WEBVTT - Musk Subpoenas Dorsey and Rep. Cicilline on Big Tech 0:00:02.240 --> 0:00:05.600 From the heart of where innovation, money and power collive 0:00:06.360 --> 0:00:10.879 in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with 0:00:10.960 --> 0:00:27.080 Emily Jay. I'm me Emily Jack in San Francisco, and 0:00:27.080 --> 0:00:29.560 this is Bloomberg Technology. Coming up in the next hour, 0:00:29.680 --> 0:00:33.920 Elon Musk subpoena's former Twitter CEO, Jack Dorsey. What could 0:00:33.920 --> 0:00:36.880 Dorsey say that would helped must get out of the deal? 0:00:37.240 --> 0:00:41.199 We'll discuss class big tech regulation wasn't lying for a 0:00:41.320 --> 0:00:43.880 big vote in Congress, but has since been sideline in 0:00:43.920 --> 0:00:47.599 the midst of a worsening economy and a war on Ukraine. 0:00:47.680 --> 0:00:49.720 One of the top crusaders to take on the power 0:00:49.800 --> 0:00:53.720 of tech joins us this hour, Representative David Cicilini, Chair 0:00:53.880 --> 0:00:58.360 of the House Antitrust Subcommittee, and Digital Medicine gets real. 0:00:58.560 --> 0:01:01.640 The maker of an FDA video game that treats a 0:01:01.800 --> 0:01:06.119 d h D goes public vias back today. The CEO 0:01:06.280 --> 0:01:10.520 of Achille will be here meantime. Elon Musk has subpoena 0:01:10.720 --> 0:01:13.640 former Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey in his latest attempt to 0:01:13.680 --> 0:01:16.759 get out of this four billion dollar deal. Musk has 0:01:16.760 --> 0:01:20.399 accused the company of misrepresenting its bought accounts and hiding 0:01:20.440 --> 0:01:24.640 the names of employees responsible for dealing We've bought issues 0:01:24.880 --> 0:01:27.560 here to give us the latest update Bloomberg Kurt Wagner, 0:01:27.600 --> 0:01:29.960 who of course covers Twitter for us. So why would 0:01:30.040 --> 0:01:32.480 Musk subpoena Jack Dorsey? Well, he was the CEO of 0:01:32.560 --> 0:01:34.959 the company for six years. He's been on the board 0:01:35.720 --> 0:01:38.960 up until May, for the entirety of the company's existence. 0:01:39.000 --> 0:01:41.679 So you would think if anybody knows about the growth 0:01:41.760 --> 0:01:45.200 of the company, how they handle metrics, who's reporting, you know, 0:01:45.640 --> 0:01:48.320 on the earnings call every quarter? It was Jack Dorsey, Right, 0:01:48.400 --> 0:01:50.440 So this is someone who knows the company intimately but 0:01:50.520 --> 0:01:52.520 also as a product person. He knows how the company 0:01:52.600 --> 0:01:54.640 grows and how they probably calculate these kinds of things. 0:01:54.720 --> 0:01:57.919 We know Twitter has subpoena a bunch of Musk's inner circle, 0:01:58.080 --> 0:02:03.920 various entrepreneurs and investors. Remind us of the interaction that 0:02:04.640 --> 0:02:08.280 happened between Musk and Dorsey. This is documented in filings 0:02:08.440 --> 0:02:11.640 leading up to uh Musk getting offered a board seat 0:02:11.720 --> 0:02:15.680 at Twitter, then leading to him offering to buy Twitter. Well, 0:02:15.720 --> 0:02:18.880 they're also friends, right, so the relationship goes back further. 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.400 But what we saw in the filing was that shortly 0:02:21.440 --> 0:02:24.600 after Ellen got his stake in Twitter, he reached out 0:02:24.639 --> 0:02:27.760 to Jack Dorsey started the conversation about how to get 0:02:27.840 --> 0:02:30.359 involved in the company. That led to a board seat offer, 0:02:30.440 --> 0:02:33.600 which he accepted, and that led to another apparently phone 0:02:33.639 --> 0:02:35.680 call at least some kind of contact, in which Jack 0:02:35.760 --> 0:02:38.000 Dorsey told him, Hey, you know, I think Twitter would 0:02:38.000 --> 0:02:41.160 actually operate better as an independent company. All of a sudden, 0:02:41.160 --> 0:02:42.679 a few days later, Elan says, I don't want to 0:02:42.760 --> 0:02:44.480 join the board. I want to buy the company instead. 0:02:44.560 --> 0:02:46.519 Now we don't know exactly, of course, what was said 0:02:46.520 --> 0:02:49.280 in that conversation, but it seems to be that that 0:02:49.440 --> 0:02:52.400 was important enough that maybe Ellen, you know, changed his 0:02:52.480 --> 0:02:54.600 mind and thought I should take this company private. So 0:02:55.160 --> 0:02:57.280 do we think that Musk thinks Jack has something to 0:02:57.360 --> 0:02:59.880 say I would help him get out of this deal. Well, 0:03:00.120 --> 0:03:02.679 I would expect the Twitter side might want to subpoena 0:03:02.760 --> 0:03:06.000 Jack Dorsey as well, right, because I remember he is 0:03:06.120 --> 0:03:08.520 a key player in this whole thing. I don't think 0:03:08.600 --> 0:03:10.799 this is that crazy that they would want to say, Hey, 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:13.079 we want to see your communications. We want to see 0:03:13.080 --> 0:03:15.400 what you've been saying about this deal. It could be important, 0:03:15.600 --> 0:03:18.000 and I imagine both sides want that information. Right, So 0:03:18.200 --> 0:03:20.639 this is not super crazy that he would do that, 0:03:20.720 --> 0:03:22.799 even though they're friendly. I don't know if he thinks, 0:03:22.880 --> 0:03:25.080 you know, Jack's going to get him out of this necessarily, 0:03:25.120 --> 0:03:28.080 but it does seem important. Has Musk subpoena anyone else? Uh? 0:03:28.280 --> 0:03:30.800 He has subpoena to other people. Caban bake Poor, who 0:03:30.919 --> 0:03:32.839 is the head of product at Twitter for a long time, 0:03:32.960 --> 0:03:36.160 was also announced today. Bruce Fulk, who was the head 0:03:36.200 --> 0:03:39.040 of revenue product at Twitter. You might remember both of 0:03:39.120 --> 0:03:42.920 those guys were actually let go by CEO Parague Agerawall 0:03:43.000 --> 0:03:45.280 shortly after he joined the company. So they are now 0:03:45.560 --> 0:03:48.920 no longer working at Twitter. They're still subpoenaed by So 0:03:49.080 --> 0:03:52.160 where are we now? Have we learned anything new about 0:03:52.280 --> 0:03:54.880 the bond issue or lack there of? What is the 0:03:55.040 --> 0:03:58.160 next phase? We are learning that there's a lot of 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:01.160 people being subpoena and right, and that there's a lot 0:04:01.240 --> 0:04:03.800 of people that both sides want to talk to. We're 0:04:03.840 --> 0:04:07.120 not um getting information about necessarily what is in a 0:04:07.160 --> 0:04:08.960 lot of these subpoenas. A lot of them you know, 0:04:09.040 --> 0:04:12.120 are redacted or will be redacted um and a lot 0:04:12.160 --> 0:04:15.800 of the evidence is closed, it's not public to us. 0:04:16.240 --> 0:04:18.200 So at this point, we kind of know who they 0:04:18.320 --> 0:04:20.880 want to talk to. We're not necessarily getting a lot 0:04:20.880 --> 0:04:23.360 of information about what they're talking about, and will they 0:04:23.560 --> 0:04:26.560 talk right and who's going to be in person at 0:04:26.600 --> 0:04:29.640 this trial. Presumably Jack Dorsey might be one of those people. 0:04:29.680 --> 0:04:31.360 We can't say for certain, but he would make sense 0:04:31.400 --> 0:04:33.640 certainly to be a witness at something. And we're we 0:04:33.720 --> 0:04:36.160 are expecting Elon Musk to testify. I would think, so 0:04:36.360 --> 0:04:39.880 that's that's the expectation. But you know, um, again we 0:04:39.960 --> 0:04:42.280 don't know the roster people. But how how could Elon 0:04:42.360 --> 0:04:44.560 not be there a time? You know, this is obviously 0:04:44.640 --> 0:04:47.240 continued to drag on. How is this according to your 0:04:47.279 --> 0:04:50.040 sources inside Twitter? How is this continuing to impact the 0:04:50.120 --> 0:04:54.560 company impact employees? Well, it's started off as a huge distraction, 0:04:54.600 --> 0:04:56.800 as you can imagine, right twitters in the news every day. 0:04:56.839 --> 0:05:00.880 They're dealing with the Elon's tweets out their product and 0:05:00.920 --> 0:05:03.719 their policies and their executives. I think at this point 0:05:03.760 --> 0:05:06.160 a lot of the people who really hated this might 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:09.360 have left by now. Certainly some of them have, And 0:05:09.720 --> 0:05:11.520 at a certain point you have to continue to kind 0:05:11.560 --> 0:05:13.560 of do your job. But I do think there's still 0:05:13.600 --> 0:05:15.839 this cloud of uncertainty. It's not a very fun place 0:05:15.880 --> 0:05:17.840 to work right now when you just don't know what 0:05:17.920 --> 0:05:19.400 your future is going to hold in a few months. 0:05:19.760 --> 0:05:22.640 All right, well, thank you for that update. Teams like 0:05:22.680 --> 0:05:26.440 a few long weeks between now and made October. Okay, 0:05:26.520 --> 0:05:37.960 who works Kurt Wagner, Thank you. I think simply because 0:05:38.080 --> 0:05:42.240 you've been successful in a few different businesses doesn't somehow 0:05:42.360 --> 0:05:45.000 mean that you have un natural market power. It just 0:05:45.120 --> 0:05:47.840 means you've been successful in a couple of different customer experiences. 0:05:48.000 --> 0:05:50.720 I look at the opportunity to be provide. I look 0:05:50.760 --> 0:05:53.640 at the skills people are learning through YouTube, you know. 0:05:53.720 --> 0:05:55.680 I feel like everywhere when I go talk to people 0:05:55.920 --> 0:05:59.920 and and providing access to information and knowledge, I think 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:01.360 will end up being on the right side of history 0:06:01.400 --> 0:06:04.120 as one. I don't think big by itself is bad 0:06:04.440 --> 0:06:08.200 or but competition is good and every business, in particular 0:06:08.320 --> 0:06:10.920 the businesses that are large and have high scale. The 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:15.440 unintended consequences of your scale cannot be dealt after the fact. 0:06:15.520 --> 0:06:18.840 They need to be dealt while you're scaling. Regulation will 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:21.159 have an important role to play here. I think privacy 0:06:21.240 --> 0:06:24.600 regulation is important in the areas like AI regulation will 0:06:24.640 --> 0:06:29.799 be important. Some thoughts there from my interviews with various 0:06:29.880 --> 0:06:33.120 big text CEOs over the last eighteen months, as antitrust 0:06:33.160 --> 0:06:37.599 scrutiny loose. The most talked about bill the bipartisan American 0:06:37.720 --> 0:06:41.039 Innovation and Choice Online Act targeting Big Tech, which would 0:06:41.080 --> 0:06:44.760 prevent companies like Amazon, Meta Alphabet, and Apple from punishing 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:48.360 rivals to boost their own products and services. It seemed 0:06:48.400 --> 0:06:50.719 to be on track to be considered by the Senate 0:06:50.760 --> 0:06:54.040 this summer, but more urgent bills like the Inflation Reduction 0:06:54.120 --> 0:06:56.640 Act and the Chips Act when I head first now, 0:06:56.720 --> 0:07:00.160 the antitrust bill is in limbo. Where is the moment them? 0:07:00.279 --> 0:07:03.800 Let's bring in Congressman an Antichrist Subcommittee chair David Cicillini 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:07.000 with us now for more. Congressman Ceilini, it's so great 0:07:07.320 --> 0:07:09.200 to have you back with us. Thank you for taking 0:07:09.240 --> 0:07:12.440 the time. So look, does this vote bill have enough 0:07:12.520 --> 0:07:14.960 votes to pass the House? And will you need more 0:07:15.080 --> 0:07:19.000 Republican votes to do that? Well, thank you for having 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:21.760 me back. It's great to see you again. I'm pleased 0:07:21.800 --> 0:07:23.440 to say that both in the House and the Senate 0:07:23.520 --> 0:07:26.640 we have votes to pass both of the bills. The 0:07:26.720 --> 0:07:30.480 APPS Bill as well, as the UH Innovation Online Act 0:07:30.520 --> 0:07:34.320 that you just referenced. They've been bipartisans since they were introduced. We, 0:07:34.480 --> 0:07:38.000 as you know, at a sixteen month by partisan investigation 0:07:38.160 --> 0:07:41.120 with a foreigner and fifty page report and then delivered 0:07:41.480 --> 0:07:44.360 legislative solutions. This is one of them. We have the 0:07:44.440 --> 0:07:46.200 votes in the House and the Senate, but as you 0:07:46.280 --> 0:07:49.320 pointed out, the press of business both with the Inflation 0:07:49.360 --> 0:07:52.640 Reduction Act, CHIPS Bill, the Soul Weapons, then we just 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:54.560 had a lot of things that we needed to address. 0:07:54.640 --> 0:07:57.760 My expectations that we when we returned in September, we 0:07:57.800 --> 0:08:00.040 will take this bill up first in the Senate, it 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:02.320 then in the House and send it to the President's guest. 0:08:03.040 --> 0:08:06.280 So you're optimistic then that Senator Schumer will schedule a 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:10.160 date in September and this will happen before the mid terms. Well, 0:08:10.280 --> 0:08:12.520 the Senator Schumer has said publicly, and I know I've 0:08:12.520 --> 0:08:15.960 been working very closely with Senator Klobuchar. There's a bipartisan 0:08:16.480 --> 0:08:18.760 caucus of individuals in the Senate, like in the House 0:08:19.120 --> 0:08:23.320 who's strongest support this legislation. Will understand that in order 0:08:23.400 --> 0:08:26.840 to protect small businesses from the monopoly power with these 0:08:26.920 --> 0:08:29.440 large technology platforms. We need to restore competition in the 0:08:29.520 --> 0:08:32.319 digital marketplace. This is good for consumer, is good for 0:08:32.400 --> 0:08:36.800 small businesses, good for competition, and strongly supported by the 0:08:36.800 --> 0:08:40.520 American people pulling shows sevent the American people believe that 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:43.959 Congress must reign in big tech and restore competition. So 0:08:44.440 --> 0:08:46.600 it's good for small business. The public wants it, our 0:08:46.679 --> 0:08:50.240 constituents wanted, and I expect the Senate Shumer is gonna 0:08:50.240 --> 0:08:52.559 bring the bills the floor in September. Then we'll take 0:08:52.600 --> 0:08:54.480 it up in the House and we'll send it to 0:08:54.559 --> 0:08:56.640 the President's desk, who, by the way, the President has 0:08:56.679 --> 0:09:00.080 been the most pro competition president we've ever had ad 0:09:00.600 --> 0:09:03.600 both in his executive order and his appointments in his administration, 0:09:03.920 --> 0:09:07.439 and someone who really understands the competition is that the 0:09:07.520 --> 0:09:11.040 heart of making our economy work for everyone. Still, there's 0:09:11.080 --> 0:09:14.600 concerns that, you know, even among Democrats, this bill could 0:09:14.679 --> 0:09:18.719 be weaponized to prevent big tech companies from moderating some 0:09:18.840 --> 0:09:21.920 of the most extreme content. Does the bill need to 0:09:22.120 --> 0:09:24.959 change at all to address those concerns? And if the 0:09:25.000 --> 0:09:30.240 bill changes, can you get or keep those Republicans on board? Well, 0:09:30.280 --> 0:09:32.360 I don't think the bill needs to change. In fact, 0:09:32.720 --> 0:09:35.880 so long as the policies that a platform has in 0:09:35.960 --> 0:09:39.840 place to, you know, to provide protections against certain kinds 0:09:39.880 --> 0:09:44.199 of speech so that particularly dangerous speech or speech that 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:46.840 they think is inappropriate, as long as that same standard 0:09:46.880 --> 0:09:49.640 applies across the board. And you don't say for liberal 0:09:49.720 --> 0:09:52.240 viewers this is one test, for more conservative us is 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:55.480 another jest. As long as there's an established standard that 0:09:55.559 --> 0:09:58.400 applies across the board, then then there would be no 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:02.599 concern about implicating, uh, the ability to moderate content. But 0:10:02.760 --> 0:10:06.600 the truth is these platforms don't want to change anything. 0:10:06.920 --> 0:10:09.960 They want to preserve an ecosystem that has generated profits 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:12.720 never seen in the history of the world because they 0:10:12.840 --> 0:10:16.240 favored their own products and services. They're collecting the enormous 0:10:16.240 --> 0:10:19.839 amount of data from consumers and monetizing that data, and 0:10:19.960 --> 0:10:22.560 they have no interest in competition. They want to continue 0:10:22.600 --> 0:10:25.439 to be able to acquire or crush or block their 0:10:25.480 --> 0:10:28.120 competitors so they can grow their market power and grow 0:10:28.200 --> 0:10:31.400 their dominance and grow their profits. They have they've spent 0:10:31.440 --> 0:10:34.280 over a hundred and twenty million dollars to kill this 0:10:34.520 --> 0:10:37.640 bill because they know it will bring competition that's bad 0:10:37.760 --> 0:10:41.920 for our economy because competition is the single greatest driver 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:45.000 of innovation. If we're going to remain a global economic power, 0:10:45.080 --> 0:10:47.960 we need to have competition in this space, and right 0:10:48.000 --> 0:10:50.839 now we don't. So you keep using the words they, 0:10:51.200 --> 0:10:57.400 and I assume you mean Meta, Apple, Alphabet, Amazon. Here 0:10:57.440 --> 0:10:59.679 we are, you know, coming out of the pandemic? Is 0:10:59.720 --> 0:11:03.120 there one of those companies that concerns you more than 0:11:03.200 --> 0:11:06.760 the others based on how their power has evolved since 0:11:06.800 --> 0:11:09.959 you started talking about it? Well, I mean all of 0:11:10.040 --> 0:11:13.200 these companies engage in behavior which is anti competitive, which 0:11:13.240 --> 0:11:16.319 favors their own products and services, which uses their market 0:11:16.360 --> 0:11:20.760 dominance to bully or crush competitors. Uh, they all engage 0:11:20.760 --> 0:11:23.360 in behavior which is really harmful to our economy and 0:11:23.520 --> 0:11:27.040 harmful to competition. I mean, I think in particular Facebook 0:11:27.120 --> 0:11:28.679 or Meta. You know, it's funny you change the name. 0:11:28.720 --> 0:11:31.720 Their behavior hasn't changed. I think there's a direct line 0:11:31.800 --> 0:11:35.920 between Facebook and the misinformation and the spread of toxic 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:39.280 and violent material that ultimately resulted in the attack on 0:11:39.320 --> 0:11:42.560 our democracy on January six. This is a business model 0:11:43.000 --> 0:11:46.679 that values above all else engagement, and as it turns out, 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:50.400 the most provocative, most untrue, most dangerous content has the 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:54.000 deepest engagement. So they have a business model that incentivizes 0:11:54.120 --> 0:11:57.360 amplifying the worst material and uh, they're not. They have 0:11:57.480 --> 0:12:01.320 proven time and time again they cannot regulate themselves. Congress 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:03.719 has a responsible to make sure that we're doing our 0:12:03.800 --> 0:12:07.720 part to restore competition and prevent these companies from really 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:10.920 becoming instruments to undermine our democracy, which is what they've become. 0:12:11.520 --> 0:12:15.079 It's interesting you mentioned Metta. I've given this lawsuit that 0:12:15.120 --> 0:12:19.160 has come under Lena Kahn's FTC about the acquisition of 0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:22.720 a smaller VR company within unlimited. Facebook says this deal 0:12:22.800 --> 0:12:26.160 will be good for competition. What's your reaction to that 0:12:26.559 --> 0:12:29.679 and the moves that Lena Kahn has made so far 0:12:29.960 --> 0:12:32.920 at the FTC. Well, I'm proud to say that Lena 0:12:32.960 --> 0:12:35.959 kh was on the team that conducted the investigation that 0:12:36.000 --> 0:12:38.640 I referenced for sixteen months. She was essential to the 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:41.360 development of our report and the set of recommendations that 0:12:41.480 --> 0:12:44.360 formed the basis of the legislation we're discussing. She's been 0:12:44.400 --> 0:12:48.000 a champion of her competition her whole life. I'm delighted 0:12:48.080 --> 0:12:50.439 that she's at the FTC. And while I don't come 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:53.280 in in a particular case, I have full compace that 0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:57.360 she pursuing an action. That's because it will help restore 0:12:57.400 --> 0:13:00.880 competition and and anti competitive behave here. And look, I 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:03.520 don't think we can take any representation made by Meadow 0:13:03.600 --> 0:13:06.959 or Facebook or Mark Zuckerberg seriously. Time and time again, 0:13:07.320 --> 0:13:10.520 they've been found to be engaging in anti competitive behaviors. 0:13:10.920 --> 0:13:12.719 They go on, you know, Mark Stuckerberg goes on this 0:13:13.200 --> 0:13:16.400 national apology tour and then resorts to the same kind 0:13:16.440 --> 0:13:20.360 of anti competitive conduct. And look, I think we've learned 0:13:20.520 --> 0:13:22.959 these companies are too big and they're not going to 0:13:23.120 --> 0:13:27.640 regulate themselves. Congress has a responsibility. We've abandoned that responsibly 0:13:27.679 --> 0:13:30.280 for a very long time. The good news is or 0:13:30.400 --> 0:13:33.040 back or back in a bipartisan way. This can be 0:13:33.280 --> 0:13:36.000 and will be the next big bipartisan victory of the 0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:39.080 Biden administration when we passed these spills and get them 0:13:39.120 --> 0:13:42.400 to the President's desk. It's interesting because we just spoke 0:13:42.440 --> 0:13:45.800 to an investor, Eric visheria Benchmark Capital last week who 0:13:45.840 --> 0:13:50.480 called Apple the greatest monopolist of today and indicated that 0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:55.280 the FTC shouldn't be bothering itself with this meta acquisition, 0:13:55.679 --> 0:13:59.800 saying that Apple is crushing all of these small businesses 0:14:00.120 --> 0:14:04.320 under the guys of protecting privacy. What's your response to that, Well, 0:14:04.480 --> 0:14:07.360 all of these platforms are crushing small businesses. Amazon is 0:14:07.440 --> 0:14:10.120 doing it by collecting third party data and then rolling 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:12.439 out their own products to compete with people sell in 0:14:12.480 --> 0:14:16.360 the marketplace and preferencing their position in that marketplace. Um 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:19.480 uh Meta is doing it with the way that information 0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:22.880 is shared and preferencing again their own services and products. 0:14:23.560 --> 0:14:26.160 So they're all doing this Apple and similarly to engage 0:14:26.160 --> 0:14:29.120 in anti competitive behavior. They all have different impacts, but 0:14:29.240 --> 0:14:33.920 the central tenant is that by undermining competition and engaging 0:14:34.000 --> 0:14:37.320 in and preferencing your own products and services, you are 0:14:37.520 --> 0:14:40.040 undermining the ability of others to compete in the marketplace. 0:14:40.120 --> 0:14:44.440 You're making impossible for small businesses to survive your degrading quality, 0:14:45.040 --> 0:14:47.440 and you're in the end hurring consumers. And so we 0:14:47.600 --> 0:14:50.600 all know competition is good for the economy. As the 0:14:50.680 --> 0:14:55.320 President said, capitalism without competition is exploitation. He's right. These 0:14:55.360 --> 0:14:58.200 are debt, you know, data surveillance and machines that are 0:14:58.280 --> 0:15:02.360 collecting incessantly information than using it to grow their market power. 0:15:02.680 --> 0:15:05.040 And the American people understand this. They are demanding that 0:15:05.160 --> 0:15:08.320 Congress do its part in raining in big tech. We 0:15:08.400 --> 0:15:10.200 have the first set of bills to do that, and 0:15:10.240 --> 0:15:11.800 I have every company is going to get them to 0:15:11.840 --> 0:15:14.680 the President's desk. We were talking about Elon Musk and 0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:18.320 Twitter earlier. Curious there, you know, given that he obviously 0:15:18.480 --> 0:15:22.240 runs to other big tech companies Tesla, SpaceX, which of 0:15:22.280 --> 0:15:25.280 course is still private. If he takes over Twitter, is 0:15:25.320 --> 0:15:28.080 at a deal that would have to be approved by regulators. 0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:31.320 And does it concern you that one person could have 0:15:31.600 --> 0:15:36.120 control over so many influential tech companies? Well, I mean, 0:15:36.200 --> 0:15:39.400 it's exactly the problem with having a single individual with 0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:43.240 this much market power and this much dominance, And it's 0:15:43.240 --> 0:15:46.000 not good for the economy. It's not good for competition. 0:15:46.560 --> 0:15:49.160 And you know, you know, one billionaire buying another billionaires. 0:15:49.200 --> 0:15:52.239 I mean, this is not what a good, healthy competitive 0:15:52.240 --> 0:15:54.200 economy looks like. So I think there are lots of 0:15:54.320 --> 0:15:57.560 reasons to be concerned, But most importantly, we want to 0:15:57.760 --> 0:16:01.080 prohibit the worst kind of conduct, this self preferencing. That's 0:16:01.120 --> 0:16:04.640 really hurting consumers, that's hurting small businesses, and a lot 0:16:04.680 --> 0:16:08.400 you know, these companies will remain wildly successful companies simply 0:16:08.440 --> 0:16:11.000 because they're not allowed to cheat and engage in anti 0:16:11.040 --> 0:16:14.240 competitive behaviors and favor their own products and services to 0:16:14.280 --> 0:16:16.280 the detch meat of others. They're not going to suddenly 0:16:16.360 --> 0:16:18.800 not be successful. They're gonna be wildly successful. They're just 0:16:18.960 --> 0:16:20.480 not going to get to engage in the sort of 0:16:20.520 --> 0:16:24.400 monopolistic behavior that's saving their own products and services and 0:16:24.520 --> 0:16:27.240 really taking advantage of the dominance. They have to continue 0:16:27.280 --> 0:16:28.880 to grow it and grow it and grow it, so 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:32.280 that becomes more and more difficult for new entrance into 0:16:32.320 --> 0:16:35.400 the market or for anyone else to compete with them. Meantime, 0:16:35.440 --> 0:16:38.880 Microsoft is still having conversations with regulators about its seventy 0:16:39.080 --> 0:16:42.800 billion dollar deal to buy Activision. You know, some critics 0:16:42.880 --> 0:16:47.320 have said that Microsoft is somehow skirting the antitrust spotlight. Um, 0:16:47.520 --> 0:16:49.560 you know, do you think this deal goes through? Do 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:52.200 you have any issues with this deal? And if not, 0:16:52.520 --> 0:16:55.240 why not? It's a huge deal. Yeah. I mean again, 0:16:55.280 --> 0:16:58.120 it's it's not a question of whether the deal is 0:16:58.240 --> 0:17:01.800 big or whether it transactions figs. What kind of market share, 0:17:02.280 --> 0:17:05.320 uh does does a company represent and what do they 0:17:05.440 --> 0:17:07.680 do with the power they have the dominance that they have. 0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:10.400 And I think what we learned in our investigation after 0:17:10.520 --> 0:17:14.520 sixty months, as these large technology flat platforms are using 0:17:14.920 --> 0:17:18.480 their market share to just protect their dominance, to prevent 0:17:18.600 --> 0:17:21.159 others from getting a competitive edge. In the minute they 0:17:21.200 --> 0:17:23.639 see a competitive threat, they either require it, kill it, 0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:27.200 or exclude it. And that's the concern. And so you know, 0:17:27.320 --> 0:17:29.720 some of your prior guests were saying, oh, just because 0:17:29.760 --> 0:17:31.639 the company is big is not a problem. No one 0:17:31.680 --> 0:17:34.639 is suggesting a company is big that that's the sole problem. 0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:38.159 But the same conduct we're attempting to prohibit, the self preferencing, 0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:40.520 is that the heart of the Digital Markets Act. That's 0:17:40.560 --> 0:17:43.320 already happening in Europe, and these companies are already being 0:17:43.400 --> 0:17:46.359 required to comply with those provisions. So think about that. 0:17:47.240 --> 0:17:50.280 Small businesses in Europe are gonna have more protection than 0:17:50.359 --> 0:17:53.159 small businesses in America. American small businesses are going to 0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:55.040 be at a disadvantage because they're not going to be 0:17:55.160 --> 0:17:57.920 protected from these practices in the way that they will 0:17:57.920 --> 0:17:59.840 be in Europe. And that's bad for the American economy. 0:18:00.320 --> 0:18:02.439 That's why I've got to pass these bills. That's why 0:18:02.480 --> 0:18:05.480 we have to restore competition and give small businesses and 0:18:05.560 --> 0:18:08.359 innovators and competitors the ability to enter the market and 0:18:08.440 --> 0:18:13.440 compete successfully and fairly. All right, Congressman and Anti Trust 0:18:13.440 --> 0:18:15.600 sub Committee chart David Cecili. Good to have you back 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:19.280 with us. Appreciate hearing where your thoughts are now. And 0:18:19.400 --> 0:18:22.680 speaking of Activision Microsoft, I'm actually gonna be speaking with 0:18:22.760 --> 0:18:25.960 Microsoft Gaming CEO Phil Spencer on the next edition of 0:18:25.960 --> 0:18:29.520 Bloomberg Studio WellPoint. Oh, we talked about the deal with Activision. 0:18:29.800 --> 0:18:33.359 That episode coming up this Wednesday. We will be right 0:18:33.400 --> 0:18:46.200 back before of Bloomberg Technology. This is Bloomberg. Apple employees 0:18:46.200 --> 0:18:49.800 are pushing back against the return to office Apple asking 0:18:49.840 --> 0:18:51.960 workers to come back two to three days a week 0:18:52.040 --> 0:18:55.800 starting September five, but hundreds of employees have since signed 0:18:55.840 --> 0:18:59.119 a petition calling for even more flexibility without having to 0:18:59.200 --> 0:19:02.240 be approved by managers. This at a time when the 0:19:02.400 --> 0:19:05.359 term quiet quitting is making the rounds on social media. 0:19:05.760 --> 0:19:08.479 The idea is not that employees actually quit, but instead 0:19:08.560 --> 0:19:11.840 do the bare minimum that the job requires to maintain 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:16.840 a healthy work life balance. For the second time this year, 0:19:16.920 --> 0:19:19.520 Tesla is raising the price of the driver assistant system 0:19:19.600 --> 0:19:22.720 it calls full self driving, the price going up from 0:19:22.880 --> 0:19:26.159 twelve thousand to fifteen thousand dollars in North America. The 0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:30.200 Tesla system is controversial because it requires active supervision, and 0:19:30.280 --> 0:19:33.360 some critics say it doesn't live up to its full 0:19:33.520 --> 0:19:38.600 self driving name. And Movie Pass is staging a comeback 0:19:38.680 --> 0:19:42.480 the failed movie subscription service. Returning Labor Day weekend. There'll 0:19:42.520 --> 0:19:45.040 be three priced tiers between ten and thirty bucks a month, 0:19:45.400 --> 0:19:48.840 no option for unlimited view, which helped the concept reinvigorate 0:19:48.960 --> 0:20:01.760 the theater going experience pre pandemic. Welcome back to Bloomberg 0:20:01.760 --> 0:20:04.719 Technology and Emily Changing in San Francisco. Amazon is spending 0:20:04.800 --> 0:20:07.640 one and a half billion dollars to acquire I Robot, 0:20:07.720 --> 0:20:11.600 the maker of the Roomba vacuum. The deal had some 0:20:11.760 --> 0:20:15.399 confused because Amazon had already had a robot butler in 0:20:15.560 --> 0:20:20.520 the works named Astro. How Amazon integrate I Robots products 0:20:20.600 --> 0:20:23.960 into its ongoing products and aspirations here to discuss I 0:20:24.080 --> 0:20:27.240 Robot co founder Helen Grenier. She is also the CEO 0:20:27.359 --> 0:20:32.200 of Turtle, a solar powered waiting robot for home gardens. Helen, 0:20:32.320 --> 0:20:34.800 thank you so much for joining us so obviously I 0:20:34.840 --> 0:20:38.560 know I Robot goes way back. What do you make 0:20:38.720 --> 0:20:42.080 of Amazon buying the company? Now? Well? Thank you for 0:20:42.160 --> 0:20:45.480 having me UM. I'm just built to see Amazon showing 0:20:45.560 --> 0:20:49.920 such a strong interest in home robots UM and investing 0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:52.960 heavily in them, not just Astro but now buying I 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:56.399 robot Um. They've got a check by good of seeing 0:20:56.840 --> 0:21:00.280 where the future is going and helping acceler ate it, 0:21:00.400 --> 0:21:05.360 you know with the e commerce with UM, making fulfillment 0:21:05.400 --> 0:21:09.920 center is more automated with web services and and now 0:21:10.119 --> 0:21:14.920 home robots my passion. Still, there's been concerned that this 0:21:15.000 --> 0:21:18.040 gives Amazon access to even more of our data, interior 0:21:18.160 --> 0:21:22.120 maps of our homes for example, Like do you worry 0:21:22.160 --> 0:21:25.840 about that? Should well be worried about that? I actually 0:21:25.880 --> 0:21:28.080 don't think people need could be worried whenever you have 0:21:28.160 --> 0:21:30.879 a new technology, and technology keeps advancing so much, and 0:21:30.920 --> 0:21:33.439 we get lots of technologies on allline devices like our 0:21:33.480 --> 0:21:36.680 cell phones. Right, you've got a GPS, you've got a camera. 0:21:36.800 --> 0:21:39.159 You don't need those to make phone calls. But the 0:21:39.200 --> 0:21:43.119 additional benefits that the technology he gets you like maps 0:21:43.160 --> 0:21:46.679 and video calls, pedometers, having you know, the best cameras, 0:21:46.720 --> 0:21:48.160 the one that's with you, right, so you get those 0:21:48.200 --> 0:21:51.680 great shots. Most people have decided that even those privacy 0:21:51.760 --> 0:21:55.680 concerns that the benefits outweigh them. And I think it's 0:21:55.800 --> 0:21:58.520 the same with the robot vacuums. Right, there is a 0:21:58.600 --> 0:22:02.200 camera on the most recent ones, but the cameras on 0:22:02.760 --> 0:22:06.000 it's really optimized and cost reduced for navigation. And what 0:22:06.119 --> 0:22:08.200