WEBVTT - Part Two: Vince McMahon, History's Greatest Monster 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:05.040 Robert Evans here and we'll get to the Vince McMahon 0:00:05.040 --> 0:00:07.040 episodes in a second. I wanted to let you all 0:00:07.080 --> 0:00:09.280 know that for the fourth year in a row, we 0:00:09.320 --> 0:00:13.280 are doing our fundraiser for the Portland Diaper Bank. Behind 0:00:13.320 --> 0:00:15.680 the Bastards supporters have been helping to fund the Portland 0:00:15.760 --> 0:00:18.799 Diaper Bank since twenty twenty and bought millions of diapers 0:00:18.840 --> 0:00:21.040 for people who really need them. So if you go 0:00:21.079 --> 0:00:24.759 to GoFundMe and type in bTB fundraiser for PDX Diaper Bank, 0:00:24.920 --> 0:00:28.160 or just type in bTB fundraiser Diaper Bank, gofund me 0:00:28.320 --> 0:00:31.280 into Google anything like that, you will find it. So 0:00:31.360 --> 0:00:34.800 please go fund me bTB Fundraiser for Portland Diaper Bank. 0:00:35.200 --> 0:00:37.800 Help us raise the money that these people need to 0:00:37.800 --> 0:00:48.160 get diapers to folks who need them desperately. All right, everybody, 0:00:48.200 --> 0:00:51.159 welcome back to Behind the Bastards. We're gearing up for 0:00:51.360 --> 0:00:55.760 a really intense match today. In one corner of the 0:00:55.840 --> 0:01:01.840 room we have Sean Baby, the famous guy on the Internet, 0:01:02.080 --> 0:01:04.120 and on the under court of By God, it's Tom 0:01:04.200 --> 0:01:07.160 Rayman with a steel chair O the. 0:01:07.200 --> 0:01:12.360 Cream the crop rising a top the cream Crop. I 0:01:12.360 --> 0:01:13.760 don't know why I had to pick one of you 0:01:13.840 --> 0:01:15.520 to be the Steelers. 0:01:15.560 --> 0:01:19.280 Bring this energy, but let me get into it, grabbed 0:01:19.360 --> 0:01:23.479 the bolls of your enemies and used him to power 0:01:23.560 --> 0:01:27.520 the thrusters that take the Warriors rocket to the top 0:01:27.560 --> 0:01:28.959 of the Bastards. 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:33.160 Well, that was great. 0:01:33.319 --> 0:01:37.680 This is behind the Bastards podcast that is inconsistently opened, 0:01:38.480 --> 0:01:41.400 but I appreciate the edge that you both lent to this. 0:01:42.880 --> 0:01:45.360 We Are We Are, We Are Coming in Hot and 0:01:45.480 --> 0:01:48.920 Part two of the Vince McMahon series, the episode where 0:01:48.960 --> 0:01:53.800 we finally talk about Vince McMahon. I hope you're all 0:01:54.240 --> 0:01:56.360 now caught up all of our people who were not 0:01:56.400 --> 0:01:58.560 coming in as wrestling fans, and I also hope that 0:01:58.600 --> 0:02:02.360 our wrestling fans learn a thing or two in our 0:02:02.440 --> 0:02:05.920 last episode before we diverted to talk about the von 0:02:06.040 --> 0:02:09.440 eric family. I kind of left wrestling in the fifties 0:02:09.440 --> 0:02:12.680 and sixties when the NWA and television had started to 0:02:12.680 --> 0:02:15.360 turn it into a big business with seriously big money 0:02:15.680 --> 0:02:19.840 for the first time. Now, today, pro wrestling salaries are 0:02:19.880 --> 0:02:22.839 pretty pitiful. I think the average is like fifty two 0:02:22.880 --> 0:02:26.000 thousand per year, which may sound good for you if 0:02:26.000 --> 0:02:28.120 you're making like thirty five grand a year, but you 0:02:28.200 --> 0:02:31.200 have to remember your job does not entail getting a 0:02:31.200 --> 0:02:34.840 head injury every single night. So it's really you have 0:02:34.880 --> 0:02:38.400 to cut some dollars off of that salary, which is 0:02:38.440 --> 0:02:40.480 not wildly you know, crazy anyway. 0:02:40.560 --> 0:02:41.240 Yeah, makes you this. 0:02:41.360 --> 0:02:43.680 You live on a bus, you'd pay eight grand a 0:02:43.720 --> 0:02:47.480 month for painkillers and steroids. You get hitting out of 0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:51.799 the chair seven times a day, and any tiny mistake 0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:52.639 will get you fired. 0:02:52.960 --> 0:02:56.760 Yeah, making making an average American middle class salary for 0:02:56.919 --> 0:03:00.480 collecting TBIs like kids in the nineties collected hogs. 0:03:00.960 --> 0:03:04.720 And by the way, you have no retirement and retirement 0:03:04.760 --> 0:03:06.959 absolutely whatsoever. 0:03:07.040 --> 0:03:09.120 Yeah, your retirement is dying at thirty seven. 0:03:11.200 --> 0:03:14.320 Yeah, that's your pension. Is you're not gonna make it 0:03:14.360 --> 0:03:17.120 to fifty. You're secure in the knowledge. 0:03:16.760 --> 0:03:17.280 That you're not. 0:03:18.600 --> 0:03:22.560 I mean, one of the saddest moments in kind of 0:03:22.600 --> 0:03:25.880 pro wrestling history is is my hero Rowdy Roddy Piper, 0:03:26.240 --> 0:03:28.600 when he was like sixty or sixty one, gave an 0:03:28.639 --> 0:03:31.600 interview where he was like, look like, I'm out of cash, 0:03:31.880 --> 0:03:34.240 you know, between the medical bills and everything, Like, I 0:03:34.240 --> 0:03:36.840 don't have you know, any of the money left that 0:03:36.920 --> 0:03:38.800 I made during all of those years that I was 0:03:38.840 --> 0:03:41.520 one of the biggest stars in wrestling. You know, I'm Canadian, 0:03:41.640 --> 0:03:43.440 I have a pension, but it doesn't kick in until 0:03:43.440 --> 0:03:45.400 I'm sixty five, and I'm not going to make it 0:03:45.400 --> 0:03:52.560 to sixty five. Like it's a bleak, bleak interview to watch. Yeah, Anyway, 0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:55.680 that's the way things are now. Back in the day, 0:03:55.920 --> 0:03:57.840 in this kind of period where we're having the first 0:03:57.920 --> 0:04:01.440 real big height of wrestling and alevision kind of coming together, 0:04:02.040 --> 0:04:06.360 wrestlers were paid reasonably well. Now they're destroying their bodies 0:04:06.400 --> 0:04:08.760 probably at a faster rate. Right, we know less for 0:04:08.840 --> 0:04:10.880 one thing, Like we didn't know what we know now 0:04:10.920 --> 0:04:13.240 about steroids, so it was kind of impossible to do 0:04:13.280 --> 0:04:17.800 them without destroying your heart very rapidly. Nowadays you can't, like, 0:04:17.880 --> 0:04:20.600 you know, all these like celebrities who are on steroids 0:04:20.600 --> 0:04:23.080 for movies and stuff aren't doing the same thing to 0:04:23.120 --> 0:04:27.200 their bodies that like the Vaughan Erik kids work, Which 0:04:27.240 --> 0:04:29.440 is not to say you should do steroids listeners, it's 0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:31.120 just it's it's less toxic. 0:04:31.200 --> 0:04:34.000 Now are going to steroids do them today? Not in 0:04:34.080 --> 0:04:34.920 nineteen fifty eight. 0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:40.760 Yes, don't do steroids and yeah, yeah, and also you. 0:04:40.720 --> 0:04:44.599 Know, but Jose Canseco's book juice. He's got some tips 0:04:46.400 --> 0:04:50.680 travel to the future. Think his book Travel to the 0:04:50.680 --> 0:04:52.000 Future Your Steroids. 0:04:53.200 --> 0:04:57.640 When you do enough steroids, you visit the future. But 0:04:57.800 --> 0:04:59.760 in those days and kind of this first big wave 0:04:59.800 --> 0:05:04.320 in the sixties, most pros were compensated pretty well. That 0:05:04.680 --> 0:05:06.480 is to say that we're making what people at the 0:05:06.480 --> 0:05:09.039 time would have considered pretty good money. This is one 0:05:09.080 --> 0:05:12.080 of the reasons why wrestling never unionized. We'll talk a 0:05:12.080 --> 0:05:14.400 little bit later about another reason why it didn't unionize, 0:05:14.440 --> 0:05:17.280 but kind of at the beginning of its rise to prominence, 0:05:17.320 --> 0:05:18.600 a lot of guys would be like, well, we're making 0:05:18.640 --> 0:05:21.200 great money, why do we need to unionize. The answer 0:05:21.240 --> 0:05:24.680 to that is because Vince McMahon will inevitably come along 0:05:24.839 --> 0:05:25.800 in your industry. 0:05:26.800 --> 0:05:28.800 When you said the other reason they didn't unionize him 0:05:28.839 --> 0:05:30.200 like he's talking about Ncentman. 0:05:30.200 --> 0:05:34.040 Yeah, absolutely, but that comes later, so he's on his way, 0:05:34.120 --> 0:05:37.400 like fanos So. 0:05:37.880 --> 0:05:41.279 Television caused wrestling to go mainstream, and TV execs during 0:05:41.279 --> 0:05:45.280 the Golden Age of TV loved it because wrestling not 0:05:45.320 --> 0:05:47.120 only did it get a lot of eyeballs, people are 0:05:47.160 --> 0:05:50.359 always wanting to rotch wrestling. It's incredibly cheap to produce, 0:05:50.480 --> 0:05:52.880 right you don't need a ton of blocking, you don't 0:05:52.880 --> 0:05:56.640 need you know, special effects people. You don't need the 0:05:56.680 --> 0:05:59.520 same kind of you know stars that you have to 0:05:59.560 --> 0:06:01.960 have for a drama or something. You need a ring 0:06:02.080 --> 0:06:05.279 in huge men who are willing to hurt themselves for money, right. 0:06:05.200 --> 0:06:07.880 Its own like source of profit, like the ticket sales, 0:06:07.920 --> 0:06:12.400 and yeah, yeah, and yeah sorry, I'm just saying you 0:06:12.440 --> 0:06:15.159 can theoretically make money on a wrestling broadcast before even 0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:15.760 gets on TV. 0:06:16.200 --> 0:06:18.440 Yeah, and we're getting to that. That is what people 0:06:18.440 --> 0:06:21.239 eventually figure it out. And one of the first people 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:24.120 to realize kind of how profitable television could be for 0:06:24.160 --> 0:06:28.119 wrestling was Vincent James McMahon, the father of our Vince. 0:06:28.440 --> 0:06:31.120 He was born on July sixth, nineteen fourteen, to a 0:06:31.160 --> 0:06:36.039 sports promoter named Jess McMahon in West Harlem. Now, over time, 0:06:36.240 --> 0:06:38.680 Vince we'll call him Vince Senior for the purpose of 0:06:38.720 --> 0:06:41.599 these episodes, and we'll call r Vince Vince Junior otherwise 0:06:41.600 --> 0:06:45.479 it's going to get way too complicated. Over time, Vince 0:06:45.480 --> 0:06:48.920 Senior's father and older brother got really into boxing promotion, 0:06:49.839 --> 0:06:52.520 and you know, Vince Senior eventually follows his dad as 0:06:52.520 --> 0:06:56.240 a promoter in nineteen thirty one, his dad noticed that 0:06:56.320 --> 0:06:59.200 pro wrestling seemed to be a growing concern. People are 0:06:59.200 --> 0:07:01.560 really getting into the kind of thing a lot more. 0:07:01.560 --> 0:07:03.320 So he decided to promote a match, and he wound 0:07:03.400 --> 0:07:05.640 up thinking it might be a good business. For the 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:10.400 next fifteen years, Vince McMahon Senior's father worked in both 0:07:10.440 --> 0:07:13.360 boxing and wrestling, booking matches all throughout the Greater New 0:07:13.480 --> 0:07:16.560 York area. He expanded his business to DC and sent 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.600 his son to run his office there. Vincent Senior was 0:07:19.640 --> 0:07:23.160 on a swell path until you know, World War Two happened, 0:07:23.520 --> 0:07:26.200 that whole shebang, and he had to go overseas for 0:07:26.200 --> 0:07:28.680 a couple of years in the military. It was during 0:07:28.760 --> 0:07:31.320 this period that he met up with a young woman 0:07:31.600 --> 0:07:35.520 named Vicky Hanner. By nineteen forty three, Vicky was pregnant 0:07:35.560 --> 0:07:38.200 with his child. This is going to be our Vince McMahon. 0:07:38.600 --> 0:07:41.080 Vicky was married to another guy at the time, and 0:07:41.160 --> 0:07:44.000 while they did file for divorce before she got pregnant, 0:07:44.040 --> 0:07:46.960 or while he filed a divorce petition against her before 0:07:47.000 --> 0:07:49.840 she got pregnant, she didn't like do anything with it, 0:07:50.160 --> 0:07:53.400 and so the divorce didn't go through until nineteen forty seven, 0:07:54.200 --> 0:07:57.040 she and Vincent Senior, while kind of in a big 0:07:57.080 --> 0:08:00.160 amous relationship, moved to New York, where they had their 0:08:00.200 --> 0:08:04.800 first son, Roderick James McMahon, who is Vince McMahon's older brother, 0:08:04.920 --> 0:08:08.280 out of wedlock on October twelfth. The couple were married 0:08:08.280 --> 0:08:11.160 in nineteen forty four, while Vicki is again still legally 0:08:11.200 --> 0:08:14.280 married to her first husband, which means that Vincent might 0:08:14.440 --> 0:08:19.680 technically qualify as a literal bastard, although the timing here 0:08:19.840 --> 0:08:23.040 is a little fuzzy. In August of night. Huh, how 0:08:23.080 --> 0:08:26.240 often does that happen? Very rarely, most of our bastards. 0:08:26.280 --> 0:08:28.640 They're born within the bounds of holy matrimony. 0:08:28.920 --> 0:08:37.080 Really, okay? Nice born into ethics is well? Exactly. Yeah. 0:08:37.120 --> 0:08:40.320 So, in August of nineteen forty five, Vincent Senior was 0:08:40.360 --> 0:08:43.280 honorably discharged and a few days later their second son, 0:08:43.400 --> 0:08:46.800 Vincent Kennedy McMahon. That's our Vince McMahon, was born in 0:08:46.880 --> 0:08:50.040 North Carolina. I'm sorry the Vince McMahon's here, It is 0:08:50.080 --> 0:08:52.280 a little complex at this point. 0:08:52.320 --> 0:08:53.040 I don't buy it. 0:08:53.320 --> 0:08:55.640 They found him in the forest. 0:08:56.520 --> 0:08:59.640 They pulled him out of a bush. Yeah, yeah, he 0:08:59.720 --> 0:09:03.040 was a He was in a pod. Yeah. 0:09:03.160 --> 0:09:05.080 Yeah, he's in a tuber with like, I don't know 0:09:05.640 --> 0:09:08.760 the guy who owns the Knicks currently pull them both 0:09:08.840 --> 0:09:13.160 up at the same time. So Vince McMahon are Vince McMahon. 0:09:13.280 --> 0:09:16.880 Vince Junior was baptized in a local Catholic church, which 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:19.760 Riseman notes would be the only real influence that Vincent 0:09:19.880 --> 0:09:22.440 Senior had on his son for more than a decade. 0:09:22.520 --> 0:09:25.160 Right because his family's Catholic. He makes sure the kid 0:09:25.160 --> 0:09:27.600 gets baptized in a Catholic church. And then he and 0:09:27.679 --> 0:09:31.200 Vicky split the fuck up and we don't really know why, 0:09:31.679 --> 0:09:35.040 but Vicky has a lot of husbands, so this is 0:09:35.160 --> 0:09:37.960 like not a not an uncommon thing for her to 0:09:38.080 --> 0:09:39.840 like get married to a guy and then for them 0:09:39.840 --> 0:09:40.760 to split up for a while. 0:09:41.640 --> 0:09:44.800 Given given what we know happens in the future, it's 0:09:45.280 --> 0:09:49.720 we could blame this on Vince McMahon, Yes, and I. 0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:52.480 Think it is generally fair to blame the child and 0:09:52.679 --> 0:09:57.120 incidents of divorce. I think we can all usually yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 0:09:57.120 --> 0:10:00.560 that's the official stance of this podcast. So he gets 0:10:00.600 --> 0:10:04.760 together after Vincent Senior leaves with a guy named Leo 0:10:04.880 --> 0:10:07.960 Lupton Junior. Leo is a high school dropout and an 0:10:08.000 --> 0:10:12.160 electrician who had already abandoned one family before he got 0:10:12.200 --> 0:10:17.080 married to this family in nineteen Again, these are honestly 0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:19.880 these are my people, right, this is this is the American, 0:10:20.840 --> 0:10:21.559 the Heartland. 0:10:21.679 --> 0:10:22.760 Yes, classic American. 0:10:24.040 --> 0:10:27.000 Listen to the Allman Brothers always leaving his family in 0:10:27.040 --> 0:10:27.880 the rear view Marriaga. 0:10:28.000 --> 0:10:30.679 Yes, that's his hobby, is leaving families. It's an rd 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:35.920 form for some abandoning his family. Good stuff. 0:10:36.280 --> 0:10:40.080 So he abandons his first family in nineteen forty, and 0:10:40.120 --> 0:10:42.560 it's it's very funny. So before he meets Vicky, he 0:10:42.640 --> 0:10:45.080 abandons this first family, a wife and a daughter, and 0:10:45.120 --> 0:10:48.720 he gets like charged and convicted for this and his 0:10:48.800 --> 0:10:52.760 sentence for abandoning his family, he is sentenced to quote 0:10:52.920 --> 0:10:54.960 two years on the roads. 0:10:56.320 --> 0:11:01.400 What does that mean? You're exiled from the cities. I 0:11:01.400 --> 0:11:01.760 didn't know. 0:11:02.040 --> 0:11:05.200 My guess is like, realistically, probably some sort of like 0:11:05.280 --> 0:11:07.960 hard labor on the highway system. But that that is 0:11:08.000 --> 0:11:11.280 a Cormack McCarthy ass sounding just. 0:11:11.200 --> 0:11:20.679 Like and his bindle. Two years in the roads. God, 0:11:20.760 --> 0:11:21.960 the forties were funny. 0:11:22.679 --> 0:11:24.800 I mean, I guess some unfunny stuff happened, but it 0:11:24.840 --> 0:11:25.760 was mostly a laugh. 0:11:25.880 --> 0:11:28.880 So this would be the pillow in the sky, shall 0:11:28.960 --> 0:11:33.600 be a blanket sentenced to hobo. 0:11:34.000 --> 0:11:37.480 Honestly, we ought to be doing that now, like when 0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:39.839 we had the big financial crash in two thousand and eight. 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:42.079 All those bankers. You gotta be a hobo. Now you 0:11:42.160 --> 0:11:44.040 gotta go wander with a bendle no more than two 0:11:44.160 --> 0:11:51.480 nights in the same city. God, what a cool sounding punishment. 0:11:51.600 --> 0:11:55.800 So he finishes his time on the roads and gets 0:11:55.800 --> 0:11:58.520 together with Vicki after she breaks up with Vincent Senior. 0:11:59.200 --> 0:12:02.240 They get married in nineteen forty seven. This is her 0:12:02.360 --> 0:12:06.120 third marriage in six years, which is honestly pretty impressive. 0:12:06.160 --> 0:12:09.040 For now, those are some numbers. I'll give it to her. 0:12:09.400 --> 0:12:13.560 So Vince McMahon are Vince McMahon. Vince Junior is a 0:12:13.559 --> 0:12:17.000 professional liar and a fabulous In another era he would 0:12:17.000 --> 0:12:19.520 have been a Carnival barker. And this is a problem 0:12:19.600 --> 0:12:21.800 for us because he's been pretty good over the years 0:12:21.800 --> 0:12:23.199 at doing his own PR. 0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:28.680 In this era, he's a party. He is a Carnival marker. Yes, 0:12:30.280 --> 0:12:33.240 he's the most Carney son of a bis. He does 0:12:33.320 --> 0:12:37.959 have strong Carnie energy. He's been doing his own pr 0:12:38.040 --> 0:12:39.800 for quite a while and he's given a couple of 0:12:39.840 --> 0:12:43.720 remarkable interviews where he goes into honestly startling detail about 0:12:43.720 --> 0:12:47.640 his father and his own childhood, although you can't ever 0:12:47.720 --> 0:12:50.600 trust anything he says entirely, like, you have to go 0:12:50.679 --> 0:12:53.080 over this kind of stuff because number one, even if 0:12:53.080 --> 0:12:55.640 he's lying, it's fascinating that he would say some of 0:12:55.679 --> 0:12:58.160 these things. But you always take it with a grain 0:12:58.200 --> 0:13:00.160 of salt. So one of the two really good, good 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:02.640 interviews we have where he talks about his early life 0:13:02.800 --> 0:13:05.839 is a feature with New York Magazine titled Beyond Fake 0:13:06.160 --> 0:13:09.880 and written by veteran journalist Nancy Joe Sales. The other 0:13:10.000 --> 0:13:12.960 is an interview in Playboy Magazine with an unnamed reporter 0:13:13.040 --> 0:13:15.080 who sounds like the kind of dude you'd expect to 0:13:15.080 --> 0:13:19.960 find wrestling interviewing wrestling promoters for Playboy magazine, And unfortunately, 0:13:20.080 --> 0:13:22.160 the Playboy interview was the one where he gives us 0:13:22.200 --> 0:13:25.760 the most detail about his childhood. It is worth noting 0:13:25.760 --> 0:13:28.479 that this interview was conducted as part of a promotional 0:13:28.520 --> 0:13:31.960 campaign Vince was doing for the XFL, which was supposed 0:13:31.960 --> 0:13:34.920 to be an ultra violent football league with no rules 0:13:35.280 --> 0:13:37.600 and wound up collapsing inside of a year because all 0:13:37.600 --> 0:13:39.920 of the athletes were hoping to get hired by the NFL, 0:13:40.080 --> 0:13:42.480 and none of them wanted to suffer life altering energies 0:13:42.960 --> 0:13:46.040 injuries in the XFL. So Vince is very much in 0:13:46.240 --> 0:13:48.600 macho mode while he's doing this piece. You know, he's 0:13:48.640 --> 0:13:51.840 trying to sell himself in order to sell the XFL. 0:13:52.840 --> 0:13:54.680 You know, as a result. For example, he starts this 0:13:54.720 --> 0:13:57.360 interview by talking about how he doesn't feel pain, which 0:13:57.400 --> 0:13:59.600 is why he's so good at taking hits in the ring. 0:14:00.720 --> 0:14:03.720 Later in the interview, he calls his stepfather, Leo Lupton, 0:14:03.840 --> 0:14:08.000 a real asshole who quote enjoyed kicking people around. Playboy 0:14:08.080 --> 0:14:11.400 asks him, your stepfather beat you, and Vince nods yes. 0:14:11.720 --> 0:14:14.600 Quote It's unfortunate that he died before I could kill him. 0:14:14.640 --> 0:14:16.640 I would have enjoyed that, not that he didn't have 0:14:16.720 --> 0:14:20.280 some redeeming qualities. He was an athlete, great at any sport, 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:23.120 which I admired, and I remember watching the Jackie Gleason 0:14:23.160 --> 0:14:25.800 Show with him. We used to laugh together at Jackie Gleason. 0:14:26.560 --> 0:14:27.000 Jesus. 0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:30.040 I like the idea of going through masturbating to a 0:14:30.080 --> 0:14:32.880 magazine and getting to the story and being like, hm, 0:14:33.640 --> 0:14:34.600 it only makes it hotter. 0:14:34.680 --> 0:14:36.200 For me, I'm being honest. 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:39.080 You gradually stop masturbating as you're reading. 0:14:39.360 --> 0:14:43.080 After a solid hour with the restart, after a solid 0:14:43.080 --> 0:14:46.040 hour with this ball draining cum mag I was happy 0:14:46.080 --> 0:14:47.680 to see Vince McMahon's face. 0:14:48.160 --> 0:14:51.720 Let me know I could rehydrate a very alluring story, 0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:52.880 mister McMahon, Thank you. 0:14:55.560 --> 0:15:03.720 So this interview, say it's slower. 0:15:04.240 --> 0:15:07.480 Everyone gripping their dick really appreciates it. 0:15:09.480 --> 0:15:12.120 So one of the great things about this, like that's 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:15.640 an objectively insane thing to say, Like it's unfortunate he 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:17.760 died before I could kill him, but at least we 0:15:17.880 --> 0:15:20.720 used to listen to laugh at Jackie Gleason together, Like 0:15:20.800 --> 0:15:23.520 that's sh right, that's a crazy thing to tell. 0:15:23.600 --> 0:15:24.520 Playboy. 0:15:25.120 --> 0:15:27.680 Yeah, there's a lot, there's a lot there, and the 0:15:27.720 --> 0:15:31.680 interview like, honestly low key. The interviewer here is also 0:15:31.760 --> 0:15:33.880 a bastard because after he says we used to laugh 0:15:33.920 --> 0:15:37.880 together at Jackie Gleason, the Playboy journalist says Lupton was 0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:40.560 an electrician. He hit you with his tools, didn't he 0:15:40.800 --> 0:15:41.560 a pipe wrench? 0:15:41.920 --> 0:15:47.360 What jesus what Vince? 0:15:48.000 --> 0:15:51.800 Vince says, sure, sure, and then the Playboy guy says 0:15:52.080 --> 0:15:55.200 hit your brother too, and Vince says, God, no, I 0:15:55.360 --> 0:15:57.360 was the only one of the kids who would speak up, 0:15:57.400 --> 0:15:59.600 and that's what provoked the attacks. You would think that 0:15:59.640 --> 0:16:01.760 after being on the receiving end of numerous attacks, I 0:16:01.760 --> 0:16:03.080 would wise up, but I couldn't. 0:16:03.080 --> 0:16:03.760 I refuse to. 0:16:03.880 --> 0:16:05.760 I felt I should say something, even though I knew 0:16:05.760 --> 0:16:10.680 what the result would be. And that's like, you know again, 0:16:10.720 --> 0:16:13.640 obviously he's he's he's in part doing this to like 0:16:13.720 --> 0:16:17.440 mythologize like this, I'm like, this is like in context, 0:16:17.520 --> 0:16:19.800 he starts with being like, I'm tough, I don't feel pain. 0:16:20.320 --> 0:16:22.880 I learned how to not feel pain because my dad 0:16:22.920 --> 0:16:26.240 beat me. He beat me because I wouldn't stop mouthing off, right, 0:16:26.680 --> 0:16:29.960 like this is both possibly parts of this are I'm 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:32.680 sure parts of this are true. And also he's telling 0:16:32.680 --> 0:16:34.560 you this because he thinks it makes him look cool. 0:16:34.640 --> 0:16:38.440 Which is this like just an undeniable aspect of this 0:16:38.640 --> 0:16:39.600 Playboy interview And. 0:16:39.640 --> 0:16:41.640 Then his story is just getting completely poisoned by this 0:16:41.680 --> 0:16:44.040 interviewer who in this interviewer, it's a piece of shit. 0:16:44.200 --> 0:16:45.680 You don't want to say no to this, but. 0:16:48.160 --> 0:16:52.360 Maybe he hits you with a ridge, right, So Vince 0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:54.920 claims the physical abuse started when he was six, and 0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:57.600 continued for the next half decade or so at least. 0:16:57.880 --> 0:17:00.560 When the playboy guy tells him, that's an awful way 0:17:00.600 --> 0:17:03.440 to learn how a man behaves, Vince gives this line, 0:17:03.920 --> 0:17:06.000 I learned how not to be. One thing I loathe 0:17:06.080 --> 0:17:08.040 is a man who will strike a woman. There's never 0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:10.679 an excuse for that. Now hold on to that for 0:17:10.720 --> 0:17:13.399 a moment, folks, because we'll be talking about this a 0:17:13.400 --> 0:17:13.960 little later. 0:17:14.880 --> 0:17:15.800 Oh boy. 0:17:16.320 --> 0:17:20.200 Yeah. Leo went on to have a son later in life. 0:17:20.320 --> 0:17:24.080 Leo Lupton his stepdad, and this son when interviewered by 0:17:24.080 --> 0:17:27.040 I believe it was Josie Riiseman who interviewed his son, 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:30.920 who is like Vincent R. Vincent's half brother, this guy says, 0:17:31.000 --> 0:17:33.600 I didn't experience any abuse like our dad, you know, 0:17:33.680 --> 0:17:36.960 didn't hit me. Obviously, that doesn't mean Vince isn't telling 0:17:36.960 --> 0:17:39.159 the truth. This kind of thing happens all the time. 0:17:40.200 --> 0:17:44.439 That said, like, it's also I'm trying both not to 0:17:44.520 --> 0:17:47.800 deny because it's entirely possible that Vince and in fact 0:17:47.840 --> 0:17:50.840 probably pretty likely that he received something we would consider 0:17:50.880 --> 0:17:54.359 physical child abuse, and also every word, nearly every word 0:17:54.359 --> 0:17:56.680 out of Vince McMahon's mouth is a lie and has 0:17:56.720 --> 0:17:59.760 been for like fifty years. This is a complicated thing 0:17:59.800 --> 0:18:01.840 that in your head ethically, but I think both of 0:18:01.880 --> 0:18:03.320 those things need to be acknowledged. 0:18:04.920 --> 0:18:05.200 Now. 0:18:05.720 --> 0:18:08.439 I don't doubt that this was a difficult period in 0:18:08.480 --> 0:18:12.680 his childhood. He certainly reports that. And Leo Lupton is 0:18:12.720 --> 0:18:14.520 a bit of a dirt bag. So again, you know, 0:18:14.600 --> 0:18:16.560 all of this, all of these things can be true. 0:18:17.200 --> 0:18:20.320 And while his biological dad was While this was all 0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:23.879 going on, his biological dad, Vincent Senior was reaping the 0:18:23.920 --> 0:18:26.719 sweet rewards of abandoning both of his children to focus 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:31.119 on his wrestling career. When Jess McMahon R, Vince's grandfather 0:18:31.240 --> 0:18:34.439 died in nineteen fifty four, Vincent Senior took over what 0:18:34.520 --> 0:18:37.760 had become a sizable family business, one of the larger 0:18:37.840 --> 0:18:41.840 wrestling concerns in the United States. Syndicate's probably a better 0:18:41.880 --> 0:18:45.000 thing to call it. So Vincent Senior was known to 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:47.639 his wrestlers as a nice guy and a world of 0:18:47.640 --> 0:18:52.480 promoters that were mostly unhinged psychopaths. Right, most wrestling promoters, 0:18:52.560 --> 0:18:56.360 most syndicate leaders are like you know, von Eric, Right, 0:18:56.440 --> 0:19:00.040 they are like just a slight step away from just 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:02.760 being a straight up gang boss and some of them 0:19:02.760 --> 0:19:07.560 are literally gang bosses. Yeah, the these people are like 0:19:08.359 --> 0:19:10.640 wild men. And by the way, Vincent Senior does work 0:19:10.680 --> 0:19:14.280 pretty closely with Toots. Vincent Senior is generally known as 0:19:14.320 --> 0:19:17.159 like he's a relatively honest one. He's reasonably good to 0:19:17.240 --> 0:19:19.520 work for. Now, this is what a lot of his 0:19:19.600 --> 0:19:23.480 wrestlers will say. I'm not sure if that's actually true 0:19:23.600 --> 0:19:26.200 or if he was just really good at being likable 0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:29.840 while he fucked people over, and he just kind of 0:19:29.880 --> 0:19:33.159 was able to differentiate differentiate himself from the other leaders 0:19:33.200 --> 0:19:35.600 because he dressed better and he was kind of nicer 0:19:35.640 --> 0:19:38.919 to his employees to their faces. There's some interviews that 0:19:38.960 --> 0:19:42.080 make me suspect that his reputation for being a decent 0:19:42.160 --> 0:19:45.480 guy was largely the result of kind of his marketing. 0:19:46.160 --> 0:19:48.520 One of these is a quote from Jesse the Body 0:19:48.640 --> 0:19:51.639 Ventura quote. You could be angry at Vince Senior for 0:19:51.680 --> 0:19:54.000 a payoff. You'd walk in, you'd voice your complaint, you'd 0:19:54.000 --> 0:19:56.320 walk out, and you'd feel great, and yet you got 0:19:56.320 --> 0:19:58.280 no more money when he was sticking it to you. 0:19:58.359 --> 0:20:00.720 He always made you feel good while he was doing it. 0:20:02.200 --> 0:20:04.520 And Jesse the Body Venture is somebody we're going to 0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:08.159 be hearing from a little bit later as well. Fascinating man. So, 0:20:09.720 --> 0:20:12.879 Vince Senior was a ruthless businessman, but he was also 0:20:12.960 --> 0:20:16.760 a team player. When the Justice Department cracked down on 0:20:16.800 --> 0:20:20.800 the NWA for being an illegal cartel and threatening independent promoters, 0:20:21.080 --> 0:20:24.240 Vincent Senior tampered with a witness, threatening one of his 0:20:24.320 --> 0:20:27.879 wrestlers to change their testimony before a deposition. He's not 0:20:28.080 --> 0:20:30.320 in the WA, but he's an affiliate. And when they 0:20:30.320 --> 0:20:31.919 come to him being like, hey, one of your guys 0:20:32.000 --> 0:20:35.479 is gonna, you know, basically testify to the government that 0:20:35.520 --> 0:20:39.520 we're operating as an illegal cartel in order to keep 0:20:39.560 --> 0:20:42.560 the prices low for you know, paying our wrestlers, Vince 0:20:42.560 --> 0:20:44.680 sits down with this guy and he's like, hey, man, 0:20:45.160 --> 0:20:47.200 this is the end of your career if you if 0:20:47.240 --> 0:20:50.160 you do this shit. You know, he's he's that guy. 0:20:50.200 --> 0:20:52.359 He is willing to go to bat for his industry, 0:20:53.280 --> 0:20:54.640 for the owners in his industry. 0:20:54.680 --> 0:20:57.560 Good for him, Good for him? Yeah, maybe or maybe 0:20:57.560 --> 0:21:00.520 I'm confused. This might be terribly ethical. 0:21:03.720 --> 0:21:06.520 So as far as I can tell, it doesn't seem 0:21:06.600 --> 0:21:10.200