Speaker 1: Pushkin. This is Solvable. I'm Ronald Young Jr. We have
Speaker 1: a really special episode for you today. You may recall
Speaker 1: that back in September, I talked with TV writer Mike
Speaker 1: Goyo about his work to support young black writers in Hollywood.
Speaker 1: He mentioned then that his writing would be credited on
Speaker 1: the upcoming and final season of Insecure. Well, as you
Speaker 1: probably know, that season is well underway, so I asked
Speaker 1: Mike to come back to Solvable and spill all his secrets,
Speaker 1: or at least tell me more about what it was
Speaker 1: like writing for Insecure. Here's our conversation, and stick with
Speaker 1: us because at the end of this short chat, we'll
Speaker 1: share our original episode about Mike's inspiring mentorship program called
Speaker 1: the Black Boy Writes Black Girl Rights Mentorship Initiative. Here
Speaker 1: we go. You know, I follow you on Instagram. I
Speaker 1: saw your pictures. You do a big things with care
Speaker 1: right now. Stopped you for the premiere party. I did
Speaker 1: to myself. You look fantastic. I styled myself for for everything.
Speaker 1: Um that look came together in less than twenty four hours. Honestly,
Speaker 1: if I wasn't a writer, I would be in I
Speaker 1: would be in fashion fair. Yeah, yeah, you got your
Speaker 1: Instagram on lock Man like, no, thank you, thank you,
Speaker 1: thank you. The premiere was great, and you know, this
Speaker 1: is my first season writing on the show, but I've
Speaker 1: been a fan of the show since it started, you know,
Speaker 1: so being able to have that kind of like insider
Speaker 1: experience to its history almost like just a museum, felt great.
Speaker 1: It was awesome. So I know you've written for other
Speaker 1: shows like you know, Jenny and Georgia. You know, writing
Speaker 1: for a show like this where you're you're a fan
Speaker 1: of the show from the beginning, does that change the
Speaker 1: experience in the writer's room for you. It does. It does,
Speaker 1: and emotionally in the sense of like, oh this is
Speaker 1: my favorite show. Okay, I gotta do right by it.
Speaker 1: I can't be out here pitching like crazy stuff things
Speaker 1: that I wanted to see like season two, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. It's like, Noah, she should have went
Speaker 1: with Daniel. Daniel like to tell you that, like the
Speaker 1: I think the first day in the writer's room, I
Speaker 1: was like, Okay, so this and this need to happen
Speaker 1: because if you don't, like you know, I was like, okay,
Speaker 1: my calm down. But yeah, I was, you know, incredibly
Speaker 1: excited and to your point, it's different than Ginny and
Speaker 1: Georgia only because Ginnie and Georgia is it was its
Speaker 1: first season, so you originated stuff. Yeah, so come on originator. No.
Speaker 1: But like the same kind of fanfare that people are
Speaker 1: experiencing over Jenny and Georgia as z words I experienced
Speaker 1: with Insecure. But when you're on a show and it's
Speaker 1: like the inception of the show and you're starting with
Speaker 1: the first season, then you and the other writers are
Speaker 1: tasked with creating the world, with creating who these characters are.
Speaker 1: So when you become a part of that process, it's
Speaker 1: slightly harder to just be able to sit back as
Speaker 1: a fan and you know, and of course we love
Speaker 1: all the fans of the show and it it's become
Speaker 1: an incredibly successful show and we love that. But it's
Speaker 1: just a different experience, you know, Like with insecurests like
Speaker 1: I didn't have to write it. I didn't have to
Speaker 1: come up with these stories, and I could just enjoy
Speaker 1: it as a fan and like pick my team. I
Speaker 1: was like team Lawrence, team Nathan, Like who am I? Like?
Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean? Yelvable podcast? All right,
Speaker 1: I don't care. I didn't even ask anybody this is
Speaker 1: a time podcast. You can tell Malcolm tell everybody's Lauren's
Speaker 1: Time podcast. Come on alone time when I'm mad at
Speaker 1: it and tell me Take me back forward a second,
Speaker 1: take me through if you remember, and I'm sure you do.
Speaker 1: What was your what was your first day working with
Speaker 1: the team like? And I imagine was it was a
Speaker 1: virtual were you in person? What was it like? It
Speaker 1: was fantastic. What I'll say is I knew most of
Speaker 1: the writers personally, and it was my first time working
Speaker 1: with a lot of them professionally. So there's that kind
Speaker 1: of like, Okay, Mike, don't be on here talking crazy
Speaker 1: like you would having drinks drinks with this person, you know,
Speaker 1: be professional, pitch beacup things like that. Say something smart
Speaker 1: like you know what you're talking about. But it was
Speaker 1: also different because it was my first virtual room because
Speaker 1: remember we were all in the depths of quarantine and
Speaker 1: that kind of like familial aspect of the writer's room.
Speaker 1: You don't really get to build it as much on
Speaker 1: Zoom Like it was very efficient, but that efficiency kind
Speaker 1: of slightly stepped on some of the relationship building maybe,
Speaker 1: but for the most part, like oh my god, the
Speaker 1: room experience was fantastic. Wow. So did you ever get
Speaker 1: to spend time on set and what was that like?
Speaker 1: I did to get to spend time on set. I
Speaker 1: love that you can't tell us everything, so I get it.
Speaker 1: I appreciate that. So imagine you're gonna get me. I'm not.
Speaker 1: I'm not, I'm not. So yeah. So you so you
Speaker 1: had a good time? I imagine? Um, what was your
Speaker 1: What was your favorite thing about about writing this season
Speaker 1: or about helping out this season that you can share
Speaker 1: talking about the larger themes of the show, and because
Speaker 1: it's the final season, you're closing out these characters and
Speaker 1: their experiences and you're wanting to kind of give them
Speaker 1: their like full circle moment. Being able to discuss that
Speaker 1: and having conversations around that was great because you you
Speaker 1: get to assist in how these characters land emotionally in
Speaker 1: the series. It's like, what are they learning? What is
Speaker 1: coming up for them? What do we want the audience
Speaker 1: to know as we finish out the series. One thing
Speaker 1: that was really that we kind of landed on early
Speaker 1: is that we wanted it to write like we were
Speaker 1: getting a season six, so that we didn't feel the
Speaker 1: pressure of, oh, we have to, like, you know, really
Speaker 1: close out these characters in a huge way. Dada Insecure
Speaker 1: has been about slightive life stories and also like what
Speaker 1: it looks like if you were just you know, a
Speaker 1: fly on the wall in this person's life, in this
Speaker 1: particular section of this person's full life. So if that's
Speaker 1: the case, then let's not concern ourselves with closing them
Speaker 1: out in a way that feels finite, do you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. It's not meant for you to feel like, oh, okay,
Speaker 1: I'm never going to see that character again. It's meant
Speaker 1: to feel like that character is living on in a
Speaker 1: universe that you just don't get, you just aren't privy
Speaker 1: to anymore. Yeah, that's all you kind of wanted to
Speaker 1: feel like, Yeah, that's I kind of feel like that
Speaker 1: when I watched my favorite shows on television. Now, you know,
Speaker 1: when you look back to them over and over again,
Speaker 1: it always feels good to just go back to that
Speaker 1: episode and see that they're doing the same thing over
Speaker 1: and over again, to timeloop and you could just go
Speaker 1: visit them and see how this boding. You know, I
Speaker 1: guess I like it with some of my shows get
Speaker 1: revived and you get to see what they're doing. You're
Speaker 1: going to update on them, But I feel like some
Speaker 1: people take that too far. So I like what you're
Speaker 1: saying to just consider them being in a universe somewhere
Speaker 1: where I just I'm not privy to what they're doing.
Speaker 1: And I think that's that's excellent ways to write. Do
Speaker 1: you You know, with your with your foundation with black
Speaker 1: boy Rights, black girl Rights, you have a lot of
Speaker 1: advice for your mentees about you know, how to be
Speaker 1: in the room and all that. Did you find yourself
Speaker 1: using any of the advice that you have been giving
Speaker 1: out as a mentor. I feel myself not using my
Speaker 1: own advice. Okay, you know how I'm sitting there giving
Speaker 1: them like page advice about like what to do. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I'm over here, like Mike, you're not even saying
Speaker 1: what you said what you told them to do, so
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? So I try to remember
Speaker 1: that I am a member of the writing staff and
Speaker 1: not not just like a fan anymore. So that kind
Speaker 1: of like those those nerves that you might have about
Speaker 1: feeling like, okay, is what are thing making sense? You know,
Speaker 1: you quickly have to kind of dispel so that you
Speaker 1: can be an effective communicator. Okay, So I'm gonna ask
Speaker 1: you two questions that you probably can't answer, and that's okay,
Speaker 1: what I want to ask of it. Hey, all right,
Speaker 1: you can ask where there were there any particular lines
Speaker 1: or anything that you wrote that we can listen for
Speaker 1: coming up, coming up. In Nah, I can't tell you
Speaker 1: that I care. There are a couple that I am
Speaker 1: particularly proud of, and I have to like wait to
Speaker 1: I have to remember if they even made the final cut.
Speaker 1: But there are and I'm not saying anything. Okay, Well
Speaker 1: we'll talk about it. We'll talk offline. Nobody's listening, right right.
Speaker 1: Um by next question is, um, so you've done insecure now,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? And that's you know, that's
Speaker 1: a pretty big feather in your cap. What do you
Speaker 1: want to do next? I have been so blessed and
Speaker 1: grateful to take on a few projects. I can't even
Speaker 1: talk about them yet. That's the thing. I can't talk
Speaker 1: about them that yet. They haven't been announced. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: as soon as they are, Ronald, you know, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: call you and be like, Yo, Ronald, what happened? This
Speaker 1: is what I was talking about? What I was talking about?
Speaker 1: So Mike. You know, I'm really glad that you took
Speaker 1: the time to be here. I consider you a friend
Speaker 1: to the show. You're the only guest that has returned,
Speaker 1: well except for Malcolm, of course, but you're the only
Speaker 1: gul You're the second that is that is Malcolm. Shout
Speaker 1: out to Malcolm Gladwell. But we're glad to have you back.
Speaker 1: Tell everybody how they can find you, and tell me
Speaker 1: more about the work that you're doing with Black Boy
Speaker 1: Rites and Black Girl Writes. Thank you. You can find
Speaker 1: me on Twitter at black Boy Writes. You can find
Speaker 1: me on Instagram also at black Boy Writes, but it's
Speaker 1: a period in between each letter. Blackboyris and Blackgy Rites
Speaker 1: is a mentorship initiative that I launched at the top
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty one to help writers of color gain
Speaker 1: access into the industry. You know, there are a lot
Speaker 1: of talented writers out there that just need the access.
Speaker 1: So please keep your eyes peeled for the twenty twenty
Speaker 1: two class of mentees. I'm very proud of the program
Speaker 1: and hope that it becomes like a mainstay in the Hollywood.
Speaker 1: I hope it does too, man, I hope this is
Speaker 1: the beginning of something very big for you and and
Speaker 1: I'm really proud of the work that you're doing. I'm
Speaker 1: really glad that you came back to the show, and
Speaker 1: thanks for coming back. Thank you, thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: Ronald now solvable listeners. Here's the episode we first published
Speaker 1: back in September of twenty twenty one about Mike Goyle's
Speaker 1: mentorship initiative Black Boy Rights, Black Girl Rights. This is solvable.
Speaker 1: I'm Ronald Young Junior. We should be allowed to take
Speaker 1: up space, not just allowed to take up space. We
Speaker 1: should just be taking up space ourselves because we deserve it.
Speaker 1: In recent years, calls for more diverse representation in Hollywood
Speaker 1: and show business have grown louder and more frequent, whether
Speaker 1: it's April Rain starting the hashtag oscar so white or
Speaker 1: writer director actor Issa Ray using her large following to
Speaker 1: be rooting for everybody black. There have been many public
Speaker 1: calls for action around and criticism of the lack of
Speaker 1: visibility for non white folks in Hollywood. Without visibility, there's
Speaker 1: no change. Without visibility, there's no access. So it's really
Speaker 1: about getting in front of as many eyes and ears
Speaker 1: as possible to get your story out there and in
Speaker 1: order to tell a story. You need to be in
Speaker 1: the room where stories are written, specifically writers rooms. According
Speaker 1: to a twenty seventeen report on representation in Hollywood and
Speaker 1: in Television, of nearly four thousand writers, four point eight
Speaker 1: percent of them were black, and over half of all
Speaker 1: shows have zero black writers. Mike Goyo is one of
Speaker 1: the very few who have made it to the inside.
Speaker 1: We're in this space now. We have to build out
Speaker 1: these programs for ourselves because if we don't build them out,
Speaker 1: everything will remain the same. So we have to kind
Speaker 1: of like take the initiative to do that. Goya's most
Speaker 1: recent job was writing for a little show on HBO.
Speaker 1: You might have heard me shout out on a previous
Speaker 1: solvable episode. That show is called Insecure and Today. Goyo
Speaker 1: is also the founder of a mentorship organization called Black
Speaker 1: Boy Rites and Black Girl Rights. They help burgeoning writers
Speaker 1: not only find their footing when entering a large white landscape,
Speaker 1: but also offer support and a network as they continue
Speaker 1: to grow their careers in Hollywood. The lack of creatives
Speaker 1: of color in positions of power in Hollywood is solvable.
Speaker 1: I met Etha early twenty fifteen, and like she had
Speaker 1: a mixer at her production company for Creatives of Color,
Speaker 1: and I went to that mixer, met her for all
Speaker 1: of two minutes. But Etha, I mean I credit her
Speaker 1: to helping me in my career. She has always helped
Speaker 1: up and coming creatives. And I met several people there
Speaker 1: that became my people, that became my tribe of people.
Speaker 1: She was like, you know, look to the people in
Speaker 1: the room to grow with, and that's exactly what I did,
Speaker 1: you know, and that is my group chat Like that
Speaker 1: is those are my people. We all came up at
Speaker 1: the same time, we all got staffed around the same time,
Speaker 1: we all continue to rise around the same time, and
Speaker 1: she really helped make that happen. So it's about how
Speaker 1: are all these creatives that are out here creative, the
Speaker 1: colors that are coming up in the business, how they're
Speaker 1: helping others come up. And I want to be able
Speaker 1: to do the same thing. Originally, you weren't going to
Speaker 1: be a writer, So tell me what your aspirations were
Speaker 1: or what your parents wanted you to be originally. You
Speaker 1: know what, I love that last minute correction there because
Speaker 1: it really was my parents. I was like, my aspirations,
Speaker 1: I don't think I knew what they were until my
Speaker 1: parents told me what they were. No. Yeah, I was,
Speaker 1: you know, being groomed to be a doctor by my parents,
Speaker 1: you know, from a young age. That's the road I
Speaker 1: went down. I didn't know anything else. But once I
Speaker 1: got to college and I started taking you know, theater
Speaker 1: classes and screenwriting classes, I was like, oh wow, I
Speaker 1: really enjoy this. I also came across you know, organic stream,
Speaker 1: was like, oh, okay, this is this is the enemy.
Speaker 1: Definitely not getting past this level. You're a child of
Speaker 1: Haitian immigrants, I am. The earthquake in Haiti in twenty ten,
Speaker 1: it bore some influence on making the switch from becoming
Speaker 1: a doctor to being fully focused on writing. Can you
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about that, Ronald this his research. Basically,
Speaker 1: what happened was my both my parents and my sister
Speaker 1: were in Haiti during the earthquake, so we couldn't have
Speaker 1: reached them for three days, so we were thinking the
Speaker 1: worst at the time. My little brother, who's he's twelve
Speaker 1: years younger than me, he was in my care at
Speaker 1: the time, so I'm also having to think of like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, like okay, my parents can't locate them.
Speaker 1: I'm like, you know, trying to put aside thoughts about
Speaker 1: like the idea of raising my little brother alone. So
Speaker 1: after discovering they were okay and everything was fine, and
Speaker 1: you know, they eventually flew back to the States. I
Speaker 1: really had an aha moment of like, just a life
Speaker 1: is too short to live for other people, and I
Speaker 1: was really kind of living for everyone else but myself.
Speaker 1: I was living for my parents. It just wasn't working
Speaker 1: for me. I was really kind of like honestly depressed.
Speaker 1: That's when I decided to change my major to the
Speaker 1: theater with a concentration in creative writing. And then I
Speaker 1: also came out in the same year to my parents too,
Speaker 1: so that was that was what was that like for them?
Speaker 1: I mean it was man when I when I changed
Speaker 1: career path, my mother cried, was like, I can't believe
Speaker 1: you're doing this. Oh you were, you know, on such
Speaker 1: a good path. Now you're writing. I don't even know
Speaker 1: what that is, what does that even mean? And then
Speaker 1: my dad was like, it's gonna be all right. Just
Speaker 1: let him fly, like, let him do what he wants
Speaker 1: to do. He was very supportive in that way. And
Speaker 1: then I was, oh, fantastic. And then later that year
Speaker 1: when I came out, like my dad was crying and
Speaker 1: my mom was like, let him do what he wants,
Speaker 1: like you said, let him be free. I love that.
Speaker 1: So yeah, that was really a pivotal year for me,
Speaker 1: not just in my career what would become my career,
Speaker 1: but in my life. You know, your story really resonates
Speaker 1: with me because I was in it for most of
Speaker 1: my adult life. I'm still fairly due to this job,
Speaker 1: so I I appreciate that. So Viking, that adjustment was
Speaker 1: something that it was easy to wrap my head around
Speaker 1: because it was my dream job. But there were some
Speaker 1: difficulties in terms of switching industries and learning the industry
Speaker 1: and learning the people around me. My granted, I don't
Speaker 1: think you did a career switch, but even starting in
Speaker 1: this career in this world, tell me what that world
Speaker 1: was like, especially for you a black man, Like, what
Speaker 1: was that like? Interacting with all these folks and even
Speaker 1: though it is your dream job, what was that like?
Speaker 1: After graduating college, I knew that I wanted to Purdue Television.
Speaker 1: I knew I want to move to LA So I
Speaker 1: was making plans to move to LA. While making those plans,
Speaker 1: I was working as a production assistant in Boston. You know,
Speaker 1: I worked on the Equalizer as a production assistant with
Speaker 1: Denzel Washington. I worked on American Idol. I worked on
Speaker 1: a few other reality TV shows. But when I was
Speaker 1: working on American Idol, who was in Boston for their
Speaker 1: Boston auditions, I happened to mention a production like, Hey,
Speaker 1: I'm moving to LA in a month, and I'm like, okay, great.
Speaker 1: Once he moved to La, come work with us, and
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, say no. More So, once I moved,
Speaker 1: I had a job which was which was great. But
Speaker 1: to your question, like when I got here, I felt like, Okay,
Speaker 1: this is the opportunity I was asking the universe for.
Speaker 1: So I need to kind of really focus and make
Speaker 1: some connections, start networking. Part of the my success has
Speaker 1: been building my network. And what I came to realize
Speaker 1: very quickly that my network will dictate my net worth
Speaker 1: in this business, and it's really about who you know
Speaker 1: as well as your talent. Some have been able to
Speaker 1: succeed with you know without both, but as if you're
Speaker 1: a person of color, you will most likely you will
Speaker 1: need both. It's far and being a person of color
Speaker 1: in this industry trying to come up and being able
Speaker 1: to create some type of like sustainable pathway program for
Speaker 1: other writers, or some type of like access that stays
Speaker 1: open for us is really important. So much of Hollywood
Speaker 1: is about who you know across all areas of work.
Speaker 1: Researchers have found that people in positions of power demonstrate
Speaker 1: unconscious bias. That's when we hire people who look like
Speaker 1: us or have a similar background or path the one
Speaker 1: we follow. Some people have a conscious bias too, of course,
Speaker 1: which leads to the same result. Doors shut to people
Speaker 1: of color in TV and film. The many white writers
Speaker 1: making it bring on other white writers, who in turn
Speaker 1: bring on more white writers. Only seven of every twenty
Speaker 1: writers is currently a person of color. Discrimination is perpetuated,
Speaker 1: Mike with your organization, black boy writes, black Girl writes,
Speaker 1: Are you seeking to create work and opportunities to overlooked
Speaker 1: folks in writing or is it more that you're trying
Speaker 1: to teach them about writing? Or is it both? It's
Speaker 1: really both. Once you're in the program, some of the
Speaker 1: features include writer round tables with other writers in the
Speaker 1: business who are established, and we try to invite as
Speaker 1: many people that feel like relay the to our mentees,
Speaker 1: imparting you know, tips about writing and also just like
Speaker 1: writer's room etiquette and things like that, like things you
Speaker 1: would normally you would not know unless you were in
Speaker 1: a writer's room. But it is also about providing access.
Speaker 1: You know, these conversations that we're having with these you know,
Speaker 1: established writers or like intimate conversations where they get to
Speaker 1: be free to ask any type of question they'd like
Speaker 1: to ask. They have some face time with the writers,
Speaker 1: They get the writers contact information so that they can
Speaker 1: contact them themselves and build like a personal their own
Speaker 1: like genuine personal relationship with that person. I try to
Speaker 1: provide them with access to securing general meetings with executives.
Speaker 1: It's really about creating a sense of visibility for them
Speaker 1: so that you can get the access that you need. Also,
Speaker 1: once the program is over, we have an alumni system
Speaker 1: where we're not going to let you just go off
Speaker 1: on your own and expect you to fly. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: like it's like it's that thing of like when a
Speaker 1: mother bird like watches there baby fly off the branch.
Speaker 1: They at least look down to make sure that they
Speaker 1: made it. Like that they're okay. So as soon as
Speaker 1: like the program's over and it's really just a year program.
Speaker 1: The intention is to keep up with all our alumni
Speaker 1: and make sure that they are okay, make sure they've
Speaker 1: made it, make sure that they still have what they need.
Speaker 1: So Mike, like you, you give them a lot, Like
Speaker 1: that's a lot for a person to get, like, especially
Speaker 1: starting off as a writer. I imagine that this has
Speaker 1: to be connected to something that you felt was lacking
Speaker 1: as you were coming up in the program, Like, Man,
Speaker 1: I wish it I had would have had this. I
Speaker 1: wonder if you have any stories or anything that are
Speaker 1: attached to what you did not have a kind of
Speaker 1: what you had to fight for an advocate for yourself
Speaker 1: growing up as a young black writer in the game.
Speaker 1: You know what the funny thing is, Ronald, It's it's
Speaker 1: because of what I had that I'm doing what I'm doing.
Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean? It's of people that
Speaker 1: came up before me who gave me a helping hand,
Speaker 1: do you know what I mean? And who like and
Speaker 1: pulled me up. Yes, I credit my career to hard
Speaker 1: work and to ambition, right, but I also credited to
Speaker 1: people who have been mentors of mine and who have
Speaker 1: kind of like helped me in my career, all I
Speaker 1: want to do is be able to like really pay
Speaker 1: that back, pay that forward. I just went ahead with
Speaker 1: that idea and started pursuing it. Mike Goyle was hardworking
Speaker 1: and fortunate. He was able to land a job when
Speaker 1: he first moved to LA He was able to mingle
Speaker 1: with successful black writers, and he could afford to take
Speaker 1: the time to show up in the places where they
Speaker 1: were and offered to take them out for coffee or drinks. Persistence, networking,
Speaker 1: playing the game. It all takes time and effort. Mike,
Speaker 1: how do you feel about the necessity of a POC
Speaker 1: community having to build our own networks in order to
Speaker 1: even stand a chance. That isn't necessarily the case for
Speaker 1: white folks, or it might be a little more naturally
Speaker 1: built in for white folks than it is for black
Speaker 1: folks who have to build our own network. I think
Speaker 1: you hit it right on the head and the last
Speaker 1: sentence there, it's like it's just they have been able
Speaker 1: to build it out in a way that we have
Speaker 1: not had the opportunity to, or when we have had
Speaker 1: the opportunity to, you know, Telsa, it getting burned down.
Speaker 1: So I think that right, I'm just saying we're getting real.
Speaker 1: I'm just saying, but yeah, it's it's it's it's it's
Speaker 1: not as natural for us, and that's why we have
Speaker 1: to continue to work at it. But it's this thing
Speaker 1: of like we're in this space now where we have
Speaker 1: to build out these programs for ourselves because if we
Speaker 1: don't build them out, everything will remain the same. So
Speaker 1: we have to kind of like take the initiative to
Speaker 1: do that. Do we have allies who want to help us, absolutely,
Speaker 1: but we still have to put ourselves in that space
Speaker 1: of building that out for ourselves. So I think some
Speaker 1: of the stats that come to Hollywood and writing and
Speaker 1: show business generally skew largely white. I mean a couple
Speaker 1: years ago we had that controversy of hashtag oscars so white,
Speaker 1: And in twenty nineteen twenty twenty, seventy percent of showrunners
Speaker 1: were men, eighty two percent were white. How does your
Speaker 1: program helping to address those types of issues or how
Speaker 1: do you how do you hope to address those types
Speaker 1: of issues in the future. It's really about like leveling
Speaker 1: the playing field and when it comes to access, and
Speaker 1: that's what I'm trying to provide with the program. Is
Speaker 1: creating the access so that there can be more showrunners
Speaker 1: of color, there can be more high level writers in
Speaker 1: the writers room who are people of color. Mike Like,
Speaker 1: I could totally see your program continuing to expand and
Speaker 1: fill these spaces in a major way. But one thing
Speaker 1: I'm thinking right now is that you also have an
Speaker 1: individual career. You're working on your own writing and growth
Speaker 1: and professional ambitions. So even though your mentorship program is
Speaker 1: clearly rewarding and important, the burden of this kind of
Speaker 1: work often falls on us as marginalized people to simultaneously
Speaker 1: lift each other up while lifting ourselves. And that's a
Speaker 1: lot of lifting, you know. I'm thinking about how a
Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago, we talked about this with doctor
Speaker 1: Joy Harden Bradford. She runs therapy for black girls, and
Speaker 1: she talked about how part of showing up for her
Speaker 1: community was also saying no from time to time and
Speaker 1: making time for herself. So how do you strike the
Speaker 1: balance between helping others and helping yourself? Ronald? You are
Speaker 1: asking all the right questions. You're asking questions that I
Speaker 1: think about on a daily basis, because right now, I mean,
Speaker 1: in terms of the program, it's been like a one
Speaker 1: man band. I have a producing partner. Her name is
Speaker 1: Ashley Aaronson. She's fantastic and who's really helped me build
Speaker 1: out the program. She's helped me build the site like
Speaker 1: she has been fantastic. But the thing is, for the
Speaker 1: most part, it's just been myself putting this program together.
Speaker 1: And I had some time in between jobs to really
Speaker 1: be there for my mentees. And I continue to be
Speaker 1: there for my mentees. But am currently in a writer's
Speaker 1: room now in the process of contract negotiations over something
Speaker 1: that I'm extremely excited about and we'll share later down
Speaker 1: the line. And I'm like pitching TV shows and features.
Speaker 1: It's just there isn't a lot of time, so I
Speaker 1: have had to be very conscious of how I allocate
Speaker 1: my time so that I'm making time for what matters
Speaker 1: to me. Let's look five to ten years down the line,
Speaker 1: what does success look like for you, Mike personally, and
Speaker 1: what does it look like for the program and for
Speaker 1: black folks in writing in show business. If everything is
Speaker 1: successful as you as you hope for it to be
Speaker 1: more content about people of color who are experiencing, you know,
Speaker 1: different things. We're not monolithic, you know, we live varied experiences.
Speaker 1: Several shows can exist about you know, a group of
Speaker 1: friends and there not be one girlfriends or one insecure,
Speaker 1: or you know, or one living single. You know what
Speaker 1: I mean equality in the sense of, like the higher ups,
Speaker 1: what it looks like, What those numbers look like that
Speaker 1: you mentioned earlier, like having more women of color running shows,
Speaker 1: having more LGPTQ individuals of color running shows. Those things
Speaker 1: are important, So it looks like true equality, and it
Speaker 1: looks like a television slate that's not monolithic or not
Speaker 1: only catering to one type of way of being black.
Speaker 1: And what about you personally? Of course, I want the
Speaker 1: program to continue to flourish. I want to be able
Speaker 1: to expand the program to like colleges and high schools,
Speaker 1: create a scholarship fund for young aspiring writers to have
Speaker 1: access to tools that they need in order to get
Speaker 1: to where they want to be. That can take someone
Speaker 1: who's ten and has a dream, and you know, take
Speaker 1: them all the way into the writer's room once they're ready.
Speaker 1: So I w point out that I asked about your
Speaker 1: personal goals and where you are five to ten years,
Speaker 1: if you still talked about your program, which is that's
Speaker 1: not that's crazy. It's almost like you're right. Um, I'm
Speaker 1: I'm truly always thinking about it myself, myself creating shows,
Speaker 1: of course. I mean I want, you know, to have
Speaker 1: my own shows on air. I want to be able
Speaker 1: to support other writers who have fantastic ideas who just
Speaker 1: can't get a shot, you know, build out more programs
Speaker 1: to help other writers get to where they'd like to be. Like,
Speaker 1: I love it. I'm not bad at it. I mean,
Speaker 1: that's it. You know. I just got here. Okay, I
Speaker 1: just got here, and I'm grateful to be here. So
Speaker 1: what can our listeners do to help I'm listening to
Speaker 1: this and I'm like, man, I want to really support
Speaker 1: I care about black representation in writer's room. Maybe I'm
Speaker 1: somebody who loved Insecure and like, man, I'd love to
Speaker 1: see more things like that on television. At the same time,
Speaker 1: what can listeners do to help support this? Listen, there's
Speaker 1: like over four hundred shows on air, So when we're
Speaker 1: putting our shows on air and we're actually getting a shot,
Speaker 1: watch that would that would really help To watch these
Speaker 1: shows and even beyond watching the show, look them up
Speaker 1: see ways in which you can like help support their
Speaker 1: careers specifically with the program. You know, if anyone out
Speaker 1: there would like to reach out who are interested in investing,
Speaker 1: and you know, I like the idea of this program
Speaker 1: existing and living on for many years, please feel free
Speaker 1: to reach out to me and contact me. Because without visibility,
Speaker 1: there's no change. Without visibility, there's no access. So it's
Speaker 1: really about getting in front of as many eyes and
Speaker 1: ears as possible to get your story out there to
Speaker 1: be able to build that support. Do you have any
Speaker 1: reading resources to help become a sharper writer, or anything
Speaker 1: to become a stronger networker, anything that helped you persevere
Speaker 1: in your journey. Oh my god, Podcasts, the Writer's Room,
Speaker 1: the Screenwriter's Room. I don't know if you know Hilliard
Speaker 1: guests like he Hilliard is fantastic. He has a fantastic podcast.
Speaker 1: The WGA has a great podcast. One of the first
Speaker 1: screenwriting books I ever got with a Screenwriter's Bible. I
Speaker 1: suggest every writer have that though. I really listened to
Speaker 1: like podcasts, podcast word my thing, Mike. This has been
Speaker 1: an incredible conversation. Thank you so much for taking the
Speaker 1: time to be with us, Ronald. Thank you so much
Speaker 1: for having me. This was great. Thank you guys for
Speaker 1: reaching out. Mike Oyo is a television writer and founder
Speaker 1: of Black Boy Rights Black Girl Rights mentorship program. Solvable
Speaker 1: is produced by Jocelyn Frank, research by David Jah, booking
Speaker 1: by Lisa Dunn. Our managing producer is Sasha Matthias, and
Speaker 1: our executive producer is Mio Lobel. I'm Ronald Young Junior.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening.