WEBVTT - Christian Bale & Sam Rockwell / "Vice" 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:02.400 This episode of Playback is brought to you by Warner Brothers. 0:00:02.400 --> 0:00:05.080 A Star is Born. As we talk about important films 0:00:05.080 --> 0:00:07.040 of this past year, this one is top of mind, 0:00:07.080 --> 0:00:11.200 emotionally resonating with critics and audiences. The film's director, Bradley 0:00:11.240 --> 0:00:13.600 Cooper is being recognized for his brilliant work as a 0:00:13.600 --> 0:00:16.720 filmmaker and actor, along with his cast Lady Gaga and 0:00:16.720 --> 0:00:20.840 Sam Elliott for their stunning performances. Varieties Film critic Owen 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:24.200 Gliberman has called the film a total emotional knockout, and 0:00:24.239 --> 0:00:27.800 Los Angeles Times critic Justin Chang said, from the first frame, 0:00:27.840 --> 0:00:30.240 it casts a spell, the kind that lets you know 0:00:30.320 --> 0:00:33.000 immediately that you're in good hands. A star is born 0:00:33.320 --> 0:00:52.040 for your consideration in all categories. You're listening to Playback 0:00:52.320 --> 0:00:55.520 a Variety I Heart radio podcast. I'm your host, Variety 0:00:55.520 --> 0:00:58.480 Awards editor Chris Tapley. This week, I'm talking to the 0:00:58.520 --> 0:01:01.960 stars of Adam McKay's Vie, Christian Bale and Sam Rockwell. 0:01:02.600 --> 0:01:05.480 The two star as former Vice President and former President 0:01:05.520 --> 0:01:09.360 Dick Cheney and George W. Bush, respectively. In the film, 0:01:09.440 --> 0:01:12.160 we talked about early days, getting their start and acting, 0:01:12.319 --> 0:01:15.640 separating personal political beliefs from playing these characters and a 0:01:15.680 --> 0:01:19.520 whole lot more. It's a pretty awesome and lively conversation. 0:01:19.640 --> 0:01:22.560 I think you'll enjoy it. So sit tight. This is 0:01:22.600 --> 0:01:47.360 playback shape. This gentle into looking pretty good yourself. Handerson, 0:01:47.440 --> 0:01:49.440 who what it was before? But you look like you 0:01:49.480 --> 0:01:55.000 can go do so dislay right now. I'm hanging in there. 0:01:55.120 --> 0:02:00.320 I just put on that table behind you, circus. Okay, 0:02:03.640 --> 0:02:05.760 we just want a clear table, Howard Port Is that 0:02:05.960 --> 0:02:09.840 really No, it's not the end of the world, is it? 0:02:10.000 --> 0:02:12.680 Go on, I'll do it for you. I just wanted 0:02:12.720 --> 0:02:15.239 to hear that I'm giving after just I just wanted 0:02:15.280 --> 0:02:19.079 to make a stand a little bits the iPhone. Yeah, 0:02:20.160 --> 0:02:22.840 there's no place being at the table. But what you're 0:02:22.880 --> 0:02:28.320 doing photos are we're talking right now. I really want 0:02:28.360 --> 0:02:36.079 to tell you about it, but you know about oh man, 0:02:36.200 --> 0:02:42.280 I just you know. I can't believe. But that's that 0:02:42.480 --> 0:02:49.800 might be the funniest thing about this. It's almost like 0:02:49.800 --> 0:02:53.960 you guys do this for a living, not this, not this. 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:57.200 Nobody gives you training in this, do they. It's like 0:02:57.240 --> 0:02:59.400 you do well, I didn't take training in any of it, 0:02:59.440 --> 0:03:03.359 but you do that not being the screen. Yes you 0:03:03.440 --> 0:03:07.840 go yeah, I don't do this. I wonder if they 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:10.280 should do that. We've got to have people that are like, 0:03:10.440 --> 0:03:13.120 come in and what do they call media training or 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:16.400 something like that. I just teach you how to be 0:03:16.520 --> 0:03:22.840 around media or something like that. I don't know. Thanks dude, Thanks, thanks, 0:03:23.440 --> 0:03:27.200 You guys are good like that. I think directional mix YadA, YadA, YadA, 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:33.040 YadA YadA. And thanks again for coming on. We're rolling. Yeah, 0:03:33.560 --> 0:03:35.840 it's just swimming on me. I have a watch, but 0:03:35.880 --> 0:03:38.240 I just that's why I always do now. I like 0:03:38.680 --> 0:03:42.400 a watch. But you know, it's not a necessity, you know, 0:03:43.280 --> 0:03:45.280 it was, it's it's a gift. It was a gift. 0:03:47.720 --> 0:03:51.119 We're here everyone with as they're talking about their their 0:03:51.160 --> 0:03:54.240 timekeeping practices. We're here with Christian Bale and Sam Rockwell, 0:03:54.320 --> 0:03:59.160 stars of Adam McKay's vice, Bush and Cheney themselves. Thanks 0:03:59.160 --> 0:04:01.720 again for coming back on the show Man for having me. 0:04:01.960 --> 0:04:03.200 I thought it would be interesting to really have you 0:04:03.200 --> 0:04:05.520 two together, because first of all, when did you guys meet? 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:08.760 How long ago? Years ago? Yeah, we were in Italy 0:04:08.920 --> 0:04:12.080 something like that, Italy and a villa, having a wonderful 0:04:12.120 --> 0:04:17.320 time getting paid nothing. We got paid in wine, remember, 0:04:17.360 --> 0:04:19.000 But you were on a strict diet. You were eating 0:04:19.000 --> 0:04:23.040 those skinless chickens. That's because I had been. I was 0:04:23.120 --> 0:04:26.000 kicked off of American Psycho, but I just refused to 0:04:26.040 --> 0:04:27.840 accept that I wasn't going to make it. So I 0:04:27.920 --> 0:04:30.680 was still getting ready for you, even though all of 0:04:30.680 --> 0:04:32.920 a stone in the camp you were already kicked off 0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:36.400 and you you were still prepping. What that doesn't What 0:04:36.440 --> 0:04:38.920 do you mean because I've insane? Man? You were just 0:04:38.960 --> 0:04:41.160 like still doing it. Yes, I remember we were all 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:43.359 eating pasta and you were. You had these like I 0:04:43.440 --> 0:04:46.279 was eating like hardly anything that sticking to the diet 0:04:46.279 --> 0:04:48.240 and all that. And I was calling Mary Harron and 0:04:48.279 --> 0:04:50.760 she'd be on holiday and she'd be going, Christian, please, 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:52.919 can you just give it up? And I'll go, no, 0:04:53.400 --> 0:04:56.200 I'm not giving it up. It's look at that. And 0:04:56.240 --> 0:04:58.880 then he did and eventually it came back around. But 0:04:58.920 --> 0:05:01.440 you know, during that time, I was actually kicked off 0:05:01.520 --> 0:05:04.400 the Bloody Project. During the during while we're in Italy. 0:05:05.800 --> 0:05:10.320 What's the context here? What the context is? So it 0:05:10.400 --> 0:05:13.600 made me some of the streams together in Italy and 0:05:13.640 --> 0:05:17.960 they paid us in crates a wine they would they 0:05:17.960 --> 0:05:20.640 would deliver. We all lived in one villa. It was 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:24.240 kind of active who was in that house and Kevin 0:05:24.279 --> 0:05:30.720 Clins in a separate David Streuth, the Sessions, John Session, John, Yeah, 0:05:30.880 --> 0:05:34.880 John Sessions, who's hilarious. Um, a bunch of people and 0:05:34.960 --> 0:05:38.640 a frel and a freel man. Yeah yeah. And in 0:05:38.720 --> 0:05:41.479 the West we're all living together in a villa. And 0:05:41.520 --> 0:05:43.719 what they said to us is, we can't pay you anything, 0:05:43.760 --> 0:05:47.520 but you'll live very nicely, which meant we will deliver 0:05:47.680 --> 0:05:52.400 regular crates of wine to you. And they did that 0:05:52.760 --> 0:05:55.320 good good food. Yeah, and so doing that. And at 0:05:55.360 --> 0:05:58.680 the same time, I've been kicked off of American Psycho 0:05:58.800 --> 0:06:01.880 after having done like age readings and whatnot and raising 0:06:01.920 --> 0:06:05.800 the financing with Mary. But then the finances had come 0:06:05.800 --> 0:06:08.320 on and said yeah, we'll fund it, just not with you. Guys. 0:06:09.000 --> 0:06:11.400 We got kicked off, and I just kept on saying 0:06:11.440 --> 0:06:15.000 myself the power of denial. And you found out I 0:06:15.040 --> 0:06:17.400 said that. I said, I'm still making this film. I 0:06:17.400 --> 0:06:19.680 don't care what they're saying. I'm still prepping. So I 0:06:19.760 --> 0:06:21.479 just kept prepping as though it was going to happen. 0:06:21.880 --> 0:06:24.920 Mary was telling me please please stop calling her because 0:06:25.080 --> 0:06:27.560 like we're off the film. But then love the whole 0:06:27.600 --> 0:06:30.159 look at that. It all came back around funny. For 0:06:30.200 --> 0:06:31.760 some reason, I thought you went back further than that, 0:06:31.880 --> 0:06:35.920 Like did you ever cross paths? Like you know, that's 0:06:35.960 --> 0:06:39.200 the first time I remember. Yeah, I just remember, like 0:06:40.880 --> 0:06:44.080 doing that play in front of you guys. Yeah, But 0:06:44.160 --> 0:06:46.400 I don't I don't know. I don't know if we 0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:48.640 did or nothing, like probably did somewhere like like the 0:06:48.640 --> 0:06:50.920 auditions or anything like that, like you might. I didn't 0:06:50.920 --> 0:06:52.600 know if they it went back that far or not. 0:06:52.800 --> 0:06:56.440 But oh, I don't know. I can't remember that. You might. 0:06:56.600 --> 0:06:58.680 We might have wronged in different you might have been 0:06:58.680 --> 0:07:00.320 were you in l A? And I was so I'm 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:02.480 always so bad. I was always so Thank god I 0:07:02.480 --> 0:07:04.400 don't have to do auditions anymore. I was always so 0:07:04.440 --> 0:07:07.400 bad at auditions. I've never really engaged with anyone in 0:07:07.440 --> 0:07:10.000 the hallway waiting because I was just busy banging my 0:07:10.040 --> 0:07:13.080 head against the wall trying to get myself to stay, 0:07:13.320 --> 0:07:15.760 knowing I was about to give the worst performance ever. 0:07:15.920 --> 0:07:17.840 I was standing that whenever I was doing an audition, 0:07:18.080 --> 0:07:21.640 the director if they did cast me, which was rare, 0:07:21.920 --> 0:07:24.000 but when they did, they would say, you were really 0:07:24.040 --> 0:07:30.280 bad in the audition. But the conversation suggested you might 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:33.559 get it together by the time we actually film, because 0:07:33.640 --> 0:07:35.880 I don't know how to audition. It's nothing like actually 0:07:35.920 --> 0:07:39.240 making a film. There's nothing like it. It's a different muscle, 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:42.000 totally different. And some people do that brilliantly, and then 0:07:42.000 --> 0:07:43.960 they get on set and you go, oh what happened. 0:07:44.720 --> 0:07:47.400 Other people can't audition, but you get them on set 0:07:47.400 --> 0:07:49.960 and you go, oh, yeah, that's it. Yeah, it's a 0:07:49.960 --> 0:07:53.480 totally different muscle. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because I wanted to 0:07:53.520 --> 0:07:56.360 go back because the way you both broke in in 0:07:56.480 --> 0:07:59.040 TV and also on the TV movie Anastasia, and then 0:07:59.040 --> 0:08:01.400 with you you were you were doing Equalizer and stuff 0:08:01.400 --> 0:08:07.320 like this. What would Yeah, no, yes, that's right, what would? 0:08:07.440 --> 0:08:10.280 I used to love watching that. John Gilgai said his 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:15.960 name was like a fart in the bath, breaking Moran. 0:08:16.240 --> 0:08:25.400 Oh my god. Wow. But yeah, you know, just at 0:08:25.440 --> 0:08:27.720 that time, it means late eighties, mid mid eighties for 0:08:27.800 --> 0:08:31.480 you breaking in in the TV world. I just wanted 0:08:31.480 --> 0:08:34.839 to kind of get your two separate experiences with that. 0:08:34.920 --> 0:08:37.680 And then you go off you work with you know, Spielberg, 0:08:37.920 --> 0:08:42.000 and you work with Christopher Lee. You did TV before that, 0:08:42.240 --> 0:08:44.560 you did the TV film I did were The first 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:46.679 thing I did was comedy in the West End with 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:55.920 Brown Atkinson. You're other than doing like commercial under the 0:08:55.920 --> 0:08:57.680 commercial when I got a pair of d ms and 0:08:57.679 --> 0:09:02.200 a rubic snake of it, and then I got a 0:09:02.280 --> 0:09:06.920 job working in the West End doing a Ron Atkinson company. 0:09:07.080 --> 0:09:08.959 That's great. So you were a kid, I was. We 0:09:08.920 --> 0:09:12.680 were both kids on stage. Yeah, that's that's interesting. Another. 0:09:13.440 --> 0:09:16.160 I mean, you probably don't have another obviously don't have 0:09:16.160 --> 0:09:19.880 a different context, but starting the career that young, especially you, 0:09:20.480 --> 0:09:23.800 But you know, what do you think that did to 0:09:23.880 --> 0:09:26.040 you as an actor? What did did it? Is? Is 0:09:26.080 --> 0:09:28.640 it like baked into who you are even more because 0:09:28.640 --> 0:09:31.120 you got started so early, or you know what do 0:09:31.160 --> 0:09:34.960 you think I think it makes you? I mean, I 0:09:35.000 --> 0:09:37.440 think it makes like Chris Walkin was a stage kid. 0:09:38.040 --> 0:09:41.840 I think it makes you I was. I was. He 0:09:41.960 --> 0:09:45.160 was like song and dance kids, and he had a 0:09:45.160 --> 0:09:48.120 stage mom and his brother. And I think it makes 0:09:48.160 --> 0:09:50.040 you a little bit like I mean, we've talked about 0:09:50.080 --> 0:09:52.920 it a little bit, and it makes you a little 0:09:52.960 --> 0:09:54.920 like feel like an alien a little bit. I don't 0:09:54.920 --> 0:09:57.839 know about you, but I feel a little I think 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:00.440 it because you see stuff at an early a age, 0:10:01.320 --> 0:10:04.320 you know, like Bob Fosse who you know, and I 0:10:04.360 --> 0:10:07.240 think you you you sort of get you have to 0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:09.440 grow up a little quicker. I don't know what your experiences, 0:10:09.520 --> 0:10:12.400 but that's kind of my I feel a little. I 0:10:12.400 --> 0:10:14.440 would feel a little bit odd when I went back 0:10:14.440 --> 0:10:17.360 to school to a normal life with kids, because I'd 0:10:17.400 --> 0:10:21.439 seen adult stuff. You know, it's been at the circus, 0:10:21.520 --> 0:10:25.880 you know, and it's it's it's interesting. I didn't do films. 0:10:25.920 --> 0:10:28.920 He did films, but my mom was in the circus. 0:10:29.320 --> 0:10:32.800 My mom was a circus performer. Really yeah, he's serious. 0:10:33.240 --> 0:10:36.000 And I would go watch her and do all that 0:10:36.040 --> 0:10:40.600 and should be a clown and elephants and stuff like that, 0:10:40.679 --> 0:10:45.160 and so I'd see that. But then I had a 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:49.080 family member fool very ill and right at that moment. 0:10:49.679 --> 0:10:53.319 My sister was actually the one who was into acting 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:56.160 and interested in it in theater and whatnot. But we 0:10:56.200 --> 0:10:58.320 only had one car, so I would always have to 0:10:58.440 --> 0:11:00.640 drag along with her. And I was always, oh god, 0:11:00.720 --> 0:11:04.200 I've got going on whatever she's doing. I'll be sitting around, 0:11:04.520 --> 0:11:08.120 you know whatever amateur thing backstage. And they said to me, 0:11:08.160 --> 0:11:10.800 how about you try. You're right for this role. So 0:11:10.840 --> 0:11:13.679 I started doing it, and it suddenly got offered money. 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:19.560 My family needed that money because remember was ill and 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:21.640 we were we were having a lot of archer we 0:11:21.640 --> 0:11:24.360 were going to move around, I staying at different people's 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:26.840 houses and stuff, and so it became that that was 0:11:26.880 --> 0:11:31.040 the intro for me was oh, bloody l it's as 0:11:31.080 --> 0:11:37.720 the breadwinner because and that was burning. So I hated it. 0:11:38.240 --> 0:11:40.240 I did it, but I hated and then I was 0:11:40.280 --> 0:11:42.800 just talking about this, actually about and then and then realizing, 0:11:43.720 --> 0:11:47.160 but look, this might give me opportunities I've never dreamed 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:52.480 of and travel and etcetera and all that and uh, 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:54.840 and also going I'm kind of stuck. I can't not 0:11:54.960 --> 0:11:57.200 do this because how can I say to my family 0:11:57.240 --> 0:11:58.480 I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:01.640 earn that money that we need. And so I started 0:12:01.640 --> 0:12:03.640 looking around and it was Gary Old, but I would 0:12:03.880 --> 0:12:07.520 I would see Gary's films and go, he is fantastic. 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:11.080 He is really good. If I'm stuck doing this, I 0:12:11.120 --> 0:12:13.319 want to be as good as he is. And that 0:12:13.360 --> 0:12:17.960 was my inspiration as a teenager. I hate doing this. 0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:20.320 I want to give it up. But if I'm if 0:12:20.360 --> 0:12:22.760 I'm going to do this, I'd like to do something 0:12:22.800 --> 0:12:24.720 like he does. And I just told him that a 0:12:24.720 --> 0:12:28.040 couple of weeks ago. Um, yeah, and then and then 0:12:28.120 --> 0:12:30.720 and then one of the actual passion for it kicking. 0:12:31.000 --> 0:12:33.000 It's sort of gradually came in. But I think it's 0:12:33.040 --> 0:12:35.800 a I don't think it's an unhealthy level of love 0:12:35.840 --> 0:12:39.080 and hate. Yeah about that last year, Yeah, I think 0:12:39.160 --> 0:12:42.600 I don't think that's an unhealthy Yeah, how about you 0:12:42.640 --> 0:12:46.960 say much that's a fascinating So we started about the 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:52.040 same age, do we? Yeah? I think I was ten, Yeah, 0:12:52.280 --> 0:12:53.839 when I got my d MS in the room snake. 0:12:56.080 --> 0:12:59.160 But that's amazing about your mom in the circus, that's incredible. 0:12:59.160 --> 0:13:04.240 I mean, yeah, my mom was uh, improvisational theater actress 0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:06.880 and and and she knew a bunch of crazy kind 0:13:06.880 --> 0:13:09.800 of downtown and I got thrown into place. She didn't 0:13:09.840 --> 0:13:11.719 have a babysit. You money for a babysitter. So I 0:13:11.800 --> 0:13:14.480 go to the rehearsals. She was saying telegrams and then 0:13:14.480 --> 0:13:16.079 I just ended up. Somebody said when you throw the 0:13:16.160 --> 0:13:19.360 kid in the play, and oh, that's crazy. Didn't do improv? Yeah, 0:13:19.480 --> 0:13:22.280 And so that was like an improv based show, and 0:13:22.320 --> 0:13:24.240 that's how I got into it. But but yeah, I 0:13:24.280 --> 0:13:26.160 do relate to that, that kind of there's a there's 0:13:26.160 --> 0:13:29.120 a thing about when you're a kid, you know, you 0:13:29.120 --> 0:13:32.080 don't want to you want to be playing and you know, 0:13:32.440 --> 0:13:35.880 going to sleep at a normal hour, And so I 0:13:35.880 --> 0:13:38.040 think there is a little resentment when you're a kid 0:13:38.080 --> 0:13:39.880 and you grow up in it. You're doing stuff that 0:13:39.960 --> 0:13:42.600 you know you should be going to bed early, and 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:46.240 you're up staying up late with the adults, and it's 0:13:46.280 --> 0:13:48.640 not normal. And I think there is a little bit 0:13:48.679 --> 0:13:51.160 of that hate love thing. I I kind of relate 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:54.679 to that. And then nothing. It is a very natural 0:13:54.720 --> 0:13:57.320 thing for kids to role play, right an act, Yeah, 0:13:57.440 --> 0:13:59.920 they stop it when they feel like stopping it. They don't. 0:14:00.080 --> 0:14:03.400 You don't, no, no, no, no, You've got to keep going. 0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:05.760 But I don't want to do it anymore, no more. 0:14:05.840 --> 0:14:08.880 You do have to. So that's the big difference. Thinks, 0:14:09.120 --> 0:14:11.800 very natural instinct and very healthy thing to act and 0:14:11.920 --> 0:14:14.800 perform a role playing all that, but not on someone 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:17.920 else's schedule. Most kids, you have to go, yeah, I'm done, now, 0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:21.720 let's go ride my bike. Yeah, you know you're on 0:14:21.760 --> 0:14:24.680 the clock until this time. And you well, that's what 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:27.360 I love about what was Clintics would always say whenever 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:30.560 you're ready, didn't say action. He says whenever you're ready. Yeah, 0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:32.840 I kind of because that's kind of isn't that it 0:14:32.960 --> 0:14:36.400 right there? It's like it's like take away those strictures. Yeah, 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:37.880 you want to do it for yourself. You want to 0:14:37.880 --> 0:14:39.720 do it because you want to be like your old man. 0:14:39.760 --> 0:14:42.400 You want to you know, um, you don't want to 0:14:42.560 --> 0:14:45.160 do it because you have somebody's making it because I 0:14:45.240 --> 0:14:48.160 want to snapping their fingers. Essentially, like your best work 0:14:48.160 --> 0:14:51.120 when you're doing it for yourself. Never, you never. If 0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:52.960 you do it for yourself, you're gonna do good work. 0:14:53.000 --> 0:14:54.360 If you do it for somebody else, you're not going. 0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:56.040 And then how about for you? Like when did the 0:14:56.040 --> 0:14:58.440 passion for it actually kick in for you? I think 0:14:58.480 --> 0:15:00.720 I was. I was similar where I sort of sucking 0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:04.120 off and I was I was, um, I was getting 0:15:04.160 --> 0:15:06.320 stone in high school and chasing girls, and then I 0:15:06.400 --> 0:15:08.800 kind of I didn't take it seriously because it was 0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:11.760 also in the blood, so I took it for granted. 0:15:13.120 --> 0:15:16.360 And then I went to New York when I was eighteen, 0:15:16.600 --> 0:15:18.440 and I started getting jobs, but I really didn't know 0:15:18.440 --> 0:15:20.440 what I was doing. And then I went and trained 0:15:20.440 --> 0:15:24.240 at this with this guy William Mesper and then I 0:15:24.600 --> 0:15:27.080 was sort of obsessed with Robert de Niro and all 0:15:27.120 --> 0:15:30.480 that kind of stuff. And then Gary and Malkovich and 0:15:30.640 --> 0:15:33.080 John Taturo were on the scene, you know, and they 0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:35.960 were like, you remember John Thurrow Miller's crossing was like 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:41.800 that scene Malkovich and you know everything you know. Um, 0:15:41.840 --> 0:15:44.480 but Gary Oldman was one of those guys and and so, 0:15:46.080 --> 0:15:48.160 and then I just was were you watching all that 0:15:48.280 --> 0:15:52.040 Robert DeNiro movies and you know, John Boyd and and 0:15:52.080 --> 0:15:55.000 then uh, and then I realized, oh, this is uh, 0:15:55.040 --> 0:15:57.640 this isn't a lark, this is a calling, this is 0:15:57.680 --> 0:16:00.600 a this you know, Darry said not to be pretentious, 0:16:00.640 --> 0:16:04.120 but it can be a noble profession. It is a 0:16:04.160 --> 0:16:06.600 craft and and it's something to work at. And so 0:16:07.400 --> 0:16:09.560 I think then I was when I was like twenty 0:16:09.560 --> 0:16:11.520 four or something, I was like, Okay, I should be 0:16:11.560 --> 0:16:16.160 more serious about this and not just take it for granted. Yeah. 0:16:16.760 --> 0:16:19.960 Funny you mentioning Gary Oldman because I had a note here. 0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:21.520 I had Gary on the show last year. We're talking 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:24.640 about you had another immersion that he had last year 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:26.400 into a role with the makeup and everything, and then 0:16:26.400 --> 0:16:29.480 you both are are working in some serious makeup with 0:16:29.560 --> 0:16:33.440 this movie. So him just curious about you know, just 0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:36.080 crafting the visage and everything is is a huge part 0:16:36.080 --> 0:16:38.520 of this movie. So just talk to me about that, 0:16:38.600 --> 0:16:41.960 like especially with you Christian working under a lot of 0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:46.360 makeup and about that, because yeah, because um, you know, I, 0:16:46.360 --> 0:16:50.720 I we we we have very different approaches, uh to it. 0:16:51.840 --> 0:16:56.320 Because I had said, well, I don't know how to 0:16:56.360 --> 0:16:58.200 do this except for I've got to gain the white 0:16:58.280 --> 0:17:02.040 you know myself. Uh, And I was, I was in 0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:04.439 the middle of doing that. I was probably you know, 0:17:05.920 --> 0:17:13.160 you know, a large toddler, bigger than I had begun already, 0:17:13.240 --> 0:17:17.679 you know. And and then I see that Gary has 0:17:17.760 --> 0:17:20.000 done that. So I caught up Gary and said, well, 0:17:20.040 --> 0:17:23.040 how much weight did you gain? And he said I 0:17:23.040 --> 0:17:25.320 didn't gain any weight? And I went no, no, no, no, no, Gary, 0:17:25.400 --> 0:17:27.000 how much weight did you gain, you know, for the 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:30.560 role doing that? And he was like, just told you 0:17:30.680 --> 0:17:33.679 for the Winston Churchill And he said, no, I just 0:17:33.720 --> 0:17:38.640 told you. I didn't gain anything. I wait what he said, 0:17:38.640 --> 0:17:42.600 I didn't get a pound? How was that even possible? 0:17:42.680 --> 0:17:44.680 He said, no, no, nothing at all. So I was 0:17:44.720 --> 0:17:47.439 already well down the track of sort of you know, 0:17:47.480 --> 0:17:50.159 putting on a lot of weight myself. But you know, 0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:56.800 the understanding that now things have come that was very 0:17:56.840 --> 0:18:05.280 Oh absolutely, but I didn't understand that it comes such 0:18:05.320 --> 0:18:07.720 a long way, you know, at that point. And then 0:18:07.800 --> 0:18:09.800 and then it was possible. I always thought when people said, oh, 0:18:09.840 --> 0:18:11.640 we'll just stick on the fat, so I was like, oh, 0:18:11.680 --> 0:18:16.280 you're naive creature. It's that doesn't work like that. Um. 0:18:16.400 --> 0:18:20.399 But so yes, I would completely rethink the way I 0:18:20.400 --> 0:18:23.280 would do it now. But I was already well down track, 0:18:23.359 --> 0:18:25.360 and like I was like, but Gary, I've already put 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:28.760 on this much weight and I've grown my neck like 0:18:29.000 --> 0:18:34.080 four inches, you know. I mean, but you're like you're 0:18:34.080 --> 0:18:36.879 like a crazy person, like Robert de Narrow, like the machinist. 0:18:37.040 --> 0:18:39.760 I mean, I mean you're like a crazy like you're like, 0:18:40.040 --> 0:18:42.960 you know, it's nuts like you. I mean, is it 0:18:43.040 --> 0:18:47.960 like me in admirable way? I mean admirable nuts. I say, 0:18:48.000 --> 0:18:51.720 I say that with the adoration respect. I couldn't do 0:18:51.840 --> 0:18:53.480 I don't know if I could do that. It's it's 0:18:54.520 --> 0:19:00.480 admirable nuts to you. So nuts, I always I keep saying, 0:19:00.520 --> 0:19:04.280 never again, Yeah, Okay, We're just gonna pause here for 0:19:04.320 --> 0:19:06.320 a moment and have a quick word from our sponsors. 0:19:06.640 --> 0:19:09.560 Will be right back here with Christian Bale and Sam Rockwell. 0:19:10.560 --> 0:19:13.080 This episode of Playback is brought to you by Warner Brothers. 0:19:13.080 --> 0:19:15.879 A Star is born. As we talk about important films 0:19:15.880 --> 0:19:17.960 of this past year, this one is top of mind, 0:19:18.280 --> 0:19:22.000 emotionally resonating with critics and audiences, and the film's director, 0:19:22.040 --> 0:19:25.119 Bradley Cooper is being recognized for his brilliant work as 0:19:25.119 --> 0:19:28.320 a filmmaker and actor, along with his cast Lady Gaga 0:19:28.359 --> 0:19:32.560 and Sam Elliott, for their stunning performances varieties. Film critic 0:19:32.640 --> 0:19:36.040 Owen Gliberman has called the film a total emotional knockout 0:19:36.359 --> 0:19:39.400 in Los Angeles Times, as critic Justin Chang said, from 0:19:39.400 --> 0:19:42.119 the first frame, it casts a spell, the kind that 0:19:42.200 --> 0:19:44.480 lets you know immediately that you're in good hands. A 0:19:44.600 --> 0:19:53.399 star is born for your consideration in all categories. All Right, everyone, 0:19:53.440 --> 0:19:55.720 We're back here with Christian Bale and Sam Rockwell, the 0:19:55.760 --> 0:19:59.679 stars of Adam McKay's Vice. Uh, you did a good 0:19:59.720 --> 0:20:01.480 job being on the weaight, sir, you did a good 0:20:01.520 --> 0:20:02.840 job of losing it too. I was gonna ask you 0:20:02.840 --> 0:20:05.280 how you lost it if you don't mind sharing. Did 0:20:05.280 --> 0:20:08.119 you just stop eating? Yeah, pretty much, just go to 0:20:08.160 --> 0:20:14.200 bed hungry and be miserable. Yeah. When we spoke last year, yeah, 0:20:14.520 --> 0:20:18.679 you had the day before, you had you had just 0:20:18.960 --> 0:20:21.320 wrapped the day before actually, and you were just happy 0:20:21.359 --> 0:20:25.480 to kind of relinquished Cheney for a little bit. So, 0:20:25.560 --> 0:20:27.080 you know, I wanted to talk about that. It's a 0:20:27.160 --> 0:20:29.600 character that. First of all, I just want to say 0:20:29.640 --> 0:20:33.840 I loved the film. It's it's phenomenal, and I actually 0:20:34.119 --> 0:20:36.520 I had such a weird experience watching it. I felt 0:20:37.440 --> 0:20:40.480 incredibly empty after I finished watching it. I just felt 0:20:40.520 --> 0:20:42.480 like I stared on to the boy because I just 0:20:42.520 --> 0:20:45.160 watched a portrait of a soulless individual. In my opinion, 0:20:45.200 --> 0:20:47.760 that's what I just finished watching. And I was staggered 0:20:48.600 --> 0:20:52.800 at at at the person I had just seen. And so, uh, 0:20:52.880 --> 0:20:55.040 I know that's not your approach, though, because you when 0:20:55.040 --> 0:20:57.280 we spoke last year, you you you said you told 0:20:57.280 --> 0:21:00.359 Adam that you were going to really I'm at it 0:21:00.440 --> 0:21:03.680 trying to understand that. Yeah. Yeah, and just just so 0:21:04.080 --> 0:21:06.880 uh so obviously a different perspective. And have you seen 0:21:06.880 --> 0:21:10.320 the film yet? Numerous times? Okay, because because Sam hadn't 0:21:10.320 --> 0:21:12.200 seen it yet, and it's interesting because it seems like 0:21:12.280 --> 0:21:14.080 so much footage might have been shot that didn't make 0:21:14.080 --> 0:21:16.080 it into the movie. So I'm very curious once you 0:21:16.119 --> 0:21:19.720 see it, what you think, you know, But talk about 0:21:19.760 --> 0:21:23.960 that like like the balance of you are in it. Yeah, yeah, 0:21:23.960 --> 0:21:26.320 you didn't make the cut. You didn't make the cut, 0:21:26.600 --> 0:21:28.960 the balance of you know, any feelings you might have 0:21:29.000 --> 0:21:32.480 about the man versus pushing that away to play the man, 0:21:32.840 --> 0:21:35.159 and then the same for you know, you absolutely have 0:21:35.280 --> 0:21:38.480 to do that. Um, there's no interest to me in 0:21:38.680 --> 0:21:41.800 uh making a film where it's my opinions in their 0:21:41.800 --> 0:21:44.399 my opinions. I want to remove completely. You know, Adam 0:21:44.520 --> 0:21:47.280 is the story Eacheller and we agreed early on. Let 0:21:47.359 --> 0:21:52.560 me counter his um uh points of view, let me 0:21:52.680 --> 0:21:56.440 advocate for Cheney, let me try to convince him, because 0:21:56.480 --> 0:21:59.720 I do believe Trainey he's very strong, mind minded individual. Um, 0:22:00.160 --> 0:22:02.040 the nature of what does it mean to be a patriot? 0:22:02.160 --> 0:22:04.040 You know? I mean that that's a that's a real 0:22:04.119 --> 0:22:08.080 amorphous word, isn't it. You know, It's it's like obsession, right, 0:22:08.119 --> 0:22:10.680 It be a healthy thing, it can be incredibly unhealthy 0:22:10.720 --> 0:22:14.200 as well. But he certainly believes that what he did 0:22:14.400 --> 0:22:17.399 is right and correct and patriotic and good for the 0:22:17.440 --> 0:22:19.760 American people, whereas you will get other people who will 0:22:19.800 --> 0:22:23.760 say he's absolutely patriotic and and say he's a war criminal. 0:22:24.040 --> 0:22:27.399 You know, So that that disparity there, But for me 0:22:27.480 --> 0:22:31.000 to truly try to understand where he was coming from, um, 0:22:31.240 --> 0:22:35.040 to try to see the motivations and hopefully the good 0:22:35.040 --> 0:22:38.320 motivations in it. To look at his personal life as well, 0:22:38.480 --> 0:22:41.399 his devotion to Lynn, to his family, is embracing of 0:22:41.560 --> 0:22:43.840 Mary when she came out immediately, even though it was 0:22:43.840 --> 0:22:49.560 an athema to the rest of the party at that time. Um. Uh. 0:22:49.880 --> 0:22:53.280 There is, of course, you know, the enormous thing here though, 0:22:53.359 --> 0:22:59.760 of the Iraq war, enhanced interrogation, one of us white tapping, etcetera. Um. 0:22:59.800 --> 0:23:03.200 But how somebody can come to believe that these are 0:23:03.400 --> 0:23:09.760 American values um, and believe in American exceptionalism um in 0:23:09.800 --> 0:23:12.560 a way that is so vastly different from the way 0:23:12.600 --> 0:23:16.560 that other people American exceptionalism. But certainly not wanting to 0:23:16.560 --> 0:23:18.800 put my own politics into it. You know, the difference 0:23:18.800 --> 0:23:23.600 between Adam and Sam, myself, Amy, Steve is you're looking 0:23:23.640 --> 0:23:26.240 at Sam and me and Amy and Steve on the screen, 0:23:26.680 --> 0:23:30.160 and so we can be a terrible distraction to the 0:23:30.200 --> 0:23:32.840 film if you know too much about our own ideas 0:23:33.320 --> 0:23:35.600 we want, we want, you know, just look and see 0:23:35.640 --> 0:23:38.200 the characters, you know. So for me, it's Adam's place 0:23:38.280 --> 0:23:40.760 to be as political as he wants, but for me 0:23:40.880 --> 0:23:43.520 to try and stay, you know, somewhat neutral as far 0:23:43.560 --> 0:23:45.760 as the viewer is concerned. Of course, I've got my 0:23:45.800 --> 0:23:48.800 own opinions, very strong ones, but that's not why I do. 0:23:49.000 --> 0:23:52.760 You know, I portray other people, uh not me. But 0:23:52.840 --> 0:23:57.200 it was a fascinating exploration. You know. He's a fascinating individual, 0:23:57.359 --> 0:24:04.000 very complex, very very strong minded and hardline, but lots 0:24:04.000 --> 0:24:06.399 of ambiguity at the same time, you know, having this 0:24:06.760 --> 0:24:10.439 incredible ambition and many would say arrogance, but also being 0:24:10.520 --> 0:24:12.840 quite self sacrifice and giving up his own dreams of 0:24:12.880 --> 0:24:15.480 the presidency, you know, being a real zealot for the 0:24:15.560 --> 0:24:19.280 unitary executive, but which is for the president, He's not 0:24:19.359 --> 0:24:23.320 for him directly, but seeing the opportunity obviously with w 0:24:24.160 --> 0:24:27.399 being able to have his perfect scenario of working in 0:24:27.400 --> 0:24:31.360 the shadows but truly controlling m everything. But he's he's 0:24:31.359 --> 0:24:35.280 a remarkably complex individual. I came away from the movie 0:24:35.320 --> 0:24:37.120 with a big question mark of why though. I mean, 0:24:37.680 --> 0:24:39.679 I don't want to get into a political discussion, but 0:24:40.680 --> 0:24:43.280 just that's what I was left with, was all of 0:24:43.320 --> 0:24:45.200 this hunger for power to what end and why? And 0:24:45.240 --> 0:24:46.880 it seems the answer to you as he's a patriot, 0:24:46.880 --> 0:24:48.439 he thought he was being a patriot, and I just 0:24:48.480 --> 0:24:50.080 it's just not it's not the vibe I gap from 0:24:50.080 --> 0:24:51.679 what Adam made, you know. I just I got a 0:24:51.800 --> 0:24:56.199 very very mysterious portrait out of it that I just 0:24:56.200 --> 0:24:58.440 could not understand why the man wanted what he wanted 0:24:58.480 --> 0:25:03.560 and what he did. I do UM find though, that 0:25:04.080 --> 0:25:09.920 this to me transcends chainey, that it does become a 0:25:10.040 --> 0:25:17.400 character um study um, an incredibly humorous one, an absurdest 0:25:17.480 --> 0:25:20.679 one at moments, which is Adam's rule talent of being 0:25:20.720 --> 0:25:23.800 able to take something which is very profound in moments 0:25:23.800 --> 0:25:28.160 and absolutely tragic and diabolical, but also to be able 0:25:28.160 --> 0:25:30.480 to find the entertainment and the humor as well, which 0:25:30.520 --> 0:25:33.639 always have to go hand in hand. Um. But to 0:25:33.680 --> 0:25:36.879 me it transcended just Chaining was also a reflection about 0:25:36.920 --> 0:25:38.679 what it means to be a person, to be a family, 0:25:38.720 --> 0:25:41.119 to be a nation, I found it moving beyond the leaf. 0:25:41.560 --> 0:25:45.000 I was sort of almost embarrassed and surprised that I 0:25:45.600 --> 0:25:49.880 was crying with laughter and I was crying from sadness. Uh. 0:25:50.400 --> 0:25:52.159 And I kind of see it also as as a 0:25:52.160 --> 0:25:54.520 love story to America. I think that it's it's it's 0:25:54.560 --> 0:25:57.040 you know, America has always been a country of great contradictions, 0:25:57.200 --> 0:26:00.359 with these beautiful ideals and beautiful dreams that make it 0:26:00.520 --> 0:26:02.879 exceptional and that the rest of the world look to 0:26:03.480 --> 0:26:05.600 and have been inspired by. You know, there are many 0:26:05.640 --> 0:26:08.600 other free countries now around the world, but many of 0:26:08.600 --> 0:26:12.640 which were inspired by America's um. But then the dark 0:26:12.720 --> 0:26:15.960 underbelly that has always existed, you know, I mean obviously 0:26:16.000 --> 0:26:18.520 slavery and you know, considering some people to be three 0:26:18.520 --> 0:26:21.320 fifths of person, etcetera, and all that and then continues 0:26:21.359 --> 0:26:24.680 to this day of people who believe that in order 0:26:24.720 --> 0:26:27.359 to have those freedoms, you are allowed to act in 0:26:27.400 --> 0:26:31.280 a way that it is absolutely opposing to what we judge, 0:26:31.359 --> 0:26:35.320 you know, America's standards to be um. That's fascinating, and 0:26:36.000 --> 0:26:38.640 I think that's fascinating not only to Americans, but to 0:26:38.520 --> 0:26:41.479 the to the entire world, because America has an enormous 0:26:41.520 --> 0:26:45.399 influence and not just politically but emotionally to it because 0:26:45.520 --> 0:26:48.440 it is a very unique country. Yeah, how about you Sam, 0:26:48.480 --> 0:26:51.920 similar question. I mean, just divorcing any feelings you might 0:26:51.960 --> 0:26:56.639 have from playing the character. Yeah, I mean what what 0:26:56.640 --> 0:27:03.280 what Christians about being juxtaposing Adam's job. I think it's 0:27:03.320 --> 0:27:09.840 really important to kind of it's our job to find 0:27:09.880 --> 0:27:13.880 the humanity in the character. That's our responsibility. And it's 0:27:13.920 --> 0:27:19.600 also it's George W. Through Cheney's point of view too. 0:27:20.480 --> 0:27:24.640 But um, I think that that's that's what's that's what's 0:27:24.680 --> 0:27:30.080 sort of my job is to kind of just make 0:27:30.480 --> 0:27:33.679 him as human as possible, you know, in spite of 0:27:33.720 --> 0:27:38.400 the very famous way that he talked, you know, which 0:27:38.440 --> 0:27:42.000 is a little daunting. But um but yeah, yeah, I 0:27:42.000 --> 0:27:47.520 mean I think it's just working with when whenever you're 0:27:47.760 --> 0:27:53.679 you're working with somebody like like Christian or Francis mcdormott 0:27:53.920 --> 0:27:57.679 or Gary Oldman or Joaquin Phoenix. For right now, I'm 0:27:57.680 --> 0:28:01.480 wearing the show Alimes, you go go in loaded for bear, 0:28:02.480 --> 0:28:05.400 You're going no, when you're you're gonna fight Frasier or 0:28:05.520 --> 0:28:09.240 you're gonna you're going into like You're like you better 0:28:09.280 --> 0:28:12.119 be on your a game, you know, because I know 0:28:12.240 --> 0:28:14.440 he's gonna be on his A game, so and that, 0:28:14.600 --> 0:28:16.960 and then it's a very famous guy, so it's a 0:28:17.080 --> 0:28:22.479 it's it's a you're you're you're tingling with you know, 0:28:22.600 --> 0:28:26.040 creativity because you're scared and you're like you want it 0:28:26.080 --> 0:28:30.840 to be, you know, really good. And I think that's 0:28:30.840 --> 0:28:34.200 what was so fun about us on set working together, 0:28:34.600 --> 0:28:38.720 you know. Yeah, and he really did get thrown to 0:28:38.800 --> 0:28:40.840 the deep end. But also that because the very the 0:28:41.480 --> 0:28:43.760 scene that you see in the trailer when we discuss 0:28:43.800 --> 0:28:45.959 it really gonna am I on and on, you know, 0:28:46.320 --> 0:28:48.240 it's chiny on and on. It's that is the VP. 0:28:48.720 --> 0:28:52.480 That was Sam's very first say. But it was also 0:28:52.560 --> 0:28:56.120 the first time I actually sat down and spoken as 0:28:56.240 --> 0:29:00.560 Cheney every other scene, working from one him to the other, 0:29:00.560 --> 0:29:02.840 getting the gate right, doing all that. It was for 0:29:02.880 --> 0:29:05.600 me also the first time I sat down and we 0:29:05.640 --> 0:29:07.400 had I don't know how long the original take of 0:29:07.480 --> 0:29:09.800 that was, but it was long, and it already gets 0:29:09.800 --> 0:29:12.360 cut down, but were off the minute. We're doing a 0:29:12.440 --> 0:29:15.000 lot of improv and stuff, and it was fantastic and 0:29:15.040 --> 0:29:18.720 it was hilarious, but it was we're discovering it at 0:29:18.760 --> 0:29:20.840 the same time, and it helped me a great deal 0:29:21.280 --> 0:29:24.040 because I would talk to and not to jump in. 0:29:24.040 --> 0:29:26.560 There's no other way to do it with these characters. 0:29:26.600 --> 0:29:28.360 He was, he was staying in it, and so I 0:29:28.400 --> 0:29:30.120 tried to stay in it. But we talked about normal 0:29:30.200 --> 0:29:33.760 things like like Steves on right and other things, and 0:29:34.640 --> 0:29:36.520 it was fun and I was like, all right, let's 0:29:36.520 --> 0:29:38.479 do this. And I actually me and Michelle are doing 0:29:38.480 --> 0:29:40.560 a little bit of that right now, but in and out, 0:29:40.640 --> 0:29:43.400 you know. But but it's it's a fun way to work, 0:29:43.680 --> 0:29:46.719 you know. And also, when you're like a supporting player 0:29:47.080 --> 0:29:50.880 and you have done leads, you have an incredible amount 0:29:50.880 --> 0:29:53.880 of compassion for the lead actor because even though this 0:29:54.000 --> 0:29:57.640 felt like bigger than a supporting role, it because I 0:29:57.640 --> 0:30:01.239 think because of the daunting task of who this guy is. 0:30:01.280 --> 0:30:05.360 But but you you you know that he's getting up 0:30:05.360 --> 0:30:07.440 at two in the morning, and you have and you 0:30:07.560 --> 0:30:11.440 just you know, if you've done lead roles and you're 0:30:11.440 --> 0:30:15.160 doing a supporting you have a you have an understanding 0:30:16.520 --> 0:30:19.280 and a respect for what kind of hours this person 0:30:19.360 --> 0:30:21.320 is keeping, you know, and you want to be there 0:30:21.360 --> 0:30:24.160 for them and and that kind of thing. Yeah, thank 0:30:24.200 --> 0:30:26.440 you should. Yeah, it's probably nice to show up first 0:30:26.520 --> 0:30:28.120 day and just have a plate of fried chicken. You're 0:30:28.120 --> 0:30:32.840 gonna be digging into the whole time. Yea, yeah. Uh. 0:30:32.880 --> 0:30:35.880 And you never met Bush. I know you never met changing, 0:30:36.040 --> 0:30:38.640 but no, cigar, you said you did try that. I 0:30:38.680 --> 0:30:41.720 did try. Yeah, what what did you hope to glean 0:30:41.760 --> 0:30:43.680 from him? If you did? I want you know what 0:30:43.720 --> 0:30:46.120 I would have done. Really, The main thing is have 0:30:46.240 --> 0:30:48.720 him take my lines in a tape of quart and 0:30:48.920 --> 0:30:52.320 do some alts. That's what I would have done. I 0:30:52.360 --> 0:30:53.880 did that with Chuck Barriss. I would have done that 0:30:53.920 --> 0:30:55.920 with him. But if he was willing, I thought you 0:30:55.960 --> 0:31:00.360 would have loved it. Yeah, I think he would have too, 0:31:00.400 --> 0:31:02.760 But I never I would have hadn't recorded my lines 0:31:02.840 --> 0:31:04.360 and say and I would say, what do you think 0:31:04.680 --> 0:31:06.760 would what would you say if you don't like this line? 0:31:06.800 --> 0:31:08.640 What would you say instead? And then I would bring 0:31:08.680 --> 0:31:11.520 that to Adam and go, this is what you know. 0:31:13.040 --> 0:31:14.640 And the way Bush is used in the movie is 0:31:14.720 --> 0:31:16.480 kind of I mean, he's kind of used his color 0:31:16.560 --> 0:31:18.800 in a way. Obviously he's playing there Adams playing up 0:31:18.800 --> 0:31:21.600 the comedic elements of the character in terms of how 0:31:21.600 --> 0:31:23.000 we're going to few him as an audience and I 0:31:23.040 --> 0:31:25.960 just wondered if that, with everything you've said about trying 0:31:25.960 --> 0:31:28.040 to be true to the to the you know, the 0:31:28.080 --> 0:31:30.640 reality and the emotion of the character taken. I'm just 0:31:30.680 --> 0:31:33.360 curious if the way Bush was being used in the 0:31:33.360 --> 0:31:37.520 project at all made you wanted to play a caricature 0:31:37.960 --> 0:31:42.000 in any way. No, I mean never, never, never, I mean, 0:31:43.280 --> 0:31:45.720 you gotta it's gotta be real, you gott you can't. 0:31:45.600 --> 0:31:48.680 The the impression has to take back seat to the acting, 0:31:49.680 --> 0:31:52.400 so the you know, to the reality always I think, 0:31:52.560 --> 0:31:54.560 I mean I was saying this earlier, but you know, 0:31:56.400 --> 0:31:58.440 you know, we don't. I don't think we're we we 0:31:58.520 --> 0:32:01.440 want to see Daniel de Lewis do an impression of 0:32:01.480 --> 0:32:04.160 Abe Lincoln or what he imagines Abe Lincoln to be. 0:32:04.280 --> 0:32:08.160 I think we're seeing some of Daniel dey Lewis's attributes 0:32:08.360 --> 0:32:13.560 that he imagines Lincoln would have, sensitivity, the intelligence, etcetera. 0:32:14.080 --> 0:32:15.880 And we don't. You're not going to give a shit 0:32:15.960 --> 0:32:18.880 if you don't see that actor's hard and soul coming 0:32:18.920 --> 0:32:22.800 through and just an impression. I mean, both characters. We've 0:32:22.800 --> 0:32:26.959 seen people do fantastic, yeah, impressions, you know, much of 0:32:27.000 --> 0:32:32.120 it um during Adams Days Saturday that life, you know. 0:32:32.400 --> 0:32:35.640 So that's it's great and it's brilliant and it's good, 0:32:35.680 --> 0:32:38.120 but you can't do that's not a two hour film. Yeah, 0:32:38.280 --> 0:32:41.440 you've gotta get the essence of the character an impersonation. 0:32:42.280 --> 0:32:45.440 Uh did you reach out to anyone in their circles? 0:32:45.480 --> 0:32:48.200 Did you? Did it seem appropriate to do so? Yeah? 0:32:48.240 --> 0:32:50.400 Well I thought I I very much. I did all. 0:32:50.760 --> 0:32:52.480 I did a lot of research thinking how I'm gonna 0:32:52.520 --> 0:32:54.520 reach out because I've always met with every real person 0:32:54.520 --> 0:32:59.520 I've ever played, um, but they weren't public figures. And 0:32:59.560 --> 0:33:02.920 that's what the big difference ultimately came down to, was 0:33:03.000 --> 0:33:05.040 that I did all this research and I thought, you know, 0:33:05.120 --> 0:33:07.240 it'll either just tell me you know what you told 0:33:07.280 --> 0:33:09.520 Patrick lay on the Senate floor, and it will be 0:33:09.560 --> 0:33:13.200 well that would be enterchaining just to be told that. Um, 0:33:13.240 --> 0:33:15.560 you know, but if he did give me the time 0:33:15.600 --> 0:33:19.640 of day, I better know everything because I thought it'll 0:33:19.680 --> 0:33:21.800 grill me. So I really did a research and then 0:33:21.840 --> 0:33:23.600 I called and I said I'm ready, I want I 0:33:23.600 --> 0:33:25.320 want to reach out, and I got told within like 0:33:25.360 --> 0:33:28.560 five minutes, no, you cannot do that. If you bumped 0:33:28.560 --> 0:33:31.520 into him accidentally and chatted with him makes it different, 0:33:31.680 --> 0:33:35.920 but you're reaching out directly. That leaves the movie legally vulnerable. 0:33:36.000 --> 0:33:38.560 So I don't even begin to understand all of that particulately. 0:33:39.200 --> 0:33:40.640 I do, really, I just don't want to get into 0:33:40.640 --> 0:33:46.880 it and show that that that didn't happen. But but yeah, 0:33:47.000 --> 0:33:50.440 but you know, um, I saw this before. I see 0:33:50.440 --> 0:33:52.959 if it come up quick enough. But I have you know, 0:33:53.040 --> 0:33:56.760 on your phone arm and you look at this. You know, 0:33:56.960 --> 0:33:59.200 people in places, Look who's on my people in places? 0:33:59.680 --> 0:34:05.479 They it's me, it's my daughter. And because I've just 0:34:05.520 --> 0:34:08.640 got I've got all these wonderful things where you can 0:34:08.680 --> 0:34:11.560 bring up you know they do, uh, the iPhone does 0:34:11.600 --> 0:34:15.719 the memories. Yeah, yeah, it's hundred with Dick Cheney with 0:34:15.920 --> 0:34:18.920 uplifting music behind there and then little seatements and he 0:34:19.000 --> 0:34:23.759 goes well the weapons around the music, and some of 0:34:23.760 --> 0:34:27.120 it is intermingled with my family Oh my god moments 0:34:27.160 --> 0:34:30.880 and all that iPhone has gone. Clearly this person is vital. 0:34:31.360 --> 0:34:33.960 I think he must thinks he's the granddad or something. 0:34:34.440 --> 0:34:36.320 He kill he's part of the family. So all of 0:34:36.360 --> 0:34:39.520 our family memories all have suddenly Dick Cheney coming into 0:34:39.520 --> 0:34:43.040 middle because they've got so many videos on here. I 0:34:43.080 --> 0:34:47.640 think you work on You're very watching photographs and all 0:34:47.680 --> 0:34:51.120 that that my phone misunderstands and thinks that obviously this 0:34:51.160 --> 0:34:55.120 man that's going to happen forever until let's you started 0:34:55.160 --> 0:34:58.120 leading those decide to delete and I haven't quite gotten 0:34:58.120 --> 0:35:04.240 me yet. Keep in mind, horrid I think to play that, yeah, 0:35:04.280 --> 0:35:07.000 you have to be yeah, yeah, I mean that's yeah, 0:35:07.080 --> 0:35:11.440 that's taking your work home. Um. I want to talk 0:35:11.480 --> 0:35:14.239 about Adams was just shooting style because as I've been saying, 0:35:14.239 --> 0:35:16.600 it seems like there's stuff in the trailer that's not 0:35:16.640 --> 0:35:18.320 in the movie. So it just seems like he's the 0:35:18.360 --> 0:35:20.440 kind of guy that shoots a lot of stuff and 0:35:20.480 --> 0:35:22.279 finds a lot of things in the editing. Maybe, but 0:35:23.040 --> 0:35:24.760 you know, you've obviously worked with him, and like before, 0:35:25.200 --> 0:35:27.640 what did you think about working with Adam on this one? Said, 0:35:27.719 --> 0:35:31.240 I had a great time. I'd heard about Adam's improvisational 0:35:31.400 --> 0:35:35.040 kind of alt stuff, and so I prepared some some stuff, 0:35:35.080 --> 0:35:39.040 you know, just in case, and I think I bombarded 0:35:39.080 --> 0:35:41.000 you the first day. It was some of those um 0:35:41.080 --> 0:35:44.359 but yeah, I thought it was really fun. I had 0:35:44.360 --> 0:35:46.319 a good time. I like the looseness of it. I 0:35:46.320 --> 0:35:50.480 thought it was really really cool. Yeah, how was it 0:35:50.520 --> 0:35:53.320 different this time? I guess or did it feel different? Um? 0:35:53.400 --> 0:35:59.919 Just more involving, you know, I mean, it's it's it's yeah, 0:36:00.080 --> 0:36:03.879 Adams got such an easy going where about him. It's 0:36:03.960 --> 0:36:07.120 such a good nature, even with all of the hours 0:36:07.160 --> 0:36:09.279 that you were mentioning and everything. You know, it's very 0:36:09.280 --> 0:36:13.080 often on films it's an intense environment and you know, 0:36:13.239 --> 0:36:16.520 sometimes you get attention and up and all that, and 0:36:16.600 --> 0:36:19.319 sometimes you sort of feel like, well that maybe that's 0:36:19.440 --> 0:36:22.520 needed because it happens so often on films, but because 0:36:22.520 --> 0:36:25.520 people care about what they're doing. But on Adam's sex 0:36:25.640 --> 0:36:30.520 it really never happens at all star and uh, and 0:36:30.600 --> 0:36:34.759 you still get this wonderful uh and the result um, 0:36:35.320 --> 0:36:38.640 and that really does come from the director. But in 0:36:38.760 --> 0:36:41.320 terms of like the improv, this was a whole different 0:36:41.560 --> 0:36:46.920 kettle of fish, because it's not just a matter of, oh, 0:36:47.000 --> 0:36:49.719 what are the sayings that the guy would have from 0:36:49.760 --> 0:36:54.919 the region he is from, what's his history there? Ummane. 0:36:55.040 --> 0:36:58.920 It's about understanding what his thoughts were on policy and 0:36:58.960 --> 0:37:01.239 what the policy was old and where it came from 0:37:01.239 --> 0:37:04.680 and what number it had. So my head was about 0:37:04.719 --> 0:37:07.719 to explode every day, not because of what was on 0:37:07.760 --> 0:37:10.480 the page, but because of what I had ready in 0:37:10.520 --> 0:37:13.880 my head in case anybody else decided to go off page, 0:37:13.880 --> 0:37:16.800 that I would be able to just go with it. 0:37:17.440 --> 0:37:20.760 So that was That was many hours of just staying 0:37:20.840 --> 0:37:23.480 up and reading and rereading and listening. Again was the 0:37:23.480 --> 0:37:25.759 big short like that though too, because you did you 0:37:26.000 --> 0:37:29.359 remind me so, because I was totally isolated, you know, 0:37:29.440 --> 0:37:31.560 because the nature of Michael Bury was that he was 0:37:31.600 --> 0:37:33.800 in an office all by himself. So I shot that 0:37:33.840 --> 0:37:37.279 whole thing in nine days, so and it was very 0:37:37.320 --> 0:37:41.960 much him by himself, and the luxury and the real 0:37:42.000 --> 0:37:44.160 pleasure of going and sitting with Michael for a whole 0:37:44.239 --> 0:37:46.399 day and talking with him, and so I had all 0:37:46.440 --> 0:37:48.960 of that, you know. Yeah, you know I didn't. I 0:37:49.000 --> 0:37:51.240 didn't get to go. Would you haven't taped your lines 0:37:51.320 --> 0:37:54.360 or have you ever done that thing kind of things? 0:37:55.040 --> 0:37:58.520 I've done that with people from areas with the correct 0:37:58.640 --> 0:38:01.080 dialect I had. Oh no, I did do it with 0:38:01.120 --> 0:38:03.680 the dick Yekman for the fire. Yeah, I had him 0:38:04.680 --> 0:38:07.000 read and it's the same aligns, you know, because you 0:38:07.080 --> 0:38:09.279 have no idea, you know, you never know. You might 0:38:09.280 --> 0:38:12.400 get a dialect, but then you've got the personal lydiosyncrasies 0:38:12.440 --> 0:38:15.040 where oh, Dicky, it says it actually like this, it's 0:38:15.080 --> 0:38:18.960 nothing like everyone else. So yeah, that was really helpful. 0:38:19.000 --> 0:38:21.359 And it also just helps break the eyes. It's nice 0:38:21.360 --> 0:38:24.280 to just you want to spend quantity time with people 0:38:25.120 --> 0:38:27.440 and and and and it's a nice way of just 0:38:27.560 --> 0:38:30.000 hanging out together without to think about, oh, what do 0:38:30.080 --> 0:38:37.600 we talk about now? It's just you know exactly. Yeah, 0:38:37.840 --> 0:38:39.440 time is getting away from me. I'm gonna okay, you 0:38:39.480 --> 0:38:42.200 guys lose. But before I let you go, there was 0:38:42.239 --> 0:38:44.560 one person that you I kind of wrote out a 0:38:44.600 --> 0:38:46.719 list of people that you've both worked with, you know, 0:38:46.800 --> 0:38:49.440 Ridley Scott McGee, Francis McDormand, but one person I really 0:38:49.440 --> 0:38:51.800 wanted to hear about from both of you, Sam Shepard. 0:38:52.320 --> 0:38:54.080 I worked with him on Jesse James Sam. You worked 0:38:54.080 --> 0:38:56.919 with him on Out of the Furnace Christians. So just 0:38:56.920 --> 0:38:59.200 such great memories. I'd I'd love to hear anything. The 0:38:59.239 --> 0:39:02.879 first time that we uh met, we just they done 0:39:02.920 --> 0:39:04.560 one of those weak things you know sometimes where they 0:39:05.600 --> 0:39:09.239 almost never sit in a chair on a film set, right, 0:39:09.239 --> 0:39:12.040 but we were filming out in a forest and they 0:39:12.080 --> 0:39:15.320 put Sam in my chair like about two hundred yards 0:39:15.400 --> 0:39:18.720 away from everybody else. So Sam and I found ourselves 0:39:18.800 --> 0:39:22.279 sitting there with nobody or else around. I just had 0:39:22.320 --> 0:39:26.560 the best discussion. He was just such a great conversations 0:39:27.160 --> 0:39:32.240 because we're funny and and I really what I regret 0:39:32.400 --> 0:39:35.640 is that he is that we didn't get together after 0:39:35.680 --> 0:39:38.000 because he had invited me down to that joint in 0:39:38.040 --> 0:39:43.799 Santa Fe. And and after, you know, sadly he passed that, 0:39:43.880 --> 0:39:46.720 I did find myself driving past it and I stopped 0:39:47.200 --> 0:39:50.040 and thought, man, I can't you know, you just think 0:39:50.080 --> 0:39:52.480 people are going to be around and you're gonna have 0:39:52.560 --> 0:39:55.319 more time. Particularly want to go and sit with him 0:39:55.320 --> 0:39:57.600 when we're not acting, you know, together. And he would 0:39:57.680 --> 0:40:01.640 laugh at me because we had such different aisles of approach, 0:40:01.760 --> 0:40:06.640 you know, and we can look at you, dude, go 0:40:06.760 --> 0:40:09.040 on the let's try that. I never I've never bothered 0:40:09.080 --> 0:40:12.240 that much. But he was just brilliant. He was somebody 0:40:12.320 --> 0:40:16.080 special and and and even though you know, I didn't 0:40:16.080 --> 0:40:18.680 know for life or for for many years, just a 0:40:18.680 --> 0:40:21.560 few months that we spent together, really miss him because 0:40:21.840 --> 0:40:26.280 I expected to know him for years to come. Yeah, 0:40:26.760 --> 0:40:29.440 how about you saying? Yeah, I felt that, Well, we 0:40:29.480 --> 0:40:31.399 all were on Jesse James that we were sort of 0:40:31.680 --> 0:40:34.160 going out one night. It was Garrett Della Hunt, Jeremy 0:40:34.160 --> 0:40:37.680 Renner and a bunch of us were gonna go go 0:40:37.800 --> 0:40:39.719 a night on the town and we were like, well, 0:40:39.800 --> 0:40:42.600 let's call Sam, you know, and and was like, well, 0:40:42.640 --> 0:40:44.399 you know, he's gonna maybe he justn't want to hang out. 0:40:44.400 --> 0:40:45.799 And I was like, now we should call him. You know, 0:40:45.840 --> 0:40:48.080 I think Paul snyders, let's call him. And he came 0:40:48.120 --> 0:40:49.680 out with us. We had a great night, you know, 0:40:49.719 --> 0:40:52.800 and I think I asked him about Full for Love, 0:40:52.840 --> 0:40:56.279 which I ended up doing, and um, he was just 0:40:56.360 --> 0:40:58.160 so cool on Full for Love. You know. I had 0:40:58.200 --> 0:40:59.920 to learn the last so really quick and I was 0:41:00.120 --> 0:41:02.960 terrible at it. And he was funny about it. He 0:41:03.000 --> 0:41:05.440 was like, well maybe you're a bull rider or something, 0:41:05.520 --> 0:41:09.120 you know, and then he said, um we we said 0:41:09.120 --> 0:41:11.799 do you want to do you want? He rewrites, I'm 0:41:11.840 --> 0:41:14.840 fool for Love? And he hit the most minimal stuff 0:41:14.880 --> 0:41:19.480 like he said, why don't you say, um, uh, just 0:41:19.600 --> 0:41:23.399 throwing goats, you know, just like little little things like that. 0:41:24.280 --> 0:41:26.160 He was just a cool guy. He just he he 0:41:26.200 --> 0:41:28.560 could tell you about would you mean throwing the wood? 0:41:29.000 --> 0:41:31.040 It was like there was there was like a diet 0:41:31.320 --> 0:41:33.800 some dialogue like comes stay with me and my my 0:41:33.800 --> 0:41:37.319 my ranch with this, this and this, and he just said, 0:41:37.360 --> 0:41:40.400 you know, like most playwrights would like change and entire 0:41:41.160 --> 0:41:43.120 scene or something, and he just he didn't. He just 0:41:43.160 --> 0:41:45.799 like tweaked a little bit. And he but he he 0:41:45.880 --> 0:41:49.200 just knew about all kinds of I just knew he 0:41:49.400 --> 0:41:53.120 would tell you about how they make cigars and hit 0:41:53.160 --> 0:41:55.680 all this weird kind of actual stuff. He was just 0:41:56.000 --> 0:42:00.400 he told me. He did. He told me how to 0:42:00.480 --> 0:42:03.040 do that, and he introduced me to Poppy Van Winkles. 0:42:03.680 --> 0:42:07.560 Ah that's a good reduction. Wow. Yeah, that's a good introduction. 0:42:07.880 --> 0:42:10.640 Well thanks for that. Uh, and go see the movie everyone, 0:42:10.719 --> 0:42:14.200 vice it opens Christmas Day holiday fund for the family. 0:42:14.239 --> 0:42:16.160 You should go check it out. It's I think it's 0:42:16.160 --> 0:42:17.640 one of the best movies of the year and you're 0:42:17.640 --> 0:42:19.759 both fantastic in it. So thank you again to both 0:42:19.760 --> 0:42:23.719 of you for coming back on the show. There you go, 0:42:24.080 --> 0:42:29.680 There you go. Thanks Thanks guys, Thanks a lot, Thanks 0:42:29.680 --> 0:42:45.839 a lot. Once again, this episode of Playback has been 0:42:45.840 --> 0:42:47.799 brought to you by Warner Brothers. A Star is born. 0:42:48.080 --> 0:42:50.239 As we talk about important films of this past year, 0:42:50.320 --> 0:42:52.800 this one is top of mind, emotionally resonating with critics 0:42:52.840 --> 0:42:55.719 and audiences, and the film's director, Bradley Cooper is being 0:42:55.719 --> 0:42:58.160 recognized for his brilliant work as a filmmaker and actor, 0:42:58.200 --> 0:43:00.600 along with his cast Lady Gaga and em Elliott for 0:43:00.600 --> 0:43:03.879 their stunning performances varieties. Film critic Owen Glieberman has called 0:43:03.880 --> 0:43:07.040 the film a total emotional knockout. In Los Angeles, Times 0:43:07.040 --> 0:43:09.920 critic Justin Chang said, from the first frame, it casts 0:43:09.960 --> 0:43:12.160 a spell, the kind that lets you know immediately that 0:43:12.200 --> 0:43:15.080 you're in good hands. A star is born for your 0:43:15.080 --> 0:43:16.640 consideration in all categories.