WEBVTT - The Office of the Future 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:07.440 Brought to you by Toyota. Let's go places. Welcome to 0:00:07.600 --> 0:00:14.960 Forward Thinking. Hey there everyone, and welcome to Forward Thinking, 0:00:15.000 --> 0:00:17.400 the podcast that looks at the future. Says, up every morning, 0:00:17.440 --> 0:00:19.120 just to keep a job, I gotta fight my way 0:00:19.120 --> 0:00:22.120 through the hustling mob on Jonathan Strickland, I'm Lauren vocalon 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:25.840 I'm Joe McCormick. And and my theory is that out 0:00:25.880 --> 0:00:29.280 of context lyrics are actually less satisfying when you complete 0:00:29.280 --> 0:00:33.400 the rhyming couplet. Yeah you think so, Well it's more interesting. 0:00:33.440 --> 0:00:35.960 Well just do the first half. See some empirical research 0:00:36.000 --> 0:00:40.120 on that. Yeah, you know. My theory hypothesis is that 0:00:40.400 --> 0:00:43.760 the person who introduces the podcast gets to choose whatever 0:00:43.800 --> 0:00:46.400 the heck he wants to introduce it. Okay, well, what 0:00:46.440 --> 0:00:47.880 are we going to talk about today? We're going to 0:00:47.960 --> 0:00:51.080 talk about offices, Joe, offices, where you go to work, 0:00:51.520 --> 0:00:54.480 where we go to work, Well, not specifically our office, 0:00:54.520 --> 0:00:56.080 although I'm sure that's going to come up in the 0:00:56.160 --> 0:01:00.440 conversation several times, hopefully as the least amount of snarkly 0:01:00.600 --> 0:01:04.600 is possible. We are we are about to full disclosure, 0:01:04.880 --> 0:01:08.480 full disclosure, We're about to to endure. Now we're about 0:01:08.520 --> 0:01:12.800 to have a transition, a transition experience in our office. 0:01:13.440 --> 0:01:16.720 The house Stuff Works office, which is where we work, 0:01:17.360 --> 0:01:20.840 is relocating to a different floor on the in the 0:01:20.880 --> 0:01:23.080 building that we work in, and we're going to end 0:01:23.120 --> 0:01:27.400 up in a smaller office space with a new floor plan, 0:01:27.720 --> 0:01:30.120 and it is one of those things that we'll be 0:01:30.160 --> 0:01:32.600 talking about. I actually have some information about the type 0:01:32.600 --> 0:01:35.840 of floor plan that we will be in, not specific, 0:01:35.880 --> 0:01:37.440 so I'm not going to give you guys, like the 0:01:37.640 --> 0:01:40.679 square footage or whatever. Basically, this is just to say 0:01:40.720 --> 0:01:44.800 that we're we're having feelings. So if they're sighing throughout 0:01:44.840 --> 0:01:49.240 this intellectual discussion about office environments, you'll know why. Yeah, exactly, 0:01:49.240 --> 0:01:51.600 because we have we have feelings and have an intrinsic 0:01:51.680 --> 0:01:54.840 bias and that's feels yes, okay, well, and it's not 0:01:54.920 --> 0:01:57.000 just us, by the way, this is something that's borne 0:01:57.000 --> 0:02:00.240 out through actual research. I have information about the I 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:02.040 thought you were going to say, like, also, Robert Lamb 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:04.880 is really upset. Well, Robert Lamb is very upset. Robert 0:02:05.000 --> 0:02:08.840 Lamb actually is one of those stuff to blow your mind. 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:12.320 And they did an episode called Cubicle Doom, a podcast 0:02:12.360 --> 0:02:15.799 episode called Cubicle doom, which is very good. You guys 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:18.560 who are listeners afford thinking, who have not listened to 0:02:18.560 --> 0:02:20.359 stuff to blow your mind, you should check that out. 0:02:20.720 --> 0:02:24.360 Cubical doom in particular, goes into some research about how 0:02:25.360 --> 0:02:27.000 you know, we talked about how Mars is trying to 0:02:27.080 --> 0:02:29.560 kill you, and they're talking about how your office is 0:02:29.600 --> 0:02:33.240 trying to kill you. So it's everything from psychological effects 0:02:33.320 --> 0:02:36.320 to actual medical effects of offices. Really well, let's talk 0:02:36.360 --> 0:02:38.760 about some of those effects. Okay, what happens to you 0:02:38.840 --> 0:02:40.680 when you work in an office five days a week 0:02:40.720 --> 0:02:44.840 for thirty years? Yeah, well, all depends a lot of 0:02:44.880 --> 0:02:46.639 that depends upon the office. But Lauren, I think you've 0:02:46.639 --> 0:02:49.320 got some information about this, right all right? Okay, So, so, 0:02:49.800 --> 0:02:52.280 first of all, research suggests that indeed stress at work 0:02:52.320 --> 0:02:55.320 is associated with all kinds of things that are negative 0:02:55.400 --> 0:02:58.200 to not only your own health but in turn your 0:02:58.280 --> 0:03:01.440 your productivity and a need to do your job. Um. 0:03:01.480 --> 0:03:04.000 And furthermore, that physical characteristics of your work space, you know, 0:03:04.040 --> 0:03:06.600 the noise, the lighting, the ventilation, are all linked to 0:03:06.800 --> 0:03:09.360 job stress. So compounded upon that, the way that we 0:03:09.400 --> 0:03:12.200 work in offices mostly these days is sitting down at 0:03:12.200 --> 0:03:14.679 a desk looking at a computer screen. Yeah, I mean, 0:03:15.080 --> 0:03:18.440 that's all we do it. I mean, I would imagine 0:03:18.440 --> 0:03:20.480 that in these are modern times. That is, I do 0:03:20.560 --> 0:03:22.880 not have a statistic about that specifically, I believe that 0:03:22.880 --> 0:03:24.760 one of you, too, find fellows is a little bit 0:03:24.800 --> 0:03:28.080 of information about that. Here's the deal. Going looking at 0:03:28.639 --> 0:03:31.799 research about people in office spaces is difficult. You can 0:03:32.200 --> 0:03:34.600 find a lot about trends, but when you get to 0:03:34.880 --> 0:03:37.320 look when you're looking for hard numbers of how many 0:03:37.320 --> 0:03:40.160 people are actually working in offices, that's where it really 0:03:40.200 --> 0:03:43.600 gets kind of messy because a lot of the surveys 0:03:43.600 --> 0:03:46.200 are small sample size, and then you extrapolate out and 0:03:46.240 --> 0:03:49.240 as it turns out, there are very different trends across 0:03:49.280 --> 0:03:52.640 different parts of the world and even across different nations. So, 0:03:52.720 --> 0:03:55.720 for example, in the United States, teleworking, which we will 0:03:55.720 --> 0:03:58.640 talk about later on in this episode, is something that 0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:01.800 you find that's very prevalent in places like the southeast, 0:04:01.840 --> 0:04:04.240 the Southwest, and the West, but not so much in 0:04:04.280 --> 0:04:07.080 other parts of the country. So it's really difficult to 0:04:07.160 --> 0:04:09.360 actually say how many people are working in offices. However, 0:04:09.960 --> 0:04:11.960 it's a lot and I actually do have some information 0:04:11.960 --> 0:04:15.160 about the types of offices people are working in today 0:04:15.320 --> 0:04:19.719 compared to previous generations. Let's hear it. Oh well, okay, 0:04:19.760 --> 0:04:22.760 so like you know, we at how stuff works right now, 0:04:23.040 --> 0:04:25.960 we have cubicles, right, and they're a little different from 0:04:26.000 --> 0:04:28.800 the cubicles you might see in something like office space. 0:04:29.120 --> 0:04:32.960 They or one of my favorite movies, Joe Versus the Volcano, 0:04:33.760 --> 0:04:37.560 where it's a soul crushing experience. It's like everything is 0:04:37.600 --> 0:04:40.200 done in this blue filter on the screen, so it 0:04:40.240 --> 0:04:43.560 looks like the artificial lighting is just draining the life 0:04:43.560 --> 0:04:47.280 out of everyone. It looks like the building that Joe 0:04:47.360 --> 0:04:50.560 works in and Joe Versus the Volcano was scientifically designed 0:04:50.560 --> 0:04:54.040 to crush a human spirit. Well, that's not the kind 0:04:54.080 --> 0:04:56.159 of cubicles we have here at how stuff works. It 0:04:56.200 --> 0:04:58.799 tends to be this sort of kind of weird angular 0:04:58.880 --> 0:05:01.640 cubicle where you've got your own little sense of space. 0:05:02.120 --> 0:05:04.840 But it's it's but it's open to the to the 0:05:05.360 --> 0:05:08.200 to the environment, so that people walking by or you know, 0:05:08.279 --> 0:05:10.400 you can make eye contact with someone if you want 0:05:10.440 --> 0:05:13.720 to write. Yeah, it's it's not so much sequestered that 0:05:13.800 --> 0:05:16.040 you are in a cell, right, You're not in a 0:05:16.040 --> 0:05:18.719 little blocked off cell. It's open a little bit, but 0:05:18.760 --> 0:05:20.719 it also gives you some privacy, so it has sort 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:23.440 of the best of both worlds approach. The ceiling is open. 0:05:23.440 --> 0:05:26.440 I've heard that that's an important factor in that that 0:05:26.440 --> 0:05:28.559 that that if you you don't have a full wall 0:05:28.600 --> 0:05:31.799 to the ceiling, that that adds to your sense of space. 0:05:32.000 --> 0:05:34.479 And uh, and yeah, you're not. You don't feel like 0:05:34.480 --> 0:05:36.920 you're you don't feel like you're hemmed in right, that 0:05:36.920 --> 0:05:41.200 that you're being you're being contained, uh, because you could 0:05:41.240 --> 0:05:44.360 like potentially climb over the cubicle wall if you needed. Well, 0:05:44.400 --> 0:05:49.320 it just doesn't psychle Lauren, did you see this video psychologically, 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:52.880 it doesn't feel like you are contained. You know, for example, 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:56.760 the same idea that you paint a wall of different shade, uh, 0:05:57.320 --> 0:06:00.520 two thirds of way up to accentuate height, or use 0:06:00.560 --> 0:06:04.599 of mirrors to expand a space, Well, that's not the 0:06:04.600 --> 0:06:07.480 way a lot of offices are moving these days. And 0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:11.200 that's not the way our office is moving. Pretty soon more, 0:06:11.320 --> 0:06:13.400 more and more offices these days are moving to what's 0:06:13.440 --> 0:06:16.560 just called an open plan. So it's not open floor plans, 0:06:16.600 --> 0:06:19.839 not just cubicles necessarily, it may be workstations where you 0:06:19.880 --> 0:06:23.800 don't have all these divide dividers that that sequester people 0:06:23.880 --> 0:06:27.640 or give them the sense of privacy. In fact, seventy 0:06:27.680 --> 0:06:31.400 of unite US workers in offices today are working in 0:06:31.560 --> 0:06:36.200 open floor plans. Huge. Yeah, so that's that's become sort 0:06:36.200 --> 0:06:37.800 of the approach, which is kind of funny if you 0:06:37.839 --> 0:06:40.760 look back on the history, like the development of the 0:06:40.839 --> 0:06:43.440 office space. If you look back in the early days, 0:06:44.240 --> 0:06:46.360 it was essentially kind of the same sort of thing. 0:06:46.400 --> 0:06:48.960 Like if you ever think of any newsroom type films 0:06:48.960 --> 0:06:51.400 about newsrooms where you just see lots of desks in 0:06:51.440 --> 0:06:55.520 a big open space. Yeah, the bullpen that that was 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:58.280 a very typical kind of approach, and then we moved 0:06:58.320 --> 0:07:01.400 into this sort of cubicle approach, and then we're now 0:07:01.440 --> 0:07:04.240 moving back into an open floor space. And the idea 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:08.479 behind it is to, uh, to foster collaboration, right, but 0:07:08.600 --> 0:07:11.280 if you work in a field where you're not necessarily 0:07:11.320 --> 0:07:14.680 collaborating all the time. For example, what we do, we 0:07:14.800 --> 0:07:17.040 collaborate right now, but we do a lot of our 0:07:17.080 --> 0:07:19.880 research on our own. Will will meet occasionally to kind 0:07:19.920 --> 0:07:22.240 of compare notes, but then we go back in our 0:07:22.360 --> 0:07:26.520 own little world. We're not constantly collaborating. For people who 0:07:26.720 --> 0:07:29.720 do that sort of work or even more individualized work. 0:07:30.080 --> 0:07:34.160 This can actually be really distracting, and in fact, there 0:07:34.200 --> 0:07:36.920 have been some studies that suggest that this kind of 0:07:37.000 --> 0:07:43.840 open floor approach increases things like dissatisfaction and aggression in 0:07:43.880 --> 0:07:46.800 the workplace. And you guys have so much to look forward. 0:07:47.080 --> 0:07:49.520 I know, we can't wait to find out if this 0:07:49.600 --> 0:07:51.400 is going to be the king No, but we also 0:07:51.480 --> 0:07:56.080 all love each other. So also it says that according 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:59.920 to surveys, people whose work is interrupted make fifty more 0:08:00.040 --> 0:08:02.680 mistakes and take twice as long to finish tasks as 0:08:02.720 --> 0:08:05.679 people who can actually concentrate on their work. So again, 0:08:05.720 --> 0:08:08.920 if if you need that sense of privacy to concentrate, 0:08:09.400 --> 0:08:13.280 then you're going to find that your your work style 0:08:13.320 --> 0:08:15.480 is going to be impacted quite a bit through this 0:08:15.520 --> 0:08:17.560 move to an open floor plan. But there must be 0:08:17.640 --> 0:08:20.680 some perceived advantages to an open floor plan as well. 0:08:20.840 --> 0:08:23.400 There is a trend, not just a perceived advantage. There 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:27.800 is an advantage. It's cheaper. Open floor plans take up 0:08:27.880 --> 0:08:31.680 less space. Office space is expensive. It's not just expensive 0:08:31.720 --> 0:08:34.000 to have the real estate, it's expensive to maintain it. 0:08:34.000 --> 0:08:37.480 It's expensive to provide power, it's expensive to provide all 0:08:37.520 --> 0:08:40.480 the ventilation that you need. So you know, your your 0:08:40.520 --> 0:08:44.079 rental space. All of these things factor into the bottom line. 0:08:44.440 --> 0:08:47.120 If you can cut that, if you can reduce the 0:08:47.120 --> 0:08:50.960 space you need, then you end up saving lots of money. 0:08:51.240 --> 0:08:52.800 So one way to do that is to move to 0:08:52.840 --> 0:08:55.839 this open floor plan where you eliminate things like offices. 0:08:56.040 --> 0:09:00.800 You can use that space just as one unit. So, uh, 0:09:00.880 --> 0:09:06.080 that is a demonstrable improvement from the corporate side. I 0:09:06.120 --> 0:09:09.120 bet there are also plenty of workers though, who enjoy 0:09:09.240 --> 0:09:11.760 this well, you know, I you know, this is certainly 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:15.080 not scientific, but within our own offices are our audio 0:09:15.120 --> 0:09:19.080 and video department is within an open floor office kind 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:22.720 of space. And and they granted, many of them, I 0:09:22.720 --> 0:09:24.640 think we're friends before they came to the office, so 0:09:24.679 --> 0:09:27.640 they all have a good interpersonal relationship to start with, 0:09:27.800 --> 0:09:32.559 but they seem to not hate it. Well. In nine 0:09:33.080 --> 0:09:35.800 of the research that was done on this, like an 0:09:36.240 --> 0:09:38.480 of the research that's been published, So you're talking about 0:09:38.520 --> 0:09:42.800 like a meta study. Yes, the research of the outcome 0:09:42.840 --> 0:09:45.360 of working in an open environment was negative, with increases 0:09:45.360 --> 0:09:49.400 and anxiety, aggression, and employee turnover. So nine times out 0:09:49.440 --> 0:09:53.480 of ten, in other words, we're talking about a negative outcome. Okay, 0:09:53.480 --> 0:09:55.560 so we're saying that my plan of going and getting 0:09:55.640 --> 0:09:59.640 those those grade school science report folders and or, as 0:09:59.720 --> 0:10:05.560 Rob Lamb said, dungeons and Dragons portfolios. Yeah yeah, and 0:10:05.600 --> 0:10:08.640 setting those up is actually a very good idea. It's uh, 0:10:08.760 --> 0:10:11.040 it is not a bad idea because it turns out 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:13.400 all right. So there's this great article. It's fantastic. I 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:16.480 recommend people check this out. Uh. It's a New York 0:10:16.480 --> 0:10:18.960 Times article called the Rise of the New group Think, 0:10:19.040 --> 0:10:23.480 and it's by Susan Kane. Uh. There's there's a great 0:10:23.720 --> 0:10:25.679 section in this. I'll just go ahead and quote it. 0:10:26.400 --> 0:10:29.600 Research strongly suggests that people are more creative when they 0:10:29.640 --> 0:10:33.079 enjoy privacy and freedom from interruption, and the most spectacular 0:10:33.480 --> 0:10:37.040 liarly creative people in many fields are often introverted. So 0:10:37.080 --> 0:10:40.280 that's a generalization there, but they are often introverted, and 0:10:40.679 --> 0:10:44.080 they are they're extroverted enough to exchange and advanced ideas, 0:10:44.120 --> 0:10:47.200 but see themselves as independent and individualistic. They are not 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:50.880 joiners by nature. So in other words, they do their 0:10:50.880 --> 0:10:54.600 best work when they can kind of focus and and 0:10:54.600 --> 0:10:57.880 and be on their own. There they can collaborate and 0:10:57.920 --> 0:11:00.000 they can move things forward. But when they're doing those 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:03.720 big leaps that's when they're on their own. Obviously, not 0:11:03.800 --> 0:11:07.760 everyone's like this, but there are lots of some somewhat 0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:12.959 anecdotal reports that, and some are actual studies where they 0:11:13.000 --> 0:11:15.800 found that people in various fields who were were moving 0:11:15.800 --> 0:11:19.079 into these open floor plants, like game developers, for example, 0:11:19.840 --> 0:11:22.959 we're finding it much more difficult to work in open 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:26.480 floor environments than they were when they had their own spaces. 0:11:27.080 --> 0:11:31.120 So it's, uh, you know, it's it's interesting because according 0:11:31.160 --> 0:11:35.400 to at least the studies that I've seen, the demonstrative 0:11:35.440 --> 0:11:40.160 effect is that productivity goes down, efficiency goes down employees 0:11:40.200 --> 0:11:44.360 as faction goes down, but your costs also go down. 0:11:44.520 --> 0:11:46.880 So you have to weigh the two against each other. 0:11:46.960 --> 0:11:49.880 And it may be that perhaps the open floor plan 0:11:50.120 --> 0:11:53.840 approach is still young enough that a lot of companies 0:11:53.880 --> 0:11:57.240 haven't started to really factor in what the impact is 0:11:57.320 --> 0:12:00.360 to their business. And maybe it's one of those things 0:12:00.400 --> 0:12:03.360 that it's really just a social change. It could be 0:12:03.440 --> 0:12:06.719 that we eventually adapt to this open floor plan and 0:12:07.640 --> 0:12:11.520 gradually don't hate it with all our heart and souls. Yeah, 0:12:11.600 --> 0:12:15.080 I don't know. I mean, you've seen um all of 0:12:15.120 --> 0:12:18.640 the comic strips and and little jokey essays and everything 0:12:18.679 --> 0:12:21.240 from the eighties and nineties about how much everybody hates 0:12:21.280 --> 0:12:26.240 cubicles and it's like your amount all that stuff. Uh, 0:12:26.360 --> 0:12:29.360 you know, rat in a maze. Uh. I don't know. 0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:32.040 I like my cubicle, but at some point apparently people 0:12:32.040 --> 0:12:34.240 found this just awful. Well, you know a lot of 0:12:34.280 --> 0:12:37.440 those cubicles also were very much designed to be it 0:12:37.480 --> 0:12:39.600 was all looking like everything was the same, right, it 0:12:39.640 --> 0:12:43.280 was all you know, this this idea of almost like 0:12:43.320 --> 0:12:48.600 an institutionalized approach where all individuality was stripped away and 0:12:48.640 --> 0:12:51.560 you were just another cog in the massive machine that 0:12:51.640 --> 0:12:54.520 was your company. Um I I do have to say 0:12:54.559 --> 0:12:56.680 that that what I enjoy most about my cubicles having 0:12:56.720 --> 0:13:00.600 wall space to put up a really ridiculous posters. Unfortunately, 0:13:00.600 --> 0:13:02.560 we're gonna have to say goodbye to that, not if 0:13:02.600 --> 0:13:06.000 I bring in those giant poster boards. UM. So that's 0:13:06.040 --> 0:13:08.800 the psychological side of that. I I had a little 0:13:08.840 --> 0:13:11.440 bit of research about the physical side of what happens 0:13:11.480 --> 0:13:13.600 to us when we sit around in offices all day. 0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:16.200 And um, I mean, because we've all heard the big 0:13:16.240 --> 0:13:21.680 headlines lightly sitting is killing you. Um And that's that's 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:23.520 that's a wee bit debatable. There is a study from 0:13:23.559 --> 0:13:26.040 two thousand nine that found that people who sat most 0:13:26.040 --> 0:13:28.199 of the day were more likely to have a heart 0:13:28.200 --> 0:13:31.240 attack than people who sat very little, independent of how 0:13:31.320 --> 0:13:35.080 much they weighed or how often they exercised otherwise, which 0:13:35.080 --> 0:13:38.040 seems disturbing. UM. I mean, but a that is studying 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:40.880 heart effects only, so you know, there there are a 0:13:40.960 --> 0:13:44.679 lot of other UH commorbidities involved in UH in in 0:13:44.840 --> 0:13:47.960 exercise and weight that I have not seen research on, 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:50.440 and I hope that someone is working on that right now. 0:13:50.760 --> 0:13:55.640 But there are definitely other factors. You know. It's basically, 0:13:55.640 --> 0:13:58.400 when you're not using your muscles, they get less good 0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:01.959 at being musci e um. That is the highly scientific 0:14:02.000 --> 0:14:04.320 breakdown of that thing. And and so you know it's 0:14:04.920 --> 0:14:07.840 there's there's connective tissue that covers your muscles called fascia 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:10.440 and it's flexible that can set in the position that 0:14:10.480 --> 0:14:13.480 you stay in the most, which causes muscle stiffness, poor balance, 0:14:13.760 --> 0:14:17.080 lack of stability, and mobility. Um. You know, sitting will 0:14:17.080 --> 0:14:20.560 weaken your your glutes, your butt, which is a major 0:14:20.640 --> 0:14:23.280 muscle group. And the more that you exercise, more that 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:26.240 you develop any given muscle group the more energy it 0:14:26.280 --> 0:14:29.200 will burn. In general, So if you're letting this major 0:14:29.280 --> 0:14:32.080 muscle group go to waste, then in general you will 0:14:32.320 --> 0:14:35.720 you will burn fewer calories, which is bad times. Um. 0:14:35.760 --> 0:14:39.280 You know. Skeletally speaking, sitting puts the absolute most pressure 0:14:39.320 --> 0:14:41.480 on your spine. It's terrible for for your back and 0:14:41.480 --> 0:14:44.400 for your neck, and over time, all of these problems 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:47.480 just compound each other, you know. Weakening muscles and tendons 0:14:47.920 --> 0:14:51.520 makes all of these problems harder for you to correct. Yeah, 0:14:51.560 --> 0:14:55.200 this very thing actually makes me wonder if so, on 0:14:55.200 --> 0:14:57.920 one hand, you've got a trend towards open floor plans. 0:14:57.920 --> 0:14:59.360 But on the other hand, I wonder if there might 0:14:59.400 --> 0:15:04.040 be a trend away from the standard sitting desk toward 0:15:04.560 --> 0:15:08.120 maybe standing desks or even this is such a there's 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:11.200 such a thing as this, the treadmill desk. And I'm 0:15:11.240 --> 0:15:14.400 not entirely it doesn't seem crazy to me, like I 0:15:14.440 --> 0:15:16.600 can kind of see it. I actually have a friend 0:15:16.640 --> 0:15:19.520 who has a treadmill desk. Worked at a treadmill desk 0:15:19.600 --> 0:15:21.960 and she loved it. She she liked the idea that 0:15:22.320 --> 0:15:25.480 it allowed her to to walk at a very very 0:15:25.480 --> 0:15:27.640 slow pace. You know, we're talking like a mile per hour. 0:15:27.720 --> 0:15:30.160 It's really, you know, a very gradual thing, and it 0:15:30.200 --> 0:15:32.040 was really just meant to keep the muscles moving. It 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:35.960 wasn't meant as you know, not not like an aerobic 0:15:36.000 --> 0:15:38.840 exercise and filling out that Excel sheet while jogging at 0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:41.800 twelve miles per hour. Yeah, obviously that would be kind 0:15:41.800 --> 0:15:44.360 of silly. But um, but I can see that, I 0:15:44.520 --> 0:15:48.400 I can. I think I'd probably really prefer if I 0:15:48.480 --> 0:15:51.720 had such equipment. We also had a coworker, a former 0:15:51.720 --> 0:15:54.840 coworker of ours, who would regularly work standing up. He 0:15:54.880 --> 0:15:57.040 would spend about probably about two thirds of his day 0:15:57.280 --> 0:16:01.080 standing and only about a third on fuller who used 0:16:01.120 --> 0:16:03.760 to used to stand up and work at his desk. 0:16:03.800 --> 0:16:06.920 And he even had a little a little platform you 0:16:06.960 --> 0:16:08.400 have for him to put his laptop on, so that 0:16:08.440 --> 0:16:10.360 would be tall enough where he wouldn't have to know, 0:16:10.440 --> 0:16:13.280 lunch over in tight because obviously that wouldn't necessarily help 0:16:13.280 --> 0:16:16.000 you help past Um, I do wonder if open floor 0:16:16.040 --> 0:16:19.600 plans might help aid, you know, getting up, standing up, 0:16:19.600 --> 0:16:22.480 getting your muscles moving, walking around the office to go 0:16:22.720 --> 0:16:25.360 away from the person who's all yappity yappity. That one 0:16:26.400 --> 0:16:28.280 because out of the three of us. I don't know. 0:16:28.400 --> 0:16:31.000 I don't know how you both tested, if you've taken 0:16:31.080 --> 0:16:34.280 like Myers Briggs tests or whatever I test out, here's 0:16:34.280 --> 0:16:40.600 a shock alarmingly extroverted. That's so so I I am 0:16:40.640 --> 0:16:43.800 one of those people who I really do get energized 0:16:43.800 --> 0:16:46.400 and jazz by having quick conversations with people, and then 0:16:46.520 --> 0:16:49.000 I can quickly I can go right back into focusing. 0:16:49.040 --> 0:16:52.040 But that means that if everyone else is introverted, I'm 0:16:52.040 --> 0:16:55.840 actually hurting them at least as far as their ability 0:16:55.880 --> 0:16:58.840 to do work. They I am distracting them. I interrupt 0:16:58.920 --> 0:17:03.000 their their processes. They get their energy by really sitting 0:17:03.000 --> 0:17:06.880 down and focusing and being apart from everything. So it's 0:17:06.960 --> 0:17:11.280 it's difficult because I don't want to impact their work experience. 0:17:11.320 --> 0:17:13.199 I don't want to be irresponsible in that way. But 0:17:13.240 --> 0:17:15.800 at the same time, if I don't say anything and 0:17:15.840 --> 0:17:18.400 I just sit there by myself, my own work productivity 0:17:18.440 --> 0:17:21.119 starts to decline because I haven't had the chance to 0:17:21.160 --> 0:17:25.120 actually energize myself by chatting with someone. So occasionally I'll 0:17:25.160 --> 0:17:27.800 go and have a quick chat, trying my best to 0:17:27.880 --> 0:17:31.520 keep it as as short as possible, which is difficult 0:17:31.520 --> 0:17:35.400 with me as the length of these podcasts can attest, 0:17:36.040 --> 0:17:38.720 but uh, you know, in these open floor plans, that 0:17:38.720 --> 0:17:41.960 becomes even more difficult because I can't just kind of 0:17:42.200 --> 0:17:46.000 have a quick conversation with another extra sing and then 0:17:46.040 --> 0:17:49.800 walk away. Though this also makes me wonder if, um, 0:17:49.840 --> 0:17:53.200 you know, the sort of like really cutting edge off 0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:56.880 as to the future might have floor plans grouped by 0:17:56.960 --> 0:18:01.000 personality type or you know, I think, well, does that 0:18:01.080 --> 0:18:04.120 make sense You can take your take your test when 0:18:04.119 --> 0:18:06.040 you come into the office and maybe have a group 0:18:06.080 --> 0:18:08.440 of extroverts in a small open floor area and then 0:18:08.480 --> 0:18:10.280 maybe have people like me who just want to live 0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:12.960 in a hobbit hole, you know, kind of cornered off. Well, 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:17.000 it's also a question of I mean, the collaboration aspect 0:18:17.119 --> 0:18:19.600 is something that a lot of companies are still saying 0:18:19.640 --> 0:18:21.080 this is the main reason they want to move to 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:24.080 this open floor plan. They want to have a collaborative 0:18:24.240 --> 0:18:28.280 environment for their employees. And in some applications that makes 0:18:28.280 --> 0:18:30.879 perfect sense. You might have a team of six or 0:18:30.920 --> 0:18:33.720 eight people who are working on a specific project, and 0:18:33.800 --> 0:18:36.399 so having them close together makes it much easier for 0:18:36.440 --> 0:18:40.239 them to touch base and really understand what's going on 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:44.040 and move forward. So that and and in some of 0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:46.280 these places, we're talking about floor plants where you don't 0:18:46.280 --> 0:18:48.800 even have an assigned desk all the time. Because if 0:18:48.840 --> 0:18:50.800 you work in a place where you're going to be 0:18:50.800 --> 0:18:53.840 on multiple teams throughout your career, then it makes sense 0:18:53.840 --> 0:18:56.040 for you to be able to move to different locations 0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:57.920 and so the group of people you work with one 0:18:57.960 --> 0:19:00.600 month might be different from the next month. UH. That 0:19:00.640 --> 0:19:03.280 moves us into an area where we're talking about places 0:19:03.320 --> 0:19:05.919 where you you type in on a computer when you 0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:08.040 get to work, and it assigns you a desk for 0:19:08.040 --> 0:19:11.639 the day, which makes it even less personal for you 0:19:11.680 --> 0:19:14.600 because you can't set up your space, you can't define 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:16.359 your space because you're sharing, you can't bring all your 0:19:16.400 --> 0:19:19.320 wacky action figures and and unless you carry them desk 0:19:19.359 --> 0:19:22.400 to desk with. Yeah, but as we've established, that might 0:19:22.440 --> 0:19:24.919 be ideal for some types of workers and especially some 0:19:25.000 --> 0:19:27.920 types of work well. And it also again is ideal 0:19:28.000 --> 0:19:31.600 for companies that maybe they have a teleworking policy where 0:19:32.000 --> 0:19:35.880 they have UH only a certain percentage of employees are 0:19:35.920 --> 0:19:38.640 in the office on any given day, they can reduce 0:19:38.720 --> 0:19:42.160 down to a minimum or maybe just over minimum number 0:19:42.160 --> 0:19:44.679 of desks they need on a per day basis. And 0:19:44.720 --> 0:19:47.920 that way, even though they might have two hundred employees, 0:19:48.160 --> 0:19:50.040 if only fifty of them are showing up on any 0:19:50.040 --> 0:19:52.240 given day, they only have fifty desks, so they don't 0:19:52.320 --> 0:19:54.040 have to have the space for all two hundred in 0:19:54.080 --> 0:19:59.880 their office because of that teleworking uh schedule. Okay, sorry, Well, 0:20:00.000 --> 0:20:02.600 I have one other thing to say about health, which 0:20:02.640 --> 0:20:07.960 is that offices are germ bombs, y'all. I'm talking they 0:20:08.000 --> 0:20:12.760 are uh sinks. The handles on sinks, like if you 0:20:12.800 --> 0:20:15.399 have a kitchen in your office, that that sinks a 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:18.560 death trap just waiting to kill you. Not all of 0:20:18.640 --> 0:20:21.320 us spend like an hour a day licking the sink, 0:20:21.560 --> 0:20:24.480 do uh. No one spends an hour a day licking 0:20:24.520 --> 0:20:27.359 the sink like I do. I got my own sweet style, 0:20:27.800 --> 0:20:30.320 all right. But also things like the microwave handle is 0:20:30.320 --> 0:20:33.119 pretty growdy, you know. There's there are parts of the 0:20:33.280 --> 0:20:36.480 of your typical office that are And that's another thing 0:20:36.600 --> 0:20:39.080 is that let's say that you have one sick person 0:20:39.160 --> 0:20:42.479 coming into an open floor planned office. Then you've suddenly 0:20:42.520 --> 0:20:46.040 got this one sick person who's who's coughing, sneezing, breathing 0:20:46.359 --> 0:20:49.119 in the same general area as everybody else. It's just 0:20:49.200 --> 0:20:52.000 like any other enclosed space. It means that the disease 0:20:52.040 --> 0:20:55.960 hasn't a the chance the opportunity to spread to other people, 0:20:56.280 --> 0:20:58.920 and thus you can have something that would have been 0:21:00.040 --> 0:21:03.960 HAPs more controllable in a different environment become kind of 0:21:04.000 --> 0:21:07.120 a rampant disease within the enclosed space of an open 0:21:07.160 --> 0:21:10.800 floor plan. Okay, So is the coming future solution to 0:21:10.920 --> 0:21:14.760 this problem that everybody's going to wear those surgical masks. Well, 0:21:14.920 --> 0:21:18.680 that only works if you are sick and you're trying 0:21:18.680 --> 0:21:21.840