WEBVTT - Warren Says Powell ‘Failed’ as Leader 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:04.440 This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Carole Masser and I'm 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:07.280 Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stanovk. We're here every day bringing 0:00:07.320 --> 0:00:09.840 you the latest news from the world to business and finance, 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:13.640 plus technology, politics, economics, all purtnising the power of Business 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:17.160 Week reporters and editors, not to mention our journalists and 0:00:17.160 --> 0:00:20.000 analyst in more than one twenty countries. You can download 0:00:20.000 --> 0:00:23.239 Bloomberg Business Week and iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot Com. 0:00:23.400 --> 0:00:25.200 You can also listen to our radio show at two 0:00:25.200 --> 0:00:27.880 pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on 0:00:27.920 --> 0:00:31.960 YouTube search Bloomberg Global News. A couple of headlines when 0:00:31.960 --> 0:00:35.480 it comes to COVID J and J leading or should say, 0:00:35.520 --> 0:00:38.320 seeking US backing for booster dose if it's one shot 0:00:38.400 --> 0:00:41.120 vaccine after data showed it provided strong protection. We've got 0:00:41.120 --> 0:00:43.600 that going on. We have JP Morgan Chase banning business 0:00:43.640 --> 0:00:47.159 travel and in person meetings for unvaccinated staff. So, as 0:00:47.159 --> 0:00:49.720 always Tim, there is a lot going up. The sticks work, 0:00:49.760 --> 0:00:52.239 do the carrots work, that's the question, or a combination 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:54.640 of both. Let's see though what our next leader has 0:00:54.680 --> 0:00:57.840 to say. You might recall we recently talked about billionaire 0:00:57.880 --> 0:01:01.320 investor Leon Cooperman making a hundred theion dollar donation to St. 0:01:01.320 --> 0:01:04.160 Barnabas Medical Center and Livingston, New Jersey, the largest gift 0:01:04.200 --> 0:01:06.920 to a hospital in the state. Well, Barry Ostrowski is 0:01:06.920 --> 0:01:10.200 presidency you at r w J. Barnabas Health and so 0:01:10.240 --> 0:01:14.440 the recipient of that donation his organization. He's on the 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:17.320 phone in Livingston, New Jersey. Barry, nice to have you 0:01:17.360 --> 0:01:21.240 here on Bloomberg Radio. How are you. I'm great pleasure 0:01:21.280 --> 0:01:23.399 to be here and I thank you for the invitation. Well, 0:01:23.400 --> 0:01:25.200 it's great to have you here. First of all, we 0:01:25.200 --> 0:01:27.160 do want to talk about the donation. But you know, 0:01:27.440 --> 0:01:29.640 front and center, you guys have been dealing with COVID, 0:01:29.680 --> 0:01:34.960 like any healthcare institution. How are things going well? They 0:01:35.040 --> 0:01:38.040 seemed to level off. You know, we really evaluate what's 0:01:38.040 --> 0:01:40.399 happening by based on how many people need to be 0:01:40.400 --> 0:01:44.039 admitted to our hospitals. At the height of the pandemic, 0:01:44.400 --> 0:01:47.840 we had eighteen hundred in patients throughout our system. We're 0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:51.120 now down to about a hundred and sixty, although we 0:01:51.120 --> 0:01:55.480 were down far lower eight weeks ago. But most of 0:01:55.520 --> 0:01:58.920 those people, while six don't require ventilator care and are 0:01:59.000 --> 0:02:01.640 not in our I c use, and I must say 0:02:01.720 --> 0:02:06.240 that plus percent of them were unvaccinated, so I think 0:02:06.240 --> 0:02:09.040 we've seen the inpatient level off. We continue to get, 0:02:09.080 --> 0:02:13.160 of course, folks who convert to infection being treated with 0:02:13.280 --> 0:02:18.760 monoclonal antibodies, or frankly with weak cases just staying home. UH. 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.360 And we are, of course insisting that all of our 0:02:21.400 --> 0:02:24.680 employees are vaccinated. We were the first in New Jersey 0:02:24.680 --> 0:02:29.040 to announce that requirement. UH. And I'm delighted and gratified 0:02:29.080 --> 0:02:34.840 that we're well over of our employees vaccinated. Now there's 0:02:34.840 --> 0:02:38.080 another two weeks in the in the duration of the 0:02:38.120 --> 0:02:40.880 required time UH and I think we'll be in pretty 0:02:40.880 --> 0:02:43.280 good shape at that point. What happens if you don't 0:02:43.320 --> 0:02:45.120 for the folks who for that three percent or the 0:02:45.200 --> 0:02:49.080 last percentage of folks you vaccinated, I'm sorry. Yeah, Unfortunately, 0:02:49.120 --> 0:02:52.640 they will have to be separated from the organization. I 0:02:52.680 --> 0:02:55.680 don't expect it to be a big number. And frankly, 0:02:55.720 --> 0:03:00.640 in today's world, losing anybody is a burden. UH. And 0:03:00.720 --> 0:03:04.959 I must say, well, we disagree perhaps with their policy 0:03:05.000 --> 0:03:08.560 on vaccination UH and their personal choice on that. These 0:03:08.560 --> 0:03:12.840 are people who have sacrificed UH in order to provide 0:03:12.840 --> 0:03:15.760 care to our employees at every level, of our patients, 0:03:15.800 --> 0:03:19.560 at every level of our organization. So it's it's really 0:03:20.440 --> 0:03:23.640 an unfortunate set of circumstances, but we do need for 0:03:23.680 --> 0:03:26.520 the safety of everyone folks to be vaccinate. Hey, Verry, 0:03:26.560 --> 0:03:28.080 I want to talk a little bit about planning because 0:03:28.080 --> 0:03:31.000 as president and CEO of our w J. Barnabas Health, 0:03:31.000 --> 0:03:32.240 I mean, this is something that you have to be 0:03:32.280 --> 0:03:34.720 thinking about anticipating what happens this quarter, what happens in 0:03:34.760 --> 0:03:37.800 two How do you plan for a capacity when it 0:03:37.840 --> 0:03:39.280 comes to COVID? I mean, what are you thinking a 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:42.160 realistic number of people who will be admitted is going 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:44.480 to be are we getting Basically, it's another way of 0:03:44.520 --> 0:03:48.120 me asking if we're actually turning a corner on the pandemic. Well, 0:03:48.160 --> 0:03:50.760 I think we are, and it's a great question. I 0:03:51.120 --> 0:03:53.880 think right now in our sites is a concern about 0:03:53.920 --> 0:03:59.360 the period immediately after Thanksgiving. Uh, those are holiday events 0:03:59.360 --> 0:04:01.880 where on for ginerally we would expect people to become 0:04:01.880 --> 0:04:06.080 infected because of close proximity with many people, and so 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:09.720 we may see that inpatient number tick up, but I 0:04:09.760 --> 0:04:13.480 don't think it's going to exceed the two mark in 0:04:13.560 --> 0:04:17.599 our view, perhaps a couple more than that across our system. UH. 0:04:17.640 --> 0:04:20.080 And again for us and for our other patients, the 0:04:20.160 --> 0:04:23.440 key is will we be able to operate by providing 0:04:23.520 --> 0:04:26.720 services to non COVID patients and the worst of it, 0:04:26.800 --> 0:04:30.720 we had to cretel or frankly stop those services. We 0:04:30.760 --> 0:04:33.320 don't see that happening again, at least, of course it's 0:04:33.320 --> 0:04:36.279 our fervent hope, but we really don't project that. So 0:04:36.360 --> 0:04:40.800 save that holiday period potential for slightly more folks in 0:04:40.839 --> 0:04:44.919 the in the institutions. I think we have reached the 0:04:44.960 --> 0:04:47.920 plateau and as you point out, perhaps turned the corners, 0:04:47.960 --> 0:04:50.680 so that certainly Q one of next year, I think 0:04:50.720 --> 0:04:53.880 we'll start to see those numbers come down, uh and 0:04:53.920 --> 0:04:56.560 get back to a more normal environment for our health 0:04:56.560 --> 0:05:00.200 care facilities. Keeping my fingers cross, because I've been nice 0:05:00.240 --> 0:05:03.400 to be much more normal. Hey, listen, just got a 0:05:03.400 --> 0:05:06.160 couple of minutes left here, Barry Um. This donation from 0:05:06.240 --> 0:05:10.920 Leon Cooperman. Leon Cooperman obviously a very familiar uh individual 0:05:11.040 --> 0:05:13.799 to our Bloomberg audience. It's a big donation, a hundred 0:05:13.800 --> 0:05:17.520 million dollars from the Cooperman Family Foundation. What does that 0:05:17.560 --> 0:05:20.680 mean for your hospital and your organization. Well, well, of 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:24.200 course it's unbelievable. We're gratified by it. I couldn't be happier. 0:05:24.240 --> 0:05:27.440 He's been a good friend for decades. I have to 0:05:27.440 --> 0:05:29.600 tell you. The money is important, no doubt about it. 0:05:29.640 --> 0:05:33.040 But the fact that he's endorsed our plan for the 0:05:33.040 --> 0:05:36.760 institution and our system in general, and he's reinforced our 0:05:36.800 --> 0:05:39.760 commitment to the mission and now through this gift we 0:05:39.800 --> 0:05:44.400 can accelerate that those mission objectives is very important to us. 0:05:44.480 --> 0:05:46.599 He's a thought leader, and I know you believe the 0:05:46.600 --> 0:05:49.960 same about him. Uh, And that being a thought leader 0:05:50.000 --> 0:05:53.120 in terms of its impact on others who might become donors. 0:05:54.040 --> 0:05:56.479 But his endorsement of who we are and what we 0:05:56.560 --> 0:06:01.200 do this way is just an incredible active philanthropy on 0:06:01.279 --> 0:06:04.839 his part, and for us reinforcement beyond anything we can 0:06:04.960 --> 0:06:07.279 we can really describe. How much do you rely on 0:06:07.360 --> 0:06:10.720 gifts like this in order to operate and also for 0:06:10.800 --> 0:06:15.400 capital expenditure for the hospital, Well, we rely on it because, 0:06:15.440 --> 0:06:17.839 of course, we we don't have the ability to raise 0:06:17.880 --> 0:06:21.680 equity in terms of sharehold share sales. We do use 0:06:21.720 --> 0:06:25.560 publicly traded debt. We recently raised some money there and 0:06:25.600 --> 0:06:29.119 we have a strong operating cash flow, but in order 0:06:29.240 --> 0:06:32.200 to address all the capital needs of the organization in 0:06:32.240 --> 0:06:36.640 a timely fashion, these gifts of philanthropy are critically important. 0:06:37.120 --> 0:06:40.120 Eventually we would be able to build a new facilities, 0:06:40.160 --> 0:06:43.680 attract the new clinicians, put in the new technology, but 0:06:43.760 --> 0:06:47.080 it would take much longer and frankly be more expensive 0:06:47.120 --> 0:06:50.120 by the time we got there. So philanthropy at any 0:06:50.200 --> 0:06:54.720 level donorship in general, enables us to accomplish that which 0:06:54.720 --> 0:06:58.640 we want to UH in unaccelerated fashion. Well, thank you 0:06:58.680 --> 0:07:00.760 so much for finding time for us, and it's really 0:07:00.760 --> 0:07:03.080 great to check in with you. UH and be well 0:07:03.160 --> 0:07:06.800 and safe to your entire team. Barriot Ostrowski his presidency 0:07:07.000 --> 0:07:10.200 at r w J Barnabas Health. On the phone from Livingston, 0:07:10.480 --> 0:07:14.720 New Jersey. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser 0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:19.840 and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. So Tim, 0:07:19.840 --> 0:07:21.800 this is the top are most read on the Bloomberg. 0:07:21.880 --> 0:07:24.600 He talks about the FED under great greater scrutiny from 0:07:24.640 --> 0:07:28.440 both inside and outside its walls. That's following revelations about 0:07:28.520 --> 0:07:30.760 market trading by some senior officials that happened back in 0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:33.960 UH Senator Elizabeth Warren. We're gonna hear from her a 0:07:33.960 --> 0:07:35.840 little bit later on on this Yeah, she'll be live 0:07:35.880 --> 0:07:38.520 on Bloomberg Radio and television at four thirty five Wall 0:07:38.560 --> 0:07:41.480 Street time today, So in just a little while, Yeah, exactly, 0:07:41.520 --> 0:07:43.480 So let's get an update on the situation. Kind of 0:07:43.520 --> 0:07:46.520 set the stage. Bloomberg News Federal Reserve reporter Matt Bosler 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:50.920 joins us right now on the phone in New York City. So, Matt, 0:07:51.520 --> 0:07:53.960 you know, there's a headline that talks about, you know, 0:07:54.000 --> 0:07:58.320 more scrutiny for the FED. Are they really under incredible pressure? 0:07:58.360 --> 0:08:01.400 And most importantly, is the FED chief really under pressure? 0:08:01.400 --> 0:08:05.000 And might his job be at risk? Yeah, it certainly 0:08:05.040 --> 0:08:07.440 seems that way, Carol. I mean, it's kind of hard 0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:10.400 to disentangle everything that's going on right now with these 0:08:10.440 --> 0:08:16.280 trading disclosures, from the ongoing question of what President Joe 0:08:16.280 --> 0:08:18.760 Biden is going to do in terms of the decision 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:22.280 he has to make about whether to renominate Jerome Powell 0:08:22.520 --> 0:08:25.960 for another four years of fedhair and so um, certainly 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:29.600 that is one of the main reasons why this continues 0:08:29.680 --> 0:08:34.400 to grab big headlines. Obviously, with someone like Senator Elizabeth 0:08:34.440 --> 0:08:38.640 Warren gunning for Powell, trying to prevent him from being renominated. 0:08:38.720 --> 0:08:42.400 She's really latching onto this um you know what's quickly 0:08:42.440 --> 0:08:46.960 becoming a widening scandal related to some of these trading 0:08:46.960 --> 0:08:50.440 activities that these beneficials were involved in last year. Well Man, 0:08:50.480 --> 0:08:52.800 help us understand the structure of the Federal Reserve and 0:08:52.880 --> 0:08:55.480 to what extent if you think about it, the FED 0:08:55.559 --> 0:09:00.319 chair Powell sits the top. And indeed, like with another organization, 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:03.080 a company, perhaps uh the person to top the company 0:09:03.080 --> 0:09:05.680 would say, okay, yes, the buck does stop with me. 0:09:05.760 --> 0:09:09.600 I am responsible for the people who are below me, 0:09:09.960 --> 0:09:12.360 at least on an organizational chart. Is it Is it 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:16.120 like that with with the Fed? In these officials it 0:09:16.400 --> 0:09:19.480 is um. You know. One interesting thing that we always 0:09:19.520 --> 0:09:22.520 talk about with the Federal Reserve in particular is that 0:09:22.559 --> 0:09:26.079 it has this kind of quasi public private structure where 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:28.719 you've got the Board of Governors in Washington, d C. 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:32.880 Which includes obviously FED Chair Jerome Powell and uh FED 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:35.440 Vice Chair Richard Clarida, who is the latest to be 0:09:35.520 --> 0:09:39.160 drawn into all of these questions surrounding his trading. And 0:09:39.160 --> 0:09:41.480 then you've got the reserve banks around the country that 0:09:41.559 --> 0:09:44.880 are somewhat set apart from uh, you know, the DC 0:09:45.000 --> 0:09:48.240 operation and and that's of course where this whole story 0:09:48.720 --> 0:09:51.920 got started a couple of weeks ago, and so um, 0:09:51.960 --> 0:09:55.720 you know, it looked like uh Powell certainly had more 0:09:56.120 --> 0:09:59.640 deniability a couple of weeks ago when this really seemed 0:09:59.640 --> 0:10:04.080 to be an issue related to the Reserve Bank presidents, 0:10:04.160 --> 0:10:08.200 the former presidents of the Dallas and Boston Feds. Now, 0:10:08.280 --> 0:10:11.640 when you're talking about the vice chair whose office is 0:10:11.679 --> 0:10:14.800 down the hall from the FED share right, it makes 0:10:14.840 --> 0:10:19.760 it a little bit harder to um, perhaps distance yourself 0:10:19.760 --> 0:10:23.880 from that than it was before. This is the first 0:10:23.920 --> 0:10:27.800 time that this has been an issue with beneficials. Is 0:10:27.800 --> 0:10:30.360 certainly the first time I can remember, you know, in 0:10:30.440 --> 0:10:32.920 my time in the ten years that I've been covering this. Now. 0:10:33.280 --> 0:10:37.800 The one thing that people do uh like to recall 0:10:38.200 --> 0:10:41.480 lately with this story is, um, you know, what happened 0:10:41.520 --> 0:10:45.000 in I think it was two thousand nine, um, after 0:10:45.120 --> 0:10:48.640 the financial crisis, where you had a member of the 0:10:48.640 --> 0:10:52.560 Federal Reserve Bank of New York's board of directors who 0:10:52.600 --> 0:10:57.840 got a waiver to trade in Goldman sax stock during 0:10:58.000 --> 0:11:00.680 you know, in the fall out of the financial crisis, 0:11:01.280 --> 0:11:05.560 and um, you know, those boards of directors at the 0:11:05.600 --> 0:11:09.920 reserve banks aren't actually involved in policymaking, right, they don't 0:11:09.920 --> 0:11:12.760 attend the f C meetings, they're not, Um, they have 0:11:12.880 --> 0:11:15.960 no say in what the Fed does with policy. But 0:11:16.200 --> 0:11:22.240 even that situation was enough to um precipitate new rules 0:11:22.320 --> 0:11:24.840 around that kind of trading that you know, then made 0:11:24.880 --> 0:11:29.200 their way into the Dodd Frank legislation that was passed thereafter. 0:11:29.360 --> 0:11:33.760 And so um, certainly, you know the President would seem 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:37.960 to suggest that there are going to be changes as 0:11:37.960 --> 0:11:41.040 a result of this whole thing. Yeah, I do feel 0:11:41.040 --> 0:11:47.480 like that there was a kind of untold rule of ethics. Um, 0:11:47.480 --> 0:11:49.240 when it comes to write to him, it just feels 0:11:49.280 --> 0:11:52.360 like you're at the FED could be very careful. Yeah, 0:11:52.360 --> 0:11:55.240 it's surprising this all came out at one time too, 0:11:55.440 --> 0:11:58.880 exactly right, It's not just one. It's been three cases 0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:01.320 now at this point. Matt, thank you so much for 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:03.800 getting us up to speed. Bloomberg News Federal Reserve reporter, 0:12:03.880 --> 0:12:07.880 Matt Bosler, you're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol 0:12:07.920 --> 0:12:12.400 Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stenovic on Bloomberg Radio. 0:12:12.800 --> 0:12:14.959 So this story also among our most right on the 0:12:15.000 --> 0:12:17.920 Bloomberg Today. It's in the upcoming issue of Bloomberg Business 0:12:17.920 --> 0:12:21.080 Week magazine out later this week. It's tim about Facebook, 0:12:21.400 --> 0:12:24.280 HP nev artists, a few other big corporations who are 0:12:24.320 --> 0:12:28.000 finding a very novel way to pressure outside council. Well. 0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:30.280 Joining us now to talk all about it is Ellen Milliken, 0:12:30.360 --> 0:12:32.920 legal reporter at Bloomberg News. She joins us on the 0:12:32.920 --> 0:12:35.840 phone now from London. Joel Weber is editor at Bloomberg 0:12:35.920 --> 0:12:40.480 Business Week. He's with us in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker studio. Joel. Uh, 0:12:40.600 --> 0:12:42.760 there is a problem when it comes to diversity at 0:12:42.800 --> 0:12:47.360 elite law firms. Maybe this is like the other Facebook story. 0:12:48.640 --> 0:12:51.120 There's this other one that's you know, clearly interesting, and 0:12:51.120 --> 0:12:54.120 this one is as well, but for different reasons. Uh. So, 0:12:54.559 --> 0:12:58.400 everybody knows corporate America or even bigger than America, global 0:12:58.840 --> 0:13:02.760 corporations have a ton of outside council. Uh. It tends 0:13:02.800 --> 0:13:06.920 to be fairly white and fairly male. And Facebook, uh, 0:13:07.360 --> 0:13:12.280 HP novartists um are among companies that are trying to 0:13:12.320 --> 0:13:16.960 put pressure on outside legal to diversify and have it 0:13:17.360 --> 0:13:20.400 have different types of lawyers representing them and working on 0:13:20.440 --> 0:13:23.960 their on their projects. And to do that, they're willing 0:13:24.040 --> 0:13:26.920 to maybe withhold some fees, which I think is a 0:13:27.679 --> 0:13:29.640 you know, if you want to get somebody's attention, like 0:13:30.000 --> 0:13:32.440 you know, withholding a paycheck will probably get them to 0:13:32.480 --> 0:13:38.160 listen up, Ellen, how's that working out well? These companies 0:13:38.200 --> 0:13:41.120 are definitely serious about this as well as withholding fees. 0:13:41.200 --> 0:13:44.880 They have said that they will redirect their work away 0:13:44.920 --> 0:13:47.199 from law funds you aren't up to scratch on their 0:13:47.200 --> 0:13:50.600 diversity and give the work to UM law funds which 0:13:50.679 --> 0:13:53.920 do have the adequate diversity. And their demands are quite high. 0:13:54.000 --> 0:13:57.439 FACEBOOK requires half of the lawyer to be diverse, and 0:13:57.480 --> 0:14:02.120 that's gender, race, UM, sextually urity and also disability as well. 0:14:02.760 --> 0:14:06.320 UM and nevatism HPO also asking for this and and 0:14:06.360 --> 0:14:09.960 there they are among quite a large Posit's actually increasing 0:14:10.400 --> 0:14:13.200 and law firms are taking this seriously. They have to 0:14:13.360 --> 0:14:18.079 write like their profits UM hang on their relationships with 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:20.920 their clients and the works that they get UM and 0:14:21.160 --> 0:14:23.720 especially when it hurts the partnership level. They take an 0:14:23.720 --> 0:14:27.440 equity cut of the profits of the law fir profits teacher, 0:14:27.560 --> 0:14:30.240 so it could it eats into the balance sheets of 0:14:30.280 --> 0:14:32.400 the law firm. That eats into the into the pay 0:14:32.480 --> 0:14:34.720 that the partners takes the end of the year. Yeah. 0:14:34.760 --> 0:14:36.760 You point out in your piece that last year Facebook 0:14:36.800 --> 0:14:39.600 spent one point six billion dollars on legal fees, settlements 0:14:39.600 --> 0:14:42.840 and fines, and I got a feeling like that perhaps 0:14:42.960 --> 0:14:46.360 might go up after this week. Might be an opportunity here. 0:14:46.920 --> 0:14:49.880 Um So. So, there's a lot of companies that I mean, 0:14:49.880 --> 0:14:52.560 we we mentioned some big ones, but there has been 0:14:53.000 --> 0:14:56.520 an attempt to actually out this problem before. You mentioned 0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:59.920 in the story of hundred and seventy companies sent a 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:03.240 open letter to law firms criticizing that lack of diversity. 0:15:03.680 --> 0:15:06.920 I'm curious did that Did that work though, or do 0:15:07.000 --> 0:15:12.640 they have to resort to, uh, you know, more painful methods. Yeah. 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:16.400 So those companies who signed up have taken a less 0:15:16.440 --> 0:15:20.080 threatening approach than placement of artist and HP um there 0:15:20.120 --> 0:15:23.760 approaches more that we will slap your hand and we 0:15:23.960 --> 0:15:27.160 might redirect work, or or simply if they have ten 0:15:27.280 --> 0:15:29.840 law firms for examples, saying we can we can carry 0:15:29.840 --> 0:15:32.840 out this litigation or m and ada or whatever it is, 0:15:33.280 --> 0:15:36.640 they will pick the law firm with the best diversity. 0:15:37.280 --> 0:15:40.320 Um so. So, one one of the ducas instat your 0:15:40.360 --> 0:15:43.720 Anglo Americans said, it's more about encouraging law firms rather 0:15:43.760 --> 0:15:48.080 than set them. Um. But I think everyone recognizes in 0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:51.320 the data that not much has changed over the past 0:15:51.400 --> 0:15:56.360 five years. Partnership level still one in four partners of 0:15:56.440 --> 0:16:00.640 women across the US UK UM one in ten partners 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:04.080 from an ethnic minority in the US. So people recognize 0:16:04.120 --> 0:16:08.080 that this is slow. Um, there are commitments in place, 0:16:08.200 --> 0:16:12.880 but I wouldn't be surprised if more companies follow with Facebook, 0:16:13.160 --> 0:16:16.680 Artist and HP if it's change doesn't have to do Yeah, 0:16:16.680 --> 0:16:18.960 And I find it interesting, as you say, the companies 0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:22.440 pushing change are they're not necessarily models of diversity. So 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:24.320 to do as I say now as I do essentially, 0:16:24.360 --> 0:16:27.080 which to me is like there's anyone better. We're gonna 0:16:27.120 --> 0:16:29.600 hold your money because you need to be better and 0:16:29.640 --> 0:16:32.359 we're working on it. But you know, it's it's incredible. 0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:36.360 So as a result of this, though, however it may happen, 0:16:36.640 --> 0:16:42.560 is it bringing about changes in law firms global law firms. Yeah, 0:16:42.600 --> 0:16:46.840 so the data we've seen, that's change happening in the 0:16:46.920 --> 0:16:51.720 lower roungs of law firms, So trainees, new cohorts, and associates. Um. 0:16:51.720 --> 0:16:54.440 Actually the gender split in those junior lawyers of fifty 0:16:54.520 --> 0:16:57.840 fifty um and almost fourty centers on the associates that 0:16:58.200 --> 0:17:02.320 us um um, we're people of color last year. Um. 0:17:02.400 --> 0:17:05.200 But as I said before, it just dramatically drops when 0:17:05.240 --> 0:17:07.640 you get to partnership level. And that's a really crucial 0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:12.800 um essential data points because partners control the relationships with 0:17:12.880 --> 0:17:16.119 the clients, they get an equity cut, um, and they 0:17:16.240 --> 0:17:20.600 run the law firm. So um. It does take some 0:17:20.760 --> 0:17:24.040 homes decades for lawyers to be in a law firm 0:17:24.119 --> 0:17:27.399 before they get to into partnership level. But that's really 0:17:27.400 --> 0:17:31.040 the area where we haven't seen much moving over the 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:34.040 five years plus, and that's really the area that law 0:17:34.040 --> 0:17:37.399 firms really need to start pushing and promoting more people 0:17:37.440 --> 0:17:41.679 have come color, more women into those more senior positions. 0:17:41.720 --> 0:17:44.040 What about the other end of the pipeline, law school 0:17:44.080 --> 0:17:48.119 and training, specifically, how law schools are doing with diversity 0:17:48.119 --> 0:17:51.560 and producing those lawyers who can then go and work 0:17:51.560 --> 0:17:57.280 at these firms. Yeah, so that's actually they're doing much better. Um. 0:17:57.320 --> 0:18:00.439 The pipeline of young lawyers that she kind of gives 0:18:00.600 --> 0:18:04.720 gives them hope to this whole situation. Um Um. The 0:18:05.000 --> 0:18:08.280 diversity among those new cohorts is so much better. Um. 0:18:08.760 --> 0:18:14.520 The unfortunate thing is that, um that before lawyer becomes 0:18:14.560 --> 0:18:17.600 client placings, they will actually get higher up the law firm. 0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:20.920 So even though a law firm might have good diverse 0:18:21.040 --> 0:18:25.160 representation as a whole, what these fans facebook of architics, 0:18:25.160 --> 0:18:28.320 We really care about the lawyers on their matters. So 0:18:28.440 --> 0:18:31.000 the more senior lawyers who have come into the office 0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:35.040 represent them and corps who helps them sign the M 0:18:35.119 --> 0:18:37.600 and a deal, that that's who they care about. That's 0:18:37.600 --> 0:18:41.360 who they want to see more diverse representation in. So 0:18:41.680 --> 0:18:44.520 I'm also just curious is that how do the US 0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:47.879 and the UK compare? And you have some numbers in 0:18:47.880 --> 0:18:51.200 the story, but it is one improving more than the other. 0:18:51.560 --> 0:18:55.399 Um in in you know what what kind of country 0:18:55.640 --> 0:19:00.000 dynamic is that play here? Yeah, so they're actually pretty 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:02.520 and on gender split, as they said, it's fifty fifty 0:19:02.560 --> 0:19:05.840 across the base markets. Um, the US does do better 0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:09.760 on racial diversity. Um they have also the US has 0:19:09.760 --> 0:19:13.840 a big population of of black people for example, in 0:19:13.880 --> 0:19:17.960 the UK does Um, but um, it's it's pretty even 0:19:17.960 --> 0:19:21.600 across I think looks firm. You know, huge UK law 0:19:21.640 --> 0:19:24.080 firm will have quite a big presence in the US 0:19:24.119 --> 0:19:28.719 and vice versa, so I'm not surprised. And these companies 0:19:28.840 --> 0:19:32.679 are European based on the US based, and they have 0:19:32.960 --> 0:19:35.080 broaches all over the globe, so I'm not surprised that 0:19:35.119 --> 0:19:37.640 it's actually quite a similar picture across this Well, let's 0:19:37.640 --> 0:19:40.080 help us the pipelines improved. Maybe it will move all 0:19:40.080 --> 0:19:43.879 the way up the ladder. Hey, interesting story. Ellen Milligan, 0:19:44.040 --> 0:19:46.440 Legal reporter, Blomberg News, obviously joining us on the phone 0:19:46.480 --> 0:19:48.920 from London. There. Check out that story in the upcoming 0:19:48.920 --> 0:19:52.960 issue a Bloomberg Business Week, also online at Bloomberg dot com, 0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:55.920 Slash business Week and on the Bloomberg terminal, Chilweb or 0:19:56.080 --> 0:20:04.280 editor Bloomberg business Week. This is Bloomberg Business Week with 0:20:04.440 --> 0:20:09.119 Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes. Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. 0:20:09.920 --> 0:20:11.800 All Right, I just heard an interesting fact, toy. This 0:20:11.840 --> 0:20:13.760 is what I love about working with Tim because he's like, yeah, 0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:17.240 we talked with Kyle's Stock earlier about this story. He 0:20:17.359 --> 0:20:19.320 worked on this story for a long time, doing other 0:20:19.400 --> 0:20:21.520 things too, doing other things too, But this story is 0:20:21.560 --> 0:20:23.639 a long time in the making. It's all about Rivan 0:20:23.880 --> 0:20:26.520 Rivvy and it's the maker of electric vehicles. It's backed 0:20:26.520 --> 0:20:28.800 by Amazon dot Com and Ford. You know, it filed 0:20:28.800 --> 0:20:30.160 for an I p O. We got that news after 0:20:30.160 --> 0:20:32.679 the close on Friday. Let's bring in Kyle Stock. He's 0:20:32.680 --> 0:20:36.040 Bloomberg new senior correspondent. Uh, and he's on the phone 0:20:36.040 --> 0:20:38.359 in New Jersey. Nine months. It's a long time to 0:20:38.400 --> 0:20:42.040 work on a story. Sorry, he told me. I should 0:20:42.040 --> 0:20:45.679 have told you, Carol, He told me that off fair. Sorry. 0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:49.240 It wasn't a straight nine months. It's just a little 0:20:49.240 --> 0:20:52.200 bit every day. You know. It's like you're on baby, Kyle. Okay, 0:20:52.280 --> 0:20:54.879 that's what I can think about exactly. It's been a 0:20:54.920 --> 0:20:58.120 messy road though, as you write, Um, tell us about 0:20:58.160 --> 0:21:02.159 your reporting. Yeah, I mean what was really cool is, uh, 0:21:02.200 --> 0:21:05.880 this was start up and it was really startup. Bat. 0:21:05.920 --> 0:21:08.159 You know, we hear about these billion dollar unicorns all 0:21:08.160 --> 0:21:11.640 the time that seeing, you know, manifest destiny, that they 0:21:11.680 --> 0:21:14.840 come into the world with this idea just set in 0:21:14.920 --> 0:21:17.439 stone and they just make it happen and everyone loves it. 0:21:17.480 --> 0:21:19.320 And this was not that. You know, this is a 0:21:19.400 --> 0:21:23.199 story of a brilliant engineer who had an idea and 0:21:23.240 --> 0:21:27.080 it didn't work out, and you know, he scrapped and 0:21:27.160 --> 0:21:32.080 he pivoted and tweaked and stretched his team and laid 0:21:32.119 --> 0:21:34.640 people off and almost went out of business, and then 0:21:35.680 --> 0:21:38.920 tried to idea number two, idea number three, idea number four, 0:21:38.960 --> 0:21:43.240 and then you know, finally got a small investor, finally 0:21:43.320 --> 0:21:46.720 got a little bit of a lifeline, and everything started clicking. 0:21:47.160 --> 0:21:52.159 And here we are expected potential I PO around Thanksgiving, 0:21:52.160 --> 0:21:56.199 which would value the company at eighty billion dollars. And 0:21:56.440 --> 0:21:59.119 I want to contextualize eighty billion dollars in terms of 0:21:59.119 --> 0:22:01.840 market caps, specifically for a car company, a little company 0:22:01.880 --> 0:22:04.080 called Ford that has been doing this for you know, 0:22:04.440 --> 0:22:08.440 more than a century. Uh market tap about fifty some 0:22:08.880 --> 0:22:12.200 billion dollars. Kyle and Jim just and GM just under 0:22:12.240 --> 0:22:15.919 eight billion, seventy nine billion and change. So that's a big, 0:22:16.320 --> 0:22:20.280 big there's a big bet on the future, right Yeah. 0:22:20.400 --> 0:22:22.560 And it's about that, you know, they can have a 0:22:22.640 --> 0:22:28.399 tesla like trajectory UM. Interestingly, you know, I think the 0:22:28.480 --> 0:22:32.399 founding team here is a lot in a lot of ways, 0:22:32.840 --> 0:22:37.000 you know, very different and maybe even smarter than Elon 0:22:37.160 --> 0:22:40.840 was in the early days. UM. And they certainly gathered 0:22:41.080 --> 0:22:43.200 you know, a war chest more quickly. You know, there's 0:22:43.200 --> 0:22:48.600 some there is uh, sort of some baked and success 0:22:48.680 --> 0:22:53.600 with Jeff Bezos behind you. Um, but expectations are very 0:22:53.680 --> 0:22:56.960 high and they are still just figuring out how to 0:22:57.040 --> 0:22:59.120 build these things. But I mean they're literally just now 0:22:59.200 --> 0:23:02.440 coming off the Lee line for the first time. So 0:23:02.560 --> 0:23:04.280