1 00:00:01,360 --> 00:00:03,640 Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, we're up to I think number five on 2 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:06,640 Speaker 1: the list of our science playlist, and this is a 3 00:00:06,640 --> 00:00:09,760 Speaker 1: good one. Things we believe before the scientific Method. I 4 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:11,920 Speaker 1: remember really enjoying this one, so I hope you dive 5 00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:17,200 Speaker 1: in right now. Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, a 6 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:21,040 Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio. 7 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:27,360 Speaker 2: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's 8 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 2: Chuck and Jerry's here too, and this is Stuff you 9 00:00:29,880 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 2: should Know, the Let's get Jiggy with Science edition. You 10 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 2: know you're about to get jiggy Chuck with it, Yeah, 11 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 2: with it. And it is this episode about what people 12 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:47,479 Speaker 2: believe before the scientific method. 13 00:00:48,040 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, we have a pretty good episode on 14 00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:53,840 Speaker 1: the scientific method. And we have talked about some of 15 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:57,959 Speaker 1: this stuff here and there throughout the years, like you know, 16 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 1: early science, and it's easy to make fun of that stuff, right, 17 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 1: but we are here not to make fun of it 18 00:01:04,840 --> 00:01:07,520 Speaker 1: and not necessarily to defend it, but to just put 19 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:12,160 Speaker 1: it into perspective of where these people were at the time. 20 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:14,320 Speaker 1: And you can see how a lot of this stuff 21 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:15,520 Speaker 1: made since at the time. 22 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 2: See, that was as jiggy as it comes, all right, 23 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:23,160 Speaker 2: see you later. Yeah, that was really well put and 24 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 2: just as a refresher real quick, so you don't have 25 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:27,119 Speaker 2: to pause and go back and listen to our scientific 26 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:29,200 Speaker 2: method episode. You can if you want, but if you 27 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:32,319 Speaker 2: don't feel like doing that, the scientific method is just 28 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:36,959 Speaker 2: basically a plan to keep yourself from going down blind 29 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:40,480 Speaker 2: alleys or being misled by what seems to be the 30 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 2: case but isn't necessarily the case. Sometimes your own eyes 31 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:46,200 Speaker 2: can lie to you, and it basically says is like, 32 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:51,160 Speaker 2: based on you know, data you've collected or things you've observed, 33 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:55,400 Speaker 2: form a hypothesis like this happens because of this, figure 34 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 2: out how to test it, test it, look at the results, 35 00:01:58,920 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 2: did it support the hypothsis? Did it not support the hypothesis, 36 00:02:02,480 --> 00:02:05,040 Speaker 2: and either keep going forward or go back to square one? 37 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:10,160 Speaker 2: And by testing it, that's where the scientific method really shines. 38 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:13,919 Speaker 2: And before the scientific method, people didn't do that. They 39 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 2: used their eyes, the empiricists, they formed theories, the rationalists 40 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:25,720 Speaker 2: or dogmatists, they performed experiments, the methodists, that's really what 41 00:02:25,760 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 2: they called them. But they didn't actually like test this stuff, 42 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 2: and so they were able to create these theories that 43 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,639 Speaker 2: were totally wrong. Sometimes we're really right, but in a 44 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:39,640 Speaker 2: lot of cases we're really wrong, and that those things 45 00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 2: were adopted for like thousands of years in some cases. 46 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:45,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, because a lot of science was mixed up with 47 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:49,040 Speaker 1: philosophy for a long long time. And as you'll see 48 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:51,600 Speaker 1: with some of these, like if you had a good 49 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:56,440 Speaker 1: enough sort of philosophical thought about something and other people said, hey, 50 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:58,760 Speaker 1: that makes sense, and you kept repeating it a lot 51 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 1: then at the time and people are like, well that's 52 00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:02,640 Speaker 1: good enough for us. 53 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, which meant also if philosophy was in there, you 54 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 2: had to also it had to explain why more than 55 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 2: be reliably consistent in its results. 56 00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:13,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. 57 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:16,840 Speaker 2: So one of the first ones that I think people 58 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:19,880 Speaker 2: think of when they think of ancient science as the 59 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:24,799 Speaker 2: for humors humors of medicine, which was something that came 60 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:29,239 Speaker 2: along from Hippocrates all the way back in I think 61 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 2: the fourth or fifth century BCE and was in place 62 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:39,640 Speaker 2: until the sixteen hundreds. Essentially that was how people practiced medicine. 63 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:43,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, that's a long run. Hippocrates probably did 64 00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 1: not make it up himself. It's theorized that he probably 65 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:51,240 Speaker 1: brought it over or he didn't necessarily, but it was 66 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:55,960 Speaker 1: brought over to the Greeks maybe from India, maybe from Egypt, 67 00:03:56,640 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 1: but Hippocrates ran with it, and then Galen really with it, 68 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:03,840 Speaker 1: and Galen is who is probably most people think of 69 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:06,680 Speaker 1: Galen when they think of the humors, the poor humors, right, 70 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:10,880 Speaker 1: But humor h U m O r is Latin meaning fluid, 71 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:14,800 Speaker 1: and that's basically what they're talking about with the poor humors. 72 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:19,240 Speaker 1: Almost at humids, the four humors, which are the fluids 73 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:23,440 Speaker 1: of the body, and we should just name them quickly. 74 00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 1: I think, yeah, flint, fhlim. Yeah, you got blood, and 75 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 1: then you got the two biles. You got black bile 76 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:32,400 Speaker 1: and yellow bile. 77 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:37,239 Speaker 2: Right, And those things are not just the sum total 78 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:40,039 Speaker 2: of what was studied or what was responsible for ill 79 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:43,479 Speaker 2: health or for health. They almost stood in for a 80 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 2: bunch of other things too, Like your energy could be 81 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:51,240 Speaker 2: low or angry or overly happy, and all those were 82 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:54,839 Speaker 2: associated with different humors, right. So I think it was 83 00:04:55,000 --> 00:05:00,280 Speaker 2: Palamar University website on it basically put it like more 84 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:03,920 Speaker 2: than just fluids themselves. You could think of the humors 85 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 2: as those things that flow fluids, energy, that kind of stuff. Yeah, 86 00:05:09,279 --> 00:05:14,400 Speaker 2: and all these humors also had complexions. They had they 87 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:17,600 Speaker 2: were either wet or dry, cold or hot, and there 88 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:19,160 Speaker 2: were combinations. 89 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 1: Of those, but not It's not literally that no, a 90 00:05:22,400 --> 00:05:24,920 Speaker 1: little confusing, it's super duper confusing. 91 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 2: And I think this is an example of what happens 92 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 2: when people over a couple thousand years kind of contribute 93 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 2: to stuff. It gets a little off kilter. 94 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:36,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, like blood is hot and wet, But that didn't 95 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,680 Speaker 1: necessarily mean they're saying that when you touch blood it 96 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 1: was hot to the touch, right, It's almost like what 97 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:48,080 Speaker 1: a synesthesiac approach right to the body. 98 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, put so like water is cold, boiling water 99 00:05:52,920 --> 00:05:57,120 Speaker 2: is cold, ice is hot. I don't understand some of 100 00:05:57,160 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 2: it exactly right. So the upshot of it was is 101 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:06,880 Speaker 2: that each humor was hot and hot or it has 102 00:06:06,720 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 2: It had a temperature and humidity hotter, cold, wet or dry, 103 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 2: and depending on what symptoms you had, you either had 104 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:20,080 Speaker 2: like a hot and wet disease, right, or a cold 105 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:25,640 Speaker 2: and dry disease, and the treatment was to use the opposite. 106 00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 2: So I think pneumonia was cold and wet because it 107 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 2: came on during the winter, which is very cold and 108 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:35,360 Speaker 2: wet around the Mediterranean at the time, and you would 109 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,520 Speaker 2: treat that with something warm and dry. So herbs were 110 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:41,480 Speaker 2: warm and dry, you would treat use herbs to treat pneumonia. 111 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 2: And the whole pursuit was just to regain balance. Each 112 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:50,920 Speaker 2: person at a pre I guess ordained balance of those 113 00:06:50,920 --> 00:06:53,279 Speaker 2: four humors, and when they got out of whack, that's 114 00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:55,840 Speaker 2: when you were you came down with the disease. 115 00:06:56,480 --> 00:06:59,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, so you've heard about, you know, forcing yourself to 116 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:03,359 Speaker 1: vomit or you know, the bleeding, the old great Steve 117 00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 1: Martin sketch from Saturday Antlive years ago. You just need 118 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 1: a good bleeding. That's what they were doing. They were 119 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 1: trying to get you back into balance by removing whatever 120 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:16,400 Speaker 1: humor they thought, you know, either the flimme or the 121 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 1: blood thought would you needed you had an excess of 122 00:07:19,600 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: at the time, to bring you back into homeostasis. So 123 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 1: they were again they were wrong, but you know, things 124 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:30,240 Speaker 1: like homeostasis, they were on the right track with some 125 00:07:30,280 --> 00:07:32,720 Speaker 1: of this, some of these ideas at least for sure. 126 00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:34,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's I think kind of a recurring theme 127 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:37,600 Speaker 2: in this. When you look in on ancient science and 128 00:07:37,680 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 2: ancient knowledge, it's like they kind of had like the 129 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:43,160 Speaker 2: contours of some of these and that's a good example 130 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:48,480 Speaker 2: of that contours exactly. So It wasn't until Paracelsus who 131 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 2: came up I think in our Zenobiotics episode. When he 132 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:58,000 Speaker 2: came along, he was definitely an outlier and an outsider thinker, 133 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:01,200 Speaker 2: and he was like, I think Galen was just really wrong. 134 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:05,080 Speaker 2: This stuff just doesn't quite add up. Yeah. And I 135 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 2: think William Harvey, who was an English i think physician 136 00:08:09,240 --> 00:08:12,120 Speaker 2: in sixteen sixteen, he shows that the heart pumps blood 137 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:17,480 Speaker 2: and that just completely undermined the humoral medicine thought that 138 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:21,320 Speaker 2: these these humors moved around the body through attractive forces. 139 00:08:22,200 --> 00:08:24,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know, again, this is one of those 140 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:27,000 Speaker 1: kind of what I said in the intro, like, this 141 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 1: is one of those that people believed and got on 142 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:32,319 Speaker 1: board with because it made sense at the time. It 143 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 1: was something that they were very persistent about. And if 144 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 1: you're persistent about something, even if it wasn't proven at 145 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:46,040 Speaker 1: the time, that was enough for people. It was the 146 00:08:46,120 --> 00:08:49,679 Speaker 1: consistency of sort of the idea that's repeated over and 147 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:52,000 Speaker 1: over that got people on board for a long time, 148 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:52,800 Speaker 1: hundreds of years. 149 00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:56,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think it's interesting, like the humoral medicine 150 00:08:56,600 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 2: is still one of the foundations of ayervedic medicine from 151 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:03,040 Speaker 2: India and that's why they think it might have come 152 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:07,080 Speaker 2: from India originally to Greece. But the basis of it 153 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 2: is that you use like movement and diet to keep 154 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:13,840 Speaker 2: your humors in balance, and that was kind of the 155 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 2: basis of the Greek interpretation too, But then they took 156 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:20,280 Speaker 2: it too far and started using it to treat disease 157 00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 2: and doing all sorts of weird stuff. So now we 158 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:28,439 Speaker 2: have modern medicine, and modern medicine likes to disown its predecessors. 159 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:30,720 Speaker 2: But it wouldn't be here if we didn't have things 160 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 2: like humoral medicine. 161 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:33,760 Speaker 1: First up with Galen. 162 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 2: Why not. 163 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:40,079 Speaker 1: You have sneakily not mentioned that this is a top five. 164 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 2: Oh, that's right, it's a top five, maybe part one 165 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 2: of a top ten. Who knows. 166 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:49,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll see. Should we try and knock out the 167 00:09:49,440 --> 00:09:49,840 Speaker 1: next one? 168 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:52,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, I say that, I say so. I agree, that's 169 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:53,120 Speaker 2: what I say. 170 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 1: All right, this one's interesting and this has to do 171 00:09:56,960 --> 00:10:01,320 Speaker 1: with Yeah, it sounds a little whack, but again you 172 00:10:01,400 --> 00:10:04,240 Speaker 1: have to keep in mind where they were at the time. 173 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:09,199 Speaker 1: So this is the idea put forth by how do 174 00:10:09,240 --> 00:10:10,080 Speaker 1: you pronounce that name? 175 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:18,920 Speaker 2: I'm going with Adoxus, Eudoxus eudoxis, Yeah, I think eudoxis 176 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:19,560 Speaker 2: all right. 177 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:25,200 Speaker 1: Eudoxus of Nidos was born between three ninety five and 178 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:29,199 Speaker 1: three ninety BCC lived to kind of early to mid fifties. 179 00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 1: And he came along and said, all right, I've got 180 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:36,000 Speaker 1: some pretty radical things to throw out there that are fivefold. 181 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 1: Part one, the Earth is the center of the universe. 182 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:39,520 Speaker 2: Check. 183 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:43,959 Speaker 1: And everyone was like, sounds reasonable, And it was reasonable 184 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: at the time. And we'll talk about that in a second. 185 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 1: Number two, all celestial motion is circular Roger number three, 186 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:53,760 Speaker 1: all celestial motion is regular. Number four, The center of 187 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:56,720 Speaker 1: the path of any celestial motion is the same as 188 00:10:56,760 --> 00:10:59,880 Speaker 1: the center of its motion, all right. And then number 189 00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:02,920 Speaker 1: on the center of all celestial motion is the center 190 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:07,440 Speaker 1: of the universe. And I said, you know, he can't 191 00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:09,320 Speaker 1: be blamed for that first one, even though he was 192 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:14,440 Speaker 1: wrong about geocentrism. At the time, when you stood on 193 00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 1: the planet and you looked up and you saw you know, 194 00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 1: stars sort of moving and other things moving in a 195 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:23,600 Speaker 1: circle around the Earth, you probably felt like you were 196 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:25,360 Speaker 1: the center of the universe exactly. 197 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 2: I mean, it would just make sense. You'd be a 198 00:11:27,080 --> 00:11:30,200 Speaker 2: fool to think otherwise because there's no indication that the 199 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:33,680 Speaker 2: Earth itself is also moving. It seems like everything else 200 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 2: is moving around the Earth, so it's not so far 201 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:37,760 Speaker 2: fetched to think that, oh, the Earth is the center 202 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 2: of the universe. Part of it also tied into that 203 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 2: natural philosophy thing where humans were the center of the universe. 204 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:47,440 Speaker 2: They were like the creation of the gods, and of 205 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:50,200 Speaker 2: course why would Earth be anything but the center of 206 00:11:50,240 --> 00:11:53,360 Speaker 2: the universe. But it also had to do with practical stuff, 207 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 2: like what they saw with their own eyes. 208 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:57,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, he wasn't the first person to come up 209 00:11:57,240 --> 00:11:59,439 Speaker 1: with this, like this has been around for a long 210 00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:01,840 Speaker 1: long time. Was just sort of officially reaffirming it. 211 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 2: But he was the first person to give us a 212 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:10,960 Speaker 2: model of the movement of the cosmos, celestial bodies moving 213 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 2: through the sky and trying to explain it. And somebody 214 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:18,679 Speaker 2: who came before him an Aximin's I'm going with that. 215 00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:21,679 Speaker 2: He was the first one to say, Hey, I've got it. 216 00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 2: This is back in the sixth century VC. It shells. 217 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:28,800 Speaker 2: Everything exists in shells, man. 218 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:37,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, the idea that, like, I mean, it almost sounds 219 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:43,840 Speaker 1: like he was creating little miniature galaxies and like everything 220 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:47,080 Speaker 1: we see is contained inside its own little miniature galaxy, 221 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:48,959 Speaker 1: like literally contained in a shell. 222 00:12:49,400 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 2: Yes, but all of these shells are rotating in different 223 00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:54,480 Speaker 2: orbits around. 224 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:58,960 Speaker 1: Earth, right, but they can affect one another, right Or 225 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:00,000 Speaker 1: did that come along later? 226 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:04,439 Speaker 2: That came along with Eudoxus and Aximni's basically said it's shells. 227 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,680 Speaker 2: And then Eudoxis was the first one to really lay 228 00:13:07,679 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 2: out an explanation of theory for how these shells worked. 229 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 2: And I think he came up with twenty seven different shells. 230 00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:19,760 Speaker 2: Some shells had shells within shells. It got really kind 231 00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:23,360 Speaker 2: of crazy. But the point of this isn't like because 232 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:27,199 Speaker 2: Eudoxus was mad or anything like that. He had to 233 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:30,120 Speaker 2: keep adding shells to explain things they saw in the 234 00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:30,800 Speaker 2: night sky. 235 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:33,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's almost like they dug themselves a bit 236 00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 1: of a hole. Instead of course correcting and saying, well, 237 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:39,680 Speaker 1: maybe we should look into a different theory or something, 238 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 1: they were just like kept adding shells exactly. 239 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:46,640 Speaker 2: So one of the big problems was that first of all, 240 00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:48,840 Speaker 2: the Earth is not the center of the universe, but 241 00:13:48,920 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 2: also that the motion of celestial bodies is not circular 242 00:13:53,559 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 2: and it's not regulars. He was basically wrong. Yeah, on 243 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 2: all five of those points. But the reason that they 244 00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:06,640 Speaker 2: that he thought it was circular was that circles were perfect. 245 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:08,760 Speaker 2: And again, the Earth was the center of the universe 246 00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:10,480 Speaker 2: and it was created by the gods, so of course 247 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:13,400 Speaker 2: it was perfect. But other people have pointed out that 248 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 2: it had to be circular if he was going to 249 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:20,880 Speaker 2: apply math, because non circular math for movement hadn't really 250 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:24,440 Speaker 2: been created yet. Yeah, that's basically that's all he had 251 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:26,680 Speaker 2: to work with was circular motion. So if he was 252 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:28,840 Speaker 2: going to actually investigate this and try to figure it 253 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:32,600 Speaker 2: out with math, he had to be circular. So just 254 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:36,240 Speaker 2: by what he had available at the time, that's why 255 00:14:36,280 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 2: this motion was supposedly circular. But that was a huge 256 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 2: boondoggle because it's not circular, as we found out finally 257 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:46,160 Speaker 2: from Kepler, who came along and I think the seventeenth century. 258 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:49,760 Speaker 2: So again this is like two thousand years. People are 259 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 2: like shells is where it's at. Even Copernicus who said 260 00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:57,160 Speaker 2: he was the first one to really say the Sun 261 00:14:57,320 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 2: is at the center of the universe, and what he 262 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 2: was talking about was this solar system and he created 263 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:04,680 Speaker 2: a revolution with that. He still was saying, but it's 264 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 2: all within shells. 265 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,200 Speaker 1: It's just everyone's like, that makes a lot more sense. 266 00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: And then he brings up. 267 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:13,000 Speaker 2: The shells exactly so Copernicus lays it out, and then 268 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:16,000 Speaker 2: Kepler comes along, it's like there's no shells and these 269 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 2: orbits aren't circular, they're elliptical, and he ended up laying 270 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:21,360 Speaker 2: the groundwork for astrophysics to come. 271 00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, it's so easy now that we have 272 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:30,480 Speaker 1: telescopes and beyond, Like, it's hard to even put your 273 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 1: mind in a framework of the only thing you have 274 00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 1: is standing on the earth and looking at something with 275 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:39,120 Speaker 1: your eyeballs and trying to take a guess at what's 276 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:39,880 Speaker 1: happening out there. 277 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:42,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think that's what gets lost too, is 278 00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:45,120 Speaker 2: when we look back and like poke fun at our 279 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:48,840 Speaker 2: ancient predecessors for being so dumb that like they were 280 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:51,360 Speaker 2: really trying to figure this out with what they had 281 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:54,880 Speaker 2: available at the time. And even if it does seem wacky, 282 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 2: it's like, can you explain how adams come together to 283 00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:00,960 Speaker 2: form a rock hi cans? 284 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: That's a good teaser, you know. Yeah, Yeah, I think 285 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:09,280 Speaker 1: it's easy to poke fun of now. But the other 286 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:12,840 Speaker 1: alternative is they didn't even try, and as we see 287 00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:15,400 Speaker 1: time and time again. A lot of the stuff that 288 00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 1: they came up with at least led to the next 289 00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 1: thing and the next thing. And that's what science is. 290 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 1: So like, hats my toga is off to them. 291 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:24,800 Speaker 2: You took your toga off. 292 00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:30,920 Speaker 1: Oh wait a minute, my grapevine atop my head is 293 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:34,200 Speaker 1: off you. All right, my toga is back on. 294 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:37,240 Speaker 2: Okay, because I was gonna say, they're like a helicopter 295 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 2: won't be invented for a thousand plus years. 296 00:16:41,160 --> 00:16:42,960 Speaker 1: All right, I think we should take a break now 297 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 1: and we will talk about the idea that the Earth 298 00:16:47,760 --> 00:17:18,920 Speaker 1: is rotating around to central fire right after this, all right. 299 00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:23,000 Speaker 1: I promised talk of wackiness before we left, about the 300 00:17:23,000 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 1: idea that the Earth circled a central fire capital C, 301 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 1: capital F like the big fire. And this was a 302 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:38,879 Speaker 1: thing Pythagoreans, which are the people, the group that you know, 303 00:17:38,920 --> 00:17:43,000 Speaker 1: followed in the footsteps of Pythagoras himself in the sixth century. 304 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:47,000 Speaker 1: They thought that the Earth circled a big central fire, 305 00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,480 Speaker 1: and not only the Earth, but basically everything, all the planets, 306 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:53,439 Speaker 1: all the stars, the sun, and the moon, everything circled 307 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:56,639 Speaker 1: around a central fire, and that there was also a 308 00:17:56,720 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 1: counter earth, like another earth, and I don't know how 309 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:00,640 Speaker 1: pronounced that. 310 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 2: And titch Thun I think it's Antichthon and Tickson. Yeah, 311 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:07,159 Speaker 2: it's a really odd word. 312 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:10,920 Speaker 1: It is. It's not capitalized, which makes me feel weird. 313 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:13,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, it seems fishy, but that's the name of a 314 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,399 Speaker 2: counter earth that's either in the same orbit or in 315 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:19,760 Speaker 2: its own orbit, but always opposite the Sun from Earth. 316 00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:23,000 Speaker 2: Right right, This wasn't something where they were pointing up 317 00:18:23,040 --> 00:18:25,159 Speaker 2: in it was Mars unless they called Mars. This is 318 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 2: a hypothetical planet that they were saying was out there, 319 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:30,879 Speaker 2: we just can't see it. And then also with the 320 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:33,679 Speaker 2: Central Fire, they're not saying that was the Sun. The 321 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,960 Speaker 2: Sun had its own orbit around the Central Fire. Yeah, 322 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:41,040 Speaker 2: and the Central Fire was unseen because Greece always revolved 323 00:18:41,040 --> 00:18:43,440 Speaker 2: in a way, or the Earth always revolved in a 324 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 2: way that Greece was opposite the Central Fire, so it 325 00:18:46,840 --> 00:18:47,679 Speaker 2: could never see it. 326 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:51,840 Speaker 1: Yeah. So there was this guy, uh Philileus. 327 00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 2: Probably I think that's exactly right. 328 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:57,920 Speaker 1: Of Croton, which sounds like a planet that would circle 329 00:18:57,920 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 1: of fire. 330 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 2: Take me to your leader, Croton. 331 00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:04,760 Speaker 1: But Croton was actually in southern Italy and he was 332 00:19:04,880 --> 00:19:08,160 Speaker 1: another Greek philosopher. Scientists there were a lot of those guys, 333 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:12,840 Speaker 1: and he was hanging around with Socrates. He was a 334 00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:17,000 Speaker 1: pretty prominent Pythagorean. Oh yeah, and he was one of 335 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:21,840 Speaker 1: these guys that put forth this, you know, this idea 336 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:25,680 Speaker 1: even though like they moved away from geocentrism, which is great, 337 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:29,280 Speaker 1: but instead of moving directly into heliocentrism, they moved to 338 00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:30,439 Speaker 1: the central fire thing. 339 00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:32,520 Speaker 2: First central fire sism. 340 00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:33,520 Speaker 1: Yeah. 341 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:37,280 Speaker 2: So yeah, he basically said, there's a central fire, everything 342 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,919 Speaker 2: orbits around the central fire, and the all of the 343 00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:46,040 Speaker 2: orbits are circular. They love circular orbits, and that the Earth, 344 00:19:46,240 --> 00:19:49,160 Speaker 2: the Sun, the Moon, and the five planets each had 345 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 2: their own orbit. And there was that counter Earth too, 346 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:57,280 Speaker 2: bizarro Earth and Tikman that was opposite Earth at all times. 347 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:01,920 Speaker 2: That made ten ten orbits altogether. And there are a 348 00:20:01,960 --> 00:20:04,639 Speaker 2: couple of reasons for that. One is that to the Pythagoreans, 349 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:07,280 Speaker 2: ten was a perfect number. So of course there were 350 00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 2: ten orbits, but also it explained having that counter Earth, 351 00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:16,840 Speaker 2: that tenth orbit explained lunar eclipses because then that meant 352 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:19,359 Speaker 2: that that was just a tick thin shadow being cast 353 00:20:19,440 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 2: on the Moon. 354 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:25,520 Speaker 1: Yeah. Also to in defense of these sort of wild ideas, 355 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 1: they did have the idea that these orbits, they varied 356 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 1: quite a bit in how long they took. The Earth's 357 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:34,919 Speaker 1: took twenty four hours, the suns took a year, the 358 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:37,520 Speaker 1: moons took a month. And you know, they were on 359 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:40,639 Speaker 1: a right track at that point as far as lunar 360 00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:44,639 Speaker 1: orbits and Earth's orbits in the Sun and things like that, 361 00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:48,120 Speaker 1: because they all do take different amounts of time, and 362 00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 1: they were pretty on track with the Earth taking twenty 363 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:54,399 Speaker 1: four hours, except the way they describe it was I 364 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:57,320 Speaker 1: think it was more that not the Earth is spinning 365 00:20:57,320 --> 00:21:00,399 Speaker 1: on its axis as at orbits the Sun, but more 366 00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 1: like we're really circulating the central fire a lot faster 367 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:07,200 Speaker 1: than the Sun, and we lap the Sun every twenty 368 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:09,400 Speaker 1: four hours, and that's how we have day and night. 369 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 2: It's just so wrong, but you can understand. It's so 370 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:17,080 Speaker 2: fascinating that they had that data, they had that information available, 371 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 2: and they just went the exact wrong direction with it. Yeah, 372 00:21:20,359 --> 00:21:22,639 Speaker 2: but again, this is just what this is what they 373 00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:24,960 Speaker 2: had available to them at the time. I find that 374 00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:29,480 Speaker 2: fascinating that that's how they explained it. It's pretty cool. 375 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 2: So in this IFL Science article I found, they basically 376 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,560 Speaker 2: said it's actually possible, hypothetically for a counter Earth to 377 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 2: exist in the same orbit as Earth, but always opposite Earth, 378 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:45,320 Speaker 2: like traveling at the same rate. We've discovered extra solar 379 00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:50,119 Speaker 2: planets that have that same arrangement, so it's possible, but 380 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:53,399 Speaker 2: it's impossible that there actually is a counter Earth because 381 00:21:53,920 --> 00:21:56,680 Speaker 2: we've run models on it. Our astrophysicists have, I should say, 382 00:21:56,720 --> 00:22:00,760 Speaker 2: you and I haven't, and it would It would affect 383 00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:04,960 Speaker 2: other planets. Even just a small counter Earth would affect 384 00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:09,920 Speaker 2: other planets orbits very noticeably. Is starting with Venus, and 385 00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:13,440 Speaker 2: Venus's orbit is not being affected by any mysterious object, 386 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:15,760 Speaker 2: so there is no counter Earth. That turns out. 387 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,600 Speaker 1: That's right, I'm sure. Jim Morrison was very disappointed to 388 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:24,080 Speaker 1: hear that the central fire went away. This all reminded 389 00:22:24,119 --> 00:22:25,080 Speaker 1: me of like a door song. 390 00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:26,960 Speaker 2: Central fire, Yeah, for sure. 391 00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:30,320 Speaker 1: You know, everything revolving around a central fire a counter earth. 392 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:34,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it does kind of seem doors issh also 393 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 2: pink floidy. 394 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:38,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true because the doors didn't get super spacey 395 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 1: as like literal space. 396 00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:43,720 Speaker 2: No, but he a central fire sounds Jim Morrison, the 397 00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 2: counter Earth sounds pink floidy. Yeah, you're right, Okay, I'm 398 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:50,280 Speaker 2: glad we finally settled it. 399 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:52,960 Speaker 1: All right, what do we get next? 400 00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:56,080 Speaker 2: So another one that I think a lot of people 401 00:22:56,080 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 2: are familiar with is the four elements, like earth, air, wind, fire, 402 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 2: earth wind, fire, and air. 403 00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:08,119 Speaker 1: Great band Okay, screws it all up? Feature air another 404 00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:11,440 Speaker 1: great band? Air should open for earth, wind and fire exactly. 405 00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:14,840 Speaker 2: And those that that whole idea it dates back to, 406 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:19,520 Speaker 2: like the humoral sense of medicine as well. This was 407 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:22,639 Speaker 2: something that was found in I think the sixth century BCE, 408 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 2: and that an x Menes, the guy who also said 409 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:29,440 Speaker 2: it's shells, also was like, it's air. 410 00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:31,320 Speaker 1: I love this guy. 411 00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:34,919 Speaker 2: Yeah, he really was out there, but he like he 412 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,360 Speaker 2: lives in a van down by the river, but he 413 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:38,600 Speaker 2: was very well regarded. 414 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:44,480 Speaker 1: Yeah. So, I mean a lot of people were sort 415 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:47,480 Speaker 1: of thinking at the time that things were all made 416 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:49,840 Speaker 1: from a single thing, none of no one could get 417 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:52,080 Speaker 1: together and agree on what that single thing might be. 418 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: But like you said, for what was it an x 419 00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: And yeah, I think so he was all about the air. 420 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:03,520 Speaker 1: And Plato came along and then later said, actually we've 421 00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:08,800 Speaker 1: got earth, fire, water, and air. And Aristotle said, don't 422 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:13,880 Speaker 1: forget about the ether. And they're like, all right, yeah, fine. 423 00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:16,280 Speaker 2: That's something that comes up a lot when you start 424 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:21,800 Speaker 2: researching ancient knowledge. Aristotle in particular was the guy everyone 425 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,959 Speaker 2: looked at for a thumbs up or thumbs down and 426 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,000 Speaker 2: knowledge at the time, and just him giving a thumbs 427 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 2: up would mean that people would keep doing it for 428 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:33,919 Speaker 2: two thousand years until the scientific revolution. He was that 429 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:38,639 Speaker 2: well regarded in his time and following his time as well, 430 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:43,119 Speaker 2: so he definitely was like, yes, I'm totally down with 431 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:47,560 Speaker 2: the whole earth, air, fire, water, and ether idea that 432 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:51,359 Speaker 2: everything is made of that and that everything is touching 433 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,560 Speaker 2: everything else. So like the space between you and me 434 00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:57,000 Speaker 2: filled with the air element, but not only that. It's 435 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:58,840 Speaker 2: not only like if you look at the earth that's 436 00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:01,040 Speaker 2: obviously earth element, or if feel like a fire this 437 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,720 Speaker 2: fire element. Everything is made up of a combination of 438 00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:08,520 Speaker 2: some degree of each of these elements. And there's actually 439 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:11,479 Speaker 2: method to that madness too. It wasn't just like because 440 00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:14,199 Speaker 2: where we know what water is, we know what air is, 441 00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 2: we know what fire is, and earth that's what we're 442 00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:19,919 Speaker 2: gonna say, everything's made up. They actually made observations that 443 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:23,320 Speaker 2: either led them to this or that really supported their 444 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:24,480 Speaker 2: ideas in the first place. 445 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:25,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. 446 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:28,120 Speaker 2: Like, for example, this is how Stuff Works article gives 447 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 2: a great example. Wood was solid, which means that it 448 00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:34,399 Speaker 2: had earth in it. It floated, which means that it 449 00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:36,680 Speaker 2: had an air element to it, and then it. 450 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,720 Speaker 1: Burns, which right, then it burned, which did. 451 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,439 Speaker 2: So part fire too. So you can see how these 452 00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:46,520 Speaker 2: things kind of came together to form a log or 453 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 2: a stone or a rabbit. Is another recurring theme. 454 00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:53,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, so that's where we are. Then this 455 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:57,639 Speaker 1: guy Empedocles comes along. He's from Sicily, fifth century BCE, 456 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:00,479 Speaker 1: and he was one of the first people to kind 457 00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:04,800 Speaker 1: of put forth the theory that, you know, maybe things 458 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 1: are built out of things that are so small that 459 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,320 Speaker 1: we can't see them, right, that there are actual building blocks, 460 00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:14,120 Speaker 1: we can't touch them, we can't see them or feel them. 461 00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:17,320 Speaker 1: And if you look at a stone, like look at 462 00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:20,800 Speaker 1: that big rock over there, that's not we call it rock, 463 00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:24,320 Speaker 1: but it's not rock. It's made up of these small elements. 464 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:29,119 Speaker 1: And people went elements and he said, yes, elements. And 465 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,560 Speaker 1: this was a pretty like far out but on the 466 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:34,640 Speaker 1: right track way of thinking for fifth century BCE. 467 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think he was in Pedocolis was the guy 468 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:38,879 Speaker 2: who came along and said no, that these things are 469 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,720 Speaker 2: all made up of different combinations and interactions of these 470 00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:46,960 Speaker 2: four elements. And he also suggested that the transformations or 471 00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:50,359 Speaker 2: the creations of these things took place through an attractive 472 00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:51,639 Speaker 2: force known as love. 473 00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 1: Oh man, I love that part. 474 00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:56,320 Speaker 2: That that was the combiner, the creator force. So if 475 00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:59,400 Speaker 2: you step back and think about epidocolis, he's just introduced 476 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,200 Speaker 2: the idea that there are elements. There are elements, it's 477 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:06,080 Speaker 2: just the earth, air, fire, wind, and water. And he 478 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,520 Speaker 2: also introduced the idea of attractive horses that bring elements together. 479 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:15,880 Speaker 2: And it's not love. Maybe it's more like electro magnetism 480 00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:18,160 Speaker 2: or the nuclear force something like that. 481 00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:21,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. Boy, talk about Jim Morrison. He would have 482 00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:23,680 Speaker 1: been all over this episode totally. I think it would 483 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:25,760 Speaker 1: have been a big stuff. You should know, fan, Do 484 00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:26,199 Speaker 1: you think so? 485 00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:28,840 Speaker 2: I could see him really just talking smack about us 486 00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:30,440 Speaker 2: for no good reason on the internet. 487 00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:34,600 Speaker 1: I mean, how old would he be today? He died 488 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:36,800 Speaker 1: at It's a twenty seven clubber and he died in 489 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:41,480 Speaker 1: the seventies, so. 490 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:41,560 Speaker 2: I would say probably forty eight. Let's say he was 491 00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:45,119 Speaker 2: born in nineteen forty eight. So seventy five, he'd be 492 00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 2: something that's perfect age to complaint on the internet these days. 493 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:54,600 Speaker 1: I remember I remember seeing a phony gap ad this 494 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,240 Speaker 1: is a long time ago, where they showed like an 495 00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:00,920 Speaker 1: aged Jim Morrison in like gap jeans or something what, 496 00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,600 Speaker 1: and they did a really good job with it and 497 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,080 Speaker 1: it looked like totally like what you could picture him 498 00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:06,520 Speaker 1: looking like. 499 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:08,320 Speaker 2: Are you sure you didn't just dream that? 500 00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:11,960 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure. I also saw the thing recently where 501 00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:13,960 Speaker 1: they use AI to create like what would they look 502 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:16,440 Speaker 1: like now kind of things? Uh huh. For a lot 503 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:18,360 Speaker 1: of people who died young, and some of them were 504 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,199 Speaker 1: pretty good, and some of them, like Elvis's was just 505 00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:24,440 Speaker 1: like you just basically gussied up Vernon Presley his dad. 506 00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:28,680 Speaker 1: Oh really it was like obviously his dad lazy AI. Yeah, 507 00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:30,600 Speaker 1: some of them were okay. Some of them were pretty dumb. 508 00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:32,399 Speaker 2: Well like Coo, who was one that was okay that 509 00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:32,840 Speaker 2: you saw? 510 00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:38,280 Speaker 1: Uh oh boy, I'm trying to remember. I don't know. 511 00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:41,160 Speaker 2: I don't have to go look that up. I always 512 00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 2: forget to look up the stuff you talk about on 513 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 2: the episodes because the moment we're done, I'm all of 514 00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:49,440 Speaker 2: it just vanishes. Yeah, you stop existing. 515 00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:52,440 Speaker 1: That's great. That's a secret to our longevity. 516 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 2: That's right. We just both stop existing in the other's 517 00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:56,680 Speaker 2: minds until the next time. 518 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:03,960 Speaker 1: All right, so where are we? We are a democritis okay, yeah, yeah, 519 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:06,920 Speaker 1: Democritis then comes along, Yeah, and he's like, all right, 520 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:10,360 Speaker 1: I got this new theory because there were some problems 521 00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:14,440 Speaker 1: with what Empedocles was talking about. First of all, he 522 00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:16,760 Speaker 1: has offered no evidence. I don't know if anyone noticed 523 00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:19,800 Speaker 1: that at all. And second of all, you take that 524 00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:21,520 Speaker 1: rock of it there, and he said, it's made up 525 00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:24,480 Speaker 1: you know, if you if you break it up, it's 526 00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 1: made up of smaller things. But if you keep breaking 527 00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:30,080 Speaker 1: that thing up, you're never gonna get down to fire, 528 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: no matter how small you break that thing up. 529 00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:35,640 Speaker 2: Right, So he came up with this idea that you 530 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:41,240 Speaker 2: could break something down to finally its most basic unit, 531 00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:47,160 Speaker 2: an indivisible unit that he called atomos, which is Latin 532 00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:50,720 Speaker 2: or Greek for adams. Yeah, this guy came up with 533 00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:52,960 Speaker 2: the idea of adams, which he not only mad said 534 00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:58,480 Speaker 2: were the indivisible base units of everything everything. He also 535 00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:02,680 Speaker 2: said that they were into instructible and eternal. And then 536 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:07,040 Speaker 2: he also said that they exist in free space around 537 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:09,959 Speaker 2: us what you would call today a vacuum. So this 538 00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:16,160 Speaker 2: guy basically predicted atomic theory a couple thousand years ago, right, yeah, 539 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 2: and it's known as the best guess in antiquity. He 540 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 2: got it so close. Where he went astray is that 541 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,320 Speaker 2: he said that when you broke down a rock, you 542 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,120 Speaker 2: would get to the rock atom. And that was it. 543 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:32,480 Speaker 2: Like what you saw a rock, a rabbit something like that, 544 00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:36,720 Speaker 2: you would if you broke it down to its constituent part, 545 00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:41,680 Speaker 2: like its base atom. It was a rabbit atom, or 546 00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:44,320 Speaker 2: a rock atom, or a log atom, or a chuck atom, 547 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:47,600 Speaker 2: the things. The thing it was, it was like that 548 00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:50,959 Speaker 2: specific kind of atom rather than a combination of just 549 00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:53,840 Speaker 2: a few types of atoms that can make anything. 550 00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, which you know you did pretty get up into 551 00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:00,320 Speaker 1: that point. For sure, you did very good. I dare 552 00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:01,680 Speaker 1: say excellent up in that point. 553 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 2: Would you take your toge off for him? 554 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:08,440 Speaker 1: I'd flash it, okay, but you know, with permission, of course, 555 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:12,000 Speaker 1: sure I would. You know, it's like, do you mind 556 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:14,479 Speaker 1: if I lift my togad? And he could? 557 00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:15,440 Speaker 2: You added that? 558 00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,000 Speaker 1: So you know, everyone of course wanted to know what 559 00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:22,160 Speaker 1: Aristotle and Plato thought, even you know at the time 560 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:26,160 Speaker 1: or especially at the time, and they both basically rejected 561 00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 1: these ideas. Aristotle sort of accepted it, but he said, well, also, 562 00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:36,160 Speaker 1: there are those four core elements, but they can be 563 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:40,040 Speaker 1: transformed into one another. And everyone was like, oh God, 564 00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:42,200 Speaker 1: here he goes again, Like now we have to start 565 00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,320 Speaker 1: thinking that because Aristotle said. 566 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,040 Speaker 2: It exactly, he was. He threw his lot in with 567 00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:50,480 Speaker 2: the four elements, in part because he totally rejected Democritis's 568 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:54,080 Speaker 2: assertion that there was such a thing as Adams moving 569 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,360 Speaker 2: in a void in free space. He said, there's no 570 00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:58,920 Speaker 2: such thing as a void. Everything around us is connected, 571 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,080 Speaker 2: Like the stuff that looks like space between you and me, 572 00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:04,920 Speaker 2: that's the air element filling that up. Like there's nothing 573 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:08,080 Speaker 2: that's not connected. And because he just would not accept 574 00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 2: the idea of a vacuum, he gave the thumbs up 575 00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:17,320 Speaker 2: to Empedocle's idea with the elements thumbs down to Democritis. 576 00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:21,680 Speaker 2: So Democritis is incredibly accurate. Prediction would have to wait 577 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:24,280 Speaker 2: about two thousand years before people finally came around and 578 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:26,480 Speaker 2: were like, oh, Democritis was super. 579 00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:31,040 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, exactly. And that's in sixteen forty three. Evangelista 580 00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:33,560 Speaker 1: Torricelli came along. 581 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:35,960 Speaker 2: Linda Evangelista Torricelli, that's. 582 00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:42,640 Speaker 1: Right, an Italian mathematician, this time studying under Galileo, came 583 00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:46,560 Speaker 1: along and showed that air and I believe he was 584 00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:48,840 Speaker 1: he the first person to create a vacuum in an 585 00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:52,840 Speaker 1: experiment like this. Yeah, so that's a pretty key part here, 586 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,160 Speaker 1: But in a vacuum, showed that air had weight, like 587 00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: this thing that we can't see or well, sometimes you 588 00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,560 Speaker 1: can smell it, I guess, but you can't see it 589 00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:05,480 Speaker 1: or feel it or anything like that. But it was 590 00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:10,320 Speaker 1: still capable of pushing down liquid mercury, which is also 591 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:13,520 Speaker 1: how he got the barometer, by the way, and everyone 592 00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:17,040 Speaker 1: was like it rocked everyone's world, basically, like we can't 593 00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 1: feel it, we can't see it, but it has weight, 594 00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:21,880 Speaker 1: so it's got to be made of something, and so 595 00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 1: what's it made of? 596 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 2: Right? So how can an element be made of something else? 597 00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,520 Speaker 2: I guess is the point of that. And then even 598 00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:34,520 Speaker 2: more to the point, Torricelli, by creating the first experimental vacuum, 599 00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:38,760 Speaker 2: proved that Democratis's assertion that there is a vacuum, his 600 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:42,520 Speaker 2: predictions part of his atomic theory, was right. So that 601 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:46,000 Speaker 2: was what really led to the investigation into atomic theory, 602 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:49,560 Speaker 2: which is finally I think put forth in I think 603 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:54,920 Speaker 2: eighteen oh three maybe by John Dalton. Amazing, It really 604 00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:57,920 Speaker 2: is amazing that he got that close. Like imagine just 605 00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:01,040 Speaker 2: and again he's guessing. He had no way of testing 606 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:04,280 Speaker 2: any of this, but it was a really good guess. 607 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:07,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, very very smart forward thinking guy. 608 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:12,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll bet he was a heck of a discus thrower. Two. 609 00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:15,840 Speaker 1: All right, well, we're gonna take our final break and 610 00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:18,680 Speaker 1: we're gonna come back and talk about our final topic. 611 00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:21,480 Speaker 1: Number one, spontaneous generation. 612 00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:52,239 Speaker 2: All right, chuck. So there's a well worn trope that 613 00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:56,440 Speaker 2: if you throw some grain in like a cellar and 614 00:34:56,600 --> 00:35:00,360 Speaker 2: leave it alone for a little while, it'll spontaneously generate mice, 615 00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:03,400 Speaker 2: right have you you've heard that before. 616 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:06,240 Speaker 1: Haven't you sure? That old bumper sticker. 617 00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:09,680 Speaker 2: Apparently there's an element that I'd never heard of before. 618 00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:12,560 Speaker 2: You have to put the grains of wheat on a 619 00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:16,640 Speaker 2: soiled shirt, and then it'll generate mice after a given 620 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:20,799 Speaker 2: amount of time. And that came from the mind of 621 00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 2: a guy named Antoine Lewen Hook Levin' hook whoa von Levinhook, 622 00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:31,000 Speaker 2: Yeah who? In the sixteen seventies, basically pointed to a 623 00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:35,800 Speaker 2: bunch of stuff and said, spontaneous generation, spontaneous generation, spontaneous generation. 624 00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:39,799 Speaker 2: And again he was so he wasn't actually coming up 625 00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,480 Speaker 2: with this idea of spontaneous generation. He was giving it 626 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:46,279 Speaker 2: a boost in the seventeenth century. It was actually a 627 00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:50,680 Speaker 2: really ancient way of explaining where life came from. And 628 00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 2: at the time of again Aristotle, there were three competing theories, right, 629 00:35:55,440 --> 00:36:00,440 Speaker 2: there was spontaneous generation, there was Preformationism, and then there 630 00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:04,640 Speaker 2: was epigenesis. And depending on what you thought about what 631 00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:08,120 Speaker 2: you subscribe to at least one, if not two, of 632 00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:09,160 Speaker 2: those at the same time. 633 00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:15,160 Speaker 1: Can I name my favorite spontaneous generation from Jean Baptista 634 00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:19,240 Speaker 1: von Helmont. Yes, that if you took a brick mold 635 00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:23,440 Speaker 1: and lined it with basil, you would spawn scorpions. 636 00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:24,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, isn't that weird? 637 00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:25,720 Speaker 1: It's pretty good. 638 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:28,600 Speaker 2: He also said, and I think I said it was 639 00:36:28,640 --> 00:36:31,279 Speaker 2: Antoine von Leevinhook who said that. No, I'm sorry, that 640 00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:35,279 Speaker 2: was the guy who started to perfect the microscope. He 641 00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:38,600 Speaker 2: comes in later on. I was wrong, But von Helmont 642 00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:41,360 Speaker 2: van Helmont, he was the one that came up with 643 00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:43,399 Speaker 2: a whole bunch of different ones like mice from grain, 644 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:47,920 Speaker 2: scorpions from brick molds. I think insects was a huge 645 00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:52,200 Speaker 2: one that if you laid out rotting meat. Yeah, this 646 00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 2: is a big one, maggots would spontaneously generate. And again 647 00:36:56,600 --> 00:37:01,720 Speaker 2: it sounds mad, it sounds ridiculous, preposterous to us today, 648 00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:06,360 Speaker 2: but that was before Antoine von Leevenhook, the Dutch scientists 649 00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:11,520 Speaker 2: introduced or popularized the microscope, and could show with his 650 00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:14,520 Speaker 2: much more improved version of the microscope that there was 651 00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:17,680 Speaker 2: a whole other world out there that's invisible to the 652 00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:20,880 Speaker 2: naked eye. Prior to that, they had no idea and 653 00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:23,279 Speaker 2: if they did it, they were just guessing. And so 654 00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:25,360 Speaker 2: it would make sense that you're like, okay, if you 655 00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:27,759 Speaker 2: lease some rotting meat out, these totally these things just 656 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:32,160 Speaker 2: come out of nowhere. The maggots generate from spontaneously from 657 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:32,759 Speaker 2: rotting meat. 658 00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:36,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know that was disproved before the microscope. 659 00:37:36,560 --> 00:37:40,880 Speaker 1: The maggots at least yeah by Francesco ready was a 660 00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:44,719 Speaker 1: Tuscan position and said, you know, all you gotta do 661 00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:47,480 Speaker 1: is keep the flies off of it. You're not going 662 00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:49,400 Speaker 1: to get maggots, So let's just cover it with some 663 00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:54,719 Speaker 1: muslin and voila no maggot. So everyone was a little disappointed. 664 00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:59,879 Speaker 1: I think the microscope comes along right, and it didn't 665 00:37:59,920 --> 00:38:03,600 Speaker 1: like blow up everything automatically. As far as these theories go, 666 00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:08,360 Speaker 1: it did not settle anything out of the gate, because 667 00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:12,239 Speaker 1: what basically they were saying was, you know, there are 668 00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,239 Speaker 1: things that are so tiny we can't see them with 669 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:15,960 Speaker 1: our naked eye, but now we can see them with 670 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:19,399 Speaker 1: this microscope. But then all of a sudden people started saying, oh, well, 671 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:23,680 Speaker 1: those tiny things are what's causing the spontaneous generation. Then 672 00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:24,800 Speaker 1: we just couldn't see. 673 00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:28,360 Speaker 2: Them before, right, But then the microscope also said the 674 00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:31,560 Speaker 2: people who were in favor of spontaneous generation said, great, 675 00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:35,600 Speaker 2: those are the things that are spontaneously generating. Then we 676 00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:38,600 Speaker 2: just don't see them until they become maggots. And so 677 00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:43,680 Speaker 2: they performed experiments where they would seal a flask of water, 678 00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:46,680 Speaker 2: boil it to sterilize it, and then wait a few 679 00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:49,040 Speaker 2: days and go back and look, and there would be 680 00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:52,480 Speaker 2: microbes again where there hadn't been before, and they're like, 681 00:38:52,560 --> 00:38:55,840 Speaker 2: see spontaneous generation. And then some of the critics of 682 00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:58,759 Speaker 2: those experiments said, you guys just aren't boiling it long enough. 683 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,319 Speaker 2: It's not actually right. And it wasn't until I think 684 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:06,000 Speaker 2: eighteen sixty when Louis Pasture came along and said, this 685 00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:09,560 Speaker 2: is how you precisely sterilize things and showed the world 686 00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:12,760 Speaker 2: how to do it, that he really was He managed 687 00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:15,360 Speaker 2: to really kind of put the final nail in the 688 00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:17,120 Speaker 2: coffin for spontaneous generation. 689 00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:20,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, and that was kind of it. From that moment 690 00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:23,239 Speaker 1: we knew, or you know, we started to build on 691 00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:27,000 Speaker 1: the idea that life arises from life. That's the only 692 00:39:27,040 --> 00:39:30,960 Speaker 1: way things do not spontaneously generate. As fun of an 693 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:33,480 Speaker 1: idea as that is, life comes from life and that's 694 00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:34,920 Speaker 1: the only place that comes from. 695 00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:37,960 Speaker 2: Yes. So I said that in the ancient world you 696 00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:42,200 Speaker 2: may have subscribed to two of those, and the reason 697 00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:46,200 Speaker 2: why is because one of them epigenesis, an Aristotle product 698 00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:52,480 Speaker 2: Aristotle brand was pretty pretty accurate. It was Aristotle explaining 699 00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:55,319 Speaker 2: that the fluids from the mother and the fluids from 700 00:39:55,320 --> 00:40:00,800 Speaker 2: the father exchanged during sexual reproduction, are what of rise 701 00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:04,719 Speaker 2: to biology, what gives rise to life, and after that 702 00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:07,759 Speaker 2: it just becomes an embryo and starts growing. And the 703 00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:11,920 Speaker 2: main rival that epigenesis was Preformationism, which said that if 704 00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:14,759 Speaker 2: you could get a sample of your dad's sperm and 705 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:18,560 Speaker 2: could zoom in on an individual sperm cell, you would 706 00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:22,799 Speaker 2: see a mini version of yourself and that you that 707 00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:26,600 Speaker 2: was just that was deposited in your mom where you 708 00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:28,799 Speaker 2: started to grow, You came out of your mom, you 709 00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:31,680 Speaker 2: kept growing until you finally reached your adult size. But 710 00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:35,160 Speaker 2: you were pre formed even before you were conceived. And 711 00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:37,759 Speaker 2: those were the two rivals. But the cool thing about 712 00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:42,760 Speaker 2: epigenesis is that you could say epigenesis and spontaneous generation 713 00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:47,440 Speaker 2: can coexist because something spontaneously generate, like say crocodiles out 714 00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:52,319 Speaker 2: of an exposed riverbank. They once they spontaneously generate, then 715 00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:56,040 Speaker 2: they'll just start reproducing biologically through epigenesis. 716 00:40:56,360 --> 00:40:57,640 Speaker 1: Yeah. 717 00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:01,040 Speaker 2: Pretty interesting that Aristotle finally got one, right. 718 00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:05,040 Speaker 1: That guy, Yeah, that guy. I like the Aristotle brand. 719 00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:08,279 Speaker 2: I had a really great time, and I know you did, 720 00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:10,320 Speaker 2: so I say we do a part two of this someday, 721 00:41:11,120 --> 00:41:15,120 Speaker 2: all right, we'll see. Okay. Well, as everyone's waiting for that, 722 00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:17,680 Speaker 2: you can go check out this housetuff Works article about 723 00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:22,439 Speaker 2: things we believe before the scientific method. And I think 724 00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:24,400 Speaker 2: since I said that, it's time for listener mail. 725 00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, I dug this one out. Jeez, this one's been 726 00:41:30,640 --> 00:41:32,160 Speaker 1: out there for a long time, so I'm just gonna 727 00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:34,920 Speaker 1: say long time coming. Okay, hey, guys, just listen to 728 00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:39,840 Speaker 1: how conversion therapy doesn't work. Oh yeah, Joe, the listener 729 00:41:40,480 --> 00:41:43,160 Speaker 1: got on you. I guess this was another listener mail 730 00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:46,920 Speaker 1: got on to you about saying and historic, and then 731 00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:49,399 Speaker 1: you started to doubt every H word. But the rule 732 00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:51,279 Speaker 1: is super simple, guys. As long as you know how 733 00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:54,759 Speaker 1: things sound, does the word start with a vowel sound? 734 00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:57,759 Speaker 1: If the answer is yes, then and is correct, it 735 00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:02,239 Speaker 1: starts with a consonant use a. So here's some examples. 736 00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:08,360 Speaker 1: The Undertaker tapped people out with a Hell's gate. I 737 00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:09,520 Speaker 1: guess that's a wrestling thing. 738 00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:10,120 Speaker 2: Okay. 739 00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:14,719 Speaker 1: The atomic leg drop is a Hulk Hogan move. 740 00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:16,960 Speaker 2: I like this guy. 741 00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:23,680 Speaker 1: It was an honor to have seen bray Wyatt's creativity 742 00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:28,200 Speaker 1: on screen and honor. The pre show for this pay 743 00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:35,040 Speaker 1: per view lasted an hour, so n historic. It sounds 744 00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:38,560 Speaker 1: snooty almost to say nhistoric, but it's true because you 745 00:42:38,600 --> 00:42:41,200 Speaker 1: say it takes about an hour, and that doesn't sound snooty. 746 00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:44,040 Speaker 2: No, But it depends on how much you emphasize the 747 00:42:44,239 --> 00:42:49,680 Speaker 2: H and historic, because most people don't say historic. It's historic, right, 748 00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:52,520 Speaker 2: whereas Honor, it's like that it starts with an oh, 749 00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:54,000 Speaker 2: like the h is silent. 750 00:42:53,680 --> 00:42:57,840 Speaker 1: Almost right, like if England and Henry Higgins is biking 751 00:42:57,880 --> 00:42:58,239 Speaker 1: to ya. 752 00:42:58,719 --> 00:42:59,239 Speaker 2: Exactly. 753 00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:04,760 Speaker 1: These examples, guys, brings me to the request from my email, 754 00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:06,160 Speaker 1: could you do a show in pro wrestling? 755 00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:07,520 Speaker 2: Nice? 756 00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:09,920 Speaker 1: And that is from Aviva. 757 00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:12,600 Speaker 2: Thanks Aviva, that was a great email, one of the 758 00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:15,600 Speaker 2: all time greats. I agree, and yes, we'll do one 759 00:43:15,640 --> 00:43:18,680 Speaker 2: on pro wrestling someday We've done We've nibbled around the edges, 760 00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:20,760 Speaker 2: but we'll finally do one on just pro wrestling. 761 00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:23,239 Speaker 1: Yeah. We did Mexican wrestling, right, Lucha Libra. 762 00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:25,839 Speaker 2: Yeah, we also did a live one on Andre the Giant. 763 00:43:26,120 --> 00:43:28,080 Speaker 1: M So maybe not on pro wrestling. 764 00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:31,000 Speaker 2: Then well, if you want to be like a Viva 765 00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:33,640 Speaker 2: and take your shot at requesting an episode, you can 766 00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:36,240 Speaker 2: do that by sending us an email to Stuff podcast 767 00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:40,560 Speaker 2: at iHeartRadio dot com. 768 00:43:40,719 --> 00:43:43,600 Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For 769 00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:47,879 Speaker 1: more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 770 00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:49,840 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.