Speaker 1: I'm gonna say this, and I'm gonna say this one time.
Speaker 1: Only stop telling people how they are supposed to feel
Speaker 1: about the ship you do to them. Dead ass. I
Speaker 1: like that one because sometimes when emotions are on high,
Speaker 1: it's better to shut up and listen to while you're
Speaker 1: making them feel no way they feel dead ass. Hey,
Speaker 1: I'm Cadine and we're the Ellises. You may know us
Speaker 1: from posting funny videos with our boys and reading each
Speaker 1: other publicly as a form of therapy. Wait, I'll make
Speaker 1: you need therapy most days. Wow. And one more important
Speaker 1: thing to mention, we're married. We are. We created this
Speaker 1: podcast to open dialogue about some of life's most taboo topics,
Speaker 1: things most folks don't want to talk about through the
Speaker 1: lens of a millennial married couple. Dead adds is the
Speaker 1: term that we say every day. So when we say
Speaker 1: dead ass, we're actually saying facts, the truth, the whole truth,
Speaker 1: and nothing but the truth. We're about to take pillow
Speaker 1: talk to a whole new level. Dead as starts right now.
Speaker 1: I don't remember when this happened. I just feel like
Speaker 1: this has been like a theme in our relationship that
Speaker 1: you and I just kind of unpacked, right, But there
Speaker 1: was a momentum. It had to be recently because it
Speaker 1: was in the theater downstairs, and Kadine and I were
Speaker 1: having a discussion because we don't really like argue like that.
Speaker 1: It's no longer arguments anymore. We have discussions. So we
Speaker 1: were having a discussion about something that happened the night prior.
Speaker 1: And I don't remember exactly what we were arguing about,
Speaker 1: because that just shows me how like unimportant it was.
Speaker 1: But I was explaining to you how I felt about it.
Speaker 1: And every time I kept trying to explaining to you,
Speaker 1: how trying to explain to you how I felt about it,
Speaker 1: you kept saying, I don't think you should have felt
Speaker 1: that way about that, because that's not what I meant.
Speaker 1: And then I kept trying a different way to explain it.
Speaker 1: And every time I use a different analogy, because what
Speaker 1: Kadin gonna do is look at me, And every time
Speaker 1: I'm using an analogy, she's gonna look at me even
Speaker 1: more sideways, like that analogy ain't got shipped to do
Speaker 1: with what we're talking about. But what I started realizing
Speaker 1: after giving like the fourth analogy and you're looking at
Speaker 1: me with that blankster which your eyes blinking, was like,
Speaker 1: you know what, I just got to say this. I
Speaker 1: don't have to explain to you why I feel the
Speaker 1: way I feel, but I feel a way, and I
Speaker 1: am tired of you telling me that I shouldn't feel
Speaker 1: a way because that's not what you meant. And you
Speaker 1: were just like, I ain't never think about it like that,
Speaker 1: And I was like, yeah, it's like, you can't punch
Speaker 1: somebody in the face and then tell them it shouldn't
Speaker 1: hurt because I didn't punch you that hard because that's
Speaker 1: typically what we do. Maybe I didn't punch you. Maybe
Speaker 1: it was a love tap. What if the love tap hurt?
Speaker 1: What if you're being soft? See what I'm saying and
Speaker 1: this and that that right there is exactly how the
Speaker 1: story went. Story done. Since we're talking about feelings today,
Speaker 1: you know what I just thought about when I thought
Speaker 1: about feelings, feelings, nothing more than feeling today. But shout
Speaker 1: out to Steve rcle Julia White. Yes, trying to forget
Speaker 1: those feelings of love. But instead, you know what, baby,
Speaker 1: I'm I'm gonna lean on you to do the opening riff,
Speaker 1: all right, because it's opening riff. Ain't nothing quite like
Speaker 1: it right. Let me uh and prepare my vocals. Yeah,
Speaker 1: if that was a sound like that. However, don't forget
Speaker 1: to come and pick up feeling. Don't leave no pieces.
Speaker 1: You need to read. Pick up you feeling while I'm cleaning. Yo, listen,
Speaker 1: Jasmine Southerd. They're gonna make it to karaoke at least
Speaker 1: one shout out Jasmine. Yes, girl, I'm listen. But I
Speaker 1: was watching the video and I was like, dang, she
Speaker 1: really did that in the very beginning. I'm gonna try it.
Speaker 1: Listen to Jasmine, appreciate trying like I have no oxygen
Speaker 1: coming to my brain. It was your neck musters for me, Like,
Speaker 1: don't look, but that was super cleming. She said, up
Speaker 1: feelings while I'm cleaning. Bro, Yeah, while I'm cleaning. One
Speaker 1: time I'm cleaning, it's not going in the garbage. And
Speaker 1: I don't know if you're feelings deved to be in
Speaker 1: the garbage. But you know, hey, but let's go on
Speaker 1: a quick break and come back, and we're gonna unpack
Speaker 1: how to stay out of folks feelings be right back, y'all.
Speaker 1: All right, we're back. So let me explain to y'all
Speaker 1: a little bit about story time and what we've been
Speaker 1: going through and what we've learned to unpack over the
Speaker 1: last like this has been something like that, we've unpacked
Speaker 1: this in the last a year. Yes, but it's just
Speaker 1: crazy to me that we're still unpacking ship twenty years in.
Speaker 1: Like that just goes to show y'all that relationships require
Speaker 1: the investment and constantly having the conversations and learning each
Speaker 1: other and expecting there to be changed and things that
Speaker 1: bothered somebody before may not bother them now or vice versa.
Speaker 1: So just know that twenty years and we're still unpacking.
Speaker 1: So for people who feel like, man, I'm in a
Speaker 1: couple of years and she didn't really going nowhere and
Speaker 1: we're not learning anything, just make sure y'all are having
Speaker 1: those conversations that need to be had, because with that,
Speaker 1: I guess sometimes you feel like there's no progression happening.
Speaker 1: The progression may not be happening because you're not having
Speaker 1: those conversations. And so don't feel no kind of way
Speaker 1: because we're still having conversations twenty years in. I remember
Speaker 1: exactly what the argument was about. I remember exactly now
Speaker 1: now this I'm explaining to you, how realist is we
Speaker 1: really just be having conversations on this podcast, right. It
Speaker 1: was when my mom didn't get the invite for my
Speaker 1: birthday party when were supposed to go to Jamaica, and
Speaker 1: my mom felt away. And what happened was Codeine spoke
Speaker 1: to my brother and spoke to my father and he
Speaker 1: she told them that she was planning a birthday party
Speaker 1: for me for my I think it was seven, I
Speaker 1: remember which one it was, but we were supposed to
Speaker 1: being someone. It never happened. We just moved. She was planning,
Speaker 1: She was planning. Ultimately, my brother and my father trying
Speaker 1: to figure out what days worked for them, and through
Speaker 1: that process, neither one of them spoke to my mom.
Speaker 1: So when I'm on the phone speaking to my mom
Speaker 1: about this is where we contested positive for COVID and
Speaker 1: I said, said, then we can't travel no more, and
Speaker 1: she said aware. And I was like, well, we're supposed
Speaker 1: to be going to Jamaica for my birthday, but now
Speaker 1: we can't go. And she said I didn't know. And
Speaker 1: I was like, how did you not know? Did you
Speaker 1: not like it was my birthday? How did you do
Speaker 1: not know? And She's like, no, one called me and
Speaker 1: talked to me about it, and she felt the way.
Speaker 1: So I expressed to Kay like, I was like, how
Speaker 1: com you didn't call my mom? And Kay was just like, well,
Speaker 1: I called you dad, I called you bro. I figured
Speaker 1: someone relay the message. And I was just like, also
Speaker 1: to his sister, was due any day with the baby
Speaker 1: or she had just had she had just had the
Speaker 1: baby through c section, so your dad and talking to
Speaker 1: him was just like, well, you know, Tory just had
Speaker 1: the baby. I don't know. So in speaking to his dad,
Speaker 1: I just figured, Okay, it's like a family discussion. That's happening.
Speaker 1: Your sister had just had the baby two weeks prior
Speaker 1: so having a c section. She probably needed her mom
Speaker 1: and needed the help. So I just never gave your
Speaker 1: mom the option to this side, I guess by telling
Speaker 1: her directly. Right. So Kay had her reasons for not
Speaker 1: calling my mom, and my mom felt the way about it.
Speaker 1: And when I started talking to k about it, Kay
Speaker 1: got upset and was just like, I didn't mean to
Speaker 1: offend your mom. And I kept trying to explain to
Speaker 1: her like, just because you don't mean to offend someone
Speaker 1: doesn't mean that their feelings don't get hurt. And Kay
Speaker 1: kept saying but why would your feelings get hurt if
Speaker 1: And she kept trying to give me reasons why my
Speaker 1: mom's feelings shouldn't be hurt if her if my dad
Speaker 1: knew and my brother knew, and they were speaking on
Speaker 1: her behalf, and I was like, what are you not understanding?
Speaker 1: I'm not saying that you did anything purposefully or you
Speaker 1: were trying to upset anyone, but your actions hurt my
Speaker 1: mom's feelings and she's entitled to feel that way. And
Speaker 1: then Kay became upset with me because she was just like,
Speaker 1: you're trying to make it seem as if I'm trying
Speaker 1: to hurt your mom. And I was like, hey, I'm
Speaker 1: not saying that you're trying to hurt my mom, and
Speaker 1: I'm not saying you're trying to hurt me. Because then
Speaker 1: I was upset because no one spoke to my mom.
Speaker 1: And then she was like, why are you upset? I
Speaker 1: told you what I did? How could you still be upset?
Speaker 1: I told you I spoke to your family, And I'm like, hey,
Speaker 1: I don't want to be upset, but does it does
Speaker 1: it matter to me what your intentions were if my
Speaker 1: mom feel away? And now I'm i uset my mom
Speaker 1: feels like she was left out. I'm upset, And Codeine's
Speaker 1: whole point was to tell me my mom shouldn't feel
Speaker 1: left out and I shouldn't be upset because she had
Speaker 1: reasons for doing it, And the reason why I was
Speaker 1: making this story the point of it is because no
Speaker 1: one had no ill will, no one. You didn't do
Speaker 1: anything on purpose. My dad didn't purposely leave my mom out.
Speaker 1: My brother did not tell my mom, but my mother
Speaker 1: was still upset about being left out, feeling left out,
Speaker 1: and everybody I spoke to like that, she's your mother
Speaker 1: being your mother like, and I'm like, no, y'all gotta
Speaker 1: stop doing that. Mom didn't wake up wanting to feel
Speaker 1: left out. She felt left out. Can we at least
Speaker 1: acknowledge the fact that my mom's feelings got hurt? And
Speaker 1: can we at least acknowledge the fact that I'm upset
Speaker 1: that my mom's feelings are her? Can we not try
Speaker 1: to discredit her feelings are mine? And after going through
Speaker 1: that whole process and unpacking it, I learned there too,
Speaker 1: Like I do the same thing to you at times,
Speaker 1: and sometimes I'll say something and I'll just be like, well,
Speaker 1: I don't know why you took it like that Because
Speaker 1: I was a joke. It was a joke, like Kenina
Speaker 1: and I have this thing. We joke on each other
Speaker 1: a lot, right, and sometimes the joke don't land properly
Speaker 1: on the other person, and when that person feels away,
Speaker 1: you have to start to understand that just because you
Speaker 1: meant something a certain way doesn't mean it was delivered
Speaker 1: or received that way. So I understand everything. Um, you
Speaker 1: know that was said. And then in that moment too,
Speaker 1: I made sure I think we went to New York
Speaker 1: shortly after that, once we got over COVID and everything,
Speaker 1: and I spoke to your mom directly in person, your
Speaker 1: mom and your dad together and just to clear the
Speaker 1: air because one thing that's huge for us is trying
Speaker 1: to make sure that we take accountability. So sometimes accountability
Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily mean that you're taking blame per se. Yeah
Speaker 1: it's not blamed, but it's just saying, Man, if I
Speaker 1: would have acted differently in this moment, I'm acknowledging that
Speaker 1: I could have taken another step to make things better,
Speaker 1: but in that moment, I didn't think about it, right. So, Um,
Speaker 1: having the conversation with your mom and all of that
Speaker 1: I think my issue with yes, someone feels a way. Yes,
Speaker 1: that may not may have been my intention. But one
Speaker 1: thing that I always do that you don't like that
Speaker 1: I do is even if I acknowledge, Okay, I understand
Speaker 1: that you're upset, you don't like when I explained to
Speaker 1: you my rationale. And to me, I feel like I
Speaker 1: have to explain my rationale if someone feels as if
Speaker 1: I've done something to either make them feel left out,
Speaker 1: hurt their feelings, or if my intentions weren't landing correctly.
Speaker 1: I feel like it's my responsibility and out of respect
Speaker 1: to the person, to say, hey, I understand that you
Speaker 1: feel this way. I'm sorry you feel this way, but
Speaker 1: this is how I arrived at this rationale. And because
Speaker 1: I arrived at it this way, I feel like that's
Speaker 1: me taking responsibility and taking the onus for saying I
Speaker 1: might have hurt you in this moment, or something may
Speaker 1: have been misconstrued, but here is how I arrived at it.
Speaker 1: I wasn't trying to just be, you know, deceitful. I
Speaker 1: wasn't trying to be mean. I wasn't trying to leave
Speaker 1: you out. Here's how I arrived and you'll never like that, no, no, no.
Speaker 1: The way you explained it is the more mature version
Speaker 1: of what you do or what you've done now. In past,
Speaker 1: it used to be, Yo, you didn't tell my mom.
Speaker 1: I told you Dad. Yeah, but you didn't tell my
Speaker 1: mom and the feelings got hurt. But I told you Dad.
Speaker 1: It's the growth for me. And it's like and and seriously,
Speaker 1: it's like, it's like, you didn't tell my mom. You
Speaker 1: have a devil. If I told you Dad, they live
Speaker 1: in the same house. Why wou't you Dad just tell
Speaker 1: your mom. It's like you used to not even acknowledge
Speaker 1: the fact that that could have hurt my mom's feelings.
Speaker 1: It was just, well, I told your dad, So whatever
Speaker 1: feeling she has, she got to get over it because
Speaker 1: I told someone in that absolutely. And one thing I've
Speaker 1: always had an issue with which we've unpacked, like we said,
Speaker 1: for having conversations for twenty years, I have a problem
Speaker 1: with accountability, or I've had problems with accountability because it's
Speaker 1: something that I've noticed, even just as an adult unpacking
Speaker 1: things that my mom has had an issue with. It
Speaker 1: still has an issue with accountability because it's this idea
Speaker 1: and this pursuit of just trying to be perfect and
Speaker 1: never making a mistake, and that's something deep rooted and
Speaker 1: just how we were raised. But wanting to be the example,
Speaker 1: wanted to be perfect one to make sure things are
Speaker 1: done correctly. So if something does go wrong, it's kind
Speaker 1: of like, oh, shoot, let me not let me not
Speaker 1: connect myself with something that went wrong. I just want
Speaker 1: to find a way to then say, get the blame
Speaker 1: off of me, potentially when a lot of times we're
Speaker 1: not looking to place blame or you know, make a
Speaker 1: responsible party feel bad for something that may go wrong.
Speaker 1: It's more so just saying, hey, how can we pivot
Speaker 1: next time to make things different? How can we avoid
Speaker 1: making the same mistake again? Um, And I've learned that
Speaker 1: just recently. So when you say that this happened maybe
Speaker 1: about almost two years ago, a year and a half.
Speaker 1: In the year and a half, I feel like it's
Speaker 1: safe to say, just from my own standpoint, that I've
Speaker 1: learned how to act differently in this One thing we
Speaker 1: talked about a lot on this show was growth, and
Speaker 1: you and not have talked about how we've changed even
Speaker 1: since the beginning of this podcast till now. Some of
Speaker 1: the things that we thought were okay in the very beginning,
Speaker 1: we're learning now we'ren't okay, so we're both I will
Speaker 1: have to give you kudos on that you have acknowledge
Speaker 1: that and being like, you know, I'm gonna be deliberate
Speaker 1: about changing that. A lot of people ask us all
Speaker 1: the time, like, how do you guys continue to keep
Speaker 1: the fire burning? How do you guys continue to keep
Speaker 1: staying in it in the marriage that has open communication.
Speaker 1: One word empathy. M hmm, right, And I'm gonna explain
Speaker 1: to you why empathy allows you to not agree with
Speaker 1: what the person is saying, because you don't have to agree,
Speaker 1: but it allows you to understand how they could feel
Speaker 1: about what is transpiring in the present moment. And there's
Speaker 1: a difference. Right agreeing means yeah, you're right, I'm wrong,
Speaker 1: I should change all of my behavior. That's not what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. Empathy is saying, you know what, in life,
Speaker 1: there is never really a true black and white. There's
Speaker 1: never truly a right and wrong. Now, there are moral
Speaker 1: clauses in between every situation where you know what the
Speaker 1: right thing is right like don't stay over, don't fight people,
Speaker 1: don't kill. But there's definitely some areas of gray, and
Speaker 1: empathy allows you to live in the gray and at
Speaker 1: least understand where your partners coming from. For example, Codina
Speaker 1: and I talk all the time about how we've matured
Speaker 1: through sex, right, because a lot of the issues that
Speaker 1: we see from people often relate to my partner doesn't
Speaker 1: understand what I need or want sexually, right, And Codina,
Speaker 1: when I went through that for years, it wasn't until
Speaker 1: we started to have empathy for our partner and say, well,
Speaker 1: you know what, my partner is not wrong, She's just
Speaker 1: living in a different space with a different perspective. So
Speaker 1: if I can exist in that space and perspective through
Speaker 1: listening to her, I can understand where she's coming from.
Speaker 1: And if I can understand where she's coming from, I
Speaker 1: can now maneuver in a way that's positive for both
Speaker 1: of us. And I use sex as an example because
Speaker 1: for a lot of relationships, there's two things that cure
Speaker 1: relationships is sex and finances. So so the same thing
Speaker 1: with finances, right, You and I have talked about how
Speaker 1: we've bettered our finances started with empathy. Rather than Kadine
Speaker 1: and I being at each other's throats and being like
Speaker 1: she does this wrong with money or he does this
Speaker 1: wrong with money? Is let me understand why this person
Speaker 1: feels this way. And if I can at least understand why,
Speaker 1: now I can get a greater understanding of how to
Speaker 1: explain why I feel the way I feel. But it
Speaker 1: first has the empathy to understand where my partner's coming from.
Speaker 1: So empathy is very important. Well, you know there's different
Speaker 1: types of empathy. I think we should jump into some
Speaker 1: facts and stats about the way you can exhibit empathy
Speaker 1: towards someone because there's different ways to do it. So
Speaker 1: first off, there is um effective that's with an a
Speaker 1: effective um or emotional empathy, which is the ability to
Speaker 1: respond to people's emotions appropriately. So in that instance, for example,
Speaker 1: somebody is distraught about something, how do you then, like
Speaker 1: we say, empathize with them. How do you then kind
Speaker 1: of help to relate to the situation that they're in
Speaker 1: or offer some sort of comfort? And can I say
Speaker 1: the first thing about responding to someone's emotions appropriately, do
Speaker 1: not tell people that they are not allowed to feel
Speaker 1: the way they feel like. That is the number one thing.
Speaker 1: When you say to someone why would you feel like
Speaker 1: that way about that? People don't wake up just asking
Speaker 1: to feel the way. Some people do, some people just
Speaker 1: people punishment, some people do. But most people are affected
Speaker 1: by past traumas and when something happens, it triggers that
Speaker 1: and they feel a way. And we a lot of times,
Speaker 1: as humans, like to say, well, I didn't mean for
Speaker 1: it to affect you that way, So you got to
Speaker 1: grow up, stop being so sensitive and change the way
Speaker 1: you respond to what I said, rather than saying, damn,
Speaker 1: I affect that person that way. Uh, can let me
Speaker 1: at least try to help that person unpack why that
Speaker 1: happened like that. I know a lot of times we
Speaker 1: are very quick to discard how people feel because we
Speaker 1: feel like remember that used to be argument between us,
Speaker 1: Yo Canina, I used this. We don't do this anymore,
Speaker 1: and we used to because Dean will be feeling a
Speaker 1: way about something and I will give for an example
Speaker 1: of well, you do that to me and I don't
Speaker 1: feel a way. So now I'm expecting you to not
Speaker 1: feel a way because it didn't affect me that way.
Speaker 1: That's unfair to your partner. Just because you didn't respond
Speaker 1: a certain way to the same scenario doesn't mean that
Speaker 1: your partner is supposed to exhibit the same behavior. You
Speaker 1: can't do that to people, absolutely not. And as partner, parents, spouse,
Speaker 1: child friends, partner friends, same thing, same thing. Then there's
Speaker 1: the somatic empathy, which is the ability to feel what
Speaker 1: another person is feeling. Right, So I think in an
Speaker 1: instance like this, it's like, you know, somebody you know
Speaker 1: loses a parent, and you've lost a parent, you've lost
Speaker 1: a child for example, God forbid, And it's the thing
Speaker 1: where you know, I can actually understand for sure, because
Speaker 1: you know, a lot of times things happen and you're like, man,
Speaker 1: I can't even imagine what you're going through type of thing.
Speaker 1: But this type of empathy is different. You've been there,
Speaker 1: you know what it's like. You may not exhibit the
Speaker 1: same exact feelings, but you can kind of empathize with that.
Speaker 1: And then particularly what we're speaking about today is cognitive empathy,
Speaker 1: and that's the ability to understand someone's response to a
Speaker 1: situation that takes emotional maturity absolutely. So expressing empathy is
Speaker 1: really the quickest way to disarm someone in an emotional situation.
Speaker 1: Empathy allows people to kind of let go of that
Speaker 1: defense energy and feel safe enough to express themselves. So
Speaker 1: let's talk about that. What do I always say you
Speaker 1: are when we have arguments? Defensive? Defensive? Have you noticed
Speaker 1: how my approach to you has changed? Don't tell me
Speaker 1: you're using reverse psychology is reseychology, but think about things
Speaker 1: about cognitive empathy right right, and also knowing that codeine
Speaker 1: is and this this is where empathy is important. We've
Speaker 1: talked about this on the pot on the live podcast.
Speaker 1: I know that my wife is defensive, right. The only
Speaker 1: reason I know that my wife is defensive is because
Speaker 1: I used empathy to understand why does she feel this way?
Speaker 1: When we used to have arguments and I'd be like,
Speaker 1: why did she get some defensive? Rather than trying to
Speaker 1: understand why she gets defensive? What I used to say
Speaker 1: you all the time, You've got to stop being defensive.
Speaker 1: There's no reason for you to be defensive, right, And
Speaker 1: then I was like, that's not working because that just
Speaker 1: made her more offensive. So I said, let me try
Speaker 1: to understand why she gets that way. Started speaking to you.
Speaker 1: We talked about your parents. We notice how your parents
Speaker 1: respond to situations, and I started to realizing she gets
Speaker 1: like that because that's the only way she knows how
Speaker 1: to not take accountability for what she may have done wrong.
Speaker 1: Why is she avoiding accountability because she doesn't want to
Speaker 1: be blamed. Why that she doesn't want to be blamed
Speaker 1: because in her life she felt like she was blamed
Speaker 1: for a lot that she didn't do. And it's like
Speaker 1: not even as much as just me trying to pursue
Speaker 1: whatever I think this perfection is for. So I want
Speaker 1: to be the perfect wife, for example, So if I
Speaker 1: do something that upsets you, to me, that's like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, in this moment, I'm not the perfect wife
Speaker 1: because what do I say to you? A lot? Sometimes
Speaker 1: I feel in addequate. Sometimes I feel like I'm the
Speaker 1: weak link of the two of us because I don't
Speaker 1: do things the way you do or my process that
Speaker 1: may not be the same. So for me, that's that's
Speaker 1: me feeling beaten down because I'm like, man, like I'm
Speaker 1: disappointing to the situation, like I was the same through
Speaker 1: my parents, and every want to disappoint my parents. So
Speaker 1: that was a large part of the reason why that
Speaker 1: I really had to moll over in my head, like
Speaker 1: am I going to make this decision? What's going to
Speaker 1: be the repercussions for it? I don't want to be
Speaker 1: able to do that. So because I usually move so intentionally,
Speaker 1: that's the reason why I feel like I need to
Speaker 1: quote unquote defend myself or I need to explain how
Speaker 1: I arrived at something. I need to explain my rationale
Speaker 1: because I don't just move or willingly just to move,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. So that's why it's important
Speaker 1: for me to be able to do that, because I'm
Speaker 1: pursuing this perfection that I know is probably impossible. But
Speaker 1: I need the people who I love and people who
Speaker 1: I care for to know that Kadine is moving with
Speaker 1: the best intention, but it's never received that way. But
Speaker 1: do you realize that in moving that way and trying
Speaker 1: to be super deliberate, you're not allowing yourself to have
Speaker 1: empathy for your partner because now you're like, I'm moving deliberately.
Speaker 1: I'm I'm moving in a space of perfection, which means
Speaker 1: anything I'm doing I'm doing so that you don't get hurt.
Speaker 1: So if you get hurt, that's on you, that's not
Speaker 1: on me. It's taking the which I was moving in
Speaker 1: this direction. If you feel a way, that's something you
Speaker 1: have to do, and that's something I used to do
Speaker 1: to me a lot, or she used to discard my
Speaker 1: feelings and I used to be like, yo, hey, just
Speaker 1: because you didn't do it on purpose, don't mean that
Speaker 1: it didn't hurt me. And she was just like, but
Speaker 1: I don't understand why it hurts you if you know
Speaker 1: now why I did it. And I used to say
Speaker 1: to her, I know now why you did it, so
Speaker 1: I'm able to have empathy for you. But in the moments,
Speaker 1: I had no idea why you did it, and the
Speaker 1: fact that it hurt me was not my choice. It
Speaker 1: just hurt and and it's like both of us being
Speaker 1: able to have empathy for each other's allowed us to
Speaker 1: get to a space where it's like, oh, I see
Speaker 1: so I was trying to move purposeful, but I hurt you.
Speaker 1: I apologize. Let's discuss why it hurt you. Then we
Speaker 1: discussed why it hurts me. And when I get that
Speaker 1: feeling of at least she's trying to understand, but now
Speaker 1: I at least I understand how she moves. So now
Speaker 1: I realized there's nobody to aim. She wasn't moving in
Speaker 1: the space of negativity or trying to be malice malicious,
Speaker 1: but I took it that way, and now I have
Speaker 1: to unpack why did I take it that way? Then
Speaker 1: I started to realize, Wow, there were projections from things
Speaker 1: that were happening in my life before that way. She
Speaker 1: moved this way. I perceived it in a way that
Speaker 1: it wasn't. But here's the thing. This is the work
Speaker 1: that goes into marriage or any relationship that people like, oh,
Speaker 1: marriage be tough, marriage, don't be tough. It is the
Speaker 1: two of us together working on unpacking all the things
Speaker 1: that we have developed in ourselves as individuals and now
Speaker 1: trying to be together. Right, I mean, think about it,
Speaker 1: you're really unpacking a lifetime's worth of things with the spouse,
Speaker 1: and this is stuff that was ingrained in you before
Speaker 1: you even met each other. It's the way you were
Speaker 1: conditioned based off of society, based off of your upbringing,
Speaker 1: within your household, things that your parents you know, in turn,
Speaker 1: caused you to Then it became a character stick. You know,
Speaker 1: it could be a character flaw in some instances, you know.
Speaker 1: Emotional validation. What we're seeing here is like the process
Speaker 1: of learning about, understanding and expressing acceptance over another person's
Speaker 1: emotional experience, which is what we talked. We talked about.
Speaker 1: So emotionally validating is distinguished from emotional invalidation, when a
Speaker 1: person's emotional experiences are rejected, ignored, and judged. So, for example,
Speaker 1: like the example we just gave, my mom feels away.
Speaker 1: Codem's response, which would be an emotional invalidation is she
Speaker 1: shouldn't feel that way because I told your father. So
Speaker 1: now you're saying that my mom shouldn't be shouldn't feel
Speaker 1: away about what happened to her. That piste me off
Speaker 1: as opposed to be like, oh wow, I didn't realize
Speaker 1: that it made her feel away. I'm sorry about that,
Speaker 1: and I will let her know that that wasn't my
Speaker 1: purpose or my intention. There goes, here's someone who understands
Speaker 1: how my mom feels. You see how the response the
Speaker 1: response is totally totally different, and that now it doesn't
Speaker 1: validate or invalidate what you did because you still did
Speaker 1: what you did. But now it's like, wow, at least
Speaker 1: I I validated her emotional response, So now I feel empathy.
Speaker 1: So now she can open up and tell me. Because
Speaker 1: that's what happens when you make someone feel invalid right
Speaker 1: their emotions. Now they get defensive. And most people when
Speaker 1: when they feel like their emotions are invalid. You know
Speaker 1: what they do, attack because now you're making me feel
Speaker 1: like my emotions don't matter. So now I have to
Speaker 1: hurt you so you can feel how I felt. That
Speaker 1: was me. That was me whenever CADEM used to make
Speaker 1: me feel like my emotions were invalid. My defense mechanism
Speaker 1: to that was to then try to say something to
Speaker 1: make her feel how I feel, so that then I
Speaker 1: can say, you see how you feel right there, that's
Speaker 1: how I feel. Since you don't understand how I feel,
Speaker 1: I got to make you feel how I feel. Right
Speaker 1: And that's when the petty comes in, super petty, and
Speaker 1: I know my pet petty and yes, And the thing
Speaker 1: is neither response is helpful and building a bridge for communication.
Speaker 1: You sure uh? And next we have Validating an emotion
Speaker 1: does not mean that you agree with the other person
Speaker 1: or that you think that their emotional response is warranted. Rather,
Speaker 1: you demonstrate that you understand what they are feeling without
Speaker 1: trying to talk them out of it or making them
Speaker 1: feel shame for feeling that way. And that's exactly what
Speaker 1: we're talking about. When someone feels a way, do not
Speaker 1: shame them. Do not shame them for feeling a way right.
Speaker 1: You know, I gave an example because we were discussing
Speaker 1: this last night with Trouble and Matt and right, and
Speaker 1: it's no different than you and your boys are playing
Speaker 1: around all the time, right, and yea, you're acting like
Speaker 1: a bitch. You say that you acting like a bitch.
Speaker 1: He gets piste off. It's really piste off. And he's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: what do you get mad for? You don't call me
Speaker 1: a bit? My boys like why why would they get mad?
Speaker 1: You know what I mean? Boy? You know I know
Speaker 1: you're not a bitch. But now you're saying to him, like,
Speaker 1: why you acting like that? You get that upset? Then
Speaker 1: he tells you, well, you know, I had a very
Speaker 1: tumultuous pass with my dad and before he used to
Speaker 1: whip my ass, he used to call me a bit
Speaker 1: all the times. I don't like that. Allowing someone showing
Speaker 1: empathy to someone and allowing them to tell you why
Speaker 1: they feel a way about it may open your eyes
Speaker 1: to who they really are. But when you invalidate how
Speaker 1: they feel, you're now closing them off to not opening
Speaker 1: up about why. And then what you do is you
Speaker 1: repeat the behavior because you're telling them I should be
Speaker 1: able to call you a bit because I'm saying it
Speaker 1: out of love, which doesn't work for everybody. I mean,
Speaker 1: if somebody you genuinely care for you, you should want
Speaker 1: to be able to have that dialogue, you know. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I totally um CO signed on that one as well,
Speaker 1: for sure. So like, let's talk about ways that you
Speaker 1: can actually validate or or or help to emotionally validate
Speaker 1: um in a scenario. Right, So, yeah, someone's feeling so
Speaker 1: identifying acknowledging the emotion, encouraging the person to speak vulnerably
Speaker 1: express the emotion that they're feeling, increase your emotional vocabulary
Speaker 1: with a feelings will used by therapists. That's interesting feelings will. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't really use the feelings will, but
Speaker 1: I guess it's it's simple. There are a wheel of
Speaker 1: emotions that you go through anger, uh, disappointment, happiness, you know, envy, joy,
Speaker 1: There's a bunch of wheel emotions, and you just understand
Speaker 1: what each of those emotions look like with the person
Speaker 1: that you're with, and when when you can express or
Speaker 1: understand what their emotions look like when they're projecting that emotion,
Speaker 1: you can be more intent intent for not intent for
Speaker 1: um purposeful or deliberate about how to address the feelings
Speaker 1: you see, rather than just saying, these are the feelings
Speaker 1: I'm used to and you need to stay in these
Speaker 1: feelings and for us to be friends or in a relationship,
Speaker 1: which I think a lot of people do. A lot
Speaker 1: of people say, listen, you need to be happy because
Speaker 1: I need to be happy. So you need to stay
Speaker 1: in your happiness regardless of what I say to you,
Speaker 1: because everything I say to you out of love. That's
Speaker 1: probably one of the most toxic, fun up things I've
Speaker 1: ever heard in my life. But you know how many
Speaker 1: people exist in that space. You know how many parents
Speaker 1: that their kids. I was about to say, that's probably
Speaker 1: the biggest time when you've seen it, when you've seen it,
Speaker 1: you were doing this because I love you. I'm doing
Speaker 1: don't don't do what I do, do what I say
Speaker 1: because I love you. That's probably one of the most
Speaker 1: toxic relationships that creates no explanation that we see today,
Speaker 1: no explanation, no conversation, right acknowledge the source of the emotion.
Speaker 1: Behind every negative emotion is an unmeant need. So you
Speaker 1: have to listen to your speakers experience that may have
Speaker 1: led them to be triggered and ask questions about their experience.
Speaker 1: You know, they believe their fears, their needs to get
Speaker 1: to the root of the emotion. And that's not easy
Speaker 1: because how many conversations when I kept member when we
Speaker 1: first got together, and you're just very quiet, yes, and
Speaker 1: I just be like, why are you acting like this? Why?
Speaker 1: And you didn't feel vulnerable enough to open up. I didn't.
Speaker 1: The thing is, I didn't know how to I didn't
Speaker 1: even know where to beren't even to be. And I
Speaker 1: impact a lot of this in our book too. I
Speaker 1: just didn't even I didn't begin to eat. I don't
Speaker 1: know where to start with exper seeing how I felt,
Speaker 1: because it wasn't something that was encouraged in my house,
Speaker 1: and not for the sake of my parents saying, well,
Speaker 1: we don't care about your feelings, so whatever. It was
Speaker 1: just more so that we just never had those dialogues
Speaker 1: or conversations where anyone was able to then unpack how
Speaker 1: they felt in a forum where they felt like it
Speaker 1: was going to be received without disrespect. And that was
Speaker 1: something that was difficult for me. So that's why with you,
Speaker 1: when I met you, I think your approach was at
Speaker 1: first met with a little bit of like, damn, why
Speaker 1: is he getting on me? And now I'm not being
Speaker 1: that perfect girlfriend that I'm supposed to be. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: I'm just like damn, Like now now he's gonna hate me.
Speaker 1: Now he's gonna want to break up with me. Now
Speaker 1: he's gonna probably try to find better because I'm not
Speaker 1: being the best for him in that moment. And that
Speaker 1: gave me a lot of anxiety. So it made me
Speaker 1: feel like I didn't even want to express how I felt.
Speaker 1: And I think it's important for people to understand that
Speaker 1: when you ask people what's wrong. Here's another thing. Don't
Speaker 1: expect people to have the vocabulary or the intellect or
Speaker 1: even know how to express what they're going through and
Speaker 1: judge them for not knowing how to adequately express what
Speaker 1: they're going through. We are all humans, learning as we
Speaker 1: go from day to day. So when you're in a
Speaker 1: relationship with someone, or when you're talking to your child,
Speaker 1: or when you're talking to someone, don't just say what's wrong,
Speaker 1: and then when they can't express to you verbally exactly
Speaker 1: what they're going through, feel like, oh, you're just being emotional.
Speaker 1: That's unfair. You know. And I feel like I'm just
Speaker 1: speaking from a man's standpoint because this podcast is from
Speaker 1: a husband wife perspective. I feel like we as men
Speaker 1: often do that to women, right. I feel like, if
Speaker 1: your if your wife, or your girlfriend or your baby's
Speaker 1: mother is going through something emotional because we are different emotionally,
Speaker 1: we have different hormones and stuff, our first responses, she's
Speaker 1: just being emotional, and our first responses, you know, I'm
Speaker 1: never gonna understand what she's talking about going through, so
Speaker 1: I'm going to shut down. And I feel like women
Speaker 1: often do this to men. If a man tries to
Speaker 1: show emotional, being vulnerable, then it's he's acting like a bit.
Speaker 1: Well I said that to you before. I was just like, damn,
Speaker 1: like you're trying to for yourself becoming off as being
Speaker 1: real nitpicky or like, you know, I would say things
Speaker 1: to you like that, like damn, like you just want
Speaker 1: to be harpen on ship like and using that terminology
Speaker 1: is enough to shut somebody down or it's enough to
Speaker 1: start some sort of like combat with another person. Um.
Speaker 1: So that is absolutely absolutely true. And then the last
Speaker 1: one think about intent versus impact, which is a great
Speaker 1: way to really put it like, what's my intent versus
Speaker 1: how it impacted the person? Right, So expressing that you
Speaker 1: understand the feeling that's being expressed to you is like
Speaker 1: the first sign, which we've said, and then you don't
Speaker 1: have to necessarily apologize if you don't feel like you've
Speaker 1: done something wrong, but you can still express that you
Speaker 1: understand the source of that emotion being hard or frustrating
Speaker 1: or saddening to saddening to somebody. So for me, that
Speaker 1: was always my struggle intent versus impact, Like I didn't
Speaker 1: intend for it to come out this way, and then
Speaker 1: I end up beating myself up like damn, Like where
Speaker 1: did I go wrong? I thought this out so perfectly
Speaker 1: it should have landed this way, and then it didn't
Speaker 1: land that way. So now the impact that it's caused
Speaker 1: is now creating a space for me to feel badly.
Speaker 1: And because I don't want to feel badly, I want
Speaker 1: to put the onus on you, I'm gonna be like,
Speaker 1: you know what, that's not how I intended it. But
Speaker 1: you know why most people don't even think about their
Speaker 1: partner when they make a move or do something. They
Speaker 1: deliberately do things thinking I wouldn't feel a way about this,
Speaker 1: so I'm gonna move this way, and then when their
Speaker 1: partner feels a way about something, they try to invalidate
Speaker 1: their partner's emotions because even if you thought about it,
Speaker 1: you thought about it from your perspective. So this is
Speaker 1: what I would say to people. When you make a
Speaker 1: move that hurt someone, Right, even if you did someone
Speaker 1: purpose and you didn't think that it was going to
Speaker 1: hurt someone, don't say, well, I wouldn't be hurt by this,
Speaker 1: so they shouldn't be hurt, and definitely don't tell that person. Instead,
Speaker 1: just be like, oh, it's it's interesting that you're hurt
Speaker 1: by it. Can you tell me why, right, don't be
Speaker 1: so quick to give your reasons as to why they
Speaker 1: shouldn't be hurt. Just listen, listen, And I agree with
Speaker 1: them saying you don't have to admit fault, like you
Speaker 1: you really don't, but you you can say, man, I
Speaker 1: apologize that you're hurt. I feel bad that you're hurt.
Speaker 1: That was never my intent. That doesn't mean that I'm
Speaker 1: not going to move in the same way moving forward,
Speaker 1: because this way maybe best for me and for you.
Speaker 1: But at least if you know what my intent was,
Speaker 1: then you can decipher if the impact really was what
Speaker 1: it was and then beyond what you just said. And
Speaker 1: I'll use the example with your parents and your mom
Speaker 1: particularly feeling like she was left out with this whole
Speaker 1: Jamaica thing. Right, I knew that she was now hurt
Speaker 1: by the fact that I did not personally speak to
Speaker 1: her about Jamaica. Right, So I acknowledge that to you
Speaker 1: because you're my husband, I was kind of like, bro,
Speaker 1: like I told your dad, they didn't live in the
Speaker 1: same house. I can't even expect for a husband and
Speaker 1: wife living in the same house to communicate. So that
Speaker 1: was the first thing where I went wrong, Right, You
Speaker 1: and I communicate a lot about a lot of things,
Speaker 1: but everybody isn't work that way, right, So I acknowledge
Speaker 1: that your mom deserved seeing as though she birthedew her
Speaker 1: own invitation. Right, I should not have assumed that she
Speaker 1: automatically would not make provisions to come because your sister
Speaker 1: just had a baby, right, And that's just me thinking
Speaker 1: as a woman and a mom, like, damn, you know,
Speaker 1: I know how much I needed my mom when I
Speaker 1: just had a baby. So she's probably not gonna leave
Speaker 1: Tori to deal with this baby. You're not to deal with,
Speaker 1: but you know, deal with the first part. This is
Speaker 1: all my perspective that has gone through my head because
Speaker 1: again why I don't move without intention. I kind of
Speaker 1: try to mold things over right. It wasn't received that way.
Speaker 1: So when I saw your mom in person and not
Speaker 1: through text and not through phone, because I wanted to
Speaker 1: make sure that her and your dad understood where I
Speaker 1: came from, then apologized to her for feeling left out.
Speaker 1: Acknowledge that the fact that she could have felt left
Speaker 1: out because as a mom now who has sons, I
Speaker 1: would have felt away if my daughter in law didn't
Speaker 1: tell me that you was having some sort of trip
Speaker 1: for my son, like I birthed the kid, you know.
Speaker 1: So I understood that, and I related to your mom
Speaker 1: how I understand if it was the other way around,
Speaker 1: I might have felt hurt. And then what I do
Speaker 1: now is what I've created a group text with you,
Speaker 1: your dad, your mom, your sister, and I have a
Speaker 1: text with your mom and dad separately because they do
Speaker 1: a lot of the arrangements in their household and they
Speaker 1: know I keep our schedule. So now I've showed you recently,
Speaker 1: even recently, this is the chat that I have with
Speaker 1: your family and let you know that this is where
Speaker 1: I coordinate schedules who's coming, who's going, when we can
Speaker 1: get together, when we can visit, because I want to
Speaker 1: make sure nothing like that happens again. So it's the
Speaker 1: work after acknowledging how she felt, it's the work that
Speaker 1: goes into place to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Speaker 1: And it's also empathy on my part from knowing that
Speaker 1: my wife can't do this on purpose, right, You know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. It takes It takes empathy to also
Speaker 1: be like it would be easy for me to be
Speaker 1: like she did this on because she she wants my
Speaker 1: mom to feel it because now she's my wife. You
Speaker 1: know how people around about what happened because it's easy.
Speaker 1: You know how people like to just kind of spew
Speaker 1: out the fact that you should have issues with your
Speaker 1: in laws, you know what I mean. And it's never
Speaker 1: been the case for your mom and dad and I, like,
Speaker 1: we've never had those kind of issues. So it was
Speaker 1: important for me to make sure that she understood that.
Speaker 1: And I ain't trying to mess with Karen. I ain't
Speaker 1: trying to Karen come upside in my head. But I
Speaker 1: know she's also a sensitive because, you know, because like mom,
Speaker 1: she cares about kids. I completely understand that. And some people,
Speaker 1: I think from from our parents generation, like when you
Speaker 1: have things going on, they require that you contact them
Speaker 1: directly because if they feel like they didn't receive an invitation,
Speaker 1: that they weren't invited. Very recently, my dad's seventieth birthday
Speaker 1: party another situation. I send a text to the children
Speaker 1: in the house, who are my cousins that are my
Speaker 1: age range, Hey, y'all, I'm having a party for my dad.
Speaker 1: Make sure you tell your dad, who is my dad's brother.
Speaker 1: Make sure you tell your dad and mom to let
Speaker 1: me know who can come or whatever whatever. Then my
Speaker 1: aunt reaches out to me and it's like, did you
Speaker 1: tell your uncle? And I was like, well, I told
Speaker 1: my cousins their dad. I told him, so I just
Speaker 1: told him to spread the word. And she's like, but
Speaker 1: you didn't invite him directly, And I was like, you
Speaker 1: need your own invitations. And then I'm like, all right, Sis, alright, Sis,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna send him indirectly. Direct I'm gonna send it
Speaker 1: to him directly. So I sent it to him directly
Speaker 1: and he was like, oh yeah, I already knew about this.
Speaker 1: I told you that I was coming. I'm like, you see,
Speaker 1: but I do feel you let me cross my teas
Speaker 1: and that minds because I ain't trying to offend nobody promise.
Speaker 1: And if you have the the wherewithal or the ability
Speaker 1: to go to the extra step to make sure that
Speaker 1: people are okay, you might as well do it. But
Speaker 1: also empathy required. Empathy is required also for the person
Speaker 1: who's having the emotional outburst right to also have empathy
Speaker 1: for the person that they're upset at, to understand, to
Speaker 1: understand that that person may not have been trying to
Speaker 1: hurt you. So just because your feelings hurt, don't mean
Speaker 1: that you get to then spue all of this venom
Speaker 1: on someone else when they might probably didn't do what
Speaker 1: you're expecting they did on purpose. And I think that
Speaker 1: this is important for many relationships. Right, you know, how
Speaker 1: we create narratives about why someone does something, that's because
Speaker 1: we don't give empathy to the party that we want
Speaker 1: to be upset at. So for example, that happened with
Speaker 1: my parents, I could have been no, no, funk that
Speaker 1: funk that no, you just want to leave my parents
Speaker 1: out on purpose, and that's just what it is, and
Speaker 1: I'm just pissed about it. Or I could have empathy
Speaker 1: and be like, you know what, She'd be playing on
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff and it could have been an
Speaker 1: oversight purpose. And I think that a lot more people
Speaker 1: need to understand that most arguments don't don't happen because
Speaker 1: people are trying to be malicious. They happen because of
Speaker 1: miscommunications and false narratives. You eliminate miscommunications and false narratives
Speaker 1: by having empathy and learning to listen and not listening
Speaker 1: with the intent to respond, but listening with the intent
Speaker 1: to understand. That's ultimately what this this whole thing is about.
Speaker 1: Listening with the intent to understand. And I said, you
Speaker 1: know what, I was hoping that my aunt would understand
Speaker 1: cadinans life is crazy. Cadine could barely She don't even
Speaker 1: know what she had for breakfast, or if she even
Speaker 1: had breakfast this morning. So in that moment, I could
Speaker 1: have been taken it two ways. I could have been like, wow,
Speaker 1: Auntie knows that my life is crazy, so she was
Speaker 1: just reaching out to remind me not to not include
Speaker 1: my uncle. Or I could have taken it as damn,
Speaker 1: she just trying to come down on me because I
Speaker 1: didn't send the invitation to him. In that moment, I
Speaker 1: chose to say, you know what, she's probably looking out
Speaker 1: for me because she knows my life is crazy. I
Speaker 1: chose to take the positive route on that one. And
Speaker 1: I said, you know what, Auntie, thank you so much
Speaker 1: for telling me that I'm want to invite him now
Speaker 1: because I don't want them to feel left out. You know,
Speaker 1: that's a whole another podcast, right choosing to see the positive,
Speaker 1: See the positive, that's the whole. We're gonna do a
Speaker 1: whole another positive podcast. We just be here involving coming
Speaker 1: up with episodes as we talked to See the Positive,
Speaker 1: because we had a whole discussion listen about how to
Speaker 1: choose to be positive. And for two seconds, I promise you,
Speaker 1: I was like, you know, my life is crazy. Says
Speaker 1: like come on, and she says, you know my life
Speaker 1: is crazy. You know, you know I'm not going to
Speaker 1: not invite his brother, Like come on, what does that
Speaker 1: even make any sense? But I said, you know what,
Speaker 1: she's probably just reminded me. And she said it, she said,
Speaker 1: I know you're busy, so you know, I just want
Speaker 1: to make sure you didn't forget and it came it was.
Speaker 1: That was as simple as that. Because she understands that
Speaker 1: I'm crazy busy, I understand how it could have been taken,
Speaker 1: party done. And I think that's every family because the
Speaker 1: same thing happened with my aunt and my cousins. It's
Speaker 1: the same thing. It's the same thing. Is that it's
Speaker 1: a generational things, which I'm learning with some things too.
Speaker 1: And then lastly, just to kind of wrap things up,
Speaker 1: making sure that we're encouraging our kids to express the
Speaker 1: root of their feelings. So with Dival and I, when
Speaker 1: the kids stock coming, they start crying about something or
Speaker 1: they're whining about something, I try to make sure that
Speaker 1: it's not just meant with like stop crying, stop crying,
Speaker 1: but it's more meant with control your emotions in this moment.
Speaker 1: Can you tell mommy why you feel the way you feel.
Speaker 1: It's super important to encourage that conversation and encourage the dialogue.
Speaker 1: Even as early as four years old, we make sure
Speaker 1: if Cats is crying, Cats has to tell me how
Speaker 1: he feels in that moment so I can help him
Speaker 1: navigate those emotions in a safe space before he's old
Speaker 1: enough to have to deal with people that may not
Speaker 1: be a savvy Okay, I, hey, this is like a conversation.
Speaker 1: I think we should take a break now and come
Speaker 1: back to some listener letters so we can see what
Speaker 1: y'all have to say this episode, because you know, sometimes
Speaker 1: we don't always going to be the ones to come
Speaker 1: up with the topics. We want to see what 'll
Speaker 1: happen to So take a quick break and we'll be back.
Speaker 1: Al right, back with listen letters. I always start. Do
Speaker 1: you want to start? I'll start, all right, go for
Speaker 1: it number one. Hey, y'all, I'm a twenty six year
Speaker 1: old female that suffers from mommy issues. Just some backstory.
Speaker 1: My mom had me very young and I was raised
Speaker 1: by my grandmother father's mom, but my mom was somewhat
Speaker 1: active in my life as far as providing financially. My
Speaker 1: trauma comes in when I was sexually assaulted by her
Speaker 1: boyfriend at the time I was around twelve thirteen, where
Speaker 1: she was aware of because I told her the day
Speaker 1: it happened. Fast forward, she is married and for a
Speaker 1: very long time I was conflicted. So I went to
Speaker 1: therapy and also invite her and I did give her
Speaker 1: an ultimatum, and she told me that she can't give
Speaker 1: up on her livelihood from me and walked out. I'm
Speaker 1: a little bit confused. Was the guy connected to her livelihood?
Speaker 1: The livelihood is about making money, so I'm a little confused.
Speaker 1: But what we'll see having spoke to her since two
Speaker 1: years have passed, but I'm starting to realize that it's
Speaker 1: affecting other relationships around me. I'm quick to cut people off.
Speaker 1: It's hard for me to show grace. I don't speak
Speaker 1: about this much because it's not something people usually can
Speaker 1: give me advice on. But I listened to you guys
Speaker 1: a lot, and I'm just hoping that I can get
Speaker 1: something out of how to be more graceful to others
Speaker 1: and not be quick to dismiss them. Yeah, I guess
Speaker 1: that's yeah. I felt the same way. I was confused
Speaker 1: about did mom go on to marry this man after
Speaker 1: you expressed that he sexually assaulted you? Because that's like
Speaker 1: huge and that's major and I wouldn't be able to
Speaker 1: relate to that. No, I wouldn't. I wouldn't be able
Speaker 1: to relate that. But um, I would say this though
Speaker 1: your mom clearly has had some trauma in her life
Speaker 1: as well. Right, you said you were raised by your
Speaker 1: father's mom, which means you wasn't raised by your father
Speaker 1: and he wasn't raised by your mother's mom. So we
Speaker 1: don't know what has happened in her life to make
Speaker 1: her make the choices. But she did have a child
Speaker 1: very young. Was she sexually abused? You know what I'm saying?
Speaker 1: Why you know what I'm saying? Why was she active
Speaker 1: so young? And how did that affect her? Why does
Speaker 1: she feel like leaving this man is going to affect
Speaker 1: her livelihood? Is this person providing something for her that
Speaker 1: she can't get anywhere else? But this only happens when
Speaker 1: you have empathy. Rather than saying to your mom, you
Speaker 1: made me feel away, and since you made me feel away,
Speaker 1: you have to apologize and you have to tell me
Speaker 1: all these reasons, how about you approach your mom with
Speaker 1: some empathy and say, hey, mom, what's been going on
Speaker 1: in your life? Understand where Try to understand where your
Speaker 1: mom is coming from, so it can at least give
Speaker 1: you peace. You may not get the answers you want,
Speaker 1: may not agree right, you may not agree with her
Speaker 1: at all, but at least it can give you pieces
Speaker 1: that you know what, my mom has been struggling with
Speaker 1: these demons for years, and part of the way she
Speaker 1: responds to me are projections of what she's dealt with.
Speaker 1: Then you can release it from yourself. Now you're no
Speaker 1: longer saying what's wrong with me, because it seems like
Speaker 1: now she's saying what's wrong with me that my mom
Speaker 1: would choose that relationship. Now your self loath and you
Speaker 1: feel like it's something I did wrong, and you're taking
Speaker 1: that on you. Where someone's response to a act, someone's
Speaker 1: feelings don't have to necessarily be a direct indicator of
Speaker 1: something that you may or may not have done. So
Speaker 1: I think that's a really great piece for her, and
Speaker 1: I feel like you also choose this now that you're
Speaker 1: aware of what's happening. If your mom is able to
Speaker 1: unwilling to have the conversation with you, maybe just you
Speaker 1: and her or in the presence of maybe a therapist,
Speaker 1: you then can't or regardless if you have the conversation
Speaker 1: with her or not, then take the way you feel
Speaker 1: and blame other people or look for ways to cut
Speaker 1: other people off just because you're You're mom was that way.
Speaker 1: Not everyone is the same. It's almost like being in
Speaker 1: an abusive relationship, for example, and you with a spouse
Speaker 1: that abuses you, abuses you or doesn't do things to
Speaker 1: make you feel good, and then you get into another
Speaker 1: relationship and this new person now has to bear the
Speaker 1: burden of what the last person did, and the last
Speaker 1: person if you're not giving them a fair chance to
Speaker 1: express to you how they genuinely feel about you. So
Speaker 1: you may be sabotaging relationships around you because of your mom,
Speaker 1: but I feel like it should be quite the opposite,
Speaker 1: And I know it's probably easier said than done. It's
Speaker 1: I completely get that, um, but also to everyone cannot
Speaker 1: bear the burden, UM, of what your mom puts you through.
Speaker 1: I feel like she's sabotaged a little bit because having
Speaker 1: having a mom leave you gives you a sense of like,
Speaker 1: like you're not worthy. Yeah, like an abandonment, an abandonment issue,
Speaker 1: you know, not worthy. So rather than this person leaving me,
Speaker 1: I'm going to push them away at least I'm in control, control,
Speaker 1: at least power again. Shout out to uh the team
Speaker 1: Perry's Sisters. Season two, we actually talk about that actual issue.
Speaker 1: You get a chance to learn more about the characters
Speaker 1: and one of the characters I'm not gonna give it away,
Speaker 1: but had issues with mommy issues, had mommy issues and
Speaker 1: abandonment issues, and purposefully pushed people away so they can
Speaker 1: feel like they were in control before the person left.
Speaker 1: So what happens and what she probably tends to do,
Speaker 1: She says, she cuts people off quickly. They're constantly scanning
Speaker 1: for red flags, and once they see a red flag,
Speaker 1: rather than have an empathy for a person and trying
Speaker 1: to understand why that flag is there, they say, I'm
Speaker 1: going to control this and cut them off. I win,
Speaker 1: I win, you lose. You lost me on my terms.
Speaker 1: But that's self sabotaging, and I think you just have
Speaker 1: to learn how to deal with that. And it helps
Speaker 1: with um having empathy with your mom first and understanding
Speaker 1: what she went through in her life and stopped putting
Speaker 1: that on yourself, because then you end up feeling like
Speaker 1: I don't deserve people. If my mom left me, that
Speaker 1: means I don't deserve people, which means everyone is going
Speaker 1: to leave me, which is not the case. Absolutely that
Speaker 1: helps us, all right, And our second letter starts with hey,
Speaker 1: Conde and devote I love y'all and thank God for
Speaker 1: giving you both the courage to heal others by simply
Speaker 1: living your truth. Than I'd love to hear that thank you.
Speaker 1: In today's climate, there's a lot there's a lack of authenticity,
Speaker 1: So I'm really happy you push the narrative to authentically
Speaker 1: and apologetically be yourself. Thank you, appreciate. I'm in a
Speaker 1: relation or I'm in relation with someone who decides to
Speaker 1: ignore me in times of frustration. Granted I caused the
Speaker 1: frustration sometimes and understand needing to take a breather, come
Speaker 1: back later to discuss for a resolution. Once he decides
Speaker 1: to talk to me again, the issue isn't addressed. He
Speaker 1: acts normal as if nothing happened, and it frustrates the
Speaker 1: living ship out of me exactly. Sorry for the verbid.
Speaker 1: I came from a family who did just that growing
Speaker 1: up the same and I've internally suffering, right, I've internally
Speaker 1: suffered from it. So learning to respectfully, effectively and efficiently
Speaker 1: vocalize my concerns has been paramount and very hard. Might
Speaker 1: I add, I completely understand this, this is me. Nevertheless,
Speaker 1: I'm trying, which I am. I've asked him to stop
Speaker 1: ignoring me, as it isn't conducive to my growth and
Speaker 1: to try to articulate himself. But he's under the notion
Speaker 1: what's understood doesn't have to be explained. He also believes
Speaker 1: ignoring is better than blowing up. I disagree. I don't
Speaker 1: think either are effective or efficient. I know people deal
Speaker 1: with things differently and arrive at conclusions at different times,
Speaker 1: but this is truly bothering my spirit. I've tried communicating
Speaker 1: as best I know how, and it seemingly isn't working,
Speaker 1: falling on deaf ears. What are your thoughts? Ps? I
Speaker 1: came to your Life show and had the absolute best
Speaker 1: time of my life when you allow the audience to
Speaker 1: space X question. I had my hand up but got scared.
Speaker 1: Y'all a groundbreak and keep doing what you do and thanks.
Speaker 1: So with this girl, you're me like, this is literally
Speaker 1: me having, you know, not had the opportunity or the
Speaker 1: space or feeling the comfort to be able to describe
Speaker 1: how I felt in moments. It really really um suffocated
Speaker 1: me in my relationship with Devout early on, and it
Speaker 1: still continues to be a constant, day in and day
Speaker 1: out work for me to be able to eloquently express
Speaker 1: to him how I feel. I think one I've gotten better, um,
Speaker 1: and thank you for that, thanks for acknowledging it. But
Speaker 1: I feel like the issue in this whole entire paragraph
Speaker 1: that she said is that sometimes you have to take
Speaker 1: a breather and come back to it later to discuss
Speaker 1: the resolution. That's one thing that I used to think
Speaker 1: worked particularly for us, And I'm giving you this piece
Speaker 1: of advice because I know it didn't work for us,
Speaker 1: and since it's a very similar situation, maybe you can
Speaker 1: try this and see how it works for you. But
Speaker 1: Deval and I need to sit in real time in
Speaker 1: the moment, discuss and come to conclusion. Now, the conclusion
Speaker 1: may not be hunky dorry. We're gonna hug and kiss
Speaker 1: and we both agreement with each other. No, a lot
Speaker 1: of times it's meant with like, well, you're in titile
Speaker 1: to feel it what you feel. You're entitled to feel it.
Speaker 1: What you feel it may not be the same. However,
Speaker 1: we're going to respect how the other person feels and
Speaker 1: agree to agree. As cliche as that sounds, but leaving
Speaker 1: things to fester is never good. And let me I
Speaker 1: speak on his point, because I'm gonna let you finish
Speaker 1: his point. When you decide that you want to walk
Speaker 1: away and take some time and then come back, right,
Speaker 1: You can't just expect that he wants to now then
Speaker 1: talk about it. And if you left him because Kadina
Speaker 1: and I have been through this, you left him to
Speaker 1: talk think on his own, and he's figured out a
Speaker 1: way to let it be okay, he then does not
Speaker 1: want to talk about it. I've been there before. When
Speaker 1: I wanted to talk about it, you wanted to walk
Speaker 1: away and be gone for hours and not say nothing. Cool.
Speaker 1: Now when you come back, okay, can we talk about it?
Speaker 1: I don't want to. I've already I've already closed that chapter.
Speaker 1: I'm done with it, which is also not mature by
Speaker 1: any means. But it's like I don't want to think
Speaker 1: about it now because I just don't always want to
Speaker 1: be on your terms. That's where the frustration comes. Nothing
Speaker 1: has been resolved, and now he wants to act normal
Speaker 1: and you're like, no, I want to talk about it now.
Speaker 1: That's unfair. So that's where where he's coming from. It
Speaker 1: is like, Okay, my time is not important. Your time
Speaker 1: is more important. Even though you've caused the frustration, that's
Speaker 1: not fair to me. So that's what he's feeling. We're
Speaker 1: go ahead. Also he wants to leave. Oh, now you
Speaker 1: gotta do with that, so our producer uh, correcting me,
Speaker 1: which really definitely does change the scope of the conversation.
Speaker 1: When you want to talk, he wants to to walk away.
Speaker 1: That's where the frustration comes because he's frustrated. He doesn't
Speaker 1: want to blow up. He'd rather be quiet and ignore it,
Speaker 1: which I agree that does not help anything. He the
Speaker 1: same way, she's going to have to learn what triggers
Speaker 1: her triggers are. He's going to have to learn what
Speaker 1: his triggers are and learn how to effectively communicate in
Speaker 1: real time. But because she she also cannot wait on
Speaker 1: his time. It's not cool to put someone aside, even
Speaker 1: if they're the cause of the frustration. If she did
Speaker 1: something wrong to you and you're upset and now she
Speaker 1: wants to talk about it, I get that. But if
Speaker 1: this is the person you want to spend your life with,
Speaker 1: you have to be able to speak to them in
Speaker 1: real time time, even through your frustration. That's what growth is. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's hard for me. I'm not even gonna lie
Speaker 1: like sometimes in real time it's hard for me because
Speaker 1: I tend to do what get really emotional. So if
Speaker 1: I get emotional and then like my eyes are welling
Speaker 1: up and I'm starting to tear up and I'm starting
Speaker 1: to cry, and then de vals just like, what are
Speaker 1: You're crying for your being a victim? And I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to play victim, but that's just how
Speaker 1: it's affecting me in that moment. So now I'm being
Speaker 1: judged for crying, and now for being for for being
Speaker 1: that this cry baby, and norm I'm not looking for
Speaker 1: any kind of um, you know, special attention. I'm not
Speaker 1: looking to be the victim, not looking for you to
Speaker 1: console me. I'm not trying to make you the villain.
Speaker 1: But this is how I'm naturally reacting in this moment.
Speaker 1: So sometimes for me, it requires that I kind of
Speaker 1: step away from it so that way I can gather
Speaker 1: my emotions to then effectively communicate. I understand, I understand
Speaker 1: where you're coming from, and I was wrong for that,
Speaker 1: but once again having empathy and listening to people, the
Speaker 1: way I felt in that moment was you if you've
Speaker 1: done something to me and now I'm expressing to you
Speaker 1: how it made me feel, And now you're crying. It's
Speaker 1: like you did something to me, and now I have
Speaker 1: to console you about something you've done exactly. The shift
Speaker 1: ends up being that we don't even really sometimes get
Speaker 1: to the root of the issue right now. I have
Speaker 1: to spend all this time trying to calm you down,
Speaker 1: and at times it was just like, bro, I'm the one.
Speaker 1: That's that's why I like I had to walk away
Speaker 1: because I'm like, I don't want to make it about me.
Speaker 1: It's not about me. You're the one who's upset. Let
Speaker 1: me come back when I'm in a better mental space
Speaker 1: to be able to have this conversation without emotion, but
Speaker 1: also imagine being the one to do something to me
Speaker 1: and then tell me you don't want to talk to
Speaker 1: me about what you did to me. It's like, it's
Speaker 1: like I can't win. You know what I'm saying. I
Speaker 1: can't win. But this is where having empathy because we
Speaker 1: just had this discussion where you said to me is like,
Speaker 1: I don't want to cry and make you think that's
Speaker 1: that it's about me. It's about to not talk. And
Speaker 1: I said, well, you know what, that's wrong for me
Speaker 1: to tell you how to feel about what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: If what I'm saying about how you made me feel
Speaker 1: makes you cry. I have to receive that that's how
Speaker 1: you feel. I can't tell you how to respond to
Speaker 1: what I'm saying, and that's also me just having empathy.
Speaker 1: So then what we came to conclusion was don't walk
Speaker 1: away from me. I'd rather you be here and cry
Speaker 1: to me. But now I have to be strong enough
Speaker 1: to say, hey, she's crying because she feels a way.
Speaker 1: I have to continue to talk through what's my problem,
Speaker 1: not stop what I'm saying to make her not cry,
Speaker 1: because that also is a false way to get through issues.
Speaker 1: I just don't want to see my wife cry, so
Speaker 1: I'll say whatever. And I used to do that. You you
Speaker 1: you would cry and I'd be like, I know, worry
Speaker 1: about I'm fine. I'm fine. I promise you I'm fine,
Speaker 1: And then you'd be like, okay, he's a he's fine,
Speaker 1: But I still wouldn't be fine. That's not okay. Let
Speaker 1: her cry if she wants to cry, if she anything
Speaker 1: like me, let the cry. Let her cry, because I
Speaker 1: also realized that my wife is strong enough to cry,
Speaker 1: but listen to what I'm saying, but she also feels
Speaker 1: bad that I and she said on time, She's like,
Speaker 1: I just feel bad that I'm making you feel bad.
Speaker 1: And I used to be like, well, I'm feeling bad
Speaker 1: that I'm making you feel bad about making me feel bad,
Speaker 1: and then it becomes a self loathing thing where I'm
Speaker 1: just like, I'm just the worst person in the world
Speaker 1: for making you feel like this. And then you know,
Speaker 1: I would say to her because she's asking what should
Speaker 1: I do? UM, it's difficult with someone who doesn't want
Speaker 1: to communicate. It depends on how long you've been together.
Speaker 1: Give them time and keep trying and give them empathy
Speaker 1: to understand that they've probably going through some things that
Speaker 1: they working through on their own. If he loves you,
Speaker 1: and you know, because this is a very important part too,
Speaker 1: there's another whole podcast triple write this down. We're going
Speaker 1: to do a whole podcast on choices, right because there's
Speaker 1: a lot of people who ask me questions and they
Speaker 1: tell me, these bitches be doing this, these bayes be
Speaker 1: doing that. But it's like you keep choosing the same
Speaker 1: person over and over again. There's billions of women in
Speaker 1: the world, but you keep choosing the same type of
Speaker 1: woman and saying that all women are like this, No,
Speaker 1: you keep choosing. When you've chosen someone to be with,
Speaker 1: how they respond is up to you whether or not
Speaker 1: you want to be in that relationship. So if you're
Speaker 1: trying to work and trying to work and realizing that
Speaker 1: you're the only one trying to work, there may come
Speaker 1: a point where you have to say, this is no
Speaker 1: longer a relationship I'm carrying, and I need to be
Speaker 1: in a relationship where someone's gonna work as hard as me.
Speaker 1: That's a hard truth. But no one has to be there.
Speaker 1: We talk about this in the book We over me
Speaker 1: shout uh, shameless plug, but we always talk about it.
Speaker 1: The opening of the book, we mentioned that no one
Speaker 1: deserves well, no one has a right to your presence,
Speaker 1: and you don't have to give anything to anybody. So
Speaker 1: anything you give to someone or anything they give to
Speaker 1: you as a privilege, remember that. And if you constantly
Speaker 1: live in that space, it's easy for you to walk
Speaker 1: away when the situation does not no longer provides what
Speaker 1: you need. I love that. I love that. I think
Speaker 1: there's some great advice and just know says you're not alone,
Speaker 1: and at least you're asking to find out the right
Speaker 1: avenue to be able to tackle this. When people writing
Speaker 1: for listening letters, y'all, we take that as you being
Speaker 1: concerned about whatever situation that you're in and you're really
Speaker 1: trying to find a way to make it work. So
Speaker 1: we appreciate you all really being vulnerable with us, and
Speaker 1: you know, thanks for even listening to our little two
Speaker 1: sins because you know, we don't have all the answers,
Speaker 1: but we're trying it out and hopefully it helps change
Speaker 1: with us because Kadina and I are different people from
Speaker 1: two thousand eight teen when we started this podcast. That
Speaker 1: is a fact. That is a fact. All right. I'll
Speaker 1: keep writing in for listening letters. If you want to
Speaker 1: be featured as one of our listener letters, be sure
Speaker 1: to email us at dead as Advice at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1: That's right, that's D E A D A S S
Speaker 1: A D V I C E at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1: All right, we're talking empathy today and what would you
Speaker 1: want to some things up with as your moment of truth?
Speaker 1: We're talking about feelings. I would saying, while I'm up cleaning,
Speaker 1: pick up your feelings. No, I would say, it's important
Speaker 1: for people to understand that emotions are real. Number one thing.
Speaker 1: Stop telling people that they are not entitled to feel
Speaker 1: the way they feel. Everyone is entitled to feel the
Speaker 1: way they feel. What you have to start doing if
Speaker 1: you want to become a more productive human And why
Speaker 1: I say productive human is because if you want to
Speaker 1: be better in relationships, business, work, parent, child, intimate relationships,
Speaker 1: the greatest thing you can have in this life is empathy,
Speaker 1: because empathy allows you to see from a different perspective.
Speaker 1: Empathy opens up your eyes. Empathy gives you a three
Speaker 1: sixty view of a situation as opposed to the one
Speaker 1: view that you have sitting from where you're sitting. Because
Speaker 1: as people, we are extremely limited with these two eyes. Right,
Speaker 1: we have our peripheral vision and the vision in front,
Speaker 1: so we can see about one eight. Well, there's a
Speaker 1: whole d eighty degrees behind us that we can't yea.
Speaker 1: And if you allow yourself to have empathy, you give
Speaker 1: yourself a greater amount of vision, which can open up
Speaker 1: your mind and you can learn a lot more. Give
Speaker 1: them an entire mouthful. You know what I'm saying them
Speaker 1: the truth? Good job. This is great because this is
Speaker 1: an episode that you came up with the topic four
Speaker 1: and I think it was great that we were able
Speaker 1: to discuss it. Um, I guess my moment. The truth
Speaker 1: is going to be pretty simple because you said pretty
Speaker 1: much everything. Um. Learn how to be empathetic without having
Speaker 1: to be in defense. Oh, okay, you can. You can.
Speaker 1: They're not move mutual exclusive. You can be empathetic towards
Speaker 1: someone and have empathy for something that you may have
Speaker 1: done or feelings that you've evoked in that person without
Speaker 1: feeling like you're just the bad guy, or you're to blame,
Speaker 1: or what you did was necessarily wrong. Because no one
Speaker 1: is gonna not every not every person is going to
Speaker 1: feel the exact way you feel about a scenario. We're
Speaker 1: all different, we all react to things differently, And although
Speaker 1: your heart might have been in the right place if
Speaker 1: it wasn't received that way, you don't necessarily have to
Speaker 1: be down on yourself that you've you're to blame. You
Speaker 1: just opened up a different perspective having empathy for yourself, yeah,
Speaker 1: and saying, you know what, I didn't do that on purpose.
Speaker 1: I'm not the worst person in the world. I can
Speaker 1: make in correction and move on. That's that's a great
Speaker 1: at A tip is empathy doesn't only go to other people.
Speaker 1: You can also have empathy and get place to yourself
Speaker 1: that love, that perfect way to end, all right, y'all?
Speaker 1: And if you want to be featured on social media,
Speaker 1: um no, you don't want to be featured on social media.
Speaker 1: Why can I get it together today? Feelings empathy for me? All,
Speaker 1: let's talk? All right, So we already did the list
Speaker 1: of letter. If you want to be featured, however, you
Speaker 1: can follow us on social media, and I think you should.
Speaker 1: If you're not already did ask the podcast and I'm Cadine,
Speaker 1: I am and I am devout And if you're listening
Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts, be sure to rate, review and subscribe.
Speaker 1: Dead As Dead Ass is a production of I Heart
Speaker 1: Media podcast Network and is produced by the Norapinia and
Speaker 1: Triple Follow the podcast on social media at dead as
Speaker 1: the Podcasts and Never Miss a Thing