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Speaker 1: Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I'm Matt

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Speaker 1: and today we're discussing COVID travel information and your debt

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Speaker 1: collection rights, Eduel. This is our Friday episode where we

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Speaker 1: covered a bunch of different topics h and specifically we're

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Speaker 1: gonna be speaking with Scott Kais on the second half

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Speaker 1: of this episode. Scott the founder of Scott's Cheap Flights.

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Speaker 1: He's gonna have a lot of great information for Uce

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Speaker 1: regarding travel, specifically airline travel, and we're gonna cover cancelations,

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Speaker 1: you know, flight delays and the different rights that we

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Speaker 1: have to to get our money back. So I'm looking

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Speaker 1: forward to that part of this episode. But first, man,

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Speaker 1: I saw that your favorite e bike company, Uh, they

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Speaker 1: are now offering an affordable e bike for a thousand bucks. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so rad Power Bikes. I have a rad y Agon

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Speaker 1: actually interesting story. Just sold my rat my rat Wagon,

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Speaker 1: and I pre ordered the new rad Wagon, which is

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Speaker 1: Wagon four. Yeah, so it's got some extra special things

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Speaker 1: happening there. So I'm excited to get that in September.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, they just announced this week that they're about

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Speaker 1: to offer a bike that cost less than a thousand dollars.

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Speaker 1: And for an e bike, that's really incredible. Their their

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Speaker 1: bikes are already pretty affordable in the range if you're

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Speaker 1: an ebike enthusiast. Obviously a regular bike with no ePower

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Speaker 1: is going to be, you know, a whole lot cheaper

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Speaker 1: than that, or a lot of them are. But I've

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Speaker 1: enjoyed my rat Wagon for a lot of years. I

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Speaker 1: put like almost miles on it, and the rat four man,

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Speaker 1: I'm looking to put at least that on that one too,

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Speaker 1: so uh, but I was excited to see that people

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Speaker 1: are gonna be able to get an e bike that

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Speaker 1: looks good, that has decent components for a thousand bucks man.

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Speaker 1: That's not bad. That's it's a really good deal. And

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Speaker 1: I wanted to share one thing that I noticed about

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Speaker 1: So I saw the different videos and like the promos

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Speaker 1: for the new rad Wagon right and the rat Wagon

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Speaker 1: four they're goofy well specifically, but caught my I was

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Speaker 1: that in a lot of the footage of people riding

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Speaker 1: the bike, they're literally just riding it. They're not peddling

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Speaker 1: and twisting the throttle and going yea. And so, as

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Speaker 1: someone I guess who's maybe more of like a purist,

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Speaker 1: you know, when it comes to bikes, I guess I

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Speaker 1: am happy that more folks are riding bikes, even if

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Speaker 1: it is an ebike, and even if they're only using

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Speaker 1: the throttle and then I really moving their feet. But

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Speaker 1: I think it's just funny that they are specifically targeting

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Speaker 1: those folks. It's like, look, look at all these folks

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Speaker 1: getting around town and they're they're not even peddling at all.

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Speaker 1: I know that's not how you use your bike. You

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Speaker 1: certainly use it in a more assist manner. Folks are

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Speaker 1: treating it more like a little electric scooter and it

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Speaker 1: looks like they're riding a bike, but not really. No,

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Speaker 1: that's honestly. There are a lot of people that have

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Speaker 1: purchased radbikes in particular and e bikes in general in

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Speaker 1: our neighborhood, and I feel like most of them twist

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Speaker 1: the throttle and go. Most of them are not peddling

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Speaker 1: almost at all. And no judgment here, That's not how

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Speaker 1: I like to use it. I really like to actually

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Speaker 1: get a workout. I like to get exercise when I'm

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Speaker 1: riding a bike. And for me, it's just like, oh,

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Speaker 1: it helps up the hills with two kids on the back,

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Speaker 1: or whatever. Um And you know, Atlantic can be pretty hilly,

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Speaker 1: but I'm also commuting long distances on it, and so

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Speaker 1: that extra little assist helps me show up to work.

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Speaker 1: Not just a complete sweat bomb. But yeah, no, there

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Speaker 1: are a lot of people riding it like that, and

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Speaker 1: no wonder they would put that name their little commercial

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Speaker 1: because they want people to know that they don't actually

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Speaker 1: have to do any work if they don't want to. Sure. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so you said that, no judgment passed by you. I

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Speaker 1: am trying and working to not pass judgment. But also

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Speaker 1: don't neglect any of the great companies out there who

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Speaker 1: are are making non motorized versions of of bikes as well,

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Speaker 1: and specifically, Cargo Bikes is the company that makes the

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Speaker 1: bike that I have, and they came out with this

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Speaker 1: one thousand dollar version of their cargo bike, and so

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Speaker 1: it's this nice affordable baseline sort of addition, and you're

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Speaker 1: gonna virtually guarantee that you get a good workout because

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Speaker 1: there's no motor Yeah, you're definitely getting a good workout

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Speaker 1: with a cargo bike that has no electric capabilities, that's

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Speaker 1: for sure. Yeah. All right, man, let's get onto our

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Speaker 1: Friday flight A sampling of stories that we found interesting

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Speaker 1: this week. And at first, let's quickly talk about my

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Speaker 1: lack of being able to find YaST. I get some

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Speaker 1: still well, still, yeah, no, I haven't found east. One

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Speaker 1: kind listener offered to send me some. She sent an

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Speaker 1: email which was very kind, and a few comments in

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Speaker 1: the Facebook group about where they've been able to find yeast.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna go to Costco or Walmart. A couple of

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Speaker 1: people mentioned they found something there. We'll see what happens

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Speaker 1: to a fifty pound drum of it. Yeah, exactly. Another

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Speaker 1: person to mention going to a local bakery. And that's

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Speaker 1: actually a really good idea that I had not thought about.

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Speaker 1: But there was an article that I read this week

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Speaker 1: on Eater that really kind of drove this point home.

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Speaker 1: The lack of yeast and the increase in people baking

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Speaker 1: King arthur Flower, whose sales have risen SI apparently answers

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Speaker 1: baking questions of their customers via email on the phone

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Speaker 1: and apparently quoting Eater here, the hotline has become a

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Speaker 1: magnet for lonely, anxious human behavior and lots of questions

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Speaker 1: about sour. Though sour does like obviously so hot right now, right.

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Speaker 1: But I just found it neat that the now baking

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Speaker 1: obsessed public has this free place to turn with these

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Speaker 1: specific questions, even if they might get a bit emotional

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Speaker 1: at times. Oh what's interesting too about this hot line

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Speaker 1: is you don't necessarily have to be a King Arthur

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Speaker 1: Flower customer in order to call that number. And I

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Speaker 1: know this because I didn't call the call. And she's

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Speaker 1: several years ago. She called and she was following a

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Speaker 1: bag at recipe on their site and it wasn't turning

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Speaker 1: out and she couldn't figure it out, so she gave

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Speaker 1: him a call. She said. They're so incredibly kind and

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Speaker 1: patient with her, but they kind of walked through all

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Speaker 1: the steps and you know, she was following the recipe

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Speaker 1: to a t and so they kind of stepped it

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Speaker 1: back even further and they, you know, then they asked her, well,

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Speaker 1: are you are you using our flower and she had

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Speaker 1: to admit that she wasn't she just using the cheap

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Speaker 1: didn't No. Yeah, they stayed on the line with there,

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Speaker 1: and they're very kind and patient even still. But that's

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Speaker 1: when she learned that different types of flower have are

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Speaker 1: are made differently, and you know, King Arthur Flower has

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Speaker 1: like a different amount of protein in it, which means

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Speaker 1: it's going to react differently. So if you're out there

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Speaker 1: and you're maybe a new struggling baker, uh, that can

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Speaker 1: make all the difference for you, called King Arthur. I

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Speaker 1: don't know what the number is. We'll post it in

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Speaker 1: the show notes. Sure, all right, let's get on to

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Speaker 1: the next interesting topic, Matt. We've talked a lot about

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Speaker 1: the p PP loans that were made available because of

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Speaker 1: the pandemic to help keep businesses afloat right. We also

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Speaker 1: talked about how to get these loans and the recent

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Speaker 1: changes in forgiveness eligibility. There was also a lot of

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Speaker 1: confusing language and it wasn't clear what the requirements were

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Speaker 1: going to be. There were just a lot of moving parts,

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Speaker 1: and it left a lot of business owners pretty confused. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: that also meant that a lot of borrowers were reluctant

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Speaker 1: to even tap those loans, which was unfortunate because many

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Speaker 1: of them needed them in times of distress. But fortunately

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Speaker 1: there was at least a little bit of clarity that

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Speaker 1: we got last week that we felt like we we

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Speaker 1: had to mention on the show today. Yeah, last Wednesday,

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Speaker 1: the SPA released some new forms that greatly simplified the

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Speaker 1: forgiveness application process. Uh. And they also included this safe

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Speaker 1: harbor option where business owners can just affirm that they

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Speaker 1: weren't able to operate at the same level as before

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Speaker 1: the pandemic. Sounds like a much better option than the

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Speaker 1: eleven pages that was supposed to only take three hours

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Speaker 1: to complete, although I saw in one article there was

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Speaker 1: an individual that said he spent at least twenty five

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Speaker 1: hours trying to navigate all the different checkboxes, and so

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Speaker 1: that was before these forms were released out right, exactly exactly.

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Speaker 1: So hopefully it's gotten a lot simpler and people that

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Speaker 1: were daunted by looking at the sense of trying to

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Speaker 1: get forgiveness, hopefully it's a lot simpler now and they'll

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Speaker 1: be able to to get forgiveness without having to spend

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Speaker 1: a whole lot of time. And it should be, from

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Speaker 1: what we can tell, a pretty straightforward and simple process now. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you know it wouldn't hurt as well as to

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Speaker 1: get in touch with your banker, your bank that you

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Speaker 1: received your PPP loan through, because they're gonna know more

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Speaker 1: of the specifics to your individual business a little better

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Speaker 1: that way, If you do have any questions you can

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Speaker 1: ask them, as they'll likely be pretty up to date

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Speaker 1: on the information that's out there. J Let's talk about

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Speaker 1: debt collection as well, my favorite topic, man, And it

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Speaker 1: seems that debt collectors are a little emboldened right now.

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Speaker 1: More folks are financially vulnerable, and so there have been

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Speaker 1: a few anecdotes and news reports that seem to show

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Speaker 1: that some debt collectors are becoming even more pushy and

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Speaker 1: reckless in their collection efforts. And so because of that,

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Speaker 1: if you get contacted by a debt collector, it's really

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Speaker 1: important that you know your rights. Collectors have to follow

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Speaker 1: the rules that are in the Fair Debt Collection Practices

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Speaker 1: Act and will link to some f A queues in

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Speaker 1: our show notes that a lot of folks might have

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Speaker 1: when it comes to debt collection. Yeah, mat And one

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Speaker 1: particular tactic that debt collectors tend to use, or the

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Speaker 1: shady ones at least at times, are trying to get

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Speaker 1: you to pay even just a small amount towards towards

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Speaker 1: what you owe towards the debt, and that can actually

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Speaker 1: restart the clock on that debt. In many states, so

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Speaker 1: there's something called the Statute of Limitations and in every

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Speaker 1: state it's a little bit different in how long the

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Speaker 1: collector has to be collecting that debt before they're not

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Speaker 1: allowed to collect on it anymore. And it makes sense

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Speaker 1: that these debt collectors are trying to get you to

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Speaker 1: do that because then it makes it easier for them

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Speaker 1: to sue you for that debt in court. But the

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Speaker 1: CFPB has proposed a rule that consumers should be notified

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Speaker 1: about that debt clock restart mat because I guarantee you

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Speaker 1: ninety eight percent of them don't know that that's the case.

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Speaker 1: But that is not a law that's been enacted yet. Sadly,

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Speaker 1: we'll let you know if there's any movement on that.

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Speaker 1: But one thing you need to be aware of right

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Speaker 1: now is that you have rights, and one right you

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Speaker 1: have is to send that debt collector a letter telling

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Speaker 1: them to stop contacting you. If you're being harassed in

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Speaker 1: particular by a debt collector, file a complaint with the

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Speaker 1: CFPB and you state Attorney General's office. Matt, it's kind

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Speaker 1: of hard to read those anecdotes that you mentioned. It's

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Speaker 1: hard to see those stories of people being harassed by

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Speaker 1: dec collectors, and in particular in a pandemic when everybody

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Speaker 1: is suffering at least some hardship, many people financial and

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Speaker 1: other people mental and financial. I mean, there's just so

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Speaker 1: many hurdles to overcome it, and it makes it's so

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Speaker 1: much harder with dirty dec collection tactics like piling on

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Speaker 1: top of that. Yeah, well, speaking of dirty gross debts,

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Speaker 1: man payday loans they are probably the worst financial product ever,

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Speaker 1: and recently they've been getting around Google and Facebook ad

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Speaker 1: bands to reach customers with their absolutely rank offerings of

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Speaker 1: interest rates in the two to range. And these lenders

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Speaker 1: they prey on the financially vulnerable, of which there are

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Speaker 1: many right now. In particular, they're using s e O

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Speaker 1: SO search engine optimization to target people who are searching

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Speaker 1: for help and they're feeding them these quick online loans.

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Speaker 1: There are folks who might take those loans and they're

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Speaker 1: sure that they're gonna be able to pay them off right,

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Speaker 1: those small loans in just that short period of time.

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Speaker 1: But often, man, it becomes a terrible side of bait

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Speaker 1: and switched tactics to go along with that high interest rate.

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Speaker 1: So if you are having a hard financial time right now,

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Speaker 1: make sure to stay away from not only the physical

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Speaker 1: paid a lending storefronts, but the online ones as well. Man,

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Speaker 1: there's one near us, and every time I drive by it,

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Speaker 1: I like, look over there and glare at it. I

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Speaker 1: want them to feel my disapproval. Yeah, I kind of

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Speaker 1: shudder when I see him. And it is amazing when

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Speaker 1: you open your eyes how many there are around where

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Speaker 1: most of us live, and in particular small towns. It

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Speaker 1: can be so tough to go through certain small towns

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Speaker 1: these days. I feel like there's a lot of fast

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Speaker 1: food restaurants and paid a lending places, and yeah, those

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Speaker 1: are truly like the worst financial product, and and it

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Speaker 1: does promote, like you said, this sick cycle of debt

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Speaker 1: that's hard to get out of. All right, let's talk

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Speaker 1: about travel real quick before we bring Scott on. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna talk to him in just a minute. But cruise

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Speaker 1: lines are voluntarily suspending trips out of US ports until

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Speaker 1: September fift I'm sure that some people out there, maybe

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Speaker 1: you're riching to get on the cruise right now, but

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Speaker 1: I'm certainly not one of them. And I've actually never

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Speaker 1: been on a cruise before. I mean either, No, I

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Speaker 1: just can't imagine that demand is high given the current circumstances.

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Speaker 1: But it will be interesting to see what happens to

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Speaker 1: the cruise industry when they do start to resume operations

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Speaker 1: from the United States in the fall. And I think

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Speaker 1: it's probably a smart marketing move and a smart health

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Speaker 1: move to say no cruises until mid September. Sure, yeah,

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Speaker 1: assuming the US can manage COVID nineteen. There might be

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Speaker 1: deals though in the fall. So if if you are

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Speaker 1: all about cruises, yeah, keep an eye out. And Joe,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna talk more about travel and how you should

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Speaker 1: be thinking about it in just a minute with a

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Speaker 1: friend of the show and travel expert, Scott Kays. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna talk with him right after the break. All right, Matt,

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Speaker 1: we're back from the break. We just talked a little

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Speaker 1: bit about the cruise industry and now we're gonna talk

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Speaker 1: about travel more broadly. And one of our our favorite

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Speaker 1: travel experts to to have on the show. We had

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Speaker 1: them on quite a while back, but we haven't actually

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Speaker 1: talked to him. That was back in our Money Pro

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Speaker 1: episode Days is Scott Kais and Scott runs the website

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Speaker 1: Scott's Cheap Flights, and it's also an email newsletter and

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Speaker 1: it informs people about the best and cheapest places to

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Speaker 1: book travel. And so Scott, thank you so much for

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Speaker 1: taking a little bit of time to join us on

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Speaker 1: the show today. Thank you guys for having me. I'm

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Speaker 1: excited to be here. Yeah, ask, We're glad to have

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Speaker 1: a flights and airfare expert on the show. And you

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Speaker 1: know you recently you sit on an email to your

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Speaker 1: newsletters subscribers describing getting a refund on a flight that

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Speaker 1: hasn't yet been canceled, sort of as this like game

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Speaker 1: of chicken, and so what do you mean by that?

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Speaker 1: And how can our listeners who find themselves in this

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Speaker 1: predicament get their money back? Yeah? Great question. So here's

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Speaker 1: the deal. By law, if an airline cancels your flight,

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Speaker 1: you are eligible for a refund period. Doesn't matter that

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Speaker 1: there's a pandemic, doesn't matter that they didn't want to,

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Speaker 1: doesn't matter that they'd really like to keep your money.

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Speaker 1: If they cancel your flight, then you're owed a refund.

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Speaker 1: For a lot of people, this has been a really

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Speaker 1: urgent matter during the pandemic and during over the past

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Speaker 1: few months when the airlines have been doing major surgery

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Speaker 1: to their schedules, canceling flights left and right. But for

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Speaker 1: a lot of folks, they didn't necessarily know that they

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Speaker 1: were eligible for a refund when an airline cancels their

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Speaker 1: flight because the airlines didn't tell them. They tell them,

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Speaker 1: you know, they'll cancel your flight and send you an email, Hey, Matt,

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Speaker 1: Hey Joel, Sorry, we just canceled your flight. But here's

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Speaker 1: a We've already processed a travel voucher for you. Click

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Speaker 1: here to accept it, and they don't mention anywhere in

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Speaker 1: it that you can get a refund if you prefer. Now,

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Speaker 1: if you're anything like me, you'd rather get that refund

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Speaker 1: because you can't go down to the grocery store and

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Speaker 1: pay for your food with a five dollar American Airlines

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Speaker 1: gift card. You need your cash to do that. You

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Speaker 1: can't buy craft beer with a voucher. You can't buy

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Speaker 1: craft beer with an airline's gift card. And so it's

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Speaker 1: really important to know your rights and to be able

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Speaker 1: to take advantage of them, because the airlines aren't necessarily

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Speaker 1: going to tell you about it. And so this is

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Speaker 1: why I liken it's to a game of chicken. If

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Speaker 1: you have a flight booked, even if you've decided I'm

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Speaker 1: not taking that trip. I don't feel safe or comfortable

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Speaker 1: right now, it still makes sense to hold off as

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Speaker 1: long as possible to cancel it, because, uh, if the

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Speaker 1: airline winds up canceling the flight that you're on, or

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Speaker 1: if they make a significant schedule change let's say they

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Speaker 1: switch it from a NonStop to a connecting flight, or

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Speaker 1: they change it by at least a couple of hours.

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Speaker 1: If they cancel or make a significant schedule change, then

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Speaker 1: they owe you a refund, Whereas if you're the one

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Speaker 1: who cancels, you're only going to get a travel voucher.

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Speaker 1: So this is why I liken it to a game

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Speaker 1: of chicken. Whichever party blinks first loses. So, so is

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Speaker 1: it a matter of when you are offered a travel voucher,

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Speaker 1: sticking up for yourself and saying no, no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: I know I'm eligible for a refund and you need

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Speaker 1: to you need to make that happen because you know

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Speaker 1: you might not always get offered that immediately from the airlines.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, is it just a matter of telling them

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Speaker 1: that you know what you're eligible to receive. Unfortunately, Yes, Uh,

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Speaker 1: it is oftentimes a matter of showing them that you

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Speaker 1: know your rights mentioning it sometimes, you know, most of

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Speaker 1: the time, it's pretty simple. You can call up the

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Speaker 1: airline and they'll tell you, uh, yeah, you know, we

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Speaker 1: can see we canceled your flight. Therefore we're going to

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Speaker 1: process a refund that I would say, and maybe ten

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Speaker 1: to of cases they might put up a fight. Um

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Speaker 1: whether because that is uh, we've got an agent who

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Speaker 1: might be misinformed about the law, or whether that's because

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Speaker 1: the airline itself the executives have decided they're just going

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Speaker 1: to flout the law, which is frankly uh shameful and

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Speaker 1: and and disgusting in my book. But there are a

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Speaker 1: number of airlines, especially around the world, less so US

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Speaker 1: airlines these days, but airlines like Air Canada, uh tap At,

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Speaker 1: Portuguese Airline, a couple in Mexico Laris and Interjet that

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Speaker 1: have been really just just dragging their heels, throwing up

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Speaker 1: roadblocks whenever they can to try to avoid giving customers

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Speaker 1: the refunds that they're legally owed. And so in those situations,

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Speaker 1: if you called a couple of times and they're still

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Speaker 1: just saying no, no, we're not giving you a refund

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Speaker 1: even though you're legally owed one, you've got two other

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Speaker 1: options at your fingertips. Step one, you can file a

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Speaker 1: complaint with the Department of Transportation. Now you might be

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Speaker 1: thinking file a complaint that sounds like just kind of

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Speaker 1: spitting in the wind, doesn't actually do anything well in

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Speaker 1: this case. Actually, the Department of Transportation, what they do

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Speaker 1: is that they'll take your complaint and they immediately afford

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Speaker 1: it to the airline. They're like, airline, you need to

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Speaker 1: rectify this situation promptly. And we're watching, you know, and

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Speaker 1: and and they're kind of keeping tabs on the airlines

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Speaker 1: and threatening enforcement action if the airlines don't comply. I've

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Speaker 1: had enough, you know. I've seen tons and tons of

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Speaker 1: different of Scotts Flights members who have said that they

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Speaker 1: were denied a refund until they filed that complaint, and

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Speaker 1: then the airline, you know, got it together and gave

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Speaker 1: him the refund. If that doesn't work, the last option

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Speaker 1: you've got your fingertips is to dispute the charge on

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Speaker 1: your credit card. Every credit card, every bank guarantees you

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Speaker 1: that if you pay for something with their credit card

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Speaker 1: and you don't receive what you paid for. Let's say

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Speaker 1: you booked a flight and that canceled the flight, uh

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Speaker 1: that you can get your money back. You know that

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Speaker 1: they're not going to to hold you to that. And

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Speaker 1: so if the airline won't process a refund, you can

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Speaker 1: dispute the charge. The the bank will reimburse you, and

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Speaker 1: then they'll go fight the air with the airlines to

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Speaker 1: try to get the money back for themselves. So it's

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Speaker 1: a nice way to make it your credit cards problem

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Speaker 1: rather than your problem. Right yeah. Another great reason to

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Speaker 1: not pay for your your plane tickets in cash, however,

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Speaker 1: it is that you're supposed to do that, you don't

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Speaker 1: want to do that, and also trying to avoid paying

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Speaker 1: with it with debit cards. Credit cards have stronger protections

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Speaker 1: along these lines. And so if you have a credit card,

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Speaker 1: good idea to pay to use that to pay for

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Speaker 1: your flights, right yeah. Yeah, so we're talking about cancelations.

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Speaker 1: What about just like massive delays, right, Like a lot

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Speaker 1: of flights are are just being rescheduled, and so like

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Speaker 1: what rights to passengers have who have had their travel

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Speaker 1: times change, you know significantly where it massively alters their

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Speaker 1: their itinerary you know, including hotel stays and like connecting

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Speaker 1: flights as well. Right, So the Department's transportation. Again, this

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Speaker 1: is federal law says that if an airline makes a

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Speaker 1: significant schedule change to your itinerary, that also makes you

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Speaker 1: eligible for a refund. Now, what's frustrating is that they

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Speaker 1: didn't spell out exactly what is a significant schedule change.

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Speaker 1: They leave that up to each individual airline, but each

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Speaker 1: so each individual airline actually has this in there what's

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Speaker 1: called their contract of carriage, essentially the fine print. You know,

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Speaker 1: I agree through these terms and conditions when you when

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Speaker 1: you hit purchase on a flight, uh most airlines, it

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Speaker 1: is uh two hours. So they'll say if going to

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Speaker 1: change your flight times by more than two hours, then

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Speaker 1: you're eligible for refund. What was interesting, United Airlines tried

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Speaker 1: to really get away with some stuff during the pandemic.

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Speaker 1: Where before the pandemic there their um their policy was

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Speaker 1: two hours, but during the pandemic, all of a sudden

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Speaker 1: they quietly tried to shift it to twenty five hours,

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Speaker 1: saying like, oh, yeah, we can change your flight by

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Speaker 1: an entire day twenty four hours, and we would not

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Speaker 1: consider that a significant schedule change and thus eligible for

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Speaker 1: a refund. You know, people understandably had a h away

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Speaker 1: with them on on social media there's a big, big

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Speaker 1: dust up about it. And what was funny was the

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Speaker 1: Department's Transportation actually ended up essentially sub tweeting United Airlines

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Speaker 1: in a memorandum that they put out saying that airlines

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Speaker 1: cannot retroactively change their policies on significant schedule changes. They can't,

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Speaker 1: you know, try to like, whatever the policy was when

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Speaker 1: you booked, is the policy that you're owned. They can't

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Speaker 1: retroactively apply this new policy. Had a lot of pressure,

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Speaker 1: right exactly, it's common sense. And so anyway, they backed down.

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Speaker 1: They said, Okay, we'll go back to the two hour policy, thankfully,

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Speaker 1: but um yeah, in general two hours you should be

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Speaker 1: good for a refund. I thought you're gonna say that.

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Speaker 1: They kind of quietly went in there and trying to

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Speaker 1: try to change hours to like weeks, just two weeks.

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Speaker 1: Oh did you think hours now? It'd be even worse? Right, Uh,

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Speaker 1: it's got to. We've seen some some kind of interesting

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Speaker 1: things happen in travel insurance during the pandemic, right, A

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Speaker 1: lot of policies don't seem to be covering people as

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Speaker 1: well as they would have hoped. So what guidance can

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Speaker 1: you offer people who are booking travel about how they

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Speaker 1: should go about thinking about and then buying travel insurance

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Speaker 1: right now when they're when they're going on a trip.

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Speaker 1: Really good question, and I'm gonna try to simplify this

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Speaker 1: as much as possible because I've made I have a

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Speaker 1: lot of thoughts on travel insurance. UM. The first thing

430
00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:54,480
Speaker 1: that I recommend people is know what protections you already have. UM.

431
00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:58,000
Speaker 1: Many people don't realize how much they are already covered

432
00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:01,800
Speaker 1: without having to spend a single time. UM. When you

433
00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:05,560
Speaker 1: purchase a ticket from an airline, they're already make certain

434
00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:08,359
Speaker 1: guarantees that and they will give you forms of compensation

435
00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:10,679
Speaker 1: if they break those guarantees. So if there's you know,

436
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:13,720
Speaker 1: you book a flight and there's a huge delay or

437
00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:16,560
Speaker 1: a cancelation that that's not like weather relating, you know

438
00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:19,560
Speaker 1: that's a mechanical issue or something, or their computer system

439
00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:23,440
Speaker 1: went down, you can ask for compensation. They'll typically give

440
00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:25,919
Speaker 1: it to you. As a result. If they lose your

441
00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:28,800
Speaker 1: bags or damage your bags, or or you know they're delayed,

442
00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:31,640
Speaker 1: you can ask for compensation. They'll typically give it to you.

443
00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:34,199
Speaker 1: So not only are you do you have certain protections

444
00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:37,960
Speaker 1: already from the airline, you also have certain protections through

445
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:40,479
Speaker 1: your credit card that you book with. Now, these are

446
00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:43,840
Speaker 1: going to vary credit card to credit card, but UM

447
00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:47,240
Speaker 1: in general, many of them will give you similar protections

448
00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:49,800
Speaker 1: as well, where if there's a big delay or cancelation

449
00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:52,960
Speaker 1: on your flight, you can get UH money for that.

450
00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:55,480
Speaker 1: If your bags get messed up, if there are other

451
00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:58,119
Speaker 1: sorts of issues, even if you need things like you know,

452
00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:01,960
Speaker 1: medical evacuation or of like that, some some credit cards

453
00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:06,560
Speaker 1: will cover that. And so knowing what you're already protected

454
00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:10,359
Speaker 1: for so that you're not buying something that's superfluous, I

455
00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:14,400
Speaker 1: think is really really important. But then it's also if

456
00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:18,600
Speaker 1: you're really kind of gung ho on buying insurance, making

457
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:23,640
Speaker 1: sure you're really clear on what it is that you're purchasing. UM,

458
00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:26,840
Speaker 1: many people kind of will just click yes on the

459
00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:29,879
Speaker 1: travel insurance page when you're booking their flight because they're

460
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:34,280
Speaker 1: thinking about it almost philosophically. They're thinking about it in

461
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:37,719
Speaker 1: moral terms like, oh, I want to be protected, you know,

462
00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:39,960
Speaker 1: I want to I want to watch my downside and

463
00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 1: want to make sure that that I don't lose everything,

464
00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:44,520
Speaker 1: so I'm gonna click yes, not realizing that they can't

465
00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:47,520
Speaker 1: just this doesn't make them eligible to just cancel their

466
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:52,800
Speaker 1: flight and get anything exactly exactly like, so much of

467
00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:56,639
Speaker 1: the fine print is there to deny giving you claims,

468
00:22:56,880 --> 00:22:59,520
Speaker 1: and they have time that most people realize this is

469
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,560
Speaker 1: when they're trying to collect on a claim, not when

470
00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:04,920
Speaker 1: they're making in the purchase, and obviously by that time

471
00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:07,119
Speaker 1: it's too late. And you know, a lot of people

472
00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:11,360
Speaker 1: learned this really unfortunately firsthand when the pandemic first hit,

473
00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 1: before the airlines loosened up their refund policies, and they

474
00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 1: realized that the insurance that they had bought did not

475
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:20,840
Speaker 1: let them just cancel their tickets or change the dates

476
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,800
Speaker 1: and get compensation for that. They would have had to

477
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:27,359
Speaker 1: buy a much more expensive form of insurance called cancel

478
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:32,320
Speaker 1: for any reason insurance. And so man, I hate saying like, oh,

479
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,200
Speaker 1: just read the fine print, because look, I almost never

480
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:38,720
Speaker 1: read the fine print. I'm a normal person now. But

481
00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:42,320
Speaker 1: with something like travel insurance, if you really, if if

482
00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:45,720
Speaker 1: all you're trying to do is kind of assuage your

483
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:50,000
Speaker 1: your your guilt or feel better about it, you know

484
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:54,240
Speaker 1: understand what that is, then you're paying to just kind

485
00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:55,960
Speaker 1: of feel better. But if you really want to make

486
00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:59,520
Speaker 1: sure that you would be protected and insured, it really

487
00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:01,960
Speaker 1: does make sense to to read the fine print and

488
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,760
Speaker 1: contrast that with the protections you already have from the

489
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:08,239
Speaker 1: airline and the credit card you used. I think it's

490
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:10,439
Speaker 1: also important to mention to Scott that you can buy

491
00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:13,719
Speaker 1: travel insurance from websites that aren't the airline website, right.

492
00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:15,480
Speaker 1: You can go out there on the open market and

493
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:17,640
Speaker 1: shop travel insurance. You can often get a better deal,

494
00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:19,879
Speaker 1: you can get better coverage for a lower price, all

495
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:21,879
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. So you're not subject to just

496
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:24,399
Speaker 1: buying it on the checkout screen of American Airlines or

497
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 1: wherever you're getting your your airline ticket from, yes, and

498
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 1: and and shopping around like that is almost certainly going

499
00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:31,600
Speaker 1: to get you a better deal. I mean, if you

500
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:35,080
Speaker 1: think about it, if the default option when you buy, uh,

501
00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:38,119
Speaker 1: you know, flight from American or Delta or wherever, the

502
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,000
Speaker 1: default option they show you is almost certainly not going

503
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,800
Speaker 1: to be as good or as valuable as if you

504
00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:47,280
Speaker 1: shopped around for it. So that's a really good point. Nice.

505
00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:50,440
Speaker 1: So Scott, let's let's ask maybe an obvious question, you know,

506
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,080
Speaker 1: let's kind of zoom out a little bit here, like

507
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,560
Speaker 1: do you feel comfortable at this point in time traveling

508
00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:57,600
Speaker 1: right like, like, do you feel comfortable getting on a

509
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 1: plane and going somewhere if it wasn't necessary, I personally

510
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:03,679
Speaker 1: would feel comfortable getting on an airplane right now. And

511
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:08,639
Speaker 1: the reason why is that airplanes are not as dangerous

512
00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:11,800
Speaker 1: as we might think they are. That they don't tend

513
00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:14,320
Speaker 1: to be vectors of disease, they don't tend to be

514
00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:17,320
Speaker 1: hotspots of transmission, they don't tend to be kind of

515
00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:22,680
Speaker 1: super spreading events. And that's not me talking. That's epidemiologist

516
00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:26,760
Speaker 1: Dr Joseph Allen from Harvard, you know, Harvard train professor

517
00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:30,200
Speaker 1: who really studies kind of air quality and airplanes, talking

518
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:33,520
Speaker 1: about this in the Washington Post and elsewhere. That look,

519
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:38,680
Speaker 1: millions and millions of people have flowns on airplanes since February,

520
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 1: since marchin the pandemic began. If airplanes were super spreading events,

521
00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:45,280
Speaker 1: if there were, you know, tons and tons of people

522
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,640
Speaker 1: getting sick on them in these big clusters, we would

523
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:50,919
Speaker 1: know about it by now. The fact that is that

524
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:54,640
Speaker 1: there's only been one instance that we've identified where multiple

525
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:58,200
Speaker 1: people on an airplane came down with coronavirus. Now, you

526
00:25:58,280 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 1: might be asked, why is that you know it seems

527
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,960
Speaker 1: so like such a an obvious place for disease transmission.

528
00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:05,399
Speaker 1: You've got a lot of people in a kind of

529
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:09,200
Speaker 1: confined space. It's not outdoors. The reason why, and this

530
00:26:09,280 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 1: is why I would personally be comfortable on a plane,

531
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:15,080
Speaker 1: is that contract the sort of idea that, oh, it's

532
00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:18,639
Speaker 1: all recycled air onboard, it's all recirculated. There is a

533
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,640
Speaker 1: lot of fresh air when you're up at thirty feet.

534
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:24,359
Speaker 1: It kind of boggles the mind. But and this is

535
00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: something that we didn't really need to think about before

536
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,399
Speaker 1: all of a sudden the air quality on planes became paramount.

537
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:33,680
Speaker 1: But it's true that the airline airplanes are sucking up

538
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:37,399
Speaker 1: fresh air from the outside through the like a complex

539
00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 1: series of vents and hoses, where essentially they're continuously throughout

540
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:46,120
Speaker 1: the flight bringing fresh air, fres fresh oxygen in from

541
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:50,960
Speaker 1: the outside. Obviously, we need fresh air, fresh oxygen to breathe,

542
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:53,840
Speaker 1: so that obviously that helps kind of makes a lot

543
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:56,359
Speaker 1: of sense. But it's not just to that the air

544
00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 1: that's on board is the exact same air that was

545
00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:03,800
Speaker 1: there at takeoff. There are these really kind of powerful

546
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,920
Speaker 1: hospital grade air filters on board called Heppa filters that

547
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:11,800
Speaker 1: are continuously recycling the air to to clear out. I

548
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:17,800
Speaker 1: think it's since like of particles on board. I say

549
00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,280
Speaker 1: all this not to be like Polly Anish. Oh, you know,

550
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:24,120
Speaker 1: nobody could ever get sick on an airplane. Like, yes,

551
00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:28,160
Speaker 1: if somebody is sitting next to you and has coronavirus

552
00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 1: and they sneeze like I would not want to be

553
00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:35,439
Speaker 1: in that situation. The Heppa grade air filter and fresh

554
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 1: air from the outside is probably not going to protect

555
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:40,760
Speaker 1: you in that situation. But if somebody has sneezes, you know,

556
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:44,000
Speaker 1: twenty rows back, I'm not sitting there where like, oh,

557
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:47,159
Speaker 1: the entire plane is going to get sick because of

558
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:50,120
Speaker 1: all these sorts of protections that are on board. Add

559
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,359
Speaker 1: on that the fact that you know, everybody is wearing

560
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 1: masks now or or should be. Most people are wearing masks,

561
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 1: which is really helpful, and they say they think it

562
00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:00,679
Speaker 1: might cut down a transmission as much as ten x.

563
00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:05,040
Speaker 1: All those factors are reasons why planes haven't been the

564
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:08,639
Speaker 1: super spreading events that we might have anticipated, given that

565
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 1: it's indoors, given us a lot of people in confined spaces,

566
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,080
Speaker 1: and that you can't really have social distancing per se.

567
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:18,760
Speaker 1: I think it's important to know that the science here

568
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 1: if it's helpful and comforting, but at the end of

569
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: the day, vacation it should be fun like, it should

570
00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:27,960
Speaker 1: be like something enjoyable, not something that's stressful in And

571
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:30,160
Speaker 1: so if you're gonna be if if if you know,

572
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:32,159
Speaker 1: like I'm just gonna be really worried, I'm gonna be

573
00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 1: stressed out, and I mean not enjoying myself. That doesn't

574
00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:36,719
Speaker 1: sound like a very fun vacation to me. Like, I

575
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:39,200
Speaker 1: think I don't think that's something that you should feel

576
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 1: like you have to do. I think you should do

577
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:45,480
Speaker 1: it when you feel comfortable and and and able to

578
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 1: do so without feeling like you're putting your life at

579
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:51,280
Speaker 1: risk to get on that plane. How will that answer

580
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:53,640
Speaker 1: makes me feel less bad about the last question I

581
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:57,200
Speaker 1: want to ask you. So, let's say hypothetical here, somebody

582
00:28:57,240 --> 00:29:00,600
Speaker 1: had a tenure anniversary coming up in October and and

583
00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:04,959
Speaker 1: they hypothetical congratulations, Yeah, thank you very much to the

584
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:08,320
Speaker 1: hypothetical person. So, like, where where have you been seeing

585
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:11,120
Speaker 1: great deals recently? And yeah, is there any place that

586
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:13,760
Speaker 1: you would be like, man in October, you should totally

587
00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 1: go there. That is an excellent, excellent question. Now, presumably

588
00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 1: this person may be flying out of somewhere like Atlanta.

589
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:27,040
Speaker 1: There's a good all right. So I'll tell you one

590
00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 1: place where we have been seeing some really surprisingly great

591
00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 1: deals lately, and that has been uh Japan. Japan typically

592
00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 1: one of the most expensive places to fly to in

593
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:39,640
Speaker 1: the s because it's so popular, like it's an amazing

594
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,240
Speaker 1: I mean, for for good reason. I it's one of

595
00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:45,360
Speaker 1: my favorite countries in the world to visit, alongside Mexico.

596
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 1: And normally flights, especially from Atlanta to Japan can be

597
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:52,960
Speaker 1: in twelve fourteen hundred dollars. We found it last week

598
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 1: for five five bucks round trip, including in October. That's

599
00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:00,880
Speaker 1: pretty good. Yeah, over to to Tokyo. That's one of

600
00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:03,959
Speaker 1: the places that definitely kind of springs to mine if

601
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:06,960
Speaker 1: you're looking to say somewhere maybe a little bit closer

602
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:10,240
Speaker 1: to home. I'll be honest, some of the best deals

603
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,960
Speaker 1: and popping up lately have been domestic deals because that's

604
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 1: where there's been the most capacity, that's where it's been

605
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:19,360
Speaker 1: the most planes flying. So a few recent deals that

606
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 1: we found on full service airlines, including in uh sort

607
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 1: of the fall Atlanta NonStop to Philadelphia or Chicago for

608
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 1: fifty one bucks round trip. Again, this is not on Spirit,

609
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 1: this is not in Frontier, this is on full service

610
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:36,760
Speaker 1: airlines or even to somewhere uh like um l A

611
00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:40,960
Speaker 1: for bucks NonStop round trip. So those are the places

612
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:42,640
Speaker 1: that that you know. Look, if I was going to

613
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 1: take my wife on a on a on a anniversary

614
00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:49,320
Speaker 1: trip this October first, might be thinking Japan. But if

615
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:51,280
Speaker 1: we're looking to stay somewhere a little closer to home,

616
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: Chicago or l A would be my choices. Sweet man,

617
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 1: Well those are good tips, so I might take listen

618
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 1: to consideration. Well, Scott like where else and folks go

619
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:04,840
Speaker 1: to learn about some affordable flights. Yeah, we are working

620
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 1: out of Scott's cheap flights dot Com. There's no postorbary,

621
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:12,080
Speaker 1: no dashes, no underscores, just Scott's cheap Flights dot Com. Uh. Look,

622
00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 1: we're searching for cheap flights all day, every day, and

623
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 1: when we find them, we don't want to keep it

624
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:17,680
Speaker 1: to ourselves. We want to be able to share it

625
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:19,800
Speaker 1: with folks and help them be able to travel for

626
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 1: way less than they anticipated. And so you know, if

627
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:26,760
Speaker 1: you want interested in getting cheap flights that emailed directly

628
00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:28,640
Speaker 1: to you out of your Home Airport. We'd love for

629
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:30,240
Speaker 1: you to sign up. We'd been would be an honor

630
00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 1: to send you those deals. Scott, thank you so much

631
00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:35,720
Speaker 1: for all the information and uh and for coming on

632
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:38,080
Speaker 1: the show. We really appreciate it. Awesome. Thanks for having

633
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,360
Speaker 1: me manage all this has been a lot of fun. Absolutely,

634
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:42,400
Speaker 1: thanks again, Man and Joel Man. How great is it

635
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: to have Scott on again? You know, someone who's an

636
00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:47,880
Speaker 1: expert within this industry, who knows air fare, who knows

637
00:31:47,960 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 1: flights and what's going on, uh, day in and day out.

638
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:52,600
Speaker 1: So I'm glad that we're able to have Scott on

639
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 1: to share some of his knowledge, some of his wisdom

640
00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:58,720
Speaker 1: with our listeners. Yeah, Scott is an airfair nerd, kind

641
00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 1: of like on the level that we're money, they're so

642
00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:04,440
Speaker 1: I appreciate his advice and his wisdom, and hopefully that

643
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:07,280
Speaker 1: helps our listeners who are thinking about future travel, who

644
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Speaker 1: are thinking about travel that they currently have a book.

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Speaker 1: Hopefully that was helpful. And how you make decisions and

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Speaker 1: and how you approach the airlines when you're looking for

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Speaker 1: a refund. So, Matt, that's going to do it for

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Speaker 1: this episode. If anybody wants show notes for this episode,

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Speaker 1: just go to our website at how to money dot

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Speaker 1: com and it's always helpful to the show if you

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Speaker 1: were to leave us a review over at Apple Podcasts,

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Speaker 1: so if you haven't done that already, we would appreciate

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Speaker 1: a solid review. So Joel, that's going to be it, buddy.

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Speaker 1: Until next time, Best Friends Out, Best Friends Out,