WEBVTT - Lucy Walker Surveys Another California Fire

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<v Speaker 1>This is Alec Baldwin, and you were listening to Here's

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<v Speaker 1>the Thing from iHeart Radio. In twenty twenty one, I

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<v Speaker 1>spoke with documentary filmmaker Lucy Walker about her film Bringing

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<v Speaker 1>Your Own Brigade, which focuses on the two La wildfires

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<v Speaker 1>in twenty eighteen, the Campfire, which nearly destroyed the town

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<v Speaker 1>of Paradise and killed eighty five people, and the Woolsey Fire,

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<v Speaker 1>which erupted on the same day and destroyed large parts

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<v Speaker 1>of Malibu. At the time, those wildfires were the largest

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<v Speaker 1>in California's history. You can find a link to that

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<v Speaker 1>conversation with Lucy Walker in the show notes of this episode.

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<v Speaker 1>In January of this year, Los Angeles suffered more devastation

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<v Speaker 1>from out of control wildfires that destroyed the Pacific Palisades

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<v Speaker 1>areas of Altadena and killed twenty nine people. Incredibly, the

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<v Speaker 1>recent fires eclipsed the size and devastation of the two.

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<v Speaker 1>I was eighteen disaster and have left all of Los

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<v Speaker 1>Angeles in mourning. I asked Lucy Walker to join me

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<v Speaker 1>again to see how she's doing and to ask if

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<v Speaker 1>anything can be done to try to prevent this part

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<v Speaker 1>of the country from burning so predictably on a regular basis.

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<v Speaker 1>For Walker, it's been a traumatic revisiting of recent history.

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<v Speaker 2>It was horrifying watching it happen to my friends in

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<v Speaker 2>my town and knowing so much but feeling so powerless

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<v Speaker 2>to stop it. And that was such a terrifying couple

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<v Speaker 2>of days. And I was supposed to go I was

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<v Speaker 2>here when it happened, and then I had to go

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<v Speaker 2>straight to New York and go straight to an award show.

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<v Speaker 2>I was supposed to be on stage, and I actually

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<v Speaker 2>felt so panicked and upset I actually couldn't go on stage.

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<v Speaker 2>It really was such an upsetting time to be in

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<v Speaker 2>Los Angeles, and for everyone who loves the city and

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<v Speaker 2>who has friends involved.

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<v Speaker 1>In your film, bringing your own brigade, and you see,

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<v Speaker 1>of course that infamous section where they bring in the

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<v Speaker 1>advisor and they give them the very simple boilerplate of

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<v Speaker 1>things they needed to do to likely avoid at least

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<v Speaker 1>that level of severity again, and they refuse. What did

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<v Speaker 1>you understand was the reason why did they refuse? I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>it was something as vital as that. What was that

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<v Speaker 1>element of human nature as far as you were concerned.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I think the simple answer is that you know

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<v Speaker 2>The fabulous thing about this country and what I chose

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<v Speaker 2>to immigrate from the UK, is that this is a

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<v Speaker 2>country of people striking out on their own and doing

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<v Speaker 2>their own thing and not sort of bound by old

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<v Speaker 2>community sort of get togethers, and really excited to kind

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<v Speaker 2>of progress and do their own thing. And the bad

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<v Speaker 2>news about that is when you try to get people

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<v Speaker 2>together to kind of rain in their individuality and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>for example, not have fammable plants, you know, three feet

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<v Speaker 2>from the house, or not have gutters or something like

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<v Speaker 2>that which are kind of low cost or no cost

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<v Speaker 2>anti fire measures, the instinctive reaction is I don't want

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<v Speaker 2>to be told what to do. But I think there's

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<v Speaker 2>a deeper issue, which is that the fire issue is

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<v Speaker 2>really counterintuitive. I went in such a learning journey when

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<v Speaker 2>I made the movie, and it wasn't intuitive. You know.

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<v Speaker 2>It's so when I've watched my dear beloved friends go

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<v Speaker 2>through this, it's so obvious that it's the fault of

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<v Speaker 2>the firefighters, or the fault of the water or the

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<v Speaker 2>mayor or something like that, right, the evacuation system. And

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<v Speaker 2>yet it's really hard to take in this bigger picture

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<v Speaker 2>because it is a layered story. Yes, it's climate change,

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<v Speaker 2>but it's also where we're building, and it's also how

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<v Speaker 2>we're building, and it's just kind of a complicated picture.

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<v Speaker 2>And you know, I've seen the same sort of things

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<v Speaker 2>kick in with my smart friends here in Los Angeles,

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<v Speaker 2>sort of seeing a part of the picture very clearly,

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<v Speaker 2>but not the whole picture. And so I really was

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<v Speaker 2>so grateful through this that I'd had financiers and colleagues

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<v Speaker 2>when I was making my film that actually supported me

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<v Speaker 2>to go on this kind of hard journey of finding

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<v Speaker 2>out the whole story because it's inconvenient and it's complicated.

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<v Speaker 2>But now in a situation like this, this is exactly

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<v Speaker 2>why I made the film with all the rigor and

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<v Speaker 2>work so so hard, and our team worked so hard

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<v Speaker 2>because I wanted, I felt a responsibility to get it right.

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<v Speaker 2>I felt like lives are at stake, homes are at stake,

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<v Speaker 2>and I felt like if I didn't get it right,

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<v Speaker 2>it would you know, I don't want to be grand

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<v Speaker 2>and said in danger lives, but I really felt like, gosh,

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<v Speaker 2>I just want to get the story right so that

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<v Speaker 2>people can understand, because it isn't easy to I knew

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<v Speaker 2>for myself when I started making the film, I had

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<v Speaker 2>this naive I did just put out the fires and

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<v Speaker 2>another simple idea, Oh it must be just climate change,

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<v Speaker 2>And neither of them are quite true and understanding now

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<v Speaker 2>as I do when I looked at the fire in

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<v Speaker 2>Los Angeles and all the dreadful things that have happened,

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<v Speaker 2>if you understand what's going on, I can understand everything

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<v Speaker 2>that's happened in this dreadful last few weeks. I can

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<v Speaker 2>see when someone opens their mouth, I can almost tell

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<v Speaker 2>you what they're going to say, because I know this

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<v Speaker 2>story so well, and I think it's hopefully going to

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<v Speaker 2>be a real resource and help to people that if

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<v Speaker 2>they do watch the film. I think it is hopefully

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<v Speaker 2>clear information that really gives you a three sixty picture.

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<v Speaker 1>When I live there, I got absorbed in southern California living,

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<v Speaker 1>and when you told me this happened in this area

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<v Speaker 1>of this can't be true, so much of it being gone,

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<v Speaker 1>and I'm wondering, do you think these people will be

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<v Speaker 1>different from the people in the campfire and they'll adhere

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<v Speaker 1>to some new code of how that might be restored.

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<v Speaker 2>I've been reflecting deeply on this and have some absolutely

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<v Speaker 2>some of my favorite closest friends who've lost their homes

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<v Speaker 2>and their animals and of their kids' schools and just

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<v Speaker 2>so profoundly impacted. And I'm hearing something a little bit different.

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<v Speaker 2>And I guess my prayer is that this is an

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<v Speaker 2>opportunity for some really well informed and well resourced people

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<v Speaker 2>to have this hard, hard conversation that I do believe

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<v Speaker 2>we're going to have to have sort of one way

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<v Speaker 2>or the other. This conversation is pressing up against us,

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<v Speaker 2>is are we going to do something a little bit differently,

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<v Speaker 2>Because I do think that the fundamental proposition of living

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<v Speaker 2>in the wildland urban interface in Los Angeles and perhaps

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<v Speaker 2>more broadly in California has changed. And part of that

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<v Speaker 2>is going to be the insurance companies, which in the

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<v Speaker 2>short term are going to be prevented from pulling out

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<v Speaker 2>and changing coverage and things like that. But I don't

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<v Speaker 2>think that's going to last very long. I don't think

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<v Speaker 2>you can kind of force insurance companies to, you know, expose.

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<v Speaker 1>Themselves for these changes for risks for them.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's a change of circumstances and it's been kind

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<v Speaker 2>of creeping up, but I think this has really changed

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<v Speaker 2>things with the amount of money, and yeah, so I

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<v Speaker 2>think that the hope is that we will have less

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<v Speaker 2>of these in future, and we might build back smarter

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<v Speaker 2>and have opportunities to live in a way that will

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<v Speaker 2>have less of these just devastations moving forward, because it's

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<v Speaker 2>not just I can't even say it's not just because

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<v Speaker 2>we're just in the middle of this horrific shock where

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<v Speaker 2>it seems so overwhelming and everything that we've lost. But

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<v Speaker 2>we've lost animals, we've lost homes, all my neighborhoods.

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<v Speaker 1>If people only knew that area how it is, I

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<v Speaker 1>mean California living among many things involved. You know, if

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<v Speaker 1>you've got two acres and a paddock in a Goa

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<v Speaker 1>or North Hills, you've got a horse, you know, people,

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<v Speaker 1>animals or a big part of people's lives out there

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<v Speaker 1>because of the weather in a way they can't be

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<v Speaker 1>other places.

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<v Speaker 2>Exactly. It's not just that people have lost so much

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<v Speaker 2>in the short term. In the long term, it's also

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<v Speaker 2>these neighborhoods are not going to go back quickly. The

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<v Speaker 2>trauma can really last a long time. People have health

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<v Speaker 2>impacts actually after, you know, because you imagine the shock

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<v Speaker 2>and the stress of being homeless and finding new places

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<v Speaker 2>and moving around and just having to cope. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>will continue to see people have health problems that are

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<v Speaker 2>not actually they won't be traced to the fire. But

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<v Speaker 2>I remember, you know, to be absolutely brutal about it,

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<v Speaker 2>but let me say that two of the people I

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<v Speaker 2>was following in the aftermath of the Paradise fire died

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<v Speaker 2>of causes that you wouldn't recognize connected with the fire

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<v Speaker 2>in the year following as we kept filming heart attacks

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<v Speaker 2>in particular stress from the stress. Absolutely, you can never

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<v Speaker 2>kind of pin those things, right, but it did seem

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<v Speaker 2>like a lot of people, you know, it makes absolute sense, right.

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<v Speaker 2>So the thing I've been really praying is that the

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<v Speaker 2>people impacted can really try to sort of really take

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<v Speaker 2>care of their health and really prioritize just trying to

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<v Speaker 2>recover themselves because it's kind of a long haul.

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<v Speaker 1>Filmmaker Lucy Walker. Listen to our twenty twenty one conversation

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<v Speaker 1>for more in depth discussion about the LA fires and

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<v Speaker 1>Walker's documentary film, Bring Your Own Brigade. The title is

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<v Speaker 1>a reference to wealthy residents who hire their own private

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<v Speaker 1>firefighters to protect property during wildfires.

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<v Speaker 2>What I want to understand is, well, how are we

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<v Speaker 2>stopping it, and why are people living in these areas

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<v Speaker 2>and building these houses that burn over and over and

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<v Speaker 2>over again. Could we do better? So you would think

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<v Speaker 2>that when people look at developing an area for housing,

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<v Speaker 2>they would think about fire safety, but nobody's actually thinking about,

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<v Speaker 2>well are they going to be able to ensure these

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<v Speaker 2>homes and who's going to pay if these homes burn down.

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<v Speaker 1>To hear more of my conversation with Lucy Walker, go

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<v Speaker 1>to Here's Thething dot org. After the break, Lucy Walker

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<v Speaker 1>details why she believes residents who choose to rebuild in

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<v Speaker 1>fire prone areas are taking on enormous risk to both

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<v Speaker 1>their financial stability and their lives. I'm Alec Baldwin, and

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<v Speaker 1>this is Here's the Thing. I first spoke with filmmaker

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<v Speaker 1>Lucy Walker in twenty twenty one. I was curious if

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<v Speaker 1>she stayed in touch with any of the subjects that

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<v Speaker 1>she was acquainted with while making her film.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I absolutely. The film came out and it really

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<v Speaker 2>followed not just the fires, and it sort of talked

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<v Speaker 2>about fires in general and actually, if anything, it was

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<v Speaker 2>specific about could Los Angeles burn? Because that's where I

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<v Speaker 2>live and that was my sort of naive question that

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<v Speaker 2>I kind of sparked the conversation into the movie with.

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<v Speaker 2>But the Fire looked at those twin events that happened

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<v Speaker 2>in November twenty eighteen, but it didn't come out till

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<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty one, so I was filming a couple of

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<v Speaker 2>years after the events and put that in the movie.

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<v Speaker 2>But actually, you get really close with people when you

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<v Speaker 2>film with them, so I have absolutely kept in touch.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's a really slow journey back, and these neighborhoods

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<v Speaker 2>don't recover all at once. And what we're seeing now

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<v Speaker 2>is people have to live or make that decision, and

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<v Speaker 2>it's toxic for a very long time, and these are

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<v Speaker 2>going to be very slow, hard decisions about building. And

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<v Speaker 2>then it's a very slow process.

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<v Speaker 1>So what's it like there now in your campfire area?

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<v Speaker 2>In the campfire area, it's coming back in that neighborhood.

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<v Speaker 2>The spirit was just rebuild back as fast as possible.

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<v Speaker 1>In the same exact way.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, there's a strange thing that happens where real estate

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<v Speaker 2>goes up. They call it fire gentrification because you get

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of displaced people and so it's kind of

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<v Speaker 2>like things actually kind of escalate. What cuts off this

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<v Speaker 2>is the insurance. What people are up against is that

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<v Speaker 2>the insurance companies are really pulling out of these areas.

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<v Speaker 2>And there is this thing called the California Fair Plan,

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<v Speaker 2>which is, you know, the state gives you this option

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<v Speaker 2>of getting very expensive and very restrictive. You have to

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<v Speaker 2>sort of trim and do certain things to get your

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<v Speaker 2>fire insurance. But it does give people a backup option

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<v Speaker 2>to get insurance rather than not be insured at all.

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<v Speaker 2>But it's increasingly true that I think in that area

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<v Speaker 2>people are choosing to go without insurance. And of course

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<v Speaker 2>going without insurance is a nice affordable strategy until it

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<v Speaker 2>all goes wrong. I think some people there are individually

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<v Speaker 2>choosing to build back in a more fire safe way.

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<v Speaker 2>And what we've seen as these stories have emerged from

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<v Speaker 2>these New Los Angeles fires is there are stories that

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<v Speaker 2>the home that was fire hardened has survived. Now that's

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<v Speaker 2>not fool proof. My understanding is that even if you

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<v Speaker 2>have a far hardened home, it's not sort of impossible

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<v Speaker 2>that it'll burn, but it's way less likely. And so

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<v Speaker 2>I think these stories they did get through to some

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<v Speaker 2>people in Paradise, and some people did build back in

0:12:46.320 --> 0:12:49.760
<v Speaker 2>a more sort of hardened way, and they had a

0:12:49.800 --> 0:12:51.760
<v Speaker 2>fire that came through already I think it was two

0:12:51.800 --> 0:12:54.600
<v Speaker 2>summers ago, and they managed to put it out so

0:12:54.640 --> 0:12:58.480
<v Speaker 2>it wasn't a huge, uncontrollable one, but that area is

0:12:58.600 --> 0:12:59.960
<v Speaker 2>likely to burn again very soon.

0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:05.120
<v Speaker 1>Again. I'm very curious also as to what comes back afterward,

0:13:05.640 --> 0:13:07.800
<v Speaker 1>where the campfire people were like, well, no, we don't

0:13:07.800 --> 0:13:10.080
<v Speaker 1>want to change a thing. And I'm wondering, do we

0:13:10.080 --> 0:13:11.920
<v Speaker 1>wind up in a situation where you almost have to

0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:16.920
<v Speaker 1>have an AI capacity to develop what the next palisades

0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:18.960
<v Speaker 1>will be? Like the road you drove up to go

0:13:18.960 --> 0:13:21.559
<v Speaker 1>to your house, that road doesn't exist anymore. Do they

0:13:21.600 --> 0:13:26.319
<v Speaker 1>replan the whole thing, every square foot of it as

0:13:26.360 --> 0:13:31.800
<v Speaker 1>to access density, vegetation, building materials. This is an opportunity

0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:36.120
<v Speaker 1>to have, like an almost lab experiment. Do you agree absolutely?

0:13:36.440 --> 0:13:40.680
<v Speaker 2>What the movie showed was that the town leadership, the

0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:45.680
<v Speaker 2>town council, and the firefighters in that town in Paradise leadership,

0:13:45.840 --> 0:13:50.520
<v Speaker 2>the firefighters in the town, and all the organizations involved

0:13:50.840 --> 0:13:54.920
<v Speaker 2>really came together and had this really good process of

0:13:54.960 --> 0:13:58.440
<v Speaker 2>imagining how they could rebuild back differently and presenting it

0:13:58.480 --> 0:14:00.840
<v Speaker 2>to the town, and the town actually voted it down.

0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:03.840
<v Speaker 2>The town pressured the town council to vote down these

0:14:03.880 --> 0:14:06.440
<v Speaker 2>initiatives one by one, which was very disheartening to watch.

0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:09.440
<v Speaker 2>In the movie, however, they did have that dream. But

0:14:09.559 --> 0:14:12.800
<v Speaker 2>I think that exactly what you've described will happen in

0:14:12.880 --> 0:14:15.600
<v Speaker 2>these areas in Los Angeles that I think that people

0:14:15.640 --> 0:14:17.480
<v Speaker 2>are going to come together and say, how can we

0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.000
<v Speaker 2>do it a little bit differently? And I don't think

0:14:20.040 --> 0:14:22.920
<v Speaker 2>it'll be as radical as in the movie. There's a

0:14:22.960 --> 0:14:27.640
<v Speaker 2>section where Mike Davis, who's since passed away but wrote

0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:30.760
<v Speaker 2>a lot about fires, and he talks in the movie

0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:34.920
<v Speaker 2>about how when Los Angeles was designed, the most famous

0:14:34.960 --> 0:14:37.520
<v Speaker 2>sort of town planners of Los Angeles were these guys

0:14:37.520 --> 0:14:40.920
<v Speaker 2>called the Olmsted Brothers, and their vision was that these

0:14:41.040 --> 0:14:44.560
<v Speaker 2>areas that were burned repeatedly, such as Malibu, but that

0:14:44.600 --> 0:14:47.680
<v Speaker 2>were so beautiful that we wanted to be there, let's

0:14:47.720 --> 0:14:50.880
<v Speaker 2>be there, but let's only build sort of carefree cabins

0:14:50.920 --> 0:14:53.800
<v Speaker 2>where we can let it things burn, not keep our

0:14:53.800 --> 0:14:58.520
<v Speaker 2>great treasures there and not sort of disposable homes and

0:14:58.640 --> 0:15:00.960
<v Speaker 2>to enjoy for as long as they might be there.

0:15:01.400 --> 0:15:04.720
<v Speaker 2>But if the winds line up and the rains haven't come,

0:15:05.040 --> 0:15:07.200
<v Speaker 2>just get out of the way and let nature take

0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:10.280
<v Speaker 2>care of cleaning up, and then come back and build

0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:13.640
<v Speaker 2>another cabin again once that's past. And of course that's

0:15:13.680 --> 0:15:16.040
<v Speaker 2>not what we've done. These areas are so beautiful. We've

0:15:16.040 --> 0:15:19.880
<v Speaker 2>built these absolute palaces of homes within great artworks and

0:15:19.920 --> 0:15:22.880
<v Speaker 2>so forth there, and then of course we get terribly attached.

0:15:22.960 --> 0:15:25.240
<v Speaker 2>And then we've got also all this fantastic you know,

0:15:25.800 --> 0:15:30.040
<v Speaker 2>shrubberry and all these quite flammable plants and other flammable stuff,

0:15:30.080 --> 0:15:32.760
<v Speaker 2>and so we've kind of built up this huge problem

0:15:32.800 --> 0:15:34.800
<v Speaker 2>for ourselves. But I think now there is sort of

0:15:34.800 --> 0:15:36.800
<v Speaker 2>a blank slate about how we come back. I don't

0:15:37.040 --> 0:15:39.880
<v Speaker 2>expect that we'll get the carefree cabins, but I do

0:15:40.720 --> 0:15:45.960
<v Speaker 2>hold out hope that there will be positive conversation about

0:15:45.960 --> 0:15:48.280
<v Speaker 2>doing things a little bit differently so that we don't

0:15:48.320 --> 0:15:50.640
<v Speaker 2>have our hearts broken to this extent.

0:15:50.960 --> 0:15:54.160
<v Speaker 1>Again, at what point, in terms of public policy, to

0:15:54.320 --> 0:15:56.560
<v Speaker 1>people in every area like this, if you're building in

0:15:56.600 --> 0:15:59.560
<v Speaker 1>flood zones and the East Coast, and you're building in

0:15:59.640 --> 0:16:01.960
<v Speaker 1>fire zones on the West coast, how much do you

0:16:01.960 --> 0:16:04.040
<v Speaker 1>say to people you're on your own. You're going to

0:16:04.080 --> 0:16:06.800
<v Speaker 1>have to take care of all your costs, no insurance,

0:16:07.080 --> 0:16:09.480
<v Speaker 1>don't ask the federal government to come in and you know,

0:16:09.640 --> 0:16:12.560
<v Speaker 1>save your neighborhood the more important. Yes, save it on

0:16:12.600 --> 0:16:15.760
<v Speaker 1>a safety level, but not to pay for it to

0:16:15.840 --> 0:16:16.440
<v Speaker 1>rebuild it.

0:16:16.720 --> 0:16:21.080
<v Speaker 2>That's right. One thing that I heard from people, particularly

0:16:21.080 --> 0:16:24.280
<v Speaker 2>in Paradise, I think because it is this quite rugged,

0:16:24.680 --> 0:16:27.160
<v Speaker 2>anti big government area, was like, Oh, we don't want

0:16:27.160 --> 0:16:29.760
<v Speaker 2>to pay taxes, we don't want government. What does government

0:16:29.800 --> 0:16:32.480
<v Speaker 2>give us? But in the same conversation they say, oh,

0:16:32.520 --> 0:16:34.560
<v Speaker 2>I'm waiting for my FEMA money. I wish my FEMA

0:16:34.600 --> 0:16:38.120
<v Speaker 2>money was more, and not making that connection that FEMA

0:16:38.280 --> 0:16:42.520
<v Speaker 2>was a great gift of the government really and that

0:16:42.720 --> 0:16:46.440
<v Speaker 2>is what government can provide. And yet what is that

0:16:46.520 --> 0:16:49.480
<v Speaker 2>question about wanting to sort of pay into this kind

0:16:49.520 --> 0:16:52.480
<v Speaker 2>of common resource and pay out, you know. And now

0:16:52.480 --> 0:16:55.720
<v Speaker 2>we're dealing with insurance, it's like, well, this is a

0:16:55.840 --> 0:16:59.600
<v Speaker 2>very expensive incident. And moving forward, now that we are

0:16:59.640 --> 0:17:03.680
<v Speaker 2>starting to know more, are other policyholders who live in

0:17:03.720 --> 0:17:06.119
<v Speaker 2>safer areas going to want to subsidize these homes in

0:17:06.200 --> 0:17:09.200
<v Speaker 2>less dangerous areas? And are insurer is going to be

0:17:09.240 --> 0:17:12.840
<v Speaker 2>able to even afford to ensure homes in safer areas

0:17:13.000 --> 0:17:15.399
<v Speaker 2>if they keep being exposed to these incidents in more

0:17:15.480 --> 0:17:18.520
<v Speaker 2>dangerous areas. What I hope, and maybe that sounds naive

0:17:18.520 --> 0:17:20.199
<v Speaker 2>of me, but what I hope is that people can

0:17:20.240 --> 0:17:24.120
<v Speaker 2>be really helped through this really complicated change because it's

0:17:24.200 --> 0:17:27.280
<v Speaker 2>really not intuitive, and it's really new, and we love

0:17:27.359 --> 0:17:31.560
<v Speaker 2>these areas. I mean, what a gorgeous landscape, and it

0:17:31.640 --> 0:17:35.080
<v Speaker 2>is heartbreaking to think that we're not safe in this

0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:38.080
<v Speaker 2>place that we think of as the most beautiful home, imaginable,

0:17:38.400 --> 0:17:44.280
<v Speaker 2>full of nature and inspiration. And to sort of really

0:17:44.280 --> 0:17:48.359
<v Speaker 2>fundamentally change our relationship with how we think about risk there.

0:17:49.040 --> 0:17:51.960
<v Speaker 2>We're not very good at that human beings, and that's

0:17:52.000 --> 0:17:55.199
<v Speaker 2>before you add in commercial pressures like the realtors. I

0:17:55.200 --> 0:17:58.520
<v Speaker 2>remember I started out my project, as I remember telling you,

0:17:58.800 --> 0:18:02.359
<v Speaker 2>during the terrible months slides in Montecito and the terrible

0:18:02.400 --> 0:18:04.639
<v Speaker 2>what was at the time the worst fire in California,

0:18:04.640 --> 0:18:07.199
<v Speaker 2>which was the Thomas Fire around the Santa Barbara and

0:18:07.320 --> 0:18:12.840
<v Speaker 2>Ohai area. I had a shocking experience during that when

0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:17.240
<v Speaker 2>I saw a realtor selling the property to a new

0:18:17.400 --> 0:18:20.439
<v Speaker 2>customer who wasn't aware that the previous residents had been

0:18:20.520 --> 0:18:23.640
<v Speaker 2>killed in this mud slide and this property was really

0:18:23.640 --> 0:18:27.359
<v Speaker 2>where it was situated geographically because of the potential for

0:18:27.440 --> 0:18:31.720
<v Speaker 2>slides in certain you know, Santa Barbara being under very

0:18:31.760 --> 0:18:34.200
<v Speaker 2>steep sort of mountains that go down to the ocean,

0:18:34.520 --> 0:18:37.040
<v Speaker 2>and that after a fire, these hillsides can really collapse

0:18:37.160 --> 0:18:40.800
<v Speaker 2>in quite predictable sort of places. And so this property

0:18:40.880 --> 0:18:42.840
<v Speaker 2>was really very dangerous.

0:18:42.720 --> 0:18:44.600
<v Speaker 1>Boulders sliding down hills.

0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:49.600
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, yes, exactly, it does have these predictable slides. After

0:18:49.680 --> 0:18:52.640
<v Speaker 2>the vegetation that kind of holds the hillside together gets

0:18:52.640 --> 0:18:55.960
<v Speaker 2>burned off when the rains come, the boulders can kind

0:18:55.960 --> 0:18:58.359
<v Speaker 2>of get loose and really land on houses and sweep

0:18:58.400 --> 0:19:01.440
<v Speaker 2>them all the way down to the ocean. It's absolutely horrifying.

0:19:02.160 --> 0:19:05.240
<v Speaker 2>So I think that the way they're kind of you know,

0:19:05.280 --> 0:19:07.480
<v Speaker 2>the way that it all works because people have property

0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:10.040
<v Speaker 2>values and they want to keep things going. And obviously

0:19:10.080 --> 0:19:13.760
<v Speaker 2>everyone understandably is in this. But I think that we're

0:19:13.800 --> 0:19:16.840
<v Speaker 2>going to need some help, you know, so that individuals

0:19:16.880 --> 0:19:20.920
<v Speaker 2>are helped who are involved and impacted to really get

0:19:20.960 --> 0:19:23.879
<v Speaker 2>with this new reality that there are really dangerous places

0:19:23.920 --> 0:19:27.400
<v Speaker 2>to live that unfortunately the risk is perhaps just too

0:19:27.480 --> 0:19:30.080
<v Speaker 2>high now and too expensive to live in the way

0:19:30.080 --> 0:19:32.520
<v Speaker 2>that they might want to live right there. And there's

0:19:32.520 --> 0:19:35.200
<v Speaker 2>also another problem but the other opposite end of the

0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:39.160
<v Speaker 2>economic spectrum, which is it's not just the well resourced

0:19:39.240 --> 0:19:42.160
<v Speaker 2>people who have this choice of living in this most

0:19:42.200 --> 0:19:45.040
<v Speaker 2>spectacular part of Los Angeles, that's the hilly part that's

0:19:45.119 --> 0:19:48.720
<v Speaker 2>very far prone. It's also true that the cheaper areas

0:19:48.720 --> 0:19:52.480
<v Speaker 2>that California is building into, and not just California, you know,

0:19:52.920 --> 0:19:56.480
<v Speaker 2>looking at other states too. It's not just California, many

0:19:56.520 --> 0:20:01.320
<v Speaker 2>states and Canada and Maui and other countries certainly, especially

0:20:01.400 --> 0:20:05.160
<v Speaker 2>in Mediterranean countries, are really being impacted by these increasing fires.

0:20:05.800 --> 0:20:10.040
<v Speaker 2>So what we're seeing is that actually affordable housing further

0:20:10.080 --> 0:20:13.360
<v Speaker 2>out of town is also being built in these areas

0:20:13.359 --> 0:20:17.080
<v Speaker 2>that are hilly and fire prone. This wildland urban interface.

0:20:17.400 --> 0:20:19.719
<v Speaker 2>And we saw for example during COVID, where a lot

0:20:19.760 --> 0:20:22.040
<v Speaker 2>of people were moving further out of the cities into

0:20:22.560 --> 0:20:25.600
<v Speaker 2>places with more space, they were almost all moving into

0:20:25.640 --> 0:20:28.120
<v Speaker 2>these areas that are very fire prone. So you've kind

0:20:28.119 --> 0:20:31.000
<v Speaker 2>of got more rich people living in these spectacular areas

0:20:31.440 --> 0:20:33.560
<v Speaker 2>that are fire prone, and you've also got a lot

0:20:33.560 --> 0:20:36.920
<v Speaker 2>of people who are much less wealthy. For example, Paradise

0:20:36.960 --> 0:20:39.639
<v Speaker 2>communities or some of the communities that are much further

0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:42.640
<v Speaker 2>out of Los Angeles where a lot of the more

0:20:43.000 --> 0:20:45.960
<v Speaker 2>affordable homes are being built, and developers are building huge

0:20:45.960 --> 0:20:47.960
<v Speaker 2>amounts of homes there because there's a lot of people

0:20:47.960 --> 0:20:51.080
<v Speaker 2>that want homes in California. But unfortunately that development is

0:20:51.119 --> 0:20:55.439
<v Speaker 2>into exactly the areas that might be affordable now but

0:20:55.560 --> 0:20:58.080
<v Speaker 2>aren't going to be ensurable and are really prone to

0:20:58.080 --> 0:21:01.200
<v Speaker 2>burning soon. So I really hope that we can get

0:21:01.200 --> 0:21:04.080
<v Speaker 2>our heads around this, because unfortunately the fires are not.

0:21:04.200 --> 0:21:12.040
<v Speaker 1>Going to stop. Filmmaker Lucy Walker. If you're enjoying this conversation,

0:21:12.160 --> 0:21:14.840
<v Speaker 1>tell a friend and be sure to follow Here's the

0:21:14.880 --> 0:21:19.200
<v Speaker 1>Thing on the iHeartRadio app, Spotify, or wherever you get

0:21:19.240 --> 0:21:22.959
<v Speaker 1>your podcasts. When we come back, Lucy Walker discusses the

0:21:22.960 --> 0:21:26.919
<v Speaker 1>most recent devastation to befall Los Angeles and why she

0:21:27.080 --> 0:21:30.600
<v Speaker 1>feels the twenty twenty five fires feel like LA's own

0:21:30.840 --> 0:21:44.879
<v Speaker 1>nine to eleven. I'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening to

0:21:44.960 --> 0:21:48.480
<v Speaker 1>Here's the Thing. After the most recent twenty twenty five

0:21:48.560 --> 0:21:52.720
<v Speaker 1>fires devastated huge parts of Greater Los Angeles, I was

0:21:52.800 --> 0:21:57.560
<v Speaker 1>curious how individual communities had been impacted. I asked Lucy

0:21:57.640 --> 0:22:01.200
<v Speaker 1>Walker if she's noticed they shared sense of grief among

0:22:01.280 --> 0:22:03.240
<v Speaker 1>residents across LA.

0:22:04.440 --> 0:22:08.400
<v Speaker 2>I have never felt this city more united and that

0:22:08.600 --> 0:22:11.800
<v Speaker 2>spirit of nine to eleven. Actually it was ironic because

0:22:12.240 --> 0:22:13.720
<v Speaker 2>sort of after the fires, I had to go to

0:22:13.720 --> 0:22:15.520
<v Speaker 2>New York for this awards show and they gave me

0:22:15.640 --> 0:22:18.439
<v Speaker 2>hotel room number nine to eleven, and I looked at

0:22:18.480 --> 0:22:21.159
<v Speaker 2>them and I thought, that is exactly what I feel like.

0:22:21.640 --> 0:22:25.080
<v Speaker 2>This is Los Angeles is nine to eleven. And what's beautiful,

0:22:25.119 --> 0:22:28.600
<v Speaker 2>I do think, and may it last, is this really

0:22:28.640 --> 0:22:32.879
<v Speaker 2>open hearted feeling of just infinite kindness and compassion for

0:22:32.920 --> 0:22:36.439
<v Speaker 2>those caught up in it. So many people affected, so

0:22:36.560 --> 0:22:42.159
<v Speaker 2>many people know, so many people affected. It's absolutely overwhelming.

0:22:41.560 --> 0:22:44.160
<v Speaker 1>Almost like everybody knows somebody. Are you on the east

0:22:44.200 --> 0:22:45.200
<v Speaker 1>side of the West side.

0:22:45.320 --> 0:22:47.720
<v Speaker 2>I'm in sort of southern Santa Monica on the Venice

0:22:47.760 --> 0:22:52.720
<v Speaker 2>border and an area I never thought could burn Ocean flats. Yes,

0:22:52.760 --> 0:22:55.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm exactly in Ocean Park, So I'm a good sort

0:22:55.960 --> 0:22:59.080
<v Speaker 2>of five miles from where the far perimeter in the

0:22:59.119 --> 0:23:03.840
<v Speaker 2>Palisades was. But my experience that first night when the

0:23:03.880 --> 0:23:06.000
<v Speaker 2>fires erupted and I'd been watching them, and I'd been

0:23:06.080 --> 0:23:08.280
<v Speaker 2>like five hours ahead of the news because I was

0:23:08.320 --> 0:23:11.600
<v Speaker 2>looking at the winds and I knew what we're up

0:23:11.640 --> 0:23:15.439
<v Speaker 2>against and nobody could get planes in the air to

0:23:15.560 --> 0:23:20.240
<v Speaker 2>see it. But just from following X and radio traffic

0:23:20.400 --> 0:23:22.199
<v Speaker 2>and looking at the winds, and I just knew what

0:23:22.240 --> 0:23:25.879
<v Speaker 2>I was looking at, and my firefighter friends just this

0:23:26.000 --> 0:23:29.080
<v Speaker 2>horrifying feeling of knowing what we were in for and

0:23:29.119 --> 0:23:32.040
<v Speaker 2>watching an unfold. But there was this moment that night

0:23:32.080 --> 0:23:34.119
<v Speaker 2>when I looked out of my window and it was

0:23:34.280 --> 0:23:37.240
<v Speaker 2>orange and I smelled smoke, and the wind was knocking

0:23:37.240 --> 0:23:39.480
<v Speaker 2>you flat if you walked outside your door. And I

0:23:39.600 --> 0:23:41.960
<v Speaker 2>found myself for the first time in that position of thinking,

0:23:42.520 --> 0:23:45.919
<v Speaker 2>oh grief, I'm going to have to figure out what

0:23:46.200 --> 0:23:48.960
<v Speaker 2>I need to take. And I am in the opposite.

0:23:49.000 --> 0:23:50.760
<v Speaker 2>If there was an area in Los Angeles that would

0:23:50.760 --> 0:23:53.320
<v Speaker 2>be the lowest fire risk, that's where I live. And

0:23:53.359 --> 0:23:55.840
<v Speaker 2>I'm a good you know, four or five miles from

0:23:55.840 --> 0:23:59.600
<v Speaker 2>the hills here, and yet even here because these sort

0:23:59.600 --> 0:24:03.880
<v Speaker 2>of ember driven windstorm type events, you know, once those

0:24:03.920 --> 0:24:06.080
<v Speaker 2>embers get going and those kinds of winds, you know,

0:24:06.119 --> 0:24:07.920
<v Speaker 2>there's kind of no stopping it. And I was sort

0:24:07.920 --> 0:24:11.159
<v Speaker 2>of paranoid and traumatized to sort of be afraid of thinking.

0:24:11.240 --> 0:24:13.400
<v Speaker 2>I didn't really think it would get this far, because

0:24:13.400 --> 0:24:15.640
<v Speaker 2>if it got this far, you know, it'd been sort

0:24:15.680 --> 0:24:17.679
<v Speaker 2>of the whole city would have been at risk, but

0:24:17.800 --> 0:24:19.800
<v Speaker 2>to actually have to go through for the first time,

0:24:19.800 --> 0:24:24.240
<v Speaker 2>for myself that situation, and I think most people in

0:24:24.280 --> 0:24:28.040
<v Speaker 2>Los Angeles had that experience, was like, oh God, could

0:24:28.040 --> 0:24:30.760
<v Speaker 2>it get here? And how many people do I know?

0:24:30.800 --> 0:24:34.359
<v Speaker 2>And so many people have friends living with them now

0:24:34.720 --> 0:24:38.159
<v Speaker 2>who are helping people. So many people have stepped into

0:24:38.359 --> 0:24:41.440
<v Speaker 2>that role. And that's obviously what's beautiful about these disasters,

0:24:41.760 --> 0:24:44.679
<v Speaker 2>and that my prayer is that there are gifts in

0:24:44.720 --> 0:24:48.359
<v Speaker 2>this for people. And I did film people not just

0:24:48.480 --> 0:24:52.439
<v Speaker 2>during the fires and the immediate horrific aftermath, but on

0:24:52.480 --> 0:24:54.760
<v Speaker 2>the long term for the next couple of years following,

0:24:55.280 --> 0:24:57.960
<v Speaker 2>and have kept following up with them even since filming.

0:24:58.400 --> 0:25:02.320
<v Speaker 2>And the beautiful thing of course humans being resilient. You know,

0:25:02.359 --> 0:25:05.640
<v Speaker 2>our movie ends with the wedding of two people who

0:25:05.680 --> 0:25:07.679
<v Speaker 2>would not have come together had it not been for

0:25:07.720 --> 0:25:09.960
<v Speaker 2>their fire. And so I hope that there will be

0:25:10.000 --> 0:25:12.040
<v Speaker 2>gifts in this, even for the people that at this

0:25:12.160 --> 0:25:15.280
<v Speaker 2>point just feel so overwhelmed with the grief of what

0:25:15.280 --> 0:25:16.280
<v Speaker 2>they've lost.

0:25:16.840 --> 0:25:19.960
<v Speaker 1>Are people out there are their beliefs that the power

0:25:19.960 --> 0:25:22.040
<v Speaker 1>authority was indeed involved in this in terms of the

0:25:22.240 --> 0:25:25.199
<v Speaker 1>arcing and the where the origin of the fire was.

0:25:25.200 --> 0:25:26.840
<v Speaker 1>Do they think that that might be a suspect? Is

0:25:26.880 --> 0:25:27.960
<v Speaker 1>that still being discussed.

0:25:28.960 --> 0:25:31.919
<v Speaker 2>I think that it does seem like that's being discussed.

0:25:31.960 --> 0:25:35.760
<v Speaker 2>And I will say from my observations is that the

0:25:35.840 --> 0:25:40.720
<v Speaker 2>learnings about, you know, what causes the fires and what

0:25:40.880 --> 0:25:43.679
<v Speaker 2>went wrong, sometimes they're really slow to come out, and

0:25:43.680 --> 0:25:46.240
<v Speaker 2>that can be frustrating for people who you know, in

0:25:46.320 --> 0:25:50.679
<v Speaker 2>their anger and grief, very natural, but you know, the

0:25:50.680 --> 0:25:54.000
<v Speaker 2>impulse is to point fingers sooner. And what I've observed

0:25:54.040 --> 0:25:59.879
<v Speaker 2>is that the firefighters and especially are very good at

0:26:00.200 --> 0:26:04.560
<v Speaker 2>being incredibly accountable and responsible, and even when it's tough

0:26:04.760 --> 0:26:09.280
<v Speaker 2>to sort of realize mistakes were made and to discuss failings,

0:26:09.440 --> 0:26:11.959
<v Speaker 2>they do it unflinchingly, and they do it because their

0:26:12.000 --> 0:26:13.000
<v Speaker 2>own lives are at stake.

0:26:13.680 --> 0:26:15.560
<v Speaker 1>I'm not even referring to the fire. I'm talking about

0:26:15.600 --> 0:26:16.359
<v Speaker 1>the electric company.

0:26:16.480 --> 0:26:20.040
<v Speaker 2>The electric companies are slower. I would say, to get

0:26:20.080 --> 0:26:22.719
<v Speaker 2>into it, but I hope that it does seem like

0:26:23.200 --> 0:26:25.960
<v Speaker 2>the story, even with the electric companies, is that they

0:26:26.000 --> 0:26:27.919
<v Speaker 2>will be held to the fire. I guess can I

0:26:28.000 --> 0:26:31.399
<v Speaker 2>use that pun I do think that you know, it

0:26:31.440 --> 0:26:34.680
<v Speaker 2>does seem like people are going through the evidence pretty thoroughly.

0:26:35.119 --> 0:26:36.720
<v Speaker 2>The one thing that I'll say that's kind of a

0:26:36.720 --> 0:26:41.160
<v Speaker 2>bigger point, though, is that things will burn even if

0:26:41.200 --> 0:26:43.919
<v Speaker 2>we had no electric companies, no matter what you do,

0:26:44.119 --> 0:26:46.639
<v Speaker 2>no matter what you do. When the European the first

0:26:46.640 --> 0:26:50.160
<v Speaker 2>European boat sailed up to the coast of Los Angeles,

0:26:50.160 --> 0:26:52.479
<v Speaker 2>and it's kind of how I opened my movie. It

0:26:52.560 --> 0:26:54.879
<v Speaker 2>was on fire. They called it the Bay of Smoke

0:26:55.080 --> 0:26:57.040
<v Speaker 2>because it was a fire. Now, there weren't any electric

0:26:57.080 --> 0:27:00.840
<v Speaker 2>companies here when the Europeans first sales out. Obviously that

0:27:00.840 --> 0:27:02.760
<v Speaker 2>would have been a lightning strike probably right.

0:27:02.920 --> 0:27:03.879
<v Speaker 1>It's meant to burn.

0:27:04.280 --> 0:27:07.160
<v Speaker 2>It's meant to burn. It is a fire landscape, whether

0:27:07.200 --> 0:27:11.159
<v Speaker 2>it's a firework or a cigarette butt, or just the

0:27:11.200 --> 0:27:16.520
<v Speaker 2>way that the sun magnifies through somebody's discarded glasses. You know,

0:27:16.680 --> 0:27:19.159
<v Speaker 2>there's a gender reveal party that winds up setting a

0:27:19.200 --> 0:27:21.080
<v Speaker 2>big at fire and killing somebody that we show in

0:27:21.119 --> 0:27:23.280
<v Speaker 2>the movie, And so there's always going to be something.

0:27:23.320 --> 0:27:25.880
<v Speaker 2>And the other thing that I observed, which is kind

0:27:25.880 --> 0:27:27.639
<v Speaker 2>of hard to get your brain around, but true, is

0:27:27.680 --> 0:27:30.760
<v Speaker 2>that it's a disaster and things are going to go wrong,

0:27:30.840 --> 0:27:33.000
<v Speaker 2>and that might be a water reservoir, or it might

0:27:33.040 --> 0:27:36.840
<v Speaker 2>be an evacuation system. It might be a bad call

0:27:37.440 --> 0:27:40.200
<v Speaker 2>that in retrospect turned out to be not the right one,

0:27:40.240 --> 0:27:42.439
<v Speaker 2>but was made under juress by a firefighter who had

0:27:42.480 --> 0:27:43.960
<v Speaker 2>to just go one way or the other in the

0:27:44.000 --> 0:27:47.080
<v Speaker 2>moment and has to make decisions that in our jobs,

0:27:47.520 --> 0:27:49.720
<v Speaker 2>you know, I'm not faced with those kind of life

0:27:49.760 --> 0:27:52.080
<v Speaker 2>and death decisions in the course of my work. Right,

0:27:52.560 --> 0:27:56.840
<v Speaker 2>So it's a disaster, and things will sometimes go awry

0:27:57.119 --> 0:28:01.159
<v Speaker 2>even when they're pretty well set up. And ironically, they

0:28:01.200 --> 0:28:04.240
<v Speaker 2>had a really robust evacuation plan that they'd worked on

0:28:04.320 --> 0:28:06.840
<v Speaker 2>and rehearsed that you kind of if the fire hadn't

0:28:06.840 --> 0:28:09.080
<v Speaker 2>come through and killed eighty six people, you would have

0:28:09.119 --> 0:28:11.280
<v Speaker 2>textbooks and they'd point at paradise and say they were

0:28:11.320 --> 0:28:15.399
<v Speaker 2>well prepared. But things go wrong. That's actually the nature

0:28:15.520 --> 0:28:18.920
<v Speaker 2>of accidents and disasters. And so I sort of had

0:28:18.920 --> 0:28:21.360
<v Speaker 2>this bigger picture where, yes, there's going to be failings,

0:28:21.600 --> 0:28:23.679
<v Speaker 2>Yes we definitely need to learn from them, but we

0:28:23.800 --> 0:28:28.800
<v Speaker 2>also perhaps need to face into the very challenging reality.

0:28:29.640 --> 0:28:30.480
<v Speaker 1>Do you have animals.

0:28:30.920 --> 0:28:32.880
<v Speaker 2>I don't because I travel the time as a documentary

0:28:32.920 --> 0:28:35.560
<v Speaker 2>because but I love animals, and my heart's been absolutely

0:28:35.560 --> 0:28:38.239
<v Speaker 2>broken for my friends that have lost their animals, but

0:28:38.560 --> 0:28:41.920
<v Speaker 2>I feel lucky to be surrounded by these people with

0:28:42.040 --> 0:28:44.160
<v Speaker 2>great spirit. I was just at physical therapy and I

0:28:44.200 --> 0:28:45.920
<v Speaker 2>saw a friend of mine who lost everything in the

0:28:45.960 --> 0:28:51.640
<v Speaker 2>Palisades and has three kids and has this great stoic attitude,

0:28:51.960 --> 0:28:53.880
<v Speaker 2>you know. But he said to me, I don't think

0:28:53.880 --> 0:28:56.640
<v Speaker 2>we're going to rebuild in the Palisades. I kind of

0:28:56.800 --> 0:29:00.120
<v Speaker 2>like Venice now. I don't think we can do it

0:29:00.200 --> 0:29:03.280
<v Speaker 2>the same way anymore. And I do think that this

0:29:03.400 --> 0:29:06.479
<v Speaker 2>could be the moment which when my film came out

0:29:06.520 --> 0:29:08.840
<v Speaker 2>in twenty twenty one, I don't think we were there yet,

0:29:08.920 --> 0:29:13.680
<v Speaker 2>but I think this episode has been so hallacious. I'm

0:29:13.720 --> 0:29:16.000
<v Speaker 2>really glad for you for having the vision to have

0:29:16.040 --> 0:29:19.400
<v Speaker 2>this conversation four years ago and then to revisit it now.

0:29:19.440 --> 0:29:22.120
<v Speaker 2>And I think more people may be actually looking for

0:29:22.120 --> 0:29:25.480
<v Speaker 2>this kind of information and conversation, and it may be

0:29:25.520 --> 0:29:27.920
<v Speaker 2>time to have a conversation that we really don't want

0:29:27.960 --> 0:29:30.360
<v Speaker 2>to have. And I get it, but I think that

0:29:30.360 --> 0:29:32.080
<v Speaker 2>we will be better off the sooner that we can

0:29:32.240 --> 0:29:33.400
<v Speaker 2>get our heads around it.

0:29:33.800 --> 0:29:36.200
<v Speaker 1>My thoughts are with you and stay safe.

0:29:36.400 --> 0:29:38.560
<v Speaker 2>I'm so grateful for this outpouring of love for Los

0:29:38.600 --> 0:29:41.640
<v Speaker 2>Angeles and for you for highlighting the hopefully good information

0:29:41.720 --> 0:29:45.200
<v Speaker 2>that the film contains. And it's really that's the sweetest

0:29:45.200 --> 0:29:47.080
<v Speaker 2>thing about this is to feel your support and I

0:29:47.160 --> 0:29:48.479
<v Speaker 2>really really appreciate doing this.

0:29:48.560 --> 0:29:56.400
<v Speaker 1>Thank you. My thanks to Lucy Walker. Her documentary about

0:29:56.400 --> 0:30:00.480
<v Speaker 1>the California wildfires, Bring Your Own Brigade, is streaming on

0:30:00.560 --> 0:30:05.280
<v Speaker 1>Paramount Plus. This episode was recorded at CDM Studios in

0:30:05.320 --> 0:30:08.880
<v Speaker 1>New York City. Were produced by Kathleen Russo, Zach MacNeice,

0:30:08.960 --> 0:30:12.920
<v Speaker 1>and Victoria De Martin. Our engineer is Frank Imperial and

0:30:13.040 --> 0:30:16.600
<v Speaker 1>our social media manager is Danielle Gingrich. I'm Alec Baldwin.

0:30:16.800 --> 0:30:22.320
<v Speaker 1>Here's the thing is brought to you by iHeart Radio.