1 00:00:01,040 --> 00:00:06,360 Speaker 1: Conversations on life, style, beauty, and relationships. It's the Velvet's 2 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:08,200 Speaker 1: Edge podcast with Kelly Henderson. 3 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 2: So that's where Bonnie Buckner is here. Her books is 4 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:18,000 Speaker 2: out today. Actually it's called The Secret. Well, the day 5 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:21,120 Speaker 2: we're recording, I just say that for the listeners, it 6 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:23,479 Speaker 2: is already out when you guys are hearing this, but 7 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:25,840 Speaker 2: it's called The Secret Mind. Unlock the power of your 8 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:29,520 Speaker 2: dreams to transform your life. And I'm so excited to 9 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:32,479 Speaker 2: talk to you, specifically because I've been having very active dreams. 10 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:34,360 Speaker 2: So this could not have come at a better time. 11 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:35,520 Speaker 3: Nice. 12 00:00:35,640 --> 00:00:37,960 Speaker 2: Great, So welcome, Thank. 13 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:39,919 Speaker 3: You for being thank you, thanks for having me here. 14 00:00:40,040 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, so we were just talking before the podcast and 15 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:45,680 Speaker 2: in the description of your book on I think it 16 00:00:45,720 --> 00:00:49,040 Speaker 2: was on Amazon dot com. Actually, it just talks about 17 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:52,840 Speaker 2: how there were living in this time that I find 18 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 2: this to be such an interesting conversation. We're living in 19 00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 2: this time where creativity is dropping rapidly, and you know, 20 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:00,760 Speaker 2: I think a lot of my listeners have probably heard 21 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 2: about the effects of AI that are coming out now 22 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:08,959 Speaker 2: on our cognitive abilities. We're constantly scrolling, which is something 23 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:13,000 Speaker 2: you've talked about to and you talk about dreams really 24 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:15,880 Speaker 2: being this force that we can tap into to get 25 00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:18,920 Speaker 2: back to our creativity. Can you talk about that just 26 00:01:18,959 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 2: as a start? I found that to be such a 27 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 2: powerful statement and such a powerful idea, and that's kind 28 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:26,360 Speaker 2: of what this book is about. 29 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:29,800 Speaker 3: Yes, And thank you for asking that question, because I 30 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:32,800 Speaker 3: do love to talk about that, because for me, when 31 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 3: we can tap into our inner creativity, then we can 32 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,560 Speaker 3: move our whole our life, first of all, and our 33 00:01:40,600 --> 00:01:45,119 Speaker 3: communities in our world to new places, new being, new 34 00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:47,240 Speaker 3: things that we can imagine, new ways of being that 35 00:01:47,280 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 3: we can imagine. And so let's go back before AI. 36 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 3: Since nineteen ninety, creativity scores in America have been dropping, 37 00:01:58,160 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 3: and they've been dropping at such a rate that there's 38 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:03,520 Speaker 3: papers written on it and things like this, and there's 39 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 3: a lot of different research around the why. You know, 40 00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:11,720 Speaker 3: back then it was a little bit technology, but a 41 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 3: lot more about just multiple choice questions and about schools 42 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:19,239 Speaker 3: not having enough time for creativity in a whole host 43 00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:24,280 Speaker 3: of other reasons. But now it's compounded by AI and 44 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:27,119 Speaker 3: all of these other things that you brought up. When 45 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 3: we sleep, in our night dreams, the part of our 46 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 3: brain that lights up is the part that is also 47 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:39,120 Speaker 3: responsible for creativity and imagination. So not only does the 48 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 3: content of dreams sort of spark our creativity, we're literally 49 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:48,600 Speaker 3: using that part of our brain that is the creative 50 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:52,440 Speaker 3: part of our brain, if you will. Yeah, So so 51 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 3: many people tell me, yeah, but I don't have time 52 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:56,160 Speaker 3: to write my dreams in the morning. I don't pay 53 00:02:56,200 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 3: attention to my dreams. The thing that starts to happen 54 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 3: if you just get a journal and you start to 55 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 3: write down your dreams and we'll dig into your dreams 56 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 3: here and just the crazy dreams you're talking about. But 57 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:10,640 Speaker 3: if you just start to write those down and just 58 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:15,400 Speaker 3: lay there for like five minutes without grabbing the phone, 59 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 3: without jumping into all those things, and just let those 60 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 3: sensations images resonate, it's amazing the amount of ideas and 61 00:03:26,880 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 3: really answers to things that have kind of been in 62 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 3: the back of your head will come forward. 63 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 2: Okay, that actually you've already answered some of my questions 64 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:37,680 Speaker 2: about my own dreams. But right, so it's the writing 65 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:39,520 Speaker 2: it down because one of the things that happens to 66 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:43,480 Speaker 2: me often is I'll be waking up kind of you know, 67 00:03:43,520 --> 00:03:46,040 Speaker 2: you're still in that haze, and you're going what that 68 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:49,280 Speaker 2: was the weirdest dream. And I swear to you, if 69 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:52,760 Speaker 2: I do one thing like go make a coffee or something, 70 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 2: I can get back to my bed, even if I'm 71 00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 2: just like going back into the same position and not 72 00:03:57,640 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 2: remember at all what it was about, Like, what did 73 00:03:59,560 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 2: I dream? 74 00:04:00,160 --> 00:04:00,240 Speaker 3: Like? 75 00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 2: It goes away? Why does that does? Well? 76 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:06,240 Speaker 3: We move to a different part of our cognitive processing. Okay, 77 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 3: so we have two powerhouse cognitive processing systems in our 78 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 3: brain and making this very simple, but there's the executive network, 79 00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 3: and that's what we're doing right now because we're thinking 80 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 3: about what's the next question, what's the response? List, making, 81 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:26,400 Speaker 3: adding up numbers, any of those things, goal oriented tasks. 82 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 3: But the dreaming part of ourself is called the default network, 83 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:35,359 Speaker 3: and it's the creative part, the imaginative part. It's the 84 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:41,039 Speaker 3: part that's responsible for understanding how our actions might have 85 00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:46,480 Speaker 3: affected another person. So I call that sometimes social cognition. 86 00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:51,360 Speaker 3: So really very simply put imagining stepping in the shoes 87 00:04:51,400 --> 00:04:55,479 Speaker 3: of somebody else. And these two are kind of like 88 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 3: on off switches if one is on, the others off 89 00:04:59,279 --> 00:05:02,920 Speaker 3: and vice versa. So when you're laying there in that 90 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:07,880 Speaker 3: very you called it hazy, it's really just super productive, 91 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 3: but in a different way time for us. Then we're 92 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 3: in that part of ourself and it's still active and 93 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:20,039 Speaker 3: we haven't switched over to the goal making. You said, 94 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 3: I wake up, go make a cup of coffee. Well 95 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 3: that's the goal. So you're out of it already. 96 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:28,280 Speaker 2: Yeah. So I got myself out of it by going 97 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 2: to make the coffee. I'm in the different part of 98 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:31,840 Speaker 2: my brain and then now I feel like, Okay, I 99 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 2: got to get a going with my day exactly more 100 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:37,400 Speaker 2: than the hazy remembering what happened in my dream. 101 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:40,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, but think about this. Have you ever been in 102 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:45,640 Speaker 3: the shower or filing your nails and you're not thinking 103 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 3: of anything, You're relaxing, and suddenly you're like, oh, yeah, 104 00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:50,919 Speaker 3: that's what I need to write or that's what I 105 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 3: need to do, and an idea comes up. That's because 106 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:58,440 Speaker 3: the executive network has gone quiet and the default network 107 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:01,320 Speaker 3: is on. So it's really dreaming while awake. 108 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 2: Dreaming while awake. I'm processing that because I always thought 109 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:09,520 Speaker 2: of that as your intuition. Same, it is the same thing. 110 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:14,400 Speaker 3: It's the same thing. There are distinctions. Dreaming while awake 111 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 3: is you know, if we want to be very academic 112 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 3: about it. It's the default network. Depending on the research 113 00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:24,920 Speaker 3: article that you read, it might be called mind wandering, 114 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 3: it might be called day dreaming, you know, actual scientific term. 115 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:32,840 Speaker 3: And it's when we're in that part of ourself, of 116 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:39,240 Speaker 3: our cognitive processing. Intuition For me is maybe probably that part. 117 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:42,920 Speaker 3: I haven't like studied that what happens in the brain 118 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:47,719 Speaker 3: and intuition, but I know that from a body sense, right, 119 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:51,720 Speaker 3: it's a hyper perceptive state for me. It's the same 120 00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 3: state as dreaming is being aware of what we're sensing 121 00:06:55,839 --> 00:06:58,000 Speaker 3: in the very most basic way. 122 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 2: I want to ask the questions about subconscious but I 123 00:07:01,720 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 2: have one other question before that. Was there something that 124 00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:07,720 Speaker 2: happened in your life that sent you on this track 125 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:12,600 Speaker 2: of studying dreams, Like what was the catalyst for even 126 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:15,200 Speaker 2: wanting to write this book to help people really tap 127 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 2: more into the dream work. 128 00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, And that's like two different questions. So the first 129 00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 3: thing is when I was three years old, I had 130 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:28,760 Speaker 3: had a series of nightmares and I just I was 131 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:31,120 Speaker 3: really upset about it, and like I didn't want to 132 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 3: sleep anymore. I was trying to figure out how can 133 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 3: I not sleep? And one morning I was thinking about 134 00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 3: this on our front steps and it just kind of 135 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:42,960 Speaker 3: hit me, Oh wait, this is what I'm here to do. 136 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 3: I'm here to figure out how to master my nightmares 137 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:49,040 Speaker 3: and teach that to other people. And it's not like 138 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:51,800 Speaker 3: I had a straight line from there, but I had 139 00:07:51,800 --> 00:07:53,880 Speaker 3: it always in the back of my head. And then 140 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 3: I've worked in different things. I've worked in Hollywood, I 141 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 3: worked in media political research company before going back to 142 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:07,680 Speaker 3: get my PhD to work in this work. And both 143 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 3: of those, whether it's you know, Hollywood or it's politics, 144 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:16,120 Speaker 3: it's all about how do images move us? And that's 145 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:19,760 Speaker 3: what I went to study very specifically, is what is 146 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:25,400 Speaker 3: the cognitive neuroscience behind images? Why can they change behavior? 147 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 3: How do they move us so much? Because dreams are 148 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:33,079 Speaker 3: composed of images. And then it was around this time 149 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:37,160 Speaker 3: that I found my teacher of dreaming, who taught me, 150 00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:42,920 Speaker 3: doctor Katherine Schamberg, this very ancient lineage of dreaming and 151 00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 3: I just sort of put, you know, insights from modern 152 00:08:46,800 --> 00:08:50,400 Speaker 3: science to that. So that was the sort of my 153 00:08:50,559 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 3: personal dreaming journey. Okay, this book. One of the things 154 00:08:55,080 --> 00:08:58,080 Speaker 3: I do is I teach this work in a coaching 155 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:03,040 Speaker 3: program at George Washington Universe, and the person that I 156 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:05,400 Speaker 3: work with very closely. There said to me at one 157 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,080 Speaker 3: point right before COVID, you know, you should write a 158 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 3: white paper or something that we can use in the program. 159 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 3: So I started to do that. But then during COVID, 160 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:17,839 Speaker 3: I started thinking a lot more deeply about the fact 161 00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 3: that we need to come back to our imagination. There 162 00:09:21,400 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 3: are a lot of people who are feeling very shut 163 00:09:23,760 --> 00:09:29,440 Speaker 3: down about the future of us, as in really us 164 00:09:29,800 --> 00:09:33,679 Speaker 3: humans and not just their lives, but for all of us. 165 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 3: And I know that we can solve all of these 166 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:41,640 Speaker 3: problems if we can see it. And there's been a 167 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:48,319 Speaker 3: long list of science of songs, media, all kinds of 168 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 3: things that have come from dreams, everything from insulin as 169 00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:56,600 Speaker 3: a cure for diabetes to several of the elements on 170 00:09:56,800 --> 00:10:00,640 Speaker 3: the periodic table of elements. All these things have come 171 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:04,840 Speaker 3: from dreams. It is theory of relativity. It is really 172 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:09,680 Speaker 3: the space for us to get out of the pattern 173 00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 3: thinking part of our brains, which is also part of 174 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:16,160 Speaker 3: the goal what we're using to think with right now, 175 00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:20,040 Speaker 3: the executive network, and into thinking beyond that. 176 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:25,120 Speaker 2: So this kind of leads perfectly into my subconscious questions. 177 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:35,839 Speaker 2: So when you're talking about these two different parts of 178 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:38,960 Speaker 2: our brain. We have this executive part in the what 179 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:40,600 Speaker 2: do you call it, the pattern. 180 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:44,280 Speaker 3: The default network. The executive part is patterned, the network 181 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 3: is imaginative. 182 00:10:45,559 --> 00:10:51,480 Speaker 2: Imaginative. Okay, So when I think of dreams, I associate 183 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:54,840 Speaker 2: them with my subconscious brain, like maybe I'm tapping into 184 00:10:54,880 --> 00:10:57,679 Speaker 2: something that I've repressed that isn't in the part of 185 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:00,960 Speaker 2: my brain that I'm working with day to day to day, 186 00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 2: you know, doing the activities like the going to make 187 00:11:03,320 --> 00:11:05,840 Speaker 2: the coffee and all of that stuff. Is that accurate 188 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 2: or is this a totally different Is that? Are they 189 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:11,199 Speaker 2: related at all? Because I also know and I want 190 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 2: to get to some of these other things that I 191 00:11:13,280 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 2: was thinking about dreams, But like, are we working through things? 192 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:18,760 Speaker 2: Like I know you're saying we can tap into creativity, 193 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:22,199 Speaker 2: but are we working through traumas and things like that 194 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:26,440 Speaker 2: while we're dreaming. I'm just curious about the neuroscience. But 195 00:11:26,679 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: behind all of that. 196 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, so dreams are showing us all of our responses 197 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:36,040 Speaker 3: to what we're living. Okay, So there's a whole lot 198 00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:39,559 Speaker 3: going on around us right now. There's a whole lot 199 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:43,839 Speaker 3: going on all day long that is on our inside. 200 00:11:44,280 --> 00:11:47,560 Speaker 3: But we're so busy you know, we're making coffee, we're 201 00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:50,880 Speaker 3: making lists, we're doing podcasts, we're doing I don't know 202 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 3: stuff on the computer. We're busy. But inside of all 203 00:11:55,160 --> 00:11:58,480 Speaker 3: of these different things that we're doing, the really quick scrolling, 204 00:11:58,600 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 3: the email from somebody else, the phone call, we have 205 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:05,360 Speaker 3: responses to all of these things, but we never pause 206 00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:10,960 Speaker 3: to listen to ourselves. We're busy, so it's not repressed, 207 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:15,880 Speaker 3: it's not paid attention to, right, we just don't stop 208 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:20,240 Speaker 3: and listen. So when we dream, all of that part 209 00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:23,240 Speaker 3: the executive at work, the list making, all of that 210 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:31,479 Speaker 3: is literally taken offline. So all of these experienced responses, 211 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:38,280 Speaker 3: which is image not verbal, image is front center. But 212 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 3: we can check into that during the day. If we 213 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:45,959 Speaker 3: only stopped, paused, relaxed, fouled our nails, you. 214 00:12:45,920 --> 00:12:51,680 Speaker 2: Know it took a shower exactly, But we don't do that. No, Okay, 215 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:55,160 Speaker 2: So that's where we have termed it, like we suppressed 216 00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 2: whatever we were just not pausing to see. Okay, that 217 00:12:57,559 --> 00:12:59,640 Speaker 2: makes so much sense. So one of the dreams I've 218 00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:02,720 Speaker 2: been having recently, or that I had last week, was 219 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 2: very interesting for me because it's about a relationship that 220 00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:08,800 Speaker 2: you know, I feel like I've put it. It's way 221 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:13,920 Speaker 2: behind me, like there's there's nothing that I feel emotionally 222 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:18,760 Speaker 2: about it. It's resolved, I guess in my day to day. 223 00:13:19,200 --> 00:13:21,480 Speaker 2: And I was telling my current boyfriend about this dream 224 00:13:21,520 --> 00:13:23,880 Speaker 2: because I was like, it really threw me that this 225 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:26,880 Speaker 2: came up, Like I don't think about this anymore, but 226 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 2: I basically retraced part of that relationship in my dream, 227 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:35,559 Speaker 2: and in the dream we broke up, but then there 228 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:37,960 Speaker 2: were amends made and we got back together to try 229 00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 2: to work on it again. But then the same thing happened, 230 00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 2: and so there was a lot of fear that came 231 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:44,880 Speaker 2: up again and all of that stuff. And I was 232 00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:47,160 Speaker 2: telling him about it the next morning because there's been 233 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 2: a period of time too where I felt like I 234 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:51,320 Speaker 2: haven't been dreaming, and then all of a sudden last week, 235 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:54,000 Speaker 2: I was having dream after dream after dream, and this 236 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 2: one happened, and so it threw me. And I don't 237 00:13:57,040 --> 00:13:59,200 Speaker 2: really know where to put it. But what would you 238 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:02,360 Speaker 2: say about that, Like, how do I tap into working 239 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:05,480 Speaker 2: with that and figuring out what my brain or body 240 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:07,640 Speaker 2: or whatever is trying to tell me through this dream. 241 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:11,240 Speaker 3: That's a great example, Okay, kind of put you and 242 00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 3: your current boyfriend at ease. Yes, I'm not sure what 243 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:16,480 Speaker 3: he was thinking when you told him that. 244 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:19,520 Speaker 2: But no, he knows, I think. So he was kind 245 00:14:19,520 --> 00:14:21,600 Speaker 2: of thrown to He was like, what, that's so not 246 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 2: like you, and I'm like, I know. 247 00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:28,480 Speaker 3: So here's the thing. So, first of all, our dreams 248 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:35,520 Speaker 3: are showing us in image feelings that we have feelings, emotions, understandings, 249 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 3: and they get all packaged into an image or a 250 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:44,800 Speaker 3: sequence of images. Okay, and so each image is you know, 251 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:47,040 Speaker 3: a picture is worth more than a thousand words. That 252 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:51,360 Speaker 3: is super true because that ex boyfriend, you could probably 253 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 3: write a thesis right now about every single thing that was. 254 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 2: Yes, and I've changed as a person too, So there's 255 00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:01,760 Speaker 2: like that's why I think gets so interesting. And you're right, 256 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:04,400 Speaker 2: my poor boyfriend, but he knows about how I feel 257 00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 2: about this, so it wasn't There's absolutely no desire for 258 00:15:09,320 --> 00:15:13,640 Speaker 2: me in my life to even contemplate getting back together 259 00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:15,000 Speaker 2: with that person. This is a way. 260 00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 3: I get that totally. 261 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:19,000 Speaker 2: That's why it was so confusing about it. 262 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:22,800 Speaker 3: Yeah. Then here's the thing. So whenever we have an 263 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:27,680 Speaker 3: event like today, it generally reminds us of an event 264 00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:34,280 Speaker 3: we've had before. Okay, and so whatever that ex boyfriend is, 265 00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:37,880 Speaker 3: you can ask yourself. And this is a great thing 266 00:15:37,880 --> 00:15:40,600 Speaker 3: for people to do when they dream about somebody. And 267 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 3: you don't have to answer this on your podcast, but 268 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:46,120 Speaker 3: when people have a dream about somebody they've known before 269 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:49,360 Speaker 3: or they know right now, is to say so and 270 00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:52,760 Speaker 3: so is the kind of person who and whatever qualities 271 00:15:52,880 --> 00:15:56,200 Speaker 3: are the first things that come off of your tongue 272 00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:59,320 Speaker 3: are some of the qualities that are just sort of 273 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:02,160 Speaker 3: want to be looked at at this moment in time 274 00:16:02,400 --> 00:16:06,920 Speaker 3: about the self and where the self is in relationship 275 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 3: to certain things. So this is something that is about 276 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:15,000 Speaker 3: making amends without going into completely opening out that dream. 277 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:18,200 Speaker 3: There's a new boyfriend, there's an old boyfriend that didn't work, 278 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:22,200 Speaker 3: but there's some amends being made. So current boyfriend, there's 279 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:26,160 Speaker 3: still this idea of just in general boyfriend, you see 280 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 3: what I'm saying, relationship in general. So it's about making sure. 281 00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:35,040 Speaker 3: And this dream is super interesting because there's four levels 282 00:16:35,080 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 3: to every dream. And the first level is just the story, 283 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:41,760 Speaker 3: that's what you told us. The second level is pattern 284 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 3: So what are the patterns that's showing in me? And 285 00:16:44,640 --> 00:16:48,040 Speaker 3: if I have a fear of a pattern repeating, or 286 00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 3: if I'm headed down the road where maybe my reactions 287 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:55,680 Speaker 3: to something could lead towards that pattern if I don't 288 00:16:56,480 --> 00:17:01,120 Speaker 3: curb it and transform it in some ways, the dream 289 00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:03,880 Speaker 3: think about dreams is like road signs, you know, next 290 00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:07,879 Speaker 3: exit ten miles. They're kind of helping us to see, like, 291 00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 3: here's where you are, here's where this could lead, but 292 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:12,080 Speaker 3: here's how you change it. 293 00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:16,440 Speaker 2: Okay, that makes so much sense. I mean the other thing, 294 00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:18,280 Speaker 2: and I've failed to mention this, but we had been 295 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:21,840 Speaker 2: watching a movie where something similar had happened, and so 296 00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 2: obviously it had gone into my brain. I did not 297 00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:30,639 Speaker 2: associate the two in my actual living life, like I mean, 298 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 2: until I was asleep, my brain wasn't putting the two 299 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:36,800 Speaker 2: together at all. But so I definitely know there was 300 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,960 Speaker 2: a reason that part of my brain attached to that. 301 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:42,359 Speaker 2: But what you're talking about with the pattern is so 302 00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:46,920 Speaker 2: interesting because even in the dream the pattern did repeat. Yeah, 303 00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:49,719 Speaker 2: so it's mostly but what was I think it was? 304 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 2: Like I even expected that in the dream, if that 305 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:56,640 Speaker 2: makes sense. But really what was throwing me was the 306 00:17:56,920 --> 00:18:00,760 Speaker 2: buying into what someone was saying and not ended up 307 00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:03,200 Speaker 2: being true. Like and said, then that's making me kind 308 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 2: of reflect on, oh, where is that coming up in 309 00:18:05,640 --> 00:18:09,920 Speaker 2: my life now? Like who am I not believing in something? 310 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:13,160 Speaker 2: Am I not believing myself in something? There's so many 311 00:18:13,240 --> 00:18:15,919 Speaker 2: questions that started that brought up. But really it's so 312 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,880 Speaker 2: interesting because it has absolutely nothing to do with my ex. 313 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:23,680 Speaker 3: It doesn't end ultimately because ultimately it's not about the 314 00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:26,560 Speaker 3: ex is that person, but it is about the experience 315 00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:31,040 Speaker 3: of being with that persone and what that brought up 316 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:35,520 Speaker 3: as an aspect of the dreamer. So all of us 317 00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 3: have many different aspects to ourself, many different facets. Every 318 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:44,080 Speaker 3: aspect of the dream is an aspect of the dreamer. 319 00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:48,720 Speaker 3: So you know, old boyfriend is an aspect of me, 320 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:51,720 Speaker 3: and that can be in really big ways how I 321 00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:55,919 Speaker 3: was reacting at that time, my fears at that time, 322 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:59,440 Speaker 3: my hopes at that time. So we asked that question. 323 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:01,959 Speaker 3: So is the kind of person who to get an 324 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 3: idea of like what are those things that I need 325 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:07,639 Speaker 3: to look at right now? And then what you just 326 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,880 Speaker 3: did of saying there's so many questions. This is part 327 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:14,360 Speaker 3: of the power of dreams. They're weird on purpose. 328 00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:15,600 Speaker 2: Okay, you know. 329 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:20,640 Speaker 3: All day we ignore our inner self, right then when 330 00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:23,080 Speaker 3: we go to sleep, we have a very weird dream, 331 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:24,879 Speaker 3: or we have a scary dream, or we have a 332 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 3: dream we're we wake up and we're super mad about 333 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 3: something or something that's our inside giving us a little 334 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:34,679 Speaker 3: kick in the pants saying, you know, pay attention to me. 335 00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:40,919 Speaker 3: So when we just do that and we allow ourselves 336 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:46,639 Speaker 3: to ask those questions, our own inside has all of 337 00:19:46,680 --> 00:19:49,840 Speaker 3: our answers. We just have to listen and ask some 338 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:52,919 Speaker 3: questions and also just be courageous enough to see the 339 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:54,120 Speaker 3: answers when they come up. 340 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:56,400 Speaker 2: Well, you just that just made me want to cry 341 00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:59,200 Speaker 2: because you just summed it up. As we were talking 342 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:03,640 Speaker 2: about the not STU to listen to what was coming up. 343 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:05,640 Speaker 2: You know, when we're making the coffee, we're doing the list, 344 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:08,359 Speaker 2: we're doing all the things. And then my listeners know 345 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:10,200 Speaker 2: this because I talked about it. But I was very, 346 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 2: very busy before I went to see my boyfriend last week, 347 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:16,200 Speaker 2: and last week was like my reset time, and did 348 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 2: I not just say? And then I dreamed all week 349 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:21,320 Speaker 2: and I haven't been in a pattern of dreaming, so 350 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:23,680 Speaker 2: that's crazy. So it was like I was finally my 351 00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:25,120 Speaker 2: body was like hello. 352 00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:27,560 Speaker 3: Pay attention exactly. 353 00:20:27,800 --> 00:20:32,359 Speaker 2: My brain, Yeah, I guess was telling me your body first. 354 00:20:32,119 --> 00:20:35,880 Speaker 3: Brain is always second. Everything comes from the body first. 355 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:38,200 Speaker 2: Oh, because that's and that's like what I was asking 356 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:41,160 Speaker 2: about intuition too, same thing about it. 357 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 3: We're sitting here and we're processing what's happening with our brains, 358 00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:50,000 Speaker 3: but actually it's coming through our senses first. It's coming 359 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:54,920 Speaker 3: through visual hearing. Right now, I can you know, there's 360 00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:58,280 Speaker 3: fresh flowers behind me that I can smell. There's all 361 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:02,720 Speaker 3: kinds of sensory information coming in, and it's much bigger 362 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:05,399 Speaker 3: than we are. We're kind of in focus lock right now, 363 00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:10,520 Speaker 3: but our perception is much more expanded than that, and 364 00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:13,879 Speaker 3: all of that is information. So it comes into our 365 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:17,440 Speaker 3: body first, and then it makes its way to our brain. 366 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,880 Speaker 3: It happens faster than we can put our finger on it. Yeah, 367 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:23,160 Speaker 3: although we can learn to kind of slow that down. 368 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:27,120 Speaker 3: And so intuition is when we are able to really. 369 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,679 Speaker 2: Put our finger on it and listen to the body. 370 00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:32,280 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, that's so interesting. 371 00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:44,800 Speaker 2: So what about when people are having reoccurring dreams. We're 372 00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:48,199 Speaker 2: the stories of people having this same dream over and 373 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:51,080 Speaker 2: over where all their teeth fell out or something like that, Like, 374 00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:53,840 Speaker 2: why is that happening over and over and over with 375 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:56,840 Speaker 2: the same story and something really weird like that. 376 00:21:57,720 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, so let's start with the really weird and go 377 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,679 Speaker 3: back to how dreams wake us up to ourself. Okay, 378 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:08,120 Speaker 3: so there's seven kinds of dreams, and the first kind 379 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:11,200 Speaker 3: of dream is a nightmare and teeth falling out. I'm 380 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:12,080 Speaker 3: gonna say that's. 381 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:15,080 Speaker 2: A nightmare, yeah, not pleasant something. 382 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:21,919 Speaker 3: Yeah, And counterintuitively, that's actually a good thing. It's our 383 00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:25,680 Speaker 3: friend because it's waking us up to a right now 384 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:29,840 Speaker 3: emotional block, something that we need to deal with. Okay, 385 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 3: this is the thing about our bodies. Our bodies are 386 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 3: so amazing. They're constantly letting us know what's going on. 387 00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:40,680 Speaker 3: It's it literally is like the dashboard on a car, 388 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:44,399 Speaker 3: like okay, you're running out of gas, you know, or 389 00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 3: on our phone, like we're getting all this kind of 390 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:51,719 Speaker 3: feedback information. But if we ignore that and we're like 391 00:22:52,520 --> 00:22:54,960 Speaker 3: I can go, you know, twenty five more miles, or 392 00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:57,960 Speaker 3: I won't run out of battery, I've got one bar left, 393 00:22:58,040 --> 00:23:01,920 Speaker 3: or whatever, we ignore the signals, then we have these 394 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:04,399 Speaker 3: kinds of dreams that are like, you have a major 395 00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:07,320 Speaker 3: emotional block, wake up to it. That's our inside talking 396 00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:07,639 Speaker 3: to us. 397 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:08,280 Speaker 2: Okay. 398 00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:12,360 Speaker 3: If I ignore that, then I start repeating that nightmare 399 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:19,320 Speaker 3: because these energetic blocks are literally blocking our ability to 400 00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:24,440 Speaker 3: be more creative because there's an alarm bell going off somewhere. 401 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:26,800 Speaker 3: You know, it'd be like if you were trying to 402 00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 3: have a dinner party and the toilet is backed up, 403 00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 3: You're not going to relax at the dinner party because 404 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,159 Speaker 3: you're me thinking the whole time, I really hope somebody 405 00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 3: doesn't go to the bathroom, right right, Yes, So these 406 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:40,240 Speaker 3: emotional blocks were like I really hope this doesn't come 407 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:42,399 Speaker 3: out when I'm in the middle of the meeting, or 408 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:45,480 Speaker 3: I really hope whatever. And if we just take the 409 00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:49,959 Speaker 3: time to look at it and deal with whatever that 410 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:53,960 Speaker 3: internal block is, then our energy is free to up 411 00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:56,919 Speaker 3: and then we're more creative. We can solve our problems 412 00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 3: and move on. 413 00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:01,000 Speaker 2: Okay, well that makes sense. So you said there's seven 414 00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:04,639 Speaker 2: types of dreams. Yeah, what are the other six? 415 00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:09,120 Speaker 3: So there's nightmare, there's a repetitive nightmare. If we don't 416 00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:11,479 Speaker 3: deal with those, then we get a busy dream and 417 00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:15,040 Speaker 3: that's really just an emotional pilon, like a multi car 418 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:19,439 Speaker 3: pile up. Okay, because that's the thing about it, Like 419 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 3: this if I just have a basic fear dream, I 420 00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:26,880 Speaker 3: don't deal with it, it repeats, I don't deal with it. 421 00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:31,280 Speaker 3: Then I start piling on. I start thinking things like, oh, 422 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:36,600 Speaker 3: I'm so, I'm such a coward, or I resent you know, 423 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:39,879 Speaker 3: so and so for turning me down for this, because 424 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:41,879 Speaker 3: now I'm a coward because of that. Like we just 425 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:45,680 Speaker 3: start adding story, story, story on top of it, and 426 00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:49,520 Speaker 3: it gets almushed together. So those three kind of go 427 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 3: together in a way if we're not dealing with it. 428 00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,240 Speaker 3: But then there's also a clear dream, and clear dreams 429 00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:58,600 Speaker 3: are showing us both here's your block, here's where you're 430 00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:02,159 Speaker 3: on your presentence, here's your block, here's your potential. But 431 00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:05,720 Speaker 3: it's a potential that we're not really exercising at the moment, 432 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:08,879 Speaker 3: and so it leaves us with choice, like here's your blog, 433 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,640 Speaker 3: here's your potential, and here's the way over that. When 434 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:17,159 Speaker 3: we do that, then we resolve that, we resolve that 435 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:21,200 Speaker 3: energy and we can go somewhere else. So those four 436 00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:26,200 Speaker 3: dreams are the unresolved dreams, and then we have resolved dreams, 437 00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:30,200 Speaker 3: which are you know, the messages, great dreams, dreams of light, 438 00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:34,639 Speaker 3: those those experiences of wonder and awe which is also 439 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,240 Speaker 3: part of the human experience and also part of something 440 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:42,040 Speaker 3: that we don't spend a lot of time seeking out or. 441 00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:46,000 Speaker 2: Paying attention to. It's also interesting to me because you know, 442 00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:49,760 Speaker 2: we do so many podcasts about just getting in touch 443 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:53,439 Speaker 2: with yourself, self care, all of the things that we 444 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:57,000 Speaker 2: need for healing, and it's so fascinating to me because 445 00:25:57,080 --> 00:26:00,560 Speaker 2: when I really break down what they're all saying, or 446 00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:03,280 Speaker 2: what any sort of healing work is, it's really about 447 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:06,720 Speaker 2: getting back in touch with yourself. And it's so wild 448 00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:09,119 Speaker 2: because we live in this culture that teaches us the 449 00:26:09,280 --> 00:26:13,320 Speaker 2: exact opposite, when really it's like, no, all the answers 450 00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:17,359 Speaker 2: are inside of each of us, and it's just about 451 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:21,800 Speaker 2: us slowing down, believing in that touching base, even communicating 452 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:23,760 Speaker 2: with ourselves. I talk about that a lot, like sometimes 453 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:26,679 Speaker 2: I'll just start talking to myself because I forget to, 454 00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:30,560 Speaker 2: like I forget to pay attention to me. Obviously, as 455 00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:33,160 Speaker 2: my dreams are telling me. The fact that I could 456 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:36,720 Speaker 2: dream every night last week is because I actually stopped. 457 00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 2: I slowed down. I was like, I need to reset, 458 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:43,359 Speaker 2: I need to rest. I said those words, and then poof, 459 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:47,560 Speaker 2: I'm having wild dreams every night. It's just it's wild 460 00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:48,880 Speaker 2: to me, it's fascinating. 461 00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:52,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know, back to AI, because you kind 462 00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,560 Speaker 3: of started to say, yeah, that there's so many great 463 00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:58,359 Speaker 3: things I'm sure that come from AI or I hope 464 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:01,200 Speaker 3: that they go find a lot of you know, protein 465 00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:04,360 Speaker 3: things that can help cure diseases and all of that. 466 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:08,680 Speaker 3: But if I'm using AI because I'm being lazy about something, 467 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:13,639 Speaker 3: I'm training myself that I'm not able to do this 468 00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:16,520 Speaker 3: as well, or I'm not as creative and I'm not 469 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:21,240 Speaker 3: exercising it. It really is a muscle, just like sitting 470 00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:24,720 Speaker 3: there and that you know, you called it that hazy time. 471 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:27,399 Speaker 3: It's a muscle to do that. And why it's a 472 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 3: muscle is because with all of this technology, it gets 473 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:35,639 Speaker 3: harder and harder for people to just focus on one 474 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:39,480 Speaker 3: thing or to not focus and stay in that hazy thing. 475 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,879 Speaker 3: I mean, just holding one thing in your mind for 476 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 3: a minute is a very difficult task for most people today. 477 00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:50,879 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I used to be one of these people 478 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 2: who said, oh I just can't meditate. But that's why. 479 00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:57,960 Speaker 2: It's because you have to sit and your whole job 480 00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:01,480 Speaker 2: is not I mean, it is to bring yourself back 481 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:04,360 Speaker 2: to this one focus in this one place, even when 482 00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:06,199 Speaker 2: you start to drift off. And I was always like, oh, 483 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:07,960 Speaker 2: I just keep drifting off, I keep going to a 484 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 2: million different places. I'm making a to do list, and 485 00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:14,399 Speaker 2: that's okay. In meditation, it's just about bringing yourself back 486 00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:17,400 Speaker 2: to coming out of you know, thinking of the million things, 487 00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:19,119 Speaker 2: to going back to the one thing. And that is 488 00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:22,960 Speaker 2: tricky with how we're wired because we don't build that muscle. 489 00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:26,720 Speaker 3: It's so true. And also, you know, let's go back 490 00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 3: to how cool we are when we do listen. So 491 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,400 Speaker 3: last summer, there was a whole new genre of music 492 00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:37,920 Speaker 3: called hit Them and it was at a very different 493 00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:40,720 Speaker 3: number of beats per minted and had a bunch of 494 00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:45,120 Speaker 3: different particularities to it, and it came from this guy's dream. 495 00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:50,320 Speaker 3: And that's like one example. There's so many examples, so 496 00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:54,040 Speaker 3: many songs that we love, the Twilight series, all these 497 00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 3: things that came from a dream. And sometimes the dream 498 00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:01,640 Speaker 3: sort of lays it out pretty good detail for us, 499 00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:04,920 Speaker 3: but more often than not, it gives us a lot 500 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:10,200 Speaker 3: of very interesting things, images, sensations, feelings, maybe a sentence, 501 00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:14,680 Speaker 3: and then it's our innate creativity if we just sort 502 00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 3: of get curious about it that puts all those pieces 503 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:21,280 Speaker 3: together and comes up with a new genre of music 504 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:24,240 Speaker 3: or a new invention or whatever it may be. 505 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:27,680 Speaker 2: Right, we're just not allowing ourselves to do that. So 506 00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:29,880 Speaker 2: if people do want to start working with their dreams, 507 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:31,440 Speaker 2: what would you say? I know you talk about this 508 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:33,640 Speaker 2: a lot in the book, so obviously go buy the book. 509 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:37,560 Speaker 2: But what are good places to start? If you could 510 00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:40,520 Speaker 2: just give us, like one tip, Yes, get a. 511 00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:43,360 Speaker 3: Dream journal, write them down before you get out of bed. 512 00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:47,520 Speaker 3: Don't like, yeah, make coffee. Start writing it down, and 513 00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,200 Speaker 3: also write down whatever it is you wake up with, 514 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:52,640 Speaker 3: because a lot of people say to me, oh, I 515 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:55,360 Speaker 3: didn't dream, And then when I just start asking questions 516 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:57,880 Speaker 3: of like what was in your mind when you woke up, 517 00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:00,120 Speaker 3: they say, oh, yeah, I woke up with the song? 518 00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:03,520 Speaker 3: And Dad, it's all a dream. Whatever you wake up with. 519 00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:05,960 Speaker 3: Is it a color, is it a snippet of a song? 520 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 3: Is it a thought? Just write it down. It's a dream. 521 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:11,680 Speaker 2: What about like some mornings I wake up just in 522 00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:13,440 Speaker 2: a great mood, and some mornings I wake up in 523 00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:16,240 Speaker 2: a terrible mood. I have no definition of why is 524 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:17,320 Speaker 2: that part of your dream? 525 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:20,600 Speaker 3: It could be, So maybe if you just lay there 526 00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:24,200 Speaker 3: just a teeny bit longer and see, like, what's the 527 00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,000 Speaker 3: image associated with that? If you just kind of ask 528 00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 3: yourself that question, you may see something. 529 00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:35,080 Speaker 2: Okay, So is there a particular study or is there 530 00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:40,600 Speaker 2: research that you've done about dreams helping heal people emotionally? 531 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:43,360 Speaker 2: I know you also mentioned something physically, didn't you a 532 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:43,880 Speaker 2: second ago. 533 00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:50,160 Speaker 3: There's so many different studies that kind of triangulate at that, okay, 534 00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 3: And I kind of put those together in the book 535 00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:56,440 Speaker 3: in Secret Mind. So one of the things that I 536 00:30:56,480 --> 00:31:00,160 Speaker 3: can speak about, and again I want to emphasize that 537 00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:04,080 Speaker 3: at the very foundation of what I teach is a 538 00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:10,480 Speaker 3: centuries old understanding of dreams. And that's, you know, centuries 539 00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:15,840 Speaker 3: and centuries of observation of seeing how intervening with a dream, 540 00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:19,280 Speaker 3: looking at a dream, working with a dream, and then 541 00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:21,400 Speaker 3: here's what that human did after that. I mean, that 542 00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:25,320 Speaker 3: is science. So I want to speak to that too, 543 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:31,120 Speaker 3: because it's actually, in many ways further ahead than contemporary neuroscience. 544 00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:36,080 Speaker 3: That's interesting, it's super interesting. So to put it very simply, 545 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:46,040 Speaker 3: everything that is abstract to us, emotions, feeling, love, you know, democracy, 546 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:51,120 Speaker 3: all of these concepts that we have, they're super abstract. 547 00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 3: The feelings we have super abstract, we give it a name, 548 00:31:55,560 --> 00:32:00,480 Speaker 3: but we also have images for how we understand that, 549 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 3: and so having an image for that and seeing it 550 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:10,840 Speaker 3: in our dreams helps us to see Okay, So if 551 00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 3: this is an emotion, I can transform it. If it's 552 00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:19,479 Speaker 3: a belief system and it's restrictive, I can enlarge it. 553 00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:22,800 Speaker 3: It's difficult to do that if we're just feeling stuff, 554 00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:26,320 Speaker 3: especially these days, because we feel a lot of stuff, 555 00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 3: a lot of different stuff, all day and long. So 556 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:34,680 Speaker 3: dreams give us these images in scenarios, just like with 557 00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,240 Speaker 3: the ex boyfriend dream, so we can finally like put 558 00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 3: our hands around something and really understand it for ourselves, 559 00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 3: and then we can change, right. 560 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:47,280 Speaker 2: I mean, you changed the whole narrative I had about 561 00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:50,040 Speaker 2: what that dream was about, you know, as I started 562 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,960 Speaker 2: going back into like is there some unresolved anger that 563 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,320 Speaker 2: I have about this or you know, things like that, 564 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:57,480 Speaker 2: and that didn't feel true to me when I really 565 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,320 Speaker 2: started asking myself the questions. But when you kind of 566 00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:04,320 Speaker 2: reframed it as the pattern, it took the face of 567 00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 2: him out of it, and I'm like, oh, right, that 568 00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 2: is that is, you know going on in my life 569 00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:11,959 Speaker 2: in other areas that I could think about. That's just 570 00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 2: such an interesting reframe. But it works to what you 571 00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:17,120 Speaker 2: were just saying. I guess that's where my brain was 572 00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:17,640 Speaker 2: going with that. 573 00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:18,959 Speaker 3: Yeah, totally. 574 00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:21,840 Speaker 2: If anyone is listening and they are really wanting to 575 00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,480 Speaker 2: work with their dreams, can you tell us a little 576 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,320 Speaker 2: bit more about what they would find in the book. 577 00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:29,720 Speaker 3: Yeah. So I start in the book with how to 578 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:33,320 Speaker 3: remember your dreams, because this book is really for everybody, 579 00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:36,479 Speaker 3: and I need to say that every person dreams. We 580 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:39,440 Speaker 3: dream every night, whether you remember it or you don't, 581 00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:43,240 Speaker 3: and remembering it is actually really easy. So the whole 582 00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:45,640 Speaker 3: first chapter is about how to remember, how to set 583 00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 3: up a practice, and then I lead people through a 584 00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:53,560 Speaker 3: sort of step by step of how to understand the images? 585 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:56,000 Speaker 3: How do we make the images that appear in our 586 00:33:56,080 --> 00:34:01,520 Speaker 3: dreams from our own subjective experiencing, and then how to 587 00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:03,720 Speaker 3: you know, go more deeply into it. What is this 588 00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:05,840 Speaker 3: dream telling me? How do I know that? How do 589 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:08,040 Speaker 3: I work with the dream? And I have pieces of 590 00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:12,320 Speaker 3: dreams from clients that I've worked with my own dreams, 591 00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:16,319 Speaker 3: And then we kind of shift gears and look at 592 00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:18,719 Speaker 3: this thing called the life plan, which is a way 593 00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 3: of understanding our body energies that we call emotions and 594 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:28,719 Speaker 3: feelings is an energy first, and understanding what that is 595 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:32,920 Speaker 3: and how that corresponds to dreams. And then I switch 596 00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:37,040 Speaker 3: gears again and we have a whole chapter on premonitory 597 00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:40,800 Speaker 3: dreams and intuition, because it's really important. We know way 598 00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,040 Speaker 3: more than we think we know, and it's really important 599 00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:49,160 Speaker 3: to tap into that. And from there looking at you know, 600 00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:51,040 Speaker 3: how can you use your dreams to make a big 601 00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:55,080 Speaker 3: change in your life? And then finally the impact that 602 00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:59,000 Speaker 3: using our dreams can have not just on us as individuals, 603 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:03,160 Speaker 3: but really on whole communities and even the world. 604 00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:05,080 Speaker 2: Well, if you guys want to go get this book. 605 00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:08,040 Speaker 2: I'm actually so pumped to really dive into doing my 606 00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:10,040 Speaker 2: journal and stuff in the morning and working with this. 607 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:13,120 Speaker 2: I think it's so interesting about the forgetting because I 608 00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:15,399 Speaker 2: do that and I'll think, oh, I just didn't dream 609 00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:17,719 Speaker 2: last night, But then you'll get a ping later of 610 00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:19,880 Speaker 2: something random and you're like, wait, did I dream that? 611 00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:22,040 Speaker 2: Where is this coming from? So I want to work 612 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 2: with that as well. But the book is out, it's 613 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:26,920 Speaker 2: this podcast is going out June twenty fifth, and said 614 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:29,600 Speaker 2: the book came out yesterday for you guys, so I 615 00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,920 Speaker 2: will put a link for that book in the description 616 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,200 Speaker 2: of this podcast. But where else can people keep up 617 00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:36,640 Speaker 2: with your work if they want to keep up with you? 618 00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:40,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, you can find me at Bonnie Buckner dot com. 619 00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 3: I teach classes as well and do one on one 620 00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:47,960 Speaker 3: sessions through The institute is Institute for Dreaming and Imagery 621 00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:51,520 Speaker 3: dot com. You can follow us on Instagram. My insta 622 00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:55,960 Speaker 3: is Bonnie Buckner dot spill it out dotcom or dream 623 00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:58,720 Speaker 3: with Idi Perfect. 624 00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:00,440 Speaker 2: I will put that in the disc option of this 625 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:02,879 Speaker 2: podcast as well. Bonnie, thank you so much for being here. 626 00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:05,120 Speaker 2: I am fascinated by this topic so I can't wait 627 00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:06,480 Speaker 2: to dive in in my own life. 628 00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:08,920 Speaker 3: Awesome. Thank you so much. 629 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:10,120 Speaker 2: Thank you guys for listening. 630 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:13,920 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Velvet's Edge podcast with Kelly Henderson, 631 00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:16,600 Speaker 1: where we believe everyone has a little velvet in a 632 00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:20,800 Speaker 1: little edge. Subscribe for more conversations on life, style, beauty, 633 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:27,080 Speaker 1: and relationships. Search Velvet's Edge wherever you get your podcasts.