WEBVTT - Marilyn Monroe: From Dullsville To Beverly Hills 0:00:01.920 --> 0:00:06.120 Hello the Internet, and welcome to this spinoff episode of 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:13.200 The Daily Zeitgeist called Gaconograph Iconograph. Instead of looking at 0:00:13.200 --> 0:00:16.239 the zeitgeist through current events, we're looking at it through 0:00:16.239 --> 0:00:19.720 the lens of powerful pop cultural hork cruxes that are 0:00:19.720 --> 0:00:24.480 our icons, pork Brooks. We use these characters to create meaning, 0:00:24.600 --> 0:00:28.280 to build identity, to know what our grandfathers were jacking 0:00:28.320 --> 0:00:32.040 off to grandpa, to teach us that when standing on 0:00:32.080 --> 0:00:34.599 a subway, great, you should just wear a sensible pair 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:38.519 of slacks, much less problems. Uh. And most importantly, we 0:00:38.640 --> 0:00:42.319 learn how to cure Frank Sinatra's erectile dysfunction. That's right, 0:00:42.400 --> 0:00:47.400 today we're talking Marilyn Monroe, Nay, Norma Jean. That's the 0:00:47.440 --> 0:00:49.400 first big one. Do you know our name wasn't even 0:00:49.440 --> 0:00:50.720 actually Marilyn Monroe. 0:00:50.800 --> 0:00:51.640 Dude. 0:00:52.080 --> 0:00:54.920 I'm thrilled to be joined as always by my co host, 0:00:55.000 --> 0:00:56.480 mister Miles Bray. 0:00:59.000 --> 0:00:59.480 How are you? 0:00:59.720 --> 0:01:04.440 Hey hey hey hey, hey, hey hey hey Jean. 0:01:04.560 --> 0:01:06.399 That's one that's like, I think the only bit of 0:01:06.520 --> 0:01:11.600 trueba normal Jane is that about her. I think that 0:01:11.680 --> 0:01:14.880 was the first thing that was my first introduction. My 0:01:15.200 --> 0:01:18.560 fucking name was dang. There was something like HBO movie 0:01:18.560 --> 0:01:21.240 where it was like something in like Norma Jean or something, 0:01:21.440 --> 0:01:24.280 and I was just like, oh, yep, yep, yep, that's 0:01:24.360 --> 0:01:27.560 and that's the depth of my knowledge of Marilyn Monroe. 0:01:27.600 --> 0:01:30.160 That and she's buried at Hollywood Forever Cemetery. 0:01:30.240 --> 0:01:36.720 I think she's buried in the Westwood Cemetery, West Veteran. Yeah, dammit, Miles. 0:01:36.800 --> 0:01:39.760 And it was drugs and we're we're. 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:42.840 Going to talk about it. Oh in our third seat. 0:01:43.360 --> 0:01:45.120 A t d Z Hall of Famer, one of the 0:01:45.200 --> 0:01:47.960 very faces on Mount Zeitmore, a brilliant stand up comedian. 0:01:48.080 --> 0:01:52.480 You've seen on MTV, Comedy Central, NBC, True TV, h 0:01:52.680 --> 0:01:54.720 You've heard her on Bob's Burgers. You can see her 0:01:54.800 --> 0:01:57.000 in her hilarious special Life from the Big Dog, and 0:01:57.080 --> 0:01:59.640 on her podcast spased out with Blair Saki because it 0:01:59.680 --> 0:02:08.079 is Blair Sockerlair. 0:02:05.440 --> 0:02:07.520 What's up? Iconographer's Gang? 0:02:08.120 --> 0:02:08.639 What's up? 0:02:08.760 --> 0:02:10.239 Miles and Jack Gang? 0:02:12.320 --> 0:02:13.720 Hello, Blair Sockey. 0:02:14.400 --> 0:02:16.640 I'm so thrilled to be here. You know what I 0:02:16.840 --> 0:02:22.119 just remembered actually that I did read a gigantic Marilyn 0:02:22.360 --> 0:02:24.959 Monroe biography, like years and years and years ago. 0:02:25.120 --> 0:02:28.160 I had a feeling I had a feeling you had. 0:02:28.480 --> 0:02:30.880 Because i'd psychically. 0:02:30.880 --> 0:02:36.520 We're all the collective shared consciousness on the icon scale 0:02:36.520 --> 0:02:40.080 that we use on this show. I feel like Marilyn 0:02:40.120 --> 0:02:44.960 Monroe is at the tippy top. Einstein's up there, but. 0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:51.600 Tupac like where their aura just keeps going for years 0:02:51.600 --> 0:02:53.840 and years and years and years and years after their death. 0:02:54.000 --> 0:02:56.840 But also just like the visual like this, once you 0:02:56.880 --> 0:02:59.720 see it, it's like it's only one person. Some people 0:02:59.760 --> 0:03:04.160 are so unwell that they're like, that's me now professionally. 0:03:03.720 --> 0:03:06.040 Right, Yeah, there are We talked about how. 0:03:06.800 --> 0:03:08.960 There's Elvis impersonators say it to people. 0:03:09.200 --> 0:03:13.880 Maryland. Impersonators are a thing. I just the generic T 0:03:14.000 --> 0:03:17.760 shirt store test you walk down a boardwalk today for 0:03:18.280 --> 0:03:21.920 our office. One of the shittiest parts of LA the 0:03:22.000 --> 0:03:24.079 nineteen eighties Times Square of La Not. 0:03:24.080 --> 0:03:26.840 To don't know it was recently ranked as like one 0:03:26.919 --> 0:03:32.359 of the worst tourist spots, like the in America purely. 0:03:33.560 --> 0:03:38.720 He officially used German tourists walking around being. 0:03:38.600 --> 0:03:40.240 Like, what's so many bummed out? 0:03:40.560 --> 0:03:42.440 But I'll tell you what you will find. You might 0:03:42.480 --> 0:03:44.119 not find what you were looking for, but you will 0:03:44.120 --> 0:03:47.320 find many T shirt stores with pictures of Marylyn Monroe 0:03:47.400 --> 0:03:51.800 on them and cardboard cutouts of Marylyn Monroe. She pas 0:03:51.880 --> 0:03:55.640 the college dorm room wall like first apartment wall test 0:03:55.840 --> 0:03:59.960 where just like you know, posters photos. The image of 0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:02.160 her skirt being blown up by the subway grade is 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:04.880 one of the most famous moments in film history, though 0:04:05.320 --> 0:04:10.080 it wasn't in the movie. That was a publicity stunt. 0:04:10.760 --> 0:04:13.720 They reshot it on. The thing that we've all seen 0:04:13.960 --> 0:04:16.880 was from a publicity shoot, and the reshoot that was 0:04:16.920 --> 0:04:19.599 in the movie is not the same. Also, I'd say 0:04:19.600 --> 0:04:23.040 one of the most misunderstood figures that we've covered so far, 0:04:23.520 --> 0:04:26.200 Like that song, which was the first thing I knew about. 0:04:26.279 --> 0:04:30.440 Goodbye norm Jean talks about her like as kind of 0:04:30.600 --> 0:04:33.960 this like helpless victim, Like it talks about how Hollywood 0:04:34.000 --> 0:04:37.919 made her change her name and like Hollywood created a superstar. 0:04:38.080 --> 0:04:43.040 She did that shit. Man, She wanted to be a star, 0:04:43.600 --> 0:04:46.800 and she was like really smart and really good at it. 0:04:46.839 --> 0:04:49.159 She had to do twice as much to get half 0:04:49.200 --> 0:04:51.760 as far as the men of her era, and she 0:04:51.920 --> 0:04:55.600 still became, like I thought she was like famous and 0:04:55.640 --> 0:04:58.039 then died and became like even more famous. She was 0:04:58.160 --> 0:05:00.760 the most famous person on the planet, and she was alive, 0:05:01.000 --> 0:05:03.560 she was a wild I feel. 0:05:03.320 --> 0:05:08.960 Like she also started the whole thing where she really 0:05:09.400 --> 0:05:13.279 like pretended to be a certain way, you know, this 0:05:13.520 --> 0:05:17.119 soft like sex kitten, but really like the Paris Hilton 0:05:17.200 --> 0:05:22.040 thing where it's like people had no idea how calculated 0:05:22.080 --> 0:05:23.320 and intentional she was. 0:05:23.760 --> 0:05:25.000 Do you have access to my notes? 0:05:25.440 --> 0:05:28.360 Do you shoulder? 0:05:28.440 --> 0:05:30.880 Here? Is the same biography though, even though mine was 0:05:30.920 --> 0:05:35.960 many years ago. YEA fascinated because there's word, there's word 0:05:36.200 --> 0:05:39.280 of Russell's whispers on the Internet that they think that 0:05:39.680 --> 0:05:43.960 she might have also been a fellow autistic baddie and 0:05:44.080 --> 0:05:46.839 so considering it through that lens. 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:51.040 Okay, But in terms of her films, I think that's 0:05:51.080 --> 0:05:53.080 a very important point that you just brought up, that 0:05:53.360 --> 0:05:57.119 her she like played the character from her films also 0:05:57.360 --> 0:06:00.880 in reality and like all of she had like movie 0:06:00.920 --> 0:06:05.159 lines ready to go for her real life, like it 0:06:05.240 --> 0:06:09.960 was just like she had she had crackling comedic dialogue 0:06:10.080 --> 0:06:13.440 in like press conferences. But just in terms of like 0:06:13.520 --> 0:06:17.080 her films, they grossed two hundred million dollars by the 0:06:17.120 --> 0:06:19.640 time of her death. That's the equivalent of two billion 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:22.560 dollars today twenty four in. 0:06:22.560 --> 0:06:25.279 Back then money too. Yeah, oh my god. 0:06:25.520 --> 0:06:30.479 Okay, and then her death is mysterious, like it's not 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:34.080 we we did Elvis last week player, And like Elvis's death, 0:06:34.720 --> 0:06:38.039 he is fairly straightforward, like he was just doing so 0:06:38.200 --> 0:06:41.640 many drugs and died from doing so so many drugs. 0:06:41.800 --> 0:06:44.800 But with and And, people were just like, he's not 0:06:44.839 --> 0:06:47.120 really dead because they just needed that to be true. 0:06:47.520 --> 0:06:51.040 With Marilyn Monroe, like there is some very real, shady 0:06:51.120 --> 0:06:53.960 shit that happened surrounding her death. So we're gonna we're 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:56.520 gonna spend more of this episode talking about her death 0:06:56.560 --> 0:06:58.120 than maybe with past icons. 0:06:58.320 --> 0:07:00.719 I wondered if I was gonna bring be the one 0:07:00.760 --> 0:07:02.200 to bring up that freaky ship. 0:07:02.720 --> 0:07:06.440 No, there's a yeah. I mean I ultimately I don't 0:07:06.640 --> 0:07:11.120 think that she was killed by Frank Sinatra, JFK, RFK 0:07:11.320 --> 0:07:14.040 and the CIA all at the same time. But uh, 0:07:14.680 --> 0:07:17.880 there there's just some there's some weird ship that happened. 0:07:17.960 --> 0:07:21.800 There's some weird shit went down, all right, But should 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:25.280 we get into just the bio and yeah, you know when. 0:07:25.280 --> 0:07:29.800 Let me know, oh good that that part is from 0:07:29.840 --> 0:07:32.000 Candle in the Wind. Is that what you're talking about? 0:07:32.160 --> 0:07:35.520 Yeah? Yeah, oh yeah, Like. 0:07:37.800 --> 0:07:38.480 The whole time I was. 0:07:38.480 --> 0:07:40.320 Like, is there a song called Goodbye Normal Jean? 0:07:40.400 --> 0:07:41.560 Or isn't that the big part of that. 0:07:41.640 --> 0:07:45.480 At the beginning, that's the first line of wind Yeah, yeah, yeah, which. 0:07:45.280 --> 0:07:48.840 Is about her every mother's favorite song from nineteen ninety seven. 0:07:49.120 --> 0:07:51.280 He should have just kept making songs like because he 0:07:51.280 --> 0:07:53.320 did it for Princess Die. He should just be that 0:07:53.440 --> 0:07:55.520 every time someone died. Oh, he could make a lot 0:07:55.600 --> 0:07:56.920 of mone. I'm just saying he can make a lot 0:07:56.960 --> 0:07:57.360 of money. 0:07:57.640 --> 0:08:01.119 He could have done a Betty White one. Yeah. 0:08:01.160 --> 0:08:03.800 I also just saw Goodbye Golden Girls. 0:08:04.440 --> 0:08:07.000 You know the people like all her husbands, like they 0:08:07.120 --> 0:08:11.840 still loved her so much, like after their breakups, like 0:08:11.920 --> 0:08:15.360 Joe DiMaggio sent her flowers every week. 0:08:16.760 --> 0:08:21.760 Obsessed. Oh my god, you're obsessed with me. He was 0:08:22.560 --> 0:08:26.440 super obsessed, but also a complete fucking monster when they 0:08:26.480 --> 0:08:29.280 were married. But we're going to get to all of that. 0:08:30.360 --> 0:08:33.800 We're just so. She was born Norma Jean Mortenson on 0:08:33.880 --> 0:08:36.360 June first, nineteen twenty six, and the charity ward of 0:08:36.400 --> 0:08:40.200 Los Angeles General Hospital. She was born very poor. Her 0:08:40.240 --> 0:08:45.440 mother was diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic, and Norma Jean 0:08:45.720 --> 0:08:50.199 wound up in various foster homes and orphanages her mom's diagnosis. 0:08:50.280 --> 0:08:53.240 I just want to like this gave her, Like her 0:08:53.240 --> 0:08:57.520 mom always being institutionalized, gave Marilyn a lifelong fear of 0:08:57.600 --> 0:09:00.400 mental words, and like she would never lock her door, 0:09:00.480 --> 0:09:03.720 which is gonna come into play in her death, but 0:09:04.160 --> 0:09:08.120 probably understandable given the state of psychiatric care at the time. 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:10.959 And I just want to give a quick anecdote from 0:09:10.960 --> 0:09:13.360 her mom's life that I think sets the stage for 0:09:13.600 --> 0:09:17.720 the world of psychiatry, because that's a big part of 0:09:17.760 --> 0:09:19.840 her story too, because you know, a lot of the 0:09:19.840 --> 0:09:23.120 biographies are speculating about like what kind of mental illness 0:09:23.160 --> 0:09:26.160 she had, and it's tough to tell because it was 0:09:26.200 --> 0:09:30.080 a time when like women were not trusted at all, 0:09:30.360 --> 0:09:34.160 and like just them having something to say or a 0:09:34.200 --> 0:09:38.280 complaint was pathologized. This is just a wild anecdote from 0:09:38.320 --> 0:09:40.560 her mom's life. So this is in the Donald Spotto 0:09:40.640 --> 0:09:44.280 biography Male in Mom Roe. The biography tells the story 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:48.600 about how her mom learned that her most recent husband 0:09:48.679 --> 0:09:51.920 had been killed in a motorcycle accident in Ohio, and 0:09:52.600 --> 0:09:55.760 it turns out that wasn't true. It was just a 0:09:55.840 --> 0:09:58.760 guy with the same name with like a similar background, 0:09:58.800 --> 0:10:00.640 and her husband was still a lot than just being 0:10:00.640 --> 0:10:03.680 a typical like shit ass absentee husband from the mid 0:10:03.679 --> 0:10:08.000 twentieth century. Identity was like a real loose thing back 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:11.600 then where they were like Marilyn Momroe Norman Gy like 0:10:11.640 --> 0:10:15.800 had different names on her birth certificate, on her baptismal certificate, 0:10:15.960 --> 0:10:18.760 like your name was what you told them at the 0:10:18.880 --> 0:10:21.760 DMV and they're like whatever you want to call yourself late, right, 0:10:22.600 --> 0:10:25.200 But so by the time her mom's real husband shows 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:28.960 up from you know, being a shit ass Gladys, Marilyn's 0:10:28.960 --> 0:10:33.640 mom is institutionalized and she gets a call from her 0:10:33.640 --> 0:10:36.840 dead husband, which for someone who's been taught not to 0:10:36.880 --> 0:10:40.200 trust her own mental health, like, she freaked the FuG out. 0:10:40.679 --> 0:10:43.240 She like, yeah, she tried to like call him back, 0:10:43.720 --> 0:10:47.400 and the people in the institution are like, she's trying 0:10:47.440 --> 0:10:50.800 to call her dead husband. The dame's baby boys get 0:10:50.840 --> 0:10:54.880 the butterfly nets, and because she freaks out about that, 0:10:54.920 --> 0:10:58.560 they send her to a high security facility and like 0:10:58.600 --> 0:11:02.520 people only really know about this, like mind fuck of 0:11:02.559 --> 0:11:05.480 a thing that happened, because her daughter then goes on 0:11:05.520 --> 0:11:07.920 to become the most famous person in the world, like 0:11:08.000 --> 0:11:10.800 otherwise it's just a thing that happened to people at 0:11:10.840 --> 0:11:14.880 that time was just people diagnosed you and then stop 0:11:15.200 --> 0:11:18.120 believing anything that you had to say. 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:19.880 Yeah, once that labels on there, right. 0:11:20.280 --> 0:11:24.560 Especially the women, I mean like oh yeah, it's kind 0:11:24.559 --> 0:11:28.880 of analogous to I mean like the Witch's time. Like 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:31.319 if one person just said you're a witch, like all 0:11:31.320 --> 0:11:33.440 this sudden, you're a witch, and if you were like 0:11:33.800 --> 0:11:36.319 if they're like, oh, she's she has hysteria, she has 0:11:36.360 --> 0:11:39.640 the vapors, then they're like your toast. 0:11:39.640 --> 0:11:43.880 Right, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, this is the time of 0:11:44.000 --> 0:11:48.200 lobotomies where they're like, she's difficult and we're gonna deal 0:11:48.200 --> 0:11:48.480 with that. 0:11:48.800 --> 0:11:49.040 Yeah. 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:54.280 For instance, right, so you know, her mom is in 0:11:54.360 --> 0:11:56.319 and out of the picture. She goes from foster family 0:11:56.360 --> 0:12:00.960 to foster family. Most biographers agree she's a toed at 0:12:01.040 --> 0:12:05.319 age twelve and just has it. Has a really rough upbringing, 0:12:05.720 --> 0:12:09.240 like she doesn't really have a home ever, and to 0:12:09.280 --> 0:12:12.800 the point that like one of her maternal figures who 0:12:13.320 --> 0:12:16.000 like took her to movies and like really helped delay. 0:12:16.000 --> 0:12:20.080 The foundation for this also is like I found this 0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:22.720 guy that I really like in West Virginia, So you're 0:12:22.760 --> 0:12:28.319 going to marry our neighbor James Doherty, who to her 0:12:28.440 --> 0:12:32.200 was just mister Doherty. And she is sixteen years old 0:12:32.440 --> 0:12:35.319 when they marry her off. She's forced to drop out 0:12:35.320 --> 0:12:36.360 of high school. 0:12:36.160 --> 0:12:38.240 To do you imagine how scary that would be. 0:12:38.559 --> 0:12:39.040 Yeah. 0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:43.120 Wait, so this Carol One maternal figure she had was 0:12:43.160 --> 0:12:45.000 just like, you're marrying mister Doherty. 0:12:45.120 --> 0:12:48.679 You're marrying mister Doherty, our neighbor, because I don't know 0:12:48.720 --> 0:12:49.599 what else to do with you. 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:53.600 Oh yeah, that she would be taking care of you probably, yeah. 0:12:53.360 --> 0:12:57.000 Yeah, And that's at sixteen, okay. 0:12:56.080 --> 0:12:58.760 And care yeah, straight up like dark age as shit, 0:12:58.800 --> 0:13:01.960 where just like you may marrier off that's like the best, 0:13:02.400 --> 0:13:05.320 the best way to kind of solve this problem. So 0:13:05.960 --> 0:13:07.840 this is around the time of World War Two. He 0:13:07.920 --> 0:13:13.400 joins the Merchant Marines and she starts working at a factory, 0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:16.800 and weirdly enough, she is at the forefront of drone warfare. 0:13:17.160 --> 0:13:21.520 At this time. She worked in a World War two 0:13:21.559 --> 0:13:25.840 defense plant for a company called radio Plane, which made small, 0:13:25.920 --> 0:13:29.760 remote controlled, pilotless aircraft. And it's straight up like there's 0:13:29.800 --> 0:13:34.040 a direct line from people who had toy planes, like 0:13:34.120 --> 0:13:39.160 toy remote controlled planes, to our modern drone warfare because 0:13:39.200 --> 0:13:45.160 there's an actor named Reginald Denny no no relation, Yeah, 0:13:45.360 --> 0:13:49.480 another same name. Yeah. So he's a famous actor who's 0:13:49.520 --> 0:13:53.520 obsessed with remote control airplanes and is like, we could 0:13:53.559 --> 0:13:56.760 start using these for target practice for the US Army, 0:13:57.040 --> 0:13:59.959 like I think in nineteen thirty five. And then his 0:14:00.200 --> 0:14:02.640 toy plane. He was so into toy planes. He had 0:14:02.679 --> 0:14:06.599 a factory that gets converted into this like anti aircraft, 0:14:07.679 --> 0:14:12.600 you know, drill thing that then gets acquired by Northrop 0:14:12.720 --> 0:14:18.480 Aircraft and becomes essentially Northrop Grumman's autonomous systems that we 0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:22.960 have today. Wow, she is the very first like public 0:14:23.040 --> 0:14:26.880 pictures modeling pictures of her are her putting the propellers 0:14:27.000 --> 0:14:31.560 on these planes that go on to become the first drones. 0:14:31.880 --> 0:14:33.680 That's wow. 0:14:34.080 --> 0:14:38.320 And another wild anecdote about those first pictures. So this 0:14:38.400 --> 0:14:42.440 is where she's first discovered. Reginald Denny, the actor, is 0:14:43.080 --> 0:14:47.560 at his factory and sees her. Says to this military 0:14:47.600 --> 0:14:51.280 captain that he knew from Hollywood, you gotta get somebody 0:14:51.280 --> 0:14:53.720 over here to look at the talent, you know what 0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:57.960 I'm saying, brother, And that captain sends over a photographer 0:14:58.360 --> 0:15:00.960 who takes these kind of rosy the river at her pictures. 0:15:01.000 --> 0:15:03.400 Of her that end up getting some attention and like 0:15:03.480 --> 0:15:07.280 launching her modeling career. That captain that he like reached 0:15:07.280 --> 0:15:14.480 out to who hired the photographer Ronald Reagan. Wow, the only. 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:17.320 Picture of them the other day to get there, of 0:15:17.440 --> 0:15:20.440 Ronald Reagan when he was still like an actor, the. 0:15:20.320 --> 0:15:23.920 Only good thing in his legacy, and it required no 0:15:24.080 --> 0:15:26.479 talent and could have been done by a phone operator. 0:15:26.640 --> 0:15:31.160 But he is indirectly responsible for basically passing along the 0:15:31.200 --> 0:15:36.080 message that this actor was horny for this woman who 0:15:36.160 --> 0:15:39.760 worked in his factory, who ends up being Marilyn Monroe. Wow, 0:15:40.080 --> 0:15:43.120 so get fucked, Ronald Reagan. This is the only good 0:15:43.120 --> 0:15:49.480 thing you did, and it required no Okay, yeah, that 0:15:49.560 --> 0:15:52.280 should have been the end. If only that had been 0:15:52.280 --> 0:15:52.880 the end of. 0:15:55.160 --> 0:15:57.720 This is I'm looking at the picture. Her hair is brown. 0:15:58.000 --> 0:15:59.920 Her hair is brown and curly. 0:15:59.680 --> 0:16:03.120 And reddish in the beginning kind of yes, yeah, yeah, 0:16:03.160 --> 0:16:05.760 before she to her famous. 0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:07.760 Yeah, this is where we get into So from this 0:16:08.160 --> 0:16:13.560 very first photo shoot, she is like an immediate savant 0:16:13.640 --> 0:16:18.520 and also like student of modeling. But yeah, to your point, 0:16:18.720 --> 0:16:21.440 I don't think I ever like associated her with like 0:16:21.520 --> 0:16:24.200 getting work done. I thought the work she had done 0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:27.600 was just like her hair died blonde. She also had 0:16:27.600 --> 0:16:30.560 a bump removed from her nose, had a silicon line 0:16:30.600 --> 0:16:34.200 added to her jaw, got her overbite fixed, which was 0:16:34.200 --> 0:16:37.440 paid for by the head of William Morris, who was 0:16:37.480 --> 0:16:40.200 her boyfriend at that time. But she was like kind 0:16:40.240 --> 0:16:42.920 of a Kardashian before the Kardashians. 0:16:43.520 --> 0:16:47.400 I'm crazy. I've always wondered about that because I didn't 0:16:47.440 --> 0:16:48.760 know that they could do that stuff. 0:16:48.840 --> 0:16:53.720 A silicon, a silicon line in your jaw, like a. 0:16:53.760 --> 0:16:56.040 Jaw, like you know what people put like filler in 0:16:56.080 --> 0:16:59.520 their jaw. Now that's some Oh so this is just 0:16:59.560 --> 0:17:01.280 like yeah, like sharp drawling. 0:17:01.600 --> 0:17:05.440 Yeah wow. But just a couple of things from these 0:17:05.480 --> 0:17:08.959 early stages because like the photographer at the time was 0:17:09.359 --> 0:17:11.920 he said, blown away by her ability to scan as 0:17:12.200 --> 0:17:15.880 sex on film. He also claimed they had a steamy 0:17:15.880 --> 0:17:20.119 affair which is cooperated by him and only that's another 0:17:20.200 --> 0:17:24.560 thing that just across her whole life. Everybody's like, yeah, 0:17:24.600 --> 0:17:28.120 everybody the second she dies is like, here's my biography 0:17:28.680 --> 0:17:32.240 where and I have with Marilyn Monroe. 0:17:32.400 --> 0:17:35.320 So everyone becomes the Chris Farley bush Driver character in 0:17:35.359 --> 0:17:36.160 Billy Maddison. 0:17:36.359 --> 0:17:40.040 Yeah, yeah, exactly, And the biographers are like, yeah, nobody 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:43.359 believes that shit man, So it's kind of a pathetic look. 0:17:43.920 --> 0:17:46.159 But he talks about how she's able to like flirt 0:17:46.200 --> 0:17:48.720 with the camera in a way that like seems uncanny. 0:17:49.000 --> 0:17:52.280 But I just want to read this from there's a 0:17:52.320 --> 0:17:55.800 newer biography. The Spoto one that I mentioned earlier is 0:17:55.880 --> 0:17:58.919 kind of the most widely read one, but there's a 0:17:58.960 --> 0:18:01.639 newer one that I think might correct some of that 0:18:01.680 --> 0:18:05.440 stuff by Jay Randy Tamborelli, called The Secret Life of 0:18:05.480 --> 0:18:11.800 Marilyn Monroe. This quote is about these very first pictures 0:18:11.880 --> 0:18:15.240 that she takes. Besides the speed of her success, what 0:18:15.440 --> 0:18:18.879 was also fascinating about Norma Jean's first photo sessions was 0:18:18.880 --> 0:18:21.440 how quickly she seemed to understand the business of modeling. 0:18:21.800 --> 0:18:24.840 She was very inquisitive about the process and highly critical 0:18:24.840 --> 0:18:27.840 of her appearance. For instance, she asked David Conover, that's 0:18:27.880 --> 0:18:31.879 the guy who's taking these very first pictures, questions about lighting, 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:35.600 about different camera lenses, about how he coaxed his models 0:18:35.600 --> 0:18:38.720 into giving their best performances in meetings with him. After 0:18:38.760 --> 0:18:41.960 the sessions, she would study the contact sheets with the 0:18:42.040 --> 0:18:45.240 kind of careful scrutiny one might expect from a professional model. 0:18:45.440 --> 0:18:47.320 She wanted to know what she'd done wrong if an 0:18:47.320 --> 0:18:51.480 exposure didn't meet with her approval. Again, like right from 0:18:51.480 --> 0:18:54.200 the start, like in these photographs that are for an 0:18:54.480 --> 0:19:00.800 army magazine called Yank, which oh my god, double entendre intended, 0:19:00.880 --> 0:19:04.160 I have to assume like you're yeah, they're like you 0:19:04.560 --> 0:19:07.400 jack off to this one. But the point about her 0:19:07.440 --> 0:19:10.520 being highly critical of her appearance and you know, the 0:19:10.640 --> 0:19:13.520 stuff we were talking about about her like getting a 0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:17.040 bump in her nose fixed, and it seems like, first 0:19:17.040 --> 0:19:20.600 of all very like crazy making to like exist in that, 0:19:20.840 --> 0:19:25.600 but also she's really good at like viewing herself from 0:19:25.640 --> 0:19:29.159 outside herself, Like right from the start, she's just immediately 0:19:29.200 --> 0:19:32.239 like yeah, exactly, she's just like I'm viewing herself as 0:19:32.240 --> 0:19:34.440 a product and being like how do I fix this. 0:19:34.720 --> 0:19:37.639 There's another quote from the Spotto biography from one of 0:19:37.680 --> 0:19:41.720 her early modeling teachers about again how hard she worked, 0:19:41.720 --> 0:19:46.840 but also just the weird geometries of beauty that like 0:19:47.480 --> 0:19:50.639 people talk about in the modeling industry. So she this 0:19:50.680 --> 0:19:53.440 woman says she was a clean cut American, wholesome girl, 0:19:53.640 --> 0:19:57.119 too plump, fuck off, but beautiful in a way we 0:19:57.200 --> 0:19:59.240 tried to teach her how to pose, how to handle 0:19:59.240 --> 0:20:02.439 her body. She always tried to lower her smile because 0:20:02.440 --> 0:20:05.240 she smiled too high and it made her nose look 0:20:05.280 --> 0:20:09.480 a little long. At first, she knew nothing about carriage posture, sitting, 0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:12.040 or walking. She started out with less than any girl 0:20:12.080 --> 0:20:14.280 I ever knew, but she wanted to learn, wanted to 0:20:14.320 --> 0:20:17.000 be somebody more than anybody I ever saw before in 0:20:17.040 --> 0:20:21.760 my life. So again, just like a student from the start, 0:20:21.960 --> 0:20:24.399 but also the shit that she had to study is 0:20:24.440 --> 0:20:27.879 like horrifying. For they're like, yeah, when you smile like that, 0:20:27.960 --> 0:20:29.480 it makes your nose look long. 0:20:29.760 --> 0:20:30.040 Yep. 0:20:30.560 --> 0:20:30.919 Yeah. 0:20:31.000 --> 0:20:35.040 And I just think also some of these people, like 0:20:35.080 --> 0:20:38.479 these icons that impact culture in the way they do, 0:20:38.640 --> 0:20:42.720 It's like it does feel like this real destined thing 0:20:43.480 --> 0:20:47.439 because there's just all this certain amount of things that 0:20:47.560 --> 0:20:53.800 add up into this like completely remarkable alchemy. You know, 0:20:53.920 --> 0:20:57.800 like she comes from this insane childhood like absolutely nothing. 0:20:58.280 --> 0:21:03.000 Then she learns how to be basically like ponjure energy 0:21:03.320 --> 0:21:06.720 in a way that she can seduce like an entire 0:21:06.840 --> 0:21:11.560 population for yeah, millennia. 0:21:10.520 --> 0:21:13.320 Right right, Yeah, I mean to know, like you're to 0:21:13.359 --> 0:21:16.560 your point of being so early to having that kind 0:21:16.600 --> 0:21:19.760 of media savvy in such an early phase of like 0:21:19.880 --> 0:21:22.040 mass media and be like, Okay, I know what I'm 0:21:22.040 --> 0:21:22.960 gonna know what. 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:23.560 My angles are. 0:21:23.600 --> 0:21:25.679 I'm gonna know what a well lit thing looks like 0:21:25.760 --> 0:21:29.240 because every image that you will cast your gaze upon 0:21:29.400 --> 0:21:32.280 will be perfected for maximum effect. 0:21:32.720 --> 0:21:37.000 Yeah, you guys are absolutely like nailing that. She had 0:21:37.040 --> 0:21:39.640 this like ability that people were like, she's just got 0:21:39.640 --> 0:21:41.960 a magic power. I don't know what it is, right, 0:21:42.119 --> 0:21:45.320 and it comes from like studying. And there's a quote 0:21:45.440 --> 0:21:48.080 not to jump ahead, but like this continues right into 0:21:48.119 --> 0:21:50.879 her work on film, Like on the set her co 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:54.600 stars would be like, this is a fucking disaster, and 0:21:54.680 --> 0:22:00.480 then they would see the movie and be like. There's 0:22:00.520 --> 0:22:03.520 a quote from her co star in one of her 0:22:03.560 --> 0:22:06.960 early movies, Richard Windmark, and he said, at first we 0:22:07.000 --> 0:22:10.240 thought she's not going to get anything right, and we'd mutter, oh, 0:22:10.280 --> 0:22:13.320 this is impossible, Oh this is impossible. You can't print this. 0:22:14.080 --> 0:22:17.399 But something happened between the lens and the film, and 0:22:17.440 --> 0:22:19.800 when we looked at the rushes, which is like the 0:22:19.880 --> 0:22:22.680 dailies from the she had the rest of us knocked 0:22:22.720 --> 0:22:25.159 off the screen. And that just like happens over and 0:22:25.240 --> 0:22:28.679 over where everyone's like, she's fucking up our movie. And 0:22:28.680 --> 0:22:31.320 then you look on film and you hear this a 0:22:31.359 --> 0:22:33.679 lot about like movie stars, where like people are on 0:22:33.720 --> 0:22:35.919 the set of a movie and they're like, what the 0:22:35.960 --> 0:22:39.560 fuck was that? Like he appears to be like whispering 0:22:39.720 --> 0:22:42.680 or like there, you know, you don't see anything happening, 0:22:43.119 --> 0:22:47.119 And then you actually look what they're doing with the 0:22:47.200 --> 0:22:50.720