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Speaker 1: The rock doesn't really care if you succeed on it

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Speaker 1: or not, Like the mountains are so much bigger than us,

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Speaker 1: and we can just show up and be as prepared

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Speaker 1: as possible and mitigate our risks as much as possible

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Speaker 1: so that we're in control of our safety to the

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Speaker 1: extent that we can be.

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Speaker 2: Hey, everybody, Emily, A body here coming to you from

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Speaker 2: the Age Studio. You are listening to episode two hundred

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Speaker 2: and one of Hurdle, a wellness focused podcast where I

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Speaker 2: connect with everyone from your favorite athletes to top experts

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Speaker 2: and industry CEOs about their highest highs, toughest moments, and

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Speaker 2: everything in between. We all go through hurdles in life,

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Speaker 2: and my goal through these discussions is to empower you

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Speaker 2: to better navigate yours and move with intention so that

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Speaker 2: you can stride towards your own big potential and of

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Speaker 2: course have some fun along the way. For episode two

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Speaker 2: oh one, I am chatting of pro climber Sasha to Julian.

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Speaker 2: We dive right in to this discussion with a conversation

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Speaker 2: about being transparent about your goals. Plus she also tells

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Speaker 2: me about falling in love at first sight with climbing

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Speaker 2: from six years old, Sasha has been a climbing phenom.

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Speaker 2: She's also taken quite the unconventional route in her career,

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Speaker 2: going to college at Columbia in New York while simultaneously

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Speaker 2: making a big name for herself in the industry. We

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Speaker 2: also chat about navigating bullying and disordered eating, which Sasha

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Speaker 2: says is rampant in climbing since it's a gravity based sport.

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Speaker 2: This really brings me back to the conversation I had

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Speaker 2: last year with climbing pro Kai Lightner, and we talked

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Speaker 2: about injury and how Sasha navigated hip surgery during the

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Speaker 2: pandemic that left her feeling isolated and alone and really

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Speaker 2: really struggling through, as she.

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Speaker 3: Puts it, some dark times. So grateful for this combo.

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Speaker 2: Sasha and I have been trying to make this happen

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Speaker 2: for a really long time, as one can imagine, when

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Speaker 2: someone is off and on expeditions all the time, it

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Speaker 2: makes sinking up to pod a little bit difficult. But

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Speaker 2: grateful that we got it on the books, that this

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Speaker 2: episode is now in the feed, and happy to bring

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Speaker 2: it to you. A huge, huge, thank you, so much

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Speaker 2: love to all the hurdlers that came out in Los

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Speaker 2: Angeles over the weekend. To say that it was a

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Speaker 2: joy to spend some time with you would be the

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Speaker 2: biggest understatement ever. Next up, some news coming asap. I

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Speaker 2: promised about Boston, but do meet a favor. If you're

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Speaker 2: going to be in Boston, you may want to think

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Speaker 2: about holding some time for me, either Thursday evening April

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Speaker 2: fourteenth or Saturday, April sixteen at five pm. I promise

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Speaker 2: when I have the details to offer you, you will

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Speaker 2: be the first people to know. Make sure you're following

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Speaker 2: along with Hurdle over on socials at Hurdle podcast, I

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Speaker 2: am over at Emily a body and if you aren't

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Speaker 2: doing so yet, subscribe to the weekly Hurdle newsletter. Stay

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Speaker 2: in the loop with what's going on with the show.

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Speaker 2: Where my head's at yet, my favorite gear and podcast

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Speaker 2: and music and book picks and so much more. The

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Speaker 2: link to do that is in the show notes. And

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Speaker 2: with that, let's get to hurdling.

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Speaker 3: Today.

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Speaker 2: I'm sitting down with Sasha did Julian. She is a

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Speaker 2: pro climber, pro and world champion climber.

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Speaker 3: How you doing today, Sasha.

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Speaker 4: I'm doing so well. Emily, thanks for asking how are

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Speaker 4: you doing?

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Speaker 3: I'm so good. I'm so excited to sit down with you.

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Speaker 2: Feel like this has been forever, like Sandlot's style, forever

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Speaker 2: in the making.

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Speaker 4: Our stars are finally aligned.

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Speaker 2: Well again, I'm so excited that we were able to

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Speaker 2: make the stars align.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to jump into this with you, like on

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Speaker 3: the quick. Is that cool with you?

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Speaker 4: Let's go?

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Speaker 3: Okay, So you.

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Speaker 2: Wrote a post on medium not all that long ago,

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Speaker 2: and in the post you wrote this sentence, I'd rather

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Speaker 2: speak about my smaller goals than my bigger ones because

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Speaker 2: it feels less risky of letting others down if I fail.

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Speaker 2: I think about this all the time. Can we can

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Speaker 2: we talk about this a little bit because do we

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Speaker 2: actually think, like, genuinely if we take a step back,

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Speaker 2: that other people are that invested in care that much

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Speaker 2: that if we quote unquote fail, they're going to be like, oh,

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Speaker 2: that person is such like a waste of space.

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Speaker 1: It's such a good point. And first of all, thanks

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Speaker 1: for reading my baby me, Paige. I missed writing and

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Speaker 1: I was like, you know what, I'm just going to

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Speaker 1: start a blog.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I totally agree with that question, though, like do people

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Speaker 1: actually even remember? Because I think that we're all pretty

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Speaker 1: self absorbed in our own orbit to.

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Speaker 4: An extent that I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes when you put a goal out there, it feels

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Speaker 1: more real than when you don't put it out there,

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Speaker 1: that there's an accountability that can really help you in

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Speaker 1: achieving it. And so it's kind of like, once you

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Speaker 1: can get past that hurdle unintended for this podcast and

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Speaker 1: just let your circle in on what your goal is,

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Speaker 1: then I have found that I try harder, Like I

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Speaker 1: feel more accountable.

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Speaker 4: Whether or not people actually care or not.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, and I don't know why it can

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Speaker 1: feel so intimidating to be like, I want to go

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Speaker 1: climb the hardest climb ever achieved by a woman, or

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Speaker 1: something like that, like because there is a side of

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Speaker 1: it that I temper away from because of fear of

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Speaker 1: feeling arrogant, of fear of not necessarily being able to

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Speaker 1: uphold that goal, or what if my intentions change and

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Speaker 1: then someone judges me because I've changed paths and I'm

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Speaker 1: not still charting forward on that, And then I'll start

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Speaker 1: asking It's like, do you want to open the bag

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Speaker 1: of questions or not? Yeah? And I guess it's just

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Speaker 1: weighing whether it's worth it or not for that extra accountability.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, now I hear that.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm a really big runner, and I remember

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Speaker 2: before Chicago Marathon twenty nineteen, I put out what felt

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Speaker 2: like a really impossible goal. But what I really knew

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Speaker 2: deep in my gut is that my goal was even

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Speaker 2: faster than the goal that I shared with the world.

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Speaker 2: So I hear you, Like, sometimes I feel like we

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Speaker 2: kind of temper what we're willing to let other people

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Speaker 2: in on because we're scared of that, Like we're scared

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Speaker 2: of quote unquote failing publicly. But sometimes I don't know, lately,

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Speaker 2: I'm kind of like go big, fail big, Like what's

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Speaker 2: the worst thing that can happen.

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Speaker 1: That's such an interesting point though, It's like you set

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Speaker 1: your goal out there, it was almost like you took

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Speaker 1: a dip into the shallow end rather than letting everyone

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Speaker 1: in the deep end with you. And there must be

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Speaker 1: some psychology behind it, Like there is also in climbing,

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Speaker 1: like we have a really precious community where you're almost like,

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Speaker 1: if you're a woman, especially, you're damned if you do

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Speaker 1: and damned if you don't. Because as soon as you

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Speaker 1: start setting these big, audacious goals and saying what you're

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Speaker 1: going to go and achieve. You're pegged as like maybe

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Speaker 1: arrogant or whatever. And then as soon as you're not

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Speaker 1: saying like what you want to achieve or not, or

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Speaker 1: like taking time off from climbing, it's like, well, what

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Speaker 1: Isashy joy and done lately?

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Speaker 4: And it's like, well, it's been a month.

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Speaker 1: So I think that there is just this tug and

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Speaker 1: pull in society in general that I experience in climbing,

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Speaker 1: and that could be like a whole other subject, but

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Speaker 1: I relate it to goals and letting yourself be vulnerable,

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Speaker 1: because when you don't have this space to be vulnerable

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Speaker 1: in the world that you're orbiting, then it's really hard

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Speaker 1: to want to be vulnerable.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: In more of my digging into Sasha's digital presence, I

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Speaker 2: saw that you wrote the sentence on your website. If

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Speaker 2: I were to believe in love at first site, climbing

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Speaker 2: would be the supportive evidence. So give us some insight

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Speaker 2: into your love at first site with climbing, which correct

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Speaker 2: me if I'm wrong, but I know that I'm not

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Speaker 2: started at six years old.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I love that you dug up that quote. I don't

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Speaker 1: even remember it that well, but it sounds just like me,

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Speaker 1: so I believe it. My brother had a birthday party

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Speaker 1: at a climbing gym and Alexandria, Virginia, at this place

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Speaker 1: called Sport Rock, which still exists. It's a right off

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Speaker 1: Eisenhower for those of you in northern Virginia. And he

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Speaker 1: was a hockey player. Were like Irish twins, like he's

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Speaker 1: a year older than me, and it was his whole

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Speaker 1: hockey team and me and I was just so fiercely

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Speaker 1: competitive with my older brother Charlie, and to the point

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Speaker 1: that like he wasn't competing, but I always was.

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Speaker 4: I just remember a.

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Speaker 1: Not that this should be like a stepping stone for passion,

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Speaker 1: but I was better than the boys, and I was

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Speaker 1: like sweet found my sport, but I was like in control.

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Speaker 1: And I distinctly remember that because at the time I

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Speaker 1: was a figure skater too, and that was kind of

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Speaker 1: like the path that my mom thought for me was

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Speaker 1: my brother played ice hockey and I figure skated and

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Speaker 1: did ballet, and then at the birthday party, like it

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Speaker 1: was kind of like climbing, if you want to succeed

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Speaker 1: upward on the wall, then it's up to you.

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Speaker 4: And that the.

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Speaker 1: Level of intricacy of like what I thought of climbing

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Speaker 1: didn't necessarily dawn on me as a six year old.

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Speaker 1: I just loved it and I wanted to go back,

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Speaker 1: and so I joined like their junior team program, which

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Speaker 1: was this program that met each Wednesday and Saturday and

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Speaker 1: Wednesdays after school Saturday mornings. And then about eight to

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Speaker 1: twelve months into doing this little program with like kids

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Speaker 1: around the Tri State area, I walked in on a

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Speaker 1: Saturday morning with my mom and there is this youth

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Speaker 1: regional championship taking place. And I had like never known

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Speaker 1: of climbing as a sport. Frankly, like I knew of

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Speaker 1: it as my hobby and this thing that I loved

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Speaker 1: to do. And then my mom kind of like convinced

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Speaker 1: the organizers to let me compete because I hadn't done

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Speaker 1: any of like the qualifying regional events to qualify for

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Speaker 1: like youth regionals. And I competed in the eleven and

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Speaker 1: under category. I was seven, and I won my category,

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Speaker 1: which you know, at the time was far far less

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Speaker 1: competitive than it is these days, like there are so

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Speaker 1: many kids who climb these days.

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Speaker 4: I'm granted this was.

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Speaker 1: Over twenty years ago, but yeah, that was like the

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Speaker 1: spawning of my competitive career as a climber.

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Speaker 2: No big deal, just like showing up on the spot

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Speaker 2: and becoming like, you know, the one.

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Speaker 3: To take it all.

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Speaker 4: In eleven and under.

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Speaker 3: And the yeah, but still like give yourself some credit.

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Speaker 3: This is a big deal.

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Speaker 2: And I mean that moment spawned what would become, like

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Speaker 2: to this day, a lasting love affair with this sport.

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Speaker 2: So obviously pre eleven and under, starting from the get

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Speaker 2: go and excelling.

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Speaker 3: But when did you truly feel.

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Speaker 2: As though, Okay, this isn't just something that I like

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Speaker 2: to do, this is something that I'm really really good at.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I know, that's a great question.

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Speaker 1: And the love affairs gone through ups and downs like

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Speaker 1: any good relationship. When I was eleven, I won my

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Speaker 1: first Youth Continental Championship in Mexico City, and that was

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Speaker 1: my first like big international win. The year prior to that,

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Speaker 1: I had made the youth national team, which had qualified

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Speaker 1: me to compete in the Continental championships. And right after

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Speaker 1: that I had my first like sponsor, which was this

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Speaker 1: climbing endemic company called mad Rock. And I remember that

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Speaker 1: my parents, like my whole family, didn't climb, and I

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Speaker 1: was constantly kind of in this like tug and pull

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Speaker 1: of like proving myself and feeling this need to prove myself,

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Speaker 1: even though I don't know if that was like an

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Speaker 1: actual need or just like in my mind. But when

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Speaker 1: I was in Toronto visiting my family and it was

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Speaker 1: like I think it was like passover or something.

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Speaker 4: My whole mom said, the family is Jewish, I was like, I'm.

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Speaker 1: A professional climber now, and like granted my first sponsorship,

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Speaker 1: Like it was it was just product that I was

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Speaker 1: given as a twelve year old, and then I was

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Speaker 1: given I negotiated the entire thing. I never let to

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Speaker 1: this day my parents like aware of any contract I've every.

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Speaker 3: Wait at twelve.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but there wasn't much negotiation.

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Speaker 1: It was like I was like this product budget, Okay,

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Speaker 1: well how about one thousand.

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Speaker 4: Dollars for first place? You know, these competitions.

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Speaker 3: Is that regal?

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Speaker 4: I mean, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I mean, climbing isn't all It wasn't a collegiate sport.

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Speaker 1: Now it's not part of the collegiate league either. It's

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Speaker 1: like a it has a collegiate series, but it won't

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Speaker 1: prevent you from so yeah, I mean as a climber.

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Speaker 4: I was really at.

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Speaker 1: This like new frontier though of like climbing becoming more

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Speaker 1: of this like sport that you could make a living from.

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Speaker 1: And as a twelve year old, I was very far

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Speaker 1: from making a living in climbing.

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Speaker 4: But I was taking myself really seriously, I.

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Speaker 3: Mean, as you should.

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Speaker 2: It's really exciting at age twelve when someone's like, we're

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Speaker 2: gonna give you all this stuff just to do something

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Speaker 2: that you already love to do.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And it was like I just wanted to be

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Speaker 1: a part of the community so badly because I always

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Speaker 1: felt in school like this other, like it was this

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Speaker 1: no one at my school climbed, and it was climbing

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Speaker 1: was really like a new sport. Whenever I said I climbed,

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Speaker 1: people would be like, what's that, and then I'd like

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Speaker 1: explain it. And so I never talked about climbing growing up,

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Speaker 1: Like at school, I did other sports too, like field

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Speaker 1: hockey and track and field and stuff like that, and

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Speaker 1: if people ask me about climbing, I would change the subject.

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Speaker 1: I just I didn't like talking about you know, as

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Speaker 1: like an adolescent girl, like the last thing you want

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Speaker 1: is something that makes you feel like a total and

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Speaker 1: that's kind of like what climbing felt like. But then

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Speaker 1: once I left school and I was in this climbing community,

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Speaker 1: it felt like home and I had all these friends

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Speaker 1: that it felt like this this connected language and this

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Speaker 1: shared passion that my climbing friends kind of became my

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Speaker 1: much closer community.

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Speaker 4: Than my school friends.

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Speaker 1: My journey with climbing to now it's like funny because

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Speaker 1: I'm like so proud to talk about it and like

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Speaker 1: my mission ultimately and climbing is just get more people

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Speaker 1: to go out and try it. Because I'm obviously biased,

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Speaker 1: but I think it's been a really empowering journey for me.

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Speaker 4: That I like, I remember a couple of.

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Speaker 1: Years ago, I went back and I spoke at my

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Speaker 1: high school and we had what was called like it was.

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Speaker 4: Crossroads or something.

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Speaker 1: It was where like all the seniors hung out and

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Speaker 1: if you were a cool junior, you could like go in,

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Speaker 1: but like as a high schooler, I would like circumvent

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Speaker 1: the circumference, like like I would not touch my foot

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Speaker 1: on the rug of crossroads when I was not ready,

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Speaker 1: Like I was just like I don't know, And then

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Speaker 1: I was like standing in the middle of crossroads talking

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Speaker 1: and I was like this is really really ironic.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well you mentioned you mentioned the the not wanting

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Speaker 2: to feel like a total other, and it's interesting that

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Speaker 2: you said that because there have been moments within the

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Speaker 2: climbing community where you have voice that you have felt

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Speaker 2: like a total other, specifically when it comes to your

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Speaker 2: looks and a little bit about how you're built.

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Speaker 3: So talk to us.

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Speaker 2: And this is usually a question that I say for

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Speaker 2: the end of the show, but I do feel like

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Speaker 2: I want to bring it up now to lean us

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Speaker 2: into this discussion. So someone comes to your Instagram page

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Speaker 2: and they see a pro climber with something like four

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Speaker 2: hundred and seventy five thousand followers and growing. But when

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Speaker 2: you look in the mirror, what is it that you

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Speaker 2: see looking back at you.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's a great question. I mean, I've wrestled

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Speaker 1: with imposter syndrome through most of my career, feeling like

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Speaker 1: I don't necessarily look the part of a climber. I've

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Speaker 1: been told since I was a really young kid, like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you're a rock climber.

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Speaker 4: That's surprising, you.

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Speaker 1: Don't look like a climber, And it's I think I

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Speaker 1: got to the point of like, well, what does a

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Speaker 1: climber look like because.

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Speaker 4: I, you know, have these accolades.

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Speaker 1: I've had multiple national championship titles, world championship title, all

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Speaker 1: these outdoor achievements. Yet I'm still told I don't look

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Speaker 1: like a climber, so let's like consider what that looks like.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I've gone through a lot within the climbing community.

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Speaker 1: My success has been attributed to me being an attractive

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Speaker 1: blonde girl, which I'm like, if only that were the cays,

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Speaker 1: like that would be pretty easy and also open the

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Speaker 1: floodgates to a lot of people much much prettier than me.

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Speaker 1: But I guess like also weight and the disordered eating

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Speaker 1: and being singled out online by cyber bullies from people

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Speaker 1: who are total keyboard trolls to people who are actually

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Speaker 1: other colleagues and professional athletes in my sport, and from

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Speaker 1: when I was when I was eighteen, I went through

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Speaker 1: my own kind of experience with disordered eating and fitting

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Speaker 1: into this World Cup circuit of what it did look

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Speaker 1: like to be a competitive climber was being incredibly rale,

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Speaker 1: thin and meticulous about everything that you eat. And I

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Speaker 1: think that a lot of sports can kind of relate

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Speaker 1: to that as gravity related. But climbing, like literally, what

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Speaker 1: you weigh is what you pull up the wall. And

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Speaker 1: I think it took me a long time to realize

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Speaker 1: that the stronger you are than the more capacity you

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Speaker 1: have to pull the weight, and the long term progression

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Speaker 1: is going to be that much stronger if you just

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Speaker 1: like put in the work to training. But when I

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Speaker 1: was in high school, I kind of like unintentionally started

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Speaker 1: losing weight when I was really kicking up training towards

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Speaker 1: this world championship goal, and I started succeeding even more,

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Speaker 1: and I started coming into more of this limelight, and

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Speaker 1: with this limelight online in the climbing community came hate.

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Speaker 1: And it was like this new level of hate that

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Speaker 1: I had never experienced because up until that point, for

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Speaker 1: the first I guess over a decade in my career,

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Speaker 1: I was like growing up in the sport and I

356
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Speaker 1: was like always collecting people's opinions of My mom, for instance,

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Speaker 1: was like such a dedicated support system and she dressed

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Speaker 1: nicely like I wasn't like some like heiress to any

359
00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:58,080
Speaker 1: sort of fortune at all, and I was paying a

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Speaker 1: lot of my own climbing trip myself. But my mom

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Speaker 1: was like people would make fun of her even and

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Speaker 1: call her Gucci mom and stuff like that, and she

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Speaker 1: was like, I didn't actually own a single piece of

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Speaker 1: Gucci for the rector. I think we were always kind

365
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Speaker 1: of judged as outsiders in that regard, which is kind

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Speaker 1: of ironic because climbing was my safe space away from

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Speaker 1: being an outsider in like middle school, high school. But

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Speaker 1: it was also this place that I never really did

369
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Speaker 1: fit in because I was this city kid who loved

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Speaker 1: this outdoor origin sport and I was trying to find

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Speaker 1: my place in climbing too. That yeah, when I started

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Speaker 1: succeeding at a higher level in climbing, I would see

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Speaker 1: like comments online like bet she doesn't even get her.

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Speaker 4: Period, ha ha ha, and like.

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Speaker 1: Just skeletor I bet I could climb that hard if

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Speaker 1: I was still light, And it was just totally negated

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Speaker 1: everything that I was dedicating my life two to like

378
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Speaker 1: six am before school hitting the gym and then being

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Speaker 1: at school and then leaving school and going straight to

380
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Speaker 1: the climbing gym for practice. So I was working really

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Speaker 1: hard and it was like a blow to the gut

382
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Speaker 1: to be just everything you put into this sport is

383
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Speaker 1: like related to what you weigh and then contrarily, as

384
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Speaker 1: I went through puberty and as my body kind of changed,

385
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:29,560
Speaker 1: I was then judged for being like not super real thin,

386
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Speaker 1: and then like even another pro climber May was like,

387
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Speaker 1: who had been at the front of calling me anarexic

388
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Speaker 1: was like the first lead the charge of making fun

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Speaker 1: of me being fat. And here's like, okay, maybe I

390
00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:48,119
Speaker 1: weighed like one hundred and fifteen pounds, not ninety five,

391
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Speaker 1: and I'm being targeted as.

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Speaker 4: Being overweight in my sport publicly online.

393
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Speaker 1: And so I think when you have disordered eating and

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Speaker 1: this happened to me when I was in my late

395
00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:03,680
Speaker 1: teens early twenties, it doesn't just go away. And right now,

396
00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:08,800
Speaker 1: like I'm really really passionate about nutrition and learning what's

397
00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:13,520
Speaker 1: the optimal status for me, and working with trainers and

398
00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:18,400
Speaker 1: something that's new to climbing ish is like more cross training.

399
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Speaker 1: And historically people have always just said to improve at climbing,

400
00:22:23,359 --> 00:22:25,320
Speaker 1: you just climb. And I was even at the gym

401
00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:28,359
Speaker 1: the other day and there was this younger girl who

402
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,880
Speaker 1: joined me and my friend who were doing a core workout,

403
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:34,040
Speaker 1: and she was like, are you guys sure that doing

404
00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:37,200
Speaker 1: this helps you improve climbing? And I was like, tell

405
00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:39,520
Speaker 1: me one sport where cross training.

406
00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:41,880
Speaker 4: Doesn't have an additive value. And so it's just.

407
00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:46,119
Speaker 1: Been interesting because that's been like at the foundation of

408
00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:49,520
Speaker 1: why I'm starting this company that's nutrition bar company called

409
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,040
Speaker 1: send Bars is because I've always made my own bars

410
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:56,600
Speaker 1: and been really into nutrition but also been let down

411
00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,480
Speaker 1: by like what's available for healthy on the go on

412
00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:03,040
Speaker 1: expedits and stuff like that. I want to learn and

413
00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:08,760
Speaker 1: grow in this arena because it's really been a journey

414
00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:12,919
Speaker 1: for me with my own like confidence in climbing and

415
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:16,840
Speaker 1: that pertains to like wait and what you eat and yeah,

416
00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:20,919
Speaker 1: being judged for wearing makeup, being judged for having I

417
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,879
Speaker 1: don't have style, for attempting style, you know, and like

418
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:29,480
Speaker 1: things like that, Like it's anything that I've done, I've

419
00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,480
Speaker 1: felt like I've been criticized.

420
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Speaker 4: And it's not by everyone.

421
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:37,959
Speaker 1: It's just like you hear if there's ninety nine percent

422
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:42,320
Speaker 1: of positivity fed back to you, you're going to hear

423
00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:45,359
Speaker 1: that one percent of negativity and that sticks, and it Like,

424
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:48,960
Speaker 1: I think it's a fallacy to think that you know,

425
00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:52,800
Speaker 1: words can't hurt and that you're too big to care,

426
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:58,240
Speaker 1: because I mean me growing and climbing and becoming more

427
00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:03,439
Speaker 1: quote unquote famous in this industry. I've been ripped apart

428
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 1: and I've had to grow some pretty callous skin around it.

429
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Speaker 2: When you, I would say, and you reference that it's

430
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:18,160
Speaker 2: kind of like a lifelong journey. But when you look

431
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:22,119
Speaker 2: back at the time when you really learned how to

432
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:26,359
Speaker 2: get over the hurdle of disordered eating, what would you

433
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:30,960
Speaker 2: credit was the thing or maybe the person that really

434
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,520
Speaker 2: helped you get over that hurdle.

435
00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:38,640
Speaker 1: I started my first year at Columbia and I had

436
00:24:38,760 --> 00:24:43,360
Speaker 1: come off the heels of climbing for a year without

437
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,400
Speaker 1: being in school. I deferred my acceptance for a year.

438
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:49,400
Speaker 1: I had won the World Championships that year and really

439
00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:53,160
Speaker 1: focused on some big like outdoor single pitch climbing achievements,

440
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 1: and then I went to this event that was an

441
00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:02,480
Speaker 1: invitational competition. I ruptured my a two polium my ring finger,

442
00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 1: which is like right here, and my entire palm just

443
00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:09,840
Speaker 1: like spasmed out and I couldn't close my hand. And

444
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 1: so for a normal non climber, it's just a finger injury,

445
00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:16,760
Speaker 1: but for a climber, it's kind of a really big,

446
00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 1: devastating moment that you have to take two to three

447
00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,080
Speaker 1: months off. That was in August, and I started at

448
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:26,760
Speaker 1: Columbia in September. I guess I missed my orientation week

449
00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:31,200
Speaker 1: because I was I was climbing. That event bled into

450
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:35,520
Speaker 1: orientation week. But then I remember in high school I

451
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:40,639
Speaker 1: had such an atypical experience at school. My high school

452
00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 1: boyfriend was another pro climber who was Norwegian, who, like

453
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:47,200
Speaker 1: I would just go off and climb with him every day.

454
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:49,880
Speaker 1: And so for college, I was pretty disengaged at high

455
00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:52,680
Speaker 1: school and all I wanted to do was climb and

456
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 1: get straight in so I could get through it and

457
00:25:55,440 --> 00:26:00,280
Speaker 1: satisfy my parents and just graduate and move on with life.

458
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 1: And so college I was like, I'm really excited to

459
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:06,360
Speaker 1: have a college experience and like to engage with what

460
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:09,199
Speaker 1: that might look like. Of course, it never was like

461
00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:13,280
Speaker 1: that typical because I through college I was traveling, like

462
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:16,440
Speaker 1: Thursday evenings, I would fly to like Europe or Asia

463
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 1: or wherever, and I would come back Monday night.

464
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:18,960
Speaker 4: But for the.

465
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 1: First semester at least, I had this finger injury, and

466
00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 1: I just I guess it was like exposure to normalcy.

467
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:35,000
Speaker 1: My entire community up until college was I mean, I

468
00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,800
Speaker 1: can't think of many female climbers that I was surrounded

469
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,280
Speaker 1: by and looked up to that didn't have eating disorders,

470
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:42,800
Speaker 1: which is wild to think about, and I hope it's

471
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,680
Speaker 1: changing everything. Like I lived with this woman in Austria

472
00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 1: and Innsbruck when we were competing on the World Cup

473
00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,919
Speaker 1: circuit and she weighed her oatmeal and weighed everything on

474
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:54,879
Speaker 1: a scale, and so I did too, And it's just

475
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,480
Speaker 1: like habitually, like that became the norm for me. And

476
00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:00,280
Speaker 1: when I was in college, like people were going to

477
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,560
Speaker 1: Magnolia Bakery and getting like banana bread pudding and I

478
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:03,840
Speaker 1: was like.

479
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:05,680
Speaker 4: What is that? This is godly.

480
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:10,920
Speaker 1: And I think just like letting my body be still,

481
00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 1: it adjusted and there was like a period of time

482
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:16,879
Speaker 1: where my body and hormones were all catching up to me,

483
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:18,680
Speaker 1: like I had a very delayed.

484
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 4: Puberty and stuff like that.

485
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 1: And so my body changed and then I had to

486
00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:25,760
Speaker 1: kind of relearn how to climb with my new body,

487
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:29,359
Speaker 1: and instead of pushing against it to revert to my

488
00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:33,480
Speaker 1: pre pubescent body, I had to accept cross training and

489
00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:36,439
Speaker 1: learning more about how to strengthen my body and be

490
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: like a woman who climbed rather than like a young.

491
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:41,639
Speaker 4: Girl who climbed.

492
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:48,760
Speaker 2: Taking a break from today's episode to give some love

493
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494
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495
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496
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497
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498
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499
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500
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514
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517
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518
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523
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:40,200
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524
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525
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529
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530
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:01,840
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531
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:04,719
Speaker 2: Thanks to the Whoop Journal feature, I also know what

532
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,520
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533
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534
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:15,760
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535
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:18,160
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536
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,920
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537
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540
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541
00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:39,360
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Speaker 2: and use the code Hurdle one five for fifteen percent

543
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Speaker 2: off any membership today. How do you navigate the negative

544
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:59,120
Speaker 2: voice inside your head? Because you mentioned before even how

545
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:03,120
Speaker 2: easy it is to let that one negative comment be

546
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:05,640
Speaker 2: the thing that jumps off the page in a sea

547
00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:09,760
Speaker 2: of hundreds and hundreds of positive sentiments. So for you

548
00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 2: and your inner voice, how have you learned to become

549
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 2: a little bit more of your own hype woman instead

550
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:20,680
Speaker 2: of letting that naysayer inside take over.

551
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, at the end of the day, I think there's

552
00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:27,960
Speaker 1: a couple things there the community that I surround myself.

553
00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:33,400
Speaker 1: Now I'm much much more particular about people that I

554
00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:37,560
Speaker 1: consider my friends, and not in a ruthless way, but

555
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:41,800
Speaker 1: I'm really affected by energies. And if I don't get

556
00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 1: a good positive energy from someone that feels supportive and

557
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,760
Speaker 1: collaborative and encouraging.

558
00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:51,240
Speaker 4: Then I'll consider them an acquaintance.

559
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:54,960
Speaker 1: But I'll definitely be very protective with my space. So

560
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:58,920
Speaker 1: my core, like my core community, has definitely shrunk to

561
00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:02,160
Speaker 1: the point that I feel like everyone who I consider

562
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:05,200
Speaker 1: a friend is like a very genuine got your back,

563
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 1: will share the common enemies, stand up for me, I'll stand.

564
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 4: Up for you, like loyalty is very important.

565
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:15,800
Speaker 1: But then on the performative side, like for me, really

566
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:19,200
Speaker 1: feeling confident about what I'm doing, like I'm putting my

567
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,640
Speaker 1: best foot forward, I'm putting my head down, I'm grinding.

568
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 1: I know that everything I do is my personal best

569
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 1: and what comes out of that is going to be.

570
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:29,960
Speaker 4: What I can put out.

571
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,120
Speaker 1: And when my dad was alive, he always said, like

572
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:37,120
Speaker 1: when he would drop me off at the airport if

573
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 1: I was going off on a climbing expedition or something,

574
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:42,080
Speaker 1: and he'd be like, have fun, be safe, and do

575
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 1: your best. And so that mantra has really like stuck

576
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:49,280
Speaker 1: with me and been my guiding light for how I

577
00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:52,440
Speaker 1: approach what I do in my every day but also

578
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 1: like when I go off on these dangerous expeditions, it's like,

579
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:57,880
Speaker 1: I guess, be safe could be number one, or I

580
00:32:57,880 --> 00:32:59,800
Speaker 1: could be safety thread, like whatever way you want to

581
00:32:59,800 --> 00:33:02,440
Speaker 1: look at it, But being safe and having fun is

582
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:05,240
Speaker 1: really important, and then doing your best because at the

583
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 1: end of the day, like the rock doesn't really care

584
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:11,600
Speaker 1: if you succeed on it or not, Like the mountains

585
00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 1: are so much bigger than us, and we can just

586
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:17,960
Speaker 1: show up and be as prepared as possible and mitigate

587
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:21,040
Speaker 1: our risks as much as possible so that we're in

588
00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 1: control of our safety to the extent that we can

589
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:25,600
Speaker 1: be and show up.

590
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:25,840
Speaker 4: You know.

591
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 2: I love that idea, the idea that, like the rock

592
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:31,720
Speaker 2: doesn't care how you show up, it's just that you

593
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:35,200
Speaker 2: show up at all. And I certainly share those sentiments

594
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 2: when it comes to the run. It's like you can

595
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 2: be having the worst day or the best day, but

596
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:41,680
Speaker 2: the run is always going to be there for you,

597
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 2: And the same goes for you in your sports.

598
00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:46,400
Speaker 3: So to hear it in that light is just it's

599
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:47,200
Speaker 3: really beautiful.

600
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 1: I love the fact that sports are so transcendent through

601
00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:57,800
Speaker 1: life and also what that sport is because there's such

602
00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:01,480
Speaker 1: a connective tissue there to your mentality as an athlete

603
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 1: and as just anyone who is really passionate about what

604
00:34:06,600 --> 00:34:09,440
Speaker 1: you do. But I don't know if like the negative

605
00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,920
Speaker 1: voice ever goes away, because I have good days and

606
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:17,319
Speaker 1: I have bad days. And on the bad days, if

607
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:19,600
Speaker 1: I have a busy schedule, I just try and like

608
00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:24,479
Speaker 1: maybe throw on some makeup and dress like I care

609
00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:28,440
Speaker 1: and not like hide it. But I think that the

610
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:32,480
Speaker 1: way that you show up, whether you're in a good

611
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:35,480
Speaker 1: mental space or not, can kind of help dictate how

612
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:39,040
Speaker 1: you handle it. And this last like two years, I

613
00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:42,680
Speaker 1: went through double hip reconstruction, and so I did have

614
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:46,760
Speaker 1: a lot of time with myself and reevaluating priorities and everything.

615
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:49,759
Speaker 1: I think that my mental game had to become a

616
00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:54,359
Speaker 1: lot stronger and more confident because I was stuck with

617
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 1: myself like most of the world. I mean through COVID

618
00:34:57,080 --> 00:35:00,160
Speaker 1: it was like its own thing too, but there were

619
00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:03,400
Speaker 1: basically six months where I couldn't do absolutely anything.

620
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:05,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, two things to double click on here. The first

621
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:07,680
Speaker 2: thing to double click on is I'm totally with you

622
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:10,200
Speaker 2: on sometimes you just need to put yourself together to

623
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:12,960
Speaker 2: have a day. Even putting yourself together to have a day,

624
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 2: is you walking like twelve feet into your office or

625
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:19,600
Speaker 2: your desk that's strategically placed in the corner. I definitely

626
00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:22,279
Speaker 2: had my fair share of days like that over the

627
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:23,240
Speaker 2: past two years.

628
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,200
Speaker 3: And then man, a double hip reconstruction.

629
00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:29,160
Speaker 2: So many people listening to this show have been sidelined

630
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:34,319
Speaker 2: with injury before themselves. Talk to us about how you

631
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:40,080
Speaker 2: mentally handled what was I'm sure a severely isolating experience.

632
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, Man, it was dark.

633
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:48,360
Speaker 1: Sometimes it was pretty dark, but I found light for

634
00:35:48,480 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: sure and purpose in a new way. I for the

635
00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:56,320
Speaker 1: like two to three years, probably three years, but mounting

636
00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:59,640
Speaker 1: up to the last two years before twenty twenty, i'd

637
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:04,120
Speaker 1: really bad hip, like chronic pain, and I didn't know

638
00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:07,040
Speaker 1: what was going on, and I saw like a whole

639
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:11,359
Speaker 1: array of physical therapists ranging from it being a tight

640
00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:15,880
Speaker 1: so as to it being in my head. And in

641
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:20,279
Speaker 1: February of twenty twenty, right before going on an expedition

642
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:23,799
Speaker 1: to this place in Mexico to go and climb this

643
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 1: three thousand foot first female ascent on Elgigonte, which is

644
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:33,399
Speaker 1: this gigantic monolith, I Finally I couldn't sleep at night.

645
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:37,319
Speaker 1: Like there's like two months where everything id just like compounded,

646
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:40,279
Speaker 1: and I was like my femurhead felt like it was

647
00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 1: like popping out of the socket. And so I got

648
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 1: an memor I found out I had hip displasion, and

649
00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 1: I was either faced with a hip replacement, which would

650
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:53,040
Speaker 1: be essentially career ending because you can't be a professional climber.

651
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:55,440
Speaker 1: You can climb, but you can't be a professional climber

652
00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:58,920
Speaker 1: with a hip replacement from a mobility side, but also

653
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:02,360
Speaker 1: from a safety side of the remoteness of my expeditions,

654
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:05,080
Speaker 1: and yeah, for obvious reasons. And then there was this

655
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:08,560
Speaker 1: double po surgery which could happen on both sides of

656
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 1: like essentially, the surgeon would go in, cut my pelvic

657
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 1: bone in four places, shape down the femur head, adjust

658
00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:23,040
Speaker 1: the pelvic bone over the new femerhead, the newly shaped

659
00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:27,320
Speaker 1: down the femerhead, sent it down with six six inch screws,

660
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,719
Speaker 1: and then I had to basically I couldn't even have

661
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 1: like a ninety degree angle of my hips for two

662
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 1: months and no weight bearing or anything, and then do

663
00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:40,600
Speaker 1: it all again on the other side. And so there

664
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:44,160
Speaker 1: was a total of five surgeries throughout this process, and

665
00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:49,279
Speaker 1: I think that for me, I had never taken off

666
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:53,359
Speaker 1: more than six weeks from climbing for an injury. Maybe

667
00:37:53,400 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 1: with my finger injury. It was actually one of the

668
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 1: worst injuries that I had had prior to that.

669
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:03,040
Speaker 4: And so I had to figure out what I was

670
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:03,560
Speaker 4: going to do.

671
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:08,200
Speaker 1: I had always had this passion for, as I mentioned earlier,

672
00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,359
Speaker 1: like making my own bars, and I had wanted to

673
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:14,160
Speaker 1: start this nutrition bar company, and so that was something

674
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 1: that I kind of embraced had on and was like,

675
00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:19,279
Speaker 1: if life has a way of working out for a

676
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,680
Speaker 1: reason and telling me something, now is the time to

677
00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:24,320
Speaker 1: do it. And so I started embarking on that journey.

678
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:28,720
Speaker 1: I started writing my book because I studied nonfiction creative

679
00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:32,600
Speaker 1: writing at Columbia and I'd always wanted to write a book,

680
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 1: but it never felt like the right inflection point. And

681
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:39,200
Speaker 1: I still, you know, wrestle with like I'm not done

682
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 1: with my career and this isn't like an autobiography, but

683
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:44,759
Speaker 1: it's time to have a coming of age memoir that

684
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 1: just kind of dives into where I'm at now. And

685
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 1: it felt like a good time to do that. And

686
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:52,400
Speaker 1: writing has always been an outlet for me just to

687
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:55,360
Speaker 1: process through my thoughts, and ninety nine percent of the

688
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:58,360
Speaker 1: writing that I do is like just in journals that

689
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:01,319
Speaker 1: will never be seen, and then really focusing in on

690
00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:04,600
Speaker 1: what I could control, like from the nutrition aspect to

691
00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:09,320
Speaker 1: the PT like I was, I mean, my PT exercises

692
00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 1: I would do like three to five times a day,

693
00:39:11,239 --> 00:39:14,680
Speaker 1: and I was just like very very committed to what

694
00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:19,320
Speaker 1: does my body need and going back to like wrestling

695
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 1: with disordered eating and my relationship with food. The injury

696
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:27,000
Speaker 1: actually set me up for success in that way because

697
00:39:27,040 --> 00:39:32,480
Speaker 1: I started seeing my body as this incredibly resourceful, like

698
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:38,000
Speaker 1: remarkable thing that I could like literally knit myself back together,

699
00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:43,160
Speaker 1: having like had my abs taken out twice, no three times,

700
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:46,399
Speaker 1: they're cut out because in three different surgeries, and then

701
00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,799
Speaker 1: just like seeing that my body could come back and

702
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,080
Speaker 1: like just be normal. Like my expectation of my body

703
00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:56,640
Speaker 1: was just to walk again. And it was, like you

704
00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:00,319
Speaker 1: kind of similar to our goal setting discussion at the

705
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:02,600
Speaker 1: top of this talk, like some days it was just

706
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:05,400
Speaker 1: like being able to put on a stock, which like

707
00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 1: I couldn't do for a long time, Like even my

708
00:40:07,719 --> 00:40:09,839
Speaker 1: fiance had to like carry me to the bathroom it's

709
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:11,759
Speaker 1: one way to get really close to someone go through

710
00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:14,960
Speaker 1: massive injury, and I think focusing on what you can control.

711
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:17,480
Speaker 1: It's kind of like an expedition. Like when you're on

712
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:21,320
Speaker 1: an expedition, there are so many variables that you can't

713
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:24,759
Speaker 1: control and so much risk that you need to mitigate

714
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: over what's rational fear, what's irrational fear? What are our

715
00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:32,680
Speaker 1: conditions we're facing, How can we handle this, how do

716
00:40:32,719 --> 00:40:35,040
Speaker 1: we best prepare our packs so that we're set up

717
00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:38,799
Speaker 1: for success? And then all the training and kind of

718
00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:41,680
Speaker 1: like under the hood work that goes in prior and

719
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:45,800
Speaker 1: so I started to just kind of process this injury

720
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:46,799
Speaker 1: as a part of that.

721
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 4: It was like, this is going to be my next climb.

722
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:50,799
Speaker 4: It's going to be like.

723
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:56,359
Speaker 1: Just grueling and uncomfortable and all these things, but at

724
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:59,240
Speaker 1: the end of the day, I have to make the summit.

725
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,839
Speaker 1: And that that was different because obviously, like with an expedition,

726
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:04,400
Speaker 1: you can't make the summit.

727
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:06,799
Speaker 4: You can return, but through a recovery, like.

728
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:09,319
Speaker 1: You have a one track mind, Like you're like, I'm

729
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:12,000
Speaker 1: getting through this, But yeah, it got dark in the

730
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:14,759
Speaker 1: way that physical exercise is the way that I deal

731
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:20,239
Speaker 1: with with like my mental anxiety and just process through

732
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:24,480
Speaker 1: thoughts and emotions and feeling pent up like in a

733
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:29,320
Speaker 1: cage for so long, basically nine months. It was pretty

734
00:41:29,320 --> 00:41:32,839
Speaker 1: mentally challenging, and it took a toll on my like

735
00:41:33,040 --> 00:41:36,479
Speaker 1: fortitude as just like seeing life as this optimistic thing.

736
00:41:36,520 --> 00:41:39,239
Speaker 1: And some days I woke up and I was like

737
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:42,360
Speaker 1: I don't even see the point, Like I can't wait

738
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 1: for the day to be done, And so dealing with

739
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:47,920
Speaker 1: those thoughts and stuff like working with therapists and a

740
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:48,960
Speaker 1: sports psychologist.

741
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 4: I definitely leaned on my network.

742
00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 1: For instance, like Red Bull really stepped up in a

743
00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:57,440
Speaker 1: really big way for me through this injury because the

744
00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:01,440
Speaker 1: company provided me with nutritionness and a sports psychologist and

745
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:05,920
Speaker 1: all these kind of like tools for me to work

746
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:09,239
Speaker 1: with that could I could kind of like grow as

747
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:10,960
Speaker 1: a human through the process.

748
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:13,919
Speaker 2: What a moment to take a step back and look

749
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:16,680
Speaker 2: at the network of people around you who want you

750
00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:20,120
Speaker 2: to succeed and be like, Wow, how lucky am I

751
00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:24,800
Speaker 2: that I have these people, these resources, this stuff. Although,

752
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:28,080
Speaker 2: like you're saying, in the darkness, sometimes it's really really

753
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:30,440
Speaker 2: difficult to take that perspective.

754
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:35,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was redefining my identity for twenty three years

755
00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:38,400
Speaker 1: of my life, I had been a climber and that's

756
00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:41,840
Speaker 1: what my profession has been and still is. And to

757
00:42:41,960 --> 00:42:45,080
Speaker 1: be like, well, I'm I can't even be a normal human.

758
00:42:45,160 --> 00:42:49,640
Speaker 1: I can't even walk, and understanding that that's just like

759
00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:53,480
Speaker 1: a current season and not your forever. But I mean

760
00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:57,360
Speaker 1: now I just I take everything with so much more gratitude.

761
00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 1: We forget it, Like I remember the days when I

762
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:05,920
Speaker 1: was like I would do anything to walk, and now

763
00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:08,640
Speaker 1: you know, I walk around and like have a bad

764
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:10,560
Speaker 1: day at the gym and I'm like, damn it, I suck,

765
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:14,239
Speaker 1: and then remembering like, no, I'm so grateful to be

766
00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:16,880
Speaker 1: here and to be like able to be challenging my

767
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:22,040
Speaker 1: body again and to be like doing like sports in general.

768
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:24,840
Speaker 1: That that's when I look at my body and think like,

769
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:26,800
Speaker 1: how could I have ever starved?

770
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:29,400
Speaker 4: You like you have like been there for me.

771
00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 1: You you built yourself back up like all these things

772
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:35,840
Speaker 1: so that I just appreciate myself better.

773
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I want to be conscious of your time.

774
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:40,120
Speaker 2: So I'm going to start to wind us down here.

775
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:42,960
Speaker 2: Earlier I asked you what you see when you look

776
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:45,440
Speaker 2: in the mirror, and we didn't quite get to that answer.

777
00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:47,800
Speaker 3: So talk to us, talk to me about Sasha.

778
00:43:47,840 --> 00:43:50,239
Speaker 2: When you look in the mirror, what is it that

779
00:43:50,280 --> 00:43:51,879
Speaker 2: you see staring back at you?

780
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:54,360
Speaker 4: I know I deflected you.

781
00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:55,000
Speaker 3: I heard.

782
00:43:56,560 --> 00:43:59,760
Speaker 1: I see someone who works really, really hard and who's

783
00:44:00,160 --> 00:44:04,960
Speaker 1: is committed to finding out what's possible. I guess I

784
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,520
Speaker 1: look in the mirror and I'm like, how did we

785
00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:12,760
Speaker 1: get here? Not that I'm like at some like pinnacle

786
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:15,279
Speaker 1: of success or anything. I'm just like, how did we

787
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:18,160
Speaker 1: get to this point that you get to do everything

788
00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:22,120
Speaker 1: that you love every single day and you're you're paid

789
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:25,239
Speaker 1: to do this passion. And that's where I'm just like,

790
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:29,560
Speaker 1: let's keep going, Like, let's keep pushing and working hard

791
00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:31,719
Speaker 1: and showing up and finding out.

792
00:44:31,880 --> 00:44:34,600
Speaker 2: And that's like such a good takeaway though, is that

793
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:36,560
Speaker 2: you don't like work hard and get to this point

794
00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:38,600
Speaker 2: where you've accomplished some of your goals and you're like.

795
00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:39,719
Speaker 3: Okay, cool, like I did it.

796
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,760
Speaker 2: We're good now. That is really when the work really begins.

797
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:43,840
Speaker 2: Wouldn't you agree.

798
00:44:45,120 --> 00:44:45,560
Speaker 4: Totally?

799
00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:49,080
Speaker 1: I Mean, it's like the point at what you can

800
00:44:49,160 --> 00:44:53,120
Speaker 1: recognize how much you want to work and work hard.

801
00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:57,719
Speaker 1: I think it's like it's a special realization because you

802
00:44:57,800 --> 00:44:59,520
Speaker 1: start appreciating the grind.

803
00:44:59,760 --> 00:45:02,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, for sure, and not to like, you know,

804
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:05,719
Speaker 2: glorify hustle culture, but more so just to be like,

805
00:45:05,960 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 2: if you're willing to put in the work, that won't

806
00:45:08,120 --> 00:45:12,000
Speaker 2: guarantee without a doubt that you will succeed. But that's

807
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:14,440
Speaker 2: a lot closer to getting to success than the person

808
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 2: that's just sitting on the couch wondering what if.

809
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:20,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I definitely think that the hustle is

810
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:26,400
Speaker 1: a big thing, like for my confidence and everything around,

811
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:30,920
Speaker 1: like whether I feel this impostor syndrome of what I

812
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:35,880
Speaker 1: think a lot of particularly woman go through, because there's

813
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:39,200
Speaker 1: no end of people saying questioning whether you deserve what

814
00:45:39,239 --> 00:45:42,400
Speaker 1: you have. If you can stand on the legs of

815
00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 1: your hustle and know that you really tried hard, then

816
00:45:46,280 --> 00:45:50,000
Speaker 1: there's kind of like I always kind of wrestle with

817
00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:54,040
Speaker 1: this idea of like finding balance because I don't necessarily

818
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:56,680
Speaker 1: know if like I find balance in my life. I

819
00:45:56,680 --> 00:46:02,160
Speaker 1: think I like manage the chaos and and I balance

820
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:05,160
Speaker 1: my priorities, and I don't know if I have like

821
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:08,839
Speaker 1: a balanced lifestyle, but I love it, like I love

822
00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:13,239
Speaker 1: being busy and being in the thick of it, and

823
00:46:13,600 --> 00:46:17,240
Speaker 1: I do definitely value like taking care of your mental

824
00:46:17,280 --> 00:46:21,399
Speaker 1: health and taking time to rest, more so than ever

825
00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:24,840
Speaker 1: after going through this last two years. But I think

826
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:28,120
Speaker 1: that it has to be coupled with the hustle, and

827
00:46:28,160 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 1: it has to be coupled with like just going full on,

828
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:35,040
Speaker 1: like trying and going into the unknown and challenging your

829
00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:35,880
Speaker 1: comfort zones.

830
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:38,279
Speaker 4: So all of that, it's just kind of all has

831
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:38,799
Speaker 4: to be there.

832
00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:43,319
Speaker 2: If you reflect quickly thinking about your current state and

833
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:46,280
Speaker 2: the hustle and perhaps at times that lack of balance,

834
00:46:46,360 --> 00:46:48,840
Speaker 2: what could be one thing that you could add to

835
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:51,759
Speaker 2: your routine that you're not doing just yet that may

836
00:46:51,840 --> 00:46:55,720
Speaker 2: help you get to a closer definition of balance.

837
00:46:56,239 --> 00:47:01,080
Speaker 1: I meditated a lot through my recovery process, and it

838
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:04,600
Speaker 1: was almost like I dropped that off when I was

839
00:47:04,640 --> 00:47:08,480
Speaker 1: healthy again because my training schedule was back and I

840
00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:11,799
Speaker 1: started traveling again and all this stuff. So meditation and

841
00:47:11,880 --> 00:47:15,120
Speaker 1: visualization has definitely been like a very helpful tool for

842
00:47:15,160 --> 00:47:18,040
Speaker 1: me to add to my toolkit, and I shouldn't abandon it.

843
00:47:18,120 --> 00:47:19,120
Speaker 4: When the going's good.

844
00:47:19,520 --> 00:47:23,560
Speaker 1: And I'm a big bath person, I do epps and

845
00:47:23,640 --> 00:47:26,240
Speaker 1: salts and baking powder.

846
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:27,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, baking powder.

847
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 1: I always mix the two up, but one of them

848
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:31,960
Speaker 1: activates the EPs and salts, baking powder. I'm all about that,

849
00:47:32,040 --> 00:47:38,839
Speaker 1: So making more time for baths would be a very recharging.

850
00:47:38,200 --> 00:47:39,880
Speaker 4: Aspect that I could add back it.

851
00:47:39,960 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 3: We love that.

852
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:42,759
Speaker 2: It's like you abandon the run warm up when your

853
00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:46,040
Speaker 2: injuries go away. So I hear that, Okay, Sasha, final

854
00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:49,880
Speaker 2: question right now, you have an opportunity to offer yourself

855
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:53,680
Speaker 2: a piece of advice looking back during that nine month

856
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 2: period when you could not do the thing that you love,

857
00:47:57,080 --> 00:47:59,880
Speaker 2: the longest time away from your sports since you started

858
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:03,280
Speaker 2: six years old. What piece of advice do you offer

859
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:06,440
Speaker 2: yourself going through that hurdle moment now looking back on it.

860
00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:08,400
Speaker 4: Be kind to yourself.

861
00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:12,640
Speaker 1: I think that when I was going through just being

862
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:17,160
Speaker 1: totally flattened, it was hard for me to really appreciate

863
00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:21,440
Speaker 1: the motions of what was what was just necessary, and

864
00:48:22,280 --> 00:48:26,840
Speaker 1: I would be pretty critical of my body and feel useless.

865
00:48:27,239 --> 00:48:29,920
Speaker 1: And now looking back, it was actually my body was

866
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:33,680
Speaker 1: working really, really hard and I could have appreciated it more.

867
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:37,040
Speaker 1: And I think that like the way that we talk

868
00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:40,880
Speaker 1: to ourselves. Yeah, I've like seen the little like quotes

869
00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:43,400
Speaker 1: and stuff on Instagram. I like, talk to your body

870
00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:45,600
Speaker 1: like you would talk to your best friend. That's really

871
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:47,560
Speaker 1: hard for me. It's really hard for me to do that,

872
00:48:47,719 --> 00:48:49,640
Speaker 1: but it's something that's always in the back of my

873
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 1: mind that's like I need to do a better job

874
00:48:52,680 --> 00:48:55,640
Speaker 1: at and I would definitely want to have been more

875
00:48:55,719 --> 00:48:59,320
Speaker 1: kind to my body when it was like literally broken

876
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:01,320
Speaker 1: up into two halves.

877
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:04,239
Speaker 3: Into two halves. Well, I'm so grateful for your perspective.

878
00:49:04,560 --> 00:49:06,719
Speaker 2: There's so many more things that I feel like you

879
00:49:06,760 --> 00:49:08,279
Speaker 2: and I could talk about, and maybe we'll have to

880
00:49:08,280 --> 00:49:09,880
Speaker 2: do a part two of this at some point, But

881
00:49:10,040 --> 00:49:13,040
Speaker 2: I appreciate you, Sasha. Let the hurdlers know how they

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00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:14,960
Speaker 2: can follow along with you, how they can keep up

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00:49:14,960 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 2: with you.

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00:49:15,320 --> 00:49:16,400
Speaker 3: Give us the details.

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00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:19,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, I really appreciate you having me here,

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00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:22,040
Speaker 1: and likewise, I have so many questions for you. You're

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00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:26,480
Speaker 1: such an inspirational woman. My Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, it's all

888
00:49:26,520 --> 00:49:29,120
Speaker 1: the same. It's just at sashaty Jolian, so you can

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00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:29,680
Speaker 1: find me there.

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00:49:29,760 --> 00:49:32,440
Speaker 2: I'm over at Emily a Body and at Hurdle Podcast

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00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:34,080
Speaker 2: Another Hurdle Conquered.

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Speaker 3: Catch you guys next time.