1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:05,320 Speaker 1: You're listening to Math and Magic, a production I heart Radio. 2 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:10,320 Speaker 1: I knew nothing about house music. I went to a 3 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:12,120 Speaker 1: friend here in New York. I said, if I really 4 00:00:12,119 --> 00:00:14,560 Speaker 1: want to learn about the history of dance music, who 5 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:17,280 Speaker 1: can I talk to? And he said, go meet Paul Lookingfold. 6 00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:19,560 Speaker 1: And then about five years ago, Paul was coming to 7 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:21,560 Speaker 1: New York to play at Marquis and he said to me, 8 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:23,880 Speaker 1: you know, I hear you're getting pretty good. Why don't 9 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:27,479 Speaker 1: you take an hour Marquis in front of me. I said, Paul, 10 00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:29,639 Speaker 1: I've never DJ in front of people. How can I 11 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:31,640 Speaker 1: possibly do that? And he said, just do it. You'll 12 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:33,800 Speaker 1: do fine. I was lost in the moment and it 13 00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 1: felt great. So I started knocking around New York and 14 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:38,239 Speaker 1: doing it. Nobody knew that I was doing it, and 15 00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 1: then a New York Times reporter heard about it wrote 16 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:44,080 Speaker 1: an article about it. Lloyd Blank, find former CEO and 17 00:00:44,200 --> 00:00:46,600 Speaker 1: my mentor, did something that I felt was very cool. 18 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,320 Speaker 1: The day that it came out, he tweeted out the 19 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 1: article and made a joke. He said, sometimes David just 20 00:00:52,320 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 1: has to let his hair down. I'm Bob Pittman, and 21 00:01:02,600 --> 00:01:05,720 Speaker 1: welcome to this episode of Math and Magic. Stories from 22 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:08,759 Speaker 1: the frontiers of marketing. On this episode, we're gonna push 23 00:01:08,800 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 1: the frontiers a bit to banking Wall Street and explore 24 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,360 Speaker 1: the relationship of math and magic there. Our guest today 25 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:18,440 Speaker 1: is a man of broad interest in skills. He is 26 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:21,880 Speaker 1: the fairly recently appointed chairman and CEO of Goldman Sacks, 27 00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:31,679 Speaker 1: and he is also desolved the d J. He has 28 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 1: already put his stamp on Goldman Sacks in the industry 29 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:36,199 Speaker 1: in a number of ways, but one of the most 30 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:39,679 Speaker 1: interesting and important is in diversity and inclusion. One stat 31 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:42,479 Speaker 1: correct me if I'm wrong here. Two thousand and nineteen 32 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 1: summer intern class was women not quite the stereotype we 33 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:51,279 Speaker 1: have a Wall Street. He also gasp relaxed the dress code, 34 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:55,560 Speaker 1: signaling a better understanding of the millennial workforce and clients. 35 00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:58,440 Speaker 1: It's been reported that his favorite Shakespeare quote is if 36 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 1: music be the food of love? Lay On seems to 37 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:03,640 Speaker 1: sum up much of his life. We're gonna jump into 38 00:02:03,680 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: all this, plus his early days career lessons he's learned, 39 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:09,400 Speaker 1: and also how Goldman Sacks is more than what you 40 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:12,119 Speaker 1: may think it is. It's also a major tech company. 41 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:15,520 Speaker 1: David Solomon, Welcome, thank you. Before he gets started, We're 42 00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:18,880 Speaker 1: gonna be you in sixty seconds. Okay, Ready. Do you 43 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 1: prefer vanilla or chocolate, vanilla, coffee or tea coffee? Facebook 44 00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 1: or Instagram? Instagram, skiing or yoga skiing? Red or white wine? Both? 45 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:34,839 Speaker 1: Sunrise or sunsets? Sunsets. I thought you were gonna say 46 00:02:34,840 --> 00:02:39,320 Speaker 1: both because you're working hours. Yankees are mets Yankees giants 47 00:02:39,360 --> 00:02:43,280 Speaker 1: or jets, Jets, boats or planes. I'd like to say both, 48 00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:46,560 Speaker 1: but I'll say boats. I live on planes, but I 49 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: really prefer both. Feeling. David Ghetta or a Vici aspen 50 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 1: or veil. It's about to get harder. Secret talent. Well, 51 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 1: a number of years ago, I would have said DJ 52 00:02:58,080 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 1: Now it's not a secret. Typical breakfast, yogurt, Berry's favorite city, 53 00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 1: New York, favorite wine, great bottle of red Burgundy from France. 54 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:09,680 Speaker 1: Career highlight. I think my career highlight had to be 55 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 1: when I moved from bear Stearns to Goldman Sax. I mean, 56 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: that's certainly set me up on an addressing course. It's 57 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:19,160 Speaker 1: sure to childhood hero. You know, I was a New 58 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:23,520 Speaker 1: York kid. Joe Namath, Broadway, Joe Broadway, Joe Mentor. There 59 00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:26,080 Speaker 1: was a man that at an early stage of my career. 60 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:28,080 Speaker 1: His name was Richie Metric. Good to give him a 61 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:30,840 Speaker 1: shout out best live concert. I'll always go back for 62 00:03:30,880 --> 00:03:34,560 Speaker 1: Bruce Springsteen show. Best thing about being you, I'm a 63 00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:36,280 Speaker 1: lucky guy, I mean the best thing about being me. 64 00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 1: I've got two beautiful daughters, so I love dearly. Who 65 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 1: would play you in a movie? Bruce Wallis, Oh, that's true. 66 00:03:42,240 --> 00:03:44,560 Speaker 1: What would the title of your memoir be? I'd like 67 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:46,480 Speaker 1: to say I did it my way? Great way to 68 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:48,720 Speaker 1: end it. Let's get into it here. You are CEO 69 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:52,120 Speaker 1: of Goldman Sachs. But you were a political science major, correct, 70 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 1: at a small liberal arts college, Hamilton's and rural New York. 71 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 1: Not exactly what you would think is the training ground 72 00:03:58,760 --> 00:04:02,000 Speaker 1: for Goldman Sachs. You know, you studied Shakespeare and even 73 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 1: spent a month in London studying Shakespeare. You've got no 74 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 1: n b A, that is correct. You've got no fancy 75 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 1: business school, that is correct. So what is generally that 76 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:12,720 Speaker 1: goes with not having an NBA? I mean, so, what 77 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:15,920 Speaker 1: is it about that kind of college education that prepared 78 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 1: you for this job in this career. I've thought about 79 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:20,479 Speaker 1: it a lot recently. Bob is that how did I 80 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:23,919 Speaker 1: wind up here? Finance and Wall Street has changed a 81 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 1: lot over the course of the thirty five plus years 82 00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 1: since I got out of college. I got of college 83 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 1: in and Wall Street was really just evolving, developing. The 84 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:37,840 Speaker 1: markets were very localized, and I really stumbled into finance 85 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 1: because I was coming to New York. All my college 86 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:42,839 Speaker 1: buddies were coming to New York and I was looking 87 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:45,039 Speaker 1: for a job. There wasn't a preset plan. And one 88 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,200 Speaker 1: of the things that observed that is different today young 89 00:04:48,279 --> 00:04:50,840 Speaker 1: people while they're studying in college, there is so programmed 90 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 1: to think they have to have an answer, they have 91 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:55,320 Speaker 1: to have a plan. I worked at a summer camp 92 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:59,400 Speaker 1: all through my college years. Finance, like any other business, 93 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:02,280 Speaker 1: is about how people interact with people. To be successful 94 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 1: in finance, you can do it by being a mathematician 95 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:10,359 Speaker 1: and being very quantitative and being very analytical. But you 96 00:05:10,400 --> 00:05:12,919 Speaker 1: can also do it by being very good and connecting 97 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,919 Speaker 1: with people and giving advice and consulting and counseling. I 98 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 1: felt more into the latter category than the former. Do 99 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:20,800 Speaker 1: you think there's something in your college education that you 100 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:23,599 Speaker 1: got out of being in this small college in this 101 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:28,279 Speaker 1: rural setting that gave you some insight which is propelled 102 00:05:28,320 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 1: you in ways you might not have had. I think 103 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: the education I got at Hamilton's was extraordinary. And if 104 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:37,599 Speaker 1: I were to talk about two really base principles in 105 00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:40,000 Speaker 1: Hamilton's college education that I think helped me and really 106 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:44,839 Speaker 1: made a difference, it's communication skills. It's public speaking and 107 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 1: written communication or all in written communication. And really at Hamilton's, 108 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:51,600 Speaker 1: even to this day, there are almost no requirements in 109 00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:53,560 Speaker 1: terms of what you take other than you take public 110 00:05:53,560 --> 00:05:57,359 Speaker 1: speaking and you take a freshman English writing class. And 111 00:05:57,440 --> 00:05:58,800 Speaker 1: I think when you get out into the world, the 112 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 1: ability to communicate is super important. Do you find in 113 00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:04,880 Speaker 1: people coming out of school that they are lacking that 114 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:09,440 Speaker 1: ability to communicate through writing? I think unfortunately, one of 115 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 1: the things technology has done is it's changed to a 116 00:06:12,960 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 1: great degree the way young people as they're educated, even 117 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:19,480 Speaker 1: if the highest standards of education are writing. I think 118 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:21,599 Speaker 1: that's unfortunate and I think it's a lost skill, and 119 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:25,719 Speaker 1: I think it will impact our society in interesting ways 120 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:27,839 Speaker 1: over time. I like to say that text is the 121 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:30,919 Speaker 1: lowest form of human communication. That doesn't mean it's not 122 00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 1: effective for certain things, but there's no context, there's no nuance. 123 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 1: There's no substance around it. It's not going away. But 124 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:39,600 Speaker 1: I think there's something that's getting lost. So let's go 125 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: back a little farther to get some more insights. You 126 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:44,000 Speaker 1: grew up north of New York City, New York Suburbs. 127 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:46,080 Speaker 1: What did your mom and dad do for work? My 128 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,360 Speaker 1: mom was an audiologist. My mom actually would have been 129 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 1: a doctor if she could have had her way, but 130 00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:54,400 Speaker 1: she graduated from Cornell in nineteen sixty and you know, 131 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 1: at that point in time, there weren't a lot of 132 00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 1: women that were heading to medical school, so she ultimately 133 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: studied audiology. She had an audiology practice up in Westchester 134 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:05,360 Speaker 1: at the Burke Real Rotation Hospital, built a private practice 135 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:07,280 Speaker 1: and had a nice business. And that that was the 136 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:09,560 Speaker 1: oldest of three. As my youngest brother got more into 137 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:12,280 Speaker 1: his school years, my mother devoted more time to that. 138 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:15,440 Speaker 1: My father, for a significant part of his career owned 139 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:18,160 Speaker 1: a printing business, a small financial printing business in the 140 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:21,040 Speaker 1: city with a partner. They were very smart and that 141 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:23,600 Speaker 1: they sold at it exactly the right time, probably around 142 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:27,040 Speaker 1: two thousand just is that whole business really went away. 143 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:29,680 Speaker 1: So did your mother ever warned you about listening to 144 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 1: the music too loudly. She absolutely did. In fact, I 145 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 1: do when I go into clubs now or on plane, 146 00:07:35,520 --> 00:07:38,400 Speaker 1: I do have high quality ear plugs. You're graduating class 147 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 1: in high school, I believe was about students. You've done 148 00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:44,080 Speaker 1: a lot of research, Bob, and I am very very impressed. 149 00:07:44,160 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 1: And you had a job, as you say, as account counselor. 150 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:48,480 Speaker 1: I think you were scooping ice cream too, was one 151 00:07:48,520 --> 00:07:50,600 Speaker 1: of your jobs. That was actually my first real job, 152 00:07:50,640 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 1: as I worked at the Basket Robbins in Hartsdale, New York. 153 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 1: And your high school quotes were very earthy, Emmerson. The 154 00:07:57,640 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: success of a job well done is to have done it. 155 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 1: The row what a man thinks of himself, that is 156 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: what determines or rather indicates his life. You'd call those earthy. 157 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 1: To those are earthy. I think it's sort of really 158 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 1: in touch with yourself. Is that always been a hallmark 159 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: of yours? Or is that because you were in this environment? 160 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:19,840 Speaker 1: What do you think? My parents definitely encouraged us to 161 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 1: pursue passions, to have self confidence, and to be willing 162 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:27,040 Speaker 1: to fail. And you know, when you do fail, which invariably, 163 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:31,120 Speaker 1: you will pick yourself up, dust yourself off. I would say. 164 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:35,160 Speaker 1: There was some sense of trying to think big picture 165 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:37,839 Speaker 1: as to what really matters to me. I want to try, 166 00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:39,680 Speaker 1: I want to do my best. I want to feel 167 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:43,040 Speaker 1: good about myself. You know. It seemed more relevant than 168 00:08:43,520 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 1: something like we are the Champions from Queen, which sat 169 00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:48,760 Speaker 1: in a lot of those yearbook quotes at that point 170 00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 1: in time. So you then, looking at you, now, what 171 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:56,040 Speaker 1: do you think you them would say, I just can't 172 00:08:56,040 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 1: imagine that at eighteen years old, I could have seen 173 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:05,559 Speaker 1: myself having gone to finance, to Wall Street, having worked 174 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:09,640 Speaker 1: there pretty much continuously for thirty five years without interruption, 175 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 1: and winding up in this seat. I think myself then 176 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 1: would say, Wow, how did that happen? I was a 177 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 1: good student. I wasn't a great student. I played sports, 178 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:20,480 Speaker 1: I was involved in student government, you know, I was 179 00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:23,160 Speaker 1: involved in the musical production. You know, at school. I 180 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:25,200 Speaker 1: was very active in school. I loved my community, had 181 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:27,760 Speaker 1: a great, great high school experience. This is definitely a 182 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 1: different outcome than I think eighteen year old David would 183 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 1: have imagined. Math and Magic is about marketing, and one 184 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 1: of the key pieces of marketing is brand. Maybe the 185 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 1: most important piece you've got one of the if not 186 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:42,920 Speaker 1: the best brand Home Wall Street. How do you describe 187 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: that brand? What is Goldman Sachs. Goldman Sachs has always 188 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 1: been an institutional firm. This year we're celebrating a hundred 189 00:09:49,400 --> 00:09:51,599 Speaker 1: and fifty years, which is really extraordinary. There are a 190 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:53,959 Speaker 1: lot of companies that make it through that time period. 191 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 1: For the vast majority of our time we served governments, corporations, 192 00:09:57,240 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 1: and institutions. It's been an institutional firm and for those clients. 193 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:06,319 Speaker 1: I think our brand as symbolized excellence, really high quality 194 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:09,840 Speaker 1: people that are able to give advice at the highest level. 195 00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:14,720 Speaker 1: It's symbolized a collaborative environment, a team orientation which helps 196 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 1: people solve their problems, and that's been very very effective 197 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,120 Speaker 1: for us. I think the interesting thing for us now 198 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:24,440 Speaker 1: is that we're starting to build consumer brands. That's a 199 00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:28,560 Speaker 1: very very different thing. And so as I think about 200 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:32,839 Speaker 1: Goldman Sachs as a consumer company or a company that's 201 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:35,800 Speaker 1: serving consumers with a variety of products, I want to 202 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 1: think about human interaction first. I want us to be 203 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:41,679 Speaker 1: a financial services with the quality of the human interaction 204 00:10:41,800 --> 00:10:44,160 Speaker 1: is real, it's personal, and it matters. Even though it's 205 00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:47,080 Speaker 1: going to be enhanced by technology and a digital age. 206 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:51,560 Speaker 1: I want people to feel that the experience has the 207 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:54,200 Speaker 1: same level of excellence and everything we do that people 208 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:57,600 Speaker 1: might see if they were dealing with us institutionally. And last, 209 00:10:57,800 --> 00:11:00,400 Speaker 1: the things we're trying to build around a brand, we 210 00:11:00,440 --> 00:11:03,000 Speaker 1: want them to be centered around our clients, around the individuals. 211 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 1: So the experience that you'll get will be one that's 212 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:07,079 Speaker 1: really centered around you. And so we're trying to think 213 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 1: about that. Is we're building these digitally enhanced businesses and 214 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 1: trying to move into competing in these consumer businesses, but 215 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:16,200 Speaker 1: it's forcing us to wrestle a little with how do 216 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 1: we want to define our brand, because certainly you define 217 00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:22,000 Speaker 1: a consumer brand differently than you define an institutional brand, 218 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:23,720 Speaker 1: and that's that's new for us, and so we're thinking 219 00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: about that. Who is the steward of the brand? The 220 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 1: thirty eight thousand employees of Goldman Sachs. One of the 221 00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:32,200 Speaker 1: things that I feel so incredibly lucky is that I 222 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:34,440 Speaker 1: work with thirty eight thousand people around the world who 223 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:37,920 Speaker 1: are really extraordinary. It's an extraordinary organization with extraordinary people, 224 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:41,239 Speaker 1: and every single one of those people is an ambassador 225 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:44,680 Speaker 1: of our brand, of our values, of what we strive 226 00:11:44,760 --> 00:11:47,679 Speaker 1: for With any business, you can have thirty eight thousand 227 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:50,440 Speaker 1: people rowing the boat and the same direction. But if 228 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:52,840 Speaker 1: you have one person who kind of stands up and 229 00:11:52,880 --> 00:11:55,840 Speaker 1: does something that's not appropriate, doesn't match with our values, 230 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 1: you know what really attacks the brand. And so I 231 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 1: want to applaud you know, all the who work an 232 00:12:00,559 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 1: organization that really steward the brand, and I want us 233 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:06,199 Speaker 1: all to be zealous to protect it. As we examine 234 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:09,120 Speaker 1: these case studies, one of the things that jumps out 235 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:12,520 Speaker 1: is that the culture so influences the brand. Going to 236 00:12:12,559 --> 00:12:14,520 Speaker 1: your point about everybody's rolling in the same direction. If 237 00:12:14,520 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 1: you've got the culture going the right way, that brand 238 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:19,599 Speaker 1: naturally moves the right direction. What do you do to 239 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: build the culture that perpetuates that brand. Culture is built 240 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:26,120 Speaker 1: over time, And it's one of the things that I 241 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: spent a lot of time thinking about because we have 242 00:12:28,640 --> 00:12:31,760 Speaker 1: some very very large companies that have been around for 243 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: twenty years or less, and no matter how you think 244 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 1: about that, the culture of those companies can't be that 245 00:12:39,320 --> 00:12:42,600 Speaker 1: rooted in foundation because it's really new, it's developing. I 246 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:44,559 Speaker 1: think culture has to start with the leadership, and the 247 00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:47,080 Speaker 1: leadership can't just espouse that they have to live it. 248 00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:50,520 Speaker 1: I think you have to decide what you stand for, 249 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 1: and there are times when you've got to stand up 250 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:56,480 Speaker 1: for those things and make choices that are more investing 251 00:12:56,520 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: in the long term foundation of the organization than the 252 00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:02,480 Speaker 1: short term offit of the organization. We think a lot 253 00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:06,720 Speaker 1: about teamwork and collaboration. We think a lot about excellence, 254 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 1: We think a lot about creativity and innovation, and we 255 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:13,480 Speaker 1: think a lot about diversity and inclusion. Those things create 256 00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:15,559 Speaker 1: an environment that people want to be a part of. 257 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 1: Culture is the operating system. Absolutely, If you don't get 258 00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:20,720 Speaker 1: that right, none of the programs work very well on 259 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:23,520 Speaker 1: a corrupted operating system. It's a great way to look 260 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:25,680 Speaker 1: at it. And you always are going to be challenged 261 00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:28,080 Speaker 1: and tested because these are big organizations and there are 262 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:30,280 Speaker 1: a lot of people and things go wrong. That's part 263 00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:35,959 Speaker 1: of running big, complicated businesses. But the culture gets stronger 264 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:39,559 Speaker 1: by how you respond when things go wrong and how 265 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 1: you endorse what you think is right or wrong for 266 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: the organization over a longer period of time. And what 267 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 1: do you think are threats to the brand? Do you 268 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:49,200 Speaker 1: see any on the horizon or do you see them 269 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:51,520 Speaker 1: in the day to day operation of the company. Well. 270 00:13:51,520 --> 00:13:54,360 Speaker 1: I think that if we if we serve our clients well, 271 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:56,840 Speaker 1: if we serve our clients and now our customers well 272 00:13:57,320 --> 00:14:00,120 Speaker 1: with a medium or long term view, if we do 273 00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:03,680 Speaker 1: the right thing for the long term, we'll do just fine. 274 00:14:03,679 --> 00:14:07,920 Speaker 1: As an organization, our brand is very susceptible because the 275 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:12,320 Speaker 1: visibility of the company. Any mistakes that we make get amplified. 276 00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:15,360 Speaker 1: Those things hurt our brand and they can nag at 277 00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:17,720 Speaker 1: the organization a little bit. I worry about that. You know, 278 00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 1: every single day you've been very good, and I think 279 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:23,320 Speaker 1: the company has about responding to those very quickly. Do 280 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 1: you have a system of doing it? Do you have 281 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:27,640 Speaker 1: a this is the way we're going to handle it. 282 00:14:27,640 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 1: When something goes wrong, we're gonna what we're talking about. 283 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:32,880 Speaker 1: Some of this stuff that I think really is about 284 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:36,000 Speaker 1: how the leadership at the top of the organization responds. 285 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:39,600 Speaker 1: And I'll start by saying I'm a relatively new leader. 286 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:41,520 Speaker 1: It's been less than a year in the seat, but 287 00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:45,000 Speaker 1: I'm a big believer in when there are issues, transparency, 288 00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 1: clear message, accountability. Let me go on a tangent for 289 00:14:48,720 --> 00:14:52,520 Speaker 1: a second. You said Golden Sax has about forty employees. 290 00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 1: I think about eleven thousand of those or engineers or 291 00:14:55,760 --> 00:14:59,400 Speaker 1: tech people. That's about a quarter of your employees are tech. 292 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:01,120 Speaker 1: And I don't think a lot of people think of 293 00:15:01,160 --> 00:15:03,720 Speaker 1: Goldman Saxes tech company. You clearly are when you invest 294 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: that much. Why is technology so key to what you do? Well, 295 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:09,680 Speaker 1: let's just step back at a high level. Can you 296 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:15,280 Speaker 1: name a company today does not use technology and a 297 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:20,480 Speaker 1: significant way two connect with our customers of their clients 298 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:25,240 Speaker 1: to deliver their products or services, to enhance the capabilities 299 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 1: of their talent and their human capital to serve you know, 300 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:31,960 Speaker 1: in their business. Every single company in the world is 301 00:15:32,040 --> 00:15:35,360 Speaker 1: using software and platforms to make them more efficient or 302 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:37,880 Speaker 1: better do or deliver what they're doing. Look at your 303 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:41,520 Speaker 1: business and so in the context of that, of course 304 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 1: we're a technology company, but we're not really a technology 305 00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 1: company or a company that's providing products and services to people, 306 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:52,120 Speaker 1: mostly financial products and financial services, and we use technology 307 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:54,760 Speaker 1: to enhance our ability to deliver that in the most 308 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:58,440 Speaker 1: effective way possible. Think about the trading businesses. These were 309 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:01,440 Speaker 1: businesses if you go back thirty years ago and you 310 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:04,320 Speaker 1: wanted to trade all different kinds of securities, it was 311 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:08,360 Speaker 1: person to person, mostly over the counter, today, a lot 312 00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 1: more of that is done through platforms, and we connect 313 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:15,360 Speaker 1: through pipes that run between clients directly to us. And 314 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 1: so having the best technology that allows the greatest efficiency 315 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: and speed with the least friction is important in this 316 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:25,640 Speaker 1: business as it isn't any other. So technology for your 317 00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 1: business like ours, is an enabler. It's an enabler. It's 318 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 1: a necessity that you use it to enable or your 319 00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:36,480 Speaker 1: you can't compete having that many tech people, though in 320 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:40,080 Speaker 1: this company that was once bankers and traders, etcetera. How 321 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 1: does that influence the culture? It's evolving? And I when 322 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 1: you highlighted that we formally change the dress code, you know, 323 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:50,520 Speaker 1: you talked about it as a reaction to millennials. It 324 00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:53,280 Speaker 1: also was a reaction to the fact that of our 325 00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:56,200 Speaker 1: organization was engineers. And so one of the things I 326 00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 1: did when I walked in at the beginning of my 327 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:00,680 Speaker 1: tenure is CEO, you've been an are building. There's a 328 00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:02,960 Speaker 1: sky lobby. You go up eleven floors. It's where the 329 00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:05,840 Speaker 1: organization gathers. There are hundreds of people milling around in 330 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:08,400 Speaker 1: a given day. There's a Starbucks and the sky lobby, 331 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:11,040 Speaker 1: And I kind of walked in and looked around, and 332 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:14,040 Speaker 1: everybody was dressed casually, and of course I was in 333 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:16,760 Speaker 1: my suit and everybody was dressed casually, and I kind 334 00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 1: of looked around. I said, Okay, I wonder do we 335 00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:21,400 Speaker 1: actually have a dress code? What does that dress code 336 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 1: look like? Has anybody looked at it in a number 337 00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 1: of years? So I promptly marched upstairs to my office 338 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:28,960 Speaker 1: and said, can somebody get me the dress code? And 339 00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:34,720 Speaker 1: the thirty five page document arrives. That had was every 340 00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:37,480 Speaker 1: department and every division had a different dress code, and 341 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:41,639 Speaker 1: it was literally, I'm not exaggerating, thirty five pages. And 342 00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:43,159 Speaker 1: I looked at this and I said, you know what, 343 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 1: it's time to modernize. And we put out a very 344 00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:49,359 Speaker 1: simple note saying, dress in a way that's appropriate for 345 00:17:49,400 --> 00:17:51,359 Speaker 1: your day, for the clients you're seeing or the people 346 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:54,199 Speaker 1: you're interacting with, dress in a way that's appropriate. We 347 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:57,000 Speaker 1: were in an organization that's filled with adults. People know 348 00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: it's appropriate and what's not. If people see something that's inappropriate, 349 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:02,919 Speaker 1: they're gonna say something. And it was really endorsing what 350 00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:06,920 Speaker 1: had already happened, but the organization had moved there because 351 00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 1: of the diversity of our organization. And this was an 352 00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:13,199 Speaker 1: endorsement or an acknowledgement of that. In the context of 353 00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:15,000 Speaker 1: the decisions I've had to make in the last year, 354 00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:18,359 Speaker 1: this was one of the easy ones. You hire about 355 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:21,960 Speaker 1: people out of school each year. I think it's got 356 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:23,919 Speaker 1: to be tough to keep it up to be the 357 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:26,080 Speaker 1: first choice of people who want to come to you. 358 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:30,520 Speaker 1: How does this cultural stuff you're talking about effect that 359 00:18:30,840 --> 00:18:34,639 Speaker 1: when they look at Goldman Sachs. We're very fortunate that 360 00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:36,879 Speaker 1: we've managed, over a long period of time, with a 361 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:40,639 Speaker 1: lot of investment, to be a very desirable place for 362 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 1: people to come to work out of college. We get 363 00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:46,479 Speaker 1: tens and tens of thousands of applications for those jobs, 364 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 1: and actually the number of applications has been increasing. I 365 00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:53,120 Speaker 1: think the firm, through its training programs, through its brand, 366 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:56,080 Speaker 1: through the experience that people have at the organization, and 367 00:18:56,200 --> 00:19:00,080 Speaker 1: also the experiences people have when they leave, you know, 368 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 1: is very well positioned as a great place to start 369 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:04,760 Speaker 1: to build a career. And there are people to come 370 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:06,840 Speaker 1: and they stay for twenty five years, and there are 371 00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 1: people to come and they spend a couple of years, 372 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:10,760 Speaker 1: and they learn, and they meet people, and they start 373 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 1: to create a network and then they're exposed to other 374 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:14,480 Speaker 1: things and they decide, I want to go do something 375 00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:18,320 Speaker 1: completely different. It's a good ecosystem, and so we work 376 00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 1: really really hard to try to maintain that. Just hold 377 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:25,639 Speaker 1: on a second, because we've got so much more to 378 00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:32,360 Speaker 1: talk about. We'll be back after a quick break. Welcome 379 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:35,400 Speaker 1: back to Math and Magic. We're here with David Solomon. 380 00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:39,280 Speaker 1: We have folks who do great research here. And as 381 00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:43,159 Speaker 1: I was digging through the reams of information which was 382 00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:46,080 Speaker 1: compiled here, a couple of things jumped out at me. 383 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:52,159 Speaker 1: Your work force is millennials or under the age of thirty. 384 00:19:52,480 --> 00:19:55,800 Speaker 1: That's correct. That's not the image of Goldman sax and 385 00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 1: the culture you're talking about clearly sounds like it's reflective 386 00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:03,560 Speaker 1: of that. You've made some big workplace changes to prevent burnout, 387 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:06,680 Speaker 1: to improve the work experience, something like also being responsive 388 00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 1: to this new generation. You can talk a little bit 389 00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:10,440 Speaker 1: about that, besides the dress code and some of the 390 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 1: other stuff we've covered. Sure, and you're comment it's very interesting, 391 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 1: it's not the image of golden sex. One of the 392 00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:17,840 Speaker 1: things I'm wrestling with is golden sex is a private 393 00:20:17,880 --> 00:20:20,920 Speaker 1: partnership for a hundred and thirty years and it became 394 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 1: a public company twenty years ago, you know, became a 395 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:27,320 Speaker 1: public company to time where finance was growing wildly. So really, 396 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:29,400 Speaker 1: for the first hundred and forty years of Golden Sex, 397 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:32,280 Speaker 1: Golden Sex did talk about itself and didn't advertise it 398 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:35,919 Speaker 1: in a very private place. You wake up today Goldman 399 00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:40,760 Speaker 1: Sachs is a fortune fifty company, and we need to 400 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:43,240 Speaker 1: communicate a little bit more about who we are. We're 401 00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:45,680 Speaker 1: a young organization for exactly what I said, it's an 402 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:48,720 Speaker 1: experience based business, but we start by hiring a lot 403 00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:52,280 Speaker 1: of people at a young age. It's definitely a young organization. 404 00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:56,320 Speaker 1: The way we work is changing. And because the way 405 00:20:56,359 --> 00:20:58,840 Speaker 1: we work is changing, some of the old ways that 406 00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:02,400 Speaker 1: people did things, you know, needed to change. And so 407 00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:06,400 Speaker 1: it is an apprenticeship business, and at times an apprenticeship 408 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:08,720 Speaker 1: businesses is a little bit of I did it this way, 409 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:10,520 Speaker 1: I was trained this way, so you're going to live 410 00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:13,000 Speaker 1: through the same thing. We wanted to try to break 411 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:14,200 Speaker 1: that up. And the way I think about it is 412 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:16,320 Speaker 1: very simple. When I was young and I was working 413 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:18,760 Speaker 1: in the business, I worked very very hard. There were 414 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:20,479 Speaker 1: nights where I worked all night and I worked very 415 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 1: very hard. But one thing was clear when I walked 416 00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 1: out of the office. No matter what time I walked 417 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:28,680 Speaker 1: out of the office, I was out, I was gone, 418 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:31,679 Speaker 1: and I was disconnected. The only way you could reach me, 419 00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 1: and this was was to call my home number. If 420 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:39,959 Speaker 1: I wasn't there, an answering machine picked up. If I 421 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:42,719 Speaker 1: was there, often an answering machine picked up because I 422 00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:45,359 Speaker 1: was screening the calls. So you were really unreachable. There 423 00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:48,879 Speaker 1: were boundaries, and people could not get in touch with you, 424 00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:51,720 Speaker 1: and it wasn't unusual that people if something came up, 425 00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:54,880 Speaker 1: they couldn't get to you to the next day. And 426 00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:59,240 Speaker 1: so you look at the world today, we're all connected instantly. 427 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:01,280 Speaker 1: For someone who young and is coming out of school 428 00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:03,439 Speaker 1: and they're just making the transition to going into a 429 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 1: professional work environment and you're in a client business where 430 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:08,919 Speaker 1: stuff is coming at you at all time, we just 431 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:11,800 Speaker 1: decided we had to set up boundaries. Nothing comes without 432 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:13,480 Speaker 1: hard work, and you need to work hard and you 433 00:22:13,520 --> 00:22:16,919 Speaker 1: need to be committed, but it can't There have to 434 00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 1: be boundaries. We started by saying, what is a lot 435 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:23,359 Speaker 1: of work but not crazy, And we came to the 436 00:22:23,359 --> 00:22:25,440 Speaker 1: conclusion for a young person coming out of school going 437 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:29,160 Speaker 1: into finance that seventy hours a week was a good base. 438 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:31,680 Speaker 1: When you got above that, it was just too much 439 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:35,480 Speaker 1: quality and equality went down. So the first thing we 440 00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:37,879 Speaker 1: did is we decided we're going to track how people 441 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,080 Speaker 1: were working. People going in out of the building. You 442 00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:42,359 Speaker 1: can get a rough idea of when people are in 443 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:44,080 Speaker 1: the building. You know. What we saw was there was 444 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,160 Speaker 1: a giant bell curve. The myth was everybody was out 445 00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:50,119 Speaker 1: on one end working a hundred hours a week. The 446 00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:53,240 Speaker 1: reality was the bell curve was generally where you wanted 447 00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:55,399 Speaker 1: it to be, sixty to seventy hours a week, but 448 00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:59,280 Speaker 1: there were outliers on both sides. We started managing the 449 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:02,640 Speaker 1: outliers directly because we have the data. And the other 450 00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 1: thing we did we said, let's set up some boundaries. 451 00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 1: If people are gonna work this way, there's plenty of 452 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 1: time to get the work done. Let's close the shop 453 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:11,480 Speaker 1: from nine o'clock on Friday night at nine o'clock on 454 00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:13,679 Speaker 1: Sunday morning, We're just going to close the shop. You 455 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:15,879 Speaker 1: have your Friday night, your Saturday night, and you have 456 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: your Saturday and you can make plans with a girlfriend 457 00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:22,440 Speaker 1: or a boyfriend, with your family. It changes your mindset 458 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:25,480 Speaker 1: and so when we put it forward, people are yelling 459 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:28,000 Speaker 1: and screaming, this could never work, this is crazy. It 460 00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:31,679 Speaker 1: hasn't been perfect, but it's set boundaries and it's helped. 461 00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:33,639 Speaker 1: And the feedback I get from young people in the 462 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:37,520 Speaker 1: organization is it's made a difference. You talked about diversity 463 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:39,719 Speaker 1: and inclusion. I know you. I know this has been 464 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:42,080 Speaker 1: very important to you. You mentioned up front and we 465 00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:45,960 Speaker 1: talked about the Summer interns. Of summer interns were women. 466 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:48,640 Speaker 1: One of your first moves of CEO that was very interesting. 467 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 1: You added four new members to the Executive Management Committee, 468 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,760 Speaker 1: three of whom were women. Impressive actions. What is your plan? 469 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:56,840 Speaker 1: I mean, that's clearly part of an overall plan. How 470 00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: are you thinking about it? You know, Diversity and inclusion 471 00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:02,560 Speaker 1: I just think is something that any world class organization 472 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:05,480 Speaker 1: has to make a priority. When I look at our 473 00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 1: industry and our organizations, we've probably made more progress than 474 00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:12,920 Speaker 1: certain other industries because we've been at it for a 475 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:14,760 Speaker 1: period of time, but it's not been enough, and it 476 00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:16,920 Speaker 1: hasn't gone fast enough, and it hasn't gone far enough. 477 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:20,080 Speaker 1: It's got to start from leadership at the top. We 478 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:23,439 Speaker 1: try to solve some of these problems around recruiting by saying, 479 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,000 Speaker 1: if you're recruiting out of school schools are diverse, you're 480 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:30,280 Speaker 1: really recruiting out of diverse population. It is unacceptable to 481 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:35,960 Speaker 1: recruit out of undergraduate school and not have a diverse outcome. 482 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 1: And we've got different results. You know, an example that 483 00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:41,360 Speaker 1: very specifically was the investment banking division, and they get 484 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:43,680 Speaker 1: tens of thousands of applications, but let's say at the 485 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:46,880 Speaker 1: end of the day we're talking about gender diversity. They 486 00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:51,200 Speaker 1: get twelve thousand super qualified applications, eight thousand or men, 487 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 1: four thousands or women. That division is hiring three d 488 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:57,320 Speaker 1: and fifty people. Well, let's get the hundred and seventy 489 00:24:57,359 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 1: five best women out of the four thousand women, and 490 00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 1: let's go the hundred and seventy five best men. And 491 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:04,000 Speaker 1: if you change the mindset to that, you've got a 492 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:06,160 Speaker 1: great result. You've got a more diverse population, and then 493 00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:10,440 Speaker 1: over time things improved. From a senior perspective, you've got 494 00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:13,359 Speaker 1: to take actions that the organization sees and reflects. So 495 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:17,440 Speaker 1: I didn't feel our management committee had enough diversity on it, 496 00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:19,760 Speaker 1: and so I said, you know what, I'm going to 497 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:22,560 Speaker 1: look through a different lens who are the three or 498 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:26,639 Speaker 1: four most important women at the firm that are big jobs, 499 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:28,919 Speaker 1: having a huge impact with our clients, with our business, 500 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:31,280 Speaker 1: that aren't on the management committee because they're just not 501 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:33,720 Speaker 1: one of these jobs that have traditionally been the jobs 502 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:35,760 Speaker 1: we put on the management committee. And I said, you 503 00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:37,760 Speaker 1: know what, We're going to change the mix. We're gonna 504 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:40,160 Speaker 1: send a message that says we want to move faster 505 00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:42,360 Speaker 1: on this and we care. And so we made those decisions. 506 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:45,400 Speaker 1: I made some personnel decisions. I took a woman named 507 00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:49,000 Speaker 1: Beth Hammock who was a trader in our securities division. 508 00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 1: I said, you know what should be a great treasurer 509 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:52,960 Speaker 1: of the firm, and that can set her up for 510 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,040 Speaker 1: bigger jobs, And we plucked her out of a trading 511 00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:58,840 Speaker 1: seat and made her treasurer of the firm. It's elevated 512 00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,560 Speaker 1: her organization. You where she now can be seen by 513 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:05,639 Speaker 1: the organization more broadly and differently. Stephanie Cohne, as a 514 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:07,879 Speaker 1: woman who came out of investment banking, now our head 515 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:11,240 Speaker 1: of strategy. And so I've tried to find places where 516 00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:14,439 Speaker 1: I can try to accelerate. Some people make some very 517 00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,040 Speaker 1: conscious choices. Look, it's not perfect and I'm sure I 518 00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:18,720 Speaker 1: haven't made all the right ones, but I'm trying to 519 00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 1: send a message that this matters to me, that matters 520 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 1: to the senior leadership of the organization. And we're gonna 521 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:27,800 Speaker 1: make progress with ginger, We're gonna make progress with people 522 00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:30,600 Speaker 1: of color. We're gonna make progress with respect to the 523 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:34,359 Speaker 1: openness and the inclusion of the organization broadly for everyone, 524 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 1: because I think it's a stronger organization. Our clients want it, 525 00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:39,639 Speaker 1: we want it. Let's turn to the other side of you, 526 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:45,840 Speaker 1: DJ Saul club DJ if I'm sorry, and you've played 527 00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,560 Speaker 1: with some of the great DJs at top venues around 528 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 1: the world. In addition to DJ sets and remixes, you've 529 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:54,440 Speaker 1: produced one original song which hit number four in the 530 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:58,040 Speaker 1: Billboard Dance Charts. It's sort of impressive. How did you 531 00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:02,000 Speaker 1: go down this path? How? And when? The big picture 532 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:05,440 Speaker 1: story is, I've always loved music, you know. As music digitized, 533 00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 1: you know, I got more interested in curating music. I 534 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:11,679 Speaker 1: spent a lot of time in my banking career in 535 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:15,480 Speaker 1: and around Las Vegas. I was very involved in financing 536 00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:19,400 Speaker 1: the development of a lot of the big buildings entrepreneurs 537 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:22,440 Speaker 1: that were out there about eight to ten years ago, 538 00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:24,960 Speaker 1: was around the time that the Encore was opening. I 539 00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:28,520 Speaker 1: was in a meeting where I heard that Tryst, which 540 00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:30,879 Speaker 1: was the club at the Win at the time, was 541 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:34,520 Speaker 1: going to make a monstrous amount of money in a 542 00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:37,400 Speaker 1: given year. And I started asking questions, how is that possible? 543 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:39,639 Speaker 1: What is going on that a nightclub could make that 544 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:43,320 Speaker 1: kind of money playing recorded music. I was told, well, 545 00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,080 Speaker 1: you know, we're paying the DJs hundreds of thousands of 546 00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:48,880 Speaker 1: dollars a night, and here's the economics. And I looked 547 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:50,560 Speaker 1: at this and I was like, wow, what's going on. 548 00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:54,040 Speaker 1: So I knew nothing about house music or electronic dance music. 549 00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:56,720 Speaker 1: You know, at that point, this is when that genre 550 00:27:56,880 --> 00:27:59,360 Speaker 1: was really, you know, starting to expand, it was emerging, 551 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:01,600 Speaker 1: and I broader way, and so I was out there 552 00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:03,600 Speaker 1: handful times that I went into some of these clubs 553 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,120 Speaker 1: to try to understand the business model. But I love 554 00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:08,520 Speaker 1: the music. I mean I just realized, oh wow, I 555 00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:10,199 Speaker 1: like this music. I have to add this, and so 556 00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:13,159 Speaker 1: I started looking at it, exploring it. I went to 557 00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:15,320 Speaker 1: a friend here in New York that knows something about 558 00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:16,960 Speaker 1: the music business. I said, if I really want to 559 00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:19,480 Speaker 1: learn about the history of house music and dance music. 560 00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:22,600 Speaker 1: Who can I talk to? How can I learn? And 561 00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:25,359 Speaker 1: he said, go meet Paul Lookingfold. I was out in 562 00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,280 Speaker 1: Los Angeles, and you know, I sat down with Paul, 563 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:30,439 Speaker 1: and Paul's really one of the grandfathers of all this, 564 00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:32,120 Speaker 1: you know, going back thirty years ago to a music 565 00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:34,760 Speaker 1: et cetera. You know, he's roughly my age, and we 566 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:36,120 Speaker 1: just kind of hit it off. We had a great 567 00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:38,400 Speaker 1: conversation and he was like, well, if you like this, 568 00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:40,520 Speaker 1: I'll send you some music and you should play around. 569 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:42,480 Speaker 1: You should learn to DJ. Go by yourself some decks 570 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:44,720 Speaker 1: and they'll talk you through how you can do this 571 00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:47,320 Speaker 1: as a hobby for fun. I started doing it on 572 00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:50,440 Speaker 1: Sunday afternoons, and as I got more interested, I hired 573 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,560 Speaker 1: somebody here was a professional DJ in New York to 574 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:54,880 Speaker 1: come to my apartment on Sunday afternoons and teach me 575 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:56,480 Speaker 1: how to mix music. I was doing it. I was 576 00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 1: having a good time in my apartment. And then about 577 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:01,120 Speaker 1: five years ago, always coming to New York to play 578 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:03,040 Speaker 1: at Marquis, and he said to me, you know, I 579 00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 1: hear you're getting pretty good. Why don't you take an 580 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 1: hour Marquis in front of me, in front of the 581 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:10,760 Speaker 1: guy who's opening for me. I said, Paul, I've I've 582 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:13,040 Speaker 1: never DJ in front of people, how can I possibly 583 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,040 Speaker 1: do that? And he said, just do it. You'll do fine. 584 00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:16,760 Speaker 1: And he said, by the way, it will be eleven o'clock, 585 00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:19,920 Speaker 1: there won't be anybody there. So I went in. I 586 00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:21,800 Speaker 1: did it at eleven o'clock. My kids and some of 587 00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:23,880 Speaker 1: their friends were there. That was kind of it. But 588 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 1: by the time twelve o'clock was around, there a lot 589 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 1: of people there, and I just loved it. I was 590 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 1: lost in the moment and it felt great. So I 591 00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:32,400 Speaker 1: started knocking around New York and doing it. Nobody knew 592 00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:34,080 Speaker 1: that I was doing it. I was just doing it 593 00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:38,320 Speaker 1: for fun and some pretty dingy dark places. And then 594 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:40,920 Speaker 1: a few years ago the New York Times Reporter heard 595 00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:43,880 Speaker 1: about it wrote an article about it, and at that 596 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:46,080 Speaker 1: point I kind of had an AHA moment where I said, Okay, now, 597 00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:47,600 Speaker 1: if I'm gonna do this, I actually have to get 598 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:49,120 Speaker 1: really good at this, and I've got to really do it. 599 00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:51,240 Speaker 1: I've got to stop doing it. And I decided to 600 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:53,200 Speaker 1: do it. And one of the things I decided when 601 00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:55,480 Speaker 1: I decided I would do this, I started making any 602 00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:58,240 Speaker 1: money from this all the money would be directed to charities, 603 00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:00,400 Speaker 1: and so I've created a small record able that at 604 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:03,000 Speaker 1: the moment has two releases on it. I'm hoping over 605 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,920 Speaker 1: time but we'll have more called payback records. Any money 606 00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:08,160 Speaker 1: that comes from the music I producer. Hopefully one day 607 00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:10,240 Speaker 1: I can get some other artists to maybe put some 608 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:12,280 Speaker 1: tracks out on Payback Records. All the proceeds will go 609 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,040 Speaker 1: to addiction charities. And so try to take what's a 610 00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:18,000 Speaker 1: hobby and something that I'm very passionate about. I'm just 611 00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:21,160 Speaker 1: in a very lucky position to have this platform and 612 00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:22,760 Speaker 1: try to see if we can do some good with it. 613 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,400 Speaker 1: I could be playing golf on a Sunday afternoon, but candidly, 614 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,800 Speaker 1: I i'd rather be in the music studio. So you're 615 00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:31,960 Speaker 1: thinking about it as a hobby, but it must have 616 00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:35,000 Speaker 1: some impact on you as the CEO. What if you've 617 00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:39,640 Speaker 1: learned there that comes out of that side of your personality, 618 00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:42,640 Speaker 1: your life that does give you some interesting insights. Look, 619 00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:44,840 Speaker 1: I've learned a lot, candidly, I've learned a lot about myself, 620 00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:46,400 Speaker 1: and I've learned a lot about what it means to 621 00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:49,760 Speaker 1: be a CEO and be visible and be exposed when 622 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:54,000 Speaker 1: it first was made publicly visible. Lloyd blankfind former CEO 623 00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:56,520 Speaker 1: and my mentor, you know, in the context of my 624 00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:59,200 Speaker 1: moving along in the organization, did something that I felt 625 00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:01,760 Speaker 1: was very cool. The day that it came out, he 626 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:04,680 Speaker 1: kind of tweeted out the article and made a joke, 627 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 1: you know, a nice joke. He said, sometimes David just 628 00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 1: has to let his hair down. And you know, it 629 00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:10,880 Speaker 1: was it was really really nice. But he basically said, 630 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:12,800 Speaker 1: you know what this is something he's doing, is passionate 631 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:15,160 Speaker 1: about It's okay. He endorsed it in a positive way. 632 00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:19,040 Speaker 1: I really appreciated that, but it also relaxed me and said, Okay, 633 00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:20,840 Speaker 1: if this is kind of who I am or something 634 00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,680 Speaker 1: I'm interested in, be open about it. And the thing 635 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:28,240 Speaker 1: that's really surprised me is by being open and authentic 636 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:30,800 Speaker 1: about something that I'm interested in, that makes me the 637 00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:34,120 Speaker 1: normal person that I am with everybody else. People are 638 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:36,560 Speaker 1: more inclined to engage you, to talk to you. It 639 00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:39,160 Speaker 1: makes you more approachable. I feel like I've learned a 640 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:42,280 Speaker 1: lot about what it means to be a leader, to 641 00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:44,520 Speaker 1: open up, to expose yourself, to be a little bit 642 00:31:44,680 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 1: vulnerable about who you are and what you are, and 643 00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:48,760 Speaker 1: I think it's good for me as a leader. I 644 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,960 Speaker 1: think it's good for the organization. Hopefully others feel like 645 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:54,360 Speaker 1: they can bring their whole self, their authentic self to 646 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,440 Speaker 1: our workplace. I think that's a pretty good thing. Your 647 00:31:57,440 --> 00:31:59,800 Speaker 1: image is the CEO. As soon as someone sort of 648 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:02,080 Speaker 1: is that about you, you can't be that big, bear, 649 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,560 Speaker 1: terrible CEO sitting in the corner office. I think you're 650 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:07,840 Speaker 1: right about that. I think when people have more insight 651 00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:10,400 Speaker 1: into who we are, the more open to approach and look. 652 00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:12,080 Speaker 1: I was a senior person of Golden Sax for a 653 00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,560 Speaker 1: lot of years before I was a CEO. I ran 654 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: investment banking for ten years, and I just noticed that 655 00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:20,920 Speaker 1: more people come talk to me today in the hall 656 00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,200 Speaker 1: and the elevator, and often they approached me to talk 657 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,360 Speaker 1: about music. It very quickly turns to business or Golden Sacks. 658 00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:28,720 Speaker 1: But you know that didn't go on the same way 659 00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:32,760 Speaker 1: before this. You had this interesting career trajectory. You started 660 00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:35,800 Speaker 1: Irving trust your Drexel Burnham in their heyday. You've had 661 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:39,600 Speaker 1: a quick Stanard Solomon Brothers, and you're a real star 662 00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:42,720 Speaker 1: at bear Stearns. You took a step back to join 663 00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:45,960 Speaker 1: Goldman Sachs, and here you are today as the CEO. 664 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,320 Speaker 1: If someone's listening now and they're sort of looking to 665 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:52,000 Speaker 1: you for a little career advice, here, what lessons come 666 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,240 Speaker 1: out of that for someone who's really building a career 667 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:57,080 Speaker 1: in finance. The best piece of advice I ever received 668 00:32:57,080 --> 00:32:59,800 Speaker 1: this from my grandmother, who, when I was very young 669 00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:02,760 Speaker 1: to starting my career, said, don't be in a hurry. 670 00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:04,680 Speaker 1: I think one of the things that's happening today is 671 00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:07,640 Speaker 1: everybody is in a hurry to know where they're going. 672 00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:10,840 Speaker 1: Do they know the destination instead of kind of enjoying 673 00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:13,680 Speaker 1: the journey. My career was a journey. I interviewed at 674 00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:15,360 Speaker 1: Goldman Sacks when I got out of college. I didn't 675 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:17,840 Speaker 1: get a job. If you knew Goldman Sacks. Again, when 676 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:19,320 Speaker 1: I was a couple of years out of college, I 677 00:33:19,360 --> 00:33:22,560 Speaker 1: didn't get a job. So I never imagined i'd wind 678 00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:24,480 Speaker 1: up there. But it's a journey and you don't really 679 00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:26,200 Speaker 1: know where it's going to take you, and part of 680 00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:29,520 Speaker 1: it is enjoying the ride, not being in a hurry 681 00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:32,239 Speaker 1: to find out what the destination is. So with that 682 00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:36,280 Speaker 1: in mind, thinking about other destinations, you were at a 683 00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:40,160 Speaker 1: spectacular career in investment banking. You knew every CEO in America, 684 00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:42,680 Speaker 1: and I know a lot of people tried to hire 685 00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:45,040 Speaker 1: you to come to businesses where you ever tempted to 686 00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:47,920 Speaker 1: step out of finance and go run a business. There's 687 00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:50,840 Speaker 1: no question that somewhere along the way the thought of 688 00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:54,640 Speaker 1: having the opportunity to run a business was appealing to me. 689 00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,600 Speaker 1: I never expected it would be Goldman Sacks up until 690 00:33:57,720 --> 00:33:59,600 Speaker 1: right before I got the job. I didn't think I 691 00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:01,880 Speaker 1: was getting the job. When I was promoted to co 692 00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,360 Speaker 1: president of the firm, Boyd said to me, you know 693 00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:08,040 Speaker 1: what you're behind, Okay. So I never had an expectation. 694 00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:10,600 Speaker 1: There was no expectation put upon me, and so as 695 00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:12,799 Speaker 1: a result, I did what I thought was right. But 696 00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:15,600 Speaker 1: I always was open to the fact that probably one 697 00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:17,840 Speaker 1: day I wouldn't get the next job and I'd have 698 00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:20,600 Speaker 1: to go find something else. And so I listened to 699 00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:22,560 Speaker 1: a lot of those things, but none of them, as 700 00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:26,000 Speaker 1: they came through, was more compelling than doing what I 701 00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:28,080 Speaker 1: was doing at Golden Sex. I never looked at it 702 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,400 Speaker 1: through the lens of what's next. I always looked at 703 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:33,279 Speaker 1: it through is this more compelling right now than what 704 00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:36,320 Speaker 1: I'm doing? And they just weren't you were talking about 705 00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:39,000 Speaker 1: that you're getting out of shape as you get older, 706 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 1: blah blah blah. But you do bike, ron sky golf, 707 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:46,120 Speaker 1: kite sir, scuba, dive, hike, do yoga. You are in 708 00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:50,279 Speaker 1: a very high stress job. Do you think these activities 709 00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 1: counteract that stress? How do you design your life with 710 00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:56,880 Speaker 1: some kind of balance there so this job doesn't literally 711 00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:58,680 Speaker 1: kill you. Look, I think we all have a responsibility 712 00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:01,400 Speaker 1: to take care of ourselves. I think that super super important. 713 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:07,440 Speaker 1: For me. The exercise of the activity definitely helps me 714 00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:11,040 Speaker 1: with stress, helps me think, and so I've incorporated it 715 00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:13,440 Speaker 1: into my life in a very formal way. I get 716 00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:16,200 Speaker 1: up every morning Monday through Friday and I get some 717 00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:18,720 Speaker 1: form of exercise. It can be working out with a trainer. 718 00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:22,120 Speaker 1: It can be going to spin class or riding on 719 00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:25,480 Speaker 1: a peloton. This morning, I was out walking very very 720 00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:28,160 Speaker 1: briskly uphill on a treadmill for forty five minutes. But 721 00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,120 Speaker 1: I'm doing something because I just need it. When I'm 722 00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:33,440 Speaker 1: traveling in a way where I miss it for some reason, 723 00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 1: I find that it does affect, you know, my headspace, 724 00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:37,920 Speaker 1: and so I think it's very important and that on 725 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:40,359 Speaker 1: the weekends I try to do the things that are 726 00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:42,960 Speaker 1: more active, you know, road bike during the summer, like 727 00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:45,200 Speaker 1: kite surfing, like being the water. You know, try to 728 00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:47,400 Speaker 1: stay active. It's not always easy, but I think it's important. 729 00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:49,600 Speaker 1: We were talking about culture. Do you build that into 730 00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:52,280 Speaker 1: the culture or into the organization at all? The Goldman 731 00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 1: sacks for all the people. I think you've got a 732 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:58,880 Speaker 1: responsibility to make time to take care of your mental 733 00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:01,239 Speaker 1: and physical health. And I just think you'll be more 734 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:05,200 Speaker 1: successful professionally over the medium in the long term if 735 00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:07,720 Speaker 1: you do that. I'm trying to encourage it the best 736 00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:10,960 Speaker 1: I can and hopefully what resonates with people. And it's 737 00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:13,120 Speaker 1: a choice people have to make. You can't tell people 738 00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,359 Speaker 1: what to do. People have to make a choice. You're 739 00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:19,200 Speaker 1: a relatively young CEO for a company like this and 740 00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:22,080 Speaker 1: you've just begun. But have you set any parameters for 741 00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:23,839 Speaker 1: how long you stay in a job like this? How 742 00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:26,440 Speaker 1: long is the CEO thing last? It lasts until you 743 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:28,799 Speaker 1: on the board decide it's time for somebody, it's time 744 00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:30,600 Speaker 1: for somebody else. And by the way, it's interesting you 745 00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:32,520 Speaker 1: say that I'm young. I'm fifty seven. I'll be fifty 746 00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:36,439 Speaker 1: eight this year. Lloyd started this job at fifty one. Yeah, 747 00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:40,240 Speaker 1: I actually think, not just for this job, but you know, generally, 748 00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:43,440 Speaker 1: I think to start a CEO tenure at fifty seven. 749 00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,080 Speaker 1: It's somewhere between the average and the older side of 750 00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:48,480 Speaker 1: I think when a lot of these maybe I'm rationalizing 751 00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:50,720 Speaker 1: because you're a young man, but only by a little. 752 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:54,360 Speaker 1: We always wrap up the show with one last question. 753 00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:57,160 Speaker 1: Math and Magic is about the special relationship of the 754 00:36:57,160 --> 00:37:00,480 Speaker 1: analytics of marketing, the math and the creative pivity to 755 00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:04,120 Speaker 1: those insights, how we use them to inspire, attract or 756 00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:07,720 Speaker 1: motivate consumers. So, if you think about it, in your career, 757 00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:11,160 Speaker 1: you've seen a lot of really strong analytical people. Is 758 00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:12,920 Speaker 1: there someone who jumps out at you that we want 759 00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,319 Speaker 1: to give a shout out to as the greatest mathematician 760 00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:18,560 Speaker 1: you've seen. I've been blessed to work with so many 761 00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:23,800 Speaker 1: people that are so extraordinary quantitatively, their ability to think quantitatively, 762 00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:28,799 Speaker 1: to analyze, their nimbleness around numbers and facts. It's one 763 00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:30,640 Speaker 1: of the great things about Goldman Sacks. There are hundreds, 764 00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:32,880 Speaker 1: and so you know, to shout one out feels almost 765 00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:37,759 Speaker 1: impossible to me. So let's go the other side. We 766 00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:40,440 Speaker 1: take those analytics, and we do something with it to 767 00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:44,520 Speaker 1: cause people to do something. That's the magician. Do you 768 00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:46,759 Speaker 1: have any magicians you want to give a shout out 769 00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:49,320 Speaker 1: to that just managed to take that idea and create 770 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:51,120 Speaker 1: something to go Where did they think of that idea? 771 00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:53,560 Speaker 1: There are lots of great creative people in the world. 772 00:37:53,560 --> 00:37:55,920 Speaker 1: But I'm going to answer your question very literally. I 773 00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:57,719 Speaker 1: look at the great magicians in the world. I look 774 00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:00,840 Speaker 1: at somebody like David Copperfield. You know, I've spent a 775 00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: little bit of time around magic and small scale illusion. 776 00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:06,839 Speaker 1: My father used to play around with it a little bit, 777 00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,279 Speaker 1: so I understand some of the base principles. But you 778 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:12,080 Speaker 1: look at some of the things that they do and 779 00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:15,960 Speaker 1: the creativity that goes into creating those experiences, it is magic. 780 00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:21,960 Speaker 1: It is really crazy, literally literally. David Solomon, Thanks, Thank you, Bob, 781 00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:28,520 Speaker 1: really nice to be here with you. Here are three 782 00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:31,320 Speaker 1: things I've picked up for my conversation with David Solomon. 783 00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:36,200 Speaker 1: One communication matters, David says the classes that best prepared 784 00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:39,560 Speaker 1: him for the workforce republic speaking and writing, which helped 785 00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:43,759 Speaker 1: him communicate ideas clearly and with nuance too. You can 786 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,960 Speaker 1: make quick steps to change corporate culture from relaxing the 787 00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:50,120 Speaker 1: dress code to closing the office on Saturdays, the prioritizing 788 00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:53,600 Speaker 1: diversity and inclusion, David has quickly shifted the way his 789 00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:57,719 Speaker 1: employees think about work. Three, Let your hair down. As 790 00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:01,160 Speaker 1: a leader, people can be intimidated. While David was initially 791 00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:04,640 Speaker 1: secretive about his interest in electronic music, being vocal about 792 00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:07,600 Speaker 1: his interest has made him much more approachable to his employees. 793 00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:18,760 Speaker 1: I'm Bob Pittman. Thanks for listening. That's it for today's episode. 794 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:21,120 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening to Math and Magic, a 795 00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:23,920 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. This show is hosted by 796 00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:27,040 Speaker 1: Bob Pittman. Special thanks to Sue Schillinger for booking and 797 00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:30,600 Speaker 1: wrangling our wonderful talent, which is no small feat Nikkiatore 798 00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:33,920 Speaker 1: for pulling research bill plaques, and Michael Asar for their 799 00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:37,840 Speaker 1: recording help, our editor Ryan Murdoch, and of course Gayl Raoul, 800 00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:41,319 Speaker 1: Eric Angel, Noel Mango and everyone who helped bring this 801 00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:43,480 Speaker 1: show to your ears. Until next time,