Speaker 1: The following. He's a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club Cowboys. He's the Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys dot Com Draft Show, your war room for incenter
Speaker 1: news and crafted analysis from deep within the confines of
Speaker 1: Cowboys headquarters at the Star in Fresco. And now your
Speaker 1: hosts Brian brought us, Jeff Kavanaugh, Kyle Yeoman, and David Hellman.
Speaker 1: Good morning and welcome. It is Tuesday, March the first
Speaker 1: Happy Marti Gras got to throw that in there. Very
Speaker 1: self serving everywhere else, it's just Tuesday. We are not live,
Speaker 1: but guys, we are back at the Indianapolis Convention Center.
Speaker 1: It's been a long time coming, not just because we're
Speaker 1: back at the NFL Combine here on the Draft Show,
Speaker 1: but we are back with our friend Dame Brugler, Draft
Speaker 1: Show alum, Draft Show originator. I think a lot of
Speaker 1: people excited to see on the show man. Welcome back. Oh,
Speaker 1: it feels so good. It feels right. You know, we
Speaker 1: didn't get the combine last year, so it feels good
Speaker 1: to be back in Indianapolis. Feels good to be be back
Speaker 1: with you guys. Uh, we got plenty to talk about,
Speaker 1: so I'm excited. It is like it's like a warm
Speaker 1: hug took a year off. Everybody feeling a little bit
Speaker 1: better about that first bite into that riverby at Saint Almo's.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's yeah, it's it's good. That's good cocktail.
Speaker 1: It just clears your sciences of everything that doesn't matter
Speaker 1: except for the draft. I mean, and that's the thing
Speaker 1: is you talk about it's been a year in between,
Speaker 1: but think about how all that has changed in that year.
Speaker 1: I mean, last time we were here, we were talking
Speaker 1: to Joe Burrow at the podium, and now Joe Burrow
Speaker 1: has been to a Super Bowl. Crazy. I mean, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of things that have gone on since then.
Speaker 1: Last time we were here there was a fresh powdered
Speaker 1: snow on the ground while we were walking around Indianapolis.
Speaker 1: It's been like mid forties. So we've gotten lucky in
Speaker 1: that regard this this time around. But things have changed
Speaker 1: over the last couple of years in a number of
Speaker 1: different ways. I almost feel like I've been through a
Speaker 1: time warp, like I lived. I lived those two years,
Speaker 1: but I've just I'm not convinced that it ever actually happened.
Speaker 1: At least you don't want to convince yourself that it happened.
Speaker 1: Got so excited about Dane, I forgot to mention I'm
Speaker 1: David Hellman. I think you know that, joined by my
Speaker 1: buddy Kyle Yeoman's Jeff and Brian taking the week off
Speaker 1: because they're slackers. They didn't want to come up to Indianapolis.
Speaker 1: They definitely wanted to come up to Indianapo. You're right, well,
Speaker 1: easy money, sending our love to them, but I'm very
Speaker 1: happy to trade them in for Dane. So, Dane, I
Speaker 1: just want to I want to set the stage with
Speaker 1: you that it's kind of an awkward thing. We're at
Speaker 1: the combine. We're excited to be here here on Tuesday morning.
Speaker 1: We still haven't actually done a whole lot, you know.
Speaker 1: Steven Stephen Jones talked yesterday to Cowboys media. There's some
Speaker 1: Cowboys news that maybe we can get too later. But
Speaker 1: in terms of the draft, no interviews yet, no testing.
Speaker 1: So I just I kind of want to set the
Speaker 1: stage with you since we haven't checked in with you
Speaker 1: this year about the storylines about maybe the guys that
Speaker 1: have the most to gain, or the narratives that can
Speaker 1: kind of shape this draft class the most. Because I
Speaker 1: do think it's Kyle brought up Joe Burrow. We don't
Speaker 1: have that guy, like, we don't have that guy that
Speaker 1: dominates the draft talk the way we did with Joe
Speaker 1: or with Kyler Murray. I mean, we're basically talking about
Speaker 1: edge rushers and offensive tackles, and so how do you
Speaker 1: how do you think this week might shape that? I
Speaker 1: think the main storyline is exactly that, the fact that
Speaker 1: we don't have that obvious storyline. It's just a very
Speaker 1: different draft. And every draft class has its own identity,
Speaker 1: you know, its own It's usually driven by the quarterbacks.
Speaker 1: This year, the quarterback after five in the top fifteen
Speaker 1: last year, this quarterback class. You know, it's it's just
Speaker 1: all over the place, and you know, you're looking for
Speaker 1: the high floor guy and Kenny Pikett. You're looking for
Speaker 1: the guy that five years from now hopefully is that
Speaker 1: top fifteen quarterback in the NFL. And like a Malik
Speaker 1: Willis or Matt Corrall. It's hard to have conviction about
Speaker 1: any of these quarterbacks, it really is. And I don't
Speaker 1: know that we're going to get any real information here
Speaker 1: that's going to help us. You know, Matt corral the
Speaker 1: one quarterback that wasn't at the Senior Bowl, not working out,
Speaker 1: still working his way back from that ankle injury from
Speaker 1: the ball game. So quarterbacks, I'm not sure that this
Speaker 1: week's gonna change all that much based on what we know.
Speaker 1: So it's going to remain kind of a tough position
Speaker 1: to sort out. But some other positions will will I
Speaker 1: think it'll be important context here, the receivers, the corners,
Speaker 1: the stop watch positions. You know, I want to see
Speaker 1: how some of these pass rushers move, and you know,
Speaker 1: so the three cone and short shuttle drills. To me,
Speaker 1: I don't know how you guys feel. There's one position that,
Speaker 1: above all is the deepest and the best position in
Speaker 1: this draft, and that's pass rusher ed rushers. To me,
Speaker 1: it is by far the deepest position. And so you know,
Speaker 1: I was doing my pre combined rankings last night, putting
Speaker 1: that all together, and I'm going through and I'm like, okay, well,
Speaker 1: how many pass rushers in the top one hundred. I
Speaker 1: do my top ten. I'm like, now there's more, all right,
Speaker 1: top fifteen, there's more top twenty, And I'm still leaving
Speaker 1: guys out that I'm like, man, he Beach should be
Speaker 1: in the top one hundred so pass rushers this week.
Speaker 1: I'm excited to see him see how these guys test.
Speaker 1: My guy, Trevon Walker from Georgia, want to see if
Speaker 1: he lives up to the hype I've been putting on
Speaker 1: his name. So it's gonna be a fun week that
Speaker 1: hopefully adds context to these evaluations we've been working on.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought up edge rusher because having those
Speaker 1: conversations around the draft class and kind of looking at
Speaker 1: these rankings back and forth, it feels like one of
Speaker 1: the only positions that's complete this year because you do
Speaker 1: have that high, top heavy talent pool like a Cavon
Speaker 1: Thibodeau out of Oregon, the Aidan Hutchinson's of the world
Speaker 1: out of Michigan, and then even after that you've got
Speaker 1: late first round guys. You have a complete board off
Speaker 1: of your edge rushers around that it really doesn't feel
Speaker 1: like there's not a whole lot of positions elsewhere because
Speaker 1: you can talk about quarterbacks. You mentioned there's not going
Speaker 1: to be that high end, high profile quarterback at the
Speaker 1: top of this draft. So with all of that being said,
Speaker 1: where does this rank from a draft class? Excitement for
Speaker 1: you because I mean, with me, I'm looking at edge rusher,
Speaker 1: maybe wide receiver just because it's deep. Again, not really
Speaker 1: the top heavy guys at that position. But I really
Speaker 1: don't get as excited about this draft just based off
Speaker 1: of the fact of the top heavy star power, right,
Speaker 1: But there's a lot of ways you can make your
Speaker 1: team better because of how deep it is in a
Speaker 1: couple areas, no doubt. And yeah, this is not relative
Speaker 1: to past years. This is not a great year to
Speaker 1: be picking top fifteen. It's just not a top heavy draft. Now,
Speaker 1: you're still gonna get good players there, but relative to
Speaker 1: past years, we're missing those blue chippers at the top.
Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean that it's not a good draft.
Speaker 1: And so I've heard so many people characterize as a
Speaker 1: bad draft or a down draft, and it's just that's
Speaker 1: just not true because when you see the value, there's
Speaker 1: Pro bowlers in this draft, future Pro bowlers, and you
Speaker 1: just go find them, go go go get them. And
Speaker 1: so yeah, I think pass rusher, I think I think
Speaker 1: your point is valid. Pass rusher at every stage of
Speaker 1: the draft, you feel like it's a it's a good position,
Speaker 1: where you can't really say that about every other position.
Speaker 1: Wide receiver. To me, there's six receivers in the top
Speaker 1: twenty five this year. But then you know, it takes
Speaker 1: a little bit, there's a little of a lull, you know,
Speaker 1: later on corner I really like the corners in the
Speaker 1: first round. I think we could see three in the
Speaker 1: top fifteen and then but then there's a little bit
Speaker 1: of a lull before we get to some other levels
Speaker 1: of the cornerback position. So I think, I think what
Speaker 1: you said is fair pass rusher. The only position that
Speaker 1: you point to and say, okay, it's deep at the
Speaker 1: top or strong at the top, deep in the middle,
Speaker 1: and then it'll stretch out so you still feel like
Speaker 1: you're getting good players well into day three. Let me
Speaker 1: ask you this, and it's what I find so fascinating
Speaker 1: about this class. And I know, I mean you you
Speaker 1: have your own grades and your own process and your
Speaker 1: own confidence every year. But the recurring talking point on
Speaker 1: this class is like, outside of maybe eight prospects at
Speaker 1: the top right, it's like set your own board, you know,
Speaker 1: And is that more fun or more stressful as somebody
Speaker 1: who does this all year round, who wants to be
Speaker 1: as right as possible, This seems like it could be
Speaker 1: a stressful class where you know you gotta stack these tackles.
Speaker 1: You got to figure out how you feel about all
Speaker 1: these addreshers in corner. It just seems like we talk
Speaker 1: about this all the time. A guy could go to
Speaker 1: the Cowboys at twenty four that somebody else has graded
Speaker 1: in the top ten or vice versa, Like maybe the
Speaker 1: Cowboys draft a guy at twenty four that everybody else
Speaker 1: is like you picked him in the first round. Like
Speaker 1: it just seems more so than any year. It kind
Speaker 1: of seems like this is a year where everybody is
Speaker 1: fending for themselves. Yeah. Absolutely, I think it speaks to
Speaker 1: you have you have to have confidence in what you
Speaker 1: what what you see. You know, there's a reason why
Speaker 1: you gave this player a a second round grade and
Speaker 1: then oh see him in the first round and other
Speaker 1: mocks and things like that, and it's well, okay, well
Speaker 1: why do you have him the second And you have
Speaker 1: to have confidence in what you're doing. Um, there are
Speaker 1: certain players where you know, I think you can come
Speaker 1: around on or like you other people, you you don't
Speaker 1: don't just take what everyone else says. I mean to me, like,
Speaker 1: just from speaking from my experience, I've got you know,
Speaker 1: my my short list of people that I trust what
Speaker 1: they say, and I'll take what they say and take
Speaker 1: it to heart and listen and try tore it out.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it's just it's just one of those drafts.
Speaker 1: And to me that makes it fun because I use
Speaker 1: the baseball analogy all the time. Like, if you expect
Speaker 1: me to hit a thousand percent on you know these players,
Speaker 1: you're gonna be disappointed, just like if you expect Mike
Speaker 1: Trout to you know, hit about a thousand. And I'm
Speaker 1: not trying to compare myself to mat Mike Trout in anyway. Hey,
Speaker 1: you're the Mic Trout of the draft. I'll take that.
Speaker 1: But again, if you're a baseball player and you got
Speaker 1: on base four times out of ten, you're doing a
Speaker 1: heck of a job. And so you know, it's not
Speaker 1: the same quite the same, But you know you're gonna
Speaker 1: miss on some of these guys and that's fine. Um,
Speaker 1: but that's what I love about the Draft Guide, or
Speaker 1: you know why, being able to put all my opinions
Speaker 1: out there on hundreds and hundreds of players. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: I put a lot of confidence in that, and it
Speaker 1: served me well to this point and I really like
Speaker 1: what you said about there's gonna be a lot of
Speaker 1: prospects in this draft where people are gonna come around
Speaker 1: on them, because I feel like this draft more than others.
Speaker 1: I'm looking at my board and I'm like, Okay, I'm
Speaker 1: confid and where I have this guy, But maybe I
Speaker 1: need to go back and watch him again. We were
Speaker 1: talking about a couple of prospects even before we went
Speaker 1: on air, about how, hey, maybe I need to go
Speaker 1: back and watch this guy because somebody else an example,
Speaker 1: the sky More wide receiver out of you were gonna
Speaker 1: try and say that you were going to say for
Speaker 1: the third, but let's just get out of the way
Speaker 1: because he's the only player Jeff Kavanaugh wants to talk about. Dude,
Speaker 1: he's so let's just put it to everybody for hearing
Speaker 1: for now. What do you think about sky Moore? I
Speaker 1: think he's the heag of a player, um I think,
Speaker 1: And he might think he's gonna surprise people that this
Speaker 1: week he's not a burner, but don't be surprised heroes
Speaker 1: in the low four force. Uh like that That's what
Speaker 1: I was told. So, um, I what I love most
Speaker 1: about him, and I think he'll also be one of
Speaker 1: the I love the Gauntlet drill. I think he'll be
Speaker 1: one of the best performers in the Gauntlet drill because
Speaker 1: he's so good with those quick hitters of slants, catching
Speaker 1: the ball away from his body. Um, he's so tough
Speaker 1: squares up the catch point. Um uh there's I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't know when you list the reasons not to
Speaker 1: like him, it's like you're kind of like nitpicking more
Speaker 1: so than like a fatal flaw with this guy. So
Speaker 1: I don't think he's a slot only but I do
Speaker 1: think he is projects best in the slot where he
Speaker 1: can do the most damage. So in my opinion, yeah,
Speaker 1: I see a top top sixty, top seventy five guy
Speaker 1: in this drafting. He's my ninth receiver in my rankings.
Speaker 1: So that makes me feel a little bit better because
Speaker 1: I was talking to Dave earlier and I said I
Speaker 1: had him seventeen, which is really low. Like I'm looking
Speaker 1: at some of these guys in front of him that
Speaker 1: I really like more than him. But you're talking about
Speaker 1: fatal flaw. I agree with you. I don't have a
Speaker 1: fatal flaw with him. And if I'm nitpicking at his
Speaker 1: cons like you said, I thought he was a slot
Speaker 1: only guy, and he may be moving forward, but if
Speaker 1: he's able to show some versatility and if he runs
Speaker 1: in the four fours, that could potentially change my thought
Speaker 1: process too, because at least looking at him, he plays fast,
Speaker 1: he doesn't play exceptionally fast, and if he comes out
Speaker 1: and runs in the low four fours, then I might
Speaker 1: have something there to look at. Something we always talk
Speaker 1: about these players is understanding their journey where they came from.
Speaker 1: He wasn't a receiver in high school. Here's a quarterback
Speaker 1: and cornerback, so you know there was an adjustment period
Speaker 1: for him, and that I feel. I still think there's
Speaker 1: upside there. I still think he's learning how to be
Speaker 1: a more polished receiver and he's gonna get better and better.
Speaker 1: So um yeah, I think with sky Moore, you feel
Speaker 1: really good about the player you have now, but you
Speaker 1: feel even better about what he's going to be two years,
Speaker 1: three years from now. And as long as we're at this,
Speaker 1: let me tell you something about my buddy Jeff Kavanaugh.
Speaker 1: Like when when he gets excited about something, you know,
Speaker 1: caution goes out, Caution goes to the wind. That's why
Speaker 1: we waited until Jeff's not on the show. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: then we have Dane Brooke, I think to talk to this. Yeah, Dane,
Speaker 1: Dane Will Dane shot him down and pretty quicker. You
Speaker 1: shot Jeff down. You kind of killed his dream. I
Speaker 1: give Jeff credit because he when he sees a guy
Speaker 1: he likes, he's not afraid, he buys in and he
Speaker 1: honestly I would rather make Jeff stand on the table
Speaker 1: and be wrong or rather than Dan. I think Dane
Speaker 1: gave a very similar scouting report as Jeff. Dane is
Speaker 1: just a rational human being, whereas Jeff is just all
Speaker 1: excitement all the time. Right, You're exactly right. I wanted
Speaker 1: to hit on this too because and I'm curious, I'm
Speaker 1: not I'm I'm asking this more than stating it. It
Speaker 1: feels to me like the testing pool is going to
Speaker 1: be a little bit disappointing here, just in the sense,
Speaker 1: you know, at the top of my mind, obviously because
Speaker 1: of who I am as a person. Derek Stingley is
Speaker 1: not going to work out this week. Um, I saw it.
Speaker 1: You mentioned Drake London might not work out. It seems
Speaker 1: like we're going to be missing some sex appeal and
Speaker 1: Evan Neil I believe isn't going to do anything at
Speaker 1: this combine, right, So top tackle for a lot of
Speaker 1: a lot of people. Do you do you feel like
Speaker 1: it's less than most years or am I exaggerating? I
Speaker 1: think it happens every year where and most of these
Speaker 1: guys are injurily. If Derek Stingley working his way back
Speaker 1: from the foot injury, not quite ready, Drake London working
Speaker 1: his way back from injury, not quite ready. Jeremy Ruckert
Speaker 1: Ohio State tight end foot injury at the Senior Bowl,
Speaker 1: not quite ready. So we have that every year. Um
Speaker 1: with this year, I think we still will have some
Speaker 1: like the wide receivers and corners. I think we're gonna
Speaker 1: have a lot of a lot of guys test really well.
Speaker 1: Chris Olive from Ohio State. I don't think people understand
Speaker 1: how fast this guy is. Uh ten eight guy in
Speaker 1: high school in one hundred meters, He's gonna blaze. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, I think Baylor, Baylor brought a track team.
Speaker 1: It's crazy with Baylor the athletes they have most some
Speaker 1: of them are on the defensive side of the football
Speaker 1: as well. With Barns the corner, He's he's my vote
Speaker 1: for the fastest forty this week. Should be in the
Speaker 1: four threes. Wow, maybe gets lower than that. Even um JT.
Speaker 1: Woods the safety. He can fly a very fast linear athlete,
Speaker 1: So those guys will test really well. Treill Bernard the
Speaker 1: linebacker from Baylor. Taekwon Thornton the wide receiver, so Baylor
Speaker 1: mentioned Jalen Petrie in there as well. Yeah, and I
Speaker 1: hope he runs well. I don't know they's gonna run well.
Speaker 1: I don't think that that's necessarily his strength as a player,
Speaker 1: But I think he'll be okay. I think he'll do
Speaker 1: well for himself. And he's to me he's in the
Speaker 1: top fifty mix as one of the better safeties this year.
Speaker 1: But you know, I don't I don't know that it's
Speaker 1: necessarily that much different than past years. I think that
Speaker 1: you with no Evan Neil, it's an opportunity for Ricky
Speaker 1: stay Tackle to say, hey, this is why I belong
Speaker 1: number one. I put him at number one of my
Speaker 1: mock draft, and wow, uh hey, I don't obviously the
Speaker 1: Jaguars and I don't think they have any idea who
Speaker 1: they're taking number one, but uh, you know, it's a
Speaker 1: chance this week to show what he can do in
Speaker 1: this show that he's, you know, not just one of
Speaker 1: the top players, he is a top player. It's ironic
Speaker 1: because drafting Jamar Chase clearly worked out for the Bengal
Speaker 1: But the Jags situation at one reminds me of the
Speaker 1: Bengals last year, where I'm like, just just draft to tackle, please,
Speaker 1: please protect, please protect that long haired quarterback taking any
Speaker 1: more damage. It's exactly right you want to find. And
Speaker 1: that's one of the things I want to talk to
Speaker 1: Dan about too, is where you have those tackles ranked.
Speaker 1: You talked about a quantu, but we've talked about Charles
Speaker 1: Cross at Neil Cross being from Mississippi State, Neil of
Speaker 1: course from Alabama. But then you've got a quantu who
Speaker 1: really seems like he's jumping up draft boards as just
Speaker 1: I've heard the word nasty thrown around with him, and
Speaker 1: his tape certainly stands up to the billing there as well.
Speaker 1: But is that where you see kind of what we
Speaker 1: were talking about with edge rusher early, those top heavy
Speaker 1: players that could certainly make an immediate impact at the
Speaker 1: top of this draft, maybe in those top fifteen players. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and with a quantu, he's just He's so explosive at
Speaker 1: contact in the run game, it's really a sight to behold. Um,
Speaker 1: and he's a better athlete. Thank people give him credit
Speaker 1: for Uh in a lot. I mean, he's never been
Speaker 1: called small in his life, but in a lot of ways,
Speaker 1: he's kind of a smaller McKay Beckton with the way
Speaker 1: he moves out there. And uh, you know, I wrote
Speaker 1: my report how you watch his tape and and there's
Speaker 1: more pancakes than iham. I mean, it's just he he
Speaker 1: finishes to the ground and he does not apologize for it.
Speaker 1: And that's the type of guy you want to coach.
Speaker 1: And I think he's got the most refined player in
Speaker 1: the world. No, but he he showed this year, at
Speaker 1: least in my mind, he proved he could play tackle.
Speaker 1: He could stay on the outside, but he could also
Speaker 1: move inside play guard. So when you have his combination
Speaker 1: of all the traits that he offers, with the explosiveness,
Speaker 1: the power, and the fact that you think he's only
Speaker 1: going to get better as he develops it and gets
Speaker 1: more experience, I'm all in on a quando. I like
Speaker 1: to think if you're not if you're not aware, Dane
Speaker 1: is going to spend this entire week doing draft interviews.
Speaker 1: Probably I just imagine you standing in your mirror at
Speaker 1: home working on your draft analogies more pancakes than I
Speaker 1: bringing a track team to the comment sitting here, coming
Speaker 1: ready with the word play, and I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna probably use that on the blitz or something
Speaker 1: down the road. That's the finest form of flattery, my friend,
Speaker 1: real quick before we take this break. That So, from
Speaker 1: what I'm hearing from you, and especially without without a
Speaker 1: quarterback who is, it's probably not going to change a
Speaker 1: whole lot with what happens with them this week. From
Speaker 1: what I'm hearing with you is it sounds like there's
Speaker 1: anywhere from like ten to fifteen guys that could really
Speaker 1: jump onto the radar in terms of like big time
Speaker 1: first round prospects when this week is over. Whether it's
Speaker 1: an Aquanu jumping up as as a favor to be
Speaker 1: number one, or whether it's a cornerback or a receiver
Speaker 1: who maybe we're not talking about as much as we
Speaker 1: should kind of. Alave is a perfect example, Like this
Speaker 1: whole time, we've been talking about him as like a
Speaker 1: fringe first round guy. If he does the right stuff
Speaker 1: this week, he could completely change that narrative. You think
Speaker 1: that's fair to say. I think the way we need
Speaker 1: to look at this draft is there's gonna be very
Speaker 1: little consensus, and so like in our minds, you know,
Speaker 1: because I'm with you, I'm I'm seeing Olave as a
Speaker 1: late more of a late one. Don't be surprised if
Speaker 1: a team thinks he's one of the best receivers in
Speaker 1: this draft and would take him top you know fifteen.
Speaker 1: You know, I just when you They're just not going
Speaker 1: to be very much consensus, and so I think, you know,
Speaker 1: we have to have an open mind, all the viewers
Speaker 1: and readers have to have an open mind, all the
Speaker 1: fans because even though I think we're doing a nice
Speaker 1: job of setting the stage and you guys do a
Speaker 1: great job every week on the Draft show of setting
Speaker 1: the stage of what this draft is, still keeping an
Speaker 1: open mind because there's going to be more or less
Speaker 1: consensus this year that I think in most years. So
Speaker 1: the combine will help influence that as well. Based off
Speaker 1: of how that these guys work out and how they run.
Speaker 1: We don't get to see the interviews, but how Cavon
Speaker 1: Thibodeaux interviews is going to play a part and where
Speaker 1: he's drafted. You know, like it's he's trying to figure
Speaker 1: out how to say this, but you know, like he's
Speaker 1: when teams interview him there, they'll have a seat for
Speaker 1: him and then they'll pull up another seat for his ego,
Speaker 1: and you know, it's just that's just how it is.
Speaker 1: And so he has to sell himself and say, hey,
Speaker 1: I'm I'm passionate about being the best football player I
Speaker 1: could be And he needs to sell himself and worry
Speaker 1: about the other all the other stuff and other times.
Speaker 1: So you know, it's going to be important for for
Speaker 1: Thibodeau to have a good week on the field, but
Speaker 1: even more so any interviews and how he performs that
Speaker 1: that could shake whether he goes two overall or ten overall.
Speaker 1: It's a fantastic segue for a question we've got in
Speaker 1: the second segment, So we will go ahead and take
Speaker 1: this break and get to y'all's questions in the second
Speaker 1: segment with Dan Burglar. We will be right back after this.
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Speaker 1: This is the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show. Welcome
Speaker 1: back to the Draft Show. Here from the Indianapolis Convention Center.
Speaker 1: I'm joined by Kyle Yeomans and Dane Brugler. We don't
Speaker 1: have all the funny sound effects, so I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: say it. Dane Twitter on the twenty man. You're ready
Speaker 1: Twitter Twitter Twitter on the Twitter and Brian's not here,
Speaker 1: so we can get to some questions. We can actually
Speaker 1: maybe ten a lot of questions. So, like I said
Speaker 1: at the end of the last segment, it's the last
Speaker 1: question I wrote down from Ernie. You already said cave
Speaker 1: on Thibodeau. We can talk a little bit more about him,
Speaker 1: but he was curious about prospects who could use really
Speaker 1: good interviews this week at the combine. Obviously we don't
Speaker 1: get to see that. Maybe some of these teams will
Speaker 1: release them later after they draft a guy, but until
Speaker 1: then we don't know. But just in terms of guys
Speaker 1: who have questions, whether it's character, whether it's football habits, whatever.
Speaker 1: Some guys that jump out to you that need to
Speaker 1: impress in the interview rooms, Well, I think you start
Speaker 1: with the quarterbacks because you obviously that's that's it's quarterbacks
Speaker 1: an intangible position. So you have to understand what's their
Speaker 1: mental development, what's their mental capacity, Where are they when
Speaker 1: you put them on the white board and get a
Speaker 1: better sense for how they can read a defense, what
Speaker 1: they see pre snap post snap, What were their responsibilities
Speaker 1: in college, like, uh, you know, college offenses. The number
Speaker 1: one goal for a college offense is not to prepare
Speaker 1: you for the NFL. It's to win games, and so
Speaker 1: they're going to make it as simplistic as possible. And
Speaker 1: so there's a lot of these quarterbacks just weren't asked
Speaker 1: to do things that you're gonna be asked to do
Speaker 1: in the NFL. That doesn't mean you can't do it,
Speaker 1: just means they weren't asked too. So I think that'll
Speaker 1: be big for a lot of these quarterbacks, especially you
Speaker 1: look at Malik Willis coming from that scheme with you free, um,
Speaker 1: Matt Carroll with Lane Kiffin, a very an offense that's
Speaker 1: designed around uh, set throws where you don't have to
Speaker 1: make a ton of progression reads. And so that'll be
Speaker 1: big for these quarterbacks. Um. You know. I I think
Speaker 1: for a lot of these players, it's maybe understand Ark
Speaker 1: getting a better sense for you know, why the production
Speaker 1: wasn't better, Uh de marven le Al from A and
Speaker 1: M like, Okay, you've got the trades, you got the skills,
Speaker 1: you know, why weren't you more of an impact player? Uh?
Speaker 1: You know, and kind of challenge him a little bit
Speaker 1: on that, you know, Derek Stingley that that's gonna be
Speaker 1: a big one. M I know, you guys have talked
Speaker 1: extensively about Stingley, and you know, is he and alpha?
Speaker 1: Is he can he come in and be at number one?
Speaker 1: And is it more than just durability questions? Does he
Speaker 1: have that it factor to be worthy of a top
Speaker 1: pick um And so, you know, I think that, Uh,
Speaker 1: A lot of these players are coming in and you know,
Speaker 1: we see what's on film. Uh, we see their talent,
Speaker 1: and that's maybe the easiest part of the process. The second,
Speaker 1: you know, the other part of the process is understanding
Speaker 1: who they are as people. Do they fit with your culture,
Speaker 1: do they fit with what you're trying to build? Are
Speaker 1: they good human beings? Off the field? A lot of
Speaker 1: these guys just they don't fit what you're looking for.
Speaker 1: And so after an interview, you're not talking to a scout.
Speaker 1: He told me that they cross off more names from
Speaker 1: their list based off of interviews that did not go
Speaker 1: the well the way they thought, compared to anything that
Speaker 1: happens on the field this week. So, you know, bad
Speaker 1: forties and things like that. They cross off more names
Speaker 1: because of the interviews than anything else, because they realize, Okay,
Speaker 1: this guy's just not a fit for what we're trying
Speaker 1: to build in our in our building. It sounds like
Speaker 1: the world's most public job fair of all time, because
Speaker 1: I mean that's what it is. It's it's performance based, sure,
Speaker 1: but there's an interview aspect and there's that personality side
Speaker 1: to it. And one of the names that I thought
Speaker 1: of first was Jordan Davis too out of Georgia, defensive tackle.
Speaker 1: Maybe in that conversation about his production and his collegian scheme.
Speaker 1: Is he able to play three downs in the NFL?
Speaker 1: Is he able to make a lengthy impact drive to
Speaker 1: drive for an interior of a defensive line. That's something
Speaker 1: that I would ask throughout as a scout because I
Speaker 1: want to know if he's going to make an impact
Speaker 1: not only on first and second down, but can he
Speaker 1: get it done on third down as well and continue
Speaker 1: to stop the run the way that he does whenever
Speaker 1: he's out on the field period. It's funny because it's
Speaker 1: definitely the world's most public job fair, But the irony
Speaker 1: is some of the most important information never sees the
Speaker 1: light of the light of day. Yeah, between the medicals,
Speaker 1: which again I think we everybody agrees, is the really
Speaker 1: the reason why we're here, absolutely, and then the interviews
Speaker 1: and maybe the best of the best of draft media
Speaker 1: might uncover a few of these things. Maurice Hearst comes
Speaker 1: to mind, sitting right here. Yeah, I think I think
Speaker 1: we were doing a showy Brian wanted to draft Maurice
Speaker 1: Hearst in the first round and we find out he's
Speaker 1: got an irregular heartbeat on the show, and I think
Speaker 1: I think Brian just shut down for the rest of
Speaker 1: the day. But but like, maybe two or three of
Speaker 1: those things will come out, And meanwhile, every team, I'll
Speaker 1: never forget. I'm not going to say the guy's name,
Speaker 1: but like the Cowboys people told me after the fact,
Speaker 1: they were like, yeah, we know you love that guy.
Speaker 1: We were never going to draft him because of something
Speaker 1: that was wrong with him. And I'm just like, wow,
Speaker 1: I wish I had known that in February. But I
Speaker 1: understand why you don't yet comblicize that information for a reason.
Speaker 1: But it goes back to the intimacy of these conversations
Speaker 1: and the importance of them as well. I mean, that's
Speaker 1: why the convention center is as big as it is
Speaker 1: here in India's because they have all these rooms and
Speaker 1: you have all these interactions that are crucial to who
Speaker 1: is ultimately going to end up on your roster. So
Speaker 1: we're not interested in getting too deep into the Cowboys weeds.
Speaker 1: But Stephen Jones, interviewed with Cowboys media yesterday, was pretty
Speaker 1: noncommittal about A Mari Cooper's history with the team. So
Speaker 1: Mario asked, if A Maria Cooper's not here, what is
Speaker 1: the likelihood of drafting a receiver in the first three rounds?
Speaker 1: I think we would all agree that if that's the case,
Speaker 1: it's fairly likely. Yeah, it's likely. So I'm going to
Speaker 1: skip that part of it, But I'm curious to hear
Speaker 1: from you, Dane. We can do a little bit on
Speaker 1: the first round, guys. I feel like we've covered a
Speaker 1: lot a lot of that. But if the Cowboys find
Speaker 1: themselves needing a receiver that badly, what about some Day
Speaker 1: two options that intrigue you for them? I don't think
Speaker 1: this is sorry, this is assuming Amari's not on the team.
Speaker 1: So what type of receiver you think they go after?
Speaker 1: Do you think they want a pure outside guy? Do
Speaker 1: you think they'd be open to a slot in that situation?
Speaker 1: I guess I guess they could go in any direction. Really, yeah,
Speaker 1: because if you're not bringing back Amari, there's a chance
Speaker 1: to try and maybe try to lock up Michael Galla.
Speaker 1: Wilson could come back. So let's say I would probably
Speaker 1: say outside receiver would most likely be the biggest replacement
Speaker 1: for him. Maybe given that CD can play in the slot,
Speaker 1: I would assume you'd be looking at it outside, right, Okay,
Speaker 1: and that's once we get to day two. We're getting
Speaker 1: the guys with question marks. Uh, you know, the George
Speaker 1: Pickens of the world, you know from Georgia, who is
Speaker 1: kind of the offensive version of Derek Sting. You know,
Speaker 1: he had that great freshman year and then things kind
Speaker 1: of tailed off from there. So the medicals gonna be
Speaker 1: big for George Pickens this week. I don't know if
Speaker 1: we're going to see him work out or not, because
Speaker 1: he's had the ACL last spring. I don't know if
Speaker 1: he feels one hundred percent just yet, so that'll be
Speaker 1: important to watch. John Metchi from Alabama, who I mean,
Speaker 1: you want to hear Nick Saban gush, which he doesn't
Speaker 1: do a ton, but you want to hear him gush.
Speaker 1: Ask him about John Metchi and he calls him the
Speaker 1: epitome of a wide receiver when you talk about the toughness,
Speaker 1: the route running, the intangibles. John Metchi, how did she
Speaker 1: chance to go in the first round? But then he
Speaker 1: added the ACL and so you know this, this franchise
Speaker 1: has not been scared to draft guys coming off injury.
Speaker 1: I was about to say so, yeah, second round baby
Speaker 1: right by John Metchi in the second round. Yeah, that
Speaker 1: would absolutely be a possible fit. A guy that could
Speaker 1: play inside or outside. Not I don't think he has
Speaker 1: like that elite skill where average size, average speed, but
Speaker 1: he's just a he's already a professional with how he
Speaker 1: operates and plays the position. Um David Bell from producing
Speaker 1: that mix. Um, he's kind of like a maybe a
Speaker 1: poor man's Michael Pittman, you know, like non explosive but
Speaker 1: just solid down the field. Christian Watson from North Dakota State. Uh,
Speaker 1: he's still really raw as a route runner, but he's
Speaker 1: got athleticism. He's still figuring out how good he can
Speaker 1: be like those justin Ross from Clemson. This is a big,
Speaker 1: big week from him. Uh, you know, he looked like
Speaker 1: a future top ten pick after that College football playoff
Speaker 1: is freshman year and then things kind of tailed off
Speaker 1: and so teams are trying to figure him out this week.
Speaker 1: So there's some interesting options on Day two at receiver.
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna pair that with a question from Cowboy
Speaker 1: Rattler of the of that crop Day two guys, is
Speaker 1: there a guy that stands out to you as a
Speaker 1: route runner? Well? I think John Metchi definitely, um and
Speaker 1: we need to talk about John or Jalen Tolbert from
Speaker 1: South Alabama, but he's in that mix two. But in
Speaker 1: terms of a route runner, I have to say Metchi.
Speaker 1: I think he'd be the the more most polished of
Speaker 1: the group, and in just understanding how to attack leverage,
Speaker 1: how to manipulate coverages, how to work the chemistry with
Speaker 1: your quarterback, and be on time, on schedule with everything
Speaker 1: you're doing out there. Metchie has that. Again, if he's
Speaker 1: available for you in the second round, it's really because
Speaker 1: of that injury and nothing else. So I think Metchi
Speaker 1: would stand out as a guy that brings that polish
Speaker 1: as a route runner that maybe you don't usually see
Speaker 1: at that point in the draft. I really like Metchi
Speaker 1: and at that spot, I mean, like you said, second round,
Speaker 1: if he's there fifty six, I'm gushing at the fact
Speaker 1: that he could potentially be available, of course if Amark
Speaker 1: Cooper Mark Cooper is not a part of the team. However,
Speaker 1: I just want to play Devil's advocate here. He had
Speaker 1: some problem with bald skills to a certain extent. I mean,
Speaker 1: that wasn't the strong part of his game, but separation,
Speaker 1: route running, his ability to find himself into space, where
Speaker 1: all things that he did very very well. How much
Speaker 1: are you worried about the fact that he hasn't necessarily
Speaker 1: shown that elite ball skills that some of the other
Speaker 1: guys that would be considered first round receivers maybe second
Speaker 1: round receivers have in this class. Yeah, and you know,
Speaker 1: he had a share of drops, but I think his
Speaker 1: drop rate overall, considering the amount of targets he had,
Speaker 1: is okay. It's not like an alarming number, and so
Speaker 1: even though he did have some drops, it's not something
Speaker 1: that I think it would really stop me from drafting him.
Speaker 1: Is he a guy that consistently plays bigger than he
Speaker 1: is not necessarily not compared to like a Drake London
Speaker 1: or some of these other guys who you know, play
Speaker 1: above the rim and are able to expand their catch
Speaker 1: radius and crazy ways, he's not that guy. But and again,
Speaker 1: I think that's what it goes back to, maybe not
Speaker 1: having that elite trait, but just being solid across the board.
Speaker 1: And I think there's something to be said about that consistency,
Speaker 1: going back to your point about just being comfortable with
Speaker 1: a lack of consensus. Would it surprise you at all?
Speaker 1: I actually goes in the first round, that would surprise me,
Speaker 1: just because I think there's six receivers in that top
Speaker 1: twenty five in my opinion, and so if he goes
Speaker 1: ahead of one of those six, that would surprise me. Um.
Speaker 1: And then if we had more than six, I think
Speaker 1: that would surprise me. UM. So, especially with the a
Speaker 1: cl we're not gonna be able to see him work out. UM.
Speaker 1: I think you know, Kyle's point is is valid. He
Speaker 1: had I always worry about guys that had more drops
Speaker 1: than touchdowns over the career, and Met she's one of
Speaker 1: those guys. One more drop in his career compared to touchdowns. Um,
Speaker 1: And that's that's not ideal. So I would be surprised
Speaker 1: if we saw him sneaking to that first Who are
Speaker 1: those six wide receivers? I'm just curious, uh, for me,
Speaker 1: it's Garrett Wilson at one. He's my clear cut top guy. Wow.
Speaker 1: Traylon Burkes to Drake London three, Jamison Williams four, and
Speaker 1: Williams would be higher if not for the AC I
Speaker 1: mean just that that speed. We were robbed of not
Speaker 1: being able to see him this week at the combine.
Speaker 1: He doing more like two tilligence on him. He comes
Speaker 1: from my track family, his entire family track athletes. So
Speaker 1: apple doesn't fall too far from the tree. There uh
Speaker 1: five of Lava six. John Dotson to me, all six
Speaker 1: of those guys belonging to top twenty five picks, and
Speaker 1: probably all six probably won't go out of high so
Speaker 1: a team picking twenty seven to thirty five will get
Speaker 1: good value there. Nice. I love. I love forward thinking
Speaker 1: questions from people that are trying to problem solve. So
Speaker 1: Wayne and Johnny both ask similar questions about different players.
Speaker 1: They're looking for j Ron Curse if j Ron Curse
Speaker 1: isn't able to be retained in free agency. So Wayne
Speaker 1: wants to know. And I think it's interesting because I
Speaker 1: think of both of these guys more as cover safeties
Speaker 1: than box safeties. Dax Hill out of Michigan and obvious
Speaker 1: and Quon Brisker out of state. And again I think
Speaker 1: of those guys more as coverage guys, but they both
Speaker 1: want to know, like, are those guys capable of thriving
Speaker 1: in more of a box sort of linebacker hybrid type
Speaker 1: of role. See. I think if you're keeping Dax Hill
Speaker 1: in the box, I think you're just you're not doing him.
Speaker 1: You're doing him a disservice. You know, his athleticism, his versatility,
Speaker 1: that's why you drafted Daxil. Because if you're drafting Jack Hill,
Speaker 1: you're doing it in the first round. So you know,
Speaker 1: I think if you're gonna get a guy like that,
Speaker 1: you want him to play the nickel. You want to
Speaker 1: play over the slot receiver. You want to play more
Speaker 1: of a split safety where he's gonna cover half the field.
Speaker 1: You want him showing off that athleticism because Dax Hil
Speaker 1: is gonna tear it up this week. He's gonna have
Speaker 1: outstanding numbers. And that athleticism is why you draft Dack
Speaker 1: Hill in the first round. So you know, I if
Speaker 1: you're gonna draft them just to play on the box,
Speaker 1: I think you're maybe doing them a disservice and you
Speaker 1: might as well, wait and draft a different safety at
Speaker 1: a different point in the draft. Brisker, I think is
Speaker 1: more of that box guy that he played a lot
Speaker 1: of box at Penn State. Um, you know, the mistackles
Speaker 1: piled up for him this year, but he's also injured
Speaker 1: and so that's that's something with him that you're trying
Speaker 1: to figure out, is you know how much did the
Speaker 1: injuries cause the mistackles? But jico On Brisker should be
Speaker 1: another top tester this week at the safety position. Okay,
Speaker 1: as long as we're with DBS, and I am interested
Speaker 1: in this. You mentioned cornerbacks maybe improving their stock this week.
Speaker 1: I feel like Sting, Sauce Gardner, and Andrew Booth are
Speaker 1: like really the only three that I hear about is
Speaker 1: in terms of first rounders. Wow, you didn't mention my
Speaker 1: number one corner Oh God, who am I forgive him?
Speaker 1: From Florida? Oh McDuffie from Washington. We talked about, We
Speaker 1: talked about my I'm gonna say it again, my apologies
Speaker 1: to Washington because I feel like they deserve so much
Speaker 1: more credit for franking out DBS there out West and
Speaker 1: we will ball in the league every year. We can
Speaker 1: talk about DBU later and whether or not the Ben
Speaker 1: Rouge or up in the Pacific Northwest. I got nothing
Speaker 1: to say, but okay, so Chris want Chris wants to
Speaker 1: know first of all, and his question is mainly like,
Speaker 1: is cornerback a realistic scenario for the Cowboys? How does
Speaker 1: the fact that Calvin Joseph and Nashan Wright are sitting
Speaker 1: there on the depth chart? How does it play into that?
Speaker 1: On top of whether or not you think it's a
Speaker 1: good idea. Maybe, yeah, let's just kick around some names,
Speaker 1: because I don't think any of us think Gardner and
Speaker 1: Stingley are going to be there at twenty four, but
Speaker 1: maybe some guys who would be. Yeah, and maybe and
Speaker 1: Andrew Booth makes it to you at a Clemson who's
Speaker 1: a really exciting player just still getting better and better. Um,
Speaker 1: I want to hear from you guys, just with the
Speaker 1: corner the current depth chart, the cornerback position. They invested
Speaker 1: two corners in the top three rounds last year. You
Speaker 1: saw a little bit of them up and down, and
Speaker 1: so what's the feeling in the building of those two
Speaker 1: guys going into next season? Go first, I'll follow up.
Speaker 1: I'll start with me like it terrifies me. It's a
Speaker 1: chart the situation right now, because like on paper, you're like,
Speaker 1: we spent two top one hundred picks on this position. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and on top of that, we have an all pro now,
Speaker 1: so we're sure you're set there. Anthony Brown and Jordan
Speaker 1: Lewis were absolutely good enough that I'm not worried about
Speaker 1: getting rid of them. But you got to start thinking
Speaker 1: about the future. Anthony Brown, now in the last year
Speaker 1: of his extension, probably not going to do that again.
Speaker 1: And I think I think, I think the Cowboys are
Speaker 1: optimistic that the arrow is pointing up, particularly on Kelvin Joseph.
Speaker 1: But is it enough that if that guy's sitting there,
Speaker 1: you go away from it. I don't think so. I
Speaker 1: definitely don't think so. And that's my thing too, is
Speaker 1: Kelvin Joseph could could come in, be that slot guy
Speaker 1: in the future, could play in the slot, could play outside.
Speaker 1: Who knows, maybe that Anthony Brown Jordan Lewis role. He
Speaker 1: can kind of fill in whoever's not on the field.
Speaker 1: We can't see him do it this year. That's my
Speaker 1: that's my point. That's kind of what I'm getting to,
Speaker 1: is the fact that he was expected to be a
Speaker 1: heavy part of the rotation later in the season and
Speaker 1: he never got there. Now, does that mean he's not
Speaker 1: going to be there in twenty twenty two? Not necessarily.
Speaker 1: I think there's still a chance that he sees a
Speaker 1: heavy amount of snap work and is able to show
Speaker 1: some versatility in his game at the cornerback spot as
Speaker 1: soon as the year kicks off later in the fall. However,
Speaker 1: if there is a there at either twenty four or
Speaker 1: at fifty six that you fall in love with, that
Speaker 1: doesn't mean you shouldn't take him just because you have
Speaker 1: four guys right now that you feel have the opportunity
Speaker 1: to play significant number of snaps for you. Do you
Speaker 1: think twenty four like what McDuffie's Well, you have him
Speaker 1: as your CB one, So I mean did The name
Speaker 1: to watch is gonna be Kyler Gordon, McDuffie's teammate at Washington.
Speaker 1: Kyler Gordon's gonna just have a ridiculous week and he's
Speaker 1: got a fascinating background. He was kung fu and a
Speaker 1: dance champion growing up. Wow, that translated at the football field,
Speaker 1: the basketball court forum in high school. And then he
Speaker 1: goes to Washington and it is up and down a start, Like,
Speaker 1: I don't know that he has the most natural instincts,
Speaker 1: but when you talk about a guy that with size
Speaker 1: and his athleticism and you know, can make plays on
Speaker 1: the ball when it's in his area. He's the toughness.
Speaker 1: He will lay out guys. So when you put that
Speaker 1: all together, it's like, yeah, he doesn't maybe have those
Speaker 1: elite instincts, but he's got what you can't teach with
Speaker 1: the movements and he's you know, he's a physical, competitive kid.
Speaker 1: So I think Kyler Gordon, if he tests like we
Speaker 1: expect him to test pencilman the first round, he's going
Speaker 1: to go that high. So there's a lot to work
Speaker 1: with Kyler Gordon. This is this is what this is
Speaker 1: what you miss with not having Dane, because like we
Speaker 1: can watch the tape and tell you what we think,
Speaker 1: but Dane's like, yeah, this guy's a black belt, that's true.
Speaker 1: Kung fu martial arts. Yeah, that's what he was. His
Speaker 1: mom was a kind of like a gymnastics teacher, so
Speaker 1: got him into all these different things and he was
Speaker 1: mister Spotlight at like nine years old all these dance competitions.
Speaker 1: So I'll tell you what that flexibility and quickness that
Speaker 1: that translated. And just to back up your point, Dave,
Speaker 1: is the fact that I'm looking at what Dane is
Speaker 1: looking at on his laptop right now. There is nothing
Speaker 1: here that says anything about a dance background or a
Speaker 1: taekwondo machine, Like I have to go pull up scouting
Speaker 1: reports just to talk about players, whereas Dane just has
Speaker 1: it off the top. It's pretty like Dana, I'm shocked
Speaker 1: at everywhere the Beast. I assume you don't have a
Speaker 1: release date, but I'm guessing like beginning of April, first
Speaker 1: week of April is always the goal. And so Kyle,
Speaker 1: you mentioned how it's March already and I'm kind of
Speaker 1: sweating right now thinking about that. Um, but yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: we'll get it done somehow somewhere. As he's the Beast,
Speaker 1: it's the best, It's the best draft guy that exists.
Speaker 1: You're doing a disservice if you don't get it. Keep
Speaker 1: an eye out for that, all right, Rich. I love this.
Speaker 1: I love the way people get scarred by picks U.
Speaker 1: Rich wants to know more about David A. Jabo and
Speaker 1: the fact that in the Michigan Oh yeah, yeah, you
Speaker 1: know where I'm going. I don't even have to say this.
Speaker 1: I am Taco. I don't know you did more. Sorry,
Speaker 1: it's okay, don't scout the helmet. Uh. You know, David
Speaker 1: Dajabo and Taco Charlton of very little in common except
Speaker 1: they played in ann arbor Um Ojabo and we can
Speaker 1: talk about guy's gonna impress it the combine. He went
Speaker 1: to high school with Jason Oway. Oh, Dafeway, who's the
Speaker 1: first round pick of the Ravens last year, ran off
Speaker 1: four three seven at the forty in the forty at
Speaker 1: Pence's pro day last year. Oh, just ridiculous. David Jabo
Speaker 1: will tell you that he used to beat away in
Speaker 1: hundred meter dashes in high school. So he's gonna light
Speaker 1: it up this week and you see it on the field. Now.
Speaker 1: Do you have to hide him a little bit in
Speaker 1: there as a rundefender, Yeah, you do. He's still figuring
Speaker 1: out how to set the edge and be a functional
Speaker 1: run defender, especially at his size. But if you want
Speaker 1: a guy that can get after the quarterback, he finished
Speaker 1: second in the Big Ten this year in sacks. And
Speaker 1: who do you finish behind? Just hi Adan Hutchinson his teammates,
Speaker 1: So you know he can do a lot of things
Speaker 1: for you as a pash rusher, and he's been playing
Speaker 1: football for five years, still growing, still learning. I mean,
Speaker 1: we're talking about him, and I'm not sure we need
Speaker 1: to because he's not made at twenty four wow, So
Speaker 1: no way is there any question mark around him. Just
Speaker 1: the fact that, like you mentioned, his teammate Aidan Hutchinson
Speaker 1: drew so much of that attention, drew so much of
Speaker 1: the looks from opposing teams in the Big Ten to
Speaker 1: where maybe it did allow for a job out to
Speaker 1: kind of see a free release at different times throughout
Speaker 1: his film. I mean, he still has to beat his blocker.
Speaker 1: I mean, did he see you know, fewer double teams
Speaker 1: in Hutchinson. Yeah, but he's supposed to beat this guy
Speaker 1: and he did consistently. So I mean that that is
Speaker 1: something I think is fair to point out, but it
Speaker 1: is not something that would stop me from drafting. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think when you look at the pass rushers this year,
Speaker 1: a lot of split opinions about how you rank these guys. Hutchinson, Thibodeaux,
Speaker 1: Travan Walker for me is up there, um, and then
Speaker 1: you throw Jabos in there, and then Jermaine Johnson and
Speaker 1: then if you want to throw Karloftis in there as well.
Speaker 1: So that's six guys that should all be in that
Speaker 1: top twenty conversation. I get real excited when you mentioned
Speaker 1: like six guys, and because I think you've said it
Speaker 1: about four different positions at this point, and I'm like, well,
Speaker 1: they can't all go, they can't all go. Dan will
Speaker 1: be here at twenty four. All right. One one more
Speaker 1: from my buddy Randall. A lot of people worried about
Speaker 1: the Cowboys offensive line, and rightfully so, um he wants
Speaker 1: to know. And we've I mean, we've beaten the first
Speaker 1: round prospects into the ground at this point. But if
Speaker 1: they were to double dip at the position, can you
Speaker 1: imagine a way that that would look like maybe a
Speaker 1: first rounder and then again on Day two or what
Speaker 1: have you? Sure? And I think nothing should be off
Speaker 1: limits when we talk about offensive line and the Cowboys
Speaker 1: don't want to go tackle makes sense? Guard? Okay, upgrade
Speaker 1: at center. I think that's something that should be on
Speaker 1: the table and something they need to consider. So uh yeah,
Speaker 1: I no team is set on the offensive line, not
Speaker 1: a single team in the NFL. And so if you
Speaker 1: double dip in the first three rounds on the offensive line.
Speaker 1: Not only does that make sense, but it's smart. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's especially when you think about the
Speaker 1: Cowboys and the identity they want to have on offense.
Speaker 1: You need you need to give your quarterback help, You
Speaker 1: need to give your running game help, and I think
Speaker 1: that this draft is set up to do that. When
Speaker 1: you look at the offensive line in the first round.
Speaker 1: If they there's there's at least a scenario where no
Speaker 1: interior offensive linement is off the board before the Cowboys pick,
Speaker 1: which would be I think a great situation. If that's
Speaker 1: a direction want to go. If they want to go
Speaker 1: at Tyler Lennard Baum at center, if they want to
Speaker 1: go to Kenyan Green from a and m Zion Johnson,
Speaker 1: I think is in that mix as well. But if
Speaker 1: they also want to wait until second or third round,
Speaker 1: I think the position stretches. I love Luke Fortner from
Speaker 1: Kentucky or Cole Strange from Chattanooga two centers in the
Speaker 1: third round. I think those guys will be starting in
Speaker 1: the NFL. You know, Tyler Smith from Tulsa is a
Speaker 1: really intriguing player because he's one of the youngest players
Speaker 1: in the draft. He's got a really interesting mix of
Speaker 1: power explosions. His fundamentals just need rebuilt from the bottom up,
Speaker 1: and so he's not ready to play right away. But
Speaker 1: what you're thinking about what he could be down the line,
Speaker 1: Tyler Smith's easy to get excited about. Bringing up Tyler
Speaker 1: Smith from Tulsa. Keep keep an eye on that name
Speaker 1: just in the future. Keep keep an eye on that name.
Speaker 1: I think that's something that could possibly come up again.
Speaker 1: I love how thorough y'all are, like. I think I
Speaker 1: wrote down a list of names I want to get
Speaker 1: to in the third segment. I think we've covered half
Speaker 1: of them into this segment. So why don't we go
Speaker 1: ahead and take that second break and we'll get into
Speaker 1: that in a little bit more detailed. To round this up,
Speaker 1: we'll be right back. Football season is almost over, and
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Speaker 1: Show wrapping up this first episode of Combine week. On
Speaker 1: the Draft Show, it's gonna be hectic. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of moving parts, there's a lot of schedules. But I
Speaker 1: think we're gonna have Dane with us for all three
Speaker 1: shows this week. I'm excited about that. Yes, showing out
Speaker 1: the cash to get a Dane on here because spare
Speaker 1: no expense for the best analyst in the game. I
Speaker 1: agree completely. So I laughed at the time at the
Speaker 1: end of the last segment because I wrote down a
Speaker 1: list of names, Like when I prep for the show,
Speaker 1: I'm always like, who are we not talking about? That?
Speaker 1: We should be that fans want to hear about that
Speaker 1: people are talking about, and I really think Tyler Smith,
Speaker 1: that Tulsa offensive tackle, he's like right at the top
Speaker 1: of that list. So can we just expand on that
Speaker 1: a little bit? Who he is as a prospect. He's
Speaker 1: one of the youngest players in this draft, redster sophomore,
Speaker 1: came out early, and there's gonna be a lot of
Speaker 1: split opinion on him from evaluator to evaluator because so
Speaker 1: much of his his draft grade is based on a
Speaker 1: projection what he's going to be down the road. Because
Speaker 1: when you look at the foundational traits that you want
Speaker 1: an offensive lineman, size checks that box, movement, skills checks
Speaker 1: that box play, strength there, physical brand of football is there.
Speaker 1: It's just the fundamentals need a lot of work. The
Speaker 1: he's just incredibly raw, and so when is it be
Speaker 1: able to help your football team. That's why I would
Speaker 1: be surprised if you went in the first round, just
Speaker 1: because I don't know that he's necessarily going to help
Speaker 1: you right away. That's it's kind of a draft and
Speaker 1: developed type of player, and that's hard to take in
Speaker 1: the first round. But you know, we've seen the worst
Speaker 1: offensive lineman go in the first round. You know Isaiah Wilson,
Speaker 1: you know the Titans took in the first round two
Speaker 1: years ago. Well, if that's the case, then maybe that one.
Speaker 1: But my point is is that Tyler Smith, I think
Speaker 1: is you're more oftenistic about him than you were about
Speaker 1: Isaiah Wilson. So the offensive line is such a starved
Speaker 1: position around the league that guys like this don't last
Speaker 1: very long. So maybe he sneaks into that top forty mix.
Speaker 1: But again we're talking about a guy that needs a
Speaker 1: lot of work before he's you know, the guy that
Speaker 1: you expect him to be. No, no surprise on this.
Speaker 1: I mean, Dane's got the guy peg to a certain extent,
Speaker 1: and the reason why is because you look at the youth,
Speaker 1: but you also look at the aggression. I mean, he
Speaker 1: is one of the most aggressive, heavy hitting big guards
Speaker 1: in all of college football. Sixteen penalties this year. He's
Speaker 1: as fans don't want to hear, something phenomenal, six foot six,
Speaker 1: three hundred and thirty pounds. Of course, we'll see what
Speaker 1: he's weighed at this week. He did not go to
Speaker 1: the Senior Bowl because, of course, he's twenty one years
Speaker 1: old by the time the draft he's actually not twenty
Speaker 1: one yet. Still, he will be twenty one when the
Speaker 1: draft comes around for like twenty five days prior to
Speaker 1: the first round. But he's one of those guys that
Speaker 1: I think Dallas has their eye on in that second
Speaker 1: round because, like you said, because of the unpolishedness, because
Speaker 1: the reason why he maybe has those penalties is because
Speaker 1: there are some ways that he can grow in his game.
Speaker 1: But if he's able to grow in his game, he
Speaker 1: wouldn't just be a starter this year. He'd be a
Speaker 1: starter in the future if maybe they move on from
Speaker 1: Connor Williams at that spot, if there's something that they
Speaker 1: could upgrade there, but they don't necessarily want to spend
Speaker 1: that high in the first round. If he's at fifty
Speaker 1: six and he's the selection, don't be surprised and also
Speaker 1: be happy about that because I think that's something that
Speaker 1: could really benefit this football team and especially the rotation
Speaker 1: and the offensive line moving forward. He mentioned his aggression,
Speaker 1: and that's that's the strength and the weakness. You love
Speaker 1: to see it, You love to see the way he plays,
Speaker 1: but at the same time, it leads to chaotic timing
Speaker 1: and you go have a tallencl right and it's sixteen
Speaker 1: penalties this year, like that's that's that's an issue. Obviously,
Speaker 1: he needs to grow and mature and I will he
Speaker 1: reach that point hopefully, but again there's more of a
Speaker 1: projection with him, which is why we're probably looking at
Speaker 1: more of a second round pick. Yep. It sounds weird
Speaker 1: to say about an offensive line that struggled as much
Speaker 1: as this one day in the second half of the year,
Speaker 1: but if there's a unit that could take a guy
Speaker 1: who needs a year to sit and develop, it's probably
Speaker 1: this one still, yeah, because I mean, you still have
Speaker 1: starters available at every position, and honestly, how often do
Speaker 1: second round picks come in and beat the difference between
Speaker 1: you win. You're losing a division, right you know, Like
Speaker 1: it's just you have to frame it that way when
Speaker 1: you're talking about, you know, who's gonna especially in the
Speaker 1: second first round maybe a little different discussion, but second
Speaker 1: third round, it's a long term investment more so than
Speaker 1: who's gonna, you know, fill that need right away that
Speaker 1: we have Kelvin Joseph an example that we saw earlier
Speaker 1: in the show and what we've seen this past year.
Speaker 1: And then you ask the question of earlier how could
Speaker 1: the double dip happen. Maybe if you take a Tyler
Speaker 1: Linderbaum who falls to you at twenty four, if that's
Speaker 1: even possible, then you turn around you want to upgrade
Speaker 1: the guard spot as well and just completely redo your
Speaker 1: offensive line. That could be a way to do it.
Speaker 1: Sticking with offensive line, senior Bowl guy that I feel
Speaker 1: like we didn't give just attention to Bernard Ryman Sentman
Speaker 1: the Austrian. First of all, the story just an amazing backstory.
Speaker 1: He was a wide receiver, came over to the United States,
Speaker 1: moves a tight end, goes to Central Michigan tight end
Speaker 1: his first few years, and not only did he make
Speaker 1: the tight end to tackle transition, he did it in
Speaker 1: the midst of a pandemic. So it's just a really
Speaker 1: rare thing hin with him. Not the longest player, doesn't
Speaker 1: have the widest range, but he's doubt at the point
Speaker 1: of attack for a guy that has not been playing
Speaker 1: the position very long, he understands how to best use
Speaker 1: his body posture and the technique. And so yeah, Bernard Raymond,
Speaker 1: I think he's somewhere in that late first round and
Speaker 1: absolutely should be on the radar for the Cowboys at
Speaker 1: twenty four. See that's see twenty four. I that actually
Speaker 1: surprised me. I thought you would say something of fifty
Speaker 1: six to the third round. The fact that you said,
Speaker 1: I mean, really, I don't think he's is another one
Speaker 1: of those things of ceiling in terms of looking at
Speaker 1: guys in the way that they could based on their backstory,
Speaker 1: the way that they can improve because they're so raw
Speaker 1: at the position at the moment. Yes, but I really
Speaker 1: don't think that Raymond is is. I mean, he is raw,
Speaker 1: but not to the extent that I would it would
Speaker 1: hesitate me from throwing him out there from day one.
Speaker 1: I think he can handle it. I mean, I think
Speaker 1: because he is a little bit older guy, and I
Speaker 1: think he is one of the most genuine people I've
Speaker 1: ever talked with my life. Like he's just a really
Speaker 1: smart guy who understands where he needs to get better,
Speaker 1: what his strengths are. And I think that self evaluation
Speaker 1: at self awareness goes a long way with young players,
Speaker 1: and so I think he's going to be a really
Speaker 1: solid pro early in his career. I swear to God,
Speaker 1: the entire Georgia defense is going to get drafted. It's
Speaker 1: not that pretty close. It's that. But a guy that
Speaker 1: I don't think we've really talked about is uh the
Speaker 1: third of these Georgia linebackers. Kway Walker. In this instance, Oh,
Speaker 1: he might be the I think you should be the
Speaker 1: second drafted of these Georgia linebackers, behind the Kobe d
Speaker 1: in front of Channing Tindall. Uh quay Walker. He looks
Speaker 1: like a defensive I mean he's like sixty three and
Speaker 1: a half two fifty and I bet you runs in
Speaker 1: the mid four fives this week. He's gonna tear it up.
Speaker 1: One year starter. He's got that inside outside versatility, He's
Speaker 1: got the experience doing both. Outstanding athlete. There's a lot
Speaker 1: to like about kway Walker in the second round. I
Speaker 1: don't know that he makes it to the Cowboys second
Speaker 1: round pick, but if he does, if you're looking for
Speaker 1: a linebacker, kway Walker would be the dude. He's my
Speaker 1: third linebacker as well. I mean I have Dean, then Lloyd,
Speaker 1: there's a little bit of a gap there and then
Speaker 1: you've got kway Walker sitting there. I agree. I think
Speaker 1: he could bring that pass rusher mentality if if he
Speaker 1: is able to get there to fifty six. But I
Speaker 1: don't think that's gonna happen. I always I always geek
Speaker 1: out about like the thirty three to seventy five pick range,
Speaker 1: but because they're all great players, but they slipped especially No,
Speaker 1: it feels even, it feels even deeper this year. Absolutely, Uh,
Speaker 1: it's sixty players deeper. You're gonna be geeking wake wake
Speaker 1: me up when the first round's over, Like I'll figure that,
Speaker 1: Like that's fine. Just don't worry about thurday night. I'll
Speaker 1: show up Friday. You mentioned you mentioned him earlier in
Speaker 1: the show, but I'd like to talk a little bit
Speaker 1: more about Justin Ross because I do remember him looking
Speaker 1: like he was going to set the world that that
Speaker 1: that the playoffs with the year Slimson receiver for the
Speaker 1: year clumpson one national title, Thank Trevor Lawrences freshman year.
Speaker 1: Justin Ross, uh freshman receiver Notre Dame in Alabama. Those
Speaker 1: two games. He went over three hundred yards combined in
Speaker 1: those in those two games with a couple of just
Speaker 1: ridiculous highlight reel grabs. He just okay, pencilman the top
Speaker 1: ten a couple of years from now, but had the
Speaker 1: next surgery and then he missed this the he had
Speaker 1: season ending foot surgery this year. He was cleared to
Speaker 1: work out this week. So what type what type of
Speaker 1: athlete we're talking about post injuries? Post two pretty serious injuries, UM,
Speaker 1: and the medicals be obviously important for him. So justin
Speaker 1: Ross is kind of the I don't know quite what
Speaker 1: to do with him like that. That's the type of
Speaker 1: player that could have the most fluctuation based off the
Speaker 1: combine because you're getting them clinfoe and you're seeing just
Speaker 1: what type of athlete is he post injury? Uh So
Speaker 1: this this receiver position on day two, he could maybe
Speaker 1: make a jump if he you know, hits the boxes
Speaker 1: he needs to hit here in Indianapolis, where do you
Speaker 1: have him right now? He's like thirteen UM back end
Speaker 1: at my top one hundred, you know, just like behind
Speaker 1: guys like Pickens and David Bell, and so it's kind
Speaker 1: of like you just park them there and you kind
Speaker 1: of figure out as the process goes on to where
Speaker 1: you put him, because it's is a talented dude. He
Speaker 1: might have the biggest catch radius of any receiver in
Speaker 1: this draft. Uh. He's just really remarkable with the adjustment
Speaker 1: skills in his length. But again, coming back from those
Speaker 1: two major injuries and just not sure what type of
Speaker 1: what type of player he is. The combine will be
Speaker 1: big for him. Is there a chance that with him?
Speaker 1: Of course, with him being on the field, he's always
Speaker 1: played really well. I mean even this year, even with
Speaker 1: the injuries, he had forty six receptions five hundred fourteen
Speaker 1: yards town Yeah, like like quarterback situation really hurt him
Speaker 1: this yet clumps him, didn't help him out at all. Absolutely,
Speaker 1: if if everything checks out, everything looks good from the combine,
Speaker 1: is there a chance he skyrockets up to the top
Speaker 1: of back maybe top seven eight conversation In terms of receivers,
Speaker 1: I know there's probably six guys that you feel really
Speaker 1: good about right now. However, I mean seven and eight
Speaker 1: I feel like isn't out of the ordinary with a
Speaker 1: ross guy. I think, going back to what we talked
Speaker 1: about before, how there won't be a consensus. There will
Speaker 1: be teams that see the injury history and just say,
Speaker 1: you know, no thanks, But there will be some teams that,
Speaker 1: you know, if the medical info comes back, hey two
Speaker 1: thumbs up, we think you know, we shouldn't shouldn't affect
Speaker 1: him long term, then there will be some more teams
Speaker 1: that have a little more appetite for risk that say, okay,
Speaker 1: second round, we'll roll the dice on a high, high
Speaker 1: end talent like that with his upside. So I don't
Speaker 1: think there'd be a consensus, but yeah, would not shock
Speaker 1: me at all if we have see a team maybe
Speaker 1: draft him earlier than we think, if he's able to
Speaker 1: hit those marks this week in Indie, I would give
Speaker 1: anything to just see like ten different teams receiver boards.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, what the differences look like. Yeah, well, and
Speaker 1: we've remember too because there's different types of receivers, different positions,
Speaker 1: you know, X, y z H. Do you do different things?
Speaker 1: Team's value after the catch more soil than route. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's it's all over the place. So uh yeah, that's
Speaker 1: that's a great point. That is going to do it
Speaker 1: for one episode of the draft show amazing and we like,
Speaker 1: nothing's even happened yet, So if this is what we
Speaker 1: can do with nothing having happened, I'm excited for the
Speaker 1: rest of the week. Thrilled to be back with Dane Brugler.
Speaker 1: Thank y'all so much, great listening. We will be bill
Speaker 1: be back Wednesday and Thursday time TVD. Sorry about that.
Speaker 1: We're doing what we can, but we appreciate it. For
Speaker 1: Dan and Kyle, I'm Dave. We will see y'all next time.
Speaker 1: This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.