Speaker 1: Welcome back to another edition of the Frida Egg Podcast.
Speaker 1: Today we are reheating in honor of Master's Week, one
Speaker 1: of my favorite podcasts. We did this over two parts.
Speaker 1: Last year I did it with Jeff Ogilvie down in
Speaker 1: Augusta and we went through We really he went through
Speaker 1: every single hole at Augusta National. He broke it down,
Speaker 1: talked about the different shots, different insights. It was fascinating
Speaker 1: to hear him talk about things that I had never
Speaker 1: even thought of, one being laying up on fifteen how
Speaker 1: it's counterintuitive you want to lay up on the opposite
Speaker 1: side you think you should, especially when the pin's left,
Speaker 1: you know, And then you see it play out on
Speaker 1: Master Sunday with shots like Xanderschoffle. I remember last year
Speaker 1: he had that wed shot just as Jeff described that
Speaker 1: caught the down slope and skipped over the green. So
Speaker 1: this is one of my favorite podcasts we've ever done.
Speaker 1: And if you missed it, I hope you enjoy it.
Speaker 1: If you didn't miss it, you know you can listen
Speaker 1: to it again. I think I've re listened to it
Speaker 1: and remembered a lot of things I'd forgotten. It is
Speaker 1: Master's Week. We will have a Frida Egg story up
Speaker 1: on Wednesday, so that'll be coming. That's Garrett Morrison production.
Speaker 1: And we will have daily newsletters, so sign up for
Speaker 1: those at Thefrida Egg dot com and there's a newsletter
Speaker 1: sign up bar right there. Sign up for those there
Speaker 1: and you'll get daily newsletter into your inbox all week long.
Speaker 1: That's for free, and it'll keep you up to date
Speaker 1: on all the ins and outs of the Masters. But
Speaker 1: without further ado, here is Jeff Ogilvie and all eighteen
Speaker 1: holes at Augusta, Nashal.
Speaker 2: I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset. When
Speaker 2: I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset.
Speaker 2: And when I find my ball in a Friday Friday Egg,
Speaker 2: the dreaded Friday Friday Frida Egg, bright Egg, frid Egg
Speaker 2: bright egg.
Speaker 3: Lie, I'm about ready to run off with the course.
Speaker 3: So you're you're in contention on the weekend. What are
Speaker 3: you thinking about before your Saturday Sunday rounds? Like? Is
Speaker 3: there stuff that worries you early on?
Speaker 2: Well, the first green might be the hardest green on
Speaker 2: the course maybe, and certainly the first the hardest first
Speaker 2: green in world tournament golf. I would say, man, Oakmont
Speaker 2: is a well renowned, ridiculous first hole and a really
Speaker 2: tough green to hit. But it feels like you're in
Speaker 2: the lap of the gods a little bit at Oakmond
Speaker 2: because you can land at the front right of the
Speaker 2: green and maybe it stays on, maybe it runs over
Speaker 2: the back. It's kind of you make bogie on the
Speaker 2: first in Oakmond. You don't have to have done anything wrong.
Speaker 2: It's just part of Oakmont. You just hit you in
Speaker 2: the face on the first hole and then you move on.
Speaker 2: But the Masters, if you play the hole really sensibly,
Speaker 2: you can get a nice birdy part on the first,
Speaker 2: but if you hit it anywhere other than directly under
Speaker 2: the hole, you have the hardest part in the world.
Speaker 2: And sometimes if you miss it past the hole, it's
Speaker 2: even a hard bogie. It's a brutal, easy first tee
Speaker 2: shot relatively. I mean, Tiger historically has struggled with it.
Speaker 2: But it's a gentle first tee shot and a simple
Speaker 2: looking iron shot until you realize what's up at the green,
Speaker 2: and the green is so savage, really hard to hit
Speaker 2: the ball under the hole too. The way the front
Speaker 2: half of the green is because if you land it.
Speaker 2: If you hit it short of a lot of pins,
Speaker 2: it rolls off the front, so it encourages you get
Speaker 2: it to pin. It was always trying to get you
Speaker 2: to hit it to pin high, and if you get
Speaker 2: it to pin high just a bit past it, you
Speaker 2: get a lot of stress. So it's one of the
Speaker 2: most un talked about. I guess it's more talked about
Speaker 2: now because it's on the coverage more and people talk
Speaker 2: about the first green more. But it might be the
Speaker 2: hardest green on the course, especially because it's the first hole,
Speaker 2: and Ernie El's kind of showed that a few years ago.
Speaker 3: Uh the false front he touched on it. I guess
Speaker 3: I's got a lot of vicious ones. Do you think
Speaker 3: false fronts are like one of the best ways to
Speaker 3: defend against the tour pro.
Speaker 2: I think it's a great way to really encourage, not
Speaker 2: quite force, but really motivate a player to want to
Speaker 2: get it to pin high, especially in a situation where
Speaker 2: past pin high is going to ruin your day, Like
Speaker 2: you can't just just kind of go one club less
Speaker 2: and chunk it up to the front of the green
Speaker 2: on the first You can't because it's the chip could
Speaker 2: come back. You know the false front thing. So I
Speaker 2: think you're right. I think it's a really good way
Speaker 2: to do it. And if you look at standers, I
Speaker 2: mean every green's got one really close in the Valley
Speaker 2: of Sin. That's really what that is, right, It's a
Speaker 2: It's a good way to do it because it really
Speaker 2: really it rewards the player for being aggressive and hitting
Speaker 2: a quality shot.
Speaker 3: Neathing too with it is for the lower ex trajectory player,
Speaker 3: you're like your regular guy. It's a way for it
Speaker 3: to slow down the ball into it.
Speaker 2: I think it's like the perfect for me. I go,
Speaker 2: of course, the perfect mindset is how do I make
Speaker 2: it easier for the eighth, the ninety shooter, the alien handicapper,
Speaker 2: and how do I make it harder for the scratch
Speaker 2: player and the false front or at least the style
Speaker 2: I do it here at the Masters, that's exactly what
Speaker 2: it does. Because the guy can't spin is he's coming
Speaker 2: in with his hybrid or his four iron or five iron,
Speaker 2: he's running it up. It's actually a really nice screen
Speaker 2: to run it up onto. But the guy who's flying
Speaker 2: it up there with spin with an eight iron, he
Speaker 2: really has three or four yards to landit it and
Speaker 2: that's it. So it's a super precise shot for the
Speaker 2: elite player and really quite a gentle easy shot for
Speaker 2: the avera player, which is ideal. It's bringing those two
Speaker 2: guys closer together as opposed to some modern stuff where
Speaker 2: it's all carry and big long stuff. It just separates
Speaker 2: that scratch and eighteen handicappers so much that it kind
Speaker 2: of it's it's just super intimidating for the average guy.
Speaker 3: Is that second shot on two like the most fun
Speaker 3: shot on the course? No, it was to Sunday pen.
Speaker 2: Yes and no. The Sunday pin might be the funnest
Speaker 2: pin on the course or one of I mean there's
Speaker 2: a lot of fun pins on the course. I mean
Speaker 2: sixteen on Sundays pretty fun. And that pin on seven
Speaker 2: when they put it in that whole outspot and the
Speaker 2: bowl on the right hand side, that's a fun pin.
Speaker 2: But the one on two is hard. I kind of
Speaker 2: always laid it up onto a little bit. My mentality
Speaker 2: was if I could get it just in that front
Speaker 2: right bunker or around that front right bunker and two,
Speaker 2: I was happy. You know, I missed the green left
Speaker 2: a couple of times. I missed it in that left bunk,
Speaker 2: or a couple of times on the green or short
Speaker 2: left of that left bunker, trying to get really aggressive
Speaker 2: a few times and worked out that that's not really
Speaker 2: what you want to be and had some kind of
Speaker 2: train wrecks on that hole. So I would always try
Speaker 2: to hit it next to the bunker, off the tee,
Speaker 2: next to the bunk, or on the second shot, and
Speaker 2: you can get it anywhere on the green close to
Speaker 2: the hole. If you're next to that front right bunker
Speaker 2: on two. It is a super fun it's a fun
Speaker 2: shot to watch. It might be one of the fun
Speaker 2: of shots to watch on those guys at those long
Speaker 2: arms on the top of the hill and they land
Speaker 2: on the front of the green and they roll for
Speaker 2: about thirty seconds allay up the back and they roll
Speaker 2: right next to the hole. As a spectator, that would
Speaker 2: be a great place to stand on Sunday.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a lot of holes right around there too.
Speaker 3: You could watch two, you could watch three, t you
Speaker 3: can watch I mean it's close to eighteen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, eighteen seventeen, you're really not far from sixteen if
Speaker 2: that is the sweet spot of the course. Really, Yeah,
Speaker 2: you've got seven green two green, really kind of seventeen green,
Speaker 2: seventeen fair, you can kind of whip across to fifteen.
Speaker 2: That's kind of the heart of the course.
Speaker 3: I would say, there's that hill that everything plays into,
Speaker 3: and it's similarly, you know, Mackenzie does that a lot
Speaker 3: of his places, that focal point, and that's it kind
Speaker 3: of is the folk that's like, it's such a neat
Speaker 3: routing how they play down to it and then he
Speaker 3: takes you away from it and he keeps bringing you
Speaker 3: back at different points in the round.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a it's a great route. I mean, it's
Speaker 2: I think serendipitous. Really. I think they were fortunate how
Speaker 2: it worked. He was obviously a genius router and Jones
Speaker 2: might have been the best golf mind ever, like when
Speaker 2: it related to golf course and playing the course. I mean,
Speaker 2: he was truly genius, but there was serendipity involved in
Speaker 2: how it all worked out. And mean, it just it
Speaker 2: is such a good golf course to watch golf, and
Speaker 2: you can pretty much from that point from the second green,
Speaker 2: seventh green, kind of eighth tea area, you can pretty
Speaker 2: much get to every hole with a five minute walk almost.
Speaker 2: You know, you're kind of really central and people keep
Speaker 2: you watch them come through two, and then you see
Speaker 2: that same group come through seven, and then later on
Speaker 2: they come back through seventeen. It's like, yeah, it's all
Speaker 2: it's brilliant like that, because if it just went out,
Speaker 2: like the old course is the old course and it's brilliant,
Speaker 2: but it's been awful course to watch golf, great course
Speaker 2: to play golf, but to watch it's kind of awful.
Speaker 2: But this kind of matches all the creates, all the
Speaker 2: great golf and it makes it great to watch.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's incredible, almost like the Stadium course before the
Speaker 3: Stadium course.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean everything about it is just I mean
Speaker 2: you say perfect, I mean there is no perfect, but
Speaker 2: relative to everything else. If you want to find for
Speaker 2: a great place to watch golf and a place that's
Speaker 2: going to create great attractive golf to watch, right, it's
Speaker 2: all right here. It's incredible.
Speaker 3: It's an expansive property but intimate.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it seems I don't think it's quite as big
Speaker 2: as you think, but it seems so big because if
Speaker 2: there's no real lines of trees, they're like copses of trees,
Speaker 2: right as cops is the word, right, like groupings of trees.
Speaker 2: But you stand at the clubhouse, you can pretty much
Speaker 2: see across the whole course, which makes it seem like
Speaker 2: this big kind of park. You know, it's so it
Speaker 2: seems massive, big scale, big wide fairways, big bunkers, but
Speaker 2: as you say, intimate, because everything kind of comes back
Speaker 2: it's kind of near each other. But because it's so
Speaker 2: big scale, it seems big. But you realize that everything's
Speaker 2: kind of close, and that helps with the rules and
Speaker 2: the feel. And you see how you're constantly seeing other
Speaker 2: groups go up other holes and stuff from feeling that
Speaker 2: you just you're you're always kind of feel like you're
Speaker 2: part of the whole show. You're never separated on one
Speaker 2: spot way away from anywhere else. It's just brilliant.
Speaker 3: That's gonna be one of the cool things compared to
Speaker 3: like your modern TPC choruses, the how close you are
Speaker 3: all the competitors when you're playing it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's yeah. I mean you're teeing off on the
Speaker 2: first and you're watching the guys hit into the ninth
Speaker 2: and kind of sussing out the pin and where they're
Speaker 2: hitting it, and then and that happens kind of all
Speaker 2: the way around. You're playing down two and you're watching
Speaker 2: him pitch into three, and then on seven you're watching
Speaker 2: you're walking down six, say, and you're watching the shots
Speaker 2: into sixteen, and you're constantly kind of being reminded of
Speaker 2: what's coming and what's gone and who's doing what. It's
Speaker 2: nice to feel a part of it. You know, there's
Speaker 2: a lot of courses where you're just way out there.
Speaker 2: Now modern routings seem to just go wherever they want
Speaker 2: and don't take that sort of thing into account. But
Speaker 2: it's great to be out there with all the competitors
Speaker 2: and playing partners and feel like you're part of the
Speaker 2: whole show. That's the whole thing. It's just a whole
Speaker 2: The whole thing is just one big show, right, and
Speaker 2: it's brilliant.
Speaker 3: A Buddy Mane Sean Martin did this Strokes gained analysis
Speaker 3: of winners and the golf course where they picked up
Speaker 3: the most shots to the field, and the two holes
Speaker 3: that came out on top were number three and number fourteen.
Speaker 2: Well, they're the two holes that you can have the
Speaker 2: most docile seeming holes, no bunkers. On fourteen. Three has bunkers,
Speaker 2: but they're really easy to miss. You just kind of
Speaker 2: hit some sort of well modern play. These guys all
Speaker 2: seem to hit driver up short left of the green,
Speaker 2: but it's just been a three or two or three
Speaker 2: on or a hybrid these days to the top of
Speaker 2: the hill wedge onto the green, and it's relatively simple.
Speaker 2: And fourteen is driver in a nine nine or something.
Speaker 2: But they'd have two greens that if you miss them
Speaker 2: in the wrong spots you have almost zero chance to
Speaker 2: make par and a big chance to make six or
Speaker 2: seven or eight. You can just they turn you into idiots.
Speaker 2: That doesn't actually surprise me, Like I think everyone would
Speaker 2: have thought twelve or thirteen or eleven or fifteen, But
Speaker 2: it's the third I think is a genius hole because
Speaker 2: the only way to really make birdie or get it
Speaker 2: close is to really risk missing it short of the green.
Speaker 2: And if you miss it short of the green, it's
Speaker 2: almost an impossible up and down. It comes all the
Speaker 2: way back and you're twelve feet below the level of
Speaker 2: the green to this crazy pitched green. And the only
Speaker 2: way to get that pitch close if you do miss
Speaker 2: it short, is to risk leaving it short again. You know,
Speaker 2: So once you've missed it short, unless you say right,
Speaker 2: I'm just going to make five, and by the way,
Speaker 2: it's not an easy five because your little pitch will
Speaker 2: go twelve feet past the hole and a part that'll
Speaker 2: break six feet, and so it's if you want to
Speaker 2: have a good score, if you want to make three,
Speaker 2: you have to risk living it short. If you want
Speaker 2: to make four, once you leave it short, you have
Speaker 2: to risk leaving it short again. And that just kind
Speaker 2: of follows the whole hole it's and fourteen is the
Speaker 2: miss on fourteen is long right, but you'd nen't want
Speaker 2: to miss like an eight or nine nine too, and
Speaker 2: they're usually.
Speaker 3: It's really hard to miss long right for a good
Speaker 3: player too.
Speaker 2: It is especially rady, especially alrighty. Yeah, it's not the
Speaker 2: thing you usually miss short right or along left right,
Speaker 2: which is the genius on twelve, but it's a there's
Speaker 2: the three of the four pins on fourteen. Generally, oh,
Speaker 2: I want to make birdie there. He's kind of one
Speaker 2: of your last birdie chances. You've got fifteen and sixteen,
Speaker 2: but seventeen and eighteen are really tough, so you kind
Speaker 2: of want to get something going. On fourteen. You've got
Speaker 2: a nine, nine or eight iro into a pin that
Speaker 2: it's all going to roll towards, but you kind of
Speaker 2: have to risk landing it short of the green to
Speaker 2: get it really close sometimes, and if you miss it
Speaker 2: short of fourteen, you definitely I mean, that's a one
Speaker 2: N ten up and down, so an amazing green.
Speaker 3: One of my favorite things I've heard you say, and
Speaker 3: I think you said it. I'm not sure if you
Speaker 3: said it on our pod or on the stay of
Speaker 3: the game, but you said, like, the greatest holes are
Speaker 3: the ones where if you want to make an easy
Speaker 3: par it's like, you know, if you want to make
Speaker 3: parts really easy, but if you want to make Birdie
Speaker 3: and it's really hard. So from what I'm hearing, like
Speaker 3: three and fourteen are holes where if you're in the hunt,
Speaker 3: your expectation almost changes. Where those are the holes you
Speaker 3: feel like you got to get Birdie on right. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: for sure, So all of a sudden it switches versus
Speaker 3: the tough holes coming in where you're like, par is
Speaker 3: a good score, So that expectation flip then brings bogie
Speaker 3: or worse into play.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like eleven is so obviously impossible, you're quite content
Speaker 2: to go two fours and two fives to the week.
Speaker 2: Probably that would be okay. You know, most winners of
Speaker 2: the Masters probably have a bogi or two and eleven,
Speaker 2: so you're quite happy you I am it away from
Speaker 2: the grain. Everyone aims at a the row ede the
Speaker 2: green and tries to hit it in the right spot
Speaker 2: and maybe on Sunday like these modern roars and dustins,
Speaker 2: and they're super aggressive and they'll go for it. But
Speaker 2: generally you're quite content if you make five on eleven.
Speaker 2: Oh well, everyone's making five on eleven. But see three
Speaker 2: and fourteen. They are legitimate birdie holes. But the only
Speaker 2: way to make Bertie is to risk making bogie, which
Speaker 2: is the genius of the whole course really and all
Speaker 2: great courses in that they give the great player a
Speaker 2: par pretty much. If you want to make par, if
Speaker 2: you give up, Bertie will give you a par. But
Speaker 2: as soon as you want to make Bertie, that's when
Speaker 2: you bring bogie in. If you want to make eagle,
Speaker 2: you're going to bring double in. To me. That is
Speaker 2: absolutely perfect because it's probably relatively easy for a good
Speaker 2: player playing well to cruise around here, have a decent week,
Speaker 2: finish top twenty, take no risks, put a nice check
Speaker 2: in his pocket, and just walk away and get invited
Speaker 2: back next year and happy days. But to win the tournament,
Speaker 2: you have to go for everything. And when you go
Speaker 2: for everything, that's when it can all go wrong.
Speaker 3: It almost too becomes enhanced when you're in the position too,
Speaker 3: So like if you were yeah, because like if you're
Speaker 3: coming down that back nine and you're in fifteenth, you
Speaker 3: know you have a shot if you play great nine,
Speaker 3: But if you're in fiftieth, like it is what it is.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's It just makes you so nervous this course,
Speaker 2: and the only way to make birdies and have do
Speaker 2: great shots is to take on shots you don't want
Speaker 2: to take on. Like on a normal week, you just
Speaker 2: wouldn't hit that second shot to fifteen. I mean, it
Speaker 2: looks like you're hitting a three on on the top
Speaker 2: of a Volkswagen Beetle. It just wow, this is a really,
Speaker 2: really hard shot. But if you want to win, you've
Speaker 2: got to hit it, and you've got to get your
Speaker 2: head into that place where obviously guys like Phil and
Speaker 2: Tigers seem to get it into that fearless swing, that
Speaker 2: rory kind of that that free swing. It's like, you
Speaker 2: know what, the only way I can hit this shot
Speaker 2: is to be loose, but the difficulty of the shot
Speaker 2: and the potential train wrecks. The challenge is to get
Speaker 2: loose with that much trouble around. It's really that's that's
Speaker 2: to me. The whole essence of the Masters is to
Speaker 2: swing loose with hyper aggressive, really risky plays, and that's
Speaker 2: a really difficult thing to do.
Speaker 3: It's the counterintuitive of GoF Like it's a really scary
Speaker 3: shot and most people get cautious, and then when you
Speaker 3: get cautious, you're dead.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Human nature is to like, well, this is risky,
Speaker 2: so I'm not sure about this. I'll just carefully, like
Speaker 2: just feed it up there so I don't get any trouble. Well,
Speaker 2: that's why you get into trouble, because you get careful
Speaker 2: about it.
Speaker 3: It's funny. I always say I'm like a scuba I'm
Speaker 3: like a snorkeler when I play golf. Like if I
Speaker 3: get a little under the water, I'm fine. But as
Speaker 3: soon as I get a certain spot, that's when I
Speaker 3: start protecting and I start losing it. But that's what
Speaker 3: makes you, guys so great. You're nuclear subs. Like everybody
Speaker 3: that's playing in the Masters, for the most part, has
Speaker 3: the ability to get there but then this is a
Speaker 3: golf course that makes it even harder to get there
Speaker 3: because it's even scarier, right it is.
Speaker 2: And I mean it's it's all part of it's so
Speaker 2: the whole picture. I mean, the build up to the
Speaker 2: Masters is outrageous. Every media official in the world is here,
Speaker 2: everybody's watching. It's the one everybody wants to win, at
Speaker 2: least in April. It's the one everyone wants to win
Speaker 2: because it's the first one for six or nine months.
Speaker 2: It sets up the whole year for everybody, and it
Speaker 2: sets up your career. It's just such a huge deal.
Speaker 2: And it's a course that just and so your kind
Speaker 2: of anxious performance anxiety anyway, Like it's hard to be
Speaker 2: loose and free, but the only way to play it
Speaker 2: well is to be loose and free. So you've got
Speaker 2: that fight in yourself that you're desperate to win or
Speaker 2: you really want to win really badly, and that usually
Speaker 2: creates tension and tightness and being careful. But the only
Speaker 2: way to play it well is to be the other
Speaker 2: way around. And if you look at historically, guys like
Speaker 2: Fred Kauple's play there every year, I mean, that's the
Speaker 2: pit of me of a loose Skulfer. You know, it's Phil,
Speaker 2: you know, it's win all. Oh well, it doesn't matter,
Speaker 2: like I just want to win. So that's really those
Speaker 2: sort of guys are going to play well. And I
Speaker 2: think that's why it's so hard for guys when it
Speaker 2: like Rory at the moment when it becomes their thing.
Speaker 2: You know, it was Norman and Duval and Earliels and
Speaker 2: it was that they just every year it gets harder
Speaker 2: to be loose, because how do you that one thing
Speaker 2: you really want the world the most, you have to
Speaker 2: be looser than every other week. That's a really really
Speaker 2: hard thing to do, you know, I think.
Speaker 3: I mean, you see with Tiger ever once once way Yang,
Speaker 3: like I think that's like a fundamental thing, like nobody
Speaker 3: had beaten them. He'd never lost in that moment, and
Speaker 3: he lost in that moment. It's like he actually decided
Speaker 3: he never had experienced it.
Speaker 2: You know, it's like you don't know, Yeah, there'd be
Speaker 2: an argument to say, like a psychologist convention would sit
Speaker 2: down and like analyze the whole thing. But if he'd
Speaker 2: lost one or two early, yeah, he might actually still
Speaker 2: be winning more now he might have ended up with more.
Speaker 2: I mean he saw Nick Jack got comfortable with losing
Speaker 2: because I mean he won a lot, but he finished
Speaker 2: second a lot and third a lot. Tiger never lost.
Speaker 2: What was he like fifty and oh when he started
Speaker 2: Sunday and the outrageous number and when he's there's some
Speaker 2: quite a lot of the magic was gone obviously when
Speaker 2: Yang beat him, because it had been going on for
Speaker 2: so someone. At some point he was going to lose, right,
Speaker 2: I mean, you can't win forever. It's it's interesting. I mean,
Speaker 2: obviously a lot of other stuff happened too, but it
Speaker 2: is interesting. Jack lost more than he won. Yea. So
Speaker 2: it's almost like the lost the losses were he was
Speaker 2: a bit more teflon for the losses. It was a
Speaker 2: bit more like he didn't develop the scars because he
Speaker 2: was used to losing along with winning all the time.
Speaker 3: It's crazy. It's like goth for mortals is a game
Speaker 3: of ninety nine percent failure. Like my buddy said this
Speaker 3: to me, like at one point he's like, so that
Speaker 3: one percent when you actually succeed is like it's the
Speaker 3: greatest feeling in the world. And but for Tiger it
Speaker 3: wasn't that way because and that's what makes you better
Speaker 3: is the failure. It makes you better a lot of times.
Speaker 2: Right, Well, that's what they say. And you definitely learn
Speaker 2: a lot more from when you get it wrong than
Speaker 2: when you get it right. When you get it right,
Speaker 2: you walk away and say how easy is this? When
Speaker 2: you get it wrong? As all, I've got to do
Speaker 2: something better next time. You don't walk away from a
Speaker 2: success and think I've got to do something better next time.
Speaker 2: You know or you don't see what you did wrong
Speaker 2: because you won.
Speaker 3: It's interesting through three usually were you thinking like I
Speaker 3: got to get off to a good start here because
Speaker 3: of the naxt few horse.
Speaker 2: You certainly want to be under before you're over at
Speaker 2: the Masters. And if you've messed the first up, which
Speaker 2: is very easy to do, you bog you the first,
Speaker 2: it's not the end of your day because you've got
Speaker 2: two and three. And as I was talking about three,
Speaker 2: three is tricky, but it's still a birty whole. You
Speaker 2: still got a sandway or a wedge. But two. You
Speaker 2: want to make Bertie on two and hopefully be under
Speaker 2: power before you want to be one under on the
Speaker 2: fourth t Maybe two that would be great, because four's
Speaker 2: incredibly difficult. Five is going to be even harder now,
Speaker 2: but it's always been tricky. Six, depending on the pin,
Speaker 2: that's a little tough, really tough stretch those three holes.
Speaker 2: So yeah, you want to be under before you You
Speaker 2: want to under before you're over. Yeah, seven is a
Speaker 2: pin is a pin specific thing to like six, six
Speaker 2: with the pin low on the bottom tier, and seven
Speaker 2: with the pin in that bowl and the right legitimately
Speaker 2: decent birdy chances, but seven with that pin on the
Speaker 2: kind of the high one on the left just over
Speaker 2: the bunker where it crowns off both ways, hard to
Speaker 2: hit it close, and it's playing a little bit long,
Speaker 2: and it's early in the morning. You get a five
Speaker 2: on into there, it's like, wow, that's a really hard hole.
Speaker 2: And six with the pin on the high tier, that
Speaker 2: crazy high thing on the right, that is one of
Speaker 2: the toughest seven or eight ims or six onnes you'll
Speaker 2: ever have. So they can flip six and seven can
Speaker 2: go from easy to difficult, but you can have that
Speaker 2: day where four, five, six and seven four of the
Speaker 2: hardest holes on the course. So yeah, you want to
Speaker 2: be under before you're over.
Speaker 3: It's funny. I got this book. This guy did a
Speaker 3: strokes gained analysis Joe Peter. He took all the trackers.
Speaker 3: He scraped it so he had stroke gains statistics from
Speaker 3: last year. One of the things he found there's only
Speaker 3: one double or worse on eight and then but then
Speaker 3: there's very few eagles. It's like one of the least varied.
Speaker 2: Horse It's a tough eagle hole because I mean, you
Speaker 2: see everyone gets in and watches on Saturday and Sunday
Speaker 2: and Tiger or Phil or Rory or something and in
Speaker 2: there swinging it in. But it's a really big two
Speaker 2: hits for most players. Now there's no run on the fairway.
Speaker 2: That bunker on the right is really hard to avoid
Speaker 2: some reason. It's quite magnetic because the left trees are
Speaker 2: really rough. But there's no real train wreck on eight.
Speaker 2: Even if you hit it in the left trees off
Speaker 2: the tee, you kind of punch it up the hill,
Speaker 2: hit whatever you can on the middle of the green.
Speaker 2: It's quite a receptive green to hit it within twenty
Speaker 2: five feet because it's high on both sides. It doesn't
Speaker 2: repel balls, it brings them back towards the hole. So
Speaker 2: it's relatively easy if you want it to make again,
Speaker 2: if you want to make par and eight every time,
Speaker 2: easy as just take a punch bowl. Yeah, it's kind
Speaker 2: of like a punch bowl. And the fairway is really
Speaker 2: massively wide. If you just safe out to the left,
Speaker 2: safe up on top of you can lay it up
Speaker 2: as far right as you want. You can hit it
Speaker 2: one hundred yards right of the green. Long you've got
Speaker 2: a football field to hit it into right of the green.
Speaker 2: But then it gets difficult to hit it close for three,
Speaker 2: but hit it inside six feet for three or stuff.
Speaker 2: But did it inside thirty feet quite easy. So if
Speaker 2: there is it's a birdie in parhole really, I mean
Speaker 2: the whole field. That's what your stats say too. I
Speaker 2: would have said, yeah, most of the half the field,
Speaker 2: make five. Half the field make four kind of.
Speaker 3: I was looking at the old pictures and there's center
Speaker 3: line bunker is now the rate bunker. Do you think
Speaker 3: if they opened that right side up you'd see more
Speaker 3: eagles because you're actually heading from the proper angle line.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a little bit. I mean they probably were ten
Speaker 2: years in front with the letter the depth. How far
Speaker 2: that bunker was from the tee. I mean it's a
Speaker 2: three ten carry or something uphill, which is turning out
Speaker 2: to probably be about right now, right, But when they
Speaker 2: did it, it's been there my whole career pretty much.
Speaker 2: I think it was I could sometimes not get it
Speaker 2: to the bunker right. I was forty yards from carrying it.
Speaker 2: And it's a deep bunker and it's a tricky shot
Speaker 2: out of it, but it's not the worst, so people
Speaker 2: are willing to take it on because again, if you
Speaker 2: hit it in the bunker, then you just lay it
Speaker 2: up and hit a wedge on the green. And it's
Speaker 2: really it adds half a shot, like it's not adding
Speaker 2: three shots, like hitting it in the water on thirteen
Speaker 2: or something. Yeah, I don't know. I don't mind it.
Speaker 2: I don't. I think it's a pretty good balance for
Speaker 2: how we're playing right now. I think there's room on
Speaker 2: the course for a part five that only the really
Speaker 2: strong guy I can get to and too. And it's
Speaker 2: a really brave shot. The second shot, it's you've got
Speaker 2: to hook quite solidly, like some sort of three wood
Speaker 2: or something up and to get it on the green
Speaker 2: to anywhere close. And that's a really difficult shot off upslope,
Speaker 2: and whenever you try to do that off an upslope,
Speaker 2: you generally miss it right and that hole allows you
Speaker 2: to miss it right, so your brain says, okay, it's
Speaker 2: okay if I don't hook this, So everyone generally just
Speaker 2: flares it out to the right wedges it under the green.
Speaker 2: I think it's a good balance.
Speaker 3: Actually, I like it because when you miss the rate
Speaker 3: and then you're tripping over those mounds, it's really hard
Speaker 3: to hit it close, which makes it hard to make birdie.
Speaker 2: But it's still a relatively easy pa. Yeah, it does
Speaker 2: make it hard car it's.
Speaker 3: But if you get the ball over the left, especially
Speaker 3: with those rate pins, it's easier. It's much easier to
Speaker 3: make it.
Speaker 2: So if you breathe, yeah, I mean strategically, it ticks
Speaker 2: every box right, Like the more risk you take on
Speaker 2: the tea it's closer to the bunker, the easier, the
Speaker 2: less you have to hook your second shot on, the
Speaker 2: easier it is. The more that the less risk you
Speaker 2: take off the tee, then the harder it's hit it
Speaker 2: on the grain. And it's just exactly the same on
Speaker 2: the second show. If you take no risk, the further
Speaker 2: right you go, the hardier wedge. The further left you go,
Speaker 2: the easier your wedge. But the further left you go
Speaker 2: you risk going down into all the flowers and the
Speaker 2: trees and the rubbish. I mean, this course does that
Speaker 2: all the way around. It ticks strategy one I one
Speaker 2: like and in an interesting different way all the way around.
Speaker 2: It's they just get it. It's just right names the
Speaker 2: easy driving hole right maybe statistically, but it's easy if
Speaker 2: you can turn it over. And it's another one of
Speaker 2: those holes that coaxes you into trying to take more
Speaker 2: than you need to on like you really want to
Speaker 2: hit a big high draw because it goes further, like
Speaker 2: it has more of a forward bounce rather than a
Speaker 2: sideways bounce. It's a relatively easy ta shot to hit
Speaker 2: the fairway. But again it's a bit like the second
Speaker 2: shot on eight. It kind of tries to suck you
Speaker 2: into taking on more than you need and because you
Speaker 2: don't want, if you kind of flare it a little bit,
Speaker 2: it's pretty easy to not hit in the right trees,
Speaker 2: but you end up with this downslope ball below your
Speaker 2: feet six iron into this green that really isn't fit
Speaker 2: for that set up. So it encourages you to take
Speaker 2: on more than you want, and you'll see a lot
Speaker 2: of guys hit in the left trees because they're trying
Speaker 2: to kind of get those big bounces and get it
Speaker 2: down the bottom of the hill and hit like a
Speaker 2: wedge in which makes it relatively easy, but it's hard
Speaker 2: to get it to that spot. So easy to hit
Speaker 2: the fairway, but again it dangles the carrot like it
Speaker 2: kind of sucks you when you're trying to take on
Speaker 2: more than you should.
Speaker 3: It's this guy said that approach shot, that front ball
Speaker 3: is the easiest approach shot.
Speaker 2: Joe with a stat on the whole court, do you
Speaker 2: just say name, Oh yeah, yeah, the front pin definitely
Speaker 2: one hundred percent, because it's almost impossible to hit it
Speaker 2: over the ninth green, like it doesn't matter. It plays
Speaker 2: quite long because it's depending on how far you hit it.
Speaker 2: It's kind of uphill, and it effectively plays uphill because
Speaker 2: you're hitting it off such an extreme. People always end
Speaker 2: up short. Always end up short because you're nine on
Speaker 2: or go five or five. It's you're off such a downslope.
Speaker 2: It's hard to get it in the air the second shot,
Speaker 2: so nine one goes really flat, so it hits the
Speaker 2: ground before it normally would, and it's ain't bouncing forward
Speaker 2: unless it lands up top so you can really take
Speaker 2: quite a lot more club. Missing the green to the
Speaker 2: right isn't a problem, so that front and anything really
Speaker 2: that goes twenty or thirty feet past it will generally
Speaker 2: come back towards the pin. So yeah, that's certainly the
Speaker 2: easiest pin on the green, but it's also the one
Speaker 2: that you can if you don't know what you're doing,
Speaker 2: you can get it wrong too.
Speaker 3: So you turn, you're making the turn, and then that
Speaker 3: back nine, Like, what are you thinking about early in
Speaker 3: that back night?
Speaker 2: Well, ten and eleven and twelve get your attention that
Speaker 2: you certainly think about where you shouldn't, but it's in
Speaker 2: your head. You really want to get through twelve. Like,
Speaker 2: if you're in twelve, in good shape, you're having a
Speaker 2: good day. You know, good things can happen after that.
Speaker 2: Ten is arguably, I think the second shot on ten,
Speaker 2: unless you really smashed one down there long and down
Speaker 2: there and left and got a short one in, is
Speaker 2: maybe the hardest swing on the course for me. Downslope,
Speaker 2: ball above your feet, five iron to a green that
Speaker 2: looks minuscule from up there. You're going down a pretty
Speaker 2: steep hill and it's such a beautiful environment. It's such
Speaker 2: a ten is one of my favorite holes to play.
Speaker 2: It's a fun t shot. You're really trying to hit
Speaker 2: a really big draw, but if you don't, it's not
Speaker 2: the end of the world. You just get a really
Speaker 2: hard second shot. Every time I part ten, I was happy.
Speaker 2: And that's another swing. You have to swing free on
Speaker 2: that second shot on ten because it makes you be
Speaker 2: careful but plays a little bit longer than it looks.
Speaker 2: The green looks tiny, the right bunkers definitely no guarantee,
Speaker 2: and left anything can happen when it bounces down left
Speaker 2: under them Amelia bushes. So nine you get the downslope
Speaker 2: feed lie to slightly alvi green. Then ten you get
Speaker 2: the downslope hook lie. Yeah. Nine you're get to a
Speaker 2: downslope fade lie to a green that really it encourages
Speaker 2: a low fade the lie, but the shot requires a
Speaker 2: high draw. And ten you get the low draw lie
Speaker 2: and the shot really requires a high fade. And that's
Speaker 2: two two holes in a row. You've got that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the way that green sits and the bunker that
Speaker 3: eats up that rate. It's brilliant because you got to
Speaker 3: hit something that way, yeah, or else it goes further away.
Speaker 3: See that every year the ball running away from the
Speaker 3: hall that looks like it's going to be close and
Speaker 3: then it ends up thirty feet away.
Speaker 2: And I love that idea of really to play ten great,
Speaker 2: you know, have to faded into tent. It just presents
Speaker 2: like kind of want to and it lands a bit
Speaker 2: softer and it's more receptive where you have to draw
Speaker 2: it off the tee and then to fade on the
Speaker 2: second shot. Yeah, ten is brilliant and ten is a
Speaker 2: I mean, it's obviously it's been talked about the green
Speaker 2: I guess a sphair bit, but that is a really
Speaker 2: really hard green to read. It does some mysterious things,
Speaker 2: and it's always in the shade, Yeah, the shade with
Speaker 2: the odd little patch of sun, and it's a it's
Speaker 2: a really intimate spot with the crowd the patrons too.
Speaker 2: It's like it's a it's a brilliant place. I mean,
Speaker 2: ten is one of my favorite sort of environments to
Speaker 2: hit golf shots in it and play in the world.
Speaker 2: It's just just a great feeling hole. But you're very
Speaker 2: happy to make part on ten and eleven clearly is
Speaker 2: it's the.
Speaker 3: Most exec shouan oriented all right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the te shot. It got a lot narrow when
Speaker 2: they put the trees in on the right, But the
Speaker 2: first year they put the trees in it on the right,
Speaker 2: it was narrower and the trees were a bit denser.
Speaker 2: They I don't think they ever actually said that they
Speaker 2: made it wider, but I think they did. Maybe they
Speaker 2: made it wider on the left, I'm not sure, but
Speaker 2: it is a very wide fair way even still with
Speaker 2: the trees on the right.
Speaker 3: It's fifty yards wide. I think they posted on Instagram.
Speaker 3: I'd never seen it before. I hadn't seen it in
Speaker 3: that Gough digest right up where they have all the gain.
Speaker 3: It used to have a principal no center line bunker.
Speaker 2: The tea used to be behind the tenth green. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and it was almost a dog leg to the right
Speaker 2: with a center bunker, so the narrow side being on
Speaker 2: the right to get the good angle to not have
Speaker 2: to come over the water, and then most people would
Speaker 2: end up going left of the bunker and then having
Speaker 2: to go across the water. I mean that would probably
Speaker 2: be more interesting, but the scale and space isn't there
Speaker 2: for that. Now you use too short. Guys would drive
Speaker 2: it on green from behind the tenth group now, so
Speaker 2: now it encourages you still to kind of drive it
Speaker 2: up the right, but really eleven, everyone's just trying to
Speaker 2: hit on the fairway because everyone just kind of wants
Speaker 2: to go thirty forty feet right of the pin two
Speaker 2: part and get out of there. Eleven and twelve are
Speaker 2: really you would take four to three there every day
Speaker 2: and run to the thirteenth seat. Hope when you hit it.
Speaker 3: You know, we see every bait bell short rate. What's
Speaker 3: that pitchhake?
Speaker 2: Really tough? So larry my shot? Yeah, oh my goodness.
Speaker 2: I mean if you go over watch practice rounds at
Speaker 2: the Masters, every group that comes through, everybody's hitting the
Speaker 2: toun of those because you know you're going to be
Speaker 2: there twice and three times, four times in a bad week,
Speaker 2: once in a good week. It's chipping. At the Masters.
Speaker 2: The grass is so short and it's generally cut towards
Speaker 2: like where you are, so you're hitting into the grain.
Speaker 2: I mean it's not really grainy, but it's enough to
Speaker 2: make you pay attention, and it's incredibly quick from that's
Speaker 2: the low point of the course when everybody talks about
Speaker 2: like the grain or the slope or the pitch or
Speaker 2: everything breaks towards the red dot, and there's all these
Speaker 2: theories about everything everything breaks towards eleventh green and the
Speaker 2: Telk green that's the low point. So that whole green
Speaker 2: is savage towards the pond on the left. So you're
Speaker 2: chipping uphill a little bit, not a lot, but enough too,
Speaker 2: a really steep down slope. And the real tricky thing
Speaker 2: at the Masters, and that's probably the spot where it's
Speaker 2: most evident, is the fringes are quite slow and the
Speaker 2: greens are very fast, so you really the best way
Speaker 2: to play is to just get you sixty out of
Speaker 2: fifty six and just get some spin on a little
Speaker 2: pitch and land it on the green and have it
Speaker 2: grab and bribble down. But that's a really scary shot,
Speaker 2: especially with the thin kind of grass or the short
Speaker 2: grass and the water past it.
Speaker 3: And when you see like the greens against you on
Speaker 3: the chip, it just means like if you don't get
Speaker 3: to hit that like little fat and have it go
Speaker 3: through and be okay, right, it just.
Speaker 2: Has to be more precise. Yeah, it's not out and out.
Speaker 2: A good shot will be good off any lie, but
Speaker 2: it just is less room for error. You can't catch
Speaker 2: that blade of grass before you catch the ball, or
Speaker 2: it's going to go shorter than it would if there wasn't.
Speaker 2: The grain is shue, and again it's not super grainy,
Speaker 2: and it's a little bit over blown that sort of thing,
Speaker 2: the grass towards the tee, but it's just enough to
Speaker 2: make you pay attention. But so you end up maybe
Speaker 2: doing that one skip like Larry Mais. I mean, I
Speaker 2: think it looked a little different thre his bounce two
Speaker 2: or three times on that thing. It's harder to do
Speaker 2: that now, I think, especially in a wet week. Love this.
Speaker 2: It's one of those things you want to the safe
Speaker 2: players to bump it along the ground, but you can
Speaker 2: get that wrong because the fringe catches really fast. It's
Speaker 2: a bit like over the back of fifteen too. The
Speaker 2: fringe catches the ball really quick, and if you force
Speaker 2: that just a little bit and it takes you want
Speaker 2: three bounces, it only takes two. Well, it's going to
Speaker 2: go straight in the pond. So that that and the
Speaker 2: shots from over the back of the fifteenth are the
Speaker 2: two wed shots that will get your attention. They're really
Speaker 2: really tricky. The whole forces you to hit it there
Speaker 2: almost it encourages you to hit it there, so because
Speaker 2: it kind of bail out, that's the bailout. I mean,
Speaker 2: you don't want hit it in the pond because then
Speaker 2: you've got the drop zone over it. You've got to
Speaker 2: go over the pond again.
Speaker 3: And it's like eventually you got to take the pandam
Speaker 3: on both those shots. Like if you if you bail
Speaker 3: right on eleven, you got to take the pand down
Speaker 3: on your third chat, And if you bail long on fifteen,
Speaker 3: say with your second chat, you've got to take the
Speaker 3: pandawn with the chip back.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and eleven. I guess it's prob maybe a little
Speaker 2: untalked about. You can't shit it short of the green
Speaker 2: because anything short of the green there's the big mounds,
Speaker 2: the just mint, they're just perfect. They're like, oh forty
Speaker 2: thirty forty twenty hours short of the green on the right.
Speaker 2: So anything in that lands short right like where you
Speaker 2: really want to hit it.
Speaker 3: It just it can.
Speaker 2: It doesn't always, but it can bounce thirty hours to
Speaker 2: left and go in the water. So you can't go
Speaker 2: five yards short of the front edge right, which is
Speaker 2: really where you want to hit it, and it's like
Speaker 2: this course has got that everywhere that oh, this is
Speaker 2: where you want to go, but you can't. We're going
Speaker 2: to make you take this on. You have to take
Speaker 2: this on in some respect. Even missing the green to
Speaker 2: the right, you have to hit it deeper than you want,
Speaker 2: You have to hit it further than you want. It's
Speaker 2: there's so many little suddle things like that out there
Speaker 2: that's incredible, and so that's the probably hit in the
Speaker 2: right trees. There's some gaps through there, and you can
Speaker 2: get it on the green, but you have to take
Speaker 2: it over those mounds that are short right of the green,
Speaker 2: and if it goes over the mound the wrong way,
Speaker 2: it just runs into the water. So you wind up
Speaker 2: you hit those guys who get it all the way
Speaker 2: out of the twelfth teet like they're just way out
Speaker 2: there and people must be watching, what are they doing?
Speaker 2: But you can't risk that front right short of the
Speaker 2: green because it can go in the water.
Speaker 3: So then twelve's got to be scariest shot. Yeah, it's
Speaker 3: other than the fifteen to second chat.
Speaker 2: Twelve is, Yeah, fifteen is a harder shot. Yeah, twelve is.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't. It's all mostly in your head. The wind
Speaker 2: can get really weird the kind of middle pin and
Speaker 2: the left pin, and that day they have a minute
Speaker 2: can be a pitching wedge, and if it's not too windy,
Speaker 2: it really isn't too difficult. But once the pin gets
Speaker 2: over on that right half of the green and maybe
Speaker 2: there's a little bit there's a one club wind. That's
Speaker 2: and it's true, you have absolutely no clue where it's
Speaker 2: going from. Like the wind can whistle if it's coming
Speaker 2: from the right way, it can pump down the thirteenth fairway,
Speaker 2: and there's a massive wall of trees behind twelve, so
Speaker 2: it seems to come down thirteenth fairway, it kind of
Speaker 2: around the bend and hit the trees and almost bounce
Speaker 2: back towards the tee. So all day, if you look
Speaker 2: at your your wind map or your compass in your
Speaker 2: yardish book, you know it's supposed to be down off
Speaker 2: the left or down off the right or whatever, but
Speaker 2: it actually one minute out of every three it can
Speaker 2: play into the wind because it's bouncing off that big
Speaker 2: wall of trees and it kind of holds up the ball.
Speaker 3: So you know that.
Speaker 2: So everyone has a theory about looking at the flag
Speaker 2: on eleven or wait till this does that and then
Speaker 2: hit it then. And I haven't. I've said two or
Speaker 2: three days there two or three situations that were just like,
Speaker 2: oh my god, I just what do I do? Because
Speaker 2: it's very easy to hit it in the bank over
Speaker 2: the back too, and the water is the ultimate miss
Speaker 2: because then you have to do it again like we
Speaker 2: saw Jordan and historically lives a lot of people do that.
Speaker 2: So the right pin is tough, and taking the wind
Speaker 2: out of the wind is an element that has really
Speaker 2: made the whole famous probably, but without that the genius,
Speaker 2: especially because most golf is the right handed in that
Speaker 2: short riders in the water and long left is over
Speaker 2: the green, and a right hander, when they miss it left,
Speaker 2: it goes long, and they miss it right, it goes short.
Speaker 3: And those are the misses when you're a little unsure,
Speaker 3: that cut pop up because your tempo gets a little off.
Speaker 2: And if you want to eat the Nicholas has just
Speaker 2: go over the bunk and go left to the pin
Speaker 2: and put it over. And that's a great theory. But
Speaker 2: the middle of the green is shorter than where the
Speaker 2: pin is, so if you pick that line and hit
Speaker 2: it right of that line, you're going to go in
Speaker 2: the water. So I guess a lot of people would
Speaker 2: see guys hit it, and some big names. It's the
Speaker 2: big moments have hit it in the water. And the
Speaker 2: right on twelve, Well, if they're trying to play the
Speaker 2: smart play and push it, it's guaranteed to be in
Speaker 2: the water. But if you're trying to go to the
Speaker 2: pin somewhere near the pin and you pull it, you're
Speaker 2: going to be on that hill or over the back.
Speaker 2: And for a left hander, I think it's fifty percent
Speaker 2: easier a half shut at least. Yeah, because their pool
Speaker 2: goes long, so ams at them, Philip barbarraim at the
Speaker 2: middle of the green. They pull it, it gets there
Speaker 2: and they push it. It doesn't go long. So if
Speaker 2: there was no angle, if the t was twenty yards
Speaker 2: further the ride or thirty yars further the right, it
Speaker 2: wouldn't be much of a it wouldn't be the hole
Speaker 2: it was. It'd be beautiful and famous and it'll be tricky,
Speaker 2: but it wouldn't have that kind of edge of Wow.
Speaker 3: It's like the importance of an angle, yeah, because you're
Speaker 3: hitting from essentially they put it in a disadvantage angle
Speaker 3: for a right hand.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's genius. The front left edge would
Speaker 2: be I don't have the book in front of me,
Speaker 2: but it's probably fifteen yards short of the front right edge,
Speaker 2: and the back left edge is probably close to the
Speaker 2: front edge on the right pin, so if you go
Speaker 2: to the left hand side of the green, back edge
Speaker 2: will only just carry on the right. So it's you've
Speaker 2: got to pick your spot, pick your club. I hope
Speaker 2: you get the club right, pick your spot and hit
Speaker 2: it within your five yards either side of your target,
Speaker 2: and you're pretty much at the grain every time. But
Speaker 2: if you don't, you've got long left, which is stressful,
Speaker 2: less stressful than the water, but it's and it just
Speaker 2: makes you nervous, Like it's a beautiful as I said
Speaker 2: ten eleven twelve, you just want to get to the
Speaker 2: thirteenth team at that point, like, just get me there,
Speaker 2: no carnage. Maybe you're feeling it good, you maybe you
Speaker 2: make a birdie through ten eleven twelve. Whatever it's happened,
Speaker 2: you know you can do it. But it's definitely the
Speaker 2: part of the course that can ruin your.
Speaker 3: Day the most Wednesday's Pad. You said that the thirteenth
Speaker 3: tevas is the best tavacent golf like that.
Speaker 2: It's the best place in professional golf by a long way.
Speaker 2: On one about playing fields at least, I don't know.
Speaker 2: It's just your two hundred yards probably one hundred and
Speaker 2: eighty yards at least from the nearest spectator. There's maybe
Speaker 2: a Master's official back there hiding back there, and there's
Speaker 2: a CBS guy, I think, just to make sure the
Speaker 2: camera's on a tripod. I think. I don't think he
Speaker 2: actually mans the camera, but just to make sure it's
Speaker 2: all working. And otherwise it's completely silent and you've come
Speaker 2: off twelve. Where there's the most beautiful noise in golf
Speaker 2: is when you make a putt on twelve and there's
Speaker 2: that speed of sound gap, right, You've got that three
Speaker 2: seconds until you hear the cheers and the collapse. It's
Speaker 2: just fantastic. I mean, I don't know, there's something about
Speaker 2: it that's just really rare in golf. And it's just
Speaker 2: a nice feeling. So you're back on thirteen, you're tucked away,
Speaker 2: nobody can see you, and you're looking at the most
Speaker 2: beautiful T shirt in the world. So it's like it's
Speaker 2: just a nice you're always on show. You're a goldfish
Speaker 2: at something like the Masters, Right. The appeal to golf,
Speaker 2: I guess from a spectator a lot of times is
Speaker 2: that they're so close to us. And I guess that's
Speaker 2: why that's just such a nice change for us, because
Speaker 2: we're two hundred yards really from the nearest fan. It's
Speaker 2: just a nice place, and it's just such a good hole.
Speaker 2: We're just excited. We've just come off the toughest stretch
Speaker 2: on the course and we're about to play the funnest
Speaker 2: stretch on the course.
Speaker 3: When you're playing in front of a crowd, how I
Speaker 3: mean do different events like is there like a a
Speaker 3: point where you just start noticing them? Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2: Usually for me it's odd. But I've always found the
Speaker 2: bigger the crowd, the easier it is, because it all
Speaker 2: kind of blends in. I've always found the toughest crowd
Speaker 2: the three people, four people, because it's a bit more
Speaker 2: intimate and personal and they almost feel like they can
Speaker 2: talk to you, and it's a there's something kind of
Speaker 2: unnerving about two or three guys standing right near you.
Speaker 2: It's kind of I don't know. I've always found that
Speaker 2: harder than or that one guy who stands behind your put.
Speaker 2: There's one guy at the Pudding Green and he walks
Speaker 2: around to stand right behind the line of your put
Speaker 2: to watch your put. And it's a perfectly fair thing
Speaker 2: for him to do, and that's a great way to
Speaker 2: watch your put. But it's you notice that one guy.
Speaker 2: But you get to the Phoenix Open, and I mean
Speaker 2: that would be a little different. But you're in the
Speaker 2: Masters and there's five thousand people on every hole. It's
Speaker 2: just a bit of a blur. It blends in and
Speaker 2: it's almost it's white noise. So it's like the noise
Speaker 2: canceling headphones. It's almost you don't notice them as much.
Speaker 3: It's like there's constant noise. Like I was playing a
Speaker 3: tournament at Beverly in Chicago, which is like over it's
Speaker 3: like you know, in the city of Chicago, major streets,
Speaker 3: and then right over Midway is flying over like all
Speaker 3: day and it's it's gotta be the loudest course in America.
Speaker 3: And but then like it's so funny, you don't even
Speaker 3: notice it after a couple of horse.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is. It's like there's a few there's there's
Speaker 2: a few famous courses around the world to have the
Speaker 2: airports and Sernander is, to be fair, it's kind of
Speaker 2: one of them. There's Lucas the RIF base, and there's
Speaker 2: jets all day and that kind of helps a little
Speaker 2: bit sometimes. And Tory Pines is renowned for f eighteens
Speaker 2: and hornets and all sorts of stuff. They're flying absolutely
Speaker 2: all day and it does create this kind of noise
Speaker 2: canceling headphones effect. It's just you don't even notice it
Speaker 2: after a bit.
Speaker 3: So then when you go back to thirteen, it's kind
Speaker 3: of weird.
Speaker 2: It's really really quiet, and yeah, you can hear each
Speaker 2: other talk and it's just a it's a very odd place.
Speaker 2: When you play The Masters is such an assault on
Speaker 2: your senses. There's people everywhere, there's noise, and it's such
Speaker 2: a massive week that you've got this spot on the
Speaker 2: course that's just totally silent. It's it's actually really nice.
Speaker 3: What do you What are you thinking about with that
Speaker 3: thirteenth T shirt?
Speaker 2: Well, I'm for me. I've always kind of struggled to
Speaker 2: hit a big drawer with a driver, so I I
Speaker 2: kind of initially initially was trying to hit Threewood because
Speaker 2: a lot of guys the longer guys would hit three
Speaker 2: woods because it's much easier hit a hawk. And I
Speaker 2: played with Freddie early days a couple of times, and
Speaker 2: he hit this great sweeping drawer with the three wood
Speaker 2: that was kind of I was very envious about. But
Speaker 2: it looked like the sensible way to play it. And
Speaker 2: the the trouble because it's once you've gone left once
Speaker 2: or twice, it spooks you for a long time about
Speaker 2: going left again. So your problem really is hitting it
Speaker 2: through the fairway because that really takes out woll unless
Speaker 2: you get lucky in the pine straw. It brings in
Speaker 2: the risk. So I would try to hit kind of
Speaker 2: three woods with a decent draw, but give the trees
Speaker 2: a lot of air, like the trees are very penal,
Speaker 2: and everything seems to bounce in the water from the
Speaker 2: trees every single time, or left of the water even
Speaker 2: and that's just terrible. So I generally hit three wood,
Speaker 2: and I think I ended up hitting a few more drivers,
Speaker 2: trying to get a little bit more aggressive, but I
Speaker 2: I wasn't really that great, or haven't been that great
Speaker 2: in big draws of drivers, so I kind of was
Speaker 2: willing to accept like a three or four one under
Speaker 2: the green. I didn't really ever try to get much
Speaker 2: closer than that, because, as I said, you hit one
Speaker 2: left one time and you get so burnt by being left,
Speaker 2: and you just feel like you've wasted a shot or
Speaker 2: two and you've missed out on maybe the funner shot
Speaker 2: on the course, which is the second shot. I used
Speaker 2: to give it a bit of air and I used
Speaker 2: to block a few and then you'd be way out
Speaker 2: and you'd have to lay it up. But at least
Speaker 2: that way you don't go left. So I would just
Speaker 2: try to sort of almost back for the three would
Speaker 2: and hit kind of a low, screaming hook.
Speaker 3: That was my plan. So messing that fair away you
Speaker 3: would be really mad because you didn't get to hit
Speaker 3: the second shot.
Speaker 2: There's a funner shot on the course. For me, it's
Speaker 2: just incredible, and what people don't it's such a genius hole.
Speaker 2: It's almost the perfect golf hole. And if it isn't
Speaker 2: the perfect golf hole, it's probably as close as you
Speaker 2: can get to a perfect golf hole. It's strategically, the
Speaker 2: further let the closer to the water you get, you
Speaker 2: get like a threefold advantage. You get a flatter lie,
Speaker 2: you get closer to the green and you have a
Speaker 2: better angle if you the further away from the creek
Speaker 2: you are. The further from the green, the more the
Speaker 2: ball is above your feet, and the worse your angle
Speaker 2: into the green. And it's incredible how steeply or how
Speaker 2: much the ball is above your feet on that second shot.
Speaker 2: I think it surprises everyone for the first time when
Speaker 2: they hit the second shot and to thirteen. They hit
Speaker 2: a nice drive up to the middle of fairway, maybe
Speaker 2: around the corner a little bit, and they've got this
Speaker 2: four or five iron, three iron, four iron, five iron
Speaker 2: with the ball legitimately six or eight inches above your feet,
Speaker 2: and that's really quite difficult.
Speaker 3: It's gonna be so hard to hit it high off
Speaker 3: that lay right.
Speaker 2: It's hard hit at high. And it's also because the
Speaker 2: trouble is short left and it goes to long right
Speaker 2: the way they again, it's another angle. It's another great angle.
Speaker 2: If you had a flat lie and everything else was
Speaker 2: being was kind of different, you would want to hit
Speaker 2: a fade into that green because you could hit a
Speaker 2: shot that was basically never really going to be in
Speaker 2: the water. You could start it left with the green
Speaker 2: and kind of the shortest carry I mean, the carry
Speaker 2: to the front edge is probably thirty yards shorter than
Speaker 2: the car carry to kind of the right edge of
Speaker 2: that back right pin. So you could that safe one
Speaker 2: where you always fell a well, if I hit it straight,
Speaker 2: then I'll just miss the green left. But I can
Speaker 2: kind of make birdie over there, but you have to
Speaker 2: with the ball above your feet kind of hit a draw.
Speaker 2: And so you're hanging it over the long carrier and
Speaker 2: you're hanging it over the water, and yeah, it's hard
Speaker 2: to hit it high. And that shot is actually it
Speaker 2: doesn't even look at when you're standing there, but the
Speaker 2: water in the creek runs quite significantly and quite fast
Speaker 2: from the green towards rays creek, it runs back towards
Speaker 2: the teeth, so it's obviously quite uphill. A second shot,
Speaker 2: I actually can't remember we've got slopes in our books
Speaker 2: now but what it plays, but it would definitely play
Speaker 2: five ten yards longer than it measures just because of
Speaker 2: the hill. So you've got it's again, like it is
Speaker 2: all the way around the course. You've got this shot
Speaker 2: that all you want to do is hit a high fade,
Speaker 2: and all the all of the stances trying to give
Speaker 2: you as a low drawer.
Speaker 3: And the scale of that fair a way is what
Speaker 3: created the deception of the uphill on the second shot.
Speaker 2: I guess, yeah, it just doesn't seem you feel like
Speaker 2: you kind of because you come down off the thirteenth tee,
Speaker 2: you cross the creek and you walk all the way up.
Speaker 2: You walk up to your ball quite significantly really, so
Speaker 2: I guess it feels like you'll come back. It kind
Speaker 2: of seems like the corner is the high point. The
Speaker 2: way it all looks, and the way the trees are
Speaker 2: and trees on the right are so much higher than
Speaker 2: the trees the creek on the left. It's the second shot, Yeah,
Speaker 2: that it just feels like you should be going down
Speaker 2: to the green, but you're actually still going quite significantly
Speaker 2: up to the green.
Speaker 3: That's really interesting, and that makes that shot even harder.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it plays longer the carry it gets every yard
Speaker 2: you go to the right, it gets two yards further
Speaker 2: to carry. You know. It's one of those kind of deals.
Speaker 2: It's but it's such a good fun shot to pull off.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's really a massive green. It might be
Speaker 2: the biggest green on the course, but it looks tiny
Speaker 2: from back there on the fairway and yeah, never that
Speaker 2: sad when you miss the green left. But it's a
Speaker 2: really tricky chip from left. I mean it's a crazy
Speaker 2: slope green and it's got that same thing as ten.
Speaker 2: It's it's always in the shadows. Well, it's in the
Speaker 2: shadows from lunchtime onwards probably, So if.
Speaker 3: You're where you want to be, if you're playing well
Speaker 3: and you're where you want to be on the weekend,
Speaker 3: it's in the shadow.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's in the shadows. If you're telling off anywhere
Speaker 2: remotely close to the lead, you are, and it's shadows.
Speaker 2: It's not definitively all in the shade. There's like light
Speaker 2: patches and dark patches, and like there's that ultimate hard
Speaker 2: kind of light.
Speaker 3: To read a green in that little back run off
Speaker 3: area is really tricky, spart.
Speaker 2: Right, It's yeah, it's super tricky. It's kind of quite
Speaker 2: a significant kind of dip and the bunkers are actually
Speaker 2: quite high. The bunkers are almost above the heart of
Speaker 2: the green. But the I mean it's probably only a
Speaker 2: foot or two that little kind of dip between the
Speaker 2: back edge of the green or the left edge and
Speaker 2: the back edge of the green and those bunkers and
Speaker 2: up towards the flower. It's quite a significant dip, and
Speaker 2: it's enough that it's extremely slow to put up because
Speaker 2: it's quite a steep little hill, and it's like putting
Speaker 2: up a steep, little slow hill through the fringe and
Speaker 2: then just ultra fast all the way to the water.
Speaker 2: It's not where you want to be. It's clearly better
Speaker 2: than being in the water, and it's better than generally
Speaker 2: it's probably better than laying up even close to the creek,
Speaker 2: but it's still not really your favorite shot, especially if
Speaker 2: you're anywhere near the mix, because it's a Again, it's
Speaker 2: that that speed differential between fringe and green is so
Speaker 2: great that you want to run it through the fringe
Speaker 2: to the safety of the putter. But it's a really
Speaker 2: hard one to get right with the putter, so you
Speaker 2: kind of end up going with the wedge and if
Speaker 2: you don't get any spin on it, you don't clip
Speaker 2: it right, you catch the slope wrong. You can be
Speaker 2: thirty feet below the hole, or you can hitch itp
Speaker 2: it in the water pretty easy, or leave it down
Speaker 2: where your feet are, so it's you don't want to
Speaker 2: be down there. It's better than being right, but you
Speaker 2: don't want to be down there.
Speaker 3: It gives you the ultimate and if you take it
Speaker 3: on and pull it off the second chart, really it does.
Speaker 2: And again it's that perfect situation that if you wanted
Speaker 2: to make five four days in a row, you would
Speaker 2: make five for the rest of your life. A professional
Speaker 2: golfer playing in the Masters would never not make five
Speaker 2: if his goal was to make a five. Because there's
Speaker 2: a thousand hours of fairway to the right. You could
Speaker 2: just something way out to the right, lay it up
Speaker 2: into the biggest fairway on the court because it's really
Speaker 2: fourteen and thirteen fairway. You can lay it up as
Speaker 2: close to the creek as you want, left, right, anywhere,
Speaker 2: and it's really quite easy to hit the middle of
Speaker 2: that green in three shots. But you're never going to
Speaker 2: make four. So as soon as you try to make
Speaker 2: four or three, you're bringing the creek off the tee
Speaker 2: because the only the easier that it's relatively easy second
Speaker 2: shot if you're down near the creek around the corner,
Speaker 2: as I said, because it's flat lie the angle is
Speaker 2: better and you're closer to the green.
Speaker 3: The dynamics of like of where it is and knowing
Speaker 3: the back and with where people can just make up
Speaker 3: ground like crazy on there. It even if you have
Speaker 3: a four shot lead, you kind of have to go
Speaker 3: for it.
Speaker 2: Right, Well, that's it if that's the first year or
Speaker 2: two was the fourth hole, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I wanted to ask you about this.
Speaker 2: It would be completely different. Well, it would still be
Speaker 2: a great hole and it be amazing, but people would
Speaker 2: play it differently as the fourth hole because they'd probably
Speaker 2: be more willing to accept not making birdie. But when
Speaker 2: it's thirteen, especially late on Saturday or Sunday, you know,
Speaker 2: there's a few guys in contention. You're going to make
Speaker 2: three or four, or everybody's going to make four, it
Speaker 2: feels like, and a bunch of guys are going to
Speaker 2: make three, so you have to kind of try to
Speaker 2: make three and it's three or four, And as soon
Speaker 2: as you try to do that, that's when you bring
Speaker 2: in all the stress, and that's when it's a really
Speaker 2: anxiety building hole, right because you have to hit two
Speaker 2: of the most high quality shots you have to hit
Speaker 2: anywhere to get that eagle part with all sorts of
Speaker 2: risk involved. When you really could just go bail out
Speaker 2: to the right, bail out to the right, have a
Speaker 2: relatively easy wedge with a big back stop to that
Speaker 2: Sunday pin. You can get it within twenty feet every time,
Speaker 2: but you can't really do that when you were in
Speaker 2: the mix and the six in front of something. I
Speaker 2: mean even three or four in front isn't enough. Really,
Speaker 2: the situation in the tournament being six holes to play,
Speaker 2: you really have to take on again. It makes you,
Speaker 2: It encourages you to take on shots that you might
Speaker 2: not necessarily want to take on.
Speaker 3: I'm going to table my question about the flip till
Speaker 3: later because I want to go through the last few
Speaker 3: before we I ask you fourteen. We talked about it
Speaker 3: on the front nine and three a little bit. How
Speaker 3: they are the holes where leaders pick up the most shots.
Speaker 3: So fourteen no bunkers. Everybody always talks about no bunkers.
Speaker 3: But it has some of the most severe contours.
Speaker 2: Right. It's probably the if anyone's never been there, which
Speaker 2: most people probably haven't, it's probably the green that freaks
Speaker 2: people out the most when they see how dramatic and
Speaker 2: crazy it is. I mean, it is a massive green
Speaker 2: left to right or right to left wide. It's not
Speaker 2: necessarily that deep, it's quite I mean it's deep enough.
Speaker 2: But the first fifteen out of the green is completely
Speaker 2: unusable because it's one of those big kind of Sinnandrews,
Speaker 2: like kind of false fronts, if you like. It's really
Speaker 2: big and severe, and it's super high on the left
Speaker 2: and it's almost like a three tier green from left
Speaker 2: to right. So it's really high on the left, really
Speaker 2: small little level on the left, the medium kind of
Speaker 2: level in the middle, and then quite a big level
Speaker 2: down the bottom.
Speaker 3: Right. Have you played past the temper I haven't played.
Speaker 3: You've seen that sixteenth green, right, Yeah, so it's kind
Speaker 3: of like that on the side.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I've never heard anybody describe it like that, but that's
Speaker 3: what it clicked them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's a green that you the T shirt.
Speaker 2: I think actually when they made that longer, they moved
Speaker 2: the tea back twenty or thirty when was it either
Speaker 2: ninety eight or two thousand and five or whatever. They
Speaker 2: did those two changes, it got longer. I think the
Speaker 2: T shot got a little bit easier with that, and
Speaker 2: the fact when they started cut the fairways back to
Speaker 2: the teeth, because I think in the old days, from
Speaker 2: what I hear is you had to hit a drawer
Speaker 2: to keep it on the fairway because the fairway camps
Speaker 2: very it's quite high on the left and low on
Speaker 2: the right, So anything with anything where it's straight or
Speaker 2: fade is going to hit and bounce and run to
Speaker 2: the right.
Speaker 3: So now there's a little seame ridge that moves down thirteen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the same hill higher up the hill, but
Speaker 2: the same sort of slope, and you have to hit it.
Speaker 2: It's quite a big fairway now, I think it's bigger
Speaker 2: than it was before. The length actually made it a
Speaker 2: little bit easier to hit, I think, because it's quite
Speaker 2: hard to hit in the trees now. I mean you
Speaker 2: can run it out into the right raf, which is
Speaker 2: not ideal because it's a green you want a lot
Speaker 2: to spin into. But it went from like a hook
Speaker 2: three would I think in the old days, to like
Speaker 2: just smash the driver and if you can draw it,
Speaker 2: it's definitely an advantage because again the higher on the
Speaker 2: left you get the flatter of stances. So again it's
Speaker 2: a bit like thirteen. In the closer on the inside
Speaker 2: of the dog leg you are the flatterer stance, and
Speaker 2: the higher up you are, so the shorter the second
Speaker 2: shot plays. But there's trees on the left that you,
Speaker 2: I think dust and carry them yesterday, but generally no
Speaker 2: one can get them. Massive trees and you kind of
Speaker 2: have to go around them. Have you hit them. They again,
Speaker 2: Augusta trees, they always bounce towards the trouble. Right Augusta
Speaker 2: trees somehow make balls bounce into the trouble, not back
Speaker 2: onto the fairway. But it's I felt, a relatively simple
Speaker 2: t shot. If you as long as you were hitting
Speaker 2: a big fade for a right hander and get it
Speaker 2: up there to eight nine, nine weirds, you've hit a
Speaker 2: good one. And then the second shot is it changes
Speaker 2: every day with where the pin is, that famous kind
Speaker 2: of pin in the middle that they have on Sundays
Speaker 2: where anything within twenty or thirty feet left of it
Speaker 2: just goes at it just rolls towards it. That's a
Speaker 2: really fun pin to hit at when you're in the
Speaker 2: middle of the fairway, but you can get it wrong
Speaker 2: because if you miss it two feet to the right
Speaker 2: of the pin, you're going to have a sixty foot
Speaker 2: from the bottom right of the green. And that's a
Speaker 2: part that might be the slowest part of Augusta. You
Speaker 2: got to smash it, so you don't want to do that.
Speaker 2: You can't gen short. If you miss the green shorts,
Speaker 2: it's a one in five up and down, maybe even more.
Speaker 2: And again it's a hole you want to hit a
Speaker 2: draw into because you want the drawer to be holding
Speaker 2: you on the slope when it lands. But the ball
Speaker 2: is so far below your feet on the second shot,
Speaker 2: it's really difficult to hit a draw, so you end up.
Speaker 2: I usually ended up having a ball that was moving
Speaker 2: left to right, so the first bounce or the spin
Speaker 2: that's kind of checking to the right, which accentuates all
Speaker 2: the slope on the green. So it's it is certainly
Speaker 2: a birdie hole with a good drive, but it's certainly
Speaker 2: a second shot that requires as much attention as any
Speaker 2: other second shot because if you can't, if you don't
Speaker 2: get it on the right level, you're going to have
Speaker 2: a really long part or a really fast part. One
Speaker 2: O yell, and you can have puts on that green
Speaker 2: that break twenty five feet from twenty five feet.
Speaker 3: The way that green sits in that ridge is perfect
Speaker 3: to make it that way too, because that whole thing
Speaker 3: kind of cascades, latten and rate, and the green just
Speaker 3: sits there kind of carved out of it, and then
Speaker 3: you know, built up to get that little front ray
Speaker 3: part cascades is a great word. It does look like
Speaker 3: it's water falling down the hill a little bit. That
Speaker 3: green's it's.
Speaker 2: An incredible green. Ben crenshaw Is said at a bunch
Speaker 2: of times, it's the most three partable green in the world, right,
Speaker 2: I mean it's it's a crazy green. And you just
Speaker 2: you are so conscious of not missing it short short
Speaker 2: The first time you see it seems the miss because
Speaker 2: it's under the hole. But it's under the hole. You
Speaker 2: go up this massive false front, the biggest one Augusta
Speaker 2: by a long way, I mean heights. I mean it's
Speaker 2: probably only three feet, but it seems twelve feet above you.
Speaker 2: Right when you're short of that green and you have
Speaker 2: to smash the puts so hard and so far left
Speaker 2: of the hole because of all the break that it's
Speaker 2: as I said, it's probably a one in five, one
Speaker 2: in ten up and down from short of the green.
Speaker 2: So everybody knows that. And when the balls below your
Speaker 2: feet and you end up kind of carving up a
Speaker 2: bit of a fade, it's very easy to miss short
Speaker 2: of the green. So you're conscious of that.
Speaker 3: So and that's a hard light to hit that draw
Speaker 3: that you want to hit, And.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for me it always was. I mean, I think
Speaker 2: for everyone it's the hardest. For the For the comfortable
Speaker 2: drawers like like Rory and guys like that, then it's
Speaker 2: probably not that big a deal. But for most people
Speaker 2: it certainly makes the shape you want to hit. The
Speaker 2: slope is exactly wrong for the shape you want to hit.
Speaker 3: Long is the mess right, long long and.
Speaker 2: Right of the pin is the miss. And if you
Speaker 2: want to miss it right of the pin, but not
Speaker 2: by very much generally, I mean that pin in the middle.
Speaker 2: To get it close, you have to land it left
Speaker 2: of the pin and it's sweeps down, but you'd still
Speaker 2: prefer it to sweep down and break and end up
Speaker 2: below the whole. To the right, long right is you
Speaker 2: can get up and down to any pin from long right.
Speaker 3: How do you miss long rate though as a rady.
Speaker 2: It's difficult because you're you're missed. To the right is
Speaker 2: generally short right. So if you can miss it to
Speaker 2: the long ride, if you actually hit it straight or
Speaker 2: hit a draw pull one, it's going to go long right,
Speaker 2: long left and long left is a disaster. So again
Speaker 2: it's just a very clever use of slope. Serendipitous, I
Speaker 2: think a little bit because you couldn't have built a
Speaker 2: different green there that you could only build a green
Speaker 2: that went high left to low right because the severity
Speaker 2: of the hill. But it just it just worked. And
Speaker 2: there's some incredibly impossible pins that where you have maybe
Speaker 2: there's this kind of frontish left pin which isn't really
Speaker 2: front left, but it's front left of the usable green.
Speaker 2: It's probably twenty five on the green, but it's in
Speaker 2: the first eight feet of usable green on that high
Speaker 2: left side, and if it's maybe a six foot circle
Speaker 2: that you could get it close, and if you don't,
Speaker 2: you're going to be potentially one hundred feet from the hole.
Speaker 2: If you miss at one foot right of that pin,
Speaker 2: you can potentially be not all the time, it can
Speaker 2: hang on that middle tier, but if it gets a
Speaker 2: bit of momentum of the very top tier, it goes
Speaker 2: down the middle tier and then down all the under
Speaker 2: the lower tier and you can have one hundred foot
Speaker 2: And as I said, that's the slowest part of the masters.
Speaker 2: And I think sometimes the slow puts are the masters
Speaker 2: are the hard ones because you're so fearful of the
Speaker 2: one back.
Speaker 3: If you smash it and you've been hitting themselves soft,
Speaker 3: are there.
Speaker 2: You're so I wouldn't tentative isn't the word, but conscious
Speaker 2: of not hitting it too hard, and that one it's
Speaker 2: a little bit untalked about. I think a lot of
Speaker 2: the old experienced guys talk about how slow the upper
Speaker 2: parts are of the masters, and to me, they're always
Speaker 2: the difficult ones because again, it's always in your head
Speaker 2: to not hit a six week pass and you hitting
Speaker 2: it's so hard, I mean, one hundred and sixty eighty
Speaker 2: foot ninety foot up, two tiers up, I don't even
Speaker 2: know w to know, ten percent kind of slow grade.
Speaker 2: It's incredible how hard you have to hit it. And
Speaker 2: it's really really hard to get yourself to hit it
Speaker 2: that hard because you just don't want that six foot
Speaker 2: on the way back, because the six foot on the
Speaker 2: way back you could potentially go back all the way
Speaker 2: down again.
Speaker 3: So it's a whole that really really rewards great charts
Speaker 3: rewards because it's really hard to make par if you're
Speaker 3: not in the rate. It's really hard to make par
Speaker 3: even if you're in the RONKSPA.
Speaker 2: Just half yeah, it rewards a nice T shot. Again,
Speaker 2: it's not the most demanding T shot on the course.
Speaker 2: You're gotta pay a little bit of attention, but it's
Speaker 2: a very very precise second shot to hit it close.
Speaker 2: And if you don't hit that precise second shot, you're
Speaker 2: going to have some difficulty in making power for sure.
Speaker 3: Then you go to fifteen, which is infamous. Hall I
Speaker 3: feel like just surviving it for four rounds is it's.
Speaker 2: Kind of like that. It depends. It generally plays slightly
Speaker 2: into the wind. Historically in all the tournaments I played,
Speaker 2: it doesn't really ever seem to get down wind. I mean,
Speaker 2: it can swirl a bit, and it can, but it's
Speaker 2: generally probably slightly into the wind, and the T shot
Speaker 2: is relatively easy. It's just bombs away. It's not really
Speaker 2: about accuracy. It's a little bit because down the left side,
Speaker 2: obviously those trees get into the mix. But it's that
Speaker 2: one of those free is the free hit at it
Speaker 2: really you can just tee off because if you don't
Speaker 2: smash it, it's the hole you on the tee. You
Speaker 2: do everything you can to be able to go for
Speaker 2: it too. Because as hard as that second shot is
Speaker 2: and as much trouble as there with a second shot.
Speaker 2: Getting it over the water in two on dry land
Speaker 2: is preferable to anything short of the water. There is
Speaker 2: nothing good short of the water. It is the hardest
Speaker 2: wedge in golf, so by a long stretch, I would
Speaker 2: say with the most train wrecks happen on the third
Speaker 2: shot generally, not the second shot or the drop after
Speaker 2: the second one goes in the water. That wedge is
Speaker 2: just beyond brutal. So you are very motivated to hit
Speaker 2: a good T shirt and it was always never on
Speaker 2: the edge for me, but it was funny. It's one
Speaker 2: of those holes that in practice you're maybe not quite
Speaker 2: in tournament speed yet because you're not the adrenaline isn't
Speaker 2: going and stuff. I always felt like I had two
Speaker 2: forty to the pin in practice. It's like, how do
Speaker 2: people go for this is ridiculous, and like you would
Speaker 2: go for it in practice because it doesn't matter and
Speaker 2: hitting two irons and three irons and three woods even
Speaker 2: and it's just like not the target for a three wood.
Speaker 2: But as the tournament comes on, usually by the fourteenth
Speaker 2: you've kind of pretty you're swinging it pretty hard and
Speaker 2: if you're feeling decent. You can't seem if I get
Speaker 2: it up there to two twenty like three four five
Speaker 2: iron kind of when you're playing really well, so you
Speaker 2: really really really want to The most important thing of
Speaker 2: the day on fifteen is being able to get it
Speaker 2: on dry land for two over the pond, because it's,
Speaker 2: as I said, just the complete nightmare of a pit shut.
Speaker 2: And then when you get it on, it's a super
Speaker 2: fun second shot to pull off. Though it's similar to thirteen,
Speaker 2: and there's a lot of history involved in that because
Speaker 2: we've seen so many people hit the shot. And the
Speaker 2: pins on the right depends on the right are the
Speaker 2: easy pins that Sunday pin on the right, it's the
Speaker 2: eagle pin that the I mean they've moved it. They've
Speaker 2: kind of dabbled around with the Sunday pins. It's been
Speaker 2: a bit more in the middle of the green and
Speaker 2: Sergio's was in the middle of the green a couple
Speaker 2: of years ago and that unbelievable shotting hit. But that
Speaker 2: back right pin is certain the green light pin, and
Speaker 2: you would go at that back right pin with almost
Speaker 2: any club if you could get it there. I think.
Speaker 3: The slope, which you know makes that ray pin easier.
Speaker 3: It is so hard to tell on TV because it's
Speaker 3: propped up and you can't see it. But if you
Speaker 3: think about where the green's positioned, like three hundred yards
Speaker 3: the left, it's thirteen green, which is you know, just
Speaker 3: running right down that slope, so it's got a light
Speaker 3: of pitch to it right to last.
Speaker 2: It's the same kind of hill. It's the general same hill.
Speaker 2: Once when you're at twelve, the way back to the
Speaker 2: clubhouse with the routing was traversing the hill. Yeah, so
Speaker 2: thirteen that's right to left. It's high on the right,
Speaker 2: lower on the left, fourteen it's high on the left,
Speaker 2: low on the right, and fifteen high on the right
Speaker 2: and loan it's it's traversing the hill kind of. That's
Speaker 2: the way to get up the hill. So the fairway
Speaker 2: on fifteen is relatively flat, but the green is really
Speaker 2: a lot very very fast from right to left, and
Speaker 2: it's progressively shallower left you go on the green to
Speaker 2: like the back left hand side of the green seems
Speaker 2: to slope towards the back of the green a little
Speaker 2: bit down towards the water on sixteen, where if the
Speaker 2: right hand side of the green seems a bit more
Speaker 2: receptive and a bit kind of into you. You can
Speaker 2: kind of stop a three on on the right hand
Speaker 2: side of the green. On the left hands tide of
Speaker 2: the green. It seems like you can't stop a wedge.
Speaker 2: So it's kind of I don't know how to describe
Speaker 2: that in words, but it's it's an uphill kind of
Speaker 2: it lands on an up slope on the right hand.
Speaker 3: Take a potato chip.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's got a little bit of a twist in't it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: It's like it's it's an uphill part from the front
Speaker 2: right to the back right pin, and it's a downhill
Speaker 2: part from the front left to the back left pin.
Speaker 2: You know, So it's.
Speaker 3: Hitting wedges into greens that run a little away. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Do you think that's one of the hardest shots.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The shot of the wedge shot, which is why
Speaker 2: you don't want to miss the fail your neck, you
Speaker 2: t shot, is the instinct when the pin is on
Speaker 2: the left and I got burnt by this in two
Speaker 2: thousand and seven, but the instinct is to lay it
Speaker 2: up down the right because the pin's on the left
Speaker 2: and you feel like you're going to kind of create
Speaker 2: a bit more room on the green. But the further right,
Speaker 2: you are on the fairway with that wedge shot from
Speaker 2: one hundred yards or eighty yards, you are landing it
Speaker 2: on that pretty significant downslope of the green from right
Speaker 2: to left, and the first bounce is so big that
Speaker 2: if you land it anywhere near pin high, it's just
Speaker 2: one bounce over the back. And we've all seen that
Speaker 2: shot a lot, that wedge that lands next to the
Speaker 2: pin and just goes bounce over the back. So you're
Speaker 2: off a downslope on that As I said that that
Speaker 2: fairway grass that demands precision. I mean it's not difficult,
Speaker 2: but it demands precision like it's unforgiving. It's an unforgiving light,
Speaker 2: especially with the wedge. So I initially was trying to
Speaker 2: lay it up on the right, and in two thousand
Speaker 2: and seven I laid it. It was that crazy, ridiculous
Speaker 2: Saturday when it was thirty four degrees and the year
Speaker 2: of Zach Johnson one and we're all shooting over par
Speaker 2: I think I was somewhat in the mix, two or
Speaker 2: three behind, I think, with four holes to play on Saturday,
Speaker 2: and I wedged two in the water and I laid
Speaker 2: it up down the right and landed my sixty like
Speaker 2: on the front engine. It just spun off the greend
Speaker 2: of the water and then I got stubborn and dropped
Speaker 2: it in the same spot. Or maybe I walked up
Speaker 2: two yards or no, I didn't do that. I think
Speaker 2: the Tiger Woods thing. I can't remember whatever I did,
Speaker 2: but I just did it again because the fear of
Speaker 2: that one bounce over the back is really there. And
Speaker 2: it's such a downslope, so your wedge comes out low,
Speaker 2: so doesn't carry, doesn't perry got as far, and that
Speaker 2: first bounce is going to be such a big long
Speaker 2: bounce because it's coming in fast. You know that downslope
Speaker 2: wedge with a lot of spin. It's landing fast. It's
Speaker 2: like skidding on like it's almost like its skids a
Speaker 2: lot when.
Speaker 3: It grabs on like the second or even third bounce.
Speaker 2: Yeah, first bounce, it grabs on like the third bounce.
Speaker 2: So eventually, if you lay it up, I think the
Speaker 2: true experience lays it up as far left as they can.
Speaker 3: And so that was the second time you'd played it,
Speaker 3: So this is something. This is an example like the
Speaker 3: course hadn't fully revealed itself, and.
Speaker 2: I learned it early my second Masters and I always
Speaker 2: if I had to lay it up, then I would
Speaker 2: go out of my way to lay it up as
Speaker 2: deep to the left as I could, even in the
Speaker 2: semi ralf. On the left is the first cut is
Speaker 2: better than anywhere on the right, because again it's a
Speaker 2: bit like thirteen. The further left, you either flatter your stance,
Speaker 2: and if you go way left and have a distance
Speaker 2: where you can get some spin, you can even to
Speaker 2: that back left pin or that left pin. You can
Speaker 2: hit a pitch that lands twenty or thirty feet kind
Speaker 2: of right of it and kind of spins left because
Speaker 2: it comes back down the hill and you can get it,
Speaker 2: and it's a very receptive type. It's a safe way
Speaker 2: to play the shot. But from the right, it's it's
Speaker 2: really difficult. I mean, it's really difficult to describe unless
Speaker 2: you've been there. But every yard you go to the left,
Speaker 2: the more the more receptive the green gets because the
Speaker 2: more it kind of you're turning, it becomes a up slope.
Speaker 3: It's like when you have like a really fast downhelp
Speaker 3: that moves, how you can slow it down by hitting
Speaker 3: it into the slope.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, Yeah, you're hitting it into this, So it's
Speaker 2: like starting the ball into the wind, it just slows
Speaker 2: it down like it's the first bounce is now going
Speaker 2: to be a sensible distance. And again, the further left
Speaker 2: you are, the flatter your stance, so now you can
Speaker 2: hit a pitch with a bit more flight. The green
Speaker 2: is quite deep on the right and really shallow on
Speaker 2: the left, so if you're at the left, you can
Speaker 2: kind of create more green depth by hitting it quite
Speaker 2: a lot right of the pin with all the depth
Speaker 2: and maybe use a bit of backspin to get it
Speaker 2: so you don't really have to risk landing it near
Speaker 2: the water when you're pitching it from the left. But
Speaker 2: still it is I think if you asked guys in
Speaker 2: the field, if it wasn't the t shot on twelve,
Speaker 2: if they had to pitch into fifteen, would be most
Speaker 2: guys least favorite shot on the course of the one
Speaker 2: they're most trying to avoid. I mean, it's inevitable. Usually
Speaker 2: once in a week you're going to have to do it.
Speaker 2: In some weeks four times. I mean Zach Johnson did
Speaker 2: it four times a year, which is outrageously good. In
Speaker 2: some years, it gets long and it's into the wind
Speaker 2: and guys are laying it up a lot, and that's
Speaker 2: when you see cartage. You guys back and the balls
Speaker 2: off the green all the time, and I guess people
Speaker 2: watching you're like, well, why these guys, Why don't these
Speaker 2: guys just hit it past the hole? But over the
Speaker 2: back is the toughest up and down of the masters probably,
Speaker 2: So it's you're damn if you do down. If you
Speaker 2: don't like it's neither option with shorts clearly terminal and
Speaker 2: long is. I mean, Film's got that shop, but not
Speaker 2: many others. Right, it's a really from one or two
Speaker 2: yards over the back of fifteen, it's doable, but it
Speaker 2: never stops one or two years over. It just keeps
Speaker 2: running down and ten yards over the green. You've got
Speaker 2: that thing that I've been kind of describing the whole time.
Speaker 2: Is that really really slow fringe because it's quite steep,
Speaker 2: and the way they cut the grass and how fast
Speaker 2: the greens are, there's some massive speed differential between the
Speaker 2: fringe and the green. So is it a one bouncer
Speaker 2: and check because if you go for two or three bounces,
Speaker 2: it generally doesn't get to the green, or you've got
Speaker 2: to hit it so hard to skip it through for
Speaker 2: three bounces that you're risking it very easy to just
Speaker 2: blow it back into the water.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because Bermuda's got a little sticky as if it
Speaker 3: was fascue, you'd just be able to bump it right now.
Speaker 2: If it was fascual, it would be completely different, Yeah,
Speaker 2: because the speed difference would be less. It's the speed
Speaker 2: differential between green and fringe in shots like that, Plus
Speaker 2: it's quite a significant like slope you end up going down,
Speaker 2: like those trees where guys end up down when they
Speaker 2: their fore irons they catch the swirly wind. And that's
Speaker 2: another one where the wind really plays tricks that second
Speaker 2: shot of fifteen. For whatever reason, maybe it's the ponds
Speaker 2: of the water or quite a lot of open space
Speaker 2: around there, the wind is very hard to get right
Speaker 2: or to trust.
Speaker 3: Chipping from back to the right side of the green,
Speaker 3: is that easier.
Speaker 2: Than Yeah, everything on that side of the green, there's
Speaker 2: really hard. Everything on the right hand side of the green.
Speaker 2: As you play the hole from the tee is it's
Speaker 2: easier to go to that side from everywhere because even
Speaker 2: from behind it, even from behind it the ones on
Speaker 2: the left, those pins on the left, from behind it,
Speaker 2: it's as I said, it seems to slope from front
Speaker 2: to back over there, but it's such a shallower part
Speaker 2: of the green, and you generally when you're chipping from
Speaker 2: over the green, if the pin is left, you're right
Speaker 2: of the pin. No one really misses that left of
Speaker 2: the pin on fifteen when the pin's on the left
Speaker 2: because everyone's giving it air to the right. So if
Speaker 2: you're twenty feet right of the pin and ten yards
Speaker 2: over the green for that left pin, you've got to pitch.
Speaker 2: You've got that pitch where you've got to get the
Speaker 2: bounces right or do the fill super flop thing, and
Speaker 2: it's going to hit and break straight to the rights.
Speaker 2: It's a it's just a really hard shot.
Speaker 3: I mean, we've seen you're not the only guy that's
Speaker 3: had that whole bitum with like Sergio last year, Cabrera,
Speaker 3: couple of years Cabrera played it like I say, ten
Speaker 3: over the whole week, and you made the cut somehow.
Speaker 3: But then you got sixteen. He's sixteen. You said that
Speaker 3: that hole may have been your favorite Masters's moment ever.
Speaker 3: In twenty eleven eleven fasts most sick.
Speaker 2: There's two days where it's the funnest tile on the course,
Speaker 2: and there's two days when it's the least fun hole right.
Speaker 2: Just the pins, the two low pins generally, Thursday and
Speaker 2: Sunday are really fun. I mean, historically everybody knows the
Speaker 2: shot on Sunday and Thursdays really is similar to anywhere
Speaker 2: thirty or forty feet right of the pin, it's going
Speaker 2: to go towards.
Speaker 3: It's kind of where a lot of balls end up
Speaker 3: on Sunday is Thursday Thursday's pin.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's really fun and it's a famous shot,
Speaker 2: and it legitimately feels like if I can throw this
Speaker 2: out in that twenty thirty foot area somewhere out in
Speaker 2: the right, I'm a hold in one chance for a
Speaker 2: real chance to get it close here. Because it's one
Speaker 2: of those funnel pins, it just all seems to go
Speaker 2: towards that Sunday pin. And Thursdays, like you said, the
Speaker 2: Sunday when they guys just kind of maybe come out
Speaker 2: of it a little bit and hit that kind of
Speaker 2: weak high thing, it still rolls back down the slope
Speaker 2: and it ends up where Thursday's pin is. So those
Speaker 2: days are really fun. Friday and Saturday pins generally that
Speaker 2: front right on Friday and the back rode on Saturday,
Speaker 2: excruciatingly difficult one the front right one on both areas
Speaker 2: again maybe six twelve foot circles, maybe six foot from
Speaker 2: the hole on Friday to stay up there in a
Speaker 2: good spot, and if you don't, you're either down the
Speaker 2: hill or you miss the green in the right and
Speaker 2: just off the right edge is okay for that Friday pin.
Speaker 2: That front right one and that front right bunk is
Speaker 2: not too bad. It's not great, it's not too bad,
Speaker 2: but generally you end up with that thirty forty foot
Speaker 2: or up the hill. And if the front right pin,
Speaker 2: if you're you've got to be careful not to miss
Speaker 2: it very much past pin high. If you're shorter pin high,
Speaker 2: that front right pin, it's a pretty much just a
Speaker 2: straight bang up the hill. It's not incredibly difficult, but
Speaker 2: as every yard you get past the pin left down
Speaker 2: the bottom tier, putting to that front right one, the
Speaker 2: putt can break fifteen twenty feet. You've got to. It's
Speaker 2: really kind of severe because now you're putting across the
Speaker 2: tier a little bit and the tier just sweeps it
Speaker 2: to the right, and it's really easy to just have it,
Speaker 2: leave it back down and put it down to the front.
Speaker 3: Edge and if you miss left, it usually goes long.
Speaker 2: If you miss left it goes along right. So again
Speaker 2: this is a genius and Augusta it's it's really difficult
Speaker 2: to miss that one where you miss it, so you
Speaker 2: really can't where you want to miss it, so you
Speaker 2: really can't try to miss it. You really just have
Speaker 2: to like try to hit the great shot. You really do.
Speaker 2: It's always with the always with it in your mind.
Speaker 2: You don't want to be twenty five feet past the
Speaker 2: hole in the bottom tier because if you put it
Speaker 2: from from Sunday's pin to Friday's pin would be a
Speaker 2: one in ten two part. I would say it's it's
Speaker 2: a part that would break twenty or thirty feet and
Speaker 2: the last fifteen twenty feet of it is straight down
Speaker 2: the hill. Yeah, really really tough, but you manage it
Speaker 2: because it's usually the front tier on Friday and it's
Speaker 2: like the nine nine or something, and if you're playing well,
Speaker 2: it sounds crazy to people, but if you're playing well
Speaker 2: in the masses and you're contending getting it within six
Speaker 2: or ten feet of the hole with a nine nine,
Speaker 2: isn't that outrageous? Like a prospect, Now, the pin on
Speaker 2: the the Saturday pin that Nicholas and seventy five pin.
Speaker 2: It is an incredibly small area. I mean anything left
Speaker 2: of the pin, anything is going down the hill to
Speaker 2: Sunday's pin. I don't know how many balls can land
Speaker 2: left of that and stay up. It's it's an amazingly
Speaker 2: slopey green and it's a really really small area. You
Speaker 2: can hit it right of the pin and then it'll
Speaker 2: stay there. But if you're hitting that right bunker, you're
Speaker 2: not going to make path. You're going to have to
Speaker 2: two part from forty feet for bogie and rate of it.
Speaker 3: It's a nervy shot because you know, anything past it's gone.
Speaker 2: Anything past it's gone. Yeah, it's just an incredibly small area.
Speaker 2: It's just one of those Augusta on every green, really
Speaker 2: not every green, but at least half twelve of the
Speaker 2: greens have some incredibly tiny areas that them in the
Speaker 2: high pin on six is the same, and four fourteen
Speaker 2: have these really really small it's like a blank a
Speaker 2: picnic blanket to hit it into it. If you don't,
Speaker 2: you're going to have a long two part. So that's
Speaker 2: pressure on shot and against that same sort of feeling.
Speaker 2: The only way you can really hit a great shot
Speaker 2: there onto those really small pins. To hit those really
Speaker 2: precise shots is to swing it free and loose. And
Speaker 2: it's hard to get into a free and loose mindset
Speaker 2: when you know all the bad things that can happen.
Speaker 2: You get protective, and the protective swing usually goes short
Speaker 2: and it dribbles down the tier and then you've got
Speaker 2: this again, an incredibly slow part that Nicholas up the hill,
Speaker 2: and then the seventy five part. You've got to hit
Speaker 2: it really, really hard, with the idea that you don't
Speaker 2: want to hit anywhere past the.
Speaker 3: Whole Yeah, and you don't want to coming back to
Speaker 3: your feet.
Speaker 2: Which we've seen a lot. Yeah. I mean, I don't
Speaker 2: show that sort of stuff on TV that much, but
Speaker 2: it happens during the tournament. Quite a lot of guys
Speaker 2: will part up to that pin and it it'll just
Speaker 2: roll back to your feet. It's incredible. And then Sunday
Speaker 2: and then it's the funnest pin in golf. It's brilliant
Speaker 2: fun with.
Speaker 3: The way they sat it up. Sunday it's ingenius too,
Speaker 3: because twelve it's in the toughest location on the green,
Speaker 3: and sixteen they give you a chance to score it
Speaker 3: coming out.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's easy location. I mean, coming in thirteen is
Speaker 2: in probably one of the easiest spots on the green.
Speaker 2: But you've got to hit an incredibly two incredibly high
Speaker 2: quality shots to have that ego part. And if you do,
Speaker 2: you earn it. You know, you really earn it. Fifteen
Speaker 2: you earn your ego part, you really do. You've got to.
Speaker 2: If you're hanging on on your nervous and you hit
Speaker 2: fifteen green into you, you deserve everything. I mean, that
Speaker 2: is a really tough thing to do. Sixteen. It gives
Speaker 2: you a chance to make up for something you might
Speaker 2: have done on fifteen, and it gives you a chance
Speaker 2: to kind of solidify your advantage or continue your good stuff.
Speaker 2: And that's what a spectator hole. I mean that there
Speaker 2: couldn't be many better places to watch golf than sixteen
Speaker 2: on Sunday at the Masters, I mean, you're going to
Speaker 2: have twenty five balls when they land you think might
Speaker 2: go in. Quite often, it seems the last ten years
Speaker 2: there's been one or two hole in ones. I've been
Speaker 2: quite regularly. Every couple of years. It seems like we
Speaker 2: have a couple that's another one of those holes. It
Speaker 2: feel like they have that pin so dialed in that
Speaker 2: if they want hole in ones, they can almost orchestrate
Speaker 2: them almost. They can move it four inches one four
Speaker 2: inches one way, or are the four inch one it
Speaker 2: doesn't go in four inches the other way. That's the
Speaker 2: one where it might go in. It's incredible. And then again,
Speaker 2: if you hit the smart shot and you can somewhat
Speaker 2: get it under the hole, it's a relatively easy part.
Speaker 2: But if you hit it past the hole, it's just
Speaker 2: a part again. I mean, you can make the put
Speaker 2: break as much as you want. I mean Tiger's chip,
Speaker 2: so if you're on the back left edge of the green,
Speaker 2: you could hit it kind of straight with a bit
Speaker 2: of speed, or you can make the put break thirty
Speaker 2: feet if you wanted to. You know, it's just one
Speaker 2: of those crazy situations. But what a hole and what
Speaker 2: an environment and the whole setting there. It's just and
Speaker 2: that's the meat end of the business, end of the tournament.
Speaker 2: There's usually when there's it's quite close to the fifteenth green,
Speaker 2: so you're very aware of what the people are doing
Speaker 2: on fifteen when you're playing sixteen and vice versa, and
Speaker 2: there's always action and activity.
Speaker 3: I wonder whether if there's like a correlation between the
Speaker 3: guy that hits the great shout on fifteen coming right
Speaker 3: into six because I always feel like the run comes
Speaker 3: fifteen sixteen. I think it's really hard for a guy
Speaker 3: to in very I don't think a lot of guys
Speaker 3: have ever done it where they've you know, there are
Speaker 3: guys that have done it. But you get on those
Speaker 3: runs in golf, like you run through twelve, thirteen, fourteen,
Speaker 3: then fifteen you might stall, but then then there's the
Speaker 3: fifteen sixteen run.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can go three to two. H've seen that,
Speaker 2: and you can go three one seven, four, three to one.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's a It's an incredible place in tournament golf.
Speaker 2: Maybe kind of the coolest spot because again sixteen, if
Speaker 2: you sat on sixteen on Sunday, you can see fifteen.
Speaker 2: Generally for mostly it's probably so you're you're very aware
Speaker 2: of two of maybe the most pivotal holes on the
Speaker 2: course they run in front of you. It's incredible.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I keep thinking about Sergio where to be that
Speaker 3: great part in thirteen and then fifteen hit a close
Speaker 3: sixteen sixteen here really close speed. It didn't make the put.
Speaker 3: That's a tough put if you're past it.
Speaker 2: If your past is it incredibly difficult. If you're four
Speaker 2: feet yeah, four feet it breaks a lot. I mean,
Speaker 2: no one likes to four foot as much outside the hole,
Speaker 2: but you really have to just trust that it's going
Speaker 2: to break and you've got to hit it a foot
Speaker 2: outside of the hole, almost even more. Maybe sometimes it's
Speaker 2: a and again it's in the shadows. It's in the shade.
Speaker 2: You can't quite see it as clearly. You're very aware
Speaker 2: that if you let it go low, it's going to
Speaker 2: go six or eight feet past, even at no speed,
Speaker 2: very very to make the hole in one to hit
Speaker 2: it really really close, you have to almost get it
Speaker 2: past the hole, off the tee to the right and
Speaker 2: have it come back towards it. But again, if you
Speaker 2: pull that a little bit, you're going to be long
Speaker 2: down where Tiger was or even at the back edge
Speaker 2: of the green, and you've got your you've got your
Speaker 2: work cut out just two punting.
Speaker 3: Did you play seventeen with Ayes in Horrortory?
Speaker 2: Yes? Yes, what was the fact of losing that, Ah,
Speaker 2: it looks quite a lot wider, but effectively I don't
Speaker 2: think it changed it for us too much because we
Speaker 2: were generally flying eyes and hoow tree. By the time
Speaker 2: I played it, we were hitting the one after the
Speaker 2: one that said now or the There was a one
Speaker 2: after it that I think they planted thirty years after
Speaker 2: the eyes now tree, But that became the problem for
Speaker 2: us because it was the eyes now tree was quite short,
Speaker 2: not quite short, but we could mostly fly it, but
Speaker 2: it was visually less intimidating when it was gone again relatively,
Speaker 2: I mean the trees on the right they got introduced
Speaker 2: at some point ninety eight was it or two thousand
Speaker 2: and five. Yeah, one of those five relatively easy T shirt,
Speaker 2: but it's a T shirt that gets your attention, and
Speaker 2: again it's another one on us. You really want to
Speaker 2: hit it hard and hit a good one because uphill,
Speaker 2: it's uphill. Ball's not going to run anywhere, and you
Speaker 2: get a big advantage for getting it to a certain
Speaker 2: distance because it's on the flat and the ball runs
Speaker 2: out a bit. But if it flies ten yards short,
Speaker 2: or it just hits and stops, you can have a
Speaker 2: semi blind six sign into a green that's from an
Speaker 2: up slope, from an up slope that, Yeah, seventeen might
Speaker 2: be my favorite. Green on the course just because I
Speaker 2: like the green. But yeah, if you don't want to
Speaker 2: six sign, that's semi blind. And again the wind is
Speaker 2: kind of whistling. There's no trees anywhere to the right
Speaker 2: of the green. Say, the trees on the right of
Speaker 2: the fairway kind of end one hundred yards short of
Speaker 2: the green. So it feels like one of those spots
Speaker 2: where the wind can kind of whistle through and over
Speaker 2: the back. Again, it's an interesting green. Over the back
Speaker 2: of the right hand side is completely terrible. So when
Speaker 2: the pins are on the right half of the green,
Speaker 2: you have to miss it short of the green or
Speaker 2: short of the pine. And if the pins are on
Speaker 2: the left, you want to miss it past the hole.
Speaker 2: It's a front to back green on the right, and
Speaker 2: it's a back to front green on the right, and
Speaker 2: it's a front to back green on the left.
Speaker 3: It's actually one of the rare holes that worked works
Speaker 3: against the lefty the green. Yeah, and so you can't
Speaker 3: really tell the wind when Rose was coming down that
Speaker 3: Sergio Masters I remember Rose ended up in that front
Speaker 3: bunker to that back pin. On Sunday, there's death. This
Speaker 3: such a hard shot to hit all the way.
Speaker 2: There it is tough because again you are so conscious
Speaker 2: of over the back. Yeah, Scott Hokee that incredible shot
Speaker 2: ninety nine from over the back to four or five
Speaker 2: feet that is that's again it's a one in ten
Speaker 2: up and down from mine, and that's really high the
Speaker 2: back right hand side of the green and it runs
Speaker 2: down to the eighteenth tee, so it can really go
Speaker 2: a long way below the level of the surface of
Speaker 2: the green again up one of those really slow hills
Speaker 2: onto a really fast down slope. So a lot of
Speaker 2: people hit in that front right bunker because they're just
Speaker 2: if you're between clubs, you have to pick the shorter one.
Speaker 2: You can't cruise on the longer one. You just can't
Speaker 2: because you just you can get it up and down
Speaker 2: from the front right. It's really difficult, but you can,
Speaker 2: but you just basically can't from long right. So you
Speaker 2: see a lot of balls either in that front bunker
Speaker 2: for those right side pins or like running off that
Speaker 2: kind of falsey front on the extreme right of the green,
Speaker 2: and that's a relatively easy up and down, so it's
Speaker 2: all relative on the seventeenth hold the masters, but you
Speaker 2: can do it from there and you don't really want
Speaker 2: to be on the left hand side of the green
Speaker 2: because that's one of the greens where the whole raised
Speaker 2: creek is the low part of the course. Phenomenon is
Speaker 2: very evident. The put from the left hand side of
Speaker 2: seventeen to the right, it seems like an uphill part,
Speaker 2: but it's actually quite downhill. But at least it plays
Speaker 2: downhill because of the grain or the slope or raised
Speaker 2: creek or whatever it is. So you've got that twenty
Speaker 2: foot of from thirty foot to forty foot of from
Speaker 2: left that you feel like you have to bash, but
Speaker 2: you actually have to hit it quite a lot softer
Speaker 2: than you think. And that's when it looks uphill. Your
Speaker 2: brain gets confused when it's downhill. It looks uphill, but
Speaker 2: it isn't really. It might be flat, it might not
Speaker 2: be downhill, but it's certainly not uphill as it looks.
Speaker 3: That's where that having, like the contour books, is so
Speaker 3: big now because that would.
Speaker 2: Just tell you it's that way, That would tell you
Speaker 2: that's way. But I still think there's an element that
Speaker 2: the green books that they just you can like logically
Speaker 2: see that it's not uphill, that it's downhill, but your
Speaker 2: brain still sees what it sees, and it sees uphill.
Speaker 2: You know, that's topic a little bit of an optical illusion.
Speaker 2: That green sometimes so it's a seven, is a really
Speaker 2: incredibly difficult, difficult green. I mean that back left pin
Speaker 2: I think they did it on Friday is a really
Speaker 2: fun pin because you can kind of filter things down
Speaker 2: in towards it, and you can miss it just over
Speaker 2: the green. You see a lot of guys will chip
Speaker 2: it in from just over the back. The whole shots
Speaker 2: from just over the back. So the left pin short
Speaker 2: is bad, long as good, the right pin short is good,
Speaker 2: long as bad again, completely changing the way you approach
Speaker 2: the second shot just by moving the pin, which is
Speaker 2: again it happens all the way around the court.
Speaker 3: That's it's neat. Is variety two with how it with
Speaker 3: the other holes on the back where you know long
Speaker 3: life is mostly dead.
Speaker 2: Yeah, long generally is dead. But augusta and four or
Speaker 2: five spots is kind of sneaky, and that it doesn't
Speaker 2: look like long would be decent. But in some situations
Speaker 2: long is actually pretty good and short is actually awful,
Speaker 2: and fourteen is fourteen is definitely like that, and seventeen
Speaker 2: on the left hand side is definitely like that too.
Speaker 2: I mean short on seventeen isn't on the left isn't awful,
Speaker 2: but it's markedly easier from past the pin on that
Speaker 2: left pin.
Speaker 3: If you didn't hit any of the greens, but we're
Speaker 3: in all the right spots, it would be pretty easy
Speaker 3: to shoot around part right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you're a nice chipper and you've got a
Speaker 2: decent short game, it doesn't present anything other than just
Speaker 2: a relatively normal challenge from the right miss on every hole.
Speaker 2: For every pin, there is a correct miss for every
Speaker 2: hole in every pin. It's just really difficult to work
Speaker 2: out what that miss is because it's not often what
Speaker 2: you think, and it's their difficult spots to hit it into.
Speaker 2: It's it's often difficult to work out where the miss
Speaker 2: is at the Masters, and it's always difficult to miss
Speaker 2: it there. It's always difficult to miss it in the
Speaker 2: right spot.
Speaker 3: Hard to figure out, and then even harder to get to.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean not always they If you put the
Speaker 2: easy pin on every green, there's eight or nine pins
Speaker 2: that if you're hitting it well, you're going to have
Speaker 2: lots of short birdy parts, but there is five or
Speaker 2: six really hard pins on every single green that you
Speaker 2: could if they really wanted to, they could get the
Speaker 2: whole field shoot over par in a day. I think really,
Speaker 2: if they really like went to the hardest pin on
Speaker 2: every green, it'd be incredibly difficult to shoot underpath.
Speaker 3: Yeah, hard Pende. Battle of Attrition is the eighteenth T shirt.
Speaker 3: As claustrophobic as it looks.
Speaker 2: It's very narrow, and I've seen Jordan's at last yeary
Speaker 2: caught that tree right and it kind of stopped his
Speaker 2: great round, a bit of a black, a little bit
Speaker 2: of a I don't know, sad finish to an incredible
Speaker 2: run race shots. Did shoot sixty four, sixty four, shot
Speaker 2: sixty four with bog line and he caught that tree. Now,
Speaker 2: I've seen guys do in practice, and I think I've
Speaker 2: done a couple of guys doing the tournament, but generally
Speaker 2: it's probably wider than it appears. It's a very narrow
Speaker 2: kind of corridor and it's a tough T shot. But
Speaker 2: for me, it was always one of my more comfortable
Speaker 2: T shirts on the course because my miss is right,
Speaker 2: not left. My miss was always a kind of a
Speaker 2: weak kind of drift to the right. If I didn't
Speaker 2: like really smash it. It would be not right but
Speaker 2: drifting just kind of right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, feeders eat hookers, eat hamburger.
Speaker 2: There you go. So and after they made it longer,
Speaker 2: I struggled to get it to the bunkers. It's two
Speaker 2: ninety or three hundred uphill to that bunker and a
Speaker 2: fairway that really it rolls about three yards because it's well,
Speaker 2: it's really steep uphill. He saw and bounced a bit
Speaker 2: more on the old days, but when they kind of
Speaker 2: started cutting every fairway back towards the tea like that,
Speaker 2: it just took it just took enough off the first bounce,
Speaker 2: so it just pretty much hits and stops on eighteen.
Speaker 2: So for me, I just aimed at the bunkers and
Speaker 2: smashed it as as I could, and generally if I
Speaker 2: missed it, that would just drift off to the right
Speaker 2: middle of the fairway, and if I had it straight
Speaker 2: then it probably didn't get to the bunker. And I
Speaker 2: was fine. But the second shot I found really difficult
Speaker 2: because again, so.
Speaker 3: That's a really hard driving hall for a gay that
Speaker 3: hiss the draft.
Speaker 2: Yeah for fleetwood on MACAROI that's a tough shot like
Speaker 2: these big drawers who struggle to move the ball left right.
Speaker 2: Jason Day, he's three wood. He doesn't really love moving
Speaker 2: the ball left right as much as he does the
Speaker 2: other way. These guys, it's quite tricky. And again the
Speaker 2: longer you get, the harder it gets. The really long
Speaker 2: guys really have to be wary of those bunkers because
Speaker 2: they're deep and no fun. You can hit it on
Speaker 2: the green out of them, but you just much prefer
Speaker 2: not to be in them.
Speaker 3: Seventeen is better for a fader too right to certain
Speaker 3: excent probably yeah, I mean no, especially.
Speaker 2: Well eyes and how's tree kind of makes you want
Speaker 2: hit a draw? Yeah, And there's again a bit of
Speaker 2: overhang on the left off the tee on seventeen to
Speaker 2: someone who hit in the big fade. So, I don't know,
Speaker 2: I mean, it looks like you want to draw it
Speaker 2: off to seventeenth tee. It doesn't really. You don't need
Speaker 2: to hit it either way or seven. You can hit
Speaker 2: whichever T shirt you want, but it's your eye gets
Speaker 2: drawn to hitting a draw. Eighteen is definitely not a
Speaker 2: draw T shirt. And the second shot I was found
Speaker 2: difficult because it's a really extreme upside. You're hitting it
Speaker 2: off and hitting it up a long hill. I mean,
Speaker 2: if it's one sixty you get to the pin, it's
Speaker 2: playing one seventy five like, it's playing a lot longer
Speaker 2: than a measures, and it's off up slopes. Again, my miss,
Speaker 2: particularly off upslopes. If I missed it, I missed it right.
Speaker 2: And so you miss it in that right bunker, which
Speaker 2: is very rarely a good spot. I mean, it's okay
Speaker 2: to the back right pin, oh, that kind of the
Speaker 2: back pins, but to that sunday pin, that right bunker,
Speaker 2: it seems like it would be the miss. But it's
Speaker 2: a really, really tough shot.
Speaker 3: Do you think that upslopes the up slopes the hardest
Speaker 3: one to manage your distance?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Again, because it wants you to go short right.
Speaker 2: The ball goes up in the air and ends up short,
Speaker 2: and that's one of them. You don't want to be
Speaker 2: short there either. I mean it's again, there isn't a
Speaker 2: good miss on eighteen on the green, maybe over the
Speaker 2: back on the back tier. You know, the guys just
Speaker 2: dribble the puts out of the fringe and roll it
Speaker 2: down to the hole. You see most guys get it
Speaker 2: up and down from over the back On eighteen they're
Speaker 2: into that back pen, but left of the green on
Speaker 2: eighteen runs down into the patrons, and that's an awful
Speaker 2: kind of spot to be And that right bunker, as
Speaker 2: I said, it's no guarantee you look off a good lie.
Speaker 2: If you could find a bit of an upslope and
Speaker 2: a good lie, it would be relatively simple bunker shot
Speaker 2: for most two guys to get it up and down
Speaker 2: from that right bunker. But you generally don't end up
Speaker 2: on upside, but a really perfect loe, you end up
Speaker 2: on the flat or a down slope. And it's the
Speaker 2: last hole we've been around at the Masters, and you
Speaker 2: really just want to get in, and there's a bunch
Speaker 2: of people around, and that's not really the shot you love.
Speaker 2: But again, that that front pin on eighteen that we've
Speaker 2: historically sent a lot of people make birdie where people
Speaker 2: hold that put from the Marco mirror part in the
Speaker 2: all those parts from twenty feet right of the pin,
Speaker 2: you've got probably a thirty foot circle to hit it
Speaker 2: like depth and width, and you'll have that part. It'll
Speaker 2: run up the tier, run back, or it'll just land
Speaker 2: and roll in that spot will generally end up there.
Speaker 2: But if you miss that thirty foot circle. You're going
Speaker 2: to have some problems.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that it is like anything, it's the whole theme
Speaker 3: of the place. If you hit it in the race spart,
Speaker 3: you've got a good look.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And some days, the birdie days or the days
Speaker 2: they set up for people to go low, or the
Speaker 2: whole specific holes when they're set up to go low,
Speaker 2: you've got massive circles of areas to hit it into
Speaker 2: and the ball will go towards a hole, and then
Speaker 2: the very next day they move the pin twenty feet
Speaker 2: across theales. How they're green, and you've got absolutely minuscule
Speaker 2: targets to keep it near the hole, and if it doesn't,
Speaker 2: it repels fifty feet away from the hole all day.
Speaker 2: So it's it really is a course that just purely
Speaker 2: by the pin positions, they can completely change the way
Speaker 2: you feel about your swing, the way you score, the
Speaker 2: putch you're going to have. It's it's every hole can
Speaker 2: play difficult, and generally most holes, not all holes, but
Speaker 2: most holes could play somewhat easy with simple pins or
Speaker 2: the fun funnel pins and the repelling pins. I mean,
Speaker 2: every hole complain is so brutally difficult. And again, the
Speaker 2: genius again usually is it makes you tight and scared
Speaker 2: to miss it, and that's when you don't hit precise shots,
Speaker 2: hit in precise shots when you do that, and that's
Speaker 2: where it catches you out. That's why you see guys
Speaker 2: like Phil and Phil when tournament a lot, because they've
Speaker 2: got that cavalier win or it doesn't matter kind of attitude.
Speaker 2: And that really is the only way to kind of
Speaker 2: truly contend that the masses consistently is to be a
Speaker 2: little bit cavalier about it. You've got to play well,
Speaker 2: you can't miss it, but it rewards free swinging aggression.
Speaker 3: Is a great way to put it. It's that close.
Speaker 3: It kind of tightens up after sixteen, where it's a
Speaker 3: little tough clothes.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you got thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, sixteen. With the traditional
Speaker 2: Sunday pins, you have every chance to have four birdies
Speaker 2: in a row there or twenty eleven. I birdied twelve
Speaker 2: through sixteen. Actually you got every chance. Then you stand
Speaker 2: on the seventeen and you are earning your two pass.
Speaker 2: Like if you have to pay the last two holes
Speaker 2: to win the Masters, and you do, every golfer's ever
Speaker 2: played there is going to take their hat off and
Speaker 2: go well done. They are not easy passed. Seventeen is
Speaker 2: not around not that long, and guys have relatively short
Speaker 2: shots in there. But it's one of those repel pins
Speaker 2: where you really don't have a very big area to
Speaker 2: hit it into, and if you don't hit it in
Speaker 2: that area, you're gonna have a really tough tom Miking paw.
Speaker 2: And iten is kind of similar to that front pin.
Speaker 2: It's a very variable pin butt. If you miss that area,
Speaker 2: you're gonna have an awful Tommiking paw.
Speaker 3: My question, you know, I have tabled if you flip
Speaker 3: the flip the nines when they were originally done the
Speaker 3: way the first two tournaments were played would have been
Speaker 3: the front nine to the back nine, and you'd almost
Speaker 3: have the reverse effect of the nine where you're really tough.
Speaker 3: Holes would be the middle of the back nine. But
Speaker 3: then the last three with seven being a short part
Speaker 3: four par five short part four would be almost a
Speaker 3: different dynamic, right it would.
Speaker 2: I think it would be completely different. And again, whether
Speaker 2: this was the genius of Robertson Jones kind of just
Speaker 2: seeing that, or they liked the logistics of it, or
Speaker 2: they liked the feel of the first hole rather than
Speaker 2: the tenth as a first hole, you know, I mean
Speaker 2: the tenth would be a beautiful first t shirt. You know,
Speaker 2: everyone gets it running it down the hill and.
Speaker 3: It's really wide.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's they're both nice first holes, right, Actually they're
Speaker 2: both tricky holes, but nice te shots to get the
Speaker 2: field away again, either serendipitous or genius or a bit
Speaker 2: of both, you know, just this kind of sense and
Speaker 2: feeling that, you know what, there's more drama on this
Speaker 2: back nine as we know it than there is on
Speaker 2: the other one. I mean, seven eight nine, there's there's drama,
Speaker 2: but there's no water. There's probably no doubles. There's no
Speaker 2: real double bogies. You know, the score the thirteen is
Speaker 2: legitimately four to seven, the score three to seven. Scoring
Speaker 2: RTE fourteen is three four and five. Maybe even a
Speaker 2: six fifteen is three four five six seven sixteen is
Speaker 2: two to five. You know, as much more dramatic swings
Speaker 2: you're going to get in the scores through those holes,
Speaker 2: and seven eight nine you could get par birdie par
Speaker 2: really really regularly. You probably won't see many doubles on seven.
Speaker 2: You'll see no doubles on.
Speaker 3: Won the whole nine you.
Speaker 2: Can mess up. But it's a pretty wide fair way,
Speaker 2: and really, if you had to make par, you can
Speaker 2: find a way to just kind of miss it long
Speaker 2: right of the pin and just find a way to
Speaker 2: make par right. But there's thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, sixteen. You
Speaker 2: can be six under or six over with a few
Speaker 2: bad swings. Are a few good swings. I guess the
Speaker 2: drama that's what makes the Masters is the swings and
Speaker 2: the drama, like the you're never too far back. Really,
Speaker 2: with five or six holes to play on the front,
Speaker 2: you would be.
Speaker 3: The only other course that's got that kind of three
Speaker 3: whole dynamic on the back, as Sagrass with sixteen, seventeen, eighteen.
Speaker 2: Sagrass does it well too. I mean that was again
Speaker 2: the genius peak die. It was sixteen. It's three to seven, right,
Speaker 2: I mean it's but it's eagle to double. Seventeen is
Speaker 2: two to whatever you want, and eighteen is maybe the
Speaker 2: hardest stadium hole anywhere in the world. So you you
Speaker 2: get a chance to kind of solidify your score on sixteen,
Speaker 2: and then it's just you can maybe make a bartie
Speaker 2: on seventeen with a good shot, but you can have
Speaker 2: a train wre because the most nervous where John nine one,
Speaker 2: you're ever going to have an eighteen. It's just two
Speaker 2: of the best shots you've ever hit, or even a misgreen.
Speaker 3: Yeah. And then it with like US Open where you
Speaker 3: have the long rough, it just mutes the dispersion of scores.
Speaker 2: I think you you end up the US Opens at
Speaker 2: least in my lifetime have been hang on for dear
Speaker 2: life and my one. I was the only one to
Speaker 2: part of the last four holes in the last eight
Speaker 2: groups or something like. It's so the guy who made
Speaker 2: the most pars is the guy who won the tournament.
Speaker 2: The mass is that's never going to be the case.
Speaker 3: That dynamic of seventeen, eighteen and Augusta is like the
Speaker 3: last sex it USLF.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the first, it's the last eighteen.
Speaker 3: That's a good point.
Speaker 2: It's just I don't know. It's just the perfect golf course,
Speaker 2: along with a perfect venue and conditioning and history and
Speaker 2: tradition and everything else. It's the perfect kind of in
Speaker 2: the middle of the back nine. You start the back
Speaker 2: nine like you pay attention and then it's like, well,
Speaker 2: here's your chance. And then it's like, well, now you've
Speaker 2: taken your chance. Now you to You're got to prove it.
Speaker 2: You've got to like reconcile your score or solidify your
Speaker 2: score or you know you're not. You don't get away
Speaker 2: that easy. You know you've got to You can't just
Speaker 2: go five under from thirteen to sixteen and then just
Speaker 2: like fake your way in. I mean, you're going to
Speaker 2: four real golf shots in the last two holes in sixteen.
Speaker 3: Is the one place on the entire back nine really
Speaker 3: where you can you can hit a shot that might
Speaker 3: be average and have it turnout really good.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, And there's a few again those big, those
Speaker 2: big bucket pins or those kind of you would say
Speaker 2: not repelling pins, the ones that are the balls. The
Speaker 2: pin seems to attract the ball. There's that low one
Speaker 2: on seven that they use. There's the bottom one on six,
Speaker 2: there's the low one on sixteen, there's that middle one
Speaker 2: on fourteen. There's there's a bunch of holes out there
Speaker 2: nine that kind of front pin. Guys can hit it
Speaker 2: pretty close from anywhere around it. The ball just seems
Speaker 2: to get attracted towards the pin. There's a lot of
Speaker 2: opportunity if you're hitting good shots to hit it inside
Speaker 2: ten feet eight times in a day, but with shots
Speaker 2: that aren't really normally wouldn't be inside ten feet anywhere else,
Speaker 2: But you have a lot of times that week where
Speaker 2: you could hit shots that would normally be ten feet
Speaker 2: that they're fifty feet.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is the contour. Is what's the amazing thing?
Speaker 3: Is it? Dog talked about it, and in a part
Speaker 3: of Tom dok about the how he wishes as some
Speaker 3: of us cross, he cout signs and bumps that said, like,
Speaker 3: if you're reading this, you are on the wrong side
Speaker 3: of this contour. Yeah, and that's like what you were
Speaker 3: talking about with fifteen when you're coming from the rate
Speaker 3: totally on the rong side of that versus the left
Speaker 3: if you're coming in on the third chat.
Speaker 2: And there's so much counterintuitive, like almost for the guy
Speaker 2: who understands strategy at first, August is almost harder.
Speaker 3: It tricks you.
Speaker 2: It tricks you because the common logic on fifteen for
Speaker 2: the left pin would be the layer up down the right,
Speaker 2: which is what I did, and it's just completely awful
Speaker 2: over there. You want to actually be almost down on
Speaker 2: the left rough so and that happens all the way
Speaker 2: around the course like long right on fourteen it's the same.
Speaker 2: It's kind of counterintuitive. Long left on seventeen long is
Speaker 2: generally bad everywhere in the world, right on fast green courses,
Speaker 2: but the third long is doable sort is not. It's
Speaker 2: and again the slow hopes, the use of slope. The
Speaker 2: course is on quite a hill. The clubhouse is quite
Speaker 2: a long way above the twelfth Green. I don't know
Speaker 2: how many feet, two hundred feet, it's documented. But it's
Speaker 2: the traversing the slopes. They didn't necessarily go straight up
Speaker 2: and down the hills.
Speaker 3: Hill side courses is it gets really repetitive.
Speaker 2: Up they go up and down, whereas Augusta goes across.
Speaker 2: And so the genius of Jones and Mackenzie were and
Speaker 2: everyone else who's had their kind of hands on it
Speaker 2: along the way. It's the slope on the fairway almost
Speaker 2: always is the opposite of the shot you want to hit.
Speaker 2: So they built greens that reward shots that the slope
Speaker 2: on the fairway is making you do the other one.
Speaker 2: And it's all the way around the course. It's, as
Speaker 2: I said, it's a bit fortunate, and it's great architecture,
Speaker 2: great routing. It's just one of those kind of magic
Speaker 2: kind of coming togethers of things that just makes it
Speaker 2: really really work, and it provides an incredible golf course
Speaker 2: for the average person to play. I mean, it would
Speaker 2: be as fun as everybody thinks it really would, because
Speaker 2: the Adien handicapper once you kind of if he could
Speaker 2: get his nerves out of the way and get out
Speaker 2: of the fact that he's at the Masters, play it
Speaker 2: two or three times, sensibly he would be shooting his
Speaker 2: handicap or under it every time. With a good caddy
Speaker 2: who told him where to hit it. You can keep
Speaker 2: it out of trouble all day if you want. There's
Speaker 2: almost no force carries really, I mean twelves a force carry,
Speaker 2: but it's a pretty short hole and fifteen you could
Speaker 2: even go around it if you wanted to. There's no
Speaker 2: real forced carries. There's no rough off the tee. You
Speaker 2: can hit the ball along the ground all day except
Speaker 2: for probably twelve and fifteen, and you could play to
Speaker 2: your handicap pretty comfortably and have a really good day.
Speaker 2: But as soon as you start trying to break your
Speaker 2: handicap by much, that's when it all gets too hard.
Speaker 2: And that's the thing. Every day, it's you go on
Speaker 2: these cycles. You you start conservative when you get there
Speaker 2: because you're scared to get it wrong, and you gradually
Speaker 2: realize you got to get more aggressive, more aggresive, more aggressive,
Speaker 2: and you start thinking, I've got this place, I've got
Speaker 2: this place. And then you get aggressive on how an
Speaker 2: average day and you hit a few bad shots and
Speaker 2: you have train wrecks everywhere, and then you get all
Speaker 2: the way back to the beginning and you get conservative again.
Speaker 2: And then you go through that, you get more and
Speaker 2: more confident and more aggressive, and then you go back.
Speaker 2: It just it's just eventually, the more aggressive you get
Speaker 2: that you're just gonna get burnt.
Speaker 3: At some point, a guy, a batting guy. I read,
Speaker 3: I can't remember who it was. I think it was
Speaker 3: Ben Coley started listing rounds in the sixties from guys.
Speaker 3: I think that's because from what I'm here, when you
Speaker 3: push it, if you feel it's got to be really
Speaker 3: hard after you get it one day, when you get
Speaker 3: the court, when you got it, you know, you walk
Speaker 3: off the course you got I really got that. The
Speaker 3: next day's got to be hard because if you don't,
Speaker 3: you never seem to have the same stuff after a
Speaker 3: really great round.
Speaker 2: No, it's never quite the same as it when you
Speaker 2: have a mid sixties or relatively for everybody like that
Speaker 2: low round that four or five six under you annakeb
Speaker 2: ordyr level or whatever it is. The next day is
Speaker 2: really difficult, right, But.
Speaker 3: Then you're trying to get it like you got it yesterday.
Speaker 2: Uh huh's. And again, the holes can change so much.
Speaker 2: I mean a lot of them stay, I mean six
Speaker 2: or seven of them stay pretty much the same wayver
Speaker 2: the pin is. The first is always a tough hole.
Speaker 2: Whatever happens into the green. Ten is a tough to
Speaker 2: There's no real easy pins on ten. There's no easy
Speaker 2: way to play ten. Eleven is the same pretty much
Speaker 2: every day, I mean a little bit different. But then
Speaker 2: you'll get holes like two, which will have really crazy
Speaker 2: tough pins and then really easy pins. And you'll get
Speaker 2: six with just the most outrageous pin high on the
Speaker 2: right and are really really the left hands tire of
Speaker 2: the green. You kind of take a breath, and everybody
Speaker 2: hits it close, you know. In sixteen. Again there's the
Speaker 2: two easiest pins of the week at other masters, and
Speaker 2: the two hardest pins of the week might all be
Speaker 2: on sixteen, you know, And that's genius architecture. Really because
Speaker 2: you get a different challenge every day and you think
Speaker 2: you've got sixteen worked out, well, put the pin up
Speaker 2: the top. You're not gonna have it worked out, you know.
Speaker 2: It's Yeah, it's brilliant, it's really good. And the variation
Speaker 2: that the variation in score from hold to hole in
Speaker 2: day to day is the sixty six on Thursday is
Speaker 2: completely different from how you have to do a sixty
Speaker 2: six on Friday because the holes that were EASi is
Speaker 2: show Thursday are probably going to be really tough on
Speaker 2: Friday and vice versa. So it's with the exception of
Speaker 2: thirteen and fifteen, I mean, they're traditionally the holes a
Speaker 2: make birdies and the parthives. But you play one hole
Speaker 2: easy one day and then the next day that those
Speaker 2: those easy ones are hard and the hard ones yesterday
Speaker 2: are a little bit easier. And it's it's the drama,
Speaker 2: it's the fluctuat, it's the it's the range of scores
Speaker 2: that it makes you shoot on each hole that keeps
Speaker 2: it endlessly interesting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, endlessly interesting the way. That's a great way to
Speaker 3: describe the masters. Yeah, it is.
Speaker 2: And for the master's sake, they have there are such
Speaker 2: their advantage. One of their big advantages is they you
Speaker 2: play a tournament at the same course every year, and
Speaker 2: they pay attention to every single shot. There's people watching
Speaker 2: every part in every shot, and they understand their pins
Speaker 2: to within six inches, and they understand the weather and
Speaker 2: how soft or firm the fairways are, the pace of
Speaker 2: the greens. They can get their subair system, the agronomy
Speaker 2: at that point, the humidity, the temperature, I mean, absolutely everything,
Speaker 2: and they can they can't dictate a score, but they
Speaker 2: seem to be able to create the drama that they
Speaker 2: need and the tournament to almost always ends up Sunday
Speaker 2: afternoon with unbelievable fun for the last two or three hours.
Speaker 2: I mean, they're just it's an advantage of having the
Speaker 2: same course, but it's it's testament to them and hats
Speaker 2: off that they can actually they pay enough attention and
Speaker 2: they're clever enough and smart enough, and they know the
Speaker 2: game and they understand everything well enough that every year
Speaker 2: on Sunday, even if the first few days it's like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is going to be a weird master, sure enough,
Speaker 2: it's five of the top ten in the world making
Speaker 2: bodies and eagles on the back nine and doubles coming
Speaker 2: down the stretch, and the sun always seems to come out,
Speaker 2: and it's like the great shadows, and it's.
Speaker 3: They.
Speaker 2: It's the attention to detail that they have and the
Speaker 2: understanding of what they've got and how to and how to.
Speaker 2: They can't, as I said, they can't dictate a score,
Speaker 2: but they seem to be able to dictate a style
Speaker 2: of play, or encourage a style of play, and encourage
Speaker 2: a score line and a level of drama that no
Speaker 2: other tournament, of course, seems to be able to do.
Speaker 2: It's a I mean, I say, I'm gushing like a fan,
Speaker 2: but like if the more times you come to the Masters,
Speaker 2: the more you just appreciate what they do. It's just
Speaker 2: an incredible thing.
Speaker 3: I mean, there's reason why everybody Casual Gore found Day
Speaker 3: Holish is a Master.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and we're going, I mean, I'm going pretty deep
Speaker 2: into this. I mean, it's probably not as complicated or
Speaker 2: as fancy as that. It's just a really great golf
Speaker 2: course that just allows the great players, the great players
Speaker 2: in the world, when they're playing their best, to show
Speaker 2: their skills off and to show their like brave they are,
Speaker 2: as I said, that kind of care free aggression, you know,
Speaker 2: like and only the best playing their best can play
Speaker 2: like that, you know, care free aggression. So like Sergio's
Speaker 2: aida on or whatever, it wasn't the fifteen Companies. I mean,
Speaker 2: you wouldn't take that shot on at any other course,
Speaker 2: that exact shot at any other tournament ever, because it's
Speaker 2: a ridiculous shot to try to hit like close to
Speaker 2: that pin on the front there. But the Masters, it
Speaker 2: just seems to bring that. They seem to be able
Speaker 2: to bring that out of the best in the world,
Speaker 2: that that kind of take it on like attitude. It's
Speaker 2: just brilliant.
Speaker 3: Yes, that's it. We're going to cut it there. That
Speaker 3: was That was awesome. I so I help everybody enjoys
Speaker 3: this they go watch it. Hopefully we go a great weekend.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I'm sure it will be. It usually
Speaker 2: is unless the weather gets kind of weird. But I
Speaker 2: could talk about Augusta all day obviously.
Speaker 3: All right, thanks for coming on.