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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Saber Prediction of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: I'm Annie Reese, an unwarn vocal bomb, and today we

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Speaker 2: have a classic episode for you about pickles.

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Speaker 1: Yes. Yes, And I joked with Lauren when when you

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Speaker 1: were like, let's do it, let's bring back the pickles

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Speaker 1: episode immediately cravings. Yeah, And as I talk about it

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Speaker 1: in here, I'm not like a huge pickle person. I've

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Speaker 1: had times in my life where I was okay, but

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Speaker 1: there's something about when you want a pickle craving, there's nothing.

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Speaker 2: Nothing else I'll do.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: You have to give into it. You just have to

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Speaker 2: go with it. That's it.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Yes, And I looked up how to make pickles

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Speaker 1: just based on you mentioning this because we have a

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Speaker 1: good friend that we talked about in here who makes

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Speaker 1: makes his own pickles. And I was like, maybe I

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Speaker 1: can do that. And then I looked at the It

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Speaker 1: was the hot water bath that strust me out to

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Speaker 1: be honest, Oh.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I do. You've got some blanching trauma in your past,

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Speaker 2: so some things are holding me back.

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Speaker 1: I might try it, though. I I'm open to the

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Speaker 1: idea of making Pickles's that's good. That's good.

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Speaker 2: I'm glad that you're open. That's a good, good character trait.

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Speaker 2: I do want to reassure you, as I have done

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Speaker 2: in the past when you have brought up your blanching trauma,

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Speaker 2: that things like tongs and gloves do exist. They do exist.

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Speaker 2: You don't have to scald your hands.

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Speaker 1: It's true. I I once said a friend, say, you

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Speaker 1: are like the worst person for ignoring the easiest fair

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Speaker 1: Was there any reason pickles are on your mind?

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Speaker 2: We did that episode one thousand Island Dressing and we

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Speaker 2: were talking about pickles in it, and I was looking

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Speaker 2: for a classic and I was like, well, Pickles, let's

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Speaker 2: do it. And I listened and it was heck and delightful.

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Speaker 2: So here we are. The original episode aired in September

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Speaker 2: of twenty eighteen, so that was a minute ago. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I have to say, pickles, I do associate

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Speaker 1: with summer.

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Speaker 2: Sure, it is.

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Speaker 1: Getting warm here in Atlanta, so a pickle would be.

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Speaker 2: Refreshing, it would be oh, it would be yeah, I

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Speaker 2: need to I need to get to a good deli.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Oh no, the craving is really strong. It is okay, Well,

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Speaker 1: perhaps we should let pass Annie and Lauren take it away. Hello,

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Speaker 1: and welcome to food Stuff.

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Speaker 2: I'm Anny Reech and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum, and today we're

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Speaker 2: talking about pickles.

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Speaker 1: Yes, it has finally arrived the pickle episode. We mentioned

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Speaker 1: doing it in our cucumber episode, which you should totally

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Speaker 1: listen to.

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Speaker 2: Yes for an exhaustive scientific and historical look into cucumbers.

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Speaker 2: As we are known for, we exhaust people for food stuff.

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Speaker 1: We do. It's a great slogan. But yeah, we've been

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Speaker 1: working on this one for a while and pretty excited

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Speaker 1: to talk about it. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's entirely great.

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Speaker 1: It is. And one of the first questions I had

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Speaker 1: about pickles because I'm I like pickles, but you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm not as big a fan as a lot of

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Speaker 1: people are. Okay, I find but when I was a kid,

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Speaker 1: I loved pickle.

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Speaker 2: Juice, not the pickles, just the pickle juice.

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Speaker 1: I would drink it as if I was at a

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Speaker 1: bar doing shots. Got of a little sippy cup. And

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Speaker 1: my little brother was into pickle juice too, and he

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Speaker 1: was into it even more than I was.

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Speaker 2: Oh wow.

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Speaker 1: And my parents gave him a pickle ornament for Christmas

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Speaker 1: one year, which is totally a thing. And I did

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Speaker 1: not know that.

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Speaker 2: Oh, okay, all right, it's a Midwestern thing and no

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Speaker 2: one is really sure how it started. But the Christmas

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Speaker 2: pickle or the vine lutskirt ke ooh, is a pickle

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Speaker 2: shaped ornament and it's the last ornament you place on

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Speaker 2: your Christmas tree on Christmas Eve, and you kind of

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Speaker 2: hide it somewhere back in the branches, and then on

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Speaker 2: Christmas Morning, the first kid who finds the Christmas pickle

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Speaker 2: gets a special present.

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Speaker 1: Oh I would win at that. My older brother better

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Speaker 1: be glad I didn't know about this.

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Speaker 2: And despite the fact that it's like a German word, uh,

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Speaker 2: And the people of the Midwest who participate in this

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Speaker 2: tradition are generally of German heritage, and they call it

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Speaker 2: the German Christmas pickle. Germans had no bloody idea that

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Speaker 2: this was a thing until like it came back from America,

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Speaker 2: like like in the past decade, like everyone, I mean,

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Speaker 2: And since then, sales of the Christmas pickle have really

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Speaker 2: picked up in Germany.

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Speaker 1: I love it, like one of these weird Americans up

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Speaker 1: to and saying it was our ideas.

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Speaker 2: But hey, but hey, Christmas pick my Christmas pickle. Fine,

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Speaker 2: let's wirk it.

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Speaker 1: I love it and just a fun side note before

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Speaker 1: we get started. Last year at jig Con, the most

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Speaker 1: popular costume five are was Pickle Rick from Rick and Morty.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely I saw a really good one. I saw some

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Speaker 2: you know, like okay, some like mid level you know,

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Speaker 2: like you tried gold Star kind of yeah, kind of

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Speaker 2: Pickle Ricks. But man, there was one that was like

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Speaker 2: on stilts and it was giant and yes, like and

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Speaker 2: it had like all the creepy like accoutrement, like buzzsaw

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Speaker 2: kind of attachments and all that.

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Speaker 1: It was.

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Speaker 2: It was a pickle to behold.

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Speaker 1: It was a pickle to behold. I was fortunate enough

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Speaker 1: to march in the parade, the Giant Comprade this year,

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Speaker 1: and I was in the here is in Villain's section

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Speaker 1: and specifically in the Captain America section, and for some

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Speaker 1: reason there was a Pickle Rick. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: there was a pun there that I didn't get, but he.

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Speaker 2: Like wasn't carrying a cap shield or anything like that.

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Speaker 2: It was just Pickle Rick.

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Speaker 1: It was just Picklerick. And he didn't like run in

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Speaker 1: or like march in late. He lined up with us

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Speaker 1: in the hour before, like he was there the entire time.

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Speaker 1: This was his section. You know, he didn't seem to

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Speaker 1: have any friends in there.

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Speaker 2: Pickle Rick moves in mysterious ways.

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Speaker 1: I this is true, and we should probably move on

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Speaker 1: to our question pickles. What are they?

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Speaker 2: Well, pickle is both a noun and a verb, and

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Speaker 2: you can pickle any number of foods. But today we

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Speaker 2: are concentrating on what probably comes to mind first for

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Speaker 2: most Americans when you say pickle, a pickled cucumber.

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Speaker 1: And Bona Patite tells me that England pickle refers to

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Speaker 1: what we call in the States relish.

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Speaker 2: Like like chopped pickled cucumber and probably other vegetables. Yeah, yeah, yes,

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Speaker 2: that's true.

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Speaker 1: Is it true? Yeah, well this must be confusing for

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Speaker 1: our English listeners.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, sorry about it.

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Speaker 1: Well, you know, we can't control language. We're not that powerful.

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Speaker 1: We're powerful.

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Speaker 2: We're working towards it.

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Speaker 1: We are, slowly, but surely we are.

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Speaker 2: So okay, all right? Pickled cucumber. A cucumber is an oblong,

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Speaker 2: greenish fruit that's crunchy and kind of cool and fresh tasting.

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Speaker 2: The vines that they grow on tend to go from

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Speaker 2: zero to like all of the ripe cucumbers all at

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Speaker 2: the same time, within like a single week, and so

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Speaker 2: therefore you've got to preserve some of them somehow, or

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Speaker 2: you've just got a lot of rotten cucumbers on your hands.

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Speaker 1: Don't want that unless you're super producer Dylan, who hates cucumbers, but.

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Speaker 2: He does like pickles. He does, so I think that

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Speaker 2: I think he would more approve of the I mean, actually,

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Speaker 2: I guess it could go either way. It depends on

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Speaker 2: how evil is feel in that day, either pickle them

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Speaker 2: or destroy. To pickle is to preserve a food in

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Speaker 2: an acidic solution, which a makes the food taste kind

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Speaker 2: of more sour and or puckery, and b makes it

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Speaker 2: last longer. And we've talked before on the show about

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Speaker 2: how when food goes bad, microorganisms have started to eat

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Speaker 2: it before you got a chance to. They'll eat the

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Speaker 2: food and excrete stuff that smells and tastes rotten. And

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Speaker 2: if they're infesting food that you do eat, they might

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Speaker 2: make you sick. Bad times all around. But one of

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Speaker 2: the things about microorganisms is that they are more sensitive

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Speaker 2: to acids than we are. Let's talk about the pH

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Speaker 2: scale for a second. This is a spectrum that scientists

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Speaker 2: created in the nineteen oughts when they were trying to

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Speaker 2: make beer tastier. Thanks Carlsberg.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, thanks.

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Speaker 2: It ranges from zero to fourteen. Anything above seven is

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Speaker 2: considered basic, not like it likes pumpkin spice lattes, like

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Speaker 2: it's the opposite of acidic, because anything under seven is

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Speaker 2: considered acidic. Seven is neutral. Whereas we humans find things

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Speaker 2: in the two to four point five range of the

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Speaker 2: scale to be pleasantly tart, most microbes find it intolerable,

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Speaker 2: like they cannot eat that stuff or survive in it.

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Speaker 2: Sort of the way that we'd find a planet filled

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Speaker 2: with hydrochloric acid to be inhospitable. Wouldn't want to live there,

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Speaker 2: wouldn't want to eat it.

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Speaker 1: You wouldn't want to eat it.

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Speaker 2: Not a planet made of hydrochloric acid.

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Speaker 1: No, I may or may not be some evil superhero

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Speaker 1: that eats planet side on. Now. I don't really want

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Speaker 1: to talk about it right now.

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Speaker 2: That's entirely fair. I can keep going. I appreciate it, Okay.

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Speaker 2: So if you make your food drop down into that

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Speaker 2: two to four point five range, microbes won't eat it

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Speaker 2: and the food.

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Speaker 1: Will last longer. Huzzahazza.

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Speaker 2: Adding a salt or sugar or both to this acidic

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Speaker 2: solution helps with the fluid transfer of water out from

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Speaker 2: the cucumber and acidic stuff into the cucumber.

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Speaker 1: And the word pickle probably comes from either the Dutch

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Speaker 1: word peckle or the German word pokel, both of which

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Speaker 1: means salt or brine.

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Speaker 2: Yes, because of this salt thing, and the spices typically

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Speaker 2: used in pickles often do have antimicrobial properties, which is

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Speaker 2: probably how humans wound up incorporating them into their recipes,

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Speaker 2: you know, like garlic, mustard, seed, cloves, stuff like that.

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Speaker 1: M hm.

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Speaker 2: And Okay, when you're talking about pickles, there are two

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Speaker 2: basic types. Also, the word pickles, y'all, is never going

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Speaker 2: to stop being funny. I just love it, okay anyway,

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Speaker 2: Just know that I'm giggling every single time I say it.

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Speaker 1: Uh. Okay.

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Speaker 2: So you've got quick pickles, which you brine in vinegar

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Speaker 2: plus salt and other stuff, and fermented pickles, which you

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Speaker 2: brine in brine just like plain salt water plus whatever

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Speaker 2: flavorings you want to add. And how that fermented brine

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Speaker 2: thing works is that instead of adding your own acid

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Speaker 2: like a vinegar, you're setting up a wee little bacteria

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Speaker 2: farm so that the bacteria will create the acid for you.

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Speaker 1: Does this mean what I think it means? Oh?

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Speaker 2: Yes, it means bacterial poop.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So, if you set out a loosely covered jar of

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Speaker 2: cucumbers in brine, the lactic acid bacteria that just live

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Speaker 2: kind of everywhere. We've talked about this in our cheese

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Speaker 2: and yogard episodes will set up shop in the jar.

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Speaker 2: The salt solution will draw out some of the sugars

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Speaker 2: from the cucumbers into the into the brine, the bacteria

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Speaker 2: will eat the sugars and poop lactic acid. Acid infuses

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Speaker 2: the cucumbers, more bacteria grow, repeat, and in a couple

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Speaker 2: of weeks you've got pickles. Hi And I said that

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Speaker 2: you want to cover the jars loosely. It's loosely because

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Speaker 2: the bacteria also poop carbon dioxide gas. I guess they

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Speaker 2: fart it. It's not really a poop thing, which could

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Speaker 2: make a jar explode if you know.

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Speaker 1: Close it tightly.

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Speaker 2: Don't want to do that.

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Speaker 1: No. No.

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Speaker 2: Vinegar, by the way, is generally a fruit or vegetable

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Speaker 2: juice that's been exposed to yeasts that eat their sugars

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Speaker 2: and poop alcohol. Thus making like wine or cider or beer,

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Speaker 2: and then that alcoholic stuff is exposed to acetobacter, which

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Speaker 2: are bacteria that eat alcohol and poop acetic acid. So

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Speaker 2: you're really just buying your bacteria poop ready made when

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Speaker 2: you pickle with vinegar.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to think about it like that. From here on.

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Speaker 2: It perfect. Yes, I've done my job, and I guess.

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Speaker 2: Just just a linguistic note. You can also see pickles

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Speaker 2: made with vinegar being referred to as fresh packed pickles

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Speaker 2: or refrigerator pickles in addition to quick pickles.

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Speaker 1: I'd never paid much attention to to how things are labeled.

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Speaker 1: I look at what's in it, but I don't look

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Speaker 1: at the actual name.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I need to, Well, until you know what the

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Speaker 2: difference is, I guess it doesn't really remember.

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Speaker 1: Like recently, I had to buy stuff where we were

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Speaker 1: making that pickle sandwich.

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Speaker 2: Oh right, the pickle peanut butter mayo mayo, and then

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Speaker 2: the pickle peanut butter and vealveta.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And I was like texting you like, what is this?

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Speaker 1: I don't know what this means.

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Speaker 2: There's so many pickles, what do I want?

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Speaker 1: And I still messed it up.

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Speaker 2: It's Okay, it was still incredibly bizarre.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it was all right. Yeah, I feel like most

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Speaker 1: of my reviews would be that, Yeah, I liked it.

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Speaker 1: It's okay, I.

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Speaker 2: Got to eat peanut butter. That was nice.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, yes, I mean obviously, so.

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Speaker 2: There are lots of types of gold cucumbers, but here

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Speaker 2: are a few popular ones.

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Speaker 1: There's gurkin, and we discussed this in our cucumber episode.

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Speaker 1: This is not technically a cucumber. It's highly technical, but

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Speaker 1: we do often call it a pickle. There's kosher dill.

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Speaker 1: The kosher here means that the pickle was made in

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Speaker 1: a traditional Jewish manner, not that it was made under

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Speaker 1: Rabbi supervision. There's polish and this is a type of

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Speaker 1: pickle originally from Northern Europe where no vinegar is used

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Speaker 1: in the brine. Instead, salt and natural fermentation are used.

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Speaker 1: And then there's bread and butter. This is the pickle

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Speaker 1: I accidentally brought for our sandwich experiment. These are a

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Speaker 1: bit sweeter thanks to the higher levels of sugar added

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Speaker 1: to the brine.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and any of these, I mean it really you

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Speaker 2: really just have to look at the labeling pickled to

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Speaker 2: pickle to see whether it was fermented. I mean, aside

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Speaker 2: from types like polish that are usually almost always I don't.

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Speaker 1: Know, only a sith deals an absolute. We have a

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Speaker 1: colleague here, Ramsey. He makes it his own pickles.

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Speaker 2: Oh, and they're so good. I st don't know how

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Speaker 2: he does it, but they are delicious.

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Speaker 1: He's never gonna let us know.

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Speaker 2: Oh it's very secretive, that wizard Ramsey.

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Speaker 1: Secret. As far as nutrition goes, pretty good for you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they're fine. They're sort of I mean maybe high

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Speaker 2: in salt.

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Speaker 1: Maybe, yeah, mild, anti inflammatory, high vitamin C, as long

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Speaker 1: as you don't deep fry them, of course, as delicious

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Speaker 1: as that is.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, deep fried pickle slices. Some folks drink pickled

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Speaker 2: brine after exercising to replenish their electrolytes, and I suppose

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Speaker 2: that's not much different from drinking gatorade, just saltier. And

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Speaker 2: maybe if your pickles were made by fermentation and the

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Speaker 2: jar wasn't pasteurized afterwards, the brine could have some live,

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Speaker 2: active lactic acid bacteria like living probiotics in it. The

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Speaker 2: weather eating those actually makes any kind of difference in

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Speaker 2: your gut.

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Speaker 1: Is up for debate, So yay food debates.

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Speaker 2: Yes, and most commercially processed pickles are totally pasteurized.

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Speaker 1: So ah well, whatever the case. People like some pickles,

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Speaker 1: they do. We have some pickle numbers here. According to

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Speaker 1: the New York Food Museum, as of two thousand and three,

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Speaker 1: five million, two hundred thousand pounds of pickles we are

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Speaker 1: consumed annually in the United States. That's nine pounds per person.

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Speaker 2: What nine pounds oh pickles a year?

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Speaker 1: I find it very hard to believe.

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Speaker 2: But I shouldn't really eat cucumbers, so I don't eat

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Speaker 2: that many pickled cucumbers to be sure, but I guess

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Speaker 2: I might eat nine pounds of kimchi in a year. Really,

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Speaker 2: I like a kimchi.

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Speaker 1: Kimchi is amazing. But anyway, the oldest pickle was first

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Speaker 1: pickled in eighteen seventy six, yes, eighteen seventy six, and

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Speaker 1: has been passed down from generation degeneration.

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Speaker 2: It's still like it's still kicking.

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Speaker 1: Apparently no one's eating it if it lives in Florida.

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Speaker 1: That's what That's what NPR tells me. All Right, I

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Speaker 1: trust MPR.

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Speaker 2: And we may well be living in the Age of

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Speaker 2: the pickle. There's currently a pickle flavored soft serve in

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Speaker 2: New York City, and also in New York restaurants devoted

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Speaker 2: entirely to pickles. Sonic has a pickle slushy. There's pickle

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Speaker 2: ice pops, pickle candy canes, pickle vodka, pickle soda, pickle beer.

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Speaker 1: The pickleback, Oh, the pickleback.

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Speaker 2: Of course.

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Speaker 1: Of course, somebody a listener, please make a parody song

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Speaker 1: with age of Aquarius age of pickles. Request submitted, please, yes,

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Speaker 1: oh yes.

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Speaker 2: Also, while I was looking up all of these weird

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Speaker 2: pickle products, I stumbled across what would have been the

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Speaker 2: perfect Annie recipe for childhood Annie, and that is a

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Speaker 2: homemade peanut butter and pickle ice cream.

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Speaker 1: Ooh yeah, yeah. I would have lived off of that.

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Speaker 1: I would have just subsided.

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Speaker 2: I'm surprised that you never made like pickle popsicles, like

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Speaker 2: pickle Brian popsicles when you were a kid. I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I went through a huge like make my own popsicles face.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, you know, there's still time. There is still time.

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Speaker 2: There is And speaking of time, it is time for

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Speaker 2: us to take a quick break for a word from

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Speaker 2: our sponsor. But when we get back, we'll talk about

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Speaker 2: the history of the pickle.

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Speaker 1: And we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you. Okay.

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Speaker 1: So the history of the pickle pickled history. Victorians believe

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Speaker 1: cucumbers were first pickled in twoy four hundred BCE Mesopotamia. Wow. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the ancient Greeks knew about pickles roundabouts eight hundred and

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Speaker 1: fifty BCE. Aristotle himself was pushing pickles as a curative,

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Speaker 1: and the soldiers of Julius Caesar ate it for their health,

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Speaker 1: all right. Yeah. Ancient Rome viewed pickles as similarly beneficial.

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Speaker 1: One of history's biggest pickle fans was Cleopatra. Cleopatra, Yes,

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Speaker 1: she credited them as the source of her beauty. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and just to clarify by eating them, Oh, not by

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Speaker 1: rubbing them on your skin.

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Speaker 2: Or like or like using the Brian as a toner

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Speaker 2: or something like that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I bet that would burn. I bet that would burn.

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Speaker 1: But beauty hurts, you know, That's what people tell me.

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Speaker 1: People have said that to me before. By this time,

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Speaker 1: where clear Patrick's time, which was fifty CE ish, pickles

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Speaker 1: could be found throughout the mcgreb and levant regions. In

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Speaker 1: nine hundred CE, Dill, which is very important for our

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Speaker 1: modern day pickles first showed up in Western Europe. Once

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Speaker 1: we move into the Middle Ages, pickles popularity as a

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Speaker 1: condiment climes gaining two more famous historical fans, Queen Elizabeth

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Speaker 1: and William Shakespeare.

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Speaker 2: The Bard.

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Speaker 1: The Bard, the one and only. He referenced pickles and

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Speaker 1: several of his works, including Hamlet, Oh, Hamlet, how camest

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Speaker 1: thou in such a pickle? Shakespeare used that phrase more

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Speaker 1: than once too. It also appeared in the tempest I

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Speaker 1: have been in such a pickle since I saw you

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Speaker 1: last that I fear me will never out of my bones.

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Speaker 1: I shall not fear fly blowing. I love Shakespeare what

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Speaker 1: that meant. But well, people who study that, no, because

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Speaker 1: they think it means to be drunk. Oh like you're pickled, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: which I love. I kind of want to bring back.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I think I've used that before. Were you

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Speaker 1: drunk when you said it? Maybe it's close to sauce exactly. Yes. However,

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Speaker 1: the Oxford English Dictionary concludes this isn't the first use

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Speaker 1: of the phrase in a pickle to mean a difficult situation,

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Speaker 1: if that's what it meant there at all. They credit

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Speaker 1: a fifteen sixty two poem by John Haywood here we go.

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Speaker 1: This one's interesting time is tickle Challs is fickle. I

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Speaker 1: think it's chance. But it looks like schalz Man is brickle, failties, pickle, Paldres, mikel, seasoning, glickl.

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Speaker 1: It looks like season.

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Speaker 2: I think it's seasoning.

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Speaker 1: Oh well, I I wasn't meant for these times.

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Speaker 2: No me, neither very few of us wear it's true.

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Speaker 1: And if that does seem a little unclear on top

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Speaker 1: of my botch pronunciation. The first modern mention of in

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Speaker 1: a pickle comes courtesy of the diary of Samuel Peppis

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Speaker 1: in sixteen sixty quote at home with the workmen all

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Speaker 1: the afternoon, our house being in a most sad pickle.

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Speaker 2: Oh, I had no idea that the phrase was that old.

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Speaker 1: I know, I love it. I assumed it was from

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Speaker 1: like the nineteen twenties. Yeah, it feels like a twenties

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Speaker 1: or maybe a fifties thing. Sure you're saying all kinds

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Speaker 1: of weird phrases back then. Yeah. Stepping back a bit

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Speaker 1: to fourteen ninety two, when Columbus sailed the Ocean Blue.

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Speaker 1: Since pickles didn't spoil, they were a popular food among travelers,

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Speaker 1: especially among those making the long voyage to America. They

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Speaker 1: were also recommended for preventing scurvy, so much so that

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Speaker 1: Columbus rationed them for a soldiers and replenished their stocks

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Speaker 1: by growing cucumbers in Haiti before tackling the next step

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Speaker 1: of their voyage and in fact, for my pickle fact

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Speaker 1: of the episode, okay, the guy behind America's name, Amerigo Vespucci,

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Speaker 1: was a pickle salesman and the supplier for a good

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Speaker 1: chunk of the ships. Allegedly, his nickname was the Pickle Dealer.

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Speaker 1: What mm hmmm, Oh, that's that's got to be a

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Speaker 1: T shirt, The Pickle Dealer. That also has to be

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Speaker 1: a villain in our series The Dunker, which I promise

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Speaker 1: will happen one day.

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Speaker 2: Also, I don't think we've mentioned it on the podcast yet,

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Speaker 2: but we totally have merch now, and we have the

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Speaker 2: power to make an artist who's actually really good at

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Speaker 2: his job make our silly puns into shirt designs. It's

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Speaker 2: a lot of power, it's a little bit terrifying. It's

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Speaker 2: at tea public dot com slash food stuff.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and if you have any designs, oh yeah, let

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Speaker 1: us know, yes, please, we can make it happen. A

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Speaker 1: Virginia was producing commercial pickles by sixteen or six, and

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Speaker 1: Thomas Jefferson again. Thomas Jefferson later commented, on a hot

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Speaker 1: day in Virginia, I know nothing more comforting than a

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Speaker 1: fine spice pickle brought up trout like from the sparkling

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Speaker 1: depths of the aromatic jar below the stairs of Aunt

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Speaker 1: Sally's cellar. Brought up trout like there is there no food.

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Speaker 1: He didn't comment on.

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Speaker 2: Apparently that's all he did.

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Speaker 1: I mean, essentially, that's what we do too. I suppose well.

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Speaker 1: George Washington was a fan of them too.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Sources say he had loads of varieties of cucumber in

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Speaker 1: his garden for pickling. The Actually the number was so

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Speaker 1: big that I doubted it.

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Speaker 2: But wow.

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Speaker 1: In either case, I do believe he loved pickles. The

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Speaker 1: Dutch in the sixteenth century counted pickles as one of

435
00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:59,879
Speaker 1: their delicacies, and Dutch immigrants arriving to what would become

436
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:03,800
Speaker 1: New York started growing cucumbers for the pickling as early

437
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 1: as sixteen fifty nine in what is now Brooklyn. People

438
00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:10,879
Speaker 1: would buy the cucumbers, pickle them in barrels, and sell

439
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:14,399
Speaker 1: them on the streets. This was the largest concentration of

440
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:18,080
Speaker 1: commercial pickles in the world at the time. New York

441
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:20,520
Speaker 1: would remain important to the pickle scene in the nineteenth

442
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:23,720
Speaker 1: and twentieth century, with new waves of immigrants, specifically Jewish

443
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:27,160
Speaker 1: immigrants from Eastern Europe, bringing along with them kosher pickles.

444
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,520
Speaker 1: At the time, these were made by putting cucumbers in

445
00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:34,800
Speaker 1: barrels with dill, garlic, kosher salt, water, and any other

446
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,560
Speaker 1: spices desired. Then the cucumbers were left to ferment for

447
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,159
Speaker 1: over a month, longer than your average pickle, resulting in

448
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:46,480
Speaker 1: a more sour product. This extra sourness was appreciated in

449
00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:51,400
Speaker 1: contrast to Eastern europe sort of bland potato heavy diet.

450
00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:54,000
Speaker 1: At the time, bland was what I read a lot,

451
00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:58,600
Speaker 1: I'm not describing that way. You could get a half

452
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:03,000
Speaker 1: sour or full sour, depending on fermentation time. To this day,

453
00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:06,600
Speaker 1: most Jewish delis come with a complimentary slice or two

454
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:08,680
Speaker 1: or three or four of pickles.

455
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, the Ashkenazi Jewish pickles.

456
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:12,440
Speaker 1: It's great.

457
00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:15,360
Speaker 2: Also to this day, those pickles are still sold under

458
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:18,040
Speaker 2: the names a half sour for pickles that have only

459
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,000
Speaker 2: been fermented for a couple of weeks, and full sour

460
00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:22,760
Speaker 2: for pickles that have been fermented for a month or

461
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,320
Speaker 2: more to yeah, really get the punch in there.

462
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:27,400
Speaker 1: Speaking of punch.

463
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:34,280
Speaker 2: And technology, yeah, of course we have some more pickle history,

464
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:36,040
Speaker 2: some pickle technology, mayhap.

465
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:38,960
Speaker 1: But first we have one more quick break for word

466
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:52,440
Speaker 1: from our sponsor and we're back. Thank you sponsors, Yes,

467
00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:56,520
Speaker 1: thank you. And remember Nicholas a peer.

468
00:26:57,359 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 2: Yes from our canning episode.

469
00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:04,159
Speaker 1: Light Lauren Well. Thanks to his development of canning, he

470
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:08,560
Speaker 1: boasted the first large scale commercial production of pickles around

471
00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:13,400
Speaker 1: eighteen oh nine CE large scale Hey get it a pair.

472
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 2: Yeah.

473
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:18,919
Speaker 1: Innovations in jar technology helped pickles move along, James Young's

474
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,400
Speaker 1: invention of paraffin wax for better jar ceiling. John Mason

475
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: patented the Mason jar in eighteen fifty eight. Twenty years

476
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:31,040
Speaker 1: later the patent expired, but the jar remained. And another

477
00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:32,800
Speaker 1: throwback the.

478
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:36,240
Speaker 2: Pickle pin, oh right from the World's Fair right.

479
00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:39,840
Speaker 1: Which we talked about in our catchup episode you know.

480
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 1: At the Chicago World's Fair in eighteen ninety three, Hines,

481
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,880
Speaker 1: who that very same year debuted their fifty seven varieties

482
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 1: of pickles, preserves and other pickled foods, handed out free

483
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:56,200
Speaker 1: picklepins to visitors to their booth some one million pins

484
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:59,880
Speaker 1: by the fairs end. So successful was this promotion they

485
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,720
Speaker 1: repeated it as several other world's fairs. And if you

486
00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 1: visit the Heines Museum and take the stairs to this

487
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:08,600
Speaker 1: day you can still get one of these.

488
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:11,120
Speaker 2: I want one so bad I do too.

489
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,720
Speaker 1: I found one on eBay. It was a little pricey,

490
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:18,240
Speaker 1: and I was like, Hm, how badly do I want?

491
00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:19,320
Speaker 2: Do I want one?

492
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:21,440
Speaker 1: And how ridiculous does it make me look?

493
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 2: Yeah? Apparently Hines was the first commercial producer of vinegar. Oh,

494
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:29,840
Speaker 2: which kind of went hand in hand because they were

495
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:32,440
Speaker 2: making so much of it for their pickled products that, yeah,

496
00:28:33,359 --> 00:28:34,880
Speaker 2: they sold it for home use as well.

497
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:39,640
Speaker 1: Makes sense? Makes sense. The trade organization of Pickle Packers

498
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:43,600
Speaker 1: International Pickle Packers International that sounds like a tongue twister,

499
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:48,640
Speaker 1: also came together in eighteen ninety three. In nineteen twenty six,

500
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: mount Olive, a company out of Mount Alive, North Carolina.

501
00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 1: Oh Yeah, got it started with the original goal of

502
00:28:55,920 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: brining pickles for other picklers. I was not to be, however,

503
00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:03,800
Speaker 1: and they are now one of the biggest names in pickles.

504
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 1: Another name you might recognize, blastic Polish style pickles, got

505
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 1: their start in Detroit in nineteen forty two, and around

506
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:15,000
Speaker 1: this time, during World War Two, pickles were another food

507
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,520
Speaker 1: that was rationed in the US. Forty percent of pickles

508
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:21,480
Speaker 1: went to the army. Once the war was over and

509
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 1: a couple of years had passed, in nineteen forty eight,

510
00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:29,920
Speaker 1: Pickle Packers International launched International Pickle Week. This is celebrated

511
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:33,040
Speaker 1: to this day, complete with a pickle juice drinking contest

512
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:36,560
Speaker 1: in Arkansas. I will see you the in Arkansas. It

513
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 1: is one of America's longest running food promotions. I think

514
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:43,440
Speaker 1: it lasts. I think it's Pickle Week, but I think

515
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:47,360
Speaker 1: it lasts like fourteen days or something. They haven't changed

516
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:48,320
Speaker 1: the name to reflect that.

517
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:50,560
Speaker 2: Oh that's great. It's like dragon con. It just kind

518
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 2: of spreads.

519
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:56,080
Speaker 1: It's true. It's true. In nineteen seventy four, Plastic chose

520
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:59,840
Speaker 1: the stork as their mascot because at the time the

521
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,400
Speaker 1: the American birth rate was dropping. How interesting that they

522
00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 1: chose it for that reason. The slogan might help it

523
00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:09,600
Speaker 1: make more sense delivered pickles since babies were in such

524
00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:10,600
Speaker 1: short supply.

525
00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 2: Are they saying that babies are a food source? Are

526
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 2: they are people canning babies? It's got dark.

527
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 1: It really did, very quickly. I'm sure that's not what

528
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:27,040
Speaker 1: they were hoping. What happened, Plastic, I'm not sure about

529
00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:31,480
Speaker 1: your brand messaging. I do like it's like deliver pickles

530
00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:35,800
Speaker 1: since babies were in such short supply as if a pickle.

531
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:37,400
Speaker 2: Well, I guess, I get well, I guess, I guess

532
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 2: just the stork is like out of work, like he's

533
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:42,960
Speaker 2: looking for a job. Oh yeah, you know, like he's

534
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:44,800
Speaker 2: on hard times. So he's like, well, I guess I'll

535
00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 2: deliver pickles. There's no more babies for me to deliver.

536
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 2: That's also dark.

537
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 1: That is well, we'll have to move on and discuss

538
00:30:56,040 --> 00:31:00,200
Speaker 1: that later. Yes, but as part of this this whole thing,

539
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:07,040
Speaker 1: they doubled down on the idea that pregnant women craved pickles. Yeah,

540
00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 1: in the eighties they went with this slogan the pickles

541
00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 1: pregnant women crave. And I was researching into this pickles

542
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:21,520
Speaker 1: and ice cream is the go to stereotypical pregnant lady

543
00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 1: craving in the US, but that is not the same

544
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:27,160
Speaker 1: in other countries, I learned. And I would love for

545
00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 1: listeners to write in and say, what is the stereotypical

546
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:33,959
Speaker 1: food you say in your country that pregnant women crave. Yeah, yeah,

547
00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:38,200
Speaker 1: but here it's pickles and ice cream. A nineteen fifty

548
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:40,840
Speaker 1: two episode of I Love Lucy how a pregnant Lucy

549
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:44,640
Speaker 1: send Ricky in search of a papaya milkshake and a pickle.

550
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:46,520
Speaker 1: So it's pretty old. It's been around for a while.

551
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 1: And here's a strange record for you. In nineteen eighty five,

552
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 1: Stephen Trotter became the youngest fellow to survive the Niagara

553
00:31:55,160 --> 00:32:00,880
Speaker 1: Falls plunge. So, yes, he went over the waterfall. His

554
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:06,040
Speaker 1: transport of choice, some kind of big safety bubble, no

555
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 1: two pickle barrels.

556
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 2: Huh m hm.

557
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:14,080
Speaker 1: And he replicated the stunt in nineteen ninety five. Well,

558
00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 1: good for him, Yeah, good for him. It's quite a

559
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: craft if you want to look it up. It's kind

560
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 1: of impressive.

561
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 2: Yeah.

562
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 1: In two thousand, the Philadelphia Eagles credited their win against

563
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:31,040
Speaker 1: the Dallas Cowboys on a game day where temperatures got

564
00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:34,120
Speaker 1: up to one hundred and nine degrees fahrenheit, which is

565
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 1: about forty three degrees celsius, to drinking pickle juice. Sort

566
00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 1: of what you were talking about earlier, Lauren. A study

567
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 1: done by Brigham Young University a little later, and reported

568
00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:46,080
Speaker 1: on by The New York Times, found that pickle juice

569
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:50,440
Speaker 1: relieved crams about forty five percent faster than no hydration

570
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:58,400
Speaker 1: and about thirty seven percent faster than water salt salt salt.

571
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:02,240
Speaker 1: That's the answer. I mean, I wonder if that's why

572
00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 1: kids like it, or maybe maybe that's just in my family.

573
00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 1: I don't know mysteries of Rehese family history. New York

574
00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 1: City's first Pickle Day celebration took place in two thousand

575
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 1: and one. Yes, okay, and now there are kool Aid pickles,

576
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:25,720
Speaker 1: which I believe you have had.

577
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:31,840
Speaker 2: Oh let's see, yes, I think so, Yes, yes, I

578
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 2: had like Actually I believe they were Hawaiian punch pickles.

579
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:40,200
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, you can. You can make pickles extra

580
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:44,280
Speaker 2: sweet and kind of fruity flavored by adding like a

581
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:49,200
Speaker 2: packet of kool Aid or similar flavoring to the brine solution.

582
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 2: I'm honestly not sure why you would do this. I

583
00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:55,440
Speaker 2: apparently they're popular with kids, apparently especially in the American South,

584
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:57,960
Speaker 2: But you never had them growing up. This was never

585
00:33:57,960 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 2: a thing.

586
00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: Oh I thought this happened like this year.

587
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:03,360
Speaker 2: Oh no, no, I know. I'm pretty sure, this is

588
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:05,840
Speaker 2: like a thing that has gone back several decades at least.

589
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:08,400
Speaker 1: Oh, well, I should have moved this earlier in my history. Recrusting.

590
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:14,200
Speaker 1: Then I thought this happened like months ago. No, no,

591
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 1: I guess I'm too mad of the pickle news cycle.

592
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:21,960
Speaker 2: We'll forgive you just this once, Annie, Thank you.

593
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 1: I appreciate it. I'll endeavor to do better in my

594
00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:34,520
Speaker 1: pickle knowledge. But yeah, that's our pickle episode. Yeah, we

595
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:40,520
Speaker 1: got through it with I mean it's relatively professionally.

596
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, relatively little giggling.

597
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:45,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just a great word. It is. You say

598
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:47,839
Speaker 1: it enough and you'd think you'd get used to it.

599
00:34:47,920 --> 00:34:49,920
Speaker 2: But no, it's delightful every time.

600
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:55,879
Speaker 1: Delightful every time. Pickle pickle. Yep, I bet you're doing

601
00:34:55,920 --> 00:35:01,600
Speaker 1: it too. And that brings us to the end of

602
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:03,960
Speaker 1: this classic episode. We hope that you enjoyed it as

603
00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:08,279
Speaker 1: much as we did. As always, Yes, if you have recipes,

604
00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:13,279
Speaker 1: please send us. Oh yeah please. Oh yeah.

605
00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:16,439
Speaker 2: If you just have a strong pickle opinion, we want

606
00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:16,839
Speaker 2: to hear it.

607
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:21,320
Speaker 1: Yes we do. That's what we're here for. I also

608
00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:24,400
Speaker 1: forgot to mention I have a lot of pickle merchandise

609
00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 1: thanks to a sponsor, and a friend of mine recently

610
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:36,400
Speaker 1: asked was telling me about her love of this particular brand.

611
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:43,120
Speaker 1: I got an embarrassing amount of enjoyment and pride out

612
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:51,799
Speaker 1: of being like, look at all my merchandise. So that's

613
00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 1: been nice. You got to find the perks where you can.

614
00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:59,200
Speaker 1: You do you do? Pickles are pickles are a good perk?

615
00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 2: Pickle parks?

616
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 1: Yeah?

617
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:03,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah.

618
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:08,520
Speaker 1: Well, listeners, if you would like to contact those you can.

619
00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:11,160
Speaker 1: You can email us at hello at savorpod dot com.

620
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,480
Speaker 2: We're also on social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook,

621
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:17,919
Speaker 2: and Instagram. That's the third one, yeah, at saver pod,

622
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:20,080
Speaker 2: and we do hope to hear from you. Savor is

623
00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 2: a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio,

624
00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:26,320
Speaker 2: you can visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

625
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:29,040
Speaker 2: you listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as always to

626
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,040
Speaker 2: our super producers Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to

627
00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 2: you for listening, and we hope that lots more good

628
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:42,839
Speaker 2: things are coming your way