Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of Eating Whale Broke. Today we
Speaker 1: have special guests to Tavio Samuel Ceo Revolt TV, America's
Speaker 1: fastest growing black owned media company, and as we all
Speaker 1: already no, Revolt is owned by hip hop mogul Shawn
Speaker 1: Diddy Combs. The Tavio sits at the intersection of culture
Speaker 1: and content as one of corporate America's youngest executives. What
Speaker 1: do you have us eating today? Uh So, today we
Speaker 1: are eating a dish that my father, who I love dearly,
Speaker 1: passed away in February. Um. I didn't grow up in
Speaker 1: the same house with my father, but every time I
Speaker 1: would go there for the summer, he would have a
Speaker 1: special meal for me. He knew I loved omelets, and
Speaker 1: he knew I love seafood, and so he used to
Speaker 1: make seafood omelets. And so you know, we weren't balling.
Speaker 1: So it's imitation crab and uh, I've always been everybody
Speaker 1: got quirks. I have a quirk that's about hot sauce.
Speaker 1: I really put hot sauce on everything. So we have
Speaker 1: a seafood um lit with imitation crab. And of course
Speaker 1: you gotta have you're not from l a, but you
Speaker 1: value hot sauce. Oh yeah, yeah. My father is jare
Speaker 1: making Jamaican. My father is you're making. My best friend
Speaker 1: is jaremaking when I was telling your brother to Kanye
Speaker 1: West painting. Um, so, anyways, I've been eating hot stuff
Speaker 1: my whole life. Okay, okay, so you like ox tails
Speaker 1: and I do like oxtail, but I'm definitely more of
Speaker 1: like a jerk chicken jerk Sandman Brown's curry chicken. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: you're speaking my leg right. Maybe we should have made that. Yeah, yeah, no,
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure anything Jamaican doesn't fall into the broke
Speaker 1: Mama's making it. You know, I'm stretching it. Have you? Um?
Speaker 1: We would literally go have you? Have you spent a
Speaker 1: lot of time in Jamaica. I haven't been yet. I'm
Speaker 1: winning from my you know, bank accounts to grow up
Speaker 1: a little bit. One day we'll go we will go
Speaker 1: um to dun Riverfall and go crawfish hunting. We let
Speaker 1: it going still again, you could do it, broke. We
Speaker 1: go with the little gun that was made of sticks,
Speaker 1: and we capture them with our hands or shoot them
Speaker 1: with crawfish guns, and then come home and cook them. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: you can do Jamaican fruit broke to what's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1: So do you want to go ahead and cook off
Speaker 1: this thish? Yeah, so I'm gonna do it, but really
Speaker 1: full transparency. We're gonna see how me talking and cooking goes.
Speaker 1: But you know, I think you got My family came
Speaker 1: to the States as on that side, on first generation
Speaker 1: American born, and Um, they used to work for white
Speaker 1: people right in their houses, cooking and cleaning. I said
Speaker 1: all that to say that they were expert cooks. So
Speaker 1: I had great teachers. I probably haven't cooked this dish
Speaker 1: probably twenty years. Do you cook at home? I do not.
Speaker 1: Oh so you're one of those orders. Um, one of
Speaker 1: those orders. I ran out of time. I can tell you.
Speaker 1: I used to cook at home all of the time,
Speaker 1: and in two thousand and seven I took over the
Speaker 1: Walmart account. I was running a creative agency, took over
Speaker 1: the Walmight account. I have not cooked every day since then. Life.
Speaker 1: It's just been too busy and too crazy as an executive.
Speaker 1: As an executive, I definitely don't feel like I have
Speaker 1: time to cook. So what are the ingredients for the
Speaker 1: dish today? Okay, so butter just because you gotta make
Speaker 1: sure that the eggs don't stick to the bottom of
Speaker 1: the pan. We got a couple of eggs, and then
Speaker 1: we're just gonna throw imitation crab on it. You know,
Speaker 1: people could do salt and pepper and cheese however you
Speaker 1: want to do it. But that's what we got today.
Speaker 1: And then we got Louisiana, which you'll be able to use.
Speaker 1: I'm not putting it in there. You're gonna be able
Speaker 1: to use it. Oh yeah, because I just I just
Speaker 1: recently did an episode with a Haitian person and they
Speaker 1: had this stuff called Pickley's and I almost died on
Speaker 1: while we were doing it. I couldn't breathe. It's gonna
Speaker 1: be deal With's choice, alright, So this one is this one? Right,
Speaker 1: It's totally electric. Put your hand on it. Thank you
Speaker 1: for that. I feel like we're missing some stuff, like
Speaker 1: some salt and pepper for you. Yes, you know when
Speaker 1: I what I was really excited about getting you on
Speaker 1: the show. I've been asking about you for about three months,
Speaker 1: I want to say three or four months, and uh,
Speaker 1: I was really happy to see that you accepted the
Speaker 1: opportunity to come. But I was a little nervous because
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, he's an executive, he went from Stanford,
Speaker 1: you know, he's you know. And then you had your
Speaker 1: request about your question about Starbucks and MACHOs, and I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, no, no, no, he's gonna come into
Speaker 1: the studio and you know he's gonna be in for
Speaker 1: brute awakening because you know he may he may have
Speaker 1: arrived and changed or switched up. But you've been nothing
Speaker 1: but cool since you came in. So I gotta ask you,
Speaker 1: when was the last time you actually ate this dish? Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's been a long time. I had. The answer is
Speaker 1: I haven't eaten it since my father cooked it for me.
Speaker 1: And I'd be shocked if he's cooked it for me
Speaker 1: within the last ten years. So it's definitely been some time. Definitely.
Speaker 1: So take me all the way back, because I don't
Speaker 1: know how you get to a c suite position of
Speaker 1: the old TV coming from brokenness and I'm imagining, like
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be extreme levels of inspired and I'm gonna
Speaker 1: talk about you all week, So I want to go
Speaker 1: back to the origination. We could start anywhere around the
Speaker 1: point of this dish copy. Um, okay, so let me
Speaker 1: think about it all right. I grew up in Denver, Colorado,
Speaker 1: in the town called mom Bello. Mam Bello isn't all
Speaker 1: black mostly black. I remember my classes where probably they
Speaker 1: felt like they were ninety eight percent black and brown.
Speaker 1: There was two white people in my class, and I
Speaker 1: still remember their names, Sarah Cannolson Paula, and I have
Speaker 1: a terrible memory, so the fact that I remember them
Speaker 1: just goes to show. It was like two um long
Speaker 1: story short. My brother gets ready to graduate from high school.
Speaker 1: He's on his way to college, and I went to
Speaker 1: go visit a friend of mine and on the way home,
Speaker 1: I'm riding my bike. My bike tires pop and I
Speaker 1: end up having to walk my bike home. I get
Speaker 1: jumped by a couple of crips on the way home.
Speaker 1: I literally think that they are going to take my life.
Speaker 1: I remember like a four by four and they're like,
Speaker 1: go get that four by four out out the grass
Speaker 1: and I ran and my brother's, uh, my brother's best
Speaker 1: friend was like two blocks down and I run with
Speaker 1: all my might get to the door. I'm knocking and
Speaker 1: knocking waiting for someone to come. No one comes. I
Speaker 1: turned around like, oh, it's about to be a no
Speaker 1: one is there, and uh, I thank god. I run home.
Speaker 1: I'm in tears. My mom sends me to my father's
Speaker 1: house for the summer, and when I come back, I'm
Speaker 1: in the suburbs. Um. Now that I'm in the suburbs,
Speaker 1: my life is completely different. Um. The environment is different,
Speaker 1: the quality of education is different. And that's when I
Speaker 1: learned the power of your environment and the power of education.
Speaker 1: And so with that, you know, I'm playing sports. My grades,
Speaker 1: I wasn't getting in talented, but my grades were going
Speaker 1: from aids two these two sees two these. Now that
Speaker 1: I'm in the suburbs, I'm back to being in a
Speaker 1: student You don't think it was the fact that you
Speaker 1: were under your dad's rain. You think it was just
Speaker 1: the environment. I'm not trying to take away from mom
Speaker 1: or da with my dad for three months. Man. She
Speaker 1: sent me there for three months for the summer, and
Speaker 1: then when I came back, I was in a whole
Speaker 1: different school and a whole different environment. For that, I've
Speaker 1: always given my mom all the credit and all the love,
Speaker 1: because with other sacrifices she made to make that happen
Speaker 1: were the ones that fundamentally changed my life. Um, and
Speaker 1: so grateful for her and all that she's ever done,
Speaker 1: and so in that. Now I'm in school in the suburbs. Uh,
Speaker 1: let's see. I end up doing very well on my
Speaker 1: P S A T s UM. With that, I get
Speaker 1: into probably twenty schools. Because we were broke, I didn't
Speaker 1: apply to any of them. The only schools I didn't
Speaker 1: get into are the ones that made me pay. Who
Speaker 1: made me pay? So I can call him out right now.
Speaker 1: Georgetown tried to make me pay. Yep, Nope, that was
Speaker 1: a problem. You want to put this in this bowl? Uh?
Speaker 1: Do you see schools? My dream school was, you see
Speaker 1: San Diego. I was actually rapping at the time. I
Speaker 1: can ramble f y, I said, you just don't have
Speaker 1: to tell me what you're talking O. Um. I was
Speaker 1: rapping at the time. We were recording in Lahoya, California,
Speaker 1: and I fell in love with San Diego. To San
Speaker 1: Diego became the school I wanted to go to anyway,
Speaker 1: did you see? Schools wouldn't let me in without paying,
Speaker 1: and we didn't have the money to pay, so I
Speaker 1: didn't do it. How do the schools I get into?
Speaker 1: I decided my top four where Seaton Hall More House,
Speaker 1: Emory and Duke. Never went to Seaton Hall, crossed that
Speaker 1: off the list. UM went to see Emery, went to
Speaker 1: see more House, and then when I stepped on Duke,
Speaker 1: it was like, Yeah, the skies opened up. The sunshine
Speaker 1: guy said this is where you're supposed to be. UM.
Speaker 1: So I ended up going to Duke University. Best decision
Speaker 1: I could have ever made in my life. Do you
Speaker 1: think that is what made your trajectory to where you're
Speaker 1: at now? Without question? I didn't know at the time
Speaker 1: the Duke was as good of a school as it was. UM.
Speaker 1: Neither one of my parents stressed me about college school.
Speaker 1: They knew I was gonna go. I was a good student,
Speaker 1: and so they just kind of let me be. When
Speaker 1: I get in the Duke, the first month US news
Speaker 1: and reports come out with the number three school in
Speaker 1: the nation, I'm blown away. I'm like, how on earth
Speaker 1: the number three school in the nations? UM, with that
Speaker 1: probably make the next second best decision I've ever made,
Speaker 1: The next best decision ever made, which is I decide
Speaker 1: the pleasure of fraternity cap out aside and one. I'm
Speaker 1: a huge believer in Kappa as an organization, but there's
Speaker 1: something that is so special about the chapter of men
Speaker 1: that I became fraternal with, and they become they became
Speaker 1: my brothers, my coaches, my mentors, my advisors, and so
Speaker 1: through them, you know, none of my parents had done business,
Speaker 1: none of my parents had done anything that I'm doing.
Speaker 1: But through Kappa, I now have people who maybe five
Speaker 1: years ahead of me, but they can guide me and
Speaker 1: coach me. Um. So anyways, have a phenomenal run a
Speaker 1: duke mostly party and step shows. Uh uh, enjoying life
Speaker 1: and let's see what's the next big moment that happens.
Speaker 1: The next big moment for me a second semester senior year,
Speaker 1: two big things happened in my life. Um. One, I
Speaker 1: take a marketing course, and throughout all of my time,
Speaker 1: I was always relatively good at school. Um Honestly, even
Speaker 1: if dude like I never bought books, I could show
Speaker 1: up at class. I only went to school on like
Speaker 1: Tuesdays and Thursdays and get a B plus right left
Speaker 1: with the three three, but did very little work. Again, party,
Speaker 1: step shows, all those things. So you're like a fast learner. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you can say. I used to say I'm not smart,
Speaker 1: but I'm bright, Like I could pick things up relatively quickly,
Speaker 1: sit in the classroom and listen to the teacher. Pick
Speaker 1: it up and be good. When I took this marketing course,
Speaker 1: it was the first time, like my soul had ever
Speaker 1: been lit on fire for a subject. I wanted to
Speaker 1: know everything about marketing. The mental acrobatics it takes to
Speaker 1: get someone to want something by something that they didn't
Speaker 1: know they wanted was so intriguing to me. I discovered
Speaker 1: this career called advert rising. Um. So, anyways, at that
Speaker 1: point in time, I decide I want to be a CMO.
Speaker 1: Most cmos. CMO is a chief marketing officer, thank you.
Speaker 1: Chief marketing officer most cmos UM went to business school
Speaker 1: and had NBA's and so I started saying, oh, I
Speaker 1: gotta go get my m b A. So let me
Speaker 1: pause there really quickly before Let's see January of that
Speaker 1: same year. So this is while I'm in that class,
Speaker 1: we get in this massive fight Mr. Kappa's versus Alpha's.
Speaker 1: Me and my boy kind of get into it with
Speaker 1: some guys in the party. It turns out to be
Speaker 1: this massive fight all across Dukes what's what's called West
Speaker 1: Campus their main campus. UM, I don't know what it
Speaker 1: was thirty on thirty it was crazy. Cops come from everywhere,
Speaker 1: maze it was horrible again. Um on the way home,
Speaker 1: I'm so frustrated with the way the police had handled
Speaker 1: the situation. I was the president of n PHC, which
Speaker 1: is the National Paneltic Group, meaning all the lot of
Speaker 1: Greek organizations. I was frustrated that they had led a
Speaker 1: group that the issue wasn't the ouphice on my campus,
Speaker 1: if the alpice came from another campus. I was frustrated
Speaker 1: that they had let this happen with these people and
Speaker 1: that they were taking it out on us. So I
Speaker 1: go and I have one of my line brothers take
Speaker 1: me to the police station. I go into the police
Speaker 1: station and say, look, it's my senior year. I don't
Speaker 1: want any beef. I just want to put something on
Speaker 1: record so that me and the police get into it again.
Speaker 1: We have a record that there's been previous interactions. They
Speaker 1: never take my report. They end up delivering a bunch
Speaker 1: of paperwork which ends up being felonies and missing was
Speaker 1: inciting a riot, resisting arrest, refusing to disperse. Right, So,
Speaker 1: my senior year, the two things that are happening is
Speaker 1: I have both found something that has set my soul
Speaker 1: on fire and I want to do And I'm at
Speaker 1: the same time fighting for my life in my career
Speaker 1: while at Duke because of the citations they gave me.
Speaker 1: I'm not only finding it at Duke, but I'm fighting
Speaker 1: it in Durham. So I end up fighting to stay
Speaker 1: at Duke so I can graduate. Um. The reason I
Speaker 1: graduated and was able to do that is because again
Speaker 1: my chapter Kareem Cook Um big Bros. Came in, talked
Speaker 1: to the police, work with Duke, and ended up saving
Speaker 1: my career. So I ended up graduating from Duke and
Speaker 1: at the same time I couldn't do the same thing
Speaker 1: on the Duham side. Did you want to put that
Speaker 1: up before you put it? I don't really know what
Speaker 1: you're thinking. I think you should. I'm trying. I'm trying
Speaker 1: to cook and talk. You know, I ain't never had
Speaker 1: to cook, talk and beyond camera. And it's a long story.
Speaker 1: I can cut this story short. I tell you I
Speaker 1: can ramble long story short. Um. They saved me. UM.
Speaker 1: I end up pleading no contest at that and Dunham,
Speaker 1: and so I end up getting like a hundred hours
Speaker 1: of community service UM and get out of it. The
Speaker 1: key piece there's I'm applying to jobs with the record
Speaker 1: um in two thousand and two, which was like a recession,
Speaker 1: which made it incredibly difficult to get work, incredibly difficult
Speaker 1: to get a job. Um My whole time I was
Speaker 1: at Duke, I worked at Fuqual School of Business. That's
Speaker 1: an incredible black woman, Liz Riley, who was the head
Speaker 1: of admissions there, Sharon Thompson her number two. They give
Speaker 1: me a job and a career management center. So my
Speaker 1: first job by the college is working at the career
Speaker 1: management center. Just go ahead, sorry, but I'm just curious.
Speaker 1: When all this was going on with with the with
Speaker 1: them putting felonies and all this stuff, was there a
Speaker 1: part of you that felt like quitting or were you emotional?
Speaker 1: Like I would love to know what your state of
Speaker 1: being was. Yeah, it was incredibly difficult. But and I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna tell somebody else's story, but it just so
Speaker 1: happened that one of my other fraternity brothers, who was
Speaker 1: one of my best friends, was also in trouble with
Speaker 1: the police, and so we were going through it at
Speaker 1: the same time, and we were roommates, and so the
Speaker 1: benefit that I had was that I was not doing
Speaker 1: it on my own. It was he and I were
Speaker 1: both fighting for our lives at the same time, which
Speaker 1: is one of the reasons why we are as close
Speaker 1: as we are today. Do you feel like, and I
Speaker 1: don't want to get too far off, but do you
Speaker 1: feel like it makes you look at the police a
Speaker 1: certain way or do you have an emotional side to that,
Speaker 1: because that could have that could have you know, transitioned
Speaker 1: your life into a completely different direction, like they didn't
Speaker 1: even realize the damage that they were about to cause
Speaker 1: for something that's going to Duke, you know, sure, Um, yes,
Speaker 1: but I don't know if there's any different than what
Speaker 1: I think any other you know, black male, black female
Speaker 1: kind of deals with you know what I mean. I
Speaker 1: think we all so many of us have our own stories,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Um, but yeah, of course,
Speaker 1: Um it was impactful and impactful for the rest of
Speaker 1: my life. Um. How's that looking now that you don't
Speaker 1: have to cut it up? And that looks good? I'm
Speaker 1: trying to help you. You know what, though, So you
Speaker 1: you graduate from Duke, graduate from Duke, you you continue
Speaker 1: on at Stanford. Well, I end up working at the
Speaker 1: Career Management Center Duke for two years, apply to business school,
Speaker 1: end up getting in the Stanford, which is a blessing.
Speaker 1: Did you have to pay for it? Yeah? Yeah, Stanford
Speaker 1: was two years, a hundred and twenty five dollars. You
Speaker 1: still all the money? Yeah? When I graduated from Duke
Speaker 1: and Stanford collectively over a hundred and fifty thousand dollars
Speaker 1: and student loan debt. Do you think it was worth that?
Speaker 1: I have to ask do you think it was worth
Speaker 1: the every penning? Okay? And why do you say it
Speaker 1: was worth every pang? When I was working in a
Speaker 1: career management center Duke, I was making twenty nine thousand
Speaker 1: dollars a year. When I come out of Stanford working
Speaker 1: at Johnson and Johnson, I'm making nine and that's your start.
Speaker 1: I tripled my salary in two years, okay, um, And
Speaker 1: then it's just the symbols, right. So as I'm applying
Speaker 1: for jobs to get out of Stanford, people are saying
Speaker 1: to me, it's just different. You know, if you don't
Speaker 1: know what it's like until you're on the other side.
Speaker 1: But people are saying, from the top banks and from
Speaker 1: the top consulting companies, clearly you can do the job.
Speaker 1: We just need to make sure your cultural fit. I
Speaker 1: couldn't do the job I've been working in a career management.
Speaker 1: What are they basing it on the name symbols? Symbols
Speaker 1: opened up so many doors for me and continue to
Speaker 1: open up doors for me. So because of that, without question,
Speaker 1: is worth it. Yeah, I always feel like when when
Speaker 1: at least, I mean, I'm a college dropout, but I
Speaker 1: used to always I'm not I'm not saying it's a
Speaker 1: good thing, but but I used to always say that
Speaker 1: if I went to school, I would only want to
Speaker 1: go to an Ivy League school because I knew that
Speaker 1: my peers that went to that school came from one
Speaker 1: economic different economic background, and I knew that their roller
Speaker 1: decks alone in that relationship alone would help me get
Speaker 1: to where I want to be. Unfortunately, you know, I
Speaker 1: didn't have like the academia to support it, but you
Speaker 1: know it was, you know, in my next lifetime, like
Speaker 1: that would be a dream of mine, but I I
Speaker 1: didn't get to get the opportunity. So it's cool to
Speaker 1: see here you say that that played a huge role,
Speaker 1: didn't help you in any way get to some of
Speaker 1: your more I would say, you're like when you were
Speaker 1: at I one, then you were the president. You were
Speaker 1: the president? Correct? Did any of those relationships help you
Speaker 1: get there? Or was it just the Stanford? So what
Speaker 1: I say is, so I'm at I'm gonna go the
Speaker 1: job before I won. So I'm at Johnson and Johnson
Speaker 1: doing global marketing, I decide I want to do advertising.
Speaker 1: It just so happens that one of my fraternity brothers
Speaker 1: from Duke works at the number one black owned multicultural
Speaker 1: agency in the nation, and they were looking for someone
Speaker 1: who had an MBA in my skill set. And so
Speaker 1: the whole reason I get my next job at Global
Speaker 1: HU is because I went to undergrad. Literally the guy
Speaker 1: pledged me um and so that's how I end up
Speaker 1: getting the job. While I'm there, I get promoted every
Speaker 1: year for probably six seven years in a row um.
Speaker 1: And so that's how kind of my ascent really happens
Speaker 1: kind of quickly. So by the time I meet Cathy
Speaker 1: Hughes and Alfred liggn Is an interactive one, I was
Speaker 1: already a president, and so they hired me on as
Speaker 1: a president. You're young at that point, why don't you
Speaker 1: like it? Became my first president at thirty, I probably
Speaker 1: became president of thirty and then I went to work
Speaker 1: for Cathy Hughes, I think when I was thirty three,
Speaker 1: And if you don't mind me asking, like what would
Speaker 1: a salary of a president be at that age? Like
Speaker 1: your thirty year you done me to tell people that
Speaker 1: I was making Okay, I mean I'm trying to We're
Speaker 1: trying to get the skinny you know, inspirers, inspir Okay.
Speaker 1: So um, I came out of Stanford making ninety five
Speaker 1: By the time I left Global Hue, I was making
Speaker 1: four and twenty five thousand dollars in salary. You hit
Speaker 1: that I need to were policy to broken up college
Speaker 1: degree right now. It's hard to get into Stanford after
Speaker 1: Like if I wanted to go right now, I couldn't,
Speaker 1: right because there's like too much real world experience, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you have to do more of like an executive program.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, I heard about that because I remember
Speaker 1: one time I tried to get into Harvard. Like don't
Speaker 1: ask me why I tried, but hey, I wasn't gonna
Speaker 1: shume my shot. But they had said, like if you
Speaker 1: were an entrepreneur for a certain amount of years, you
Speaker 1: could only get into the executive program. Yeah, like the
Speaker 1: daytime program is usually for people who have been out
Speaker 1: of school four years, like four years of the average,
Speaker 1: so call it to the six So as long as
Speaker 1: you've been working more than six and you probably, but
Speaker 1: it doesn't give you the same credibility as someone like you, right,
Speaker 1: I think it gives you the credibility. I think what
Speaker 1: you miss is that point that you were talking earlier about,
Speaker 1: like the importance of the network. And so when you're
Speaker 1: in school every day with these folks for two years,
Speaker 1: I think I think it's different than when you see
Speaker 1: each other only on the weekends. Right, And at Stanford,
Speaker 1: like there was just this belief that we were all
Speaker 1: gonna win. And um literally I would walk into finals
Speaker 1: and my classmates would be handing out notes saying, oh,
Speaker 1: I made notes that they're gonna help us all crush
Speaker 1: the test and they pass it out to you. When
Speaker 1: you walked into there was no like, there was no competition.
Speaker 1: Was the Blacks or was this a monst all? The
Speaker 1: way Stanford moved? It was the way Stanford Business School moved.
Speaker 1: And now I don't know how the real the other
Speaker 1: schools do it, but I can't imagine. Wow, what an
Speaker 1: experience you maybe want to go to school. So you're thirty,
Speaker 1: you're you're clearing that much money, Which that's all Don Coleman.
Speaker 1: So again Don Coleman for Don Coleman, Alan Pugh, Rob Chavis,
Speaker 1: Civil Chavis promoted me every year for six or seven years.
Speaker 1: And I remember, and I give Don Coleman so much credit.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I might have been making to fifty
Speaker 1: a year and I was running the Detroit office and
Speaker 1: I want in Detroit. Yeah, you were living like a
Speaker 1: real I can only imagine what you were doing in Detroit.
Speaker 1: You were walking, were you flossy or were you just regularly? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I've always been the same this this Detroit is crazy.
Speaker 1: To make that much money in Detroit, yeah, I wouldn't
Speaker 1: be like a real boss. Yeah it was great. Did
Speaker 1: you want to buy a whole couple of blocks? Like
Speaker 1: you know, I'll take this block. Don't worry about these
Speaker 1: buildings just because anywhere you can buy a bunch of
Speaker 1: blocks is not somewhere where you want to live. You
Speaker 1: can do it. We are you in Detroit for seven years? Wow?
Speaker 1: So do you still go back and visit? I do
Speaker 1: I still have property there? You still have friends there?
Speaker 1: Why am I not surprised. How much property do you have?
Speaker 1: Just one? There's a In two thousand and seven they
Speaker 1: opened up a Western Book Cadillac. It had been used
Speaker 1: to be one of the tallest buildings I think in
Speaker 1: Detroit are definitely in the us UM and had been
Speaker 1: dilapidated for twenty thirty years. They brought it back and
Speaker 1: they had a Western hotel in the bottom and condos
Speaker 1: at the top. So you have a you have a
Speaker 1: place in downtown Detroit down Do you know how much
Speaker 1: of the value is in downtown Detroit right now on
Speaker 1: the market right now, if anybody wants to buy, anybody
Speaker 1: wants to buy, Downtown Detroit is very, very pricing now
Speaker 1: it's it's it can give Kelly a run for its
Speaker 1: money right now. That property has at least I mean
Speaker 1: at one point in time, and they doubled in price.
Speaker 1: It's kind of come down a little bit since COVID,
Speaker 1: but now it's still it's still like I want to
Speaker 1: check that out. And I'll tell you, um walk into
Speaker 1: the New York office one time and Don Coleman hands
Speaker 1: me an envelope, like, what's this hands man envelope? I
Speaker 1: opened it up. Your new salary. Fo. I don't think
Speaker 1: I ever made a salary with a three in it
Speaker 1: like this black man just knew and believed in me
Speaker 1: so much that he almost doubled my salary um without
Speaker 1: me even asking. All right, so that's why you gotta
Speaker 1: work for black folks. No, I mean, look, did you
Speaker 1: purposely choose to work for black folks or did you?
Speaker 1: Oh you did? It was a choice, it was. It
Speaker 1: wasn't conscious before. But look, here's the difference. I'm at
Speaker 1: Johnson and Johnson, and um, they won't promote me. And
Speaker 1: when I asked my boss why they won't promote me,
Speaker 1: he tells me, I can't even tell you because if
Speaker 1: you the reasons they don't want to promote you are
Speaker 1: the same reasons you're great, and I don't want to
Speaker 1: dem your life. And so that told me who I
Speaker 1: am doesn't work in this space. Right. Um? So then
Speaker 1: as as global he was recruiting me, I'm now walking
Speaker 1: into an advertising agency in Detroit that feel like Boomerang.
Speaker 1: It ain't nothing but twenty five year old, twenty six
Speaker 1: year old black, brown yellow like you on the black side.
Speaker 1: They pop in jay Z and Notorious b I G.
Speaker 1: You move over to the Latin next side, they saw
Speaker 1: some like it was just such an energy and um,
Speaker 1: when you compare that to the corporate world, it was like, oh,
Speaker 1: this is where I'm supposed to be. And then from
Speaker 1: that day on, I worked at black owned company since
Speaker 1: two thousand and seven. So where does revolt in yep? Um?
Speaker 1: So my father dies February uh, COVID hits March of
Speaker 1: um uh. And at that point in time, I was
Speaker 1: in final rounds with Revolts. So I don't know if
Speaker 1: you want to go backwards, but um, I end up
Speaker 1: getting the offer in April of um decide to make
Speaker 1: the jump and start working there jume, which is right
Speaker 1: after George Florid passed. Wow, and where were you living
Speaker 1: at the time, in New York York And then to
Speaker 1: work for a revolt you had to move to l A.
Speaker 1: I did, but didn't meaning it was right now, No,
Speaker 1: but it was COVID, so nobody cared where you lived, right,
Speaker 1: But it was COVID in New York, and New York
Speaker 1: was terrible, like it was the hot spot ambulances going on.
Speaker 1: Like whenever I meet people who like, don't believe COVID
Speaker 1: was was a real thing. I'm like, where were you living?
Speaker 1: Because where I was living in wasdies everywhere right there
Speaker 1: had bodies stacked up by her, exact bodies. They had
Speaker 1: eighteen wheelers, like it was crazy. And so for me,
Speaker 1: it was just like, why am I here revolts in
Speaker 1: l A. At some point in time, I'm going to
Speaker 1: have to be in l A. L A is probably
Speaker 1: gonna be a much healthier place for me, and so
Speaker 1: I chose to make the move, and definitely one of
Speaker 1: the best decisions I made. Yeah, much healthier than I
Speaker 1: would have been staying in New York. Really, I missed
Speaker 1: the Chinese food of Org okay, and the pizza. To
Speaker 1: be honest, I do like when my brother, my brother
Speaker 1: flies in, I'm like, brings some eggirls, girls and like
Speaker 1: just bring up and I'm like, throw me a bag
Speaker 1: of egg rolls, and I'm like, yeah, I haven't been
Speaker 1: being on Chinese food. And I love New York pizza.
Speaker 1: Yeah there's nothing like it. Even the ones in l
Speaker 1: A that called themselves New York Pizza ain't quite right.
Speaker 1: So I know we're sortm time, So we're gonna have
Speaker 1: to split this omelets and then um uh, look, first
Speaker 1: of all, can I get halfway credit for making a
Speaker 1: decent looking I'm like, while talking, I know I went
Speaker 1: on a long story, but it's because I was multitask.
Speaker 1: It looks very good. I'm very proud of you. Thank you,
Speaker 1: qu Um. I haven't had imitation. The last time I
Speaker 1: had imitation crab meat was so long ago. I remember
Speaker 1: when I was young. I loved the taste of it,
Speaker 1: and I begged my dad to buy me a bag
Speaker 1: of imitation crabby that calls the scene and he was like, Okay,
Speaker 1: if I buy it, you gotta eat the whole thing.
Speaker 1: Tonight was like, sure, no problem dead And let's just
Speaker 1: say I never liked imitation crappy, Okay, Like to this day,
Speaker 1: I fear it because, well, we're about to see how
Speaker 1: We're about to see if we can change that anxious
Speaker 1: amount of hot sauce. Yeah. I hope you can make
Speaker 1: it through because I've seen people on the show do
Speaker 1: what you just did and drown it in hot sauce
Speaker 1: and then they end up choking. You don't even you
Speaker 1: don't even know this that I did it, okay, because
Speaker 1: for the for everyone that's listening, he he bathed it
Speaker 1: in hot sauce. So it looks I can't believe that
Speaker 1: looks red. It looks like it's a bloody omelet. I
Speaker 1: can't believe You've got me to tell people my salary. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's good. You know what I feel like, you know,
Speaker 1: I'm I'm thirty, I'm thirty eight. Um, I can honestly
Speaker 1: say I've never seen that type of money, you know,
Speaker 1: manifest Manifest. Who knows, maybe one day, but I think
Speaker 1: it's an incredible feat When you come from humble beginnings.
Speaker 1: And we've talked before taping about like, you know, when
Speaker 1: you come from humble beginnings, do you ever feel like
Speaker 1: an imposture? Do you ever feel like when is the
Speaker 1: gig up? And for me, I faced that every day.
Speaker 1: Maybe that's why don't move in the same circles. Plus
Speaker 1: it's very hard for me to have the network that
Speaker 1: you know, I didn't go to school, so I have
Speaker 1: a couple of entrepreneur friends that do very well. Um,
Speaker 1: but every time I do something, I still have that
Speaker 1: little person that's like, you know, when is it? When
Speaker 1: is the when am I going to be exposed for this?
Speaker 1: You know, fraudulent somehow miracle opportunity that happens, you know,
Speaker 1: what's crazy is um. Imposter syndrome is something that minorities,
Speaker 1: women typically marginalized people face, right, and we'll tell each
Speaker 1: other we gotta fake it till you make it. Um
Speaker 1: the crazy pieces. M Oftentimes our counterparts are white counterparts
Speaker 1: who may be less quality, fied, have less hustle, never
Speaker 1: have that feeling, you know what I mean, And so um,
Speaker 1: it's only in our culture, and it's only in our
Speaker 1: world where we feel like, um, hey, we believe that
Speaker 1: the world is a meritocracy and if we didn't earn
Speaker 1: that specific thing, then we're not ready. So many people
Speaker 1: are handed opportunities because of privilege, and they never feel
Speaker 1: like we do, you know what I mean. So for me,
Speaker 1: it's up to us to fake it till we make it,
Speaker 1: find our way to get past that hurdle so that
Speaker 1: we can actually be who the heck we're supposed to be. Yeah,
Speaker 1: when I look at people like Kanye or Kye or
Speaker 1: anyone that's making it or painting the world that they
Speaker 1: feel that they should be living in, I have so
Speaker 1: much admiration because it takes a certain level of confidence.
Speaker 1: I know some people say that Kanye has mental health
Speaker 1: issues or what have you. I personally don't feel like
Speaker 1: he has mental health. I just think he's borderline genius.
Speaker 1: And I say that because I remember years and years
Speaker 1: ago I went to an album released party of his
Speaker 1: and he was like interning to learn fashion, and everyone
Speaker 1: in the crowd couldn't make sense of anything he's talking about.
Speaker 1: And I was like, you know what, I just think
Speaker 1: he's a little too smart for everybody right now, you know.
Speaker 1: And but I think there's a certain level of confidence,
Speaker 1: Like when you look at Ditty and you look at
Speaker 1: all these people, it's like they had a level of
Speaker 1: I tell people like, I'm a little crazy. I'm crazy
Speaker 1: because I believe that I can take some crazy idea
Speaker 1: of mine and bring it to life. You know, that's exactly.
Speaker 1: But um, but when I see them, they don't seem
Speaker 1: to show that level of fear like that. I internally
Speaker 1: had the imposters, which is the first time I've ever
Speaker 1: heard that term. Um, but you you've never experienced every promotion,
Speaker 1: every new job. Um, it's gonna come again. You just
Speaker 1: gotta fake it till you make it. You gotta push past.
Speaker 1: That's my belief. I also just believe, as a man
Speaker 1: of God who's very much into my faith that life
Speaker 1: is so much about the faith walk. And so while
Speaker 1: I may feel this way, if I believe I was
Speaker 1: called to do something else, then I just have to
Speaker 1: have the faith to keep walking. And so for me,
Speaker 1: it's okay to have them. Here's what I want to say.
Speaker 1: Emotions are data, not directions. And so you might feel
Speaker 1: like you aren't capable, you might feel like you're not qualified,
Speaker 1: but that's not necessary. Those just emotions. Emotions are data,
Speaker 1: not directions, not directions. I like that. I like that.
Speaker 1: So do you have a fun um sy uh? Oh?
Speaker 1: My ditty stories are fun um. But here's what I'll
Speaker 1: tell you. Here's what I'll tell you about. What's really
Speaker 1: amazing about working UM with Shaun comes Um our chairman
Speaker 1: one Um. Like everything that you're just talking about imposter syndrome,
Speaker 1: Like you can't work for him and have that He
Speaker 1: makes you feel like you can run through every single wall,
Speaker 1: no matter if it's made of concrete, titanium, no matter
Speaker 1: what it is. When you deal with a man like
Speaker 1: Shaan Komb, he only operates in magnitude right. He wants
Speaker 1: to be the first. The biggest about everything that you
Speaker 1: see about him is true, and so he pushes you
Speaker 1: to dream the impossible, but then he puts the battery
Speaker 1: in your back to go get it. And um, that
Speaker 1: is such a special and an amazing feeling. And then
Speaker 1: the other thing that I think, um, that Sean Combs
Speaker 1: has done for me is like permission to not only
Speaker 1: be fearless, but to be like my authentic self, Permission
Speaker 1: to be bold, permission to be courageous. Um. So much
Speaker 1: of what I do right now is um standing in
Speaker 1: our marketplace, championing black culture, championing black people, and it's
Speaker 1: and the reason I'm able to do that is because
Speaker 1: there is a earthly king on top who is pushing
Speaker 1: me to do it every single day and to do
Speaker 1: it in a way that is authentic to myself and
Speaker 1: in a way that is authentic to the culture. And
Speaker 1: that is such a special, special thing. So I'm grateful.
Speaker 1: This is, you know, again, one of the best decisions
Speaker 1: I would have ever made in my life. Um, working
Speaker 1: for Shaan Combs, and um, yeah, he's a unique He's
Speaker 1: a unique leader, creative, visionary, icon, all those things. Um,
Speaker 1: what he does for me personally is really really special.
Speaker 1: And as CEO of a media empire and I've asked
Speaker 1: you off golf camera, off recording. UM, I feel like
Speaker 1: there's there's an obvious pressure when you're doing any type
Speaker 1: of media's eyeballs, how many people are watching? How many views?
Speaker 1: You know, you're you're you're betting against eyeballs. And we
Speaker 1: know as a culture, eyeballs goes to primarily, and I
Speaker 1: hate to say it, but negative content, you know, sexual content,
Speaker 1: violent content, That's what gets the eyeballs, That's what gets trending,
Speaker 1: that's what gets views. How do you deliver feel good
Speaker 1: culture for our culture because the majority of our culture
Speaker 1: isn't what is portrayed. You know, there's Uh, I'm not
Speaker 1: saying abundance of black executives or people of power, but
Speaker 1: I'm saying that there's a lot of positive conversation that's
Speaker 1: happening outside of drug, sex and violence. How do you
Speaker 1: find the balance of doing the I guess the I
Speaker 1: don't want to say bad imagery, but how do you
Speaker 1: find the balance of do you how to understand? I
Speaker 1: don't know how to form the question. I got you,
Speaker 1: I got you? Um, First of all, hip hop is
Speaker 1: hip hop, so it's gonna be what it's gonna be.
Speaker 1: And so if you are a company with hip hop
Speaker 1: at its core, you're gonna have the core elements of
Speaker 1: hip hop as a part of your storytelling. I think
Speaker 1: for us, it's just really important to also have that balance. UM,
Speaker 1: And what we know about hip hop is that when
Speaker 1: hip hop talks, the world moves. The problem is people
Speaker 1: only hand hip hop the microphone and they want to
Speaker 1: talk about sex, money, drugs, and music. We hand hip
Speaker 1: hop the microphone and let them talk about mental health
Speaker 1: and financial literacy and uplifting black women, do you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? So we can take the same um,
Speaker 1: the same core, the same anchor, and redeploy it in
Speaker 1: different ways. And so so much of what we're doing,
Speaker 1: the work that I'm excited about is about feeding black
Speaker 1: people and for nation and education, but wrapping it up
Speaker 1: in a hip hop culturally relevant, cultural lifestyle packaging. And
Speaker 1: so we kind of talked about this, but like one
Speaker 1: of my favorite ideas is the show we have with
Speaker 1: these young men from Earn Your Leisure who are amazing
Speaker 1: Try and rashad Um. They have the dopest financial wealth
Speaker 1: empowerment platform for the culture that exists, and we have
Speaker 1: a show what them called Assets over Liabilities and assets
Speaker 1: over liabilities is essentially almost like a yeo MTV Cribs reboot, um,
Speaker 1: But yes, Like while you see the chains and the
Speaker 1: cars and the house, like the whole conversation is anchored
Speaker 1: and how did you build wealth? What is your next investment?
Speaker 1: What is your first investment? And so you can take
Speaker 1: that same hip hop You can take Rick Ross and
Speaker 1: have him teach people about financial wealth. You can take
Speaker 1: g Herbo and have him teach people about mental wellness,
Speaker 1: right um. And so for me, I think it's just
Speaker 1: about leveraging the same way. We have the most powerful
Speaker 1: weapon on the planet, which is hip hop. Hip Hop
Speaker 1: is the number one most listen to music around the globe, right,
Speaker 1: it drives the culture, and so we're also going to
Speaker 1: use that that weapon to drive the culture for good.
Speaker 1: I think that's a key piece of it. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: feel like people of color, black people, people that are
Speaker 1: in underserved communities are so hungry for that knowledge like
Speaker 1: once credit. You know, like when I was growing up,
Speaker 1: my parents didn't have the conversation of credit. I didn't
Speaker 1: learn about credit or taxes until I got like leans
Speaker 1: on all my stuff, you know. Yeah, I'm like trying
Speaker 1: to apply for apartment with credit like what you know? Um,
Speaker 1: And now we're in a world where you have, like
Speaker 1: you said, earn your leisure and you have social media
Speaker 1: and you have these little clips that are like you know,
Speaker 1: real estate over cars and who needs When was the
Speaker 1: last time jay z war chain? You know? And I
Speaker 1: feel like we're in an incredible place now because you
Speaker 1: no longer have to rely on your parents. Unfortunately that
Speaker 1: were maybe they weren't fortunate enough to come across this information,
Speaker 1: you know when they had us you know. Yeah, the
Speaker 1: problem is no one is talking to us in our language, right, Like, Um,
Speaker 1: all of content just typically green lipped by people who
Speaker 1: don't look like us, and so then they don't have
Speaker 1: our perspective or our lens and our gaze. And so
Speaker 1: is the information out there, sure, but is it presented
Speaker 1: in a way um that some of our people who
Speaker 1: couldn't catch it in those ways, UM, can catch it
Speaker 1: in the way that is relevant to them. And that's
Speaker 1: what we spend our time doing. Yeah, so I'm going
Speaker 1: to ask you something. I hope you can share this
Speaker 1: with us from a black media company perspective. You're dealing
Speaker 1: You're dealing with a lot of I don't know if
Speaker 1: it's white media or you know, big corporations. What would
Speaker 1: you say is the biggest challenge in that industry that
Speaker 1: you're going up against as a black owned like specifically
Speaker 1: as black owned, what would you say is the biggest challenge. Yeah, So, look,
Speaker 1: there's a bunch of different valuations about how big the
Speaker 1: total advertising market is. But for the purpose of this conversation,
Speaker 1: let's say it's two hundred and fifty billion dollars is right.
Speaker 1: Out of that two hundred and fifty billion dollars, black
Speaker 1: owned media gets one percent, So that's two point five
Speaker 1: billion dollars. Right. So then when you go work with
Speaker 1: big brands, they don't change their expectations about the quality
Speaker 1: of work or what you can deliver based on the
Speaker 1: fact that you're making one percent of the money. Right,
Speaker 1: They have those same expectations. And so our biggest challenge
Speaker 1: has been UM getting advertisers and brands to see us,
Speaker 1: getting them to unlock the dollars so that we can
Speaker 1: produce the content that we know that our culture needs
Speaker 1: and revote has been UM a force to be reckoned with,
Speaker 1: I would say over the last two years in terms
Speaker 1: of helping brands understand that not only do they have
Speaker 1: UM a social responsibility to UM spend more with black
Speaker 1: owned media, but that the world has changed. Like back
Speaker 1: in the days, you used to be able to just
Speaker 1: make good products and people would pick you UM. Now
Speaker 1: you have to have good products and purpose, or good
Speaker 1: products and values, and those values have to be flushed
Speaker 1: all the way through your business model. And so the
Speaker 1: way I start to learn that lesson as I'm at
Speaker 1: a conference and I'm looking at five tables of bottled water,
Speaker 1: and the woman walks up to me. As I'm trying
Speaker 1: to choose which bottle of woman get, she says, don't
Speaker 1: get that bottled water. That's Betsy Devoces water. Right, all
Speaker 1: water isn't created equal because the person on top of
Speaker 1: that does not have your values. And so so much
Speaker 1: of what we're doing is trying to get brands to
Speaker 1: understand you might have a great product, but people also
Speaker 1: care about your values. Your investors care about your values,
Speaker 1: your employees care about your values, and your consumers care
Speaker 1: about your values. And then one of the number, you know,
Speaker 1: top things that they care about is how brands are
Speaker 1: dealing with racial equity and racial injustice. And so we
Speaker 1: just keep ringing that alarm, helping brands understand that their
Speaker 1: job has changed. No longer do you just get to
Speaker 1: hit your numbers, but now you've got to hit your
Speaker 1: numbers and help create the world that your consumers and
Speaker 1: investors want to live in. UM. And through that, we've
Speaker 1: been very successful at unlocking dollars. The key last pieces
Speaker 1: that I want to say about that, but because I've
Speaker 1: been doing this for ten fifteen years and it's never worked,
Speaker 1: when George Floyd was murdered, it shifted the algorithm. And
Speaker 1: so once you have that and everybody is on pause,
Speaker 1: and now we can all see that maybe this thing
Speaker 1: called systemic racism really does exist. UM, that opens the
Speaker 1: door for these new conversations. And so look, we've got
Speaker 1: great brand partners, you know, Target, State Farm, Pepsi, UM, McDonald's, Cadillac, UM,
Speaker 1: brands who are truly invested in us because they're invested
Speaker 1: in our culture and our community. And we just keep
Speaker 1: looking for partners like that because they enabled us to
Speaker 1: do the great work that we volt is trying to do. Now,
Speaker 1: I'm so glad you mentioned that. Guys, We're gonna go
Speaker 1: over time. I'm just gonna say it, so and you
Speaker 1: didn't need that. I'm lit first before, just to make sure.
Speaker 1: Let me make sure she's not gonna that. Okay, Okay,
Speaker 1: let me try and you sink a big bite too,
Speaker 1: are we? Okay? Is not doing so? And I don't
Speaker 1: eat a lot of imitation crab thirty years ago, thirty
Speaker 1: year old resciping. Okay, you don't have to, but you
Speaker 1: know what it is, your wealth of knowledge. Um, the
Speaker 1: omelet is really good. I'm not gonna lie. I will
Speaker 1: finish the omelet everybody. Um, But while I have you here, Um,
Speaker 1: I've had different influencers come on the show and they
Speaker 1: all said that after the George Floyd situation happened, all
Speaker 1: of the advertisers, you know, they make their money from advertising,
Speaker 1: we're seeking them out and they made the most money
Speaker 1: they had ever made during that error. Is there a
Speaker 1: part of you that's like a love hate relationship with
Speaker 1: that where it's like, Wow, we waited all this time
Speaker 1: and it took this huge, you know, event to happen
Speaker 1: for us to actually get a bump. And do you
Speaker 1: see a bump in advertising now? Is it more than
Speaker 1: one percent? Yeah? So essentially what happened is last year
Speaker 1: in March, and I'll give Byron Allen um credit. Byron
Speaker 1: Allen starts suing companies for being racist. That creates this
Speaker 1: wave um where brands become more afraid of the PR
Speaker 1: crisis UM than they do of making commitments to black media.
Speaker 1: So what they all start doing is making commitments to
Speaker 1: sound like black media is only one percent of our spend,
Speaker 1: We're gonna take it to two percent of our spend
Speaker 1: next year and then three, four or five percent. And
Speaker 1: so what's happening in my market right now is I'm
Speaker 1: in a market that is growing for the five x
Speaker 1: over the course of the next four years. Black owned
Speaker 1: media is now growing like a tech stock, which is
Speaker 1: why you see us being able to do all of
Speaker 1: the things that we do Revolt had you know. Look,
Speaker 1: I've set these numbers publicly so I can say them here. Um.
Speaker 1: Last year advertising business grew three x, my digital advertising
Speaker 1: business grew five x. Are you publicly public profits as
Speaker 1: a CEO or or no. I know that I'm asking
Speaker 1: very invasive question. The real answer to that is always
Speaker 1: what you choose to negotiate and where you put value right.
Speaker 1: So the core three things that I think that as
Speaker 1: a CEO you're negotiating a salary, bonus and equity, and
Speaker 1: everybody's gonna choose which one is more. I have a
Speaker 1: feeling I know which way you do. I really genuinely
Speaker 1: enjoyed having you here because you expose like so many
Speaker 1: different facets that I'm not even used to having on
Speaker 1: this show, from education and the values there. Um. There
Speaker 1: was one other questions I had that was gonna I'm
Speaker 1: gonna try to smack me. Yeah, you know what, it's
Speaker 1: It's good because it's like we're learning so much. Oh,
Speaker 1: that's what I wanted to say. You came from advertising
Speaker 1: and then you're the CEO revolt. You know, from a
Speaker 1: perspective like after hearing your story, makes perfect sense how
Speaker 1: they chose me and why they chose you because you're
Speaker 1: like the triple threat. You're like the girl like ca
Speaker 1: seing dance model. You know, like you couldn't do it
Speaker 1: all because you understand the language of the advertising perspective
Speaker 1: and you understand the language you know, the media side.
Speaker 1: So you're you, Hey, I appreciate um the way you
Speaker 1: said that, and thank you, honored um. But you literally,
Speaker 1: like any interview that I'm in, that's exactly what I
Speaker 1: would say that what has made me unique is that
Speaker 1: I started on the client side, that Johnson and Johnson,
Speaker 1: and so I have an inkling of what brands and
Speaker 1: advertisers want. Then I went to the creative agency side
Speaker 1: and learned the power of ideas and creative content. And
Speaker 1: then I want to work for Cathy Hughes where she
Speaker 1: gave me her and Alfred Ligganns gave me a digital
Speaker 1: media business to run. I never ran digital, didn't know
Speaker 1: how to run. They gave me digital business to run.
Speaker 1: I never had no clue what I was doing. But
Speaker 1: then I learned digital and I learned media, and so yes,
Speaker 1: now I get to see the client perspective, the advertising
Speaker 1: agency perspective, and the media perspective. And I believe that
Speaker 1: that lens is what makes my lens unique from others. Yeah. Now,
Speaker 1: you being young, you you have a wealth of experience,
Speaker 1: so I'm pretty sure it doesn't really matter. But do
Speaker 1: you ever feel that you're being young has had its hindrances,
Speaker 1: Like for sure, like what share? Yeah, the whole time? Um,
Speaker 1: so you have to imagine, um, you know, and these
Speaker 1: titles will mean nothing. Um. But I probably became a
Speaker 1: group account director at the agency at twenty six. Again,
Speaker 1: I became the president of an agency at thirty UM.
Speaker 1: And you have to imagine that a lot of the
Speaker 1: people who worked for me were older, with a lot
Speaker 1: or lived experience in the space, and so figuring out
Speaker 1: how to be a leader who um could rally people
Speaker 1: who were younger but most importantly older to respect you
Speaker 1: enough to follow. For me, leadership is about followership, right,
Speaker 1: So earning followship as a young kid was really difficult.
Speaker 1: And then UM, walking into clients and convincing them that
Speaker 1: they should give you tens of millions of dollars to
Speaker 1: make commercials and that you were the leader to help
Speaker 1: drive that business also a very UM difficult thing. And
Speaker 1: then the other piece that I'll say is internally, UM,
Speaker 1: there's always this question of like what your motivation is,
Speaker 1: because when people see you move up the chain as
Speaker 1: quickly as I was fortunate enough to do, UM, there's
Speaker 1: always this idea that you're not really here for the business.
Speaker 1: You're just here for yourself. Oh yeah, yeah, like you're
Speaker 1: not a life person, your temporary yeah exactly. And so again,
Speaker 1: earning followership in that reality was really difficult. In fact,
Speaker 1: even be doing things like this and being on this one,
Speaker 1: the full podcast that you have is a newer thing
Speaker 1: for me because in order to lead, in order to
Speaker 1: prove to people that I wasn't there just to build
Speaker 1: my brand, I stood in the background and pushed everybody ahead. Right.
Speaker 1: It's not until you know, last year where I started
Speaker 1: doing more to kind of step into the light. And
Speaker 1: honestly don't love it, but I think it's part of
Speaker 1: the assignment. And when you're the CEO of a brand,
Speaker 1: you have to be the face of a brand. But
Speaker 1: I spent my entire career hiding in the back so
Speaker 1: that my teams knew that they were the most important thing,
Speaker 1: and that the work was the most important thing, and
Speaker 1: that it wasn't about building my personal brand. Wow wow,
Speaker 1: So I'm um. So when it comes to leading a team, um,
Speaker 1: and coming from advertising, I always tell people, I mean,
Speaker 1: I've worked for myself for abundance of years, and I
Speaker 1: always say people underestimate sales, financial literacy and sales. You know,
Speaker 1: when you're running a business, everyone, no matter how big
Speaker 1: the businesses, there's no cash flow problem. So I can
Speaker 1: tell you I've seen all types of businesses, big and small.
Speaker 1: Cash flow plays a critical role in whether they stay
Speaker 1: alive month of money. But one thing people always look
Speaker 1: down their nose on and sales. How much of your
Speaker 1: role would you say the ability to sell played a huge,
Speaker 1: like a role in it. I don't really know, but
Speaker 1: I think that if you're an entrepreneur, the number one
Speaker 1: thing you're doing is selling. I spend all of my
Speaker 1: time selling to investors, trying to unlock hundreds of millions
Speaker 1: of dollars so that we can tell black stories that
Speaker 1: have not been told. I spent all of my time
Speaker 1: sitting with brands and advertisers trying to unlock millions of
Speaker 1: dollars so that we can keep the company open, feed
Speaker 1: families and give UM people of color in this wonderfully
Speaker 1: diverse group of company that we have UM, so that
Speaker 1: they can feed their families and eat and we can
Speaker 1: grow the business. I spend all of my time selling
Speaker 1: to the media, telling our stories so that people are
Speaker 1: paying attention to the work. That it's all sales in
Speaker 1: my opinion, yeah, yeah, I agree. Agree. I'm so glad
Speaker 1: you said that, because I feel like people under they
Speaker 1: don't talk about it, and it's all sales. It's all sales.
Speaker 1: You could have the best business on the planet. But
Speaker 1: if you can't tell that story, if you can't get
Speaker 1: people excited about the work that you're doing, um a
Speaker 1: little flounder, right, you won't be able to unlock the
Speaker 1: dollars that you need for the mission that you're trying
Speaker 1: to accomplish. Now, you sell the investors, correct. So when
Speaker 1: you you run a team, I try I'm trying to
Speaker 1: imagine what a day in the life of you is.
Speaker 1: I stopped your Instagram. Okay, so I know you swim
Speaker 1: in the morning like I did the cybers talking like
Speaker 1: how girls do it. I've been I've been talking for
Speaker 1: about three months okay, okay, so um, so when you're
Speaker 1: running a team, um, and I'm just trying to envision
Speaker 1: your life because I've been trying to do it for
Speaker 1: a couple of months now. So besides the swimming in
Speaker 1: the mornings, which you seem to be very passionate about, um,
Speaker 1: do you have to like does your advertising team have
Speaker 1: to come to you in this is how much you sold?
Speaker 1: And you're like, you better sell it better? You know,
Speaker 1: we're having a problem with I don't want say Target
Speaker 1: because Target has definitely been stepping up their game, but
Speaker 1: like some advertiser that's like hard to close. Do you
Speaker 1: like stepping in like micromanage a little bit? I don't
Speaker 1: want to say micromanagement, not a micromanager. Or do you
Speaker 1: like say something like is there like a text or
Speaker 1: something I want to know? In general? The way that
Speaker 1: I would say it is, um, I try to build
Speaker 1: empowered teams. I'm super and have empowered leaders, and I'm
Speaker 1: super passionate about that for all people of all colors
Speaker 1: and all walks of life. But I'm specifically passionate about
Speaker 1: it for people of color and women because oftentimes where
Speaker 1: when they're in these other companies, they don't get to
Speaker 1: take their shot. You don't know if your ideas are
Speaker 1: good if no one ever lets you get your idea
Speaker 1: off the ground. And so I try to create a
Speaker 1: space that gives people for the ground to kind of
Speaker 1: understand what they're capable of. And so I'm blessed. We
Speaker 1: have an incredible sales leader at Revolting name Mike Roach.
Speaker 1: He and his team are doing a phenomenal job. And
Speaker 1: so I stay out of Mike's business. Mike lets me
Speaker 1: know when he needs me, if he needs me, if
Speaker 1: it's a CEO, the CEO conversation that has to be had.
Speaker 1: If it's a CMO this, you know, CEO conversation that
Speaker 1: needs to be had, he'll call me big pitches, He'll
Speaker 1: call me. He also knows that I have lots of
Speaker 1: relationships on that side, so they are potentially doors I
Speaker 1: can help him get into. But that team is doing
Speaker 1: what they're doing, and I will take zero of their credit.
Speaker 1: They're phenomenal. So my last question and then we'll I'm
Speaker 1: gonna ask you many questions once we're done. Um, you
Speaker 1: have a hundred I would say hundred staff. I'm assuming, right, Okay, Um,
Speaker 1: out of all little staff, how many would you say
Speaker 1: have a college degree? I don't know because I've never
Speaker 1: looked at it. But here's what I'll say. I said
Speaker 1: all the time that revolt is streets and sweets. We
Speaker 1: have people who sweets, meaning like the boardroom, some people
Speaker 1: who may become from more of my background. Right, So
Speaker 1: you've got Um, when I look at my executive team,
Speaker 1: you've got people from Harvard and Stanford and Duke and U. C.
Speaker 1: L a UM. But you also have people who never
Speaker 1: graduated from college. You also have people who sold drugs
Speaker 1: before this. You also have people who came from the nightlife,
Speaker 1: and I think, or I believe and I know that
Speaker 1: what makes for VOTES special is that we are figuring
Speaker 1: out that balance every day. There's a lot of companies
Speaker 1: who are trying to do work for the culture and
Speaker 1: they're just sweets. There's a lot of people are trying
Speaker 1: to do work for the culture and they're just streets.
Speaker 1: It is this combination of streets and sweets UM that
Speaker 1: makes us unique and special. And so I don't know
Speaker 1: about what it is throughout the entire organization. Basically, I'm
Speaker 1: glad to know that there's opportunities for us regular folks
Speaker 1: guys out there. Look our chief brand Officer, Dion um Graham,
Speaker 1: who is UM one of my closest business partners on
Speaker 1: this brand. Dion dropped out of college. UM. You know,
Speaker 1: he'll tell his story. Doon dropped out of college to
Speaker 1: sell drugs, went into the nightlife, started working for Shanky's
Speaker 1: our cheap brand officer. Right. And so for us, it
Speaker 1: is not about UM. It does not have to be
Speaker 1: about education. It's about your taste, profile, who you are,
Speaker 1: the work you're trying to do. Are you committed to
Speaker 1: this mission where we're trying to shift in there that
Speaker 1: for black people globally, Um, do you have a lived
Speaker 1: experience that can help us move this business in a
Speaker 1: phenomenal way. And some of those people are gonna go
Speaker 1: to Harvard or have gone to Harvard, and some of
Speaker 1: them would have never seen a college campus in their life. Right, Yeah, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I love it. I love it. I'm so glad that
Speaker 1: you came out because I was I was like, I
Speaker 1: don't know if he's gonna do it. Then I was
Speaker 1: self conscious of our studio. I'm so so relieved to
Speaker 1: have met you again. From the stalking of the profiles
Speaker 1: to the titles, it was it was a bit of
Speaker 1: a roller coaster for me. And I'm so happy to
Speaker 1: hear that did he sounds exactly like what I've imagined
Speaker 1: him to be. I'm sure. I'm sure there's a Bravado
Speaker 1: that I've also imagined. You know, when I was young,
Speaker 1: I remember always saying, I want to be a mobile,
Speaker 1: I want to be like Diddy. I want to be
Speaker 1: like Russell Simmons. You know, they would wear these white suits,
Speaker 1: and you know, I just I always thought they were
Speaker 1: just so impressive. And I've bumped into Diddy in l
Speaker 1: A when I was younger, and I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm not big enough to meet him yet, so you
Speaker 1: know when I thought, well, you know, work with him
Speaker 1: or what have you. Um, but it's great to hear that.
Speaker 1: You know, Revolt has done what it's done, and Diddy
Speaker 1: has done what he's done, and you have done what
Speaker 1: you've done, and it's amazing and impressive that you came
Speaker 1: from humble beginnings and here you are one of the
Speaker 1: top young executives. Thank you for that, young credit, young
Speaker 1: young Well, thank you for joining me on another episode
Speaker 1: of Eating wall Bro. Please feel free to come by
Speaker 1: and eat real Jamaican food with me and not invitation
Speaker 1: crab homelets. I want to say thank you for having me.
Speaker 1: I think, Um, for me, this conversation is refreshing. It's
Speaker 1: like you get tons of interviews and you never know
Speaker 1: what the conversation is going to be. But I definitely
Speaker 1: think we had a fresh conversation. I think, um, even
Speaker 1: for me. Right, I'm here to serve, but I think
Speaker 1: that this platform also gives me an opportunity to say
Speaker 1: things that I don't get to say in other places. Literally,
Speaker 1: you got my salary on my mouth breast beyond that,
Speaker 1: you just gave me the opportunity to say things that
Speaker 1: I don't always get to say. And so um sharing
Speaker 1: you on celebrating you, love the studio, love with your building.
Speaker 1: Keep going, Queen, We're here to help. Thank you. I
Speaker 1: appreciate you saw. Maybe we'll be on Revolt one day. Okay,
Speaker 1: you know, maybe you never know. All Right, Piece out
Speaker 1: y'all for more eating while broke from I Heart Radio
Speaker 1: and The Black Effect, Visit the I Heart Radio app,
Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.