Speaker 1: On this episode of This League, we break down the
Speaker 1: firing and the hiring of the new Timberwolves head coach
Speaker 1: in a matter of ten minutes. We talk about the
Speaker 1: two types of basketball fans that exist in the world,
Speaker 1: ones that enjoy the beauty of basketball and ones who
Speaker 1: look at only wins, losses and numbers. Then it's time.
Speaker 1: It's finally here, the Lamello ball appreciation segment.
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's our our first coaching change. Big news,
Speaker 2: big news.
Speaker 1: Big news, coaching carousel. It's been a long time coming
Speaker 1: for our man, Ryan Saunders, who is essentially hired because
Speaker 1: he's the son of Flip Saunders. That's his main credential.
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's the facts. Minnesota Timberwolves fired Ryan Saunders
Speaker 1: after their loss against the Knicks. Probably not a surprise
Speaker 1: to anyone, given that the Timberwolves have only had seven
Speaker 1: wins on this season. They are seven and twenty four.
Speaker 1: This season's been a train wreck, it is. There's been
Speaker 1: nothing good to say. Well, there's just been like one
Speaker 1: or two good things to say about the Timberwolves, which
Speaker 1: we'll get into next. Karl Anthony Towns has missed a
Speaker 1: ton of games almost the entire season, with COVID D'Angelo
Speaker 1: Russell has missed the last eight games, who knows when
Speaker 1: he's coming back, and the team has lost eight of ten,
Speaker 1: including four in the row. So yeah, the Saunders getting
Speaker 1: the boot is definitely not shocking. I think it's been
Speaker 1: a long time coming. But the thing that was shocking
Speaker 1: was what happened right after. So you get whoaed little
Speaker 1: put a little tweet out, breaking news, breaking news, Ryan
Speaker 1: Saunders has been fired. This is at like almost midnight
Speaker 1: last night. Boom. And then you're like, okay, thinking in
Speaker 1: your head, who are they going to replace him with?
Speaker 1: And within ten minutes Shams dropped the hiring news whoa
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, Timberwolves have hired Chris Finch, not
Speaker 1: on an interim basis, to be their head coach of
Speaker 1: the Minnesota Timberwolves multi year contract. Holy moley, And this
Speaker 1: hire is very much a non Timberwolves type. Higher Finch
Speaker 1: is who is he? Because he's not a huge name
Speaker 1: to the average casual NBA fan, Finch is an under
Speaker 1: the radar coach in the mold of Nick Nurse. In fact,
Speaker 1: he is so in the mold of Nick Nurse. They
Speaker 1: met while coaching in Britain as rivals, struck up a friendship,
Speaker 1: worked together on and off ever since NBA Outsider. By
Speaker 1: all intents and purposes, he's won championships in Britain and
Speaker 1: in Europe. He's coached Olympic basketball. Considered one of the
Speaker 1: best offensive minds in the game, his motion offense has
Speaker 1: transformed the high lying Rockets with James Harden. He came
Speaker 1: in to transform that with Dan Toni and Daryl Moury.
Speaker 1: He then went to the Nuggets in twenty sixteen, transformed
Speaker 1: a little player named Nikola Jokic and Jamal Murray that
Speaker 1: became the fourth best offense in the NBA and in
Speaker 1: the last sixty games the first best offense in the NBA.
Speaker 1: Three fourths of that year. They were number one pretty
Speaker 1: much overnight in terms of points scored in efficiency. Then
Speaker 1: he bounced to New Orleans and had a little fun
Speaker 1: run with Drew Holliday and Boogie Cousins and Brandon Ingram.
Speaker 1: Last year, his entire role was to transform Brandon Ingram
Speaker 1: and revive his career that Drew Holliday DeMarcus Cousins. After
Speaker 1: DeMarcus Cousins got injured right he had Drew Holliday and
Speaker 1: Rondo and turned them into the monster that beat the
Speaker 1: Portland Trailblazers in a sweep. There was no business, no business.
Speaker 1: He put Miratic on. This is some nerd talk, but
Speaker 1: he put Miritic on Nurkic our center and pretty much
Speaker 1: locked Dame the fuck down with Drew and we went home.
Speaker 1: And now he pretty much got dicked out of the
Speaker 1: New Orleans job. So when Alvin Gentry got fired, he
Speaker 1: was supposed to be waiting in the wings to get
Speaker 1: the head coaching gig there, and then they gave the
Speaker 1: job to stan Van Gundy. Yuck. And when they gave
Speaker 1: the job to stan Van Gundy, Chris Finch was like,
Speaker 1: I'm out. I'm out. So since then he's been in
Speaker 1: Toronto for this part of this year, transforming Siakam and
Speaker 1: transforming this Raptor's offense into a more motion style offense.
Speaker 1: Now that they have different pieces than they had when
Speaker 1: they were a contender before, and it's been a rocky
Speaker 1: road and now they've seen to smooth things out and
Speaker 1: are beating good teams again. He also interviewed the first
Speaker 1: time that the Minnesota Timberwolves had a job opening and
Speaker 1: instead Gerson Roses was the director of Player Personnel and
Speaker 1: the GM in Houston when Chris Finch was running the
Speaker 1: Rio Grand team, the D League team in Houston, and
Speaker 1: also when he was an assistant coach for the Rockets.
Speaker 1: So they've got a little history there, right, And Gerson
Speaker 1: Ross is the GM now of the Minnesota Timberwolves. So
Speaker 1: Chris Finch interviewed with Gerson the first time around when
Speaker 1: they gave that job to Ryan Saunders, and now he's
Speaker 1: been basically waiting in the wings for the shoot to drop,
Speaker 1: and within ten minutes of the firing gets hired. That's
Speaker 1: where we are. Do you feel like you've learned anything?
Speaker 2: I do? I do. It's funny how things like this
Speaker 2: can go under the radar. People are gonna have this
Speaker 2: big impact and a lot of people don't even really
Speaker 2: know who they are.
Speaker 1: It's crazy, right, it's crazy, But not everyone. I personally
Speaker 1: am happy with this. This feels like a changing of
Speaker 1: the guard of a team and a franchise as a
Speaker 1: whole that has been we'll call it not great decision makers.
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's go with that.
Speaker 1: We'll call it their talent evaluation hasn't been exactly stellar.
Speaker 2: Pretty poor pretty poor.
Speaker 1: What they've gotten out of their pieces has been even
Speaker 1: worse than the pieces that they actually get. So I
Speaker 1: was happy when I saw this news.
Speaker 2: I was like, oh shit, okay, I feel like we
Speaker 2: all pull for the Wolves like a little bit.
Speaker 1: Come on, they've been They're a beaten child. They're beaten child,
Speaker 1: and I want to see Carl Anthony town succeed, don't you.
Speaker 1: But not everybody else was happy. One of the key
Speaker 1: members of saunders coaching staff is this guy named David Vanderpool.
Speaker 1: David Vanderpool worked in Portland and mentored, raised up and
Speaker 1: made Damian Lillard and CJ. McCollum into the two guards
Speaker 1: that they are today, which are one of the most
Speaker 1: potent back courts in the league besides probably Chris Paul
Speaker 1: and Devin Booker and Harden and Kyrie. Yeah that's I
Speaker 1: would say, and then obviously Clay and Steph. But Clay
Speaker 1: is injured right so early in Dame's career, when you
Speaker 1: would see Dame getting coached up having a little like
Speaker 1: little iPad in his hand, it was David Vanderpool right
Speaker 1: next to him every single time. And I know this
Speaker 1: as a Portland Trailblazers fan because I'm like, who is
Speaker 1: this guy that Dame is attached to the hip too?
Speaker 1: That was David Vanderpool. He's been in Minnesota for a
Speaker 1: while now, and a lot of people thought that David
Speaker 1: Vanderpool would get a head coaching gig. He actually interviewed
Speaker 1: for the Houston head coaching job that Steven Silas got
Speaker 1: didn't get it. Wow, So everyone thought Vanderpool was next
Speaker 1: in line to get the Timberwolves job when Ryan Saunders
Speaker 1: eventually hopefully got fired, and I think everybody wanted him
Speaker 1: to get fired because he was a legacy hire. Around
Speaker 1: midnight last night, just after the news of Finch's hiring broke,
Speaker 1: Damian decided to go on Twitter and express his discontent.
Speaker 1: This is what he says, How the hell do you
Speaker 1: not hire David Vanderpool And he's right there on the bench.
Speaker 1: He's been in the front office successfully all Caps and
Speaker 1: on the front of the bench of a winning team
Speaker 1: successfully for seven years and has also played a major
Speaker 1: role in the development of a dominant backhourt shaking my
Speaker 1: damn head. That's damning, and just for good measure, CJ
Speaker 1: decided to chime in as well. Make it make sense respectfully.
Speaker 1: It does make sense, though that's the problem. The Chris
Speaker 1: Finch hire does make sense. Not hiring or not interviewing
Speaker 1: Vanderpool makes zero sense in this league where we've got
Speaker 1: these protocols, these rules and regulations in terms of how
Speaker 1: you hire people and how you do not exclude people.
Speaker 1: Not interviewing Vanderpool was a mistake. But this hire does
Speaker 1: seem to be driven by Karl Anthony Towns. I think
Speaker 1: Karl Anthony Towns is saying, based on what I'm reading,
Speaker 1: I want to become Nikola Jokic. I too, would like
Speaker 1: to be a passing, distributing, playmaking big man that can
Speaker 1: turn into an MVP candidate and be the focal point
Speaker 1: of an offense in a new way. I don't want
Speaker 1: to have to put up fifty every single night down
Speaker 1: on the post. I don't want to have to do that,
Speaker 1: and I like that. I think if Karl Anthony Towns
Speaker 1: was a six to three guard and that was who
Speaker 1: you were building your franchise around, David Vanderpool would probably
Speaker 1: be a go to hire. But Chris Finch is known
Speaker 1: for developing wings and big man Anthony Davis brandon Ingram
Speaker 1: Nikola Jokic, so on and so on Siakham. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I would say that this is a complicated issue. I
Speaker 1: like David Vanderpool as a human being and as a coach.
Speaker 1: I know him person. But for once, the Timberwolves are
Speaker 1: actually interesting and dominating the news cycle, which they haven't
Speaker 1: done in a very long time, and that is something
Speaker 1: that I thought I would never say. So I do
Speaker 1: love Vanderpool. I wanted to be a head coach. I'm
Speaker 1: a Portland Trailblazers fan. But I understand fully why Gris
Speaker 1: and Rosis made this decision and made the move long
Speaker 1: term relationship and fit Amine. This guy Amine is a
Speaker 1: Portland native, went to school with, went to my high school.
Speaker 2: Did not know that.
Speaker 1: Wow, so there was a Portland little Portland mix, a
Speaker 1: little Timberwolve mix. You know. It's really interesting. Just as
Speaker 1: an aside, is that the Portland Trailblazers and the Minnesota
Speaker 1: Timberwolves are almost like sister franchises. They do a lot
Speaker 1: of trades with one another, Flip Flip Saunders and a
Speaker 1: bunch of different gms in Portland. You could even go
Speaker 1: back to the Kevin Pritchard days when he was running things.
Speaker 1: They did a lot of things together. They've had some
Speaker 1: bad blood coaches who go from Portland sometimes end up
Speaker 1: in Minnesota and vice versa. So this Portland Minnesota news
Speaker 1: back and forth was very interesting to me. Yeah, we
Speaker 1: have another Timberwolf segment.
Speaker 2: Though, let's go. Let's go Wolve's podcast.
Speaker 1: This is a Wolve's podcast.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: I've been putting off talking about this franchise, like I said,
Speaker 1: because one, they've won seven games, so what are we
Speaker 1: really talking about? And they've been largely irrelevant in terms
Speaker 1: of news, and I've been asked to discuss them from
Speaker 1: a multiple amount of listener dms and I just had
Speaker 1: said no, no, But they just dominated the news this
Speaker 1: entire weekend. So let's do it. I want to get
Speaker 1: deep Marty for a second with you. We're living in
Speaker 1: two Americas. Yes, as it relates to the NBA, there
Speaker 1: are people who find joy in the individual and beautiful
Speaker 1: moment of the game because of what it means not
Speaker 1: only for their soul but for the culture.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: They take pleasure it in a crossover or in a
Speaker 1: Kyrie or a Lucas step back. Right, that's what gets
Speaker 1: them going. Group chat type vibes Twitter. Because basketball is
Speaker 1: supposed to be fun. Yep, they fell in love with
Speaker 1: the game because of those moments, right, Highlights are cool.
Speaker 1: Highlights are cool. And then there are other people who
Speaker 1: look at basketball as a business. Wins, losses, How close
Speaker 1: are you to winning a championship? Stats or something called
Speaker 1: raptor I really don't know what it is, how close
Speaker 1: the team reading, net rating, dead cap, space, storylines, et cetera,
Speaker 1: et cetera. When you break it down like thatugh, do
Speaker 1: you want your It's basically like, are you an over
Speaker 1: person or you an under person? Do you bet on
Speaker 1: the over or do you bet on the under? Do
Speaker 1: you love joy? Do you take pleasure in the game
Speaker 1: or is it all about how how close you are
Speaker 1: to winning? And breaking it down in terms of Excel spreadsheets,
Speaker 1: I understand both povs. I kind of live somewhere in
Speaker 1: the gray of those two places.
Speaker 2: Yeah, me too, I would say.
Speaker 1: And the Timberwolves Aunt Edwards dunk on Friday Night put
Speaker 1: a spotlight on this philosophical divide in basketball. This is
Speaker 1: where we are. Aunt Edwards was the number one pick
Speaker 1: selected by the Timberwolves, and he's a rookie right now.
Speaker 1: Timberwolves are what a perennial loser.
Speaker 2: Yeah, probably the biggest one.
Speaker 1: We have, probably the biggest one and the biggest disappointment
Speaker 1: in terms of players that they could have drafted and
Speaker 1: then the players that they did draft.
Speaker 2: Sure. Yeah, when you're in that many lotteries, there's gonna
Speaker 2: be a.
Speaker 1: Lot of misses facts the satisfacts. They could have drafted
Speaker 1: Steph Curry and instead I think they drafted Ricky Rubio
Speaker 1: and Ny Flynn and Johnny Flynn yep and Johnny Flynn.
Speaker 1: Timberwolves at this point, like I've said multiple times, so
Speaker 1: far have only seven wins. They have a twenty two
Speaker 1: percent winning percentage. So at this point, the Wolves on
Speaker 1: Friday Night are playing the Raptors, the team that I
Speaker 1: told you was surging, the team that I told you
Speaker 1: their offense is starting to gel and they're up on
Speaker 1: the Raptors by eight. Whoo, let's go and Aunt Edwards
Speaker 1: posterizes this kid wanton Nabe going viral, top end game
Speaker 1: dunk in years just immediately broke the internet.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a hammer hammer.
Speaker 1: He put his nuts on wanton Nabe's face and put
Speaker 1: his hand on he stiff armed him and put his
Speaker 1: nuts in his face at the same time, the Internet
Speaker 1: was a blaze. They were filled with enthusiasm and joy.
Speaker 1: Finally something to be excited about as it relates to
Speaker 1: the Minnesota Timberwolves, until a few Big Jay journals and
Speaker 1: some Timberwolves fans decided to rain on the parade of
Speaker 1: everyone who is enjoying that moment. Nate Duncan, who I
Speaker 1: have ran into many times in the NBA media. He
Speaker 1: is a mah cap cap analyst. MA Nate Duncan came
Speaker 1: in and well, actually, Edwards, well, actually, I know you
Speaker 1: think this dunk is cool, but here's his stat line.
Speaker 1: Aunt Edwards tonight with the dunk of the year. He
Speaker 1: also has seven points on three for fourteen shooting and
Speaker 1: zero for seven from three. Fuck you, Nate Duncan, Fuck you.
Speaker 2: And Danny and Danny and whoever.
Speaker 1: Is shitting on Aunt Edwards in his shining moment, let
Speaker 1: that man live. Did you just well, actually Aunt Edwards
Speaker 1: who put his nuts on Wanton Abe's face in a
Speaker 1: viral moment that we're probably gonna be talking about ten
Speaker 1: years from now. Yes he did, Yes he did. And
Speaker 1: the Internet was a ratio. Here's the number that tells
Speaker 1: you everything that you need to know, forty five hundred
Speaker 1: quote tweets, thirteen hundred comments, and fifteen thousand likes. What
Speaker 1: does that tell you? People responded to that pretty strongly,
Speaker 1: didn't they?
Speaker 2: They did.
Speaker 1: That's the only stat that matters, and the numeric response
Speaker 1: shows you how polarized NBA Twitter is. There's this kid,
Speaker 1: Justin Tinsley who works for The Undefeated, and he summed
Speaker 1: it up perfectly. He said that Anthony Edwards statline tweet
Speaker 1: really was a masterclass between seeing basketball as a culture
Speaker 1: and seeing basketball as an Excel spreadsheet.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, I'm one of those that, especially with
Speaker 2: young players, I really want to appreciate all the cool
Speaker 2: things they can do, because, especially when you go to
Speaker 2: a team like that, there's not gonna be a whole
Speaker 2: lot of winning nights. So like, let's appreciate when guys
Speaker 2: do something cool and just coming in and immediately expecting
Speaker 2: nineteen year olds to have, you know, the most polished
Speaker 2: advanced stat line is just ridiculous. So yeah, like I
Speaker 2: was thrilled to see the Anthony Edwards dunk and I
Speaker 2: hope we see a lot more. And I don't really
Speaker 2: care what his stats are in that game exactly.
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody really was worried about Alan Ivernson's
Speaker 1: stat line when he broke Michael Jordan's ankles. Yeah, no one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, do we have any idea what his line was
Speaker 2: in that game?
Speaker 1: Nope, have no idea. But we're still talking about it,
Speaker 1: aren't we. This Marty is complicated. Is so complicated because
Speaker 1: the more you think about it, the more complicated it becomes.
Speaker 1: Why because Aunt Edwards was the number one draft pick
Speaker 1: by the Timberwolves. Anytime you're the number one draft pick
Speaker 1: for whatever reason, you're expected to not only produce right away,
Speaker 1: but you're expected to affect that team's winning percentage in
Speaker 1: a major way right way. That translates to wins and losses.
Speaker 1: You're gonna get a ton of playing time, so you're
Speaker 1: gonna be expected to make an impact. Is that expectation fair? No?
Speaker 1: But this is a business with billions of dollars on
Speaker 1: the line, and the Timberwolves have a history of drafting
Speaker 1: players in a lottery. Like I said, that don't work
Speaker 1: out over ones that become superstars and storylines are what
Speaker 1: drives the NBA is a business. Do you think a
Speaker 1: dunk can get you five six columns for the week. No,
Speaker 1: is that fair? No, But the media is also a
Speaker 1: business to the tune of billions of dollars a year,
Speaker 1: where clicks and views are what matter. You can't squeeze
Speaker 1: a ton of juice out of that Anthony Edwards dunk.
Speaker 1: But what you can squeeze out is whether the Timberwolves
Speaker 1: made the right decision by drafting him when LaMelo Ball
Speaker 1: was right there, and the storyline is here's a guy
Speaker 1: with the horrible stat line expected to produce right now,
Speaker 1: not now, but right now, and he told the world
Speaker 1: pre draft, I'm not that interested in basketball. I like football.
Speaker 1: If the NFL drafted me, I would go there immediately.
Speaker 1: That's not good with a bad team who a bad
Speaker 1: team took a chance on over a sure thing in
Speaker 1: Lamello Ball, and he had a great dunk. So if
Speaker 1: you're a Timberwolves fan or an NBA insider journalist, that's
Speaker 1: what you're gonna think about, is all that context. It's
Speaker 1: a dirty game. It leads us to make assumptions, prognostications,
Speaker 1: say things that are a little early, like me. I
Speaker 1: say things that are a little early all the time,
Speaker 1: because that's what you kind of have to do. You
Speaker 1: can't just wait and react because what are you really doing.
Speaker 2: That's really the only time the stat guys get to
Speaker 2: me is when they just want to be so quick
Speaker 2: to shit on a young player, like, let me give
Speaker 2: him some time, Give them some time figured it out.
Speaker 1: Nate Duncan is the no Fun Police, but he's been
Speaker 1: in the media a long time and he knows the game,
Speaker 1: and that's the game. So it's complicated, right because that's
Speaker 1: his job. But it's like, can you give us fifteen
Speaker 1: seconds to enjoy this kid? Can we let this kid
Speaker 1: have his moment in the sun when there hasn't really
Speaker 1: been very many moments in the sun. If you're a timberwolf,
Speaker 1: I mean, that's it. Please let us enjoy something anything,
Speaker 1: in the middle of a two year long pandemic, can
Speaker 1: we have something to be happy about? This pandemic has
Speaker 1: devastated the league, this country, our mental health, and I
Speaker 1: don't know, maybe it's just something about this climate that
Speaker 1: makes the juxtaposition between these two philosophies and these two
Speaker 1: mindsets so much easier for me to see. They cannot
Speaker 1: see these people, these big Jay's, these no fun polices,
Speaker 1: They can't see Anthony Edwards by himself. He's not just
Speaker 1: a kid from Georgia who's the number one pick. All
Speaker 1: they can see is the list of other lottery players
Speaker 1: that didn't work out. All they see is the seven
Speaker 1: wins that he's not helping them get anymore. All they
Speaker 1: see is the bleak future of their franchise. I mean,
Speaker 1: this shit is sad. Really, it's trauma. These fans have trauma, Oh,
Speaker 1: no doubt, no doubt. They cannot experience joy from a
Speaker 1: historically good dunk because it came from Aunt Edwards. It
Speaker 1: could have been anyone else and everyone would have been excited.
Speaker 1: But because it was Aunt, who is expected to do
Speaker 1: all of these things for this perennial loser, and he
Speaker 1: is not, and they made a wrong decision in drafting
Speaker 1: him over another player like LaMelo, all they can see
Speaker 1: is the what ifs, and so it immediately diminishes this moment.
Speaker 1: He's the symbol to them of everything that's wrong with
Speaker 1: their favorite team. I mean, people, though, can we just
Speaker 1: say wake up? This kid is nineteen and he is nasty.
Speaker 1: That dunk was beyond nasty. Let's just relish in something
Speaker 1: that we can talk about twenty years from now. Much
Speaker 1: like that Ai cross on Jordan. By the way, the
Speaker 1: Sixers lost that.
Speaker 2: Game, Oh they did.
Speaker 1: Yeah, nobody talks about that. Take those small victories, those
Speaker 1: moments of happiness wherever you can get them. Laugh, exclaim,
Speaker 1: feel some joy. This is why we love the game
Speaker 1: of basketball, these moments, not because of war or raptor
Speaker 1: or fucking stats. Don't let anything take the joy away
Speaker 1: from you in a game that we love, especially stats.
Speaker 1: LaMelo is up late night, ballin' up early, ballin' ballin'
Speaker 1: all the time. One of the reasons that the Wolves
Speaker 1: are so scarred is a rookie that they should have
Speaker 1: taken is LaMelo ball, and LaMelo ball is fucking bond.
Speaker 1: We talked a little bit about the Hornets earlier as
Speaker 1: one of the three teams that have become very, very
Speaker 1: fun to watch, and a lot of that is because
Speaker 1: of LaMelo. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean, he's so precise with everything he does, and
Speaker 2: that's something I really try to look for in young players,
Speaker 2: like the precision with passing, and he's affecting the game,
Speaker 2: not in a way that a lot of rookies come
Speaker 2: in and just put up good stats on middling teams,
Speaker 2: like Michael Carter Williams like he's actually really improved that
Speaker 2: team's level of play. And you can see it everywhere.
Speaker 1: You can see it with players who who were not
Speaker 1: doing shit, who now all of a sudden are performing
Speaker 1: like that franchise expected them to when they were drafted.
Speaker 1: And we'll get there. So what do we know about LaMelo.
Speaker 1: He's been in the spotlight since he was fourteen years old.
Speaker 1: He is Lonzo Ball's little brother. And Lonzo Ball was
Speaker 1: balling at UCLA right, and LaMelo was like fourteen, yeah,
Speaker 1: putting up ninety two points in a high school basketball game.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there was that clip of him pulling up from
Speaker 2: half court where he was pointing at the line. He
Speaker 2: had that dumb hair.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the dumb hair was like little odell s. His
Speaker 1: teeth were still coming in. He still had his baby teeth,
Speaker 1: and he was on. He was in the spotlight from
Speaker 1: then on. We've all had our eyes on him since then.
Speaker 1: Which is crazy. That ninety two point game was the
Speaker 1: fifth highest scoring total in the US by one player
Speaker 1: in the last twenty five years. That is inc credible.
Speaker 1: And instead of doing what Lonzo Ball did right, instead
Speaker 1: of going to Kentucky or UCLA or whatever, he bounced
Speaker 1: instead of going to college. He then went to Lithuania,
Speaker 1: to the other side of the earth with Jello exactly,
Speaker 1: which was a crazy story. How that whole thing went out.
Speaker 1: I think that the coach was like selling meat out
Speaker 1: of his trunk or something. The head coach was a
Speaker 1: fucking madman. Yeah him out, Yes, LaVar got that coach
Speaker 1: out quick quick. Yeah, it was It was crazy. And
Speaker 1: then he ended up playing I think eighteen games in Australia.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So when you leave the country and don't go to
Speaker 1: the traditional college route, people are not really watching your games.
Speaker 1: It's hard to get that stream from Lithuania, right. You
Speaker 1: couldn't exactly tell at that point whether LeVar was insane,
Speaker 1: whether he made the right decision, whether he was off
Speaker 1: the reservation. Who knew right, You had the big baller shoes,
Speaker 1: the explosive interviews on first take, and when he went
Speaker 1: crazy against Christine Leahey on the herd and like man
Speaker 1: explained her. All of that was creating this this tense
Speaker 1: drama around the family that we couldn't really tell and
Speaker 1: decipher how that was going to impact his son's right,
Speaker 1: he said, all three of my sons are gonna make
Speaker 1: it pro ye had these crazy, crazy proclamations that came true.
Speaker 1: By the way, he said barely. He said he could
Speaker 1: play and beat Michael Jordan one on one. I mean
Speaker 1: it was, it was. It was a side show for
Speaker 1: a while, undefeated, never lost. The whispers on Lamellow were
Speaker 1: not good. Everybody said that this kid's a me guy.
Speaker 1: All the critics are depicting him. Is this like Harlem,
Speaker 1: This like glorified Harlem, globe trotter, hot dog who pulls
Speaker 1: up from anywhere, gives you these highlights and doesn't help
Speaker 1: teams win. It's crazy. He's like flying all over when
Speaker 1: he was with Lithuania, all over to London and Berlin,
Speaker 1: like they were on this traveling circus tour, playing only
Speaker 1: seventeen games in Australia. And the book on the Mellow
Speaker 1: was that he was lazy, that he threw up too
Speaker 1: many shots, and he was just not built for the
Speaker 1: NBA right so much. That was his brand and that
Speaker 1: was the assumption of who he was. That his current
Speaker 1: head coach, James Brego was sus super sus on Melo.
Speaker 1: He was like, ah, it's what you hear, it's what
Speaker 1: you read, it's what's on the internet. It's like, I
Speaker 1: don't know about this kid, right, But what was lost
Speaker 1: in this all of this perception because again, like we say,
Speaker 1: storylines drive everything. That perception becomes reality, and that perception
Speaker 1: changes people's decisions. Right the Timberwolves, it was a sure
Speaker 1: thing and they were like, no, what's lost in that
Speaker 1: perception is that LaMelo Ball became the fourth player in
Speaker 1: NBL history to record back to back triple doubles. That
Speaker 1: was the first person. He was the first person since
Speaker 1: two thousand and nine to do that. By the way,
Speaker 1: they changed the rules to forty minutes a game, and
Speaker 1: no one had done that ever since except for Lamello.
Speaker 1: This is an eighteen year old kid balling against grown
Speaker 1: men and giving them the business the business. And because
Speaker 1: the Wolves, like I said, have the worst talent of
Speaker 1: value enters in the business, they are legitimately the worst.
Speaker 1: They were screed, Oh my god, storylines baby, no real scouting,
Speaker 1: just ripping shit from the headlines like this Lamello kid.
Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe it's all smoke and mirrors, maybe
Speaker 1: it's all highlights. Maybe it's all storylines. And remembering that
Speaker 1: Lonzo Ball you can call him a bust at two,
Speaker 1: there was other players like Jason Tatum that they could
Speaker 1: have taken over him, Fox Fox and on and on,
Speaker 1: and Lonzo and LaMelo have got to be the exact
Speaker 1: same player, right, No, just because they're brothers, Like, no,
Speaker 1: that's wrong. They're different players with different games, with different
Speaker 1: personalities and different skill sets. Wolves were scared of the
Speaker 1: reaction that another bust would bring them, like especially one
Speaker 1: like LaMelo with all of this chatter around him. So
Speaker 1: who did they draft? Someone that has never gotten any
Speaker 1: media chatter at all and everards no headlines. This kid
Speaker 1: from the University of Georgia, athletic and explosive, but certainly
Speaker 1: not on any of our radars. I mean, goodness, gracious,
Speaker 1: he came out of nowhere. Yes he was the quote
Speaker 1: unquote consensus number one, but that that happened pretty quick.
Speaker 1: And then the Warriors have Clay, So they don't want
Speaker 1: to draft LaMelo, right because they don't really know what
Speaker 1: to do with three guards, even though that would have
Speaker 1: been perfect for them. So they draft James Wiseman a
Speaker 1: long term call him a long term project with a
Speaker 1: very low floor and who knows what the ceiling is?
Speaker 1: And I tell you what, Holy shit, did the Hornets
Speaker 1: get lucky? LaMelo just falls into their laps and with
Speaker 1: no training camp, very little time for him to gel
Speaker 1: with his teammates, no structure put into place because of COVID,
Speaker 1: LaMelo is just thriving in the This is a crazy stat.
Speaker 1: In the nine games that LaMelo has started this year,
Speaker 1: so that's nine out of thirty, he's averaging twenty one points,
Speaker 1: seven rebounds, six assists, forty five percent from the field,
Speaker 1: forty four percent from three, and nine from the free
Speaker 1: throw line. Is that good?
Speaker 2: That's pretty good? Is that good? I'd say it's pretty good.
Speaker 1: I'd say that's pretty damn good. He's the youngest player
Speaker 1: in NBA history with the triple double. Not Kobe, not Lebron,
Speaker 1: not KG just LaMelo. And the world said LaMelo, you
Speaker 1: can't shoot. I'd say forty four percent from three means
Speaker 1: he can shoot. He can shoot really well.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: He's six six and he's probably gonna grow another two inches.
Speaker 1: That is terrifying. He's a nightmare for defenses because he
Speaker 1: has handles, he has court vision, he has size, and
Speaker 1: an uncanny, uncanny ability to find that open man no
Speaker 1: matter where they are, no matter where he is in traffic,
Speaker 1: out of traffic, men draped all over him, and somehow
Speaker 1: he finds them.
Speaker 2: He's got so many different ways to find them, Like
Speaker 2: that's the thing. He has so much in his bag.
Speaker 1: It's crazy, it's crazy. This is this LaMelo ball is
Speaker 1: why Malik Monk, why PJ. Washington are playing the best
Speaker 1: that they've ever played in their NBA career. Malik Monk
Speaker 1: had thirty six in one game that was new.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Who do you think was passing him the ball? Do
Speaker 1: you think he was creating his own shot? Absolutely not.
Speaker 1: We saw that Malik Monk can't create his own shot.
Speaker 1: He's getting that. Those buckets are coming because Lamello is
Speaker 1: finding him. That is why Scary Terry is still averaging
Speaker 1: seventeen points a game off the bench. They paid Scary
Speaker 1: Terry the bag and LaMelo was like, you're on the bench, homie, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I am taking that starting job.
Speaker 2: He hit that game winner the other night though he
Speaker 2: did it is.
Speaker 1: What has resurrected Gordon Hayward's career. This is insane. They're
Speaker 1: making The Hornets are making three hundred and fifteen passes
Speaker 1: per game, second only to the seventy six Ers, and
Speaker 1: our top five in fast break points. Okay, they lead
Speaker 1: the league in assists, Oh my god. And even though
Speaker 1: he came off the bench for most this season, his
Speaker 1: passes per minute are only behind Sabonis, Jokich, Simmons and
Speaker 1: Draymond Green. That kid loves to distribute the rock. I
Speaker 1: mean Sabonis, Simmons and are known as distributors, and Green
Speaker 1: they're known as big men that love to pass.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: Team as a whole after being in the depths of
Speaker 1: hell for a very long time, fucking six in the East,
Speaker 1: playing some of the most fun basketball that we see
Speaker 1: this year, largely why because of Lamello. When was the
Speaker 1: last time that you could say that the Hornets were exciting.
Speaker 2: There was that one year where they had big al
Speaker 2: where they made like sort of a run.
Speaker 1: Remember they had CP three. They had CP three before
Speaker 1: Michael Jordan took over. That was fun. And then they
Speaker 1: changed teams and changed cities and then turn into the
Speaker 1: Pelicans and then back to the Hornets and it was
Speaker 1: like a whole. Baron Davis was fun. I like that team. Oh,
Speaker 1: Larry Johnson, Grandmama, David Wesley. I mean that was a
Speaker 1: long ass time ago. I was a child. Then I
Speaker 1: was a child. I think I was like seven. So
Speaker 1: now everyone on LaMelo who was shit talking him has
Speaker 1: changed their tune, haven't they. You have grizly coaches and
Speaker 1: guys who never give out praise, talent evaluators who are
Speaker 1: tight lipped and good at their jobs gushing over LaMelo.
Speaker 1: You have Steve Kerr, Greg Popovich, Tom Thibodeau, Rick Carlisle
Speaker 1: all gushing for him. These are not the kind of
Speaker 1: guys that you see gassing up players on other teams.
Speaker 1: They're like, yeah, he's a nice player. These people are saying, oh, no,
Speaker 1: he's got the gift. This kid hasn't the guy who
Speaker 1: was forecasted to be a selfish, hot dog chucker a
Speaker 1: professional stat getter, And now you're hearing Tibbs saying, yeah,
Speaker 1: this kid's got the rare thing about him. The only
Speaker 1: one who's not surprised is Lamello himself. What did LaMelo
Speaker 1: say after his triple double against the Hawks?
Speaker 2: Marty Yeah, No, I loved this, he said, Uh, I've
Speaker 2: been doing this ever since I was three, so it
Speaker 2: comes quite easy to meet. For real. I played a
Speaker 2: lot of twenty one when I was growing up.
Speaker 1: I fucking love this kid. Oh my god. Everyone doubted
Speaker 1: him from the time he was fourteen years old. He's
Speaker 1: been in the spotlight since he was a child, and
Speaker 1: every step of the way, he just continues to prove
Speaker 1: everybody wrong. How can you not love that? Not one
Speaker 1: person now has a bad word to say about him.
Speaker 1: We talk about joy in the last segment. Howskea is
Speaker 1: supposed to be fun? No one looks like they're having
Speaker 1: more joy out there than LaMelo Ball. It's crazy. You
Speaker 1: want an example of what a leader and a player
Speaker 1: nineteen year old LaMelo Ball is Terry Rosier, a guy
Speaker 1: that has been competing for minutes with him, hit a
Speaker 1: game winner against the Warriors on Saturday night, and who
Speaker 1: was the first player to run across the court to
Speaker 1: give a huge hug and embrace, jumping all over Terry Rosier.
Speaker 1: That was Lamello. When Draymond Green got teed up kicked
Speaker 1: out of a game, Lamello's just losing his mind. He
Speaker 1: loves this game, loves this game. Not only is Lamello
Speaker 1: the rookie of the year, he is the steel of
Speaker 1: the draft, probably the first home run draft pick that
Speaker 1: the Hornets have had in the Jordan era, and he
Speaker 1: just might fuck around and change the future of this
Speaker 1: franchise and Jordan's legacy as an NBA owner as a result.
Speaker 1: And that is not hyper believe. All right, let's get
Speaker 1: into some dms, all right.
Speaker 2: First up we have is Joel Embiid's injury history a
Speaker 2: source of concern for the Sixers going forward.
Speaker 1: So until they lost last night against the Raptors, the
Speaker 1: Sixers at one point were thirteen and zero when Joel Embiid,
Speaker 1: Ben Simmons, Tobias Harris, Seth Curry and Danny Green started.
Speaker 1: That is a wagon. They are one in five Without
Speaker 1: Embiid in the lineup, they are forty six and seventy
Speaker 1: in his career when he misses games. And the problem
Speaker 1: is though he misses a lot of games, a lot
Speaker 1: of games. I looked at this up and it was
Speaker 1: like staggering. He has missed more than a quarter of
Speaker 1: the season every year that he's played in the NBA.
Speaker 1: After that's after missing a full two years with the
Speaker 1: foot injury when he came into the league. So am
Speaker 1: I concerned? Is that a concern? I mean, what do
Speaker 1: you think? Look at the facts and you tell me
Speaker 1: they cannot win without him? And he misses twenty five
Speaker 1: percent of the games. Yes, I would be concerned. Yes,
Speaker 1: it would. Every time I see Joel hit the floor,
Speaker 1: every time I see him with a hot pack on
Speaker 1: his back, every time I hear he's out for rest
Speaker 1: or recovery, every time I see him stretching out, I
Speaker 1: would be concerned. Holy shit, is this it? Is this
Speaker 1: what it's gonna be? Is he out? Is he? Is
Speaker 1: there something wrong? Yeah? I would be concerned. Every time
Speaker 1: the camera pans to him when he's not on the floor,
Speaker 1: I would be concerned. Yes, there's no player other than
Speaker 1: Lebron James whose team rises and falls more when they're
Speaker 1: on the floor and off the floor than Joel Embiid.
Speaker 1: That's it. It's just him and Lebron. He's having the
Speaker 1: best season of his career because when he is in
Speaker 1: right now, he is incredible, putting up fifty and marquee games,
Speaker 1: single handedly transforming the center position as a whole. Yes,
Speaker 1: Embiid is incredible. He's better on the perimeter, I would say,
Speaker 1: than some point guards on his own team. Sometimes he's
Speaker 1: the best point guard on the floor at any given time.
Speaker 1: No shade, But if I were a Sixers fan, I
Speaker 1: would be concerned. Yes, injury history is meaningful every time
Speaker 1: he winces. Yes, he's already missed time. And let's just
Speaker 1: hope he's already missed more than twenty five percent of
Speaker 1: the season this year, this year, twenty five percent. And
Speaker 1: let's just hope everybody will say, Oh, Trista, that's just
Speaker 1: that's just load management. Don't trip. If it's load management, great, awesome.
Speaker 1: If it's not load management, we got problems. Let's hope
Speaker 1: that Doc is keeping him fresh so they can get
Speaker 1: to the playoffs and he doesn't miss any playoff games
Speaker 1: because without him, your team sixers are in trouble.
Speaker 2: Trouble, Okay, next step, We've got thoughts on Shay Gillis,
Speaker 2: Alexander and Lou Dort on OKC because fuck the East
Speaker 2: Coast media elite.
Speaker 1: I don't know who asked that, but God bless him,
Speaker 1: because I've been fine trying to find ways to talk
Speaker 1: about lou Dort. Lou Dort is one of my favorite players,
Speaker 1: and I love players like him because he does all
Speaker 1: the little things and he has been overlooked. He wasn't
Speaker 1: even drafted last year. He was a rookie who came
Speaker 1: into the league as a two way player and then
Speaker 1: just put on clamps. Lou Dort, I am a Lou
Speaker 1: Dort Stan. It's a truth. It's true. Lou against Dort
Speaker 1: had the highest defensive effort in the NBA. In other words,
Speaker 1: he runs significantly harder on defense than he does on offense.
Speaker 1: No one runs faster on defense as opposed to offense
Speaker 1: in the NBA other than him. It's a crazy, crazy stat. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the dudes twenty one putting on clamps. A blitzing animal,
Speaker 1: a pest, more annoying than almost anyone out there, so annoying.
Speaker 1: Harden shot one for seven against Dort when he was
Speaker 1: a rookie in the playoffs. He put the clamps on Harden, Kyrie,
Speaker 1: on Lebron, pretty much on everyone pretty much. I think
Speaker 1: he's probably one of the best, if not the best,
Speaker 1: on ball defenders that the league has coming in undrafted.
Speaker 1: That's crazy.
Speaker 2: I mean, you gotta talk about him if that comes out.
Speaker 1: Got to talk about him. He has spent the highest
Speaker 1: percentage of minutes guarding the opposing team's number one than
Speaker 1: anyone in the league. Highest. No one gets the best
Speaker 1: assignment more than or the worst assignment, whatever you want
Speaker 1: to call it the hardest assignment more than lou Dort
Speaker 1: and nobody noticed that as a rookie. He is the
Speaker 1: size to disrupt. He has the size to disrupt guards
Speaker 1: in and out of the paint. He's fast enough to
Speaker 1: go around screens, patient enough to not get baited into
Speaker 1: fouls by Harden and dame, strong enough to hold his
Speaker 1: own against guys like Lebron on the post. So how
Speaker 1: do I feel about lou Dort. I feel tremendous. I
Speaker 1: love him. James Harden after that series with OKC, all
Speaker 1: he could say was Wow, this dude is gonna have
Speaker 1: a career. And Austin Rivers said it best. We could
Speaker 1: not wait to get that guy lou Dort off. We've
Speaker 1: wanted him out of there. Quinn Snyder called him one
Speaker 1: of the best on ball defenders in the league. He
Speaker 1: makes everyone he guards upset. He makes basketball unfun for players,
Speaker 1: and I am here for that. As it relates to SGA.
Speaker 1: Love him even more if possible, because he's that offensive guy. Right.
Speaker 1: We know the SGA finished eighth in the NBA voting
Speaker 1: for guards, and there's a reason for that. In his
Speaker 1: first season as the number one option, SGA is averaging
Speaker 1: twenty two and a half points, six and a half assists,
Speaker 1: and five and a half rebounds per game while shooting
Speaker 1: fifty one percent from the field and thirty eight percent
Speaker 1: from three. Goddamn solid. He's one of five players. This
Speaker 1: is even better. He's he's one of five players averaging
Speaker 1: at least twenty two points, six assists and five rebounds.
Speaker 1: Do you know who those people are? Those others lebro On,
Speaker 1: James Nikola, Jokic, James Harden, and Doncic are the others.
Speaker 1: Pretty damn good company.
Speaker 2: I would say he has.
Speaker 1: The second best field goal percentage in that group, behind Jokic.
Speaker 1: They do it all. Center Yo Okac is underrated. Okac
Speaker 1: is not being talked about a lot in the media
Speaker 1: because they are not very good. But they have young pieces,
Speaker 1: and they have a core, and they have pretty much
Speaker 1: every single LA Clipper draft pick till the end of time,
Speaker 1: so they're gonna get some guys here and there. So
Speaker 1: I like those two, and I like the Thunder and
Speaker 1: where they're going, and I like Sam Presty too.
Speaker 2: Okay, moving on, We've got Brandon Ingram is actually fantastic.
Speaker 2: Why does he get no credit for a guy who
Speaker 2: can you.
Speaker 1: Hate brandon Ingram.
Speaker 2: I don't quite hate him. I don't think he's as
Speaker 2: amazing as a lot of people do.
Speaker 1: So what's the question?
Speaker 2: Okay, so the full question is brandon Ingram is actually fantastic.
Speaker 2: Why does he get no credit for a guy who
Speaker 2: can score like Durant? And that's just silly.
Speaker 1: So why does he get credit? Why does brandon Ingram
Speaker 1: get credit for a guy who can score like Durant? Firstly,
Speaker 1: brandon Ingram cannot score like Durant. Yeah, brandon Ingram is
Speaker 1: not seven feet tall and shooting over everyone at will.
Speaker 1: But brandon Ingram is very good. Oh, of course he
Speaker 1: is very good. He averages around twenty three game. But
Speaker 1: I would still say that he's underutilized. And the reason
Speaker 1: why is very obvious. Now Chris Finch is now gone
Speaker 1: and our boy stan Van Gundy is running things through
Speaker 1: his eye on and that's okay, but it's not good
Speaker 1: enough to me. Against the Celtics, there were stretches where
Speaker 1: he just stood around. He was literally on the left
Speaker 1: side of the court not involved in the offense for
Speaker 1: the entire stretch, and then on the other side on defense,
Speaker 1: he was not involved there either. He's just nowhere. He's
Speaker 1: not involved. So Zion's getting a lot of reps, and
Speaker 1: maybe some of those reps should go to Bi, because,
Speaker 1: like we said before, Marty Zion has two moves in
Speaker 1: the post, one move in the post. Really, it's that
Speaker 1: like little lefty spin move, and we know he's going
Speaker 1: to the left and everybody can scheme for that. So
Speaker 1: brandon Ingram has a much bigger bag of tricks than
Speaker 1: Zion does, and I think that stan Van Gunn he's
Speaker 1: not utilizing him nearly enough. I watched Bi get buckets
Speaker 1: at will to put that Pelican's team up to go
Speaker 1: into overtime and to win the game. So if Doris
Speaker 1: Burke knows that Zion is only going left, and I
Speaker 1: know that he's only going left, then we sure as
Speaker 1: hell know the NBA defenders know that Zion's only go left.
Speaker 1: So I think if Bi gets more touches he's going
Speaker 1: to get, he's going to be more effective and the
Speaker 1: Pels are going to win more games. So I like BI.
Speaker 1: I don't know that he is Kevin Durant though, so
Speaker 1: I don't know who that he's not that Pelicans fan is.
Speaker 1: He is fantastic he's better than people think, but he's
Speaker 1: no Kevin Durant. Dah.
Speaker 2: I'd like to see his fourth quarter numbers compared with Durant. Yeah, exactly, Yeah, Okay,
Speaker 2: last up we've got What do you think of fan
Speaker 2: voting in the All Star Game?
Speaker 1: What do I think of fan voting in the All
Speaker 1: Star Game? I think it's big trash. I think it's terrible.
Speaker 1: I think that there are fans who have no idea
Speaker 1: what's going on as it relates to the NBA, and
Speaker 1: that is how you get guys like Alex Caruso and
Speaker 1: Klay Thompson getting fan votes. It is awful. It is
Speaker 1: a popularity contest. It is not about how good players are.
Speaker 1: It is about storylines as usual, and these casuals are
Speaker 1: getting the same votes as everyone else, and I think
Speaker 1: it's awful. I think it's awful. I think I am
Speaker 1: disrespected by Luka Doncic getting the art over Damian Lillard.
Speaker 1: I think it's garbage. I think coaches need to decide
Speaker 1: and fans do not. It's awful. Who is to blame
Speaker 1: that eight year old kid in Dallas who voted for
Speaker 1: Luca or that eight year old kid in Oakland voting
Speaker 1: for Clay. It's like Clay's not playing. Clay is hurt.
Speaker 1: He doesn't get any votes. No votes for Clay zero.
Speaker 1: Alex Cruser doesn't deserve a fucking vote either. He's a janitor.
Speaker 2: Zaza Pachule used to get votes too.
Speaker 1: It's gross. Fuck them kids that are voting for players
Speaker 1: who cannot compete in the All Star Game like Clay Thompson,
Speaker 1: get the fuck out of here. That's insane. Dame did
Speaker 1: not make the All Star Game two years in a row,
Speaker 1: averaging twenty seven points, taking Blazers of the playoff single handily,
Speaker 1: and nope, snub fan votes are what also gets Devin
Speaker 1: Booker not making an All Star Game in six years, right,
Speaker 1: Marty exactly. Fuck those kids, fuck the fan votes. So
Speaker 1: that's all the time that we have for This League podcast.
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