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Speaker 1: Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. Ladies and gentlemen,

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Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of Quest Love Supreme. Quest Love

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Speaker 1: your host Sexually. Have we ever a tag team? Ticolo?

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Speaker 1: I don't think we have.

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Speaker 2: Thanks, this is.

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Speaker 1: The it's the tag teamages of fun Tikeolo in Quest Love.

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Speaker 1: How you doing, man? How's your week? Then?

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Speaker 2: It's hectic?

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Speaker 1: But I did. Are you about to talk about it?

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Speaker 3: Oh?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah yeah, I mean yeah.

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Speaker 4: We had our first like little brother show in like

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Speaker 4: two years over the like last weekend.

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Speaker 1: How was that?

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Speaker 2: It was insane, very surreal.

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Speaker 4: Afterwards, I had these two kids come up to the

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Speaker 4: meet and we're like, this is the greatest show we've

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Speaker 4: ever seen. Two white girls seventeen and her sister who

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Speaker 4: was twelve. Wow, that was the first. The toy year

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Speaker 4: old she said it was the first show she'd ever

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Speaker 4: been to ever. And I was sitting there talking with

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Speaker 4: my home girl er Lette, and were just sitting there

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Speaker 4: and I was like hi.

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Speaker 2: They was like, oh my god, you guys were getting

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Speaker 2: so high.

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Speaker 1: It was so great.

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Speaker 2: And I love the pink. I love you in the

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Speaker 2: pink shirt. We love the pink. I was like, Okay,

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Speaker 2: thanks for the fashion to you know what I mean?

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Speaker 1: But how did they know they even see you? Well,

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Speaker 1: both of them were younger than your career, straight.

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Speaker 2: Up I got albums older than both of them.

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Speaker 4: So they were We were opening for a band called

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Speaker 4: silvan Eso and they pick up to them that's fine.

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Speaker 1: So yes.

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Speaker 4: So they did like a three night kind of festival

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Speaker 4: thing in Durham and we were like the support act

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Speaker 4: for night too, and yeah, man, we came out there

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Speaker 4: and you know, it was our first show.

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Speaker 2: Me and Pool put the set together like the night before.

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Speaker 4: It was like, okay, we do this, do that, do that,

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Speaker 4: and we went out there and at the end of

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Speaker 4: the show, towards the end. Normally we were asked at the beginning,

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Speaker 4: but for this night, we asked it the end. We

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Speaker 4: was like, how many was your first time seeing little

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Speaker 4: brother for the first time, and like the hands went up.

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Speaker 4: They had no idea who we were, but like we

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Speaker 4: rocked that shit and so it was. It was crazy.

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Speaker 4: It was like to be you're now a twenty year veteran,

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Speaker 4: straight up no bro facts, Like twenty years in to

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Speaker 4: still be picking up new fans, that is that's kind

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Speaker 4: of surreal.

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Speaker 2: And I'm noticing too that post COVID crowds.

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Speaker 1: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: And Rick, we can ask you about it as well

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Speaker 2: if you want to win.

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Speaker 4: It seems to me like post COVID concert crowds and

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Speaker 4: pre COVID concert crowds are two different things, yes, because

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Speaker 4: like everybody's high, everybody's high.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm just I mean, I remember the first gig

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Speaker 3: we did. Hi, by the way, I remember the first

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Speaker 3: gig we did.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna introduce you for Goohead. This is like this

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Speaker 1: is the cold Open.

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Speaker 3: Okay, that's good. Yeah, first gig we did in the UK.

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Speaker 3: And that first gig was kind of crazy because we

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Speaker 3: did it at a place called Networth, which is a

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Speaker 3: legendary country house if you like, just outside of London,

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Speaker 3: and it's been amaze see gigs done there. But we

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Speaker 3: played to about two and a half thousand people instead

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Speaker 3: of two hundred and fifty thousand people because they all

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Speaker 3: brought their car and they had a picnic space and

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Speaker 3: so they all sat in their cars or on the

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Speaker 3: bonnet of their car, the roof of the car, and

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Speaker 3: they were all given a picnic space. So it went

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Speaker 3: on for about a mile of this this thing. But

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Speaker 3: it was amazing because when the sun went down, everyone

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Speaker 3: was using their car lights to sort of say yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 3: and it was amazing. So it was a really strange gig.

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Speaker 3: But I could see, especially in the crew and the

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Speaker 3: people who'd been building the stage and you know what

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Speaker 3: I mean, and everything you could see people were really

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Speaker 3: really emotional. I mean, being on stage is an emotional

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Speaker 3: thing full stop, but being on stage in front of

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Speaker 3: a crowd after that, all that time that was it

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Speaker 3: was amazing, absolutely incredible, and we did a few that

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Speaker 3: summer that were just just amazing. You know. It just

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Speaker 3: made you feel lucky, made you feel i don't know,

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Speaker 3: like a newfound respect for being allowed to do what

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Speaker 3: you do.

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Speaker 2: You know, it was very much like watching the route.

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Speaker 4: It was not versus in the past where you would

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Speaker 4: see people kind of in their bodies for lack of

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Speaker 4: a better word, where it's like.

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Speaker 2: Throw your hands up, scream shot whatever. It's like all

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Speaker 2: of that.

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Speaker 4: You can just see them just kind of in their heads,

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Speaker 4: like they're just watching it and like, you know, like

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Speaker 4: just kind of taking it in and they're enjoying, they're

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Speaker 4: having a ball, but they're just in their heads, just

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Speaker 4: kind of watching it. And yeah, that was definitely something

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Speaker 4: I noticed. I'm like, okay, yeah, these post COVID shows,

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Speaker 4: in the pre COVID this it's a whole different.

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Speaker 1: Well that said, ladies and gentlemen, I will say that

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Speaker 1: our guest is probably beyond just fame. Okay, So he's

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Speaker 1: a musician, singer, songwriter from the UK. I like to

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Speaker 1: say the UK, like I'm from the UK. I only

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Speaker 1: lived there for four years, but I make people from

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Speaker 1: the UK actually think that, you know that I'm an actual,

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Speaker 1: like lifelong resident there, you know. And he came into

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Speaker 1: our radar, at least my radar for a lot of

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Speaker 1: us here in the States, you know, of course in

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Speaker 1: the late a and made it absolutely impossible to forget

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Speaker 1: his music. And I'll say that's an actual achievement. And

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Speaker 1: even to this day, those singles, very strong, very potent

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Speaker 1: singles are dropped and it's instant happiness and joy, you know,

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Speaker 1: and even going has so much to say, I'll be

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Speaker 1: it kind of an unusual achievement, but I will well,

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Speaker 1: I'll ask you, fante, if Michael Jackson owns Halloween and

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Speaker 1: Mariah Carrey owns Christmas, I almost think that our guess

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Speaker 1: today might own April Fool's Day, which is kind of

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Speaker 1: a weird quote to say. And you know, I'm not

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Speaker 1: even implaning that our guess is a joke or his

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Speaker 1: music is a joke. Far from it. But you know,

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Speaker 1: for clarification purposes, I'll say that, you know, we all

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Speaker 1: live in the the you know this like the twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty fifth year of really the internet sort of in

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Speaker 1: our lives, and I think I would say that the

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Speaker 1: first mean he yes, exactly.

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Speaker 4: They have been the first what we now know is

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Speaker 4: Internet being cultured, Like, yes, that's the first one.

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Speaker 2: I think. I think he really was originating.

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Speaker 1: Well, definitely one of the earliest examples of the sticky

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Speaker 1: factor as we you know, as something viral, you know,

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Speaker 1: which in the eyes of gen Z like that's that's

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Speaker 1: a serious achievement our I guess, yes, it's it's the same.

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Speaker 1: You know, you're you're, you're you will be here forever,

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Speaker 1: long after we're going from Earth, you know. And in

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Speaker 1: the fact that even his name can imply, you know,

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Speaker 1: not only being a proper nown but you know, to

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Speaker 1: be rick rolled is to is the new Oki dokie

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Speaker 1: falling for the ok having successfully pulled the prank I'll

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Speaker 1: say that in my research, I didn't realize that YouTube

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Speaker 1: themselves when they you know, established in two thousand and seven,

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Speaker 1: two thousand and eight, YouTube themselves actually invented what we

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Speaker 1: call rick rolling. For the two three of you that

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Speaker 1: don't know what rick rowling means, it's the thing where

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Speaker 1: someone shares a serious video with you and then about

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Speaker 1: twelve seconds and your hit with again the irresistible course

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Speaker 1: of never going to give you up. And you know,

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Speaker 1: I will say that probably during the pandemic, I'm giving

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Speaker 1: a shout out to my pal jin Grabel from Philadelphia,

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Speaker 1: who is one of the biggest rig Ghastly fans ever.

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Speaker 1: I've fallen down a vicious rabbit hole and looking at

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Speaker 1: all anything that you do in concert, she'll instantly send me, so,

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Speaker 1: you know, to see these Springsteen covers are born to run,

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Speaker 1: and your Nirvana covers and you know, the everything from

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Speaker 1: your food fighters to a CDC covers you on drums,

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Speaker 1: all these things you covering, like the Smith songs, Like

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Speaker 1: I'm really genuinely this, you know, I had to have

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Speaker 1: you on the show because I've like discovered a rekindled

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Speaker 1: fandom for our guests to day that goes way beyond,

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Speaker 1: just like you know the Rickrolling part of his career,

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Speaker 1: but you know there's a long time coming. So welcome

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Speaker 1: to your quest of Supreme. This is Rick Astley. Thank

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Speaker 1: you for joining us.

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Speaker 3: Man, Thank you. It's a pleasure to be Thanks for

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Speaker 3: that extraordinary introduction as well. I'll take that on board

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Speaker 3: in a very heartfelt way. So it's nice to be.

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Speaker 1: Well, we mean it. Where are you right now?

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Speaker 3: Right now? We're between Vegas and Fresno. I'm on tour

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Speaker 3: right now. I got invited last year to come to

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Speaker 3: America and do a tour with Are you ready for this?

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Speaker 3: New kids on the block on Vogue as I call

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Speaker 3: them on Vogue. I've been told you've got to say

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Speaker 3: en Vogue. I'm like, no, I'm European. It's on Vogue

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Speaker 3: and Salt and Pepper. And we're having a lot of fun,

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Speaker 3: i can tell you. And we had a day off yesterday,

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Speaker 3: which is which is always nice obviously me in Vegas,

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Speaker 3: we hade a bit fun. But the gigs have just

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Speaker 3: been amazing and it's very unusual for me because I

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Speaker 3: haven't done anything like this, certainly in America anyway, where

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Speaker 3: you get a group of artists together and go out

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Speaker 3: and do that. I have done it in Europe a

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Speaker 3: different places, but I've never really been to America and

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Speaker 3: do it. And obviously it's we're just having a ball

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Speaker 3: right now. So I'm on my bus right now heading

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Speaker 3: to Fresno.

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Speaker 1: So that that also explains the video that came out

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Speaker 1: with the four of you bring Back the Time.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I believe.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so's so weird because normally, you know, I'll see

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Speaker 1: package tours and acts get together and you know, they

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Speaker 1: might interact with each other whatever. But the fact that

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Speaker 1: you guys got together to sort of collaborate and no

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Speaker 1: one saw this coming, Like, could you explain the genesis

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Speaker 1: of how that came to be? Who put it together?

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Speaker 3: So yeah, so we've got a phone call and do

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Speaker 3: you want to come and do the mixtape tour? And

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Speaker 3: for me, I was kind of like, well, America is

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Speaker 3: a very different ball game. For me. It's I grew

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Speaker 3: up listening on what in America and doing gigs here.

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Speaker 3: Doing gigs here was always kind of like one of

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Speaker 3: the pinnacle things. You know, having some records on the

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Speaker 3: radio here was always an amazing thing because I know

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Speaker 3: then whether they liked them or not, whether they liked

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Speaker 3: my voice or not. I know Luther Vandrossad might me sing.

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Speaker 3: I know Al Green did, Bill Withers did, and those

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Speaker 3: guys unknowingly taught me to sing, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 3: So I kind of I always been Coming to America

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Speaker 3: is an amazing thing. With the MIXTEP tour is something

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Speaker 3: completely different because the New Kids fans are absolutely crazy

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Speaker 3: and I'm truly sure they know by now because we've

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Speaker 3: done a few gigs. But I meet that with a

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Speaker 3: lot of love. But they're absolutely crazy. So when I

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Speaker 3: kind of google googled the previous mixtape tours and the

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Speaker 3: fans and the everything, I spoke to Donnie Donny Walburg

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Speaker 3: quite a bit about it, and I just so, you

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Speaker 3: know what, let's just do it. We're gonna have a

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Speaker 3: lot of fun. It's not normal in the sense that

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Speaker 3: because it's a mixtape. I go on sing some songs

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Speaker 3: and then I hang around backstage and I watched the

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Speaker 3: guys on I'm at the side of the stage watching

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Speaker 3: different artists, and then I kind of get ready to

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Speaker 3: go back at stage. You're going to do it again,

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Speaker 3: and I've never done that. It's kind of a it's

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Speaker 3: much more of a show in that respect.

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Speaker 1: Interact a review.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, exactly, And Johnny walked me through that, and

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Speaker 3: he talked me through that and explained how they do it.

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Speaker 3: And so I think once you get over that and

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Speaker 3: kind of realize what it is as opposed to going

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Speaker 3: up and opening for an artist and doing your forty

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Speaker 3: five minutes, doing your hour, and then going off and done,

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Speaker 3: it's a totally different thing. And also one of the

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Speaker 3: things that I have huge respect for them for doing this.

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Speaker 3: They open the gig, they go on first, and then

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Speaker 3: they introduce, and then they introduce an artist. Tell me

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Speaker 3: a headline act in the world. Who does that?

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Speaker 1: A meal? I'd about to say I pioneered this, Okay, no, no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: but I no no ideas original. But you know, I

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Speaker 1: always hated the ideal of like someone goes on first,

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Speaker 1: someone goes on second, which is you know, which I'm

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Speaker 1: also kind of I know it's comedy, but oh d

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Speaker 1: l monique thing, because I just think that, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's more unique to do. Motown reviews used to be

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Speaker 1: that way, like three songs from CV, three songs from

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Speaker 1: the Supremes, three songs to and then people come back

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Speaker 1: and interact. So I've been I've been doing that for

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Speaker 1: like twenty years, and I'm finally when you said that,

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Speaker 1: I was like, ah, finally someone else is doing it.

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Speaker 1: That's dope. Even up until twenty seventeen, eighteen, and nineteen,

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Speaker 1: there will be occasional towns in which the roots and

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Speaker 1: new Kids on the Block will be in the same

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Speaker 1: hotel and absolutely nothing has changed. Like now, you know,

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Speaker 1: Donnie told me, like, you know, back in the day,

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Speaker 1: it was it was the mother's trying to hook up

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Speaker 1: the daughters. But now it's like you have daughters taking

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Speaker 1: their mothers to new Kids on the Block shows and

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Speaker 1: they're hanging around the hotel.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well there's a lot I'm telling you what has

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Speaker 3: kind of shocked me a little bit. Of course, most

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Speaker 3: of the audiences of an age because they were there

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Speaker 3: for the first records, they bought the first records, they

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Speaker 3: went on all the tos. But I'm telling you, it's

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Speaker 3: kind of odd. There's a lot of younger people in

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Speaker 3: that audience and they know all their tunes and they

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Speaker 3: are like fully paid up members of being the blockhead

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Speaker 3: family and everything, and it's really nice to see. But

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Speaker 3: I think you know we're talking. You guys were talking

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Speaker 3: about the internet before. That's just changed the way that

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Speaker 3: everybody listens to music obviously and gets their music, but

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Speaker 3: also the way they feel about it. And they don't

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Speaker 3: sometimes have the same thing that I certainly did when

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Speaker 3: I was a kid about Oh, that's for old people.

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Speaker 3: And I don't think older people are afraid to go

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Speaker 3: and say, well, you know what, I want to go

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Speaker 3: and see this artist, even though I'm old enough to

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Speaker 3: be their mom or dad. I just want to go

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Speaker 3: and see them. And I think that that generational thing

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Speaker 3: has gone away to a great degree. You know, well,

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Speaker 3: I just think the festival thing, if you look at that,

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Speaker 3: it's so plectical these days. Who you can be on

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Speaker 3: before or after or on the next stage. It's just unbelievable.

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Speaker 3: So when you look at the audience there's a bit

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Speaker 3: of that as well, you know, it's it's it's a

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Speaker 3: random bag of people that just want to wear music,

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Speaker 3: you know, don't really Yeah, so it's I think it's

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Speaker 3: quite a beautiful thing, to be honest.

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Speaker 1: Now I do too.

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Speaker 4: I think this like with the audience now, you know,

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Speaker 4: because no one has to pay for music anymore. I

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Speaker 4: think that it's just pretty much they have the room

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Speaker 4: to explore in a.

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Speaker 1: Way that we didn't.

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Speaker 4: You know what I mean, if we had to go

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Speaker 4: to the record store you had ten dollars, Yeah, ten

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Speaker 4: dollars was a choice, you know what I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: You had to make real decisions.

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Speaker 4: But now you know, with everything available, they just hear music,

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Speaker 4: you know, And I saw that. That was what I

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Speaker 4: started to get, Like, they don't even think, like my

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Speaker 4: kids and my sons, like, they don't even look in

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Speaker 4: terms of genre or anything. If they like it, they

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Speaker 4: like it and that's all they know, and that's all

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Speaker 4: they care about.

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Speaker 3: I think the other thing is they don't they don't

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Speaker 3: actually care if the artist is dead. And I don't

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Speaker 3: think that in a callous ware and no emotion where

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Speaker 3: they're just like, I love this, What is it? Oh

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Speaker 3: it's Frank Sonatra. Oh really do you know who? Frank

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Speaker 3: Socenarta was not really well coming on? A look at

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Speaker 3: this and I'll explain it to you.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, there no more context, there's no more new music

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Speaker 4: and all music it's just music, you know, in music,

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Speaker 4: that's it, right?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, So can you tell us where in the UK

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Speaker 1: were you born? I'm assuming that you were born in

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Speaker 1: the UK, where were you born?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I was. I was. I was born in

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Speaker 3: a very very small town and it's equidistant from Liverpool

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Speaker 3: and Manchester. It's right in the middle of both of them.

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Speaker 3: It's about twenty miles either side. That town is called

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Speaker 3: Newton the Willows and that is hyphenated as in Newton

325
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Speaker 3: in the Willows. It sounds a lot posher than it

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Speaker 3: actually is. It's okay. It was an okay place to

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Speaker 3: go up and everything. And my sister still lives there

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Speaker 3: and my mum up until she passed away, recently lived

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Speaker 3: there and it's an okay town. But it's a small town.

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Speaker 3: And we then, so for us go into either of

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Speaker 3: Manchester or Liverpool was our way of going to a

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Speaker 3: shop might have some actual trendy clothes or you know,

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Speaker 3: more than one record store, do you know what I mean?

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Speaker 3: Where you could go to like four of that, you know.

335
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Speaker 3: And obviously the first time we really went to stores

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Speaker 3: to go and look at musical instruments, that was in Manchester.

337
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Speaker 3: Because you know, you jumped on the train or you

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Speaker 3: got you know, an older brother sister to take you

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Speaker 3: and you went into Manchester. That was our big deal.

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Speaker 1: With you know, I see. Can you tell me what

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Speaker 1: your first musical memory was.

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Speaker 3: It's hard to say, obviously for anybody. I know. The

343
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Speaker 3: jungle Book record was a massive thing for me. I mean,

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Speaker 3: our kids love Disney and they love music because it's

345
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Speaker 3: because it's amazing. The quality of it is always great.

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Speaker 3: They're still doing great music, I think for the jungle Bug.

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Speaker 3: For me, we had that vinyl record at home and

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Speaker 3: I'm the youngest of four, so my sister was into

349
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Speaker 3: all kinds of music. She used to go and watch

350
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Speaker 3: a lot of what she used to watch everything. She

351
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Speaker 3: going to Manchester, Liverpool, and so she had a really

352
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Speaker 3: great record collection. But a lot of her music was

353
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Speaker 3: like there was a lot of progressive rock in it,

354
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Speaker 3: but she'd also have like quite a bit of Bowie

355
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Speaker 3: which she'd have a lot of American classic soul as well,

356
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Speaker 3: Marvin Gay, Stevie Wonder obviously, things like that. She loved

357
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Speaker 3: the Beatles as well, So I broke with a lot

358
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Speaker 3: of that. But I wanted the jungle Book because obviously

359
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Speaker 3: to me, I've been taken to the movies to see

360
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Speaker 3: the film, and once you've seen a film like that

361
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Speaker 3: and then you've got the vinyl of it at home,

362
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Speaker 3: you can you can plan to watch the movie again

363
00:17:23,080 --> 00:17:25,479
Speaker 3: in your head, can't you. I just loved it, and

364
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Speaker 3: that's so for me that I probably just sat there

365
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Speaker 3: waiting for everyone to leave the room and then got

366
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Speaker 3: my moment to put because we probably had one record

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Speaker 3: player when I was five years old, do you know

368
00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:37,439
Speaker 3: what I mean? That was probably it so, But I

369
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Speaker 3: think in terms of I just went to see Paul

370
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Speaker 3: McCartney actually a week or so ago in Fort Work

371
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Speaker 3: in Dallas, and a lot of the Beople's music as

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Speaker 3: for anybody obviously, of course for everybody on the planet,

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Speaker 3: but it was a bit of a game change in

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Speaker 3: some of those records, I think, even as a really

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Speaker 3: young kid, because a lot of their music at certain

376
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Speaker 3: times has got a lot of childlike quality to it.

377
00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:03,239
Speaker 3: There is we all, there's all, there's we all live

378
00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:06,119
Speaker 3: in a yellow submarine in there. And that's so that

379
00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:07,600
Speaker 3: as a kid, that brings you in, do you know

380
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Speaker 3: what I mean? And then all of a sudden you're

381
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Speaker 3: listening to I don't know the Holestalgic Pepper or what

382
00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:15,600
Speaker 3: I've been thinking, what is this? But it's when I

383
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Speaker 3: say childlike I don't mean that in any geogratory obviously.

384
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Speaker 3: I mean there's a real innocence to some of their stuff,

385
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Speaker 3: even though it becomes really complicated and intricate and beautiful

386
00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:27,200
Speaker 3: as well, there's a real simplicity to it at times,

387
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:29,560
Speaker 3: you know. So, so I think the Beatles were quite

388
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Speaker 3: an easy one to get into as well well.

389
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Speaker 1: Because they were they were influenced by you know, timpan Alley,

390
00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:39,480
Speaker 1: which you know that that sort of era of music,

391
00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:42,800
Speaker 1: a timpan Alley is closer to show tunes and.

392
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Speaker 2: Your musical stuff.

393
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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

394
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Speaker 1: And you know, it's it's rather genius that you can

395
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Speaker 1: create music that an eight year old that can stick

396
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Speaker 1: to an eight year old and an eighty year old

397
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Speaker 1: at the same time.

398
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Speaker 3: Absolutely, yeah, and seems hip.

399
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Speaker 1: Do you remember the the first music that you purchased

400
00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:04,200
Speaker 1: yourself with your own money?

401
00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:08,720
Speaker 3: Well, it wasn't money exactly. My dad had given me

402
00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:10,560
Speaker 3: some money to go and buy a pair of jeans,

403
00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:13,600
Speaker 3: right and there was a store. This wasn't in Manchester

404
00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:15,760
Speaker 3: or Liverpool. This is a local town. Tour was a

405
00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:18,560
Speaker 3: small town. There's a little store that so told jeans

406
00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:20,359
Speaker 3: and all kinds of different things that kids would wear.

407
00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:22,600
Speaker 3: You know, and he gave me the money and I

408
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:25,879
Speaker 3: went in and I bought the jeans. I was probably

409
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,080
Speaker 3: only about nine years old of this, but he's probably

410
00:19:28,080 --> 00:19:30,000
Speaker 3: outside in the car waiting for me, kind of thing.

411
00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:32,440
Speaker 3: And I went in saying nine I could have whatever.

412
00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:35,280
Speaker 3: Went in and it also had like a little record

413
00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:37,480
Speaker 3: store as part of it, which was a bit bizarre,

414
00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:40,720
Speaker 3: I guess, but whatever, And you bought a pair of

415
00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:42,760
Speaker 3: jeans on that day and they allowed you to have

416
00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:45,480
Speaker 3: a single. So I went in next door and I'm

417
00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:47,320
Speaker 3: just looking. I had no clue, and I knew my

418
00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:49,080
Speaker 3: dad was in the car like waiting, and he's like

419
00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:51,720
Speaker 3: he's not going to be messed around, you know. So

420
00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:54,520
Speaker 3: I just said, I'll have what other's number one? Please?

421
00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:58,719
Speaker 3: And it was luckily it was I Feel Loved by

422
00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:03,440
Speaker 3: Donna Summer. So I got a great record out of it. Anyway. Yeah,

423
00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:06,479
Speaker 3: but that but that wasn't my so I was eleven.

424
00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:10,040
Speaker 3: Now I think that it wasn't necessarily a choice, and

425
00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:11,800
Speaker 3: it wasn't really my money, if you know what I mean.

426
00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:14,159
Speaker 3: It sort of came with the pair of jeans. But

427
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:15,880
Speaker 3: it was quite It was quite a thing because when

428
00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:18,320
Speaker 3: I went home, I suddenly kind of realized I own

429
00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:20,440
Speaker 3: this record. It's not one of my brothers or my sisters.

430
00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:22,280
Speaker 3: This is mine, do you know what I mean? Because

431
00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:24,359
Speaker 3: all I've done really was just pinched their records and

432
00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:26,800
Speaker 3: just played them. You know, That's all I've done up

433
00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:27,320
Speaker 3: to that point.

434
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Speaker 1: So at least by that point did you have a

435
00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:32,720
Speaker 1: singing voice? Were you?

436
00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,800
Speaker 3: I was always picked to be in school plays. I

437
00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:38,919
Speaker 3: was in a church choir as well. But it's not

438
00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:41,560
Speaker 3: as you guys will know. It's not a gospel or anything.

439
00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:44,600
Speaker 3: It's a very very Church of England and very kind

440
00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:46,760
Speaker 3: of straight and white like you know that. But it's

441
00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:49,400
Speaker 3: still singing with other people, and that I still think

442
00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:53,080
Speaker 3: that thing of a choral group of people making that

443
00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:55,080
Speaker 3: that I'm going to say, noise. I'm not even to

444
00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:57,600
Speaker 3: fall like music right now. Just making that noise together

445
00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:01,719
Speaker 3: is the most what's the word to use, It's the

446
00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:05,600
Speaker 3: most sort of primeval way of making music because you know,

447
00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:07,919
Speaker 3: when you take away the organists, and I remember we

448
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:09,320
Speaker 3: used to do that. We used to sing just on

449
00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:11,159
Speaker 3: our own a lot of the time, especially when he

450
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:13,920
Speaker 3: was like getting us through different pieces to learn them

451
00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:17,399
Speaker 3: and everything. It's just a bunch of people using this

452
00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:21,000
Speaker 3: to make a noise, and it's quite I'm not saying

453
00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:23,800
Speaker 3: I used that at all today, but I think it's

454
00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:26,640
Speaker 3: still it did something to me, even though on dinner

455
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:28,280
Speaker 3: for a couple of years, but it definitely made me

456
00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:29,960
Speaker 3: aware of the fact that a group of people come

457
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,720
Speaker 3: together harmonize or not and what have you, and make

458
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:36,280
Speaker 3: music and that's and there's no even instrument to go through,

459
00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:39,560
Speaker 3: do you know what I mean? And I even think

460
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,880
Speaker 3: from a timing point of view, because I got into

461
00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:44,760
Speaker 3: playing drums as a little kid and stuff, and we

462
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 3: say little kid, I was probably in the teenage years.

463
00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:49,600
Speaker 3: If you're not in sync and in time as a choir,

464
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:52,880
Speaker 3: it's just a mess. And I think that even sort

465
00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:55,360
Speaker 3: of got me going a bit with you know, got

466
00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:56,760
Speaker 3: to be on the river, you know, on the beat

467
00:21:56,840 --> 00:21:57,520
Speaker 3: and everything. You know.

468
00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:01,919
Speaker 1: So basically singing with a choir taught you how to

469
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:03,040
Speaker 1: blend with other voices.

470
00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:05,640
Speaker 3: And I guess, yeah, I mean, I'm still not very

471
00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:07,600
Speaker 3: good at that now, to be honest, I'm one of

472
00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:11,720
Speaker 3: those archetypal kind of big head from a person singers

473
00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:13,919
Speaker 3: that when I'm try and do harmonies, I'll do the

474
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:15,439
Speaker 3: harmony and I'm great and then at some part I

475
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:19,240
Speaker 3: go off lost it now and I start singing the yeah,

476
00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:21,399
Speaker 3: because I find it really hard to do it. And

477
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:23,199
Speaker 3: even when I do, you know, when I'm working on

478
00:22:23,280 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 3: something at home and I'm just putting harmonies in and stuff,

479
00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:28,800
Speaker 3: sometimes have to map them out on a piano and

480
00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:30,439
Speaker 3: then bang them into my head, you know, I mean

481
00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:32,320
Speaker 3: literally to be able to get me singing the harmony.

482
00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:34,000
Speaker 3: So yeah, I don't know.

483
00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:38,840
Speaker 1: So so by the mid seventies, and I've heard, you know,

484
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:43,439
Speaker 1: this narrative from people that grew up in London at

485
00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:48,640
Speaker 1: the time. I mean, so many types of music sort

486
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:51,479
Speaker 1: of avenues could be traveled by, Like of course, you know,

487
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:57,360
Speaker 1: the the punk movement is you know, is ramping up.

488
00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:00,440
Speaker 1: Then the sort of I guess you could say mod

489
00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,639
Speaker 1: movement or or you know, whatever they call Rudy's or

490
00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:10,240
Speaker 1: whatever you would categorize the specials or madness that those

491
00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:14,399
Speaker 1: types of whatever sky groups or whatever. And then of course,

492
00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:16,920
Speaker 1: you know, I know about the history of Northern soul

493
00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:20,920
Speaker 1: and generally just you know, the respect that the UK

494
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:24,359
Speaker 1: has for soul music in general. And of course you

495
00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:28,320
Speaker 1: know seventy seven is where disco is also having its moment.

496
00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:34,200
Speaker 1: What grabbed you? I mean to be eleven at that time,

497
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:37,240
Speaker 1: when there's like five options to go to. Yeah, yeah,

498
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:41,040
Speaker 1: what grabbed you the most?

499
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:44,679
Speaker 3: I think. I think I've always still I always have

500
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:49,680
Speaker 3: responded to singers full stop, because I think as much

501
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,920
Speaker 3: as I admire I mean, you know, possible getting to that,

502
00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,120
Speaker 3: I don't know, but I mean, because I started playing

503
00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:58,240
Speaker 3: drums as a kid, I always loved fans that had

504
00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:01,240
Speaker 3: interesting drummers. So the Police that he loved, and they

505
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:03,840
Speaker 3: weren't punk, but they sort of came out of the thing.

506
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:06,639
Speaker 3: Phil Collins is one of my all time favorite drummers

507
00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:08,680
Speaker 3: and he's not even remembered as a drummer at the time.

508
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:13,040
Speaker 3: It's ridiculous. But anyway, but they go, they go. I

509
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 3: know that. I think certainly with my sister, played a

510
00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:19,399
Speaker 3: lot of Motown at home, and a lot of Northern

511
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:22,320
Speaker 3: Soul as well, actually, and they're very, very very similar.

512
00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 3: And to be honest, I struggled to find out which

513
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:27,280
Speaker 3: is which half the time, but whatever, and all of

514
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,639
Speaker 3: those records and very much about the vocals. I mean,

515
00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:32,760
Speaker 3: you were mentioned in Motown before about when they used

516
00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:34,359
Speaker 3: to go out and do tours and stuff like a

517
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:38,720
Speaker 3: review tour and stuff. Any one of those vocalists would,

518
00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:42,359
Speaker 3: in my opinion anyway, kind of wipe the floor with

519
00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:45,840
Speaker 3: a lot of people who've had the chance to make

520
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 3: records since. To be honest, I think Motown was an

521
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:54,119
Speaker 3: absolute golden era for vocalists. Was even though the songwriters

522
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:57,520
Speaker 3: and producers of those records were incredible and amazing and

523
00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:00,760
Speaker 3: they had such a platform to go from as a singer,

524
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 3: those voices have stood the test of time forever, and

525
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:07,280
Speaker 3: I don't think there's a person with a pulse that

526
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:10,440
Speaker 3: doesn't respond to Motown. And obviously it's the groove, it's

527
00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:15,159
Speaker 3: the feel, it's everything. It's also because Marvin Gay, Diana Ross, whatever,

528
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:19,280
Speaker 3: you know, name any of them, when they sang you

529
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:23,440
Speaker 3: didn't question it at all. It was just truly amazing.

530
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,399
Speaker 1: Do you have a memory of your first concert.

531
00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:33,320
Speaker 3: I can't remember which came first. My sister, like I said,

532
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:35,600
Speaker 3: used to go to gigs all the time. So when

533
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:40,600
Speaker 3: I was about ten, my sister took me to see

534
00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:44,399
Speaker 3: one was Super Tramp, which is self explanatory for anybody

535
00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:46,360
Speaker 3: who knows Super Tip music, and I'm sure everyone does

536
00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:49,560
Speaker 3: unless you've been living under a rock as a ten

537
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,720
Speaker 3: year old kid. I was completely blown away, but blown

538
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:55,760
Speaker 3: away in loads of different ways. Because I was ten,

539
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,920
Speaker 3: I shouldn't really have been there, perhaps, but I think

540
00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:01,359
Speaker 3: she used to think I was like fashion accessory to

541
00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:03,400
Speaker 3: bring a ten year old kid to a gig where

542
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,480
Speaker 3: everyone's kind of smoking different things and what have you

543
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:09,400
Speaker 3: and hanging out and deliver. But it just blew me away.

544
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 3: And their music I think is because the other band,

545
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 3: and I don't know which was first, was a band

546
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 3: called Camel and that's a progressive rock band. And I've

547
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:21,080
Speaker 3: said this before, who have flute solos longer than some

548
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:22,680
Speaker 3: of the records I've made, you know what I mean.

549
00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:25,760
Speaker 3: So it's kind of like, yeah, I mean, I mean,

550
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:29,119
Speaker 3: you know, it wasn't about vocalists. It was about the music.

551
00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 3: It was, you know. And but the super Tramp One

552
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 3: I think was amazing for so many different reasons. They were,

553
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:38,440
Speaker 3: well still are, but they were such an amazing band

554
00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:41,560
Speaker 3: because they had great, like sort of pop songs. Maybe

555
00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:43,600
Speaker 3: that's not a fair term to call them, but they

556
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:46,080
Speaker 3: were very popular. So there were pop songs, but the

557
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:49,200
Speaker 3: instrumentation and the way they used to go about it

558
00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:51,919
Speaker 3: was really quirky, was really different and kind of a

559
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,320
Speaker 3: bit like nothing else, but to me anyway listening to it.

560
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:56,960
Speaker 3: So I came out of well both of those geeks,

561
00:26:56,960 --> 00:26:59,280
Speaker 3: but I can't remember which one was first. And I

562
00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:01,240
Speaker 3: think it was a game changing for me. I kind

563
00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 3: of thought, I want to do that because when the

564
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,919
Speaker 3: lights went down, it turned on the smoke machine and

565
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,560
Speaker 3: then the colored lights come on and it all even

566
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:11,280
Speaker 3: back then, you know, going to a gig was like

567
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:15,359
Speaker 3: this mystical, mythical experience. It was like something. It was

568
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:17,960
Speaker 3: like another world, you know. So yeah, so I think

569
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:20,160
Speaker 3: both of those were game changes a big time.

570
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:25,280
Speaker 1: The first band you were in it was called FBI.

571
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:26,760
Speaker 3: Well that was the second one. I was in a

572
00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:29,439
Speaker 3: band called give Way because we have a sign in

573
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 3: the UK. You may have it in America. I can't remember.

574
00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:34,040
Speaker 3: It's a triangle it says give Way. And our bass

575
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:37,400
Speaker 3: player Jeff, stole one on the way home from somewhere

576
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:39,320
Speaker 3: and stuck it in front of my drums and we said, oh,

577
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 3: that's what we're called then, right, Okay, So yeah, that

578
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:45,399
Speaker 3: was That was when I was still at high school,

579
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:49,160
Speaker 3: as you call it, And there were three bands who

580
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:52,439
Speaker 3: did an audition for the music teacher to see who

581
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 3: could play at the Valentine's Disco, right, And we were

582
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:59,560
Speaker 3: like fifteen going on sixteen at this point. And I

583
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 3: was never one of the cool kids at school. I

584
00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:04,040
Speaker 3: wasn't really a geek. I wasn't like, you know, a

585
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 3: swap or whatever. I just I just got through school,

586
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:08,399
Speaker 3: if you know what I mean. I just kept my

587
00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 3: head down and got through it. The other couple of bands,

588
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 3: one of them was all the cool kids, like there

589
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:18,040
Speaker 3: was a catching of the football soccer team captain of

590
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:20,520
Speaker 3: this day, you know, the good looking guys. They had

591
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 3: all the nice guys. But you know what I mean,

592
00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:24,960
Speaker 3: they were the cool kids, you know, and we weren't.

593
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:29,199
Speaker 3: But we could play. So we did the audition and

594
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:32,199
Speaker 3: we blew the other bands away. I was singing So

595
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,439
Speaker 3: Lonely by the Police from the drums, which was like

596
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:37,360
Speaker 3: the coolest thing in the world because it was like,

597
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 3: you know, we were doing police songs and they were

598
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:42,000
Speaker 3: doing something that wasn't anywhere near school of that. And

599
00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:44,040
Speaker 3: we did a couple of other things. We also did

600
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 3: a Joy Division song, which again was like just the

601
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 3: coolest thing in the world. I think it's you know,

602
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:52,760
Speaker 3: the teachers were not expecting that at all. And so

603
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:57,040
Speaker 3: we got the gig and I got five Valentine's Cards

604
00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 3: that year.

605
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:02,160
Speaker 1: Are you the lead singer of the group or well, no.

606
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:04,040
Speaker 3: No, no, the bass player Jeff was. But I used

607
00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:08,960
Speaker 3: to sing a couple from the drums, and.

608
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 1: And again always was then hard to sing so lonely.

609
00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 3: I sang it an octave lower. Yeah, yeah, and I

610
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 3: just think again, talk about pivotal moments and stuff. Not

611
00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:24,040
Speaker 3: because I've got the Valentine's cards, but we were We

612
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:27,600
Speaker 3: walked around school for the next two weeks as if

613
00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 3: we were different people, like people. I'm not we we

614
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 3: didn't have high five back then. I don't think. I

615
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:34,760
Speaker 3: don't think it was a thing to high five somebody.

616
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:38,600
Speaker 3: But it was like people just kind of like, you

617
00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 3: know what I mean, just getting acknowledged in the corridors

618
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:42,440
Speaker 3: at school or right in the playground or what I mean.

619
00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:45,840
Speaker 3: We were just we became different people overnight because we've

620
00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:49,520
Speaker 3: done this gig, and it was like, yeah, I don't know, really,

621
00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:51,640
Speaker 3: it was very It was very interesting I think in

622
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:56,240
Speaker 3: terms of your ego and just just the absolute joy

623
00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 3: of walking off stage going wow, we just we just

624
00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 3: did that. That just happened. People actually listened to dance

625
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:04,400
Speaker 3: and you know, so, yeah, it's pretty amazing.

626
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:08,040
Speaker 1: I went through that in high school. But I wasn't

627
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:10,040
Speaker 1: the band that blew everyone away. I was one of

628
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:15,680
Speaker 1: the bands that got blown away because I went to

629
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:21,320
Speaker 1: school with boys the men. So yeah, so I still

630
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:24,479
Speaker 1: say they cheated, but you know they you know, they

631
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:28,840
Speaker 1: had tuxedos and glitter and top hats and canes and everything,

632
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 1: and they were singing. They were singing new addition songs,

633
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 1: and I just felt like all my hopes and dreams

634
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 1: to impress, like who I wanted to impress is it

635
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 1: went down the drain, because like could.

636
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 3: They could they sing that great? Then? As well?

637
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 1: Dude? They were? They were, Yes, they were. If ever,

638
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:49,280
Speaker 1: there was a group of people ready for their close up.

639
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 1: It was boys to men. And the thing was that

640
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 1: after that Valentine's thing was over, Like girls were treating

641
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 1: them like it was you know, you ever see the

642
00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:06,000
Speaker 1: I Want to Hold Your Hand movie, first film about

643
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:08,960
Speaker 1: the Beatles. Yeah, yeah, like they were chasing them in

644
00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:11,320
Speaker 1: like seventh period and all this stuff, and I'm like,

645
00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:14,520
Speaker 1: it's just them, Like what the hell, they're not stars,

646
00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 1: they go to our school. But yeah, they after that performance,

647
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 1: things were never the same again.

648
00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:24,440
Speaker 3: Listen, I feel your pain. I also think it's a weird, weird,

649
00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:27,760
Speaker 3: weird thing. I was not one of the kind of

650
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:30,200
Speaker 3: cute kids at school or good looking kids by any

651
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 3: stretch of the imagination, right, But I think what happens

652
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,480
Speaker 3: is when you've been on TV and on a record

653
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:41,000
Speaker 3: cover and on what have you, the media themselves start

654
00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,760
Speaker 3: calling your handsome or start calling you something. I don't

655
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 3: know what, but you know, and and it's like, now

656
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 3: you got this wrong. I'm exactly the same as I

657
00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 3: was last week. It's just about a hit record. But

658
00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:53,960
Speaker 3: I mean, that is pretty crazy to be at school

659
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 3: with boys to men and them singing the way they do.

660
00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 3: If they were singing like that back then, that must

661
00:31:58,560 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 3: have been wild.

662
00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:03,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, they had every grown the palm their hands. Were

663
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:05,240
Speaker 1: you thinking of a music career by this point or

664
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:09,200
Speaker 1: was it just like, you know, our graduate school and

665
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 1: then go to university and no, I think I wanted to.

666
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,239
Speaker 3: I think my upbringing was kind of what was it.

667
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:17,840
Speaker 3: I'm from a very working class area, but my dad

668
00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 3: had a little business. He ended up having a little

669
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,440
Speaker 3: garden center and we all we all have two brothers

670
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:25,240
Speaker 3: and my sister and all of us kind of off

671
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:26,840
Speaker 3: and on did work there. And I used to work

672
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:28,960
Speaker 3: there in school, holidays and after school and all the

673
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 3: rest of it. And so we were lucky in the

674
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 3: respect that we did kind of have a little job

675
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:35,440
Speaker 3: to go to. He didn't have a big he didn't

676
00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:37,360
Speaker 3: employ lots of people or anything. I think he employed

677
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,160
Speaker 3: one or two other people, and then we kind of

678
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:42,400
Speaker 3: worked on stuff. And where we were from was kind

679
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,120
Speaker 3: of hit very very badly in the mid and late

680
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 3: eighties in terms of the way that the world changed.

681
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:49,680
Speaker 3: You know, we don't we don't manufacture so much in

682
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:52,720
Speaker 3: the UK anymore, like like Americas to that degree, you know,

683
00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 3: and we don't do a lot, you know, coal mines

684
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:57,000
Speaker 3: and all the all the old things.

685
00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 1: That industry that were still hanging on too.

686
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, and people, certainly from the little town where I'm

687
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 3: from and a lot of towns around it, those things

688
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 3: don't exist anymore. And it was in that transition period,

689
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,640
Speaker 3: you know. So we were really lucky that my dad

690
00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:12,960
Speaker 3: did have a little business and it survived and everything,

691
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:14,680
Speaker 3: but we didn't really have a lot of money or

692
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,719
Speaker 3: anything like that. And I think for me, I just

693
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:21,160
Speaker 3: I wanted to I wanted to get out of that

694
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:24,000
Speaker 3: little town and I wanted to go and do something

695
00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:27,680
Speaker 3: with my life. I don't know what that meant, and

696
00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:29,160
Speaker 3: I think the truth of it was I kind of

697
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,520
Speaker 3: felt that music was a way of possibly doing that,

698
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 3: and I did love music, don't get me wrong, I did.

699
00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 3: You know, I got a drunk it when I was fifteen,

700
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,120
Speaker 3: and I was never ever off it, just ever. I

701
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 3: used to play in my dad's greenhouse, which he used

702
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:43,440
Speaker 3: to have this fairly big glasshouse, you know, where the

703
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 3: plants were and all the rest of it. And he

704
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:47,400
Speaker 3: allowed myself to have a drunket there and my two

705
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 3: friends to come and play there as well, which is

706
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:51,160
Speaker 3: we made an awful racket, even though we were you know,

707
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:55,000
Speaker 3: we thought we were great. But so that was pretty lucky.

708
00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:57,520
Speaker 3: But I also think my mum and dad divorced when

709
00:33:57,560 --> 00:34:00,680
Speaker 3: I was really really young, and I didn't the happiest

710
00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:02,040
Speaker 3: of home lives, if you know what I mean. It

711
00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,120
Speaker 3: wasn't It wasn't tough. It wasn't horrible in what a

712
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:07,680
Speaker 3: lot of people have been tough, but it definitely left

713
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 3: the hole, there's no doubt about it. My mom and

714
00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 3: dad they both passed away now they never spoke to

715
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:16,239
Speaker 3: each other. Ever. If my mom rang the house, my

716
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:18,680
Speaker 3: dad would just kind of like he just put the

717
00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:20,920
Speaker 3: phone receiver down and walk away. And that's how we

718
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:25,080
Speaker 3: knew it was my mom. And I was brought I

719
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 3: was brought up by my dad. I lived with my dad,

720
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:29,359
Speaker 3: because it's a long story, but I saw my mom

721
00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 3: all the time. But I think I also felt somehow,

722
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:36,080
Speaker 3: even at that age, and I'm not saying I actually

723
00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 3: knew this, but I think I felt it somewhere that

724
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:42,359
Speaker 3: music and getting out of that was going to take

725
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:43,759
Speaker 3: me away from that, do you know what I mean?

726
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:45,319
Speaker 3: It was going to give me a different life where

727
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 3: I could sort of start again. And I think sometimes

728
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,600
Speaker 3: if you if you brought up in a fairly unhappy house,

729
00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 3: which I was, you just want to kind of like

730
00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 3: turn the key on the door and walk into another

731
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 3: space and just leave it where it is, do you

732
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:00,440
Speaker 3: know what I mean. I'm not saying you can't ever

733
00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:03,440
Speaker 3: go back there and just say, just just start again.

734
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,319
Speaker 3: And I did. I did feel that music was going

735
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:07,840
Speaker 3: to be the escape to do that, you know, to

736
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:11,440
Speaker 3: be coming getting a successful bound and just start again,

737
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:11,719
Speaker 3: you know.

738
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:15,720
Speaker 1: So what did the moment happened for you where you're like, Okay,

739
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:16,960
Speaker 1: I'm pursuing this.

740
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:23,600
Speaker 3: I'd have to say I was about seventeen, I think,

741
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:26,640
Speaker 3: because the band that I got in next was called FBI.

742
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 3: And the first group I was in that we were

743
00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:31,600
Speaker 3: in for a little while. One of the guys went

744
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,239
Speaker 3: to university and so we just and he's still a

745
00:35:34,239 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 3: friend today. Actually I see him for coffee like once

746
00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:40,799
Speaker 3: or two weeks were he went to university and you

747
00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:43,359
Speaker 3: know all the rest of it, and we just split up.

748
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:45,920
Speaker 3: So I joined this other group and they were like

749
00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 3: they were called FBI because of it goes back to

750
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:55,160
Speaker 3: a group called the Shadows, who were the backing band

751
00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 3: for Cliff Richard. Do you know who Cliff Richard is?

752
00:35:57,080 --> 00:36:01,759
Speaker 3: He's an English Cliff. Yeah, it goes through. So he

753
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:03,719
Speaker 3: was like the English Elvis if you like, you know

754
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:07,520
Speaker 3: what I mean? He was like the you know, and

755
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:10,880
Speaker 3: and they had a song called FBI. I think I

756
00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:13,279
Speaker 3: think that's where it comes from. And the guy who

757
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:15,400
Speaker 3: was the lead guitarist in this in this band that

758
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:19,120
Speaker 3: I joined called FBI, was a Shadows freak. He absolutely

759
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:20,400
Speaker 3: loved them, and so that his dad. I think he

760
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,520
Speaker 3: got it from his dad. Really, so they were doing

761
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:24,720
Speaker 3: covers like that. They were doing a lot of early

762
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 3: early Beatle songs, which are fantastic and great, don't get

763
00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:29,560
Speaker 3: me wrong, but I would have loved to have been

764
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:32,400
Speaker 3: playing some of the later Beatles songs, but we weren't.

765
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 3: We were playing the really really early ones, which is

766
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:37,799
Speaker 3: still great, like I say, and for a young band

767
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:42,799
Speaker 3: to learn to learn them anyway. And I got in

768
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:44,880
Speaker 3: that band as the drummer, and I sort of became

769
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 3: the singer because I wanted us to kind of try

770
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 3: and write some of our own material. And I borrowed

771
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:51,640
Speaker 3: a guitar from one of the guys and he showed

772
00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:54,319
Speaker 3: me the three chords, and so I turned up at

773
00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:56,560
Speaker 3: rehearsal a few weeks later and said, I've written some songs.

774
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:59,560
Speaker 3: Should we thrash them out? And I sort of became

775
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:01,960
Speaker 3: the singer because of that, really, because they're all looking

776
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:04,600
Speaker 3: at me, going, well, who's going to sing that? You know?

777
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:07,400
Speaker 3: And they said, well, you are so so that that's it.

778
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:09,640
Speaker 3: So we got a drummer and then from that point,

779
00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:13,040
Speaker 3: I think I just sort of became the singer by default, really,

780
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:15,000
Speaker 3: And at that point I thought, if we're going to

781
00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:17,680
Speaker 3: make this happen. I'm gonna have to push and drive this.

782
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:20,520
Speaker 3: And I think when you started doing your own songs,

783
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,280
Speaker 3: you think that's a different thing. That's not just earning

784
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:25,799
Speaker 3: living on a Friday and a Saturday and having a

785
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:27,359
Speaker 3: regular job. Do you know what I mean? Like doing

786
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:29,280
Speaker 3: your job and then earning a bit of extra money.

787
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:33,920
Speaker 3: That's how do we how do we become how do

788
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:35,879
Speaker 3: we become known? How do we get people to hear

789
00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:38,399
Speaker 3: these songs? And that that at that point is like, well,

790
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:39,279
Speaker 3: that's what I'm going to do.

791
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:42,960
Speaker 1: Then you know, by this point are you developing the

792
00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:45,319
Speaker 1: voice that we know now or you're still trying to

793
00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 1: find well.

794
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 3: I think I think one of the things is I

795
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 3: think in the eighties or late eighties, a lot a

796
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,759
Speaker 3: lot of British music there was there was more kind

797
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:55,200
Speaker 3: of it was pop, definitely pop, and it was in

798
00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 3: the charts. It was successful, but it was a lot

799
00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:01,319
Speaker 3: of people sang with a much lower tone or a

800
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:04,160
Speaker 3: lower register with their voice. It was very normal today

801
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:06,840
Speaker 3: and I think for twenty five years or more, everything's

802
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:09,399
Speaker 3: very very high with male singers most of the time.

803
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:12,719
Speaker 3: And I think back then a lot of records had

804
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:16,040
Speaker 3: a lot of for instance, the guy called Edwin Collins

805
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:18,319
Speaker 3: who was in a bank called Orange Juice, right, and

806
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 3: he had this point, yeah, yeah, And there was a

807
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:23,560
Speaker 3: lot of them. There was I'm trying to think by

808
00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:24,920
Speaker 3: now and I can't because I'm on the spot to

809
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:26,560
Speaker 3: think of them. But what I'm trying to say that

810
00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:28,719
Speaker 3: there were a lot of voices that were deeper and

811
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:30,360
Speaker 3: it was kind of cool to be that. It was

812
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:33,040
Speaker 3: edgy and it was cool. But then when I listened to,

813
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:37,640
Speaker 3: for instance, if I listened to like Bill Withers, Bill

814
00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:41,480
Speaker 3: Withers is obviously the greatest. He's written some of the greatest.

815
00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:44,000
Speaker 3: One of the things I absolutely loved and still love

816
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:46,640
Speaker 3: about Bill Withers is that he's written some of the

817
00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:49,479
Speaker 3: biggest songs in the world that five year old kids

818
00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:52,359
Speaker 3: to eighty five year old grandma's now everybody knows. They've

819
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 3: been in movies and everything. But he could probably be

820
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:57,520
Speaker 3: sat next to you eating a bowl of pasta in

821
00:38:57,560 --> 00:39:02,120
Speaker 3: a nice restaurant somewhere, and I think ninety ninety of

822
00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:04,200
Speaker 3: the people in the room wouldn't be able to recognize him.

823
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 3: And I think that was for me, was like an

824
00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:08,600
Speaker 3: amazing thing about him. Really, But that again that's another

825
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,799
Speaker 3: another universe to walk into. But I think but he

826
00:39:14,080 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 3: had all the soul in the world, his lyrics, the

827
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 3: actual music itself and the way he played and everything.

828
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:23,480
Speaker 3: But his voice obviously was incredibly soulful. But he didn't

829
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:26,320
Speaker 3: really do tricks with his voice. He didn't. He didn't

830
00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 3: do lots of trills and lots of this, that and

831
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:30,319
Speaker 3: the other, which a lot of people do associate with

832
00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:33,120
Speaker 3: soul and R and B and everything. He didn't do that.

833
00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:35,280
Speaker 3: He was for me, he was like a folk singer.

834
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:38,239
Speaker 3: Just theres a lot of soul in it, a lot

835
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 3: of soul, and so I think somebody like him. And

836
00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:45,400
Speaker 3: even though Luther could obviously do anything of his voice,

837
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:47,719
Speaker 3: and I remember seeing him live and walking out of

838
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:49,319
Speaker 3: the room and just sort of going, well, just forget

839
00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 3: it then, because that's that's that's it. There it is.

840
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:55,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, see, and in your personal time you tried to

841
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:55,919
Speaker 1: do a who.

842
00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:00,960
Speaker 3: To be honest, that no, it's the answer. I very

843
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:03,640
Speaker 3: often still sing to this day. I will always sing

844
00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:05,440
Speaker 3: never too much to my wife if we're ever in

845
00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:08,160
Speaker 3: the car, that comes on or what have you, because

846
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:10,239
Speaker 3: that's one of our songs and I always sort of

847
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:12,879
Speaker 3: sing along with it. But he was one of those

848
00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:16,759
Speaker 3: I don't care what anybody says about anybody else. He

849
00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:19,600
Speaker 3: was one of those singers that it didn't matter what

850
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:22,080
Speaker 3: where he was in the whole range of the human voice,

851
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:25,359
Speaker 3: it sounded good everywhere. He could do anything, that guy.

852
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:26,879
Speaker 3: You know, so I.

853
00:40:26,840 --> 00:40:31,760
Speaker 1: Got to know Luther's longtime manager, Sheep Gordon. I didn't

854
00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 1: realize how big Luther was in the UK. Yeah, to

855
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:41,880
Speaker 1: the point where I didn't realize that he could sell

856
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:43,720
Speaker 1: out like Wembley Arena.

857
00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:47,400
Speaker 3: Wembley was the gig back in the day. Wembley was

858
00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:50,560
Speaker 3: the gig in London. To go to Wembley Arena, Luthor,

859
00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:52,839
Speaker 3: I think, did I think multiple nights there?

860
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,319
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, he did, like eight or nine nights there,

861
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:58,759
Speaker 1: and yeah, he was telling me that basically Luther had

862
00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:02,440
Speaker 1: a more devoted and diverse fan.

863
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:05,440
Speaker 3: Base for sure, for sure over there then he.

864
00:41:05,800 --> 00:41:07,600
Speaker 1: You know here, I mean here, yes, he could still

865
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 1: you know, sell out Massive Square Garden all those things

866
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 1: like maybe one, two, three nights in a row. But

867
00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:15,360
Speaker 1: you know, he it took him a long time to

868
00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 1: sort of cross over to a pop market, you know,

869
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:21,279
Speaker 1: like here and now or do you give me the

870
00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:23,520
Speaker 1: reason like there was occasional songs that made the top ten.

871
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:26,680
Speaker 1: But yeah, yeah, I didn't realize until like I finally

872
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 1: watched like Live and Wimbley and realized that, Oh I

873
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:32,360
Speaker 1: didn't realize that Luther.

874
00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:37,719
Speaker 3: It was huge and also he I think he and

875
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:39,840
Speaker 3: and a lot of other artists around him. But I

876
00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:42,759
Speaker 3: mean he for me motally is the pinnacles, no doubt really.

877
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:45,040
Speaker 3: But I mean James Ingram was really big in the

878
00:41:45,160 --> 00:41:48,280
Speaker 3: UK as well, Jeffrey Osborne, A lot of those singers

879
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:51,400
Speaker 3: around that time that that, you know, I think a

880
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:55,960
Speaker 3: lot probably a lot of ballads were bigger as well,

881
00:41:56,120 --> 00:41:57,440
Speaker 3: if you know what I mean. I think that was

882
00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:00,839
Speaker 3: what's probably crossed them over to some degree as well.

883
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 3: You know, But we used to go we would go,

884
00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 3: I say, we're a group of friends, some of which

885
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:10,040
Speaker 3: most of which were in the second band I was in.

886
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:15,319
Speaker 3: We would go to a little night when we'd go

887
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:17,680
Speaker 3: to different clubs around us actually in different towns and

888
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:21,520
Speaker 3: into Manchester and stuff. But in our little town of Newton,

889
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:25,399
Speaker 3: Leuillow's we have a little cricket club and it's been

890
00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:28,480
Speaker 3: there forever and they used to have Monday nights and

891
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:31,480
Speaker 3: Friday nights and the Monday nights were under eighteen and

892
00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 3: the Friday were over eighteen, so there was alcohol and

893
00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:36,200
Speaker 3: all the rest of it. But they also used to

894
00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:38,759
Speaker 3: have occasionally on a Friday night, they had a guy

895
00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:40,719
Speaker 3: called keV Edwards who was a DJ in the town

896
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:43,280
Speaker 3: I'm from, and he would only he would only play

897
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:47,320
Speaker 3: records that I'm not saying all of them were imported,

898
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:50,640
Speaker 3: but he always used to have records before anybody else,

899
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:53,080
Speaker 3: so he would play and we all used to go

900
00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:55,880
Speaker 3: and we dress up. We wore jackets at times. This

901
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:58,640
Speaker 3: is in the this is in the sort of eighty

902
00:42:59,160 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 3: five eighty six, right, we would go and wear jackets

903
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:04,839
Speaker 3: and ties. Well I'm saying, yeah, eighty five eighty six

904
00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:07,880
Speaker 3: for sure, cheap ones. You know, we've just bought these

905
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:09,360
Speaker 3: jackets the ties with god knows where, do you know

906
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:11,200
Speaker 3: what I mean. But we'd all go and we're dancing

907
00:43:11,320 --> 00:43:15,160
Speaker 3: lines and all the girls, especially you, dance moves and

908
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:18,520
Speaker 3: different routines, and a certain song would come on and

909
00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:20,799
Speaker 3: for instance, let's say, I'm not sure when Never too

910
00:43:20,920 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 3: Much came out exactly, but let's say that that song

911
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 3: came on. Some of the girls had actually even have

912
00:43:25,600 --> 00:43:26,440
Speaker 3: a routine for it.

913
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:29,600
Speaker 1: Oh really, so it was choreographed.

914
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:32,279
Speaker 3: And that's not just my little town where I'm from.

915
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:34,719
Speaker 3: That is especially that was a very big thing in

916
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:37,200
Speaker 3: the north of England, but also in the South if

917
00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:41,839
Speaker 3: you speak to people about I mean not just lead

918
00:43:41,880 --> 00:43:43,640
Speaker 3: of Vantos obviously, because I like I say, he was

919
00:43:43,640 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 3: probably the biggest one to cross over in so many

920
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:48,520
Speaker 3: different ways. I think a lot of that music that

921
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:51,440
Speaker 3: was around the cane from America, Black American soul music

922
00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:55,919
Speaker 3: was a massive part of our getting down and having

923
00:43:55,920 --> 00:43:57,719
Speaker 3: a good night and having a good you know, we

924
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:01,200
Speaker 3: wouldn't even drink alcohol. We'd just go out and drink

925
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:03,520
Speaker 3: an orangey sort of coca and what have you, because

926
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:07,080
Speaker 3: we wanted to go and dance to music and that

927
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:09,120
Speaker 3: was a big thing for us. It really really was.

928
00:44:10,680 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 1: But an idea now we just do it on TikTok.

929
00:44:15,320 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, Take us on the path

930
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:27,880
Speaker 1: that leads you to actually pursuing a solo career and

931
00:44:29,160 --> 00:44:31,239
Speaker 1: meeting with Stark It.

932
00:44:32,840 --> 00:44:36,040
Speaker 3: Well, we were the second Memos in FBI. We weren't

933
00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:38,360
Speaker 3: really making waves exactly, but we were getting back to

934
00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 3: gigs and we were earning a bit of money. And

935
00:44:39,880 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 3: we were this, that and the other. We'd had one

936
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:43,759
Speaker 3: or two record labels coming have a look at us,

937
00:44:43,760 --> 00:44:46,160
Speaker 3: but they were a bit you know, we were too

938
00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:49,280
Speaker 3: naive really and we didn't really have it together really.

939
00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:52,160
Speaker 3: But anyway, one of the guys who came up to

940
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:54,719
Speaker 3: see us actually saw us in what we used to

941
00:44:54,719 --> 00:44:57,160
Speaker 3: call a battle of the bands, where you would you

942
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:00,239
Speaker 3: would have you know, over over maybe a couple of

943
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:02,320
Speaker 3: nights or even a couple of months, on different nights,

944
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:05,480
Speaker 3: banks would come together from an area and we'd all

945
00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:07,920
Speaker 3: be competing for a prize basically, but also it was

946
00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:10,800
Speaker 3: like little audiences you can get together and it's a

947
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:14,359
Speaker 3: judge as in one of those, and he requested that

948
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 3: he really would like to see us against In other words,

949
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:19,719
Speaker 3: we did a showcase for him with a couple of

950
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 3: other bands, and it sort of turns out that we

951
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:25,600
Speaker 3: kind of did that really because he liked my voice,

952
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:28,560
Speaker 3: heard something in my voice that he thought that there

953
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:30,520
Speaker 3: was some potential in it and he could do something

954
00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:34,600
Speaker 3: with it. So he asked me to come down to London,

955
00:45:34,680 --> 00:45:36,799
Speaker 3: and I did with the two guys who were kind

956
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:40,959
Speaker 3: of managing us at that point, and I didn't really

957
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:43,719
Speaker 3: exactly grasp who he was or what he was, but

958
00:45:43,760 --> 00:45:46,800
Speaker 3: he had red leather pants and he had a Jaguar.

959
00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:50,959
Speaker 3: That was enough for me. That was enough red leather

960
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:56,360
Speaker 3: pants and a Jaguar, I mean, come on, Yeah. So

961
00:45:56,840 --> 00:46:00,520
Speaker 3: I went down to London to meet him and he

962
00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:03,160
Speaker 3: kind of explained that, look, he wasn't interested in signing

963
00:46:03,280 --> 00:46:05,040
Speaker 3: the band. He didn't really want to work with bands.

964
00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:07,480
Speaker 3: He wanted to work with vocalists because he was part

965
00:46:07,520 --> 00:46:10,880
Speaker 3: of this trio that were and they weren't really famous

966
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:12,600
Speaker 3: at that point. They hadn't really had any really big

967
00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:15,520
Speaker 3: hits at that point. They were just on the cusp

968
00:46:15,560 --> 00:46:16,960
Speaker 3: of it. They were right on the edge of it.

969
00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:19,600
Speaker 3: But I didn't know that, but I kind of thought, well,

970
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:21,879
Speaker 3: I signed a little deal with their production company after

971
00:46:21,880 --> 00:46:24,520
Speaker 3: about six months of chatting a couple of times about it,

972
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:26,879
Speaker 3: because I didn't really want to leave my friends, which

973
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 3: they were they were, you know, my closest friends, and

974
00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:30,719
Speaker 3: arrested it. But in the end, I thought, look, I

975
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:33,520
Speaker 3: drive the vand I write the songs. Sometimes I have

976
00:46:33,520 --> 00:46:35,839
Speaker 3: to get people out of bed, so I'm just going

977
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:37,399
Speaker 3: to give this a try. And I did.

978
00:46:38,719 --> 00:46:41,399
Speaker 1: And how hard was it breaking the news to them? Though?

979
00:46:42,239 --> 00:46:45,040
Speaker 3: Well, that wasn't comfortable at all. I thought one or

980
00:46:45,080 --> 00:46:47,759
Speaker 3: two of us were going to come to actual you know,

981
00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:51,480
Speaker 3: fists and what everybody didn't. They didn't and it was all,

982
00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:55,359
Speaker 3: you know, but it wasn't great, I'm honest. And at

983
00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:57,000
Speaker 3: one point we were just going to try and keep

984
00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:58,680
Speaker 3: the band together and I was going to pursue this

985
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 3: and see what happened and see if we could marry

986
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:03,880
Speaker 3: the two together or get something going with a single

987
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:07,720
Speaker 3: or two and then see what we could do. But anyway,

988
00:47:07,760 --> 00:47:09,840
Speaker 3: I signed the deal with them after after a little while,

989
00:47:10,120 --> 00:47:14,960
Speaker 3: and then and then amazingly I had a number one

990
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 3: record with an artist called Princess number one, so.

991
00:47:24,560 --> 00:47:30,200
Speaker 1: You know that too, yeah, starters adding wait see some

992
00:47:30,239 --> 00:47:30,920
Speaker 1: of the UK.

993
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:34,760
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah, dog Season Brooklyn.

994
00:47:38,200 --> 00:47:41,400
Speaker 1: And number one Damn I did that.

995
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:44,600
Speaker 3: So I was kind of around. They had their own

996
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:48,520
Speaker 3: studio and I was kind of around in the process

997
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:50,400
Speaker 3: of them. I'm not saying I was on the sessions.

998
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:52,680
Speaker 3: I wasn't, but I was kind of around a little bit.

999
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:56,800
Speaker 3: And so they had this number one record and everyone

1000
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:58,960
Speaker 3: in the business in the UK went, what is that?

1001
00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:01,439
Speaker 3: Who is that? What's who was? Who she was? Who

1002
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:04,480
Speaker 3: produced it? We wrote it What's going on? Because it

1003
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:07,560
Speaker 3: was quite it was a big record, it was a

1004
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:09,839
Speaker 3: number one record, but I mean it was also quite

1005
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:11,400
Speaker 3: a sort of an ear turn. It was like, what

1006
00:48:11,600 --> 00:48:11,880
Speaker 3: is that?

1007
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 2: Because it was?

1008
00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:16,319
Speaker 3: It was? It was it. It had like a toe

1009
00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:18,640
Speaker 3: in a lot of different places, if you know what

1010
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:21,759
Speaker 3: I mean, a finger in lots of pies. I don't know.

1011
00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:23,880
Speaker 3: It wasn't I'm not saying it wasn't R and B,

1012
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 3: but it sort of wasn't. And it was very British sounding,

1013
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:28,880
Speaker 3: but it also sounded kind of like she was a

1014
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:30,640
Speaker 3: great singer. Obviously is a great thing, you know, but

1015
00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:32,920
Speaker 3: I'm saying it it could have been. It was a

1016
00:48:32,920 --> 00:48:34,960
Speaker 3: lot of things, you know. Anyway, it was it was

1017
00:48:35,160 --> 00:48:35,600
Speaker 3: to me, it.

1018
00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:38,120
Speaker 1: Was like a less song. It wasn't a ballot, but

1019
00:48:38,160 --> 00:48:40,719
Speaker 1: it also wasn't a jam. But I always heard it

1020
00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:45,880
Speaker 1: in clubs and even even the chord structures and stuff like.

1021
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:49,399
Speaker 1: It was very dreamy sounding and very very unique song.

1022
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:49,839
Speaker 1: I love.

1023
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,040
Speaker 3: I think it's a cool record. I think so anyway,

1024
00:48:54,120 --> 00:48:57,880
Speaker 3: So and at the time they're also working they just

1025
00:48:57,920 --> 00:49:02,040
Speaker 3: started working around that time on Dead or Alive, so

1026
00:49:02,080 --> 00:49:04,200
Speaker 3: that you know, you spin me around record that whole

1027
00:49:04,239 --> 00:49:07,880
Speaker 3: album and everything right and the record industry I think,

1028
00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm going back. I'm kind of putting the thoughts.

1029
00:49:10,280 --> 00:49:11,839
Speaker 3: I'm not saying I had the thoughts at the time.

1030
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:14,200
Speaker 3: I'm just remembering what was going on and what I

1031
00:49:14,280 --> 00:49:17,879
Speaker 3: must have been thinking. But they they were looking at meeting,

1032
00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:20,080
Speaker 3: we'll sign this kid, and I think they'd signed somebody

1033
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:22,000
Speaker 3: else as well, but we're not going to get to

1034
00:49:22,040 --> 00:49:23,480
Speaker 3: work on them because all of a sudden we're like

1035
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:25,840
Speaker 3: beginning to be a little bit hot as producer writers,

1036
00:49:25,880 --> 00:49:28,200
Speaker 3: and people are asking for us to do things. So

1037
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:30,239
Speaker 3: we can't start doing our own projects because people are

1038
00:49:30,239 --> 00:49:32,360
Speaker 3: throwing money out us and we need to pay the bills.

1039
00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:35,880
Speaker 3: So in a nutshell, people kind of sat me down.

1040
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:39,799
Speaker 3: I said, look, we're gonna, you know, we are going

1041
00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:41,200
Speaker 3: to make a record, but we've got to get on

1042
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:42,600
Speaker 3: with this thing right now. Do you want to come

1043
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:45,799
Speaker 3: and live in London and you become like an assistant,

1044
00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:48,040
Speaker 3: hang out of the studios, get to see how we

1045
00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:50,719
Speaker 3: do things. Because I was greenish Glass, I was pretty nervous.

1046
00:49:50,960 --> 00:49:52,959
Speaker 3: I don't have to live like twice in my life

1047
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:55,799
Speaker 3: before then anyway, you know, And so I got to

1048
00:49:55,880 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 3: live and I ended up living it. It's flat for

1049
00:49:58,000 --> 00:49:59,640
Speaker 3: the first weeks of it and everything, and I just

1050
00:49:59,719 --> 00:50:01,920
Speaker 3: used to go into the so I would he'd be

1051
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:04,120
Speaker 3: driving his Porsche, because he had a Porsche as well

1052
00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:06,200
Speaker 3: at this point, so he must have been doing something right.

1053
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:09,080
Speaker 3: He'd be driving this Porsch and he'd be on his

1054
00:50:09,200 --> 00:50:13,040
Speaker 3: massive eighties phone having his conversations, and I'm sat next

1055
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:14,960
Speaker 3: to him, his nineteen year old kid, going, I have

1056
00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:17,200
Speaker 3: no idea about the languages using because it was all

1057
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:19,920
Speaker 3: about record deals and A and R people, which I

1058
00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:21,400
Speaker 3: didn't even know what an A and R man was

1059
00:50:21,440 --> 00:50:23,680
Speaker 3: at that point. All this different stuff and I'm just

1060
00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:26,440
Speaker 3: trying to soak it up and learn, you know. So

1061
00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:28,640
Speaker 3: I ended up being at their building i'd say for

1062
00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:33,160
Speaker 3: nine months, maybe even a year, and I made tea, coffee,

1063
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:35,200
Speaker 3: got the sandwiches like all the other kids did in

1064
00:50:35,239 --> 00:50:37,200
Speaker 3: the building, you know, all the tapeops as it used

1065
00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:40,280
Speaker 3: to be. And then Banana Arma came in the building

1066
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:42,000
Speaker 3: and they made some great records for them, and it

1067
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:43,560
Speaker 3: just kept going. So they made all this and then

1068
00:50:43,600 --> 00:50:46,880
Speaker 3: there was this sister's duo called melon Kin who they

1069
00:50:46,880 --> 00:50:48,359
Speaker 3: had a massive success with as well.

1070
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:51,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, first the Weekend, Yeah, there you go. He did

1071
00:50:51,880 --> 00:50:52,200
Speaker 1: that too.

1072
00:50:52,520 --> 00:50:53,480
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, they did that.

1073
00:50:56,120 --> 00:50:57,799
Speaker 2: Live, but it still like is that team and it's

1074
00:50:57,840 --> 00:50:58,320
Speaker 2: still alive?

1075
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:02,640
Speaker 3: Yeah the three yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah.

1076
00:51:02,640 --> 00:51:04,480
Speaker 3: They don't work together anymore, but they're all still going

1077
00:51:04,520 --> 00:51:05,440
Speaker 3: yeah yeah yeah.

1078
00:51:05,320 --> 00:51:06,840
Speaker 2: Okay yeah.

1079
00:51:06,960 --> 00:51:09,440
Speaker 1: Dude, I have no clue that this was coming from London,

1080
00:51:09,719 --> 00:51:14,759
Speaker 1: Like in my head, like I thought this was all

1081
00:51:14,880 --> 00:51:16,399
Speaker 1: like New York stuff, like.

1082
00:51:16,320 --> 00:51:18,799
Speaker 3: Well, they would be they would be really happy to

1083
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:21,799
Speaker 3: hear that, to be honest, because I think I think

1084
00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:24,040
Speaker 3: the thing with those guys what used to frustrate me

1085
00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:27,920
Speaker 3: at times later on this is is that they they

1086
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:30,520
Speaker 3: got pigeonholed, but they almost did it themselves. They kind

1087
00:51:30,520 --> 00:51:32,319
Speaker 3: of created a sound and went that's what we do

1088
00:51:33,000 --> 00:51:37,080
Speaker 3: and that's it, right, And I think artists fitted into

1089
00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:39,960
Speaker 3: that sound more than then, but in the early beginnings

1090
00:51:40,000 --> 00:51:41,600
Speaker 3: of it, I don't think they did. If you listen

1091
00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:43,560
Speaker 3: to that same my Number one record, you listen to

1092
00:51:43,560 --> 00:51:46,000
Speaker 3: Spin Me Around, you listen to Melon Kin, they have

1093
00:51:46,239 --> 00:51:49,840
Speaker 3: very three, very different sounding records, different artists, different everything,

1094
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:53,239
Speaker 3: and I think they wanted to emulate like a motown,

1095
00:51:54,040 --> 00:51:56,719
Speaker 3: But unfortunately for me, I think they didn't then go

1096
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:59,720
Speaker 3: out and try and find Diana Ross, Marvin Gay, Stevie Wonder.

1097
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:02,239
Speaker 3: They thought they were good enough to get anyone to

1098
00:52:02,239 --> 00:52:05,160
Speaker 3: sing their songs and still have that thing, you know

1099
00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:05,600
Speaker 3: what I mean?

1100
00:52:06,600 --> 00:52:09,439
Speaker 1: So at what point are they ready to put you in?

1101
00:52:09,800 --> 00:52:11,200
Speaker 1: Like are you ready?

1102
00:52:11,680 --> 00:52:13,480
Speaker 3: One of the things that one of the issues was,

1103
00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:16,759
Speaker 3: well this is well, I'll just explain this for a second,

1104
00:52:16,800 --> 00:52:19,759
Speaker 3: because right, so they'd signed me to their production deal, right,

1105
00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:24,080
Speaker 3: their little production company, which sort of went on on

1106
00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:25,960
Speaker 3: the back burner. It kind of got shoved to the

1107
00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:29,920
Speaker 3: side because they were producing major hit records for artists

1108
00:52:29,920 --> 00:52:32,320
Speaker 3: and the you know, with big record deals, you know

1109
00:52:32,360 --> 00:52:36,239
Speaker 3: what I mean. So Pete Waterman said, right, I need

1110
00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:40,560
Speaker 3: to sign Rick to a major record label because this

1111
00:52:40,680 --> 00:52:42,680
Speaker 3: is the way this is going to work. Really them

1112
00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:46,239
Speaker 3: doing it themselves. They did do eventually, but I think

1113
00:52:46,239 --> 00:52:47,799
Speaker 3: they just thought, we just need to get him signed

1114
00:52:47,840 --> 00:52:50,200
Speaker 3: to a major record label and give it a really

1115
00:52:50,200 --> 00:52:52,080
Speaker 3: big push and all the rest of it. I think

1116
00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:54,319
Speaker 3: they were seeing what was happening with some of those

1117
00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:57,760
Speaker 3: records and thinking, right now, at the end of the eighties,

1118
00:52:57,760 --> 00:52:59,360
Speaker 3: you need to be with a major label. That's the

1119
00:52:59,400 --> 00:53:02,200
Speaker 3: way to do that, you know what I mean. So

1120
00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:04,120
Speaker 3: so we went to see a guy called Peter Robinson

1121
00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:05,800
Speaker 3: who was the head of A and R at RCA

1122
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:09,000
Speaker 3: in the UK. Lovely guy. I've just just met him

1123
00:53:09,000 --> 00:53:13,680
Speaker 3: again recently a few times, actually, lovely guy. And he said, well,

1124
00:53:13,719 --> 00:53:16,279
Speaker 3: this is all great to Pete Waterman, but I need

1125
00:53:16,320 --> 00:53:18,160
Speaker 3: to hear Rick sing in front of me. I need

1126
00:53:18,200 --> 00:53:21,240
Speaker 3: to see him sing songs here, sing these just sing

1127
00:53:21,239 --> 00:53:23,120
Speaker 3: some songs from me. I can't sign the guy just

1128
00:53:23,120 --> 00:53:25,520
Speaker 3: because you know he's going to be your next artist

1129
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:27,000
Speaker 3: and you say he's great and all the rest of it.

1130
00:53:27,160 --> 00:53:30,800
Speaker 1: What I wow, exactly, that doesn't happen now.

1131
00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, so we're in the car, we're in the

1132
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:36,319
Speaker 3: Porsche on the way back, and he's on the phone, right,

1133
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:39,880
Speaker 3: and he said to Matt and Mike, which is stocking

1134
00:53:39,960 --> 00:53:42,440
Speaker 3: aching and they are the two musicians in the threesome. Really,

1135
00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:45,399
Speaker 3: Pete's more an R and ideas and all that said, right,

1136
00:53:45,560 --> 00:53:47,600
Speaker 3: you need to do like a little showcase with Rick

1137
00:53:47,640 --> 00:53:51,040
Speaker 3: singing for Pete Robinson at RCA. And they both went, Nope,

1138
00:53:51,280 --> 00:53:54,520
Speaker 3: that's not what we do. We're making records. So Pete said, right,

1139
00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:56,960
Speaker 3: you know those demos you've got rich and I've done

1140
00:53:57,000 --> 00:53:59,319
Speaker 3: these little demos in a four track studio back in

1141
00:53:59,320 --> 00:54:03,600
Speaker 3: the hometown where from I went up north, went home,

1142
00:54:04,760 --> 00:54:07,759
Speaker 3: got the vocals taken off, brought them down on a cassette,

1143
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:12,720
Speaker 3: played the cassette for Pete Waterman, Peter Robinson from RTA,

1144
00:54:13,160 --> 00:54:14,920
Speaker 3: a couple of other people, one of my kind of

1145
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:17,719
Speaker 3: managers at the time, and I sang on an s

1146
00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:20,520
Speaker 3: M fifty eight microphone, which to everybody listening, he doesn't

1147
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:23,319
Speaker 3: know is the bog standard. That's what you're using it? Yeah, yeah,

1148
00:54:23,320 --> 00:54:26,239
Speaker 3: there you go, no reverb. And it just came out

1149
00:54:26,239 --> 00:54:28,480
Speaker 3: of the shitty speaker that I'd found in the basement

1150
00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:30,440
Speaker 3: because I was one of the tapops making tea and

1151
00:54:30,440 --> 00:54:33,120
Speaker 3: getting the biscuits right. So how you where your here was?

1152
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:36,200
Speaker 3: And I sang in the reception to four of my

1153
00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:39,560
Speaker 3: songs that I'd done right. I played everything, demo and everything.

1154
00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:43,719
Speaker 3: So as soon as I've finished the songs, Peter Robinson

1155
00:54:43,800 --> 00:54:49,080
Speaker 3: from RCA says, who wrote these songs? And Pete Waterman

1156
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:51,799
Speaker 3: at this point has got no intention of me ever

1157
00:54:51,840 --> 00:54:56,560
Speaker 3: writing a song, said, oh, he's a great songwriter as well,

1158
00:54:56,920 --> 00:54:59,520
Speaker 3: so because obviously he knew within a second that that

1159
00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:01,160
Speaker 3: that was the that was his way that he was

1160
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:03,879
Speaker 3: going to get a major deal the artist that they

1161
00:55:04,239 --> 00:55:07,799
Speaker 3: signed and owned and you know whatever. So I ended up.

1162
00:55:08,520 --> 00:55:11,560
Speaker 3: I ended up from that point getting like I got

1163
00:55:11,600 --> 00:55:13,360
Speaker 3: four songs on the first album. I didn't get a

1164
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:15,360
Speaker 3: single on the first album, but I got four songs,

1165
00:55:16,040 --> 00:55:18,480
Speaker 3: and I got like a few more on the next

1166
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:20,319
Speaker 3: record and stuff like that. But I was sort of

1167
00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:23,560
Speaker 3: all of a sudden, I was getting to do my demos.

1168
00:55:23,719 --> 00:55:25,640
Speaker 3: I think it already was, actually, but I was getting

1169
00:55:25,640 --> 00:55:28,280
Speaker 3: to do like, really was getting to do my demos

1170
00:55:28,880 --> 00:55:32,680
Speaker 3: on like an SSL board with an engineer who last

1171
00:55:32,680 --> 00:55:34,600
Speaker 3: week had been making a number one record with Dead

1172
00:55:34,680 --> 00:55:37,000
Speaker 3: or Alive or whatever. And I'm doing my demos like

1173
00:55:37,040 --> 00:55:40,120
Speaker 3: that because that's just the way it was, you know.

1174
00:55:40,239 --> 00:55:41,719
Speaker 3: And I used to do them at the weekend or

1175
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:45,680
Speaker 3: through the night. And so I can't remember what we

1176
00:55:45,719 --> 00:55:47,400
Speaker 3: were talking about to girls because I was getting excited

1177
00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:49,120
Speaker 3: again remembering all that. But anyway, it was like a

1178
00:55:49,200 --> 00:55:51,399
Speaker 3: mad It was a mad one of those moments where

1179
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:53,680
Speaker 3: it's like I'm just going to sing their songs and

1180
00:55:53,719 --> 00:55:57,240
Speaker 3: that's cool. We'll just see where it goes to. Okay,

1181
00:55:57,400 --> 00:56:00,360
Speaker 3: now my songs are involved, and they were naive songs.

1182
00:56:00,360 --> 00:56:03,839
Speaker 3: Don't get me wrong. They really really were. But you know, yeah,

1183
00:56:03,880 --> 00:56:05,640
Speaker 3: I don't know. I was really lucky, I think, to

1184
00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:09,560
Speaker 3: be at the stockaching Waterman moment where it exploded and

1185
00:56:09,560 --> 00:56:12,239
Speaker 3: they became this huge thing. And even though it hung

1186
00:56:12,360 --> 00:56:15,120
Speaker 3: around for almost a year making tea and getting the

1187
00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:17,200
Speaker 3: sandwiches and tidying up the room, you know, me doing

1188
00:56:17,200 --> 00:56:20,440
Speaker 3: all that stuff, I also got to do a lot

1189
00:56:20,480 --> 00:56:21,919
Speaker 3: of stuff. Like I used to go to the pub

1190
00:56:22,040 --> 00:56:24,759
Speaker 3: every night with the guys and I was allowed to

1191
00:56:24,800 --> 00:56:27,520
Speaker 3: sit on their table while they talked about, you know,

1192
00:56:27,560 --> 00:56:29,640
Speaker 3: how to produce this, and they talk about, well have

1193
00:56:29,719 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 3: you heard this new record that kicked on the way

1194
00:56:31,640 --> 00:56:34,160
Speaker 3: that that was this or this baseline is amazing or

1195
00:56:34,160 --> 00:56:36,759
Speaker 3: what I mean. And it was it was like a

1196
00:56:37,880 --> 00:56:40,080
Speaker 3: like doing an internship. But I just didn't realize I

1197
00:56:40,120 --> 00:56:40,600
Speaker 3: was doing it.

1198
00:56:40,640 --> 00:56:44,480
Speaker 1: You know, were you around for like one of the

1199
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:47,880
Speaker 1: songwriting sessions when they're putting songs together or is it

1200
00:56:47,920 --> 00:56:49,360
Speaker 1: always just here sing this?

1201
00:56:50,560 --> 00:56:53,000
Speaker 3: I mean no, I mean they're never going to give

1202
00:56:53,000 --> 00:56:54,680
Speaker 3: you up. For instance, the first, you know, my first

1203
00:56:54,719 --> 00:56:58,160
Speaker 3: song and biggest one. Obviously they'd hired a guy called

1204
00:56:58,160 --> 00:57:00,960
Speaker 3: Ian kern Or. He was a he wasn't a programmer,

1205
00:57:00,960 --> 00:57:03,719
Speaker 3: but he became a programmer for them, and I mean

1206
00:57:03,960 --> 00:57:06,720
Speaker 3: programming the loose terms of He was an amazing keyboard

1207
00:57:06,719 --> 00:57:08,920
Speaker 3: player and he you know, put tracks together, following stuff

1208
00:57:08,920 --> 00:57:12,120
Speaker 3: and ideas and stuff. So Mike Stock came down to

1209
00:57:12,200 --> 00:57:15,040
Speaker 3: his room and I was literally making the coffee. I

1210
00:57:15,120 --> 00:57:17,360
Speaker 3: remember it. I had just made a fresh pot of coffee.

1211
00:57:17,600 --> 00:57:20,760
Speaker 3: Mike Stock comes down. They just put a fair like computer.

1212
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:22,280
Speaker 3: I don't know whether you guys ever worked with a

1213
00:57:22,360 --> 00:57:24,480
Speaker 3: fairlight back in the day, yes, And I was like

1214
00:57:24,600 --> 00:57:26,960
Speaker 3: completely blown away by this. I was like, what what

1215
00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:29,800
Speaker 3: world are we living in? You know? And so Ian

1216
00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:32,439
Speaker 3: set to work, and Mike Stott came down. He put

1217
00:57:32,480 --> 00:57:34,880
Speaker 3: the chords in and he kind of sang in the melody,

1218
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:38,320
Speaker 3: the rough melody, you know, and Ian was making some

1219
00:57:38,440 --> 00:57:40,680
Speaker 3: notes and all the rest of it. So I just

1220
00:57:40,800 --> 00:57:43,120
Speaker 3: kept seeing going the coffee and biscuits and sandwiches or

1221
00:57:43,160 --> 00:57:46,360
Speaker 3: whatever he wanted. And I sat there, having just heard

1222
00:57:46,520 --> 00:57:49,400
Speaker 3: my first single, and then kind of watched it get

1223
00:57:49,400 --> 00:57:52,240
Speaker 3: put together. And then obviously we went upstairs and took

1224
00:57:52,240 --> 00:57:53,840
Speaker 3: it into the big room and all the rest of it,

1225
00:57:53,880 --> 00:57:56,360
Speaker 3: and you know, and that song went through so many

1226
00:57:56,360 --> 00:57:59,960
Speaker 3: transitions because the bassline and the drums were very, very

1227
00:58:00,000 --> 00:58:02,400
Speaker 3: different than when they began, and I've got to give

1228
00:58:02,400 --> 00:58:04,480
Speaker 3: credit to the Stock and Wantant guys for that, but

1229
00:58:04,520 --> 00:58:06,560
Speaker 3: I've got to give more credit to Colonel Abrahams, to

1230
00:58:06,600 --> 00:58:12,680
Speaker 3: be honest, because they pinched the bassline from tracks exactly.

1231
00:58:13,040 --> 00:58:15,520
Speaker 3: And I think I was kind of one of the

1232
00:58:15,720 --> 00:58:18,520
Speaker 3: only artists who was actually part of their setup, if

1233
00:58:18,560 --> 00:58:20,320
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. A lot of the other

1234
00:58:20,400 --> 00:58:22,560
Speaker 3: artists came in and yeend some of them actually wrote

1235
00:58:22,600 --> 00:58:25,120
Speaker 3: with Stock Andky Mortmon or just came into the vocals

1236
00:58:25,200 --> 00:58:27,920
Speaker 3: or whatever it was. But I'd literally been round to

1237
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:31,919
Speaker 3: the you know, the greasy spoon cafe to get their

1238
00:58:32,200 --> 00:58:34,600
Speaker 3: lunches for the last six months, you know what I mean,

1239
00:58:34,640 --> 00:58:36,120
Speaker 3: and got the coffee and all the rest of it.

1240
00:58:36,560 --> 00:58:39,000
Speaker 3: And I even remember there was one session where a

1241
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:41,520
Speaker 3: guy had come in to do a sax solo on

1242
00:58:41,600 --> 00:58:43,959
Speaker 3: a song. It was actually they were doing a cover

1243
00:58:44,040 --> 00:58:47,840
Speaker 3: of Ain't Proud to beg by the Temptations because people

1244
00:58:47,880 --> 00:58:49,880
Speaker 3: wanted me to sing some songs like that just to

1245
00:58:49,920 --> 00:58:52,680
Speaker 3: test my voice out and see whatever. So this guy

1246
00:58:52,720 --> 00:58:54,479
Speaker 3: came in to do a solo on it, and he said,

1247
00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:57,080
Speaker 3: he said, who's singing that? It's a great voice, that

1248
00:58:57,200 --> 00:59:00,000
Speaker 3: who's singing, and Matt Aikin, one of the producers, said,

1249
00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:02,320
Speaker 3: don't say too much because he's just walking in now

1250
00:59:02,360 --> 00:59:07,960
Speaker 3: with your coffee. It was like, it was so upside

1251
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:10,400
Speaker 3: down that I'm making coffee for the guy who's doing

1252
00:59:10,400 --> 00:59:13,120
Speaker 3: the saxophone solo on my god dumb record. But it

1253
00:59:13,200 --> 00:59:17,240
Speaker 3: was also it was also pretty amazing because I kind

1254
00:59:17,240 --> 00:59:18,760
Speaker 3: of felt a bit more part of it, and I

1255
00:59:18,800 --> 00:59:21,360
Speaker 3: felt a bit more. I'm not saying that I earned

1256
00:59:21,440 --> 00:59:24,680
Speaker 3: the right to be there, but I think I at

1257
00:59:24,760 --> 00:59:29,080
Speaker 3: least I understood a bit more than perhaps sometimes when

1258
00:59:29,760 --> 00:59:32,480
Speaker 3: a young kid gets plucked from obscurity, just say right,

1259
00:59:32,600 --> 00:59:34,720
Speaker 3: sing this right, off you go. This is the suit

1260
00:59:34,760 --> 00:59:36,120
Speaker 3: you're gonna wear, Now, off you go. Do you know

1261
00:59:36,160 --> 00:59:39,960
Speaker 3: what I mean? I just felt like I kind of yeah.

1262
00:59:39,600 --> 00:59:42,120
Speaker 1: You know that that was Marvin's start too. You know,

1263
00:59:42,200 --> 00:59:44,840
Speaker 1: he started out at Motown running errands.

1264
00:59:45,520 --> 00:59:47,320
Speaker 3: I don't know, Wow, Yeah, he was.

1265
00:59:47,360 --> 00:59:49,440
Speaker 1: Like running erons first, and then like he was like

1266
00:59:49,520 --> 00:59:52,960
Speaker 1: house drummer, and then you know, once he started closing

1267
00:59:53,000 --> 00:59:55,760
Speaker 1: up to Anna Gordy, then she realized that he had

1268
00:59:55,800 --> 00:59:59,960
Speaker 1: a velvety voice and was sort of like, hey, you're

1269
01:00:00,080 --> 01:00:04,480
Speaker 1: know you're obviously doing the wrong jobs. You it's time

1270
01:00:04,520 --> 01:00:05,400
Speaker 1: that you start singing.

1271
01:00:05,720 --> 01:00:07,560
Speaker 3: I don't even imagine that. He's also one of the

1272
01:00:07,560 --> 01:00:10,200
Speaker 3: most beautiful looking men that's ever walked the earth. And

1273
01:00:10,240 --> 01:00:12,320
Speaker 3: it's like with that the way he looked in that voice,

1274
01:00:12,440 --> 01:00:14,440
Speaker 3: like I seen that before.

1275
01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:18,120
Speaker 1: You know, that's how he nabbed Anna Gordy to to

1276
01:00:18,120 --> 01:00:21,000
Speaker 1: get to the front of the line. So you know,

1277
01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:24,200
Speaker 1: and you're well to hear you tell the story. It's

1278
01:00:24,240 --> 01:00:27,000
Speaker 1: like you know, you you were just around you run

1279
01:00:27,040 --> 01:00:29,640
Speaker 1: an errand you're going to sing the song whatever. At

1280
01:00:29,680 --> 01:00:36,120
Speaker 1: what point does it hit you that, like, yo, this

1281
01:00:36,320 --> 01:00:39,960
Speaker 1: is making it because it's not like you're one, you know,

1282
01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:43,040
Speaker 1: and I know that this song is now going to

1283
01:00:43,280 --> 01:00:48,800
Speaker 1: live forever in in you know, past pop culture. But

1284
01:00:48,840 --> 01:00:51,720
Speaker 1: it's also over shaddling the fact that you also had

1285
01:00:51,760 --> 01:00:55,240
Speaker 1: like eight other you know, top ten hits as well.

1286
01:00:55,680 --> 01:00:58,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, but I also think that happens with artists sometimes.

1287
01:00:58,280 --> 01:01:00,560
Speaker 3: I mean, obviously you can look at greats and I

1288
01:01:00,600 --> 01:01:03,240
Speaker 3: don't know how many greats got, and a lot of

1289
01:01:03,360 --> 01:01:05,880
Speaker 3: artists and I'll throw myself in that I've got one

1290
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:08,040
Speaker 3: that everyone would remember them from, and then when they

1291
01:01:08,080 --> 01:01:10,320
Speaker 3: go on Spotify or what I mean to go, oh,

1292
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:12,400
Speaker 3: I can't remember that one as well, and oh did

1293
01:01:12,400 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 3: he do that? Didn't know that?

1294
01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:13,680
Speaker 1: You know what I mean.

1295
01:01:13,720 --> 01:01:15,560
Speaker 3: There's a bit of that going on. But so I

1296
01:01:15,600 --> 01:01:17,640
Speaker 3: don't feel any I'm not I don't, I don't know

1297
01:01:17,680 --> 01:01:19,600
Speaker 3: any hang ups about. I'm glad I've got that song

1298
01:01:19,640 --> 01:01:23,480
Speaker 3: because it sort of opens doors and windows for me

1299
01:01:23,560 --> 01:01:25,440
Speaker 3: all the time. So I'm okay with it, you know.

1300
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:28,320
Speaker 1: But it's weird to hear that because most of the

1301
01:01:28,360 --> 01:01:32,400
Speaker 1: time I'll run into artists that hate their biggest you know,

1302
01:01:32,960 --> 01:01:36,840
Speaker 1: like Nirvana famously stopped playing Smells like teen Spirit the

1303
01:01:36,920 --> 01:01:39,920
Speaker 1: last year and a half day. Las Soul hates me

1304
01:01:40,000 --> 01:01:43,480
Speaker 1: myself and I I'm working with Mary J. Bligee right now,

1305
01:01:43,680 --> 01:01:47,680
Speaker 1: and Jesus h like, you know, the amount of number

1306
01:01:47,680 --> 01:01:49,360
Speaker 1: one songs he has were It's like, I don't do

1307
01:01:49,400 --> 01:01:50,840
Speaker 1: that no more. I don't do that, no more. I

1308
01:01:50,880 --> 01:01:52,720
Speaker 1: don't do that Like it's like good morning.

1309
01:01:52,920 --> 01:01:55,000
Speaker 3: I think I think a lot of it, though I

1310
01:01:55,040 --> 01:01:57,600
Speaker 3: don't know. We're jumping times frame now, but a lot

1311
01:01:57,600 --> 01:01:59,400
Speaker 3: of it goes to the fact that when I kind

1312
01:01:59,400 --> 01:02:03,280
Speaker 3: of quit, I was about twenty seven to twenty eight,

1313
01:02:03,920 --> 01:02:06,400
Speaker 3: and I've quit for a lot of reasons. I'd had enough.

1314
01:02:06,800 --> 01:02:08,840
Speaker 3: I knew the writing was on the wall. To sustain

1315
01:02:08,880 --> 01:02:12,400
Speaker 3: any kind of pop career. It's almost impossible, to be honest,

1316
01:02:12,520 --> 01:02:14,240
Speaker 3: as we say, there are some greats you've done it,

1317
01:02:14,240 --> 01:02:16,840
Speaker 3: but it's so difficult, you know, because it just is.

1318
01:02:17,240 --> 01:02:20,680
Speaker 3: And you've got to give everything, everything you've got, time wise,

1319
01:02:20,680 --> 01:02:23,520
Speaker 3: effort wise, everything, all your energy everything to it. And

1320
01:02:23,760 --> 01:02:26,440
Speaker 3: I was a bit sick of it, and I just

1321
01:02:26,440 --> 01:02:28,560
Speaker 3: didn't want to do it anymore. Blah blah, all those reasons.

1322
01:02:28,600 --> 01:02:30,320
Speaker 3: I was super lucky I got to do it for

1323
01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:33,480
Speaker 3: the time I did, so I didn't sing never going

1324
01:02:33,480 --> 01:02:35,600
Speaker 3: to give You Up altogether forever or anything else for

1325
01:02:35,640 --> 01:02:38,520
Speaker 3: about fifteen years. The only time I have or maybe more, actually,

1326
01:02:38,600 --> 01:02:41,760
Speaker 3: the only time I ever did it was at friend's weddings.

1327
01:02:42,000 --> 01:02:44,400
Speaker 3: That's the only time I ever did it right. And

1328
01:02:44,440 --> 01:02:46,320
Speaker 3: now I do it at friends kids weddings, which is

1329
01:02:46,680 --> 01:02:49,120
Speaker 3: which is even greater to be honest, that really that

1330
01:02:49,240 --> 01:02:51,000
Speaker 3: gets me right there that they want me to do that,

1331
01:02:51,080 --> 01:02:53,480
Speaker 3: So that's cool. But I didn't sing those songs. I

1332
01:02:53,480 --> 01:02:54,960
Speaker 3: didn't sing never going to give You Up, you know,

1333
01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:58,439
Speaker 3: night after night or dirt. And I've sort of lived

1334
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:03,439
Speaker 3: a very simple, very comfortable. Thank Evans, and I do

1335
01:03:03,920 --> 01:03:06,240
Speaker 3: thank Evans and I'm grateful for that, but a very

1336
01:03:06,440 --> 01:03:08,560
Speaker 3: obscure life, if you know what I mean in terms

1337
01:03:08,600 --> 01:03:11,640
Speaker 3: of like, you know, I haven't been famous for all

1338
01:03:11,640 --> 01:03:13,400
Speaker 3: those years. In terms of that, I mean, I know

1339
01:03:13,440 --> 01:03:15,880
Speaker 3: there's been a bit of fame comeback because of Rick

1340
01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:20,840
Speaker 3: Rowland and you know whatever. And so I approached singing

1341
01:03:21,000 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 3: never going to give you up, completely differently I think

1342
01:03:23,160 --> 01:03:26,040
Speaker 3: than perhaps artists who've done it for thirty three years.

1343
01:03:26,400 --> 01:03:29,640
Speaker 3: I when I came back to it. He's sort of

1344
01:03:29,640 --> 01:03:33,240
Speaker 3: happen in two ways. A promoter who is massive in

1345
01:03:33,240 --> 01:03:35,400
Speaker 3: the UK and is involved in managing me as well.

1346
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:39,320
Speaker 3: I bumped into him at a showcase in a tiny

1347
01:03:39,320 --> 01:03:41,720
Speaker 3: little pub in London because friends of mine had written

1348
01:03:41,760 --> 01:03:44,520
Speaker 3: the tracks and everything, and he said, look, why don't

1349
01:03:44,520 --> 01:03:46,439
Speaker 3: you sing? Why don't you? And I said, now I'm done, really,

1350
01:03:46,760 --> 01:03:48,560
Speaker 3: you know, well why don't you just go out and

1351
01:03:48,560 --> 01:03:50,040
Speaker 3: do it again? I said, well, you know, i'm't done

1352
01:03:50,040 --> 01:03:52,680
Speaker 3: it for years And he said, well what if I

1353
01:03:53,200 --> 01:03:54,720
Speaker 3: anyway he got in touch with it. What if I

1354
01:03:54,760 --> 01:03:57,720
Speaker 3: put a little tour together? You can sing anything you want.

1355
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:00,000
Speaker 3: And just been in front of a feonder people, nothing big.

1356
01:04:00,480 --> 01:04:02,080
Speaker 3: You don't even have to sing your old songs if

1357
01:04:02,080 --> 01:04:04,880
Speaker 3: you don't want, just walk out there and sing and

1358
01:04:04,920 --> 01:04:06,600
Speaker 3: see if you want to do it again. I'm like,

1359
01:04:06,720 --> 01:04:10,520
Speaker 3: who is this guy? What you know? And it turns

1360
01:04:10,560 --> 01:04:13,000
Speaker 3: out this guy is an amazing guy and he promotes

1361
01:04:13,120 --> 01:04:15,800
Speaker 3: like things from like Coldplayer Dell right the way down

1362
01:04:15,840 --> 01:04:19,000
Speaker 3: to brand new bands right. He just loves it, lives it,

1363
01:04:19,360 --> 01:04:22,160
Speaker 3: breathes it. So I'm like, what a crazy offer that if?

1364
01:04:22,160 --> 01:04:24,880
Speaker 3: It's just unbelievable. And around the same time, I also

1365
01:04:24,920 --> 01:04:27,000
Speaker 3: had an offer to go to Japan, and I'd always

1366
01:04:27,000 --> 01:04:29,200
Speaker 3: turned down all the offers to sing all my old songs,

1367
01:04:30,160 --> 01:04:32,080
Speaker 3: and I just thought so anyway, So I did this

1368
01:04:32,120 --> 01:04:35,880
Speaker 3: little tour and I sang Frank Sinatra, Backer rap anything

1369
01:04:35,920 --> 01:04:37,520
Speaker 3: I wanted to that I remember as a kid, my

1370
01:04:37,560 --> 01:04:39,800
Speaker 3: mum and dad used to play and my dad had

1371
01:04:39,840 --> 01:04:42,120
Speaker 3: a really great voice actually, and he used to sing.

1372
01:04:42,440 --> 01:04:44,440
Speaker 3: He used to sing the wrong words, but he used

1373
01:04:44,440 --> 01:04:46,440
Speaker 3: to sing Franks and around the house all the time.

1374
01:04:46,800 --> 01:04:48,640
Speaker 3: So I went and did that with a little, you know,

1375
01:04:48,800 --> 01:04:51,600
Speaker 3: little brass section, a very small brass section. Three guys,

1376
01:04:51,840 --> 01:04:54,800
Speaker 3: two or three guys I think actually, and just you know,

1377
01:04:54,920 --> 01:04:56,880
Speaker 3: just a really stand up based all the rest of it,

1378
01:04:57,640 --> 01:05:00,320
Speaker 3: tiny little venues we played. Ronnie Scott still was to

1379
01:05:00,320 --> 01:05:01,520
Speaker 3: come and do it there because we were doing that

1380
01:05:01,600 --> 01:05:03,880
Speaker 3: kind of thing, went up and down the country, and

1381
01:05:03,920 --> 01:05:07,560
Speaker 3: I absolutely loved it, and something in my mind went

1382
01:05:08,680 --> 01:05:10,560
Speaker 3: like a light bulb just went Okay, so you can

1383
01:05:10,560 --> 01:05:13,040
Speaker 3: go out and sing. But it doesn't have to be

1384
01:05:13,160 --> 01:05:15,960
Speaker 3: your bo and end all, it's not every part of

1385
01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:17,960
Speaker 3: your life. You can do it when you want to

1386
01:05:17,960 --> 01:05:21,440
Speaker 3: do it. And I accepted this offer to go to Japan,

1387
01:05:22,480 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 3: mainly because our daughter, who was fifteen at the time,

1388
01:05:25,000 --> 01:05:28,600
Speaker 3: and my wife really wanted to go. So we went

1389
01:05:28,640 --> 01:05:30,520
Speaker 3: and we went on a really lovely trip and I

1390
01:05:30,560 --> 01:05:32,840
Speaker 3: sang those songs never Going to Give You Up Together Forever,

1391
01:05:32,880 --> 01:05:35,640
Speaker 3: and a bunch of others, and again the same light

1392
01:05:35,640 --> 01:05:37,960
Speaker 3: bulb went on of lif So you go out, you

1393
01:05:38,040 --> 01:05:41,160
Speaker 3: sing them, you walk off stage, you put a different

1394
01:05:41,240 --> 01:05:45,680
Speaker 3: jacket on, and you go out for dinner. And that's it, right.

1395
01:05:45,720 --> 01:05:47,720
Speaker 3: It's not like you go out there there's three hundred

1396
01:05:47,760 --> 01:05:51,680
Speaker 3: screaming fans, there's people taking a picture. You've got to

1397
01:05:51,680 --> 01:05:54,040
Speaker 3: do interviews all day the next day, and by the way,

1398
01:05:54,080 --> 01:05:56,400
Speaker 3: you'll be on a plane at four o'clock going to

1399
01:05:56,480 --> 01:05:59,040
Speaker 3: another territory to do it all again the next You

1400
01:05:59,080 --> 01:06:01,800
Speaker 3: know what I mean. It's you can pick and choose.

1401
01:06:01,840 --> 01:06:04,680
Speaker 3: You can have a life in music that isn't. I'm

1402
01:06:04,680 --> 01:06:06,600
Speaker 3: not saying I can ever attain the success they out

1403
01:06:06,640 --> 01:06:09,120
Speaker 3: in the ages about possibly do that, but I can

1404
01:06:09,280 --> 01:06:10,920
Speaker 3: enjoy it a lot more. And that's kind of what

1405
01:06:10,960 --> 01:06:12,280
Speaker 3: I do and what I've done ever since.

1406
01:06:12,680 --> 01:06:16,160
Speaker 1: Can I ask? Okay? So one I wanted to know

1407
01:06:17,720 --> 01:06:20,280
Speaker 1: what was the straw that broke the camel's back as

1408
01:06:20,280 --> 01:06:25,400
Speaker 1: far as you walking away? And how did you manage

1409
01:06:25,440 --> 01:06:28,480
Speaker 1: to make a living? If you remind me asking for

1410
01:06:28,520 --> 01:06:29,640
Speaker 1: those fifteen years?

1411
01:06:29,880 --> 01:06:33,080
Speaker 3: Yeah? Okay, first one. Then I think a lot of

1412
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:36,720
Speaker 3: things were just coming together. I'd had some We had

1413
01:06:36,720 --> 01:06:39,680
Speaker 3: some really we like everybody has got a story about

1414
01:06:39,880 --> 01:06:43,120
Speaker 3: a record they made that never did anything or just

1415
01:06:43,160 --> 01:06:46,160
Speaker 3: didn't see the light of day, didn't get released, whatever.

1416
01:06:46,560 --> 01:06:48,960
Speaker 3: So I had a couple of things like that. We

1417
01:06:49,040 --> 01:06:52,280
Speaker 3: did a record, an album away from Stuff thinking, my

1418
01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:55,120
Speaker 3: first one, and the first single from it it was

1419
01:06:55,120 --> 01:06:57,720
Speaker 3: called Try for Help, and I was so lucky with

1420
01:06:57,760 --> 01:06:59,240
Speaker 3: that record, but I also knew, well, I might not

1421
01:06:59,320 --> 01:07:01,680
Speaker 3: get to make many more. I thought I'd love to

1422
01:07:01,680 --> 01:07:04,560
Speaker 3: get a couple of my favorite drummers on it. So

1423
01:07:04,600 --> 01:07:07,720
Speaker 3: we did some stuff with Jeff Picaell came and played drums.

1424
01:07:07,760 --> 01:07:09,640
Speaker 3: We didn't actually use those sessions in the end because

1425
01:07:09,640 --> 01:07:12,760
Speaker 3: it turned into something else. Vinni Calliuti came and played

1426
01:07:12,840 --> 01:07:16,640
Speaker 3: drums on that song. Yeah, yeah, and I'm sat there

1427
01:07:16,680 --> 01:07:19,120
Speaker 3: in the room going, I don't know what's going on.

1428
01:07:19,160 --> 01:07:20,680
Speaker 3: And I got to play their drum kits as well.

1429
01:07:20,720 --> 01:07:22,880
Speaker 3: By the way, and obviously we had some great musicians.

1430
01:07:22,920 --> 01:07:26,360
Speaker 3: Andre Crouch. It is choir that sang that sang on

1431
01:07:26,400 --> 01:07:29,280
Speaker 3: the record, and obviously I'm sure to this day, but

1432
01:07:30,080 --> 01:07:32,680
Speaker 3: I think around any of that time through the nineties

1433
01:07:32,680 --> 01:07:36,280
Speaker 3: and onwards, if you wanted a choir, there were a

1434
01:07:36,280 --> 01:07:38,360
Speaker 3: couple of choirs to ask, and he was probably at

1435
01:07:38,400 --> 01:07:40,880
Speaker 3: the top of it, and so some of those experiences

1436
01:07:40,880 --> 01:07:43,680
Speaker 3: were amazing. But anyway, so that record came out, we

1437
01:07:43,760 --> 01:07:45,360
Speaker 3: had the top ten in America with that song, and

1438
01:07:45,400 --> 01:07:47,560
Speaker 3: the top ten in the UK and lots of different countries.

1439
01:07:47,600 --> 01:07:50,440
Speaker 3: So I thought, this is crazy. I've left stocking in waterman,

1440
01:07:50,840 --> 01:07:53,800
Speaker 3: I've made a record with Vinnie Calliouti on it and

1441
01:07:54,600 --> 01:07:57,000
Speaker 3: a choir, and yet we still had a top ten

1442
01:07:57,240 --> 01:07:58,720
Speaker 3: and I had long hair as well. I just grew

1443
01:07:58,760 --> 01:08:01,160
Speaker 3: my hair for a bit of it, laughing, and I thought,

1444
01:08:01,240 --> 01:08:03,480
Speaker 3: that's it. We've turned that page. I can go and

1445
01:08:03,480 --> 01:08:07,560
Speaker 3: make records. Cut a long story short. Up to that point,

1446
01:08:07,640 --> 01:08:09,840
Speaker 3: I think I had like and this sounds like sour grapes,

1447
01:08:09,840 --> 01:08:11,880
Speaker 3: it's not. I was just shocked by it. I just

1448
01:08:11,880 --> 01:08:14,760
Speaker 3: didn't understand what was going on. The next couple of

1449
01:08:14,800 --> 01:08:17,160
Speaker 3: singles released didn't really do anything. We didn't get them

1450
01:08:17,160 --> 01:08:20,040
Speaker 3: anywhere near the charts, and the weird thing was they

1451
01:08:20,080 --> 01:08:23,800
Speaker 3: were more like pop songs than the first one. And

1452
01:08:23,840 --> 01:08:27,080
Speaker 3: it transpires that basically the head of RCA in the

1453
01:08:27,200 --> 01:08:31,760
Speaker 3: UK was moved out, a new person came along, kind

1454
01:08:31,800 --> 01:08:33,680
Speaker 3: of got rid of everybody and started again, and that

1455
01:08:33,720 --> 01:08:35,679
Speaker 3: was in that transition of in the middle of that record.

1456
01:08:35,760 --> 01:08:38,640
Speaker 3: So to be honest, we still I'm not saying this,

1457
01:08:38,720 --> 01:08:40,840
Speaker 3: I'm not believe me, I'm not bragging. I'm just trying

1458
01:08:40,880 --> 01:08:43,200
Speaker 3: to give you the facts. Right, We still sold over

1459
01:08:43,240 --> 01:08:46,960
Speaker 3: a million albums with one single. It just didn't go boom,

1460
01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:48,120
Speaker 3: if you know what I mean. And we didn't and

1461
01:08:48,120 --> 01:08:50,840
Speaker 3: we didn't get any more singles at all in any

1462
01:08:50,920 --> 01:08:53,479
Speaker 3: chart anyway, it just didn't happen. And so it made

1463
01:08:53,520 --> 01:08:55,679
Speaker 3: me realize, and a few people who know what they're

1464
01:08:55,680 --> 01:08:57,719
Speaker 3: talking about it said, look, that just happens everyone. And again,

1465
01:08:58,200 --> 01:09:00,120
Speaker 3: you can be in the middle of a record and

1466
01:09:00,160 --> 01:09:03,639
Speaker 3: if your record company just disintegrates, it doesn't matter. Goodly

1467
01:09:03,720 --> 01:09:05,320
Speaker 3: record is and even though you've had a hit with it,

1468
01:09:05,360 --> 01:09:07,200
Speaker 3: and if the album's can of out then it's doing

1469
01:09:07,240 --> 01:09:10,080
Speaker 3: well and it's could even be Top ten in a

1470
01:09:10,080 --> 01:09:12,000
Speaker 3: couple of weeks, it's just gonna die of death because

1471
01:09:12,000 --> 01:09:14,559
Speaker 3: there's nothing making it happen. And what it sort of

1472
01:09:14,600 --> 01:09:17,679
Speaker 3: made me realize was that unless your record company really

1473
01:09:17,720 --> 01:09:21,519
Speaker 3: wants this to happen, unless they're really on board, you

1474
01:09:21,560 --> 01:09:23,880
Speaker 3: know what I mean, you've got no chance. Really, And

1475
01:09:23,920 --> 01:09:26,160
Speaker 3: I've never experienced that before. And obviously I was still

1476
01:09:26,160 --> 01:09:28,400
Speaker 3: a kid, really, I was young, you know. So anyway,

1477
01:09:28,439 --> 01:09:30,640
Speaker 3: so that record kind of ended, so we start to

1478
01:09:30,640 --> 01:09:32,639
Speaker 3: make how we gonna Are we gonna make another one?

1479
01:09:32,640 --> 01:09:35,120
Speaker 3: Are we not? Or we? What have you? So I'd

1480
01:09:35,160 --> 01:09:38,040
Speaker 3: written a song for a song. I can say this

1481
01:09:38,040 --> 01:09:41,280
Speaker 3: because it's years after how so it's cool. So Madonna

1482
01:09:41,400 --> 01:09:42,800
Speaker 3: was going to be in a movie called Body of

1483
01:09:42,840 --> 01:09:44,360
Speaker 3: Evidence with Willem Defoe.

1484
01:09:46,040 --> 01:09:46,880
Speaker 1: Two weeks ago.

1485
01:09:47,320 --> 01:09:49,760
Speaker 3: Why are you joking? That's nuts?

1486
01:09:50,080 --> 01:09:52,639
Speaker 1: I wanted to watch. I had COVID two weeks ago,

1487
01:09:52,720 --> 01:09:55,599
Speaker 1: so I wanted to wow. I wanted to watch all

1488
01:09:55,600 --> 01:09:59,960
Speaker 1: the horrible films I heard about. So I watched Basic

1489
01:10:00,200 --> 01:10:00,880
Speaker 1: Instinct two.

1490
01:10:01,360 --> 01:10:02,200
Speaker 2: I didn't even know there was.

1491
01:10:06,600 --> 01:10:09,679
Speaker 3: Instinct, yes, but not basically instinct to right. So anyway,

1492
01:10:09,800 --> 01:10:12,519
Speaker 3: so somebody who is A and R in the project

1493
01:10:12,600 --> 01:10:14,240
Speaker 3: or what have you sort of said, well, look, so

1494
01:10:14,280 --> 01:10:15,800
Speaker 3: the guy I wrote Cry for Help with a guy

1495
01:10:15,800 --> 01:10:18,519
Speaker 3: called Rob Fisher. He and I wrote a couple of songs.

1496
01:10:19,520 --> 01:10:22,120
Speaker 3: This song was called Hopelessly that we wrote. We sent

1497
01:10:22,200 --> 01:10:24,720
Speaker 3: it in to possibly be in the movie. We got

1498
01:10:24,720 --> 01:10:27,200
Speaker 3: this thing back saying, look, we absolutely love it. We're

1499
01:10:27,240 --> 01:10:28,760
Speaker 3: going to come to the UK. We want to be

1500
01:10:28,800 --> 01:10:31,280
Speaker 3: involved in how you record it. We don't not produce it,

1501
01:10:31,320 --> 01:10:33,640
Speaker 3: but we've got to be there, but we need it

1502
01:10:33,680 --> 01:10:35,800
Speaker 3: done right away because we're really close and we've just

1503
01:10:35,840 --> 01:10:37,840
Speaker 3: got to get this thing done. So we went great.

1504
01:10:37,880 --> 01:10:40,080
Speaker 3: I was meg excited that, but there's something that back

1505
01:10:40,120 --> 01:10:42,639
Speaker 3: on my mind's going why isn't Madonna singing this song?

1506
01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:44,960
Speaker 3: Why isn't she singing her own song? Why isn't she

1507
01:10:45,080 --> 01:10:47,360
Speaker 3: what's going on here? But they said no, she doesn't

1508
01:10:47,360 --> 01:10:49,040
Speaker 3: want to sing any of the songs. They don't want

1509
01:10:49,040 --> 01:10:51,960
Speaker 3: any They just she wants to act and that's it.

1510
01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:54,639
Speaker 3: So I'm like, great, that'll do for me. Madonna's gonna

1511
01:10:54,720 --> 01:10:57,400
Speaker 3: be part of you know, this massive thing, and I'm

1512
01:10:57,400 --> 01:10:58,920
Speaker 3: going to get a song in it, and let's go.

1513
01:10:59,520 --> 01:11:02,559
Speaker 3: So we do the song. Everyone said, we love it,

1514
01:11:02,560 --> 01:11:05,840
Speaker 3: it's great, it's perfect, We send it off. It's all great.

1515
01:11:06,320 --> 01:11:09,840
Speaker 3: So my record label, which is still our CABMG at

1516
01:11:09,840 --> 01:11:11,759
Speaker 3: the time, said right, we needed to make an album

1517
01:11:11,800 --> 01:11:14,480
Speaker 3: because this film's coming out in a few months, and

1518
01:11:14,560 --> 01:11:15,960
Speaker 3: so have you got any songs? So well, I've got

1519
01:11:15,960 --> 01:11:17,519
Speaker 3: a lot of songs because I've been writing. I've been

1520
01:11:17,640 --> 01:11:19,559
Speaker 3: you know it, said right, just getting this. So I

1521
01:11:19,600 --> 01:11:21,720
Speaker 3: went back in the studio with the guy who had

1522
01:11:21,720 --> 01:11:24,639
Speaker 3: made the last album, with a guy called Gary Stevenson

1523
01:11:24,680 --> 01:11:27,000
Speaker 3: who's still a good friend today, and we just got

1524
01:11:27,000 --> 01:11:30,040
Speaker 3: stuck into making an album. So we did. So a

1525
01:11:30,120 --> 01:11:32,960
Speaker 3: Body of Evidence is coming out and they've decided they're

1526
01:11:33,000 --> 01:11:34,920
Speaker 3: not going to have any songs in Body of Evidence.

1527
01:11:35,880 --> 01:11:37,920
Speaker 3: They're not going to do this with a lead song

1528
01:11:38,040 --> 01:11:41,400
Speaker 3: because it doesn't really that's going to confuse people and whatever. Right,

1529
01:11:41,800 --> 01:11:43,559
Speaker 3: maybe we did have a song in the end. Yeah,

1530
01:11:44,000 --> 01:11:45,280
Speaker 3: maybe they did have a song in the end. I

1531
01:11:45,280 --> 01:11:47,240
Speaker 3: can't remember, but but they certainly didn't have ours. I

1532
01:11:47,280 --> 01:11:49,160
Speaker 3: don't think they had any I think they just had

1533
01:11:49,160 --> 01:11:52,080
Speaker 3: the theme music. They didn't want to confuse Madonna's career

1534
01:11:52,120 --> 01:11:56,840
Speaker 3: with like this music, So what is it anyway? What ever?

1535
01:11:56,960 --> 01:11:59,439
Speaker 3: And maybe that's just the way I'm remembering it. So

1536
01:11:59,479 --> 01:12:02,040
Speaker 3: at this point, when I go into the record label,

1537
01:12:02,080 --> 01:12:04,800
Speaker 3: I've made an album. At this point, most people when

1538
01:12:04,840 --> 01:12:06,519
Speaker 3: I walk in the building, I'm kind of looking at

1539
01:12:06,520 --> 01:12:09,840
Speaker 3: the window, hoping not to make eye contact because now

1540
01:12:09,880 --> 01:12:12,280
Speaker 3: they don't know what to do. Now they don't know

1541
01:12:12,320 --> 01:12:14,760
Speaker 3: what to do. It's like, is this record any good?

1542
01:12:14,840 --> 01:12:16,519
Speaker 3: Is it the right record? Should we be doing this?

1543
01:12:17,000 --> 01:12:18,880
Speaker 3: I'd like to keep my career. So I'm just gonna

1544
01:12:18,880 --> 01:12:20,639
Speaker 3: look out the window when he walks in the building.

1545
01:12:21,280 --> 01:12:23,960
Speaker 3: And at this point, I'm like, you know what, I

1546
01:12:23,960 --> 01:12:25,720
Speaker 3: think I'm just gonna walk away. I think I'm just

1547
01:12:25,760 --> 01:12:27,840
Speaker 3: going to say, look, I'm gonna while no one's watching,

1548
01:12:27,920 --> 01:12:30,080
Speaker 3: and they obviously weren't, I'm just gonna walk I'm going

1549
01:12:30,120 --> 01:12:32,519
Speaker 3: to walk out the side door. And I spoke to

1550
01:12:32,560 --> 01:12:35,960
Speaker 3: a manager who spoke to my lawyer. I was doing

1551
01:12:36,000 --> 01:12:39,880
Speaker 3: promotion for that record that I had this song Hopelessly,

1552
01:12:39,920 --> 01:12:42,599
Speaker 3: which was going to be there whatever, and I think

1553
01:12:42,600 --> 01:12:44,960
Speaker 3: we were getting a bit of roots, getting a bit

1554
01:12:45,000 --> 01:12:47,920
Speaker 3: of headway in in America, actually funny enough, And I

1555
01:12:47,960 --> 01:12:49,920
Speaker 3: was I was going to the airport. I was going

1556
01:12:49,920 --> 01:12:51,400
Speaker 3: to Heathrow to get on a plane to go to

1557
01:12:51,439 --> 01:12:53,000
Speaker 3: New York to be on a TV show for get

1558
01:12:53,000 --> 01:12:55,519
Speaker 3: which One to sing this song hopelessly, And it was

1559
01:12:55,520 --> 01:12:57,160
Speaker 3: sort of getting played a little bit, but it wasn't

1560
01:12:57,160 --> 01:12:59,760
Speaker 3: getting the full do you know what I mean? And

1561
01:13:01,120 --> 01:13:03,840
Speaker 3: something in me said, I've got a daughter at home

1562
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:07,080
Speaker 3: who is like, you know, one year older, thinks she

1563
01:13:07,240 --> 01:13:10,200
Speaker 3: was something like that. I've just done loads of promotion

1564
01:13:10,280 --> 01:13:14,120
Speaker 3: in Europe and it all felt pointless. I don't know

1565
01:13:14,120 --> 01:13:15,840
Speaker 3: whether you guys have been there, but it just felt

1566
01:13:16,080 --> 01:13:19,240
Speaker 3: absolutely it felt like, you know, it almost felt embarrassing,

1567
01:13:19,320 --> 01:13:21,880
Speaker 3: like sort of like we should just not be doing this. Really,

1568
01:13:21,880 --> 01:13:23,400
Speaker 3: they don't want to do it. I'm not sure I

1569
01:13:23,479 --> 01:13:26,759
Speaker 3: want to do it anymore. So I'm going to Heathrow.

1570
01:13:27,240 --> 01:13:29,040
Speaker 3: And I turned around to my manager, who is still

1571
01:13:29,560 --> 01:13:32,280
Speaker 3: one of my closest people in my life, and you know,

1572
01:13:32,320 --> 01:13:34,880
Speaker 3: he's a bit of a surrogate father. And I said,

1573
01:13:35,400 --> 01:13:38,439
Speaker 3: I think I'm done, and he's like, what do you mean.

1574
01:13:38,439 --> 01:13:39,920
Speaker 3: I'm like, I just don't want to go and I

1575
01:13:39,920 --> 01:13:41,320
Speaker 3: don't want to go and I don't want.

1576
01:13:41,120 --> 01:13:41,479
Speaker 1: To do this.

1577
01:13:42,080 --> 01:13:43,760
Speaker 3: And I knew what it meant, because I knew that

1578
01:13:43,760 --> 01:13:45,840
Speaker 3: that's it. You know, you don't you don't not go

1579
01:13:45,920 --> 01:13:47,439
Speaker 3: to New York to go and do a TV show

1580
01:13:47,439 --> 01:13:50,080
Speaker 3: and the record company go, oh, that's fine. I said,

1581
01:13:50,120 --> 01:13:52,240
Speaker 3: I think I'm done. So he said, fine, let's call

1582
01:13:52,640 --> 01:13:54,519
Speaker 3: let's call the lawyer and we'll just see fool. Let

1583
01:13:54,560 --> 01:13:56,320
Speaker 3: you walk away and forget about it, and we'll shake

1584
01:13:56,360 --> 01:13:59,320
Speaker 3: hands and we'll do that. And so we turned the

1585
01:13:59,320 --> 01:14:01,559
Speaker 3: car around and I went home and I cried a bit,

1586
01:14:01,600 --> 01:14:03,759
Speaker 3: you know, I did, obviously I knew what it meant.

1587
01:14:04,360 --> 01:14:07,080
Speaker 3: And I just went home and we had a bit

1588
01:14:07,120 --> 01:14:09,320
Speaker 3: of a hug, and he drove home and he called

1589
01:14:09,320 --> 01:14:12,559
Speaker 3: my lawyer and he called BMG, and to be fair

1590
01:14:12,560 --> 01:14:14,240
Speaker 3: to them, they said, yeah, we're okay with it. If

1591
01:14:14,240 --> 01:14:16,200
Speaker 3: he wants to quit, we don't want to do it anymore.

1592
01:14:16,760 --> 01:14:17,960
Speaker 3: And that was it.

1593
01:14:22,760 --> 01:14:26,120
Speaker 4: That's a rarity to one that's as good as it

1594
01:14:26,120 --> 01:14:27,960
Speaker 4: gets in the business.

1595
01:14:28,160 --> 01:14:30,439
Speaker 1: Yeah, because most people will try to force their will.

1596
01:14:31,240 --> 01:14:34,640
Speaker 3: Yeah. But I think also i'd had a very explosive

1597
01:14:34,720 --> 01:14:36,439
Speaker 3: pop career, you know, one of those kind of like

1598
01:14:36,520 --> 01:14:39,840
Speaker 3: boom sort of like I'd never really I don't think

1599
01:14:39,840 --> 01:14:41,519
Speaker 3: i'd really come to terms with a lot of it.

1600
01:14:41,560 --> 01:14:43,840
Speaker 3: I don't think i'd not grown up. I'd done from

1601
01:14:43,880 --> 01:14:47,280
Speaker 3: being nineteen to sign in a little production deal twenty

1602
01:14:47,320 --> 01:14:50,679
Speaker 3: one massive single that you know, on a really big album.

1603
01:14:50,720 --> 01:14:53,000
Speaker 3: It was a huge album and around the world and

1604
01:14:53,040 --> 01:14:57,479
Speaker 3: everything in nuts and and I never really, I never

1605
01:14:58,120 --> 01:15:04,040
Speaker 3: really I think got to sort of get totally comfortable.

1606
01:15:04,080 --> 01:15:07,240
Speaker 3: I don't think I think I was always chasing my

1607
01:15:07,360 --> 01:15:09,840
Speaker 3: tail and always kind of like I almost felt like

1608
01:15:09,880 --> 01:15:11,720
Speaker 3: I was always running after a bus. That was just

1609
01:15:11,800 --> 01:15:14,320
Speaker 3: always like leaving the depo before I got you know

1610
01:15:14,360 --> 01:15:17,280
Speaker 3: what I mean. And so I didn't I didn't grow

1611
01:15:17,360 --> 01:15:19,560
Speaker 3: up as a human. I've become a dad, but I

1612
01:15:19,640 --> 01:15:22,000
Speaker 3: don't really felt I didn't feel like a grown up,

1613
01:15:22,000 --> 01:15:24,559
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. So, and anyway, I'm gonna

1614
01:15:24,640 --> 01:15:26,519
Speaker 3: sorry very long answers. So that to the next part

1615
01:15:26,520 --> 01:15:29,519
Speaker 3: of the equation, is this that first album did really

1616
01:15:29,560 --> 01:15:31,920
Speaker 3: really well I wrote four songs on my own on it.

1617
01:15:32,640 --> 01:15:34,760
Speaker 3: The next album did pretty well. It did about half

1618
01:15:34,800 --> 01:15:36,760
Speaker 3: what the second one did, and I wrote five or

1619
01:15:36,760 --> 01:15:41,600
Speaker 3: six of them. So and even even the cry for

1620
01:15:41,680 --> 01:15:44,080
Speaker 3: help song it was on my album called Free. You know,

1621
01:15:44,200 --> 01:15:46,240
Speaker 3: we did a million something with that record. I wrote

1622
01:15:46,280 --> 01:15:47,920
Speaker 3: a lot of those tunes and co produced it and

1623
01:15:47,960 --> 01:15:50,479
Speaker 3: blah blah. So in other words, I made quite a

1624
01:15:50,479 --> 01:15:52,960
Speaker 3: lot of money because we sold a lot of you know,

1625
01:15:53,160 --> 01:15:55,040
Speaker 3: that first album sold over eight million, I think, you

1626
01:15:55,040 --> 01:15:56,439
Speaker 3: know what I mean. So we sold a lot of

1627
01:15:56,479 --> 01:15:59,040
Speaker 3: records back then, because if you had a hit couple

1628
01:15:59,080 --> 01:16:02,439
Speaker 3: of songs pop song, that very often meant he sold

1629
01:16:02,479 --> 01:16:05,240
Speaker 3: a lot of records. And so I just kind of

1630
01:16:05,640 --> 01:16:08,080
Speaker 3: was comfortable with that. But I've never I've never owned

1631
01:16:08,080 --> 01:16:12,639
Speaker 3: a fleet of ferraris. I've never driven a roll's voice

1632
01:16:12,680 --> 01:16:13,639
Speaker 3: into a swimming pool.

1633
01:16:15,520 --> 01:16:17,320
Speaker 1: You weren't balling out of control.

1634
01:16:17,560 --> 01:16:20,720
Speaker 3: No, I've been, I think again. I owed that back

1635
01:16:20,760 --> 01:16:23,040
Speaker 3: to my upbringing in the sense I'm from a very

1636
01:16:23,080 --> 01:16:25,519
Speaker 3: working class area. My dad had a little business, so

1637
01:16:25,560 --> 01:16:28,519
Speaker 3: I always knew there was a tax man. I didn't

1638
01:16:28,560 --> 01:16:30,280
Speaker 3: understand what it meant as a kid, but I knew

1639
01:16:30,280 --> 01:16:31,880
Speaker 3: he was coming, and I knew he wanted some money

1640
01:16:31,880 --> 01:16:33,559
Speaker 3: from my dad, do you know what I mean? Right,

1641
01:16:33,680 --> 01:16:35,439
Speaker 3: So my dad would be sat at home doing his

1642
01:16:35,479 --> 01:16:37,519
Speaker 3: paperwork and be going, right, well, that's for the taxman.

1643
01:16:37,560 --> 01:16:40,080
Speaker 3: I'm like, what what. I kind of thought a tax

1644
01:16:40,160 --> 01:16:42,040
Speaker 3: him was going to come with a bag almost. I mean,

1645
01:16:42,040 --> 01:16:43,479
Speaker 3: as a kid, I thought I thought he was going

1646
01:16:43,520 --> 01:16:44,920
Speaker 3: to knock on the door and give me the money,

1647
01:16:44,960 --> 01:16:48,200
Speaker 3: you know, But I always knew that was there. And

1648
01:16:48,280 --> 01:16:51,400
Speaker 3: so I think every bit of money that I earned.

1649
01:16:52,560 --> 01:16:54,640
Speaker 3: I think also because I was so busy for like,

1650
01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:57,240
Speaker 3: certainly the first three four years, well I only did

1651
01:16:57,280 --> 01:16:59,160
Speaker 3: it for four or five years. The first three years

1652
01:16:59,160 --> 01:17:01,320
Speaker 3: of it, I was so busy. I didn't buy anything,

1653
01:17:01,760 --> 01:17:04,200
Speaker 3: I think, in buy a house until quite a few

1654
01:17:04,200 --> 01:17:05,679
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, Because I was always traveling.

1655
01:17:05,680 --> 01:17:09,360
Speaker 3: I was always yeah. So and also I think that

1656
01:17:09,479 --> 01:17:12,600
Speaker 3: whole kind of like MTV cribs, look at my house lifestyle.

1657
01:17:13,520 --> 01:17:16,040
Speaker 3: Unless you were one of the absolute greats helping John

1658
01:17:17,400 --> 01:17:18,439
Speaker 3: the who the what have you?

1659
01:17:18,479 --> 01:17:18,519
Speaker 1: That?

1660
01:17:18,640 --> 01:17:23,760
Speaker 3: You know, whoever, you didn't, you didn't live like that.

1661
01:17:23,920 --> 01:17:25,680
Speaker 3: I think people just gone on with it and then

1662
01:17:25,760 --> 01:17:27,800
Speaker 3: realized they made some money some years later, you know

1663
01:17:27,840 --> 01:17:28,160
Speaker 3: what I mean?

1664
01:17:28,640 --> 01:17:30,320
Speaker 1: You tell that to my friends.

1665
01:17:33,400 --> 01:17:33,960
Speaker 2: Speaking of it.

1666
01:17:34,000 --> 01:17:34,519
Speaker 1: What was it like.

1667
01:17:34,479 --> 01:17:35,080
Speaker 2: Working with him?

1668
01:17:35,320 --> 01:17:37,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that guy is amazing in so many

1669
01:17:37,280 --> 01:17:40,920
Speaker 3: different ways. He got in touch. He cut a long

1670
01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:45,160
Speaker 3: story short. The first time any sort of connection was

1671
01:17:46,000 --> 01:17:47,880
Speaker 3: never going to give you up. Got this award at

1672
01:17:47,920 --> 01:17:50,920
Speaker 3: the BPI Awards, a Single of the Year, and because

1673
01:17:50,960 --> 01:17:52,920
Speaker 3: it was live back then, it was at the Albert

1674
01:17:52,920 --> 01:17:57,519
Speaker 3: Hale and fun enough just mentioned that who Who were

1675
01:17:57,520 --> 01:17:59,160
Speaker 3: closing the show and they were playing live at the

1676
01:17:59,160 --> 01:18:01,840
Speaker 3: album Hole. So the award for single is pretty much

1677
01:18:01,880 --> 01:18:04,600
Speaker 3: one of the last awards. So i was stood on

1678
01:18:04,640 --> 01:18:07,040
Speaker 3: this podium waiting to get the award with the audience

1679
01:18:07,120 --> 01:18:09,720
Speaker 3: looking at me but not the TV audience, and I've

1680
01:18:09,760 --> 01:18:12,000
Speaker 3: got this camera on me and to me, I'm thinking

1681
01:18:12,040 --> 01:18:13,920
Speaker 3: the cameras on. So I'm just stood there waiting for

1682
01:18:13,960 --> 01:18:15,720
Speaker 3: someone to stand up and go and the signal of

1683
01:18:15,760 --> 01:18:18,640
Speaker 3: the Year goes to Rick Hastley for right there. So

1684
01:18:18,680 --> 01:18:20,880
Speaker 3: I'm just stood there and the albuholes lo looking at me,

1685
01:18:21,240 --> 01:18:23,000
Speaker 3: and I'm like, but it didn't happen. No one came

1686
01:18:23,080 --> 01:18:24,479
Speaker 3: on the podium and no one gave me the award,

1687
01:18:24,520 --> 01:18:26,880
Speaker 3: and it just somebody just went. Ladies and gentlemen who

1688
01:18:27,040 --> 01:18:30,960
Speaker 3: and they just steamed into like, so I just stood there,

1689
01:18:30,960 --> 01:18:35,240
Speaker 3: going what is going on? And I'm literally still in

1690
01:18:35,240 --> 01:18:37,360
Speaker 3: this round podium, just in the middle somewhere, and I'm

1691
01:18:37,400 --> 01:18:40,080
Speaker 3: going like do and the camera's still looking and I'm going,

1692
01:18:40,360 --> 01:18:42,200
Speaker 3: what do I do? Don't walk do I shuffle away?

1693
01:18:42,360 --> 01:18:43,920
Speaker 3: Do I walk away? Do I look at the hoom?

1694
01:18:43,960 --> 01:18:46,840
Speaker 3: And E don't know what to do? And I just

1695
01:18:46,920 --> 01:18:49,439
Speaker 3: kind of like just sideways, just just kind of walked

1696
01:18:49,439 --> 01:18:55,639
Speaker 3: out of the picture. Anyway, I wasn't even upset because

1697
01:18:55,800 --> 01:18:57,840
Speaker 3: I was too in the sort of nonsense of it

1698
01:18:57,880 --> 01:18:59,200
Speaker 3: all to be upset. I was like, I don't know

1699
01:18:59,240 --> 01:19:03,400
Speaker 3: what's going on someone's life to do. So I woke up.

1700
01:19:03,479 --> 01:19:05,720
Speaker 3: But believe me, backstage it all kicked off. My god,

1701
01:19:05,760 --> 01:19:08,200
Speaker 3: there was some like who has you know? There really was,

1702
01:19:08,520 --> 01:19:10,559
Speaker 3: and my manager was really angry. I mean he was

1703
01:19:10,640 --> 01:19:13,000
Speaker 3: like fuming, do you know what I mean? And the

1704
01:19:13,000 --> 01:19:15,600
Speaker 3: stockcakeing watman guys were going ape shit, you know what

1705
01:19:15,640 --> 01:19:17,479
Speaker 3: I mean? It was really it was a big deal

1706
01:19:17,479 --> 01:19:21,519
Speaker 3: because they'd actually written and produced the song that had

1707
01:19:21,520 --> 01:19:23,080
Speaker 3: done you know what I mean, the business that year

1708
01:19:23,120 --> 01:19:26,679
Speaker 3: and blah blah. So anyway, a couple of days later,

1709
01:19:27,760 --> 01:19:31,200
Speaker 3: a crate of. I think it was Crystal Champagne arrived

1710
01:19:31,240 --> 01:19:35,880
Speaker 3: at my manager's office from help John to me saying

1711
01:19:35,920 --> 01:19:38,120
Speaker 3: that I'm really really sorry, what an awful thing to happen.

1712
01:19:38,160 --> 01:19:41,559
Speaker 3: That's absolutely terrible. All the best, keep on making music,

1713
01:19:41,560 --> 01:19:43,160
Speaker 3: don't let it get you down. Do it a really

1714
01:19:43,240 --> 01:19:46,080
Speaker 3: nice letter, and I was just thinking, like, this is

1715
01:19:46,200 --> 01:19:47,960
Speaker 3: just how amazing is that, you know what I mean

1716
01:19:48,080 --> 01:19:51,040
Speaker 3: to sort of, But obviously as time has gone on,

1717
01:19:51,280 --> 01:19:54,080
Speaker 3: I've obviously understood he's had his moments in life. I'm

1718
01:19:54,120 --> 01:19:56,439
Speaker 3: sure where he's been let down and he's been do

1719
01:19:56,439 --> 01:19:58,559
Speaker 3: you know what I mean? And I think he's always

1720
01:19:58,960 --> 01:20:01,519
Speaker 3: he's always done that thing, reaching out to younger artists,

1721
01:20:01,520 --> 01:20:04,400
Speaker 3: sort of saying, look, if you ever want any advice,

1722
01:20:04,439 --> 01:20:06,360
Speaker 3: if you ever want to you know. So he invited

1723
01:20:06,479 --> 01:20:08,639
Speaker 3: myself out, and my wife and I went to dinner

1724
01:20:08,680 --> 01:20:12,040
Speaker 3: with him and a few friends, and he was just

1725
01:20:12,200 --> 01:20:15,639
Speaker 3: chatting about stuff really and just being a nice dude,

1726
01:20:15,680 --> 01:20:17,320
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, and just kind of saying, look,

1727
01:20:17,320 --> 01:20:18,800
Speaker 3: if you ever want to talk, if you ever get

1728
01:20:18,840 --> 01:20:22,360
Speaker 3: you know. And I also think, because obviously he especially

1729
01:20:22,360 --> 01:20:25,280
Speaker 3: in the latter you know, years, I think he's also

1730
01:20:25,360 --> 01:20:28,960
Speaker 3: been very helpful to people who've been going to major problems,

1731
01:20:28,960 --> 01:20:30,439
Speaker 3: you know, with drugs and drinking all the rest of

1732
01:20:30,479 --> 01:20:32,519
Speaker 3: it and all kinds of things, you know. I think

1733
01:20:32,520 --> 01:20:34,519
Speaker 3: that's what his life is about really now, is about

1734
01:20:34,520 --> 01:20:36,360
Speaker 3: more giving back than it's taken, if you know what

1735
01:20:36,400 --> 01:20:38,639
Speaker 3: I mean. But anyway, that's another world to gain too.

1736
01:20:39,479 --> 01:20:42,160
Speaker 3: So but on that dinner that night, he said, look,

1737
01:20:42,160 --> 01:20:43,600
Speaker 3: if you ever want me to come and play, you know,

1738
01:20:43,600 --> 01:20:44,880
Speaker 3: if you want to come and play on a record

1739
01:20:44,880 --> 01:20:46,600
Speaker 3: of just just get in touch, you know. And I'm like,

1740
01:20:47,000 --> 01:20:49,080
Speaker 3: and I'm listening to him say the words, but I'm

1741
01:20:49,120 --> 01:20:53,120
Speaker 3: not really computing it. Sure Enough, sure enough he did.

1742
01:20:53,200 --> 01:20:55,120
Speaker 3: He came and played, and he just rolled up. He

1743
01:20:55,200 --> 01:20:57,519
Speaker 3: just rocked up and just played piano and a couple

1744
01:20:57,520 --> 01:20:59,519
Speaker 3: of songs on that record that I did when I left.

1745
01:20:59,600 --> 01:21:02,840
Speaker 3: I think he's just always been great. He I made

1746
01:21:02,880 --> 01:21:04,759
Speaker 3: a record a few years ago when I turned fifty.

1747
01:21:04,760 --> 01:21:07,559
Speaker 3: I made a record in my garage at home, just

1748
01:21:07,600 --> 01:21:10,559
Speaker 3: sort of just to kind of say to myself what

1749
01:21:10,600 --> 01:21:12,200
Speaker 3: I could do. I didn't even have a record deal

1750
01:21:12,240 --> 01:21:16,800
Speaker 3: at the time. And he we went to see him

1751
01:21:16,800 --> 01:21:18,800
Speaker 3: in Vegas. And I'm saying this because I want to.

1752
01:21:18,840 --> 01:21:21,080
Speaker 3: I want to. I'm proud of myself, but I also

1753
01:21:21,120 --> 01:21:22,800
Speaker 3: want to say how great he is in it. In

1754
01:21:22,840 --> 01:21:26,120
Speaker 3: that same sentence, we went to see him just because

1755
01:21:26,120 --> 01:21:27,519
Speaker 3: we've seen him a bunch of times and I wanted

1756
01:21:27,560 --> 01:21:29,120
Speaker 3: to see the show that he does in Vegas that

1757
01:21:29,160 --> 01:21:31,400
Speaker 3: he was doing the Red He's just sat there and

1758
01:21:31,400 --> 01:21:32,760
Speaker 3: he knows him in the audience kind of thing, and

1759
01:21:32,760 --> 01:21:34,280
Speaker 3: he sat there and he just says to the audience, is,

1760
01:21:34,320 --> 01:21:36,760
Speaker 3: by the way, nas, jentleman, there's a young man in

1761
01:21:36,760 --> 01:21:38,519
Speaker 3: the audience tonight. Not when I was younger. There's a

1762
01:21:38,520 --> 01:21:40,640
Speaker 3: guy in the audience tonight. He said, if you're going

1763
01:21:40,680 --> 01:21:42,080
Speaker 3: to buy a record, if you're going to buy a

1764
01:21:42,080 --> 01:21:44,200
Speaker 3: record in the next few weeks or next months by

1765
01:21:44,280 --> 01:21:47,679
Speaker 3: rick as record by Rick Aster's record is full fifty.

1766
01:21:47,760 --> 01:21:50,800
Speaker 3: It's an absolutely fantastic And I'm like, what is going on?

1767
01:21:50,840 --> 01:21:53,719
Speaker 3: You know, It's like wow. And he's always he's always

1768
01:21:53,760 --> 01:21:56,320
Speaker 3: done things like that. I mean, for loads of artists

1769
01:21:56,360 --> 01:21:58,320
Speaker 3: to think, and you know, he's always he's still keen

1770
01:21:58,360 --> 01:22:00,360
Speaker 3: on working with the artists and doing due and all

1771
01:22:00,400 --> 01:22:03,080
Speaker 3: the rest of it. And so I just think he's

1772
01:22:03,120 --> 01:22:06,160
Speaker 3: one of those people that I know some people around him.

1773
01:22:06,200 --> 01:22:08,960
Speaker 3: I'm really good friends with David Johnson is MD and

1774
01:22:09,000 --> 01:22:10,920
Speaker 3: his guitar player for for all the years that he's

1775
01:22:10,960 --> 01:22:13,160
Speaker 3: been going. Really so I've been to loads of his

1776
01:22:13,240 --> 01:22:15,759
Speaker 3: gigs and you know, been around some of the stories

1777
01:22:15,760 --> 01:22:19,800
Speaker 3: and some backgrounds on the Lion King, some of those

1778
01:22:19,800 --> 01:22:21,800
Speaker 3: songs and stuff like because I was just there and

1779
01:22:21,840 --> 01:22:24,680
Speaker 3: he just so much that get in there to sing,

1780
01:22:24,800 --> 01:22:27,000
Speaker 3: you know, and stuff, and I just think he's one

1781
01:22:27,000 --> 01:22:29,080
Speaker 3: of those people who's still in love with music. He's

1782
01:22:29,120 --> 01:22:32,000
Speaker 3: still back in the days of CDs and what have you.

1783
01:22:32,840 --> 01:22:34,880
Speaker 3: He would go into stores. I'm sure you've heard this story.

1784
01:22:34,880 --> 01:22:37,160
Speaker 3: It's legend, go in there and come out with two

1785
01:22:37,240 --> 01:22:40,559
Speaker 3: great big bags of CDs because he's still wanted to

1786
01:22:40,600 --> 01:22:43,479
Speaker 3: be like, what's going on? I should know what's going on,

1787
01:22:43,520 --> 01:22:44,720
Speaker 3: and I want to hear that thing, you know what

1788
01:22:45,200 --> 01:22:45,439
Speaker 3: is it?

1789
01:22:45,520 --> 01:22:47,800
Speaker 1: So now he's the real deal. He was one of

1790
01:22:47,800 --> 01:22:51,439
Speaker 1: the first, the very first people to UH when I

1791
01:22:51,479 --> 01:22:53,439
Speaker 1: when I won the BEFT and I ask her. He

1792
01:22:53,479 --> 01:22:55,360
Speaker 1: was one of the first people to cod caught me

1793
01:22:55,439 --> 01:22:59,800
Speaker 1: and congratulate me. And he's like that, wait before we

1794
01:22:59,840 --> 01:23:03,400
Speaker 1: read up. I always wanted to know, are you shocked

1795
01:23:03,439 --> 01:23:06,439
Speaker 1: at the level of adoration that you're getting for like

1796
01:23:06,600 --> 01:23:10,479
Speaker 1: these uh cover songs that you do in in your

1797
01:23:10,520 --> 01:23:14,160
Speaker 1: show now And speaking of Network, did you resist the

1798
01:23:14,200 --> 01:23:16,960
Speaker 1: temptation to do a Zeppelin song at Network when you

1799
01:23:17,040 --> 01:23:17,760
Speaker 1: did it or.

1800
01:23:18,479 --> 01:23:20,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, it wasn't that kind of a nebworth to realest.

1801
01:23:20,439 --> 01:23:22,000
Speaker 3: I think it was just because it was big enough

1802
01:23:22,040 --> 01:23:26,240
Speaker 3: to get cars in there with gardens, private gardens or

1803
01:23:26,280 --> 01:23:29,479
Speaker 3: whatever you want to call them. Whatever, right, Uh no,

1804
01:23:30,160 --> 01:23:32,080
Speaker 3: it's funny. I've never really gotten the lead out, to

1805
01:23:32,080 --> 01:23:33,960
Speaker 3: be honest, I'm not. I've got friends who are so

1806
01:23:34,120 --> 01:23:37,360
Speaker 3: into Zeppelin's it's freaky and obviously John Bonham that's another story, right,

1807
01:23:37,360 --> 01:23:41,880
Speaker 3: because just great. But I think it's never really I'm

1808
01:23:41,880 --> 01:23:43,680
Speaker 3: not saying I'm not a fan, and I'm not I

1809
01:23:43,680 --> 01:23:48,280
Speaker 3: don't appreciate Zeppelin, but it's I'm if I ever go well,

1810
01:23:48,320 --> 01:23:50,160
Speaker 3: and I do love a lot of rock music. I

1811
01:23:50,200 --> 01:23:54,160
Speaker 3: still play drums in a midlife crisis, punk rock covers

1812
01:23:54,160 --> 01:23:57,360
Speaker 3: band and what have you. And we go from like

1813
01:23:59,360 --> 01:24:02,479
Speaker 3: uh more ac DC to be honest and then yeah,

1814
01:24:04,120 --> 01:24:06,639
Speaker 3: right okay and more sort of punky rock sort of things.

1815
01:24:09,160 --> 01:24:11,479
Speaker 3: I just the thing is how I started is how

1816
01:24:11,520 --> 01:24:14,320
Speaker 3: most people start. You start by covering other people's songs

1817
01:24:14,920 --> 01:24:17,679
Speaker 3: and there's a real joy in doing it. There's a real.

1818
01:24:19,439 --> 01:24:20,840
Speaker 1: Well, you look like you're having the time of your

1819
01:24:20,840 --> 01:24:21,720
Speaker 1: life when you're doing it.

1820
01:24:22,120 --> 01:24:24,519
Speaker 3: Yeah, I do. I love it And every time. For instance,

1821
01:24:24,560 --> 01:24:29,280
Speaker 3: we toured in the UK in October, not into November,

1822
01:24:29,720 --> 01:24:31,479
Speaker 3: and we'd postpone that to her a couple of times,

1823
01:24:31,479 --> 01:24:34,240
Speaker 3: and so I went into rehearsals and they know what's coming,

1824
01:24:34,360 --> 01:24:35,880
Speaker 3: my band and crew and everything. They know I'm going

1825
01:24:35,960 --> 01:24:38,200
Speaker 3: to walk in on the last day because I don't

1826
01:24:38,240 --> 01:24:40,760
Speaker 3: like to give people much warning and say, right, we're

1827
01:24:40,800 --> 01:24:43,639
Speaker 3: doing uh, we're gonna do Watermelon Sugar by Harry Styles,

1828
01:24:43,680 --> 01:24:46,240
Speaker 3: and everyone's like, right, fire, what key? How are we?

1829
01:24:47,720 --> 01:24:49,519
Speaker 3: And I just got to play it. But the other

1830
01:24:49,600 --> 01:24:51,240
Speaker 3: reason I kind of like to do that is because

1831
01:24:51,280 --> 01:24:53,160
Speaker 3: if we can't all just shuffle into it and just

1832
01:24:53,200 --> 01:24:55,479
Speaker 3: play it and make it work, we shouldn't be doing

1833
01:24:55,479 --> 01:24:58,960
Speaker 3: it unless it just sort of happens instantly. So we

1834
01:24:58,960 --> 01:25:00,960
Speaker 3: we've done loads of cover and I just I love

1835
01:25:01,040 --> 01:25:04,439
Speaker 3: doing it. I still absolutely love it, and I think,

1836
01:25:04,479 --> 01:25:08,400
Speaker 3: to be honest, there's an element about doing other people's

1837
01:25:08,439 --> 01:25:13,240
Speaker 3: songs that there's a there's a tension relief because it's

1838
01:25:13,280 --> 01:25:15,280
Speaker 3: like you're just doing a cover. Do you know what

1839
01:25:15,280 --> 01:25:17,080
Speaker 3: I mean? It's not it's not like you're trying to

1840
01:25:17,120 --> 01:25:20,800
Speaker 3: represent for the audience something they've paid to come and watch.

1841
01:25:20,840 --> 01:25:23,040
Speaker 3: They've sort of gone right. I bought that first album

1842
01:25:23,080 --> 01:25:25,000
Speaker 3: thirty odd years ago. I wanted to do never going

1843
01:25:25,040 --> 01:25:26,759
Speaker 3: to give you up. I wanted to sound like the record.

1844
01:25:27,160 --> 01:25:29,800
Speaker 3: I wanted to you know what I mean. I feel

1845
01:25:29,800 --> 01:25:31,040
Speaker 3: like old them that, you know what I mean? And

1846
01:25:31,080 --> 01:25:33,280
Speaker 3: that's not in a negative I want to give them that.

1847
01:25:33,680 --> 01:25:35,280
Speaker 3: But I think when you do covers, you can just

1848
01:25:35,320 --> 01:25:37,840
Speaker 3: sort of say it don't really matter. I don't mean

1849
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:40,320
Speaker 3: that with any disrespect to the artists at all. I

1850
01:25:40,439 --> 01:25:42,519
Speaker 3: just mean it's just having fun, you know. I think

1851
01:25:42,560 --> 01:25:45,960
Speaker 3: all artists like covering other people's songs. It's just, you know,

1852
01:25:46,120 --> 01:25:48,519
Speaker 3: it's just it's just fun. Yeah.

1853
01:25:49,200 --> 01:25:54,559
Speaker 1: So my last question is who explained to you what

1854
01:25:54,720 --> 01:25:55,840
Speaker 1: Rick Rolling was?

1855
01:25:56,439 --> 01:25:57,120
Speaker 2: Okay?

1856
01:25:57,960 --> 01:26:00,519
Speaker 3: I have one of my closest friends, a guy called Fampton,

1857
01:26:00,640 --> 01:26:04,599
Speaker 3: and he is and his brother, actually Daniel was mixed

1858
01:26:04,640 --> 01:26:07,559
Speaker 3: and engineered last couple of albums for me and stuff.

1859
01:26:07,600 --> 01:26:10,519
Speaker 3: But Andrew is a producer and a writer and lots

1860
01:26:10,520 --> 01:26:13,960
Speaker 3: of other things. He I was on holiday in Italy

1861
01:26:14,080 --> 01:26:17,000
Speaker 3: and he literally RiPP wrote me in an email. So

1862
01:26:17,320 --> 01:26:20,400
Speaker 3: this is years ago, obviously, and I'm like, so I

1863
01:26:20,479 --> 01:26:24,400
Speaker 3: just emailed him back and went, okay, whatever, whatever send

1864
01:26:24,960 --> 01:26:26,640
Speaker 3: And then so he did it again, and I'm like

1865
01:26:27,320 --> 01:26:30,760
Speaker 3: I replied an answer to him saying, what are you doing?

1866
01:26:30,800 --> 01:26:33,000
Speaker 3: You know what I mean, We've known each other years, right, like,

1867
01:26:33,120 --> 01:26:34,280
Speaker 3: what are you actually doing?

1868
01:26:34,320 --> 01:26:34,400
Speaker 2: What?

1869
01:26:34,520 --> 01:26:36,559
Speaker 3: You know? Because I didn't grasp what it was at all.

1870
01:26:36,880 --> 01:26:39,080
Speaker 3: And it's also this is the early days of YouTube.

1871
01:26:39,320 --> 01:26:41,680
Speaker 3: It's the early days of someone getting an email with

1872
01:26:41,760 --> 01:26:43,280
Speaker 3: a video link in it that I mean, I know,

1873
01:26:43,360 --> 01:26:46,720
Speaker 3: that's like just so makes me like a granddad, but

1874
01:26:46,760 --> 01:26:49,240
Speaker 3: I mean it was early that that was quite a

1875
01:26:49,240 --> 01:26:52,639
Speaker 3: novel thing, right. So in the end, we're we're on

1876
01:26:53,240 --> 01:26:55,360
Speaker 3: our holiday in Italy. We're on the Mouthy Coast. I

1877
01:26:55,400 --> 01:26:57,040
Speaker 3: remember it where I was and everything in the hotel

1878
01:26:57,040 --> 01:26:58,800
Speaker 3: and everything. So I get on the phone to him,

1879
01:26:58,880 --> 01:27:01,000
Speaker 3: right Andrew, what the hell are you doing?

1880
01:27:01,120 --> 01:27:01,280
Speaker 1: Right?

1881
01:27:01,320 --> 01:27:03,559
Speaker 3: What are you doing? Kind of thing? And he's laughing

1882
01:27:03,760 --> 01:27:06,120
Speaker 3: and he's like, so you don't know what a rip

1883
01:27:06,200 --> 01:27:09,760
Speaker 3: roll is. I'm like, no, I don't even know, don't

1884
01:27:09,760 --> 01:27:12,360
Speaker 3: know the term, the language, the nothing. So he kind

1885
01:27:12,360 --> 01:27:14,240
Speaker 3: of explained it to me, and even then I still

1886
01:27:14,280 --> 01:27:17,240
Speaker 3: sort of thought, nah, this is just him joking, This

1887
01:27:17,360 --> 01:27:19,080
Speaker 3: is just him doing this and a couple other friends

1888
01:27:19,120 --> 01:27:21,000
Speaker 3: that he's going to get to email me and do whatever,

1889
01:27:21,479 --> 01:27:23,479
Speaker 3: and had no idea that it was actually this little

1890
01:27:23,479 --> 01:27:26,599
Speaker 3: bubble on the Internet that people were, you know. So,

1891
01:27:27,280 --> 01:27:30,960
Speaker 3: to be honest, I give credit to my daughter for

1892
01:27:31,120 --> 01:27:36,920
Speaker 3: mostly putting me right about it. I'd been nominated for

1893
01:27:36,960 --> 01:27:41,040
Speaker 3: an MTV award in whenever, it was fifteen years ago,

1894
01:27:41,880 --> 01:27:44,639
Speaker 3: something to do with best Live Act or Best Act

1895
01:27:44,760 --> 01:27:46,880
Speaker 3: or best something, which all they were doing they were

1896
01:27:46,920 --> 01:27:49,320
Speaker 3: jumping on the rip roll thing and they were having

1897
01:27:49,360 --> 01:27:51,000
Speaker 3: a bit of fun. They were having a bit of fun,

1898
01:27:51,120 --> 01:27:54,439
Speaker 3: possibly at my expense, and that's whatever. But it was

1899
01:27:54,439 --> 01:27:57,360
Speaker 3: going to be in Liverpool, and I knew that Sir

1900
01:27:57,360 --> 01:27:59,839
Speaker 3: Paul McCartney was going to be getting a Lifetime Achievement

1901
01:27:59,880 --> 01:28:04,240
Speaker 3: or from Bono in Liverpool, right right, And I'm like,

1902
01:28:04,640 --> 01:28:05,680
Speaker 3: am I going to go to that?

1903
01:28:05,880 --> 01:28:05,960
Speaker 2: No?

1904
01:28:06,080 --> 01:28:08,920
Speaker 3: I am not right. I wasn't even really gonna go anyway,

1905
01:28:08,920 --> 01:28:11,000
Speaker 3: but I thought, I'm definitely not going there. If it

1906
01:28:11,000 --> 01:28:13,960
Speaker 3: would have been in Leipzig or Hamburg or Brussels, I

1907
01:28:14,080 --> 01:28:16,000
Speaker 3: might have gone to that, right, I ain't going to

1908
01:28:16,000 --> 01:28:18,559
Speaker 3: Liverpool with Sir Paul McCartney and Bonda. That ain't happening, right,

1909
01:28:19,600 --> 01:28:23,639
Speaker 3: And my daughter said, she said, look, there's no way

1910
01:28:23,640 --> 01:28:26,400
Speaker 3: you're going to that. That's just like some And I said, no,

1911
01:28:26,479 --> 01:28:28,400
Speaker 3: you're right, you know, and she was like fifteen sixteen

1912
01:28:28,400 --> 01:28:31,280
Speaker 3: whatever she was. He said, you do realize it's got

1913
01:28:31,320 --> 01:28:36,040
Speaker 3: nothing to do with you. And I went and I

1914
01:28:36,080 --> 01:28:38,479
Speaker 3: was actually, I was stunned. Actually, I'm right. What do

1915
01:28:38,520 --> 01:28:41,040
Speaker 3: you mean, It's got nothing to it? Actually says Rick Roll.

1916
01:28:41,240 --> 01:28:43,439
Speaker 3: I'm the Rick in the Rick role. It's the video.

1917
01:28:43,560 --> 01:28:46,479
Speaker 3: I'm in the video. He said, yeah, it's got nothing

1918
01:28:46,520 --> 01:28:49,880
Speaker 3: to do with you. And it was like really wise

1919
01:28:49,960 --> 01:28:54,679
Speaker 3: words from a young a young woman, young girl, because

1920
01:28:55,280 --> 01:28:58,280
Speaker 3: she was absolutely right. It's it's got everything to do

1921
01:28:58,320 --> 01:29:00,719
Speaker 3: with me and nothing to do with me same time.

1922
01:29:00,960 --> 01:29:02,960
Speaker 3: And it's probably the best bit of advice I ever

1923
01:29:03,000 --> 01:29:05,240
Speaker 3: had about it, all of it, and that is to say,

1924
01:29:05,400 --> 01:29:07,600
Speaker 3: it's over there and it's doing whatever it is, and

1925
01:29:07,640 --> 01:29:09,519
Speaker 3: it's a thing, and it's one of you, and it

1926
01:29:09,560 --> 01:29:11,519
Speaker 3: can be fun and you can even enjoy the fun

1927
01:29:11,520 --> 01:29:14,920
Speaker 3: and get involved in it sometimes, but it isn't. It's

1928
01:29:14,920 --> 01:29:17,679
Speaker 3: a thing and it's a whatever. Just it's there. Whatever

1929
01:29:17,720 --> 01:29:21,560
Speaker 3: it is. And that's because she was of the generation

1930
01:29:22,240 --> 01:29:24,960
Speaker 3: to understand the Internet way more than I was. So,

1931
01:29:26,240 --> 01:29:28,080
Speaker 3: you know, even though I had explained by one of

1932
01:29:28,080 --> 01:29:31,080
Speaker 3: my best friends who is my age, her explanation of

1933
01:29:31,120 --> 01:29:32,720
Speaker 3: it in a real way was kind of a lot

1934
01:29:32,760 --> 01:29:34,320
Speaker 3: more useful to me.

1935
01:29:34,360 --> 01:29:36,440
Speaker 1: If you know what I mean, what's your most famous

1936
01:29:36,680 --> 01:29:39,280
Speaker 1: Rick rold turned down that you've done? Like, I'm not

1937
01:29:39,439 --> 01:29:39,760
Speaker 1: doing that?

1938
01:29:40,880 --> 01:29:43,200
Speaker 3: Uh well, I get I get really commercial ones for

1939
01:29:43,280 --> 01:29:45,679
Speaker 3: money basically with products and things and all the rest

1940
01:29:45,680 --> 01:29:47,519
Speaker 3: of it, and I don't. I'll do ones that I

1941
01:29:47,520 --> 01:29:49,920
Speaker 3: think are okay and I think they're fine, and they're not,

1942
01:29:50,439 --> 01:29:52,840
Speaker 3: you know, in any way. And also because if they

1943
01:29:52,840 --> 01:29:54,320
Speaker 3: have a bit of a sense of humor about it,

1944
01:29:54,360 --> 01:29:56,479
Speaker 3: if you know what I mean, I've just done, I say,

1945
01:29:56,560 --> 01:29:59,439
Speaker 3: just a few months ago, did one for a video

1946
01:29:59,439 --> 01:30:02,280
Speaker 3: game for God into the Galaxy. And I loved that movie,

1947
01:30:02,320 --> 01:30:04,599
Speaker 3: the first movie when it came out, I absolutely loved it.

1948
01:30:04,840 --> 01:30:07,920
Speaker 3: And the way they use music, I think is such

1949
01:30:07,920 --> 01:30:12,080
Speaker 3: a blessing because kids know those songs, even the ones

1950
01:30:12,080 --> 01:30:15,080
Speaker 3: from the seventies, eighties, whatever, They know those songs. Like

1951
01:30:15,120 --> 01:30:16,760
Speaker 3: we were talking at the very beginning, all three of

1952
01:30:16,840 --> 01:30:18,719
Speaker 3: us talking at the beginning about how we listened to music,

1953
01:30:18,720 --> 01:30:20,920
Speaker 3: how we've come across and stuff. So I thought that

1954
01:30:21,040 --> 01:30:22,840
Speaker 3: was a really cool thing to do when the guys

1955
01:30:22,840 --> 01:30:25,040
Speaker 3: who made the video game are really great. So I'm

1956
01:30:25,040 --> 01:30:29,160
Speaker 3: more than happy to be invited to do that. But

1957
01:30:29,200 --> 01:30:30,720
Speaker 3: there's just times when I just look at it and

1958
01:30:30,760 --> 01:30:33,920
Speaker 3: I go now, I just don't feel that it's just.

1959
01:30:34,960 --> 01:30:40,120
Speaker 3: And I also think it's a really difficult thing to navigate.

1960
01:30:40,160 --> 01:30:43,759
Speaker 3: I think, how far to just do something for money.

1961
01:30:44,280 --> 01:30:46,240
Speaker 3: But don't get me wrong, my wife and I my

1962
01:30:46,280 --> 01:30:50,240
Speaker 3: wife manages me, and we have a criteria of things

1963
01:30:50,240 --> 01:30:53,479
Speaker 3: that need answering. The first one it usually comes up

1964
01:30:53,600 --> 01:30:57,000
Speaker 3: is where is it? Because if somebody says it's in

1965
01:30:57,080 --> 01:30:59,840
Speaker 3: Santiago and Chile, then we're almost on the plane, right

1966
01:31:00,120 --> 01:31:01,920
Speaker 3: And I don't love flying, but we're almost on the

1967
01:31:01,960 --> 01:31:04,880
Speaker 3: plane because we have great promoters down there, We've got

1968
01:31:04,880 --> 01:31:07,000
Speaker 3: some great wine down there. We love it down there.

1969
01:31:07,120 --> 01:31:09,240
Speaker 3: And if someone says to you, you know someone like that,

1970
01:31:09,439 --> 01:31:11,680
Speaker 3: or you know anywhere in South America, that's like what

1971
01:31:11,840 --> 01:31:14,920
Speaker 3: you know. Japan has been to quite a few times

1972
01:31:14,920 --> 01:31:17,360
Speaker 3: one way or other different places. There's lots of places

1973
01:31:17,360 --> 01:31:19,840
Speaker 3: in the world. Coming back to America and getting to

1974
01:31:19,880 --> 01:31:22,160
Speaker 3: go to towns and cities in such a way like

1975
01:31:22,240 --> 01:31:24,240
Speaker 3: this with the guys and everything. It's been such a

1976
01:31:24,280 --> 01:31:26,360
Speaker 3: trait really not something I can do on my own

1977
01:31:26,439 --> 01:31:29,720
Speaker 3: in any way, shape or form, so you know. But

1978
01:31:29,720 --> 01:31:32,240
Speaker 3: but the truth of it is, it's like where is it.

1979
01:31:32,240 --> 01:31:35,559
Speaker 3: It's also kind of yes, there's money involved, usually as

1980
01:31:35,600 --> 01:31:38,240
Speaker 3: cost there is, But what we also look at is

1981
01:31:38,240 --> 01:31:41,120
Speaker 3: we sometimes say, well, you know what, we'll do that

1982
01:31:41,400 --> 01:31:44,439
Speaker 3: because that basically means we can do this. Well, We're

1983
01:31:44,439 --> 01:31:46,320
Speaker 3: not going to make any money, but I just really

1984
01:31:46,400 --> 01:31:49,000
Speaker 3: want to do it. By the time we've flown the

1985
01:31:49,040 --> 01:31:50,960
Speaker 3: band and the crew there, it's probably going to cost

1986
01:31:51,040 --> 01:31:53,680
Speaker 3: me money, but I really want to do it. I

1987
01:31:53,760 --> 01:31:55,639
Speaker 3: really want to do it, and that pays for it.

1988
01:31:55,920 --> 01:31:58,120
Speaker 3: And I'm not afraid or embarrassed to talk about that,

1989
01:31:58,200 --> 01:31:59,960
Speaker 3: because at the end of the day, music is a

1990
01:32:00,040 --> 01:32:02,080
Speaker 3: business and it has to kind of balance out at

1991
01:32:02,080 --> 01:32:04,280
Speaker 3: some point, and you pick and choose and you do

1992
01:32:04,320 --> 01:32:07,040
Speaker 3: the ones you know. So so I think I've just

1993
01:32:07,120 --> 01:32:10,360
Speaker 3: always used my head in terms of thinking about the

1994
01:32:10,680 --> 01:32:12,559
Speaker 3: rip roll thing and never going to give you up

1995
01:32:12,600 --> 01:32:15,679
Speaker 3: the same look, I don't want to bleed it dry

1996
01:32:15,760 --> 01:32:19,040
Speaker 3: because I don't but sometimes there's opportunities that come along

1997
01:32:19,080 --> 01:32:21,760
Speaker 3: and sometimes they just happen. Sometimes they just happen in

1998
01:32:21,760 --> 01:32:24,200
Speaker 3: front of me, and it's like I'm getting on the

1999
01:32:24,200 --> 01:32:26,559
Speaker 3: stage and I'm singing that song right now because it's

2000
01:32:26,680 --> 01:32:30,679
Speaker 3: it's just been it's just happening on this It's tricky,

2001
01:32:30,720 --> 01:32:32,280
Speaker 3: and like you said, there's a lot of artists who

2002
01:32:32,280 --> 01:32:34,559
Speaker 3: want to run a million miles from their biggest, oldest song,

2003
01:32:35,160 --> 01:32:37,400
Speaker 3: and I kind of go the other way. I sort

2004
01:32:37,400 --> 01:32:40,080
Speaker 3: of embrace it, and it's it's it's like an old

2005
01:32:40,160 --> 01:32:42,439
Speaker 3: jacket and it's kept me warm for thirty odd years,

2006
01:32:42,439 --> 01:32:44,280
Speaker 3: do you know what I mean? So I just I

2007
01:32:44,280 --> 01:32:48,479
Speaker 3: have that kind of like comfortable love for it.

2008
01:32:48,520 --> 01:32:52,599
Speaker 1: I think, well that that's inspirational because I'm a human

2009
01:32:52,680 --> 01:32:59,920
Speaker 1: being that is still slowly, you know, highly uncomfortable when

2010
01:33:00,560 --> 01:33:03,240
Speaker 1: nice gestures happen or people show you love or that

2011
01:33:03,360 --> 01:33:05,519
Speaker 1: sort of thing. Like I would have proudly been the

2012
01:33:05,560 --> 01:33:09,160
Speaker 1: opposite and run away from it. But you know, it's

2013
01:33:09,200 --> 01:33:13,320
Speaker 1: really inspiring to see someone in a healthy way just

2014
01:33:13,479 --> 01:33:19,320
Speaker 1: embrace and embrace their their work and really enjoy it

2015
01:33:19,320 --> 01:33:22,960
Speaker 1: and not be serious, but not take themselves that seriously

2016
01:33:23,040 --> 01:33:26,439
Speaker 1: because you know, I've run across many an artist that

2017
01:33:26,520 --> 01:33:30,320
Speaker 1: does nothing but try to sabotage a good thing, and.

2018
01:33:30,479 --> 01:33:32,720
Speaker 3: I understand it. I do understand it, Don't get me wrong.

2019
01:33:32,760 --> 01:33:35,519
Speaker 3: I do. And like I say that, me having that

2020
01:33:35,560 --> 01:33:38,439
Speaker 3: fifteen years or more not doing it is what I

2021
01:33:38,479 --> 01:33:41,439
Speaker 3: think allows me to be comfortable about it now because

2022
01:33:41,439 --> 01:33:44,280
Speaker 3: I'm not it anymore and I'm not wrapped up in it.

2023
01:33:44,360 --> 01:33:46,559
Speaker 3: And don't get me wrong, I want to represent it

2024
01:33:46,600 --> 01:33:48,360
Speaker 3: when I sing it live, you know, when I'm out

2025
01:33:48,400 --> 01:33:50,519
Speaker 3: with new kids doing this, or whether I'm doing my

2026
01:33:50,560 --> 01:33:52,800
Speaker 3: own shows, wherever it is. I want to go out

2027
01:33:52,800 --> 01:33:55,080
Speaker 3: and sing that song the best I possibly can. And

2028
01:33:55,120 --> 01:33:57,760
Speaker 3: I want anybody who remembers it and has some love

2029
01:33:57,840 --> 01:34:01,880
Speaker 3: for it to have that emotion with me and vice versa,

2030
01:34:01,920 --> 01:34:04,400
Speaker 3: and share it a bit and say, yeah, I was there,

2031
01:34:04,520 --> 01:34:07,040
Speaker 3: I bought the T shirt. I remember, you know, because

2032
01:34:07,080 --> 01:34:10,520
Speaker 3: that because I go to whether it's Sir Paul McCartney

2033
01:34:10,520 --> 01:34:13,240
Speaker 3: in fort Worth the other week, or whether it's somebody

2034
01:34:13,280 --> 01:34:17,920
Speaker 3: who's nowhere near his level of you know, greatness or whatever,

2035
01:34:18,320 --> 01:34:20,280
Speaker 3: whether it's somebody just starting out or what have you.

2036
01:34:20,760 --> 01:34:23,880
Speaker 3: If I've got a connection with them because I, you know,

2037
01:34:24,040 --> 01:34:26,280
Speaker 3: loved that record, then i want to feel that in

2038
01:34:26,320 --> 01:34:28,519
Speaker 3: the room. And if I feel their up and doing it,

2039
01:34:28,760 --> 01:34:31,080
Speaker 3: just painting my numbers up there going looking at the

2040
01:34:31,120 --> 01:34:34,240
Speaker 3: Watchgod or be off the stage at ten minutes. I'm like,

2041
01:34:34,840 --> 01:34:36,680
Speaker 3: I'd rather walk out. I don't want to know, do

2042
01:34:36,720 --> 01:34:39,160
Speaker 3: you know what I mean? It's we've still got to

2043
01:34:39,240 --> 01:34:41,679
Speaker 3: respect it. I think, however old the song is, and

2044
01:34:42,240 --> 01:34:45,680
Speaker 3: even if it's become an internet meme, you still have

2045
01:34:45,720 --> 01:34:48,840
Speaker 3: to respect what the true emotion of it when when

2046
01:34:48,880 --> 01:34:50,160
Speaker 3: somebody heard it the first time.

2047
01:34:50,920 --> 01:34:53,479
Speaker 1: I appreciate you for, you know, taking the time out

2048
01:34:53,520 --> 01:34:56,559
Speaker 1: with us and and and sharing your journey and your story.

2049
01:34:56,600 --> 01:35:00,240
Speaker 1: And you know, whether whether on the radio or ted

2050
01:35:00,320 --> 01:35:03,080
Speaker 1: Lasso or the internet, you know this song is going

2051
01:35:03,120 --> 01:35:06,880
Speaker 1: to be here forever man, and I appreciate you for

2052
01:35:07,439 --> 01:35:10,479
Speaker 1: sharing this with us. And this is uh Rick Astley

2053
01:35:10,560 --> 01:35:13,800
Speaker 1: on Quest Love Supreme. Won't be out of Fontigelow Sugar,

2054
01:35:13,880 --> 01:35:19,599
Speaker 1: Steve Unpaid, Bill and myself and laya thank you guys,

2055
01:35:19,600 --> 01:35:21,680
Speaker 1: and we'll see you on the next go round of

2056
01:35:21,840 --> 01:35:30,280
Speaker 1: Quest Love Supreme. All right, y'all. Quest Love Supreme is

2057
01:35:30,280 --> 01:35:38,479
Speaker 1: a production of iHeart Radio. For more podcasts from iHeart Radio,

2058
01:35:38,600 --> 01:35:42,080
Speaker 1: visit the iHeart Radio app Apple podcasts, or wherever you

2059
01:35:42,120 --> 01:35:43,560
Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows.