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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know.

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Speaker 2: A production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 3: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,

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Speaker 3: my name is Noah.

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Speaker 2: They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our

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Speaker 2: super producer, Dylan the Tennessee pal Fagan.

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Speaker 4: He's back.

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Speaker 2: Most importantly, you are you.

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Speaker 4: You are here.

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Speaker 2: That makes this the stuff they don't want you to know.

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Speaker 2: We are so excited to return to this, guys. I

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Speaker 2: had a feeling we were going to do this very episode.

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Speaker 2: Uh huh, yeah, maybe call it intuition. Let's start there.

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Speaker 2: How much stock do you guys put in intuition?

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Speaker 4: I just saw it in the doc so I knew,

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Speaker 4: but yes, a decent amount. I think intuition is very instinct.

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Speaker 4: I don't necessarily believe in premonitions or things like that,

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Speaker 4: but I do feel like there's a vibe. We are

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Speaker 4: vibes based, guys, and you can really, you know, you

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Speaker 4: can kind of take that to the bank sometimes.

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Speaker 2: Have you, guys, ever had as far as you're comfortable

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Speaker 2: talking about it on air or on Netflix, have either

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Speaker 2: of you guys had a moment of a strong telling intuition,

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Speaker 2: not just a hunch, but an immediate realization that you

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Speaker 2: could not explain that changed your behavior.

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Speaker 3: Hasn't happened to me yet. I'm a big educated guest

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Speaker 3: kind of guy, so I don't really know.

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Speaker 1: Man.

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Speaker 3: I'm shooting in the dark out here, just trying to

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Speaker 3: see what I can find to discover.

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Speaker 4: I love a heuristic, that's the fancy word for it.

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Speaker 4: I think a lot of times you take in more

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Speaker 4: information than you realize. Yes, you know, that's true, And

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Speaker 4: I think sometimes that can quantitatively add up to what

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Speaker 4: you're talking about about and cause you to sort of like,

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Speaker 4: without really thinking or specifically reacting to one particular set

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Speaker 4: of circumstances. You know, have those feelings and them serve

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Speaker 4: you well.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know. It's surprising, even in an increasingly science based,

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Speaker 2: secular civilization, it is astonishing how many people, at one

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Speaker 2: point or another have experienced a powerful hunch. You get

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Speaker 2: a tinge of deja vu as this song you were

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Speaker 2: just humming plays on the radio later shout out to

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Speaker 2: various psychological phenomena, or you might you might be experiencing

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Speaker 2: a sudden urge to linger at a stoplight, even though

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Speaker 2: the light is turned green. Something inside of your brain

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Speaker 2: tells you to pause and lo and behold a car

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Speaker 2: barrels through that blind intersection. You have avoided an accident

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Speaker 2: and you don't know why, but you're happy you know

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Speaker 2: your car didn't get t boned.

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Speaker 3: This is a huge thing in both popular culture and

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Speaker 3: in science. Is there really such thing as a coincidence?

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Speaker 3: And then how much of that looking back at things

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Speaker 3: after they've happened, and then thinking about how we've felt

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Speaker 3: about those things that happened, How much of that is

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Speaker 3: us filling in a narrative? Right?

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Speaker 2: Right? Yes, Because remembering something for the human brain is

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Speaker 2: a lot like time travel, but it's imperfect time travel

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Speaker 2: because you are recreating the memory and futs in with

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Speaker 2: it a little bit every time you encounter it.

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Speaker 4: That reminds me my witness accounts are so unreliable.

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Speaker 2: Just so. That reminds me of a conversation I had

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Speaker 2: with one of my scariest old professors, statistics Guy, on

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Speaker 2: our very first day of class. He said, you know,

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Speaker 2: my job is to give you three tests, and my

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Speaker 2: job is to do the following office hours, and I'm

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Speaker 2: supposed to say all kinds of fancy stuff about statistics,

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Speaker 2: and then he leaned it and he said, your real

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Speaker 2: job here is to prove to me that any coincidence exists.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, cool, yeah.

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Speaker 3: And then he said this is no coincidence. Four out

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Speaker 3: of five of you will fail because this institute is insane,

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Speaker 3: because I know where you too.

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Speaker 4: It's all probability, though, isn't it. I mean, it's all

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Speaker 4: this complex system of intersecting events, and each of them

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Speaker 4: have their own level of probability, and occasionally you'll get

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Speaker 4: these cross moments where some of those probabilities align, and

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Speaker 4: as patterns seeking creatures, we sometimes want to call that

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Speaker 4: a thing, but it really is just kind of chaos,

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Speaker 4: sort of bumping into itself. Or is it exactly exactly?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? What's the difference between perspective and reality? This is

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Speaker 2: why the majority of scientific thought now dismisses claims of

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Speaker 2: intuition or what we would call maybe short lived precognition

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Speaker 2: or presentiment. Dismisses that as coincidence that is, in retrospect,

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Speaker 2: put into a narrative, a lived reality or lived perspective

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Speaker 2: of an individual human. They might also argue, like Gavin

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Speaker 2: de Becker argues that your unconscious mind is constantly putting

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Speaker 2: together sensory input that your conscious mind does not clock.

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Speaker 2: This is something that's great for the mentalist, which we'll

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Speaker 2: get to shout out to the Darren Browns in the crowd.

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Speaker 2: It can explain some of these occurrences. But a growing

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Speaker 2: body of controversial scientific thought argues there is more to

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Speaker 2: the story. Sometimes they say, those gut feelings are not superstition.

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Speaker 2: They're not you be a wackadoo. You're receiving memories from

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Speaker 2: the future, future and or your guts and.

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Speaker 4: The vibes man read the room.

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Speaker 2: You know what.

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Speaker 4: It just occurred to me. The word coincidence kind of

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Speaker 4: refers to what I was talking about. It's when these

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Speaker 4: random elements coincide.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just a concatenation of two things, right, Well,

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Speaker 2: concatenation would be a series of linked events which gets

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Speaker 2: into linear time. So is your intuition information from the

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Speaker 2: future violating what we understand now as the concept of

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Speaker 2: the arrow of time. We'll get into it. Here are

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Speaker 2: the facts, all right. Intuition it's one of those words

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Speaker 2: everybody kind of intuitively understands, but it's difficult for a

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Speaker 2: lot of people to define intuition when you straight up

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Speaker 2: ask them, tell me what this mechanism means.

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Speaker 4: So let's jump over to Cambridge. They've got a thing

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Speaker 4: or two to say about intuition. They describe it as

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Speaker 4: knowledge from an ability to understand or know something immediately

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Speaker 4: based on your feelings rather than facts. And put this

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Speaker 4: in maybe a little simpler terms, it's knowing something without

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Speaker 4: a clear understanding of how you came to know it

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Speaker 4: or why.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the easiest way to put it. And secondly,

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Speaker 2: they call it an ability to understand or know something

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Speaker 2: without needing to think about it or use reason to

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Speaker 2: discover it. So, for example, folks, we're taking a Zener

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Speaker 2: card test. Everybody who has seen Ghostbusters remembers this test

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Speaker 2: is that the stars and they shape in three wavy lines, right,

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Speaker 2: So intuition would be an example of this would be when,

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Speaker 2: without really thinking about it, I hold up the card

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Speaker 2: for Tennessee and he says, oh, I I know, damn it.

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Speaker 2: The next card is three wavy lines and Dylan is

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Speaker 2: not counting the cards. He has no deep statistical system

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Speaker 2: or methodology consciously informing the decision. He just knows. And

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Speaker 2: this is a very old idea. Throughout time and space

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Speaker 2: and human civilization, everybody has acknowledged something like this phenomenon.

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Speaker 4: But can you can you zap intuition into people? Though?

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Speaker 4: Like in the in the movie, remember didn't they get

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Speaker 4: a zap if you got it wrong?

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Speaker 2: Yes, that was a weird That was a weird riff on.

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Speaker 4: Uh, that was acentric thing.

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Speaker 2: I think it was a weird riff on some unethical experiments.

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Speaker 2: The idea that he would shock someone a mild electric

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Speaker 2: shock when they guessed the wrong card. Not very good

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Speaker 2: for science, like great for comedy. Right. The point is

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Speaker 2: that some cultures have treated this concept of intuition or

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Speaker 2: a hunch with more importance than others, but everyone again

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Speaker 2: has acknowledged its existence. And I think I think it's

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Speaker 2: a survival mechanism, folks. I think that like a microcosmic example,

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Speaker 2: wen't a park. Who doesn't love a park? You're at

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Speaker 2: a divergence Robert Frost style.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 2: If there's a trail in your local park, you've been

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Speaker 2: there before. You know one path Vera's left, the other

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Speaker 2: path Veer's right. You also know they both eventually lead

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Speaker 2: back to the entrance. They're about the same length. You know,

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Speaker 2: in terms of a walk, they just go through different

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Speaker 2: parts of the woods, but all of a sudden, right

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Speaker 2: at that divergence point, you get a hunch, you get

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Speaker 2: a gut flash of intuition, and it says, today we

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Speaker 2: go left, or a more ominous feeling would say go

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Speaker 2: anywhere but right.

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Speaker 4: Because that's the road less traveled by, and it's made

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Speaker 4: all the difference.

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Speaker 3: I think, I do think for us and they go

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Speaker 3: I think it does go back to a lot of

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Speaker 3: other explorations we've done in this show about the human brains,

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Speaker 3: evolution over time, right, and the need to detect those

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Speaker 3: predators and the tiny little things, the little pieces of

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Speaker 3: evidence a predator might leave behind, or a telltale sign

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Speaker 3: that there's, let's say, a predator in a grass somewhere,

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Speaker 3: or you know, as we're talking about those wavy lines, right,

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Speaker 3: if you have an ability to detect small differences like

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Speaker 3: that evolutionarily, hey, your line probably did a lot better

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Speaker 3: than the ones who just kind of walk past that

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Speaker 3: grass like it's nothing and get eaten.

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Speaker 2: I hear you. I've always been a follow your gut

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Speaker 2: kind of entity personally, because like so.

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Speaker 3: It goes back to your parents right, and it go

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Speaker 3: their parents, and their parents and their parents. It all

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Speaker 3: goes back.

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Speaker 2: Well, like so many living things in our park. Example,

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Speaker 2: given that both paths are pretty much the same, you're

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Speaker 2: probably going to follow your gut because it doesn't make

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Speaker 2: a difference. So if you're more skeptical, you'll maybe rationalize

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Speaker 2: it and say that doesn't matter either way. I just

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Speaker 2: felt like going left. But whatever that rationale may be,

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Speaker 2: your action remains the same. And I do think it

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Speaker 2: could be an ancient survival mechanism. You're getting free, unexplained information.

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Speaker 2: You don't know the providence of this information consciously, and

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Speaker 2: so why not stay on the safe side and go

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Speaker 2: with the flow if it's not inconvenient. It's a little

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Speaker 2: thing like a literal walk in the park for more convenience.

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Speaker 4: Factor is interesting because as we no longer maybe are

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Speaker 4: worried about the puma or something eating us on that

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Speaker 4: one path or the other, we are now intuiting which

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Speaker 4: one's going to be more convenient. Because as our intuition

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Speaker 4: is no longer maybe leaning as much on survival, does

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Speaker 4: gaps get filled in by other stuff. Inter's like whether

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Speaker 4: it be you know, convenience or the serendipitous kind of

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Speaker 4: you know, hearing that song again or whatever and assigning

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Speaker 4: some kind of meaning to it.

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Speaker 2: And information on this idea of unconscious info information info.

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Speaker 2: Check out our Vibes episode, which I hope we're all

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Speaker 2: very proud of. Check out Vibes of course.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, the only thing this doesn't explain, guys,

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Speaker 3: is the person who picks the wrong path and gets

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Speaker 3: killed or eaten.

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Speaker 4: That's the thing, right.

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Speaker 2: Though, mechanism or they like roll the dice. It's explained retroactively.

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Speaker 3: But well that it also goes back to the concept

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Speaker 3: that our gut feelings can be off and if and

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Speaker 3: if you're not careful, you can find yourself in a

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Speaker 3: self fulfilling prophecy. Right, So, this concept of following your

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Speaker 3: gut feelings or your intuition or something or you know,

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Speaker 3: whatever it is, it can be potentially dangerous.

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Speaker 4: And think about how much stock people put in luck,

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Speaker 4: like in a casino or like, you know, my lucky

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Speaker 4: socks or whatever, because I won a bunch of hands

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Speaker 4: this one day where I was wearing these socks. So

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Speaker 4: you assume, or like to think rather that if you

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Speaker 4: wear the same socks you might do well again, and

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Speaker 4: maybe that the odds follow you around and things do

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Speaker 4: continue to do serendipity when you're wearing your lucky socks.

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Speaker 4: But at the end of the day, it is also

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Speaker 4: a numbers game.

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Speaker 2: Also, I like that example because it shows us that

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Speaker 2: quote unquote, self fulfilling prophecy can work both ways. Right,

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Speaker 2: your lucky socks and you knowing that you're wearing your

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Speaker 2: lucky socks may alter your behavior in ways that you

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Speaker 2: don't clock. That may make you more successful and give

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Speaker 2: an environment, so long as that environment is not a

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Speaker 2: casino because the house always wins.

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Speaker 4: There's so many things stacked against you. Do check out

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Speaker 4: our episode we did from Vegas on how casinos put

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Speaker 4: the kibosh on your bank account.

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Speaker 3: I'm thinking about this a lot, guys, especially after some

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Speaker 3: events that took place in Minneapolis recently with law enforcement

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Speaker 3: taking action, specific action against somebody that was unarmed. It

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Speaker 3: appeared to not have any kind of criminal intent, right right.

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Speaker 3: We talked previously about law enforce training and that training

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Speaker 3: that you get that tries you try and teach someone

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Speaker 3: to discern whether or not someone has a gun, let's say,

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Speaker 3: or whether or not someone means harm to another or

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Speaker 3: to you as an officer of the law. Sure, and

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Speaker 3: we talked about that split second decision that has to

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Speaker 3: occur in those moments and how dangerous that can be

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Speaker 3: for both the law enforcement person and everybody else that's

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Speaker 3: near them.

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Speaker 4: Did y'all see the update about how that officer had

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Speaker 4: also been in a previous incident involving a vehicle where

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Speaker 4: he was injured and dragged. And I'm not making any excuses.

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Speaker 4: I'm just talking about the pattern recognition and the perhaps

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Speaker 4: using past data to guide one's actions in another situation.

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Speaker 3: That's what I'm thinking about, because it all takes place

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Speaker 3: in the split second, right, things of that nature, and

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Speaker 3: often when we get a gut feeling it is it

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Speaker 3: is not a prolonged thing. It is something that occurs

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Speaker 3: pretty quickly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, Like I was saying earlier, it's like a

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Speaker 2: short window micro precognition.

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Speaker 3: Right, yeah, say it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this is we also should say the quiet part

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Speaker 2: out loud. We are talking in part about Renee Nicole Good,

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Speaker 2: who was an amazing poet.

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Speaker 4: By the way, say, I think that ice agent's a

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Speaker 4: bad dude, and I'm not making any excuses, and I

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Speaker 4: think this is an awful situation and absolutely unconscionable. We

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Speaker 4: are talking about patterns seeking humans in the ways brains work,

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Speaker 4: and the way these kinds of experiences can go against training.

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Speaker 4: And then what even is the training in the first place?

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Speaker 4: Is it enough? I likely would argue?

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Speaker 3: And how quickly thoughts turn into actions?

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Speaker 2: Right? And let's spin out the idea? Right, yes, thought

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Speaker 2: into action, let's spin out the idea of braining. I

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Speaker 2: like that, because what we need to recognize here is

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Speaker 2: that if you are a human being, every moment you

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Speaker 2: are alive is a kind of training. Your experience of

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Speaker 2: the present is built upon your experience of the past,

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Speaker 2: which informs your predictive or aspirational thoughts about the future.

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Speaker 2: Because you experienced time in a linear way, that's a

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Speaker 2: little bit of a foreshadowing, we call it. It is important, though,

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Speaker 2: when we talk about hunches and gut feelings, it's mission

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Speaker 2: critical for us to establish that most people experiencing these

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Speaker 2: situations don't see themselves as psychics. Right, They probably don't,

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Speaker 2: you know, dither too much over these decisions. Again, as

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Speaker 2: we said, it's a short window of time, it's immediacy,

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Speaker 2: it's action. So if you think about this information too

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Speaker 2: much gets really weird. Later, when it's you in the future,

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Speaker 2: new information might emerge that makes you return to that

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Speaker 2: moment of intuition, that quiet, still small voice inside of you, Like,

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Speaker 2: what if our pal who took the left hand path

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Speaker 2: in the park, what if they later learned there was

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Speaker 2: a gang about a quarter mile up on the right

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Speaker 2: hand path they robbed two other partgoers that day. Our

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Speaker 2: hypothetical part friend is probably gonna say, dang, I wonder

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Speaker 2: if that's why I knew to go left.

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Speaker 4: Isn't the left hand path the devil's path? Ben?

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Speaker 2: All right, we are playing a little bit.

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Speaker 4: You got me.

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Speaker 3: I just watched that episode of The X File season

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Speaker 3: two where it's the faculty at the school dude to

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Speaker 3: a bank.

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Speaker 4: That was the one referenced in our discussion with the host, Yes,

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Speaker 4: correc of the the devil. You know, that was the

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Speaker 4: one about the kind of satanic ritual blowing it up

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Speaker 4: into a huge watch the.

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Speaker 2: Eyes giving the eyes that part reptil, That part rocked me. Man.

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Speaker 2: So this idea happens so often, so much more than

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Speaker 2: even the most skeptical us may assume. So much so,

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Speaker 2: in fact, that we guarantee you, fellow conspiracy realists that

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Speaker 2: if you yourself have not had a moment like this yet,

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Speaker 2: you almost certainly know someone who has. So let's play

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Speaker 2: a game while we're all hanging out here by the campfire.

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Speaker 2: Go ask your friends and family about those moments of

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Speaker 2: powerful intuition, those flashes of gut feelings, those epiphanies. See

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Speaker 2: what they say. Their answers will surprise.

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Speaker 3: You, dude. I have no evidence to back this up.

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Speaker 3: I just know, in particular, my mother and her mother

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Speaker 3: both have this thing that they would always talk about

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Speaker 3: a gut feeling or they knew something and they would

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Speaker 3: call me. They were like, I just knew I had

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Speaker 3: to call you, or something like that happen. That happened frequently,

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Speaker 3: at least in my grandmother's life, that would occur, and

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Speaker 3: my mom too. Gosh if Yeah.

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Speaker 4: It's also the kind of thing that comes into play

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Speaker 4: when maybe meeting a new person, just getting a funny

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Speaker 4: feeling something they quite right. You don't have any data

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Speaker 4: or any knowledge of any things that this person has done,

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Speaker 4: but you get that little spidy sense that maybe there's

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Speaker 4: something not quite right, and what will that be? Micro aggressions,

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Speaker 4: little signals that your brain's picking up on that. You're

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Speaker 4: not even really acknowledging, as you know, data at all,

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Speaker 4: but you're taking it in nonetheless.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and don't get me well, we're talking about family

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Speaker 2: history of alleged psychic phenomena. Don't get me started on

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Speaker 2: the luncheons, guys. Let's just say it. We're big fans

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Speaker 2: of trust in your gut.

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Speaker 3: Yes, well, I just think, sorry, guys, random thought. We're

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Speaker 3: going to get into some things about the microbiome in

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Speaker 3: the human body and how it's transferred. So stuff we've

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Speaker 3: talked about you can find it on the audio podcast

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Speaker 3: if you go back in time. Sure, and then think

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Speaker 3: about mothers and how mothers literally hand down their gut

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Speaker 3: biomes to their children, every single one, especially if there's

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Speaker 3: breastfeeding involved in depending on the berth and all that stuff.

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Speaker 3: Either way, genetically you're handing down a certain amount and

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Speaker 3: then you're transferring more generally from being a mother. It

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Speaker 3: makes me wonder about some of that quantum entanglement weirdness

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Speaker 3: we're going to talk about, and literally the gut biome

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Speaker 3: of a mother and a child.

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Speaker 4: Which I guess would be part and parcel of a

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Speaker 4: concept like epigenetics. The idea of inheriting memory, of inheriting

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Speaker 4: this type of knowledge you know through your DNA.

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Speaker 2: It's similar. Yeah, I like that comparisonal because it's it's

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Speaker 2: like a Madroshka doll of epigenetics. Right, it's the it's

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Speaker 2: the function of the biome that lives within you. And

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Speaker 2: one other point to make with that is that your biome,

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Speaker 2: your gut biome, the floor and there are changeable, so

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Speaker 2: your diet can affect your mileage in ways that science

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Speaker 2: is still figuring out. Look, as long as your intuition

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Speaker 2: isn't asking you to do something crazy like sta abs

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Speaker 2: of one or feel the call of the void and

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Speaker 2: swerve into oncoming traffic, your gut feelings and the decisions

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Speaker 2: you make that you feel you are making well, the

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Speaker 2: determinism there, they are going to be harmless largely, the

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Speaker 2: decisions you make. It's as simple as choosing between a

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Speaker 2: burrito or case idella on a menu. You know, you'll

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Speaker 2: just say I just wanted a case idea, which is

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Speaker 2: the correct answer.

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Speaker 3: Unless there's burrito a different shape.

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Speaker 4: One can grilla burrito.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we haven't even gotten to berea case ideas. The

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Speaker 2: other day, excellent love a little telling you. That's But

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Speaker 2: that's the tricky part too. That's that's the secret ingredient here. Time.

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Speaker 2: If you're a human, your default factory settings of consciousness

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Speaker 2: experience time in a linear fashion. We sometimes call this

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Speaker 2: the arrow of time because it's a cool praise. You

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Speaker 2: move forward through life at a constant rate to you,

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Speaker 2: of one second to the next, from grad ole to grave.

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Speaker 2: But what if there is more to it than this?

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Speaker 2: What if on some level your true experience of time

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Speaker 2: goes much deeper? What if your gut knows something you

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Speaker 2: do not what.

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Speaker 4: My guts.

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Speaker 2: Here's where it gets crazy, all right. We got to

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Speaker 2: introduce the legendary, the mythical, the pioneery. Don't give us

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Speaker 2: some growing applause and sometimes controversial scientist and parapsychologist Dean Radden,

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Speaker 2: r A d I N PhD.

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Speaker 3: You may find this name to be familiar. A couple

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Speaker 3: of books that you might know. Super Normal, I think

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Speaker 3: is the one that probably probably most people have pinged

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Speaker 3: on at some point because it's been mentioned so many times.

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Speaker 3: Real Magic is another one, and Entangled Minds was Oh Gosh,

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Speaker 3: a fascinating book from six two thousand and six, talking

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Speaker 3: about interconnectedness on levels that we're now talking about, especially

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Speaker 3: with quantum mechanics and quantum entanglement and things like that.

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Speaker 3: We're talking about that on the regular as though it

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Speaker 3: is pure science. Now, well it's let's say, it's a

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Speaker 3: bleeding edge of certain science.

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Speaker 2: Farting edge, hey, ivs edge. Yeah, but I like where

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Speaker 2: you're going, man.

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Speaker 3: But I guess what I'm saying this. This human being,

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Speaker 3: Dean Ratten, PhD, has been talking about some of these

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Speaker 3: some of the weirder aspects of time and consciousness for

403
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Speaker 3: a long time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, because look, this guy might not believe in

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Speaker 2: linear time, but his bibliography short does. Uh. And we

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00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:04,919
Speaker 2: say that with great affection and respect. If you go

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00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,600
Speaker 2: to his website. One really cool thing the good doctor

408
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:12,159
Speaker 2: did is link a ton of his papers that you

409
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Speaker 2: can read for free. And be warned it's a rabbit

410
00:24:15,600 --> 00:24:20,280
Speaker 2: hole if you. If the academic stuff feels a little

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Speaker 2: too dry for you, go visit the slick website for

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Speaker 2: ions the Institute of Noetic Sciences work.

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Speaker 4: Backwards from the acronym for that one. It's just so

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00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:34,679
Speaker 4: pretty good, pretty good, noetic being a fun word that

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Speaker 4: is new to me referring to things just pertaining to

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Speaker 4: the mind or intellect.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just it's kind of metacognition with a tie

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Speaker 2: on or as we learned recently, nol a cravat.

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Speaker 4: Yes, or an ion a tie on cravat? What is

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Speaker 4: it again? Ben cravats? Y'all ascots are not ties.

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Speaker 2: It's all dases or puzzles, all puzzles or mazes. Provide

422
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:06,920
Speaker 2: is a group term for silly stuff people wear around

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Speaker 2: their neck.

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Speaker 4: Cravat could also be a bow tie. It should be

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Speaker 4: an ascot. It could be a traditional necktie with a

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Speaker 4: windsor not.

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Speaker 2: WHOA the more you know, Doc give check our mind.

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Speaker 2: Check out our show Ridiculous History where we learned about

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00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,120
Speaker 2: that one live on air because we.

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00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:28,399
Speaker 4: Like cravat and that was a real time Google session.

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Speaker 3: It's true. What's the name of that thing the Western

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Speaker 3: folks wear? Sometimes it's a bullet It's my favorite.

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Speaker 2: You guys, you know what's funny?

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Speaker 4: That one unrelated. But if you ever want to go

435
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:40,520
Speaker 4: to the Magic Castle in Los Angeles, they have a

436
00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:42,520
Speaker 4: pretty strict dress code. So if you ever get an invite,

437
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,080
Speaker 4: it's cool magicians club thing or you can see magic shows.

438
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:49,720
Speaker 4: You can wear a bolo tie in place of a necktie. Amazing.

439
00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:52,680
Speaker 2: Oh man, I remember when you went there at West

440
00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:55,480
Speaker 2: Coast Cheek. I think it would be cool. Also, speaking

441
00:25:55,480 --> 00:26:01,159
Speaker 2: of institutions for us to visit, ions, the Institute for Sciences.

442
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 4: This is it's in California as well, right, grip It

443
00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:09,800
Speaker 4: feels like it has to be just this story. Yeah,

444
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 4: well yeah.

445
00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 2: It was founded back in seventy three, nineteen seventy three

446
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:18,880
Speaker 2: by a guy named edgar Mitchell. Fun fact, the sixth

447
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:21,440
Speaker 2: man to walk on Earth's moon.

448
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:23,080
Speaker 3: That's right.

449
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:26,359
Speaker 2: It's kind of like the second act of his career.

450
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 4: They don't talk about the sixth guy really, just the

451
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:29,200
Speaker 4: first two.

452
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 3: Well, this is the sixth Yes, he's well, the sixth

453
00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:38,080
Speaker 3: the sixth guy came back and you can read on

454
00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 3: Ion's website about him. Do you guys mind if I

455
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:43,120
Speaker 3: read a quick little quote here from their website.

456
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:46,040
Speaker 2: Yes, and he also, just to be clear, he experienced

457
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 2: the overview offect for.

458
00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:51,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it says here on their website. As a

459
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 3: scientist and visionary doctor, Edgar Mitchell saw a need to

460
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 3: reconcile his training as an engineer and astrophysicist with the

461
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:01,560
Speaker 3: wisdom of the ages to transcend the limitations of what

462
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:06,440
Speaker 3: he saw as an outdated materialist worldview. A new framework

463
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,840
Speaker 3: would be needed, one that could help explain the unexplainable

464
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:11,280
Speaker 3: and spark transformation.

465
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 2: And so he makes this pitch to a couple of

466
00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 2: other people, like minded folks, including an investor named paul

467
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:26,800
Speaker 2: In Temple. This Avengers team up of exploring the edges

468
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:30,480
Speaker 2: of science. Right now as we're recording, they are conducting

469
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,160
Speaker 2: research on all sorts of the stuff we x files

470
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:39,080
Speaker 2: fans love, and a lot of modern science who poos

471
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:42,639
Speaker 2: their efforts gut jokes. We're doing gut jokes.

472
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,359
Speaker 4: Keep them comming. Yeah, we're talking about psychic powers, all

473
00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:48,120
Speaker 4: the stuff in the intro to the show. Yeah, precognition,

474
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:51,720
Speaker 4: tele slash, psycho kinesis. You know, all that bleeding edge

475
00:27:51,760 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 4: consciousness stuff, the idea of an afterlife, you know, the

476
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 4: good bits, all.

477
00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:59,360
Speaker 2: This, all the good ones, all the slow jazz. If

478
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:03,360
Speaker 2: you visit the website jazz, Yeah, if you visit their

479
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:06,960
Speaker 2: website for that slow jazz, you can see thousands of

480
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 2: articles that are free to read. Right now, Just be

481
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:15,000
Speaker 2: very well aware, folks, some of your friends and family

482
00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:18,919
Speaker 2: and loved ones in the stem fields are going to

483
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:24,439
Speaker 2: immediately dismiss this work as pseudoscience or at the very worst,

484
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:26,160
Speaker 2: a cynical rift.

485
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:29,119
Speaker 4: Yeah, it always comes back to our interview with Russell

486
00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:31,120
Speaker 4: Targ from me, I know, I bring it up all

487
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:33,639
Speaker 4: the time, but that dude and talking to him not

488
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:35,560
Speaker 4: to mention that he was like the clearly the influence

489
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 4: for the real life was Egon Spengler. It was such

490
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 4: an interesting intersection of like the science and the this

491
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:45,600
Speaker 4: sort of like this you know, sort of more out

492
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 4: there stuff, and he seemed to do a pretty good

493
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 4: job of kind of reconciling the two. So go back

494
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:52,800
Speaker 4: and check out that episode to talk to him. Search

495
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,640
Speaker 4: from a guy who's on the edge of that kind

496
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 4: of you know thought.

497
00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:59,800
Speaker 2: Thanks Doc Targ, thank you so much. What a cool

498
00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 2: guy seriously saying it.

499
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 3: But before we again, before anybody passes judgment on this thing,

500
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:07,280
Speaker 3: take a minute to head over to their website and

501
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 3: look at the folks who are involved, the PhDs that

502
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:14,600
Speaker 3: are involved in their background. So the current president, this

503
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 3: guy named Thomas G. Broffi or Brophy. I'm sorry, I

504
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,880
Speaker 3: don't know how to pronounce that name. He was initially

505
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 3: at least starting out a planetary astrophysicist with the University

506
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 3: of Colorado, and this dude was a part of the

507
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 3: Voyager program. Guys, you remember that one h that sent

508
00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 3: out the satellites.

509
00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 2: It's the Jeer in the Star Trek universe.

510
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 3: Oh oh, well, in this one it's Voyager.

511
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 2: I know, I just spoiled an awesome Star Trek film.

512
00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:45,000
Speaker 3: But then also in this thing in ions, you will

513
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:46,960
Speaker 3: see that one of their board of directors, and I

514
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:48,280
Speaker 3: don't know if this is a good thing or a

515
00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 3: bad thing. One of the board of directors is a

516
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 3: guy named George Zimmer. Does anybody know that name? Do

517
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:56,440
Speaker 3: you remember that name?

518
00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 4: It's really ringing a bell, Matt, but I can't put

519
00:29:58,680 --> 00:29:59,360
Speaker 4: my finger on it.

520
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 3: Is the founder of the Men's Warehouse, which is cool,

521
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 3: you know.

522
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:07,960
Speaker 4: Issues, No, there was some weirdness with that cat, wasn't there.

523
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 3: I don't know, there wasn't I just worked a commercials.

524
00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 2: We're definitely talking about him being into some weird stuff.

525
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 2: For sure, that's literally true.

526
00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 3: But is it super cool that he's into that stuff

527
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 3: or does it make you feel like the thing has

528
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:25,680
Speaker 3: less credibility because he's into that stuff. I don't know,

529
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 3: He's your gut is going to tell you how you

530
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 3: feel about this organization.

531
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:34,160
Speaker 2: Right, So, for our purposes tonight, let's look at their

532
00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:39,680
Speaker 2: work into the nature of the mind, precognition or presentiment

533
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:43,840
Speaker 2: as they call it. And time. There's a popular mechanics

534
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:47,560
Speaker 2: article that published in November of last year, twenty twenty five.

535
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 2: We're recording this in January of twenty twenty six. And

536
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:58,240
Speaker 2: this this article went viral because so many people were

537
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 2: fascinated by conversations the journalists were having with Dean Ratten,

538
00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 2: as well as his colleague Julia Mossbridge, also a PhD,

539
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 2: works at ions and has her own institute, the moss

540
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 2: Bridge Institute.

541
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:15,960
Speaker 3: It is a little weirder.

542
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:17,680
Speaker 4: Can I just really quickly say I didn't mean to

543
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 4: malign mister George Zimmer. By all accounts, he was a

544
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 4: lovely dude, and he was fired by the company and

545
00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:25,000
Speaker 4: then went on to found his own tux company. But

546
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:28,600
Speaker 4: apparently he was fired because he wanted to maintain a smaller,

547
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:32,600
Speaker 4: more personalized business than the board of directors of Men's

548
00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:34,760
Speaker 4: Warehouse was not down with that. So I didn't mean

549
00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 4: to say like there was some weirdness about George Zimmer.

550
00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 4: Seems like a good.

551
00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:40,160
Speaker 2: Guy, I got some suits from there back in the day.

552
00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 2: Oh yeahouse. I also didn't realize what you guys know.

553
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 2: I'm a very strange entity. I didn't realize Men's warehouse

554
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 2: was a pun warehouse. Right, he took me. I was

555
00:31:55,120 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 2: reading the label inside of one of the suit jackets,

556
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:04,960
Speaker 2: went oh cool, I love a pud. Let's go to Mossbridge.

557
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:09,600
Speaker 2: As we said, she's an's researcher, she's got her own institute.

558
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:13,520
Speaker 2: She is additionally a senior Fellow in what they call

559
00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:18,440
Speaker 2: Human Potential at Florida Atlantic University's Center for the Future

560
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:22,200
Speaker 2: of AI, Mind and Society. This reminds me of the

561
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 2: kind of work our legendary pal Damian Patrick Williams does.

562
00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:30,360
Speaker 3: Mm hmm. It's all about technology right in the mind

563
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:34,920
Speaker 3: of technology and the future, very into artificial intelligence over

564
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 3: there in large language models.

565
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 2: And Mossbridge is one hundred percent a true believer in

566
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 2: concepts like precognition, following one's intuition or hunch's. Mossbridge has

567
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:54,600
Speaker 2: spoken at length about her personal experiences. Again, everybody has them, right,

568
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:59,320
Speaker 2: growing up, things that members of our family experience. The

569
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 2: real seems that it inspired her later research as an

570
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,160
Speaker 2: adult and I'd love for us to share a quote

571
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:11,200
Speaker 2: from moss Bridge regarding precognition.

572
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:12,360
Speaker 4: Let's do it.

573
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:17,680
Speaker 2: She says, quote, It's not hard to understand precognition, it's

574
00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 2: just hard to believe for people who haven't experienced it.

575
00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:25,960
Speaker 2: We don't understand how time works, says moss Bridge. Even

576
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 2: physicists are admitting they really don't know how it works.

577
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,080
Speaker 2: We are stuck on this idea that if you are

578
00:33:32,120 --> 00:33:36,200
Speaker 2: truly scientific, you are going to think about time linearly.

579
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:39,120
Speaker 2: But is it really linear?

580
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:45,479
Speaker 3: I like this because it's leaving open the question, right,

581
00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:50,000
Speaker 3: and it's leaving open the possibility to explore further right,

582
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:53,520
Speaker 3: and not closing off any other possibilities the way we

583
00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:56,360
Speaker 3: saw with three I Atlas this past year in twenty

584
00:33:56,400 --> 00:34:01,360
Speaker 3: twenty five, right, we saw literally one scientist Harvard saying, Hey,

585
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 3: let's let's talk about the possibilities here, let's actually look

586
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,360
Speaker 3: at this stuff and think about it in this way.

587
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:10,239
Speaker 3: If only for the possibility then it could be that.

588
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:12,600
Speaker 3: And then you had most of the rest of the

589
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 3: scientific community just saying no, yeah.

590
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 2: And we're talking about Doc A vi Lob over there.

591
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 2: And I love that point because ave Lobe was not

592
00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:27,879
Speaker 2: making crazy claims in a definitive way. Doctor Lobe was saying,

593
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:31,319
Speaker 2: or Professor Loebe was saying, we should think about this.

594
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,600
Speaker 2: You know, there's nothing wrong with asking what if? That

595
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:40,400
Speaker 2: is the beating heart of science. But then the dogma

596
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:44,120
Speaker 2: comes in and things get real sticky and compartmentalized.

597
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, Love was putting out some like very particular figures

598
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:50,600
Speaker 3: with like the percentage of the possibility and all that that.

599
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:54,000
Speaker 3: You're you know, you could argue with some of that stuff.

600
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:58,480
Speaker 3: The open mindedness thing, I think though, is crucial for

601
00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 3: right now and in the future, just to leave open

602
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:02,720
Speaker 3: some possibilities.

603
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, And a lot of the resistance from the Ivory

604
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:14,280
Speaker 2: Tower to ideas about precognition and psychic phenomena. In Mossbridge's opinion,

605
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:18,680
Speaker 2: this comes from fear, the fear of the unknown, or

606
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:22,839
Speaker 2: the fear that, hey, maybe the ground of reality is

607
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:26,080
Speaker 2: not as solid as I thought. You know, It's like,

608
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:28,640
Speaker 2: do you ever have that moment or I'm sure you

609
00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 2: guys have. I don't want to cast dispersion on your

610
00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:34,359
Speaker 2: ambulatory abilities, but have you ever had that moment where

611
00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 2: you're walking upstairs, you're not really paying attention and your

612
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:41,000
Speaker 2: body thinks there's an extra step and you have that

613
00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:43,280
Speaker 2: little oh wait, I'm at the top.

614
00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:46,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, appropriate reception off for just a moment, just a

615
00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:49,319
Speaker 3: little blip, a little glitch or something. I've had that.

616
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 4: It's also like when you run into another human and

617
00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 4: you kind of both like mirror each other and like.

618
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:58,960
Speaker 2: Trying to Yeah, yeah, it's going down an Aisle eleven

619
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:01,680
Speaker 2: or the farmer dude.

620
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:04,600
Speaker 3: Just I'm sorry to jump back to three alys again, Guys,

621
00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 3: I just recalled the piece of news came out. We're

622
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 3: recording this on Friday, January ninth. A piece of news

623
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:14,359
Speaker 3: came out, like yesterday, maybe about the CIA making an

624
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 3: official statement that they can neither confirm nor deny any

625
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 3: of the documentation they have about the comment. Right, this

626
00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 3: was a little weird, but I guess it's fine.

627
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:29,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. It could also just be a staffing issue at

628
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:32,200
Speaker 2: this point. Okay, you know what I mean. There's like

629
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:35,760
Speaker 2: one guy and he's running out of black high lighters

630
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:38,400
Speaker 2: and he's still trying to get the invoice through for

631
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 2: his next pack at twelve.

632
00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:43,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, crap, we're almost at two percent of the Epstein files.

633
00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:45,040
Speaker 3: We need more black markers.

634
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,959
Speaker 2: Sorry, guys, I told you I was taking Tuesday off.

635
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 4: Did you get Apparently a lot of that was done

636
00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:55,040
Speaker 4: with like Adobe Acrobat and download that you can you

637
00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:56,680
Speaker 4: can just undo the redactions.

638
00:36:56,760 --> 00:36:58,480
Speaker 3: Yes, wait what Yeah?

639
00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:01,760
Speaker 2: At least in the first part, which partially explains the pause,

640
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:04,399
Speaker 2: because they have to figure out their process, we kind

641
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:08,120
Speaker 2: of go back to the black highlighters. They just eyelighters

642
00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:11,759
Speaker 2: show up that op sect my brothers in christ oh Man,

643
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:16,040
Speaker 2: and with all this conversation about the nature of time,

644
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:19,759
Speaker 2: which we're about to dive into, Uh, we've got to

645
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:23,000
Speaker 2: take a break. We're getting into some heavy stuff. We'll

646
00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:26,359
Speaker 2: have a word from our sponsors, will be right back.

647
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:30,760
Speaker 2: Or wait, are we all worthy there? I have a hunch.

648
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:42,440
Speaker 2: So all of the folks at Ions or Ions, they're

649
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:48,640
Speaker 2: doing really fascinating research and they believe that they they

650
00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:55,680
Speaker 2: hit upon a perspective that that is beautiful, actually beautifully

651
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 2: thought out. They said, what if we're asking the wrong questions?

652
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,640
Speaker 2: What if we're not What if we're focusing too much

653
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:06,000
Speaker 2: on the idea of predicting the future and we should

654
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:10,960
Speaker 2: be asking what we mean when we say time? What

655
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:15,319
Speaker 2: what are we getting wrong in our assumptions that constructed

656
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:16,719
Speaker 2: our earlier questions?

657
00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 3: So it makes a flat circle bend.

658
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:26,800
Speaker 2: Anyway, I've got to stop rewatching it, man.

659
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:30,919
Speaker 3: I do it all the time Detective season.

660
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:33,880
Speaker 4: One, and also that meme format. He's just ripping that sig.

661
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,160
Speaker 4: You know that's a.

662
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:40,960
Speaker 2: Class and uh, what's the what are some of the quotes, Oh,

663
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:44,480
Speaker 2: the world needs bad men, Marty, we keep the other

664
00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:45,760
Speaker 2: bad men from the door.

665
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:50,720
Speaker 4: I also like it when then he responds, stop saying odd.

666
00:38:53,480 --> 00:38:58,920
Speaker 2: Let's smell on a psychosphere a moment, A moment for

667
00:38:59,120 --> 00:38:59,919
Speaker 2: silent flat.

668
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:03,400
Speaker 4: Oh the bit he actually says he miss says it.

669
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:06,880
Speaker 4: He says, let's talk about smelling a psycho sphere, but

670
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:09,680
Speaker 4: he actually says psychosphere. But there was.

671
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:12,759
Speaker 2: Something where he's like, which hot meat? I can't I

672
00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:16,479
Speaker 2: can't remember the phrase. God dang, that was a good show.

673
00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:18,000
Speaker 4: Banger of a season, banger of.

674
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:23,680
Speaker 2: The season, and and raddening crew at all are making

675
00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:27,760
Speaker 2: some bangers of scientific claims or at the very least

676
00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:31,120
Speaker 2: lobe style asking questions. We've got a quote from Raden

677
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:36,000
Speaker 2: which sort of expounds on what we were teasing about.

678
00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:39,880
Speaker 4: That's right, He notes, time is not how we experience

679
00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:43,399
Speaker 4: it on an everyday level. In quantum mechanics, time may

680
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 4: not even be part of our physical reality. It's not

681
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:49,920
Speaker 4: that time doesn't exist, it's just that it behaves in

682
00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:52,799
Speaker 4: a much stranger way than how it is seen through

683
00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:57,240
Speaker 4: the lens of the human experience. I just recently watched

684
00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:01,399
Speaker 4: most of with my kid and their friend Interstellar, which

685
00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:04,680
Speaker 4: does a really interesting job of exploring some time dilation

686
00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:09,600
Speaker 4: and like the way times experienced differently. And I don't know,

687
00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:13,040
Speaker 4: it's like all this wormhole stuff and Einstein Rosen bridges

688
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:14,719
Speaker 4: and all of that. Very very interesting, and I think

689
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:17,799
Speaker 4: it tries really hard to stick pretty close to some

690
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 4: actual provable science ways of explaining this kind of stuff.

691
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:27,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, or at least some currently beloved speculation there. Yeah,

692
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:31,120
Speaker 2: Interstellar is a banger. We're all figuring out this together.

693
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 2: I would argue that it is. It is absolutely quintessential

694
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:43,240
Speaker 2: good science fiction because it explores the science, it explores

695
00:40:43,239 --> 00:40:45,839
Speaker 2: the possibility, and it keeps a human heart beating at

696
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:47,400
Speaker 2: the core, you know, very much so.

697
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:50,960
Speaker 3: But humans don't experience time in the same way we

698
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:53,120
Speaker 3: think we do what right?

699
00:40:53,239 --> 00:40:53,439
Speaker 2: Right?

700
00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:55,879
Speaker 4: Okay, So back to Dean go on right?

701
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:59,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, okay, so you're this guy must be an

702
00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:03,239
Speaker 2: epic haank you pause for a second. You say, Doc,

703
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 2: what and he says, what I'm saying is our consciousnesses

704
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 2: are maybe able to jump outside of ordinary experience and

705
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:15,880
Speaker 2: receive information from the past or the future. Now, before

706
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:20,359
Speaker 2: we say that's hogwash or something, remember when he's saying

707
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:24,040
Speaker 2: from the past to the future, he's also he's he's

708
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:25,960
Speaker 2: talking about just remembering stuff.

709
00:41:26,120 --> 00:41:28,200
Speaker 4: That's an amazing experience, which we set up at the

710
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:30,319
Speaker 4: very top banner. You set up this idea of the

711
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:34,680
Speaker 4: way we experience memory is a form of time travel.

712
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:38,759
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yes, but in this case, you are remembering

713
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 3: stuff that has yet to happen in your conscious experience,

714
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:46,520
Speaker 3: but perhaps it has occurred on the great wheel of

715
00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:49,680
Speaker 3: time that is rolling through whether or not you know

716
00:41:49,760 --> 00:41:53,920
Speaker 3: what's happened, whether or not you know what's happened, whether.

717
00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:58,520
Speaker 2: You experiencially anticipated in it. The Wheel of paw Right

718
00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:02,799
Speaker 2: High to the Dark Tower. That is a weird spoiler

719
00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:04,360
Speaker 2: for any Stephen King fans.

720
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:06,120
Speaker 4: I think it's too esoteric. I don't know if it's

721
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:08,960
Speaker 4: even going to constitute a spoil for most people. It's good,

722
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:10,760
Speaker 4: but I never made it that far in the series.

723
00:42:10,800 --> 00:42:12,359
Speaker 4: But I know that there's some good stuff in there.

724
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:13,400
Speaker 4: Blame the train.

725
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:15,520
Speaker 2: Blame the train. Yeah, he's a pain.

726
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:18,000
Speaker 3: So I know there's a lot more to explore, your guys,

727
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:21,600
Speaker 3: But it is strange to me to imagine if this

728
00:42:21,719 --> 00:42:25,360
Speaker 3: were true. Right, coming to it from a skeptical point

729
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:27,880
Speaker 3: of view, I think it feels like we would know

730
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:31,080
Speaker 3: more than just a tiny gut feeling every once in

731
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:33,640
Speaker 3: a while about what's going to happen right.

732
00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:37,319
Speaker 2: Right right, There would be some sort of determinism, you know.

733
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:41,560
Speaker 2: We want to shout out a phenomenal book by an

734
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:46,279
Speaker 2: MIT professor named Alan Leitman. It's called Einstein's Dreams. We've

735
00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 2: mentioned it before, you guys, remember this one. It's a

736
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:51,960
Speaker 2: real short book. It's a great read. It's all about

737
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:56,240
Speaker 2: this sleepy patent clerk named Albert and he just can't

738
00:42:56,280 --> 00:42:59,480
Speaker 2: stay awake at his boring desk job, and every time

739
00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:03,680
Speaker 2: he goes to sleep, he has these strange dreams about

740
00:43:03,719 --> 00:43:10,319
Speaker 2: the nature of time. It's pretty good. Doc Lightman is

741
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 2: not paying us to say it, but if you, if

742
00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 2: you get a chance, please read the book. It's that's

743
00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:19,719
Speaker 2: the right because you're saying, or we're saying here that

744
00:43:20,600 --> 00:43:27,040
Speaker 2: if this phenomenon exists, then why isn't it a bigger deal. Why,

745
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 2: as you said, Matt, are we just getting little little

746
00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:34,320
Speaker 2: twinkles of the future every now and then inexplicable? Why

747
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:39,160
Speaker 2: aren't we waking up right every sunset or sunrise or

748
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:43,480
Speaker 2: whatever and thinking immediately, Oh, I know what is going

749
00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:46,640
Speaker 2: to happen right at three forty five, or I know

750
00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:52,440
Speaker 2: what's going to happen on January twenty third, twenty twenty six.

751
00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 4: And I suppose folks that you know put forth, that

752
00:43:56,680 --> 00:44:01,080
Speaker 4: they have psychic abilities might be able to focus that

753
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:04,640
Speaker 4: thing that maybe most of us can experience some small

754
00:44:04,680 --> 00:44:05,760
Speaker 4: little glimmer.

755
00:44:05,360 --> 00:44:09,760
Speaker 2: Of yeah, like an exercise and a muscle right, sure, yeah,

756
00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:13,320
Speaker 2: I mean, our buddy Dean has been at this so long,

757
00:44:14,239 --> 00:44:16,480
Speaker 2: for a long time, haha, time jokes.

758
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:20,560
Speaker 4: Well, I'm curious though about how this stuff registers on

759
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:25,839
Speaker 4: you know, brain scanning type equipment egs. You mean that's

760
00:44:25,840 --> 00:44:26,840
Speaker 4: what I mean, Matt.

761
00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 2: Oh yeah. Let's go back to Doc Radden's days at

762
00:44:33,200 --> 00:44:36,800
Speaker 2: the University of Nevada in the nineteen nineties. We discussed

763
00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:39,440
Speaker 2: this a little bit in a recent Strange News recording.

764
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:42,120
Speaker 2: You can check those out. They're available wherever you find

765
00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:46,360
Speaker 2: your favorite shows. All right, so, EEG machine in what experiment.

766
00:44:47,320 --> 00:44:52,799
Speaker 2: The doc had these participants attached to EG machines and

767
00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:56,200
Speaker 2: then he told them, all right, you're going to press

768
00:44:56,239 --> 00:44:59,600
Speaker 2: a button, and when you press this button, there's going

769
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:02,120
Speaker 2: to be a brief delay of five seconds, and then

770
00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:05,319
Speaker 2: an image is going to pop on the screen. The

771
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:08,399
Speaker 2: image is either going to be negative or positive, by

772
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:12,720
Speaker 2: which we mean you might see something like a yellow

773
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:16,360
Speaker 2: dog bounding in the sunshine in a park, or you

774
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:19,759
Speaker 2: might see a car crash. You don't know. As the participant,

775
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:23,680
Speaker 2: you hit the button, boop, and then five four three

776
00:45:23,719 --> 00:45:30,359
Speaker 2: two one, boom the image appears. So they're not being

777
00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:37,320
Speaker 2: asked necessarily to predict this like the old Ghostbusters card experiment. Instead,

778
00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:43,319
Speaker 2: the EEG is measuring brain activity in that pause, in

779
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:46,520
Speaker 2: that five seconds between when you hit the button and

780
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:48,319
Speaker 2: when the image appears.

781
00:45:49,640 --> 00:45:51,160
Speaker 3: This is so strange to me, and I have so

782
00:45:51,239 --> 00:45:54,640
Speaker 3: many questions about it, man, I have so many questions

783
00:45:54,760 --> 00:45:59,720
Speaker 3: just because you can if you think about it rationally,

784
00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:02,720
Speaker 3: you think, oh, well, people are now feeling anxiety before

785
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:05,080
Speaker 3: a new image comes up, because it could be either

786
00:46:05,160 --> 00:46:09,200
Speaker 3: great or terrible, right, and so you're feeling that anxiety, right.

787
00:46:09,520 --> 00:46:12,560
Speaker 3: But their result showed that when the positive image was

788
00:46:12,600 --> 00:46:14,879
Speaker 3: about to come up. They didn't feel it.

789
00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:18,640
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay, this is fascinating. This is

790
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:23,560
Speaker 2: the controversials right. Just as just as Matt said there,

791
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:29,480
Speaker 2: the positive image didn't really rock the EEG. No emotion

792
00:46:29,880 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 2: or change in brain activity however measured. But if a

793
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:37,680
Speaker 2: negative image was on the way within that five second

794
00:46:37,719 --> 00:46:43,240
Speaker 2: span of time, there were spikes that occurred the brain

795
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:46,840
Speaker 2: activity that the conscious mind of the participant was probably

796
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:49,640
Speaker 2: not clocking. It seemed to respond to what was going

797
00:46:49,719 --> 00:46:52,520
Speaker 2: to be displayed in advance of that thing being displayed.

798
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:57,120
Speaker 4: So I guess if we trust this method, the study

799
00:46:57,160 --> 00:47:00,279
Speaker 4: is saying that somehow participants are able to sort of

800
00:47:00,320 --> 00:47:04,440
Speaker 4: anticipate or into it, the display of a negative image,

801
00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:07,200
Speaker 4: even though they had no way of knowing that it

802
00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:07,720
Speaker 4: was coming.

803
00:47:08,080 --> 00:47:11,560
Speaker 2: Nailed it, and one, Yeah, that's the idea. It reminds

804
00:47:11,600 --> 00:47:14,120
Speaker 2: me of I've got to pull up this study later

805
00:47:14,360 --> 00:47:16,760
Speaker 2: right to us if you want to read the full paper.

806
00:47:16,800 --> 00:47:21,080
Speaker 2: But I've got to find that study where the results

807
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:26,520
Speaker 2: showed that people's test scores improved when they studied after

808
00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 2: taking a test.

809
00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 4: We talked about that recently, and still it was a

810
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 4: hard one to wrap my little head around.

811
00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:35,000
Speaker 2: I don't know if we're built for it, you guys. Yeah,

812
00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:37,120
Speaker 2: I don't know if we're built to understand it or

813
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 2: simply built to experience it.

814
00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:40,279
Speaker 4: That's true.

815
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:45,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, I keep thinking about it, the idea, I don't know.

816
00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:51,320
Speaker 2: You raised a great point there about the methodology. That's where, honestly,

817
00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:56,200
Speaker 2: the bulk of scientific thought of jets to Radden's experiments

818
00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:00,279
Speaker 2: because they say, hey, they're a thousand new poles that

819
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:02,480
Speaker 2: you need to explain from their perspective.

820
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:03,920
Speaker 4: I agreed.

821
00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:06,480
Speaker 3: I just want to put this out here, guys. I

822
00:48:06,520 --> 00:48:08,560
Speaker 3: just did a cursory search for what you were just

823
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:10,440
Speaker 3: talking about Ben in that study because I recalled it

824
00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:12,320
Speaker 3: and I thought, well, I can pull this up really fast.

825
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:15,880
Speaker 3: I bet we could do that. The search terms required,

826
00:48:16,800 --> 00:48:22,080
Speaker 3: test scores improve study after all of this. The way

827
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:28,480
Speaker 3: Google and all these search things return things nowadays, it's impossible.

828
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:31,840
Speaker 3: It's trying to give me a ten thousand different things

829
00:48:31,880 --> 00:48:34,960
Speaker 3: that it thinks I want. But I just need to

830
00:48:34,960 --> 00:48:35,719
Speaker 3: get better at search.

831
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:38,640
Speaker 4: Then you just want to return things that contain those

832
00:48:38,680 --> 00:48:41,719
Speaker 4: combinations of terms. But now the AI algorithm is like.

833
00:48:42,400 --> 00:48:44,600
Speaker 3: You are, I want to help you to let me

834
00:48:44,600 --> 00:48:45,959
Speaker 3: give you what you need.

835
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:51,040
Speaker 2: Here's a recipe for precognition cast role. Also, I mean,

836
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:54,000
Speaker 2: I would argue it is indeed the stuff they don't

837
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:59,520
Speaker 2: want you to know, because, uh, searching for anything on

838
00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 2: the Internet is very much like casting an incantation, right,

839
00:49:05,120 --> 00:49:08,800
Speaker 2: You've got to get your your magic words correct.

840
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:12,440
Speaker 4: Well, especially now with what is it vibe coding or

841
00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:15,160
Speaker 4: like the way people are using these prompts, you know,

842
00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 4: to generate crazy imagery or what have you. I mean,

843
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:21,560
Speaker 4: that is absolutely a form of incantation something.

844
00:49:22,680 --> 00:49:26,359
Speaker 2: But Pandora's jar is unscrewed. You know, the gin has

845
00:49:26,440 --> 00:49:29,120
Speaker 2: left the lamp, the horses out of the barn, The

846
00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:34,359
Speaker 2: good escaped. Yeah, the badgers have escaped the.

847
00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:36,520
Speaker 4: Bag running rampant through the streets.

848
00:49:36,560 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 2: They're just badgery.

849
00:49:38,480 --> 00:49:40,560
Speaker 4: They really insist upon themselves as badgers.

850
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:45,319
Speaker 2: This is so unrelated, guys, But I was noctivigating. I

851
00:49:45,360 --> 00:49:47,360
Speaker 2: was out on a night walk and I ran into

852
00:49:47,400 --> 00:49:50,320
Speaker 2: a raccoon, but it was a city raccoon.

853
00:49:50,360 --> 00:49:54,759
Speaker 4: Did you guys mirror each other's moves? Funny? This is

854
00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:56,640
Speaker 4: no you go, no, you go racoron.

855
00:49:56,960 --> 00:49:59,400
Speaker 2: This is how weird it was. This has nothing to

856
00:49:59,480 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 2: do with our conversation tonight, but it's just a funny moment.

857
00:50:03,640 --> 00:50:06,680
Speaker 2: And when you said badgers, we had that catchphrase back

858
00:50:06,719 --> 00:50:09,600
Speaker 2: of badgers. It reminded me of this. It was a raccoon, right,

859
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:13,160
Speaker 2: little raccoon guys. He's got those adorable hands, he or she.

860
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:18,600
Speaker 2: They're digging fingers. Yeah, they're digging through some city trash.

861
00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:23,200
Speaker 2: And and it stops and it looks at me, and

862
00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:26,160
Speaker 2: that it slowly takes a bite of whatever it's eating,

863
00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:30,799
Speaker 2: and it choos and it stares at me, and I

864
00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:33,960
Speaker 2: didn't know what to do, so I said hey, and

865
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:36,600
Speaker 2: then it just ignored me and went back to the trash.

866
00:50:36,719 --> 00:50:42,240
Speaker 4: And then it says, chaos, that'd be great rubbing them together.

867
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:47,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, ah man, Because I'm thinking about there's

868
00:50:47,040 --> 00:50:49,880
Speaker 5: a few other things that have occurred or pieces of

869
00:50:49,960 --> 00:50:52,279
Speaker 5: information studies that have come out over the past couple

870
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:54,719
Speaker 5: of years, and one of them is looking at this

871
00:50:55,000 --> 00:51:00,040
Speaker 5: exact kind of stuff, but it's looking at, in particular.

872
00:50:59,600 --> 00:51:02,160
Speaker 3: The micro biome, the human microbiome, and whether or not

873
00:51:02,320 --> 00:51:06,440
Speaker 3: the signals going up the Vadgi's nerve that goes, you know,

874
00:51:06,480 --> 00:51:08,960
Speaker 3: down into your guts and then is connected directly up

875
00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:12,400
Speaker 3: to your brain, and whether or not literally those gut feelings,

876
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:16,600
Speaker 3: the way your microbiome is handling stuff and signals it's

877
00:51:16,640 --> 00:51:19,920
Speaker 3: sending to your brain. If that can actually play us

878
00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:23,359
Speaker 3: some kind of part in warning us about something that's

879
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:26,840
Speaker 3: about to happen, Right, So is there a linkage between

880
00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:30,080
Speaker 3: your literal gut and time somehow that we don't understand?

881
00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:33,279
Speaker 3: But then there's pieces There were pieces in here, Like

882
00:51:34,080 --> 00:51:37,480
Speaker 3: BBC Science Focus was talking about a Michigan State University

883
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:41,560
Speaker 3: test that looked at infants, and y'all, for this test,

884
00:51:41,800 --> 00:51:44,239
Speaker 3: I think maybe we've even talked about this before. But

885
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:47,440
Speaker 3: for this study, they would have infants in a room

886
00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:49,960
Speaker 3: with their parents, and they would have people coming in

887
00:51:50,000 --> 00:51:51,640
Speaker 3: and out of the room, and every once in a while,

888
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:54,480
Speaker 3: the person going coming into the room would be wearing

889
00:51:54,520 --> 00:51:58,399
Speaker 3: a horrifying Halloween mask and they were testing to see

890
00:51:58,600 --> 00:52:01,239
Speaker 3: the child's reaction to this new person in the room

891
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:05,480
Speaker 3: that they don't know that looks scary right, Well, but

892
00:52:05,480 --> 00:52:09,120
Speaker 3: the parents were there as fine, whatever traumatized kids for.

893
00:52:10,040 --> 00:52:12,480
Speaker 2: The kids aren't going to remember, They're just gonna have

894
00:52:12,600 --> 00:52:16,160
Speaker 2: weird behavioral patterns and fixation they want them for the

895
00:52:16,200 --> 00:52:16,919
Speaker 2: rest of their lives.

896
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:24,040
Speaker 3: The people running this examination of how a child reacts

897
00:52:24,040 --> 00:52:27,120
Speaker 3: we're also looking at the gut microbiomes of each one

898
00:52:27,160 --> 00:52:30,080
Speaker 3: of these kids and to see whether or not stuff

899
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 3: going on down there is actually going to affect their

900
00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:36,680
Speaker 3: fear response to something. And then thinking about that going

901
00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:39,799
Speaker 3: back in time like is because we do inherit our

902
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:43,319
Speaker 3: gut bacteria in a large part from our parents, you know,

903
00:52:43,560 --> 00:52:46,600
Speaker 3: mostly from our mothers. But as Ben you were saying earlier,

904
00:52:46,800 --> 00:52:50,000
Speaker 3: we alter that, and human society has been altering our

905
00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:54,759
Speaker 3: gut microbiomes for you know, centuries now, with how we've

906
00:52:54,840 --> 00:52:57,399
Speaker 3: changed our society, how it functions, the pollutants we put

907
00:52:57,400 --> 00:53:00,920
Speaker 3: out in there, the weird toxic stuff that we ingest.

908
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:04,239
Speaker 2: How how much of your biome is plastic?

909
00:53:04,440 --> 00:53:08,800
Speaker 4: Let us know, well, apparently a credit card size amount daily.

910
00:53:09,280 --> 00:53:12,160
Speaker 2: I was sick. I didn't pay a credit card like

911
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 2: a sucker. I just gotta right.

912
00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:19,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, But I just found that fascinating thinking about that,

913
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:23,840
Speaker 3: linking up to our not full understanding of time and

914
00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:26,319
Speaker 3: how it functions, and our not full understanding of how

915
00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:30,440
Speaker 3: our microbiome affects us. But you know, again, the bleeding

916
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:34,479
Speaker 3: edges of those sciences are just continually moving outwards if

917
00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:37,680
Speaker 3: we keep open our minds for the weirdness.

918
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:41,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, you always have to ask yourself, if this is true,

919
00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:43,879
Speaker 2: what does it imply right?

920
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:45,319
Speaker 4: If then right?

921
00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:48,400
Speaker 2: If so, then what? And we do know this is

922
00:53:48,400 --> 00:53:51,840
Speaker 2: why I love this point. We do know that the

923
00:53:51,880 --> 00:53:56,640
Speaker 2: current research is showing the human microbiome can have an

924
00:53:56,680 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 2: effect on memory and learning at the very leased. So

925
00:54:01,600 --> 00:54:04,120
Speaker 2: we don't have the you know, it's like we're playing

926
00:54:04,120 --> 00:54:07,680
Speaker 2: the board game Clue, but with a thousand cards in

927
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:12,000
Speaker 2: that little envelope. We're proving some stuff. We don't know

928
00:54:12,520 --> 00:54:16,120
Speaker 2: the whole story yet of the crime that we call

929
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:19,440
Speaker 2: linear time, but we're getting there. We're getting some clues.

930
00:54:20,920 --> 00:54:23,520
Speaker 3: So many murders Time has committed.

931
00:54:23,640 --> 00:54:28,080
Speaker 2: So many murders. Yeah, so far, Time remains the undefeated

932
00:54:28,160 --> 00:54:29,480
Speaker 2: champion of any.

933
00:54:29,320 --> 00:54:34,680
Speaker 4: Beat of speaking of which, check out the movie Time Crimes.

934
00:54:35,320 --> 00:54:39,320
Speaker 4: It's a really good exploration of exactly the kind of

935
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:41,760
Speaker 4: stuff we're talking about, and a lot of these crazy

936
00:54:42,120 --> 00:54:46,239
Speaker 4: parallel versions of things and intuition and time travel, and

937
00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:48,600
Speaker 4: it also involves murder, so you know, kind of sews

938
00:54:48,600 --> 00:54:49,120
Speaker 4: it all together.

939
00:54:49,480 --> 00:54:51,520
Speaker 3: And don't sleep on time cop I know.

940
00:54:56,400 --> 00:55:00,360
Speaker 2: And now we have to do spacey folks, friends andabors

941
00:55:00,440 --> 00:55:04,640
Speaker 2: around the world. Fellow conspiracy realist and especially you, Sean Claude.

942
00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:10,479
Speaker 2: We apologize one time, but yeah, yeah, it was my bad.

943
00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:16,560
Speaker 4: We're sorry. Very small man, very high kick's.

944
00:55:15,400 --> 00:55:17,360
Speaker 2: He could hear us now, man, don't do this.

945
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:22,520
Speaker 3: He's at least super kindly.

946
00:55:23,080 --> 00:55:26,439
Speaker 2: When he turned around, he was clearly giving us what

947
00:55:26,560 --> 00:55:32,600
Speaker 2: Mac from Always Sunny would call it ocular assessments. Do

948
00:55:32,760 --> 00:55:36,359
Speaker 2: these little boys the butts kick today? And he looked

949
00:55:36,360 --> 00:55:37,799
Speaker 2: at us and he thought.

950
00:55:37,719 --> 00:55:39,799
Speaker 4: Nah, I'll let them, let them live on.

951
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:45,520
Speaker 2: Thank you time cop. So okay. For her part, moss

952
00:55:45,520 --> 00:55:48,520
Speaker 2: Bridge is going to argue what we were kind of

953
00:55:48,520 --> 00:55:50,560
Speaker 2: talking about earlier, and no, I believe you're the one

954
00:55:50,560 --> 00:55:54,160
Speaker 2: who mentioned this. Most people are capable of some level

955
00:55:54,320 --> 00:55:59,319
Speaker 2: of precognition or presentiment her her belief in research. This

956
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:02,320
Speaker 2: means this doesn't mean magic, nor does it mean the

957
00:56:02,400 --> 00:56:06,600
Speaker 2: supernatural or divinity. It's Arthur C. Clark style. It's science

958
00:56:06,719 --> 00:56:12,080
Speaker 2: we don't understand. Therefore does seem indistinguishable from magic. And

959
00:56:12,480 --> 00:56:17,600
Speaker 2: it's worth understanding these folks are still conducting research as

960
00:56:17,640 --> 00:56:21,160
Speaker 2: we speak. I don't know, guys, We've got more to

961
00:56:21,239 --> 00:56:25,560
Speaker 2: talk to about time, like theoretical physicists such as Carlo Ravelli,

962
00:56:26,000 --> 00:56:31,959
Speaker 2: who say time does not exist time. Billy Corgan time is.

963
00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:37,600
Speaker 4: You know Billy Corgan as a Cartman voice. It's it

964
00:56:37,640 --> 00:56:40,960
Speaker 4: really works. Just just think about Billy Corgan and then

965
00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:43,279
Speaker 4: insert of the Cartman voice and if they're on the

966
00:56:43,280 --> 00:56:43,919
Speaker 4: same I.

967
00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:48,840
Speaker 2: Don't do it now because your user of mind powers, folks,

968
00:56:48,840 --> 00:56:51,480
Speaker 2: we believe in you. Also, I could totally, I would

969
00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:54,160
Speaker 2: totally tune in for a Cartman version of Melancholy.

970
00:56:54,800 --> 00:56:57,919
Speaker 4: And the is you don't need to, It's already there.

971
00:56:57,960 --> 00:56:58,839
Speaker 2: It's already.

972
00:57:00,080 --> 00:57:00,440
Speaker 4: Okay.

973
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:05,160
Speaker 6: So this is the issue, though, folks, because all right,

974
00:57:07,480 --> 00:57:11,600
Speaker 6: so if time doesn't exist, right, if it is indeed

975
00:57:11,719 --> 00:57:16,640
Speaker 6: an illusion in just how we encounter interconnected events, the

976
00:57:16,720 --> 00:57:21,280
Speaker 6: truth is that our perception of linear time is very

977
00:57:21,400 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 6: much a lived reality.

978
00:57:23,240 --> 00:57:26,240
Speaker 2: It is true for you that this thing has been

979
00:57:26,280 --> 00:57:29,360
Speaker 2: on for you know, around an hour or so. That

980
00:57:29,520 --> 00:57:31,520
Speaker 2: is true for you, whether or not time exists, And

981
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:37,280
Speaker 2: folks peak behind the curtain. Regardless of who wins this

982
00:57:37,400 --> 00:57:41,520
Speaker 2: heady debate, all the world runs on some kind of clock.

983
00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:45,040
Speaker 2: We have tried it. We can guarantee you men's warehouse

984
00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:49,080
Speaker 2: style that you cannot be late to meetings with an

985
00:57:49,080 --> 00:57:53,720
Speaker 2: excuse note from a physicist. Okay, you can't. You can't. Really,

986
00:57:53,840 --> 00:57:56,880
Speaker 2: you can't rock up and say I'm sorry. I was

987
00:57:57,000 --> 00:58:01,560
Speaker 2: twenty minutes late. This guy from MIT wrote a note

988
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:03,120
Speaker 2: about how time doesn't exist.

989
00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:04,960
Speaker 4: It's technically a doctor's note.

990
00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:07,240
Speaker 2: Technically is from a doctor.

991
00:58:07,520 --> 00:58:10,120
Speaker 3: Yes, we were doing some non Newtonian stuff over here.

992
00:58:10,240 --> 00:58:13,560
Speaker 3: On clocks on Mars. That's fine, it's cool some real time.

993
00:58:13,600 --> 00:58:14,280
Speaker 4: You whind me junk?

994
00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:17,440
Speaker 3: Did you see that time the clocks do move differently

995
00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:20,840
Speaker 3: on Mars. That was recently, gosh, I think maybe a

996
00:58:20,880 --> 00:58:21,800
Speaker 3: month ago or something.

997
00:58:21,840 --> 00:58:22,080
Speaker 2: That was.

998
00:58:23,120 --> 00:58:25,000
Speaker 3: I think I think it was proven. But it's like

999
00:58:25,040 --> 00:58:29,280
Speaker 3: four hundred and seventy something milliseconds difference between clocks on

1000
00:58:29,320 --> 00:58:32,920
Speaker 3: Mars and on Earth. And we're talking about like not

1001
00:58:33,120 --> 00:58:35,120
Speaker 3: as though. We're not talking about the way the planet

1002
00:58:35,160 --> 00:58:37,920
Speaker 3: moves around the Sun or anything like that, or the

1003
00:58:37,920 --> 00:58:41,720
Speaker 3: way it rotates. It's just the clocks are different. Man,

1004
00:58:41,880 --> 00:58:43,040
Speaker 3: time's different, right.

1005
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:46,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, that relates to the interstellar thing, where like they

1006
00:58:46,520 --> 00:58:49,720
Speaker 4: time okay, time passes differently depending on how far away

1007
00:58:49,880 --> 00:58:50,160
Speaker 4: you know.

1008
00:58:50,280 --> 00:58:53,000
Speaker 2: Right, and gravitational effects. They had a lot of fun

1009
00:58:53,040 --> 00:58:54,920
Speaker 2: with that one. And we're talking a little bit about

1010
00:58:54,920 --> 00:59:00,760
Speaker 2: time dilation. Because Newtonian physics everybody remembers Isaac right, he

1011
00:59:00,960 --> 00:59:02,760
Speaker 2: was the master of the Royal Mint.

1012
00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:07,160
Speaker 4: He did some other stuff, Yeah, No, he was a

1013
00:59:07,240 --> 00:59:11,480
Speaker 4: crack forgery detective. Yes, in addition to kind of discovering

1014
00:59:11,480 --> 00:59:12,280
Speaker 4: how gravity works.

1015
00:59:12,480 --> 00:59:17,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, I had a weird relationships with apples anecdotally. But okay.

1016
00:59:17,240 --> 00:59:22,640
Speaker 2: Newtonian physics argues there is a single universal now. But

1017
00:59:22,920 --> 00:59:24,960
Speaker 2: we had to throw that stuff out of the window

1018
00:59:25,080 --> 00:59:28,320
Speaker 2: Russia style when Einstein proved time as relative.

1019
00:59:28,880 --> 00:59:30,200
Speaker 3: Had to defenestrate that thing.

1020
00:59:30,480 --> 00:59:34,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, how can you finistrates anymore? Used to go back

1021
00:59:34,920 --> 00:59:35,680
Speaker 2: into windows?

1022
00:59:35,720 --> 00:59:37,680
Speaker 4: Is that when you climbed through a window like in

1023
00:59:37,720 --> 00:59:39,120
Speaker 4: the Canterbury Tails.

1024
00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:41,720
Speaker 3: Time is moving so fast nowadays?

1025
00:59:42,040 --> 00:59:45,680
Speaker 2: Oh geez, well, we do know it's very much a

1026
00:59:45,800 --> 00:59:49,600
Speaker 2: lived reality. Maybe we go back to intuition, where this

1027
00:59:50,160 --> 00:59:54,680
Speaker 2: whole mad cap escapadegan. There is no denying that people

1028
00:59:54,840 --> 01:00:01,520
Speaker 2: do experience hunches and that we can't always haunch rationalize those.

1029
01:00:01,840 --> 01:00:04,600
Speaker 2: As you're joining us, now, you're going to find all

1030
01:00:04,760 --> 01:00:08,560
Speaker 2: manner of scientists who are hotly debating the mechanisms of intuition.

1031
01:00:09,200 --> 01:00:12,920
Speaker 2: Some of these moments can be explained through various understood

1032
01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:17,360
Speaker 2: mundane things. Mentalists in particular, like the legendary Darren Brown

1033
01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:20,760
Speaker 2: have a field day with unconscious sensory collection.

1034
01:00:21,800 --> 01:00:24,640
Speaker 4: Right, And a lot of these experts do agree that

1035
01:00:24,680 --> 01:00:26,840
Speaker 4: there's still a lot more to learn about this phenomenon.

1036
01:00:26,960 --> 01:00:28,240
Speaker 4: But what are we talking about?

1037
01:00:28,680 --> 01:00:31,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, what exactly is there to learn? And where does

1038
01:00:31,720 --> 01:00:35,400
Speaker 2: this strange bag of badgers leave us? You know, if

1039
01:00:35,400 --> 01:00:39,800
Speaker 2: we're unraveling the hidden science of gut feelings and intuition

1040
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:44,800
Speaker 2: so figurative, literal, and cognitive, that might crack the case

1041
01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:47,360
Speaker 2: for us. This might be the lead we need to

1042
01:00:47,440 --> 01:00:51,480
Speaker 2: figure out once and for all the true nature of time.

1043
01:00:52,040 --> 01:00:56,479
Speaker 3: Dune A right, guys, I'm I'm going through something right now.

1044
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:00,120
Speaker 3: Not to get too personal or too much information, And

1045
01:01:00,160 --> 01:01:03,360
Speaker 3: I'm on a round of antibiotics because of sinus infection

1046
01:01:04,360 --> 01:01:07,200
Speaker 3: that was pretty heinous. Sure, and generally I wouldn't take

1047
01:01:07,200 --> 01:01:09,600
Speaker 3: antibiotics because of what we learned on this show about

1048
01:01:09,640 --> 01:01:13,880
Speaker 3: herd immunity and all kinds of other things that, you know, yeah,

1049
01:01:14,040 --> 01:01:17,240
Speaker 3: not great to train the stuff. What an antibiotic is,

1050
01:01:18,040 --> 01:01:22,360
Speaker 3: specific versions and all that stuff. But I feel a

1051
01:01:22,400 --> 01:01:25,400
Speaker 3: little off, and I don't know if it's psychosomatic from

1052
01:01:25,440 --> 01:01:28,080
Speaker 3: reading all these articles about our gut bacteria and how

1053
01:01:28,320 --> 01:01:31,440
Speaker 3: that actually affects things or that physically a lot of

1054
01:01:31,480 --> 01:01:35,160
Speaker 3: mine are currently eradicated. I'm gonna have to get some back.

1055
01:01:36,200 --> 01:01:38,520
Speaker 3: They do tell you to eat probiotics when you're taking

1056
01:01:38,560 --> 01:01:42,640
Speaker 3: antibacterial stuff too, when you're taking antibiotics stuff, which is

1057
01:01:42,720 --> 01:01:45,600
Speaker 3: you know, smart. I guess it's just interesting to me

1058
01:01:45,800 --> 01:01:50,200
Speaker 3: that I do in some way feel a bit disconnected

1059
01:01:50,720 --> 01:01:55,360
Speaker 3: from that intuition thing in this moment as we're recording.

1060
01:01:55,560 --> 01:01:58,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I hear you, man, I think a lot of

1061
01:01:58,240 --> 01:02:02,040
Speaker 2: us have experienced something similar. If you travelers spend a

1062
01:02:02,040 --> 01:02:05,680
Speaker 2: lot of time in very different places with different ecosystems,

1063
01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:10,240
Speaker 2: you can have a similar experience. Like when I'm on

1064
01:02:10,280 --> 01:02:15,800
Speaker 2: the road for a while, I noticed something, something switches internally.

1065
01:02:15,920 --> 01:02:20,720
Speaker 2: And it's not just diet, it's the other environmental variables

1066
01:02:20,760 --> 01:02:22,760
Speaker 2: that change. Yeah.

1067
01:02:23,240 --> 01:02:26,600
Speaker 3: Have you ever noticed a particular place that has that

1068
01:02:26,680 --> 01:02:29,840
Speaker 3: distinct feeling or of like maybe a stronger effect.

1069
01:02:30,240 --> 01:02:35,600
Speaker 2: Yes, I'll tell you story. Yeah, we'll talk off air.

1070
01:02:35,600 --> 01:02:39,200
Speaker 2: Don't blow up the spot, No, seriously, I'll tell you

1071
01:02:39,280 --> 01:02:42,160
Speaker 2: off But this is where we probably call it folks.

1072
01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:46,440
Speaker 2: As you can tell, this concept is endlessly fascinating to

1073
01:02:47,480 --> 01:02:51,600
Speaker 2: Dylan Tennessee pal Fagan to Noel Brown, to Matt Frederick

1074
01:02:51,680 --> 01:02:53,880
Speaker 2: to yours truly, they called me Ben Bullen in this

1075
01:02:54,040 --> 01:02:56,240
Speaker 2: neck of the global woods. We want to hear your

1076
01:02:56,240 --> 01:03:00,920
Speaker 2: thoughts past, present and future on intuition, and we know

1077
01:03:01,040 --> 01:03:03,560
Speaker 2: they're going to be awesome. How do we know that.

1078
01:03:04,240 --> 01:03:06,320
Speaker 2: Let's just say we have a hunch. You can give

1079
01:03:06,400 --> 01:03:08,640
Speaker 2: us a phone call, you can send us an email,

1080
01:03:08,680 --> 01:03:10,080
Speaker 2: and you can find us on the lines.

1081
01:03:10,280 --> 01:03:12,320
Speaker 4: You sure can find us on the lines at the

1082
01:03:12,320 --> 01:03:14,520
Speaker 4: handle Conspiracy Stuff, where we exist on Facebook with our

1083
01:03:14,520 --> 01:03:17,520
Speaker 4: Facebook group here is where it gets crazy, on XFK, Twitter,

1084
01:03:17,560 --> 01:03:19,680
Speaker 4: and on YouTube where we have tons of videos for

1085
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Speaker 4: you to consume and enjoy. On Instagram and TikTok, we're

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Speaker 4: Conspiracy Stuff.

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01:03:25,440 --> 01:03:29,520
Speaker 3: Show call our phone number. It is one eight three

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01:03:29,680 --> 01:03:33,800
Speaker 3: three std WYTK. When you call it, you got to

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01:03:33,840 --> 01:03:36,400
Speaker 3: turn those letters into numbers, but you'll figure it out

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01:03:36,560 --> 01:03:40,200
Speaker 3: to it. Yes, you got three minutes. Give yourself a

1091
01:03:40,240 --> 01:03:42,600
Speaker 3: cool nickname and let us know within the message if

1092
01:03:42,600 --> 01:03:44,560
Speaker 3: we can use it in one of our listener mail

1093
01:03:44,640 --> 01:03:47,520
Speaker 3: episodes that show up in the audio feeds. So you

1094
01:03:47,600 --> 01:03:49,760
Speaker 3: have to go somewhere else to check that out. It'll

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01:03:49,760 --> 01:03:52,200
Speaker 3: be worth your time, we promise. If you want to

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01:03:52,200 --> 01:03:54,680
Speaker 3: send us instead an email. You can do that too.

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Speaker 2: We are I'm doing a creepy light. Guys, the entities

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01:03:58,640 --> 01:04:01,320
Speaker 2: that read every piece of tour respondence we receive be

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01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:04,840
Speaker 2: well aware, yet out afraid. Sometimes the void writes back,

1100
01:04:05,320 --> 01:04:09,440
Speaker 2: maybe you've already said to us something, Maybe we've already responded.

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01:04:09,840 --> 01:04:30,800
Speaker 2: Conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

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01:04:30,920 --> 01:04:33,000
Speaker 3: Stuff they don't want you to know is a production

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01:04:33,080 --> 01:04:37,640
Speaker 3: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

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Speaker 3: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.