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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. This is Rob.

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Speaker 3: Lamb and this is Joe McCormick. And today on Weird

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Speaker 3: House we're tackling a classic. We're going to be talking

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Speaker 3: about the nineteen thirty one Universal Pictures adaptation of Dracula,

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Speaker 3: directed by Todd Browning starring Bella Lagosi. Now, Rob, this

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Speaker 3: was your pick for this week. I had always assumed

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Speaker 3: if we talked about Dracula, it would happen in October.

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Speaker 3: But I'm not complaining. Happy to talk about Dracula in

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Speaker 3: January or whatever month it still is. Yeah, we're still January.

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Speaker 3: So what's going on? How'd you get to Dracula?

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Speaker 2: Well, this is how it went down. So, yeah, this

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Speaker 2: is a film I had actually never seen before. You know,

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Speaker 2: sometimes a film I think is so iconic, so genre defining,

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Speaker 2: so all present in popular culture that it kind of

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Speaker 2: fades in to a personal obscurity. You know, you haven't

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Speaker 2: seen it, but you kind of feel like you've seen it,

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Speaker 2: or you know you're just overly familiar with its themes.

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Speaker 2: It's cast its place in film history, and therefore when

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Speaker 2: it comes time to watch something, you're like, well, I

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Speaker 2: just want to watch something fresh, or you want to

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Speaker 2: watch something you really do know, and films like this

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Speaker 2: can kind of fall through the cracks.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's sort of interesting. I might talk more about

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Speaker 3: this later. But something I find interesting about this Dracula

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Speaker 3: is I've probably seen it at least five or six times,

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Speaker 3: but I still forget things about it. And the reason

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Speaker 3: is that there are so many different adaptations of Dracula

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Speaker 3: it becomes hard to keep straight which elements are from

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Speaker 3: which version. True.

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Speaker 2: True, Yeah, what deviations are made is what is intensified

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Speaker 2: and what is condensed and so forth.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I had this realization over the weekend. So

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Speaker 2: my kid has really gotten into Dungeons and Dragons and

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Speaker 2: has set their sight so not only DMING A Campaign

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Speaker 2: for Friends, but DMING Curse of Strawed. For those of

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Speaker 2: you who are unfamiliar, the Dark Lord Strata of aon

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Speaker 2: Zardovich is D and d's take on Dracula, essentially a

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Speaker 2: Dracula esque vampire lord character created in the late nineteen

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Speaker 2: seventies by Tracy and Laura Hickman and based in part

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Speaker 2: on Bela Lugosi's iconic portrayal in nineteen thirty one's Dracula.

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Speaker 3: I have no familiarity at all. Basically, all I know

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Speaker 3: is that vampires are a big deal in D and D.

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Speaker 3: You can confirm this that they're not like your standard

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Speaker 3: you know, you're just staking them left and right kind

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Speaker 3: of enemies that you might expect from some like horror

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Speaker 3: video games or whatever. Like if you meet a vampire

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Speaker 3: in D and D, this is like one of the

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Speaker 3: most devastating and dangerous enemies you could possibly face.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, especially like a true vampire as opposed to just

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Speaker 2: a vampire spawn.

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Speaker 3: But okay, yeah, any.

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Speaker 2: Rate, I told you know, I'm supportive. I'm a supportive dad,

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Speaker 2: So I'm like, okay, that sounds good. But one doesn't

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Speaker 2: simply run Curse of Straw without seeing at least one

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Speaker 2: Dracula movie. And I think the most they'd seen was

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Speaker 2: Bart Simpson's Dracula on Treehouse of Horror.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, which is a take on a lot of

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Speaker 3: the jokes on that are tied into the Francis Ford

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Speaker 3: Coppola adaptation from the nineties.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, yes, yeah, And so you know, I was looking

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Speaker 2: at my options, and I was considering the Copola one

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Speaker 2: as well, because I'm like, all right, my wife's going

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Speaker 2: to be out of town, it's just the two of us.

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Speaker 2: We've got to watch a Dracula film. And then I

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Speaker 2: started really thinking about It's like, you know, I haven't

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Speaker 2: actually seen the nineteen thirty one classic in full. You know,

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Speaker 2: I've seen so many Dracula films over the years, and

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Speaker 2: this one has just fallen through the cracks. So given

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Speaker 2: that that they enjoyed Son of Frankenstein back in October,

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Speaker 2: I was like, well, it makes sense to watch another

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Speaker 2: black and white horror classic. It's maybe not too scary.

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Speaker 2: I mean, they can handle stranger things and aliens at

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Speaker 2: this point, so I'm not too worried about that. But

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Speaker 2: you know, some of these Dracula movies hit pretty hard.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, we watched Dracula. For my own part, I

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Speaker 2: feel like, absolutely holds up stunning, atmospherically, creepy, absolutely rooted

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Speaker 2: in Lugosi's mesmerizing performance, and it's pretty weird in its

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Speaker 2: own right too. I'm also happy to report that my

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Speaker 2: kid also really enjoyed the film, resulting in many a

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Speaker 2: oh my, whenever Dracula or Renfield made crazy or intense eyes,

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Speaker 2: they told me after we were viewing that they half

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Speaker 2: expected Dracula to creep out of the shadows in the house.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think that's what you want. I okay, let's see.

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Speaker 3: I'm trying to search my feelings and know and find

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Speaker 3: what I know to be true. Have I ever really

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Speaker 3: been scared by the Universal Dracula.

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Speaker 4: No.

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Speaker 3: I think maybe I'm just too hardened by horror movies

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Speaker 3: that would come later. But I do love it, and

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Speaker 3: I appreciate the craft of the horror in it, and

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Speaker 3: I feel like I can see how it would be

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Speaker 3: scary if I hadn't been so desensitized by all of

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Speaker 3: the edgy or hor horror movies that would come later.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, to be clear, they're fine, They're almost thirteen. They

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Speaker 2: were able to handle it, But I was. It did

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Speaker 2: bring me much joy that they enjoyed it as much

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Speaker 2: as they did, and they weren't bored with it or anything.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, I don't think there's really a boring moment

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Speaker 2: in this one. If it flies right along, sometimes literally

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Speaker 2: on the wings of a bat. So I don't really

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Speaker 2: have an elevator picture this one, Joe, other than it's Dracula.

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Speaker 2: This is the big one. This is a Titan of

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Speaker 2: not only cinema enlarge, but also horror cinema specifically.

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Speaker 3: Dracula comes to the talkies fully licensed.

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Speaker 2: That's right, that's right. Let's see if we're able to.

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Speaker 2: Let's go ahead and listen to just a little bit

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Speaker 2: of the trailer audio.

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Speaker 3: Here.

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Speaker 5: I am Dracula. I mention of the name brings to

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Speaker 5: my I'm things so evil, so fantastic, so degrading. You

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Speaker 5: wonder if it isn't all a dream, a nightmare.

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Speaker 2: Breath.

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Speaker 5: Rap now.

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Speaker 3: Millions of them.

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Speaker 5: The original terrifying story of a maniac and a man

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Speaker 5: who lived after death, lived on human blood, took the

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Speaker 5: form of a vampire bat and lured innocent girls to

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Speaker 5: a fate truly worse than death.

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Speaker 4: Became to me over the same of his arm, and

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Speaker 4: he made me dream.

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Speaker 2: All right. Well, you might be wondering, well, where can

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Speaker 2: I want watch nineteen thirty one's Dracula. Well, I watched

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Speaker 2: it on the Universal Dracula Complete Legacy Collection Blu ray Set.

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Speaker 2: I rented this from Videodrome. I think you have the

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Speaker 2: same addition, right, Joe.

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Speaker 3: No, I've got a slightly different thing. I've got the

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Speaker 3: Universal Classic Monsters Essential Collection Blu ray set, which I

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Speaker 3: highly recommend. It's got a lot of great extra I mean,

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Speaker 3: all the films look beautiful. It's got a ton of

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Speaker 3: great extras, documentaries and commentary tracks and all that comes

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Speaker 3: with a nice little booklet. So yeah, I've enjoyed this

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Speaker 3: set for years.

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Speaker 2: All Right, I think we have some of the same

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Speaker 2: extras and special features. They'll share it, so definitely, you know,

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Speaker 2: Universal Horror release.

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Speaker 3: Here might just be a partial repackaging kind of thing.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because the extras on this day and there's some

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Speaker 2: great extras. They're a little bit older, but charming in

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Speaker 2: ways that sometimes things from nineteen ninety nine are not.

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Speaker 2: But there's a really good document short documentary called The

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Speaker 2: Road to Dracula, and it's hosted by Carla Limley, who

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Speaker 2: lived you know, nine through twenty fourteen. She was the

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Speaker 2: niece of Universal founder Carl Limley and cousin of producer

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Speaker 2: Carl Limley Junior.

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Speaker 3: And she's in the movie.

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Speaker 2: She is she has the first line of dialogue.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, she's just riding in the carriage in the borgo pass. Yes. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So it's really fun and you know, you got some

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Speaker 2: of the usual suspects, various film historians. Some will refer

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Speaker 2: to Joe Dante of course shows up to talk a

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Speaker 2: little about horror films, and it's a lot of fun.

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Speaker 2: So these Blu rays are great. But this is of

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Speaker 2: course a very famous film. It's generally available for digital

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Speaker 2: purchase in rental, and it's one one of those classics

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Speaker 2: that you will also periodically get to see on the

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Speaker 2: big screen, which is a treat.

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Speaker 3: While we're on the subject of disc extras, I just

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Speaker 3: wanted to say a couple of times I've watched this

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Speaker 3: movie with a commentary track that's on the disc version

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Speaker 3: I have by the film and horror historian David J. Skull.

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Speaker 3: Some of the things, like probably a lot of the

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Speaker 3: behind the scenes things I know know about the movie,

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Speaker 3: I learned through Skall's commentary, so credit to him. That's

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Speaker 3: a source of a lot of my just general information.

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Speaker 2: Yes, Skall, who sadly passed away last year, is also

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Speaker 2: an important part of the documentary shorts on the disc

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Speaker 2: and among his many books you'll find vas for Vampire

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Speaker 2: and a to Z Guide to Everything Undead that was

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Speaker 2: published in ninety six. I've already added a used copy

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Speaker 2: of that to my cart I think I need that

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Speaker 2: in my collection.

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Speaker 3: Uh huh, they're all undead. Okay, trying to think what

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Speaker 3: the X is?

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, might be a tough pull. Yeah, all right,

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Speaker 2: Well let's talk about the connections here, the people behind

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Speaker 2: this film. I do have to note that, as usual,

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Speaker 2: we can't cover everyone and a film this big. I

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Speaker 2: feel like there's been so much written about it and

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Speaker 2: explored about the picture. Every little part has probably been

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Speaker 2: explored to some degree or another, and you know, we

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Speaker 2: just don't have time for all of that. So my

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Speaker 2: apologies to anyone whose efforts and talent we left out here.

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Speaker 3: Yes, also worth noting that this film is incredibly huge

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Speaker 3: and important in Hollywood history, and we're not going to

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Speaker 3: be able to explore all of this. This is not

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Speaker 3: your complete history lesson on the universal monsters in Dracula.

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Speaker 3: We can't do that today. We're not really qualified for that.

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Speaker 3: But we're going to do what we can, absolutely all right.

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Speaker 2: Starting at the top, the director is, of course Todd Browning,

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Speaker 2: who ofd eighteen eighty through nineteen sixty two American director

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Speaker 2: who was quite successful during the Silent Era and by

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Speaker 2: some estimates less sure of himself entering into the talky era,

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Speaker 2: and that's something you'll pick up on with this film

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Speaker 2: and its frequent use of silence and at times a

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Speaker 2: kind of like stagy ritualistic framing that feels very you know,

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Speaker 2: in keeping with this film's roots on the stage as

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Speaker 2: a play, but also fitting for the silent era as well.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess we can talk more later about the

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Speaker 3: different musical compositions that have been paired with the movie

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Speaker 3: over the years, but one thing that will feel kind

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Speaker 3: of unusual about it to a lot of modern audiences

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Speaker 3: is the lack of music throughout the film. There are

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Speaker 3: a couple of scenes with music, you know, with the

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Speaker 3: credits and the old version you get the Swan Lake,

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Speaker 3: and there's a scene that takes place at a at

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Speaker 3: a symphony performance where there's music in the background because

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Speaker 3: it's diegetic music, it's supposed to be part of the narrative.

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Speaker 3: But most of the scenes it's just kind of silence

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Speaker 3: and the characters talking, and some of the most dramatic

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Speaker 3: scenes in the film there's nothing at all to listen to.

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Speaker 3: It's just utterly silent. Well, like you know, the vampire creeps.

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Speaker 2: Up, Yeah, I mean you almost it's almost unheard. Off

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Speaker 2: when you compare it to modern films, like so many

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Speaker 2: films are just non stop blaring music and sound effects

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Speaker 2: and explosions. And it depends on the genre obviously, but yeah,

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Speaker 2: it can be almost shocking how silent this picture is.

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Speaker 2: But you're also you're not missing the cacophony either. It's

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Speaker 2: also worth noting that films of this era were also

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Speaker 2: released in silent film versions, in part for older theaters,

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Speaker 2: but also for international markets since dubbing subtitles were not

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Speaker 2: really all that established yet. So you'll find versions of

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Speaker 2: nineteen thirty one's Dracula that have the full like silent

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Speaker 2: film dialogue set up, where you know, the inter titles. Yeah, yeah, oh,

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Speaker 2: I feel like.

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Speaker 3: That would There would be so many There's a lot

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Speaker 3: of dialogue in this movie, because generally talkies had more

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Speaker 3: dialogue in them than silent films. Did I feel like

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Speaker 3: that would extend the run time a lot if you

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Speaker 3: had to have an intertitle for every line.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they must have. I haven't seen it in full myself.

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Speaker 2: I've just seen some clips. I'm not sure if a

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Speaker 2: full version exists, but yeah, they would have to cut

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Speaker 2: some stuff.

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Speaker 3: Right, I would think so, well, I don't know who knows.

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Speaker 3: I've never edited a talkie into a silent film, but yeah,

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Speaker 3: I would think it would. It would end up running

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Speaker 3: really long and they'd have to cut some stuff down.

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Speaker 2: They should. They should do that. When the new Nosferatu

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Speaker 2: film that came out, they need to do a silent

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Speaker 2: film cut of it. You know, people directors keep doing

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Speaker 2: like black and white cuts of films. It's like, that's great,

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Speaker 2: but let's see the silent Cut's see.

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Speaker 3: What that's like.

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Speaker 2: Anyway, back to Todd Browning. Browning wrote and directed his

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Speaker 2: first full length silent picture in nineteen seventeen, and found

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Speaker 2: success with nineteen twenties The Virgin of Stambul. His first

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Speaker 2: talkie was nineteen twenty nine's The Thirteenth Chair. That was

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Speaker 2: a murder mystery that had Legosi in it as So

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Speaker 2: We'll come back to and Dracula of course, followed shortly

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Speaker 2: after that. His other films include the notable loss film

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Speaker 2: nineteen twenty sevens London After Midnight, nineteen thirty Two's Freaks

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Speaker 2: nineteen thirty five's Mark of the Vampire in nineteen thirty

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Speaker 2: six is The Devil Doll. His last film was nineteen

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Speaker 2: thirty nine's Miracles for Sale, and he retired in nineteen

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Speaker 2: forty two, with Hollywood trends and tastes drifting further away

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Speaker 2: from his sensibilities.

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Speaker 3: At the time. When Browning was younger, he had some

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Speaker 3: experience working with circus performers, I believe, and this sort

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Speaker 3: of came out in an ongoing obsession that appears in

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Speaker 3: many of his works. Certainly there in nineteen thirty two's Freaks,

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Speaker 3: which is a Oh man. I haven't seen that movie

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Speaker 3: in many years, but I'd be very interested to see

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Speaker 3: what modern critics think about that as a retrospective. I mean,

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Speaker 3: it's a very surprising film for the nineteen thirties in

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Speaker 3: many ways.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this Wears is famous for the one of Us song, right, Yeah, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: it's kind of a chant. I guess it's a.

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Speaker 3: Song Google gobble one of Us.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, all right. Dracula. If you're not aware, the

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Speaker 2: original novel is by Bram Stoker, who lived eighteen forty

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Speaker 2: seven through nineteen twelve, Irish author and theater critic who's

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Speaker 2: eighteen ninety seven novel was Seeming, You know that a

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Speaker 2: lot has been written and discussed about where this novel arises.

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Speaker 2: You know, in the in Bram Stoker's life and mindset,

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Speaker 2: but seems to have spun out of various accounts and

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Speaker 2: experiences of disease in the world around him, and perhaps

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Speaker 2: you know he was sick as a child, that sort

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Speaker 2: of thing. Also folklore of Ireland as well as mainland Europe.

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Speaker 2: And of course it's also worth noting that in the

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Speaker 2: book there's a lot of use of phonographs. It's often

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Speaker 2: crazy to realize how thoroughly modern the novel was at

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Speaker 2: its release. If he had written it today, Mino would

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Speaker 2: have been on TikTok I feel.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. Wasn't doctor Seward in the book doing like

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Speaker 3: phonograph diaries or something? He was? Yes.

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Speaker 2: Another detail that we often overlook I was reading about

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Speaker 2: this is that the novel was only a moderate success

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Speaker 2: at the time, and Merritt's only brief mention in Stoker's

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Speaker 2: nineteen twelve obituary It wasn't until the copyright battle over

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Speaker 2: a little nineteen twenty two film titled Nosferatu stirred everything out.

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Speaker 2: That's when the Stoker's widow, Florence Balcombe, gave approval to

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Speaker 2: Hamilton Dean for this stage adaptation of Dracula and of

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Speaker 2: course from that this film eventually and all this blossoms,

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Speaker 2: Dracula cinematic legacy in the novel truly becomes a popular classic.

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Speaker 3: Now, wait a minute, did bram Stoker not himself adapt

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Speaker 3: the novel to the stage? I thought there was at

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Speaker 3: least one play version that he wrote, but I could

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Speaker 3: be wrong. Well, folks, neither of us knew the answer

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Speaker 3: for sure, so I just looked it up to find out. Yes,

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Speaker 3: bram Stoker did create at least one version of the

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Speaker 3: novel for the stage that apparently debuted before the novel

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Speaker 3: was even released, or at least the same year. So

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Speaker 3: he wrote the novel then made a stage adaptation which

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Speaker 3: debuted under the title Dracula or the Undead, and that

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Speaker 3: was performed in May eighteen ninety seven, the same month

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Speaker 3: that the novel was released, And according to an article

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Speaker 3: that I just dug up about this, apparently only two

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Speaker 3: people came and showed up in the audience to watch it.

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Speaker 2: Oh wow. So yeah, it can be little surprising to

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Speaker 2: realize that the popularity of the novel really rises alongside

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Speaker 2: it's sent the book cinematic history. And I think part

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Speaker 2: of the sort of confusion that can occur in my

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Speaker 2: opinion anyway, is the fact that we often love Dracula

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Speaker 2: and Frankenstein together. But Mary Shelley's book was published in

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Speaker 2: eighteen eighteen. That's seventy nine years earlier.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. So another weird thing to think about is that

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Speaker 3: when this movie was made, the movie we're talking about today,

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Speaker 3: the universal Dracula, the novel was only like thirty three

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Speaker 3: or thirty four years old. Wow, Dracula feels like an

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Speaker 3: ancient story to us. But it is the equivalent of

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Speaker 3: making a movie today based on a novel that was

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Speaker 3: originally published like in the early nineties. I looked up, like,

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Speaker 3: what were the big novels on the bestseller lists in

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Speaker 3: like nineteen ninety one, So it would be like today

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Speaker 3: making an adaptation of The Sum of All Fear by

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Speaker 3: Tom Clancy, Which that really puts it in a different

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Speaker 3: perspective for me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that man, that's mind blowing for sure. All right,

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Speaker 2: now getting into the various adaptations here, So yes, we

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Speaker 2: have the authorized initial stage adaptation of Dracula by Hamilton

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Speaker 2: Dean who lived eighteen seventy nine through nineteen fifty eight.

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Speaker 2: He was a family friend. He was Bram Stoker's widow's

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Speaker 2: choice to make the official stage adaptation. Dean himself initially

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Speaker 2: played Van Helsing and the nineteen twenty four play here

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Speaker 2: became popular, but some revisions proved necessary before it could

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Speaker 2: really make that move to Broadway in nineteen twenty seven.

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Speaker 2: That's also when Bella Lagosi comes on board to play

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Speaker 2: the Count.

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Speaker 3: It's funny that there are so many different versions of

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Speaker 3: Dracula before it even makes it to the movie that

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Speaker 3: made it so famous, you know. So like, you've got

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Speaker 3: the original novel, You've got Bram Stoker's stage adaptation, You've

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Speaker 3: got multiple different Oh, there are play versions of the play.

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Speaker 3: You got the Hamilton Dean play. You got at least

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Speaker 3: a couple of versions. You said that went through revisions

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Speaker 3: going on to Broadway. And then also you've got No Speratu,

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Speaker 3: the FW Murnow movie, which we said, as we said,

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Speaker 3: is an unofficial adaptation of the story making some changes.

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Speaker 3: So it's like this novel that is not even thirty

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Speaker 3: years old, is getting all of these different rewrites in

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Speaker 3: different versions before it even reaches its best known form.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, Nosfaratu was not even the first adaptation.

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Speaker 2: There was a nineteen twenty one film called Dracula's Death.

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Speaker 2: It was a Hungarian silent film that apparently had very

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Speaker 2: little to do with the actual plot of Dracula, but

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Speaker 2: still there it was.

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Speaker 3: But surely once we get the play version on Broadway

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Speaker 3: starring Bella Lagosi, then that's exactly what we get in

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Speaker 3: the film, right.

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Speaker 2: No, no, not no, probably not so the Broadway revision though.

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Speaker 2: That's where John L. Balderston comes in. Lived eighteen eighty

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Speaker 2: nine through nineteen fifty four playwriting screenwriter, and he'd later

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Speaker 2: work on the screenplays for Frankenstein and also in thirty one,

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Speaker 2: thirty two Is the Mummy, thirty five is Bride of Frankenstein,

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Speaker 2: Mad Love, Dracula's Daughter, Gaslight, and many others.

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Speaker 3: Wrote a lot of my favorites of the era.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and as we've alluded to this already and we'll

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Speaker 2: keep mentioning this, the play is already a notable condensing

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Speaker 2: of Dracula, which if you've ever read it, you already

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Speaker 2: know that. You know. It's only like four hundred and

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Speaker 2: something pages long. It's not a sprawling book in terms

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Speaker 2: of length, but it can kind of feel sprawling at times,

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Speaker 2: just the way that it's written composed of these overlapping correspondences,

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Speaker 2: diary entries, and phonograph recordings. The beginning of the novel

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Speaker 2: is arguably a lot more exciting than some of the

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Speaker 2: latter stretches and so forth. And we should also know

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Speaker 2: the other like major influential change that is made in

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Speaker 2: the stage adaptation of Dracula here is our change is

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Speaker 2: to what Dracula is. The way Dracula is presented as

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Speaker 2: a creature and a character.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right. I mean, Dracula is the bad guy

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Speaker 3: of the movie, but he is much more of the

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Speaker 3: Bella Lagosi. Dracula is much more charming and interesting than

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Speaker 3: the Dracula of the novel, who is a filthy, repulsive demon.

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Speaker 3: Just you know, there's not the Dracula in the book

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Speaker 3: is just not lovable.

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Speaker 2: Now, he's a creature of dust. He's he's more in

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Speaker 2: line with this. He's an grotesque, undead warrior king. And

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Speaker 2: here this is the kind of Dracula that can stand

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Speaker 2: shoulder to shoulder with London's elite later on and is

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Speaker 2: greeted as as an equal and is charming and erotic

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Speaker 2: in ways that the original Dracula in the script in

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Speaker 2: the in the novel is not.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, all right.

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Speaker 2: Garrett Fort is the screenplay credit who lived nineteen hundred

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Speaker 2: and nineteen forty five. American screenwriter, playwright, and author. His

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Speaker 2: credits include Franken and Dracula's Daughter The Devil Doll. Both

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Speaker 2: of those Dracula's Daughter and Devil Doll were thirty six

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Speaker 2: and nineteen forties, The Mark of Zaro, just to name

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Speaker 2: a few.

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Speaker 3: Okay, well we got to talk about Beyla now.

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Speaker 2: Yes, Beila Legosi plays Count Dracula. Of course, lived eighteen

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Speaker 2: eighty two through nineteen fifty six. So we've discussed some

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Speaker 2: films with iconic, even career defining performances here on Weird

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Speaker 2: House before. But the case of bel Lugosi and Dracula,

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Speaker 2: I feel like this is on an entirely different level,

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Speaker 2: like even compared to things like Carlos Frankenstein. It's because

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Speaker 2: it's not only career defining, its genre defining. He not

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Speaker 2: only becomes Dracula in this picture, but defines what Dracula

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Speaker 2: is for the next one hundred years and beyond. Anyone

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Speaker 2: else playing Dracula in the shadow of this film has

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Speaker 2: no choice but to either embrace Legosi's performance or to

416
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Speaker 2: play against it, which is what you often see, but

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Speaker 2: you absolutely cannot ignore it. Like this really sets the

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Speaker 2: tone and sets the course for not only Dracula films,

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Speaker 2: not only vampire films, but horror cinema in large.

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Speaker 3: He brings a lot to the role that I think

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Speaker 3: you wouldn't necessarily get about the character on the page.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if Bela Legosi is the sexiest Dracula

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Speaker 3: there has ever been, but he does bring a kind

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Speaker 3: of interesting suaveness and attractiveness to the role. He brings

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Speaker 3: a smile and a sense of humor to the character

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Speaker 3: that I think was not really there previously. Was certainly

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Speaker 3: not there in the previous film adaptation, like in nos Faratu.

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Speaker 3: You know Max Shrek no attacking Max Shrek's performance as

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Speaker 3: count Orlock there, but that's a totally different take on

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Speaker 3: the character. Does not have the kind of charm and

431
00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:00,560
Speaker 3: sense of humor that Bella Legosi brings to this role.

432
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:04,800
Speaker 3: That actually makes it much more sinister. In those rare

433
00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:08,440
Speaker 3: moments where in this movie you get flashes of anger

434
00:24:08,560 --> 00:24:10,960
Speaker 3: and malice from Dracula, like in the moment where he

435
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:13,680
Speaker 3: slaps down the after they pulled the trick on him

436
00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:16,600
Speaker 3: by opening the cigarette box and shining the mirror in

437
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:19,359
Speaker 3: his face, smacks it away, and you see him, you know,

438
00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,560
Speaker 3: scowling at Van Helsing and the other men, and that

439
00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:27,080
Speaker 3: moment is quite shocking. And it's because of the you know,

440
00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:31,480
Speaker 3: the calmness and the coolness that Legosi brings to this character.

441
00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:34,560
Speaker 3: He's kind of like it's he's in on a joke

442
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:37,919
Speaker 3: that only he gets, and the joke is that you

443
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 3: will serve him.

444
00:24:39,520 --> 00:24:42,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, the sexiness of Dracula. It brings me back to

445
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:44,359
Speaker 2: what I said earlier about the about being you can

446
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:47,600
Speaker 2: be overly familiar with this picture and you can also

447
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,080
Speaker 2: just be more accustomed to stills from it, and maybe

448
00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:54,000
Speaker 2: even stills of an older Legosi playing Count Dracula dressing

449
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:56,960
Speaker 2: up as Count Dracula. But I feel like you really

450
00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:58,800
Speaker 2: have to see the full performance. You have to see

451
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:03,360
Speaker 2: him in motion, you have to hear him make every

452
00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:07,720
Speaker 2: little enunciation to the Dracula dialogue, and it all adds

453
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:10,760
Speaker 2: up to what, especially for the time period, is like

454
00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:15,600
Speaker 2: a very erotically charged performance, Like there is a hypnotic

455
00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:19,480
Speaker 2: charisma to him, and there is I think a strong

456
00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:23,639
Speaker 2: like pan sexual eroticism to him as he you know,

457
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,280
Speaker 2: because he doesn't see gender or anything. He sees blood.

458
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,159
Speaker 2: Doesn't matter if you're a if you're a male, female

459
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:32,240
Speaker 2: or what have you. Dracula is going to come for you.

460
00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:35,919
Speaker 3: There is Dracula's embrace. Yeah, I would say that that

461
00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:39,119
Speaker 3: is implicit in the film. It's not explicit like it

462
00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:41,359
Speaker 3: is in a lot of the later Dracula adaptations which

463
00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:45,320
Speaker 3: make him overtly sexual and stuff. But it's a strong

464
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:50,480
Speaker 3: subtext here. And to emphasize again what we said earlier

465
00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:53,399
Speaker 3: that like, whatever sexual themes about Dracula are there in

466
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:56,640
Speaker 3: the novel or whatever, I do not think there's really

467
00:25:56,760 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 3: much about him being potentially like alluring in any way.

468
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:04,120
Speaker 3: I mean, dude, whatever's there is just purely predatory.

469
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:09,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, again nineteen twenty two, nos Faratu not really sexy.

470
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:13,200
Speaker 2: And as we were discussing off Mike earlier, twenty twenty four,

471
00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:17,359
Speaker 2: nos Faratu maybe perhaps sexy. I haven't seen it yet,

472
00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:20,880
Speaker 2: But if that Nosfaratu is sexy, it's because that Nosfaratu

473
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:24,240
Speaker 2: stands in the long shadow of Bella Lagosi's.

474
00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:28,520
Speaker 3: Dracula, because that one is remixing different themes that have

475
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:31,200
Speaker 3: come through in all the different interpretations of Dracula over

476
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:34,200
Speaker 3: the years. Yes, I would argue that the new Robert

477
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:38,080
Speaker 3: Eggers knows Feratu, which I have seen and I greatly enjoyed.

478
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:40,440
Speaker 3: In fact, I was talking about this with Rachel and

479
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:42,679
Speaker 3: we were trying to say, like, is Dracula sexy in

480
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 3: that I think the goal, actually, the specific thing they

481
00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 3: were trying to accomplish, was to go for maximally disgusting

482
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:54,920
Speaker 3: and revolting and sexy at the same time. It is

483
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:58,199
Speaker 3: kind of an oxymoron. They were trying to accomplish something

484
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:02,720
Speaker 3: that should be impossible to do. Is like polar opposite

485
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,600
Speaker 3: kind of qualities to the character. But I think they

486
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:06,720
Speaker 3: did a pretty good job.

487
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:09,080
Speaker 2: Awesome. Well, I look forward to seeing it at some

488
00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:09,560
Speaker 2: point here.

489
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 3: And if you look up fan reception on the internet,

490
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,240
Speaker 3: definitely there are a lot of people who find this,

491
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:19,879
Speaker 3: this rotting, decomposing plague corpse somewhat somewhat exciting for some reason.

492
00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:22,679
Speaker 3: All right, well, I'm not knocking it, you know.

493
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:27,920
Speaker 2: Well back to Legosi again, an immortal performance, no two

494
00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:30,160
Speaker 2: ways about it. And now we've talked about Lagosi twice

495
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:32,480
Speaker 2: on the show before, in our episodes on the Devil

496
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:36,000
Speaker 2: Bat and Son of Frankenstein. He's wonderful and Son of Frankenstein,

497
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 2: and even in Devil of bat As with many of

498
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 2: his other like later lesser roles, he still finds a

499
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:43,960
Speaker 2: way to shine through it all. But here he is

500
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:45,679
Speaker 2: at the height of his powers, and it is a

501
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:51,200
Speaker 2: thing to behold, richly charismatic, frightening, erotic, and above all hypnotic.

502
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:54,720
Speaker 2: I was asking my kid about how this one stacked

503
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:56,720
Speaker 2: up to Son of Frankenstein, and they told me that

504
00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:59,679
Speaker 2: Drakiva was definitely the scarier of the two, and the

505
00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 2: scarious moments were Dracula's gaze. Oh, looks right at the camera.

506
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:06,719
Speaker 3: What they do? Actually, I meant to bring this up

507
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 3: in the plot section. If you know anything about this

508
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:13,800
Speaker 3: shot they do. It's a recurring visual theme where we

509
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:16,960
Speaker 3: come in on Dracula's face. Maybe the camera is moving

510
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:19,920
Speaker 3: zooming in on him, or it's just still on Dracula's face,

511
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:24,040
Speaker 3: but most of the shot is dark and there's sort

512
00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 3: of a beam of light falling over his eyes. It's

513
00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:31,959
Speaker 3: just the eyes and it's just there, scowling with the

514
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:35,240
Speaker 3: eyes wide. I don't know if you knew why they

515
00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:37,919
Speaker 3: selected that, like the beam on the eyes only, but

516
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 3: I always thought that was interesting.

517
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, it really adds to this like otherworldly hypnotizing power

518
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:48,520
Speaker 2: of the character. And yeah, on top of that, Legosi's

519
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,680
Speaker 2: performance is just one thing that's pointed out by by

520
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 2: some of the Dracula experts is that there are no

521
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:59,400
Speaker 2: small moments at all in it. Every annunciation, but every

522
00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:04,040
Speaker 2: even like subtle movement feels very calculated and essential. Some

523
00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:09,160
Speaker 2: have chalked this up to the possibility that Legosi memorized

524
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 2: his parts phonetically, at least at the stage of his career,

525
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 2: but I'm not sure where the truth falls and all

526
00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 2: of that at any rate, the finished product, the actual performance,

527
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:25,160
Speaker 2: like the way that he stresses words in each line,

528
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 2: like it seems to bring across like cryptic meaning to

529
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 2: things like even some of the lines you think, you know,

530
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:35,120
Speaker 2: like like the children of the Night, what music they make?

531
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 3: You know?

532
00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:40,120
Speaker 2: It's what music they make, you know. Like the choices

533
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 2: there are so absolutely cryptic, and it feels like perfectly

534
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 2: the perfectly calculated way that this cold, immortal being would be,

535
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,520
Speaker 2: you know, cutting through to our fear and desire with

536
00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:56,120
Speaker 2: every word and every movement.

537
00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 3: I couldn't agree more. I've really loved that the annunciation

538
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:04,480
Speaker 3: of the lines does add this mystery to the intended

539
00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 3: meaning of them, which lends itself well to something that

540
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,200
Speaker 3: is here in Legosi's performance. And actually I noticed, in

541
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:13,160
Speaker 3: all three of the movies we've covered of his, two

542
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:15,000
Speaker 3: of them much better than the other one. I mean,

543
00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 3: I really enjoyed all three. But Son of frank and

544
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:19,480
Speaker 3: Dracula are much better movies than Devil Back. But in

545
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 3: all three, the thing that's common is bell Leegosi has

546
00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:27,920
Speaker 3: this way of delivering lines that he understands in a

547
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 3: different way than the person he's talking to, you know,

548
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 3: that like double meaning, kind of sinister irony lines. There's

549
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:37,640
Speaker 3: a lot of that in Dracula. There's a lot of that.

550
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:39,920
Speaker 3: There was a lot of that in Son of Frankenstein,

551
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:42,880
Speaker 3: you know, and they're what's that part where you know

552
00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:47,160
Speaker 3: they're talking about like bringing the creature back, healing him up,

553
00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 3: and the other you know, the Son of frank is like, well,

554
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 3: I don't know if he's if he's well enough yet,

555
00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:58,200
Speaker 3: and and Igor is like well enough for me, oh,

556
00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 3: And it's just he has a lot of that kind

557
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 3: of thing, These dry, threatening, humorous little ironies in that

558
00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:11,080
Speaker 3: are often expressed exquisitely in the way he inflects words

559
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 3: in an unexpected way.

560
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:17,200
Speaker 2: Absolutely so. As we discussed in the previous Legosi episodes,

561
00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:20,000
Speaker 2: he started at a Hungarian theater in silent films before

562
00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 2: making his way to Germany and finally America via New Orleans.

563
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 2: He's made his way to New York. He became very

564
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 2: active in the theater, seen there, did some silent films,

565
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:32,160
Speaker 2: and eventually lands that lead role in the Broadway. Played

566
00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 2: Dracula in twenty seven, ends up moving to la in

567
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:40,280
Speaker 2: twenty eight part of the tour, and this kicks off

568
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 2: his Hollywood career. The next year, he appeared in Todd

569
00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 2: Browning's The Thirteenth Chair. And the interesting thing is Bella

570
00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 2: was clearly the obvious choice for the film adaptation of

571
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 2: the play. He'd been performing it to rave reviews, and

572
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:54,280
Speaker 2: yet he was not the first pick for the film.

573
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,960
Speaker 2: The producers considered the likes of Lawn Cheney, who ended

574
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 2: up dying before the film could be produced. Conrad Vt,

575
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 2: The Man Who Laughs, was also considered, but he had

576
00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,320
Speaker 2: moved back to Europe, and I think the idea is

577
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:12,560
Speaker 2: like he wasn't He didn't really, it wasn't as comfortable

578
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:16,200
Speaker 2: with English language, and so eventually they're like, okay, well

579
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,320
Speaker 2: Legosi's there, will hire Legosi. And they got him somewhat

580
00:32:19,320 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 2: on the cheap. It's a role that made him an

581
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:25,280
Speaker 2: undying legend, obviously, but as has been covered in many

582
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:28,840
Speaker 2: a biography, it also type cast him. It was the

583
00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:31,520
Speaker 2: high point of a life and career that didn't always

584
00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:33,000
Speaker 2: maintain an even trajectory.

585
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 3: But I want to be clear again, not his only

586
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:40,520
Speaker 3: great performance. I mean, his turn as Igor and son

587
00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:44,400
Speaker 3: of Frankenstein is fantastic, hilarious, is so good in that.

588
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:46,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, and there are a number of other ones that

589
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 2: are often cited. Is like strong Legosi performances. So we

590
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,440
Speaker 2: may have to come back to two more Legosi in

591
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 2: the future. All right, Getting into the rest of the

592
00:32:55,520 --> 00:32:59,320
Speaker 2: cast here, I'm gonna spend less time with the remainders here.

593
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:02,160
Speaker 2: But how Allan Chandler plays Mina. She lived nineteen oh

594
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:05,000
Speaker 2: six through nineteen sixty five, American actress of stage and screen,

595
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:09,160
Speaker 2: best remembered for Dracula. David Manners plays Jonathan Harker. He

596
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:12,280
Speaker 2: lived nineteen one hundred through nineteen ninety eight, Canadian born

597
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 2: leading man. Here completely overshadowed by stronger character performances and also,

598
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,880
Speaker 2: as we'll discuss in a very reduced Jonathan Harker.

599
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:22,840
Speaker 3: He just as we was shadowed by the script.

600
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:27,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, he's just he's overshadowed by yeah, other

601
00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:31,080
Speaker 2: performances and also the writings. He's not sent to the

602
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,760
Speaker 2: castle in the opening. He does not have the Keanu

603
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:37,560
Speaker 2: Reeves version of Jonathan Harker here.

604
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:39,760
Speaker 3: No, we need to talk about this later in the plot.

605
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:42,239
Speaker 3: But it's almost like, why is this character even in

606
00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 3: the story exactly.

607
00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:47,120
Speaker 2: He's best remembered for his roles in Dracula nineteen thirty

608
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:49,560
Speaker 2: two is the Mummy and nineteen thirty four as the Black.

609
00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:52,680
Speaker 3: Cat now Rob Again. I was surprised to find out

610
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:55,840
Speaker 3: that you'd never seen Dracula in its entirety before, but

611
00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 3: it caused me to remember back back to the first

612
00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 3: time I saw Dracula. Like you, I grew up, you know,

613
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:04,640
Speaker 3: knowing bits of it, seeing bits of it on TV

614
00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:07,720
Speaker 3: and things like that, especially in clip show type things.

615
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:12,520
Speaker 3: But when I finally saw it in full honestly, one

616
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:14,680
Speaker 3: of the things that made the biggest impression on me

617
00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 3: was Dwight Frye as Renfield absolutely.

618
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 2: This is a just Bonker's performance by the great Dwight

619
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:27,680
Speaker 2: Frye lived eighteen ninety nine through nineteen forty three, American

620
00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 2: character actor of steven screen with broad range, but best

621
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:36,759
Speaker 2: remembered for his outlandish horror roles and certainly typecast to those.

622
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:38,719
Speaker 2: After a while, he went on to play Fritz in

623
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:42,879
Speaker 2: thirty ones Frankenstein, Carl in thirty five's Bride of Frankenstein,

624
00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 2: and smaller, often uncredited roles in subsequent Frankenstein films. He

625
00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:49,360
Speaker 2: was also in nineteen thirty one's The Maltese Falcon.

626
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:52,839
Speaker 3: Renfield is really a highlight of the movie apart from

627
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:56,759
Speaker 3: Lagosi here, because in multiple ways, like the way the

628
00:34:56,840 --> 00:35:02,840
Speaker 3: character is written is both intentionally and unintentionally funny, the

629
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 3: unintentional part being like the fourth time he escapes from

630
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:09,880
Speaker 3: the sanitarium and just wanders into a scene in the house,

631
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,320
Speaker 3: It's like, what, how how does this guy keep getting

632
00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:12,959
Speaker 3: out of his cell?

633
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's kind of like the Cramer of the picture,

634
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:19,000
Speaker 2: just gonna randomly busts in whenever they need need a

635
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:21,160
Speaker 2: little uh need a little Renfield action.

636
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, he slides in and he's got the crazy

637
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:26,879
Speaker 3: hair and he's like, oh, the Master is gonna give

638
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:31,040
Speaker 3: me blood this time. Oh, but it's but also just

639
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:36,200
Speaker 3: he has these deranged monologues about needing lives and blood

640
00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:39,279
Speaker 3: and wanting to eat spiders, and then also has kind

641
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,399
Speaker 3: of a you know, he's mostly a heel after being

642
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 3: turned by the Count, but he has a face turn

643
00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:48,200
Speaker 3: at one point that doesn't quite stick. It's yeah, it's

644
00:35:48,239 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 3: it's just great. I love d white Fry here it

645
00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:52,440
Speaker 3: thumbs up, thumbs up.

646
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:55,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, if not for Legosi, he would be the most

647
00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:59,799
Speaker 2: memorable performer in the piece. Yeah, totally all right. It's

648
00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 2: a Dracula movies who also have to have a Van Helsing.

649
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:04,600
Speaker 2: You have to have a Dracula slayer, and that's Edward

650
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:07,280
Speaker 2: Van Sloan, who lived eighteen eighty two through nineteen sixty

651
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,600
Speaker 2: four American character actor, here reprising the role that he

652
00:36:10,640 --> 00:36:14,200
Speaker 2: played in the stage adaptation. This was only his second film,

653
00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:18,439
Speaker 2: followed by the role of doctor Waldman in nineteen thirty

654
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,000
Speaker 2: one s Frankenstein, doctor Mueller in thirty two's The Mummy,

655
00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:24,439
Speaker 2: and he played Professor Van Helsing in nineteen thirty six

656
00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:25,560
Speaker 2: is Dracula's daughter.

657
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:28,480
Speaker 3: So he was just always the professor who shows up

658
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 3: too to know about the monster.

659
00:36:30,719 --> 00:36:33,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, probably a little bit of typecasting going

660
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:36,120
Speaker 2: on here as well, but it's another strong performance. I

661
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 2: really like him in this part of it is the

662
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:38,760
Speaker 2: haircut in the glasses.

663
00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:41,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know if he's ever made as huge

664
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:45,120
Speaker 3: an impression on me, but he does certainly drive the

665
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 3: scenes in the middle of the movie that would, I

666
00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:50,360
Speaker 3: think otherwise be the weakest links in the film, Basically,

667
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,439
Speaker 3: the investigation scenes where the heroes are trying to figure

668
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:55,880
Speaker 3: out what's going on. They're the scenes that either don't

669
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,920
Speaker 3: have Legosi or don't have a Dwight Fry in them

670
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:02,640
Speaker 3: yet until he burn later in the scene. Those would

671
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 3: be the dullest parts. But he does pretty well there.

672
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:09,120
Speaker 2: He feels a little unhinged in a great way, you know,

673
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:11,920
Speaker 2: like one of the first people to believe that we're

674
00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:15,120
Speaker 2: actually dealing with vampires. You know, it's probably somebody who

675
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:16,560
Speaker 2: lives their life a little bit on the.

676
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:20,319
Speaker 3: Edge, and later adaptations would generally take this principle a

677
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:25,520
Speaker 3: lot further, I'd say, compared to later Van Helsing portrayals,

678
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:28,839
Speaker 3: Edward Van Sloan is a pretty straight shooter. I mean,

679
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:32,720
Speaker 3: thinking about Anthony Hopkins, and Coppola's Dracula, where Van Helsing

680
00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 3: is borderline insane thinking about Willem Dafoe in the New

681
00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 3: nos Ferratu. I mean they later really embraced the idea

682
00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:43,719
Speaker 3: that the professor who knows how to fight evil is

683
00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:46,320
Speaker 3: himself an extremely eccentric figure.

684
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:52,080
Speaker 2: All right. The other principal investigator here is, of course,

685
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:55,960
Speaker 2: doctor Seward, played by Herbert Bunston, who had eighteen seventy

686
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:58,920
Speaker 2: four through nineteen thirty five British actor best remembered for

687
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:01,400
Speaker 2: this film. He also had a supporting role in nineteen

688
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 2: thirty Is the Lady of Scandal in nineteen thirty three

689
00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:08,120
Speaker 2: Is the Monkey's Paw, again somewhat reduced here, he's essentially

690
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:11,040
Speaker 2: in a lot of these older pictures, you really need

691
00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:14,000
Speaker 2: like a supporting cast of two to three old white

692
00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:17,480
Speaker 2: guy experts to help you fight your alien invasion or

693
00:38:17,520 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 2: monster attacks. And this is what this guy is.

694
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:22,319
Speaker 3: His role in this movie is I say, could it

695
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:24,799
Speaker 3: be true? All right?

696
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:26,640
Speaker 2: You can't have a Mina unless you have a Lucy.

697
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:30,400
Speaker 2: And that's where Francis Dad comes in. She lived nineteen

698
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:33,239
Speaker 2: ten through nineteen sixty eight, American actress, only active in

699
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:35,440
Speaker 2: the late twenties and early thirties. This was her most

700
00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:38,080
Speaker 2: memorable role, but she has a supporting role in the

701
00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:41,240
Speaker 2: nineteen thirty one Anime Wong film Daughter of the Dragon.

702
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:45,240
Speaker 3: Like many characters in this version, Lucy's role is greatly

703
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:47,480
Speaker 3: reduced from what it is in the novel. You know,

704
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:49,880
Speaker 3: a big part of the investigation in the middle of

705
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:52,680
Speaker 3: the novel is like the character is trying to figure

706
00:38:52,719 --> 00:38:56,759
Speaker 3: out what the cause of Lucy's wasting disease is. You know,

707
00:38:56,800 --> 00:39:00,359
Speaker 3: why is she losing blood? What's going on? In this movie,

708
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:03,400
Speaker 3: they just like acts all that. It's done in like

709
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:05,080
Speaker 3: ninety seconds of screen time.

710
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:09,520
Speaker 2: We of course have the brides. We'll talk more about

711
00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:14,080
Speaker 2: the brides later. But Geraldine Devoric, Dorothy Tree, and Cornelia

712
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:18,759
Speaker 2: Thaw those are your brides. Let's see getting behind the

713
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:23,320
Speaker 2: scenes here a bit. Carl Fround, of course, did the cinematography,

714
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:27,840
Speaker 2: rather famous for his work on this picture and subsequent films.

715
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:32,759
Speaker 2: Lived eighteen ninety through nineteen sixty nine. Legendary Austrian Hungarian

716
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:37,120
Speaker 2: born cinematographer and director, two time Oscar winner, four time nominee.

717
00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:39,719
Speaker 2: Much of the visual splendor of this film is often

718
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 2: attributed to Friend and many have also said that he

719
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:49,239
Speaker 2: probably directed parts of it as well. He was reportedly

720
00:39:49,360 --> 00:39:51,359
Speaker 2: like a very strong presence on the set sometimes when

721
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:54,600
Speaker 2: Browning wasn't. He went on to direct nineteen thirty twos

722
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:56,759
Speaker 2: The Mommy, as well as nineteen thirty five Is Mad Love,

723
00:39:57,160 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 2: which we talked about in one of, if not our

724
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:04,239
Speaker 2: first episodes, and he did several other pictures as well.

725
00:40:04,280 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 3: Freud did the cinematography on most of the movies that

726
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:11,840
Speaker 3: from the nineteen thirties that I think look the best,

727
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:14,719
Speaker 3: Like a lot of the thirties movies that I see,

728
00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:17,120
Speaker 3: I'm like, wow, this is gorgeous. It's like, oh, that

729
00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:21,760
Speaker 3: was Carl Freud, so yeah, and the movie does look great.

730
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:26,759
Speaker 3: There are typically like the scenes in it that look

731
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:30,319
Speaker 3: the best tend to be the ones that film historians

732
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:33,280
Speaker 3: say this is like a signature Carl Freun type shot.

733
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:37,799
Speaker 3: And I think this has led some people to speculate

734
00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 3: that for the less interesting cinematography in the movie that

735
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:43,520
Speaker 3: he was kind of he was kind of on leash,

736
00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:48,719
Speaker 3: like he was not necessarily being allowed to do all

737
00:40:48,760 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 3: he could do. I don't know if that's true or not,

738
00:40:50,719 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 3: but that's what some people have said.

739
00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:56,240
Speaker 2: It's often pointed out that the not also nineteen thirty

740
00:40:56,239 --> 00:40:59,560
Speaker 2: one Mexican Dracula film that they shot at night on

741
00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:05,200
Speaker 2: the same sets is more technically proficient and maybe more

742
00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 2: daring and force. Part of that is that apparently they

743
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:12,279
Speaker 2: could look back at what the day crew was doing

744
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:13,799
Speaker 2: and figure out how to one up it.

745
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:16,920
Speaker 3: Right. Yeah, So the English language production would shoot, and

746
00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:19,399
Speaker 3: then they would shoot afterwards, and so they could look

747
00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:21,600
Speaker 3: at all the mistakes made in the earlier shoots and

748
00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:23,959
Speaker 3: like figure out ways to correct them before they before

749
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 3: they set up.

750
00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:27,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, spice things up sometimes and so forth.

751
00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:28,200
Speaker 3: All right.

752
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,319
Speaker 2: Set decoration. Russell A Gossman who lived eighteen ninety two

753
00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:33,640
Speaker 2: through nineteen sixty three, Oscar winner for his work on

754
00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 2: forty fourth Phantom of the Opera and sixty one Spartacus.

755
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:40,760
Speaker 2: He also worked on other major and minor universal horror films.

756
00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:41,719
Speaker 3: Jack P.

757
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:45,200
Speaker 2: Pierce did the makeup eighteen eighty nine through nineteen sixty

758
00:41:45,239 --> 00:41:48,719
Speaker 2: eight Monster Makeup Master of the Day, who worked on

759
00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:53,560
Speaker 2: like Frankenstein, The Man Who Laughs, The Invisible Man, The

760
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 2: wolf Man, and so many others. I guess on the

761
00:41:57,000 --> 00:41:59,319
Speaker 2: surface it might seem like he had less to do here.

762
00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:03,040
Speaker 2: There's not There's there's no monster makeup on the level

763
00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:07,000
Speaker 2: of Frankenstein in this picture, but clearly makeup is a

764
00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:10,799
Speaker 2: part of bringing Count Dracula and the brides to their

765
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:15,360
Speaker 2: to undead life on the screen. And finally, Heinz Roemheld

766
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:19,239
Speaker 2: has a conductor musical arrangement credit with nineteen one through

767
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:21,840
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty five, but again this is a needle drop score,

768
00:42:22,840 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 2: owing in part to budgetary issues. Again, sometimes there's no

769
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:29,280
Speaker 2: music at all, but music used in the picture includes

770
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:35,040
Speaker 2: Schaikowski Swan Lake Opus twenty, Franz Schubert's Unfinished Symphony, and

771
00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:40,400
Speaker 2: this selection from Wagner's The Mice to singer von Nunberg.

772
00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:44,320
Speaker 3: I mainly associate Dracula with Swan Lake due to this movie,

773
00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:48,040
Speaker 3: but I have actually seen it with the Philip Glass

774
00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:50,160
Speaker 3: score that was done later. I don't know when, was

775
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:51,280
Speaker 3: that in the nineteen nineties.

776
00:42:51,440 --> 00:42:56,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was ninety eight legendary Philip Glass composed. It

777
00:42:56,200 --> 00:42:59,840
Speaker 2: was performed by the Kronos Quartet. I've never never seen it,

778
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:01,759
Speaker 2: but I did listen to part of that while I

779
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:03,919
Speaker 2: was researching and writing up notes here, and it sounds

780
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:04,399
Speaker 2: quite good.

781
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:15,200
Speaker 3: Oh hey, mentioning Swan Lake by the way. That is

782
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:17,279
Speaker 3: what plays over the opening credits, at least in the

783
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:21,080
Speaker 3: version I watched. And another thing I wanted to call

784
00:43:21,120 --> 00:43:24,520
Speaker 3: attention to in the opening credits I don't recall if

785
00:43:24,560 --> 00:43:28,560
Speaker 3: I've ever really noticed this before, is the stylized bat

786
00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 3: in the background of the title card.

787
00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:31,319
Speaker 5: Here.

788
00:43:32,840 --> 00:43:35,480
Speaker 3: You know, it works fine if you're not paying very

789
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:38,359
Speaker 3: close attention, but when you really look at it, this

790
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:41,200
Speaker 3: illustration does seem kind of odd. It looks like something

791
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:44,600
Speaker 3: that would be on like the Adam West Batman TV show.

792
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:47,560
Speaker 3: There's a whimsical, comic bookiness to it. It does not

793
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:50,279
Speaker 3: look super gothic. Yeah, yeah, it.

794
00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:53,400
Speaker 2: Looked a little art deco, I guess. But interesting that

795
00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 2: you would bring up Batman because Batman wouldn't be invented

796
00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 2: till nineteen thirty nine and first committed to the screen

797
00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:01,480
Speaker 2: in forty three, So I don't know. It's not impossible

798
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:04,440
Speaker 2: that this had an influence on the Cape Crusader.

799
00:44:04,680 --> 00:44:06,320
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I can see that, But like, do you

800
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:08,920
Speaker 3: see that the shape of the ears on the head

801
00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:11,799
Speaker 3: looks exactly like the Batman logo or not the logo,

802
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:13,200
Speaker 3: like the costume.

803
00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:15,280
Speaker 2: It looks like Batman. Yeah.

804
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:17,839
Speaker 3: Also, speaking of bats, you know, there are so many

805
00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 3: things that the like in the Dracula movie tradition that

806
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:25,640
Speaker 3: are different from how they are in the book. When

807
00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:28,359
Speaker 3: I was watching this, I genuinely could not remember if

808
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:30,840
Speaker 3: Dracula transforms into a bat in the book, and I

809
00:44:30,880 --> 00:44:33,520
Speaker 3: had to look it up and oh, yeah, he definitely does.

810
00:44:33,600 --> 00:44:35,760
Speaker 3: That's there in the novel. The book is in fact

811
00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:39,120
Speaker 3: full of talk about bats. There's this whole section where

812
00:44:39,120 --> 00:44:41,320
Speaker 3: they're trying to figure out what's happening to Lucy, and

813
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 3: they talk about these bats in South America that swoop

814
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:46,920
Speaker 3: down from the trees and drink the blood of sailors

815
00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:49,240
Speaker 3: as they sleep at night, leaving them without a single

816
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:55,120
Speaker 3: drop left in the morning. That's not true, but anyway, Yeah,

817
00:44:55,160 --> 00:45:00,200
Speaker 3: so the book definitely is all about bats. That's originally there.

818
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,200
Speaker 3: But from here, after the credits, we come on to

819
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:07,640
Speaker 3: the opening shot, and wow, what a strong opening shot.

820
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:12,560
Speaker 3: We start on this deep landscape shot with a tremendous

821
00:45:12,640 --> 00:45:16,200
Speaker 3: sense of vertical reach. In the foreground, there is a

822
00:45:16,239 --> 00:45:19,640
Speaker 3: horse drawn carriage. It's clattering over a dirt road toward

823
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:22,360
Speaker 3: the camera, and in the background we see the road

824
00:45:22,520 --> 00:45:27,880
Speaker 3: is surrounded by gargantuan mountains appearing as these shards of bare,

825
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:32,799
Speaker 3: unforested rock reaching up toward the clouds. And this made

826
00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:35,600
Speaker 3: me think about how while there are a lot of

827
00:45:35,960 --> 00:45:39,319
Speaker 3: there are lots of reasons for preferring the modern widescreen

828
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:44,240
Speaker 3: aspect ratio and film. This shot shows one cinematic benefit

829
00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:47,160
Speaker 3: of the roughly one point two or one point three

830
00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:51,120
Speaker 3: by one format, which is the ability to create this

831
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:55,279
Speaker 3: sense of towering height and depth, like a tiny subject

832
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:59,120
Speaker 3: in a desolate valley in the middle, encircled by the

833
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:00,680
Speaker 3: skyscrape of rock.

834
00:46:01,320 --> 00:46:01,840
Speaker 5: Yeah.

835
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:04,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, And we get this feeling a few different points

836
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:06,160
Speaker 2: at a few different points in the picture, So this

837
00:46:06,200 --> 00:46:06,799
Speaker 2: is a great point.

838
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,360
Speaker 3: Yeah. Apparently this shot was accomplished by a kind of

839
00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:13,160
Speaker 3: composite effect where you can bine a real, live moving

840
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:16,040
Speaker 3: photography shot of a carriage and road in the foreground

841
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 3: and then the mountains in the background or a painted backdrop.

842
00:46:19,160 --> 00:46:21,040
Speaker 3: I think I believe it was painted on a piece

843
00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:24,360
Speaker 3: of glass that may actually have been done in the camera,

844
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:27,279
Speaker 3: with the painted glass positioned over the camera lens. I'm

845
00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:30,960
Speaker 3: not sure about that in this shot, but Skyll talks

846
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:33,560
Speaker 3: about that for at least some of these exterior shots

847
00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:36,600
Speaker 3: in the commentary track. But I'd also like to point

848
00:46:36,640 --> 00:46:41,880
Speaker 3: out something about the feeling of these painted mountains, a

849
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:46,200
Speaker 3: kind of art history resonance. Actually, to me, these mountains

850
00:46:46,239 --> 00:46:51,480
Speaker 3: resemble things you see in paintings from the Romantic movement

851
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:56,680
Speaker 3: of the late eighteenth early nineteenth century. So one very

852
00:46:56,719 --> 00:46:58,480
Speaker 3: well known example, if you want to look it up

853
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:01,000
Speaker 3: and see this kind of artistic sense ability in painting

854
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:04,720
Speaker 3: is A Wanderer above Sea and Fog from eighteen eighteen

855
00:47:04,800 --> 00:47:08,960
Speaker 3: by Casper David Friedrich Robert. Have you seen this painting before? Oh?

856
00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:11,600
Speaker 2: Not only have I seen it, I like a lot

857
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:15,360
Speaker 2: of liberal arts majors had this on my dormitory wall. Okay,

858
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:18,879
Speaker 2: as a post or form, because I guess a lot

859
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:22,240
Speaker 2: of liberal arts majors probably see themselves like this. Sure,

860
00:47:22,280 --> 00:47:26,680
Speaker 2: A lone figure standing atop a mysterious, you know, craggy

861
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:29,719
Speaker 2: environment above the mists, surveying everything. That's kind of like

862
00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:31,200
Speaker 2: a gentleman scholar vibe.

863
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean, but so, how would you describe

864
00:47:34,560 --> 00:47:38,000
Speaker 3: the like the landscape here, It's it's like very active

865
00:47:38,080 --> 00:47:41,239
Speaker 3: and emotional and dramatic, right you mentioned the crags.

866
00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:44,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, definitely, very emotionally charged. There's a sense of

867
00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:49,840
Speaker 2: wonder and possibility here, it's maybe inverted to a certain extent,

868
00:47:50,040 --> 00:47:52,200
Speaker 2: or at least there's a darker sense of wonder and

869
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:56,480
Speaker 2: possibility in Dracula. But yeah, similar vibes in a way, similar.

870
00:47:56,239 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 3: Frequency exactly and realized through these like very jagged edged

871
00:48:01,719 --> 00:48:06,240
Speaker 3: depictions of nature, you know, like just like the rocks

872
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:10,400
Speaker 3: are infused with drama. A lot of Romantic landscape paintings,

873
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:14,680
Speaker 3: I think, have this feeling depicting natural objects like mountains

874
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:18,319
Speaker 3: in particular, mountains are very popular subject of you know,

875
00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:23,320
Speaker 3: painters of this style from this era, but also of rocks,

876
00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:26,640
Speaker 3: bodies of water, trees, et cetera. There was a convention

877
00:48:26,760 --> 00:48:31,600
Speaker 3: at this time of kind of showing these things as overwhelming,

878
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:36,920
Speaker 3: almost magical in some way, epic, dramatic, bursting with irrepressible emotion.

879
00:48:37,680 --> 00:48:42,360
Speaker 3: And I would say that modern genres of horror, especially

880
00:48:42,400 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 3: Gothic horror, have strong roots in the nineteenth century European

881
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:52,080
Speaker 3: Romantic movements in the arts, in arts and literature. Dracula

882
00:48:52,160 --> 00:48:55,040
Speaker 3: itself as a novel was not born of this period,

883
00:48:55,040 --> 00:48:56,960
Speaker 3: as we've said, it came much later. It was in

884
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:01,839
Speaker 3: the eighteen nineties, but Frankenstein was from this period. Frankenstein

885
00:49:01,880 --> 00:49:05,319
Speaker 3: is a Romantic novel in many ways, and if you

886
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:08,040
Speaker 3: go back and read Frankenstein you might be shocked how

887
00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:12,280
Speaker 3: much mountains and epic landscapes play a role in the story.

888
00:49:12,320 --> 00:49:15,479
Speaker 3: For example, when Victor first meets the creature again after

889
00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:19,080
Speaker 3: their initial separation, it's while he is out hiking alone

890
00:49:19,120 --> 00:49:22,799
Speaker 3: in the Alps. And so even though Dracula was not

891
00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:26,680
Speaker 3: a novel from the Romantic period, I think Romantic artistic

892
00:49:26,719 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 3: and literary conventions have influenced how it was later brought

893
00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:33,560
Speaker 3: to life on film. And so you see this kind

894
00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:37,360
Speaker 3: of in themes that want to come out in different

895
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:39,759
Speaker 3: versions of the telling of the vampire story, and in

896
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:42,240
Speaker 3: this kind of visual imagery of like the great Romantic

897
00:49:42,280 --> 00:49:46,759
Speaker 3: emotional mountains. So these common Romantic literary tropes. Again, this

898
00:49:46,840 --> 00:49:49,400
Speaker 3: is my take, and I'm sure i'm oversimplifying. You know,

899
00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:51,400
Speaker 3: literature scholars might get mad at me, but this is

900
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:53,120
Speaker 3: what I think. I think you see a lot of

901
00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:57,400
Speaker 3: like themes of the awe inspiring power of nature and instinct,

902
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:03,000
Speaker 3: a preference for emotion and passion over cold blooded reason,

903
00:50:04,000 --> 00:50:06,799
Speaker 3: a kind of a sensibility of rebellion, a desire to

904
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:12,400
Speaker 3: rebel against authority, and institutions, and themes of the ways

905
00:50:12,400 --> 00:50:16,040
Speaker 3: in which personal experiences are kind of unique and precious

906
00:50:16,200 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 3: and difficult to share or express, and beyond all that,

907
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:25,520
Speaker 3: just kind of a general attraction to mystery and amazement. Yeah,

908
00:50:26,080 --> 00:50:29,680
Speaker 3: I do not think that these themes are especially present

909
00:50:29,719 --> 00:50:32,479
Speaker 3: in my reading of the novel Dracula, but I do

910
00:50:32,560 --> 00:50:36,680
Speaker 3: think these themes really come out in movie adaptations of Dracula.

911
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:39,799
Speaker 2: Yes, and really even in the opening here in a

912
00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:43,600
Speaker 2: sense a stranger in a strange land, what's going to happen?

913
00:50:44,360 --> 00:50:48,040
Speaker 3: So anyway, we're down with the people now in the carriage,

914
00:50:48,800 --> 00:50:50,400
Speaker 3: and this is the part what I think this is

915
00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:53,600
Speaker 3: Carla Lemley, isn't it. Who's reading reading from like a

916
00:50:53,640 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 3: travel book. Here there are like five or six people,

917
00:50:56,080 --> 00:50:59,000
Speaker 3: one of them is Dwight Fry. They're in this carriage.

918
00:50:59,080 --> 00:51:01,640
Speaker 3: Dwight Fry is in a tidy suit and tie with

919
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:04,600
Speaker 3: a white fedora, and I was just thinking, dude, you're

920
00:51:04,640 --> 00:51:06,440
Speaker 3: going to go in a full three piece suit to

921
00:51:06,480 --> 00:51:07,480
Speaker 3: the Borgo Pass.

922
00:51:08,280 --> 00:51:09,680
Speaker 2: It's just how you traveled back then.

923
00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:12,399
Speaker 3: So the other woman in the carriage, she's reading from

924
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:15,000
Speaker 3: the travel book, and she says, among the rugged peaks

925
00:51:15,000 --> 00:51:18,600
Speaker 3: that frowned down upon the Borgo Pass are found crumbling

926
00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:23,960
Speaker 3: castles of a bygone age and a little real world.

927
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:27,320
Speaker 3: Note this is a real mountain pass. The Borgo Pass exists.

928
00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:30,400
Speaker 3: It's called some different today, but it is located in

929
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:33,560
Speaker 3: modern day Romania. At the time the novel was written,

930
00:51:33,960 --> 00:51:36,880
Speaker 3: this was part of the region of Transylvania, which I

931
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:40,720
Speaker 3: believe at the time was part of Hungary. Bramstoker almost

932
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:43,759
Speaker 3: certainly never went there. He probably just found the name

933
00:51:43,800 --> 00:51:48,200
Speaker 3: on a map and it sounded cool, and according to experts,

934
00:51:48,239 --> 00:51:50,600
Speaker 3: like the way he describes it is not really how

935
00:51:50,600 --> 00:51:51,319
Speaker 3: this place is.

936
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:54,319
Speaker 2: Right right. I've often heard it pointed out that there's

937
00:51:54,360 --> 00:51:57,960
Speaker 2: really more Irish mythology than Eastern European mythology. I mean,

938
00:51:57,960 --> 00:52:01,360
Speaker 2: there's a bit of it the vampire of Eastern European origins,

939
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:04,040
Speaker 2: but there's a lot of Irish mythology bound up in

940
00:52:04,080 --> 00:52:06,120
Speaker 2: what brown Stoker is creating here.

941
00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 3: That's right. So Dwight Fry looks bored and annoyed. Everybody

942
00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:13,560
Speaker 3: in the carriage is getting tossed around by the bumpy road,

943
00:52:14,000 --> 00:52:16,080
Speaker 3: and he calls out to the driver to slow down.

944
00:52:16,160 --> 00:52:19,239
Speaker 3: But another man in the carriage, a local with a mustache,

945
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:23,080
Speaker 3: leans over to sharply rebuke him, and he says, we

946
00:52:23,160 --> 00:52:26,360
Speaker 3: must reach the inn before sundown. So ain't no slowing

947
00:52:26,440 --> 00:52:29,000
Speaker 3: down this carriage. That is the wrong choice. We've got

948
00:52:29,040 --> 00:52:32,000
Speaker 3: to go as fast as we can to get to shelter. Now,

949
00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:34,720
Speaker 3: why would it be important to get there before sundown? Well,

950
00:52:34,760 --> 00:52:38,200
Speaker 3: he says, it is well, Purgas night, the night of evil.

951
00:52:38,640 --> 00:52:42,200
Speaker 3: That's April thirtieth, by the way, everyone, for those who

952
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:45,120
Speaker 3: don't celebrate, And then he goes on to shout no

953
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:48,200
Speaker 3: s ferratu before the woman in the carriage next to him.

954
00:52:48,200 --> 00:52:50,040
Speaker 3: I think this must be his wife. She tries to

955
00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:52,320
Speaker 3: cover up his mouth, but he will not be silent.

956
00:52:52,440 --> 00:52:55,920
Speaker 3: He says, on this night, madame, the doors they are barred,

957
00:52:56,040 --> 00:52:59,719
Speaker 3: and to the Virgin we pray. So the carriage does

958
00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:03,239
Speaker 3: make to the end before sundown, and we see, you know,

959
00:53:03,520 --> 00:53:07,719
Speaker 3: the locals going about their business praying in Hungarian. And

960
00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:10,160
Speaker 3: here we get a scene versions of which are in

961
00:53:10,200 --> 00:53:13,480
Speaker 3: many adaptations of Dracula, where the locals try to warn

962
00:53:13,560 --> 00:53:16,680
Speaker 3: the visiting real estate agent about the evils that lurk

963
00:53:16,719 --> 00:53:19,320
Speaker 3: at Castle Dracula. You know, no, it's a bad place,

964
00:53:19,360 --> 00:53:22,680
Speaker 3: don't go there, And they eventually will usually give him

965
00:53:22,880 --> 00:53:26,520
Speaker 3: some form of talismanic protection, usually a crucifix. Here it

966
00:53:26,560 --> 00:53:30,440
Speaker 3: is a crucifix. Now. One thing that makes this adaptation

967
00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:35,799
Speaker 3: unlike both the novel and most later movie adaptations is

968
00:53:35,880 --> 00:53:40,279
Speaker 3: the identity of the agent making the visit. Usually, the

969
00:53:40,320 --> 00:53:44,920
Speaker 3: agent that comes here to Transylvania is one of our

970
00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:49,279
Speaker 3: main young protagonists. It's Jonathan Harker, or, in the German adaptations,

971
00:53:49,280 --> 00:53:53,080
Speaker 3: like nos Faratu, Thomas Hutter. In this version, the character

972
00:53:53,320 --> 00:53:58,640
Speaker 3: is Wrinfield. Now, for those not familiar with the story,

973
00:53:59,040 --> 00:54:04,200
Speaker 3: Harker is the the young, handsome, ambitious fiancee of Mina,

974
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:07,120
Speaker 3: who Mina will become, by the end of the story

975
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:11,920
Speaker 3: the ultimate target of Dracula's predations, whereas Renfield in the

976
00:54:11,960 --> 00:54:16,160
Speaker 3: novel is a former colleague of Harker's who I believe

977
00:54:16,360 --> 00:54:20,000
Speaker 3: had also previously traveled to Transylvania, but that's not part

978
00:54:20,040 --> 00:54:22,160
Speaker 3: of the narrative. It's the background. He had gone there

979
00:54:22,440 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 3: to conduct business with Count Dracula. He ends up coming

980
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:29,640
Speaker 3: back having been driven mad, and he is turned into

981
00:54:29,800 --> 00:54:33,360
Speaker 3: Dracula's loyal servant and familiar. Spends the rest of the

982
00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 3: story housed in doctor Seward's sanitarium near Carfax, eating flies

983
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:40,759
Speaker 3: and pining to serve his master. I do about right

984
00:54:40,840 --> 00:54:44,520
Speaker 3: with that, Rob, Yes, that's correct. So in the novel, Harker,

985
00:54:44,680 --> 00:54:47,600
Speaker 3: the character who's our real like protagonist, has to pick

986
00:54:47,680 --> 00:54:51,040
Speaker 3: up where Renfield left off. So he goes to Dracula's castle,

987
00:54:51,320 --> 00:54:53,680
Speaker 3: and we go with him because we read his letters.

988
00:54:53,920 --> 00:54:56,960
Speaker 3: He's going there to bring signing papers for the purchase

989
00:54:57,000 --> 00:55:01,040
Speaker 3: of an estate in England, and we learn about Dracula

990
00:55:01,080 --> 00:55:04,920
Speaker 3: first through Harker's letters here. Harker will later escape the

991
00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:09,200
Speaker 3: castle and be reunited with Mina, and he is part

992
00:55:09,239 --> 00:55:12,160
Speaker 3: of the posse of heroes who chase down Dracula at

993
00:55:12,160 --> 00:55:14,800
Speaker 3: the end of the novel to free Mina from his curse.

994
00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:18,799
Speaker 3: But this movie has made some executive editing decisions, and

995
00:55:19,280 --> 00:55:22,319
Speaker 3: they have decided instead to just give all of the

996
00:55:22,360 --> 00:55:26,640
Speaker 3: action in Transylvania to Renfield, which is in a way

997
00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:30,040
Speaker 3: an efficient storytelling choice that I can see ways in

998
00:55:30,080 --> 00:55:33,360
Speaker 3: which that's a good edit. But I would also argue

999
00:55:33,560 --> 00:55:36,799
Speaker 3: that leaves Jonathan Harker without a very good reason to

1000
00:55:36,880 --> 00:55:39,840
Speaker 3: be in the story and without much interesting to do.

1001
00:55:40,360 --> 00:55:43,320
Speaker 3: It's just kind of like Dracula is preying on Mina.

1002
00:55:43,440 --> 00:55:45,959
Speaker 3: Oh and Mina's got a fiance somewhere. What's his deal?

1003
00:55:46,239 --> 00:55:49,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean I applaud the adaptation for

1004
00:55:50,040 --> 00:55:53,640
Speaker 2: doubling down on weird Renfield, and it makes for the

1005
00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:56,480
Speaker 2: intro to be I think, in a way more horrifying

1006
00:55:56,719 --> 00:55:59,239
Speaker 2: because it is going to me it will end in

1007
00:55:59,280 --> 00:56:03,160
Speaker 2: madness for him. He's not truly going to escape the count.

1008
00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:06,560
Speaker 2: But yeah, Harker is reduced to almost nothing in the picture.

1009
00:56:06,800 --> 00:56:09,040
Speaker 3: I'm not trying to be mean to the actor or anything,

1010
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:11,719
Speaker 3: but it's just he he has strong like why is

1011
00:56:11,760 --> 00:56:15,120
Speaker 3: he here energy? Yeah. One note I wanted to make

1012
00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:19,200
Speaker 3: about Renfield and the actor Dwight Frye who plays him here.

1013
00:56:19,280 --> 00:56:22,799
Speaker 3: This is from David Skal's commentary Scout talks about how

1014
00:56:23,920 --> 00:56:26,960
Speaker 3: you know, really Dwight Frye had the makings of a

1015
00:56:27,440 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 3: dashing leading man of Hollywood. He had good looks, he had,

1016
00:56:30,600 --> 00:56:32,759
Speaker 3: you know, good acting skills, like he could have been

1017
00:56:32,840 --> 00:56:36,799
Speaker 3: that type of character, that kind of leading player. But

1018
00:56:37,080 --> 00:56:39,920
Speaker 3: his role as Renfield and then his later role as

1019
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:43,879
Speaker 3: the grave robbing assistant Fritz and James Wales Frankenstein, made

1020
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:47,160
Speaker 3: it really hard for fry to get these roles, to

1021
00:56:47,160 --> 00:56:50,120
Speaker 3: get the leading roles he was kind of pigeonholed as

1022
00:56:50,200 --> 00:56:53,040
Speaker 3: the grinning lunatic who you catch rooting around in the

1023
00:56:53,040 --> 00:56:57,520
Speaker 3: hospital morgue and they're just like it in a way.

1024
00:56:57,600 --> 00:57:01,759
Speaker 3: It was like a very six full acting turn that

1025
00:57:01,840 --> 00:57:03,480
Speaker 3: proved to be a curse for his career.

1026
00:57:03,920 --> 00:57:05,759
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, I mean you can make some comparisons to

1027
00:57:05,880 --> 00:57:08,839
Speaker 2: Lugosi there as well. But yeah, a shame. It's also

1028
00:57:08,880 --> 00:57:11,640
Speaker 2: a shame that he died rather young heart attack or

1029
00:57:11,640 --> 00:57:16,000
Speaker 2: heart condition, and yeah, it's you know, what could we

1030
00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:18,360
Speaker 2: have gotten out of him had we had ten or

1031
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:20,800
Speaker 2: twenty more years of him as an active actor.

1032
00:57:20,960 --> 00:57:31,720
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah. Anyway, so back to the scene that the

1033
00:57:31,800 --> 00:57:34,640
Speaker 3: locals try to warn Renfield away, but he insists that

1034
00:57:34,680 --> 00:57:37,480
Speaker 3: he has to meet the count because he's made. He's

1035
00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:39,720
Speaker 3: got an appointment with Count Dracula's carriage and they've got

1036
00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:42,160
Speaker 3: to meet at the Borgo Pass at midnight. It sounds

1037
00:57:42,160 --> 00:57:44,800
Speaker 3: like fun. By the way. One of the people who

1038
00:57:44,800 --> 00:57:47,560
Speaker 3: tries to warn him off is this innkeeper here who

1039
00:57:47,760 --> 00:57:50,640
Speaker 3: is the actor is great. I love this scene where

1040
00:57:50,680 --> 00:57:53,320
Speaker 3: he's he's like telling him all of the vampire lore.

1041
00:57:53,400 --> 00:57:56,320
Speaker 3: He's telling him like, listen, no vampires are at the castle.

1042
00:57:56,360 --> 00:57:59,440
Speaker 3: You can't go there. Vampires drink blood, they sleep in coffins,

1043
00:57:59,440 --> 00:58:01,720
Speaker 3: they change in to bats and wolves. They can be

1044
00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:04,080
Speaker 3: repelled by the cross. This is all the stuff you

1045
00:58:04,120 --> 00:58:07,640
Speaker 3: need to know, but it doesn't feel like the kind

1046
00:58:07,640 --> 00:58:10,400
Speaker 3: of tight, lower dump that it is. Instead, it's like

1047
00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:12,640
Speaker 3: this innkeeper is ranting at me and I want him

1048
00:58:12,680 --> 00:58:13,120
Speaker 3: to stop.

1049
00:58:13,760 --> 00:58:16,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I had to look this guy at. Michael Visarov,

1050
00:58:16,720 --> 00:58:19,560
Speaker 2: Russian born actor most mostly active in did parts in

1051
00:58:19,560 --> 00:58:20,560
Speaker 2: the thirties and forties.

1052
00:58:20,800 --> 00:58:23,240
Speaker 3: Anyway, after this, Renfield does take off in the carriage

1053
00:58:23,280 --> 00:58:26,320
Speaker 3: again to meet Dracula's carriage at the Borgo Pass at midnight,

1054
00:58:26,360 --> 00:58:29,920
Speaker 3: and we get another great dramatic landscape shot. This was

1055
00:58:29,960 --> 00:58:33,320
Speaker 3: once again by combining real photography and painting. It's the

1056
00:58:33,600 --> 00:58:38,440
Speaker 3: perilous rock bridge crossing to the vampire's castle. Now, before

1057
00:58:38,480 --> 00:58:41,280
Speaker 3: Renfield arrives, we actually get what I think is one

1058
00:58:41,320 --> 00:58:43,320
Speaker 3: of the best shots in the film, which is a

1059
00:58:43,440 --> 00:58:48,560
Speaker 3: dolly shot, a moving camera shot through the filthy catacombs

1060
00:58:48,560 --> 00:58:52,520
Speaker 3: and the bowels of Dracula's castle, and we're approaching this

1061
00:58:52,680 --> 00:58:56,440
Speaker 3: brood of coffins that lie nestled in the dust, and

1062
00:58:56,560 --> 00:59:00,480
Speaker 3: there's this great effect where mist is pouring eerily across

1063
00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:02,920
Speaker 3: the surface of the earth, and we get closer and

1064
00:59:02,960 --> 00:59:05,840
Speaker 3: closer to the coffin, and finally the lid creaks open

1065
00:59:06,080 --> 00:59:08,160
Speaker 3: and out comes a pale hand.

1066
00:59:08,800 --> 00:59:11,680
Speaker 2: This, I believe is one of a few shots that

1067
00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:15,440
Speaker 2: is pointed out as being clearly inspired by twenty two's Nosferatu.

1068
00:59:15,840 --> 00:59:18,040
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, okay, I don't think I would have made

1069
00:59:18,040 --> 00:59:21,960
Speaker 3: that connection, but that sounds right to me. Now. Interesting note,

1070
00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:25,280
Speaker 3: we don't see Dracula's face in this moment where the

1071
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:28,120
Speaker 3: hand is coming out of the coffin. In fact, before

1072
00:59:28,160 --> 00:59:30,400
Speaker 3: we see his face, we see the face of one

1073
00:59:30,400 --> 00:59:34,880
Speaker 3: of his wives. So, despite what some movie trivia sources say,

1074
00:59:34,920 --> 00:59:38,240
Speaker 3: the first on screen vampire in a talkie was not

1075
00:59:38,440 --> 00:59:41,920
Speaker 3: Bela Lagosi, but one of his three demon brides. I'm

1076
00:59:41,960 --> 00:59:44,760
Speaker 3: almost certain this is the one played by Geraldine de Vorak.

1077
00:59:44,960 --> 00:59:46,720
Speaker 3: She beats him by a few seconds.

1078
00:59:47,120 --> 00:59:49,080
Speaker 2: However, she does not talkie herself.

1079
00:59:49,440 --> 00:59:54,280
Speaker 3: That's true. Very quiet. Also in the scene possums, you know, yes,

1080
00:59:54,480 --> 00:59:57,720
Speaker 3: but Dracula's castles, it's full of possums. They're crawling around

1081
00:59:57,760 --> 01:00:00,720
Speaker 3: in the bones, they're getting up all in all the cracks, crevices.

1082
01:00:00,760 --> 01:00:02,960
Speaker 3: They've got a real possum issue. Oh, man.

1083
01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:06,120
Speaker 2: When I started watching Dracula the other day with my kid,

1084
01:00:06,200 --> 01:00:08,640
Speaker 2: I wasn't fully considering it for this week's Weird House

1085
01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:13,120
Speaker 2: Cinema until the possums and the armadillos showed up, rooting

1086
01:00:13,160 --> 01:00:18,440
Speaker 2: around caskets and generally just infesting Dracula's castle. So the

1087
01:00:18,480 --> 01:00:21,240
Speaker 2: possums show up first, and I was like, okay, fair enough,

1088
01:00:21,280 --> 01:00:24,120
Speaker 2: possums look like big gross rats. I'll allow it. But

1089
01:00:24,160 --> 01:00:27,240
Speaker 2: then there are armadillas as well, armadillos as well. And

1090
01:00:27,360 --> 01:00:30,760
Speaker 2: to be clear, possums and armadillos are both endemic to

1091
01:00:30,800 --> 01:00:35,240
Speaker 2: the Americas. They absolutely don't live in Transylvania or Eastern Europe.

1092
01:00:35,680 --> 01:00:37,600
Speaker 2: And yet at the same time, you know you have

1093
01:00:37,640 --> 01:00:39,800
Speaker 2: to acknowledge they do look creepy rooting around in a

1094
01:00:39,840 --> 01:00:43,840
Speaker 2: Gothic castle. So what's going on here? Well, the most

1095
01:00:43,880 --> 01:00:47,200
Speaker 2: obvious interpretations are, of course, this was shot in California

1096
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:51,640
Speaker 2: and on a depression trunken budget, so you know, you

1097
01:00:51,880 --> 01:00:54,400
Speaker 2: use what you can get your hands on, and if

1098
01:00:54,440 --> 01:00:56,880
Speaker 2: you didn't know any better, these animals again look creepy

1099
01:00:56,880 --> 01:01:00,840
Speaker 2: in a Gothic castle setting. A deeper answer, however, seems

1100
01:01:00,840 --> 01:01:04,120
Speaker 2: to exist in attitudes concerning these two species, especially at

1101
01:01:04,120 --> 01:01:07,560
Speaker 2: the time I was reading Dale Hudson's Of course there

1102
01:01:07,560 --> 01:01:11,000
Speaker 2: are werewolves and vampires from the American Quarterly twenty thirteen,

1103
01:01:11,320 --> 01:01:14,840
Speaker 2: and this author argues that the presence of these creatures

1104
01:01:14,840 --> 01:01:20,160
Speaker 2: serve to animalize Dracula himself. Additionally, the contagion aspects of

1105
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:23,320
Speaker 2: Stoker's novel are perhaps summoned here in the presence of

1106
01:01:23,360 --> 01:01:26,880
Speaker 2: two creatures often associated with diseases possums.

1107
01:01:27,040 --> 01:01:27,760
Speaker 3: I look this up.

1108
01:01:27,800 --> 01:01:30,080
Speaker 2: They can carry a number of diseases that are transferable

1109
01:01:30,080 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 2: to humans, and Armadilla's of course, can carry leprosy. Furthermore,

1110
01:01:34,880 --> 01:01:39,560
Speaker 2: there are slash were apparently tall tales of Armadilla's digging

1111
01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:41,240
Speaker 2: up graves and eating corpses.

1112
01:01:41,480 --> 01:01:42,640
Speaker 3: What I've never heard that.

1113
01:01:42,880 --> 01:01:44,560
Speaker 2: I mean, they do root around, and I think the

1114
01:01:44,600 --> 01:01:49,800
Speaker 2: idea is that this led to tall tales of them

1115
01:01:49,840 --> 01:01:52,000
Speaker 2: digging up and eating corpses. And you know, there may

1116
01:01:52,040 --> 01:01:56,080
Speaker 2: be some accounts of them, you know, eating non insect meat,

1117
01:01:56,120 --> 01:01:58,640
Speaker 2: scavenging it if the availability is there. I mean, we've

1118
01:01:58,640 --> 01:02:01,800
Speaker 2: seen that in other animals, but it seems to be

1119
01:02:02,320 --> 01:02:06,800
Speaker 2: just a myth and a legend. But yeah, despite all

1120
01:02:06,800 --> 01:02:09,560
Speaker 2: the other aspects of this adaptation of Dracula, that becomes

1121
01:02:09,560 --> 01:02:13,480
Speaker 2: set in stone. The inclusion of possums and Armadilla's doesn't

1122
01:02:13,520 --> 01:02:16,320
Speaker 2: seem to be like something that really stuck. I don't

1123
01:02:16,360 --> 01:02:17,880
Speaker 2: think Copley used this at all.

1124
01:02:18,520 --> 01:02:21,800
Speaker 3: I do not recall it. But anyway, so after that,

1125
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:24,840
Speaker 3: we finally get to the iconic shot where we first

1126
01:02:24,880 --> 01:02:28,040
Speaker 3: see Bella Legosi in full. He's standing tall in a

1127
01:02:28,080 --> 01:02:31,800
Speaker 3: black cloak with the tall collar and the dark catacombs

1128
01:02:31,920 --> 01:02:34,959
Speaker 3: under the stone arches and the cobwebs, with the light

1129
01:02:35,080 --> 01:02:37,400
Speaker 3: curiously falling on his face in a way that makes

1130
01:02:37,480 --> 01:02:40,960
Speaker 3: him look unnaturally pale. And the camera closes in and

1131
01:02:41,000 --> 01:02:43,960
Speaker 3: it brings us closer and closer to him, and it's

1132
01:02:43,960 --> 01:02:47,160
Speaker 3: almost like he's floating through the air toward us as

1133
01:02:47,200 --> 01:02:51,000
Speaker 3: the camera zooms in. Just great, great shot. It's one

1134
01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:54,360
Speaker 3: of those all time epic movie introductions. It's like, when

1135
01:02:54,360 --> 01:02:55,960
Speaker 3: you see a guy for the first time like this,

1136
01:02:56,080 --> 01:02:57,160
Speaker 3: you'll never forget him.

1137
01:02:57,480 --> 01:02:59,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like he is floating towards us. We are

1138
01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:03,600
Speaker 2: being drawn towards him. Yeah, we are already captivated.

1139
01:03:04,200 --> 01:03:06,600
Speaker 3: We also see Dracula's brides for the first time in

1140
01:03:06,640 --> 01:03:09,240
Speaker 3: this scene. They're like creeping along through the catacombs, also

1141
01:03:09,360 --> 01:03:13,760
Speaker 3: under these arches and very very unsettling as well. So

1142
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:16,080
Speaker 3: the next scene is the one where Dracula picks up

1143
01:03:16,120 --> 01:03:19,560
Speaker 3: Renfield at the Borgo Pass at midnight. Dracula is supposed

1144
01:03:19,600 --> 01:03:23,040
Speaker 3: to be in disguise as the coachman here in the novel.

1145
01:03:23,720 --> 01:03:26,280
Speaker 3: I think he doesn't want Harker to realize that he's

1146
01:03:26,360 --> 01:03:29,160
Speaker 3: doing everything himself and that he doesn't actually have any

1147
01:03:29,200 --> 01:03:32,480
Speaker 3: living servants inside his castle, so he you know, he's

1148
01:03:32,520 --> 01:03:34,680
Speaker 3: in disguise. But this is not a good disguise. It's

1149
01:03:34,680 --> 01:03:35,400
Speaker 3: bela lagosi.

1150
01:03:36,520 --> 01:03:38,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, basically just as a scarf and a hat.

1151
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:42,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, but yeah, maybe if you never seen in

1152
01:03:42,240 --> 01:03:46,680
Speaker 3: Belli lagosi before, just like, okay, it's another guy. Renfield

1153
01:03:46,720 --> 01:03:49,960
Speaker 3: meets the carriage in a haunted, misty landscape filled with

1154
01:03:50,000 --> 01:03:53,040
Speaker 3: crooked trees, and then he gets aboard. The driver does

1155
01:03:53,080 --> 01:03:55,840
Speaker 3: not speak. At one point along the way, Renfield looks

1156
01:03:55,840 --> 01:03:58,080
Speaker 3: out the window and sees the team of horses being

1157
01:03:58,120 --> 01:04:01,440
Speaker 3: led by a bat in flight. Good, good little moment.

1158
01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:02,240
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1159
01:04:02,280 --> 01:04:04,640
Speaker 2: I want to add a note here about the you know,

1160
01:04:04,680 --> 01:04:07,520
Speaker 2: their rubber bats on yea, on the strings. Essentially, we've

1161
01:04:07,560 --> 01:04:11,400
Speaker 2: seen so many flapping rubber bats on strings and various films.

1162
01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:14,280
Speaker 2: But here they do look really good. I mean there's

1163
01:04:14,320 --> 01:04:18,040
Speaker 2: never any doubt that you're watching an effect and not

1164
01:04:18,120 --> 01:04:22,560
Speaker 2: a real animal, but it looks really good. I absolute props.

1165
01:04:23,000 --> 01:04:25,720
Speaker 3: It's a rubber bat. But I like this rubber bat. Yeah,

1166
01:04:25,760 --> 01:04:28,040
Speaker 3: the rubber bat is better than the rubber spider that

1167
01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:30,080
Speaker 3: climbs the wall in a few minutes.

1168
01:04:30,160 --> 01:04:32,760
Speaker 2: Oh, it's true. Yeah, they couldn't keep live spider. They

1169
01:04:32,800 --> 01:04:35,560
Speaker 2: tried to use live spiders. There are some. There are

1170
01:04:35,560 --> 01:04:39,840
Speaker 2: some live crickets as well, but yeah, live spiders. That's

1171
01:04:39,840 --> 01:04:41,000
Speaker 2: got to eaten up pretty quickly.

1172
01:04:41,520 --> 01:04:46,360
Speaker 3: Okay, some notes about the scene where where Renfield arrives

1173
01:04:46,400 --> 01:04:48,440
Speaker 3: at the castle. It's great. You know, the door creaks

1174
01:04:48,440 --> 01:04:51,320
Speaker 3: open by itself. Again, most people have probably seen some

1175
01:04:51,400 --> 01:04:54,000
Speaker 3: kind of adaptation of Dracula, so you know this scene.

1176
01:04:54,680 --> 01:04:58,040
Speaker 3: Renfield cautiously steps into the main hall, which looks as

1177
01:04:58,040 --> 01:05:01,200
Speaker 3: if it had been deserted for century. Everything's covered in

1178
01:05:01,280 --> 01:05:05,120
Speaker 3: just ages worth of dust, giant spiderwebs. You got bats

1179
01:05:05,200 --> 01:05:09,080
Speaker 3: bobbing and cheapening outside the window. Here's where we meet

1180
01:05:09,080 --> 01:05:11,320
Speaker 3: the Armadillo's for the first time. They're just crawling out

1181
01:05:11,360 --> 01:05:16,400
Speaker 3: of the furniture. Another beautiful set once again a composite

1182
01:05:16,440 --> 01:05:20,240
Speaker 3: shot made by I think it's a real photograph, real

1183
01:05:20,280 --> 01:05:25,160
Speaker 3: photography of a stage, a sound stage made up set

1184
01:05:25,240 --> 01:05:27,680
Speaker 3: on the bottom, and then I think the painted editions

1185
01:05:27,680 --> 01:05:28,840
Speaker 3: are higher up in the frame.

1186
01:05:29,720 --> 01:05:32,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's absolutely gorgeous. The depth is amazing and is

1187
01:05:32,720 --> 01:05:39,200
Speaker 2: noted in the Road to Dracula documentary. This look, this set,

1188
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:42,400
Speaker 2: like this really sets the tone for the look of

1189
01:05:42,520 --> 01:05:45,800
Speaker 2: horror films, all the horror films that come afterwards, particularly

1190
01:05:45,800 --> 01:05:50,240
Speaker 2: gothic horror films to come. This cathedral of the macabre.

1191
01:05:51,200 --> 01:05:54,080
Speaker 2: It just, yeah, you know what you're looking at here,

1192
01:05:54,120 --> 01:05:59,240
Speaker 2: and it just resonates through horror cinema and things adjacent

1193
01:05:59,240 --> 01:06:01,400
Speaker 2: to horror cinema. This is like your basic Scooby Doo

1194
01:06:01,440 --> 01:06:04,120
Speaker 2: haunted house as well. So it does get deluded to

1195
01:06:04,160 --> 01:06:06,960
Speaker 2: a certain extent, but here in its original form, I

1196
01:06:07,000 --> 01:06:08,200
Speaker 2: mean it's still astounding.

1197
01:06:08,640 --> 01:06:10,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right. I mean it is beautiful and it's

1198
01:06:10,760 --> 01:06:15,120
Speaker 3: the mother of all movie haunted castles. So we get

1199
01:06:15,160 --> 01:06:18,320
Speaker 3: the introductory scene he Dracula comes down the stairs with

1200
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:22,280
Speaker 3: the candelabra. He says, I am Dracula. He says to Renfield,

1201
01:06:22,280 --> 01:06:25,480
Speaker 3: I bid you welcome. Renfield says, is just kind of

1202
01:06:25,520 --> 01:06:28,640
Speaker 3: nervously stammering and you know, saying a bunch of stuff

1203
01:06:28,680 --> 01:06:32,520
Speaker 3: that's not necessary. And as they start to go up

1204
01:06:32,520 --> 01:06:35,640
Speaker 3: the stairs, we get the great moment where Count Dracula

1205
01:06:35,720 --> 01:06:39,560
Speaker 3: says they hear wolves howling outside, and Dracula says, listen

1206
01:06:39,560 --> 01:06:43,520
Speaker 3: to them chilled r and of the night. What music

1207
01:06:43,720 --> 01:06:47,040
Speaker 3: they make? I'm sorry if I didn't deliver that right,

1208
01:06:47,120 --> 01:06:51,760
Speaker 3: but it's it's I think Skull points out that actually,

1209
01:06:51,840 --> 01:06:54,640
Speaker 3: in a lot of later adaptations of the Dracula story,

1210
01:06:54,840 --> 01:06:59,280
Speaker 3: this line gets embellished. They start adding other words to it,

1211
01:06:59,360 --> 01:07:02,760
Speaker 3: where it's like what beautiful music they make or what

1212
01:07:02,960 --> 01:07:07,520
Speaker 3: sweet music they make? And the simplicity of what music

1213
01:07:07,600 --> 01:07:10,360
Speaker 3: they make is so much better. I like that this

1214
01:07:10,440 --> 01:07:12,200
Speaker 3: Dracula is understated.

1215
01:07:13,000 --> 01:07:15,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and again yeah, the cryptic nature of it

1216
01:07:15,440 --> 01:07:18,360
Speaker 2: and the fact that Lugosi makes every syllable count. And

1217
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:20,680
Speaker 2: I think it was Joe Dante who made the point

1218
01:07:20,680 --> 01:07:23,160
Speaker 2: in the Road to Dracula that Legosi also had a

1219
01:07:23,160 --> 01:07:26,040
Speaker 2: great ability to find every possible syllable in a word

1220
01:07:26,400 --> 01:07:29,640
Speaker 2: yes and bring it to full life.

1221
01:07:29,720 --> 01:07:31,800
Speaker 3: The scene also has the moment where Dracula is going

1222
01:07:31,880 --> 01:07:34,520
Speaker 3: up the stairs and he passes through the spider web

1223
01:07:34,600 --> 01:07:38,320
Speaker 3: without parting it, and then Renfield going through. You know,

1224
01:07:38,360 --> 01:07:40,640
Speaker 3: there's a spider web across the Dracula is already gone

1225
01:07:40,680 --> 01:07:42,560
Speaker 3: and he has to split the web and go through,

1226
01:07:42,840 --> 01:07:45,760
Speaker 3: which is eerie, but there are actually no special effects needed.

1227
01:07:45,760 --> 01:07:47,840
Speaker 3: It's just a nominous cut. You see him walking up

1228
01:07:47,840 --> 01:07:50,000
Speaker 3: toward it, and it cuts away and suddenly he's on

1229
01:07:50,040 --> 01:07:52,760
Speaker 3: the other side of it, but it's still intact. Yeah,

1230
01:07:52,800 --> 01:07:57,760
Speaker 3: and then a rubber spider scuttles up the wall. So

1231
01:07:57,880 --> 01:08:00,160
Speaker 3: Renfield is brought up to a more hospitable room with

1232
01:08:00,200 --> 01:08:03,320
Speaker 3: a roaring fireplace and supper set out for him. This

1233
01:08:03,480 --> 01:08:06,600
Speaker 3: drag hospitality scene also appears in some form in most

1234
01:08:06,840 --> 01:08:09,919
Speaker 3: versions of the story. As usual, they discuss business here.

1235
01:08:09,960 --> 01:08:12,400
Speaker 3: You know, Dracula signs the lease on the property he's

1236
01:08:12,400 --> 01:08:17,840
Speaker 3: acquiring in England. He works out shipping arrangements. He explains

1237
01:08:17,880 --> 01:08:22,880
Speaker 3: that he's taking three boxes on the ship that he's

1238
01:08:22,960 --> 01:08:26,519
Speaker 3: chartered for England, which is leaving tomorrow evening. Wow, that's

1239
01:08:26,520 --> 01:08:30,160
Speaker 3: soon three boxes. I think he takes more boxes in

1240
01:08:30,200 --> 01:08:32,559
Speaker 3: the book, but three, I guess. Yeah, that's right.

1241
01:08:32,760 --> 01:08:33,960
Speaker 2: It seems like he would take four.

1242
01:08:34,040 --> 01:08:34,200
Speaker 3: Right.

1243
01:08:34,280 --> 01:08:36,439
Speaker 2: I must be missing something here, because he needs one

1244
01:08:36,479 --> 01:08:39,479
Speaker 2: for each bride and then himself. But maybe there's I.

1245
01:08:39,400 --> 01:08:41,640
Speaker 3: Don't know, that's a good point. Yeah.

1246
01:08:41,840 --> 01:08:45,800
Speaker 2: Even then there were carry on lints and so forth.

1247
01:08:45,880 --> 01:08:48,040
Speaker 2: So it was like, I have four boxes and they're like, well,

1248
01:08:48,080 --> 01:08:49,640
Speaker 2: we have to charge you for the fourth, when he's like,

1249
01:08:49,840 --> 01:08:51,840
Speaker 2: I can make do with three.

1250
01:08:53,280 --> 01:08:55,800
Speaker 3: So Renfield in this scene, of course, you know, he

1251
01:08:55,840 --> 01:08:58,680
Speaker 3: gets a paper cut all those documents. That's a little dangerous.

1252
01:08:59,000 --> 01:09:02,479
Speaker 3: You're gonna cut your fingers, and he does, and drac

1253
01:09:02,760 --> 01:09:05,840
Speaker 3: can't help himself. He starts creeping up to him, but

1254
01:09:05,880 --> 01:09:08,479
Speaker 3: then the sign of the cross, the crucifix given to

1255
01:09:08,560 --> 01:09:10,839
Speaker 3: him by the woman at the end, makes Dracula recoil

1256
01:09:12,439 --> 01:09:15,639
Speaker 3: and around here's where we start getting these great close

1257
01:09:15,720 --> 01:09:18,840
Speaker 3: ups on Dracula's face with the light just falling over

1258
01:09:18,880 --> 01:09:21,599
Speaker 3: his eyes where he seems to be hypnotizing the person

1259
01:09:21,680 --> 01:09:24,280
Speaker 3: in front of him. The scene also has the great

1260
01:09:24,360 --> 01:09:27,879
Speaker 3: wine exchange, you know, where he offers wine to Renfield.

1261
01:09:27,880 --> 01:09:29,760
Speaker 3: He says, this is very old wine. I hope you

1262
01:09:29,800 --> 01:09:32,800
Speaker 3: will like it, and Renfield's like, oh, thank you. Aren't

1263
01:09:32,800 --> 01:09:36,440
Speaker 3: you having any? I never drink why.

1264
01:09:38,439 --> 01:09:39,400
Speaker 2: We know what he drinks.

1265
01:09:39,720 --> 01:09:42,680
Speaker 3: So after this, Dracula leaves Renfield for the evening, but

1266
01:09:42,760 --> 01:09:46,679
Speaker 3: he's not leaving for long. Renfield, when finally alone, looks

1267
01:09:46,720 --> 01:09:52,280
Speaker 3: moderately disconcerted. But then immediately some trouble starts creeping in.

1268
01:09:52,320 --> 01:09:55,559
Speaker 3: So we see Dracula's three demon brides approaching the door

1269
01:09:55,560 --> 01:09:59,200
Speaker 3: through a misty hallway, and then Renfield goes to the

1270
01:09:59,240 --> 01:10:02,519
Speaker 3: window of his outside of which there are these crooked

1271
01:10:02,520 --> 01:10:05,080
Speaker 3: tree branches and it's a I don't know, just a

1272
01:10:05,160 --> 01:10:08,360
Speaker 3: very creepy kind of landscape out there again, like mists

1273
01:10:08,400 --> 01:10:11,599
Speaker 3: covering the ground. And then a bat. There's a bat. Oh,

1274
01:10:11,680 --> 01:10:14,200
Speaker 3: bat comes to the window and it sort of floats

1275
01:10:14,240 --> 01:10:17,439
Speaker 3: in front of him. Renfield collapses on the floor as if,

1276
01:10:17,720 --> 01:10:21,479
Speaker 3: you know, hypnotized into unconsciousness somehow by the bat. And

1277
01:10:21,520 --> 01:10:24,200
Speaker 3: then the brides creep into the room. They're advancing on

1278
01:10:24,240 --> 01:10:27,920
Speaker 3: Renfield's body. They're obviously they're going to drink his blood.

1279
01:10:28,080 --> 01:10:32,040
Speaker 3: But no, no, Renfield is not for them. Dracula himself

1280
01:10:32,080 --> 01:10:35,080
Speaker 3: comes back in through the window into the room and

1281
01:10:35,120 --> 01:10:37,680
Speaker 3: he drives away his wives as if to say he

1282
01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:41,760
Speaker 3: is mine. And then the Count descends on Renfield's unconscious

1283
01:10:41,840 --> 01:10:44,679
Speaker 3: body and leans over him to take him in his arms.

1284
01:10:45,280 --> 01:10:49,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's great. Steveuince and we never actually see him

1285
01:10:49,240 --> 01:10:51,640
Speaker 2: like bite into Renfield. Correct me if I'm wrong, But

1286
01:10:52,439 --> 01:10:55,919
Speaker 2: do we ever see fangs in nineteen thirty one Stracula

1287
01:10:56,000 --> 01:10:56,320
Speaker 2: at all?

1288
01:10:56,680 --> 01:11:01,599
Speaker 3: I that's a very good point. I'm afraid to be wrong,

1289
01:11:01,720 --> 01:11:04,840
Speaker 3: But I think you never do. Yeah, I think you

1290
01:11:04,880 --> 01:11:05,960
Speaker 3: never see them. Yeah yeah.

1291
01:11:06,040 --> 01:11:08,320
Speaker 2: If you do see them there, it's not much as

1292
01:11:08,400 --> 01:11:10,880
Speaker 2: made out of it, And it almost seems like they

1293
01:11:10,920 --> 01:11:14,240
Speaker 2: couldn't show for things, you know, like that would be

1294
01:11:14,280 --> 01:11:17,880
Speaker 2: too much for thirty one, and therefore it's implied rather

1295
01:11:17,920 --> 01:11:20,840
Speaker 2: than shown. And I mean you don't miss them because

1296
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:22,599
Speaker 2: your imagination takes you there already.

1297
01:11:22,760 --> 01:11:26,160
Speaker 3: That's right. So we get the standard interlude of a

1298
01:11:26,200 --> 01:11:29,880
Speaker 3: ship on route to England. A difference from most versions

1299
01:11:29,880 --> 01:11:32,679
Speaker 3: here is that because it's w Renfield rather than Harker

1300
01:11:32,680 --> 01:11:35,599
Speaker 3: who went to the castle, Renfield is on the ship

1301
01:11:35,720 --> 01:11:38,640
Speaker 3: with Dracula. There's like there are two creeps on this

1302
01:11:38,720 --> 01:11:42,880
Speaker 3: journey and he's a full on vampire thrawle already. You know,

1303
01:11:42,920 --> 01:11:46,040
Speaker 3: he's crouching next to the to the vampire's coffin, saying,

1304
01:11:46,080 --> 01:11:48,280
Speaker 3: you will keep your promise when we get to London,

1305
01:11:48,360 --> 01:11:51,240
Speaker 3: won't you? Master? You will see that I get lives.

1306
01:11:51,760 --> 01:11:54,160
Speaker 2: I think for some reason, it's not the Demeter as well,

1307
01:11:54,200 --> 01:11:56,799
Speaker 2: like it has a different vent. Yeah, because they I guess,

1308
01:11:56,840 --> 01:11:59,639
Speaker 2: you know, they didn't give themselves enough time to make

1309
01:11:59,680 --> 01:12:01,920
Speaker 2: that particular ship, so they had to deal with the

1310
01:12:02,040 --> 01:12:02,840
Speaker 2: deal with another one.

1311
01:12:03,080 --> 01:12:08,920
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. So so Dracula is like he never answers

1312
01:12:08,960 --> 01:12:10,920
Speaker 3: the question about whether he's going to get lives, does

1313
01:12:10,960 --> 01:12:14,280
Speaker 3: he. He just gives him this withering look like no promises, kid.

1314
01:12:14,479 --> 01:12:17,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've already talked about this. We're not going through

1315
01:12:17,200 --> 01:12:19,040
Speaker 2: all this again. Yeah, you get what you get. You

1316
01:12:19,040 --> 01:12:19,760
Speaker 2: don't pitch a fit.

1317
01:12:19,920 --> 01:12:24,040
Speaker 3: We've got lives at home. So of course Dracula, you know,

1318
01:12:24,120 --> 01:12:26,360
Speaker 3: he eats the crew along the way when they arrived.

1319
01:12:26,400 --> 01:12:28,439
Speaker 3: The only sailors left on the ship are dead. There's

1320
01:12:28,479 --> 01:12:31,600
Speaker 3: one tied to the wheel, which we only see in silhouette.

1321
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:35,360
Speaker 3: But here we start to get Dwight Fry's deranged high

1322
01:12:35,439 --> 01:12:38,880
Speaker 3: energy performance. Like they throw open the doors down into

1323
01:12:38,920 --> 01:12:41,800
Speaker 3: the hold and DWIGHTE. Fry is just standing there at

1324
01:12:41,840 --> 01:12:45,320
Speaker 3: the bottom of the of the stairs, laughing maniacally with

1325
01:12:45,439 --> 01:12:50,400
Speaker 3: this unbelievably devilish grin. It's so good. Oh yes, we

1326
01:12:50,439 --> 01:12:53,280
Speaker 3: also get a newspaper clipping here to sort of fill

1327
01:12:53,360 --> 01:12:56,559
Speaker 3: us in on what's going on. It tells us that

1328
01:12:56,680 --> 01:13:00,599
Speaker 3: the sole survivor is a raving maniac, says quote. His

1329
01:13:00,760 --> 01:13:04,160
Speaker 3: craving to devour ants, flies, and other small living things

1330
01:13:04,200 --> 01:13:08,920
Speaker 3: to obtain their blood puzzles scientists. At present, he is

1331
01:13:09,000 --> 01:13:12,800
Speaker 3: under observation in doctor Seward's sanitarium near London. Now Here

1332
01:13:12,840 --> 01:13:14,680
Speaker 3: we also get a scene that saying a lot of

1333
01:13:14,800 --> 01:13:18,240
Speaker 3: versions of the story, the sort of first taste of

1334
01:13:18,320 --> 01:13:21,920
Speaker 3: the fish out of water horror scenario, and it's Dracula

1335
01:13:22,040 --> 01:13:25,519
Speaker 3: walking the streets of modern London. The old curse has

1336
01:13:25,560 --> 01:13:28,200
Speaker 3: been taken out of the old world and inserted into

1337
01:13:28,200 --> 01:13:32,679
Speaker 3: the modern world. So he menacingly approaches a girl selling

1338
01:13:32,680 --> 01:13:35,800
Speaker 3: flowers on a street corner and then slowly envelops her

1339
01:13:35,880 --> 01:13:39,400
Speaker 3: with his arms to drink her blood. And I wanted

1340
01:13:39,439 --> 01:13:41,760
Speaker 3: to take a moment to talk here about the staging

1341
01:13:41,840 --> 01:13:45,040
Speaker 3: of how Dracula descends upon a victim in this movie.

1342
01:13:45,760 --> 01:13:50,000
Speaker 3: It almost looks sort of awkward. Usually, it's clearly a

1343
01:13:50,080 --> 01:13:53,599
Speaker 3: deliberate choice to make him move like this. It is

1344
01:13:53,640 --> 01:13:59,160
Speaker 3: a stiff, extremely slow movement into the victim's space and

1345
01:13:59,240 --> 01:14:01,839
Speaker 3: around them. He did the same thing when he descended

1346
01:14:01,880 --> 01:14:04,439
Speaker 3: on Dwight Fry's unconscious body. He'll do the same thing

1347
01:14:04,520 --> 01:14:07,679
Speaker 3: later when we see him leaning down toward Mina's bed.

1348
01:14:08,400 --> 01:14:13,280
Speaker 3: It's just this slow, stiff, rigid kind of approach. I

1349
01:14:13,320 --> 01:14:16,160
Speaker 3: don't know exactly why they made that choice or what

1350
01:14:16,160 --> 01:14:19,840
Speaker 3: it means, but it's interesting and different, and I don't know,

1351
01:14:19,880 --> 01:14:20,840
Speaker 3: it looks very weird.

1352
01:14:21,200 --> 01:14:22,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, it makes me think of some of the later

1353
01:14:22,560 --> 01:14:25,960
Speaker 2: scenes where we see him using his full power of

1354
01:14:26,080 --> 01:14:29,479
Speaker 2: enthrallment over victims. You know, he doesn't have to lunge,

1355
01:14:29,560 --> 01:14:32,160
Speaker 2: he doesn't have to move quickly because he has already

1356
01:14:32,200 --> 01:14:34,080
Speaker 2: snared you with his eyes. Yeah.

1357
01:14:34,160 --> 01:14:38,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a good point. That's a good comparison. I

1358
01:14:38,680 --> 01:14:41,519
Speaker 3: don't know, I'll have to think more about that anyway.

1359
01:14:41,640 --> 01:14:44,400
Speaker 3: Dracula makes his way to an auditorium in the city

1360
01:14:44,439 --> 01:14:47,839
Speaker 3: center where a symphony performance is taking place. He eventually

1361
01:14:47,840 --> 01:14:51,320
Speaker 3: makes his way to the box bearing our main good characters.

1362
01:14:52,040 --> 01:14:55,599
Speaker 3: These are Mina Seward and Lucy Weston, two young women

1363
01:14:55,720 --> 01:14:58,880
Speaker 3: close friends since childhood who will become the targets of

1364
01:14:58,920 --> 01:15:02,920
Speaker 3: Count Dracula's blood hunt in London. Jonathan Harker again with

1365
01:15:03,040 --> 01:15:07,120
Speaker 3: big why is he here now? Energy, Mina's fiance. He's

1366
01:15:07,200 --> 01:15:11,040
Speaker 3: just he's Mina's fiance. There he is. There's doctor Seward,

1367
01:15:11,040 --> 01:15:14,599
Speaker 3: who runs the sanitarium where Rinfield has been committed, which

1368
01:15:14,720 --> 01:15:17,759
Speaker 3: also just happens to be right next door to Carfax Abbey,

1369
01:15:17,960 --> 01:15:21,920
Speaker 3: the estate that Dracula has leased. In this version of

1370
01:15:21,960 --> 01:15:26,400
Speaker 3: the story, doctor Seward is Mina's father. In the novel,

1371
01:15:26,640 --> 01:15:29,639
Speaker 3: that's not the case. I think he is. He's younger,

1372
01:15:29,720 --> 01:15:32,800
Speaker 3: and I believe he is one of Lucy's mini suitors.

1373
01:15:32,880 --> 01:15:34,559
Speaker 3: That's the whole thing. In the novel, She's got like

1374
01:15:34,640 --> 01:15:36,519
Speaker 3: five different guys who are trying to marry her.

1375
01:15:37,040 --> 01:15:40,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, unnecessary love triangle removed.

1376
01:15:41,280 --> 01:15:44,000
Speaker 3: I'm in favor love Pentagon.

1377
01:15:44,320 --> 01:15:45,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, Pentagon.

1378
01:15:46,520 --> 01:15:50,320
Speaker 3: So Dracula uses a ploy to talk himself into the

1379
01:15:50,479 --> 01:15:53,200
Speaker 3: sort of opera box here to meet these characters. I

1380
01:15:53,280 --> 01:15:56,000
Speaker 3: think one thing I was a little unclear on is

1381
01:15:56,040 --> 01:15:58,599
Speaker 3: like why he's trying to meet them, And I think

1382
01:15:58,640 --> 01:16:04,080
Speaker 3: the issue is that he knows Renfield, his vampire Thrall,

1383
01:16:04,479 --> 01:16:08,200
Speaker 3: has been committed to the sanitarium the doctor Seward runs,

1384
01:16:08,360 --> 01:16:12,280
Speaker 3: and so he's trying to to like influence them related

1385
01:16:12,320 --> 01:16:14,800
Speaker 3: to that, or maybe because they're neighbors. Now, maybe that's why.

1386
01:16:14,920 --> 01:16:17,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, their neighbors. He's just being neighborly. This is neighborly d.

1387
01:16:17,600 --> 01:16:21,360
Speaker 3: That's exactly yes. So he introduces himself to the three

1388
01:16:21,439 --> 01:16:25,760
Speaker 3: younger Londoners. Doctor Seward takes a phone call, and you know,

1389
01:16:25,800 --> 01:16:28,000
Speaker 3: they bring up that he's moving into Carfax Abbey and

1390
01:16:28,040 --> 01:16:31,080
Speaker 3: Harker's like, oh, that's very old. Will it need repairs?

1391
01:16:31,479 --> 01:16:35,040
Speaker 3: And Dracula says, I shall do very little repairing.

1392
01:16:35,680 --> 01:16:38,599
Speaker 2: This is such a great everyone plays. The next time

1393
01:16:38,640 --> 01:16:41,240
Speaker 2: you move to a new new town or new home,

1394
01:16:41,520 --> 01:16:44,000
Speaker 2: keep this one with you. When someone, when a neighbor

1395
01:16:44,120 --> 01:16:46,639
Speaker 2: like subtly brings up some sort of repair that might

1396
01:16:46,640 --> 01:16:49,719
Speaker 2: need to happen, be like, I should do very little repair.

1397
01:16:50,400 --> 01:16:54,160
Speaker 3: Very good. Yeah. So, but he explains it's because he

1398
01:16:54,320 --> 01:16:56,200
Speaker 3: likes the way that the abbey reminds him of the

1399
01:16:56,240 --> 01:16:59,760
Speaker 3: old broken battlements of his castle in Transylvania. And then

1400
01:17:00,040 --> 01:17:01,840
Speaker 3: Lucy says, oh, you know, that reminds me of an

1401
01:17:01,880 --> 01:17:04,000
Speaker 3: old toast. I don't remember everything she says, but it

1402
01:17:04,080 --> 01:17:07,040
Speaker 3: ends with a line about dying, and then Dracula says,

1403
01:17:07,120 --> 01:17:11,080
Speaker 3: to die, to be really dead, that must be glorious.

1404
01:17:12,200 --> 01:17:14,800
Speaker 2: Oh that's so good. And there's more too. That's great

1405
01:17:14,800 --> 01:17:18,679
Speaker 2: because then Mina says, why Count Dracula, and that alone

1406
01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:22,800
Speaker 2: is excellent. I love, oh Dracula. But then then the

1407
01:17:22,840 --> 01:17:26,880
Speaker 2: Count says, they are far worse things awaiting men, then death,

1408
01:17:27,320 --> 01:17:29,479
Speaker 2: and oh my god, this is another moment where I

1409
01:17:29,520 --> 01:17:31,840
Speaker 2: just love the ambiguity and the cryptic nature of it.

1410
01:17:31,920 --> 01:17:34,759
Speaker 2: Is he talking about hell? Is he talking about undeath?

1411
01:17:35,320 --> 01:17:37,880
Speaker 2: Or is it something else, like something so terrible that

1412
01:17:37,920 --> 01:17:40,439
Speaker 2: we morals haven't even conceived of it yet it's only

1413
01:17:40,560 --> 01:17:42,200
Speaker 2: known to the vampires.

1414
01:17:42,640 --> 01:17:46,959
Speaker 3: Yes, that's right. So in this scene, Dracula somewhat charms

1415
01:17:47,040 --> 01:17:51,680
Speaker 3: them clearly he becomes fixated on Lucy, and in a

1416
01:17:51,720 --> 01:17:53,960
Speaker 3: later scene at home between Mina and Lucy, we see

1417
01:17:53,960 --> 01:17:56,400
Speaker 3: that Lucy's kind of fixated on him, like they're making

1418
01:17:56,479 --> 01:17:59,240
Speaker 3: jokes about his accent, but Lucy talks about how she's

1419
01:17:59,240 --> 01:18:00,479
Speaker 3: fascinated by the Count.

1420
01:18:00,960 --> 01:18:03,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're just both kind of hanging out crushing on Dracula.

1421
01:18:03,720 --> 01:18:06,360
Speaker 3: I love it. Yeah. But then later that night, in

1422
01:18:06,439 --> 01:18:09,439
Speaker 3: Lucy's bedroom while she sleeps, there's a bat floating out

1423
01:18:09,439 --> 01:18:12,959
Speaker 3: the window. You don't want that, And then he appears

1424
01:18:13,000 --> 01:18:16,080
Speaker 3: in Legosi form in her room, standing over her bed,

1425
01:18:16,360 --> 01:18:20,400
Speaker 3: and once again, he slowly descends and we cut away

1426
01:18:20,520 --> 01:18:24,559
Speaker 3: right as he's over her. I guess here's a good

1427
01:18:24,680 --> 01:18:26,639
Speaker 3: part in the in the plot to kind of take

1428
01:18:26,680 --> 01:18:30,240
Speaker 3: a step back and acknowledge the plot falls a follows

1429
01:18:30,280 --> 01:18:34,640
Speaker 3: a similar structure to most Dracula adaptations, and we can

1430
01:18:34,720 --> 01:18:37,640
Speaker 3: kind of note some interesting things and differences. So at

1431
01:18:37,640 --> 01:18:40,800
Speaker 3: this point in the story, usually Lucy takes ill as

1432
01:18:40,840 --> 01:18:43,280
Speaker 3: a result of having her blood drained by the vampire

1433
01:18:43,280 --> 01:18:47,360
Speaker 3: each night. In the book, this illness and the mystery

1434
01:18:47,360 --> 01:18:50,599
Speaker 3: as to its cause are protracted, but in this movie,

1435
01:18:50,680 --> 01:18:52,960
Speaker 3: we're just gonna We're gonna cut straight to her death

1436
01:18:53,000 --> 01:18:57,200
Speaker 3: and the autopsy and doctor Seward and colleagues note that

1437
01:18:57,240 --> 01:18:59,160
Speaker 3: there are two marks on her neck, the same as

1438
01:18:59,200 --> 01:19:01,360
Speaker 3: with the other victim in London that have been found

1439
01:19:01,439 --> 01:19:05,600
Speaker 3: drained of blood. So from here doctor Seward recruits the

1440
01:19:05,640 --> 01:19:09,680
Speaker 3: aid of his mentor, doctor Van Helsing, who deduces that

1441
01:19:09,720 --> 01:19:12,280
Speaker 3: they may be dealing not with an ordinary illness, but

1442
01:19:12,760 --> 01:19:17,439
Speaker 3: with a vampire no s Ferratu, and then Lucy dies.

1443
01:19:17,760 --> 01:19:20,799
Speaker 3: In this version, she dies quite quickly, and the vampire

1444
01:19:20,840 --> 01:19:23,560
Speaker 3: turns his attention to Mina, whom he visits in the

1445
01:19:23,640 --> 01:19:27,000
Speaker 3: night for blood, eventually starting to turn her into a

1446
01:19:27,080 --> 01:19:29,760
Speaker 3: vampire herself, and the heroes in the end have to

1447
01:19:29,760 --> 01:19:32,320
Speaker 3: solve the mystery and realize that the only way they

1448
01:19:32,360 --> 01:19:35,439
Speaker 3: can save Mina is to destroy the vampire, which they do.

1449
01:19:36,320 --> 01:19:38,720
Speaker 3: So things to discuss within the structure. As the movie

1450
01:19:38,800 --> 01:19:41,440
Speaker 3: goes on, we got scenes of Renfield at the sanitarium

1451
01:19:41,520 --> 01:19:44,679
Speaker 3: raving about how he wants to eat spiders. He's trying

1452
01:19:44,680 --> 01:19:47,280
Speaker 3: to upgrade from flies, like he's been eating flies, but

1453
01:19:47,439 --> 01:19:49,960
Speaker 3: he decides they're not good enough now he wants spiders.

1454
01:19:51,360 --> 01:19:54,320
Speaker 3: Of course, we meet doctor van Helsing when we meet

1455
01:19:54,400 --> 01:19:57,600
Speaker 3: him here. I think he's like doing some chemistry experiments

1456
01:19:57,680 --> 01:20:00,599
Speaker 3: right after the death of Lucy, and he's like, yep,

1457
01:20:00,680 --> 01:20:03,360
Speaker 3: tests came back, knows Faratu, that's what we're dealing with.

1458
01:20:03,439 --> 01:20:06,160
Speaker 3: So they, I don't know. They cut over what, from

1459
01:20:06,160 --> 01:20:08,640
Speaker 3: my memory is a huge section in the middle of

1460
01:20:08,680 --> 01:20:12,000
Speaker 3: the book to get from like Lucy starts falling sick

1461
01:20:12,120 --> 01:20:15,599
Speaker 3: to they figure out that a vampire is involved. That's

1462
01:20:16,280 --> 01:20:17,840
Speaker 3: a couple minutes in this movie.

1463
01:20:18,160 --> 01:20:21,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's a quick test. But yeah,

1464
01:20:21,120 --> 01:20:23,599
Speaker 2: the van Helsing here, I guess maybe it's the chemistry

1465
01:20:23,640 --> 01:20:26,000
Speaker 2: set in the glasses kind of helps give him a

1466
01:20:26,120 --> 01:20:29,920
Speaker 2: slight mad scientist air for me, and I guess, like

1467
01:20:29,960 --> 01:20:33,440
Speaker 2: the van Helsing that I'm mostly familiar with is Peter Cushing's,

1468
01:20:33,640 --> 01:20:36,400
Speaker 2: and Peter Cushing's Van Helsing, of course, is very prim

1469
01:20:36,439 --> 01:20:37,200
Speaker 2: and proper.

1470
01:20:37,439 --> 01:20:41,599
Speaker 3: Very yeah, yeah, yeah. This guy's weirder than Peter Cushing definitely.

1471
01:20:49,560 --> 01:20:53,160
Speaker 3: So the mystery in this is not whether it's a vampire.

1472
01:20:53,240 --> 01:20:55,080
Speaker 3: I mean, I guess some of the other like Seward

1473
01:20:55,120 --> 01:20:58,600
Speaker 3: and Harker take some convincing, but Van Helsing gets there immediately.

1474
01:20:59,479 --> 01:21:02,839
Speaker 3: So the miss is not like what is hurting Lucy?

1475
01:21:02,960 --> 01:21:06,640
Speaker 3: But it is who is the vampire? Renfield is the

1476
01:21:06,680 --> 01:21:10,160
Speaker 3: initial subject, and this is plausible because Renfield keeps escaping

1477
01:21:10,200 --> 01:21:13,880
Speaker 3: the sanitarium. The scene where Van Helsing first meets Renfield

1478
01:21:13,960 --> 01:21:16,760
Speaker 3: is great, like he asks Renfield asked to be sent

1479
01:21:16,800 --> 01:21:20,360
Speaker 3: away from the sanitarium? Why? He says, because my cries

1480
01:21:20,400 --> 01:21:23,679
Speaker 3: at night might disturb Mina. They might give her bad dreams.

1481
01:21:24,280 --> 01:21:28,400
Speaker 3: Which is this great combination of sweet and threatening. You

1482
01:21:28,400 --> 01:21:32,679
Speaker 3: can't tell which one it is. But Van Helsing drives

1483
01:21:32,680 --> 01:21:35,240
Speaker 3: Renfield mad with the sprig of wolf Spain. He's like,

1484
01:21:35,400 --> 01:21:38,360
Speaker 3: you I have some of this, and how about little

1485
01:21:38,400 --> 01:21:41,360
Speaker 3: wolf Spain. Renfield and Renfield says, you know too much

1486
01:21:41,400 --> 01:21:44,920
Speaker 3: to live Van Helsing, and this, of course confirms Van

1487
01:21:44,960 --> 01:21:49,400
Speaker 3: Helsing's suspicions some vamping is going on. So Dracula attacks

1488
01:21:49,479 --> 01:21:52,960
Speaker 3: Mina in the night, and after this happens, there's a

1489
01:21:53,000 --> 01:21:56,000
Speaker 3: haunting scene where she explains her experience the next morning.

1490
01:21:57,280 --> 01:21:59,559
Speaker 3: This is a good monologue. She says, I heard dogs

1491
01:21:59,640 --> 01:22:02,519
Speaker 3: how and when the dream came, it seemed the whole

1492
01:22:02,600 --> 01:22:05,519
Speaker 3: room was filled with mist. It was so thick. I

1493
01:22:05,520 --> 01:22:08,040
Speaker 3: could just see the lamp by the bed, a tiny

1494
01:22:08,080 --> 01:22:10,840
Speaker 3: spark in the fog. And then I saw two red

1495
01:22:10,880 --> 01:22:14,280
Speaker 3: eyes glaring at me, and a white, livid face came

1496
01:22:14,360 --> 01:22:17,360
Speaker 3: down out of the mist. It came closer and closer.

1497
01:22:17,560 --> 01:22:21,640
Speaker 3: I felt its breath on my face, and then its lips. Oh.

1498
01:22:21,680 --> 01:22:24,360
Speaker 3: And we compare this with what we saw from the

1499
01:22:24,400 --> 01:22:27,360
Speaker 3: scene before, where Dracula is descending over her bed, And

1500
01:22:27,960 --> 01:22:32,519
Speaker 3: it's funny because Dracula is often very composed and calm

1501
01:22:32,600 --> 01:22:35,880
Speaker 3: in this movie, but he as he's leaning right over her,

1502
01:22:35,920 --> 01:22:39,240
Speaker 3: he makes this grimace that I don't think we've seen

1503
01:22:39,280 --> 01:22:40,040
Speaker 3: anywhere else.

1504
01:22:41,439 --> 01:22:43,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, this is like, this is the scene where

1505
01:22:43,520 --> 01:22:45,519
Speaker 2: you would see the things. I feel like if we

1506
01:22:45,520 --> 01:22:49,519
Speaker 2: were going to see things. But yeah, it's horrifying and

1507
01:22:49,520 --> 01:22:50,559
Speaker 2: he's coming right at us.

1508
01:22:50,800 --> 01:22:53,599
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. And this scene leads to doctor van Helsing

1509
01:22:53,680 --> 01:22:56,519
Speaker 3: doing a throat check on me and he takes her

1510
01:22:56,560 --> 01:22:58,720
Speaker 3: scarf off, and what do you know, She's got some

1511
01:22:58,760 --> 01:23:01,879
Speaker 3: punctures on the neck. She was hiding them behind a scarf.

1512
01:23:02,080 --> 01:23:04,400
Speaker 3: Something kind of interesting there. The movie doesn't really draw

1513
01:23:04,439 --> 01:23:06,439
Speaker 3: a lot of attention to it, but why was Mina

1514
01:23:06,520 --> 01:23:11,800
Speaker 3: hiding the wounds? Anyway, this scene is suddenly interrupted by

1515
01:23:11,840 --> 01:23:15,960
Speaker 3: a visit from Count Dracula. Mina kind of perks up

1516
01:23:15,960 --> 01:23:18,479
Speaker 3: on Dracula's arrival. I remember she didn't seem to like

1517
01:23:18,560 --> 01:23:20,320
Speaker 3: him that much when they first met, but now she's

1518
01:23:20,400 --> 01:23:22,439
Speaker 3: kind of eager to talk to him and smiles in

1519
01:23:22,479 --> 01:23:26,240
Speaker 3: his presence. Apparently Dracula has been telling Mina grim tales

1520
01:23:26,240 --> 01:23:30,200
Speaker 3: about his home country and she likes that. Another interesting

1521
01:23:30,280 --> 01:23:32,200
Speaker 3: choice in this scene. I don't recall if this is

1522
01:23:32,240 --> 01:23:34,479
Speaker 3: in the novel or not. I don't think so, But

1523
01:23:34,640 --> 01:23:39,000
Speaker 3: Dracula knows of Van Helsing. It's like, oh, yes, we're

1524
01:23:39,040 --> 01:23:41,320
Speaker 3: familiar with your work, even in Transylvania.

1525
01:23:41,720 --> 01:23:44,639
Speaker 2: Well, you know, Van Helsing probably publishes in the various

1526
01:23:44,720 --> 01:23:50,160
Speaker 2: occult journals and you know, Dracula and his kind read up.

1527
01:23:50,520 --> 01:23:53,959
Speaker 2: They want to stay abreast of new findings in vampire sciences.

1528
01:23:54,439 --> 01:23:56,800
Speaker 3: Of course, yeah, you got to know your enemy, right,

1529
01:23:56,840 --> 01:24:00,720
Speaker 3: So read what van Helsing writes. Another great thing in

1530
01:24:00,760 --> 01:24:03,360
Speaker 3: the scene the mirror in the cigarette case. I love

1531
01:24:03,479 --> 01:24:07,599
Speaker 3: this part. So Van Helsing first notices that Dracula has

1532
01:24:07,640 --> 01:24:10,439
Speaker 3: no reflection in the mirrored lid of a cigarette case,

1533
01:24:10,920 --> 01:24:13,519
Speaker 3: and then he sets a trap for Dracula where before

1534
01:24:13,640 --> 01:24:16,639
Speaker 3: they're parting ways, he suddenly opens the case in front

1535
01:24:16,640 --> 01:24:19,880
Speaker 3: of him, And I love the way Legosi reacts to

1536
01:24:19,960 --> 01:24:23,960
Speaker 3: this trick. It's a you know, he reacts with surprise

1537
01:24:24,040 --> 01:24:26,280
Speaker 3: and alarm, and he slaps the case out of Van

1538
01:24:26,360 --> 01:24:30,519
Speaker 3: Helsing's hand under the floor, steps back and glares at him.

1539
01:24:30,720 --> 01:24:34,240
Speaker 3: But then slowly the glare turns into a composed smile.

1540
01:24:35,040 --> 01:24:37,080
Speaker 3: Oh and also he turns into a wolf as he's

1541
01:24:37,120 --> 01:24:41,800
Speaker 3: running away across the lawn. So you know, as I said,

1542
01:24:41,880 --> 01:24:45,760
Speaker 3: Harker and Seward takes some convincing by Van Helsing that

1543
01:24:45,840 --> 01:24:49,439
Speaker 3: they're definitely dealing with a vampire, but they're they're slowly

1544
01:24:49,520 --> 01:24:52,960
Speaker 3: getting there. This leads to another lore dump. We got

1545
01:24:52,960 --> 01:24:56,080
Speaker 3: a lore dump for Renfield earlier, but here's one from

1546
01:24:56,600 --> 01:24:58,840
Speaker 3: Van Helsing. It's like, you know, yeah, vampires have to

1547
01:24:58,920 --> 01:25:01,920
Speaker 3: drink blood to survive. They sleep in their native soil

1548
01:25:02,000 --> 01:25:04,080
Speaker 3: every day, which means he must have brought some soil

1549
01:25:04,160 --> 01:25:07,280
Speaker 3: with him from Transylvania. They're talking about this, but they

1550
01:25:07,320 --> 01:25:10,960
Speaker 3: get interrupted by maniacal laughter when Dwight Fry comes in again.

1551
01:25:11,680 --> 01:25:14,559
Speaker 3: Hilarious keeps escaping. He's here once more.

1552
01:25:15,479 --> 01:25:18,880
Speaker 2: They I guess they just have a trust policy, you know, yeah,

1553
01:25:19,040 --> 01:25:23,080
Speaker 2: the sanatorium, like stop leaving. You're not gonna leave this time, right, Okay, I.

1554
01:25:23,080 --> 01:25:27,640
Speaker 3: Promise they're on the honor system. Yeah. But Renfield in

1555
01:25:27,680 --> 01:25:29,840
Speaker 3: this scene, this is the part I was talking about,

1556
01:25:29,840 --> 01:25:32,000
Speaker 3: where he does a face turn, like he explains to

1557
01:25:32,040 --> 01:25:35,679
Speaker 3: the heroes that Dracula is targeting Mina and he can't

1558
01:25:35,720 --> 01:25:39,120
Speaker 3: let Dracula take Mina. I guess maybe Renfield loves her

1559
01:25:39,280 --> 01:25:41,240
Speaker 3: or just feels protective of her in some way.

1560
01:25:41,880 --> 01:25:42,439
Speaker 2: I guess so.

1561
01:25:43,000 --> 01:25:46,000
Speaker 3: But in this scene, Dracula reappears in bat form and

1562
01:25:46,080 --> 01:25:50,040
Speaker 3: menaces Renfield, which makes him clam up and declare his

1563
01:25:50,080 --> 01:25:53,839
Speaker 3: loyalty wants more to the Master. And then suddenly everybody

1564
01:25:53,880 --> 01:25:56,519
Speaker 3: goes running because a maid calls out that Mina has

1565
01:25:56,560 --> 01:26:00,960
Speaker 3: been found dead. Oh no, which leads to this horrifying scene,

1566
01:26:01,040 --> 01:26:05,040
Speaker 3: another great Dwhite Fry moment, where like the maid is

1567
01:26:05,160 --> 01:26:07,479
Speaker 3: left alone in the room with Dwight Fry and he's

1568
01:26:07,880 --> 01:26:11,639
Speaker 3: grinning maniacally and doing this horrible laughter, and she faints

1569
01:26:11,760 --> 01:26:15,320
Speaker 3: and then he's like crawling on the floor toward her body.

1570
01:26:15,840 --> 01:26:18,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, like he's an anaconda that is going to go

1571
01:26:18,880 --> 01:26:21,519
Speaker 2: to swallow her hole. It's super creepy.

1572
01:26:21,640 --> 01:26:24,559
Speaker 3: Love it. Yeah, But fortunately we find out that Mina

1573
01:26:24,760 --> 01:26:27,120
Speaker 3: is not dead. She was near death, but they got

1574
01:26:27,120 --> 01:26:30,000
Speaker 3: there just in time. So some other stuff goes on.

1575
01:26:30,080 --> 01:26:33,760
Speaker 3: There's a side plot with Lucy being a vampire who's

1576
01:26:33,840 --> 01:26:37,719
Speaker 3: running around, you know, stealing children and stuff. But one

1577
01:26:37,720 --> 01:26:39,800
Speaker 3: thing that they do in this movie is there's no

1578
01:26:39,960 --> 01:26:42,519
Speaker 3: garlic for Mina. When they set a trap for Dracula

1579
01:26:42,600 --> 01:26:45,519
Speaker 3: and Mina's chambers with stuff to repel him. It's wolf Spain.

1580
01:26:45,600 --> 01:26:46,679
Speaker 3: It's just all wolf Spain.

1581
01:26:47,320 --> 01:26:50,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I can understand people being a little

1582
01:26:50,200 --> 01:26:53,599
Speaker 2: bit too familiar with garlic, and why would this scare

1583
01:26:53,600 --> 01:26:55,720
Speaker 2: away of vampires. Maybe we go with wolf Spaine because

1584
01:26:55,720 --> 01:26:56,960
Speaker 2: it has a little more mistique to it.

1585
01:26:57,240 --> 01:27:00,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I can see that too. Now here's

1586
01:27:00,160 --> 01:27:03,200
Speaker 3: where we get to. There's another Renfield escape scene, of course,

1587
01:27:03,240 --> 01:27:07,559
Speaker 3: and then he is describing the appeal that Dracula made

1588
01:27:07,560 --> 01:27:09,439
Speaker 3: to him. He says, he came and stood below my

1589
01:27:09,520 --> 01:27:12,160
Speaker 3: window in the moonlight, and he promised me things, not

1590
01:27:12,280 --> 01:27:15,120
Speaker 3: in words, but by doing them. He's talking to Van Helsing.

1591
01:27:15,520 --> 01:27:18,759
Speaker 3: He says, by making them happen. A red mist spread

1592
01:27:18,800 --> 01:27:21,200
Speaker 3: over the lawn, coming on like a flame of fire.

1593
01:27:21,600 --> 01:27:23,600
Speaker 3: And then he parted it and I could see that

1594
01:27:23,640 --> 01:27:26,679
Speaker 3: there were thousands of rats with their eyes blazing red

1595
01:27:27,000 --> 01:27:29,880
Speaker 3: like his, only smaller. Then he held up his hand

1596
01:27:30,080 --> 01:27:32,200
Speaker 3: and they all stopped, and I thought he seemed to

1597
01:27:32,240 --> 01:27:36,559
Speaker 3: be saying, rats, rats, rats, thousands millions of them, all

1598
01:27:36,640 --> 01:27:39,840
Speaker 3: red blood, All these I will give you if you

1599
01:27:39,920 --> 01:27:44,200
Speaker 3: will obey me. Wow. I love that. That's the thing

1600
01:27:44,320 --> 01:27:47,200
Speaker 3: that Renfield. You know, some people when they make a

1601
01:27:47,200 --> 01:27:50,759
Speaker 3: deal with the devil, they want riches, somewhat, you know, power.

1602
01:27:51,400 --> 01:27:52,280
Speaker 3: He wants rats.

1603
01:27:52,760 --> 01:27:55,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, in that line, he promised me things, not in words,

1604
01:27:55,680 --> 01:28:00,160
Speaker 2: but by doing them, like oh, this just perfect.

1605
01:28:00,280 --> 01:28:03,000
Speaker 3: But promised in return for what I think it's for.

1606
01:28:03,400 --> 01:28:07,960
Speaker 3: I believe Renfield sabotaged the protections that against Dracula that

1607
01:28:07,960 --> 01:28:09,600
Speaker 3: were in Mina's room, like he got rid of the

1608
01:28:09,600 --> 01:28:12,439
Speaker 3: wolf Spain or something. I don't know. Somehow Dracula got

1609
01:28:12,439 --> 01:28:16,120
Speaker 3: into Mina's room and I think Renfield was involved, and whoops,

1610
01:28:16,160 --> 01:28:18,920
Speaker 3: he has turned to Mina into a vampire now, and

1611
01:28:18,960 --> 01:28:21,400
Speaker 3: so this is going to accelerate us toward the conclusion.

1612
01:28:21,439 --> 01:28:23,960
Speaker 3: The only way to get Mina back is to destroy

1613
01:28:24,040 --> 01:28:26,719
Speaker 3: the vampire. Now, there's a scene where we have were

1614
01:28:26,760 --> 01:28:29,679
Speaker 3: like Harker is left alone with Mina here and she's

1615
01:28:29,760 --> 01:28:32,559
Speaker 3: creepy now right, Like she doesn't like the smell of

1616
01:28:32,560 --> 01:28:36,519
Speaker 3: wolf Spain. She's really interested in Harker's neck. She keeps

1617
01:28:36,520 --> 01:28:39,920
Speaker 3: staring at it. And Chandler is good in this, Like

1618
01:28:39,960 --> 01:28:42,759
Speaker 3: she puts on the creeps and she keeps him close.

1619
01:28:43,479 --> 01:28:44,120
Speaker 2: Absolutely.

1620
01:28:44,400 --> 01:28:46,800
Speaker 3: She's talking about like I love the fog. I love

1621
01:28:46,960 --> 01:28:49,720
Speaker 3: nights with the fog. And it's like you never you

1622
01:28:49,760 --> 01:28:51,920
Speaker 3: said in the past that you hated the night time

1623
01:28:52,000 --> 01:28:53,960
Speaker 3: in the fog, and she's like, well, I like it now.

1624
01:28:57,040 --> 01:28:59,559
Speaker 3: But anyway, we're going on toward the conclusion. We know

1625
01:28:59,600 --> 01:29:02,000
Speaker 3: that we got have a final showdown where the heroes

1626
01:29:02,080 --> 01:29:05,920
Speaker 3: find Dracula's coffins in Carfax Abbey, and drive the steak

1627
01:29:05,960 --> 01:29:08,880
Speaker 3: into him. Before that, one one great moment is we

1628
01:29:08,920 --> 01:29:11,720
Speaker 3: get the sort of the death of Renfield, Like Dracula

1629
01:29:12,040 --> 01:29:16,240
Speaker 3: is taking Mina back to his lair and he confronts

1630
01:29:16,240 --> 01:29:21,240
Speaker 3: w Renfield on this long, creepy staircase and Renfield says, no, please,

1631
01:29:21,280 --> 01:29:23,559
Speaker 3: don't kill me, master, I can't die with all those

1632
01:29:23,600 --> 01:29:27,639
Speaker 3: lives on my conscience. And Dracula just I think, breaks

1633
01:29:27,640 --> 01:29:30,000
Speaker 3: his neck and throws him down the staircase and Renfield

1634
01:29:30,080 --> 01:29:31,120
Speaker 3: tumbles like a doll.

1635
01:29:31,560 --> 01:29:34,000
Speaker 2: Great saint, Great Saint again. Like this said, the set

1636
01:29:34,080 --> 01:29:37,320
Speaker 2: is amazing that there's real tension in minutes there.

1637
01:29:37,760 --> 01:29:41,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's wonderful. And then of course we get

1638
01:29:41,040 --> 01:29:44,559
Speaker 3: the final staking, the final staking of Dracula in his coffin,

1639
01:29:45,439 --> 01:29:49,040
Speaker 3: and Mina is rescued from her demonic fate and reunited

1640
01:29:49,080 --> 01:29:52,160
Speaker 3: with John. So there is a happy ending. But like

1641
01:29:52,439 --> 01:29:56,160
Speaker 3: many adaptations of Dracula, I thought we would mention this,

1642
01:29:56,600 --> 01:29:59,719
Speaker 3: the final staking of Dracula in his coffin has always

1643
01:29:59,720 --> 01:30:02,320
Speaker 3: felt a bit anti climactic. You know, in this case,

1644
01:30:02,360 --> 01:30:05,080
Speaker 3: it's not even done by the young hero who's to

1645
01:30:05,080 --> 01:30:07,479
Speaker 3: be reunited with his love, is done by Van Helsing.

1646
01:30:08,640 --> 01:30:11,519
Speaker 3: And I don't know, it's like it happens off screen.

1647
01:30:11,560 --> 01:30:14,280
Speaker 3: You just hear Dracula yell, and then it's kind of

1648
01:30:14,280 --> 01:30:16,040
Speaker 3: a hammering and a yelling and that's it.

1649
01:30:16,960 --> 01:30:19,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's kind of like what happens to the villain. Well,

1650
01:30:19,360 --> 01:30:21,240
Speaker 2: we hunted him down and killed him in his sleep,

1651
01:30:21,600 --> 01:30:26,559
Speaker 2: like it's you know, it's it doesn't feel as heroic.

1652
01:30:27,080 --> 01:30:30,920
Speaker 2: I still love it, but but you know, it makes

1653
01:30:30,920 --> 01:30:32,920
Speaker 2: you in a way. Maybe it's the thing that makes

1654
01:30:32,920 --> 01:30:36,280
Speaker 2: people love Dracula so much though, because like a lot

1655
01:30:36,320 --> 01:30:40,160
Speaker 2: of these universal horror films, we identify with the monster

1656
01:30:40,280 --> 01:30:43,360
Speaker 2: so much, and subsequent generations identify with the monster, you know,

1657
01:30:43,400 --> 01:30:47,400
Speaker 2: the creature from the Black Lagoon, Frankenstein's Monster and Dracula,

1658
01:30:47,479 --> 01:30:49,800
Speaker 2: like we feel a certain amount of sympathy for him

1659
01:30:49,840 --> 01:30:53,599
Speaker 2: at the end because he is this outsider character who

1660
01:30:54,160 --> 01:30:57,400
Speaker 2: cannot quite make a life for himself in this new place,

1661
01:30:57,720 --> 01:31:02,400
Speaker 2: and then he's hunted down and killed by the local inhabitants. Like, yes,

1662
01:31:02,479 --> 01:31:05,840
Speaker 2: they were eradicating because he's a bloodsucking demon, but still

1663
01:31:06,479 --> 01:31:09,800
Speaker 2: feel you feel for him in a way because he

1664
01:31:09,920 --> 01:31:11,559
Speaker 2: is killed in his sleep.

1665
01:31:12,000 --> 01:31:14,479
Speaker 3: I absolutely see what you're saying. And of course Bella

1666
01:31:14,560 --> 01:31:18,200
Speaker 3: Lagosi makes the character more interesting and fun and likable

1667
01:31:18,800 --> 01:31:21,920
Speaker 3: than he would be otherwise. I still think the universal

1668
01:31:22,000 --> 01:31:25,680
Speaker 3: Dracula in this movie is a less sympathetathetic character than

1669
01:31:25,680 --> 01:31:28,160
Speaker 3: the other monster. As you mentioned, he's less sympathetic than

1670
01:31:28,160 --> 01:31:32,160
Speaker 3: Frankenstein's creature. Certainly, I would also say less sympathetic than

1671
01:31:32,160 --> 01:31:34,240
Speaker 3: the creature from the Black Lagoon who's just hanging out

1672
01:31:34,240 --> 01:31:36,920
Speaker 3: at home. People go to where he is and bother him,

1673
01:31:37,880 --> 01:31:42,720
Speaker 3: and certainly less sympathetic than some Dracula adaptations that would

1674
01:31:42,720 --> 01:31:45,879
Speaker 3: come later. That it make him a more explicitly tragic,

1675
01:31:46,479 --> 01:31:50,280
Speaker 3: wronged and romantic figure. I mean, in this movie, there's

1676
01:31:50,320 --> 01:31:53,880
Speaker 3: no mistaken he's the bad guy. He's going out of

1677
01:31:53,920 --> 01:31:55,280
Speaker 3: his way to hurt other people.

1678
01:31:55,760 --> 01:31:58,040
Speaker 2: And I think that's ultimately the way I like my

1679
01:31:58,320 --> 01:32:01,120
Speaker 2: I mean, I like some romantic Draculas. Gary Oldman's Dracula

1680
01:32:01,360 --> 01:32:05,040
Speaker 2: is terrific, and that in Coppola's version, and you know,

1681
01:32:05,040 --> 01:32:08,600
Speaker 2: that plays up the tragic aspects of the character. But

1682
01:32:09,360 --> 01:32:11,400
Speaker 2: you know, I love it when when you have like

1683
01:32:11,400 --> 01:32:13,839
Speaker 2: a Christopher Lee Dracula or the Bell of GHOSTU Dracula

1684
01:32:13,880 --> 01:32:16,880
Speaker 2: that is that is more just absolutely evil, or even

1685
01:32:16,920 --> 01:32:19,479
Speaker 2: the Dracula in Blacula that we previously talked about in

1686
01:32:19,520 --> 01:32:22,080
Speaker 2: the show where that is a really evil Dracula.

1687
01:32:23,160 --> 01:32:26,080
Speaker 3: Oh oh, you're talking about Dracula himself, not not the

1688
01:32:26,240 --> 01:32:27,120
Speaker 3: not Mama Waade.

1689
01:32:27,439 --> 01:32:30,360
Speaker 2: No, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, the racist Dracula from the film.

1690
01:32:30,360 --> 01:32:34,040
Speaker 3: Evil racist Dracula who's like I love drinking blood and

1691
01:32:34,080 --> 01:32:37,679
Speaker 3: I approve of the slave trade. Yes, that Dracula. But anyway,

1692
01:32:37,720 --> 01:32:40,160
Speaker 3: coming back to this thing about the anti climactic ending

1693
01:32:40,200 --> 01:32:42,400
Speaker 3: of staking the Dracula in his coffin, I feel like

1694
01:32:42,439 --> 01:32:45,840
Speaker 3: this is actually a change from the nineteen twenty two

1695
01:32:45,960 --> 01:32:49,040
Speaker 3: nos Feratu that was like a good a good change

1696
01:32:49,520 --> 01:32:53,120
Speaker 3: to you know, to invert the ending where instead of

1697
01:32:53,680 --> 01:32:56,439
Speaker 3: attacking the vampire in his sleep, you force him to

1698
01:32:56,479 --> 01:32:59,479
Speaker 3: stay out too late. That is more like the vampire

1699
01:32:59,560 --> 01:33:03,240
Speaker 3: is un done or is destroyed by being trapped by

1700
01:33:03,280 --> 01:33:05,120
Speaker 3: his own greed and violence.

1701
01:33:05,640 --> 01:33:07,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's a good point.

1702
01:33:07,439 --> 01:33:09,639
Speaker 3: Anyway, that's the universal Dracula.

1703
01:33:10,320 --> 01:33:13,120
Speaker 2: Love it absolutely. I mean, it's a classic. It's an

1704
01:33:13,320 --> 01:33:15,680
Speaker 2: icon for a reason, and if you haven't seen it,

1705
01:33:15,720 --> 01:33:17,519
Speaker 2: if you haven't seen it in a long time, it's

1706
01:33:17,560 --> 01:33:20,679
Speaker 2: well worth looking up. I mean, maybe save it for Halloween.

1707
01:33:20,720 --> 01:33:22,920
Speaker 2: But you know, why deprive yourself, go ahead and watch

1708
01:33:22,920 --> 01:33:25,679
Speaker 2: it now, all right, We're gonna go ahead and close

1709
01:33:25,720 --> 01:33:29,519
Speaker 2: the book on nineteen thirty one's Dracula. Just a reminder

1710
01:33:29,560 --> 01:33:31,880
Speaker 2: that Stuff to Blow Your Mind is primarily a science

1711
01:33:31,880 --> 01:33:35,560
Speaker 2: and culture podcast, with core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays.

1712
01:33:35,680 --> 01:33:38,040
Speaker 2: Dracula has come up in a number of them. He

1713
01:33:38,080 --> 01:33:40,760
Speaker 2: even came up in our episodes on Dust from last year.

1714
01:33:41,000 --> 01:33:43,679
Speaker 2: But for the most part, we don't talk about Dracula

1715
01:33:43,720 --> 01:33:46,000
Speaker 2: in every Stuff to Bliw Your Mind episode, but he

1716
01:33:46,040 --> 01:33:49,240
Speaker 2: does come up generally, though we set aside most serious

1717
01:33:49,240 --> 01:33:52,639
Speaker 2: concerns on Fridays when we have a Weird House Cinema

1718
01:33:52,640 --> 01:33:54,759
Speaker 2: episode and we just talk about a nice weird movie.

1719
01:33:54,840 --> 01:33:57,040
Speaker 2: If you want to keep up with the various weird movies,

1720
01:33:57,080 --> 01:33:59,400
Speaker 2: so we've discussed on Weird House Cinema. We have an

1721
01:33:59,400 --> 01:34:03,120
Speaker 2: account on a boxed that's Weird House. You can find

1722
01:34:03,160 --> 01:34:04,320
Speaker 2: us there, and we have a list of all the

1723
01:34:04,360 --> 01:34:07,120
Speaker 2: films that we've covered so far, and sometimes there's a

1724
01:34:07,120 --> 01:34:08,679
Speaker 2: peek ahead at what comes next.

1725
01:34:09,120 --> 01:34:13,000
Speaker 3: Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.

1726
01:34:13,439 --> 01:34:15,000
Speaker 3: If you would like to get in touch with us

1727
01:34:15,000 --> 01:34:17,360
Speaker 3: with feedback on this episode or any other to suggest

1728
01:34:17,439 --> 01:34:19,720
Speaker 3: topic for the future, or just to say hello. You

1729
01:34:19,760 --> 01:34:22,280
Speaker 3: can email us at contact at stuff to Blow your

1730
01:34:22,360 --> 01:34:29,880
Speaker 3: Mind dot com.

1731
01:34:30,000 --> 01:34:32,920
Speaker 1: Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For

1732
01:34:33,040 --> 01:34:35,800
Speaker 1: more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1733
01:34:35,960 --> 01:34:39,200
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.