1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:06,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from housetop works 2 00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:15,000 Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to the Mind. My 3 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:18,920 Speaker 1: name is Joe mccornet and I'm Christian Sager. Hey. Robert 4 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:22,000 Speaker 1: lamb Our host of Stuff to Blow Your Mind, isn't 5 00:00:22,079 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 1: with us this week. This is our first solo flight. 6 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:27,040 Speaker 1: But if you listen to the episode that we released 7 00:00:27,080 --> 00:00:29,479 Speaker 1: earlier this week, you will know that we are doing 8 00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:32,200 Speaker 1: a two parter on the science behind the X Files 9 00:00:32,320 --> 00:00:34,720 Speaker 1: right right right, And if you didn't catch our last 10 00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:36,680 Speaker 1: episode on the science of the X Files that was 11 00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:38,800 Speaker 1: part one, you should probably go back and listen to 12 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 1: that one first. It came out earlier this week because 13 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:44,159 Speaker 1: our our first one, we're the we introduced the concept 14 00:00:44,240 --> 00:00:46,600 Speaker 1: of the X Files for people who aren't fans of 15 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 1: the show, who haven't seen it themselves, so you can 16 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:52,000 Speaker 1: sort of follow along. In fact, we just got done 17 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:54,640 Speaker 1: being on periscope and somebody asked us who they wanted 18 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: to know. I've never seen the show before? Can I 19 00:00:56,800 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 1: still listen to these episodes? And the answer is absolutely yeah. 20 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 1: We really hope they will be interesting anyway, but especially 21 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 1: so if you're a fan of the show. Even if 22 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:05,920 Speaker 1: you're not a fan of the show. We hope there 23 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:08,319 Speaker 1: are enough interesting ideas to to keep you on the 24 00:01:08,360 --> 00:01:12,119 Speaker 1: hook through this whole discussion. So, uh, if you want 25 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: to go back and check out that first episode first, 26 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:17,399 Speaker 1: we recommend that. If not, and you're here and you 27 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:20,119 Speaker 1: just want to listen, feel free to continue because we're 28 00:01:20,120 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 1: gonna roll on in. We've got We're gonna talk about 29 00:01:22,480 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 1: bugs and insects and the X Files. We're gonna talk 30 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:27,600 Speaker 1: about how hypnosis, which I know is one of Joe's 31 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:30,840 Speaker 1: favorite topics, and the X Files, and we're gonna talk 32 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:33,880 Speaker 1: about the possibility of alien hybrids. Right. Yeah, So just 33 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:37,000 Speaker 1: to revisit the impetus for doing this episode. We're doing 34 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 1: it because the X Files are coming back, and I 35 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 1: believe it's Sunday, January. They're coming back to television and 36 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:46,160 Speaker 1: we're going to get a new X Files mini series 37 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 1: with Jillian Anderson, with David Duchovny, all the gangs, getting 38 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:53,320 Speaker 1: all that together. Mitch Pleggy, I hope so playing Skinner. 39 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:55,400 Speaker 1: Oh he's there. He's got a big old beard. I 40 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:58,800 Speaker 1: can't wait. Is he bringing his muscles? He's probably been 41 00:01:58,840 --> 00:02:00,840 Speaker 1: working out for the last six month. I love Mitch 42 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:04,400 Speaker 1: peleggy Um. And we want to mention also the top 43 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 1: one more thing about how we brought in a bunch 44 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:10,040 Speaker 1: of sources on our research this time. But but our 45 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:12,959 Speaker 1: primary resource over this past couple of episodes has been 46 00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:15,440 Speaker 1: a cool book called The Science of the X Files 47 00:02:15,480 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 1: by Gene Cavelos, who is an astrophysicist and mathematician now 48 00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 1: a science and science fiction writer. So this is a 49 00:02:23,000 --> 00:02:24,840 Speaker 1: really fun book. It's been a lot of help to us. 50 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:27,280 Speaker 1: It was written in so we we've had to check 51 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:29,200 Speaker 1: on a bunch of things and and and see what 52 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 1: needs a little bit of updating. But but that's been 53 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: a big help, And I think we should get right 54 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 1: into it because I am just jones in to talk 55 00:02:37,600 --> 00:02:41,920 Speaker 1: about bugs. Yeah, I mean, insects are clearly a big 56 00:02:41,960 --> 00:02:43,919 Speaker 1: theme in the X Files. They show up all over 57 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:47,520 Speaker 1: the place. We've got classics from the first season with 58 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:50,600 Speaker 1: Darkness Falls were the copper Phages, which is one of 59 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 1: my favorite episodes, which is all about cockroaches invading us 60 00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:57,680 Speaker 1: well Town and uh. And then of course the general 61 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:01,400 Speaker 1: myth arc of the show has been easy galore. These 62 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 1: feature pretty prominently in the movie too, write So I 63 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:08,600 Speaker 1: really wanted to talk about darkness falls. But unfortunately, I 64 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 1: don't know if there's all that much great to say 65 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 1: about the science behind it. So the basic idea of 66 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:18,239 Speaker 1: the episode is that Mulder Scully and some tag alongs 67 00:03:18,280 --> 00:03:21,679 Speaker 1: go into the woods where there have been some people disappearing, 68 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:25,840 Speaker 1: and they get assaulted by photophobic wood mites that kill 69 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:28,640 Speaker 1: people by cocoon ing them in the forest. I believe 70 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 1: Tightus Wellover, the actor Titus Wellover is one of the 71 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:34,000 Speaker 1: one of the tag along's. I don't know who that is. Oh, 72 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:35,839 Speaker 1: he was in like dead Wood. He's in a bunch 73 00:03:35,880 --> 00:03:39,320 Speaker 1: of stuff. He was in Transformers Age of Extinction. Oh, well, 74 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:41,040 Speaker 1: I remember that one. Who did he play in that? 75 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 1: He was like the bad FBI agent who wanted to 76 00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 1: be mean to Optimus Prime. I don't remember. If you 77 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:49,320 Speaker 1: saw him, you'd know him in a minute. He's a 78 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:51,280 Speaker 1: character actor that's been a ton of stuff. Did he 79 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:54,560 Speaker 1: get killed by the wood mites? Yeah? Okay, so yeah, Well, 80 00:03:54,640 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 1: we eventually find out that these that these attackers are 81 00:03:58,200 --> 00:04:01,160 Speaker 1: some sort of might or something grows in the trees 82 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:04,720 Speaker 1: and they are allergic to light. So you can protect 83 00:04:04,760 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 1: yourself by surrounding yourself in light. But of course a 84 00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 1: lot of the plot of the episode hinges on the 85 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: fact that Molder and Scully have a generator that's running out, 86 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 1: and can they keep the lights on long enough to 87 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 1: survive through the night. But these things kill their victims. 88 00:04:19,640 --> 00:04:21,760 Speaker 1: I don't know if they kill them by cocoon ing 89 00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: them or just they kill them and then cocoon them. 90 00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:27,000 Speaker 1: But there's there's I think there's a part where live 91 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:29,320 Speaker 1: people are pulled out of a cocoon, so it seems 92 00:04:29,360 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 1: a cocooning process that kills. I got the impression that like, 93 00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 1: once they're cocoon to, their bodies get desiccated somehow by 94 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 1: these by these bugs. So I wanted to find out 95 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:42,640 Speaker 1: if there were any really cool, real science facts about 96 00:04:42,680 --> 00:04:46,000 Speaker 1: bugs that kill by cocoon ing. And there are no 97 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 1: real killer wood mites that I know of. But one 98 00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 1: interesting thing I did find was not about an insect, 99 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 1: but about a spider that kills insects with cocoons. So 100 00:04:57,160 --> 00:05:00,280 Speaker 1: this was This was a July two blog post found 101 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:02,559 Speaker 1: by a science writer named Ed Young, who's a writer 102 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 1: I like. I follow him, and he he talks about 103 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:08,720 Speaker 1: this group of spiders called the ellbrids, which use their 104 00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:12,480 Speaker 1: silk line and these are his words, as a murderous 105 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 1: garbage compactor. Okay, alright, so I'm kind of imagining that 106 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:20,400 Speaker 1: does this. Does the silk from their their web kind 107 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:23,279 Speaker 1: of cut through the enemies as its as it constricts, 108 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:27,680 Speaker 1: it crushes, crushes them to death. So most spiders kill 109 00:05:27,760 --> 00:05:30,280 Speaker 1: with venom, and those that spin webs they use their 110 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 1: webs for like locomotion dropping down from something, or for 111 00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:37,760 Speaker 1: traps to catch insects in. But a scientist named William 112 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:41,160 Speaker 1: Epperhard from the University of Costa Rica noticed that the 113 00:05:41,480 --> 00:05:45,359 Speaker 1: librids spend more than an hour wrapping their prey in 114 00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:49,480 Speaker 1: more than eighty meters of silk. So they catch an 115 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:52,720 Speaker 1: insect and then they just started wrapping and they just 116 00:05:52,880 --> 00:05:56,560 Speaker 1: keep going and wrapping it, Yeah, wrapping it and wrapping it. 117 00:05:56,960 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: One species in particular, called philippin Ella vicina, uses so 118 00:06:02,200 --> 00:06:05,720 Speaker 1: much silk at such great compression that it crushes the 119 00:06:05,760 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 1: insect inside, making quote its legs break and its eyes 120 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:12,520 Speaker 1: buckle inwards. So this sounds like some kind of like 121 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 1: medieval torture device like that that would be used to 122 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 1: get people to talk somehow. Yeah, it's the spider version 123 00:06:18,760 --> 00:06:21,800 Speaker 1: of the scavengers daughter. Yeah, exactly Scavenger's daughter was what 124 00:06:21,839 --> 00:06:24,880 Speaker 1: I was thinking of. So okay, so darkness falls. Maybe 125 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 1: these are like we never I don't think see what 126 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: these insects actually look like other than just like a 127 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:32,839 Speaker 1: haze of green. Yeah, they just kind of show up 128 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:36,839 Speaker 1: as dots and a lot. But but maybe they're tiny, 129 00:06:36,880 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: tiny green spiders that we've very strong cocoons that squeeze 130 00:06:42,839 --> 00:06:44,920 Speaker 1: the life out of their victims. I don't think it's 131 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,840 Speaker 1: very plausible, but but imagine if I mean, one thing 132 00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:51,200 Speaker 1: that's certainly true is that spider webbing is spider silk 133 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:54,280 Speaker 1: is incredibly strong for its size, you know, it's it's 134 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:57,920 Speaker 1: very fine. But for for how fine it is, it 135 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:02,160 Speaker 1: has amazing tentsile drength. And so maybe if you've got 136 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,719 Speaker 1: a whole whole bunch of arachnids working in tandem to 137 00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:09,279 Speaker 1: cocoon a person like this with super high compression, I 138 00:07:09,279 --> 00:07:11,880 Speaker 1: don't know, could that cause injury? Maybe I'd like to 139 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 1: I'd like to imagine it could. Yeah, maybe that's where 140 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:16,280 Speaker 1: they're going to the episode. But they just didn't have 141 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 1: the budget to quite show the incredible eighty meters silk 142 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:23,360 Speaker 1: per victim. Then again, I don't know if if the 143 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 1: cocoon ing in the episode really compresses the victim all 144 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:29,000 Speaker 1: that hard, it seems like that. I think you're right, 145 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 1: they get dried out or something like that. Yeah. But 146 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 1: another episode that has some really really great bug science 147 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:38,320 Speaker 1: in it is War of the copper Phages. Yeah, where 148 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 1: the copper Phages is written by one of our favorite 149 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,560 Speaker 1: X Files writers, Darren Morgan. He only wrote like four 150 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:47,880 Speaker 1: or five episodes, but they're like all my favorite episode. Yeah. Yeah. 151 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:51,080 Speaker 1: And in this one, you know, general premises, Molder goes 152 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:53,680 Speaker 1: to a small town in which cockroaches are swarming all 153 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:56,000 Speaker 1: over people and killing them, and he's coming up with 154 00:07:56,040 --> 00:07:59,680 Speaker 1: all these various ways that he thinks that the cockroaches 155 00:07:59,680 --> 00:08:03,280 Speaker 1: are doing, usually supernatural or or or fantastics in some way. 156 00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:05,000 Speaker 1: So one of the things we should mention in the 157 00:08:05,040 --> 00:08:07,720 Speaker 1: title is, well, what is the term copper phage means? Well, 158 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 1: a copper phage it means one who feeds on excrement, 159 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:16,160 Speaker 1: because cockroaches eat their own and other species. Yeah, yeah, 160 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:18,760 Speaker 1: it's it's a lovely term. So cockroaches aren't the only 161 00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:21,120 Speaker 1: copper phages, but they are. They are a type of 162 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:24,600 Speaker 1: copper fage. I've I've heard that some of our coworkers 163 00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:27,720 Speaker 1: here at How Stuff Works are copper phages. That is inappropriate. 164 00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:32,000 Speaker 1: I've got a great insult for somebody next next time. 165 00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:35,480 Speaker 1: Somebody's got a got a really obnoxious grin that this 166 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 1: will get past the sensors. So you could you tell 167 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:44,400 Speaker 1: them they have a copper phaging grin. That's great? So okay, 168 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:48,080 Speaker 1: So this episode basically, you know, they run around trying 169 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,319 Speaker 1: to come up with all these ways, and it's everything 170 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:53,600 Speaker 1: from like the copper phages that cockroaches are aliens to 171 00:08:54,240 --> 00:08:57,880 Speaker 1: their tiny little robots, right, and and Scully basically debunks 172 00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 1: every single thing he comes up with over the over 173 00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:03,280 Speaker 1: the phone. It's great. Yeah, Scully in the episode, molders 174 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:06,280 Speaker 1: exploring this town and doing all chasing down all the leads, 175 00:09:06,280 --> 00:09:10,839 Speaker 1: and I think scullies at home eating ice cream quick, right, 176 00:09:11,160 --> 00:09:13,440 Speaker 1: she just she talks to Molder on the phone and 177 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:17,000 Speaker 1: debunks all of his theories over the over the lines. Yeah. 178 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:20,040 Speaker 1: So here's what we do know about cockroaches though, in 179 00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:23,319 Speaker 1: the possibility of them swarming all over us and killing us, right, 180 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 1: cockroaches breed very quickly. We know that we know anybody 181 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 1: who's encountered a cockroach in their home is going to 182 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 1: be aware of this stuff. They run very fast, especially 183 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 1: for their their size. And we know that they carry 184 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 1: bacteria easily because the bacteria in their feces, which let's 185 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:44,680 Speaker 1: remember they eat, remains viable for a long period of time. Uh. 186 00:09:44,679 --> 00:09:49,400 Speaker 1: And yes, some people like myself are allergic to cockroaches. Yeah, 187 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 1: especially if they're exposed more often to them. So now 188 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 1: is that allergy like allergic to their bites, are allergic 189 00:09:55,960 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 1: to I don't know, some kind of particle dispersed in 190 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 1: the air. Yeah. I believe that it's remnants of their exoskeleton. 191 00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:06,200 Speaker 1: So how do I expand this? I had an allergy 192 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:08,840 Speaker 1: test done last year where they basically do that thing 193 00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:11,679 Speaker 1: where they line up your arm and they shoot little 194 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:15,920 Speaker 1: uh injections of particles into your your skin to find 195 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:20,800 Speaker 1: out what you're what's your allergic little allergens exactly? Skin 196 00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 1: wheel responses, Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. And they do it 197 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 1: on my well, at least in my case, they did 198 00:10:25,160 --> 00:10:27,439 Speaker 1: it on my arm and on my back, and cockroaches 199 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:30,800 Speaker 1: were one of the like forty things. Uh and it 200 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 1: and it welled up. So I don't know, I haven't 201 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:35,679 Speaker 1: been exposed to that many cockroaches. So I don't know 202 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:38,800 Speaker 1: where this particular trait came from, But what what use 203 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:41,760 Speaker 1: are you supposed to make of that information? It's like, well, 204 00:10:41,800 --> 00:10:44,600 Speaker 1: don't get in the bathtub full of cockroaches. I think 205 00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 1: it's like more along the lines of this is an 206 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:50,079 Speaker 1: allergen that if you if you live in a place 207 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:52,319 Speaker 1: where there are known to be a lot of cockroaches 208 00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 1: and there's just no way that you're going to get 209 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:56,959 Speaker 1: rid of them, should move you, should or take medicine 210 00:10:57,240 --> 00:10:59,319 Speaker 1: or you know, um, one of the things they pitched 211 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 1: me there with that therapy. I don't know if you've 212 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:05,960 Speaker 1: heard of this, the allergen therapy where they slowly expose 213 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:08,040 Speaker 1: you more and more to the thing that you're allergic to. 214 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 1: Way they like inject you with it with injections with cockroaches. Well, 215 00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: I mean it's particulate matter. Yeah, yeah, I don't know that. 216 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:20,600 Speaker 1: They have like a bag of cockroaches in the back 217 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:22,520 Speaker 1: and they're just like grinding them up with a mortar 218 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 1: past they put them in there and put a little 219 00:11:27,080 --> 00:11:29,439 Speaker 1: in the syringe. Oh man, well, I can only imagine, 220 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 1: given all the things that I was found to be 221 00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:36,640 Speaker 1: allergic to, how disgusting that that mixed bag. But anyways, yeah, 222 00:11:36,679 --> 00:11:38,880 Speaker 1: so people are allergic to them. But here's the thing. 223 00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:43,760 Speaker 1: Cockroaches don't usually swarm, right. We don't find like hundreds 224 00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:46,839 Speaker 1: of cockroaches swarming on a live person and just devouring 225 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 1: them like they seems like. They don't usually move towards 226 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:51,640 Speaker 1: you either. You flip the lights on and they almost 227 00:11:52,040 --> 00:11:54,720 Speaker 1: a yeah. Usually what it is if you see a 228 00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:58,160 Speaker 1: large group of them moving at one time, Usually what 229 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:01,080 Speaker 1: that is is that they've found a suitable home, like 230 00:12:01,240 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 1: let's say a sewage plant, right, Uh. And the cockroaches, 231 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:09,080 Speaker 1: an individual cockroach can release a pheromone that will alert 232 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 1: other roaches to its location and to say like, hey, 233 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:17,559 Speaker 1: look we've got this whole hotel we can move into now, right. Um. 234 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 1: So there's that. And I also want to mention something 235 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:24,200 Speaker 1: else that we've talked about. Uh. I know you've talked 236 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:26,800 Speaker 1: about on Forward Thinking, one of our other shows here. 237 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 1: It's a show that Joe does with Jonathan Strickland and 238 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:34,160 Speaker 1: Lauren Vogel Bomb about future science. Um. And I talked 239 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:36,000 Speaker 1: about it on a on another one of our shows 240 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 1: called Stuff of Genius, which is that you can actually 241 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:44,520 Speaker 1: control cockroaches by putting backpacks on them, these little tiny 242 00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:49,160 Speaker 1: backpacks that have electrodes that connect to their brain. And uh, 243 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:52,719 Speaker 1: there's a there. There actually was a kickstarter uh two 244 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:55,960 Speaker 1: years ago that would allow you to use your phone 245 00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:58,120 Speaker 1: once you've hooked up a cockroach in such a way 246 00:12:58,280 --> 00:13:02,160 Speaker 1: in order to basically drive the cock roach around right right. Uh. 247 00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:05,240 Speaker 1: And this technology was actually developed by a guy named 248 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:09,160 Speaker 1: Dr Isao Shimu Yama at the University of Tokyo. But 249 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 1: the kickstarter was basically coming up with a way to 250 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:15,600 Speaker 1: to make this sort of a do it yourself science 251 00:13:15,679 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 1: kit for kids, I guess, although I'd be terrified at 252 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:21,040 Speaker 1: the idea of kids just like trying to stick electrical 253 00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:26,400 Speaker 1: probes into a cockroach's head. Uh. Anyways, it's totally possible 254 00:13:26,440 --> 00:13:29,560 Speaker 1: to do this. And one of the reasons why is 255 00:13:29,679 --> 00:13:34,560 Speaker 1: because we're theorizing that cockroach bodies are actually one of 256 00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 1: the best ways that we might have to explore space. 257 00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: So a robot cockroach or a cockroach that you're controlling 258 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:46,800 Speaker 1: with a little iPhone backpack might be an ideal way. 259 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:49,080 Speaker 1: And Molder even in this episode says something like he 260 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:52,200 Speaker 1: thinks the cockroaches have been sent from some alien civilization 261 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:58,520 Speaker 1: to to explore Earth, right right, Um, so we've already 262 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:04,319 Speaker 1: built cockroach esque robots to explore volcanoes. Uh. They dispose 263 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:06,680 Speaker 1: of minds and clean them up, and they also clean 264 00:14:06,679 --> 00:14:09,480 Speaker 1: out nuclear power plants. Yeah. I've actually heard about the 265 00:14:09,520 --> 00:14:13,200 Speaker 1: idea of using roach like robots to uh to search 266 00:14:13,360 --> 00:14:16,719 Speaker 1: in rubble after earthquakes for surviving. That seems like a 267 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: good idea as well, right yeah, yeah, So well, the 268 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 1: reason why is because there are multiple legs in the 269 00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:25,880 Speaker 1: way that they're you know, nervous system is set up, 270 00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:29,680 Speaker 1: they offer both stability and mobility. Uh. And they also 271 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:35,400 Speaker 1: have centralized and decentralized control systems. So the central controls 272 00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 1: of their legs, you know, it governs all their legs, 273 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:41,080 Speaker 1: their whole body's movement, but they also have de central 274 00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:44,560 Speaker 1: control on each leg, allowing it to act independently. So 275 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 1: I can see now why like malder you know, if 276 00:14:46,840 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 1: malder knew this, I don't know if he was familiar 277 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:52,720 Speaker 1: with the that doctor's research at the time, but that 278 00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: he would think, oh, yeah, maybe this is like a 279 00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 1: little uh probe for an alien civilization or something like that. 280 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:02,360 Speaker 1: Maybe that's how will probe other civilizations in the future 281 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 1: will send spaceships full of robot cockroaches. That makes a 282 00:15:06,680 --> 00:15:09,320 Speaker 1: good point, and that actually ties into something I know 283 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: I've said on this show before, and it's an opinion 284 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 1: I've held for a while now that when we encounter 285 00:15:14,880 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 1: an alien civilization, I don't think we're going to meet them. 286 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:21,480 Speaker 1: I think we're going to meet their technology. Right, whatever 287 00:15:21,520 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 1: they send, they're much more likely, I mean much more likely, 288 00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:29,200 Speaker 1: like I actually know. But my my gut feeling is 289 00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:33,120 Speaker 1: that what would be more probable is that they would 290 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 1: send feelers out throughout the galaxy, that there would be 291 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:40,720 Speaker 1: sort of unmanned probes, so weaponized bees I think is 292 00:15:40,720 --> 00:15:43,200 Speaker 1: our best transition next, right, Yeah, this has been a 293 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 1: recurring theme in the show. That's a lot of fun. Actually, 294 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:49,640 Speaker 1: it's it's in the movie. It's in some classic myth 295 00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:54,360 Speaker 1: Arc episodes like Herren Vulcan, Zero Sum, and Uh. The 296 00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:58,600 Speaker 1: bees appear sometimes as vectors for the intentional spread of 297 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:02,360 Speaker 1: a disease like smallpoxox is a big theme in the 298 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:05,320 Speaker 1: X Files. Yeah, but they also sometimes appear as what 299 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 1: appears to be just a direct attack weapons, stinging people 300 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:11,480 Speaker 1: to death. So they you know, they float into town 301 00:16:11,520 --> 00:16:13,800 Speaker 1: and sting the enemies of the conspiracy to death like 302 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:18,640 Speaker 1: this mobile cloud assassin, which is a decent idea. They're multifunctional, 303 00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:21,840 Speaker 1: and I wanted to look into the possibility of using 304 00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:26,000 Speaker 1: bees like this as a weapon in the ways envisioned 305 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:28,040 Speaker 1: in the X file. And this has actually come up. 306 00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:30,360 Speaker 1: You reminded me before we came in here. This has 307 00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:32,400 Speaker 1: come up on stuff to blow your mind before. When 308 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:36,040 Speaker 1: we were talking about wolfsbane and aconite. I guess I 309 00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:39,240 Speaker 1: theorized that you could have a bee pollinate an aconite 310 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:42,720 Speaker 1: flower and and then potentially sting to somebody and spread 311 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 1: the aconite. And we actually had a listener right in 312 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 1: and say that that is absolutely not possible, with a 313 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,320 Speaker 1: good explanation of why they did, and we addressed it 314 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:53,280 Speaker 1: in a listener mail episode. But yeah, so, yeah, there 315 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:56,440 Speaker 1: there are many diseases that are spread by insects. That's 316 00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:00,560 Speaker 1: fairly obvious. Virus is spread by arthur pods or often 317 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:04,399 Speaker 1: known as arbor viruses, and these they tend to be 318 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:08,600 Speaker 1: spread by blood sucking insects that bite or puncture the 319 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:15,160 Speaker 1: host animals skin like mosquito or fleas or lice or ticks. Yeah, uh, 320 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 1: and not by stinging insects like bees. So I would 321 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:22,200 Speaker 1: say that in principle, it doesn't seem impossible to engineer 322 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:24,879 Speaker 1: bees that deliver a virus via their sting. But I 323 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:28,399 Speaker 1: couldn't find any examples of anything like this in the 324 00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 1: real world. And uh, and I couldn't really imagine also 325 00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:37,000 Speaker 1: why this would be done, because just let me back 326 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 1: up and get into it a little bit here, Okay, 327 00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:41,920 Speaker 1: I'm with you. So spreading smallpox is a good way 328 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:44,280 Speaker 1: to kill lots of people if that's your goal, as 329 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:48,479 Speaker 1: as the cigarette smoking man or some other conspiracy commanding figure, 330 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:51,480 Speaker 1: if you want to cause terror havoc can kill millions, 331 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:54,160 Speaker 1: you could You could use a bioweapon. You could spread 332 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: a very deadly germ like small box, the small boxes, 333 00:17:57,359 --> 00:18:01,359 Speaker 1: the very ola virus. It's highly contagious and and it 334 00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:03,600 Speaker 1: and it kills lots of people. I remember reading a 335 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:06,080 Speaker 1: stat that it kills like one in four people who 336 00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:09,720 Speaker 1: get it. So what does Cavelos have to say about 337 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:13,240 Speaker 1: bees and smallpox in her book, Well, she says, you know, 338 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,359 Speaker 1: she's thinking about the question, could be be engineered to 339 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:20,359 Speaker 1: inject a virus like smallpox in its sting? And she 340 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:24,040 Speaker 1: speaks to a doctor w K y'all click and y'all 341 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: click says, basically, scientists can never rule out anything. It's 342 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:32,160 Speaker 1: kind of a vague answer just through the whole thousands 343 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:34,600 Speaker 1: of years worth of research right out the window. But 344 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:38,040 Speaker 1: I guess that's that's an appropriate point with this topic, 345 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:42,000 Speaker 1: because there's nothing. There's nothing that says it would be 346 00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:46,879 Speaker 1: impossible to get a virus into the venom gland be 347 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:50,000 Speaker 1: But it just doesn't seem like it doesn't seem probable. Yeah, 348 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:52,359 Speaker 1: it doesn't seem like the best way to go about 349 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:55,840 Speaker 1: it either. So Cavela speculates the bees and the X 350 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 1: Files are the species APIs smell of Fera scuta lata, 351 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:02,800 Speaker 1: which is the African honey bee, often sometimes known in 352 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,440 Speaker 1: the alarmist press as the killer bees. Yeah, and this 353 00:19:06,520 --> 00:19:08,679 Speaker 1: was right at the height of the X Files. This 354 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:11,920 Speaker 1: was I think when the hysteria about killer bees man 355 00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:14,320 Speaker 1: America was really can you remember this in the at 356 00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:17,200 Speaker 1: least the news stories killer bees. Yeah, they're gonna they're 357 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:19,679 Speaker 1: gonna come and they're gonna I believe they were supposed 358 00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:21,760 Speaker 1: to come up from the South, right, and they're gonna 359 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 1: kill everybody in Texas first or something. Yeah, I think 360 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:26,400 Speaker 1: the the idea is that they were introduced to South 361 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:29,600 Speaker 1: America from Africa, they became an invasive species when they 362 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:33,040 Speaker 1: got loose and they spread up from the south over 363 00:19:33,080 --> 00:19:35,680 Speaker 1: the continent, and that they were they were super dangerous. 364 00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:39,560 Speaker 1: I think that was overstated. They can be dangerous in 365 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:42,959 Speaker 1: that situation. Uh, what I've read is that their venom 366 00:19:43,040 --> 00:19:45,480 Speaker 1: isn't any more dangerous than that of other bees, but 367 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:50,040 Speaker 1: they are reportedly more aggressive in their swarming and stinging behavior. 368 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 1: So they're just more likely to get really worked up 369 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,680 Speaker 1: and keep chasing you in attacking. And that that lines 370 00:19:55,760 --> 00:19:57,600 Speaker 1: up with what we see of like the be attacks 371 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:01,359 Speaker 1: in X files pretty much like like I think I remember, 372 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:03,520 Speaker 1: like somebody walks into a room full of them and 373 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:07,679 Speaker 1: they just all immediately attack with this person, right, And 374 00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:10,520 Speaker 1: so what happens when a bee stings you, Well, there's 375 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:13,439 Speaker 1: one particular type of bee in the colony that stings you. 376 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:16,800 Speaker 1: It's it's not going to be the male drone or 377 00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 1: the queen that's usually stinging you, but the female worker 378 00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: bee and her stinger is a modified ovipositor. So it's 379 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:26,800 Speaker 1: the same organ that in a queen becomes the the 380 00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:30,679 Speaker 1: egg laying organ. But in these in these sterile sisters, 381 00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:33,240 Speaker 1: in the in the sterile worker bees, it turns into 382 00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:37,080 Speaker 1: these barbed needles that stab you as the bee furiously 383 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:40,159 Speaker 1: pumps in venom. And then usually the worker bee dies 384 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:43,920 Speaker 1: after this within a couple of hours, So it's literally 385 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:46,920 Speaker 1: the tiny death. So yeah, you can you can imagine 386 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 1: why it would seem appealing as a as a sort 387 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:53,959 Speaker 1: of infectious agent delivery system because it's literally injecting you 388 00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:56,439 Speaker 1: kind of like a hypodermic needle if somebody wanted to 389 00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 1: inject you with smallpox. Yeah, but bees don't get smallpox, 390 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:04,960 Speaker 1: and even if they did, it probably wouldn't infect you 391 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 1: for a sting because it's not delivering. It's not just 392 00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:10,720 Speaker 1: designed to do that. It delivers the venom. I believe 393 00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:14,359 Speaker 1: this was what the our listener who wrote in about 394 00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:17,000 Speaker 1: the aconite. It's just along the same lines of reasoning 395 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:20,159 Speaker 1: that even if it digested it, it's it's not the 396 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 1: like organ isn't even connected to the rest of its 397 00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 1: uh system. Yeah, so bees are not a good candidate 398 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:30,359 Speaker 1: for delivering smallpox. But that does not mean you can't 399 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:34,920 Speaker 1: use bees as weapons. In fact, there is a fascinating 400 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:38,600 Speaker 1: history of humans doing this very thing. I checked out 401 00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:42,600 Speaker 1: this book called Six Legged Soldiers Using Insects as Weapons 402 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:45,959 Speaker 1: of War by Jeffrey A. Lockwood, and this book is 403 00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:48,520 Speaker 1: really interesting so far. I look forward to reading the 404 00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:53,399 Speaker 1: rest of it. Lockwood chronicles many historical claims of insect warfare, 405 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 1: or to give it an academically respectable name, entomological warfare 406 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:02,320 Speaker 1: e W. And generally. Lockwood mentions that there there are 407 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:05,480 Speaker 1: three basic ways you can use insects to attack people 408 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:09,359 Speaker 1: and and cause havoc. One is what we've been talking about, 409 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 1: the transmission of pathogenic microbes. Throwing bodies with plague ridden 410 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 1: fleas over the walls of a city or something like 411 00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:18,560 Speaker 1: that would be an example there. Or you can use 412 00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:22,080 Speaker 1: them for the destruction of crops and livestock, and that's 413 00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:23,639 Speaker 1: a big one and a lot of people don't think 414 00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:26,200 Speaker 1: about it. Or you can use them methods of destruction. 415 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:27,959 Speaker 1: You can use them for a way they show up 416 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:31,240 Speaker 1: in in the X files. Also just direct attacks on humans, 417 00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:34,480 Speaker 1: you know, sick um bees. And he he notes that 418 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:38,240 Speaker 1: in this last in this last item, just direct attacks 419 00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 1: on humans, bees are pretty good soldiers because when you 420 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:46,240 Speaker 1: think about other war animals like dogs and elephants and horses. 421 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:50,320 Speaker 1: They all, as higher mammals, have a self preservation drive 422 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:54,200 Speaker 1: that makes them, in Lockwood's words, quote, prone to desertion 423 00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:58,119 Speaker 1: in the midst of combat. Yeah, it's the survival instinct. Yeah, 424 00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:01,359 Speaker 1: But a swarm of attacking worker bees does not have 425 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 1: that preservation instinct, and they've evolved in a very different 426 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:09,440 Speaker 1: way from mammals with teeth and claws. Worker bees are sterile. 427 00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:13,840 Speaker 1: They don't reproduce, so they don't particularly value their own survival, 428 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:17,359 Speaker 1: but they viciously attack in defense of the one among 429 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:20,880 Speaker 1: them who can reproduce, the queen. So if something bad 430 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:24,359 Speaker 1: happens to the nest, they will self sacrificially fly out 431 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 1: and attack to protect the queen. So this is interesting 432 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:29,879 Speaker 1: because I just got done working on a piece for 433 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:33,159 Speaker 1: How Stuff Works about how you can epo genetically control ants, 434 00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:36,600 Speaker 1: and when I was talking to the lead researcher on this, 435 00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:39,680 Speaker 1: she was telling me that they're also looking into research 436 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:44,359 Speaker 1: with bees in similar ways. And by using the royal 437 00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 1: jelly that's fed to the queen bees, you can sometimes 438 00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:52,880 Speaker 1: you know, potentially manipulate the bees into thinking they're protecting 439 00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:55,960 Speaker 1: the queen when they're protecting somebody else maybe maybe that's 440 00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: the science behind this. Wow, So this really you really 441 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,800 Speaker 1: could to be army in this way. Theoretically, this is 442 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:06,440 Speaker 1: I don't want to the Well, the researcher I spoke 443 00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 1: to hadn't done this, but she was hypothesizing. It's fun 444 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 1: to dream. Okay. So Lockwood speculates that people throughout prehistory 445 00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:20,720 Speaker 1: possibly used bees as weapons and and he gives the 446 00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:24,960 Speaker 1: example that early human combat might have sometimes involved hurling 447 00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:29,120 Speaker 1: bees nests or wasps nests at a group of enemies. 448 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,480 Speaker 1: So this is like before we figured out fire, it 449 00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 1: was like maybe not fire, but before we had But 450 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:38,760 Speaker 1: I'm just imagining, like, how are we gonna attack them? 451 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,240 Speaker 1: Just grab that pile of bees and throw it at him. Well, 452 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:44,800 Speaker 1: he has some interesting suggestions. So he says this would 453 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:47,120 Speaker 1: be an effective way of say, you have a bunch 454 00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:50,440 Speaker 1: of enemies, an enemy tribe that's hiding inside a cave 455 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:53,439 Speaker 1: or a hut or some enclosure, and you know it's 456 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:56,159 Speaker 1: risky to run in there at them, but what if 457 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:58,760 Speaker 1: you could drive them out by hurling a bees nest 458 00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:03,120 Speaker 1: grenade out. Lockwood notes that there's not much physical evidence 459 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:05,880 Speaker 1: of this, so it remains mostly speculation. Though an interesting 460 00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:08,359 Speaker 1: one to think about what what weapons would have been 461 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:12,800 Speaker 1: available to people in prehistory, And so he's thinking through 462 00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:14,919 Speaker 1: this and he's like, well, you know, with the technology 463 00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:17,360 Speaker 1: available to them at the time, they could have probably 464 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:21,639 Speaker 1: done this by say, harvesting a bee or wasp nest 465 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 1: at night. If they approachiate during the nighttime, the insects 466 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:28,200 Speaker 1: are slowed down by cooler temperatures, or if it's people 467 00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:32,040 Speaker 1: who have mastered fire, they can use smoke to calm 468 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:35,439 Speaker 1: the bees, and then they could insert the bees into 469 00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:38,760 Speaker 1: a woven basket or sack and then just kind of 470 00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:44,000 Speaker 1: like throw it open inside the enemy's cave exactly. Or 471 00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:48,560 Speaker 1: you could plug the openings up with mud or grass. Okay, wow, 472 00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,520 Speaker 1: that probably wouldn't kill the people that you're attacking, but 473 00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:55,640 Speaker 1: it would be well maybe unless there are these pekiller 474 00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,080 Speaker 1: bees that were speaking about earlier, but well maybe, But 475 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:01,159 Speaker 1: a lot of times the point of using bees as 476 00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:05,840 Speaker 1: direct attack is not to kill the enemy because election 477 00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 1: but yeah, it's sort of it's a terrorizing or terrifying idea. 478 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:14,560 Speaker 1: You know, it depresses the enemy, it causes fear, panic, 479 00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:18,440 Speaker 1: and and it causes bad tactical maneuvers. I'll get into 480 00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:20,439 Speaker 1: that in just a second. I believe that this is 481 00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: something that you can do in that video game BioShock. Yes, 482 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure, right, yeah, you can throw bees at 483 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:28,920 Speaker 1: your enemy and then they all start panicking. So once 484 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:32,280 Speaker 1: historians start making records of ancient warfare into mo logical 485 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,960 Speaker 1: warfare definitely appears on the scene, including bees and wasps. 486 00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:41,040 Speaker 1: For example, Lockwood says that the Tiv people of Nigeria 487 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,719 Speaker 1: developed what he refers to as a bee canon. So 488 00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:48,520 Speaker 1: this was bees loaded into a large hollow horn which 489 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:51,120 Speaker 1: could be pointed facing the enemy in battle and then 490 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 1: shake into release swarms in the opposing forces direction. And 491 00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:57,840 Speaker 1: according to a book I found called World History of 492 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:01,600 Speaker 1: Bee Keeping and Honey Hunting by Ava Rain, it's also 493 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,720 Speaker 1: suggested that if if the enemies were close enough, the 494 00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:08,600 Speaker 1: Tiv soldiers would try to pour sweet smelling powder on 495 00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:11,280 Speaker 1: their enemies, and the idea was that this would attract 496 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:16,000 Speaker 1: the bees. Okay, Another really interesting ancient use of this 497 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:20,520 Speaker 1: is that Lockwood mentions that in the Mayan sacred text 498 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:24,359 Speaker 1: popel Vu, it tells of a Mayan battle strategy that 499 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:28,000 Speaker 1: involved building a fake warrior dummy with a head made 500 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,879 Speaker 1: out of a hollow gourd covered with a head dress, 501 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,000 Speaker 1: and when the enemy rushed in and smashed the heads 502 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 1: of these dummies, they would discover not only that they 503 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:39,879 Speaker 1: were not real people, they were traps. The hollow gourd 504 00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,280 Speaker 1: heads were filled with stinging insects, either wasps or bees, 505 00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:46,439 Speaker 1: and then they just angrily swarm out an attack. This 506 00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,280 Speaker 1: would cause a chaotic retreat, and during the route the 507 00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:51,959 Speaker 1: Mayan warriors would run in and fall upon the fleeing 508 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:55,000 Speaker 1: enemy and destroy them. So a cigarette smoking man, a 509 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:59,119 Speaker 1: student of history, this is where he proposed the great 510 00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:02,840 Speaker 1: usage of bees for the alien invasion. Well, you know, 511 00:28:02,920 --> 00:28:05,159 Speaker 1: the X Files is one of the earliest examples I 512 00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 1: can think of of people talking uh tying government conspiracies 513 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:13,199 Speaker 1: into the the end of the Mayan long Calendar, you know, 514 00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:16,560 Speaker 1: which they supposedly said it was in two thousand twelve. Yeah. Yeah, 515 00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:20,520 Speaker 1: And we've talked about bees before on on the show 516 00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:22,679 Speaker 1: Brain Stuff that you and I both write for. There 517 00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:25,600 Speaker 1: was an episode that our colleague Lauren Vogelbaum did that 518 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: was about colony collapse disorder, and I'd be curious how 519 00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:35,520 Speaker 1: you might people to incorporate that into X Files conspiracy mythos. 520 00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:38,760 Speaker 1: Uh Yeah, I'm sure I bet it will show up 521 00:28:38,760 --> 00:28:41,040 Speaker 1: in the new series. Maybe what do you want to 522 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,719 Speaker 1: be let's put money to Well, we'll find out if 523 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,400 Speaker 1: it does. We'll find out in two weeks, right, So 524 00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:50,200 Speaker 1: a couple more interesting facts about bees in the ancient world. 525 00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:54,719 Speaker 1: The ancient Greek military writer a Neus Tacticus wrote in 526 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:58,440 Speaker 1: an influential work in the fourth century b c. Called 527 00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:01,960 Speaker 1: How to Survive under Siege, which sounds like a good read. 528 00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 1: That's a that's a surviving watching that Stephen Sagal movie. Touche. 529 00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:12,120 Speaker 1: Uh No, No, he gives this cool tactics. So he says, 530 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:14,200 Speaker 1: if you're in a city this under siege and the 531 00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 1: army outside is digging tunnels under your walls to get 532 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:20,680 Speaker 1: into the city, you should you should meet the tunnels 533 00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 1: and chuck some bees and wasps down into the tunnels 534 00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 1: with the enemy soldiers. These guys just have bees like 535 00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:29,440 Speaker 1: at the ready. Though it seems like like they've just 536 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:31,560 Speaker 1: got like pockets full of bees. Well they did it 537 00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:35,120 Speaker 1: first because another thing that Lockwood points out in his 538 00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 1: book is that the Romans used bee hives as a 539 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,760 Speaker 1: common catapult payload. So they put beehives in a catapult 540 00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:44,880 Speaker 1: and then throw it at enemy fortifications, and he says 541 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:46,680 Speaker 1: that they did it so much that it might have 542 00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:50,400 Speaker 1: contributed to a documented decline in the number of bee 543 00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:53,000 Speaker 1: hives found in the Roman Empire towards the end the 544 00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,479 Speaker 1: late period in the Empire. Well, you can't say they 545 00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 1: weren't creative. But to bring it back to smallpox, if 546 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:01,959 Speaker 1: we're talking about warfare today, just using bees as direct 547 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 1: attack weapons is not going to be especially powerful compared 548 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,600 Speaker 1: to lots of other things you could do. A violent, 549 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 1: terrorizing attack you can do with bullets, bombs, poison gas, 550 00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:16,240 Speaker 1: and other chemical weapons. The only reason I can imagine 551 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:19,280 Speaker 1: a modern conspiracy would want to use bees as a 552 00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:23,000 Speaker 1: direct attack weapon is maybe just for effect, because it's 553 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:27,120 Speaker 1: like a weird and frightening image to hurt enemy morale. Yeah, well, 554 00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:29,480 Speaker 1: I mean I think in the X Files, the idea 555 00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:31,560 Speaker 1: was that it was something that you just wouldn't even 556 00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:35,120 Speaker 1: suspect was a weapon, Right, that's kind of part of it. Uh, 557 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,280 Speaker 1: they're all around us man, Yeah exactly. Or that you'd 558 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,440 Speaker 1: already been stung and infected with the smallpox virus and 559 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:44,520 Speaker 1: you didn't even know it. Uh, yeah, I don't know. Uh, 560 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:47,440 Speaker 1: it sounds to me, like, based on what you've what 561 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:49,400 Speaker 1: you've said that it would have been far more effective 562 00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 1: for them to just use mosquitoes exactly right, Yeah, I 563 00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:53,640 Speaker 1: think it would be much more effective if they were 564 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 1: going to try to engineer an insect delivered weapon against 565 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,520 Speaker 1: the people of Earth. It would make much more to 566 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:04,040 Speaker 1: use mosquitoes or fleas as a disease vector, or to 567 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:09,320 Speaker 1: introduce a crop destroying pest like you know, locusts or 568 00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:11,920 Speaker 1: med flies or something to just ruin all of our 569 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:15,280 Speaker 1: food crops. And so if you're the cigarette smoking man, 570 00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:22,719 Speaker 1: that is the more fruitful pun intended avenue of attack. Okay, well, 571 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:25,920 Speaker 1: why don't we take this opportunity to take a break, 572 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 1: and when we come back, we're going to talk about 573 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:32,320 Speaker 1: one of the one of the most disturbing episodes of 574 00:31:32,360 --> 00:31:34,800 Speaker 1: The X Files that I've ever seen and I think 575 00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:46,640 Speaker 1: happened in the show's history. Okay, we're back. So we 576 00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 1: are going to talk about very briefly, the episode of 577 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:54,360 Speaker 1: The X Files called Home. Now, if you haven't seen 578 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,560 Speaker 1: this one, it's I would say it's the darkest episode 579 00:31:57,560 --> 00:31:59,840 Speaker 1: of The X Files I've ever seen. Oh, it was 580 00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:03,520 Speaker 1: so disturbing. I mean, there are parts of it that 581 00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:06,320 Speaker 1: are kind of funny in retrospect, but when you're actually 582 00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:09,080 Speaker 1: watching it, it is messed up. It is like, it's 583 00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:14,000 Speaker 1: like they let the Texas Chainsaw Massacre uncensored onto network television. Well, 584 00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:16,800 Speaker 1: one of the things I love about about this episode 585 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:19,680 Speaker 1: is that, yeah, it's definitely influenced by Texas Chainsaw Massacre, 586 00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:21,440 Speaker 1: which is too bad Robert doesn't hear with us because 587 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:23,920 Speaker 1: we know that's one of his favorite movies. But also 588 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:27,880 Speaker 1: that you don't actually see any of the violence. It's 589 00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:30,840 Speaker 1: all implied, it's all off camera, but it is. It 590 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 1: just it is shot in such a way that it 591 00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:36,160 Speaker 1: sticks in your head and your imagination fills in the blanks. 592 00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:40,720 Speaker 1: I think Fox actually apologized for this episode, right, Yeah, 593 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:43,040 Speaker 1: I didn't like it was so disturbing that after they 594 00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:45,120 Speaker 1: aired it, they were like, are bad, We're never going 595 00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:47,840 Speaker 1: to do that again. Well, so, the essential premise of 596 00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 1: Home is that I don't even remember where they are 597 00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:53,640 Speaker 1: what stayed there, and I guess it doesn't matter. But 598 00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:57,000 Speaker 1: there's this uh family that lives off sort of in 599 00:32:57,000 --> 00:33:00,080 Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere in this small town, and and 600 00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:02,480 Speaker 1: it turns out that they are all the children of 601 00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:07,920 Speaker 1: closely related parents who have a high incident of genetic disease. Right, 602 00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:11,560 Speaker 1: so they're all kind of like, uh, well, they're all 603 00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:16,560 Speaker 1: ancestral relatives, but they're also sort of crazy and it's 604 00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:19,880 Speaker 1: unclear like how they're all related in some ways. Right, Yeah, 605 00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:22,360 Speaker 1: I think this is playing on the old trope that 606 00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:27,120 Speaker 1: if you know, if closely related relatives reproduced together, that 607 00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 1: their offspring will will be messed up in one way 608 00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:34,360 Speaker 1: or another. Well so, yeah, so Cavelos actually like took 609 00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:37,080 Speaker 1: a look at this because Home is one of those 610 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:39,560 Speaker 1: pretty I would say it's like one of those up 611 00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:43,240 Speaker 1: there popular best of episodes of the X Files. Whenever 612 00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:45,240 Speaker 1: you look at those lists of like top ten, top 613 00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:47,920 Speaker 1: twenty episodes, I think a lot of people just enjoy 614 00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:51,080 Speaker 1: the perversity of the idea that an episode like this 615 00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:54,320 Speaker 1: was aired on Fox in the I I have to 616 00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:57,040 Speaker 1: say that I really enjoyed it, you know, recently watching it, 617 00:33:57,080 --> 00:33:59,960 Speaker 1: I think it holds up to any of our model 618 00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:02,880 Speaker 1: in horror movies, even you know, twenty years later. But 619 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:06,560 Speaker 1: um so Cavelos looks at this and she finds that, yeah, 620 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: when you have related couples, each of them carry the 621 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:13,759 Speaker 1: same negative recessive traits, right, which makes the chance that 622 00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:20,280 Speaker 1: their child will inherit two copies of those traits even higher. Right. So, 623 00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 1: at the time this was in when Cavelos wrote the book, 624 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:29,160 Speaker 1: eleven point seven percent of offspring from first cousin marriages 625 00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:33,360 Speaker 1: have a physical defect or had a physical defect, whereas 626 00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:37,759 Speaker 1: eight point five percent of unre related couples, people who 627 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:42,239 Speaker 1: you know, were not cousins or brothers, sister u had 628 00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:45,600 Speaker 1: these similar physical defects. Okay, so that seems like the 629 00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:49,640 Speaker 1: difference isn't actually all that huge, yeah, exactly. But she 630 00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,799 Speaker 1: goes on twenty percent of children that are born from incest, 631 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:59,319 Speaker 1: so father daughter relationships or brothers sister relationships die in childhood, 632 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:04,040 Speaker 1: and thirty three percent suffered disabilities. So it seems somewhere 633 00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:07,440 Speaker 1: along there that there's a there's a discrepancy between the 634 00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:11,279 Speaker 1: definition of a physical defect and disability, right, because the 635 00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:14,080 Speaker 1: percentages are a little different. Those are probably not the 636 00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:16,840 Speaker 1: terms that we would use today to be sensitive about. 637 00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:19,799 Speaker 1: I agree, Yeah, that's what's used in the literature of 638 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:22,879 Speaker 1: the time, exactly. And and too she calls out too, 639 00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:27,719 Speaker 1: in particular Mechel Gruber and new Lexova syndrome, and they're 640 00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:29,879 Speaker 1: both mentioned in the episode. I believe there's a scene 641 00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:32,680 Speaker 1: where they find this is gruesome. In the episode, they 642 00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:36,759 Speaker 1: find a dead baby I think, right, and Scully is 643 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:39,120 Speaker 1: like testing it and she just finds that it's got 644 00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:42,960 Speaker 1: all of these UH diseases, all these genetic diseases inside 645 00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:45,560 Speaker 1: and just say something like it's got like every every 646 00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:49,560 Speaker 1: every inherited disease you can have or something. Um. So, 647 00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,720 Speaker 1: both of those mechel Gruber and new Lexova are caused 648 00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:56,200 Speaker 1: by recessive genetic traits and this you know, the traits. 649 00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:59,520 Speaker 1: Traits that go along with this include small malformed heads 650 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:03,080 Speaker 1: and actually missing parts of the brain or spinal cord. 651 00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:05,439 Speaker 1: And there are even some cases where there's a skin 652 00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:07,960 Speaker 1: covered sack on the back of the head that has 653 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,120 Speaker 1: a malformed portion of the brain in it, along with 654 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:14,640 Speaker 1: deformed limbs. And that kind of lines up with what 655 00:36:14,719 --> 00:36:18,320 Speaker 1: we saw of the little the baby monster that they find, 656 00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:22,920 Speaker 1: and that's dug up right, the actual UH. I guess 657 00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:28,440 Speaker 1: family and home are human looking, right, Well. I wanted 658 00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:30,000 Speaker 1: to take a look into this and see how it 659 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:33,600 Speaker 1: lined up with today's numbers. And there's a great article 660 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:36,920 Speaker 1: over on Ion nine that's called why in breeding really 661 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:40,439 Speaker 1: isn't as bad as you think it is. I gotta 662 00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:44,280 Speaker 1: love Ionine with those headlines types that's clicking. Yeah, um, 663 00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:47,719 Speaker 1: so they said, and this was relatively recently. I want 664 00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:49,840 Speaker 1: to say, in the last two or three years, cousins 665 00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:53,360 Speaker 1: breeding go from a point one percent chance to a 666 00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:58,600 Speaker 1: twenty chance of a genetic disease like cystic fibrosis. So 667 00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:01,840 Speaker 1: I think that this is what cystic fibrosis is probably 668 00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:04,560 Speaker 1: what Cavellos was referring to back in the nineties as 669 00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:09,400 Speaker 1: quote physical defect right, um, and that's very different from 670 00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:12,600 Speaker 1: the numbers above. Uh. They also cite in that piece 671 00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:15,560 Speaker 1: that there's a guy named Alan Biddles at Australia's Murdock 672 00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:20,440 Speaker 1: University and he specifically studies incestual birth defects. He studied 673 00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:22,920 Speaker 1: it for thirty years. Can you imagine that that's your 674 00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:25,040 Speaker 1: line of study. You go to work every morning and 675 00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:28,520 Speaker 1: you're looking at that. He says, he's the expert on this. 676 00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:32,200 Speaker 1: He says, there's a two percent risk of birth defects 677 00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:36,680 Speaker 1: in the general population, okay, but there's a four percent 678 00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:41,440 Speaker 1: chance in first cousin relationships, so you automatically say two 679 00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:45,520 Speaker 1: for okay, So there's double the risk of birth defects, right, Well, 680 00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:47,400 Speaker 1: or you could look at it the other way, is 681 00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:49,640 Speaker 1: what they say in this ion Ion article that there's 682 00:37:49,680 --> 00:37:53,120 Speaker 1: only a nineties six percent chance that these children are 683 00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:56,480 Speaker 1: born healthy. Right, So maybe it depends on how you 684 00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:58,600 Speaker 1: look at It's like a cup half empty, half full 685 00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:02,839 Speaker 1: kind of thing, right. Um, So of children born from 686 00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:07,480 Speaker 1: first cousin relationships are just fine. But biddles found that 687 00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:11,200 Speaker 1: only one point two percent of them suffered from an 688 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:15,200 Speaker 1: increase in infant mortality rates. So that's significantly lower than 689 00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:19,439 Speaker 1: what Cavellos was reporting back in the nineties. Huh yeah, um, 690 00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 1: And this is a good opportunity for us to bring 691 00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:26,640 Speaker 1: up what a chimera is. Be familiar with this from mythology, 692 00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:30,160 Speaker 1: the chimera. The chimera, well, I mean the chimera I 693 00:38:30,200 --> 00:38:35,000 Speaker 1: believe combines different types of animals into the same animal. Yeah, 694 00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:37,480 Speaker 1: it's a good D and D monster. It's a part lion, 695 00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:40,880 Speaker 1: park goat, and part dragon. But in the scientific sense, 696 00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:43,440 Speaker 1: it's a it's a genetic condition, right, the exactly you've 697 00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:48,759 Speaker 1: you've incorporated the genome of multiple different individuals into one body. 698 00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:52,120 Speaker 1: It's an organism that has two different sets of DNA 699 00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:57,520 Speaker 1: usually originating from the fusion of different zygoats or eggs. Yeah, 700 00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:00,640 Speaker 1: that's basically how you defined it. And and it's important 701 00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:05,000 Speaker 1: to denote here a chimera in a human chimera is 702 00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:08,319 Speaker 1: not to be mistaken for a mosaic. A mosaic is 703 00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:12,359 Speaker 1: when an organism contains different populations of cells from a 704 00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:15,520 Speaker 1: single zygot or egg. It's also not a hybrid. And 705 00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:17,279 Speaker 1: this is important because we're gonna talk a lot about 706 00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:21,520 Speaker 1: hybrids later and chimeras will come up again. Hybrids contain 707 00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:26,640 Speaker 1: genetically identical cells from two different species. Okay, So the 708 00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:29,799 Speaker 1: reason I bring this up is Cavelos talks about the possibility, 709 00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:34,040 Speaker 1: well maybe, uh, maybe all of this ancestual relationship in 710 00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:37,359 Speaker 1: the family and home led to them being chimeras. So 711 00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:42,160 Speaker 1: they have the tissues of multiple genotypes. Uh. And and 712 00:39:42,239 --> 00:39:43,920 Speaker 1: so there's this idea that they've got the DNA of 713 00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:47,080 Speaker 1: two different people. Uh. And it's possible that a fertilized 714 00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:51,160 Speaker 1: twin egg was absorbed by its sibling uh And that 715 00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:54,560 Speaker 1: these can then incorporate twins of different sexes. Right, So 716 00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:58,000 Speaker 1: you could be a male twin of a female twin. 717 00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:01,640 Speaker 1: You could absorb your female twin and Cavelas actually talks 718 00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:05,720 Speaker 1: about instances where this has happened and the person grows 719 00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:10,320 Speaker 1: up and they find part like reproductive organs and weird 720 00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:13,879 Speaker 1: places inside their bodies from a totally different gender than 721 00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:17,799 Speaker 1: what they they were born to. H Yeah, so who knows, 722 00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:20,000 Speaker 1: maybe that's something that was going on with the home 723 00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:25,160 Speaker 1: people in there. They're crazy Texas Chainsaw Masca Ranch. Okay, 724 00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:26,680 Speaker 1: now I think it's time for us to take a 725 00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:28,880 Speaker 1: quick break to hear from our sponsor. But when we 726 00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:32,040 Speaker 1: come back, we will be going into the depths of 727 00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:39,920 Speaker 1: the human mind. You know, there's one great resolution you 728 00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:42,080 Speaker 1: can make for the new year, and that's to maximize 729 00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:46,040 Speaker 1: every minute and every dollar for your small business. Now 730 00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:48,200 Speaker 1: we actually know an easy way to do that, and 731 00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:51,479 Speaker 1: it's stamps dot com. So just think about how much 732 00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:54,880 Speaker 1: time you have wasted going to the post office, driving 733 00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:58,919 Speaker 1: their finding parking, fighting eagles in the parking lot. It's 734 00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:01,920 Speaker 1: just crazy. Stamps dot com is a better way to 735 00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:04,960 Speaker 1: get postage. Just use what you already have, your own 736 00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:07,759 Speaker 1: computer and your own printer, and that's all you need 737 00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:11,320 Speaker 1: to get official US postage for any letter in any package, 738 00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:13,880 Speaker 1: and the mail carrier picks it right up. Takes it away. 739 00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:16,600 Speaker 1: It really works, and it's that easy. And right now 740 00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:18,920 Speaker 1: you can sign up for stamps dot com and use 741 00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:22,319 Speaker 1: our promo code stuff for this special offer. It's a 742 00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:25,680 Speaker 1: four week trial plus a hundred and ten dollar bonus 743 00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:30,120 Speaker 1: offer that includes postage and the digital scale. So don't wait. 744 00:41:30,280 --> 00:41:32,960 Speaker 1: Go to stamps dot com before you do anything else. 745 00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,800 Speaker 1: Click on the microphone at the top of their homepage 746 00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:38,560 Speaker 1: and type in stuff. That's s t U f F. 747 00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:41,840 Speaker 1: We don't spell it differently here that's stamps dot com 748 00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:49,879 Speaker 1: enter stuff. Okay, we're back. So Joe, I gotta ask you, 749 00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:53,719 Speaker 1: after going over home and the science behind incest and 750 00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:56,120 Speaker 1: birth defects, is there any way that I can just 751 00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:59,120 Speaker 1: scrub my mind clean of this? Is? Can I forget, 752 00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:03,640 Speaker 1: just push this out of my head? Nope? Probably not really. 753 00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:06,799 Speaker 1: But if if you're I've seen this many times on 754 00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:09,000 Speaker 1: the TV show are you Are you sure? This is 755 00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:11,920 Speaker 1: one of my favorite things that happens on the TV show. Okay, 756 00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:16,560 Speaker 1: So imagine somebody wakes up in a field and they've 757 00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:19,680 Speaker 1: got this field where lay no, the field where you died? 758 00:42:19,760 --> 00:42:22,399 Speaker 1: O the fielder I died? Yeah, that was really bad 759 00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:26,239 Speaker 1: X files joke. They wake up in center field on 760 00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:29,080 Speaker 1: on a baseball stadium. Uh. And they wake up and 761 00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:31,640 Speaker 1: they've got some missing time. They've got a problem. Oh no, 762 00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:34,319 Speaker 1: some time disappeared from my life and I and I 763 00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:36,719 Speaker 1: can't figure out what happened. I have no memory of it. 764 00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:40,080 Speaker 1: What is Mulder recommend? Well, I'm gonna go with the 765 00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:44,279 Speaker 1: regression hypnosis. That's right, Thank god, I have deeper regression hypnosis. 766 00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:46,960 Speaker 1: I'm still only catching up. I'm up to the beginning 767 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:51,040 Speaker 1: of the fifth season and he's already done this four times. Uh, 768 00:42:51,280 --> 00:42:54,359 Speaker 1: and that's per Those are four episodes, I want to say. 769 00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:56,560 Speaker 1: In jose Chunks from Outer Space, it's at least three 770 00:42:56,560 --> 00:42:59,040 Speaker 1: times in that episode he does it. Yeah. And jose Chungs, 771 00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:02,200 Speaker 1: which is probably my favorite episode, hose Chungs from Outer Space, 772 00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:05,640 Speaker 1: he does it to the same girl at least three times. 773 00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:10,560 Speaker 1: And so what what is the idea of regression hypnosis? Well, 774 00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:14,120 Speaker 1: as depicted in the episodes, and we're going to distinguish 775 00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:16,640 Speaker 1: between what happens on the X Files and what might 776 00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:20,200 Speaker 1: happen in real life. On the episodes, you've got a 777 00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:25,040 Speaker 1: hypnotist or some kind of therapist who practices hypnotism, who 778 00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:28,879 Speaker 1: puts somebody into a hypnotized state, so they'll tell them 779 00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:32,040 Speaker 1: to relax and and say some kind of like patterns 780 00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:35,640 Speaker 1: of words that put them into an altered state of consciousness, 781 00:43:36,200 --> 00:43:40,080 Speaker 1: and then the person gets kind of dreamy and starts 782 00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:44,359 Speaker 1: remembering things. Wait a minute, they in the hypnotist says 783 00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:48,160 Speaker 1: where are you now? And the person under hypnosis says, 784 00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:51,680 Speaker 1: I'm being lifted up above the ground and I'm floating 785 00:43:51,719 --> 00:43:55,040 Speaker 1: through walls in a spacecraft and I'm laying there while 786 00:43:55,120 --> 00:43:58,799 Speaker 1: the aliens do experiments on me. And this is what 787 00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:01,040 Speaker 1: happens in the show pre Beviously, this person had no 788 00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:05,399 Speaker 1: memory of an event, and then suddenly, by being hypnotized, 789 00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:08,920 Speaker 1: they have access to memories that weren't available to them 790 00:44:08,960 --> 00:44:12,640 Speaker 1: consciously before. Yeah. This is um connected to the Satanic 791 00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:14,640 Speaker 1: panic that was happening around the eighties as well as 792 00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:16,879 Speaker 1: the same kind of thing. Robert and I talked about 793 00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:18,759 Speaker 1: it in the episode we did on Satanic Panic. I 794 00:44:18,760 --> 00:44:24,160 Speaker 1: believe the book that popularized this was called Michelle Remembers, Yeah, 795 00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:26,640 Speaker 1: and it very much the same idea, except for instead 796 00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:31,040 Speaker 1: of aliens, it was demon worshippers. Nice. So, in the 797 00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:34,759 Speaker 1: early nineteen nineties, when Chris Carter was first developing the 798 00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:37,720 Speaker 1: idea of the X files. He got into the work 799 00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:43,359 Speaker 1: of the Harvard psychiatrist John E. Mac, And Johnny Mac 800 00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:47,000 Speaker 1: was deep into the study of alien abductee experiences at 801 00:44:47,040 --> 00:44:48,320 Speaker 1: the time. I think he got into it in the 802 00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:52,160 Speaker 1: nineteen eighties. So Mac worked personally with more than two 803 00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:57,000 Speaker 1: hundred different people who claimed to have experiences of alien abductions. 804 00:44:57,080 --> 00:45:00,319 Speaker 1: He interviewed them and he tried to understand with their 805 00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:05,239 Speaker 1: experiences and the effect of abduction experiences on personality, consciousness, 806 00:45:05,239 --> 00:45:11,760 Speaker 1: and worldview. And the interesting thing is altruistic, I guess. So. Uh. 807 00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:15,960 Speaker 1: Mac was a respected academic and psychiatrist before he embarked 808 00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:18,919 Speaker 1: on this alien abduction research. So he wasn't. He wasn't 809 00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:21,520 Speaker 1: somebody people thought of as a kuk, at least not 810 00:45:21,600 --> 00:45:25,760 Speaker 1: before this. But his work drew a lot of controversy. 811 00:45:26,040 --> 00:45:29,680 Speaker 1: He was even investigated by the Harvard medical faculty at 812 00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:31,760 Speaker 1: one point, who were afraid that he was causing harm 813 00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:35,440 Speaker 1: to his patients by confirming the reality of their delusions. 814 00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:40,359 Speaker 1: So so what was his attitude really too? Yeah, yeah 815 00:45:40,360 --> 00:45:43,520 Speaker 1: it was. It was he just like a shyster or no, 816 00:45:43,680 --> 00:45:45,960 Speaker 1: I don't get that since at all, But he but 817 00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:49,600 Speaker 1: he also it's hard to pin down exactly to what 818 00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:53,480 Speaker 1: extent he believed in the reality of the alien abductions. 819 00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:57,200 Speaker 1: For example, he gave a quote to the BBC where 820 00:45:57,239 --> 00:46:00,320 Speaker 1: he it sounds like he's trying to avoid the hurance 821 00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:04,200 Speaker 1: of having gone full Molder, so he he says, he says, 822 00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:08,160 Speaker 1: I would never say, yes, there are aliens talking to people, 823 00:46:08,760 --> 00:46:12,200 Speaker 1: but I would say there's a compelling, powerful phenomenon here 824 00:46:12,239 --> 00:46:15,759 Speaker 1: that I can't account for in any other way. That's mysterious. 825 00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:18,440 Speaker 1: Yet I can't know what it is, but it seems 826 00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:22,120 Speaker 1: to me that it invites deeper, further inquiry. So I mean, 827 00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:25,000 Speaker 1: that's a respectable point of view. I guess you're just saying, like, well, 828 00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:28,360 Speaker 1: here's an interesting phenomenon. Lots of people claim to have 829 00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:31,160 Speaker 1: experienced something I don't really understand, and I don't know. 830 00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:34,000 Speaker 1: I've said this before in the Satanic Panic episode and 831 00:46:34,040 --> 00:46:36,319 Speaker 1: other episodes where we talk about people having kind of 832 00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:40,480 Speaker 1: out of body experiences as such. Uh that it's not 833 00:46:40,520 --> 00:46:44,320 Speaker 1: that I don't believe, but I do believe that they believe. 834 00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:46,719 Speaker 1: You know, in a lot of situations, it's so real 835 00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:48,960 Speaker 1: for them it doesn't matter whether it was real or 836 00:46:49,280 --> 00:46:53,720 Speaker 1: not it's it's affecting them regardless. But despite that quote, 837 00:46:53,760 --> 00:46:56,799 Speaker 1: I've read in other places, and I've seen videos of 838 00:46:56,880 --> 00:47:00,560 Speaker 1: Mac talking like on on TV interviews and IT conferences 839 00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:03,600 Speaker 1: where he kind of comes off as committing a little 840 00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:06,800 Speaker 1: more to the reality of alien abductions than that quote 841 00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:09,239 Speaker 1: would lead you to believe. So it seems like he 842 00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:12,200 Speaker 1: he was sort of presenting maybe some different kind of 843 00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:15,759 Speaker 1: levels of confidence in the reality of alien abductions at 844 00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:19,520 Speaker 1: different times. So back to Chris Carter. Chris Carter, of course, 845 00:47:19,800 --> 00:47:25,239 Speaker 1: I don't know if we established he created the X Files. Yeah, 846 00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:28,520 Speaker 1: And so Carter claims that in the early nineties, Mac 847 00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:32,800 Speaker 1: invited him to sit in on a regression hypnosis session 848 00:47:33,320 --> 00:47:36,680 Speaker 1: with somebody who claimed to have had an alien abduction experience, 849 00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,720 Speaker 1: and Carter found this experience very disturbing. It really stuck 850 00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,239 Speaker 1: with him what he saw, and I'm sure inspired a 851 00:47:43,239 --> 00:47:45,000 Speaker 1: lot of these things and the X Files where we 852 00:47:45,080 --> 00:47:49,360 Speaker 1: see people undergo regression hypnosis. But but what was regression 853 00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:53,680 Speaker 1: hypnosis really as practiced by Mac and the people who 854 00:47:53,840 --> 00:47:57,200 Speaker 1: endorsed it. Well, Mac wrote a book. It was called 855 00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:01,360 Speaker 1: Abduction Human Encounters with Aliens, and in max own words, 856 00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:05,640 Speaker 1: it quote describes a clinical map of the abduction territory. 857 00:48:05,760 --> 00:48:07,520 Speaker 1: And I read through some parts of the book to 858 00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:10,120 Speaker 1: see what mac had to say about the experiences, and 859 00:48:10,160 --> 00:48:13,400 Speaker 1: he sort of describes typical features of his interviews with 860 00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:17,600 Speaker 1: adductees or experiencers as he likes to call them. And 861 00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:20,640 Speaker 1: while I think he maintained that the majority of his 862 00:48:20,680 --> 00:48:24,080 Speaker 1: research was based on sort of standard face to face conversation, 863 00:48:24,160 --> 00:48:28,640 Speaker 1: just talking to people, interviews, conscious memories, he did employ 864 00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:32,680 Speaker 1: the use of regression hypnosis to get new details. He 865 00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:35,080 Speaker 1: liked to call it instead of hypnosis, he called them 866 00:48:35,160 --> 00:48:39,359 Speaker 1: relaxation exercises. So he describes that this was like where 867 00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:41,840 Speaker 1: he'd he'd go through a series of patterns where he 868 00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:46,080 Speaker 1: encouraged the subject to focus on breathing and relax all 869 00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:49,320 Speaker 1: the parts of the body and visualize a safe space, 870 00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:52,520 Speaker 1: and then have the subject mentally returned to that safe 871 00:48:52,520 --> 00:48:56,160 Speaker 1: space periodically. Sounds like yoga. That sounds like shivasana, what 872 00:48:56,239 --> 00:48:58,320 Speaker 1: I do after I cool down after a yoga session. 873 00:48:58,400 --> 00:49:01,160 Speaker 1: You know, I've noticed before some some mimilarities between what 874 00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:05,360 Speaker 1: people describe from the experience of hypnosis and what people 875 00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:09,920 Speaker 1: describe experiences of yoga or meditation, And so there seemed 876 00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:13,799 Speaker 1: to be some similarities there, and maybe in introducing very 877 00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:18,600 Speaker 1: mildly altered states of consciousness just by intentional relaxation of 878 00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:22,319 Speaker 1: the body and the mind. Yeah, and so anyway back 879 00:49:22,320 --> 00:49:25,759 Speaker 1: to mac during the session, once he got people into 880 00:49:25,760 --> 00:49:30,560 Speaker 1: these relaxation exercises, he would attempt to help the patient regress, 881 00:49:30,600 --> 00:49:34,160 Speaker 1: to go back into memories that have been repressed by 882 00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:38,360 Speaker 1: the conscious mind and recover new details, like what what 883 00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:41,080 Speaker 1: are we recovering here? Because I keep thinking about this. 884 00:49:41,760 --> 00:49:44,319 Speaker 1: Are you familiar with the comedian Kyle Kanane. No, well, 885 00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:46,560 Speaker 1: I've heard the name. He's one of my favorite comedians 886 00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:48,759 Speaker 1: that he is. His latest album, he has this bit 887 00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:51,840 Speaker 1: where he talks about repressed memories and using hypnosis to 888 00:49:51,880 --> 00:49:54,480 Speaker 1: bring them back, and he jokes because he's like, I 889 00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:56,759 Speaker 1: wish I could repress memories. He says something on the 890 00:49:56,800 --> 00:50:00,400 Speaker 1: lines of, oh you can repress memories. Tell me how, wizard? 891 00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:03,279 Speaker 1: So I want to I want to know what are they? 892 00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:05,319 Speaker 1: What are they bringing back up? Other than well, I mean, 893 00:50:05,360 --> 00:50:09,520 Speaker 1: the idea of repressed memories goes way back in in psychology. 894 00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:12,920 Speaker 1: I mean, Freud talked about repression of of memories. You 895 00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:15,640 Speaker 1: know that you would you would hide memories of traumatic 896 00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:19,279 Speaker 1: childhood experiences that really influenced who you are. But I 897 00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:21,640 Speaker 1: think you didn't have to be like a strict Freudy 898 00:50:21,719 --> 00:50:25,560 Speaker 1: and to believe in repressed memories. I'm not sure how 899 00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:28,360 Speaker 1: much science there is behind the idea of a repressed 900 00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:32,359 Speaker 1: memory now. I think that's highly debated. But anyway, what 901 00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:35,120 Speaker 1: Max said he would do is that he claimed the 902 00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:38,520 Speaker 1: value of regression and hypnosis is not necessarily to get 903 00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:43,680 Speaker 1: people to recall like whole experiences that they never otherwise remembered, 904 00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:46,640 Speaker 1: but to sort of flesh out the details have already 905 00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:50,600 Speaker 1: established memories, and also for therapeutic purpose. We've seen this 906 00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:53,480 Speaker 1: on plenty of television shows before, Like you were in 907 00:50:53,520 --> 00:50:55,920 Speaker 1: a bank when it was robbed, but you couldn't at 908 00:50:55,960 --> 00:50:59,160 Speaker 1: the time, you didn't necessarily pay attention to all the 909 00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:02,040 Speaker 1: details of what certain people were wearing. But if we 910 00:51:02,160 --> 00:51:04,400 Speaker 1: use hypnosis, we can make you go back to the 911 00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:07,960 Speaker 1: president of that event exactly. And that's what he advocates. 912 00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:10,560 Speaker 1: So in one sense, I would say the kinds of 913 00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:13,280 Speaker 1: regression hypnosis we see on the X files are probably 914 00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:17,160 Speaker 1: not even an accurate portrayal of what the advocates of 915 00:51:17,680 --> 00:51:21,080 Speaker 1: regression hypnosis would say they do, so it's it's not 916 00:51:21,200 --> 00:51:24,080 Speaker 1: even accurately showing what the people who think it works 917 00:51:24,160 --> 00:51:27,879 Speaker 1: would say. Even though Chris Carter participated in this, well, 918 00:51:27,920 --> 00:51:30,200 Speaker 1: I don't know what participated. You watch she sat there, 919 00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:32,640 Speaker 1: But but you bring up a good point. Is there 920 00:51:32,680 --> 00:51:35,279 Speaker 1: any reason to think it's a good way to get 921 00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:38,200 Speaker 1: accurate information about what happened in the past, and if 922 00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:42,560 Speaker 1: only details, I couldn't find any reason to think that 923 00:51:42,640 --> 00:51:45,040 Speaker 1: this is a good way. Mac gave some defenses, so 924 00:51:45,080 --> 00:51:48,359 Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna give some of his defenses of 925 00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:51,759 Speaker 1: of regression hypnosis. In Appendix A of the book I 926 00:51:51,800 --> 00:51:54,799 Speaker 1: mentioned earlier, the one about his clinical work with the 927 00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:58,400 Speaker 1: people who claim to have had abduction experiences, he defends 928 00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:02,080 Speaker 1: the quality of the memories brought back through regression hypnosis 929 00:52:02,120 --> 00:52:05,560 Speaker 1: by saying they met three criteria. Number one, he said 930 00:52:05,600 --> 00:52:08,680 Speaker 1: that the memories that that were brought out through regression 931 00:52:09,080 --> 00:52:12,680 Speaker 1: were usually against self interest, meaning that they were like 932 00:52:12,880 --> 00:52:17,760 Speaker 1: more embarrassing or more damaging to self regard of the patient. 933 00:52:18,360 --> 00:52:20,759 Speaker 1: Thus this he's sort of arguing for this, I think 934 00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:24,520 Speaker 1: that they wouldn't have a motivation to fabricate these memories. 935 00:52:24,840 --> 00:52:27,000 Speaker 1: It's kind of like flattering to the person, kind of 936 00:52:27,040 --> 00:52:29,600 Speaker 1: like when you've got that roommate in college who drank 937 00:52:29,600 --> 00:52:33,160 Speaker 1: too much of the night before and did something really bad, right, 938 00:52:33,560 --> 00:52:37,160 Speaker 1: and then they say, oh, I blacked out. I don't 939 00:52:37,160 --> 00:52:39,239 Speaker 1: remember any of that. Oh, I guess it could be 940 00:52:39,320 --> 00:52:41,240 Speaker 1: kind of like that, But it would be like saying 941 00:52:41,560 --> 00:52:44,520 Speaker 1: if you didn't believe what he was saying until he 942 00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:48,040 Speaker 1: started saying things that were really not flattering to his 943 00:52:48,120 --> 00:52:50,440 Speaker 1: self in right, and then you can be like, oh, 944 00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:53,560 Speaker 1: this probably did happen to ted, because you know, he's 945 00:52:53,600 --> 00:52:56,879 Speaker 1: admitting that he pooped in his pants. Okay, yeah. Yeah. 946 00:52:57,280 --> 00:52:59,960 Speaker 1: The second criterion is that he said that the memory 947 00:53:00,120 --> 00:53:04,880 Speaker 1: is recovered through aggression are more consistent with independent reports 948 00:53:04,880 --> 00:53:08,360 Speaker 1: of other abductees. So once he do a regression on people, 949 00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:11,919 Speaker 1: they started giving details that sounded a lot more like 950 00:53:12,080 --> 00:53:15,560 Speaker 1: what all of the other people reported in their abduction stories. 951 00:53:15,719 --> 00:53:18,560 Speaker 1: This was similar with the satanic panic stuff as well. Yeah. Yeah. 952 00:53:18,680 --> 00:53:21,640 Speaker 1: And then the third criterion he gives is that memories 953 00:53:21,680 --> 00:53:24,480 Speaker 1: brought up through regression tend to cause a much stronger 954 00:53:24,520 --> 00:53:29,000 Speaker 1: emotional affect and bodily reaction in the subject. People really 955 00:53:29,360 --> 00:53:32,520 Speaker 1: see seemed to be having strong feelings about what was 956 00:53:32,560 --> 00:53:36,520 Speaker 1: going on in the memories recovered through their regressions, and 957 00:53:36,600 --> 00:53:41,440 Speaker 1: so I think that bait. Even despite these defenses, I 958 00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:45,040 Speaker 1: would have a persistent concern about the idea that hypnosis 959 00:53:45,120 --> 00:53:49,360 Speaker 1: or any similar like relaxation exercise is going to recover 960 00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:53,640 Speaker 1: accurate information that was not previously available to you if 961 00:53:53,640 --> 00:53:57,160 Speaker 1: you didn't already remember it. Why is this exercise bringing 962 00:53:57,200 --> 00:54:00,800 Speaker 1: these memories back? And why don't we have or physical 963 00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:04,200 Speaker 1: evidence that these memories are better than the memories you 964 00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:08,080 Speaker 1: consciously remembered at first? Look? Okay, but what would you 965 00:54:08,239 --> 00:54:13,759 Speaker 1: say to using regression hypnosis to recollecting one of your 966 00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:16,640 Speaker 1: past lives? This comes up in an episode of The 967 00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:18,799 Speaker 1: X Files. I mean, this is all this episode I 968 00:54:18,800 --> 00:54:21,239 Speaker 1: was joking about them. Yeah, exactly the field where I 969 00:54:21,239 --> 00:54:23,400 Speaker 1: died where I But I think Mulder remembers being what 970 00:54:23,560 --> 00:54:26,040 Speaker 1: somebody's in a Civil war soldier or something like that, 971 00:54:26,120 --> 00:54:29,200 Speaker 1: and some other women who who they're currently like pursuing 972 00:54:29,239 --> 00:54:31,799 Speaker 1: that's part of like a terrorist seller or something like that. 973 00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:38,560 Speaker 1: Is was his wife. I believe Sully was like his general. Well, yeah, 974 00:54:38,640 --> 00:54:41,680 Speaker 1: this is where some of these accounts get way fishier 975 00:54:41,719 --> 00:54:45,560 Speaker 1: than the ones I've already talked about For example, there 976 00:54:45,719 --> 00:54:48,600 Speaker 1: is a writer named Alexa Clay and she grew up 977 00:54:48,719 --> 00:54:51,560 Speaker 1: with John Mack. He was her mother's partner. And she 978 00:54:51,640 --> 00:54:53,920 Speaker 1: had an interesting article on mac that I read, and 979 00:54:53,960 --> 00:54:56,720 Speaker 1: I want to read a quote from her article, she says, 980 00:54:57,600 --> 00:55:00,080 Speaker 1: I remember one summer evening at a beach house on 981 00:55:00,239 --> 00:55:03,440 Speaker 1: Martha's vineyard, when I was about eleven. We all watched 982 00:55:03,480 --> 00:55:06,880 Speaker 1: as John regressed my aunt back into a past life. 983 00:55:07,280 --> 00:55:09,919 Speaker 1: She lay on the couch recalling an incident in which 984 00:55:09,960 --> 00:55:12,800 Speaker 1: she was a forest ranger who witnessed the death of 985 00:55:12,840 --> 00:55:16,120 Speaker 1: a few people during some kind of avalanche. My aunt 986 00:55:16,200 --> 00:55:19,000 Speaker 1: later told me she was fully conscious of the experience, 987 00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:22,000 Speaker 1: but couldn't control what she was saying. It was like 988 00:55:22,040 --> 00:55:25,359 Speaker 1: she was watching herself tell a story. John later tried 989 00:55:25,400 --> 00:55:27,920 Speaker 1: to hypnotize my brother so that he wouldn't be afraid 990 00:55:27,960 --> 00:55:32,200 Speaker 1: of spiders. It seems like two very different things. They're 991 00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:35,440 Speaker 1: recollecting your past life as a ranger and not being 992 00:55:35,480 --> 00:55:38,680 Speaker 1: afraid of spiders. Yeah, and so I gotta say, um, 993 00:55:38,719 --> 00:55:41,239 Speaker 1: you know again. Just we end up working on a 994 00:55:41,239 --> 00:55:43,279 Speaker 1: lot of different things here at how stuff works on 995 00:55:43,360 --> 00:55:46,680 Speaker 1: brain stuff Ben bowl in our colleague, from stuff they 996 00:55:46,680 --> 00:55:49,759 Speaker 1: don't want you to know did an episode on hypnosis 997 00:55:49,800 --> 00:55:52,279 Speaker 1: and how it works and whether it works, and and 998 00:55:53,160 --> 00:55:56,839 Speaker 1: you know there is some legitimacy to hypnosis. I don't wanna. Um, yeah, 999 00:55:56,880 --> 00:55:59,160 Speaker 1: I think say that that you know it doesn't work 1000 00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:01,600 Speaker 1: at all. You should go watch that episode. It's a nice, 1001 00:56:01,600 --> 00:56:05,200 Speaker 1: like little three four minute summary of of how it works. 1002 00:56:05,560 --> 00:56:08,200 Speaker 1: And we've even had some hypnosis experts come on and 1003 00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:10,719 Speaker 1: say that they're really happy that, you know, we broke 1004 00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:13,520 Speaker 1: down the actual science of it. But in this case, 1005 00:56:14,200 --> 00:56:15,880 Speaker 1: I think this is a little bit beyond what it's 1006 00:56:15,920 --> 00:56:18,239 Speaker 1: capable of. Yeah, I think this is a common thing. 1007 00:56:18,280 --> 00:56:21,680 Speaker 1: I mean, based on my understanding, I think hypnosis is 1008 00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:25,439 Speaker 1: capable kind of like meditation or yoga or something of 1009 00:56:25,560 --> 00:56:29,399 Speaker 1: introducing a mildly altered state of consciousness where your your 1010 00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:31,760 Speaker 1: brain is just kind of working a little bit different 1011 00:56:31,800 --> 00:56:35,799 Speaker 1: than it normally normally would. But I don't really see 1012 00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:39,879 Speaker 1: much evidence that it really has these these dramatically powerful 1013 00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:43,680 Speaker 1: effects of people like this would claim. Um, So you 1014 00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:47,160 Speaker 1: think like maybe Mac was kind of a figure I'm 1015 00:56:47,160 --> 00:56:50,360 Speaker 1: thinking of Philip Symore Hoffman and the Master. No, No, 1016 00:56:50,520 --> 00:56:52,879 Speaker 1: I don't get that feeling, because in his writing end 1017 00:56:52,880 --> 00:56:55,680 Speaker 1: to Speech, Max seemed to me like he was an 1018 00:56:55,719 --> 00:57:02,040 Speaker 1: extremely smart, thoughtful, even a wise person. But I read 1019 00:57:02,120 --> 00:57:05,160 Speaker 1: his reasoning for accepting a lot of the subduction testimony 1020 00:57:05,200 --> 00:57:08,400 Speaker 1: and it just doesn't sound very convincing to me. It 1021 00:57:08,800 --> 00:57:12,600 Speaker 1: seems like he was a smart, thoughtful, good natured guy 1022 00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:16,880 Speaker 1: who wanted to believe. Do you think though? And you 1023 00:57:16,960 --> 00:57:20,720 Speaker 1: just hit on the prime X Files slogan he wants 1024 00:57:20,720 --> 00:57:23,920 Speaker 1: to believe. I want to believe. Do you think though? 1025 00:57:24,560 --> 00:57:28,439 Speaker 1: That he would have believed in alien human hybrids if 1026 00:57:28,480 --> 00:57:32,040 Speaker 1: one of his patients pulled that memory up. Well, a 1027 00:57:32,120 --> 00:57:34,760 Speaker 1: lot of patients did talk about things like that, did 1028 00:57:34,760 --> 00:57:37,400 Speaker 1: they really? Yeah, this is a common feature of alien 1029 00:57:37,440 --> 00:57:40,400 Speaker 1: abduction reports, especially at the time. I don't I don't know. 1030 00:57:40,720 --> 00:57:44,360 Speaker 1: It seems like alien abduction reports have sort of dropped 1031 00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:47,120 Speaker 1: off in in recent years as far as I can tell. 1032 00:57:47,320 --> 00:57:49,960 Speaker 1: Maybe I'm wrong about that, but maybe it's just that 1033 00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:52,240 Speaker 1: there's not as much coverage on them because the media 1034 00:57:52,320 --> 00:57:54,840 Speaker 1: landscapes changed too. Yeah, it could be. But at the 1035 00:57:54,920 --> 00:57:57,840 Speaker 1: time Mac talks about working with a lot of people 1036 00:57:57,840 --> 00:58:02,040 Speaker 1: who would say that the alien would say, take uh, 1037 00:58:02,160 --> 00:58:05,360 Speaker 1: sperm samples from them, or take eggs from them, or 1038 00:58:05,400 --> 00:58:09,240 Speaker 1: implant them with with eggs or in some way have 1039 00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:13,080 Speaker 1: some kind of reproductive interaction with the person. Well, that 1040 00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:15,640 Speaker 1: is a perfect segue for us to talk about our 1041 00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:18,400 Speaker 1: last and I think probably one of the things that 1042 00:58:18,440 --> 00:58:22,680 Speaker 1: The X Files is known most for topic wise, which 1043 00:58:22,720 --> 00:58:27,480 Speaker 1: is the alien hybrid conspiracy, right, mixing aliens and human 1044 00:58:27,480 --> 00:58:30,520 Speaker 1: beings together in some way or another. Yes, this is 1045 00:58:30,680 --> 00:58:34,520 Speaker 1: one of the biggest overarching plot points in the whole series, 1046 00:58:34,600 --> 00:58:37,840 Speaker 1: is that, oh man, it gets so convoluted by the end, 1047 00:58:37,880 --> 00:58:41,840 Speaker 1: who knows what's actually going on? But without spoiling too 1048 00:58:41,960 --> 00:58:45,240 Speaker 1: much for the people who haven't actually seen the series yet, 1049 00:58:45,440 --> 00:58:48,760 Speaker 1: basically there's there's a running theme of aliens wanting to 1050 00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:52,400 Speaker 1: hybridize or create some kind of some kind of blended 1051 00:58:52,400 --> 00:58:56,120 Speaker 1: offspring with Homo sapiens on planet Earth, or to maybe 1052 00:58:56,160 --> 00:58:58,520 Speaker 1: go somewhere else, or to maybe take over the Earth, 1053 00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:02,320 Speaker 1: or who knows what. So alien human hybrids. Is there 1054 00:59:02,360 --> 00:59:06,600 Speaker 1: any reason to to track with the science on this 1055 00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:09,240 Speaker 1: that's offered by the show? Is there anything to it? So? 1056 00:59:09,280 --> 00:59:11,280 Speaker 1: Here's the thing about the show is that, I mean 1057 00:59:11,280 --> 00:59:14,160 Speaker 1: it was on for nine seasons, right, and over the course, 1058 00:59:15,160 --> 00:59:19,080 Speaker 1: they had so many different rationale and scientific explanations for 1059 00:59:19,120 --> 00:59:21,360 Speaker 1: what was going on with the hybridization that it was 1060 00:59:21,400 --> 00:59:24,400 Speaker 1: all over the place. I completely lost track of it. Yeah, 1061 00:59:24,440 --> 00:59:26,520 Speaker 1: if you try to add it all up, it doesn't 1062 00:59:26,640 --> 00:59:29,880 Speaker 1: really make sense in terms even of the fictional construct 1063 00:59:29,880 --> 00:59:34,040 Speaker 1: of the show. Right, But um, Cavelos takes all these 1064 00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:37,080 Speaker 1: ways and she breaks them down one by one, and 1065 00:59:37,400 --> 00:59:41,120 Speaker 1: there is some viability to some of these ideas, although 1066 00:59:41,160 --> 00:59:44,360 Speaker 1: obviously we don't have alien DNA that we can be 1067 00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:47,080 Speaker 1: experimenting with, so she's working along the lines of what 1068 00:59:47,120 --> 00:59:50,600 Speaker 1: we know about genetics in general. Okay, Um, so she 1069 00:59:50,680 --> 00:59:53,920 Speaker 1: has five ways the show proposes that you can make 1070 00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:56,560 Speaker 1: a hybrid and alien human hybrid. Let's try to go 1071 00:59:56,600 --> 00:59:59,080 Speaker 1: through these and not get too bogged down. Sorry, one 1072 00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:03,080 Speaker 1: quick question before we breathe through these. Uh, this does 1073 01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:07,920 Speaker 1: have to assume, right that the aliens would be DNA based. Yeah, sure, yeah, 1074 01:00:07,960 --> 01:00:10,520 Speaker 1: you really just there's no way you could hybridize with 1075 01:00:10,720 --> 01:00:14,800 Speaker 1: an alien species that wasn't DNA based. Yeah, that's absolutely 1076 01:00:14,840 --> 01:00:18,160 Speaker 1: an assumption that they make here. Alright. So the premise 1077 01:00:18,280 --> 01:00:21,240 Speaker 1: essentially of the show, the overall premise for these hybrids, 1078 01:00:21,320 --> 01:00:25,560 Speaker 1: is that grays, which are you know, the generic aliens 1079 01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:27,160 Speaker 1: that we're all used to seeing with the big eyes 1080 01:00:27,160 --> 01:00:29,480 Speaker 1: in the big gray heads, Right, they're the ones in 1081 01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:33,880 Speaker 1: the sketch artist interpretation of exactly. Yeah. Uh, those are 1082 01:00:33,920 --> 01:00:38,360 Speaker 1: in fact hybrids of humans and aliens. Those aren't actually 1083 01:00:38,920 --> 01:00:43,840 Speaker 1: aliens in and of themselves. Uh. And there it seems 1084 01:00:43,880 --> 01:00:46,320 Speaker 1: to be that the reason why they're making these hybrids 1085 01:00:46,400 --> 01:00:50,240 Speaker 1: is so that there's a specific immunity to biological threats 1086 01:00:50,280 --> 01:00:53,240 Speaker 1: that might exist on Earth, to the aliens that are 1087 01:00:53,240 --> 01:00:57,560 Speaker 1: trying to colonize the planet. Okay, that's as much as 1088 01:00:57,600 --> 01:01:03,000 Speaker 1: I think makes sense of the of that part um. 1089 01:01:03,040 --> 01:01:08,200 Speaker 1: So okay, yes, some viruses can attack particular species, right, So, 1090 01:01:08,240 --> 01:01:10,720 Speaker 1: for instance, smallpox, which comes up in the show all 1091 01:01:10,720 --> 01:01:14,280 Speaker 1: the time, only attacks human beings. Uh. And here's a 1092 01:01:14,280 --> 01:01:17,120 Speaker 1: direct quote from Kevelus his book. A virus can only 1093 01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:20,040 Speaker 1: enter a cell if the proteins projecting from the surface 1094 01:01:20,120 --> 01:01:23,720 Speaker 1: of its envelope find matching receptors on the cell. So 1095 01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:25,560 Speaker 1: this is important to consider as we go forward with 1096 01:01:25,600 --> 01:01:27,240 Speaker 1: all of these things. It's a lot like in the 1097 01:01:27,320 --> 01:01:29,160 Speaker 1: last episode on The X Files when we were talking 1098 01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:33,360 Speaker 1: about the parasites and how parasites are very specific about 1099 01:01:33,440 --> 01:01:37,520 Speaker 1: what other species that they they're parasitic of. Right there, 1100 01:01:37,560 --> 01:01:39,680 Speaker 1: they're not like the face huggers that can apparently just 1101 01:01:39,720 --> 01:01:42,560 Speaker 1: get on any old animal that has a mouth. Yeah, exactly, 1102 01:01:42,640 --> 01:01:44,560 Speaker 1: And likewise we're going to find that this is the 1103 01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:47,320 Speaker 1: case with a lot of these biological threats or genetic 1104 01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:51,160 Speaker 1: manipulations that are being purported on the show. Uh So, 1105 01:01:51,280 --> 01:01:53,320 Speaker 1: I guess the premise here is that these aliens would 1106 01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:56,959 Speaker 1: are trying not to be susceptible to our diseases because 1107 01:01:56,960 --> 01:01:59,760 Speaker 1: they're not from here. But again, so why that wouldn't 1108 01:01:59,760 --> 01:02:02,439 Speaker 1: make sense? Right, if they're not from Earth, why would 1109 01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:06,120 Speaker 1: they be susceptible to a disease like smallpox which hasn't 1110 01:02:06,160 --> 01:02:09,840 Speaker 1: evolved to be tailored to their anatomy. Yeah, Earth based 1111 01:02:09,880 --> 01:02:13,360 Speaker 1: diseases don't typically affect every species on Earth that they're 1112 01:02:13,480 --> 01:02:16,520 Speaker 1: very often aimed at one species, So even even more 1113 01:02:16,600 --> 01:02:20,000 Speaker 1: so the difference between alien life forms and Earth life forms, 1114 01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:24,520 Speaker 1: and even hybrids however you know they're made, would probably 1115 01:02:24,560 --> 01:02:27,080 Speaker 1: be susceptible to the same disease as the human beings 1116 01:02:27,080 --> 01:02:29,640 Speaker 1: are susceptible to, right, or or that the aliens were 1117 01:02:29,640 --> 01:02:33,400 Speaker 1: susceptible to so changing the receptors on ourselves, you know, 1118 01:02:33,480 --> 01:02:37,520 Speaker 1: they would prevent the necessary processes from regular life happening 1119 01:02:37,600 --> 01:02:40,840 Speaker 1: to you know, manipulations on this scale. It messes up 1120 01:02:40,840 --> 01:02:44,840 Speaker 1: everything is a domino effect. Umvelos also reminds us of 1121 01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:47,240 Speaker 1: one other thing before we get into these five theories. 1122 01:02:47,920 --> 01:02:51,200 Speaker 1: She says, it wasn't until the nineteen eighties when genes 1123 01:02:51,200 --> 01:02:55,320 Speaker 1: were first transferred successfully from one species to another. So 1124 01:02:55,360 --> 01:02:57,800 Speaker 1: that might be one of the reasons why this was 1125 01:02:57,840 --> 01:02:59,880 Speaker 1: such a kind of popular idea on the show at 1126 01:02:59,880 --> 01:03:02,840 Speaker 1: the time, right that it was just being pioneered and 1127 01:03:02,880 --> 01:03:05,640 Speaker 1: it was sort of like it was like science fiction 1128 01:03:05,680 --> 01:03:07,680 Speaker 1: coming to life. Well, there were a lot of gene 1129 01:03:07,680 --> 01:03:10,200 Speaker 1: thrillers in the nineties. It was an era of Jurassic 1130 01:03:11,000 --> 01:03:13,920 Speaker 1: Jurassic Park in the nineties was you know, the as 1131 01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:17,440 Speaker 1: far as I know, the first real cloning based science 1132 01:03:17,480 --> 01:03:19,960 Speaker 1: fiction movie that was a big success. There might have 1133 01:03:20,000 --> 01:03:22,520 Speaker 1: been one before that, I can't remember, but that was 1134 01:03:22,600 --> 01:03:25,160 Speaker 1: like the thing that brought that to the public's attention, 1135 01:03:25,160 --> 01:03:27,560 Speaker 1: and that's the era of the X Files. Yeah, absolutely, 1136 01:03:27,960 --> 01:03:30,000 Speaker 1: all right, So our first way to create a hybrid 1137 01:03:30,040 --> 01:03:32,320 Speaker 1: what what would you imagine easiest way to create a 1138 01:03:32,400 --> 01:03:36,720 Speaker 1: hybrid Make two different animals of different species have sex 1139 01:03:36,720 --> 01:03:40,000 Speaker 1: and see if they get pregnant. You did it. Yeah, breeding, 1140 01:03:40,120 --> 01:03:43,960 Speaker 1: it's that simple, right, But it's not that simple because, uh, 1141 01:03:44,560 --> 01:03:47,920 Speaker 1: the whole idea of the words species means that it's 1142 01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:51,400 Speaker 1: reproductively isolated. So I think there are a lot of 1143 01:03:51,440 --> 01:03:55,240 Speaker 1: reasons that our concept of a species is sometimes kind 1144 01:03:55,240 --> 01:03:59,320 Speaker 1: of fuzzy. But yeah, that that's the most common definition 1145 01:03:59,440 --> 01:04:03,480 Speaker 1: is these animals won't naturally in the wild and probably 1146 01:04:03,600 --> 01:04:07,120 Speaker 1: can't breed with each other and produce viable offspring, especially 1147 01:04:07,160 --> 01:04:11,919 Speaker 1: not producing offspring that can breed through to the next generation. Exactly. Yeah, 1148 01:04:11,960 --> 01:04:13,840 Speaker 1: Because and I was about to get to that, is 1149 01:04:13,880 --> 01:04:17,200 Speaker 1: that almost all of the species, or rather the offspring 1150 01:04:17,240 --> 01:04:21,200 Speaker 1: that are created from any mixed species interactions, are sterile, 1151 01:04:21,800 --> 01:04:24,240 Speaker 1: so it doesn't lead to a lot. So a mule, 1152 01:04:24,320 --> 01:04:27,080 Speaker 1: for is like our best example, right, when a male 1153 01:04:27,160 --> 01:04:29,360 Speaker 1: donkey and a female horse get together, they have a mule, 1154 01:04:29,480 --> 01:04:33,400 Speaker 1: but those mules are usually sterile. We've done combinations of 1155 01:04:33,480 --> 01:04:37,960 Speaker 1: horses and zebras, We've had lions and tigers, camels and llamas. Yes, 1156 01:04:38,040 --> 01:04:40,960 Speaker 1: those are all possible, but their offspring are almost always sterile. 1157 01:04:41,360 --> 01:04:48,080 Speaker 1: And humans can't produce offspring with any other species, even chimpanzees. 1158 01:04:48,680 --> 01:04:52,400 Speaker 1: Now chimpanzee shares ninety nine point five percent of our DNA, 1159 01:04:52,880 --> 01:04:55,600 Speaker 1: And there has been some speculation there is something out 1160 01:04:55,600 --> 01:04:59,280 Speaker 1: there called the human z. This is a popular urban legend. Yeah, 1161 01:04:59,600 --> 01:05:03,000 Speaker 1: that is, uh, some somewhere along the line, somebody figured 1162 01:05:03,040 --> 01:05:06,160 Speaker 1: it out. There's both. There's there's speculation that it was 1163 01:05:06,200 --> 01:05:10,040 Speaker 1: done in Russia and in China, but that human zes 1164 01:05:10,080 --> 01:05:14,240 Speaker 1: were created in labs somewhere the combination of those two species. 1165 01:05:14,520 --> 01:05:19,320 Speaker 1: This hasn't never been proven. There's reports, but there's no evidence. Um. 1166 01:05:19,360 --> 01:05:23,680 Speaker 1: So that's number one breading. Okay, number two. Do you 1167 01:05:23,720 --> 01:05:26,720 Speaker 1: remember that episode Red Museum on X Files? And then 1168 01:05:26,720 --> 01:05:29,840 Speaker 1: there's also the episodes seven thirty one. Basically the idea 1169 01:05:29,920 --> 01:05:35,000 Speaker 1: here is that a doctor injects children with alien substances 1170 01:05:35,080 --> 01:05:37,439 Speaker 1: and says, oh that these are just vitamins, just giving 1171 01:05:37,480 --> 01:05:40,440 Speaker 1: you vitamins, but they're really trying to make them into 1172 01:05:40,520 --> 01:05:44,600 Speaker 1: hybrids where they flint stone vitamins. Yeah, they tasted their 1173 01:05:44,680 --> 01:05:49,000 Speaker 1: chewy and sugary. So it's a serum in these episodes, 1174 01:05:49,040 --> 01:05:52,240 Speaker 1: and I guess the fictional science and the show says, well, 1175 01:05:52,280 --> 01:05:58,440 Speaker 1: the serum contains antibodies that are mixed with quote synthetic corticosteroids. 1176 01:05:58,600 --> 01:06:01,880 Speaker 1: Corticosteroids how you say, well, I don't know. I mean, 1177 01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:05,480 Speaker 1: I have no idea of steroids and co cortico. Yeah, sure, 1178 01:06:05,560 --> 01:06:10,680 Speaker 1: let's go with it costco steroids. Anyways, so the show says, 1179 01:06:10,880 --> 01:06:14,600 Speaker 1: uh that these children are rather not the show, But 1180 01:06:14,720 --> 01:06:17,960 Speaker 1: Cavela says, this wouldn't make the children hybrids, but just 1181 01:06:18,080 --> 01:06:22,080 Speaker 1: injecting them, right, Yeah, all you're doing is you're mixing 1182 01:06:22,240 --> 01:06:25,720 Speaker 1: alien and human molecules together, right in a in a 1183 01:06:25,800 --> 01:06:29,840 Speaker 1: similar system. So theoretically, the different antibodies that are in 1184 01:06:29,960 --> 01:06:33,720 Speaker 1: this serum, they may help fight off a range of diseases, 1185 01:06:33,760 --> 01:06:35,680 Speaker 1: but they're not. Again, they're probably not going to fight 1186 01:06:35,760 --> 01:06:38,440 Speaker 1: off any range of diseases that are on Earth because 1187 01:06:38,480 --> 01:06:41,160 Speaker 1: they're gonna be the alien antibodies are going to be 1188 01:06:41,200 --> 01:06:44,400 Speaker 1: adapted for diseases from wherever they're from. Yeah, okay. The 1189 01:06:44,480 --> 01:06:47,520 Speaker 1: other thing is that our human bodies would probably react 1190 01:06:47,600 --> 01:06:51,120 Speaker 1: to alien antibodies as if they were invaders, right, so 1191 01:06:51,240 --> 01:06:53,960 Speaker 1: our immune system would try to destroy them. So this 1192 01:06:54,040 --> 01:06:57,600 Speaker 1: doesn't go a long way towards helping the hybrid possibilities either. No, 1193 01:06:57,720 --> 01:07:00,640 Speaker 1: I mean, our our immune system often reject sent attacks 1194 01:07:00,760 --> 01:07:03,880 Speaker 1: donated human tissue. If somebody wants to give you an 1195 01:07:04,080 --> 01:07:06,680 Speaker 1: organ that it very likely could be a problem that 1196 01:07:06,760 --> 01:07:09,920 Speaker 1: your immune system will not like that organ being in there, right, 1197 01:07:10,040 --> 01:07:14,000 Speaker 1: so aliens are probably out. Although Cavelis has she she 1198 01:07:14,120 --> 01:07:17,440 Speaker 1: actually brings back the cote coasteroids that we mentioned earlier. 1199 01:07:17,800 --> 01:07:20,200 Speaker 1: She says that maybe that's what helped. Maybe maybe one 1200 01:07:20,200 --> 01:07:22,400 Speaker 1: of these X files writers did some research and thought 1201 01:07:22,520 --> 01:07:25,960 Speaker 1: this would work out. So Cota coasteroids are hormones, and 1202 01:07:26,040 --> 01:07:29,560 Speaker 1: they helped to control our metabolism, mineral balance in our 1203 01:07:29,640 --> 01:07:36,160 Speaker 1: inflammatory processes. Okay, they're injected specifically to decrease our immune responses. 1204 01:07:36,880 --> 01:07:40,520 Speaker 1: So there's some idea here that maybe you would inject 1205 01:07:40,640 --> 01:07:43,640 Speaker 1: those those would lower the immune responses, which would then 1206 01:07:43,840 --> 01:07:48,560 Speaker 1: allow the alien antibodies to somehow coexist without being attacked 1207 01:07:48,600 --> 01:07:51,160 Speaker 1: by our immune system to do magic, and yeah, the 1208 01:07:51,200 --> 01:07:54,880 Speaker 1: magic would happen. They also, the cota steroids also elevate 1209 01:07:54,920 --> 01:07:58,560 Speaker 1: our moods, they stimulate our appetites. They also have pretty 1210 01:07:58,560 --> 01:08:04,040 Speaker 1: bad long term effects, most muscle wasting, mood swings, slow healing, 1211 01:08:04,320 --> 01:08:07,160 Speaker 1: weakened bones, and the formation of fatty deposits on the 1212 01:08:07,200 --> 01:08:10,400 Speaker 1: surface of our skin. So you know, it doesn't sound 1213 01:08:10,440 --> 01:08:12,960 Speaker 1: like an ideal way to go about making a hybrid. No, 1214 01:08:13,120 --> 01:08:15,320 Speaker 1: not at all. So you said, are there a couple more? Ways? 1215 01:08:15,680 --> 01:08:19,639 Speaker 1: There are three more, all right, the Erlan Meyer Flask. 1216 01:08:19,720 --> 01:08:24,080 Speaker 1: Do you remember that episode in the first classic Mythos 1217 01:08:24,120 --> 01:08:26,200 Speaker 1: episodes of The X Files. It was back when the 1218 01:08:26,320 --> 01:08:29,760 Speaker 1: myth Arc episodes were exciting. As the series goes on, 1219 01:08:29,920 --> 01:08:32,280 Speaker 1: the Monster of the Week episodes, sometimes they're still good, 1220 01:08:32,320 --> 01:08:35,800 Speaker 1: but the myth Arc episodes become more and more disappointing. Yeah, 1221 01:08:35,920 --> 01:08:38,719 Speaker 1: I mean, I tend to agree with you. It's funny 1222 01:08:38,800 --> 01:08:41,519 Speaker 1: because I go back now and almost all my favorite 1223 01:08:41,520 --> 01:08:45,240 Speaker 1: episodes or Monster of the Week stuff. But anyways, in 1224 01:08:45,280 --> 01:08:49,000 Speaker 1: the Earlan Meyer Flask, the premise there for the hybridization 1225 01:08:49,479 --> 01:08:53,200 Speaker 1: was that they were cloning alien bacteria that also contained 1226 01:08:53,240 --> 01:08:56,479 Speaker 1: an alien virus, and they were taking the genes from 1227 01:08:56,520 --> 01:08:59,960 Speaker 1: that virus and inserting them into terminally ill human beings. 1228 01:09:00,640 --> 01:09:03,320 Speaker 1: And this is where we get these the original hybrids. 1229 01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:05,040 Speaker 1: You remember on the show that we're like, they looked 1230 01:09:05,080 --> 01:09:07,960 Speaker 1: like people, but they had green blood and in human 1231 01:09:08,080 --> 01:09:11,639 Speaker 1: street wouldn't have the poison blood. Like if they started bleeding, 1232 01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:14,280 Speaker 1: people around them would get burning on their eyes and 1233 01:09:14,360 --> 01:09:16,840 Speaker 1: start choking. Yeah. Yeah, and they were like strong and 1234 01:09:16,920 --> 01:09:18,920 Speaker 1: they could like I think one guy like could breathe 1235 01:09:18,960 --> 01:09:21,000 Speaker 1: underwater or something like that. So there are all these 1236 01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:24,600 Speaker 1: weird abilities. So all right, Cavellas helps us break this 1237 01:09:24,680 --> 01:09:29,280 Speaker 1: down again again. And alien virus probably wouldn't be made 1238 01:09:29,320 --> 01:09:32,519 Speaker 1: of the same DNA building blocks as those of us 1239 01:09:32,840 --> 01:09:37,439 Speaker 1: in human beings, right, so they would be incompatible genetic 1240 01:09:37,760 --> 01:09:41,200 Speaker 1: let's call them languages. But they mentioned that this alien 1241 01:09:41,360 --> 01:09:45,080 Speaker 1: DNA contains this is in the episode, they contained two 1242 01:09:45,160 --> 01:09:50,320 Speaker 1: additional nucleotides or basses. And there actually are possible other 1243 01:09:50,439 --> 01:09:52,880 Speaker 1: nucleotides that exist on Earth than the ones that are 1244 01:09:52,920 --> 01:09:55,479 Speaker 1: in human DNA. Right, but they're not used in the 1245 01:09:55,600 --> 01:09:59,040 Speaker 1: DNA of any organism that we know of. But if 1246 01:09:59,080 --> 01:10:01,840 Speaker 1: you use these in some way, it would be sort 1247 01:10:01,880 --> 01:10:04,320 Speaker 1: of like taking the alphabet. Let's stick with this alphabet 1248 01:10:04,320 --> 01:10:07,920 Speaker 1: analogy and giving it two more letters, right, so you 1249 01:10:08,040 --> 01:10:11,559 Speaker 1: add uh just to make believe or brand new letters 1250 01:10:11,640 --> 01:10:13,680 Speaker 1: to the alphabet. One day, all of a sudden, you 1251 01:10:13,800 --> 01:10:17,520 Speaker 1: have all these new possible combinations, right, all these combinations 1252 01:10:17,640 --> 01:10:20,200 Speaker 1: or even ways in which you could shorten other things 1253 01:10:20,320 --> 01:10:25,120 Speaker 1: because of these added extra elements to the language. Well, 1254 01:10:25,520 --> 01:10:30,920 Speaker 1: they hypothesized. Cavella's hypothesizes that one of these might be 1255 01:10:31,720 --> 01:10:34,320 Speaker 1: used as an infectious virus. Right, so one of these 1256 01:10:34,360 --> 01:10:38,160 Speaker 1: different combinations of the alphabet of DNA is used to 1257 01:10:38,280 --> 01:10:43,040 Speaker 1: create an infectious virus that leads to this hybridization. Just 1258 01:10:43,120 --> 01:10:47,479 Speaker 1: getting complicated, is it's complicated? Right? Uh so, all right, 1259 01:10:47,760 --> 01:10:50,280 Speaker 1: there's still compatibility problem. Like no matter how you do it, 1260 01:10:50,360 --> 01:10:52,120 Speaker 1: it's like if you're trying to play like an Xbox 1261 01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:55,439 Speaker 1: game on a PlayStation, right, it's at first we put 1262 01:10:55,479 --> 01:10:58,639 Speaker 1: the PlayStation game in the case of a Nintendo we game, 1263 01:10:59,160 --> 01:11:02,920 Speaker 1: or if you blow on it, it still doesn't work. Um. 1264 01:11:03,280 --> 01:11:07,639 Speaker 1: So the compatibility problem basically comes down to the protein 1265 01:11:07,840 --> 01:11:10,840 Speaker 1: envelopes that contain DNA, right, And in this case it 1266 01:11:10,840 --> 01:11:15,000 Speaker 1: would contain alien DNA. It probably wouldn't enter our cells, 1267 01:11:15,600 --> 01:11:18,080 Speaker 1: but they do come up with cavelus. Again, she's always 1268 01:11:18,400 --> 01:11:20,639 Speaker 1: like going the extra mile, trying to help the show 1269 01:11:20,720 --> 01:11:23,960 Speaker 1: out to get there. She says, what if the alien 1270 01:11:24,120 --> 01:11:27,639 Speaker 1: DNA was placed into the protein envelope of an earth 1271 01:11:27,880 --> 01:11:33,160 Speaker 1: virus like smallpox? So maybe that's what this whole smallpox 1272 01:11:33,240 --> 01:11:36,439 Speaker 1: thing is about. It's not they're using the protein envelope 1273 01:11:36,479 --> 01:11:40,600 Speaker 1: of it to deliver alien DNA. That's her hypothesis. It 1274 01:11:40,640 --> 01:11:43,639 Speaker 1: could potentially get the virus into our human cells. But again, 1275 01:11:43,720 --> 01:11:45,880 Speaker 1: the DNA would have to be like our own human 1276 01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:48,559 Speaker 1: DNA for it to do anything more than just physically 1277 01:11:48,640 --> 01:11:51,200 Speaker 1: get there. Okay, okay, but what about all this green 1278 01:11:51,439 --> 01:11:55,040 Speaker 1: toxic blood? I mean, why why would the blood turn green? 1279 01:11:55,120 --> 01:11:58,120 Speaker 1: And is that even possible through hybridization? Well, believe it 1280 01:11:58,240 --> 01:12:02,080 Speaker 1: or not, not through hybridization, but yeah, it is possible 1281 01:12:02,160 --> 01:12:06,280 Speaker 1: to use transgenics in order to give species green blood 1282 01:12:06,320 --> 01:12:09,360 Speaker 1: that don't have them. That has been done. Um so 1283 01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:13,120 Speaker 1: in this particular instance, it's done. It's been done on fish. 1284 01:12:13,600 --> 01:12:17,840 Speaker 1: There's a green fluorescent protein uh in jellyfish. And if 1285 01:12:17,880 --> 01:12:20,599 Speaker 1: you take that gene and you insert it into fish, 1286 01:12:20,880 --> 01:12:22,439 Speaker 1: you know, I make I make it sound like it's 1287 01:12:22,479 --> 01:12:24,599 Speaker 1: that easy, you just insert it. Obviously there's a lot 1288 01:12:24,640 --> 01:12:28,559 Speaker 1: more to it than that. But yeah, they their blood 1289 01:12:28,600 --> 01:12:32,160 Speaker 1: turns green. So this is these are like glow stick fish. Yeah, 1290 01:12:32,200 --> 01:12:33,960 Speaker 1: I mean I think you break them in half and 1291 01:12:33,960 --> 01:12:36,000 Speaker 1: then you dance with them in a brave I wouldn't 1292 01:12:36,040 --> 01:12:39,439 Speaker 1: break it in but I think what the reasoning was 1293 01:12:39,560 --> 01:12:41,200 Speaker 1: was that they were doing this to these fish that 1294 01:12:41,320 --> 01:12:44,000 Speaker 1: so that they could like under a microscope, see things 1295 01:12:44,160 --> 01:12:47,960 Speaker 1: better than they could with its regular hue. And I'm 1296 01:12:48,000 --> 01:12:50,240 Speaker 1: not quite sure how that works, but yeah, so there 1297 01:12:50,320 --> 01:12:52,200 Speaker 1: was like an actual reason. It wasn't just like, hey, 1298 01:12:52,320 --> 01:12:54,160 Speaker 1: can we make this green? You know, like they were 1299 01:12:54,200 --> 01:12:56,679 Speaker 1: they were they were seeing like what kind of benefits 1300 01:12:56,720 --> 01:12:59,000 Speaker 1: they could get out of it. This also goes along 1301 01:12:59,080 --> 01:13:01,920 Speaker 1: with the breathing under water thing. Okay, so there's this 1302 01:13:02,040 --> 01:13:04,320 Speaker 1: episode It might be in the Erlan Meyer flask where 1303 01:13:04,320 --> 01:13:06,639 Speaker 1: like one of these hybrid guys like because there's horrible 1304 01:13:06,720 --> 01:13:10,080 Speaker 1: heart car chase and he crashes his car off of 1305 01:13:10,200 --> 01:13:12,720 Speaker 1: like a pier and lands in the water and they 1306 01:13:12,760 --> 01:13:14,680 Speaker 1: can't find his body. And then it turns out like 1307 01:13:14,840 --> 01:13:17,080 Speaker 1: he's been for two days, he's just been sitting at 1308 01:13:17,120 --> 01:13:21,640 Speaker 1: the bottom of this uh bay uh. And they explain, well, 1309 01:13:21,720 --> 01:13:23,920 Speaker 1: it's because he's an alien hybrid. He can breathe underwater. 1310 01:13:24,280 --> 01:13:26,960 Speaker 1: Why didn't he swim somewhere? Well, I think I think 1311 01:13:26,960 --> 01:13:28,840 Speaker 1: he was injured or something like that. I don't remember 1312 01:13:29,160 --> 01:13:33,639 Speaker 1: the details there. But so, all right, we can't change 1313 01:13:33,680 --> 01:13:39,200 Speaker 1: our respiratory system with transgenics, right, But Calas hypothesizes another 1314 01:13:39,320 --> 01:13:42,720 Speaker 1: way that this could be explained. All right, so crocodiles, 1315 01:13:43,040 --> 01:13:45,759 Speaker 1: you know that how crocodiles can survive for long periods 1316 01:13:45,800 --> 01:13:48,600 Speaker 1: of time underwater. Well, the way that they do that 1317 01:13:48,800 --> 01:13:51,760 Speaker 1: is the ions in them bind to hemoglobin in a 1318 01:13:51,840 --> 01:13:54,360 Speaker 1: different way than they do in human beings, and this 1319 01:13:54,560 --> 01:13:58,960 Speaker 1: releases oxygen even when they're underwater and they're not bringing 1320 01:13:59,160 --> 01:14:04,720 Speaker 1: in oxygen. Cavelos hypothesizes that if you inserted a crocodile 1321 01:14:04,880 --> 01:14:07,880 Speaker 1: gene into humans, we may be able to do the 1322 01:14:07,960 --> 01:14:10,720 Speaker 1: same thing. So it wouldn't change our respiratory process. It 1323 01:14:10,720 --> 01:14:13,680 Speaker 1: would just change the way that hemoglobin and ions in 1324 01:14:13,720 --> 01:14:18,240 Speaker 1: our body react together. It wouldn't trade lungs for gills exactly. Yeah. Yeah, 1325 01:14:18,760 --> 01:14:22,320 Speaker 1: So that's number three, this kind of transgenics, I guess, 1326 01:14:22,400 --> 01:14:25,640 Speaker 1: is how we could encapsulate that again. You know, I 1327 01:14:25,720 --> 01:14:29,280 Speaker 1: don't think that you could like hybridize an alien and 1328 01:14:29,320 --> 01:14:32,360 Speaker 1: a human together, but you might be able to make 1329 01:14:32,439 --> 01:14:37,360 Speaker 1: your blood green. Things that aren't exactly like superpowers. The 1330 01:14:37,479 --> 01:14:40,479 Speaker 1: fourth way, you remember back in home we were talking 1331 01:14:40,479 --> 01:14:44,560 Speaker 1: about chimeras, right, Well, what if we had alien human chimeras? 1332 01:14:44,960 --> 01:14:47,599 Speaker 1: So remember, a chimera is an organism that has two 1333 01:14:47,720 --> 01:14:51,040 Speaker 1: different sets of DNA and they usually originate from the 1334 01:14:51,160 --> 01:14:55,200 Speaker 1: fusion of two different zygotes or eggs, right, So what 1335 01:14:55,320 --> 01:14:58,560 Speaker 1: if we had an alien egg and human egg and 1336 01:14:58,720 --> 01:15:02,240 Speaker 1: we fuse those together. They're nice, So maybe then we've 1337 01:15:02,280 --> 01:15:06,240 Speaker 1: got this alien hybrid. Okay, let's see where Kevels goes 1338 01:15:06,320 --> 01:15:09,000 Speaker 1: with this. She says, uh, well, right now, that we 1339 01:15:09,080 --> 01:15:12,160 Speaker 1: can make from cells of the space same species or 1340 01:15:12,280 --> 01:15:15,560 Speaker 1: from different ones chimeric cells. Right, We've done this with 1341 01:15:15,800 --> 01:15:20,599 Speaker 1: mice before. We've made a mouse that is a chimera 1342 01:15:20,720 --> 01:15:23,120 Speaker 1: of two different species of mouse, and that was created 1343 01:15:23,200 --> 01:15:25,120 Speaker 1: back in the nineteen sixty one, so this has been 1344 01:15:25,360 --> 01:15:28,840 Speaker 1: going on for a while now. Chimeras, however, are not 1345 01:15:29,000 --> 01:15:32,120 Speaker 1: usually like fifty fifty blends of species, right, It's not 1346 01:15:32,240 --> 01:15:34,439 Speaker 1: like one half of you as mouse and the other 1347 01:15:34,520 --> 01:15:38,519 Speaker 1: half of you is shark, right, like you're you're you're. 1348 01:15:39,400 --> 01:15:41,360 Speaker 1: It's a little different from that. So like they've they've 1349 01:15:41,439 --> 01:15:45,800 Speaker 1: made goat sheep chimeras before, and those look like sheep, 1350 01:15:46,280 --> 01:15:49,559 Speaker 1: but they've got like the same briskly fur of goats. Okay, 1351 01:15:49,640 --> 01:15:52,000 Speaker 1: so it's not like it's not like I guess we're 1352 01:15:52,040 --> 01:15:57,920 Speaker 1: imagining like you'd have a blend of perfect features. So yeah, 1353 01:15:58,280 --> 01:16:01,120 Speaker 1: she says, it's possible you could use the same chimeric 1354 01:16:01,280 --> 01:16:03,600 Speaker 1: techniques that you use to make these goat sheep or 1355 01:16:03,640 --> 01:16:08,200 Speaker 1: these these weird mice, uh, to make a human female 1356 01:16:08,800 --> 01:16:13,599 Speaker 1: carry an alien human human hybrid to term. But look 1357 01:16:13,840 --> 01:16:17,200 Speaker 1: this the science that she throws down in there. This 1358 01:16:17,360 --> 01:16:19,120 Speaker 1: is why I think the book is really good, but 1359 01:16:19,200 --> 01:16:21,760 Speaker 1: it doesn't translate well for this medium on a podcast. 1360 01:16:22,120 --> 01:16:24,680 Speaker 1: It's way too complicated to get into here. I think 1361 01:16:24,720 --> 01:16:28,080 Speaker 1: we could do a whole episode just on the idea 1362 01:16:28,320 --> 01:16:35,320 Speaker 1: of chimeric fertilization and like getting a chimeric baby to term. Well, 1363 01:16:35,360 --> 01:16:38,120 Speaker 1: maybe we should. Sometimes it sounds very stuff to blow 1364 01:16:38,160 --> 01:16:41,160 Speaker 1: your mind, so it's possible. We got one more. This 1365 01:16:41,320 --> 01:16:43,519 Speaker 1: is the last one, and this is what she calls 1366 01:16:44,000 --> 01:16:48,080 Speaker 1: the fully integrated hybrid, which is in the TV show. 1367 01:16:48,160 --> 01:16:50,680 Speaker 1: It's along the lines of like when we see um 1368 01:16:51,720 --> 01:16:56,160 Speaker 1: like clones of people, right, there's like multiple like there's 1369 01:16:56,280 --> 01:16:59,479 Speaker 1: multiple Joes. There's like twelve different Joes and they all 1370 01:16:59,560 --> 01:17:03,480 Speaker 1: look exactly like you, but they're all alien human hybrids. 1371 01:17:03,840 --> 01:17:07,120 Speaker 1: And she hypothesizes that this is because every cell contains 1372 01:17:07,240 --> 01:17:12,320 Speaker 1: DNA from both of the organisms. Okay, so that's kind 1373 01:17:12,360 --> 01:17:15,000 Speaker 1: of hard to imagine, but yeah, yeah, I agree, it 1374 01:17:15,120 --> 01:17:17,960 Speaker 1: seems like it would be pretty difficult. The idea that 1375 01:17:18,040 --> 01:17:20,639 Speaker 1: she's pitching here is that you would create a single 1376 01:17:21,200 --> 01:17:25,439 Speaker 1: transgenic or hybrid cell, right, and then from there you 1377 01:17:25,479 --> 01:17:28,479 Speaker 1: would use that with what we have as like modern 1378 01:17:28,560 --> 01:17:32,040 Speaker 1: cloning technique. So think of like Dolly the Sheep um. 1379 01:17:32,400 --> 01:17:34,800 Speaker 1: So we know we can clone an animal from an 1380 01:17:34,840 --> 01:17:38,599 Speaker 1: embryo cell by taking its nucleus out and transferring DNA 1381 01:17:39,280 --> 01:17:42,840 Speaker 1: into from it into an open right. That's how it's 1382 01:17:43,040 --> 01:17:45,200 Speaker 1: sort of how Dolly the Sheep worked. Right, There's a 1383 01:17:45,400 --> 01:17:49,200 Speaker 1: transplantation of a cell's nucleus into an ovum with its 1384 01:17:49,280 --> 01:17:52,680 Speaker 1: own nucleus removed. So this is her pitch for this 1385 01:17:52,960 --> 01:17:55,439 Speaker 1: is that we would do something similar. We'd we'd have 1386 01:17:55,560 --> 01:17:58,960 Speaker 1: an alien hybrid cell and then we would clone a 1387 01:17:59,040 --> 01:18:02,680 Speaker 1: being based off of that cell. But it's more difficult. 1388 01:18:03,240 --> 01:18:05,800 Speaker 1: Uh So, for instance, like with Dollars sheep, it was 1389 01:18:05,840 --> 01:18:09,440 Speaker 1: particularly difficult because it was adult cells. They've already differentiated. 1390 01:18:11,040 --> 01:18:13,880 Speaker 1: There's all different kinds of ways that you can get 1391 01:18:13,960 --> 01:18:17,400 Speaker 1: DNA into a cell though, and again like this this 1392 01:18:17,520 --> 01:18:20,160 Speaker 1: could be a whole hour long episode of stuff to 1393 01:18:20,200 --> 01:18:23,120 Speaker 1: blow your mind. But we can do things like using 1394 01:18:23,200 --> 01:18:26,679 Speaker 1: high voltage electricity to allow DNA to enter into a cell, 1395 01:18:27,160 --> 01:18:31,800 Speaker 1: or we micro inject these directly into cells with tnc 1396 01:18:31,920 --> 01:18:35,479 Speaker 1: tiny little needles, or this one sounds like my favorite, 1397 01:18:35,840 --> 01:18:40,520 Speaker 1: this has been done shooting cells with high velocity microscopic 1398 01:18:40,720 --> 01:18:45,200 Speaker 1: DNA bullets the gene gun. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So she 1399 01:18:45,400 --> 01:18:49,000 Speaker 1: pitches like, those are all ways that we could potentially 1400 01:18:49,200 --> 01:18:52,120 Speaker 1: have these alien human hybrids. But let me go back 1401 01:18:52,160 --> 01:18:54,320 Speaker 1: to the beginning and say on the show, it doesn't 1402 01:18:54,360 --> 01:18:56,880 Speaker 1: add up, right, they don't. They don't stick to one 1403 01:18:56,960 --> 01:18:59,680 Speaker 1: of these and follow it all the way through. It's 1404 01:18:59,760 --> 01:19:02,040 Speaker 1: just kind of a mishmash of all of these things. 1405 01:19:02,400 --> 01:19:05,080 Speaker 1: Uh so, maybe the aliens themselves and the X Files 1406 01:19:05,160 --> 01:19:09,160 Speaker 1: really haven't ironed this out yet. There, that would be 1407 01:19:09,240 --> 01:19:11,280 Speaker 1: a wonderful thing that I don't know, have we ever 1408 01:19:11,400 --> 01:19:14,680 Speaker 1: seen that in science fiction where there's just a completely 1409 01:19:14,960 --> 01:19:19,000 Speaker 1: disorganized attempt to attack and take over the Earth. It's 1410 01:19:19,080 --> 01:19:22,800 Speaker 1: just like the aliens really can't get it together. I 1411 01:19:22,880 --> 01:19:27,000 Speaker 1: don't know, I don't know. Independence day, No, they're so 1412 01:19:27,160 --> 01:19:30,599 Speaker 1: highly coordinated. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, I want to see 1413 01:19:30,640 --> 01:19:33,880 Speaker 1: that maybe Plan nine from outer space that seems like 1414 01:19:34,200 --> 01:19:35,880 Speaker 1: an attempt to take over the Earth that is kind 1415 01:19:35,880 --> 01:19:38,000 Speaker 1: of thrown together at the last minute. Although I think 1416 01:19:38,040 --> 01:19:39,800 Speaker 1: you blame that on Edwood more than you could on 1417 01:19:39,880 --> 01:19:43,040 Speaker 1: the Aliens. Yea, I guess so. So there you have it, 1418 01:19:43,360 --> 01:19:46,800 Speaker 1: the Science of the X Files. We've got two episodes 1419 01:19:46,840 --> 01:19:49,280 Speaker 1: and I think we're looking at almost three hours worth 1420 01:19:49,800 --> 01:19:52,320 Speaker 1: of science of the X Files. Goodness here for you. 1421 01:19:53,200 --> 01:19:56,000 Speaker 1: If you have any questions or comments for us, If 1422 01:19:56,040 --> 01:19:58,600 Speaker 1: you want to let us know some of your hypotheses 1423 01:19:58,720 --> 01:20:02,280 Speaker 1: on ways in which science modern science could apply to 1424 01:20:02,520 --> 01:20:05,320 Speaker 1: X Files episodes. Some of the science we're talking about here, 1425 01:20:05,360 --> 01:20:11,040 Speaker 1: alien hybridization, the be weaponization, whatever it is, let us know. 1426 01:20:11,640 --> 01:20:16,040 Speaker 1: Worry everywhere, right, Yeah, you can check us out on Facebook, Twitter, Tumbler, 1427 01:20:16,120 --> 01:20:18,720 Speaker 1: where our handle is blow the Mind, or you can 1428 01:20:18,800 --> 01:20:21,960 Speaker 1: catch us on periscope at noon Eastern Standard time on 1429 01:20:22,080 --> 01:20:24,880 Speaker 1: Friday's or you can go to the best of all 1430 01:20:25,080 --> 01:20:28,040 Speaker 1: possible worlds Stuff to Blow your Mind dot com. That 1431 01:20:28,400 --> 01:20:31,320 Speaker 1: is the mother ship that will beam you up and 1432 01:20:31,479 --> 01:20:34,000 Speaker 1: do experiments on your body, but in a good way. 1433 01:20:34,080 --> 01:20:35,960 Speaker 1: So you should check it out. And if you want 1434 01:20:36,000 --> 01:20:38,160 Speaker 1: to write to us directly, if you want to, you know, 1435 01:20:38,240 --> 01:20:40,000 Speaker 1: you don't want the whole world to see what you're 1436 01:20:40,000 --> 01:20:42,280 Speaker 1: saying to us. We've got something private you want to say. 1437 01:20:42,360 --> 01:20:46,160 Speaker 1: Maybe you were an alien abduct and you have an 1438 01:20:46,439 --> 01:20:50,559 Speaker 1: argument with us about our portrayal of regression hypnosis, let's 1439 01:20:50,560 --> 01:20:53,800 Speaker 1: say let's say that's it right to us at blow 1440 01:20:53,880 --> 01:21:05,080 Speaker 1: the Mind at how stuff works dot com. For more 1441 01:21:05,160 --> 01:21:07,519 Speaker 1: on this than thousands of other topics. Is that house 1442 01:21:07,520 --> 01:21:24,759 Speaker 1: stuff Works dot com. Fou