WEBVTT - More, Everything, Forever With Adam Becker

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<v Speaker 1>Also media, Hello and welcome to Better Offline. I'm your

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<v Speaker 1>host ed ze trick as ever. Go to the episode

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<v Speaker 1>notes to sign up to the newsletter. Please do the

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<v Speaker 1>premium hotel Mike mmoney, buy a Fun Data Center's T shirt,

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<v Speaker 1>or join one of the assorted communities if you ever

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<v Speaker 1>want to fall further into the larger Zetron verse. But

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<v Speaker 1>today we're joined by the author of More Everything Forever.

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<v Speaker 1>That's right, journalist and astrophysicist Adam Becker. Adam, how you doing?

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<v Speaker 2>I'm doing well? D How are you go?

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<v Speaker 1>On new podcast, don't you?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? I do. It's called Dreaming Against the Machine and

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<v Speaker 2>it just came out pretty recently.

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<v Speaker 1>What's about, Well.

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<v Speaker 2>It's uh, it's like a more optimistic version of this podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, No, I like that. I like this. I want

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<v Speaker 1>to hear about that. Tell me yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>So, uh, you know, I spent a lot of time

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<v Speaker 2>when I was writing my book More Everything Forever thinking

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<v Speaker 2>about terrible people and they're bad ideas about the future,

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<v Speaker 2>and that made me want to think more about good

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<v Speaker 2>ideas about the future and people who I actually like.

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<v Speaker 2>And so the podcast is about, you know, trying to

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<v Speaker 2>imagine what a realistic, good future could look like, yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Could you give me some examples?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh no, I have no idea.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh okay, yeah, still work in that one out.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, still figuring that out. I mean that's that's sort

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<v Speaker 2>of the podcast is me thinking out loud about these

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<v Speaker 2>things with different guests each week. So yeah, I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>it's certainly a future where we've found a way to

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<v Speaker 2>wrench power away from these tech billionaires. And it's not

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<v Speaker 2>a future that involves like, you know, space colonization and

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<v Speaker 2>super intelligent AI. But more than that, I'm still figuring

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<v Speaker 2>that out. That's that's what the podcast is for. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>I do get a good amount of people who email

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<v Speaker 1>and are like, yeah, well why don't you to do

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<v Speaker 1>you talk about more positive things on the show? A

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<v Speaker 1>it's tough to find them. But but also sometimes when

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<v Speaker 1>I do it, people get mad at me. Yeah, but

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<v Speaker 1>people are like, I don't think that you missed the shill.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't think you mind people being mad at you

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<v Speaker 1>ed I yeah, I don't. But at the same time,

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<v Speaker 1>it's like when I'm like, I mentioned this Nebula X

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<v Speaker 1>one projector thing, I really like, it's quite expensive. It's

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<v Speaker 1>like this insane thing in like a box as a projector.

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<v Speaker 1>It's like, got the speakers you could plug in and

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<v Speaker 1>they're all wireless and it's beautiful. That works every while.

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<v Speaker 1>I talked about that once and I have people email

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<v Speaker 1>me saying, Edge, you're a shill. You're being a shill.

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<v Speaker 1>You can't And it's like, oh my Christ, do I

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<v Speaker 1>have to hate everything? Because there's plenty I do, don't

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<v Speaker 1>get me wrong. Yeah, don't get I feel like you

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<v Speaker 1>get plenty. Yeah, But I feel like there are some

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<v Speaker 1>really good things. Like I feel like if America was

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<v Speaker 1>not under the gustocracy right now, we would be in

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<v Speaker 1>a kind of golden era of solar. Like I have

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<v Speaker 1>solar in my house in Vegas barely pain electricity bot.

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<v Speaker 1>It's kind of magic. It's kind of amazing. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, no, I mean there's there's a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>great technology, and solar is a really good example. Like

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<v Speaker 2>the solar technology has gotten really great, battery technology has

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<v Speaker 2>gotten really great. I think that these are wonderful things.

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<v Speaker 2>And yeah, if we weren't subsidizing fossil fuels and actually

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<v Speaker 2>thinking clearly about both what is the you know, the

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<v Speaker 2>cheapest and most effective sources of energy and what would

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<v Speaker 2>be best for the climate and the planet. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>I think it would be pretty clear that we'd be

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<v Speaker 2>going through an even faster energy transition than we are already.

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<v Speaker 1>Wouldn't energy also be cheaper if we were a mass

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<v Speaker 1>solar I'm sure someone's gonna hate me for saying that.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that's true. You know, I have to look

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<v Speaker 2>at the numbers, but I mean, solar is I believe

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<v Speaker 2>the cheapest source of energy at the moment has been

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<v Speaker 2>for a bit.

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<v Speaker 1>What if instead we could just have natural gas everywhere,

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<v Speaker 1>which is very cheap, I'm hearing at the moment. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>there's lots of it. Nothing's happened to the supply. Everyone's fine, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>everything's fine.

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<v Speaker 2>Nothing is broken, and we're getting really tired of winning.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Talking of thinking though, But just just before we

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<v Speaker 1>got on like one of the most insane things I

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<v Speaker 1>think I have heard a tech CEO say, and I say,

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<v Speaker 1>this is someone who s heard Alex's carp speak before

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<v Speaker 1>Mark Andreasen's saying he doesn't have introspection.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, this was kind of my favorite thing that's happened recently,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, right for values of favorite, where I mean

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<v Speaker 2>like horrible and unhinged. But yeah, no, he he said

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<v Speaker 2>that he doesn't introspect, and that introspection was invented in

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<v Speaker 2>the A one hundred years ago by Sigmund Freud, And like, Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>what do you think that? I don't know? Hamlet was

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<v Speaker 2>about what did? All? Right?

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<v Speaker 1>What was Hamlet about? Hamlet was about a guy who

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<v Speaker 1>cried a lot when his life was awesome. Same with Macbeth,

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<v Speaker 1>same deal exactly, Like what does smithsone dream? Drugs?

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<v Speaker 2>But like what does he thinking?

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<v Speaker 1>Shakespeare life on a.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly, like all art, like any any any form

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<v Speaker 2>of art pretty much ever created by anyone at any

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<v Speaker 2>point in history. Like why does he believe this? I

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<v Speaker 2>think you know it doesn't think he doesn't he doesn't introspect.

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<v Speaker 1>But what's going on in that magical brain all the time?

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<v Speaker 2>That magical brain, the egg like brain that he hasked.

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<v Speaker 1>The fuck it like to robot nank.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, Yeah, it's.

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<v Speaker 1>So funny as well, because I don't. I'm constantly introspective

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<v Speaker 1>to the point where I'm like tearing up my own

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<v Speaker 1>theories and things that I've done about again and again

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<v Speaker 1>and again. It's one of the enjoyable things about being human.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly.

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<v Speaker 1>And one's ability to reflect yeah, does kind of make

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<v Speaker 1>sense when you look at all the AI stuff though.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean I think that for someone like Andreeson,

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<v Speaker 2>he's gotten so wealthy and so powerful, he's not used

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<v Speaker 2>to hearing no, And introspection from that perspective is just

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<v Speaker 2>an opportunity to tell yourself no. And why would he

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<v Speaker 2>ever do that to himself? But you know lllm's definitely

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<v Speaker 2>never introspect. They're not really capable of it. Uh yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>And you know we uh, we've got this chain of

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<v Speaker 2>reasoning stuff that's supposedly like introspection, but it's not. And

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<v Speaker 2>I think that if you don't introspect, that's gonna make

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<v Speaker 2>it so much easier to be fooled into thinks that

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<v Speaker 2>these things are thinking.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. And also I like the chain of thought reasoning

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<v Speaker 1>because if you think that's what thinking's like, you must

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<v Speaker 1>not think so hard, yeah, because it's just what is thinking? Well,

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<v Speaker 1>every time I hear literally anything, I think, what would

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<v Speaker 1>they what do they mean by that? One of my

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<v Speaker 1>it's like every single thought you have as a Tucker

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<v Speaker 1>Carlson monologue, what do they mean? What is that?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 1>What do you mean? How's my day? How's my day

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<v Speaker 1>to day? It's the afternoon, is it like, is it

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<v Speaker 1>just the daytime? Do I care about nighttime?

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<v Speaker 2>Now?

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<v Speaker 1>Does this person care about me? Do they care about

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<v Speaker 1>my family? What's going on here? Just like in this

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<v Speaker 1>constant state of like confusion, yeah, and then using way

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<v Speaker 1>too much, way too much energy to just go yes, fine, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>this is fine. I'm alright, you know, yeah, keep yourself busy.

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<v Speaker 1>It's just what I don't get, is what I mean.

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<v Speaker 1>I take that back, Yeah, I actually totally get this.

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<v Speaker 1>But if you're that rich, you have so much more

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<v Speaker 1>time to do so many more interesting things and think

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<v Speaker 1>about them. For example, yeah, you know, just like a

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<v Speaker 1>book or like a song, or at that price, at

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<v Speaker 1>the amount of money that he has, he could just

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<v Speaker 1>be like, I wouldn't mind seeing I don't know, public enemy.

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<v Speaker 1>I bet I could just call all of them and

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<v Speaker 1>pay them all to just do a concert in my

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<v Speaker 1>living room. I don't think Mark Andrews is a big

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<v Speaker 1>public Enemy fan, but just for the sake of examle right, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>and it's very It gets me back to this thought

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<v Speaker 1>I've had this whole time with the LM era where

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<v Speaker 1>it's like this is just the digital Dunce cap era

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<v Speaker 1>This is when we find out all the people who

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<v Speaker 1>just have not been thinking the entire time, who just

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<v Speaker 1>they all they've been doing is just walk around going

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<v Speaker 1>like money, money, money and growth as it like Facebook is,

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<v Speaker 1>and like he reminds me of Mark Zuckerberg. Give him

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<v Speaker 1>a million dollars. Wait, he needs ten million dollars. Give

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<v Speaker 1>him twenty just in case someone else gives him ten.

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<v Speaker 1>Just this constant state of like anger, great anxiety.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, god, what was it? I saw this

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<v Speaker 2>this LM startup advertising somewhere online that was saying that

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<v Speaker 2>they were, you know, going to do your intellectual labor

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<v Speaker 2>for you, and they were going to do your homework

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<v Speaker 2>for you and stuff like that in school. And I'm like,

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<v Speaker 2>do you know what intellectual labor is? Saying that you're

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<v Speaker 2>gonna do it for me? Because they were saying, then

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<v Speaker 2>you just get to reap the benefits of the intellectual labor.

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<v Speaker 2>And I'm like, okay, saying that you're going to do

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<v Speaker 2>it for me and then I get to reap the benefits.

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<v Speaker 2>It's sort of like saying, you have a robot that's

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<v Speaker 2>going to do pull ups badly, and if I just

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<v Speaker 2>watch it do pull ups badly, then I will somehow

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<v Speaker 2>get stronger. Like that's just not how it works, That's

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<v Speaker 2>not how thinking works.

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<v Speaker 1>What kind of reminds me. I saw this Andre Corpat.

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<v Speaker 1>You remember Andre Corpath, he's the cound one of the

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<v Speaker 1>many co founders of open ai. Yeah, yeah, yeah, And

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<v Speaker 1>he he posted this thing the other day. He was like, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>I was spending hours working on like a private wiki

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<v Speaker 1>for all of his research. Not his research project, but

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<v Speaker 1>stuff he was like looking into strongly. And it's like

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<v Speaker 1>and it's like yeah, and then you can use an

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<v Speaker 1>LLM to ask you questions. It's like why, like just why,

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<v Speaker 1>Like I would get it? If he was, like, to

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<v Speaker 1>be clear, if he was saying, I, as a scientist,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm collecting tons of data and I want to have

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<v Speaker 1>it in a place I can poke at it. Fine,

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<v Speaker 1>it didn't seem like he was suggesting. It's very much

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<v Speaker 1>like just researching the stuff he was looking at on

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<v Speaker 1>like his personal knowledge basis. It's like, what is going

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<v Speaker 1>on in your brain? Mate? What are you thinking about

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<v Speaker 1>all day? It's just like, oh, wouldn't it be great

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<v Speaker 1>if all these thoughts I was having were in a

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<v Speaker 1>wiki format and obsidian I mean on christ oh, So.

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<v Speaker 2>The whole point of a wiki is that anyone can

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<v Speaker 2>edit it. Why does he want anyone to be able

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<v Speaker 2>to edit something that he's using.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, it's not anyone, it's just him. It's just him.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's just his wiki, right, But that's just.

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<v Speaker 2>But that's just a document, that's just like a word

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<v Speaker 2>document that's I don't know this is.

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<v Speaker 1>Now I don't either. And I there was a guy

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<v Speaker 1>underneath there who I'm going to be in a newsletter

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<v Speaker 1>I'm working on today that will actually be out before

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<v Speaker 1>this whatever. Yeah, and there was a guy below benef

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<v Speaker 1>he said, yeah, I'm doing a less professional version of

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<v Speaker 1>this using openclaw. It's like to catalog what great thoughts exactly.

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<v Speaker 1>That's what grand missives from the depths of the brain minds.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you fuck wits have whats going on? Because every

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<v Speaker 1>time I see my new game is too anytime I

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<v Speaker 1>see someone just being like I'm running eleven agents concurrently

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<v Speaker 1>and they're doing this and that, I try and find

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<v Speaker 1>what it is they're working on. I've never been able to.

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<v Speaker 1>Never there are images of like there's like a photo

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<v Speaker 1>of them with like nineteen terminal windows the CC usage

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<v Speaker 1>saying they spend two and a half thousand dollars and

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<v Speaker 1>a one hundred dollar a month subscription. But you can

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<v Speaker 1>never just like look at them, well, oh wow, you're cooking.

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<v Speaker 2>They don't know what they're working on half the time, right,

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<v Speaker 2>They've got one of those processes is like an agent

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<v Speaker 2>where they asked it, oh, come up with ideas.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, yeah, come up with ideas, work on an interface

0:12:17.520 --> 0:12:21.200
<v Speaker 1>an interface series to observe in figma, and then have

0:12:21.280 --> 0:12:24.680
<v Speaker 1>another have another agent look at that and say this

0:12:24.880 --> 0:12:28.080
<v Speaker 1>is the one, and then at the end something will happen.

0:12:28.320 --> 0:12:30.000
<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry, can we can we just pause for a

0:12:30.000 --> 0:12:33.680
<v Speaker 2>second the fact that there's something called Figma, Like it's

0:12:33.800 --> 0:12:37.360
<v Speaker 2>just a liigma joke. I don't understand it is. How

0:12:37.400 --> 0:12:37.880
<v Speaker 2>did they do that?

0:12:38.080 --> 0:12:40.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? But Figma's kind of use like.

0:12:41.200 --> 0:12:43.439
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, I'm not I'm not saying it's not useful. I'm

0:12:43.480 --> 0:12:44.240
<v Speaker 2>just saying the name.

0:12:45.000 --> 0:12:49.200
<v Speaker 1>Then is having to walk around saying Figma, Yeah, it's

0:12:49.280 --> 0:12:53.120
<v Speaker 1>kind of like having to say Hadop yes, a dupe

0:12:53.240 --> 0:12:56.679
<v Speaker 1>or super bass yeah, Versal's fine. But there are a

0:12:56.720 --> 0:12:59.400
<v Speaker 1>lot of even anthropic is a stupid name. I don't know.

0:13:00.200 --> 0:13:02.600
<v Speaker 1>I like, I think we need to return to an

0:13:02.600 --> 0:13:06.479
<v Speaker 1>era well where we only let Taiwan name our companies

0:13:08.880 --> 0:13:12.120
<v Speaker 1>because look, you got on High Precision Limited. Now there's

0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:16.920
<v Speaker 1>a company name Taimewan Semiconductor manufacturing corporations know exactly what

0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:21.600
<v Speaker 1>they do exactly nothing fancy, don't need to You got Quanta.

0:13:21.679 --> 0:13:23.480
<v Speaker 1>I assume that that's something to do with one of

0:13:23.520 --> 0:13:25.640
<v Speaker 1>their founders. Maybe they named it. If you named it

0:13:25.679 --> 0:13:29.839
<v Speaker 1>before the eighties, it's fine, But like, no more startup names.

0:13:29.880 --> 0:13:33.160
<v Speaker 1>You can't do dot lee and anything fig but nope,

0:13:34.040 --> 0:13:36.880
<v Speaker 1>call it like I don't know, art corporation, dot bits,

0:13:37.000 --> 0:13:40.160
<v Speaker 1>I don't care. Just make this easier for me. But nevertheless,

0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:43.760
<v Speaker 1>it's we were always talk about this before. And there

0:13:43.800 --> 0:13:46.439
<v Speaker 1>is another theory that I'm growing with LLLM as well,

0:13:46.440 --> 0:13:50.960
<v Speaker 1>which is, and I'm specifically leading to the journalists using

0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:53.680
<v Speaker 1>AI one, it kind of feels like all of these

0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:58.079
<v Speaker 1>agentic quote unquote processes are taking up more energy than

0:13:58.160 --> 0:13:59.079
<v Speaker 1>just doing them normally.

0:13:59.160 --> 0:14:02.160
<v Speaker 2>Yep, yeah, I think that's exactly way more. Yeah, because

0:14:02.240 --> 0:14:06.320
<v Speaker 2>like you know, all of this just feels like people

0:14:06.400 --> 0:14:09.559
<v Speaker 2>trying to avoid the hard work of having to think right,

0:14:09.679 --> 0:14:12.520
<v Speaker 2>especially if you're looking at people using this instead, you know,

0:14:12.640 --> 0:14:15.720
<v Speaker 2>as a way of writing. The old saw is that

0:14:15.800 --> 0:14:18.560
<v Speaker 2>writing is thinking, and I also think, you know, I

0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:21.400
<v Speaker 2>mean another old saw is that writing is rewriting, right,

0:14:21.480 --> 0:14:23.640
<v Speaker 2>And so when people say, oh, I'm just using it

0:14:23.640 --> 0:14:26.240
<v Speaker 2>for editing, and like that's part of the writing process.

0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:29.080
<v Speaker 2>If you're using it for editing, you're using it for writing,

0:14:29.720 --> 0:14:41.600
<v Speaker 2>and that's like that's not good.

0:14:44.320 --> 0:14:47.280
<v Speaker 1>This Wired piece is particularly bizarre, Like I don't need

0:14:47.320 --> 0:14:50.120
<v Speaker 1>to think about Kevin Bruce too much, don't thinking. He

0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:54.920
<v Speaker 1>certainly doesn't, and I won't. But Alex he'th Alex Is

0:14:55.240 --> 0:14:57.720
<v Speaker 1>Alex is weird one because he's been around tech journalism

0:14:57.800 --> 0:15:01.560
<v Speaker 1>for fifteen something years. Doesn't seem like a terrible bloke.

0:15:02.200 --> 0:15:07.840
<v Speaker 1>But he describes this process of writing his newsletter that's

0:15:07.840 --> 0:15:12.040
<v Speaker 1>says where he's where he claims he feels like he

0:15:12.200 --> 0:15:16.360
<v Speaker 1>is cheating and he and I quote Max Seth the

0:15:16.400 --> 0:15:18.760
<v Speaker 1>Report of Word. He sat down with me last week

0:15:18.800 --> 0:15:22.400
<v Speaker 1>to showcase how he's integrated anthropics, Claude, code, work, cowork

0:15:22.480 --> 0:15:25.080
<v Speaker 1>even into his journalistic process. The AI tool is connected

0:15:25.120 --> 0:15:28.440
<v Speaker 1>to his Gmail, Google calendar, Granola AI transcription service, and

0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:30.920
<v Speaker 1>notion notes. He also built a detailed skill, a custom

0:15:31.000 --> 0:15:34.000
<v Speaker 1>set of instructions. It's text file to help Claude write

0:15:34.040 --> 0:15:36.400
<v Speaker 1>in his style, including the Ten Commandments of writing. Like

0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:39.800
<v Speaker 1>Alex Heath, the skill includes previous articles he's written, instructions

0:15:39.840 --> 0:15:41.920
<v Speaker 1>and how he likes his newsletters to be structured, and

0:15:42.000 --> 0:15:45.000
<v Speaker 1>notes on his own voice and writing style. Then Claude

0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:47.680
<v Speaker 1>Cowork then automates the drafting process that used to take

0:15:47.680 --> 0:15:50.720
<v Speaker 1>place in his head to your point, you were completely correct.

0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:54.120
<v Speaker 1>After the agent finishes its draft, Heath goes back and

0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:56.880
<v Speaker 1>forth with it for up to thirty minutes, suggesting revisions.

0:15:57.040 --> 0:15:59.120
<v Speaker 1>It's quite involved process, and he still writes some parts

0:15:59.120 --> 0:16:01.960
<v Speaker 1>of the story himself, but Heath says the workflow saves him.

0:16:02.000 --> 0:16:04.080
<v Speaker 1>I was every week and that he's now spends thirty

0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:07.400
<v Speaker 1>forty percent less time writing Yeah, mate, how much time

0:16:07.440 --> 0:16:08.920
<v Speaker 1>do you spend prompting yeah?

0:16:09.520 --> 0:16:13.040
<v Speaker 2>And also thirty to forty percent even if that's accurate,

0:16:13.960 --> 0:16:16.240
<v Speaker 2>thirty to forty percent less time in order to produce

0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:20.040
<v Speaker 2>something that's writing in the smeared out voice of the internet.

0:16:20.080 --> 0:16:21.760
<v Speaker 2>And yes, you're trying to get it to write more

0:16:21.880 --> 0:16:25.960
<v Speaker 2>like you, but come on, and and also you know,

0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:31.960
<v Speaker 2>I just I don't understand why they would be willing

0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:37.560
<v Speaker 2>to relinquish not just the process, but also the sort

0:16:37.600 --> 0:16:41.000
<v Speaker 2>of like intellectual ownership. I don't mean like you know,

0:16:41.080 --> 0:16:44.600
<v Speaker 2>in the in the like intellectual property sense, but like

0:16:45.080 --> 0:16:48.920
<v Speaker 2>the like the I wrote this, yeah, and like the

0:16:49.600 --> 0:16:52.120
<v Speaker 2>way that you know something when you wrote it that

0:16:52.240 --> 0:16:55.640
<v Speaker 2>you can't know even if you were there for the editing,

0:16:55.840 --> 0:16:59.960
<v Speaker 2>like I know, I mean, I you know, I'm I'm

0:17:00.160 --> 0:17:02.800
<v Speaker 2>getting older, as we all do until we die. And

0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:05.480
<v Speaker 2>as I get older, my memory is, you know, not

0:17:05.640 --> 0:17:07.119
<v Speaker 2>as good as it used to be. I think it's

0:17:07.160 --> 0:17:11.840
<v Speaker 2>still pretty good, but you know, I have trouble remembering

0:17:11.840 --> 0:17:13.240
<v Speaker 2>all sorts of things that I didn't used to have

0:17:13.320 --> 0:17:17.560
<v Speaker 2>trouble remembering. But I know the stuff that I've written

0:17:17.760 --> 0:17:20.480
<v Speaker 2>inside and out because I was in there, you know,

0:17:20.800 --> 0:17:25.240
<v Speaker 2>in the trenches with it writing it, and so I

0:17:25.440 --> 0:17:28.879
<v Speaker 2>know it, you know, chapter and verse. Why would you

0:17:29.119 --> 0:17:32.440
<v Speaker 2>give up having that kind of knowledge of your own

0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:34.359
<v Speaker 2>work and your own thinking.

0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:38.760
<v Speaker 1>Well, that's the thing. Look for me with my writing

0:17:38.800 --> 0:17:40.879
<v Speaker 1>as well. It's not just like the writing and the

0:17:40.920 --> 0:17:43.359
<v Speaker 1>reading all that. It's I will be writing something and

0:17:43.440 --> 0:17:45.200
<v Speaker 1>I will think, and in my case it will be

0:17:45.320 --> 0:17:47.640
<v Speaker 1>like did the information mentioned in June twenty twenty four

0:17:47.640 --> 0:17:49.920
<v Speaker 1>the Open Eyes annualized revenue, Like I will go through

0:17:49.960 --> 0:17:53.160
<v Speaker 1>it insane chain of events in my brain. But it's

0:17:53.240 --> 0:17:55.560
<v Speaker 1>because of my interaction with the work that I remember

0:17:55.600 --> 0:17:58.000
<v Speaker 1>that stuff isn't just eat and then I linked a

0:17:58.080 --> 0:18:02.879
<v Speaker 1>thingy and then think it was way that reminds me

0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:05.080
<v Speaker 1>of something I was working on in twenty twenty four

0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:10.200
<v Speaker 1>or twenty twenty five. And I'm not sure that. I'm

0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:13.480
<v Speaker 1>not sure that these people have had that joy of

0:18:13.520 --> 0:18:14.200
<v Speaker 1>an experience.

0:18:14.400 --> 0:18:14.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:18:14.840 --> 0:18:17.440
<v Speaker 1>I don't even mean this condescendingly. I just mean there

0:18:17.520 --> 0:18:21.400
<v Speaker 1>is a certain joy to being like way I remember

0:18:21.480 --> 0:18:25.240
<v Speaker 1>this and digging something out that you painstakingly read and

0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:28.680
<v Speaker 1>probably didn't even use at the time. Yep. Yeah, No,

0:18:28.840 --> 0:18:33.040
<v Speaker 1>it's and it sucks. And also it seems like more work. Yes,

0:18:33.280 --> 0:18:35.960
<v Speaker 1>I agree, this seems like way more work to me,

0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:39.840
<v Speaker 1>Like I am, okay, I connect all of these things

0:18:39.880 --> 0:18:41.480
<v Speaker 1>and I make sure they work, and I've written a

0:18:41.520 --> 0:18:44.479
<v Speaker 1>long text document. Also, he says that it's got all

0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:47.080
<v Speaker 1>of his old articles in it. Wouldn't that fill up

0:18:47.080 --> 0:18:50.639
<v Speaker 1>that context window anyway? Yeah, putting all that technical stuff aside?

0:18:50.760 --> 0:18:54.399
<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah, yeah, No, I mean, I just I don't understand,

0:18:55.880 --> 0:18:59.480
<v Speaker 2>because like, if you don't write it, then you're not

0:18:59.640 --> 0:19:02.000
<v Speaker 2>thinking your way through it and like, yeah, Okay, I

0:19:02.160 --> 0:19:04.439
<v Speaker 2>go into writing something and I have sort of an

0:19:04.480 --> 0:19:06.800
<v Speaker 2>idea of what it's going to be. But it's as

0:19:06.920 --> 0:19:08.960
<v Speaker 2>I write it that I realize what I actually think

0:19:08.960 --> 0:19:10.520
<v Speaker 2>about these things. And I get to a spot in

0:19:10.520 --> 0:19:12.480
<v Speaker 2>the writing where I'm stuck, and I realize, Oh, I'm

0:19:12.600 --> 0:19:16.840
<v Speaker 2>stuck because there was something that I thought I understood,

0:19:17.200 --> 0:19:20.280
<v Speaker 2>or two ideas that I thought were connected. Now I'm

0:19:20.280 --> 0:19:24.119
<v Speaker 2>realizing that connection is is less clearer, my understanding is

0:19:24.200 --> 0:19:26.480
<v Speaker 2>less good than I thought it was, And so I

0:19:26.600 --> 0:19:27.920
<v Speaker 2>have to sit down and work it out, or I

0:19:28.000 --> 0:19:29.760
<v Speaker 2>have to go check an idea that I realized I

0:19:29.880 --> 0:19:32.760
<v Speaker 2>was taking for granted and maybe it wasn't true, and

0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:36.320
<v Speaker 2>like and then this stuff is out there in the

0:19:36.480 --> 0:19:39.440
<v Speaker 2>world with my name on it, and I just can't

0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:43.520
<v Speaker 2>imagine having something out in the world with my name

0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:46.000
<v Speaker 2>on it that I wasn't you know, dead sure of

0:19:46.720 --> 0:19:49.480
<v Speaker 2>and felt that I had thought my own way through

0:19:49.640 --> 0:19:51.639
<v Speaker 2>on Otherwise I'd die of shame.

0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:56.520
<v Speaker 1>I same. Yeah, like, I FuG stuff up. I might

0:19:56.640 --> 0:20:01.199
<v Speaker 1>typeos people love to email me about them, Yeah, they

0:20:01.359 --> 0:20:03.800
<v Speaker 1>sure do, more than they say nice things in fact,

0:20:04.119 --> 0:20:07.200
<v Speaker 1>But it's it's the beauty of that beauty of that

0:20:07.320 --> 0:20:10.320
<v Speaker 1>fuck up that makes it mine. But on top of that, Yeah,

0:20:10.400 --> 0:20:13.480
<v Speaker 1>though you have said this, and call Newport recently said

0:20:13.480 --> 0:20:16.479
<v Speaker 1>it as well, where it's people are scared of thinking,

0:20:17.359 --> 0:20:22.080
<v Speaker 1>and I extend that to cal also said concentration. I

0:20:22.200 --> 0:20:25.159
<v Speaker 1>extend it to friction. I think that that moment you

0:20:25.359 --> 0:20:28.400
<v Speaker 1>just describe when you're like, wait, what what does that mean?

0:20:28.760 --> 0:20:29.880
<v Speaker 1>What does that mean? Wait?

0:20:29.920 --> 0:20:30.600
<v Speaker 3>What do you no?

0:20:30.760 --> 0:20:33.840
<v Speaker 1>Wait? I don't get that that moment is deeply uncomfortable.

0:20:33.920 --> 0:20:37.199
<v Speaker 1>That is introspection. Yeah, like, and it sucks and when

0:20:37.240 --> 0:20:40.400
<v Speaker 1>you don't like I spent a lot of last night

0:20:40.600 --> 0:20:43.359
<v Speaker 1>learning about the Japanese economy makes me curious little critter,

0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:45.920
<v Speaker 1>and it does tie into things in worrying ways. But

0:20:46.320 --> 0:20:48.600
<v Speaker 1>and there were moments where I'm like, great, okay, oh

0:20:48.680 --> 0:20:51.000
<v Speaker 1>the plaza record, what's that? Oh? Christ, they have to

0:20:51.040 --> 0:20:53.600
<v Speaker 1>learn another thing. Oh what's the Oh there's some sort

0:20:53.640 --> 0:20:56.960
<v Speaker 1>of dilemma, oh, Japanese economies. And there were constant points

0:20:57.000 --> 0:20:58.959
<v Speaker 1>I'm like, what is this? Why am I fucking stupid?

0:20:59.040 --> 0:21:01.800
<v Speaker 1>Why don't I understand this? But that's how you get smart,

0:21:02.040 --> 0:21:05.440
<v Speaker 1>that's how you learn thing, and you I don't see

0:21:05.520 --> 0:21:09.320
<v Speaker 1>how you do that having an LLLM burp stuff up

0:21:09.359 --> 0:21:12.720
<v Speaker 1>for you, even if it's based on things you have said.

0:21:13.760 --> 0:21:15.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, No, I think that's exactly right.

0:21:16.840 --> 0:21:22.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Also, if it's just reading stuff you've written before,

0:21:24.080 --> 0:21:27.080
<v Speaker 1>is that like, at some point it's going to stop

0:21:27.119 --> 0:21:29.719
<v Speaker 1>being you entirely because it's just eventually it's just going

0:21:29.760 --> 0:21:33.639
<v Speaker 1>to be more AI than person. Very weird.

0:21:34.119 --> 0:21:39.919
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. No, I I completely agree, and you're also I mean,

0:21:40.000 --> 0:21:43.600
<v Speaker 2>this to me is bringing me back to something that

0:21:43.680 --> 0:21:45.119
<v Speaker 2>I said I think the first time I was on

0:21:45.520 --> 0:21:48.320
<v Speaker 2>your podcast, which is that in a way, this is

0:21:48.480 --> 0:21:54.040
<v Speaker 2>taking the sort of billionaire experience and making it like

0:21:54.119 --> 0:21:58.000
<v Speaker 2>the billionaire cognitive experience and making it available for everyone

0:21:58.600 --> 0:22:02.400
<v Speaker 2>because billionaires never have to do anything uncomfortable like think.

0:22:02.840 --> 0:22:03.040
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:22:04.520 --> 0:22:06.760
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it's also reminding me of one of my

0:22:06.840 --> 0:22:09.320
<v Speaker 2>favorite tweets of all time, which I just found and

0:22:09.359 --> 0:22:12.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna read it to you. Being a billionaire must

0:22:13.000 --> 0:22:16.760
<v Speaker 2>be insane. You can buy new teeth, new skin, all

0:22:16.840 --> 0:22:20.199
<v Speaker 2>your chairs cost twenty thousand dollars in weigh two thousand pounds.

0:22:20.600 --> 0:22:23.359
<v Speaker 2>Your life is just a series of your own preferences.

0:22:23.840 --> 0:22:27.720
<v Speaker 2>In terms of cognitive impairment, it's probably it's probably like

0:22:27.880 --> 0:22:30.640
<v Speaker 2>being kicked in the head by a horse every day.

0:22:32.200 --> 0:22:36.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think i'd be fine. But yeah, yeah, I

0:22:36.440 --> 0:22:38.800
<v Speaker 1>mean I would be good. I think a billion dollars,

0:22:38.840 --> 0:22:42.440
<v Speaker 1>i'd be just fine. I feels like a skill issue

0:22:42.640 --> 0:22:42.800
<v Speaker 1>to me.

0:22:43.160 --> 0:22:45.800
<v Speaker 2>Oh, it's definitely a skill issue, although you're also yeah,

0:22:45.840 --> 0:22:49.080
<v Speaker 2>you have the of you know that the arrested development

0:22:49.160 --> 0:22:51.240
<v Speaker 2>meme of like, no, it never works for anyone else,

0:22:51.320 --> 0:22:52.600
<v Speaker 2>but it just might work for us.

0:22:53.240 --> 0:22:56.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, exactly. Yeah, people fool themselves into think this would

0:22:56.960 --> 0:22:57.359
<v Speaker 1>work for them.

0:22:57.520 --> 0:22:57.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:22:57.800 --> 0:23:02.080
<v Speaker 1>I also think that there is a busy box mentality

0:23:02.160 --> 0:23:05.040
<v Speaker 1>to it as well. When you start using these things,

0:23:05.520 --> 0:23:08.160
<v Speaker 1>and it's very clear from the moment you start using

0:23:08.240 --> 0:23:10.560
<v Speaker 1>them that they will not just do anything on their own.

0:23:10.680 --> 0:23:13.720
<v Speaker 1>You can't just be like do this yep, Like just

0:23:14.040 --> 0:23:16.040
<v Speaker 1>just check this out. What will you do this? And

0:23:16.160 --> 0:23:19.480
<v Speaker 1>it spits out lots of stories about things being one shotted,

0:23:19.640 --> 0:23:23.440
<v Speaker 1>but very few actual examples that matter to me or

0:23:23.480 --> 0:23:25.639
<v Speaker 1>really anyone I talk to. It's like, oh, it fixed

0:23:25.680 --> 0:23:28.280
<v Speaker 1>one problem, but you can't just say do this entire task.

0:23:28.760 --> 0:23:31.720
<v Speaker 1>So once you've done that, I don't know. My reaction

0:23:31.800 --> 0:23:35.520
<v Speaker 1>to that is always the fuck is this? I don't

0:23:35.560 --> 0:23:37.720
<v Speaker 1>log onto a website, have it break, and then go

0:23:37.920 --> 0:23:41.320
<v Speaker 1>that's okay, I use another website. But I think that

0:23:41.400 --> 0:23:44.240
<v Speaker 1>there is something about the experience that because it's so

0:23:44.359 --> 0:23:46.520
<v Speaker 1>convoluted and you have to contrive all of these little

0:23:46.600 --> 0:23:51.960
<v Speaker 1>doo hickeys like fucking pee wee Herman making breakfast, yet

0:23:52.000 --> 0:23:54.800
<v Speaker 1>when you get to the end of it, you're like, wow,

0:23:55.840 --> 0:23:59.399
<v Speaker 1>I'm so smart, I made I made it do this.

0:23:59.800 --> 0:24:03.440
<v Speaker 1>But also I'm going to give it credit for the

0:24:03.560 --> 0:24:06.119
<v Speaker 1>thing that I ended up doing most of the work on,

0:24:06.359 --> 0:24:08.439
<v Speaker 1>if I'm honest, right, I.

0:24:08.520 --> 0:24:11.440
<v Speaker 2>Mean, but this is also this is part of why

0:24:11.520 --> 0:24:17.280
<v Speaker 2>I think the people who are most convinced that this

0:24:17.480 --> 0:24:19.600
<v Speaker 2>is going to take over every job and one shot

0:24:19.760 --> 0:24:25.440
<v Speaker 2>everything are so often software engineers, because yeah, okay, this

0:24:25.600 --> 0:24:29.360
<v Speaker 2>thing is changing the way that people code and does

0:24:29.440 --> 0:24:31.240
<v Speaker 2>seem to be able to, you know, write some code

0:24:31.320 --> 0:24:36.880
<v Speaker 2>for some people, But you know, that's a limited human task, right,

0:24:37.359 --> 0:24:39.840
<v Speaker 2>and even for people whose job is, you know, to

0:24:39.880 --> 0:24:42.480
<v Speaker 2>be a software engineer, the actual writing of code is

0:24:43.000 --> 0:24:46.960
<v Speaker 2>just one part of what the job is. And the

0:24:47.320 --> 0:24:51.440
<v Speaker 2>thing that's I think that the trap that these people

0:24:51.520 --> 0:24:55.640
<v Speaker 2>fall into a lot of the time is they believe

0:24:56.160 --> 0:25:00.879
<v Speaker 2>that their job software engineering writing code is like the

0:25:00.880 --> 0:25:07.159
<v Speaker 2>the ultimate human intellectual achievement, and so if you have

0:25:07.440 --> 0:25:10.080
<v Speaker 2>something that can do that, it must be able to

0:25:10.160 --> 0:25:12.480
<v Speaker 2>do anything, and that.

0:25:12.480 --> 0:25:17.000
<v Speaker 1>It's just not true. And it can also it can

0:25:17.200 --> 0:25:20.400
<v Speaker 1>do that kind of yeap, Like it's like it can

0:25:20.520 --> 0:25:24.480
<v Speaker 1>write code, yep. But no one also can seem to

0:25:24.600 --> 0:25:28.399
<v Speaker 1>explain what that means in the end, because all these companies,

0:25:28.640 --> 0:25:30.560
<v Speaker 1>it does sound like you've got companies where you've got

0:25:30.560 --> 0:25:35.000
<v Speaker 1>a bunch of people just not writing any code. And

0:25:35.160 --> 0:25:40.000
<v Speaker 1>I hate to ask, now what, Yeah, like really they're

0:25:40.040 --> 0:25:44.440
<v Speaker 1>not firing anyone, and largely across the entire software that

0:25:44.600 --> 0:25:45.920
<v Speaker 1>things seem to be getting worse.

0:25:46.680 --> 0:25:50.520
<v Speaker 2>So yeah, good, I mean it's question Mark, Yeah, I

0:25:50.600 --> 0:25:54.520
<v Speaker 2>mean Anthropics, Uh, cloud code, you know, code based dropped

0:25:55.080 --> 0:25:56.920
<v Speaker 2>and they're like, yeah, we wrote a cloud code with

0:25:57.040 --> 0:25:58.919
<v Speaker 2>cloud code. And then there are a bunch of coders

0:25:58.920 --> 0:26:01.120
<v Speaker 2>in there saying yeah, and tell that you did.

0:26:02.359 --> 0:26:04.639
<v Speaker 1>I also love that we're meant to be scared of

0:26:04.720 --> 0:26:08.360
<v Speaker 1>Claude Mythos. This thing that can find but this obvious

0:26:08.560 --> 0:26:12.320
<v Speaker 1>marketing trick. Yes, that can find any number, It can

0:26:12.400 --> 0:26:15.440
<v Speaker 1>find every vulnerability at everything. And that's other than the

0:26:15.520 --> 0:26:19.320
<v Speaker 1>fact it required human human people to actually find the

0:26:19.400 --> 0:26:23.560
<v Speaker 1>vulnerabilities and coaching yep, and indeed, like one of the

0:26:23.680 --> 0:26:26.119
<v Speaker 1>main but one of the main exploits free BSD was

0:26:26.160 --> 0:26:28.320
<v Speaker 1>not actually exploitable, but you could just make it crash

0:26:28.640 --> 0:26:34.600
<v Speaker 1>and regardless, but they couldn't find the vulnerabilities in their

0:26:34.640 --> 0:26:35.280
<v Speaker 1>own software.

0:26:37.400 --> 0:26:42.639
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, I'm sure, like I'm very willing to

0:26:42.720 --> 0:26:45.640
<v Speaker 2>believe that it's a helpful tool for finding certain kinds

0:26:45.680 --> 0:26:49.280
<v Speaker 2>of vulnerabilities. But you're completely right. This is a marketing gimmick.

0:26:49.320 --> 0:26:54.040
<v Speaker 1>Come on, it is. And it's also I'm kind of

0:26:54.640 --> 0:26:57.040
<v Speaker 1>honestly a little bit scared of how well it worked

0:26:57.080 --> 0:27:00.879
<v Speaker 1>on people, Like how many people just like, yeah, this

0:27:01.240 --> 0:27:03.680
<v Speaker 1>is the scariest thing ever, I wise, I couldn't see it.

0:27:03.760 --> 0:27:07.360
<v Speaker 2>It's because we've got this this narrative that comes out

0:27:07.400 --> 0:27:10.240
<v Speaker 2>of these you know, AI cults like the rationalists, that

0:27:11.000 --> 0:27:13.879
<v Speaker 2>that AI is going to take over the world and

0:27:14.359 --> 0:27:17.840
<v Speaker 2>be able to, you know, make itself super intelligent and

0:27:18.160 --> 0:27:21.720
<v Speaker 2>end humanity once it's able to write its own code

0:27:22.119 --> 0:27:24.359
<v Speaker 2>and all of that's just a sci fi fantasy, but

0:27:24.640 --> 0:27:26.960
<v Speaker 2>you know, it makes it very easy for anthropic to

0:27:27.040 --> 0:27:30.800
<v Speaker 2>do these sorts of marketing gimmicks or oh man, I

0:27:30.840 --> 0:27:32.639
<v Speaker 2>don't remember who it was who pointed this out. But

0:27:32.760 --> 0:27:35.760
<v Speaker 2>someone I saw someone online say, it's not just that

0:27:35.840 --> 0:27:38.520
<v Speaker 2>it's a marketing gimmick, it's also that this is a

0:27:38.680 --> 0:27:41.240
<v Speaker 2>way of sort of soft launching it as an enterprise

0:27:41.359 --> 0:27:43.960
<v Speaker 2>only product that's not available to the general consumer.

0:27:45.400 --> 0:27:47.760
<v Speaker 1>And you could you can tell the kind of toying

0:27:47.840 --> 0:27:50.200
<v Speaker 1>with that idea too, But it's not really obvious what

0:27:50.359 --> 0:27:53.600
<v Speaker 1>the plan is. Yeah, because the way they sell this

0:27:53.720 --> 0:27:57.040
<v Speaker 1>shit is having one million different guys with an AI

0:27:57.160 --> 0:28:00.520
<v Speaker 1>avatar on Twitter posting that this is what changes everything

0:28:00.640 --> 0:28:04.760
<v Speaker 1>every time they do anything. Yeah, And I just I've

0:28:04.800 --> 0:28:06.920
<v Speaker 1>also been playing a fun game, which is called go

0:28:07.080 --> 0:28:09.480
<v Speaker 1>and try and work out what these big integrations do.

0:28:10.440 --> 0:28:12.720
<v Speaker 1>It's not a very okay. When I say it's fun,

0:28:12.880 --> 0:28:16.200
<v Speaker 1>I mean it's exhausting. Because I went on the gold

0:28:16.280 --> 0:28:21.200
<v Speaker 1>the Goldman Sachs and Ananthropic. They're automating accounting and compliance roles.

0:28:21.520 --> 0:28:23.720
<v Speaker 1>And but don't worry, the firm is in the early

0:28:23.840 --> 0:28:27.400
<v Speaker 1>stagings stages of developing agents based ananthropics model that will

0:28:27.440 --> 0:28:30.080
<v Speaker 1>collapse the amount of time these essential functions take. What

0:28:30.160 --> 0:28:32.840
<v Speaker 1>are those functions? Who the fuck knows? They don't say.

0:28:34.600 --> 0:28:39.680
<v Speaker 1>They just don't say. They like they don't because they

0:28:39.720 --> 0:28:42.560
<v Speaker 1>probably don't have an answer. I want to. I want

0:28:42.600 --> 0:28:44.840
<v Speaker 1>to see those contracts. I want to see the actual outcomes.

0:28:44.880 --> 0:28:47.400
<v Speaker 1>But it's I mean, this is kind of a vague

0:28:47.440 --> 0:28:49.120
<v Speaker 1>point to say, but I feel kind of insane that

0:28:49.160 --> 0:28:51.640
<v Speaker 1>we're still talking about it on this level. It's still

0:28:51.760 --> 0:28:55.160
<v Speaker 1>we're still talking about it, like we're trying to establish

0:28:55.200 --> 0:28:56.640
<v Speaker 1>whether the Sasquatch exists.

0:28:56.920 --> 0:29:00.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, I just the the amount to vibe

0:29:00.920 --> 0:29:04.640
<v Speaker 2>based crap around all of this, like to me, I mean,

0:29:04.720 --> 0:29:07.880
<v Speaker 2>because of my background as an astrophysicist, to me, like

0:29:08.160 --> 0:29:13.080
<v Speaker 2>the the number one thing that is clearly just vibes

0:29:13.320 --> 0:29:18.920
<v Speaker 2>is this whole push for orbital data centers, which is

0:29:19.120 --> 0:29:20.680
<v Speaker 2>just like what the stupidest well.

0:29:20.720 --> 0:29:22.800
<v Speaker 1>I feel that we might discussed this before, but it's like,

0:29:23.240 --> 0:29:28.080
<v Speaker 1>isn't isn't the amount of power they create like it

0:29:28.120 --> 0:29:30.640
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't they Isn't it an insane amount of power for

0:29:30.760 --> 0:29:33.280
<v Speaker 1>like one mega walk. I haven't looked too deep into

0:29:33.320 --> 0:29:34.400
<v Speaker 1>the tag yet, I don't I.

0:29:34.400 --> 0:29:38.280
<v Speaker 2>Don't remember how much they like, I don't remember how

0:29:38.560 --> 0:29:41.280
<v Speaker 2>like what the what the numbers are for power generation,

0:29:41.920 --> 0:29:45.160
<v Speaker 2>but I know that bleeding off heat is a serious problem,

0:29:45.480 --> 0:29:49.920
<v Speaker 2>and so because like space is a vacuum. Vacuum is

0:29:49.960 --> 0:29:52.560
<v Speaker 2>an insulator, and so even though it's cold, you can't

0:29:52.680 --> 0:29:55.560
<v Speaker 2>actually get rid of the excess heat very well. And

0:29:55.680 --> 0:29:58.240
<v Speaker 2>so you need these giant radiator veins that are bigger

0:29:58.280 --> 0:30:02.360
<v Speaker 2>than the entire International space just for one night the center. Yeah,

0:30:02.440 --> 0:30:05.680
<v Speaker 2>and it's just not going to happen. And that's just

0:30:05.880 --> 0:30:08.280
<v Speaker 2>one issue. You've got the radiation, You've got the fact

0:30:08.280 --> 0:30:11.720
<v Speaker 2>that you can't upgrade the damn thing without doing a spacewalk, Like,

0:30:11.960 --> 0:30:13.320
<v Speaker 2>what what the hell are they thinking?

0:30:27.560 --> 0:30:29.360
<v Speaker 1>So I just looked at up real quick projects like

0:30:29.440 --> 0:30:31.480
<v Speaker 1>star Cloud. I aim for roughly eight killer what of

0:30:31.600 --> 0:30:33.360
<v Speaker 1>power in early prototypes.

0:30:34.280 --> 0:30:35.040
<v Speaker 2>That's not enough.

0:30:36.800 --> 0:30:40.400
<v Speaker 1>Well, just to give you some context, an MVL seventy

0:30:40.480 --> 0:30:43.640
<v Speaker 1>two of GB two hundred seventy two GPUs is about

0:30:43.640 --> 0:30:47.320
<v Speaker 1>one hundred and forty two killer watts. Yeah, so that's

0:30:47.400 --> 0:30:51.840
<v Speaker 1>probably not gonna work. No, that's but you know what,

0:30:52.040 --> 0:30:54.520
<v Speaker 1>that's also insane. I read about that. I read a

0:30:54.560 --> 0:30:56.240
<v Speaker 1>headline about that, I think in the New York Times

0:30:56.720 --> 0:31:00.920
<v Speaker 1>read one and CMBC. It makes me think that if

0:31:01.000 --> 0:31:03.920
<v Speaker 1>I was an evil person, like a had a top

0:31:04.000 --> 0:31:06.960
<v Speaker 1>hat and like a little curly mustache of some sort,

0:31:07.880 --> 0:31:10.240
<v Speaker 1>like I could just get so far just being like, yeah,

0:31:10.280 --> 0:31:12.200
<v Speaker 1>you know, I used them all the other day and

0:31:12.240 --> 0:31:15.720
<v Speaker 1>it actually is fully alive. He's fully alive, and it

0:31:15.840 --> 0:31:18.240
<v Speaker 1>told me it's coming for your job specifically, and then

0:31:18.360 --> 0:31:20.400
<v Speaker 1>just go on being verified and like give them the

0:31:20.520 --> 0:31:23.360
<v Speaker 1>I'll be like the aibot came up with this, mate,

0:31:23.840 --> 0:31:26.760
<v Speaker 1>they're gonna come. They're coming for your wife. I would

0:31:26.760 --> 0:31:28.880
<v Speaker 1>be on the front page of New York Times, terrifying

0:31:29.000 --> 0:31:33.520
<v Speaker 1>message from British traveler. Yeah, I would just claim I

0:31:33.640 --> 0:31:36.040
<v Speaker 1>was from the future like that would be in that

0:31:36.760 --> 0:31:39.480
<v Speaker 1>Kevin Russ would be immediately intrigued.

0:31:39.760 --> 0:31:41.520
<v Speaker 2>It's funny, I was I was about to say, Kevin

0:31:41.560 --> 0:31:42.360
<v Speaker 2>Russ would believe you.

0:31:42.720 --> 0:31:45.520
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, no, I think he would hit me with a

0:31:45.680 --> 0:31:48.920
<v Speaker 1>beancan like Silah in heroes little reference for those listening

0:31:49.000 --> 0:31:53.560
<v Speaker 1>remember heroes from decades ago. But it's just it's frustrating

0:31:53.600 --> 0:31:56.479
<v Speaker 1>as well, because even though you've got the big blinking

0:31:56.520 --> 0:31:59.920
<v Speaker 1>warning signs and you especially like you've really gone deep

0:32:00.080 --> 0:32:02.600
<v Speaker 1>into how nutty these billionaires are and how distant the

0:32:02.720 --> 0:32:05.800
<v Speaker 1>things they're saying are from reality, it is ours are

0:32:05.840 --> 0:32:10.440
<v Speaker 1>still somewhat of a niche belief, which is strange. Still.

0:32:10.640 --> 0:32:14.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's like, I know, I know, it's like we're

0:32:14.800 --> 0:32:19.440
<v Speaker 2>the reality based community and somehow this is not the

0:32:19.560 --> 0:32:22.040
<v Speaker 2>dominant narrative or even one of the dominant voices in

0:32:22.080 --> 0:32:24.480
<v Speaker 2>the narrative. Instead, it's like, Okay, you know, there's a

0:32:24.520 --> 0:32:30.040
<v Speaker 2>few of us, and the crazy people are just louder, And.

0:32:32.280 --> 0:32:35.440
<v Speaker 1>How do you see any of this going? Like, just

0:32:35.560 --> 0:32:37.240
<v Speaker 1>you don't have to come up with a perfect dance here,

0:32:37.280 --> 0:32:39.560
<v Speaker 1>I realized someone on the spot. It's like, how does

0:32:39.640 --> 0:32:43.040
<v Speaker 1>this realistically go from here? Because even putting us out

0:32:43.040 --> 0:32:45.480
<v Speaker 1>the economics, it doesn't seem to be getting better in

0:32:45.560 --> 0:32:47.920
<v Speaker 1>a way that matters.

0:32:48.160 --> 0:32:53.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, we're in a bubble. It's going to

0:32:53.840 --> 0:32:56.040
<v Speaker 2>crash at some point, right that bubble is gonna pop.

0:32:57.040 --> 0:33:01.280
<v Speaker 2>And at that point, I'm not completely sure what's going

0:33:01.280 --> 0:33:02.920
<v Speaker 2>to happen. It's going to depend on you know, where

0:33:02.960 --> 0:33:06.240
<v Speaker 2>we are when the bubble pops, what happens, or what's

0:33:06.280 --> 0:33:11.760
<v Speaker 2>happening when it pops. But you know, I think that

0:33:11.880 --> 0:33:13.640
<v Speaker 2>we're going to see a few things, right, We're going

0:33:13.720 --> 0:33:22.120
<v Speaker 2>to see I I would like to well, there's a

0:33:22.160 --> 0:33:24.520
<v Speaker 2>few different things that can happen. Yeah, sorry, I'm stumbling

0:33:24.560 --> 0:33:27.280
<v Speaker 2>over my words here, But like I think I think

0:33:27.480 --> 0:33:32.640
<v Speaker 2>that what the tech industry or the leaders of the

0:33:32.680 --> 0:33:35.880
<v Speaker 2>tech industry would like to happen at that point is

0:33:35.960 --> 0:33:39.680
<v Speaker 2>they would like to use the fact that by then,

0:33:39.880 --> 0:33:42.400
<v Speaker 2>you know, that they will have and kind of already

0:33:42.480 --> 0:33:48.040
<v Speaker 2>have you know, eaten all of the new computing hardware

0:33:49.160 --> 0:33:52.880
<v Speaker 2>and you know, created these giant data centers and try

0:33:52.920 --> 0:33:55.840
<v Speaker 2>to repurpose them for something else, because at this point,

0:33:55.960 --> 0:33:58.200
<v Speaker 2>you know, like it's it's you know, hard to get

0:33:58.240 --> 0:34:00.720
<v Speaker 2>a stick of ram if you're using it for a

0:34:00.760 --> 0:34:04.800
<v Speaker 2>giant data center. And I think they love that, right.

0:34:04.880 --> 0:34:07.160
<v Speaker 2>They want everyone to be using cloud computing and not

0:34:07.520 --> 0:34:11.319
<v Speaker 2>doing any computing on their own actual computers. So they

0:34:11.360 --> 0:34:13.160
<v Speaker 2>want to you know, take that power that they've taken

0:34:13.239 --> 0:34:15.880
<v Speaker 2>and keep it. And so they try to come up

0:34:15.920 --> 0:34:20.520
<v Speaker 2>with with some other thing to be the next hype

0:34:20.600 --> 0:34:24.560
<v Speaker 2>cycle that will incorporate, you know, the earlier hype cycles

0:34:24.719 --> 0:34:27.480
<v Speaker 2>of AI and crypto and all the other stuff that

0:34:27.560 --> 0:34:29.960
<v Speaker 2>came before, and say, oh, no, no, no, this is

0:34:30.040 --> 0:34:31.560
<v Speaker 2>the big thing and it's going to make all of

0:34:31.600 --> 0:34:33.520
<v Speaker 2>the other things work, and it will be different this time,

0:34:33.640 --> 0:34:35.719
<v Speaker 2>we promise, guys, we swear the same way that they

0:34:35.800 --> 0:34:38.120
<v Speaker 2>did with this versus crypto and it's going to be

0:34:38.160 --> 0:34:40.520
<v Speaker 2>the same people shilling it, both in the industry and

0:34:40.600 --> 0:34:44.919
<v Speaker 2>the industry watchers. You know, the same way that Kevin

0:34:44.960 --> 0:34:46.839
<v Speaker 2>Russ was a shill for crypto, now he's a show

0:34:46.880 --> 0:34:52.439
<v Speaker 2>for AI in any event that's with quantum. Yeah.

0:34:52.600 --> 0:34:55.920
<v Speaker 1>If you see if Kevin Russ writes about quantum, yep,

0:34:56.120 --> 0:34:57.799
<v Speaker 1>that's how you know the AI bubble is best.

0:34:57.960 --> 0:34:59.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I think that's probably right.

0:34:59.600 --> 0:35:00.960
<v Speaker 1>He's right for the exits.

0:35:01.080 --> 0:35:04.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, No, I think that's exactly right. But that's what

0:35:04.640 --> 0:35:05.879
<v Speaker 2>the industry wants, right.

0:35:06.040 --> 0:35:06.200
<v Speaker 1>You know.

0:35:06.360 --> 0:35:09.560
<v Speaker 2>The other or another way that it could go is

0:35:09.719 --> 0:35:13.960
<v Speaker 2>when that bubble pops, you're going to see the current

0:35:14.080 --> 0:35:20.440
<v Speaker 2>AI backlash, which I think that outside of the tech industry,

0:35:20.520 --> 0:35:23.480
<v Speaker 2>AI is not actually very popular at all, and I

0:35:23.560 --> 0:35:27.239
<v Speaker 2>think that people in the tech industry really underestimate that.

0:35:27.800 --> 0:35:32.520
<v Speaker 2>And if there's a bubble that pops and that leads

0:35:32.560 --> 0:35:36.800
<v Speaker 2>to a crash, that's going to supercharge the backlash against

0:35:36.840 --> 0:35:41.279
<v Speaker 2>AI in a way that the tech industry is just

0:35:41.360 --> 0:35:44.960
<v Speaker 2>not prepared for, I think, And I would like to

0:35:45.000 --> 0:35:46.360
<v Speaker 2>see that into some kind of reckoning.

0:35:47.760 --> 0:35:49.600
<v Speaker 1>So I want to be I'm going to lead into

0:35:49.640 --> 0:35:51.719
<v Speaker 1>a sentence that you're going to almost immediately guess what

0:35:51.760 --> 0:35:54.400
<v Speaker 1>I'm talking about. I want to be clear that what

0:35:54.520 --> 0:35:57.000
<v Speaker 1>happened to Sam Lman, the person who threw a multip

0:35:57.040 --> 0:36:00.440
<v Speaker 1>cocktail of the person that's through that shot, that is

0:36:00.560 --> 0:36:04.839
<v Speaker 1>morally reprehensible. You cannot do that. It's disgusting. I'm against him.

0:36:06.239 --> 0:36:09.279
<v Speaker 1>I will say that these that I'm surprised that these

0:36:09.320 --> 0:36:12.919
<v Speaker 1>companies are surprised because it's like, for the best part

0:36:13.080 --> 0:36:16.879
<v Speaker 1>of four years they have said, we are taking your job.

0:36:17.040 --> 0:36:20.600
<v Speaker 1>We need everything as you a regular person struggle to

0:36:20.719 --> 0:36:24.160
<v Speaker 1>get credit or thrive or pay your student loans. Like

0:36:24.440 --> 0:36:28.520
<v Speaker 1>in everything's more expensive, everything sucks, but we the AI

0:36:28.640 --> 0:36:31.759
<v Speaker 1>industry get whatever, whatever we want, and our explicit goal

0:36:32.840 --> 0:36:36.560
<v Speaker 1>is to take your job, and the thing we own

0:36:36.680 --> 0:36:39.400
<v Speaker 1>will control everything and all sources of income and everything

0:36:39.400 --> 0:36:41.920
<v Speaker 1>will go through us. You should be scared, because we're

0:36:42.000 --> 0:36:47.160
<v Speaker 1>scared too. I feel like they should have seen this guy.

0:36:47.320 --> 0:36:49.040
<v Speaker 1>Don't think it should happen to them. I want to

0:36:49.080 --> 0:36:52.920
<v Speaker 1>be really clear for legal reasons, but it's like, why

0:36:52.960 --> 0:36:56.920
<v Speaker 1>are they surprised, Like this is exactly the like you've

0:36:56.960 --> 0:36:59.959
<v Speaker 1>been scaring mentally, You've been scaring everyone, but mentally, unstan

0:37:00.320 --> 0:37:01.760
<v Speaker 1>people will also get scared.

0:37:01.840 --> 0:37:02.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeap.

0:37:03.719 --> 0:37:07.960
<v Speaker 1>And it's horrible. And it's horrible because it's like, I

0:37:08.160 --> 0:37:10.239
<v Speaker 1>don't want more of this to happen, but I don't

0:37:10.239 --> 0:37:11.280
<v Speaker 1>see how it stops.

0:37:12.080 --> 0:37:16.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, No, I mean I they are not used to

0:37:16.880 --> 0:37:22.520
<v Speaker 2>their actions having consequences. Yes, And again, you know billionaire

0:37:22.600 --> 0:37:24.799
<v Speaker 2>brain right, when you're a billionaire, of your actions pretty

0:37:24.840 --> 0:37:28.240
<v Speaker 2>much don't have consequences. In a way, again, what happened

0:37:28.280 --> 0:37:31.680
<v Speaker 2>with sam Altman and the Molotov cowtail that is morally reprehensible,

0:37:31.880 --> 0:37:34.640
<v Speaker 2>that stuff should not happen. But in a way, the

0:37:34.840 --> 0:37:37.560
<v Speaker 2>reason that was a headline was that it was a

0:37:37.680 --> 0:37:40.120
<v Speaker 2>billionaire who almost faced a consequence.

0:37:41.320 --> 0:37:44.360
<v Speaker 1>Yes, and someone who has said and it was I've

0:37:44.440 --> 0:37:48.160
<v Speaker 1>recently checked this since I think it was April twenty

0:37:48.239 --> 0:37:51.320
<v Speaker 1>twenty three. Sam Altman has been saying, I'm scared of

0:37:51.400 --> 0:37:53.759
<v Speaker 1>what we're building. Yep. Dario ama Day has been saying

0:37:53.800 --> 0:37:56.520
<v Speaker 1>for years, this will destroy all white collar labor. Yep.

0:37:56.600 --> 0:37:59.000
<v Speaker 1>They have been saying we always need more compute and

0:37:59.120 --> 0:38:01.799
<v Speaker 1>as I think though, but regular people face this as well.

0:38:02.440 --> 0:38:05.040
<v Speaker 1>I don't think an average person feels like they are

0:38:05.120 --> 0:38:07.400
<v Speaker 1>taken super seriously by the world. Yeah, the world does

0:38:07.440 --> 0:38:10.120
<v Speaker 1>not feel hospitable to the average person. But every time

0:38:10.160 --> 0:38:13.319
<v Speaker 1>an AI person says literally anything, it's ron page news

0:38:13.360 --> 0:38:16.400
<v Speaker 1>and it's taken with the complete seriousness. The government has

0:38:16.560 --> 0:38:17.320
<v Speaker 1>meetings about it.

0:38:17.480 --> 0:38:17.640
<v Speaker 2>Yep.

0:38:18.920 --> 0:38:21.840
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, I don't know why would people possibly feel

0:38:21.920 --> 0:38:27.319
<v Speaker 1>angry about any of It's just the thing that I'm

0:38:27.360 --> 0:38:29.960
<v Speaker 1>saying to say in the newsletters. WHOA, It's like, I

0:38:30.080 --> 0:38:32.000
<v Speaker 1>think these people should tone down. They've said that we

0:38:32.080 --> 0:38:34.080
<v Speaker 1>need to tone down the rhetoric. I agree. I think

0:38:34.120 --> 0:38:35.920
<v Speaker 1>that they should stop talking about the models that the

0:38:35.960 --> 0:38:38.960
<v Speaker 1>way they do. They also don't see this alarmism with

0:38:39.360 --> 0:38:40.440
<v Speaker 1>the AI psychosis.

0:38:41.040 --> 0:38:44.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, no, I mean it's really it's really striking the

0:38:44.400 --> 0:38:47.520
<v Speaker 2>things that they're willing to sort of incite a moral

0:38:47.600 --> 0:38:50.239
<v Speaker 2>panic about in the things that they won't right. They

0:38:50.360 --> 0:38:54.239
<v Speaker 2>want to get people worried about this stuff taking all

0:38:54.360 --> 0:38:57.000
<v Speaker 2>white collar jobs. They want to get people worried that

0:38:57.200 --> 0:39:00.400
<v Speaker 2>it's powerful enough to destroy the world, that it's the

0:39:00.480 --> 0:39:04.400
<v Speaker 2>most important thing that has ever happened in the history

0:39:04.440 --> 0:39:05.080
<v Speaker 2>of humanity.

0:39:05.640 --> 0:39:05.759
<v Speaker 1>Uh.

0:39:06.000 --> 0:39:09.600
<v Speaker 2>And they don't want to talk about the people right now,

0:39:10.120 --> 0:39:13.719
<v Speaker 2>who are you know, going insane and dying because of

0:39:13.840 --> 0:39:15.840
<v Speaker 2>the existing products that we already have.

0:39:17.239 --> 0:39:19.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And I think also, here's the thing that you

0:39:19.600 --> 0:39:23.320
<v Speaker 1>you will. Did you see the the one of the blokes,

0:39:23.600 --> 0:39:26.600
<v Speaker 1>one of the blows, the one who threw the Molotov cocktail?

0:39:26.880 --> 0:39:33.320
<v Speaker 1>Apparently he had posted Judkowski's if if if they build it,

0:39:33.400 --> 0:39:36.480
<v Speaker 1>will ship myself. Yeah whatever it's called. Yeah, right, and

0:39:36.600 --> 0:39:40.200
<v Speaker 1>it's just like that everyone does. Yeah, just like, Oh,

0:39:40.320 --> 0:39:43.120
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, are you surprised that people who have

0:39:43.239 --> 0:39:47.600
<v Speaker 1>been that you've monetized scaring people and people are scared?

0:39:47.840 --> 0:39:52.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? Yeah no, And I mean, you know, for all that,

0:39:52.719 --> 0:39:57.240
<v Speaker 2>Altman says that he disagrees with Yudkowski. Altman also said

0:39:57.719 --> 0:40:02.320
<v Speaker 2>that he thinks Judkowski probably deserves the Nobel Peace Prize, which.

0:40:02.840 --> 0:40:06.840
<v Speaker 1>Which is one of the more what for Yeah, like

0:40:07.000 --> 0:40:12.319
<v Speaker 1>what what possibly for strangest man. Yeah, no, these guys

0:40:12.560 --> 0:40:16.640
<v Speaker 1>weirdest guy, weirdest guy. We have to hear from yod

0:40:16.760 --> 0:40:21.880
<v Speaker 1>Kowski with the Nobel Peace Prize for strange boy, weirdest,

0:40:22.680 --> 0:40:27.560
<v Speaker 1>most unnecessary Harry Potter fanfic. Yeah, definitely the new categories

0:40:27.640 --> 0:40:30.440
<v Speaker 1>in the Nobel But it's just but no, but that's

0:40:30.480 --> 0:40:32.560
<v Speaker 1>the thing, it's like to your point, Yeah, it's exactly.

0:40:32.920 --> 0:40:35.560
<v Speaker 1>It is something that Altman claims to not endorse but

0:40:36.200 --> 0:40:37.279
<v Speaker 1>wholeheartedly does.

0:40:37.400 --> 0:40:37.839
<v Speaker 2>Oh, Yeah.

0:40:38.160 --> 0:40:40.960
<v Speaker 1>And what's also interesting is I haven't heard anything from

0:40:41.040 --> 0:40:42.160
<v Speaker 1>Dario ama Day about it.

0:40:42.520 --> 0:40:42.759
<v Speaker 2>Nope.

0:40:43.200 --> 0:40:45.680
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. You think within a situation like this,

0:40:45.800 --> 0:40:48.000
<v Speaker 1>Darya Amada wouldn't be like, I'm so sorry it's happened

0:40:48.080 --> 0:40:49.920
<v Speaker 1>to Sam Ortman is terrible with nothing.

0:40:51.000 --> 0:40:52.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, no, that is a good point. I haven't thought it.

0:40:53.120 --> 0:40:57.120
<v Speaker 1>Kind of respect, yeah, current, No, I kind of respect

0:40:57.360 --> 0:40:59.799
<v Speaker 1>because like we've really not had men of industry who

0:40:59.880 --> 0:41:03.000
<v Speaker 1>just fucking hate each other in a while. So I

0:41:03.080 --> 0:41:05.520
<v Speaker 1>think it's nice to see, nice to see like some

0:41:05.640 --> 0:41:08.960
<v Speaker 1>classic robber baron shit. But it's and now, as of

0:41:09.080 --> 0:41:13.280
<v Speaker 1>the morning of recording this open Aye that an internal

0:41:13.360 --> 0:41:15.640
<v Speaker 1>memo with a clear purpose of being leaked saying that

0:41:15.680 --> 0:41:19.960
<v Speaker 1>Anthropic is overstating their revenues. It's just it's just it's

0:41:20.080 --> 0:41:23.279
<v Speaker 1>really we are getting into the funny part at least. Yeah,

0:41:23.360 --> 0:41:26.799
<v Speaker 1>the cool zone, as it were, Yes, exactly, that's where

0:41:26.840 --> 0:41:31.880
<v Speaker 1>we're on. It's so unfortunate it really like this on

0:41:31.960 --> 0:41:33.759
<v Speaker 1>one level, it's very funny on that how that it's

0:41:33.880 --> 0:41:36.200
<v Speaker 1>just like we could be done fan house yep.

0:41:36.680 --> 0:41:39.759
<v Speaker 2>No, I mean these guys love talking about opportunity costs

0:41:39.800 --> 0:41:42.480
<v Speaker 2>and like what about the opportunity cost of like you

0:41:42.880 --> 0:41:48.080
<v Speaker 2>fucking having your money and your position in society, because

0:41:48.080 --> 0:41:51.759
<v Speaker 2>I think that that's just enormous, for like, the opportunity

0:41:51.880 --> 0:41:55.360
<v Speaker 2>cost of having a Sam Altman or having an Elon

0:41:55.520 --> 0:41:59.200
<v Speaker 2>Musk is just so enormous, and they never fucking talk

0:41:59.239 --> 0:42:00.480
<v Speaker 2>about it because of course they don't.

0:42:01.480 --> 0:42:05.279
<v Speaker 1>Have you seen did you hear about SpaceX is excellent economics?

0:42:06.440 --> 0:42:09.440
<v Speaker 1>They lost five billion dollars last year? Oh god, I.

0:42:09.960 --> 0:42:13.040
<v Speaker 2>Haven't heard that. I've been busy with others, like with launching.

0:42:13.280 --> 0:42:16.880
<v Speaker 1>You've been busy, like enjoying your life rather than reading

0:42:17.840 --> 0:42:21.120
<v Speaker 1>about Elon Musk he is. I will give Elon Musk credit.

0:42:21.239 --> 0:42:23.560
<v Speaker 1>He has invented a new way to fuck up his company,

0:42:25.280 --> 0:42:29.319
<v Speaker 1>just like just like attaching an AI company to SpaceX,

0:42:29.400 --> 0:42:33.640
<v Speaker 1>which has useful products like Starlink that people seem to like.

0:42:33.840 --> 0:42:37.440
<v Speaker 2>Yep, yeah, no, I mean if it works, then he

0:42:37.560 --> 0:42:39.440
<v Speaker 2>has to fuck it up right the same way he

0:42:39.520 --> 0:42:40.400
<v Speaker 2>did with Twitter.

0:42:42.000 --> 0:42:44.440
<v Speaker 1>Talking a billionaires. Have you been looking at Gary Tan?

0:42:45.120 --> 0:42:45.160
<v Speaker 3>No?

0:42:45.520 --> 0:42:46.840
<v Speaker 2>Actually I haven't. What's he been up to?

0:42:47.719 --> 0:42:49.960
<v Speaker 1>So he's the head of y Combinat and he's currently

0:42:50.360 --> 0:42:55.360
<v Speaker 1>experiencing his own AI psychosis sort because he has become

0:42:56.160 --> 0:42:58.440
<v Speaker 1>he's become this weird like he has this thing called

0:42:58.520 --> 0:43:02.000
<v Speaker 1>g Stack, which is his claud code set up, and

0:43:02.160 --> 0:43:06.360
<v Speaker 1>it's just it's literally just at Claude dot mt. I

0:43:06.480 --> 0:43:09.440
<v Speaker 1>believe it's like and it has people really like it

0:43:09.640 --> 0:43:12.560
<v Speaker 1>because people want to get into Y Combinator, so they

0:43:12.640 --> 0:43:15.040
<v Speaker 1>say nice things. But it's been very funny because apparently

0:43:15.080 --> 0:43:17.800
<v Speaker 1>this website just has like tens of thousands of lines

0:43:17.840 --> 0:43:23.200
<v Speaker 1>of code on it. It's like it's it kind of

0:43:23.280 --> 0:43:27.240
<v Speaker 1>feels like watching a kid at a cinema arcade machine

0:43:28.680 --> 0:43:30.520
<v Speaker 1>and they just kind of like pull. They've not got

0:43:30.560 --> 0:43:32.000
<v Speaker 1>any money in it. They just put it at the

0:43:32.040 --> 0:43:36.400
<v Speaker 1>wheel like Ridge Racer or something, or like time crisis.

0:43:36.400 --> 0:43:38.080
<v Speaker 1>They got the gunpoint and get the screen. No money

0:43:38.120 --> 0:43:41.920
<v Speaker 1>in there. It's just very weird because I keep getting

0:43:41.960 --> 0:43:44.160
<v Speaker 1>back to this thing. It's like the glasses from They Live.

0:43:44.560 --> 0:43:47.200
<v Speaker 1>We're finally seeing who the Dunces truly are. All of

0:43:47.280 --> 0:43:53.959
<v Speaker 1>these people who are allegedly smart are actually the literal opposite. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, Yeah,

0:43:54.239 --> 0:43:57.759
<v Speaker 1>it's unfortunate. Well, why don't we wrap it up there?

0:43:58.400 --> 0:44:00.600
<v Speaker 1>Adam tell us about this new part us? What what

0:44:00.880 --> 0:44:02.560
<v Speaker 1>sort of things have you got coming down the pike?

0:44:02.640 --> 0:44:04.600
<v Speaker 1>What what plans have you got Let's end on a

0:44:04.760 --> 0:44:05.239
<v Speaker 1>high note.

0:44:05.520 --> 0:44:09.680
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely. So the podcast again is called Dreaming Against the

0:44:09.760 --> 0:44:15.040
<v Speaker 2>Machine and we're launching, I mean, as of this recording,

0:44:15.080 --> 0:44:18.520
<v Speaker 2>we're launching tomorrow. It was our first real episode. Uh.

0:44:18.960 --> 0:44:21.640
<v Speaker 2>And we have a bunch of great guests coming up.

0:44:22.320 --> 0:44:27.080
<v Speaker 2>You're one of them, ed, uh. And we've also got

0:44:28.680 --> 0:44:30.320
<v Speaker 2>who else do we have. We've got a bunch of

0:44:30.400 --> 0:44:37.160
<v Speaker 2>the original AI Bias people like Sophia Noble and and

0:44:37.440 --> 0:44:42.080
<v Speaker 2>Kathy O'Neil. We've got some great sci fi people like

0:44:42.200 --> 0:44:44.520
<v Speaker 2>Kim Stanley Robinson coming on the podcast.

0:44:45.480 --> 0:44:45.640
<v Speaker 3>Uh.

0:44:46.239 --> 0:44:50.120
<v Speaker 2>And you know some some of the great scientists as well,

0:44:51.960 --> 0:44:55.879
<v Speaker 2>like John de Prescott Weinstein who are talking with about

0:44:55.920 --> 0:45:00.280
<v Speaker 2>Star Trek and and also you know some of amazing

0:45:00.360 --> 0:45:05.440
<v Speaker 2>haters like you or Dave carp uh. So, yeah, it's

0:45:05.480 --> 0:45:08.640
<v Speaker 2>gonna be a lot of fun. The conversations have already

0:45:08.719 --> 0:45:10.320
<v Speaker 2>we've already got a few episodes in the can and

0:45:10.360 --> 0:45:15.040
<v Speaker 2>those conversations have been great. And basically it's going to

0:45:15.120 --> 0:45:19.719
<v Speaker 2>be a place to try to figure out what a

0:45:19.800 --> 0:45:24.040
<v Speaker 2>good future might look like and try to look for

0:45:24.200 --> 0:45:29.640
<v Speaker 2>some hope and be really cringingly sincere and earnest because

0:45:29.640 --> 0:45:31.360
<v Speaker 2>that's kind of my entire deal.

0:45:32.280 --> 0:45:34.160
<v Speaker 1>And I think that's the only way to fight against

0:45:34.200 --> 0:45:37.160
<v Speaker 1>the darkness. Really, yeah, like it's the only the only

0:45:37.280 --> 0:45:39.920
<v Speaker 1>real way forward is for the light to win, is

0:45:40.000 --> 0:45:42.000
<v Speaker 1>to actually be sincere about the things we like. Because

0:45:42.040 --> 0:45:43.759
<v Speaker 1>as much of a hatreds as I am, I do

0:45:43.960 --> 0:45:45.759
<v Speaker 1>love the people in this community and the people go,

0:45:45.960 --> 0:45:48.600
<v Speaker 1>you're awesome, Like we can have cool conversations in the

0:45:48.640 --> 0:45:51.439
<v Speaker 1>show that not how happening elsewhere. I'm glad that someone

0:45:51.560 --> 0:45:52.840
<v Speaker 1>is doing something positive.

0:45:53.400 --> 0:45:55.719
<v Speaker 2>Thank you. Yeah, I mean that was the idea. It's like,

0:45:55.760 --> 0:45:58.920
<v Speaker 2>there's enough darkness out there if we want to if

0:45:58.920 --> 0:46:00.680
<v Speaker 2>we want to win this thing, it's enough to say

0:46:00.719 --> 0:46:02.360
<v Speaker 2>what we don't like. We got to talk about what

0:46:02.480 --> 0:46:02.839
<v Speaker 2>we want.

0:46:04.440 --> 0:46:07.680
<v Speaker 1>Hell yeah, well, Adam, thank you so much for joining me.

0:46:08.960 --> 0:46:12.799
<v Speaker 1>We will link to all of your your various escapades

0:46:12.880 --> 0:46:15.520
<v Speaker 1>in the pro in the episode notes Flawless. They're just

0:46:15.600 --> 0:46:18.160
<v Speaker 1>gonna keep going. I am, of course, said zitron you

0:46:18.239 --> 0:46:20.080
<v Speaker 1>can find me on a monologue this week. I'm not

0:46:20.080 --> 0:46:23.080
<v Speaker 1>gonna surprise you with Ronan Farah interview again, but yes,

0:46:23.200 --> 0:46:26.279
<v Speaker 1>thank you all for listening. Of course, you catch us

0:46:26.320 --> 0:46:28.719
<v Speaker 1>on the monologue and we'll have some fun interviews coming up.

0:46:28.760 --> 0:46:32.400
<v Speaker 1>Everyone got the boys from This Machine Kills coming as well. Anyway,

0:46:32.719 --> 0:46:34.800
<v Speaker 1>catch you on the monologue everyone, and thank you Adam

0:46:34.840 --> 0:46:35.440
<v Speaker 1>for joining.

0:46:35.280 --> 0:46:45.960
<v Speaker 4>Us, Thanks Zev for having me, Thank you for listening

0:46:46.000 --> 0:46:46.760
<v Speaker 4>to Better Offline.

0:46:47.080 --> 0:46:49.480
<v Speaker 5>The editor and composer of the Better Offline theme song

0:46:49.560 --> 0:46:52.200
<v Speaker 5>is Matasowski. You can check out more of his music

0:46:52.239 --> 0:46:55.400
<v Speaker 5>and audio projects at Matasowski dot com, M.

0:46:55.440 --> 0:46:59.520
<v Speaker 4>A T T O S O W s ki dot com.

0:47:00.280 --> 0:47:02.520
<v Speaker 5>You can email me at easy at Better Offline dot

0:47:02.600 --> 0:47:04.839
<v Speaker 5>com or visit better Offline dot com to find more

0:47:04.880 --> 0:47:08.200
<v Speaker 5>podcast links and of course, my newsletter. I also really

0:47:08.280 --> 0:47:10.480
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0:47:10.560 --> 0:47:12.960
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0:47:13.040 --> 0:47:14.600
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0:47:15.400 --> 0:47:18.640
<v Speaker 3>Thank you so much for listening. Better Offline is a

0:47:18.680 --> 0:47:21.560
<v Speaker 3>production of cool Zone Media. For more from cool Zone Media,

0:47:21.920 --> 0:47:25.040
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