WEBVTT - The Great Minnesota Nurses Strike 0:00:05.200 --> 0:00:08.240 It's it's it's it could happen here. The podcast that 0:00:08.360 --> 0:00:11.880 we open sometimes yes, this is, this is, this is, 0:00:11.880 --> 0:00:14.760 this is how we do this job. Um it is. 0:00:14.880 --> 0:00:17.440 It is also a podcast that is very very often 0:00:17.480 --> 0:00:22.120 about strikes, and someone's presently this is this is an 0:00:22.120 --> 0:00:24.439 episode that is not about the Giant rail strike that 0:00:24.440 --> 0:00:27.840 everyone was focused on that didn't happen. Um. And the 0:00:27.880 --> 0:00:29.600 reason it's not about Okay, I mean, obviously it's not 0:00:29.600 --> 0:00:31.400 about that because it didn't happen. But the other reason 0:00:31.480 --> 0:00:33.720 it's not about that is that there was another giant 0:00:33.840 --> 0:00:39.160 strike that was really i think ignored by both sort 0:00:39.200 --> 0:00:41.240 of the media and the people who normally would be 0:00:41.240 --> 0:00:44.000 following strikes that was happening at about the same time. 0:00:44.040 --> 0:00:49.000 And that is a massive fift person nurses strike. Uh 0:00:49.479 --> 0:00:52.559 up up up in Wisconsin. And to talk with us 0:00:52.600 --> 0:00:57.720 about that. Wait, did I say that right? Minnesota? Did I? I? 0:00:57.720 --> 0:01:00.520 Did I confuse Wisconsin and Minnesota. Oh my god, I've 0:01:00.560 --> 0:01:04.920 always do this. They did treat a strike, you are, yeah, 0:01:08.040 --> 0:01:10.640 I don't. There's some part of my brain that never 0:01:10.760 --> 0:01:13.440 quite like figured out which one was Wisconsin and which 0:01:13.440 --> 0:01:15.720 one was Minnesota, and it just like flips them in 0:01:15.760 --> 0:01:17.360 my mind, they're just like they're just the state that's 0:01:17.360 --> 0:01:25.520 sort of over there from Illinois. I don't I don't 0:01:25.560 --> 0:01:28.240 really have an excuse because like I'm from here, like 0:01:28.400 --> 0:01:30.880 i've I've I've lived not in the Midwest for like 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:33.959 six months now wow, okay, like a year of my 0:01:34.000 --> 0:01:38.280 life when I was like unbelievably small child. But yeah, 0:01:38.280 --> 0:01:40.560 it is. It is. Yeah, there's been only strikes in Minnesota. 0:01:40.720 --> 0:01:42.920 And with me to talk about the strikes that are 0:01:42.920 --> 0:01:46.200 not happening in Wisconsin is Danielle, who is a nurse 0:01:46.240 --> 0:01:50.360 at Methodist Hospital and a steward for the Minnesota Nurses Association. Danielle, 0:01:50.360 --> 0:01:55.120 Welcome to the show. Thank you, thank you for having me. Yeah, 0:01:55.160 --> 0:01:59.320 thank you, thank you for coming on. Um. Okay, so 0:01:59.360 --> 0:02:03.160 I guess the first thing that I want to talk 0:02:03.240 --> 0:02:07.040 about is the kind of strike that you all were doing, 0:02:07.080 --> 0:02:10.400 because this is something that I've seen a lot with 0:02:10.480 --> 0:02:13.600 nurses strikes, but I don't think people who aren't in 0:02:13.720 --> 0:02:17.160 nurses unions like talking about very much. Which is basically 0:02:17.160 --> 0:02:19.160 doing a three day strike or doing a strike that's 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:21.040 for for for a set number of days, but it's 0:02:21.040 --> 0:02:25.000 not indefinite. Um. And I wanted to ask about that 0:02:25.080 --> 0:02:31.080 specifically as a tactic A bit. Yeah, absolutely. UM, it's 0:02:31.200 --> 0:02:33.800 not uncommon in the health care sector at all to 0:02:33.880 --> 0:02:36.440 do one day, two day, three day, five day, seven 0:02:36.480 --> 0:02:40.440 day strikes. UM. We usually leave like an open ended 0:02:40.440 --> 0:02:44.160 strike for kind of a lasted je effort um to 0:02:44.200 --> 0:02:49.000 get the employer's attention. UM. So there's a lot to 0:02:49.400 --> 0:02:54.800 coordinate to compensate for a three day strike. UM. It 0:02:54.960 --> 0:02:59.120 affects everyone's job at the hospital and then after three 0:02:59.200 --> 0:03:07.440 days they have to flip everything back. UM. That UM, 0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:11.359 that type of disruption in capital is UM has been 0:03:11.400 --> 0:03:18.720 really effective um across the nation. So we're hoping that 0:03:18.840 --> 0:03:22.920 they hear us loud and proud, but it's challenging. They 0:03:22.919 --> 0:03:25.400 have a lot of money. Yeah yeah. And I think 0:03:25.600 --> 0:03:29.200 from from what I've talked to other nurses about this 0:03:29.280 --> 0:03:31.840 strike and also other people have done nurses strikes, is 0:03:31.880 --> 0:03:35.840 that like there's like a huge pool of scabs, which 0:03:35.880 --> 0:03:39.320 makes me really hard and is it is it the 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:41.160 case that part of the reason why you do one 0:03:41.160 --> 0:03:43.119 of these limited strikes is that it's it's a lot 0:03:43.160 --> 0:03:46.440 harder for them to coordinate like bringing in scabs for 0:03:46.520 --> 0:03:48.080 limited amount of time that it would be for like 0:03:48.200 --> 0:03:55.440 hiring them full time for a definite strike. Yeah, exactly, 0:03:55.520 --> 0:03:59.840 so travel nurses. I mean they are those strike nurses 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:02.680 men strictly just for those three days. They are oriented 0:04:02.800 --> 0:04:06.680 for you know, a few hours prior to starting at 0:04:06.720 --> 0:04:11.960 seven am on Monday. UM, so there's not a lot 0:04:12.000 --> 0:04:14.360 of time to learn the entire facility. And since we 0:04:14.440 --> 0:04:18.880 are gone, the only ones left to orientate our managers 0:04:19.120 --> 0:04:24.679 or any nurses that have to stay for whatever reason. 0:04:24.960 --> 0:04:29.960 We really didn't have money at all across the line. Um. 0:04:30.000 --> 0:04:36.120 So it just compromises patient safety and care in general. Yeah. Yeah, 0:04:36.160 --> 0:04:39.720 there's no way to create teamwork with just three days 0:04:39.760 --> 0:04:47.159 of brand new nurses. Um. So just um, the hospital 0:04:47.200 --> 0:04:51.240 is just more accountable for system airs. Um. They try 0:04:51.279 --> 0:04:54.360 to keep those issues as internal as possible and not 0:04:55.360 --> 0:04:59.360 disclose them to the public. But there's a lot that happened. 0:05:00.120 --> 0:05:03.000 They've It's funny all the media reports are like or 0:05:03.040 --> 0:05:05.520 we're just like straight up printing press releases being like 0:05:05.560 --> 0:05:08.240 there have been no internal disruptions. Stomach, I don't believe that, Like, 0:05:08.279 --> 0:05:12.719 there's no way there's like it's just not true. They 0:05:12.800 --> 0:05:17.000 are just lying, so lying and to prepare for us 0:05:17.080 --> 0:05:19.720 to go and strike. I mean, they try their hardest 0:05:19.760 --> 0:05:23.960 to discharge as many patients as possible Sunday prior to 0:05:24.000 --> 0:05:26.800 our strike, to empty out hospitals. The thing is like, 0:05:26.839 --> 0:05:29.880 you can't just you're not a magician. You can't make 0:05:29.960 --> 0:05:33.479 sick people go away. Um. There was a lot of 0:05:33.600 --> 0:05:37.920 readmissions because of that. You're discharging people too quickly. Um. 0:05:37.960 --> 0:05:42.360 I know what the children's hospitals they actually um like 0:05:42.920 --> 0:05:48.480 shuttled forty four children out to other surrounding hospitals two 0:05:48.960 --> 0:05:53.320 because they couldn't get enough travelers to work. You can't 0:05:53.360 --> 0:05:57.880 get fifteen thousands travelers. So that's what they did to 0:05:57.920 --> 0:06:01.159 try to undermine us. It's a lot of moving things around, 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:05.160 and I am hoping the public there's an uproar with 0:06:05.240 --> 0:06:08.200 the public about this. That's I don't know who's paying 0:06:08.240 --> 0:06:14.000 for you know, the cost of shipping kids to different hospitals. Yeah, 0:06:14.200 --> 0:06:18.719 I assume the hospital is not going to pay for it. Yeah, God, 0:06:19.120 --> 0:06:23.640 so yeah, I guess we should move into like how 0:06:23.720 --> 0:06:25.920 we got to the point where fifteen thousand nurses or 0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:28.280 went on strike, which I think, I mean certainly the 0:06:28.320 --> 0:06:30.520 largest nurses strike like in the in the private sector. 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:32.680 I can remember, Like it's I think I think it's 0:06:32.720 --> 0:06:37.800 one of the largest the US ever had. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 0:06:37.880 --> 0:06:41.320 Can we talk about like I get and this this 0:06:41.440 --> 0:06:43.520 is there's also sort of a broader question here about 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:46.760 like what the U. S healthcare system looks like in 0:06:46.880 --> 0:06:49.280 year two of this plague in the sector that's already 0:06:49.279 --> 0:06:56.359 been sort of just decimated by like incredibly veno profit seeking, 0:06:56.480 --> 0:07:01.480 greedy corporations. Yeah yeah, so what what what? What? What 0:07:01.640 --> 0:07:03.400 have been the conditions that have been leading up to 0:07:04.000 --> 0:07:10.120 this strike? They got this many people off of the line. Um, 0:07:10.160 --> 0:07:13.559 I mean, our health care system has been unstable um 0:07:13.640 --> 0:07:17.119 for quite some time. Hospitals have been consolidating so much, 0:07:17.200 --> 0:07:22.040 like closing clinics and facilities, um, just to maximize profit. 0:07:22.200 --> 0:07:25.520 It's um like there their whole goal is kind of 0:07:25.560 --> 0:07:30.040 like how airlines overbooked for flights, they create like an 0:07:30.120 --> 0:07:35.280 artificial hospital beds shortage in order to maximize profit. So 0:07:35.320 --> 0:07:38.120 they've been doing that for years and then also just 0:07:38.240 --> 0:07:42.360 buying up little hospitals to control the market more. UM. 0:07:42.520 --> 0:07:46.440 They've also are starting their own insurance companies just to 0:07:46.560 --> 0:07:52.200 double dip into communities wallets. So that's been going on 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:56.400 prior to the pandemic. Pandemic hit they were not ready. 0:07:57.040 --> 0:07:59.480 They didn't have enough PPE at all, because it's not 0:08:00.000 --> 0:08:08.720 there's no UM, it's not financially incentivized to have extra 0:08:08.840 --> 0:08:12.440 pp ON. And that's their logic. I remember in the 0:08:12.440 --> 0:08:14.560 beginning of the pandemic, like my my aunt and uncle 0:08:14.600 --> 0:08:16.800 work for hospital, and like we were trying to get 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:20.240 the masks, and like we wound up like we were 0:08:20.280 --> 0:08:24.000 like doing contracts with like like my like literally my 0:08:24.080 --> 0:08:26.880 family in China was like, I know a guy who 0:08:26.920 --> 0:08:29.800 knows a guy who could, like who who like has 0:08:29.840 --> 0:08:33.280 a mass manufacturing thing. It was o god, it was 0:08:33.360 --> 0:08:37.840 so grim. It was Yeah, it was a mess, and 0:08:39.640 --> 0:08:42.040 we didn't have enough PPU. We had to reuse stuff 0:08:42.200 --> 0:08:46.840 instantly UM. And we were never compensated for it either. UM. 0:08:46.840 --> 0:08:50.600 We just were forced to work harder and longer UM 0:08:50.679 --> 0:08:54.480 for the same pay. And now hospitals are trying to 0:08:54.559 --> 0:08:59.320 normalize that staffing UM shortage and say, well that's it, 0:08:59.640 --> 0:09:03.800 that's you know, so you just have to work with 0:09:03.840 --> 0:09:07.959 what we're giving you. UM. In this shortage is just 0:09:08.600 --> 0:09:14.880 it's causing unnecessary medical errors and deaths, and it's just 0:09:14.920 --> 0:09:18.000 a disservice to our community. Yeah, it's going kind of 0:09:18.000 --> 0:09:21.720 down a dark path. So I think all of that 0:09:22.400 --> 0:09:26.280 during the pandemic, hospitals really showed their true colors. And 0:09:26.320 --> 0:09:30.320 I know the nurses really realized that the hospital is 0:09:30.360 --> 0:09:34.520 only there too, just like fat in their wallets. They're 0:09:34.520 --> 0:09:39.359 not there for us. They're not The goal is to 0:09:39.400 --> 0:09:41.840 make us all leave the bedside and just outsource all 0:09:41.880 --> 0:09:45.520 of their employees. You would escape all liabilities if you 0:09:45.640 --> 0:09:50.440 have all travelers in place, there's um, there's no real 0:09:50.480 --> 0:09:55.160 incentive to hold the hospital accountable for institutional failures. Can 0:09:55.200 --> 0:09:57.960 you explain what travelers are for the audience people who 0:09:58.080 --> 0:10:04.000 may not know. Oh, yeah, absolutely, UM. So travel nurses 0:10:04.080 --> 0:10:09.280 come across her like across the entire um nation, and 0:10:09.640 --> 0:10:17.480 they are contracted through travel companies that work with hospitals. UM. 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:22.200 So if there's a nursing shortage, um, there will be 0:10:22.240 --> 0:10:25.839 open positions to apply for those contract positions that are 0:10:26.360 --> 0:10:29.480 like short terms, so either like a four week, six 0:10:29.559 --> 0:10:32.400 week or if it's like a strike contract, it would 0:10:32.400 --> 0:10:36.200 be like three days, seven days, whatever it might be. UM. 0:10:36.880 --> 0:10:41.680 And they're paid handsomely. I know for our three days strike, 0:10:42.000 --> 0:10:45.760 those travel nurses, those strike nurses specifically for three days, 0:10:45.840 --> 0:10:51.840 may ten k each for three days and they didn't 0:10:51.840 --> 0:10:55.679 even know the facility. Some of them never even worked 0:10:55.679 --> 0:11:01.720 in a hospital. I don't I don't understand the require aerments. Um. 0:11:01.760 --> 0:11:07.119 It's confusing. How Yeah, And I'm not trying to demonize 0:11:07.160 --> 0:11:10.360 travel nurses in any sort of way. There's amazing travel nurses. 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:14.240 I've worked with some. They're great people, but they're um, 0:11:14.280 --> 0:11:19.280 it just undermines um, like our profession. Like it's it's 0:11:19.320 --> 0:11:22.079 hard to improve our profession when you have people that 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:26.640 can replace you. Um, there's no real change we can make. 0:11:26.679 --> 0:11:29.720 It's just we're fighting each other. And travel nurses are 0:11:29.760 --> 0:11:36.439 independent contractors. Yeah, exactly, So the hospital doesn't pay them benefits. UM, 0:11:36.480 --> 0:11:41.400 they don't take vacation, they don't call in six Um. 0:11:41.440 --> 0:11:45.280 They save the employer a lot of money um because 0:11:45.280 --> 0:11:49.080 they don't have to like provide any hospital resources such 0:11:49.080 --> 0:11:52.040 as like employee health or workers compensation or anything like that. 0:11:53.280 --> 0:11:58.600 And they just have that six week contract that they 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:04.560 focus on and they they're definitely paid their worth. There's 0:12:04.640 --> 0:12:08.000 less liability on the hospital too. If there's any medical errors, 0:12:08.120 --> 0:12:11.760 it's easier to like blame the travel nurse instead of 0:12:12.080 --> 0:12:17.679 blaming like institutional failures. UM. Travel nurses they just they 0:12:17.720 --> 0:12:20.240 can't unionize. There's just not a way. There's not like 0:12:20.280 --> 0:12:23.560 a common area for them to come together and yeah, 0:12:23.760 --> 0:12:33.840 create a union. So that's the hospitals like that. Um. Also, 0:12:35.040 --> 0:12:39.040 when you have more travel nurses at a hospital, that's 0:12:39.160 --> 0:12:41.160 less funding that can go to our union. So like 0:12:41.200 --> 0:12:47.079 we pay union dudes every month, UM, and if hospitals 0:12:47.120 --> 0:12:51.240 are hiring more travel nurses, our union gets less funny, 0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:54.839 less power sadly, Okay, do you do? You do? You know? 0:12:54.880 --> 0:12:57.960 Who else wants everyone to work as contract workers so 0:12:58.000 --> 0:13:02.840 they can't unionize. Ever, it's it's the products and services 0:13:02.920 --> 0:13:17.959 that support the show and we're back. So all right, 0:13:17.960 --> 0:13:20.360 I guess moving on from that, well, okay, I guess 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:22.800 I guess before we fully move on to talking about 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:25.560 how the strike was sort of organized, UM, can we 0:13:25.600 --> 0:13:28.840 talk a little bit more about what staffing shortages looks 0:13:28.880 --> 0:13:31.520 like and what what the effect that has on patients 0:13:31.640 --> 0:13:34.640 is because I think people like I think people this 0:13:34.720 --> 0:13:38.520 is something people like kind of conceptually understand but don't 0:13:38.559 --> 0:13:41.840 like viscerally get what it means to have a staffing 0:13:41.840 --> 0:13:53.240 shortage in a hospital. Mhm UM. So with inadequate inadequate nursing, UM, 0:13:53.360 --> 0:13:58.600 staffing levels by experienced nurses. UM, there's an increased rate 0:13:58.840 --> 0:14:05.520 of hey sent falls, infections, medical errors, UM, increase in deaths, 0:14:05.600 --> 0:14:13.160 increasing pressure ulcers, UM, increase in readmission rates, so having 0:14:13.200 --> 0:14:19.000 to go back to the hospital because UM, you weren't 0:14:19.400 --> 0:14:21.680 given like high quality care at the hospital. It is 0:14:21.720 --> 0:14:25.320 just kind of mediocre if nurses are kind of strapped 0:14:25.360 --> 0:14:28.880 with time and I have to divide their attention between 0:14:29.320 --> 0:14:32.280 too many patients. So I don't know if you actually 0:14:32.280 --> 0:14:34.440 are legally allowed to say this, but like how many 0:14:34.480 --> 0:14:38.120 patients like per day roughly are like you are, like 0:14:38.200 --> 0:14:43.080 you are treating patients are retreating the day um. Our 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:49.360 hospital at Methodist has about four beds and we've been 0:14:50.040 --> 0:14:54.640 at capacity so above a hundred percent, And you're probably wondering, well, 0:14:54.640 --> 0:14:58.400 how do you get above a hundred percent? UM. The 0:14:58.560 --> 0:15:04.440 e ER will board patients meeting a patient will stay 0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:06.440 on a cart and they'll be in a hallway and 0:15:06.600 --> 0:15:10.080 always will be lined up with patients that are just 0:15:10.240 --> 0:15:15.040 waiting for other patients and other units to be discharged 0:15:15.080 --> 0:15:19.600 so they can take that that UM, so they can 0:15:19.600 --> 0:15:22.360 wait in the e R for up to two to 0:15:22.440 --> 0:15:28.760 three days just waiting to be like really admitted um, 0:15:28.800 --> 0:15:33.000 so we've been at capacity for a long time, and 0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:38.880 that is that is purposely done to maximize profit, just 0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:45.960 because of they've been consolidating, closing other hospitals, UM in 0:15:46.440 --> 0:15:49.240 other neighborhoods. Like they're like they're they're charging all those 0:15:49.240 --> 0:15:51.520 people who are just like laying there in a hallway 0:15:51.640 --> 0:15:56.160 right absolutely, or even um if people come in for 0:15:56.240 --> 0:15:59.680 surgery and they have to after surgery, they go to recovery. 0:16:00.000 --> 0:16:03.400 They can sit in recovery for up to eight hours, 0:16:03.840 --> 0:16:07.000 which normally after surgery you only need to be there 0:16:07.040 --> 0:16:08.760 like a half hour to an hour kind of depending 0:16:08.800 --> 0:16:11.400 on how you will wake up from anesthesia, and then 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:14.320 you go to your room. But we are just holding 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:18.400 them in recovery because we're waiting on beds and rooms 0:16:18.400 --> 0:16:21.760 to be available. Because the hospital does not plan an 0:16:21.760 --> 0:16:26.680 advance at all, it's not cost effective. Yeah. Well, I 0:16:26.760 --> 0:16:29.480 mean it's funny because it's like it's it really seems 0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:31.600 it's sort of one of those things where it's like, literally, 0:16:31.640 --> 0:16:34.240 this entire process would be enormously less expensive if you 0:16:34.320 --> 0:16:36.760 hire like four more people and didn't close every hospital 0:16:36.800 --> 0:16:39.480 around you. But like you know, it's it's it's not 0:16:39.520 --> 0:16:43.080 it's not about efficiency. It's about like making sure you 0:16:43.120 --> 0:16:45.480 have as many dying people like sitting in a hallway 0:16:45.520 --> 0:16:49.520 so you can charge them more. It's like exactly, it's 0:16:49.480 --> 0:16:52.680 just like people are profitable and not healthy people. Yeah, 0:16:54.520 --> 0:17:00.560 m hmm, yeah, I mean it's really it's like there 0:17:00.640 --> 0:17:03.360 is just something like sort of particularly venal and disgusting 0:17:03.360 --> 0:17:05.000 about here. It's like, you know, it's it's all of 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:07.800 the same, like, Okay, well, we we've we've we've built 0:17:07.840 --> 0:17:09.920 up a monopoly, and we're using your monopoly to force 0:17:09.960 --> 0:17:12.160 everyone to user services. And then we're you know, we're 0:17:12.160 --> 0:17:13.960 we're using contract workers to a place to people who 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:16.200 normally do the job. But it's like, well, it's with healthcare, 0:17:16.600 --> 0:17:18.600 and it's like instead of just like every TV show 0:17:18.640 --> 0:17:20.639 being awful, it's here's a bunch of people who are 0:17:20.680 --> 0:17:22.880 getting sick and dying because we just don't have enough 0:17:22.960 --> 0:17:27.760 nurses exactly. And then the only thing the hospitals do 0:17:28.000 --> 0:17:30.440 um is um. They have all the managers go around 0:17:30.440 --> 0:17:33.880 and tell nurses okay, today, we gotta flex up. They'll 0:17:33.960 --> 0:17:36.960 use terminology like that that sounds like empowering and like 0:17:37.080 --> 0:17:39.840 strong man, we gotta flex up today, meaning we want 0:17:39.880 --> 0:17:46.359 you to take more patients than you like safely can meeting. 0:17:46.760 --> 0:17:50.480 Like if you're if you work on a medical surgical unit, 0:17:51.160 --> 0:17:54.360 it's usually like fortified patients is what's recommended for one 0:17:54.440 --> 0:17:56.960 nurse to have for twelve hours. They'll ask you to 0:17:57.000 --> 0:18:01.240 take six or seven Jesus and they'll call it flexing 0:18:01.359 --> 0:18:04.040 up and they're like, well, yeah, but Boble, there's flexing up. 0:18:04.080 --> 0:18:06.560 Why aren't you flexing up? And it's just it's that 0:18:06.680 --> 0:18:11.960 type of like corporate speak and empowerment language, um that 0:18:12.080 --> 0:18:17.320 forces us to risk our license. Yeah, And I think 0:18:17.600 --> 0:18:21.360 one of one of the consequence of this that I mean, 0:18:21.400 --> 0:18:23.600 it's really obvious if you've been following sector at all, 0:18:23.840 --> 0:18:26.320 is that Okay, Well, it turns out if you if 0:18:26.359 --> 0:18:28.960 you work a bunch of people like basically to death 0:18:29.000 --> 0:18:30.520 and you don't give them a free sources and you're 0:18:30.520 --> 0:18:33.720 making them take too many patients, it's that people just 0:18:33.760 --> 0:18:38.040 start quitting. And yeah, can you talk a bit about 0:18:38.080 --> 0:18:39.800 sort of the shortage that has been happening because of 0:18:39.840 --> 0:18:43.520 that too, because that's I think a really bleak like 0:18:43.720 --> 0:18:46.800 just in the long term too. It's just I don't know, like, 0:18:46.880 --> 0:18:49.720 if you want to have an even vaguely functioning society. 0:18:49.760 --> 0:18:53.120 The fact that you can't keep people as nurses. It's 0:18:53.119 --> 0:19:03.680 really bad. Absolutely, Yeah. Pandemic hit and nurses realize that 0:19:03.920 --> 0:19:06.439 they're just they're not being paid their worth. There's travel 0:19:06.520 --> 0:19:09.840 jobs that are you can make two hundred grant a year, 0:19:09.920 --> 0:19:13.280 three undergrand a year, um, just doing travel nursing. And 0:19:13.320 --> 0:19:16.960 then they're kind of sold on the idea that you 0:19:18.080 --> 0:19:21.920 own your schedule and you can just kind of plan 0:19:22.000 --> 0:19:24.760 around vacations and other times off you need, and you 0:19:24.840 --> 0:19:27.320 just kind of book like a four week stint at 0:19:27.320 --> 0:19:31.640 a hospital. If you don't like it, you can leave. Um. 0:19:31.680 --> 0:19:34.920 So they kind of just sell our jobs back to us. 0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:39.800 But it's not good healthcare. Yeah, it is. It's like 0:19:40.880 --> 0:19:43.200 you know, I've talked about this with like like people 0:19:43.200 --> 0:19:45.359 who work at Starbucks for example, where it's like, well, okay, 0:19:45.400 --> 0:19:47.600 like if if you're just constant moving people around and 0:19:47.640 --> 0:19:49.880 nobody's like actually stays at a place, and you never 0:19:49.960 --> 0:19:51.760 you never build up a community of people who are 0:19:51.760 --> 0:19:53.840 working with like your cares, you know, it's like okay, 0:19:53.840 --> 0:19:55.720 well you're not going to get good stuff. It's like yeah, 0:19:55.800 --> 0:20:01.159 like this is like like this is people's lives exactly. 0:20:01.240 --> 0:20:05.400 And those UM travel travel nurses, I mean their their 0:20:05.440 --> 0:20:09.359 goals are usually like financial freedom, UM like all of 0:20:09.400 --> 0:20:12.800 our goals UM so, and their goals are always short term. 0:20:12.880 --> 0:20:14.400 You know, all I have to do is just deal 0:20:14.440 --> 0:20:17.160 with this hospital for four weeks and then I'm gone. Well, 0:20:17.200 --> 0:20:20.439 how is that going to fix any institutional area errors? 0:20:20.440 --> 0:20:24.480 I mean there issues there. I mean, they never will 0:20:24.600 --> 0:20:28.000 hold the employer accountable. Yeah, and especially like it seems 0:20:28.040 --> 0:20:30.640 like like, you know, even even even if like everyone 0:20:30.840 --> 0:20:32.240 walking like I don't, I don't think you could have 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:34.480 a functional hospital system if everyone was a travel nurse. 0:20:34.520 --> 0:20:37.760 But like at some point it feels like there's no 0:20:37.840 --> 0:20:41.040 way for there to be like there's no way for 0:20:41.240 --> 0:20:44.720 people to like keep leaving hospitals to go be travel nurses. 0:20:44.720 --> 0:20:48.760 And also for travel nurses pay to stay that high. Yeah, exactly. 0:20:48.800 --> 0:20:51.480 Eventually it'll get saturated, and that's kind of the goal 0:20:51.520 --> 0:20:55.760 of hospitals to push all of their UM permanent employees 0:20:55.800 --> 0:21:00.320 into traveling. So once that industry becomes saturated and you 0:21:00.320 --> 0:21:03.480 can decrease wages and we'd have to compete amongst each other, 0:21:04.119 --> 0:21:07.960 UM for certain jobs with certain hours that we need 0:21:08.160 --> 0:21:12.400 or whatever, we'll just be Um, it's just a race 0:21:12.480 --> 0:21:17.840 to the bottom. We're just gonna Yeah, then the employer 0:21:17.880 --> 0:21:24.040 will control the market and it's yeah. Um, and I 0:21:24.119 --> 0:21:27.800 can't imagine twenty years from now, um, trying to be 0:21:27.840 --> 0:21:29.960 a travel nurse. It's just going to be hard to 0:21:30.000 --> 0:21:32.800 compete with those younger people that are that could work 0:21:32.840 --> 0:21:35.800 harder and faster and longer than me for less money. 0:21:36.800 --> 0:21:41.679 It's not sustainable for a career. Yeah, it's it's just 0:21:41.760 --> 0:21:44.239 doesn't seem like a good way to do healthcare. Like 0:21:44.480 --> 0:21:52.919 yeah that also yeah, m hm, exactly. Yeah, So I 0:21:52.960 --> 0:21:54.760 guess the next thing I want to talk about in 0:21:54.840 --> 0:21:56.400 terms of okay, so how do you make this better? 0:21:56.600 --> 0:22:00.040 Is about Yeah, this is a very large bolt the 0:22:00.200 --> 0:22:04.719 hospital strike across multiple cities, which is really impressive thing 0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:09.200 to pull off. Was warning shalk about how how that happens. Yeah, 0:22:09.359 --> 0:22:12.840 you know, the pandemic really pushed a lot of nurses 0:22:12.840 --> 0:22:16.280 to want to fight for change. Um, and I think 0:22:16.320 --> 0:22:19.080 that it all started there. We all started coming together 0:22:19.119 --> 0:22:24.400 with the same issues and problems, and um, yeah finally 0:22:24.440 --> 0:22:30.120 just started organizing more. Um. All these hospitals were currently unionized, 0:22:30.200 --> 0:22:34.760 but somewhere more like involved in their union than others um, 0:22:35.240 --> 0:22:40.240 i'd say, now a lot of nurses are more involved 0:22:40.240 --> 0:22:45.200 in the union, and it's a lot of younger nurses too. Um, 0:22:45.240 --> 0:22:49.520 just because there people are finally realizing that we are 0:22:49.640 --> 0:22:52.720 the union. It's not a separate entity from us. It's 0:22:52.800 --> 0:22:55.720 something that we can control and be a part of 0:22:55.840 --> 0:23:01.719 and be able to use it to balance power. UM. 0:23:01.880 --> 0:23:07.520 So it just, yeah, it's our only way to fight um, 0:23:07.560 --> 0:23:11.280 this healthcare sector. We also want to ask about what 0:23:11.359 --> 0:23:17.240 the negotiation process has been like, because I mean five 0:23:17.280 --> 0:23:20.359 months is I mean, you know, okay like that you 0:23:20.480 --> 0:23:23.480 very rarely get fast contracts when you're dealing with bosses. 0:23:23.600 --> 0:23:27.919 But yeah, like the contract negotiation process seems to have 0:23:27.960 --> 0:23:32.679 been really bad, even by sort of like regular contract 0:23:32.680 --> 0:23:40.120 association standards. Yeah, for sure. I mean the our negotiations, 0:23:40.200 --> 0:23:42.800 we probably have negotiations like once a week, once every 0:23:42.800 --> 0:23:47.160 other week, um, and the hospital shows up with five 0:23:47.200 --> 0:23:50.280 of their like elites that just hied behind a corporate lawyer. 0:23:50.960 --> 0:23:53.760 It was just a union busting lawyer. And all they 0:23:53.800 --> 0:23:56.640 do is just gaslight and demonize this and say, well, 0:23:56.720 --> 0:24:00.520 the hospital staffing shortage is your fault because you guys 0:24:00.520 --> 0:24:03.080 are calling in sick too much, or I mean they 0:24:03.119 --> 0:24:10.320 just turn everything around to blame the nurses. It's very demoralizing. It's, um, 0:24:10.640 --> 0:24:15.080 we feel very just underappreciated, especially with everything we've gone 0:24:15.119 --> 0:24:17.840 through with the pandemic, and they've just been dismissive of 0:24:17.960 --> 0:24:21.880 what we're um, what our needs are and anything, especially 0:24:21.920 --> 0:24:24.520 like like the like the calling in sick too much 0:24:24.560 --> 0:24:26.680 is like, well, yeah, okay, maybe your nurses wouldn't be 0:24:26.720 --> 0:24:29.040 getting sick if you were making them work with no 0:24:29.160 --> 0:24:35.480 people like with ppe in a pandemic, Like Jesus Christ. Oh, 0:24:35.600 --> 0:24:38.520 it's just it's just comic all the arguments as they have, 0:24:39.400 --> 0:24:42.120 I know, and it's like we don't we can't ever 0:24:42.240 --> 0:24:45.919 get vacation that we're asking for. I mean, one of 0:24:46.040 --> 0:24:48.360 one of our proposals is just to get a two 0:24:48.359 --> 0:24:51.760 week block vacation for every nurse in the hospital guaranteed 0:24:51.800 --> 0:24:56.480 every year. Um, because we don't even get that. We 0:24:56.480 --> 0:24:59.240 we have a cap on our vaccasion hours and then 0:24:59.240 --> 0:25:03.360 we get deny our vacation constantly people calling sick because 0:25:03.480 --> 0:25:08.160 we need a day off, we need a break. Yeah, 0:25:08.280 --> 0:25:11.840 We're like yeah, yeah, like okay, Like if you have 0:25:11.920 --> 0:25:14.080 vacation nows but you can't use them, you don't actually 0:25:14.119 --> 0:25:20.640 have them like, it's not how this works exactly. Yeah, 0:25:20.880 --> 0:25:25.399 it's it's a benefit they control. Yeah. What are the 0:25:25.440 --> 0:25:28.000 things that I've been reading about that you've all been 0:25:28.000 --> 0:25:30.120 fighting for? That It's really interesting to me because it's 0:25:30.160 --> 0:25:34.520 something I've seen in a few other struggles kind of proposed, 0:25:34.520 --> 0:25:40.199 but never like really like put in the center of 0:25:40.240 --> 0:25:46.520 the thing is talking about like all right, like giving 0:25:46.560 --> 0:25:51.720 giving workers a role in staffing decisions. Yeah, yeah, you 0:25:51.760 --> 0:25:53.719 can you talk about that because that that's really interesting 0:25:53.760 --> 0:25:58.439 to me. Yeah, absolutely so. Um, I mean currently we 0:25:58.480 --> 0:26:03.119 don't own our profession, We have no say in staffing ratios. 0:26:03.320 --> 0:26:10.200 The hospitals decide um what is safe care, and they're 0:26:10.240 --> 0:26:15.240 doing it absolutely wrong. Um. So we want to be 0:26:15.320 --> 0:26:19.040 able to take that back and control that and to 0:26:19.160 --> 0:26:24.199 say this is what we need because our patients are sicker, um, 0:26:24.240 --> 0:26:27.359 they're staying longer in the hospital, and in order to 0:26:27.400 --> 0:26:34.359