WEBVTT - Do Supersenses Exist? 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:02.880 Hey, if you can use stereo headphones to listen to 0:00:02.880 --> 0:00:07.360 this episode. Hey, welcome to sign Stuff, a production of 0:00:07.400 --> 0:00:11.200 iHeartRadio More Hit Cham And today we're tackling the question 0:00:11.600 --> 0:00:16.360 do super senses exist? Scientists out there have an idea 0:00:16.480 --> 0:00:20.280 that we can give humans new senses beyond the ones 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:24.160 we already have, and this is done by basically hacking 0:00:24.360 --> 0:00:28.920 your brain. We're going to be talking to experts about echolocation, 0:00:29.440 --> 0:00:33.080 a skill some people have to use sonar Like that, dude, 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:36.960 how we're going to talk to a scientist that's using 0:00:37.000 --> 0:00:40.120 technology to one day let us sense things you can't 0:00:40.240 --> 0:00:45.400 see or hear, like collectromagnetic fields or even Wi Fi. 0:00:46.760 --> 0:00:49.400 So you get ready to augment your awareness as we 0:00:49.520 --> 0:00:59.760 make sense of the question do super senses exist? Hey, 0:01:00.360 --> 0:01:03.160 Today we're starting our exploration of the limits of our 0:01:03.200 --> 0:01:08.600 senses by taking a dive into echolocation. This is something 0:01:08.600 --> 0:01:12.800 that some animals like bats, dolphins, some shrews, and digny 0:01:12.840 --> 0:01:18.560 dormice do where they use sound to know what's around them. 0:01:19.040 --> 0:01:21.920 Now you might have heard that some people can do 0:01:22.040 --> 0:01:24.520 it too. To fill us in on everything we know 0:01:24.600 --> 0:01:27.760 about echolocation in humans, I reached out to two of 0:01:27.840 --> 0:01:32.200 the world's experts on the subject, Professors Laura Thaller and 0:01:32.319 --> 0:01:35.360 Liam Norman of Durham University in the UK. 0:01:37.680 --> 0:01:40.039 My name is Liam Norman, and a lot of my 0:01:40.160 --> 0:01:44.280 research concerns human perception, in particular human echolocation. 0:01:44.560 --> 0:01:49.120 I investigate echolocation, in particular how people echolocate and how 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:52.600 they use echolocation to perceive their Welsh and how they 0:01:52.720 --> 0:01:54.200 learn it amazing. 0:01:54.720 --> 0:01:58.120 Maybe can you start us off by explaining what is echolocation. 0:01:58.480 --> 0:02:03.200 Echolocation is the process where typically an animal make a sound, 0:02:03.680 --> 0:02:06.720 That sound goes out in the environment, and then when 0:02:06.760 --> 0:02:10.760 there's something in the sounds past, it will reflect the 0:02:10.840 --> 0:02:13.320 sound and so that's the echo that then comes back 0:02:13.400 --> 0:02:16.520 to the person and they can hear that echo, and 0:02:16.680 --> 0:02:18.919 this carries spatial information. 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.840 But what's around them? Yes, can you give some examples 0:02:21.840 --> 0:02:23.840 of humans that are able to do this? 0:02:24.160 --> 0:02:27.440 So one of the possibly most famous non echo locators 0:02:27.520 --> 0:02:30.920 Daniel Kish, he is blind from an early age. He's American, 0:02:31.080 --> 0:02:33.239 and he has used echo location as long as he 0:02:33.320 --> 0:02:36.520 can remember, and he uses mouth clicks as his sound 0:02:36.560 --> 0:02:39.359 that he makes. So they're very brief, trendient sound there 0:02:39.360 --> 0:02:44.400 like this, and these sounds then travel out in the 0:02:44.480 --> 0:02:47.240 environment and the echoes return to him the reflections of 0:02:47.320 --> 0:02:49.760 the sound. It doesn't mean that he clicks all the time, 0:02:50.000 --> 0:02:52.280 you know, the ouphent situations where he doesn't need to. 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:55.200 So why do you think this person, Daniel Kish is 0:02:55.280 --> 0:02:56.160 so famous? 0:02:56.360 --> 0:03:00.120 Now, Daniel Kish is very good at echo location. We 0:03:00.480 --> 0:03:05.480 have tested his skills and variety experiment and so we 0:03:05.560 --> 0:03:09.200 found that he's extremely good at localizing how fartings are 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:11.880 weigh and whether they are to the left or right, 0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:15.160 So he can, for example, determine a shift in the 0:03:15.240 --> 0:03:17.000 distance of about centimeter. 0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:21.160 Here we're talking about Daniel Kish, one of the most 0:03:21.200 --> 0:03:25.160 well known human echolocators. If you google his name you 0:03:25.160 --> 0:03:28.840 can find lots of videos of him using echolocation. Mister 0:03:28.919 --> 0:03:31.480 Kish is so good at it. If you place an object, 0:03:31.639 --> 0:03:33.959 say five ft in front of him, he can tell 0:03:34.040 --> 0:03:36.880 if you move that object half an inch closer or 0:03:37.080 --> 0:03:39.360 half an inch back, and he can tell if you 0:03:39.440 --> 0:03:41.640 move it a few inches to the right or to 0:03:41.680 --> 0:03:45.640 the left. He can also tell what shape an object is. 0:03:47.480 --> 0:03:49.360 So it was a bit of a silly experiment, but 0:03:49.400 --> 0:03:53.320 we just wanted to test possible So we had different 0:03:53.360 --> 0:03:56.320 shapes that were made from cardboards and there were either 0:03:56.360 --> 0:04:01.960 a triangle or a circuleancequere and wrecked angle and represented 0:04:02.000 --> 0:04:03.880 one at a time, and he was allowed to click 0:04:03.880 --> 0:04:06.000 at them as long as he wanted and to move 0:04:06.000 --> 0:04:08.080 his head, and she could tell them a part very easily. 0:04:08.160 --> 0:04:13.440 Actually, mister Kish is also able to recognize the texture 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:16.640 of an object, whether it's rough or smooth, and he 0:04:16.720 --> 0:04:19.760 can tell if something is hollow or flat, can tell 0:04:19.800 --> 0:04:22.880 their size, whether they're up or down, and all of 0:04:22.920 --> 0:04:27.919 it while being completely blind. It's really quite amazing. But 0:04:28.160 --> 0:04:33.160 here's the surprising fact. Daniel Kish is not unique. There 0:04:33.160 --> 0:04:36.800 are many expert echo locators out there like him, and 0:04:37.040 --> 0:04:41.240 actually doctor Steller and Norman think that anyone can learn 0:04:41.400 --> 0:04:45.720 to echo locate. Okay, so who can do human echo location? 0:04:46.040 --> 0:04:48.960 That's a good question. The short answer is, anybody who 0:04:48.960 --> 0:04:52.160 has an ability to use hearing normally to locate sounds 0:04:52.440 --> 0:04:55.080 should be able to learn echo location to some degree. 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:58.080 So one thing that we've learned is that anyone can 0:04:58.160 --> 0:05:03.360 learn to echolocate people with pickle vision, people who are blind. Obviously, 0:05:03.440 --> 0:05:08.120 it is mediated through hearing, so if there's a profound 0:05:08.120 --> 0:05:11.000 hearing loss, then there are natural limits to how this 0:05:11.160 --> 0:05:14.440 can work. But in principle. It's very learnable and we 0:05:14.560 --> 0:05:17.839 had in workshops at the youngest child that's learned it 0:05:18.000 --> 0:05:21.279 was three years old, and in our research, which today 0:05:21.400 --> 0:05:24.800 has focused on adults, the oldest person was seventy nine 0:05:24.880 --> 0:05:25.280 years old. 0:05:25.839 --> 0:05:26.520 Wow. 0:05:27.800 --> 0:05:31.120 Yes, people from three years old to seventy nine years 0:05:31.160 --> 0:05:34.359 old can learn to echo locate. You don't need to 0:05:34.360 --> 0:05:37.640 be blind or have special hearing to do it, although 0:05:37.800 --> 0:05:40.200 it helps you have been doing it for a while. 0:05:41.200 --> 0:05:43.479 As with anything, there is a benefit to learning this 0:05:43.640 --> 0:05:46.760 ability from a young age. So the best human echolocate 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:50.159 is that we know began learning this ability either in 0:05:50.200 --> 0:05:51.640 early or middle childhood. 0:05:51.880 --> 0:05:54.360 Wow. How do you train someone to echo locate? 0:05:54.680 --> 0:05:57.400 For our research, we have developed a paradigm where we 0:05:57.520 --> 0:05:59.919 have different tasks that we ask people to do. 0:06:01.000 --> 0:06:04.159 Okay, here's how you can train to echo locate. The 0:06:04.160 --> 0:06:06.280 first thing you have to do is learn to make 0:06:06.320 --> 0:06:08.520 the clicking sound with your mouth. 0:06:09.000 --> 0:06:11.760 And so this is usually made by placing the tongue 0:06:11.800 --> 0:06:14.000 in a particular position at the roof of the mouth 0:06:14.160 --> 0:06:16.200 and then keeping the mouth open. You then bring the 0:06:16.279 --> 0:06:18.880 tone down quite quickly and it can create a kind 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:21.640 of a short popping sound or a clicking sound. It 0:06:21.680 --> 0:06:22.320 sounds like a. 0:06:24.640 --> 0:06:27.600 Now you don't have to make this particular sound. Some 0:06:27.640 --> 0:06:31.640 echo locators use shouts or hissing or whistling. You can 0:06:31.680 --> 0:06:34.760 also use a clicker in your hand. But mouth clicks 0:06:34.760 --> 0:06:38.039 are good because they're short so they don't interfere with 0:06:38.080 --> 0:06:40.880 the echo. They're sharp, so they have lots of high 0:06:40.880 --> 0:06:44.280 frequencies which give you more resolution, and they come from 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:47.200 your mouth, which is a fixed distance from your ears, 0:06:47.480 --> 0:06:48.800 so it's more consistent. 0:06:49.800 --> 0:06:52.200 And then once you've established that the person is comfortable 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:55.279 making a mouth click, then it's just about teaching them 0:06:55.360 --> 0:06:58.440 what to listen for in the echoes. And the key 0:06:58.480 --> 0:07:00.960 thing is to start with tasks that are fairly simple 0:07:01.279 --> 0:07:04.160 and then just develop the difficulty in a step by 0:07:04.200 --> 0:07:07.680 step way. For example, you can place a large object 0:07:07.720 --> 0:07:09.760 in front of the person. They can be very close 0:07:09.840 --> 0:07:12.080 to the head, and then you ask them to make 0:07:12.080 --> 0:07:17.600 a click, and then you can take the object away. 0:07:18.000 --> 0:07:22.760 They do the same thing again, and you ask them 0:07:22.760 --> 0:07:25.040 to pay attention to the difference in how those two 0:07:25.080 --> 0:07:28.679 sounds sound, and then you ask them to judge whether 0:07:28.720 --> 0:07:32.160 they think the object is in front of them or 0:07:32.200 --> 0:07:36.520 whether it's not there, and you can gradually increase the distance, 0:07:36.600 --> 0:07:38.880 and so with practice they should be able to develop 0:07:38.880 --> 0:07:41.640 disability and be able to do these tasks that maybe 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:44.200 one or two meet a distance after a few weeks. 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:48.440 And this training works. Even people who don't have a 0:07:48.560 --> 0:07:52.520 visual impairment can learn to have sonar like a bat. 0:07:52.840 --> 0:07:56.280 And you'd be surprised. It sounds difficult. But then we 0:07:56.360 --> 0:07:58.720 have people who at first are very doubtful, like oh, no, 0:07:58.800 --> 0:08:00.920 I cannot dose this as sort of ago, and then 0:08:00.960 --> 0:08:02.720 they come in for the second or third session and 0:08:02.800 --> 0:08:04.400 they just get the hang of it. And then we 0:08:04.520 --> 0:08:07.160 asked them to come in for twenty sessions in total, 0:08:07.440 --> 0:08:09.720 and we space this around ten weeks out and by 0:08:09.760 --> 0:08:12.520 the end when we benchmark them to someone who's done 0:08:12.600 --> 0:08:15.760 this for ten years or more, many of the people 0:08:15.760 --> 0:08:18.560 who've trained for just ten weeks reached the level of 0:08:18.600 --> 0:08:21.440 this expert, which suggests, you know, it's a skill that 0:08:21.760 --> 0:08:25.040 you don't have to practice for ten years. So for 0:08:25.160 --> 0:08:28.040 some people they are very good even earlier on, so 0:08:28.400 --> 0:08:30.360 may not even take ten weeks. 0:08:31.600 --> 0:08:35.200 Yes, it seems anyone can learn to echo locate. Even 0:08:35.280 --> 0:08:37.480 you could learn to do it, you just have to 0:08:37.760 --> 0:08:41.160 want to learn. In fact, the two researchers we're talking 0:08:41.160 --> 0:08:45.200 to who are both sided taught themselves to echo locate. 0:08:45.960 --> 0:08:48.440 So you're able to echo locate, you've taught yourself to 0:08:48.480 --> 0:08:48.720 do it. 0:08:49.120 --> 0:08:51.520 Yeah, I have had a good role model. I'm not 0:08:51.600 --> 0:08:54.079 as good as many of the echo locations, but I'm 0:08:54.080 --> 0:08:56.480 not too bad. I can do some you know, basic stuff. 0:08:56.960 --> 0:09:01.120 Okay, But here's the thing about echo location principle. It's 0:09:01.320 --> 0:09:03.880 easy to know what's going on. You make a sound, 0:09:04.200 --> 0:09:07.400 the sound goes out, it bounces on things, it comes 0:09:07.440 --> 0:09:10.079 back to your ears, and from the echo you can 0:09:10.120 --> 0:09:13.040 tell what's there. But if you talk to anyone who 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:16.400 can echo locate, they're not really thinking about any of 0:09:16.440 --> 0:09:19.920 the physics or even the timing between the sound and 0:09:19.960 --> 0:09:26.080 the bouncing echo. It's really more of a feeling. Was 0:09:26.120 --> 0:09:28.680 there a moment when it clicked for you? No pun 0:09:28.720 --> 0:09:31.960 intended when you say that, like, Okay, I get it now, 0:09:32.240 --> 0:09:33.760 I understand what to listen for. 0:09:34.240 --> 0:09:38.120 Yeah, definitely. I started out expecting or I must have 0:09:38.240 --> 0:09:40.880 this revelation of this this echo that I'm hearing, but 0:09:41.200 --> 0:09:44.480 often that's not what it sounds like. There's something's presented 0:09:44.520 --> 0:09:47.040 at one two meters. Also, for me, it's more the 0:09:47.120 --> 0:09:50.120 quality that I'm paying attention to and so that was 0:09:50.200 --> 0:09:51.520 an ahab moment for me. 0:09:51.960 --> 0:09:54.240 I see, it's not so much about hearing the echo, 0:09:54.320 --> 0:09:56.320 but maybe kind of feeling the echo. 0:09:56.760 --> 0:09:58.319 Yeah. 0:09:58.400 --> 0:10:04.720 In other words, unless you're sh across the Grand Canyon, Hello, Hello, 0:10:04.960 --> 0:10:08.120 in a room with objects close to you, the echoes 0:10:08.280 --> 0:10:11.840 happen way too fast for us to consciously notice them, 0:10:12.240 --> 0:10:15.280 which means that when you echo locate, your brain is 0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:19.320 sort of processing the echo automatically, and to your conscious self, 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:21.199 it's just the feeling that you. 0:10:21.200 --> 0:10:22.680 Get it's close. 0:10:23.920 --> 0:10:26.840 Or to the right or left, or that it's round 0:10:27.400 --> 0:10:31.199 or rough or smooth. And that means that either your 0:10:31.240 --> 0:10:35.440 brain is already wired to do echolocation, or your brain 0:10:35.559 --> 0:10:39.840 rewires itself as you learn to do it. So when 0:10:39.840 --> 0:10:41.840 we come back, we're going to find out which is 0:10:41.880 --> 0:10:45.040 the case by digging into what happens in the brain 0:10:45.160 --> 0:10:48.120 of people who echo locate, and we're going to find 0:10:48.120 --> 0:10:50.920 out what that means for our ability to hack the 0:10:51.000 --> 0:10:55.679 brain to gain more supersensus. Stay with us, we'll be 0:10:55.840 --> 0:11:13.360 right back. Hey, welcome back. We're talking about whether supersensues exist, 0:11:13.760 --> 0:11:17.520 and we started with e colocation. It's what bats and 0:11:17.679 --> 0:11:21.240 dolphins use to get around and it's something people can 0:11:21.320 --> 0:11:23.880 learn to do. In fact, they can learn to do 0:11:23.920 --> 0:11:26.720 it pretty well, to the point where they can notice 0:11:26.840 --> 0:11:30.240 centimeter changes in the position of things around them and 0:11:30.360 --> 0:11:34.080 even their shape and texture. Now, I asked our two experts, 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:38.000 professors Laura Thaler and Lean Norman, to describe what happens 0:11:38.040 --> 0:11:41.600 in the brain when people echo locate, and their answer 0:11:41.920 --> 0:11:48.120 is kind of surprising. Okay, so I saw some research 0:11:48.200 --> 0:11:51.000 done by you about what happens to the brain of 0:11:51.000 --> 0:11:53.560 people who learn to echolocate. Can you tell us about that. 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:56.079 Yeah, I think this is one of the most fascinating 0:11:56.120 --> 0:11:58.520 things about this topic. Who don't have all the answers yet. 0:11:58.559 --> 0:12:01.520 But first of all, that location is obviously processed through 0:12:01.559 --> 0:12:04.080 the auditory system because it is part of our hearing. 0:12:04.400 --> 0:12:07.640 But when we conduct brain imaging studies and we have 0:12:07.840 --> 0:12:11.040 expert eclocators in an MRIs Kunner and they listen to 0:12:11.040 --> 0:12:13.760 e colocation sounds they make judgments about them, we find 0:12:13.760 --> 0:12:15.520 that actually it's the part of the brain that we 0:12:15.640 --> 0:12:18.600 normally call the visual codex that is the most active. 0:12:18.760 --> 0:12:21.240 That's where we see by far the most activity in 0:12:21.240 --> 0:12:24.360 the brain in terms of processing these zones. So that's 0:12:24.440 --> 0:12:27.240 quite surprising because we call this visual codex. 0:12:28.600 --> 0:12:31.600 Okay, this is the first interesting fact about the brain 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:35.600 activity of people who use echolocation, and that is that 0:12:35.679 --> 0:12:38.840 they're part of the brain that scientists normally think is 0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:43.040 used to see things. The visual cortex lights up when 0:12:43.080 --> 0:12:47.520 they echo locate, and this is unexpected because A you 0:12:47.559 --> 0:12:51.320 see this in expert echo locators who are blind, so 0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:55.960 they're definitely not using their eyes and b echolocation only 0:12:56.040 --> 0:12:59.839 uses hearing. So why is the visual cortex being you 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:04.400 and not only that, Scientists can see these brain areas 0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:07.360 light up in the same way as if the person 0:13:07.720 --> 0:13:09.800 was seeing something in front of them. 0:13:11.640 --> 0:13:14.760 When we followed this up later on, wondering is there 0:13:14.760 --> 0:13:18.800 a systematic pattern to this activity, we found that it's 0:13:18.840 --> 0:13:21.719 not just responding to the echos, but that there's a 0:13:21.760 --> 0:13:25.000 relationship between the location and space where the echo comes 0:13:25.040 --> 0:13:28.320 from and the part of the brain in this eartivisual 0:13:28.360 --> 0:13:32.040 context that maps that takeos sound and let's often retract 0:13:32.120 --> 0:13:34.160 to as retino topek mapping. 0:13:35.240 --> 0:13:38.440 All right, this is a little complicated but super interesting. 0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:42.400 If you're a sighted person, there's kind of a one 0:13:42.480 --> 0:13:46.000 to one mapping between what you see and which part 0:13:46.040 --> 0:13:49.200 of the visual area of your brain lights up. This 0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:51.520 is the little patch of brain that first gets the 0:13:51.559 --> 0:13:55.000 signals from your eyes. So, for example, if you see 0:13:55.040 --> 0:13:58.280 an image of a black cross on a white background 0:13:58.480 --> 0:14:01.400 and then someone looked at your brain actively in that area, 0:14:01.600 --> 0:14:05.200 they'll see it activate in a little cross pattern as 0:14:05.240 --> 0:14:08.320 if someone was projecting that image onto that part of 0:14:08.360 --> 0:14:10.680 the brain. And if you see a circle in front 0:14:10.720 --> 0:14:13.840 of you, you'll see that area light up in a circle. 0:14:14.520 --> 0:14:19.160 It's super fascinating. But what's amazing is that the scientists 0:14:19.160 --> 0:14:24.160 saw the same thing happen for echoes. In expert echolocators 0:14:24.200 --> 0:14:27.040 who are blind, if they send an object to one 0:14:27.080 --> 0:14:29.640 side of them, then one side of their visual cortex 0:14:29.680 --> 0:14:32.520 would light up, and if they sense an object on 0:14:32.600 --> 0:14:35.640 the other side, the other side of the visual cortex 0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:39.360 would light up. They were using their visual cortex almost 0:14:39.480 --> 0:14:43.080 in the same way a sided person would, and this 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:46.920 points to something that scientists call sensory plasticity. 0:14:49.000 --> 0:14:51.080 So it seems like there are parts in the brand 0:14:51.120 --> 0:14:53.560 that have a high degree of what we call plasticity, 0:14:53.920 --> 0:14:56.800 which is the capability to change and adapt over time 0:14:56.840 --> 0:15:01.560 to process information from sensory modolities that they ordinarily would process. 0:15:02.960 --> 0:15:05.920 In other words, the wiring of your brain for your 0:15:06.000 --> 0:15:10.400 senses isn't fixed. If your brain notices, for example, that 0:15:10.520 --> 0:15:14.320 you're not using your visual area because maybe you're blind, 0:15:14.680 --> 0:15:19.040 your brain will start using that area for other senses. 0:15:19.440 --> 0:15:22.600 In this case, the visual area is used to process 0:15:22.760 --> 0:15:26.080 what the echo locators are getting through their ears when 0:15:26.080 --> 0:15:29.120 they send out these sounds and then hear the echoes. 0:15:29.680 --> 0:15:33.160 And not only that, Doctor Thaler and Norman think your 0:15:33.200 --> 0:15:40.200 brain actually starts to change. Is there evidence though, that 0:15:40.240 --> 0:15:43.760 people who echolocate for a long time somehow the brain changes. 0:15:44.240 --> 0:15:46.320 Yes, and there is some evidence to suggest that is 0:15:46.360 --> 0:15:49.640 the case. So somebody who who is initially naive to 0:15:49.680 --> 0:15:51.720 this ability but then learns it over maybe a ten 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:54.920 week period, we find subtle changes in order for your 0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:57.560 brain areas where there might be high gradmouta density in 0:15:57.600 --> 0:15:59.760 that area. But at the same time we also get 0:15:59.800 --> 0:16:03.480 these functional changes in visual codex where the role of 0:16:03.520 --> 0:16:05.560 the brain reagion has changed to some extent. 0:16:06.440 --> 0:16:10.880 So when learning to echolocate, your brain possibly grows the 0:16:11.000 --> 0:16:14.120 hearing parts of your brain and it starts using the 0:16:14.200 --> 0:16:18.040 seeing parts of your brain for processing the information you hear. 0:16:18.720 --> 0:16:22.280 In other words, your brain to some degree molds itself 0:16:22.320 --> 0:16:25.440 to this new sense so that it becomes a natural 0:16:25.440 --> 0:16:30.320 addition to your existing senses. And this says something profound 0:16:30.640 --> 0:16:35.000 about the brain. Well, what do you think this says 0:16:35.040 --> 0:16:39.920 about just human senses and human abilities how our brain works. 0:16:40.120 --> 0:16:42.200 I think it says a couple of things. I think 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:44.880 it tells us that our sensory abilities are much more 0:16:44.880 --> 0:16:49.240 adaptable than what we previously believed. So the classic textbook 0:16:49.320 --> 0:16:51.560 idea is that where you have the visual codex that 0:16:51.640 --> 0:16:55.240 processes site, you have the order free codex that processes 0:16:55.280 --> 0:16:58.040 hearing and so on. But research seem to suggest that 0:16:58.040 --> 0:17:00.440 these brain readers are much more adaptable and they can 0:17:00.480 --> 0:17:05.000 process sensory information from an atypical modality. And so what 0:17:05.000 --> 0:17:08.240 we would call the visual codex isn't necessarily the visual 0:17:08.280 --> 0:17:11.320 codex In many people, people who are blind, they can 0:17:11.400 --> 0:17:13.679 use as part of the brainfall many other purposes that 0:17:13.720 --> 0:17:15.040 aren't supported through vision. 0:17:15.600 --> 0:17:18.159 It just creates, like, for me, I think this feeling 0:17:18.160 --> 0:17:21.400 of yeah, we do have a sensory repertoire that we're 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:23.720 born with that we use every day, but we can 0:17:23.760 --> 0:17:26.320 actually do a lot more. It just makes you sort 0:17:26.320 --> 0:17:30.760 of believe in, you know, other possibilities. If you think 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:34.399 about technology that might make you able to sense the 0:17:34.520 --> 0:17:38.080 mood in a room or favorite example. Also you know, 0:17:38.200 --> 0:17:41.639 sense magnetic lords or something like that. You know where 0:17:41.920 --> 0:17:44.679 if you have technology to provide you this information and 0:17:44.760 --> 0:17:46.560 you know, we should be able to do it. So 0:17:46.640 --> 0:17:50.000 I think that's what e location has certainly made me 0:17:50.200 --> 0:17:53.320 very confident with that we can expand sensory reportoire. 0:17:53.960 --> 0:17:56.320 Wait, did you just say that we could expand our 0:17:56.400 --> 0:18:01.120 senses so we can sense magnetism using technolology and our 0:18:01.160 --> 0:18:04.600 brain can adapt to that well. As it happens, I 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:08.600 talked to a scientists working on just this idea. So 0:18:08.720 --> 0:18:11.160 when we come back, we're going to see how technology 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:14.600 can hack your brain to give you extra senses like 0:18:14.760 --> 0:18:19.520 sensing magnetic fields or even Wi Fi. Stay with us, 0:18:19.880 --> 0:18:35.400 we'll be right back. Hey, welcome back. We're talking about 0:18:35.440 --> 0:18:40.040 whether supersensus exist. Now, this last segment is going to 0:18:40.080 --> 0:18:44.040 seem a little bit like science fiction. For example, imagine 0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:46.760 a scenario where you're a chef or a cook and 0:18:46.800 --> 0:18:48.840 you work in a commercial kitchen. 0:18:48.840 --> 0:18:51.480 And somehow you can tell how hot something. 0:18:51.320 --> 0:18:54.160 Is just by looking at it. You wouldn't have to 0:18:54.160 --> 0:18:56.840 touch it or get near it to tell. You would 0:18:56.920 --> 0:18:59.680 just no, you could tell if a pan was the 0:18:59.760 --> 0:19:03.480 right temperature, or if a piece of steak was hot enough. 0:19:04.920 --> 0:19:07.840 Or imagine, if you could sense the Earth's magnetic field, 0:19:08.320 --> 0:19:11.320 you could have a perfect sense of direction. You would 0:19:11.320 --> 0:19:13.879 always know where north was, no matter how deep in 0:19:13.920 --> 0:19:16.320 a forest you were, or if you were inside a 0:19:16.359 --> 0:19:20.240 building or a crowded city you've never been to. Having 0:19:20.240 --> 0:19:23.679 these kinds of supersensus may seem like science fiction, but 0:19:23.760 --> 0:19:28.080 I promise it's not. It's real science, at least according 0:19:28.119 --> 0:19:31.320 to the next expert I talked to, doctor Amber Mymon. 0:19:33.200 --> 0:19:37.480 So my name is Amber Myimon. I'm a researcher at 0:19:37.520 --> 0:19:41.399 the interface of neuroscience and human computer interaction. Most of 0:19:41.440 --> 0:19:43.680 my research has to do with how we can use 0:19:43.800 --> 0:19:47.000 technologies to induce neuroplasticity. 0:19:47.160 --> 0:19:50.439 Now, I always thought that humans had five senses, but 0:19:50.760 --> 0:19:53.160 the first thing I learned from doctor Mymon is that 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:56.320 apparently we have more than five senses. 0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:04.560 So we basically inherited the five senses from philosophers many, many, 0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:08.480 many decades ago, such as Aristotle, who said that we 0:20:08.600 --> 0:20:12.840 have five basic senses. We have vision, hearing, touch, tastes, 0:20:12.920 --> 0:20:15.160 and smell, which people are usually familiar with. 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:17.240 But we don't have five senses. 0:20:17.560 --> 0:20:20.520 So that's the thing. It's an issue of hot debate. 0:20:20.600 --> 0:20:22.760 Right now, I can give you an example. We have 0:20:22.840 --> 0:20:26.919 something called approprioceptive sense, which is kind of a sense 0:20:27.040 --> 0:20:31.320 of where our body parts are located. So I can 0:20:31.400 --> 0:20:34.479 know where my hand is located, for example, even if 0:20:34.520 --> 0:20:37.120 I don't see my hand. And then we also have 0:20:37.359 --> 0:20:41.720 vestibular system, which controls our sense of balance and more 0:20:41.760 --> 0:20:42.200 and more. 0:20:43.560 --> 0:20:47.120 Yes, scientists can't really agree how many senses we have. 0:20:47.480 --> 0:20:50.639 Some people say our ability to sense temperature, or to 0:20:50.680 --> 0:20:53.640 feel or heart beat or are breathing, or our sense 0:20:53.680 --> 0:20:57.159 of balance, or even our ability to feel pain should 0:20:57.200 --> 0:21:00.639 also be included in our list of senses. A sense, 0:21:00.880 --> 0:21:03.919 it seems, includes any time we know something about the world, 0:21:04.240 --> 0:21:07.639 including our bodies, without thinking about it. It's when we 0:21:07.800 --> 0:21:11.760 just know information about the world. Okay, now let's get 0:21:11.800 --> 0:21:15.600 to supersensus. Let's get to the topic of supersensus. So 0:21:15.680 --> 0:21:18.440 there's the idea of augmenting your senses. 0:21:18.160 --> 0:21:21.480 Right, So the idea of augmenting our senses is generally 0:21:21.640 --> 0:21:25.679 changing our sensory abilities in a positive way for some 0:21:25.920 --> 0:21:31.480 form of improvement, like for example, Superman and see into 0:21:31.560 --> 0:21:35.080 the thermal range. Is it something that I've personally worked 0:21:35.119 --> 0:21:36.879 on and it's an interesting time. 0:21:37.680 --> 0:21:41.960 So a supersense is basically giving ourselves the ability to 0:21:42.119 --> 0:21:46.399 sense something we currently can't sense, like seeing into the 0:21:46.480 --> 0:21:49.840 infrared or having X ray vision, or being able to 0:21:49.920 --> 0:21:54.639 sense the Earth's magnetic field. And for that you need technology. 0:21:55.119 --> 0:21:55.280 Now. 0:21:55.320 --> 0:21:58.040 According to doctor Mama, there are two ways to do this. 0:21:58.640 --> 0:22:02.520 The first is to base turn yourself into a cyborg. 0:22:03.840 --> 0:22:08.680 There are methods to augment our senses that are invasive 0:22:08.960 --> 0:22:11.800 or they physically interact with our brain. So I can 0:22:11.840 --> 0:22:17.480 give you some examples. You can have an implant, for example, 0:22:17.600 --> 0:22:22.760 Retinal prosthesis are known as bionic eyes colloquially in day 0:22:22.800 --> 0:22:28.480 to day's each These are implants that electrically stimulate whether 0:22:28.480 --> 0:22:31.439 it's the retina today. There are also cortical implants that 0:22:31.520 --> 0:22:34.800 stimulate the brain directly, and what they do is they 0:22:34.840 --> 0:22:41.399 try to physically create the sensory information. They physically activate 0:22:41.960 --> 0:22:45.720 the retina, for example, to allow blind people to have 0:22:45.800 --> 0:22:47.400 some form of visual perception. 0:22:47.840 --> 0:22:50.320 And I guess can that be used to augment someone 0:22:50.600 --> 0:22:53.640 without a visual impairment? Like, can I use an implant 0:22:53.720 --> 0:22:54.640 to make me see better? 0:22:54.920 --> 0:22:58.280 Yes, absolutely. There's also more and more awareness of this 0:22:58.400 --> 0:23:03.040 concept of augmenting the senses, which means enhancing or extending. 0:23:03.880 --> 0:23:07.080 So one way to extend our senses with technology is 0:23:07.119 --> 0:23:11.880 with neural prosthetics. In other words, implanting some device senses 0:23:11.920 --> 0:23:15.200 something about the world and then having that device give 0:23:15.240 --> 0:23:19.840 that information directly to your nerves or directly to our brains. 0:23:20.320 --> 0:23:23.520