WEBVTT - Short Stuff: The @ Symbol

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, and welcome to the short stuff. I'm Josh. There's Chuck.

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<v Speaker 1>Go go go, let's go. This is Josh. That's man.

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<v Speaker 1>I just did it again. Do you want to start over? Sure? Hey,

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<v Speaker 1>and welcome to the short stuff. I'm Josh. There's Chuck.

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<v Speaker 1>There's Chuck. I did it again. Hey and welcome to

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<v Speaker 1>the short stuff. I'm Josh. There's Chuck. Let's get started perfect.

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<v Speaker 1>No one will ever know, so. Uh. This is put

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<v Speaker 1>together by our buddy Dave Rouse for how stuff works

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<v Speaker 1>dot com. And this is a great one about the

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<v Speaker 1>at symbol and I love this stuff. This is These

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<v Speaker 1>are the ones that are those uh nice little dinner

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<v Speaker 1>party nuggets that you can whip out in right when

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<v Speaker 1>you can eat dinner with humans. Again, that's not that's

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<v Speaker 1>not obnoxious. It's not one of those that makes people

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<v Speaker 1>roll their eyes. It's a little one where people go, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>that's a really cool little nugget. Thank you for that.

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<v Speaker 1>Give me an example of an obnoxious one. I know

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<v Speaker 1>what you mean, but like, what is it? What it

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<v Speaker 1>could be an example? Because I know what you mean,

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<v Speaker 1>but I can't put my finger on it. Do we

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<v Speaker 1>have time? I know this is a short I don't.

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<v Speaker 1>I can't think of a specific example, but it's also

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<v Speaker 1>in the delivery too, and the one uh, the one

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<v Speaker 1>way you're guaranteed to be obnoxious, as if someone says

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<v Speaker 1>something kind of cool and you go, well, actually, and

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<v Speaker 1>then say anything else. There's a life lesson from Chuck

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<v Speaker 1>right there. Never say well actually to any human so, um,

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<v Speaker 1>that's true, or push your glasses up while you're saying that,

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<v Speaker 1>right right, that's another two word combination that's awful, like

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<v Speaker 1>canal well actually, well, actually, what we're talking about is

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<v Speaker 1>the at symbol. And in America we have the most

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<v Speaker 1>boring name for a symbol that's basically everywhere in the

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<v Speaker 1>world that has a better name for it than in America,

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<v Speaker 1>we just call it the symbol. It's really functional and functionary,

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<v Speaker 1>I think. So let's let's go around the world, Yeah

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<v Speaker 1>we Chuck. Let's start off in Germany. Yes, if you

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<v Speaker 1>go to Germany, you would call it the Klamarafa spider monkey. Sure, well,

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<v Speaker 1>you have to say spider monkey in a German accent too,

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<v Speaker 1>spider monkey. Uh. In Israel it's called a struddale because

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<v Speaker 1>it does kind of look like a struddle a little bit.

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<v Speaker 1>Um what about in Hungary. Well, in Hungary, you're gonna

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<v Speaker 1>go with a ku kak, I don't know if it's

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<v Speaker 1>a kuka. Let's go with that, it's a worm. It

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<v Speaker 1>sounds way more Hungarian. What about in in Norway? Norway

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<v Speaker 1>it's a pigstail, which is a grizz hole. Yes, and

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<v Speaker 1>then it's a ghoul or rose in Turkey. So everywhere,

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<v Speaker 1>and in Spain it's called an a roba. And the

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<v Speaker 1>reason that Spain is worth calling out, it's actually in

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<v Speaker 1>the title of this house stuff Works article from ruse Um,

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<v Speaker 1>is because they think that aroba is actually the oldest

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<v Speaker 1>name for that symbol that we call the at symbol

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<v Speaker 1>in the entire world. That's right. Uh, if you go

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<v Speaker 1>to Spain or any kind of Spanish speaking country now

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<v Speaker 1>and you go to a market, let's say, you will

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<v Speaker 1>see the sign called the aeroba, and it is depending

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<v Speaker 1>on where you are, what Spanish speaking country you're in,

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<v Speaker 1>um it is. It's a quantity. So if you go

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<v Speaker 1>to Bolivia, let's say, and you want potatoes, you could

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<v Speaker 1>get one aeroba of potatoes it's about a bushel, or

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<v Speaker 1>an aroba of oil is about three gallons. Okay, So

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<v Speaker 1>now that you know that you can translate in aroba

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<v Speaker 1>into absolutely anything you find in the market, right, I

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<v Speaker 1>guess no. No, the answer is no, because, for some

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<v Speaker 1>weird reason, in aroba of oil is about three gallons

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<v Speaker 1>or some at each point three leaders, and aroba wine

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<v Speaker 1>is over four gallons. It's fifteen point one. This makes

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<v Speaker 1>zero sense at all. Yeah, I think you just have

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<v Speaker 1>to know what product you're getting what an aeroba is

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<v Speaker 1>equivalent to. Yes, you do. And that's weird because measurements

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<v Speaker 1>are meant to standardize things, and you standardized liquid or

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<v Speaker 1>you standardized mass. But the Spanish said, no, we're not

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<v Speaker 1>doing that. We're going our own way. Um, why don't

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<v Speaker 1>you just have some of our delightful topics and stop complaining?

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<v Speaker 1>That's right? But Rus do then and got his hands

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<v Speaker 1>on a book from Keith Houston or Houston Shady Characters

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<v Speaker 1>colon the Secret Life of punctuation symbols and other type

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<v Speaker 1>of graphical marks, And in that is a two part

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<v Speaker 1>history of the AT symbol, where Mr Houston or Houston,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure which one it is. I'm going to Houston.

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<v Speaker 1>I think George is the only place in the world

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<v Speaker 1>that pronounces at Houston. Oh wait, no, that's what they

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<v Speaker 1>call that street in New York too, don't they. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>you said Houston Street in New York, They're like, get

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<v Speaker 1>a rope. Hey, is that at the corner of Houston

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<v Speaker 1>and Avenue of the America's You know, I was referencing

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<v Speaker 1>the famous Pace Picante commercial. Oh yeah, New York City,

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<v Speaker 1>get a rope. So anyway, Greeks and Romans, Mr. Houston

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<v Speaker 1>points out, were the first people that were trading these

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<v Speaker 1>commodities uh in markets and using something called uh m

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<v Speaker 1>for a as the measurement. It was the ceramic sort

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<v Speaker 1>of long necked ceramic jar. Yeah, with the two handles

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<v Speaker 1>called an M sorry M for a. Yeah, that's plural, right,

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<v Speaker 1>and I was about seven gallons. So that was Greece

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<v Speaker 1>and Rome. Then the Spanish and Portuguese picked it up

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<v Speaker 1>for their commodities, but they called it the aroba. They did,

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<v Speaker 1>but not at first. Apparently a roba comes from um

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<v Speaker 1>the Arabic for al rub, which means one fourth or

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<v Speaker 1>a quarter, and the ancient Portuguese and Spanish traders worked

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<v Speaker 1>pretty closely with some of the Moors who lived in

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<v Speaker 1>the area as well, and actually ran the place for

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<v Speaker 1>about seven hundred years or more, get it or more,

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<v Speaker 1>and so that the that Arabic rubbed off al rub

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<v Speaker 1>rubbed off onto the Spanish and Portuguese. I don't know

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<v Speaker 1>where all this word play is coming from. It's making

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<v Speaker 1>me panic a little bit. But the point is is

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<v Speaker 1>in aroba did not necessarily stand in for amphora. It

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<v Speaker 1>meant a quarter of something, or about twenty five pounds,

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<v Speaker 1>and then eventually it's somehow made the switch over to

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<v Speaker 1>be the same thing as an amphora, which again is

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<v Speaker 1>that vessel that's used for storage but also a unit

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<v Speaker 1>of measurement, usually a liquid measurement. And some researcher figured

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<v Speaker 1>out that somewhere between the Middle Ages and the Renaissance

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<v Speaker 1>and flora and arooba became synonymous with one another. That's right,

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<v Speaker 1>and we're gonna take a little break and we'll tell

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<v Speaker 1>you what all of this has to do with the

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<v Speaker 1>AT symbol right after this. Well, now we're on the road,

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<v Speaker 1>driving in your truck. Want to learn a thing or

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<v Speaker 1>two from Josh man Chuck. It's stuff you should know,

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<v Speaker 1>all right, alrighty, So we've been talking a lot about

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<v Speaker 1>these words that are units of measurement, But what has

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<v Speaker 1>this all got to do with the AT sign, what

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<v Speaker 1>we call the AT sign uh. An Italian historian found

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<v Speaker 1>this out in two thousand, a man named Giorgio Stabile.

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<v Speaker 1>He's a professor of history in science or history of

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<v Speaker 1>science at La Sapiens University in Rome, and he found

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<v Speaker 1>a letter from fifty six that showed the AT symbol

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<v Speaker 1>as used as a shorthand for amphora. Yeah, the guy

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<v Speaker 1>there it is the first one. Yeah, the the guy

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<v Speaker 1>who wrote the wrote the letter back in six, Francesco Loppy.

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<v Speaker 1>He was describing an amphora of wine, but rather than

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<v Speaker 1>use the word amphora, he used the AT symbol. And

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<v Speaker 1>it's like you're saying, as far as anybody can tell,

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<v Speaker 1>that's it. That's the first use of that ever. And

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<v Speaker 1>then the fact that um in Spain that this was

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<v Speaker 1>the same thing as amphora. It shows that since we

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<v Speaker 1>know that amphora and uh aroba or became interchangeable, then

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<v Speaker 1>that we know that Aroba is the oldest known descriptor

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<v Speaker 1>of what we call the AT symbol here in the States,

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<v Speaker 1>that's right. And then here in the States, and we're

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<v Speaker 1>getting to how it became like twitter handle. Yeah, just wait, everybody,

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<v Speaker 1>we'll get to it in part three of this episode.

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<v Speaker 1>This is sort of a long one for a shorty,

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<v Speaker 1>but that's right. Um. Here in the States, it became

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<v Speaker 1>known as just shorthand for at the rate of something.

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<v Speaker 1>So if you were, uh, if you worked at a

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<v Speaker 1>warehouse or whatever, and you're filling out your order form,

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<v Speaker 1>you would say, I need a hundred tons of of

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<v Speaker 1>whatever at this price per ton, and you would use

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<v Speaker 1>that little AT symbol and they'll say, nice, try, We'll

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<v Speaker 1>be telling you what price you're going to be paying. Uh.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's sort of the way it was used in

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<v Speaker 1>America and our commerce. It was just like, this is

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<v Speaker 1>at the rate of this, and that's what this little

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<v Speaker 1>symbol means. And um, I mean that's basically what it's

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<v Speaker 1>always meant in English, at least or in the United States. UM.

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<v Speaker 1>And it still is use that, yeah, for sure, for sure. UM.

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<v Speaker 1>We never used it to equate amphora or any kind

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<v Speaker 1>of unit of measurement. It was just like you said,

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<v Speaker 1>at the rate of um. But we typically tend to

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<v Speaker 1>think of the AT symbol as a a keyboard key.

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<v Speaker 1>But it didn't make it onto keyboards as at least

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<v Speaker 1>in the form of typewriters until I think the brown

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<v Speaker 1>the turn of the nineteenth century, and typewriters have been

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<v Speaker 1>around for a while before them, but they were not

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<v Speaker 1>like the kind of keyboards that we understand now. They

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<v Speaker 1>only had the letters are the numbers two through nine

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<v Speaker 1>on them, all the letters of the alphabet, so they

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<v Speaker 1>didn't have any room for any kind of fancy AT

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<v Speaker 1>symbol or anything like that. Yeah, the the dollar sign

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<v Speaker 1>and the AT symbol came about, like you said, the

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<v Speaker 1>end of the nineteenth century, and then in the nineteen fifties,

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<v Speaker 1>the AT sign was made or I was added to

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<v Speaker 1>the binary code decimal interchange code, the b C D

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<v Speaker 1>I C, which were these forty eight characters that were

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<v Speaker 1>printed on those punch cards, those early computer punch cards. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>they used their word code twice in that I know,

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<v Speaker 1>binary coded decimal interchange code. So um so kind of

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<v Speaker 1>made it's on trade into computing all the way back

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<v Speaker 1>in the fifties, and then by nine sixty one IBM

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<v Speaker 1>used it in its programming code. Uh, and it's one

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<v Speaker 1>of its early supercomputers, the Stretch. UM. So from that

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<v Speaker 1>moment on, the AS sign has always kind of been

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<v Speaker 1>there hanging around, but it wasn't until ninety one when

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<v Speaker 1>a guy named Ray Tomlinson, who was working UM with

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<v Speaker 1>the Advanced Research Project Agencies, first stab at what would

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<v Speaker 1>become the Internet arponnet. That it became um the symbol

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<v Speaker 1>that we know and love today, which is the thing

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<v Speaker 1>the fulcrum that an email address moves up and down on.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh man, I'd love that word up and down on

0:11:45.160 --> 0:11:49.080
<v Speaker 1>on fulcrum. Fulcrum is pretty great, so great. So his

0:11:49.160 --> 0:11:51.800
<v Speaker 1>job there was to write programs that we're going to

0:11:51.920 --> 0:11:55.480
<v Speaker 1>run on this arponnet network. And he was connecting nineteen

0:11:55.760 --> 0:12:00.520
<v Speaker 1>computers in nineteen seventy one, and the electron mail at

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<v Speaker 1>the time was basically it was very cute. It was

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<v Speaker 1>basically a message that you could save on a computer

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<v Speaker 1>and then opened later by a different person, but on

0:12:10.880 --> 0:12:13.480
<v Speaker 1>that same computer, no one was sending anything at the time.

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<v Speaker 1>It was like a digital post it basically, yeah, exactly.

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<v Speaker 1>It would have probably been more efficient to just leave

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<v Speaker 1>a post it was, but they were trying to electrify

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<v Speaker 1>or I guess digitize everything, right, it's electrifying. So he said,

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<v Speaker 1>you know what, what would be really cool is if

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<v Speaker 1>I could take this little digital post it note and

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<v Speaker 1>actually send it across the room to that computer that

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<v Speaker 1>I'm connected to. How can I do this? So, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>he figured out that there was a I don't know

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<v Speaker 1>if an easy way to do it is the right

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<v Speaker 1>way to put it. But one of the things that

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<v Speaker 1>he had to to establish was how to identify one

0:12:52.800 --> 0:12:56.400
<v Speaker 1>computer from another as far as you know, the protocol

0:12:56.480 --> 0:12:59.880
<v Speaker 1>was concerned. And so he came up with email addresses

0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:04.120
<v Speaker 1>basically what we would call email addresses today. Um. And

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<v Speaker 1>that he inserted the AT symbol basically for a couple

0:13:06.720 --> 0:13:10.360
<v Speaker 1>of reasons. One, it already made sense as AT because

0:13:10.360 --> 0:13:12.400
<v Speaker 1>it was at the rate of so AT's right there

0:13:12.440 --> 0:13:15.400
<v Speaker 1>in the in the thing the symbol stands for. It's

0:13:15.400 --> 0:13:18.200
<v Speaker 1>not like some big stretch of the imagination when you

0:13:18.240 --> 0:13:20.840
<v Speaker 1>see that. Yeah, he just meant that this computer to

0:13:20.920 --> 0:13:23.880
<v Speaker 1>go to that one at at that one over there,

0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:26.880
<v Speaker 1>or this user at this computer or something like that.

0:13:27.200 --> 0:13:29.680
<v Speaker 1>And so Um. The other thing was that it hadn't

0:13:29.720 --> 0:13:32.679
<v Speaker 1>really been used in any of the coding language that

0:13:32.880 --> 0:13:35.480
<v Speaker 1>ARPA net was was based on, So it was kind

0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:37.480
<v Speaker 1>of like a free symbol just hanging out there. And

0:13:37.800 --> 0:13:40.800
<v Speaker 1>that's how AT got drafted into becoming one of the

0:13:40.840 --> 0:13:46.360
<v Speaker 1>most most used symbols in computer programming today. Yeah, he

0:13:46.440 --> 0:13:50.440
<v Speaker 1>sent that very first test message to um what we

0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:54.959
<v Speaker 1>think is the very first email address Tomlinson at BBN

0:13:55.120 --> 0:14:01.560
<v Speaker 1>dash uh ten exa full stop. Right, you're waiting for

0:14:01.800 --> 0:14:04.600
<v Speaker 1>dot something but dot EU. Yeah, they didn't need it

0:14:04.640 --> 0:14:07.959
<v Speaker 1>at the time. I guess, so that's I mean, that's

0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:11.560
<v Speaker 1>how they add symbol became so great, so so great.

0:14:11.760 --> 0:14:15.800
<v Speaker 1>Love it, uh and I guess since Chuck said love it,

0:14:15.880 --> 0:14:18.360
<v Speaker 1>that's it for short Stuff, which means short Stuff is out.

0:14:21.560 --> 0:14:23.800
<v Speaker 1>Stuff you should know is a production of iHeart Radios

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