Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to sign Stuff, a production of iHeartRadio. I'm
Speaker 1: hoor cham And in this bonus short episode, we are
Speaker 1: following up on our recent episode about the search for
Speaker 1: alien life. In that episode, we talked about what scientists
Speaker 1: are doing to look for life out there in space,
Speaker 1: and so now the question is what if we find it?
Speaker 1: Are we prepared? Would people freak out or would they
Speaker 1: shrug and go about their regular lives. We're gonna talk
Speaker 1: to an anthropologist who's been looking into this question. Are
Speaker 1: we gonna hear her opinion on what discovering aliens would
Speaker 1: do to the human race. I think her answer at
Speaker 1: the end will surprise you. So here is my interview
Speaker 1: with doctor Clara Kapoa as we answer the question what
Speaker 1: if we find aliens? Well, thank you doctor Coppola for
Speaker 1: joining us.
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. It's really nice meeting you,
Speaker 2: the famous cartoonist, the creator.
Speaker 1: Of the Thank you so when.
Speaker 2: I miss Clara. I studied socio culturalthropology. I specialized in
Speaker 2: science and technology studies, and my question was search for
Speaker 2: life beyond Earth. So I was writing about what it
Speaker 2: really means to people to think about what the other
Speaker 2: life is, how people used to search for that life
Speaker 2: or how they would work with the idea.
Speaker 1: Doctor Kapova has worked with NASA and the European Space
Speaker 1: Agency on several projects, but one of them was to
Speaker 1: get a sense of what people see in their heads
Speaker 1: when they imagine an alien So, for example, take a
Speaker 1: moment and close your eyes unless you're driving, and picture
Speaker 1: in your head when an alien being would look like.
Speaker 1: Did you imagine little green men or women, or maybe
Speaker 1: something insect like? Or may you imagine a reptilian creature
Speaker 1: like the ones in Star Wars or Star Trek. Well
Speaker 1: you're not alone.
Speaker 2: When I was doing my research and talking to people,
Speaker 2: not only scientists but also citizens of Europe, I would
Speaker 2: just ask for their idea about the otherness or other
Speaker 2: life was. You know, there are hundreds and hundreds of
Speaker 2: imagined life form that are being brought to us by
Speaker 2: different books and movies and series and the variety of
Speaker 2: our imaginations. It's amazing, actually, So a lot of us
Speaker 2: would read a book when we were little or at
Speaker 2: school or what you movie, and people tend to always
Speaker 2: remembered that as a memory, and this memory almost defines
Speaker 2: what they imagine that the other life could be.
Speaker 1: It's always something you remember from your childhood.
Speaker 2: I would say. So that's the feedback I was getting
Speaker 2: from people.
Speaker 1: So people's expectations of meeting aliens are shaped by the
Speaker 1: movies and books in media we consume. And what's interesting
Speaker 1: is what those depictions, which are made by writers and
Speaker 1: artists say about us.
Speaker 2: What I find really interesting think about imagined extraterrestrials. They
Speaker 2: always somehow mirror what we are or we are not.
Speaker 2: Either it's negation or it's based on what we see
Speaker 2: in the nature I see.
Speaker 1: What we imagine aliens might be is a reflection of
Speaker 1: ourselves and how we see ourselves. We want to see ourselves,
Speaker 1: how we don't want to see ourselves. Can you explain
Speaker 1: that a little more.
Speaker 2: This is based on the first contact scenario, So when
Speaker 2: people imagine first contact with the extraterristrial, and it's something
Speaker 2: that I'm often asked about, like what if we meet,
Speaker 2: what it would be like? What do you think will happen?
Speaker 2: And of course there's been already a research john about this,
Speaker 2: and it's mostly based on the encounters of humans with
Speaker 2: other humans, and this is reflected in the movies or
Speaker 2: the stories as well.
Speaker 1: Okay, what Tarkakapopa is saying is that it's very hard
Speaker 1: to imagine something you've never seen before, so our brains
Speaker 1: automatically go to things we have seen before, or that
Speaker 1: we've seen in bo or movies. I asked her if
Speaker 1: she thought that was a good idea to prepare ourselves
Speaker 1: for potentially meeting aliens. Do you think it's a good
Speaker 1: idea to use that as a reference?
Speaker 2: What else do we have?
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: That's the thing, you know. We use this because the
Speaker 2: human experience we have with encounters with something alien or unknown.
Speaker 1: In other words, we are probably completely unprepared to meet
Speaker 1: alien life because we only know what we know and
Speaker 1: we don't know what we don't know. Okay. In the
Speaker 1: main episode about aliens, we talked about how people are
Speaker 1: searching for two kinds of life out there. Some scientists
Speaker 1: are doing astrobiology, meaning they're looking for basic life like
Speaker 1: microbes that used to live on Mars or maybe self
Speaker 1: replicating molecules on the moons of Jupiter. And then there
Speaker 1: are scientists who are looking for intelligent life out there
Speaker 1: or aliens with advanced technology. According to doctor Kapova, how
Speaker 1: we'll react depends on which of the two we find
Speaker 1: first the people I talk to.
Speaker 2: Most people I interviewed acknowledge that there will be a
Speaker 2: different reaction dependent on the life form or the type
Speaker 2: of the life form that will be.
Speaker 1: Discovered, Meaning you probably react differently if I told you
Speaker 1: we found microbes at Mars than if I told you
Speaker 1: there's an alien flying saucer outside your window right now.
Speaker 1: And doctor Kapova also found that your reaction depends on
Speaker 1: how old you are.
Speaker 2: Young people today they've seen so many science fiction movies
Speaker 2: that they almost like, yeah, of course there's like somewhere,
Speaker 2: but it's so far away and will never see it,
Speaker 2: while older generation be, oh my god, this is like
Speaker 2: the word changing question, you know. So it almost feels
Speaker 2: like pop culture has been bombarded us with new ideas
Speaker 2: that were almost like gotten used to it.
Speaker 1: Do you think the younger generation will not be very
Speaker 1: surprised or won't be very changed by this information.
Speaker 2: That's a good question from what I heard from people.
Speaker 2: A lot of people think that it wouldn't mistake that much,
Speaker 2: but it's tect my everyday life. Unlikely.
Speaker 1: You don't think there'll be a fundamental shift in how
Speaker 1: people think about their lives or civilization or humans.
Speaker 2: You know, our planet consists of six billion people. It's
Speaker 2: really really hard to say how out the society react.
Speaker 2: So who are we talking about? You know, there has
Speaker 2: been a study done that the people in Asia actually
Speaker 2: think that aliens are mostly walking amongst us, but we
Speaker 2: just can't see them. So we also know that each
Speaker 2: culture you have some sort of like a template or yeah,
Speaker 2: a template through which this discovery will be perceived. And
Speaker 2: if we're talking about the change of the world, this
Speaker 2: will be almost a personal thing, right. Well, I'm just
Speaker 2: trying to say that there is no generic answer that
Speaker 2: would cover all people on planet. I see.
Speaker 1: It would be different for each and every single one
Speaker 1: of us.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I say.
Speaker 1: In other words, we may not know how the world
Speaker 1: will react if we find alien life until it actually happens. Okay,
Speaker 1: The last question I asked doctor Kapova was what would
Speaker 1: it mean to her to discover aliens? What would it
Speaker 1: mean to you if we found life in other planets
Speaker 1: or somewhere else in the universe. Let's say it's the
Speaker 1: astrobiology kind. What would you think?
Speaker 2: So I would think that I have now an answer
Speaker 2: to one of the questions I've been asking myself for
Speaker 2: a very long time. But when I was a child,
Speaker 2: I was really curious, like is there something else? Are
Speaker 2: you really alone? Where do we came from? Who are we?
Speaker 2: So I would have that answer and I would be delighted.
Speaker 2: That's it.
Speaker 1: Would you change anything about your life right now?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 1: Would you still go sailing to Antarctica next month?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 1: I didn't tell you before. Doctor Kapova recently took a
Speaker 1: leave from academic research to work on a sailboat, and
Speaker 1: she's scheduled to sail to Antarctica next month. So would
Speaker 1: she still sail to Antarctica if we found my chrobial
Speaker 1: life in another planet?
Speaker 2: Absolutely? Yes?
Speaker 1: Okay, what if it was the alien civilization kind that
Speaker 1: we discovered?
Speaker 2: That is a different story, because if we could communicate
Speaker 2: with them, that I would be curious to know more
Speaker 2: about them.
Speaker 1: Interesting, So then you might not go on that sailing
Speaker 1: ship to Antarctica. Let's say NASA has your contact information.
Speaker 1: European Space Agency has your contact They say, Clara Nay simplication,
Speaker 1: which is established contact. Can you come in and help
Speaker 1: us ask them questions?
Speaker 2: Okay, I would go because that will be two grays
Speaker 2: about I think.
Speaker 1: You would go you would definitely change your life.
Speaker 2: Of course, I would want to know. It's one of
Speaker 2: the most fundamental questions, and I would be really curious.
Speaker 2: So if you asked me, I would probably go, yes.
Speaker 1: I think that perfectly illustrates the range of reactions we
Speaker 1: might have depending on what we find out there.
Speaker 2: Yes, as I said, it really depends on the person.
Speaker 2: I'm sure we would find commonalities, but it would be
Speaker 2: an amazing anthropological study on that on the humans or
Speaker 2: the aliens, I guess in the interactions.
Speaker 1: Oh fantastic. Well, thank you so much for joining us.
Speaker 1: Like krek Kapova, it was my pleasure.
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me tonight.
Speaker 1: All right. I hope you enjoyed that short bonus episode
Speaker 1: and that it maybe got you to think about what
Speaker 1: would mean to you to find out we're not alone
Speaker 1: in the universe. Thanks for joining us. See you next
Speaker 1: time you've been listening to Science Stuff. A production of iHeartRadio,
Speaker 1: written and produced by me Or hey Hm, edited by
Speaker 1: Rose Seguda, Executive producer Jerry Rowland, an audio engineer and
Speaker 1: mixer Chandler Mace and you can follow me on social media.
Speaker 1: Just search for PhD Comics and the name of your
Speaker 1: favorite platform. Be sure to subscribe to sign stuff on
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts,
Speaker 1: and please tell your friends we'll be back next Wednesday,
Speaker 1: another episode