just complicated and whatever. Yeah. The main argument that

572
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 2: people have is about how much it was a time

573
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:16,800
Speaker 2: of magic and death versus just a big social gathering.

574
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:20,920
Speaker 2: I lean towards it actually was both, based on everything

575
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 2: that I've been reading, but it absolutely was a big

576
00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:30,560
Speaker 2: social gathering that was probably also time of magic and death. Okay, Celts,

577
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:33,840
Speaker 2: you could say that they are the hidden people, kell

578
00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:37,320
Speaker 2: being the Indo European prefix for hidden. They are a

579
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 2: very diverse collection of peoples, a ton of different tribes

580
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:42,719
Speaker 2: that's spread out across Europe and the British Isles. They

581
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 2: use an oral history by and large, so we don't

582
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:46,800
Speaker 2: have much about them beside what was written by their

583
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:50,920
Speaker 2: enemies who talk about human sacrifice and how their primitive

584
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:52,800
Speaker 2: people live in bogs or whatever the fuck you know.

585
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:57,560
Speaker 2: But certain histories and traditions only linger in the margins.

586
00:31:57,880 --> 00:31:59,880
Speaker 2: So most of what's left of the traditions and lang,

587
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:02,760
Speaker 2: which is of the Celts, are found in Ireland, Scotland,

588
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:07,320
Speaker 2: Wales and a few other places. Right, Sowyn is one

589
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 2: of the big four Celtic pagan holidays that we know about,

590
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:12,720
Speaker 2: and it was on November first. I mean, I doubt

591
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:15,720
Speaker 2: they had the specific calendar, but let's just go with it, right. Sure,

592
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 2: sometimes it gets called a harvest festival. But apparently that's

593
00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:22,440
Speaker 2: not really true because November first isn't really a big

594
00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:27,480
Speaker 2: deal for agriculturists. Neither is May first. It's not the

595
00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:32,800
Speaker 2: time for planting or reaping because beltane and sown in

596
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 2: the Celtic tradition, they're important to pastoralists. Okay, it's when

597
00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:39,960
Speaker 2: you take your herds to different pastures. So instead of

598
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:42,760
Speaker 2: having a harvest festival, they have a like we're taking

599
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 2: the cows out of the high hills, out of the highlands, a.

600
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:49,160
Speaker 3: Little cow party, and we're are the four main holidays?

601
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:52,080
Speaker 3: Are these separated generally by season?

602
00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:52,640
Speaker 4: Are there?

603
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 2: Or I can't remember the other two off the top

604
00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 2: of my head. I think they are the sole ses,

605
00:32:58,200 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 2: but I could be wrong.

606
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 4: Makes sense to me.

607
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 2: I think one of them is low. Oh man, no,

608
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:06,400
Speaker 2: I'm anyone listening. Your nose is now mad at me,

609
00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:09,400
Speaker 2: But so it goes. Don't message me about it on

610
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:14,800
Speaker 2: Insta know every single up myself. Yeah that is people

611
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 2: get I know you know that was a podcaster before,

612
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 2: very frustrated that just because you know one thing doesn't

613
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 2: mean you know another thing.

614
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:26,760
Speaker 3: I do feel sometimes that the feedback I mean, and

615
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 3: often I get a lot of great, very helpful feedback,

616
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,320
Speaker 3: and every once in a while I get how dare

617
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:36,440
Speaker 3: you not have lived my exact life? And you're like, I,

618
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,680
Speaker 3: you know, can't, can't speak to it, don't know, don't know.

619
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:44,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, until you kill them and then step into their.

620
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 3: Body precisely, precisely.

621
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:49,600
Speaker 2: And there's a lot to be said about how the

622
00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 2: Gaels were seen as barbaric, specifically for preferring pastoralism to agriculture. Basically,

623
00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:56,239
Speaker 2: people mean like, don't you want to like stay in

624
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 2: one place and grow things? And they're like, I'm good,

625
00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 2: I have a cow. I need just hang out with

626
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 2: the cow. Why would I? It gives me what I need?

627
00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:06,200
Speaker 2: What the fuck? If you ever want to get mad,

628
00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:09,280
Speaker 2: you should read what Angles from Marks and Engles, famous

629
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:13,880
Speaker 2: comedy duo had to say about the Irish Really oh god,

630
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:18,879
Speaker 2: it wasn't nice stuff, no kidding, although he sure fetishized

631
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 2: the Irish women of course anyway.

632
00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,920
Speaker 3: Really also a misogynist to the people that he had

633
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:25,640
Speaker 3: no respect for.

634
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:26,919
Speaker 4: Wow wow wow.

635
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:32,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. So November first is Swen. It's the celebration of

636
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:33,799
Speaker 2: the coming of winter. It's the time to take the

637
00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 2: cows of the high pasture. And slaughter them. It's the

638
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,359
Speaker 2: perfect time for sacrifice. You're like, I mean, you're killing

639
00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:42,279
Speaker 2: the moo guys anyway, right, m h and thanks, thanks

640
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:43,879
Speaker 2: for laughing at that. I'm pretty proud of that show,

641
00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:48,360
Speaker 2: and so I was really thrilled. It's also when alcohol

642
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:50,479
Speaker 2: is most readily available, at least according to one source

643
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:53,600
Speaker 2: I read, which probably ties into all the like magic

644
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:55,720
Speaker 2: and mischief and shit that comes from Sowen.

645
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:58,320
Speaker 3: Uh huh.

646
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:00,320
Speaker 2: The thing that we know happened is that on and

647
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:03,360
Speaker 2: various tribes from different places and Ireland would gather and

648
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 2: they would have huge bonfires, and various kings would make

649
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:10,880
Speaker 2: various pronouncements. Ireland has had no shortage of kings, but

650
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,239
Speaker 2: fortunately it wasn't very good at centralizing them, so usually

651
00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:17,200
Speaker 2: it had multiple At any given time, there were contests

652
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:21,480
Speaker 2: and feasts and sacrifices. There was possibly human sacrifice and

653
00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:26,800
Speaker 2: then later some like representative of sacrifice stuff. There was divination,

654
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:28,840
Speaker 2: which we'll talk about in a bit, and there was

655
00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:33,520
Speaker 2: a bunch of other ritual stuff, gotcha, that's what's certain.

656
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 2: Then there's the argued stuff. I tend to believe that

657
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,920
Speaker 2: all the magic and death stuff because that argument is

658
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 2: really politicized because Christians want to be like, no, there's

659
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:49,439
Speaker 2: no paganism in Halloween, right, But then on the other hand,

660
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:52,479
Speaker 2: there's people who are like, no, everything is super cool

661
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:55,560
Speaker 2: and magic y and buy my books right, Like it's

662
00:35:55,680 --> 00:36:00,360
Speaker 2: just fucking there's not trustworthy people in the like modern

663
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:02,879
Speaker 2: pagan versus Christian arguments.

664
00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:05,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, there, I mean, everyone's got a vested interest, and

665
00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:09,200
Speaker 3: I feel like on the on the non Christian end

666
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:13,600
Speaker 3: there it is becoming increasingly muddled because it seems like

667
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:18,239
Speaker 3: there is such an opportunity to I don't want to

668
00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:22,760
Speaker 3: say this without being like being disrespectful to people's beliefs,

669
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 3: because I'm not saying that this is something I completely

670
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:27,439
Speaker 3: disbelieve in at all, But I do think that there's

671
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:30,919
Speaker 3: time points in history, very likely one we're living through

672
00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:33,800
Speaker 3: right now, where people would very much like to believe

673
00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:40,480
Speaker 3: in magic, and that brings out a bunch of predatory types.

674
00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:43,920
Speaker 2: Totally and like, and one of the other things is like, like,

675
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:45,880
Speaker 2: I'm going to do some of the ritual stuff that

676
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:48,040
Speaker 2: I'm going to be talking about. I'm planning to do it.

677
00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:51,279
Speaker 2: Oh that's amazing the day after you walk here to this,

678
00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:55,839
Speaker 2: And because I don't know why the fuck not. And

679
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:57,760
Speaker 2: to me, the fact that a lot of it comes

680
00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:02,719
Speaker 2: from syncretic traditions is fine. I have no problem with that,

681
00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:08,520
Speaker 2: you know. And so another thing that might have happened

682
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:10,120
Speaker 2: on SOO, and this is actually what I'm gonna do

683
00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:14,919
Speaker 2: on Sowen this year, is that unsuccessful kings are ritually sacrificed.

684
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 2: Oh you're gonna kill a guy, yeah, yeah, but only

685
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:19,920
Speaker 2: a king. I gotta find a monarch.

686
00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:24,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, that is a slaughter, slaughter of flop.

687
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:26,239
Speaker 4: I'm happy to do it.

688
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:30,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's possible, like, no one's quite sure. But basically

689
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:32,160
Speaker 2: some of the bog bodies people are starting to be like,

690
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:36,680
Speaker 2: we think that's a sacrificed king. Oh wow, they might

691
00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,440
Speaker 2: have had their nipples cut off and then stabbed and

692
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 2: beheaded and thrown into bogs.

693
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:46,600
Speaker 3: I've been to a bog buddy, bog body, bug body,

694
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:50,480
Speaker 3: a bog body exhibit or too in my day, and

695
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:53,120
Speaker 3: that would be said, that would be huge for the

696
00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 3: bog body community if that is if true, I know,

697
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:58,760
Speaker 3: And it's like it's a little bit of a stretch

698
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:00,279
Speaker 3: as a story, and who's making this claim and it's

699
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:01,520
Speaker 3: based on a lot of the stuff where like a

700
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:05,280
Speaker 3: lot of the bog body people were like fed better

701
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:07,439
Speaker 3: and like like it seems to be that they seem

702
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:09,319
Speaker 3: to be like upper class in some way or whatever,

703
00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:12,160
Speaker 3: right right, and.

704
00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 2: Like more than one of them had like weird stuff

705
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 2: around their nipples going on.

706
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:20,160
Speaker 3: Interesting, Like all we know is that they ate well

707
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:22,120
Speaker 3: and they had weird nipples.

708
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:25,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. So yeah, lots of kings might have gotten dead

709
00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:28,719
Speaker 2: on Sowen, which is cool. And I wonder how much

710
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:30,839
Speaker 2: of old human sacrifice was just well, like this guy

711
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:33,080
Speaker 2: said he'd be a good leader, but he wasn't. So

712
00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:34,799
Speaker 2: I guess we should just give him to the gods now,

713
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 2: because there's a lot of like that stuff gets into

714
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 2: later whatever, But what doesn't come later, what comes now

715
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:48,200
Speaker 2: is advertisement.

716
00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:52,279
Speaker 3: Wow that was so good. Wow, you really did get

717
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:52,919
Speaker 3: me with that one.

718
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:57,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, my one actual top that I'm good at cynically

719
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 2: transitioning to ads like these what great prices.

720
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:05,040
Speaker 3: Like these great products you're about to find out about.

721
00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:09,719
Speaker 2: And we're back.

722
00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:12,160
Speaker 4: So we have potentially some dead kings.

723
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:15,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, we have potentially some dead kings. It's also probably

724
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:18,520
Speaker 2: the Festival of the Dead. That is the like the

725
00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 2: big argued thing that makes sense to me. Too to

726
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:24,520
Speaker 2: go under the assumption that it was, which I that

727
00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:27,920
Speaker 2: is actually what I think. But the Celts, like a

728
00:39:27,960 --> 00:39:30,680
Speaker 2: lot of people, believed in a lot of different realms, right,

729
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:35,399
Speaker 2: there's most notably there's Earth or the realm war stuck in. Yeah,

730
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:37,960
Speaker 2: then there's the other world with a big capital O.

731
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:41,160
Speaker 2: It's got a bunch of different names. Most famous is

732
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:44,600
Speaker 2: probably Tyrannog, which is either a name for the whole

733
00:39:44,600 --> 00:39:47,120
Speaker 2: place or just a part of it. And this is

734
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:50,239
Speaker 2: like the land of the Fairies, the Promised Land, the

735
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:51,600
Speaker 2: land of everlasting youth.

736
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:56,799
Speaker 3: I learned about that from watching Titanic when I was nine.

737
00:39:57,120 --> 00:39:58,480
Speaker 2: Well, they talk about nearing an Noog in it.

738
00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:04,719
Speaker 3: They do. There's a mother with children on the Titanic.

739
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:07,920
Speaker 3: They're about to, you know, drown on the Titanic, and

740
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:09,960
Speaker 3: she's saying that that's where they're headed. They're headed to

741
00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:13,600
Speaker 3: the land of Tyrannanog, the land of eternal youth and beauty.

742
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 3: The kids are crying because they of course are about

743
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:18,399
Speaker 3: to drown on the Titanic. But that's where I learned

744
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:18,839
Speaker 3: about it.

745
00:40:19,520 --> 00:40:23,640
Speaker 2: That makes sense, And honestly, faith is a really good

746
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:28,520
Speaker 2: counterpoint to anxiety. So yeah, I like totally get that, Like,

747
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:30,640
Speaker 2: I want to believe in Tyrannanog while the fucking ship

748
00:40:30,680 --> 00:40:34,040
Speaker 2: is going down, Like what are my other options being?

749
00:40:34,120 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 2: Like no, only this is real and I'm about to

750
00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 2: not ever have anything ever again, like deep but you know, Yeah,

751
00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:45,600
Speaker 2: So Tyrannanog is one of the mystical is where the

752
00:40:45,640 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 2: mystical precursors of the Irish people live, the fairies or

753
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:54,759
Speaker 2: the gods, the too hot Todnin and twice a year

754
00:40:55,000 --> 00:40:58,279
Speaker 2: on Beltane and Sowen. The veil is thin between our

755
00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:02,000
Speaker 2: world and other world. So Sowyn is a liminal festival

756
00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:03,760
Speaker 2: at the end of summer. It's the start of winter,

757
00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:06,840
Speaker 2: and it's a time when everything is possible and nothing

758
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,799
Speaker 2: is the same. And that's I love that shit. And

759
00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:14,839
Speaker 2: that's still part of fucking Halloween. I think it's also

760
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 2: when the Four Mourians, which was another ancient Irish race,

761
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:22,440
Speaker 2: the race of evil Giants, they demanded a yearly tax

762
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,840
Speaker 2: of two thirds of the corn, milk and children from.

763
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:29,600
Speaker 3: Folks top three products.

764
00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:35,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, they were driven out, and they were driven out

765
00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:40,040
Speaker 2: specifically by the goddess Morgan and the hero agnes Og,

766
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:44,240
Speaker 2: and they drove the monsters out from Ireland on sown, Okay,

767
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:47,319
Speaker 2: which makes sense because that's when they show up, but

768
00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:53,080
Speaker 2: you know, still wild shit. Yeah. Irish mythology, at least

769
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:56,359
Speaker 2: as it was written by a Christian eleventh century Christian guy,

770
00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:58,920
Speaker 2: is a series of different people replacing one another in

771
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:02,560
Speaker 2: the area. There were six groups. The first four had

772
00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:04,920
Speaker 2: been killed or driven out entirely. The fifth were the

773
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:07,560
Speaker 2: pagan gods who disappeared into the other world but are

774
00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:10,200
Speaker 2: still around. Some folks argue that this is people talking

775
00:42:10,239 --> 00:42:14,120
Speaker 2: about the picts, and then there's the sixth, the modern humans,

776
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:17,640
Speaker 2: the Gaels. This book, the history of Ireland from the

777
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 2: eleventh century, is called the Book of Invasions, which is

778
00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:24,880
Speaker 2: what a fucking name for a country's history.

779
00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:27,400
Speaker 4: Truly, I'm like harsh but fair.

780
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:31,200
Speaker 2: I know, they kind of set themselves up with that.

781
00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:36,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, seems kind of antagonistic, but I see where the

782
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:37,879
Speaker 3: reality is.

783
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:42,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, And this book was I think intentionally written to

784
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:46,799
Speaker 2: Christianized people. So so many of the European pagan books

785
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:51,280
Speaker 2: are from Christian monks, as I've complained about already. Sometimes

786
00:42:51,280 --> 00:42:53,160
Speaker 2: people say the dead went to the other world, like

787
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:55,480
Speaker 2: in that movie The Titanic, which I definitely didn't just

788
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:57,239
Speaker 2: add to the script. I totally had it in.

789
00:42:57,160 --> 00:43:00,680
Speaker 3: There, absolutely, and it is called The Titanic, and I

790
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:02,960
Speaker 3: think that that's something that people need to remember about

791
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:04,759
Speaker 3: the movie The Titanic, which we love.

792
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:08,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, I actually really did like them. I never watched

793
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 2: it again, I think because I was, like, I cried

794
00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:09,879
Speaker 2: so much.

795
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:15,120
Speaker 3: It's unfortunately one of the bet.

796
00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:17,920
Speaker 2: It's a really good movie. I'm not so good anti.

797
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:21,879
Speaker 3: It's like it's everything a movie can be.

798
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:25,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, I saw it multiple times in theaters.

799
00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:29,520
Speaker 3: Really. Oh that gives me, especially because that happened during

800
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:30,959
Speaker 3: a period of culture that you.

801
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:35,120
Speaker 2: Find otherwise distasteful. That's true. I might have to take

802
00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:38,680
Speaker 2: all that back. I just really don't like all rock

803
00:43:38,719 --> 00:43:42,680
Speaker 2: from the late nineties. I'm sorry, totally fair, totally.

804
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:45,439
Speaker 3: I mean, you will not find a dissenting opinion here.

805
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:49,600
Speaker 3: But yeah, every tongue that rises up against Titanic nineteen

806
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:50,719
Speaker 3: ninety seven shell fall.

807
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:54,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's like The Titanic did.

808
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,440
Speaker 4: Much, including and not limited to the Titanic.

809
00:43:57,520 --> 00:43:59,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're on Hue risk brought them down both groups.

810
00:44:00,239 --> 00:44:00,720
Speaker 3: Mm hmmm.

811
00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:03,600
Speaker 2: So some people say that the dead go to the

812
00:44:03,640 --> 00:44:05,560
Speaker 2: other world. Other people say that they went to a

813
00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:07,480
Speaker 2: place that was more of a hell or a purgatory.

814
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:10,279
Speaker 2: Other people were like, no, first you go to the purgatory,

815
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:13,640
Speaker 2: then you go to the other world. That last one,

816
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:18,799
Speaker 2: curiously and possibly coincidentally, maps to the Catholic experience of theater.

817
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 1: Right.

818
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:21,880
Speaker 4: It was like, that is a that's also a Christian concept.

819
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:23,440
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, and.

820
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:26,319
Speaker 2: You know, some shit is just universal. Some shit is

821
00:44:27,080 --> 00:44:31,640
Speaker 2: given to cultures by Christians. I don't know. Two things

822
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:34,400
Speaker 2: happen on Sowen because of the thinning of the veil. First,

823
00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:36,920
Speaker 2: the spirits of the dead, especially the recently dead. They

824
00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:40,400
Speaker 2: come out and hang out for the night, which is cool. Second,

825
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 2: so do the fairies, especially mischievous if not downright malevolent

826
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,080
Speaker 2: ones who like rejoice in human suffering and all that stuff.

827
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:50,560
Speaker 2: It's also the time when babies can be replaced with

828
00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:52,480
Speaker 2: change links. So you got to like watch your kids.

829
00:44:53,040 --> 00:44:56,120
Speaker 4: Okay, Okay, that's that's eventful.

830
00:44:56,239 --> 00:44:58,520
Speaker 3: That is a that is a full side show's worth

831
00:44:58,520 --> 00:44:59,279
Speaker 3: of activities.

832
00:44:59,520 --> 00:44:59,920
Speaker 1: Yeah.

833
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:03,239
Speaker 3: Absolutely, it's a good thing that it's also commonly associated

834
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:05,560
Speaker 3: with getting drunk on the night where your baby.

835
00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 4: Could be switched out with a change Like it's.

836
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 3: Good to have your senses really truly dulled when those

837
00:45:13,200 --> 00:45:13,920
Speaker 3: are the stakes.

838
00:45:14,160 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, sharpened up, you know, a little bit more in

839
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:22,680
Speaker 2: touch with your emotions instead of what's happening around you. Yeah,

840
00:45:23,040 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 2: it's possible that people would open the burial mounts themselves

841
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:27,960
Speaker 2: on Sowen, but because of their portals the other world,

842
00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:30,799
Speaker 2: I don't think that that's I've read that, but I don't.

843
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:33,880
Speaker 2: It doesn't track with the rest of mythology because most

844
00:45:33,880 --> 00:45:36,399
Speaker 2: of the rituals are around how to deal with how

845
00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:39,160
Speaker 2: scary it is that the veil is thin. It's less

846
00:45:39,200 --> 00:45:42,200
Speaker 2: like the way that I would say modern like how

847
00:45:42,239 --> 00:45:44,319
Speaker 2: I see it where I'm like, fuck, yeah, the veil's thin,

848
00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:47,279
Speaker 2: time to talk to dead people, And instead it's more

849
00:45:47,320 --> 00:45:51,799
Speaker 2: of a like oh God, oh God, like veil too thin?

850
00:45:52,560 --> 00:45:56,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, So it was intended to be because I

851
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 3: feel like that is an interesting thing to hear from

852
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:01,400
Speaker 3: culture to culture of like how the concept of the

853
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:03,480
Speaker 3: thinning of the veil is received, because they feel like

854
00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:06,320
Speaker 3: sometimes it's joyously other times it seems like intentionally to

855
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:10,319
Speaker 3: stoke fear, which it seems like in this case is that, I.

856
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:13,319
Speaker 2: Think so, But it's also kind of both because they

857
00:46:13,320 --> 00:46:16,680
Speaker 2: do a lot of like really easy joyous stuff. Yeah, No, totally.

858
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:18,520
Speaker 2: I mean, and I guess it's just like the same

859
00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:22,000
Speaker 2: as like people be Like in twenty first century United States,

860
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:26,319
Speaker 2: people hated Halloween because like, some people hate Halloween and

861
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:28,600
Speaker 2: then we're over here being like this fucking rules. I'm

862
00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 2: sure that Free Christian Ireland or Syncretic Christian Ireland was

863
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:36,279
Speaker 2: the same way. They were like some people are really

864
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:38,360
Speaker 2: fuck yeah, bring on the fairies, and other people are like,

865
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:42,439
Speaker 2: they stole my baby, and you're like, eh, h, maybe

866
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:43,239
Speaker 2: she's happier now.

867
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:46,399
Speaker 3: You know, there's always gonna be someone that thinks their

868
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:49,520
Speaker 3: baby's been switched out with a changeling, and sometimes it

869
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:53,680
Speaker 3: just turns out they don't like their baby. Yeah, totally

870
00:46:54,239 --> 00:46:58,200
Speaker 3: and are searching for a justification as to why.

871
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:01,320
Speaker 4: Yeah.

872
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:05,080
Speaker 2: Portals also open at the base of the of Hawthorn trees,

873
00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:07,600
Speaker 2: So if you live on Hawthorn Street in Portland, you

874
00:47:07,600 --> 00:47:10,560
Speaker 2: should be careful this week. It's all I'm saying. And

875
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:13,319
Speaker 2: the dead coming back is totally chill with people. As

876
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:15,399
Speaker 2: long as you were good to people, they'll be good

877
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:17,879
Speaker 2: to you back right now. If you're shitty to people,

878
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:19,480
Speaker 2: if you're a dick to someone and then they died,

879
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:21,520
Speaker 2: good fucking luck on that one.

880
00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:24,200
Speaker 3: Ooh they is it like purge rules?

881
00:47:24,680 --> 00:47:25,760
Speaker 4: Can they get your ass?

882
00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 2: Okay, it's funny. We're going to talk about some weird

883
00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:29,960
Speaker 2: purge rules shit and cool later.

884
00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:33,719
Speaker 1: But okay, Jamie's the perfect guess for this episode.

885
00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:39,040
Speaker 2: I know, I know. Although yeah, but but yeah, so

886
00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:41,879
Speaker 2: you know, if you're good to the dead, that part's fine.

887
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:45,120
Speaker 2: There's a ton of different rituals around it. The the

888
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:47,239
Speaker 2: ones most of these are like the ones that I'm

889
00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:49,080
Speaker 2: aware of, I think are a little bit more modern.

890
00:47:49,080 --> 00:47:50,960
Speaker 2: They're not necessarily from the day of like the tribe

891
00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:53,880
Speaker 2: gathering for a week to feast and discuss laws, and

892
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:55,960
Speaker 2: are more from the medieval era onward. But they like

893
00:47:56,000 --> 00:48:00,320
Speaker 2: also might be continuations or developments of different traditions. Okay,

894
00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:02,680
Speaker 2: the one I'm gonna do on sow and if my friends,

895
00:48:02,719 --> 00:48:06,359
Speaker 2: if I can talk them into it, there's a lot

896
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:08,799
Speaker 2: of different variations. And it's called a dumb supper, as

897
00:48:08,840 --> 00:48:12,919
Speaker 2: in a supper without talking. Oh, and there's a bunch

898
00:48:12,960 --> 00:48:14,440
Speaker 2: of different ways to do it. Go ahead.

899
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:16,640
Speaker 3: I was just about to make a bad joke about

900
00:48:16,680 --> 00:48:20,160
Speaker 3: how there's there's a lot of Christian families that have

901
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:21,600
Speaker 3: dumb suppers every night.

902
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:25,399
Speaker 4: It's just kind of how we eat food.

903
00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:30,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, you open all the doors in the windows in

904
00:48:30,440 --> 00:48:32,960
Speaker 2: your house, and you set the table for everyone plus

905
00:48:32,960 --> 00:48:35,480
Speaker 2: a setting for the dead, like at an empty chair,

906
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:39,400
Speaker 2: and then you either eat in silence or in the version.

907
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:41,799
Speaker 2: I kind of think it's more fun you talk as

908
00:48:41,800 --> 00:48:44,520
Speaker 2: if the dead are in the room and not like, Sayancy,

909
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 2: you're not like what happened? I've never been to a

910
00:48:48,160 --> 00:48:50,720
Speaker 2: seans and you have, but that's how I'm imagining it.

911
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:58,200
Speaker 3: It's honestly, I wish you were further off. Yeah, a

912
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:01,640
Speaker 3: lot a lot of loud talking, a lot of questions, no,

913
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:04,440
Speaker 3: no gentle introductions really that I've found.

914
00:49:04,760 --> 00:49:09,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is a one way conversation where you catch

915
00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:12,160
Speaker 2: the dead up on everything that they've missed over the year,

916
00:49:12,560 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 2: where you just include them back in your life as

917
00:49:15,680 --> 00:49:17,360
Speaker 2: if they just have been away for a while.

918
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:19,040
Speaker 4: That's wonderful.

919
00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:24,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I genuinely think that like magic or afterlives

920
00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:27,560
Speaker 2: or religion aside, I think that this seems like a

921
00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:30,080
Speaker 2: like useful way for people to connect with loss and

922
00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:31,040
Speaker 2: grief and stuff, you know.

923
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:34,560
Speaker 3: But I do think that there's like an uh, it's

924
00:49:34,600 --> 00:49:38,279
Speaker 3: interesting hearing people talk to their dead because in the

925
00:49:38,320 --> 00:49:41,960
Speaker 3: times that I've been at rituals are like I mean,

926
00:49:42,000 --> 00:49:44,960
Speaker 3: I've mostly been to them as they relate to spiritualism

927
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:48,279
Speaker 3: and like table turning and stuff like that. And it

928
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:50,480
Speaker 3: is interesting because I feel like the closest thing that

929
00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:54,000
Speaker 3: I could identify it with outside it's like a combination

930
00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:59,719
Speaker 3: of the way you speak in like like prayer by

931
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:02,640
Speaker 3: your if that's something you've done, and then also like

932
00:50:03,560 --> 00:50:06,000
Speaker 3: and this not with all due respect to the dead,

933
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:09,200
Speaker 3: how like children talk to their dolls, Like there is

934
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:11,719
Speaker 3: an element of like, I am having lunch with my

935
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:15,560
Speaker 3: American girl doll, and I want her to be involved

936
00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:19,640
Speaker 3: in the conversation, and like it feels like everyone has

937
00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:24,800
Speaker 3: some sort of base level of Oh, that's so lovely.

938
00:50:24,880 --> 00:50:25,560
Speaker 3: I really like that.

939
00:50:25,680 --> 00:50:27,600
Speaker 4: Is that what you're gonna Is that your plan?

940
00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:28,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's my plan.

941
00:50:28,920 --> 00:50:30,560
Speaker 3: Yeah that's great.

942
00:50:31,120 --> 00:50:33,520
Speaker 2: And one of the reasons I think it immediately hit

943
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:36,480
Speaker 2: me is that, like I didn't grow up in a

944
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 2: particularly religious family. My Irish grandmother talked to the dead

945
00:50:39,719 --> 00:50:43,080
Speaker 2: like they were in the room. Like she lost one

946
00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:45,759
Speaker 2: of her sons before she died, and she would just

947
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 2: like talk to him as if he was there. And

948
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:51,920
Speaker 2: and I just like thought that was cool. You know,

949
00:50:52,239 --> 00:50:56,560
Speaker 2: that's so lovely. Oh, there's that's great. There's other versions

950
00:50:56,719 --> 00:50:59,000
Speaker 2: where you leave food out at night for the dead,

951
00:50:59,120 --> 00:51:00,759
Speaker 2: like you put bread and water and set them out

952
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:03,720
Speaker 2: at midnight, which reminds me of the milk and cookies

953
00:51:03,719 --> 00:51:08,840
Speaker 2: from for Santa. And there's a lot of like Halloween

954
00:51:09,000 --> 00:51:12,359
Speaker 2: sow and Christmas weird and eMule and shit, they all

955
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:14,839
Speaker 2: like blur into each other sometimes, you know.

956
00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:18,600
Speaker 4: It's all very a lot of Q four shit going on.

957
00:51:19,520 --> 00:51:22,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I get everything crammed in end of

958
00:51:22,960 --> 00:51:26,759
Speaker 2: the year. Nice, but evil spirits come into the world too,

959
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:30,640
Speaker 2: Fairies and werewolves and shit just fucking pouring into the world.

960
00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:33,400
Speaker 2: For that, you need protection. For that, you need a

961
00:51:33,440 --> 00:51:38,719
Speaker 2: bonfire in some traditions called a need fire. And my

962
00:51:38,840 --> 00:51:41,080
Speaker 2: favorite version of this that I've read is that the

963
00:51:41,120 --> 00:51:43,279
Speaker 2: whole town puts out their hearth fires and then goes

964
00:51:43,320 --> 00:51:45,919
Speaker 2: to the bonfire and then re lights their own fire

965
00:51:45,960 --> 00:51:49,520
Speaker 2: from the bonfire, which is meant to not only is

966
00:51:49,520 --> 00:51:51,520
Speaker 2: it ward off spirits, but also just like brings everyone

967
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:54,960
Speaker 2: together and like reminds everyone that their hearth comes from

968
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:56,560
Speaker 2: the same place, you know, like karth is a very

969
00:51:57,120 --> 00:51:58,400
Speaker 2: that's totally pricessful.

970
00:51:58,719 --> 00:52:03,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's yeah, that's the and then I feel like

971
00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:05,719
Speaker 3: it ties in completely with the feeling of continuity, like

972
00:52:05,760 --> 00:52:06,799
Speaker 3: that's that's really nice.

973
00:52:06,920 --> 00:52:10,680
Speaker 2: Yeah totally. And then to protect your new mothers could

974
00:52:10,680 --> 00:52:14,359
Speaker 2: also be stolen away as well as babies. I wonder

975
00:52:14,360 --> 00:52:16,240
Speaker 2: how much is people just like running away when.

976
00:52:16,800 --> 00:52:21,960
Speaker 3: Anyway that's there's a there's a runaway movie waiting to

977
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:23,800
Speaker 3: happen to be like, oh, it's the perfect crime.

978
00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:24,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally.

979
00:52:25,280 --> 00:52:26,800
Speaker 3: These fools believe in magic.

980
00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:28,239
Speaker 4: I'm kidding the fuck out of here.

981
00:52:28,680 --> 00:52:30,200
Speaker 2: And then if I write it, like they get halfway

982
00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:32,200
Speaker 2: down the road and the ferries are like, yeah, you

983
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:36,480
Speaker 2: said you're coming with us, Like, oh fuck, that is.

984
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:38,360
Speaker 4: The mar Greek Kilty original waiting to.

985
00:52:40,120 --> 00:52:42,600
Speaker 2: And so the fairy world represents I mean, sometimes it's

986
00:52:42,640 --> 00:52:44,920
Speaker 2: just like stolen away for evil, but sometimes it represents

987
00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:47,880
Speaker 2: like sort of like wildness and like non sieve and

988
00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:50,480
Speaker 2: stuff and like witches high end all of this once

989
00:52:50,520 --> 00:52:52,799
Speaker 2: you get into the syncretic in the Christian side of things,

990
00:52:53,480 --> 00:52:56,280
Speaker 2: So new mothers could be given a spoonful of oatmeal

991
00:52:56,360 --> 00:52:58,560
Speaker 2: as soon as the baby was born protect them from

992
00:52:58,640 --> 00:53:02,880
Speaker 2: being stolen away a lump of unsalted butter could be

993
00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:05,879
Speaker 2: put into the newborn's mouth, or you can rub salt

994
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:07,839
Speaker 2: and oatmeal into the crown of a child's head.

995
00:53:09,040 --> 00:53:12,319
Speaker 3: I'm really amenable to any like ritual that involves a

996
00:53:12,360 --> 00:53:14,160
Speaker 3: little treat. That sounds very nice.

997
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:17,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's time for the little treat ritual,

998
00:53:18,120 --> 00:53:20,560
Speaker 2: like a ritual nap that I take in the afternoon.

999
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:20,799
Speaker 1: You know.

1000
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:23,560
Speaker 3: There you go, right, I'm like, yeah, I guess I

1001
00:53:23,600 --> 00:53:25,920
Speaker 3: did just give raw birth. Give me a little give

1002
00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:27,080
Speaker 3: me a little treat.

1003
00:53:27,000 --> 00:53:30,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. Otherwise I'm gonna fucking run away, I mean,

1004
00:53:30,840 --> 00:53:31,440
Speaker 2: get stolen.

1005
00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:32,279
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1006
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 4: I may go with the fairies if I don't get

1007
00:53:34,080 --> 00:53:34,719
Speaker 4: my little treat.

1008
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:36,200
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1009
00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:40,319
Speaker 2: And it's possible that all of the stories they like.

1010
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:43,920
Speaker 2: The argument for the argument against Sowyn being traditionally a

1011
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:45,920
Speaker 2: time of death and ritual was that a lot of

1012
00:53:45,920 --> 00:53:48,880
Speaker 2: the like fairy stories for on Sowen was just that

1013
00:53:49,880 --> 00:53:52,200
Speaker 2: Sowen was the big gathering of all the kings and shit.

1014
00:53:52,680 --> 00:53:55,160
Speaker 2: So if you wanted to set a story and have

1015
00:53:55,239 --> 00:53:59,640
Speaker 2: like important people there and important stuff happen, you just

1016
00:54:00,040 --> 00:54:02,200
Speaker 2: did it on Sowen. And so that's how it became

1017
00:54:02,239 --> 00:54:05,360
Speaker 2: associated with the dead and the supernatural. I don't, okay,

1018
00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:07,880
Speaker 2: buy that argument, but that is an argument that people

1019
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:14,399
Speaker 2: make interesting, okay. And then there's the divination and most okay.

1020
00:54:14,440 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 2: So there's like one piece of the divination that's like

1021
00:54:16,520 --> 00:54:20,759
Speaker 2: actually spooky, which is around the bonfire, people would put

1022
00:54:20,800 --> 00:54:22,840
Speaker 2: like a everyone like put like a rock and be like,

1023
00:54:22,840 --> 00:54:25,080
Speaker 2: that's my rock, and then if it's gone by the

1024
00:54:25,120 --> 00:54:26,560
Speaker 2: next day, then you're not going to survive.

1025
00:54:26,600 --> 00:54:29,920
Speaker 4: Also colonialism totally.

1026
00:54:31,600 --> 00:54:33,920
Speaker 2: They learn it from the English.

1027
00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:36,399
Speaker 4: My rock actually this my rock now?

1028
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 3: Sorry?

1029
00:54:37,560 --> 00:54:41,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, so if your rock disappears, then you're gonna die.

1030
00:54:41,040 --> 00:54:43,680
Speaker 2: And this this, this is the like maybe replaced human

1031
00:54:43,719 --> 00:54:47,640
Speaker 2: sacrifice ritual that I read about m but the rest

1032
00:54:47,680 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 2: of the divination rituals for sowen you heard of any

1033
00:54:50,600 --> 00:54:50,879
Speaker 2: of these?

1034
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:52,520
Speaker 4: No?

1035
00:54:52,520 --> 00:54:55,520
Speaker 2: No, did you ever play mash as a kid that

1036
00:54:55,719 --> 00:54:58,160
Speaker 2: like figure out who you're gonna marry.

1037
00:54:57,920 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 3: And where you're going to live? And shit, well I'm

1038
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:03,279
Speaker 3: married Josh Hotcherson and if so, will we for some

1039
00:55:03,320 --> 00:55:04,640
Speaker 3: reason live in an apartment?

1040
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:05,400
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1041
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:08,600
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, that's what it stood for, right the mansion

1042
00:55:08,920 --> 00:55:11,359
Speaker 4: it is it is a very like I've thought about

1043
00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:11,799
Speaker 4: this a lot.

1044
00:55:12,160 --> 00:55:14,040
Speaker 3: The more I get interested in housing where it's like

1045
00:55:14,400 --> 00:55:19,000
Speaker 3: a children's game that is named after housing options mansion, apartment.

1046
00:55:18,920 --> 00:55:20,920
Speaker 2: Shack house, shack.

1047
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:24,960
Speaker 3: I was like ship, Like, oh see, that's no, you

1048
00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:28,320
Speaker 3: have to have what is viewed as a negative outcome.

1049
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:31,520
Speaker 3: And then the funny thing is like Josh Hodgerson's career

1050
00:55:31,600 --> 00:55:33,920
Speaker 3: must have really fallen out from under him due to

1051
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:35,640
Speaker 3: the fact that I married him and we live in

1052
00:55:35,680 --> 00:55:38,319
Speaker 3: a shack but we drive an Audi, you know.

1053
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:42,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so this is this is the style of

1054
00:55:43,000 --> 00:55:47,279
Speaker 2: divination of South Okay, it's like who you are going

1055
00:55:47,320 --> 00:55:49,440
Speaker 2: to marry, and where you're going to live, and what

1056
00:55:49,600 --> 00:55:52,239
Speaker 2: job you're going to have and shit like this. They

1057
00:55:52,239 --> 00:55:56,360
Speaker 2: were playing Mash based Sowen on the other hand. Every

1058
00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:58,319
Speaker 2: now and then it would be like am I going

1059
00:55:58,360 --> 00:56:00,319
Speaker 2: to get married this year? Am I going to become bake?

1060
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:00,560
Speaker 3: Like?

1061
00:56:00,560 --> 00:56:02,279
Speaker 2: Am I gonna get this job? Am I gonna die

1062
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:04,800
Speaker 2: this year? That's like thrown in as one of the options.

1063
00:56:05,320 --> 00:56:07,799
Speaker 4: Oh, that's not a part of Mash to.

1064
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 2: Be fair, This is like medieval Europe where oh right,

1065
00:56:11,239 --> 00:56:14,279
Speaker 2: really present chance if you're going to die any given year. Yeah,

1066
00:56:14,320 --> 00:56:15,399
Speaker 2: you're like, I'm getting up there.

1067
00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:21,759
Speaker 3: I just turned nineteen, yeah, yeah.

1068
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:21,920
Speaker 2: And so most of this stuff, most of this divination

1069
00:56:21,960 --> 00:56:23,960
Speaker 2: seems that we have the records of or that I've

1070
00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:25,880
Speaker 2: seen it seems to come from the sort of syncretic

1071
00:56:26,120 --> 00:56:29,840
Speaker 2: part of it. But it's still cool. So one traditional

1072
00:56:29,880 --> 00:56:32,520
Speaker 2: dish for Soowin is coal cannon, which is Irish mashed

1073
00:56:32,520 --> 00:56:35,000
Speaker 2: potatoes a lot of greens in it, and you take

1074
00:56:35,280 --> 00:56:37,560
Speaker 2: the first two portions of it and you set them

1075
00:56:37,600 --> 00:56:41,480
Speaker 2: out either by the gate for hungry passerby, or you

1076
00:56:41,560 --> 00:56:43,720
Speaker 2: set it at the foot of the nearest fairy thorn,

1077
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:48,040
Speaker 2: hawthorn or white thorn on Halloween or and or Allsoul's.

1078
00:56:47,680 --> 00:56:48,600
Speaker 4: Night kind of.

1079
00:56:48,920 --> 00:56:52,080
Speaker 3: So this is like the Santa Santa potatoes kind of, yeah,

1080
00:56:52,080 --> 00:56:53,799
Speaker 3: but also a little bit of mutual aid if so,

1081
00:56:53,880 --> 00:56:56,120
Speaker 3: if anyone just needs potatoes.

1082
00:56:55,800 --> 00:56:59,120
Speaker 2: Well yeah, and that actually, I mean in trick or

1083
00:56:59,120 --> 00:57:00,839
Speaker 2: treating kind of comes from a lot of this kind

1084
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:02,839
Speaker 2: of stuff too. Oh and we'll talk about more about

1085
00:57:02,840 --> 00:57:03,680
Speaker 2: that stuff later too.

1086
00:57:04,600 --> 00:57:07,000
Speaker 4: And wow, you're blowing my fucking mind.

1087
00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:07,759
Speaker 3: Okay, this is great.

1088
00:57:07,840 --> 00:57:13,160
Speaker 2: Okay, another weird Christmas parallel m The first and last

1089
00:57:13,160 --> 00:57:15,960
Speaker 2: spoonfuls of the Halloween coal cannon can be put into

1090
00:57:16,000 --> 00:57:19,080
Speaker 2: an eligible girl's stocking and then well, now while she's

1091
00:57:19,080 --> 00:57:22,080
Speaker 2: wearing it, and then you hang it from a nail

1092
00:57:22,120 --> 00:57:24,880
Speaker 2: in the door, and her future husband will be the

1093
00:57:24,920 --> 00:57:26,200
Speaker 2: first man to enter the house.

1094
00:57:27,680 --> 00:57:34,200
Speaker 3: So if you put potatoes in a sog yeah some

1095
00:57:34,360 --> 00:57:37,320
Speaker 3: real Okay, Okay, well they didn't have a lot of money.

1096
00:57:37,400 --> 00:57:40,720
Speaker 2: Okay, this is not a rich culture. It's a rich culture.

1097
00:57:40,840 --> 00:57:43,880
Speaker 2: It's not a culture with money, and it's a rich.

1098
00:57:43,760 --> 00:57:47,800
Speaker 3: Culture not with money necessarily. But look at that lower

1099
00:57:48,080 --> 00:57:49,640
Speaker 3: potato in a sock. Got it?

1100
00:57:50,120 --> 00:57:53,680
Speaker 4: I look, I'm this is this is my culture. I

1101
00:57:53,680 --> 00:57:54,240
Speaker 4: should know this.

1102
00:57:54,520 --> 00:57:57,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, this is this is my favorite one. Like actually,

1103
00:57:58,080 --> 00:58:01,320
Speaker 2: barm brack is a fruit loaf. That's basically you make

1104
00:58:01,400 --> 00:58:06,200
Speaker 2: this fruit loaf and then you hide small tokens in it,

1105
00:58:06,280 --> 00:58:09,880
Speaker 2: like like a ring or a button or a thimble,

1106
00:58:10,200 --> 00:58:11,960
Speaker 2: and if you get the ring, you're gonna get married.

1107
00:58:11,960 --> 00:58:14,160
Speaker 2: If you get the button, you're either going to be

1108
00:58:14,200 --> 00:58:15,840
Speaker 2: an old or the button or thimble you're gonna be

1109
00:58:15,840 --> 00:58:18,040
Speaker 2: an old bachelor or an old maid.

1110
00:58:18,360 --> 00:58:20,560
Speaker 3: Wait what is this call to I want to do this?

1111
00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:22,800
Speaker 2: Yeah? No, it's actually I can. I can send you

1112
00:58:22,800 --> 00:58:27,240
Speaker 2: a recipe. My friend sent me a barm brack b

1113
00:58:27,720 --> 00:58:29,720
Speaker 2: r M. There's a bunch of different ways of spell it,

1114
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:32,400
Speaker 2: like anything from Irish that gets anglicized, but b r

1115
00:58:32,600 --> 00:58:37,320
Speaker 2: M space br A c k okay, my friend makes it.

1116
00:58:37,360 --> 00:58:40,320
Speaker 2: So these days when people make it, they usually either

1117
00:58:40,400 --> 00:58:42,800
Speaker 2: like really well wrap the thing so that it's not

1118
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:47,160
Speaker 2: a choking hazard, or they like minimize the number of

1119
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:50,680
Speaker 2: choking hazards they put into the food. And then my

1120
00:58:50,760 --> 00:58:53,280
Speaker 2: friend who makes it just puts an uncooked P in it.

1121
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:54,600
Speaker 2: I think maybe it's a lential. I think it was

1122
00:58:54,640 --> 00:58:57,840
Speaker 2: a P really, so it isn't like choking hazard game,

1123
00:58:57,960 --> 00:58:59,080
Speaker 2: you know, I do.

1124
00:58:59,240 --> 00:59:01,840
Speaker 3: I mean I I really do kind of appreciate when

1125
00:59:01,960 --> 00:59:05,640
Speaker 3: someone goes hogwild with the choking hazards in the food.

1126
00:59:05,880 --> 00:59:08,200
Speaker 3: I do feel it's it's part of why I find

1127
00:59:08,920 --> 00:59:13,280
Speaker 3: heterosexual proposals to be so fascinating, where it's like what

1128
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:17,080
Speaker 3: if I what if I potentially killed someone I theoretically

1129
00:59:17,160 --> 00:59:19,200
Speaker 3: want to spend the rest of my life with by

1130
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:23,200
Speaker 3: shoving an ugly little ring I've purchased into like an

1131
00:59:23,240 --> 00:59:28,560
Speaker 3: expensive meat love and and you have to be thrilled

1132
00:59:28,560 --> 00:59:32,320
Speaker 3: if you almost swallow a ring and you're like oh, and.

1133
00:59:32,200 --> 00:59:34,120
Speaker 2: You get to find out if you're a future spouse

1134
00:59:34,160 --> 00:59:40,800
Speaker 2: nos time like maneuver one hundred times yes, Yeah, Well

1135
00:59:41,640 --> 00:59:43,360
Speaker 2: you can also if you want to find out who

1136
00:59:43,360 --> 00:59:46,960
Speaker 2: your future husband or wife will be. And there's different

1137
00:59:46,960 --> 00:59:49,000
Speaker 2: ways of doing this, and one of them the like

1138
00:59:49,040 --> 00:59:52,000
Speaker 2: witchiest ways that like three unmarried women get together or

1139
00:59:52,080 --> 00:59:54,040
Speaker 2: girls get together and do this and then do this

1140
00:59:54,080 --> 00:59:57,240
Speaker 2: like separately from the rest of everyone, and you make

1141
00:59:57,280 --> 01:00:00,400
Speaker 2: something called a dumb cake, which is just a a

1142
01:00:01,560 --> 01:00:05,000
Speaker 2: very plain piece of bread, and everyone makes them and

1143
01:00:05,040 --> 01:00:07,600
Speaker 2: then you like sleep with them under your pillow, or

1144
01:00:07,680 --> 01:00:09,800
Speaker 2: you sleep with a sprig of yarrow under your pillow,

1145
01:00:09,840 --> 01:00:11,840
Speaker 2: and then you'll dream of your lover.

1146
01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:16,680
Speaker 3: So wait, this one is sleep with bread under your pillow.

1147
01:00:16,760 --> 01:00:20,200
Speaker 3: And you can also potatoes in the sock, bread under

1148
01:00:20,240 --> 01:00:23,040
Speaker 3: the pillow. Yeah, eternal love is yours.

1149
01:00:23,320 --> 01:00:25,720
Speaker 2: Yeah. And the reason I kind of like this, I

1150
01:00:25,760 --> 01:00:29,200
Speaker 2: think that this is a recipe for sleep paralysis because

1151
01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:32,040
Speaker 2: if you're sleeping, if you go to bed thinking about

1152
01:00:32,360 --> 01:00:34,640
Speaker 2: what am I going to Like, if you go to

1153
01:00:34,680 --> 01:00:36,480
Speaker 2: bed and you think about I'm going to dream of

1154
01:00:36,480 --> 01:00:38,760
Speaker 2: the following, you're more likely to dream of that, right,

1155
01:00:39,040 --> 01:00:40,680
Speaker 2: and so you're able to kind of influence your dreams

1156
01:00:40,680 --> 01:00:42,439
Speaker 2: in that way. But also if you sleep with something

1157
01:00:42,480 --> 01:00:44,680
Speaker 2: under your pillow, you might sleep on your back, which

1158
01:00:44,680 --> 01:00:46,920
Speaker 2: gives you more more likely sleep paralysis and more intense

1159
01:00:47,000 --> 01:00:50,080
Speaker 2: dreaming in general, and like you might sleep kind of

1160
01:00:50,160 --> 01:00:52,439
Speaker 2: lightly as a result of it. So I think people

1161
01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:56,160
Speaker 2: have like mostly horrifying nightmares, but sometimes they might.

1162
01:00:56,320 --> 01:00:57,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, but I think.

1163
01:00:57,880 --> 01:01:01,080
Speaker 2: Anyway, So, okay, other way you can find out who

1164
01:01:01,120 --> 01:01:03,480
Speaker 2: you're gonna marry is you can peel an apple in

1165
01:01:03,520 --> 01:01:06,360
Speaker 2: a single strip and then throw the peel over your

1166
01:01:06,400 --> 01:01:08,640
Speaker 2: shoulder and see what letter it forms, and that's the

1167
01:01:08,640 --> 01:01:10,440
Speaker 2: first letter of the person who marry or whatever.

1168
01:01:11,160 --> 01:01:14,960
Speaker 3: I've heard of that, Okay, Okay, yeah, I've heard of that.

1169
01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:17,680
Speaker 3: I've never done it because that's actually really hard to do.

1170
01:01:17,880 --> 01:01:19,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, that seems really hard.

1171
01:01:19,120 --> 01:01:21,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I would imagine if you did it, you'd

1172
01:01:21,080 --> 01:01:25,560
Speaker 3: be like, oh the letter, oh.

1173
01:01:25,160 --> 01:01:28,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, or like everything looks like okay or whatever the

1174
01:01:28,240 --> 01:01:32,320
Speaker 2: most convoluted letters are, you know, right, Okay. There's another

1175
01:01:32,360 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 2: way you can do this, and this is actually my

1176
01:01:34,680 --> 01:01:37,760
Speaker 2: favorite because it Okay, you can cut nine stalks of

1177
01:01:37,840 --> 01:01:40,600
Speaker 2: yarrow with a black handled knife and then stay in

1178
01:01:40,680 --> 01:01:44,000
Speaker 2: silence for the rest of the evening. Once everyone is asleep,

1179
01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:46,120
Speaker 2: you peel the yarrow. I have no idea what yarro

1180
01:01:46,200 --> 01:01:49,560
Speaker 2: looks like. Where you peel it. I'm not a supper witch.

1181
01:01:49,960 --> 01:01:53,480
Speaker 2: You peel the yarrow, and you say good night, good yarrow,

1182
01:01:53,800 --> 01:01:56,400
Speaker 2: thrice good night to thee. Pray. Tell me who my

1183
01:01:56,480 --> 01:01:59,080
Speaker 2: true love will be. If his clothes I'm to wear,

1184
01:01:59,120 --> 01:02:02,160
Speaker 2: if his children I'm to rear blithe and mary, may

1185
01:02:02,160 --> 01:02:04,640
Speaker 2: he be with his face turned to me. If his

1186
01:02:04,760 --> 01:02:07,800
Speaker 2: clothes I'm not to wear, if his children not to

1187
01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:11,400
Speaker 2: rear sour and groma, may he be with his back

1188
01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:13,600
Speaker 2: turned to me, and groma being an Irish word for

1189
01:02:13,680 --> 01:02:18,080
Speaker 2: like morose. Oh okay, So you recite this and then

1190
01:02:18,120 --> 01:02:22,600
Speaker 2: the first suitable man you see is scrutinized. And I

1191
01:02:22,720 --> 01:02:26,120
Speaker 2: like this one because it's like, oh, if I meet

1192
01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:29,400
Speaker 2: a man and he's like nice and smiles, and he

1193
01:02:29,560 --> 01:02:33,160
Speaker 2: like doesn't as soon as I turn away, like look

1194
01:02:33,360 --> 01:02:37,240
Speaker 2: evil and shitty and mean, you know, because they're like, Okay, well,

1195
01:02:37,360 --> 01:02:39,520
Speaker 2: at least there's a filtering process here.

1196
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:40,240
Speaker 4: I guess.

1197
01:02:40,240 --> 01:02:44,960
Speaker 3: So I guess I would. I would conversely argue that

1198
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:48,919
Speaker 3: this is a great historical example of the bar never

1199
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:53,320
Speaker 3: being particularly high. Well, if he doesn't turn into the

1200
01:02:53,480 --> 01:02:58,560
Speaker 3: literal devil when I avert my eyes, he's probably he'll be.

1201
01:02:58,760 --> 01:03:01,040
Speaker 4: He can he's serviceable. We can make it work.

1202
01:03:01,400 --> 01:03:03,240
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, if we put the bar there

1203
01:03:03,280 --> 01:03:07,040
Speaker 2: about I probably shouldn't say missing just stuff on the show.

1204
01:03:09,440 --> 01:03:13,960
Speaker 2: So okay. The other way you can do it is

1205
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:16,160
Speaker 2: you can eat an apple standing in front of a

1206
01:03:16,200 --> 01:03:19,080
Speaker 2: mirror at midnight while combing your hair. I don't know

1207
01:03:19,080 --> 01:03:21,560
Speaker 2: how I eat an apple and whatever.

1208
01:03:21,960 --> 01:03:25,600
Speaker 3: That's two like hygienically healthy things to be doing at midnight,

1209
01:03:25,760 --> 01:03:26,320
Speaker 3: I don't think.

1210
01:03:26,480 --> 01:03:28,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, it would have to be intentional.

1211
01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:30,920
Speaker 2: As the clock hits midnight, you can see the face

1212
01:03:30,960 --> 01:03:32,920
Speaker 2: of your future husband over your right shoulder.

1213
01:03:35,080 --> 01:03:38,000
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, this sounds like something that's been paid by

1214
01:03:38,040 --> 01:03:39,640
Speaker 3: the apple lobby.

1215
01:03:39,920 --> 01:03:42,840
Speaker 2: There's a lot of apple stuff. Apples are pretty, yeah,

1216
01:03:43,280 --> 01:03:45,560
Speaker 2: symbolically useful for different.

1217
01:03:45,280 --> 01:03:47,760
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean that was the da Vinci code.

1218
01:03:48,920 --> 01:03:51,040
Speaker 2: I haven't seen the da Vinci code.

1219
01:03:51,600 --> 01:03:55,280
Speaker 3: I regret to inform you spoiler alert. Do you know

1220
01:03:55,280 --> 01:03:58,160
Speaker 3: what the da Vinci code is? The word apple. I

1221
01:03:58,200 --> 01:04:00,920
Speaker 3: remember it being twelve years old, reading that book when

1222
01:04:00,920 --> 01:04:03,120
Speaker 3: it was like super popular, like reading it in the bath,

1223
01:04:03,640 --> 01:04:05,920
Speaker 3: wanting to be wanting to be a part of something

1224
01:04:06,000 --> 01:04:10,160
Speaker 3: bigger than myself. Getting to the point like nine thousand

1225
01:04:10,240 --> 01:04:13,560
Speaker 3: pages in where the Davini code is Apple, And I

1226
01:04:13,720 --> 01:04:18,040
Speaker 3: was like, are you fucking kidding me? I'm twelve and

1227
01:04:18,160 --> 01:04:22,120
Speaker 3: I'm underwhelmed by this. The da Vinci cope was Apple. Yeah, okay,

1228
01:04:22,120 --> 01:04:24,240
Speaker 3: I no, that makes sense, you know, not that anyone's

1229
01:04:24,280 --> 01:04:26,320
Speaker 3: reading it now, but like if you ever were, like,

1230
01:04:26,360 --> 01:04:28,680
Speaker 3: I'm going to get around to that, don't bother. The

1231
01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:30,440
Speaker 3: DaVinci code was literally Apple.

1232
01:04:30,840 --> 01:04:34,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, that makes sense, I guess.

1233
01:04:34,080 --> 01:04:36,440
Speaker 3: So anyways, Christian parallels.

1234
01:04:36,120 --> 01:04:40,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so that's sourin the big gathering of the

1235
01:04:40,600 --> 01:04:44,680
Speaker 2: tribes that was probably but not necessarily super spooky. It

1236
01:04:44,720 --> 01:04:48,680
Speaker 2: got all jumbled up in kind of fun ways. As

1237
01:04:48,720 --> 01:04:53,360
Speaker 2: for All Saints Day, all hollows tied, Devil's Night, witch hunts,

1238
01:04:54,000 --> 01:04:59,040
Speaker 2: We'll talk about those on Wednesday, which is Saints Day.

1239
01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:03,160
Speaker 2: Oh this is All Souls Day. Crap, I don't remember

1240
01:05:03,160 --> 01:05:03,720
Speaker 2: which one.

1241
01:05:04,280 --> 01:05:04,960
Speaker 4: God damn it.

1242
01:05:05,040 --> 01:05:06,520
Speaker 2: I don't have a calendar in front of me. There's no

1243
01:05:06,560 --> 01:05:08,240
Speaker 2: way of knowing. It's just on one of them.

1244
01:05:08,880 --> 01:05:11,120
Speaker 3: Impossible to say a good yes.

1245
01:05:11,880 --> 01:05:15,680
Speaker 2: But what else is This isn't an ad transition, it's

1246
01:05:15,680 --> 01:05:21,840
Speaker 2: a plug transition. What else is spooky is your plugs? What?

1247
01:05:22,600 --> 01:05:23,480
Speaker 3: It's All Saintsday?

1248
01:05:23,680 --> 01:05:25,920
Speaker 2: Okay, I even got it. Write in the script. I'm

1249
01:05:25,960 --> 01:05:26,360
Speaker 2: so smart.

1250
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:31,200
Speaker 3: I guess I guess. Well, you can find me on

1251
01:05:31,720 --> 01:05:37,400
Speaker 3: mainly Instagram. Jamie christ Superstar is still technically on Twitter.

1252
01:05:37,480 --> 01:05:41,760
Speaker 3: I guess Jamie laughed his help. But and you can

1253
01:05:41,760 --> 01:05:44,480
Speaker 3: get my book which is called Raw Dog and that's

1254
01:05:44,480 --> 01:05:47,560
Speaker 3: about hot dogs. However, for the purposes of what we're

1255
01:05:47,560 --> 01:05:49,360
Speaker 3: talking about today, I think you should listen to my

1256
01:05:49,440 --> 01:05:54,040
Speaker 3: podcast Ghost Church, which is about the history of spiritualism

1257
01:05:54,680 --> 01:05:59,440
Speaker 3: and what modern spiritualism looks like in Central Florida. So

1258
01:05:59,480 --> 01:06:03,120
Speaker 3: if you produce it, Ian edited it. My uncle Dennis

1259
01:06:03,200 --> 01:06:07,760
Speaker 3: is in it. Uncle Dennis rules. Yeah, long live Uncle Dennis.

1260
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:11,840
Speaker 3: He fucking rocks. And yeah, so that that you should

1261
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:12,320
Speaker 3: listen to that.

1262
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:17,560
Speaker 2: Okay, I will wait, I already have, but you did

1263
01:06:17,720 --> 01:06:21,800
Speaker 2: the listeners listen to it. Yeah, Sophie, what do you got?

1264
01:06:24,680 --> 01:06:25,280
Speaker 3: I think I plu.

1265
01:06:25,400 --> 01:06:27,000
Speaker 1: I think I've plugged this last a couple times, but

1266
01:06:27,520 --> 01:06:30,080
Speaker 1: listen to it. Could happen here. It's more important than ever.

1267
01:06:30,720 --> 01:06:35,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, all right, see everyone on Wednesday.

1268
01:06:36,480 --> 01:06:38,960
Speaker 3: Ah, thank you.

1269
01:06:41,320 --> 01:06:43,840
Speaker 1: Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production of

1270
01:06:43,880 --> 01:06:44,800
Speaker 1: cool Zone Media.

1271
01:06:45,120 --> 01:06:48,000
Speaker 3: For more podcasts on cool Zone Media, visit our website

1272
01:06:48,120 --> 01:06:51,800
Speaker 1: Coolzonemedia dot com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

1273
01:06:51,840 --> 01:06:54,720
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.