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Speaker 1: Very pleased to be joined on this episode of the

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Speaker 1: Warning podcast by Jason Smart, who is in Kiev, Ukraine. Jason, welcome,

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Steve.

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Speaker 2: Good to see you.

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Speaker 1: Why don't we start out by you telling the audience

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Speaker 1: how long you've been in Ukraine what it is that

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Speaker 1: you're doing there.

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Speaker 2: So I've been in Ukraine since about twenty fifteen, pretty

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Speaker 2: steadily since then, and I'm currently a journalist for the

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Speaker 2: Kiev Post, the largest English language newspaper in the country

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Speaker 2: that's been in existence since nineteen ninety five.

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Speaker 1: Talk to us about life in Kiev this Christmas season,

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Speaker 1: heading into winter.

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Speaker 2: So recently it's been sort of complicated. There's been a

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Speaker 2: series of missile strikes. Yesterday, I think there's five air

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Speaker 2: raid warnings, and Ukraine has been fortunate thanks to specifically

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Speaker 2: American Patriot missiles, has been able to shoot down a

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Speaker 2: lot of the missiles that are coming into the territory.

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Speaker 2: The last Christmas was far worse without the air defense.

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Speaker 2: Ukraine was getting hit regularly. There's losing electricity, and it's

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Speaker 2: so bad that walking down the streets of Kiev you

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Speaker 2: couldn't hold a conversation with somebody by your side because

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Speaker 2: there's so much noise in the generators. There's just so

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Speaker 2: many generators everywhere, you just gonna have a conversation. So

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Speaker 2: we're past that point. At this point, they are able

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Speaker 2: to shoot a lot of them down. Yet the Irani

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Speaker 2: made drones are still almost daily hitting Ukraine. They try

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Speaker 2: to figure out where the air defense is located, and

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Speaker 2: then they try to exploit in various infrastructure targets that

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Speaker 2: they have. And that's in addition to the fact that

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Speaker 2: the ballistic missiles, those that are produced by Russia, as well,

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Speaker 2: as it seems done now, missiles that are produced by

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Speaker 2: North Korea and Iran are also going to be used.

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Speaker 1: What is the rale of the Ukrainian people in this moment?

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Speaker 1: Is it defiant, exhausted, resolved? How do they assess the

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Speaker 1: counter offensive, its status? And how do they assess the

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Speaker 1: politics of the country right now heading into twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 2: So I would say that the morale overall in the

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Speaker 2: population remains very resolved. There's certainly a desire to defeat

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Speaker 2: Russia that's not changed at all. I can't even imagine

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Speaker 2: how people would respond if you're ask them, do you

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Speaker 2: think it's time to kind of deal with Putin, nobody

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Speaker 2: would accept that argument. That being said, obviously they recognize

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Speaker 2: there's been setbacks with things like the counter offensive. Those setbacks, though,

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Speaker 2: we're not something that we can blame just in one place.

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Speaker 2: Let's be fair, for a forour kilometer by four kilometer,

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Speaker 2: which is, you know, two and a half mile by

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Speaker 2: two and a half mile large area, they uncovered about

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Speaker 2: twenty thousand land mines on the Russian side. That many

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Speaker 2: landmines obviously slows things down, especially when there's not sufficient

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Speaker 2: amount of demining equipment. But more at that point, I

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Speaker 2: think that on the Ukrainian side there remains a very

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Speaker 2: strong desire to see victory. The president of the country, Zelenski,

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Speaker 2: has an approval rating that's above eighty percent. It's probably

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Speaker 2: about eighty eight percent of our call correctly, and this

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Speaker 2: is all addicted to the fact that the population is

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Speaker 2: very united. I mean, they recognize this. His genocidal Vladimir

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Speaker 2: Putin has been very clear, and it was clear yesterday

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Speaker 2: when he had his annual address the press that his

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Speaker 2: intention has not changed. He wishes to conquer Ukraine. He

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Speaker 2: also signaled very clearly that after Ukraine, there's other things

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Speaker 2: in the work such as the country in Moltova and

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Speaker 2: including the Baltic states which are all NATO members. Vladimir

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Speaker 2: Putin is unrepentent. He is complete decided that this is

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Speaker 2: what he wishes to be, the hill that he dies

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Speaker 2: on if it needs to be. And Russia is lost

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Speaker 2: over three hundred thousand troops casualties I should say necessarily died,

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Speaker 2: but to those who have died it's well over one

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Speaker 2: hundred and senty thousand. This point, Russia is just bleeding

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Speaker 2: out men and he will not stop.

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Speaker 1: What is the casualty count or the Ukrainian armed forces

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Speaker 1: at this.

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Speaker 2: Point, so the numbers aren't public. Ukraine doesn't publish them,

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Speaker 2: but it is estimated to be less than half of

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Speaker 2: what the Russians are. And it's surprising at first, it

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Speaker 2: seems not feasible. It seems, you know, it's just sort

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Speaker 2: of like propaganda. But the fact is it make sense.

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Speaker 2: Russia doesn't respect the lives of its soldiers. It does

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Speaker 2: d mind fields, using the soldiers to run across them.

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Speaker 2: These are generally to be fair, not something to do

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Speaker 2: with all soldiers, specifically the ones that are, for instance,

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Speaker 2: prisoners who they forced to go to the war or

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Speaker 2: ethnic minorities, they use them for the same purposes. Those

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Speaker 2: that have AIDS or other diseases that are communicable, they

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Speaker 2: use for purposes such as this. So that this is

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Speaker 2: something that Russia has used as sort of a stape

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Speaker 2: of the war, which is that they're ken father. They're

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Speaker 2: happy to send them off in droves and very few

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Speaker 2: might return.

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Speaker 1: Are there public estimates or government estimates of how many

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Speaker 1: Ukrainian women and Ukrainian children have been raped by Russian

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Speaker 1: soldiers or Russian mercenaries or Russian parabilitaries.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's at the prosecutor's office a lot of cases open,

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Speaker 2: about ninety thousand cases of rape and sexual assault, the

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Speaker 2: majority of which were against small children as well as

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Speaker 2: against elderly women. And in the case sickly enough, is

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Speaker 2: the same for both the Russian soldiers who have been

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Speaker 2: captured and who've been dud has said that it's because

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Speaker 2: they don't run away as fast, so it's easier to

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Speaker 2: get them. So the rape of children has become so

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Speaker 2: significant that they're the psychologists here overwhelmed by it. Some

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Speaker 2: of the interviews which you can find online, you're not

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Speaker 2: hard to find what the psychologists have said about. You know,

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Speaker 2: they've just for no specific reason castrated little boys, raped

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Speaker 2: girls to death, raped little girls or little boys to

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Speaker 2: death in front of their parents, and then raped the

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Speaker 2: mother to death. This is something that Russia has engaged

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Speaker 2: in Ukraine.

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Speaker 1: Is there an official count, precise count of how many

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Speaker 1: children have been kidnapped by those Russian forces who have

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Speaker 1: raped upwards of ninety thousand people and taken them ease?

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Speaker 1: How many children are missing?

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Speaker 2: So tragically we know about only twenty thousand, though it's

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Speaker 2: estimated being one hundreds of thousands. Like in the case

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Speaker 2: of the rape of children, we only know about it

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Speaker 2: when they have made it to the free Ukraine, that

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Speaker 2: is to say that their parents are in the unoccupied territories.

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Speaker 2: Those who remain occupied territories, there's no way of knowing

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Speaker 2: what's occurred. So the number of rapes, for instance, their

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Speaker 2: murders is undoubtedly much higher. The numbers of people that

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Speaker 2: be kinnapped us much higher. Simply the parents are not

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Speaker 2: in free Ukraine, they are occupied Ukraine, and so there's

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Speaker 2: no way for the Ukrainian Prosecutor's office to know that

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Speaker 2: this has occurred. But it is estimated that the reality

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Speaker 2: is that though it is about twenty thousand that's public

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Speaker 2: UNNI of children who have been abducted from their parents,

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Speaker 2: many of them who then have their names changed when

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Speaker 2: they move to Russia. The reality is that the numbers

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Speaker 2: are going to be multiple times higher than that.

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Speaker 1: How is the building Maga Republican opposition to arming Ukraine

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Speaker 1: being covered in Ukraine? How has President Zelensky's visit to

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Speaker 1: the United States been covered domestically in Ukraine? Is it

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Speaker 1: through a prism of worry that American support with regard

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Speaker 1: to funding for the lethal weaponry necessary to repel the

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Speaker 1: Russian military will be cut off?

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Speaker 2: Sadly, To be frank with you, yes, there is quite

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Speaker 2: a few about that. There's a lot of lack of

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Speaker 2: understanding of why this is. The Ukrainians can understand why.

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Speaker 2: You know, We've just a year ago said they were

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Speaker 2: allies and we'd stick it out with them, and today

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Speaker 2: the United States has decided that it's got other priorities.

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Speaker 2: I keep in mind, this is a country where their

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Speaker 2: abduction is going on today. There are people of both sexes,

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Speaker 2: of all ages being raped to death today. There are

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Speaker 2: people that are pits being tortured in eastern Ukraine, and

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Speaker 2: the atrocity is just fancy you've never had imagined in

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Speaker 2: your life. And they do not understand why it is

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Speaker 2: that there is a growing group of Americans who just

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Speaker 2: do not have any sympathy for their plight, who write

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Speaker 2: it off the things that are nonsense, such as you

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Speaker 2: know the corruption. Listen, there's tons of oversight of the

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Speaker 2: money going to Ukraine, just absolutely tons that he was

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Speaker 2: twelve or thirteen different government agencies that are looking into

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Speaker 2: an oversight of the money. There's not been any prompts

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Speaker 2: so far. And they don't understand why is that Americans

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Speaker 2: are going to hang them out to dry, to a

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Speaker 2: bunch of bloodthirsty savages that have nothing else in their

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Speaker 2: minds than they commit genocide. And that's what we see

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Speaker 2: a current today.

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Speaker 1: Well, they have to have some idea what do they

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Speaker 1: think it is?

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Speaker 2: They really don't. They're very scared by it because in mind,

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Speaker 2: the Ukraine perspective on this is they read in the

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Speaker 2: news that the US is tying and support for their

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Speaker 2: country to immigration. They have no idea what US immigration

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Speaker 2: is like, why that's a big deal. They have no

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Speaker 2: idea how you tie bills together in the US. These

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Speaker 2: are all things that are very foreign to them, So

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Speaker 2: it is not something that makes a lot of sense.

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Speaker 2: They just understand that for some closing this border or

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Speaker 2: whatever it is the Americans wish to do is something

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Speaker 2: that's more important than what's happening to their population. They

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Speaker 2: truly don't have a strong understanding. There's obviously, yes, a

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Speaker 2: great deal of apprehension about the return of Donald Trump.

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Speaker 2: There's a great deal of fear of what that might mean.

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Speaker 2: Just today I was with the journalists who asked, you know,

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Speaker 2: Trump has promised in the world twenty four hours. Do

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Speaker 2: you think that means to just give the whole territory

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Speaker 2: over to Russia? What do you think that is? Some mean, yes,

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Speaker 2: there's significant concern in the population.

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Speaker 1: When you look at it from Kiev. Who are the

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Speaker 1: Americans that are viewed by the Ukrainians as being Putin's

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Speaker 1: most astonishing, useful idiots. Who are the Americans that they

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Speaker 1: see and revile as being on the other side of

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Speaker 1: this fight, being on the Russian side?

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Speaker 2: Well, undoubtedly Tucker Carlson has a special place in their hearts.

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Speaker 2: Tucker Carlson is so widely cited in Russian news it's nightly,

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Speaker 2: literally every single night, for that matter, there's a YouTube channel.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure you can find YouTube if you just take

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Speaker 2: Tucker Carlson Russian and you see his television shows are

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Speaker 2: being translated to Russian. Who's paying for that? Where's it

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Speaker 2: come from? But whatever it is, the Russian government or

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Speaker 2: whoever is behind it is so pleased by it that

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Speaker 2: it is translating tons of episodes, especially the key parts,

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Speaker 2: and using them, and the fact that it's showing up

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Speaker 2: routinely is amazing. Alex Jones is another great example. He's

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Speaker 2: been on Russian TV. He cited as a person fighting

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Speaker 2: for freedom in America who has been oppressed. The Russian

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Speaker 2: press just loves him, and so we look at these guys.

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Speaker 2: You know, if Russian press is highlighting you as an

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Speaker 2: example of what's good about America, you're probably actually the

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Speaker 2: worst part of America. And that's what Russia has tried

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Speaker 2: to really put an effort to expose their population into morows.

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Speaker 1: What Republican members of the Senate and or Congress are

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Speaker 1: you routinely saying on Russian state TV, Russian propaganda channels

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Speaker 1: and outlets.

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Speaker 2: So the different congressman, senators, it varies anytime they see

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Speaker 2: something to oppose Ukraine or any time that they come

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Speaker 2: up and use Ukraine sorry Russian talking points, it is cited.

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Speaker 2: I mean, Russia is constantly on the hunt for who

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Speaker 2: it is they can cite as an example. Who is

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Speaker 2: it we can say is an example that there is

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Speaker 2: really a lot of support in America for what we're doing.

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Speaker 2: What we're doing is not, you know, grossly unethical, but

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Speaker 2: in fact Americans support it. And I think that when

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Speaker 2: we look at it as a whole, I would say

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Speaker 2: that there's a few who are really their favorites. The

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Speaker 2: congress woman from Georgia or Marjorie Taylor Green is obviously

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Speaker 2: at the very top of the list. Is routine inside it.

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Speaker 2: By the way, she also cites Russian government sanctioned by

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Speaker 2: the US government, sanctioned news sources, and they're sanctioned for

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Speaker 2: him to try to mess in the US elections. But

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Speaker 2: they are literally government propaganda. It's nonsense. They're completely nonsense.

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Speaker 2: Things Zelenski buyings in France and literally baseless, literally basis

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Speaker 2: and you could say the same thing about me and

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Speaker 2: I have the same degrie of truth. It's just baseless,

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Speaker 2: and that sided by people like this, I mean, I

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Speaker 2: will say yes, the Magropublicans in Poling are the least

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Speaker 2: supportive of Ukraine out of any demographic in America. They

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Speaker 2: believe essentially conspiracy theories about Ukraine. They believe things that

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Speaker 2: are nonsensical, and they also have a very nonsensical view

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Speaker 2: of Russia as a country. It's defending Christian values or

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Speaker 2: somehow defending traditional family values, which is just simply not true.

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Speaker 2: Russia does none of the above. Russia is a criminal

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Speaker 2: state runlive Vladimir Putin, who's the mafia don And anyone

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Speaker 2: who thinks otherwise should really just take a look at

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Speaker 2: what is Russia. That is a terrifying country with a

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Speaker 2: population that's quite brainwashed. And there is sadly yes US

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Speaker 2: congressman or senators who somehow think that it's a light

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Speaker 2: to the east and nothing to be further from truth.

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Speaker 1: Do you get the sense sitting in Ukraine that the

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Speaker 1: war is yet to escalate to its full potential?

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Speaker 2: The war will worsen, I mean undoubted will. Listen, the

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Speaker 2: Russians have located here in Ukraine an estimated six hundred

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Speaker 2: thousand troops, at least what Putin said yesterday, the estimate

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Speaker 2: prior to yesterday have been about four hundred and fifty thousand,

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Speaker 2: so let's say it's you know, five hundred something at least.

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Speaker 2: The Ukrainian military is quite large, but it's still really

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Speaker 2: slightly larger than the Russian military. The advantage of Ukraine

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Speaker 2: has though, as it suffers far less losses, and thanks

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Speaker 2: to specifically the American technology that is here, the military hardware,

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Speaker 2: it is able to defend itself and to suffer less

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Speaker 2: losses than the Russian stew and to evacuated soldiers more

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Speaker 2: efficiently than the Russian stew and since so there's survival

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Speaker 2: rates much higher. That being said, you know, Russia has

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Speaker 2: no intent of stopping what it's doing now, and so

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Speaker 2: we can expect that Vladimir Putin, as he becomes more

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Speaker 2: frustrated by this war, will engage in other human rights

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Speaker 2: atrocities in the bombing of cities as he currently does,

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Speaker 2: and to just continue this. But I think there's another element,

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Speaker 2: which is that there is a lot of evidence that

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Speaker 2: Russia is trying to stir up tensions in other countries,

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Speaker 2: including in the Balkans, including Moldova, in order specifically to

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Speaker 2: distract from what's going on here so that he'll have

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Speaker 2: more of a free hand and less attention will be

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Speaker 2: placed on him.

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Speaker 1: When you assess the situation, to what degree do you

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Speaker 1: think that Vladimir Putin is calculating that Donald Trump will

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Speaker 1: be elected president in November twenty four take office in

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Speaker 1: January twenty five. A precipitate, a constitutional crime is domestically

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Speaker 1: and be attempt to or resolved to withdraw America from

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Speaker 1: its NATO obligations, which are harder to do than the

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Speaker 1: MAGA spokespeople allow, but nevertheless concernedly signal that countries that

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Speaker 1: America is obligated to defend under Article five, including the

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Speaker 1: Balitic republics, would not be defended and leaving them naked

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Speaker 1: outside of America's deterrence perimeter. What degree to which do

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Speaker 1: you look at the situation and see that the Putin

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Speaker 1: is just holding on waiting for that to happen.

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Speaker 2: You know, I would generally agree with that assessment. So

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Speaker 2: I think that Donald Trump is something that is the

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Speaker 2: hope for Varmora Putin, and as time goes on, you know,

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Speaker 2: I don't think that's part, isn't talking point. I think

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Speaker 2: that is accurate because I see enough of what's happening

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Speaker 2: in Russia that affirms that listen, I read the Russian

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Speaker 2: news every day, obviously speak Russian, and I'm telling you

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Speaker 2: when you read the Russian news and you read what

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Speaker 2: their television channels, the Kremlin Finance Telvin channels, when they

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Speaker 2: say things such as our friends that Republicans are doing

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Speaker 2: this right now, or we're closer to victory and Donald

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Speaker 2: Trump will join us for how should you interpret that?

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Speaker 2: I mean, to me, it is a very scary thought

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Speaker 2: that there is not just I mean, I understand all

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Speaker 2: countries will have a preference in an election. That's normal,

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Speaker 2: but the fact that they consider it to be their

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Speaker 2: ally being elected who will help them to conquer Ukraine,

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Speaker 2: I find it to be just sickening. I mean, it

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Speaker 2: is truly. I don't remember this ever once Russian history

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Speaker 2: in its relation to the United States, where the Russians

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Speaker 2: have been so unambivalent about the fact that one of

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Speaker 2: the two candidates is someone who is going to help

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Speaker 2: them to win, and then the fact that they are

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Speaker 2: citing people who the same guy Donald Trump cites, such

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Speaker 2: as Tucker Carlson. The people who are the most loudmouthed

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Speaker 2: in the mag of movement are exactly the people show

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Speaker 2: up in a Russian TV To me, this is just incredible.

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Speaker 2: And we're not talking you know, a one time thing

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Speaker 2: where somebody has a quote that's taken out of context

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Speaker 2: that Russians use it. We're talking steadily and routinely. The

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Speaker 2: Russians say, but look, there are good people in America

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Speaker 2: and this is what they believe. This is what they say.

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Speaker 2: But Donald Trump on a personal level, yes, I mean

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Speaker 2: his lack of predictability, how scary he is for the

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Speaker 2: NATO countries. Just listen to what the Foreign Minister of Lithuania,

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Speaker 2: gabrielis linz Burgas, has been saying. They're tremendously worried. They

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Speaker 2: know that Donald Trump is dangerous for them. They never

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Speaker 2: use his name. Is there politically you know, they're trying

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Speaker 2: to be neutral, they are f ministry, but it's very

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Speaker 2: clear what they're saying. They're saying that the Russians are

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Speaker 2: going to try to conquer Ukraine and then go for

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Speaker 2: the Baltic States. But they definitely have an eye on

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Speaker 2: what happens next to Washington, and we all understand exactly

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Speaker 2: what they're referring to. They're referring to the Donald Trump

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Speaker 2: coming back, a guy who's promised not to make America

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Speaker 2: great again, but to have revenge. What does that mean?

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Speaker 2: And the fact that they have all the investigations going

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Speaker 2: on now in the US House about Hunter Biden, which

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Speaker 2: is touching on Barisma and Ukraine. I have no doubt whatsoever.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, we know this is ties back

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Speaker 2: to Russian intelligence the whole story. There are people that

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Speaker 2: were inclusion with Russian intelligence, who met with people like

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Speaker 2: Giuliani in regards that you know years ago now. But

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Speaker 2: those those things are all being done specifically to benefit

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump and his campaign.

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Speaker 1: You used three times a word in describing pudent subjectives

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Speaker 1: during this conversation, and the word is conquer as in

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Speaker 1: conquer Ukraine, and I want to drill down on that.

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Speaker 1: Do you mean to say that it is Vladimir Putin's

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Speaker 1: aim to occupy Ukraine fully and completely the full nation

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Speaker 1: of in the mid forties of millions of people, that

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Speaker 1: in the way that Germany did France and did Greece

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Speaker 1: and did the Netherlands as an occupying power, as a

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Speaker 1: controlling power, making illegal the Ukrainian language. What do you

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Speaker 1: mean by that? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Actually, the example of Germany that you gave is pretty

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Speaker 2: much what I mean by that. So we can only

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Speaker 2: look at the occupied terraportratories so far, some of the

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Speaker 2: eastern parts of Ukraine and what we saw there, and

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Speaker 2: we'll just say that's probably a good example a prologue

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Speaker 2: of what is to come. History is but a prologue,

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Speaker 2: and in this case we see that in those regions

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Speaker 2: there is forced taking a citizenship of Russian citizenship, that is,

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Speaker 2: those who have refused. If you know, many things have happened.

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Speaker 2: You know, just yesterday they were raiding their houses, stealing

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Speaker 2: their possessions, stealing the cash they might have had or

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Speaker 2: anything had value, and then throwing them out into the streets.

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Speaker 2: There is also the fact they've you know, kidnapped their

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Speaker 2: children so they can send the Russia to be rucified,

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Speaker 2: to only speak Russian and also to become more Russian like,

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Speaker 2: and to forget the Ukrainian identity. They've eradicated, stopped out

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Speaker 2: the Ukrainian language and culture. They've closed down the Ukrainian

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Speaker 2: churches for that matter. I mean, they've closed down Protestant churches,

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Speaker 2: Baptist churches, Evangelical churches because it's considered to be a

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Speaker 2: pro American conspiracy in the eyes of the Russians. I've

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Speaker 2: interviewed pastors from eastern Ukraine who lived under occupation or

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Speaker 2: who are capped by Russians, who are tortured. I mean

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Speaker 2: they hooked their generals up to electric prods and lit

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Speaker 2: them up. These pastors because they said that, you know,

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Speaker 2: all Evangelicals are all Protestants are part of the American conspiracy.

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Speaker 2: It's something that the Russians really believe. It's not just

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Speaker 2: you know, crazy, This is not so far outside of

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Speaker 2: the rum. I've met enough people who have suffered these

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Speaker 2: sorts of faiths to say that it's what happens. So

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Speaker 2: and I talked about what's going to happen to the

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Speaker 2: rest of Ukraine. Yes, I'd imagine be very naugous that

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Speaker 2: Russia is historically also taken the male population from the

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Speaker 2: regions and forces them to become soldiers for their military.

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Speaker 2: Once again. They use them primarily as cannon. Father There

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Speaker 2: is no intent that they're going to win the war,

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Speaker 2: said I should say, come back victoriously. They send the

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Speaker 2: soldiers to die. There's an understanding they're going there to

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Speaker 2: be wiped away.

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Speaker 1: They've taken three hundred thousand casualties. Does Russia have the

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Speaker 1: wherewith all military to occupy the whole of Ukraine if

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Speaker 1: Western military support collapses.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I mean that's the whole thing, is that Ukraine

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Speaker 2: is able to keep it together because of the Western

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Speaker 2: military assistance. Should that not come through. Look at the numbers.

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Speaker 2: Russia's got one hundred and forty million people. It's a

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Speaker 2: massive country. And the fact is if they just keep

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Speaker 2: rounding up people and send them off as they are,

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Speaker 2: they will eventually overwhelm Ukraine. Unfortunately. That being said, Ukraine's

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Speaker 2: senior advantage has been the Western military technology that allows

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Speaker 2: us to suffer far less casualties than the Russian side.

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Speaker 2: And it's thanks to the Americans. I mean, I have

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Speaker 2: no doubt about it. It is thanks to the American people.

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Speaker 2: And Ukrainians are very thankful. I want to be clear.

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Speaker 2: Is they're very thankful, and they do bring it up.

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Speaker 2: I mean when they hear my accent, it's one of

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Speaker 2: the first things they say. They love America. They appreciate

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Speaker 2: the Americans have done for them, and they are, you know,

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Speaker 2: worried about what's going on in the domestic American politic.

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Speaker 1: Let's see if we agree on something which I suspect

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Speaker 1: we do. But this is just as a basic strategic proposition, right,

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Speaker 1: if you're a United States senator cold bloodedly looking at

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Speaker 1: this situation, Let's say that you are true equities of

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Speaker 1: the matter or defending Poland and you're really indifferent to Ukraine.

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Speaker 1: Is it not the case that, so long as this

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Speaker 1: war is fought in Ukraine, that the Russians do not

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Speaker 1: have the wherewithal to expand it beyond Ukraine, to say,

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Speaker 1: Moldova or the Baltics, Or do you believe they can

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Speaker 1: continue to fight in Ukraine, will expanding the war simultaneously

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Speaker 1: to those other places? Or do you believe an expansion

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Speaker 1: is the consequence of defeat in Ukraine?

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Speaker 2: So the Russians at this point absolutely cannot take a

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Speaker 2: significantly attack pulling into the Baltic states, e. They're far

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Speaker 2: too occupy it here in Ukraine. That being said, you know,

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Speaker 2: if Ukraine were to fall, yeah, in the closing days

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Speaker 2: of that, they could easily roll through Moldova for instance. No,

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Speaker 2: we'll not take much effort. There's only seven thousand soldiers

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Speaker 2: in Moldova. It'd be pretty quick. Two point five million

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Speaker 2: people in the country. But at this stage, no, far away.

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Speaker 2: Russia just does not have the capacity to do so. Again,

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Speaker 2: you know, I think part of the whole strategy, if

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Speaker 2: I was a US senator, is the fact that hey, listen,

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Speaker 2: is far better. They keep the Russians occupied in Ukraine,

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Speaker 2: Losing troops like crazy, losing tanks like crazy. Russia has

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Speaker 2: lost I want to say, it's the statistic crectness. It's

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Speaker 2: sixty eight percent of its tanks have been destroyed in

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Speaker 2: its moore. The attritionary in the number of its soldiers

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Speaker 2: who die in the war that wiped out, it's about

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Speaker 2: eighty six percent. There's plenty of evidence that Russia does

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Speaker 2: not have the ability to stand up to modern American technologies.

433
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:33,440
Speaker 2: And it's really that simple. And of course the bravery

434
00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:35,760
Speaker 2: of the Ukraine soldiers and all else, but it's the

435
00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:38,840
Speaker 2: technology that's blowing up the tanks. And so we have

436
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,840
Speaker 2: to be clear, is that we are obliterating fifty percent

437
00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:45,560
Speaker 2: of the Russian military and it has cost US five

438
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,520
Speaker 2: percent in the US defense budget. The police comparison that

439
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 2: works out a lesson about let's see five tenths. Let's

440
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:57,200
Speaker 2: say half of one percent of the US national budget,

441
00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 2: half of one percent of the total US budget has

442
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:02,359
Speaker 2: been able to destroy more than fifty percent of the

443
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:04,840
Speaker 2: Russian military. And I think that if we look at

444
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,720
Speaker 2: the many generations of Americans who paid federal taxes to

445
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:11,320
Speaker 2: pay for a military that would specifically defend them from

446
00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 2: the Soviet Union from the Russians. Today we're destroying the

447
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:17,520
Speaker 2: Russian military in a way that they could never have

448
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:21,639
Speaker 2: dreamt of, costing not one US soldier's life. This is

449
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 2: a very low cost. And one thing that they leave

450
00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:27,439
Speaker 2: out in the American talk about this discussion is that

451
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:30,160
Speaker 2: the vast majority of the money, and this is easily

452
00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:33,159
Speaker 2: found in the government's websites, the vast majority of the

453
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:35,200
Speaker 2: money that we give to Ukraine is actually stayed in

454
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:38,600
Speaker 2: the United States. In mind, these are US produced things.

455
00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:42,000
Speaker 2: Abram's tanks are produced in Ohio, you know, these are

456
00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:45,080
Speaker 2: things Louisiana produces one fifty five. There is different things

457
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,480
Speaker 2: where you look at the US States, but they're producing

458
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,000
Speaker 2: the jobs that are created. And how much the weaponry

459
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:56,760
Speaker 2: that Ukraine has given as well as the various artillery

460
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,960
Speaker 2: and stuff like this that were nearing their date of exploration.

461
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:01,800
Speaker 2: They have to be used up by a certain date.

462
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 2: These are things that we've had in stockpiles, a lot

463
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:07,400
Speaker 2: of it from the eighties, you know, from the early nineties.

464
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,120
Speaker 2: They're not going to sit there for one hundred years.

465
00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:11,000
Speaker 2: I mean, if we don't use it a certain time period,

466
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:14,200
Speaker 2: they destroy it, and that costs more money. It costs

467
00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:16,640
Speaker 2: very little senate to Ukraine for free. So the numbers

468
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:18,680
Speaker 2: and how much we're spanning Ukraine, I would argue actually

469
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 2: quite inflated. It's a lot less and it's saving US

470
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 2: taxpayer a lot of dollars in many ways. The US

471
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 2: military and return gets the newer technology, the newer equipment,

472
00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:30,760
Speaker 2: and we're offloading the older stuff or the more used

473
00:29:30,760 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 2: stuff to Ukrainians. So this is a win win for everybody,

474
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 2: and we're getting rid of one of our greatest geopolitical

475
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,240
Speaker 2: foes in our entire history.

476
00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:41,280
Speaker 1: Well, you know, it's funny listening to you say that.

477
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 1: I mean, I do have a bit of a different

478
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:49,160
Speaker 1: opinion on the messaging piece, though I understand the meritoriousness

479
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 1: right of the argument you're making. But in the end,

480
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 1: it costs what it costs, because the cost of Ukraine

481
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 1: falling to the Russian Federation under Vladimir Putin is ultimately

482
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:13,360
Speaker 1: paid for by America's young men and women somewhere down

483
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:18,520
Speaker 1: the line in a widening European war. And so you

484
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 1: have a confluence of leaders in Trump, in lepenn far

485
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 1: right party rising in Germany, that are all that you

486
00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 1: need to unravel the EU, to unravel NATO, and history

487
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 1: would suggest that there's terrible consequences to that, particularly particularly

488
00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:54,719
Speaker 1: in Europe. So you know, this is an urgent moment

489
00:30:55,000 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 1: I think for America's national security in one where the

490
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 1: arming of Ukraine is an essential matter in the in

491
00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:08,480
Speaker 1: the politics of it in the States are clear is

492
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:13,200
Speaker 1: that President Biden is going to have to capitulate on

493
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 1: the on the border funding issue. And these issues should

494
00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:19,080
Speaker 1: never have been linked. One should not be used to

495
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:24,200
Speaker 1: ransom the other, particularly by the extremists that are doing

496
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:28,400
Speaker 1: the ransoming. But they have succeeded in doing it, and

497
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 1: I think that the Biden administration will be compelled to

498
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 1: cut that deal. But the fundamental issue for Ukraine in

499
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: the United States is that in the course of a year,

500
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:52,960
Speaker 1: President Zelenski has gone from a universally admired man to

501
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 1: a man who the presence draws a lot of indifference.

502
00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 1: The attention span of the United States is that of

503
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:10,280
Speaker 1: a gerbil And in the end, there has to be

504
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 1: a consistency of communication about the urgency of what's at stake,

505
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:20,960
Speaker 1: because this is going to go on for a long

506
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,480
Speaker 1: long time, and the American commitment has to be absolute

507
00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:31,520
Speaker 1: until the end, and that the war cannot stop, must

508
00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:35,960
Speaker 1: not stop until there are no longer any Russians on

509
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,720
Speaker 1: Ukrainian soil left to be killed. And that's how the

510
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 1: war can stop. And that's the position of the Ukrainian government,

511
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 1: that's the position of the Ukrainian people, and the American

512
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 1: position must be to arm and support them for as

513
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 1: long as as necessary. And it's incumbent upon America's political

514
00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:03,200
Speaker 1: leaders to communicate that, I think, with absolute with absolute clarity.

515
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:07,760
Speaker 1: It may cost more and real dollars next year and

516
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:11,160
Speaker 1: more than that. Whatever the number is, it's a big number,

517
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 1: but it's one we can easily afford because we're a

518
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:18,520
Speaker 1: very rich country, and we're a country that spends such

519
00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 1: an extraordinary amount of money on its armaments that it's

520
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 1: impossible for the Pentagon to pass an audit. So there's

521
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:34,320
Speaker 1: a lot of crocodile tiers around this issue. And the

522
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:43,320
Speaker 1: underlying infection is the America first infection. We have seen

523
00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 1: a reawakened affinity for fascism, and there's always been part

524
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 1: of the body politic, part of the leadership that has

525
00:33:55,440 --> 00:34:02,640
Speaker 1: embraced it. Was some blindness, the authority impulse, the shiny uniform,

526
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:11,840
Speaker 1: the military parade, the dogmatic religiosity that is thinly veiled authoritarianism,

527
00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:15,719
Speaker 1: and all of these, all of these things you get

528
00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:18,680
Speaker 1: to see play out with regard to Ukraine. And it's

529
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:26,040
Speaker 1: quite interesting to me the parallels between that affinity and

530
00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 1: affiliation towards Vladimir Putin as it compares to the affiliations

531
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:41,240
Speaker 1: towards Adolph Hitler. And you know, Tucker Carlson is very

532
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:52,360
Speaker 1: much a Father Kauflin type figure for the digital age.

533
00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 1: And the reality is that none of it is particularly

534
00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:02,480
Speaker 1: surprising because of a version of it has already played

535
00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:08,200
Speaker 1: out literally within a human lifetime, which is the astonishing

536
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:16,399
Speaker 1: part with a whole society. Amniesia about what happens when

537
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:29,480
Speaker 1: a aggressive imperial country like Russia tries to aggrandize itself

538
00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:35,000
Speaker 1: through acts of war and acts of war crimes, to

539
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:39,800
Speaker 1: enlarge its territory and to impose its will on people

540
00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:45,600
Speaker 1: that it regards as less than and that's what's happening

541
00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:48,319
Speaker 1: in Ukraine and the United States has to be at

542
00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 1: the center, not just of the armaments end of it,

543
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 1: but in terms of making the moral argument in defense

544
00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 1: of liberty and freedom. That's so essential, I think.

545
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:03,319
Speaker 2: Absolutely. I think you're absolutely right. And you know, it

546
00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:05,879
Speaker 2: is shocking to me to see that the United States

547
00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:09,920
Speaker 2: so many people do not appreciate the parallels which is highlighted.

548
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 2: That's the rise of Hitler. I mean, if you look

549
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 2: at Putin, I think you'd be very hard priced to

550
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:18,439
Speaker 2: find people who followed Putin carefully who would not say

551
00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:22,280
Speaker 2: there are very clear parallels to Germany in the thirties.

552
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:27,360
Speaker 2: The fact is that Letter Putin has already occupied other countries' territory.

553
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:31,799
Speaker 2: He has created a it's not patriotism and then it

554
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:34,879
Speaker 2: is fascism. Truly, if you look at this ulternationalism within

555
00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:40,600
Speaker 2: the population, the superiority of ethnic Russians, linguistic Russians. They

556
00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:43,800
Speaker 2: don't use the word superior, but it's very clear what's

557
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 2: being implied. What they're trying to say by it, the

558
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:50,320
Speaker 2: fact they've deemed everything that's foreign to be some similarti

559
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 2: enemy in or country everything that's a foreign let's say,

560
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:59,319
Speaker 2: belief or religion or anything else is bad. It needs

561
00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:01,439
Speaker 2: to be stopped, stopped out. There is no free press

562
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:03,439
Speaker 2: in Russia. There hasn't been for a long time. They're

563
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 2: not free trials in Russia or court processes. There is

564
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:10,600
Speaker 2: not by any means of free society. I mean a

565
00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:13,160
Speaker 2: podcast such as this would absolutely free to bid in Russia.

566
00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 2: I mean your house will definitely get rated for something

567
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:17,480
Speaker 2: like that, and you wound up in the camps. I mean, listen,

568
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:20,560
Speaker 2: they have plenty of people in Russia sent to prison

569
00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:23,920
Speaker 2: for years for doing something so small. It's pulling it

570
00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 2: up aside. That just says no war. It's all says

571
00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:29,800
Speaker 2: no war, no war, and you'll get years in prison.

572
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:31,960
Speaker 2: You get up to fifteen years in prison for that. Now,

573
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:34,279
Speaker 2: people stay outside of the Kremlin and you can find

574
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:36,960
Speaker 2: it videos online with a blank piece of paper. Just

575
00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 2: hold up a blank piece of paper. Doesn't say anything.

576
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 2: But the shade absurdity of the police state is that

577
00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 2: they will arrest you and take you away. You will

578
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:46,319
Speaker 2: go to prison. This is not a joke. Russia is

579
00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:49,400
Speaker 2: a fascist state. Their brand washing their population, and this

580
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:51,399
Speaker 2: is you know, we throw that word around a lot

581
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:53,719
Speaker 2: in other countries that bit in the US, but this

582
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 2: is something unparalleled. We've never had something like this. I mean,

583
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:00,719
Speaker 2: the social media such as Facebook and things there are

584
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:02,760
Speaker 2: not used. They have their own which is a direct

585
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:06,239
Speaker 2: copy paste of what Facebook looks like the conductor on

586
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,239
Speaker 2: the classicky they're called. They look exactly the same as

587
00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:12,640
Speaker 2: Facebook or no social media. They have their own chats

588
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:15,920
Speaker 2: like WhatsApp or signal. They have their own it's called telegram,

589
00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:18,799
Speaker 2: which they use. They can monitor what the users do.

590
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 2: They can monitor the users right, they can monitor which

591
00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:24,840
Speaker 2: groups they join. And then when somebody is you know,

592
00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:27,880
Speaker 2: they notice is engaging in behavior which is state does

593
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 2: not sanctioned to come and raid their house. They do have,

594
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:34,239
Speaker 2: you know, all sorts of loyalty tests and verification of

595
00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 2: people is to a degree. And and I know this

596
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:40,399
Speaker 2: is a far branch you got on, but I think

597
00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:43,280
Speaker 2: it is a serious argument that it is worse today

598
00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:46,560
Speaker 2: than it was in the Soviet Union. Simply the Soviet Union.

599
00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:50,200
Speaker 2: I don't think they're the technological capacity to monitor the

600
00:38:50,239 --> 00:38:53,280
Speaker 2: citizens as closely as they are now. They are able

601
00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 2: to monitor them on the most every level possible. Obviously,

602
00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,279
Speaker 2: all their credit card data and everything else to make

603
00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:01,319
Speaker 2: sure what they're percha seeing from whom you're purchasing, if

604
00:39:01,360 --> 00:39:04,360
Speaker 2: it's foreign or if it's domestic. They really keep tabs

605
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:06,920
Speaker 2: on their people and they live in fear, and people

606
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:09,760
Speaker 2: know that they can't joke about things. What's what's forbidden

607
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:13,719
Speaker 2: to talk about. It is a closed society. Increase in

608
00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:16,640
Speaker 2: the closed society, and it isn't direct threat to the

609
00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:18,480
Speaker 2: United States. And actually that, you know, I think that's

610
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:21,440
Speaker 2: one thing that anyone who's lost about the America or

611
00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:25,200
Speaker 2: thinks this about Ukraine is absolutely wrong. Listen, Ukraine is

612
00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:28,320
Speaker 2: the first step, and this is this is the first

613
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:30,759
Speaker 2: stop on the metro. This is gonna keep going, and

614
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:32,600
Speaker 2: the next stop is going to be other countries. It

615
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:34,320
Speaker 2: is definitely going to be you know, the Moltogas or

616
00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:37,520
Speaker 2: the Baltic States and then Poland's. And that's why the

617
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:40,920
Speaker 2: Baltic states in Poland have been so openly in favor

618
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:43,880
Speaker 2: of Ukraine or continue to assist it and to push

619
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 2: US lawmakers as well to support it, is because they

620
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:48,880
Speaker 2: know it's their own self security that comes with this.

621
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:52,759
Speaker 2: But let's look at the repercussions we see Venezuela let's

622
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:56,720
Speaker 2: take Guyana, that's not by coincidence. Venezuela is as close

623
00:39:56,760 --> 00:39:59,359
Speaker 2: as it gets to Russia as possible. We see what's

624
00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:03,480
Speaker 2: going on China and Tailan that's also related to what Russia.

625
00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:06,960
Speaker 2: Russia showed is perhaps gonna be some permissibility if we

626
00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:09,160
Speaker 2: do this, if especially if Trump were to come to power,

627
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:11,799
Speaker 2: and so we're going to start laying the cars up.

628
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:16,560
Speaker 2: We see that Russia's leading its allies around the world Iran,

629
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:20,399
Speaker 2: for instance, cooperation with HESBA and Hamas, which by the way,

630
00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 2: Hamas was in meetings in Moscow in mid October.

631
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:24,560
Speaker 1: Uh.

632
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:28,400
Speaker 2: They've openly worked with organizations like this for years. Russia

633
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 2: is a direct threat to the United States security globally

634
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:35,000
Speaker 2: and our allies, not just ours, our allies. So if

635
00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:37,600
Speaker 2: anyone is so misguided as believers, well you know who

636
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:39,920
Speaker 2: cares if they take Ukraine. You know, if you're willing

637
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:42,520
Speaker 2: to look past a genocide, that's not going to turn

638
00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:46,279
Speaker 2: your stomach. Okay, but let me argue that eventually it

639
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:48,520
Speaker 2: will be American soldiers that will die for this, have

640
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:52,080
Speaker 2: no doubt about this. US citizens will die as a

641
00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:54,840
Speaker 2: result of this decision. So right now, it's pay a

642
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:57,279
Speaker 2: little bit of money, less than five percent of the

643
00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 2: defense budget, and we can keep this far from our shores,

644
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:01,920
Speaker 2: protector Alice and protect her sons from having to go

645
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:03,880
Speaker 2: fight a war. Or we can say we're going to

646
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,760
Speaker 2: fight over this for these crocodiles. Here is about saving

647
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:09,560
Speaker 2: taxpayers money. And in fact, no, that's gonna be your

648
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:11,960
Speaker 2: sons at diamonds war, and it'll cost US hundreds of

649
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 2: billions of dollars in the meantime.

650
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:18,200
Speaker 1: Well, save taxpayer money. We hire five thousand auditors to

651
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:21,880
Speaker 1: go in there and kick ass, right like a sealed

652
00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:28,440
Speaker 1: team of auditors to deal with what Dwight Eisenhower warned about.

653
00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:34,560
Speaker 1: But you know, look, the US Navy isn't big enough,

654
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 1: the procurement process is shattered, the waste is profound, but

655
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:56,359
Speaker 1: there's no choice. But two are in Ukraine. And I

656
00:41:56,360 --> 00:42:00,839
Speaker 1: think that this has to be and elevate cause in

657
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:04,800
Speaker 1: the United States, and that there needs to be better

658
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:09,680
Speaker 1: communication about the matter as a as a whole, which

659
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 1: is one of the reasons I wanted to have you

660
00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:16,120
Speaker 1: on and talk about it today so that you know,

661
00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:19,240
Speaker 1: people can get a better sense. But let me ask

662
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 1: you this too, talk about what it is like to

663
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:28,000
Speaker 1: live in Kiev. Now are you moving around the country.

664
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:38,719
Speaker 1: How close are you to the combat zones in your coverage?

665
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:42,560
Speaker 1: If at if at all? Are you primarily in the city?

666
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 1: What is what is life like? Is there privation? Are

667
00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:51,440
Speaker 1: there things you can't get on the stores? Is is

668
00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:58,279
Speaker 1: life away from the frontline fairly normal? Is the air

669
00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:03,239
Speaker 1: raid or the missile attack now a routine oze, you know,

670
00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:06,120
Speaker 1: a routine part of the part of the day that

671
00:43:06,920 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 1: you know people you know, we're just innoored to it.

672
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:13,359
Speaker 1: We talk about what life is like.

673
00:43:14,920 --> 00:43:16,720
Speaker 2: So you know, it depends on where in the country

674
00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:18,920
Speaker 2: you are, and it is quite a large country for

675
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:23,360
Speaker 2: European standards. I'm using in Kiev, the capital. In Kiev,

676
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 2: there is routinely drone strikes, drum attacks. The drones are

677
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:31,760
Speaker 2: Iranian made primarily. They typically come in they're quite loud

678
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:35,359
Speaker 2: if historically them they've got chiry ones not to but

679
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:37,480
Speaker 2: that's you know, that sets off the air rate alarms.

680
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:39,680
Speaker 2: The air rate alarms also go off whenever a MiG

681
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 2: Russian made airplane and Soviet made airplane takes off in

682
00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:46,080
Speaker 2: Belarus or in Russia that's near the border. Because they

683
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:50,000
Speaker 2: use the MiGs. The fire missiles. The the ballistic missiles

684
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:53,560
Speaker 2: are fired from the Mins into Ukrainian cities, so they

685
00:43:53,600 --> 00:43:56,960
Speaker 2: target from you know, air and they fire into land

686
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:01,719
Speaker 2: targets here in Ukraine now obviously, I mean, thank god,

687
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:04,719
Speaker 2: in Kiev it's much quieter. That is, let's say, in

688
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:06,279
Speaker 2: an eastern part of the country. In eastern part of

689
00:44:06,280 --> 00:44:08,960
Speaker 2: the country, it is I mean it's horrendous. I mean,

690
00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:14,200
Speaker 2: the firing and the shooting doesn't stop. It does go constantly.

691
00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:19,319
Speaker 2: You can hear small arms artillerary, there's the drones hanging

692
00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 2: over head constantly. It is. It is World War One

693
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:25,960
Speaker 2: sort of conditions for the soldiers. It's winter and outs.

694
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:28,560
Speaker 2: I mean it's Ukraine, so it's cold, so they're in

695
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:32,959
Speaker 2: sub you know, zero temperatures outside in the snow, as

696
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 2: as things are just exploding constantly, especially at night. The

697
00:44:37,719 --> 00:44:40,120
Speaker 2: air rates tend to offs in this key as well

698
00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:42,680
Speaker 2: as in the front. Nighttime is when a lot of

699
00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:46,040
Speaker 2: the big explosions happen because you know, it's harder to

700
00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:49,240
Speaker 2: detect things such as drones or like its missiles as well.

701
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:54,960
Speaker 2: It's it's it adds confusion, but also that's terror. There's

702
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:57,920
Speaker 2: a whole population's woken up. Every night. Not every night.

703
00:44:57,960 --> 00:44:59,719
Speaker 2: I mean it was quite for pure but yes, very

704
00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:01,279
Speaker 2: f and go off a couple of times a night.

705
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:04,160
Speaker 2: So if you're the local population and you're trying to

706
00:45:04,160 --> 00:45:06,200
Speaker 2: sleep at nights and you're you know, this air raid

707
00:45:06,239 --> 00:45:08,120
Speaker 2: which is out in the streets goes off and goes off,

708
00:45:08,160 --> 00:45:10,560
Speaker 2: goes off, of course it's gonna wake you up. It's

709
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 2: become normalized the sense that you know, I talked to

710
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 2: her friends in the morning after an air raid and

711
00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:19,759
Speaker 2: they talk about how their kids sleep in the bathroom specifically.

712
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:21,360
Speaker 2: You know, the bathroom is not gonna have windows on

713
00:45:21,440 --> 00:45:23,760
Speaker 2: everything else, so there's up being broken glass or shards

714
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:27,480
Speaker 2: coming through if something explodes outside, or they sleep in

715
00:45:27,480 --> 00:45:30,920
Speaker 2: the hallway. There's one friend of mine who works in

716
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:33,959
Speaker 2: television news in Ukraine. Her or she's a single mother.

717
00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:40,400
Speaker 2: The run just a rush raw missile was headed towards

718
00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:43,360
Speaker 2: Ky if the air defense fortunately shot it down. The

719
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 2: downside is when you shoot down, when air defense shoots

720
00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:49,600
Speaker 2: down a rocket or missile, it's still going to fall somewhere.

721
00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:50,200
Speaker 1: Uh.

722
00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:52,080
Speaker 2: In that case, I fell in her house and exploded.

723
00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:54,600
Speaker 2: She her ten year old son was at home alone.

724
00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:57,720
Speaker 2: She was at work. He heard the air raid alert

725
00:45:57,760 --> 00:46:00,640
Speaker 2: and went to the basement by himself and fortunately survived.

726
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,960
Speaker 2: The house got completely destroyed, her car get destroyed, She's

727
00:46:04,000 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 2: got nothing left, and she's literally she's living in the

728
00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:09,960
Speaker 2: framework of that house now, which they've got a heater.

729
00:46:10,040 --> 00:46:12,360
Speaker 2: They put on some patch parts of the walls. But

730
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:15,759
Speaker 2: she was telling me it's about twelve degree centigrade, which

731
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:19,400
Speaker 2: I guess is probably the low forties mid forties of

732
00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:23,880
Speaker 2: temperature during the day and night, and it's so it's cold,

733
00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:25,880
Speaker 2: and she's living there with her son, and she was

734
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:29,400
Speaker 2: asking me if I could help them, And that's not uncommon.

735
00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:30,960
Speaker 2: I've been plenty of people have had it sort of

736
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:34,759
Speaker 2: her fate and her case. You know, I look at

737
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:37,400
Speaker 2: it and say, it's incredible, what can be done for you?

738
00:46:37,719 --> 00:46:40,480
Speaker 2: In fact, this the government's broke International insurance is both

739
00:46:40,520 --> 00:46:44,279
Speaker 2: the Messing insurance does not cover acts of war. As

740
00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:45,960
Speaker 2: it does not cover acts of war, means you're just

741
00:46:46,000 --> 00:46:47,799
Speaker 2: out of luck. You know, if your car gets total

742
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:50,800
Speaker 2: buyed or your house gets burned or blown up, as hersted,

743
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:54,279
Speaker 2: you've just lost your life savings. There's no way everything

744
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:56,640
Speaker 2: to recover it. Keep in mind, the average salary for

745
00:46:56,680 --> 00:46:59,400
Speaker 2: a worker here such as herself. I don't know exactly

746
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 2: what you got paid, but I'll guess to me it's

747
00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:03,759
Speaker 2: about seven hundred dollars a month. How will she ever

748
00:47:03,880 --> 00:47:06,839
Speaker 2: be able to fix this damage? It's and she said

749
00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:08,359
Speaker 2: it was asked to be twenty thousand to fix her

750
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 2: house back to what it was. It was an inheritance

751
00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:14,239
Speaker 2: from the Soviet period from her grandparents who had lived there.

752
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:16,959
Speaker 2: But how was she ever if you mixed one hundred

753
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:18,759
Speaker 2: I was a month to get twenty thousand. She'll never

754
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:21,880
Speaker 2: get'll never And so the reality is that she's going

755
00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:25,200
Speaker 2: to live in destitute poverty unless a miracle comes through

756
00:47:25,280 --> 00:47:28,040
Speaker 2: sheets the job outside the country. But this is this

757
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:31,000
Speaker 2: sort of thing happens to people. I mean people Dan

758
00:47:31,239 --> 00:47:34,640
Speaker 2: and Dana are struggling. Twenty six percent is the unofficial on.

759
00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:37,680
Speaker 1: The twenty And she's a broadcast journalist.

760
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 2: She works behind us the camera. She does not work

761
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:43,239
Speaker 2: behind it. She works behind the camera, not in front

762
00:47:43,239 --> 00:47:47,759
Speaker 2: of the camera. But yes, so she was doing you know,

763
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:51,400
Speaker 2: different things for programming, but by profession, she was working

764
00:47:51,440 --> 00:47:55,120
Speaker 2: with disabled children and as a psychologist for them. But

765
00:47:55,160 --> 00:47:58,400
Speaker 2: there was trying to get a change of professions so

766
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:00,319
Speaker 2: she could be a home more with her son, and

767
00:48:00,360 --> 00:48:03,680
Speaker 2: this is what happens. So she's a good person and

768
00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:07,920
Speaker 2: that's what happens. Then you have the other situations here

769
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:10,560
Speaker 2: in the country. You know, there's six point two million

770
00:48:10,719 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 2: Ukrainian women and children who have left the country since

771
00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:17,560
Speaker 2: the war began, primarily in Europe. Poland's the biggest country

772
00:48:17,560 --> 00:48:20,080
Speaker 2: they've moved to. We know that there's been a host

773
00:48:20,120 --> 00:48:23,120
Speaker 2: of prompts of them being abducted for sex trafficking all

774
00:48:23,160 --> 00:48:25,240
Speaker 2: over the world. I meant to Turkey, to Middle East,

775
00:48:26,120 --> 00:48:30,560
Speaker 2: all over the place, and women, well mostly the younger women,

776
00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:34,160
Speaker 2: girls and children. But we also have you know, the

777
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:37,520
Speaker 2: people that are lives are destroyed. I mean, they've got

778
00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:41,640
Speaker 2: no future once they've left Ukraine, they have no community,

779
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:43,360
Speaker 2: they don't know what to do. They have been outside

780
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:45,560
Speaker 2: the country before, so they just sort of left to

781
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:48,480
Speaker 2: their own luck of the wind. But within the country,

782
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:50,880
Speaker 2: as it say, it's twenty six percent unemployment rate, that's official,

783
00:48:51,000 --> 00:48:55,400
Speaker 2: it's presumed to be much higher. It's quite a bit destitution.

784
00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:57,840
Speaker 2: There is not everything that they used to be in

785
00:48:57,920 --> 00:49:02,720
Speaker 2: stores by any means. It's become much harder, uh, including

786
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:05,920
Speaker 2: things like medical eriods and stuff like that things that

787
00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:09,279
Speaker 2: are more expensive because there's much less demands. Uh. You

788
00:49:09,320 --> 00:49:11,359
Speaker 2: see a lot of store fronts that are closed. There

789
00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:13,560
Speaker 2: used to be all open. It was very vibrant, I'm

790
00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:15,719
Speaker 2: gonna say, keV. I mean was a lot of fun.

791
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:17,719
Speaker 2: All the cities I've been to in Europe, which is

792
00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,359
Speaker 2: right number, Uh, this was by far the most fun.

793
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:24,120
Speaker 2: Cub was a great city. And it's just it's it's dying.

794
00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:26,680
Speaker 2: And it's simply dying because you.

795
00:49:26,640 --> 00:49:31,000
Speaker 1: Know, is there anyone in the restaurants? Are their restaurants

796
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:34,319
Speaker 1: open or their bars open or there? You know, as

797
00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:38,479
Speaker 1: you pointed out, it was a vibrant, vibrant city place

798
00:49:38,560 --> 00:49:43,080
Speaker 1: I've been to more than more than once. What is there?

799
00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 1: Is there any social activity that's carrying on, any type

800
00:49:49,320 --> 00:49:53,279
Speaker 1: of normalcy you know that you would expect in a

801
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:54,000
Speaker 1: great city.

802
00:49:54,880 --> 00:49:57,160
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, there are there are some restaurants open.

803
00:49:57,880 --> 00:49:59,400
Speaker 2: A lot I've gone out of business, but there are

804
00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:05,600
Speaker 2: some open. There are some you know, cafes open, coffee shops.

805
00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:08,120
Speaker 2: Once again, the quantity is much less than what was before,

806
00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:13,600
Speaker 2: but it's it's it's no the nightlife, I mean for execos,

807
00:50:13,719 --> 00:50:16,920
Speaker 2: it's non existent for that matter. You know, there's a

808
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:19,000
Speaker 2: curfew in the country due to the state of war

809
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:22,080
Speaker 2: and the martial law. So it's by midnight people off

810
00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:24,760
Speaker 2: to be home, which is especially here in the capital

811
00:50:24,880 --> 00:50:29,000
Speaker 2: in the eastern parts of country, strictly obeyed. Because I

812
00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:33,000
Speaker 2: have a journalistic pass, an ID military d I'm allowed

813
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 2: to be out. Passes are so I have walked just

814
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:37,320
Speaker 2: so curiosity to see if it's strictly obeyed. But I

815
00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:39,480
Speaker 2: can assure you it's strictly obayed. There are no cars

816
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:42,920
Speaker 2: out past midnight until five am, and that's very very

817
00:50:42,920 --> 00:50:45,120
Speaker 2: simple reason. I mean, it is one in the early

818
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:46,759
Speaker 2: days of where there's a lot of seven tours that

819
00:50:46,840 --> 00:50:49,839
Speaker 2: were catching Russians and people assisting the Russians to give

820
00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:52,759
Speaker 2: the positions. But at this point, you know, a lot

821
00:50:52,800 --> 00:50:56,279
Speaker 2: of the military reposition of technologies happens tonight. So I

822
00:50:56,280 --> 00:50:58,359
Speaker 2: think it's to try to keep taps on that and

823
00:50:58,560 --> 00:51:01,360
Speaker 2: also try to control I mean, it's you know, I

824
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:03,759
Speaker 2: don't think most people would, but just the hypothetical. I

825
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:06,520
Speaker 2: don't think it's necessarily good for the morale that people

826
00:51:06,520 --> 00:51:08,560
Speaker 2: are going to nightclubs in the midst of a war,

827
00:51:08,920 --> 00:51:11,600
Speaker 2: which they're not because they're not open, they're closed. So

828
00:51:11,640 --> 00:51:14,279
Speaker 2: that's not happening. People aren't going out and drinking all night.

829
00:51:14,360 --> 00:51:18,240
Speaker 2: That's not happening. It is much more of a controlled situation.

830
00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:21,960
Speaker 2: But people realize that there's an existential battle of their

831
00:51:21,960 --> 00:51:25,160
Speaker 2: country's engage. And when you talk to people, I assure

832
00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:27,799
Speaker 2: you just go and you know, ask them how to

833
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:29,640
Speaker 2: do it, and ask them, do you know if there's

834
00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:32,200
Speaker 2: anyone in the war, anyone personally who's in the war.

835
00:51:32,680 --> 00:51:35,279
Speaker 2: One percent chance they will tell you about their friends

836
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:38,279
Speaker 2: and family in the war. More than likely than that,

837
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,719
Speaker 2: at this point they will mention who has died or

838
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:44,000
Speaker 2: been permanently injured in the war. When you rock down

839
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:46,040
Speaker 2: men sheet the street in the key of this ko kushetik,

840
00:51:47,160 --> 00:51:49,960
Speaker 2: one thing you'll notice is and you know, I had

841
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:52,719
Speaker 2: never paid attention to it. A Polish journalist was here

842
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:55,040
Speaker 2: last month and he knowed this when we were walking

843
00:51:55,040 --> 00:51:56,480
Speaker 2: down the street. And I guess, I'm sure, like the

844
00:51:56,480 --> 00:51:59,040
Speaker 2: frog that's in the boiling water, I didn't realize if

845
00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:01,359
Speaker 2: it's something here every day, it's getting worse. If I

846
00:52:01,360 --> 00:52:04,440
Speaker 2: didn't notice it is you notice the number of amputees.

847
00:52:04,880 --> 00:52:08,360
Speaker 2: The number of amputees is really staggering. And I just

848
00:52:08,440 --> 00:52:10,239
Speaker 2: never appreciate it because it's just you know, every day

849
00:52:10,280 --> 00:52:12,200
Speaker 2: it's a little bit more. But at this point, yeah,

850
00:52:12,640 --> 00:52:16,000
Speaker 2: you see quite a bit double amputees. Otherwise, you see

851
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:20,080
Speaker 2: people with facial burns, they're they're pounched up, you see

852
00:52:20,120 --> 00:52:23,480
Speaker 2: things with just you know, horrible things have happened people

853
00:52:23,520 --> 00:52:26,200
Speaker 2: in the Horses War. And it's not just soldiers, there's

854
00:52:26,239 --> 00:52:27,840
Speaker 2: plenty of civilians.

855
00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:34,359
Speaker 1: Yet the morale of the country remains high. Yeah, it

856
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:35,879
Speaker 1: is defiant, it.

857
00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:38,640
Speaker 2: Remains define because the listeners, to be fair, they themselves

858
00:52:38,719 --> 00:52:42,200
Speaker 2: believe what is true that if Putin were to take

859
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:46,320
Speaker 2: something like Kiev, he will send their children off to Russia.

860
00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:50,480
Speaker 2: The younger girls will become the prostitutes of the Russian soldiers.

861
00:52:51,800 --> 00:52:55,080
Speaker 2: They will be tortured, that men will go the forced

862
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:57,919
Speaker 2: than to fight against western Ukrainians. As the Russians move

863
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:01,320
Speaker 2: further west, they will send those men off to become canafather.

864
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:05,560
Speaker 2: Everything of value here will be robbed or eluded, They

865
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:08,319
Speaker 2: will destroy anything of cultural value, because this is what

866
00:53:08,400 --> 00:53:12,840
Speaker 2: Russia has done throughout eastern Ukraine. Russia has routinely done this.

867
00:53:12,840 --> 00:53:15,160
Speaker 2: This is a genocide or mayor Viar Putin is up

868
00:53:15,280 --> 00:53:19,360
Speaker 2: at the International Criminal Court International arrest war for charges

869
00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:24,480
Speaker 2: of trafficking in children. He's up on stealing children and

870
00:53:24,520 --> 00:53:28,439
Speaker 2: deporting them to Russia. This is what the Russia, Matarizi gets.

871
00:53:28,640 --> 00:53:31,200
Speaker 2: This is not just you know, geopolitics, which is an

872
00:53:31,239 --> 00:53:35,000
Speaker 2: important and going to discuss, but this is actual genocide

873
00:53:35,040 --> 00:53:38,200
Speaker 2: taking place. The UN commissions looking to this is called

874
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:42,200
Speaker 2: the same conclusions. This is terrifying and it's happening today.

875
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:44,680
Speaker 2: And the fact that people think of this is in

876
00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:47,520
Speaker 2: terms of oh, that's a Biden issuer. You know, that's

877
00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:50,799
Speaker 2: not good for Trump or whatever. People the confines or

878
00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:53,920
Speaker 2: context that they add to it, please ignore it. Just

879
00:53:53,960 --> 00:53:55,600
Speaker 2: look at what's going on in the grounds. I think

880
00:53:55,640 --> 00:53:58,920
Speaker 2: as Americans we should defend freedom and value such as

881
00:53:58,960 --> 00:54:02,560
Speaker 2: our own US who support America, such as the Greens.

882
00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:04,719
Speaker 2: We we should be doing what we can to to

883
00:54:04,800 --> 00:54:08,040
Speaker 2: fight off this new wave of fascism.

884
00:54:08,080 --> 00:54:11,640
Speaker 1: It's a perfect place to leave it. Jason Smart, thank

885
00:54:11,680 --> 00:54:15,280
Speaker 1: you so much. Stay safe, and Keeve, thank.

886
00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:20,360
Speaker 2: You, Steves. I appreciate it. H