Speaker 1: Hi, guys, Welcome to another episode of Legally Brunette. I
Speaker 1: will be your host today Emily Simpson, with my sidekick
Speaker 1: over here, Shane. Just Shane, all right. First of all,
Speaker 1: so last night there was the TMZ presentation of this
Speaker 1: interview from prison for the Menendez Brothers, so I stayed
Speaker 1: up later than normal to watch it. But before we
Speaker 1: get into that, I wanted to do just a couple
Speaker 1: updates on some other cases that we've talked about previously.
Speaker 1: First of all, last episode, if you guys haven't listened
Speaker 1: to it yet, we went into the Idaho college murders,
Speaker 1: which is really an interesting case. Also, the alleged suspect,
Speaker 1: Brian Coburger, goes on trials soon, so that's why we
Speaker 1: wanted to get into this case. But after I released
Speaker 1: some of the social media clips, I had a lot
Speaker 1: of people asking about the door dash driver, So I
Speaker 1: just wanted to do a quick little update on the
Speaker 1: timeline and then ask you guys a question, because this
Speaker 1: whole DoorDash driver kind of has me a and a.
Speaker 2: I don't know what is the DoorDash, so I have
Speaker 2: questions about it too. What is it?
Speaker 1: So on the night of the murders. Xanna Kernodle received
Speaker 1: a DoorDash delivery less than twenty minutes before she was
Speaker 1: stabbed to death inside her home. This was, according to
Speaker 1: the arrest Affid David, the twenty year old's final meal
Speaker 1: likely from Jack's Jack in the Box, and we have
Speaker 1: a photo of it. It was the photo was taken
Speaker 1: inside the house and it was dropped off by the
Speaker 1: DoorDash driver at the house on King Road in Moscow, Idaho,
Speaker 1: at four a m. According to the probable cause Affidavid.
Speaker 1: Now the timeline is she was active on her so
Speaker 1: the DoorDash delivery gets dropped off at four am. She's
Speaker 1: active on her phone at four twelve, But she had
Speaker 1: been murdered alongside her boyfriend Ethan in her bed by
Speaker 1: four twenty five. So there is a picture of the
Speaker 1: DoorDash delivery, but it's in the kitchen. So here's where
Speaker 1: I'm confused by this conundrum. If the DoorDash driver delivers
Speaker 1: the door dash at four a m, she's on her
Speaker 1: phone at four twelve on social media or active on
Speaker 1: her phone, and she is dead by four twenty five,
Speaker 1: did she.
Speaker 2: Or someone was active on her phone?
Speaker 1: Okay, well maybe that's another theory. But my question is
Speaker 1: the photo of the DoorDash delivery is in the kitchen
Speaker 1: of the house, So did the DoorDash driver come into
Speaker 1: the house and deliver it.
Speaker 2: In the g Maybe that's what I was saying earlier
Speaker 2: last week, was is it like a four plex? Is
Speaker 2: it like an apartment style building, even if it's not
Speaker 2: aficially an apartment, And maybe there's a common area, like
Speaker 2: there's a hallway that they can walk in, and then
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, Like, I don't know what
Speaker 2: the layout is.
Speaker 1: I've seen pictures of the layout of the house and
Speaker 1: it's three as far as I know, it's three levels,
Speaker 1: so there's like a main level, then there's a second level,
Speaker 1: and then there's a third level. Don't exactly where the
Speaker 1: kitchen is. And I understand this isn't relevant to the
Speaker 1: murders because the DoorDash driver has been Clearity was not
Speaker 1: a suspect. But I'm just confused when I try to
Speaker 1: imagine what happened that evening before she was murdered. She
Speaker 1: gets a DoorDash delivery at four, Why is the food
Speaker 1: not in her room? Why did she not pick up
Speaker 1: the food from the DoorDash delivery at four and take
Speaker 1: it in her room with her.
Speaker 2: Well, how many times you order the DoorDash almost every night?
Speaker 1: And first of all, is an inaccurate statement. You order
Speaker 1: it last night for the kids, not for me.
Speaker 2: Okay, anyway, sometimes it's out there on the front door
Speaker 2: for a while. I know, but this is especially if
Speaker 2: you're dead. It's going to stay out there for quite
Speaker 2: a while.
Speaker 1: I understand that. But the picture of the food is
Speaker 1: in the kitchen, So I'm just confused.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: Did the DoorDash driver drop it off and bring it
Speaker 1: inside it?
Speaker 2: Well, that would be a question for the DoorDash driver.
Speaker 2: Did you ask him?
Speaker 1: I actually googled it, googled it because I was trying
Speaker 1: to find more articles about it. But everything I read
Speaker 1: just broke down the timeline.
Speaker 2: Of all because it is probably nothing. It's probably what.
Speaker 1: I need to know. So if anybody knows that, can
Speaker 1: you please DM me and let me know. Also, I
Speaker 1: do believe that the door dash driver would probably testify
Speaker 1: during trial in order to establish a timeline of events, right,
Speaker 1: so maybe we can figure that out.
Speaker 2: Once eaten eaten eating, it was not consumed. It was
Speaker 2: not consumed.
Speaker 1: I believe it was not consumed. It's jack in the
Speaker 1: box that has Zana's name on the bag. It's sitting
Speaker 1: in the kitchen meat.
Speaker 2: Meat because Colberger is a vegan and maybe he ordered
Speaker 2: he didn't order door dash to Have you ever heard
Speaker 2: of like the murders eaten like they're they're leftover food
Speaker 2: and stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is true. I've said that on forensics exactly
Speaker 1: how they commit murder. They go through the kitchen and
Speaker 1: make themselves a.
Speaker 2: Say, got me some slack. I might have had something.
Speaker 1: All right, anyway, we're going to move on. That was
Speaker 1: just a question I had about the DoorDash delivery. So
Speaker 1: if anybody has more information about that, feel free to
Speaker 1: dm me. I love to hear your guys.
Speaker 2: If the door Dash delivery guy is listening, Yes, mister
Speaker 2: door Dash driver, if you listen to legally Brunette, could
Speaker 2: you please let me know what happened that evening, even
Speaker 2: though there's a gag order on everyone in this case.
Speaker 2: But I'll underestimate your audience, that's true.
Speaker 1: All right, Let's do a little update on gene Hackman.
Speaker 1: So the I think it's called hant Is it haunt
Speaker 1: a virus or handa virus. I think someone told me
Speaker 1: I was pronouncing it.
Speaker 2: Called the rat poop poop virus. Okay, the rat the
Speaker 2: street name for it all, All right.
Speaker 1: We'll just go with rat poopoo virus kills three people
Speaker 1: in California. So the Mono County Public Health has confirmed
Speaker 1: a total of three deaths due to the rat poo
Speaker 1: poo virus and Mammoth Lakes, a town in California Sierra
Speaker 1: Nevada Mountains. All three of the recent California cases have
Speaker 1: been fatal. Oh my gosh, which doctor tom his last
Speaker 1: name is Boo, doctor Tom Boo's because you just said
Speaker 1: it was called the rat poo poo vir and now doctor.
Speaker 2: Doctor Boo is a rat poo poo expert.
Speaker 1: I can't with you, Doctor Tom Boo. The county's public
Speaker 1: health officer described this as and alarming. Clearly, one person
Speaker 1: had numerous mice in their home, but no evidence of
Speaker 1: mice was found, and the other two homes. This is
Speaker 1: what the release stated. The occurrence of three cases in
Speaker 1: a short period has me worried, especially this early in
Speaker 1: the year. Doctor Boo said, you.
Speaker 2: Know, I saw a video of the groundskeeper or whomever
Speaker 2: it was that found them and then reported and called
Speaker 2: nine to one to one for welfare checked and they
Speaker 2: were very emotional and in the actual reporting of it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I did read that to me. I don't know if
Speaker 2: I'm right, but it just seemed like they had a
Speaker 2: connection and probably the Hackmans were very nice and good
Speaker 2: clients and probably were kind and they always they probably
Speaker 2: kind of like my parents have these groundskeeper that have
Speaker 2: been for ten plus years, yeah, ten plus years, right,
Speaker 2: and like they kind of know them, and if they
Speaker 2: found my parents unfortunately dead, they would probably too. So anyway,
Speaker 2: just made me think that the Hackmens are probably they
Speaker 2: were probably good to them, they probably had a connect
Speaker 2: with them, And so I just made it even more
Speaker 2: of a sad, you know loss, right, that's all as
Speaker 2: opposed to you know, it just didn't seem so cold.
Speaker 2: It seemed very unfortunate, right.
Speaker 1: So a little bit more with the Hackman case. Gene
Speaker 1: Hackman's mother in law, so this is his wife's mother,
Speaker 1: asked the court to block the release of footage of
Speaker 1: the actual bodies. This was a People article. So Betsy Arakawa,
Speaker 1: which was the wife her mother, is opposing the release
Speaker 1: of police bodycam footage that would show her daughter and
Speaker 1: Gene Hackman's dead bodies in court documents, which were attained
Speaker 1: by people on Monday, March thirty first. The mother in
Speaker 1: law's name is Yoshi Feaster. She shared in a statement
Speaker 1: that since the death of her daughter and son in law,
Speaker 1: the significant media coverage surrounding the circumstances of her passing
Speaker 1: have forced me to relive the experience of her untimely
Speaker 1: death repeatedly the mother in law or the mother the
Speaker 1: mother of anyway. Gene Hackman's mother in law continued that
Speaker 1: media outlets have been seeking to act access photographs and
Speaker 1: videos of her daughter's body from the New Mexico's Office
Speaker 1: of the Medical Investigator. What do you think about that?
Speaker 1: I mean, what do you think about the public rights
Speaker 1: to information as opposed to someone's.
Speaker 2: Like the videos? Like the videos? Yeah, I don't think
Speaker 2: it should be really am I curious? Would I watch it?
Speaker 2: Would I click on it if it was made avail
Speaker 2: to me?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Yes, right? Do I think it should be released as
Speaker 2: a matter of rights?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 2: I don't think so.
Speaker 1: So you think a person a family's privacy as to
Speaker 1: their their dead relatives is a higher standard or regard
Speaker 1: as opposed to the public's need to consume yeah, salacious material, right,
Speaker 1: a daily basis, right, other.
Speaker 2: Than these dumb podcasts trying to get all that they
Speaker 2: can I know. But also, I mean that's a that's
Speaker 2: a general answer. I mean, but there might be specifics
Speaker 2: sometimes if there's criminality involved and they want to release
Speaker 2: it to maybe get insight information or people to give tips.
Speaker 2: There are reasons. But generally speaking of if there's no
Speaker 2: foul playing, someone's just just because there's a celebrity everyone
Speaker 2: wants to see Gene Hackman on the floor. I mean,
Speaker 2: that's kind of sad, especially when to go watch Crimson Tides, right,
Speaker 2: especially after he had apparently been laying there for a week.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so we can imagine what the body looks like
Speaker 1: at that point. So, Betsy's mother expressed concerns over how
Speaker 1: releasing the images of her late daughter could end up online,
Speaker 1: on television and be discussed on the radio and on
Speaker 1: these annoying podcasts. Yes, So, on March thirty first, a
Speaker 1: New Mexico judge ruled that video, audio, and photos that
Speaker 1: fall under New Mexico public records law can be released
Speaker 1: in connection to the deaths of Gene and Betsy, but
Speaker 1: that their bodies cannot be shown. The bodies must be
Speaker 1: blurred or edited out. This is what the judge ruled.
Speaker 1: So basically, you can look up probably the crime scene,
Speaker 1: you can look up the house, you can look up everything.
Speaker 1: You just can't see the images of the bodies.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, don't they always blur out like faces
Speaker 2: and bodies when they're dead anyway, when they like if
Speaker 2: there's a news reporting or you know, you watch those
Speaker 2: video like well maybe bodycam videos, and when there's a
Speaker 2: dead by, they always blurred out.
Speaker 1: I think maybe with reputable news sources because they try
Speaker 1: to have some integrity. But if you google something online,
Speaker 1: I mean, you can usually find the crime scene photo. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean I've seen them menindaz crime scene photos like
Speaker 1: those are pretty brutal, all right. Gene Hackman and Betsy
Speaker 1: are Akalla bodies are left unclaimed for over a month.
Speaker 1: This was in the Mirror. This was an article. So
Speaker 1: the names of Gene Hackman and a spouse, Betsy, have
Speaker 1: been quietly scrubbed from New Mexico's Office of the Medical
Speaker 1: Investigator list of unclaimed descendants, amidst rumors suggesting a bitter
Speaker 1: family division at play over the bodies left unattended according
Speaker 1: to the current protocol and unclaimed decedent implies individuals have
Speaker 1: been id'd, but the next of ken haven't been tracked down.
Speaker 1: This comes after mounting speculation that their loved ones had
Speaker 1: yet to lay claim to the bodies, igniting talks of
Speaker 1: a family feud. Up until March twenty seventh, the Hackmans
Speaker 1: were still marked on the Office of a Medical Investigator's website,
Speaker 1: but by Friday morning, people observed that they'd vanished from
Speaker 1: the record. So I think there was some reporting that
Speaker 1: they were listed as unclaimed, and then I think once
Speaker 1: it was reported in the media, it looks like it
Speaker 1: was a scrub from the website. So I don't know
Speaker 1: if someone claimed the bodies or if right, or if
Speaker 1: they just didn't want the attention on that website and
Speaker 1: maybe they just took them off. So I don't really
Speaker 1: know what happened with that.
Speaker 2: I don't know, but it's I mean, it's not really
Speaker 2: of public.
Speaker 1: Value, no, but I think it goes to the heart
Speaker 1: of there were the two daughters, and remember they hadn't
Speaker 1: checked on them for months or had any contact with them,
Speaker 1: and then apparently the bodies were left and not claimed
Speaker 1: by next of Kenada for a while, so speculating that,
Speaker 1: you know, there's this type of family feud, and where
Speaker 1: is this? I mean, he had a pretty large estate.
Speaker 1: I think that was maybe surprising the people because it
Speaker 1: seemed like he lived a very simple life. But just
Speaker 1: because someone lives a simple life doesn't mean that they.
Speaker 2: Know don't have a lot. And just because someone lives
Speaker 2: a flashy life doesn't mean they have a lot of money.
Speaker 1: Either, exactly. So where do you fall.
Speaker 2: I'm a simple man, a simple man man.
Speaker 1: Shane is a simple man. I will tell you when
Speaker 1: Shane and I were first married, this was like sixteen
Speaker 1: years ago. He lived in Utah, and this man, he
Speaker 1: would never have bought furniture or anything if it wasn't
Speaker 1: for me.
Speaker 2: This is, my kids have furniture.
Speaker 1: The kids have furniture.
Speaker 2: And I had a couch and a TV. A couch
Speaker 2: in the TV you are, And there was a lot
Speaker 2: of toys in the house.
Speaker 1: A lot of toys, no furniture. And you know, I
Speaker 1: remember when my dad and I had no debt. I know,
Speaker 1: I just I remember when my dad got divorced when
Speaker 1: I was like eighteen. Well, he wasn't divorced, but he
Speaker 1: had girlfriend for a long time. She moved out. My
Speaker 1: dad had outdoor lawn furniture as his furniture inside his home. Yeah,
Speaker 1: for like a year.
Speaker 2: Was he an unhappy man?
Speaker 1: No, he had a big TV and cable and then
Speaker 1: he had outdoor furniture as his living room furniture. And
Speaker 1: I was like, men are so simple. If Shane was
Speaker 1: not married to me, this house would never be remodeled,
Speaker 1: it would not have furniture. He would have it the
Speaker 1: biggest TV you could buy and a couch and it
Speaker 1: would still look like nineteen ninety three in this house.
Speaker 1: Yeah right, I'm right.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Okay, So apparently Gene Hackman had a pretty large estate
Speaker 1: when he died. He lived on twelve acres. The house
Speaker 1: was worth around three point eight million. This is in
Speaker 1: New Mexico, and according to a will, he had in
Speaker 1: estate of around eighty million.
Speaker 2: Okay, and we don't know who's who's gonna be the beneficiary.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I don't think that's been made public yet.
Speaker 2: It'll likely be whoever.
Speaker 1: She chose, whoever the wife chose. Yeah, because was she
Speaker 1: the gatekeeper? She was the gatekeeper. But I mean that
Speaker 1: was just my speculation because it said I believe earlier
Speaker 1: when we talked about this case, it was that he
Speaker 1: didn't have a cell phone, like everyone had to go
Speaker 1: through her. He was estrange, I think from the daughters,
Speaker 1: and so I called her the gatekeeper. So I if
Speaker 1: she would not have died at the same time as him,
Speaker 1: she would have inherited.
Speaker 2: Well actually no, not necessarily unless he had a will
Speaker 2: that excluded her. Well I can't, but like the likelihood
Speaker 2: was they just had joint accounts or whatnot. He might
Speaker 2: have had some prenup for his kids or something. We'll
Speaker 2: find out.
Speaker 1: We'll find out when the when the will. I'd rather
Speaker 1: see the will than the body. Yeah, Shane wants the finances.
Speaker 1: He does not want to gets what. So last night
Speaker 1: there was a special on the Meninda's brothers, and I
Speaker 1: feel slightly bamboozled because it was like TMZ presents, you know,
Speaker 1: prison interviews of Lyle and Eric Menindez. So I stayed
Speaker 1: up past my bedtime to watch this, and when I
Speaker 1: was watching it, I was like, this sounds so familiar
Speaker 1: to me. So basically what it was Harvey Levin, who
Speaker 1: is TMZ, and Mark Garrigos, who represents them in Inda's
Speaker 1: Brothers Post Conviction. They together, the two of them have
Speaker 1: a podcast called Two Angry Men, and weeks ago, I
Speaker 1: think it was weeks ago, maybe a month or so ago,
Speaker 1: they had an.
Speaker 2: Episode on Z spelled two or t o.
Speaker 1: It's two. Yeah, that's you, You're the too angry Man.
Speaker 2: I was wondering how they spelled it, So too to
Speaker 2: Tea's in a pod, but it's two angrymen.
Speaker 1: It's two in a pod, two agremen in a pod,
Speaker 1: but it's two, not t o. Anyway, they had an
Speaker 1: episode that I listened to, and it was Lyle and
Speaker 1: Eric calling in from prison and Harvey was asking them
Speaker 1: questions and they did an interview. I listened to the
Speaker 1: whole podcast. They talked about what they want to do
Speaker 1: if they get released. And anyway, what they did for
Speaker 1: the special that was on last night, This Whole TMZ Presents,
Speaker 1: was that they took the audio from this podcast and
Speaker 1: they used that same audio as the interview, and then
Speaker 1: they added some clips and some photos and so basically
Speaker 1: it was just taking what they'd already recorded on a
Speaker 1: podcast and trying to make it into a special.
Speaker 2: So is that what you were angry watching it.
Speaker 1: I was angry.
Speaker 2: I was I couldn't ask any questions like Emily snapping.
Speaker 1: I was like, stop talking to me.
Speaker 2: And I asked a couple weeks ago, I said, well,
Speaker 2: what's different. I already did an interview. Said no, this
Speaker 2: is the first ar I'm like, no, they already did
Speaker 2: the first interview, So what's different? And you said, and
Speaker 2: you got all angry and then last night you watched
Speaker 2: it and then you feel now bamboozle. That's what I said.
Speaker 2: I said, it's the same thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So TMZ special was called The Meninda's Brothers the
Speaker 1: Prison Interview. It aired last night on Fox and it
Speaker 1: will air today on Hulu.
Speaker 2: But they did add like video and visuals and some narration.
Speaker 2: It wasn't just an audio play.
Speaker 1: No, that's what I said.
Speaker 2: For those that want to watch it, there was some
Speaker 2: more value to it.
Speaker 1: So in the exclusive interview, Lyle and Eric Menendez spoke
Speaker 1: with Harvey Levin over the phone from their correctional facility
Speaker 1: and discuss their experiences in prison and their hopes for
Speaker 1: the future. They expressed optimism about their upcoming parole hearing,
Speaker 1: scheduled for June thirteenth, twenty twenty five. And their aspirations
Speaker 1: to continue advocacy work for abuse victims if they are released.
Speaker 1: So let's just go back and just do a little
Speaker 1: summary of where they're at in the legal system. They're
Speaker 1: really on a two track way right now. There is
Speaker 1: the June thirteenth, they have a parole hearing, which that
Speaker 1: came down from what's his name, Gavin Newsome himself when
Speaker 1: he said when he did, I think it was his.
Speaker 2: First podcast he of his revamped podcast.
Speaker 1: His first podcast of his revamped podcast, he talked about
Speaker 1: how he was now getting involved into the in this case.
Speaker 2: He doesn't need to get involved. He wants get involved
Speaker 2: as commune their sentence and stead He's like, oh, this
Speaker 2: is popular, let me get involved.
Speaker 1: Let me get involved because I don't cook in the
Speaker 1: kitchen after the fire situation, so let me hop on
Speaker 1: the Menendez trade. So anyway, he now has ordered that
Speaker 1: the parole board do this risk assessment type of research
Speaker 1: to put together what some type of opinion as to
Speaker 1: whether they should be paroled or not, and that's is
Speaker 1: scheduled for June thirteenth. Also, they still have the resentencing
Speaker 1: hearing possibility. Even though the DA hawkman is not He's
Speaker 1: not behind the recensing. He came out and said that
Speaker 1: they shouldn't be released, they shouldn't be resentenced. There is
Speaker 1: a hearing this Friday in front of Judge Jessic and
Speaker 1: it's basically the DA trying to withdraw their invite to
Speaker 1: be resentenced. So the judge has to decide whether he's
Speaker 1: going to continue with the hearing going forward or whether
Speaker 1: the DA gets to a withdraw.
Speaker 2: So they filed like a motion to withdraw or whatever.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 2: It's to the judge Tree if you everything, and decide
Speaker 2: if he's going to grant it or continue.
Speaker 1: Right, because if you do, remember that the whole resentencing
Speaker 1: started with the prior DA, who is a much more
Speaker 1: progressive DA. Now we have Hawkman and he's like, no,
Speaker 1: they should stay in prison forever. And he called them
Speaker 1: liars and said they needed to admit to all these
Speaker 1: lies and things.
Speaker 2: Like that is something that said that the greatest liars
Speaker 2: of all time or something. So that was that just
Speaker 2: some commentators.
Speaker 1: That was a reporter that had been during that had
Speaker 1: been present during the trials, and so if you watch
Speaker 1: the special, the TMZ special, there is a reporter that
Speaker 1: called them the greatest liars that he'd ever witnessed. So
Speaker 1: so there's that, all right, So let's talk about what
Speaker 1: Eric and Lyle will do if they are released again.
Speaker 1: They have a two track system that could either be
Speaker 1: their sentence can be commuted by Gavin Newsom, or there's
Speaker 1: still the possibility of a resentencing. It's not dead yet,
Speaker 1: they said. We have pretty much a shared purpose. This
Speaker 1: is what Lyle told TMZ in terms of the victim's community.
Speaker 1: We have for decades been involved with and a lot
Speaker 1: of our joy and a lot of our grief has
Speaker 1: come from that community. Lyle spoke about the work he
Speaker 1: and his brother have done in prison, including speaking about
Speaker 1: trauma in order to help healing. He hopes to do
Speaker 1: more of that if released. Lyle told TMZ, which is
Speaker 1: actually Harvey, that after testifying about the abuse he and
Speaker 1: his brothers said they suffered at the hands of their father,
Speaker 1: he received a lot of support and also hopes to
Speaker 1: keep up his work with helping survivors of trauma. Eric
Speaker 1: also expressed similar sentiments to TMZ, saying that if he's released,
Speaker 1: he wants to be an advocate for people who have
Speaker 1: survived childhood trauma. There are people that the system is failing,
Speaker 1: and I want to help the people that the system
Speaker 1: is failing. Eric said, Lyle and I aren't talking about
Speaker 1: leaving prison. Should we be able to get out and
Speaker 1: not looking back, our lives will be spent working with
Speaker 1: the prison and doing the work we're doing in here,
Speaker 1: but doing it out there. Basically, they're saying we've spent
Speaker 1: the last you know, thirty five years in prison helping
Speaker 1: other survivors of trauma. I know they do. I know
Speaker 1: they have groups that they speak in. I know Eric
Speaker 1: paints and Lyle does these groups. I know Lyle has
Speaker 1: painted like he was. He started some initiative that was
Speaker 1: called like a green space initiative where they painted murals
Speaker 1: and they planted some trees and greenery. I actually thought
Speaker 1: that was interesting because I remember in the original if
Speaker 1: you listen to the original podcast, which had more interview
Speaker 1: than this actual special did, Lyle talks about how in
Speaker 1: prison it's not really rehabilitating if you're just within these
Speaker 1: walls that are white, you know, and you're stuck in
Speaker 1: these rooms. Like, how are you supposed to rehabilitate someone
Speaker 1: if they don't see trees or animals or grass or
Speaker 1: anything that keeps people happy and grounded. And so I
Speaker 1: believe he started like this green space initiative where they
Speaker 1: planted some trees, they brought in some there's some grass,
Speaker 1: some flowers planted. I think they painted this huge mural
Speaker 1: on the wall in order to have more color and
Speaker 1: life in the prison system. And I actually agree with that, Like,
Speaker 1: if we want people to be rehabilitated.
Speaker 2: Then rehability to rehabilitate them is like going to physical
Speaker 2: therapy and they're going to sit here. They come like, Okay,
Speaker 2: you're done, go back out there, right, So you know,
Speaker 2: maybe that's something that will catch on in other prisons.
Speaker 1: As far as rehabilitating prisoners, I do like a lot
Speaker 1: of times when you see the therapy dogs that come
Speaker 1: in and the prisoners train them to be they get
Speaker 1: them as puppy as they trained them to be therapy dogs.
Speaker 1: Things like that are just such cool. And the firefighters
Speaker 1: that's another one. We were going to do a podcast
Speaker 1: about that. Do you remember during the LA fires, a
Speaker 1: lot of the fire teams that were brought in were the.
Speaker 2: Person I was very curious how that's organized. That's very interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so someone actually reached out to me. It was
Speaker 1: an attorney. She was a defense attorney, and she's a
Speaker 1: lot of times with these young guys. When they go
Speaker 1: into prison, you can request from the judge that they'd
Speaker 1: be put into the fire program. And I don't remember
Speaker 1: exactly what all the requirements were, but it was like,
Speaker 1: you know, good health and young and not violent.
Speaker 2: Not convicted of arson, right, not convicted of.
Speaker 1: Arson, probably not convicted of murder, but maybe some of
Speaker 1: the lesser sentences that they could go into the fire
Speaker 1: program within the prison and learn these skills. Anyway, the
Speaker 1: brothers are hopeful. At this point in the interview, Lyle shared,
Speaker 1: our hope for the future is really kind of a
Speaker 1: new thing for us. I think Eric would probably agree
Speaker 1: with that. It's not something we've spent a lot of
Speaker 1: time on. And you know, if you think about it,
Speaker 1: they were convicted thirty five years ago, life without parole.
Speaker 1: So all these good things that they've done in prison.
Speaker 2: Are in the hopes of the writing out.
Speaker 1: Are not because they're trying to create for show, right,
Speaker 1: it's not for show. It's not because they're trying to create,
Speaker 1: you know, a legacy so that when they are up
Speaker 1: for parole, they can talk, they can list all these
Speaker 1: great things that they've done, they're actually doing it because
Speaker 1: they were in Well, that was the one thing I.
Speaker 2: Got out of the quote unquote special last night was
Speaker 2: the rapper the named X Rated.
Speaker 1: Yes, x Rated was on there with the d he
Speaker 1: Ray did.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he said he was with them for eighteen years.
Speaker 2: And he said, and I'm paraphrasing, he said that those
Speaker 2: guys helped him to kind of be motivated to get
Speaker 2: himself together for when he got out, Like they educated him,
Speaker 2: they worked with him, they supported him. And he said,
Speaker 2: those guys were never getting out, but they were focused
Speaker 2: on me and becoming a better person for when I
Speaker 2: got out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thought that was That did say a lot,
Speaker 1: and I thought that was really interesting and I'm glad
Speaker 1: they did include that in the special. I mean, I
Speaker 1: guess I was slightly bamboozled, but they did add in
Speaker 1: some other people into the special that spoke on their behalf.
Speaker 1: I mean, they also had the detective. You know, you
Speaker 1: have to keep it balanced, right, So they had the
Speaker 1: detective that said they should never get out of I mean,
Speaker 1: he was the detective.
Speaker 2: That the detective did live with him in jail this
Speaker 2: whole time.
Speaker 1: No, he's still as far. I mean, they interviewed the detective.
Speaker 2: It's not a matter of, oh, they're not guilty, let
Speaker 2: them out. It's a matter of given the circumstances, given
Speaker 2: the trauma that they supposedly went through, and all these
Speaker 2: things coupled with them for thirty five years having already
Speaker 2: served prison time, and all the good that they're doing
Speaker 2: that they might actually be contributing citizens when they come out, right.
Speaker 2: It's all those things put together right, probably more.
Speaker 1: But here's a quote from Eric that was in the special.
Speaker 1: I'm striving to be a better person every day, and
Speaker 1: I want to be a person that my family can
Speaker 1: be proud of. Who I've evolved into, who I've seen
Speaker 1: Lyle evolve into. I'm finally beginning to like myself and
Speaker 1: be proud of myself, and I find it's okay to
Speaker 1: like myself. Also, I thought it was interesting that TMZ
Speaker 1: included a poll in this special. They asked, I don't
Speaker 1: remember what they're how many people look. I can't remember
Speaker 1: the exact number of people they pulled. I think it
Speaker 1: was like sixty eight thousand or something that voted.
Speaker 2: It as an online poll though, Yeah.
Speaker 1: So they asked the public if the Meninda's brothers should
Speaker 1: go free. What do you what are your guests? What
Speaker 1: do you guess? What do you think it was?
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know who the sixty eight
Speaker 2: thousand people are.
Speaker 1: That doesn't matter.
Speaker 2: Are they people in the prisons? No voted? I don't know.
Speaker 1: No, it's just TMS like you you follow TMZ.
Speaker 2: I mean like maybe they did it on X they
Speaker 2: just put.
Speaker 1: It yeah, probably, So what do you think?
Speaker 2: Well, I bet you it's a toss up. I bet
Speaker 2: you it's like any it's like fifty to fifty.
Speaker 1: It's actually very close. It's forty seven percent voted that absolutely,
Speaker 1: they've served enough time. Fifty three percent voted no, way,
Speaker 1: they murdered their parents, they should stay in prison. I
Speaker 1: actually was surprised by that because I thought it would
Speaker 1: be flipped. I thought it would be higher that people
Speaker 1: think that they should be really.
Speaker 2: Yeah, But I think I just guess it's a toss
Speaker 2: up fifty, which it pretty much is, because no one
Speaker 2: you have to look into the facts to really no.
Speaker 2: I mean, how many people just vote just because it's
Speaker 2: in front of them and they don't really know. So
Speaker 2: the thy oh murder their parents stay in prison? Like,
Speaker 2: no one's you mean, that's how I thought that poll
Speaker 2: isn't really.
Speaker 1: So you're saying, yeah, well okay, Well let me ask you.
Speaker 2: Are they informed votes? Probably not?
Speaker 1: Probably not. I don't think anyone's informed when they've no vote. Okay,
Speaker 1: let me ask you, because you're an informed voter, how
Speaker 1: would you vote? I'm talking about the poll. I'm saying
Speaker 1: you're an informed voter.
Speaker 2: Because if it's just a vote, I would say they
Speaker 2: should be released.
Speaker 1: Do you think so? Okay?
Speaker 2: I mean, based on all the things you've talked to me,
Speaker 2: and if I voted, know they should stay in prison,
Speaker 2: you'd probably be very mad with me.
Speaker 1: Oh that's not even true. I go back and forth. Honestly,
Speaker 1: people have asked me do I think they should be
Speaker 1: released or do I think they should stay in prison?
Speaker 1: And I go back and forth. I tell you, when
Speaker 1: I listen to them speak now as adults, and they
Speaker 1: sound so poignant and poised and like they've been rehabilitated,
Speaker 1: I don't think that they're a risk to society, which
Speaker 1: is a factor, right It All rehabilitation and whether they
Speaker 1: should be released all comes down to are they a
Speaker 1: risk to society? Do I think they're a risk. Absolutely not.
Speaker 1: Would I want them as neighbors. I wouldn't be worried
Speaker 1: if they were my neighbors. I think the brutality of
Speaker 1: what they did was a specific, isolated event to that
Speaker 1: family and the trauma that was going on in that family,
Speaker 1: and I think that's what that was about. I don't
Speaker 1: think they're the kind of people that would be released.
Speaker 2: It doesn't sound like you go back and forth.
Speaker 1: No, I do, though I do, But then when I
Speaker 1: see crime scene photos and you go back to that
Speaker 1: night and the brutality of it, I'm like, wow, that
Speaker 1: was I mean, they were eighteen to twenty one, and
Speaker 1: that was a pretty brutal evening and Lyle reloaded.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean then I kind of think about that. But
Speaker 1: I guess if I had to, if I had to,
Speaker 1: if I had to pick a side, I think they've
Speaker 1: been rehabilitated. I think they should be released. I think
Speaker 1: they've served their time. It's been thirty five years that
Speaker 1: they've spent in prison, and they've been model prisoners.
Speaker 2: So I think, you know, and they might very well
Speaker 2: continue work outside. They might, I imagine. I don't imagine
Speaker 2: that they would just leave the prison and never return.
Speaker 2: They probably would come back to help with programs. Well
Speaker 2: that's a follow up on the Oh okay, yeah, so
Speaker 2: I was right.
Speaker 1: Did you not watch this special?
Speaker 2: Well, I wasn't allowed to ask questions. Right, we're getting mad.
Speaker 1: So they do talk about how they will wants to
Speaker 1: continue with the work that they've done inside the prison,
Speaker 1: but outside, so I think they would still be involved
Speaker 1: with victims and children and inmates and whatever. So that's
Speaker 1: what they say. Eric admits to being a spoiled brat.
Speaker 1: He calls his younger self a spoiled brat, saying back
Speaker 1: then he could mask his insecurities with expensive clothes and
Speaker 1: fancy cars. He went on to say measuring success by
Speaker 1: the stuff he acquired was ridiculous. He goes on to
Speaker 1: admit I'm so ashamed and embarrassed, but he admits he
Speaker 1: now likes himself and his goal is to.
Speaker 2: See why he did that. He looked back and reflected
Speaker 2: on his life and realized he wanted all those things
Speaker 2: because he was missing his self identity or whatever you
Speaker 2: want to call his independence, real happiness. So he was
Speaker 2: masking it or trying to get all these things to
Speaker 2: fill that void. I mean, that's quite a bit of growth.
Speaker 2: That's more growth than most people get, you know.
Speaker 1: I also thought it was interesting that Harvey, when he
Speaker 1: did the interview, he said that he was at the
Speaker 1: trial thirty five years ago and that he thought that
Speaker 1: they were just horror you know, cold blooded killers, spoiled
Speaker 1: rotten brats. I'm sorry who said this, Harvey, the guy
Speaker 1: he did the end at the time, he said.
Speaker 2: Thirty at the time.
Speaker 1: He was with the public at the time. He was
Speaker 1: there during the trials, right.
Speaker 2: But I mean he was like the public where everyone
Speaker 2: thinks only got these brats that wanted money and killed
Speaker 2: their parents.
Speaker 1: Right. But my question is how much of that was
Speaker 1: just perpetuated by the media, because we talked about before
Speaker 1: the way that they were just made fun of relentlessly.
Speaker 1: They were called spoiled brats.
Speaker 2: They were on David Like. It was referenced on David
Speaker 2: Letterman all the time. And I watched the Letterman it
Speaker 2: was all the time, and as a kid, I'm watching
Speaker 2: in high school and you just know, like, oh, these
Speaker 2: two guys killed their parents for money and they got caught.
Speaker 2: That's all that's all I knew. Of course I was
Speaker 2: only in high schooler, but that's all that's the impression
Speaker 2: I got, and that was all the comedians, and that
Speaker 2: was all the news references, right, and so publicly, yeah,
Speaker 2: they were screwed.
Speaker 1: Right. Here's his actual quote. So Harvey Levin is stunned.
Speaker 1: He says he's stunned by the changes in the Menindas brothers.
Speaker 1: He says, I covered the trials when I was a
Speaker 1: low reporter here in LA and my impressions of them
Speaker 1: were spoiled brats, monsters who deserved their sentence. Thirty five
Speaker 1: years later, I spoke with two entirely different people. Their introspective.
Speaker 1: They're thoughtful, they are remorseful. You had mentioned X Rated before,
Speaker 1: but let's talk a little bit more about that. So Annarey,
Speaker 1: his stage name is x Rated Brown, a rapper who
Speaker 1: spent twenty six years in prison for murder, found unexpected
Speaker 1: allies in Lyle and Eric Menindez who helped him rise
Speaker 1: above his pass and discover his own worth. X Rated
Speaker 1: met Lyel Menindez first in two thousand and one at
Speaker 1: Mule Creek State Prison in Ione? Is it Ione, California?
Speaker 1: Is that how you say it?
Speaker 2: I don't know, but he's he was only in prison
Speaker 2: for twenty six years.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he got out right, what's his murder like,
Speaker 1: I don't know the details of what happened, but he
Speaker 1: spent twenty six years in prison for murder and he
Speaker 1: was released. So I don't know the circumstances of that.
Speaker 1: I mean, maybe that's something interesting to look up. You
Speaker 1: bet it is.
Speaker 2: I'm going to look it up right.
Speaker 1: Now, he says. Meeting Lyle, he struck me as sturdy.
Speaker 1: He was a strong man. He wasn't a weakling or
Speaker 1: someone who couldn't hold his own, he said. Lyle taught
Speaker 1: him to see himself in a new light and recognize
Speaker 1: his own worth despite his challenging upbringing. In two thousand
Speaker 1: and eight, the rapper then met Eric. When I got there,
Speaker 1: he came looking for me and brought a letter that
Speaker 1: Lyle had written to him, essentially telling him, Hey, this
Speaker 1: is X Rated. He's our little brother. I love him,
Speaker 1: so you love him too. He took me under his wing.
Speaker 1: From there, x Rated continued, Eric could stand on his own.
Speaker 1: He wasn't a coward. He was very intelligent, and his
Speaker 1: emotional intelligence was probably higher than anyone I had ever
Speaker 1: met before. He helped me a lot with that. So,
Speaker 1: after spending twenty six years in prison. X Rated was
Speaker 1: released on parole in twenty eighteen with the help of
Speaker 1: Lyle and Eric. So I don't know. I thought that
Speaker 1: was interesting. I mean, I guess I wasn't completely bamboozled
Speaker 1: because they did leave. They did have the interview with
Speaker 1: X Rated, which added another element to their prison life.
Speaker 1: One last thing. I thought it was interesting that Harvey
Speaker 1: asked Lyle what his thoughts were on the Monsters drama series.
Speaker 2: Yeah, did they watch it?
Speaker 1: He said that they did. He said he said he
Speaker 1: saw bits and pieces that he was able to sit
Speaker 1: and watch the whole thing.
Speaker 2: But he saw.
Speaker 1: Enough of it to piece it together. He said he
Speaker 1: saw parts of it online and he kind of basically
Speaker 1: felt he saw the movie right. Lyleman Is revealed on
Speaker 1: the podcast that he felt grateful for the Netflix series,
Speaker 1: expressing how he thinks that helped people understand the childhood
Speaker 1: trauma he and his brother experienced. I feel a lot
Speaker 1: of people were educated about what can happen in rich
Speaker 1: and affluent homes behind walls. I think it opened a
Speaker 1: lot of people's eyes, and that's always a good thing.
Speaker 1: The brothers initially criticized the show's portrayal of their lives,
Speaker 1: crime and trial, calling it a disheartening slander. I do
Speaker 1: know initially that they were upset by it. There's also
Speaker 1: they allude to an incestuous relationship between the two brothers,
Speaker 1: which I'm sure that wasn't something that they were happy about.
Speaker 1: I also know the family spoke against it, saying that
Speaker 1: it wasn't factually correct and they weren't happy with it.
Speaker 1: No one asked them their thoughts or anything like that. However,
Speaker 1: I think Lyle, now, when you step back from it
Speaker 1: and you look at it, you recognize the fact that
Speaker 1: so many people watched it and were invested in it,
Speaker 1: and then probably like me, went back and did more
Speaker 1: research and watched their original trials. These are the people
Speaker 1: that are rallying around them and are saying that they
Speaker 1: should be released and their time has been served, and
Speaker 1: let's be honest for a moment, these two men are
Speaker 1: getting privileges that other men in prison aren't getting because
Speaker 1: of their notoriety, Like you can't deny that no one
Speaker 1: else I'm saying. They're famous. Yeah, they have a resentencing hearing,
Speaker 1: and Gavin Newsom has personally said that he's ordering a
Speaker 1: parole board to review their case and possibly commute their sentence.
Speaker 1: I'm saying those are privileges that those two are getting
Speaker 1: because of who they are and the notoriety surrounding.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we taught we mentioned that before, But for their popularity, right,
Speaker 2: I mean, no one would be you know, Team Z
Speaker 2: wouldn't have a vote out there with sixty eight thousand people,
Speaker 2: I wouldn't do any polls or anything. We wouldn't be
Speaker 2: talking about it right now, and you wouldn't have driven
Speaker 2: by their house to look at it.
Speaker 1: I did drive. I didn't just drive by. I actually parked,
Speaker 1: I stopped selfies, I got out, I made a video
Speaker 1: of it.
Speaker 2: I don't know, It's just it's I mean, even Millie
Speaker 2: van Illy is getting some comeback opportunities here because you're
Speaker 2: listening to it every day. Everyone's listening to it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I would say that the Monsters series did more
Speaker 1: good than harm for the brothers, and I think now
Speaker 1: looking back on it, they recognize that. So all right, anyway,
Speaker 1: we are finished with this episode. Thank you again so
Speaker 1: much for listening to Legally Brunette. We truly appreciate it,
Speaker 1: and if you have any other information or you have thoughts,
Speaker 1: please dm me. I read them and I like to
Speaker 1: respond if I can so. Any thoughts you have, or
Speaker 1: if you know any more information that we didn't cover,
Speaker 1: please feel free to let me know. So Thanks guys,
Speaker 1: we appreciate it. Bye.