WEBVTT - The Mark Moss Show Feb 09, 2022 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:03.200 Hey, everyone, welcome to another episode of the Mark Moss Show, 0:00:03.200 --> 0:00:05.880 where we talk about bitcoin and we talk about the 0:00:06.000 --> 0:00:09.760 decentralized revolution that is happening right now that we're witnessing. 0:00:10.560 --> 0:00:12.360 Each and every week, I'm trying to bring to you 0:00:12.840 --> 0:00:16.040 the most up to date education so you can understand 0:00:16.079 --> 0:00:19.720 what's going on, the latest breaking news, so of course 0:00:19.800 --> 0:00:22.239 you can be the most educated person at that cocktail 0:00:22.280 --> 0:00:25.280 party this weekend, and some very interesting people to give 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:28.080 you some different perspectives, um, and some insights that maybe 0:00:28.120 --> 0:00:32.159 I can't provide. And so, uh, if you are not already, 0:00:32.320 --> 0:00:34.960 if you haven't already, bookmark this, grab your phone, if 0:00:34.960 --> 0:00:39.159 you're not driving, pull your phone, make up calendar appointment 0:00:39.200 --> 0:00:41.040 to be with me each and every week at this time, 0:00:41.080 --> 0:00:44.640 at this channel, same time, same place. You know the drill, 0:00:44.920 --> 0:00:47.279 um if you are driving, do it later. UM. I'm 0:00:47.320 --> 0:00:51.920 in the studio today with Spike Cohen. And Spike was 0:00:52.040 --> 0:00:57.960 a vice presidential candidate UM for the Libertarian Party and 0:00:58.160 --> 0:01:01.000 you can find them on Twitter at real Spike Cohen. 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:03.920 Very interest. I've been following him for quite a long time. 0:01:04.360 --> 0:01:07.360 I love his takes. Anyway, Spike, thanks so much for 0:01:07.440 --> 0:01:11.240 joining me today. Absolutely, Mark thanks for having me on man. Yeah, 0:01:11.280 --> 0:01:13.360 so it was kind of cool. Like I've been following 0:01:13.360 --> 0:01:14.720 you on Twitter for a while. I love I love 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:17.839 the takes that you have. And then, uh, just recently, 0:01:18.560 --> 0:01:20.800 somebody I think that saw me speaking at Ron Paul's 0:01:20.800 --> 0:01:22.360 conference is like, oh, I gotta get you connect with 0:01:22.400 --> 0:01:25.040 Spike and um and then it turns out you've seen 0:01:25.040 --> 0:01:27.000 some of my stuff and retweeted some of my stuff 0:01:27.040 --> 0:01:28.520 and I love how it works out like that. It's 0:01:28.560 --> 0:01:31.880 pretty cool. Yes, yeah, it worked out perfectly. Shout out 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:35.839 to Guerrimo for facilitating all of this. So Spike, I uh, 0:01:35.880 --> 0:01:37.720 I kind of threw out a little bit. I mean, 0:01:37.760 --> 0:01:41.400 you were the vice presidential candidate of the Libertarian Party. 0:01:41.400 --> 0:01:43.640 Give us a little bit of background on on on 0:01:43.800 --> 0:01:46.440 you and how you got into that position and what 0:01:46.480 --> 0:01:49.760 you're doing. Sure, so my background is actually more in 0:01:49.840 --> 0:01:52.280 business than in politics. I kind of came out of 0:01:52.280 --> 0:01:55.960 nowhere seemingly because of that. Um. I started a web 0:01:56.000 --> 0:01:58.480 design company when I was in my teens. Uh, and 0:01:58.520 --> 0:02:01.000 I successfully grew that into I mean it wasn't fortune 0:02:01.560 --> 0:02:03.640 or anything like that, but it was a successful company. 0:02:04.040 --> 0:02:07.600 And uh. And then six years ago I was diagnosed 0:02:07.640 --> 0:02:10.880 with ms UM, and that coupled with the talks we 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:14.080 were having about the course of treatment and things like that, 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:17.240 made me realize our life is finite. I had reached 0:02:17.240 --> 0:02:19.040 a point in my life where I really didn't need 0:02:19.080 --> 0:02:22.919 to work anymore for money, and I really started kind 0:02:22.919 --> 0:02:26.120 of rethinking what I wanted to do and what purpose 0:02:26.160 --> 0:02:28.440 I wanted to have in my life. And I realized 0:02:28.639 --> 0:02:32.280 I wanted my life too. I wanted for the world 0:02:32.280 --> 0:02:34.080 to be a better place because I was here, and 0:02:34.120 --> 0:02:36.240 for to have even mattered that I was here. And 0:02:36.280 --> 0:02:37.720 the best way that I could see to do that 0:02:37.840 --> 0:02:39.919 was to talk to people about the fact that they 0:02:39.960 --> 0:02:42.680 do best when they're most free UM and that got 0:02:42.720 --> 0:02:46.760 me into UM libertarian activism, which sort of parlayed its 0:02:46.760 --> 0:02:50.679 way almost accidentally into it to my getting the UH 0:02:50.720 --> 0:02:53.520 the Libertarian vice presidential nomination. I didn't actually think they 0:02:53.520 --> 0:02:55.520 were going to nominate me. I just was giving them 0:02:55.600 --> 0:02:58.280 ideas about how they could better message and better reach 0:02:58.320 --> 0:03:00.760 out to people, and then they ended up picking UM. 0:03:00.840 --> 0:03:02.840 So that's that's what caught me where I am, and 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:05.040 since then I've been continuing to hit the road and 0:03:05.280 --> 0:03:07.880 spread the message of liberty and work with activists across 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:10.519 the country to help you that m that's great. Now 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:13.960 for everybody listening the Mark Ma Show. We talk about bitcoin, 0:03:14.000 --> 0:03:17.079 but really I like to focus on the intersection of politics, finance, 0:03:17.120 --> 0:03:20.519 and technology, which of course is bitcoin. To me. UM, 0:03:20.560 --> 0:03:24.079 I don't uh, I think bitcoin is a political Um. 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:28.160 It's not prescribed, it's it's technology. It's an open source protocol. UM. 0:03:28.200 --> 0:03:30.840 I think people bring their own biases to it. And 0:03:30.919 --> 0:03:33.239 so we'll talk about some of those things. And I 0:03:33.240 --> 0:03:36.240 would say, just to the listener, just keep an open mind. Uh, 0:03:36.280 --> 0:03:40.320 it's not about politics. Were assigning one necessary way to another, 0:03:40.320 --> 0:03:44.280 but have an open mind about that. But I'm just curious, Spike. UM. 0:03:44.320 --> 0:03:47.560 So you're a business person and then you found yourself 0:03:47.760 --> 0:03:49.960 wanting to kind of submit to a higher, higher calling 0:03:50.040 --> 0:03:52.280 or do something positive, I guess, and that led you 0:03:52.320 --> 0:03:56.040 to the Libertarian party. UM. Had you been a libertarian 0:03:56.120 --> 0:03:59.440 cander or not candidate but a libertarian before that? UM? 0:03:59.600 --> 0:04:02.240 Or were involved in politics before that or was that 0:04:02.280 --> 0:04:04.840 like something new that that dragged you in there? So 0:04:04.880 --> 0:04:07.400 I'd never really been involved in politics other than giving 0:04:07.440 --> 0:04:09.320 my opinion and stuff like that, but I had never 0:04:09.360 --> 0:04:12.360 really actively been involved in politics. And when I started 0:04:12.360 --> 0:04:16.720 off in my activism. Politics wasn't or political party. Politics 0:04:16.960 --> 0:04:19.800 wasn't actually my my initial intention. Like I said, when 0:04:19.839 --> 0:04:22.719 I first ran for the vice presidential nomination, I did 0:04:22.720 --> 0:04:24.960 it in somewhat of a tongue in cheek way and 0:04:25.040 --> 0:04:28.039 really was more just trying to present here is how 0:04:28.080 --> 0:04:31.640 we can present ideas of liberty better. And apparently I 0:04:31.720 --> 0:04:33.680 did a pretty good job of selling my ideas because 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:35.880 they ended up nominating me to be the the the 0:04:35.920 --> 0:04:39.719 actual candidate. Um. But but no, so I actually and 0:04:39.760 --> 0:04:41.359 I tend to agree with you when it comes to 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:45.520 bitcoin and and defying all of that, I actually I'm 0:04:45.520 --> 0:04:47.720 not sure. I think it's a political as much as 0:04:47.800 --> 0:04:52.480 anti political. If politics is groups. If politics as groups 0:04:52.480 --> 0:04:57.719 of people who are trying to basically force people into 0:04:58.440 --> 0:05:02.919 their quote unquote solution by first denying at least partially 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:07.280 denying their cell ownership, their autonomy, and their property and 0:05:07.360 --> 0:05:09.520 their and their money that that comes forth from that. 0:05:09.839 --> 0:05:13.600 Then anything that robs them of that ability to rob you, 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:17.600 to steal from you inherently robs them of that ability 0:05:17.640 --> 0:05:20.799 to engage in politics. Um. And so I actually see 0:05:21.480 --> 0:05:25.160 the blockchain in general and especially bitcoin, as being an 0:05:25.200 --> 0:05:29.159 actual act against that against the ability for politicians and 0:05:29.240 --> 0:05:32.360 policymakers to be able to exert themselves in any real way. 0:05:32.400 --> 0:05:35.440 If we are are our absence of or outside of 0:05:35.480 --> 0:05:38.240 their system they've built, then they really can't control us. 0:05:38.440 --> 0:05:41.320 So then you're saying that a political means that it's 0:05:41.360 --> 0:05:43.880 not assigned to one political party or another, versus what 0:05:43.960 --> 0:05:46.800 you're saying, anti political means it's the end of politics 0:05:46.800 --> 0:05:50.560 where it's not about one party or another but actually, um, 0:05:50.560 --> 0:05:52.880 no party that could co opt you or try to 0:05:52.920 --> 0:05:55.240 put you in that group. Not just no party, but 0:05:55.279 --> 0:05:57.440 the end of these coercive systems, or at the very 0:05:57.520 --> 0:06:01.000 least a great reduction and a and a empowering of 0:06:01.040 --> 0:06:04.680 those coersive systems. Um. Yeah, absolutely, I mean yes, it 0:06:04.760 --> 0:06:07.440 is also a political in that it is not left 0:06:07.600 --> 0:06:10.600 or right or you know, I will say, I do 0:06:10.640 --> 0:06:14.160 believe it's libertarian as opposed to authoritarian, but not libertarian 0:06:14.160 --> 0:06:16.560 in terms of a political party or something like that. 0:06:17.120 --> 0:06:18.680 But no, I think it goes further. I think it 0:06:18.720 --> 0:06:23.120 actually diminishes their capability and their capacity to inflict their 0:06:23.120 --> 0:06:26.440 harm on us through the ability to manipulate the currency 0:06:26.520 --> 0:06:28.240 and the and the money that they forced us to use. 0:06:29.480 --> 0:06:31.840 I'm working on a bigger book. We're talking about a 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:33.440 smaller book. I just wrote put a bigger book, and 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:36.240 um in it, I have a section of the death 0:06:36.240 --> 0:06:38.800 of politics and basically talking the kind of the same 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:43.360 way how um you don't politics is is has has 0:06:43.440 --> 0:06:46.320 kind of emerged really as a function of kind of 0:06:46.320 --> 0:06:49.560 coming out of this industrial age, um, and all this 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:52.560 centralization that's happened because of that. And as we start 0:06:52.560 --> 0:06:54.720 to decentralize and to your point, start taking away the 0:06:54.760 --> 0:06:57.080 money supply, um, it starts to take away their power 0:06:57.120 --> 0:07:00.440 and starts to change and any with technology, we organizers differently, 0:07:00.440 --> 0:07:01.840 and it just kind of takes away the need for 0:07:01.880 --> 0:07:04.600 a lot of that stuff. I guess. Oh, I definitely 0:07:04.640 --> 0:07:08.039 agree that the first example that that was or or 0:07:08.120 --> 0:07:10.960 widespread example that was ever given of a government happened 0:07:11.120 --> 0:07:15.160 in the in Mesopotamia, and the first governors were actually 0:07:15.160 --> 0:07:19.160 called ditch bosses, and it was someone who just hided 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:22.720 how much water in their agricultural system each person could use. 0:07:23.120 --> 0:07:25.240 Maybe that was the best system they could come up 0:07:25.240 --> 0:07:27.440 without the time. But the fact that we're still using 0:07:27.440 --> 0:07:31.240 that same coercive model, uh, you know, thousands of years later, 0:07:31.280 --> 0:07:32.880 I think at the very if it ever was the 0:07:32.880 --> 0:07:37.840 best model that humans had available, we've certainly progressed past that. Yeah. Now, 0:07:37.880 --> 0:07:41.000 one thing that I love about your story is that, UM, 0:07:41.000 --> 0:07:44.160 a problem that it seems I have anyway with people 0:07:44.160 --> 0:07:47.400 in politics is that we have these career politicians that 0:07:47.440 --> 0:07:50.040 have basically never done anything, and so because of that, 0:07:50.080 --> 0:07:52.920 they're detached from reality. They've never had to bounce a 0:07:52.920 --> 0:07:55.680 budget or hire someone or actually try to produce a profit, 0:07:56.560 --> 0:08:01.640 versus you coming from the um actual business world, and uh, 0:08:01.800 --> 0:08:03.520 you have a different perspective on that. Is that something 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:05.480 that you probably see with the you know, a typical 0:08:05.480 --> 0:08:08.080 problem with the politics or politicians. I should say, I 0:08:08.120 --> 0:08:10.440 think the three biggest differences that I know, and yes, 0:08:10.520 --> 0:08:13.120 that's a huge problem. The three biggest differences between me 0:08:13.600 --> 0:08:15.880 and what you would typically see in a politician or 0:08:15.920 --> 0:08:19.160 elected official is Number one, I actually come from knowing 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:21.520 things from living in the real world and not just 0:08:21.560 --> 0:08:24.920 being in career politics. Number Two, I'm not particularly concerned 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:27.440 about getting elected to anything. If I do get elected 0:08:27.440 --> 0:08:30.040 to something, that's fine, But first and foremost I'm trying 0:08:30.080 --> 0:08:33.040 to reach people and share a message with them. And 0:08:33.080 --> 0:08:34.560 then the third thing is, and this has been in 0:08:34.600 --> 0:08:37.640 talking with quite a few elected officials, uh everything from 0:08:37.640 --> 0:08:40.960 the federal level on down. They are often very breaft 0:08:41.000 --> 0:08:45.400 of any knowledge. They have their narratives, they're talking points, 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:49.000 they're good at their at their optics, but in terms 0:08:49.040 --> 0:08:52.720 of of a deep knowledge of anything, that's often very lacking. 0:08:53.200 --> 0:08:56.560 Um And so I'm in that way, I'm I'm I'm different, 0:08:56.600 --> 0:08:59.240 I think than most politicians. Uh. With that said, I 0:08:59.280 --> 0:09:02.600 always when I tell people don't trust politicians, don't don't 0:09:02.600 --> 0:09:04.800 take their word for it, I include me and that 0:09:04.840 --> 0:09:07.400 you know, don't just take my word for anything. But 0:09:07.400 --> 0:09:10.640 but yeah, that's there's that's definitely a huge problem in politics, 0:09:11.000 --> 0:09:15.200 is politicians that are basically going off of narratives and 0:09:15.200 --> 0:09:18.439 and and uh catchphrases and talking points that are being 0:09:18.480 --> 0:09:21.960 handed to them. Yeah, all right, um man, there's so 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:23.880 much that I want to dig into here. I have 0:09:23.920 --> 0:09:25.760 so many questions. And of course you're listening to the 0:09:25.760 --> 0:09:28.280 Mark mo Show. We're talking about bitcoin and the decentralized 0:09:28.320 --> 0:09:32.840 revolution and how it could change or maybe even eliminate 0:09:32.920 --> 0:09:35.520 politics as we know. It's a big subject and a 0:09:35.600 --> 0:09:38.240 dive in more. I'm with Spike Cohen at Real Spike 0:09:38.280 --> 0:09:40.040 Cohen let me be back with more in a second. 0:09:40.040 --> 0:09:42.440 Don't go away, all right, Welcome back. You are listening 0:09:42.480 --> 0:09:45.360 to the Mark Mo Show. We're talking about bitcoin. We're 0:09:45.360 --> 0:09:49.400 talking about the decentralized revolution that is happening right now 0:09:49.440 --> 0:09:51.959 that we're witnessing. And something that I've been talking a 0:09:52.000 --> 0:09:54.800 lot about is how bitcoin is going to change the 0:09:54.840 --> 0:09:57.240 world for any number of ways, one of which is 0:09:57.320 --> 0:09:59.560 that it changes the way that we interact, It changes 0:09:59.600 --> 0:10:02.439 the way that we organize ourselves, and because of that, 0:10:02.640 --> 0:10:05.720 it's going to change the course of humanity. Right. It's 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:10.679 a technological revolution, not in technology, a revolution that changes 0:10:10.920 --> 0:10:13.720 the course of humanity. We're talking about how it could 0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:16.920 change politics, and I've even said it could be the 0:10:16.960 --> 0:10:19.800 death of politics. I'm in the studio joined by Spike Cohen. 0:10:19.840 --> 0:10:22.200 You can find him on Twitter at real Spike Cohen. 0:10:22.760 --> 0:10:27.160 He was the vice president Libertarian candidate for and Uh. 0:10:27.240 --> 0:10:31.839 He's a previous business owner who found himself in politics. Now, Spike, UM, 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:34.880 A question I was thinking too, is that, Um, you 0:10:35.360 --> 0:10:38.560 said that you know, you had the business. Um, you 0:10:38.600 --> 0:10:41.679 were sort of drawn to politics only because you thought 0:10:41.720 --> 0:10:43.679 that you need to do something better, to kind of 0:10:44.040 --> 0:10:46.600 do some good in the world, you didn't need politics. 0:10:46.960 --> 0:10:50.400 I'm curious what it was like trying to work inside 0:10:50.400 --> 0:10:54.480 that system. Uh what did you learn about politics from 0:10:54.520 --> 0:10:57.280 being inside the belly of the beast? So the thing is, 0:10:57.320 --> 0:10:59.719 because I've never been an elected official, and I've never 0:10:59.760 --> 0:11:02.200 been in any of the major parties, I may not 0:11:02.280 --> 0:11:04.320 have been as deeply into the belly of the beast. 0:11:04.480 --> 0:11:07.679 But in terms of just being involved in the political system, 0:11:07.679 --> 0:11:11.800 it's a terrible system. Uh. Anyone who follows the Libertarian Party, 0:11:12.000 --> 0:11:14.040 even if you agree with our ideals, one of the 0:11:14.040 --> 0:11:16.480 things you'll notice is the constant in fighting. And the 0:11:16.520 --> 0:11:19.080 reason there's constant in fighting is the same reason we 0:11:19.120 --> 0:11:21.920 have constant in fighting in government is because we are 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:24.959 because we are trying to have a political party that 0:11:25.040 --> 0:11:28.200 has to comply with state and federal election law, we 0:11:28.280 --> 0:11:32.360 are forcing ourselves into this de facto democracy. And when 0:11:32.400 --> 0:11:35.240 you force people into a democracy, and I meanwhile, I 0:11:35.240 --> 0:11:37.280 shouldn't say force, we're all choosing to be a part 0:11:37.280 --> 0:11:39.760 of it. But as a quote unquote necessary evil to 0:11:39.800 --> 0:11:44.040 be involved in party politics, we're subjecting ourselves to a democracy, 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:47.080 which means that instead of the best ideas rising to 0:11:47.160 --> 0:11:50.760 the top as a result of supply demand and price signals. 0:11:50.800 --> 0:11:53.320 The best ideas are in theory rising to the top 0:11:53.480 --> 0:11:57.000 from everyone arguing with each other and forming political factions 0:11:57.160 --> 0:12:00.120 and fighting other factions and constantly fighting over who is 0:12:00.120 --> 0:12:02.240 in charge of the narrative. And that's why there's the 0:12:02.280 --> 0:12:05.680 constant in fighting. You know that a democratic system or 0:12:05.760 --> 0:12:09.560 or really a political system in general, turns your neighbor 0:12:09.600 --> 0:12:13.280 who might have a different opinion from you into your enemy, 0:12:13.320 --> 0:12:16.559 potentially depending on how far their opinion is from yours. 0:12:16.600 --> 0:12:20.760 And that's extrapolated out to the division we see in society, 0:12:20.800 --> 0:12:22.560 that we see in our country, that you even see 0:12:22.600 --> 0:12:25.839 in your neighborhood. And uh, you know, that's before you 0:12:25.880 --> 0:12:28.400 even get into the corruption that happens when you actually 0:12:28.400 --> 0:12:31.760 get into office. Do you think that the Libertarian Party 0:12:32.040 --> 0:12:34.080 actually has a chance or are we stuck in a 0:12:34.080 --> 0:12:36.840 two party system? So I think, first of all, we've 0:12:36.840 --> 0:12:39.079 been doing it the wrong way. I think the Libertarian 0:12:39.080 --> 0:12:42.040 Party has focused so long on finding someone who's going 0:12:42.120 --> 0:12:45.720 to win the White House by tricking everyone into voting libertarian, 0:12:46.080 --> 0:12:48.120 and then after that happens, they're going to trickle down 0:12:48.120 --> 0:12:49.880 liberty on the rest of the world. And yet that's 0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:52.280 not what we believe as libertarians, we believe that good 0:12:52.280 --> 0:12:57.320 ideas happened from a decentralized manner, from people that voluntarily 0:12:57.400 --> 0:13:00.000 recognize that you know that this is a good idea 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:03.360 you and that the the demand is fed by that supply, 0:13:03.440 --> 0:13:05.959 and that it works up organically from there. But then 0:13:05.960 --> 0:13:08.400 our politics is the exact opposite. We're gonna shoot all 0:13:08.440 --> 0:13:09.840 the way for the top and then trickle it down 0:13:09.880 --> 0:13:13.040 from there. And uh so what what where we've been 0:13:13.120 --> 0:13:17.120 successful is in trying to win more local races, everything 0:13:17.160 --> 0:13:20.840 from city council races, school board races, auditors races. I 0:13:20.840 --> 0:13:23.400 think from a political standpoint, long before anyone's gonna trust 0:13:23.480 --> 0:13:25.800 us in the White House or even in Congress or 0:13:25.800 --> 0:13:28.079 in the governor's mansion, they need to see what we're 0:13:28.080 --> 0:13:30.199 gonna do in their cities and their towns. We can 0:13:30.200 --> 0:13:33.520 do immediate changes their harm reduction from what's being done 0:13:33.559 --> 0:13:35.920 there from now, and then work up from there. It's 0:13:35.920 --> 0:13:37.880 not gonna be a slow process, or it's not gonna 0:13:37.880 --> 0:13:40.800 be an easier quick process, but we're already seeing it 0:13:40.840 --> 0:13:44.480 happen there. They're the number of elected Libertarians almost doubled 0:13:44.679 --> 0:13:47.360 in the last election, So it's certainly happening, but I 0:13:47.360 --> 0:13:49.960 don't think it's gonna happen tomorrow, 're next year. I 0:13:50.000 --> 0:13:52.240 like that approach, and actually that's very tactical. I mean 0:13:52.240 --> 0:13:54.439 it's something that we're seeing a lot of the activists, uh, 0:13:54.480 --> 0:13:56.600 you know, the George soros Is of the world, um, 0:13:56.600 --> 0:13:59.199 really starting to target those local elections, right, I mean, 0:13:59.400 --> 0:14:02.120 starting with the two attorneys and things like that. Um, 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:03.880 And it seems to have a lot more effect. And 0:14:03.880 --> 0:14:06.120 I would say, um, kind of back to this theme 0:14:06.160 --> 0:14:09.439 of this kind of decentralization, and we're starting to see 0:14:09.480 --> 0:14:12.880 like this balconization almost of the United States. And maybe 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:15.440 in feel free to tell me what you think, but 0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:19.680 maybe it goes back to like the last election, um, 0:14:19.760 --> 0:14:24.080 when there was you know, allegations of of miscounting and whatnot, 0:14:24.160 --> 0:14:25.440 and then when all over to the Supreme Court and 0:14:25.440 --> 0:14:27.360 the Supreme Court kicked it back down, said nope, that's 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:29.680 up to the states. And then fast forwarding through the 0:14:29.760 --> 0:14:33.240 last two years of the pandemic, we're starting to really 0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:36.440 see the states starting to kind of uh, you know, 0:14:36.960 --> 0:14:39.360 take matters into their own hands. Uh. Texas with their 0:14:39.360 --> 0:14:42.320 abortion laws. Now we're starting to see them Arizona putting 0:14:42.360 --> 0:14:44.560 this bill together to have a bitcoin is a cryptocurrency 0:14:44.720 --> 0:14:48.320 or a legal tender, etcetera. And so maybe do you think, one, 0:14:48.400 --> 0:14:52.000 I guess, is there this balconization almost in effect um 0:14:52.040 --> 0:14:53.960 happening in the States. And if so, then does that 0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:58.720 make this grassroots kind of a style of politics more effective? Yes? 0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:01.360 And yes, balcon is anation is going to be natural 0:15:01.800 --> 0:15:05.400 in a politically created subdivision of three thirty million people 0:15:05.440 --> 0:15:08.880 who largely share nothing in common. We live in different areas, 0:15:09.040 --> 0:15:12.120 were culturally different, We're never gonna meet each other or 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:15.960 anyone like each other. We have widespread opinions. And the 0:15:16.080 --> 0:15:18.960 entire political system is built around this, this good cop 0:15:19.000 --> 0:15:22.080 bad cop routine between the two major parties, who are 0:15:22.200 --> 0:15:24.600 to distract from the fact that they're working together to 0:15:24.720 --> 0:15:28.440 rob us all blind, are constantly creating this theater of 0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:31.960 culture wars and and partisan in fighting and so forth 0:15:32.200 --> 0:15:35.120 that feeds that divide even further. But even absent that 0:15:35.800 --> 0:15:39.600 this country as we as it were would not exist 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:42.640 absent the threat of murder, if if we didn't opt 0:15:42.640 --> 0:15:46.840 out of it. Right, So that so that but and 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:49.440 then that's why naturally we're seeing just at the the 0:15:49.480 --> 0:15:53.360 real politic is becoming one of nullification cities, nullifying things 0:15:53.400 --> 0:15:55.400 they don't agree with at the state and federal level. 0:15:55.560 --> 0:15:58.120 States agree nullifying things they don't agree with at the 0:15:58.120 --> 0:16:00.720 federal level, the federal government argue, wing and fighting with 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:03.200 the states and threatening to withhold money if they don't 0:16:03.240 --> 0:16:05.880 cooperate with them. I actually like that if we're going 0:16:05.920 --> 0:16:07.680 to have a government, if we're going to have a state, 0:16:07.800 --> 0:16:10.080 I want them constantly fighting with each other, and I 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:13.880 want the the push to be as local as possible 0:16:14.080 --> 0:16:16.960 for people to recognize that there's a tremendous amount of 0:16:17.000 --> 0:16:20.920 political power in simply refusing to cooperate with higher authorities 0:16:21.080 --> 0:16:24.040 and nullifying their orders from on high and saying no, 0:16:24.080 --> 0:16:25.880 we're not going to cooperate with it, because without that 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:29.880 local cooperation, it's usually almost impossible for them to effectively 0:16:29.960 --> 0:16:34.520 enforce whatever they're trying to impose on us. Yeah. Good point. Now, Um, 0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:36.480 this is a bigger topic. But I'm curious. You know, 0:16:37.280 --> 0:16:39.280 I kind of grew up in this kind of grassroots 0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:42.600 political home, and uh, politics is still something discussed around 0:16:42.600 --> 0:16:46.360 my family and my extended family's kitchen table. Um. You know, 0:16:46.440 --> 0:16:49.040 I guess I would consider myself a Republican growing up, 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:52.360 I don't like to assign myself to any party anymore. Um, 0:16:52.440 --> 0:16:55.240 I'm for the party that gives me more freedom less government. 0:16:55.280 --> 0:16:56.520 I don't know which. I don't know which party that 0:16:56.600 --> 0:16:59.120 is anymore. Uh, maybe it's a libertarian party. I don't 0:16:59.160 --> 0:17:02.120 know right as a freedom already, I don't really know anymore. Um. 0:17:02.200 --> 0:17:05.840 And it's like not one single party can really give 0:17:05.880 --> 0:17:08.640 me everything that I want, I guess, um. But one 0:17:08.720 --> 0:17:12.439 thing that I've had kind of looking at libertarians and 0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:15.720 anarchists if you will or whatever, is like, hey, that's great, 0:17:15.840 --> 0:17:18.600 Like you have a really good idea, Um, but how 0:17:18.800 --> 0:17:23.159 do we get that to happen? Right? The machine, the 0:17:23.160 --> 0:17:26.560 political machine, the left and right, it's so powerful. How 0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:28.679 do we wrestle that power out of their hands? And 0:17:28.680 --> 0:17:30.480 I guess you've kind of made a good point, um, 0:17:30.520 --> 0:17:32.560 starting at a local level and not trying to go 0:17:32.640 --> 0:17:35.280 straight for the top. But that's one reason why I 0:17:35.400 --> 0:17:38.920 have been so excited about bitcoin over the last you know, decade, 0:17:39.200 --> 0:17:42.000 because I feel like we we actually no actually have 0:17:42.040 --> 0:17:44.400 a tool now and whereas like libertarians were kind of hopeless. 0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:46.679 I'm curious to your thoughts on that we're gonna talk 0:17:46.720 --> 0:17:48.760 about that in a second. Um, you're listening to the 0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:51.320 Mark Moa Show and we are talking about bitcoin, and 0:17:51.320 --> 0:17:54.919 we're talking about this decentralized revolution and a revolution, a 0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:58.280 technological revolution that will change the course of humanity because 0:17:58.280 --> 0:18:00.640 it will change the way that we work organized. Um, 0:18:00.840 --> 0:18:03.600 organize ourselves and work with each other. Um. I'm in 0:18:03.640 --> 0:18:05.600 the studio with Spike Cohne. You can find him on 0:18:05.600 --> 0:18:08.240 Twitter at real Spike co and he was the vice 0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:12.720 presidential candidate for the Libertarian Party in a former business owner, 0:18:12.760 --> 0:18:15.719 somebody who gets it, um and has a plan. And 0:18:15.880 --> 0:18:18.160 we'll dig more into that in a second. So don't 0:18:18.200 --> 0:18:20.480 go away, all right, welcome back. You are listening to 0:18:20.560 --> 0:18:23.280 the Mark Moa Show, and we're talking about bitcoin, always 0:18:23.320 --> 0:18:26.600 talking about bitcoin, always talking about the decentralized revolution, always 0:18:26.640 --> 0:18:31.359 talking about the way politics, finance and technology are intersecting 0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:33.840 with each other and about to change the world. If 0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:35.920 you're just joining us. I'm in the studio with Spike 0:18:36.000 --> 0:18:38.440 Cohen at Real Spike Cohen. You can find him on Twitter. 0:18:39.840 --> 0:18:44.080 Libertarian candidate, vice presidential Libertarian Party candidate. Now Spike. Before 0:18:44.119 --> 0:18:46.000 the break, I was saying, how, um, you know, while 0:18:46.040 --> 0:18:49.280 I like what the libertarians do shout out to Ron 0:18:49.359 --> 0:18:52.480 Paul kind of running that. Um. I got to speak 0:18:52.480 --> 0:18:53.639 on a stage with him a few weeks ago. As 0:18:53.640 --> 0:18:55.959 I was saying, was was pretty amazing highlight of my 0:18:55.960 --> 0:18:57.879 my life. I don't know about my life, but one 0:18:57.880 --> 0:18:59.760 of the one of the key points. But anyway, one 0:18:59.760 --> 0:19:02.040 thing I've always kind of looked at these libertarians and 0:19:02.040 --> 0:19:05.359 these anarchists is like, hey, you know, your ideas are great, um, 0:19:05.480 --> 0:19:07.560 and that's cool, and like maybe we should try that, 0:19:07.640 --> 0:19:10.000 but like, how does that ever really gonna work? And 0:19:10.080 --> 0:19:12.040 as I was saying before the break, like I finally 0:19:12.119 --> 0:19:15.840 feel like maybe there's actually something that we can do. 0:19:16.320 --> 0:19:19.480 And it just seems like most libertarians and most anarchists 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:23.119 have overlooked that. Um, would you agree with that? Is 0:19:23.160 --> 0:19:25.479 that something that you've seen. I think that a lot 0:19:25.560 --> 0:19:30.000 of libertarians and anarchists and liberty lovers in general, maybe 0:19:30.000 --> 0:19:33.600 even those that that consider themselves constitutionalists or whatever, but 0:19:33.640 --> 0:19:36.359 people who want far less control and less government than 0:19:36.400 --> 0:19:37.760 we have now. I think a lot of them have 0:19:37.800 --> 0:19:40.000 just shrugged their shoulders and resigned themselves that it's going 0:19:40.040 --> 0:19:41.760 to be this way. You hear this a lot from 0:19:41.760 --> 0:19:43.800 people that, well, you know, most people are stupid and 0:19:43.840 --> 0:19:46.040 their sheep and they want to be controlled. And so 0:19:46.200 --> 0:19:50.639 the idea that we can actually effectively uh forget you know, 0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:55.080 you know, uh, eliminating the state or even greatly reducing it, 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:58.760 but have any kind of real uh progress towards more freedom. 0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:00.960 I think they've given up on it. But I think 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:04.600