WEBVTT - Sting 0:00:02.200 --> 0:00:05.400 Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the 0:00:05.440 --> 0:00:09.040 Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan Runtag, but 0:00:09.240 --> 0:00:13.360 enough about me. My guest today has won seventeen Grammys 0:00:13.520 --> 0:00:16.400 and sold over a hundred million records by my count, 0:00:16.680 --> 0:00:18.840 both as a solo artist and as a member of 0:00:18.840 --> 0:00:22.200 the police. For over forty years now. His work has 0:00:22.200 --> 0:00:25.360 been a bridge between music of all different cultures, so 0:00:25.400 --> 0:00:28.000 it's fitting that his latest record is called The Bridge. 0:00:28.840 --> 0:00:31.120 Like so many artists over the last two years, he 0:00:31.200 --> 0:00:33.320 began working on this album as a kind of self 0:00:33.360 --> 0:00:37.160 therapy while in lockdown. Before long, a loose theme began 0:00:37.200 --> 0:00:40.600 to emerge. The songs are populated by characters in a 0:00:40.680 --> 0:00:44.600 state of transition, an unsettling place between life and death, 0:00:45.000 --> 0:00:49.880 health and sickness, between relationships, between worlds, all looking for 0:00:50.000 --> 0:00:53.480 the bridge to a future that's safer and happier. Though 0:00:53.479 --> 0:00:56.200 the forward thinking musician has long been a champion of 0:00:56.360 --> 0:01:00.680 environmental and humanitarian causes, this desire for a writer future 0:01:00.840 --> 0:01:05.240 certainly feels more acute in two, but the serious subject 0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:07.920 matter is bolstered by some of the strongest melodies he's 0:01:07.959 --> 0:01:11.560 crafted in years. The lead single, if It's Love opens 0:01:11.600 --> 0:01:14.800 with a Whistle, a first in his extensive back catalog. 0:01:14.880 --> 0:01:17.480 As near as I can tell, it's a welcome note 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:21.640 of whimsical optimism amid a deeply thought provoking record both 0:01:21.680 --> 0:01:25.440 intimate and immediate. The Bridge stands proud alongside his formidable 0:01:25.480 --> 0:01:29.479 list of classics. I'm so happy to welcome to the show, Sting. 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:32.280 I hope you enjoy our conversation as much as I did. 0:01:37.840 --> 0:01:41.320 Your new album, The Bridge is fantastic. It's it's a 0:01:41.400 --> 0:01:43.680 much needed adventure for those of us stuck at home. 0:01:43.720 --> 0:01:46.640 I mean, it's so vary musically and emotionally. I can't 0:01:46.640 --> 0:01:49.040 begin to tell you how much I enjoyed it. Well, 0:01:49.040 --> 0:01:51.080 that's a very good start to an interview. Thank you. 0:01:51.160 --> 0:01:56.160 I'm flatted. Um. The album, I mean, it came together 0:01:56.240 --> 0:01:59.600 during the pandemic for someone who's been on tour and 0:02:00.440 --> 0:02:02.440 on the move really more or less for for so 0:02:02.480 --> 0:02:06.000 many years. Did the opportunity to sit still more comparatively speaking, 0:02:06.000 --> 0:02:09.840 I guess impact you creatively. I think, to be honest, 0:02:09.919 --> 0:02:14.160 making an album is usually usually cloised, it away for 0:02:14.200 --> 0:02:17.080 weeks on end in the same place, So it actually 0:02:17.160 --> 0:02:21.000 isn't that much of a novelty for for recording artists 0:02:21.000 --> 0:02:24.920 to be stuck. It's very hard to make albums on 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:28.600 the road. We tried but failed. Um, So in a 0:02:28.639 --> 0:02:33.280 way it was it was a way to cope with lockdown, um, 0:02:33.320 --> 0:02:36.160 even though I was out of my work cycle you know, 0:02:36.200 --> 0:02:43.160 which is recording, uh, touring, thinking recording, you know. Um, 0:02:43.200 --> 0:02:46.760 this was halfway through the the the touring cycle. So 0:02:47.560 --> 0:02:51.320 I just said, okay, this is the universe saying you 0:02:51.360 --> 0:02:53.160 have to get back in the studio and do some 0:02:53.200 --> 0:02:56.520 work otherwise you go completely nuts. To ask you more 0:02:56.520 --> 0:02:58.919 about the title the Bridge, It's a metaphor of that 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:01.640 that crops up at one form or another throughout the album, 0:03:01.680 --> 0:03:04.600 and it's certainly a time they want, given the unsettled, 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:07.960 uncertain world that we all find ourselves in unfortunately these days. 0:03:08.120 --> 0:03:09.920 Can you tell me more about what the bridge means 0:03:09.960 --> 0:03:13.280 to you? It's a it's a useful metaphor, and as 0:03:13.320 --> 0:03:16.480 you say, it does recur on on the record in 0:03:16.560 --> 0:03:20.760 almost every song. I think all the characters I'm writing 0:03:20.800 --> 0:03:25.920 about are in some sort of transition, um, between love affairs, 0:03:26.040 --> 0:03:29.680 between life and death, health and sickness, as as we 0:03:29.760 --> 0:03:34.800 all are, of course in in this current um climate 0:03:35.000 --> 0:03:38.920 of crisis. You know, the climate crisis, the pandemic, you know, 0:03:38.960 --> 0:03:43.400 the political crisis. All of us are looking towards a 0:03:43.600 --> 0:03:47.480 route to a safer future. Um. We have different ideas 0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:49.839 of what what that is, but we're all looking for it. 0:03:49.840 --> 0:03:53.440 It's a it's a metaphor. It's um, you know, a bridge. 0:03:53.440 --> 0:03:55.880 It's it's a it's a spiritual bridge if you like. 0:03:56.720 --> 0:04:01.400 Whatever that means that the vacant concept. But um, it's 0:04:01.480 --> 0:04:05.200 something we we searched for. It's not iron or steel. 0:04:05.280 --> 0:04:10.200 It's just it's just hopefully there. And you've said that 0:04:10.240 --> 0:04:12.320 this theme kind of revealed itself to you sort of 0:04:12.400 --> 0:04:14.280 late in the process when you're looking back at that 0:04:14.400 --> 0:04:16.880 the songs that that you've that you've written so far. 0:04:17.440 --> 0:04:19.359 Is that a regular occurrence for you? Do you often 0:04:19.360 --> 0:04:22.440 finish the song and read it back and learn something 0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:25.960 about yourself, almost like a good dream reading or something. Well, once, 0:04:26.080 --> 0:04:29.359 once I've finished, you know a fair number of the songs, 0:04:29.440 --> 0:04:32.120 I will lay them out and look at them and 0:04:32.120 --> 0:04:36.080 see if there's any connecting tissue between them. And I'm 0:04:36.080 --> 0:04:40.679 often surprised that there is. And because it's the songs 0:04:40.720 --> 0:04:45.640 are created subconsciously. Um. And this theme of the bridge 0:04:45.760 --> 0:04:49.560 came after looking at a nine or so songs, and 0:04:49.600 --> 0:04:53.159 then I wrote the song called the Bridge. So in 0:04:53.200 --> 0:04:55.280 a way, that was it was organic in that in 0:04:55.279 --> 0:04:57.480 that sense, it wasn't like I started off with an 0:04:57.520 --> 0:05:01.400 agenda at all. I was just allowing the music to 0:05:01.440 --> 0:05:05.280 tell me a story. And if you allow allow it 0:05:05.320 --> 0:05:07.960 to if you if you allow that process to happen, um, 0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:12.880 you know, miraculously it appears. And I don't quite understand 0:05:12.920 --> 0:05:16.039 how or why, but not being lucky enough for it 0:05:16.200 --> 0:05:19.919 happened on a number of occasions. I mean, your songs 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:23.520 are so character driven, and they say and in screenwriting 0:05:23.520 --> 0:05:25.880 that the characters tend to write themselves after a while, 0:05:25.920 --> 0:05:28.599 they sort of behave according to their own internal logic 0:05:28.680 --> 0:05:30.839 that you've given them and almost take it from there. 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:32.680 Do you find that in the case and your songs 0:05:32.680 --> 0:05:35.280 that the characters almost wind up in the driver's seat 0:05:35.320 --> 0:05:38.359 by the end of the writing session actually do and 0:05:38.600 --> 0:05:43.080 it's driven by rhyme? I think rime is a very 0:05:43.080 --> 0:05:48.400 interesting phenomena in music. Uh, there's a there's a truth 0:05:48.440 --> 0:05:51.360 to rhyme. You know, when things rhyme, we tend to 0:05:52.600 --> 0:05:56.160 accept them as being gospel, you know. I mean that 0:05:56.360 --> 0:05:59.800 maybe a trick. At the same time, there is a 0:06:00.040 --> 0:06:04.680 rus to rhyme, and if you follow a rhyme scheme, um, 0:06:04.720 --> 0:06:07.960 the mystery of a story opening out is it becomes 0:06:08.080 --> 0:06:11.760 very apparent. You know. I started one song called the 0:06:12.040 --> 0:06:14.839 Bells of St. Thomas, you know, with just one line 0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:17.800 I woke up in some rich woman's bed, and then 0:06:18.520 --> 0:06:22.240 the rhyme just kept, you know, opening our possibilities for 0:06:22.279 --> 0:06:25.800 this character to explore. And I had no idea what 0:06:25.880 --> 0:06:28.440 it was about when I was writing it. I'm still 0:06:28.520 --> 0:06:32.520 not sure, but it's kind of evocative. I think, what 0:06:32.640 --> 0:06:34.840 an opener. I woke up in Antwerp and some rich 0:06:34.880 --> 0:06:37.880 woman's bad I was going to ask him, no, no, 0:06:38.000 --> 0:06:42.480 it's not biographic, but um, you know, it's not a 0:06:42.520 --> 0:06:46.160 lot of time in Antwerp. Um. It's an interesting city 0:06:46.279 --> 0:06:49.760 sort of it's in Belgium, but it's also very Dutch, 0:06:50.120 --> 0:06:52.440 and it's on the on the coast to the North Sea, 0:06:52.480 --> 0:06:54.560 and it just has a has a mood about it 0:06:54.600 --> 0:06:58.360 that is kind of what's the word, it's mysterious. It's 0:06:58.360 --> 0:07:02.880 a mysterious town. It's also where you know, the Flemish 0:07:02.960 --> 0:07:06.800 artists lived, which became another strand in the story of 0:07:07.600 --> 0:07:13.200 the work of Peter Rubens. I love how these historical 0:07:13.240 --> 0:07:15.520 figures crop up in in some of these songs. I mean, 0:07:15.520 --> 0:07:17.160 one of my favorite tracks on the record is the 0:07:17.160 --> 0:07:19.680 Book of Numbers, inspired by to me, one of the 0:07:19.720 --> 0:07:23.480 most compelling historical figures, Robert Oppenheimer. Can you talk a 0:07:23.480 --> 0:07:27.119 little more about about the story in that song, because 0:07:27.280 --> 0:07:30.560 it's so powerful to me. Well, Oppenheimer has has dropped 0:07:30.640 --> 0:07:34.360 up twice in my work, once in Russians Um many 0:07:34.440 --> 0:07:38.080 years ago, and this time he appears as a ghost 0:07:38.440 --> 0:07:44.320 UM haunting I suspect the bar near Los Alamos out 0:07:44.320 --> 0:07:47.880 in the desert, and he's the ghost is haunted by 0:07:47.960 --> 0:07:51.840 the idea that he needs to repent for what what 0:07:51.960 --> 0:07:56.120 he's invented. You know, there's a wonderful YouTube footage of 0:07:56.120 --> 0:08:01.600 Oppenheimer talking um with an incredible will, regret and compassion 0:08:02.480 --> 0:08:06.920 um recording the bag bad geta. You know, I you see, 0:08:06.960 --> 0:08:10.920 I'm become deaf and he could not reconcile what it 0:08:11.040 --> 0:08:15.080 invented with his humanity, and that that tragedy is kind 0:08:15.080 --> 0:08:19.800 of stays with stays with me. Oh, it's an incredible 0:08:19.840 --> 0:08:22.440 clip for anyone listening who hasn't seen it. I recommend 0:08:22.440 --> 0:08:26.160 watching it. It is uh trying to read the emotions 0:08:26.200 --> 0:08:28.560 on his face as he as he said, just to 0:08:28.640 --> 0:08:32.760 rationalize inventing, you know, unleashing inadvertently the atomic bomb in 0:08:32.800 --> 0:08:37.319 the world and what it's real world repercussions. It's um, 0:08:37.360 --> 0:08:40.320 it's a study in character and a study and emotion. 0:08:40.400 --> 0:08:43.200 It's pretty extraordinary. I mean I called it the Book 0:08:43.200 --> 0:08:45.400 of Numbers because you know, it's one of the first 0:08:45.559 --> 0:08:49.720 books of the Bible, and it's it concerns the wandering 0:08:49.720 --> 0:08:54.800 in the desert and the census where they counted the tribe, 0:08:54.840 --> 0:08:58.440 but they counted everything, which I can I thought to 0:08:58.520 --> 0:09:01.720 be the metaphor for the beginning of math, you know, 0:09:01.760 --> 0:09:04.560 on the beginning of math leads to leads the science, 0:09:04.559 --> 0:09:08.640 and science eventually leads to the ability to destroy ourselves. 0:09:08.640 --> 0:09:13.360 So uh, it's it's a it's an interesting conundrum being 0:09:13.440 --> 0:09:17.880 a human being, absolutely, I guess. On on the on 0:09:17.920 --> 0:09:21.600 the flip side of the desert water is a recurring 0:09:21.640 --> 0:09:23.840 theme on this record as well. I mean, having grown 0:09:23.920 --> 0:09:26.040 up I think quite literally in the shadow of a shipyard, 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:30.240 I imagine that must be a really primal touchdown for you. Yeah, 0:09:30.240 --> 0:09:32.680 I was born right next to the river on the 0:09:32.720 --> 0:09:36.560 shipyard and quite close to the North Sea, and I'm 0:09:36.760 --> 0:09:42.760 very very attracted toward I'm also very afraid of water. Um. 0:09:43.040 --> 0:09:49.960 I think it's a fearsome element. Traditionally it symbolizes the feminine. 0:09:50.280 --> 0:09:54.000 Um symbolizes the subconscious and both of those things that 0:09:54.080 --> 0:09:58.880 I'm deeply interested in. And um, as you say, water 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:01.120 crops up again and then again in this and on 0:10:01.200 --> 0:10:09.200 this album as sacrament as a cleansing agent. Uh news. Yeah, 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:12.319 what is a powerful symbol for me. It's a lot 0:10:12.320 --> 0:10:14.760 of I mean hearing you say that water is related 0:10:14.800 --> 0:10:17.000 to to the feminine, that's sort of feminine energy I 0:10:17.000 --> 0:10:19.240 feel like on this this album as well. I mean, 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:22.520 you know, from the broken Promise of Captain Bateman to 0:10:22.800 --> 0:10:26.360 you know, reference referencing God's daughter and rushing water and 0:10:27.120 --> 0:10:30.760 as in addition to the many water references in general. 0:10:31.000 --> 0:10:32.920 It's interesting to me that you say that because I 0:10:33.040 --> 0:10:35.400 thinking back now, I can I pick up on a 0:10:35.400 --> 0:10:39.320 lot of those references. Well, I'm glad you do. You know, 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:45.200 I'm essentially agnostic. I don't belong to a faith. Agnostic 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:49.560 meaning I don't know, but um, you know, I used 0:10:49.559 --> 0:10:52.439 the word spiritual before, but I think I'm going to 0:10:52.600 --> 0:10:58.760 only define spirituality as curiosity. I'm curious about why we're here, 0:10:58.800 --> 0:11:03.160 about what what this whole thing is. And that's my spirituality, 0:11:03.280 --> 0:11:19.960 not not any dogma, just curious. We had, of all 0:11:19.960 --> 0:11:22.000 of the songs and all the characters on this record, 0:11:22.000 --> 0:11:23.600 the one that seemed to me to have the most 0:11:23.640 --> 0:11:25.880 of you, and it was seemed to be Harmony Road. 0:11:26.120 --> 0:11:30.319 Uh assessment. I do come from the wrong side of 0:11:30.360 --> 0:11:35.920 the tracks, um and managing it like that. Well, managed 0:11:35.960 --> 0:11:41.160 to escape my postal code or what what was signified 0:11:41.200 --> 0:11:47.840 by that through music, through education. But I've never forgotten 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:53.000 my humble upbringing, and I think that story is a 0:11:53.160 --> 0:11:56.080 you know, a powerful one. It's a powerful archetype for 0:11:56.120 --> 0:11:59.760 all of us that you can move out of your 0:12:00.559 --> 0:12:04.160 uh predicament if you like. So. Yeah, how Many Road 0:12:04.280 --> 0:12:07.600 is kind of biographical though I never stole a car, 0:12:10.679 --> 0:12:14.040 not once. Well, we'll put that out there, put that 0:12:14.080 --> 0:12:16.800 on record. I mean a lot of touchstones. Do you 0:12:16.880 --> 0:12:18.440 bring me the hills at the border too, I mean 0:12:18.480 --> 0:12:21.000 those hills up by Scotland near Hadrian's Wall. I mean 0:12:21.000 --> 0:12:24.880 that area must also have a strong connection for you. Yeah, 0:12:24.960 --> 0:12:28.640 we know, I come from a border town that changed 0:12:28.679 --> 0:12:31.880 hands between the English and the Scots over hundreds of 0:12:31.920 --> 0:12:33.920 years and the Vikings, and you know, it was a 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:36.800 war zone basically after the Romans left, there was this 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:41.520 war zone. And um, that natural border between England and 0:12:41.600 --> 0:12:46.000 Scotland was was haunted by ghosts as well as bandits 0:12:46.480 --> 0:12:49.600 and in clans who would you know, rape and pillage 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:51.679 a lot. So there's a lot of there are a 0:12:51.679 --> 0:12:54.800 lot of battles fought. And I just wrote a ghost 0:12:54.840 --> 0:12:58.559 story about those hills that they're they're kind of mysterious achieving. 0:12:58.640 --> 0:13:02.520 It's you're gonna you're gonna hang up on me for 0:13:02.559 --> 0:13:05.120 this question. Do you are you open to spirits? Do 0:13:05.160 --> 0:13:07.760 you believe in I had to think they call them ghosts? 0:13:07.880 --> 0:13:10.520 But do you do you feel those presents and interact 0:13:10.520 --> 0:13:12.559 with them or is that something that you more are 0:13:12.640 --> 0:13:16.640 open to but haven't really seen much of firsthand experience of. Well, 0:13:16.720 --> 0:13:22.480 once again, I'm I'm agnostic. I don't know. UM, certainly 0:13:22.480 --> 0:13:25.839 a possibility that are that there are other realms than 0:13:25.880 --> 0:13:28.960 the ones we perceive. Um, you know, we have a 0:13:29.000 --> 0:13:37.280 limited range of perception visually, and perhaps these rooms exist. 0:13:37.640 --> 0:13:39.880 I just don't know, you know, I know one of 0:13:39.960 --> 0:13:42.559 a note vibrates. You know, at a certain frequency, you 0:13:42.679 --> 0:13:45.560 get harmonics. They keep going up and up and up, 0:13:45.840 --> 0:13:48.199 and we can only hear a certain level of them. 0:13:48.240 --> 0:13:51.520 But I'm assuming that they keep going up, so vibration 0:13:51.679 --> 0:13:56.160 keeps getting, you know, higher and higher. So I don't know, 0:13:57.120 --> 0:14:00.960 I really don't. That's a great, very very practical answer. 0:14:01.000 --> 0:14:02.600 I feel. I feel like there's a lot of makes 0:14:02.640 --> 0:14:04.760 a lot of practical sense that their realms that that 0:14:04.840 --> 0:14:08.480 we can't perceive or experience. Yeah, I mean, I'd like 0:14:08.559 --> 0:14:10.880 to believe it. Um. I think it's a it's a 0:14:10.960 --> 0:14:16.480 lovely idea. But again, I'm just curious. I'm thinking in 0:14:16.480 --> 0:14:18.520 the last few years, I guess, prior to the pandemic, 0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:21.520 we revisited your past work on on my songs, the album, 0:14:21.560 --> 0:14:24.680 and the tour and the and the Vegas resident residency 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:28.920 and your audio only memoir Upon reflection, Did revisiting those 0:14:28.920 --> 0:14:31.720 pieces from your past uh set the stage in any 0:14:31.720 --> 0:14:34.200 way for the bridge? Was there a link between contrasting 0:14:34.280 --> 0:14:37.600 the then and the now? I don't think I do 0:14:37.640 --> 0:14:41.320 it as as obviously as that, but I'm kind of 0:14:41.400 --> 0:14:44.920 intrigued when I when I do hear my music by accident, 0:14:45.280 --> 0:14:47.800 you know, I found in the shop and they're playing 0:14:47.800 --> 0:14:49.520 a song of mine. It'll take me a while before 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:52.080 I recognize it, and my wife will say, that's that's 0:14:52.080 --> 0:14:55.280 you on the on the sound system, so oh yeah, 0:14:55.440 --> 0:14:59.040 And then I listen and I'm always kind of surprised 0:14:59.080 --> 0:15:02.640 by the decisions I might have made as a younger musician. 0:15:02.800 --> 0:15:05.280 You know, how did I know that? How did I 0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:10.160 know to go to that chord there? That's interesting? So yeah, 0:15:10.280 --> 0:15:13.160 but I don't often do it. Um that my song 0:15:13.200 --> 0:15:16.880 has forced me to do that. That that the concept 0:15:16.920 --> 0:15:20.480 of going going back and re recording them with the 0:15:20.560 --> 0:15:26.720 knowledge that we now have, um, musical knowledge, technical knowledge, 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:30.000 whatever it is, to try and make them not better, 0:15:30.040 --> 0:15:33.080 but just different and reflecting who I am right now? 0:15:35.520 --> 0:15:38.200 When when you do right do you get more inspiration? 0:15:38.240 --> 0:15:43.440 Looking outward or looking inward? I turned to want to 0:15:43.440 --> 0:15:48.960 write about characters other than me at the moment. I think, 0:15:49.120 --> 0:15:51.640 you know, a singer songwriter, I can get very kind 0:15:51.640 --> 0:15:57.960 of naval intensive, you know. Um, so it's more interesting 0:15:58.040 --> 0:16:00.400 to put yourself in someone else's shoot is I think 0:16:00.440 --> 0:16:03.440 songs are great empathy machines. You know, you you look 0:16:03.480 --> 0:16:08.400 at the world through someone else's eyes and and see 0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:10.880 it from that point of view, So in a way 0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:14.680 it's a useful psychological exercise. But of course then you 0:16:14.800 --> 0:16:17.560 also bring your own you know, your own biases in 0:16:17.600 --> 0:16:21.520 your your own subconscious comes into the process. So it 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:25.880 can never be entirely without without a personal element. But 0:16:26.360 --> 0:16:28.960 that really is what you know. I listened to music 0:16:29.720 --> 0:16:32.080 and I asked the music to tell me a story. 0:16:32.680 --> 0:16:38.080 H it's generally about somebody else, not me. This is 0:16:38.440 --> 0:16:40.600 sort of a corlery to that question, and it's gonna 0:16:40.720 --> 0:16:43.440 betray the fact that I've never been able to successfully 0:16:43.440 --> 0:16:45.800 write a song in my life. What is it that 0:16:45.800 --> 0:16:47.920 compels you to write in the first place? Is it 0:16:47.960 --> 0:16:50.360 a desire to connect with other people or is it 0:16:50.440 --> 0:16:53.560 something a little more introverted, like a desire to excavate 0:16:54.160 --> 0:16:58.120 an expouse or feelings. Well, it is my bridge to 0:16:58.960 --> 0:17:03.240 people in general, music and singing, and I have a 0:17:03.320 --> 0:17:06.800 voice that so I have a vehicle to express it in. 0:17:06.960 --> 0:17:10.000 And then that seems to be a fairly successful mode 0:17:10.000 --> 0:17:15.720 of expression. Um, but I am fairly introverted, even though 0:17:15.760 --> 0:17:20.159 I'm a performer. You know, the act of performance across 0:17:20.240 --> 0:17:22.240 you cross the line and you become the opposite of 0:17:22.240 --> 0:17:25.960 what you are most of the performers I know this 0:17:26.080 --> 0:17:29.119 way too. They're not people who immediately want to be 0:17:29.160 --> 0:17:31.720 the center of attention in a room at all. They 0:17:31.800 --> 0:17:36.120 observe and and I'm one of those people. I'm quite shy. 0:17:38.119 --> 0:17:40.600 Are you superstitious at all when it comes to songwriting? 0:17:40.600 --> 0:17:42.840 Do you have certain rituals or do you feel at 0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:45.280 a certain time of the day he's more inspiring or 0:17:45.320 --> 0:17:49.000 a room or an instrument. Can I kind of avoid it, 0:17:49.080 --> 0:17:51.800 you know, as often as I can. It's it's not 0:17:51.840 --> 0:17:56.639 an easy process. Facing a blank page is terrifying, and 0:17:57.040 --> 0:17:59.800 you know, the whole process is fraught by that acause 0:17:59.800 --> 0:18:02.639 I will I will I be able to write a 0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:04.399 song as good as the one I've just written. You know, 0:18:04.400 --> 0:18:07.200 You're happy for a few minutes, and then you go, now, 0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:10.639 what what what do I have to say? Uh? What? 0:18:10.640 --> 0:18:14.840 What will be useful? I love songs to have a um, 0:18:14.960 --> 0:18:19.879 a utility, you know, beyond just amusing myself. It's a 0:18:19.960 --> 0:18:24.880 nice one. They're used for campaigns, like, you know, even 0:18:24.920 --> 0:18:27.240 as a joke, don't stand so close to me was 0:18:27.359 --> 0:18:31.680 used as the part of the you know, the COVID warning, 0:18:31.720 --> 0:18:36.879 you know, just to keep your distance. You know, I 0:18:37.000 --> 0:18:40.160 enjoyed that. You know, song songs can have a utility. 0:18:41.680 --> 0:18:43.800 Is it a daily practice for you writing? And the 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:46.560 way that some people jog or swim or do yoga, 0:18:46.600 --> 0:18:49.119 is that's something that you've incorporated into your your daily 0:18:49.119 --> 0:18:51.080 life in one way or another. No, I say, I 0:18:51.119 --> 0:18:54.400 avoid it. It's just a certain point of the year 0:18:54.640 --> 0:18:57.800 and I know I have to knuckle down and actually right, 0:18:59.200 --> 0:19:03.800 you know, I kind of open to inspiration. I think 0:19:03.840 --> 0:19:07.040 you have to put yourself in a state of open 0:19:07.119 --> 0:19:11.280 necess state of receptivity. Uh, and ideas come to you. 0:19:11.320 --> 0:19:14.600 A line will come to you, a melody, and then 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:18.800 you build from that. You know, songs begin in a 0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:22.959 very modest way. It's like one little step on baby 0:19:23.000 --> 0:19:24.879 step and not at least two another, and then you 0:19:24.960 --> 0:19:29.480 end up with something sometimes fairly complex from that process. 0:19:29.560 --> 0:19:33.879 But again, it's a mystery Jordan's It's totally a mystery 0:19:33.920 --> 0:19:46.840 to me as a fan of yours and a passionate 0:19:46.840 --> 0:19:50.040 amateur basis myself. Speaking of superstition, I want to ask 0:19:50.040 --> 0:19:53.439 you about your mainstay, your your workhorse, the your p bass. 0:19:53.440 --> 0:19:56.159 It's one of the most iconic instruments this side of 0:19:56.160 --> 0:20:00.159 Paul McCartney's Hoffner What is it about that instrument that 0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:04.120 that keeps you, you know, married to it. UM's it's 0:20:04.200 --> 0:20:09.480 from so we're kind of almost the same age. It's 0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:12.880 been pretty battered over the years, a bit like me, 0:20:14.000 --> 0:20:17.320 and it's my It's my bruised little brother. You know. 0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:22.399 It has a growl about it has a spirit about it, 0:20:22.440 --> 0:20:25.280 you know. I'm Leo Fender actually must have wound the 0:20:25.280 --> 0:20:27.960 pickup himself and probably put it on a naze and 0:20:28.000 --> 0:20:30.560 made it so it has that sense of history. But 0:20:30.640 --> 0:20:33.000 I think every note that's ever been played on it 0:20:33.040 --> 0:20:37.639 is somehow, you know, embedded in the instrument itself. And 0:20:39.320 --> 0:20:42.200 I love it. Mind you. I did a bass solo 0:20:42.280 --> 0:20:45.240 on this album, but I played it on a Fretless bass, 0:20:45.359 --> 0:20:49.800 not not my normal favorite. I have a Founder Fretless 0:20:49.840 --> 0:20:53.760 that was a copy of Jacko's bass, which I love. 0:20:54.240 --> 0:20:58.680 Oh wow, you you knew him, didn't he? I think 0:20:58.720 --> 0:21:01.600 I read somewhere that you hung out in in Miami 0:21:01.640 --> 0:21:03.680 and we're we're friendly with him. What what was Jaco 0:21:03.800 --> 0:21:06.600 like to to be with one on one? Jacko came 0:21:06.680 --> 0:21:08.679 to see the police a couple of times, and uh, 0:21:09.359 --> 0:21:13.280 we used to exchange from course late at night, you know, 0:21:13.320 --> 0:21:16.160 he'd bring me up like four in the morning. I say, 0:21:16.359 --> 0:21:18.359 Jacko's four in the morning, said no, man, it's not 0:21:18.400 --> 0:21:25.640 it's only turned okay. But he was a lovely man 0:21:25.760 --> 0:21:29.399 and you know, a genius. I mean, he completely recalibrated 0:21:29.480 --> 0:21:33.000 people's ideas of what a base could do, and to 0:21:33.080 --> 0:21:35.960 this day he has yet to be you know, superseded. 0:21:36.040 --> 0:21:38.880 I mean that Charlie Parkers so low as he did 0:21:38.920 --> 0:21:41.800 on the base. Who would have thought of that? I mean, 0:21:41.880 --> 0:21:48.359 it's incredible love the amazing some of your other Base heroes. 0:21:48.400 --> 0:21:50.600 I mean I saw the title for Harmony Road and 0:21:50.640 --> 0:21:53.479 I immediately thought a Harmony Road. Jack Bruce, who were 0:21:53.520 --> 0:21:56.560 some of the other Base people that you looked up 0:21:56.600 --> 0:21:58.040 to that really kind of showed you the way when 0:21:58.040 --> 0:22:00.439 you were first starting out. Well, I think playing the 0:22:00.440 --> 0:22:03.200 bass and singing is it is not the natural thing. 0:22:03.280 --> 0:22:07.080 You know, you're playing contrapuntal to the rhythm of the song. 0:22:07.119 --> 0:22:09.119 It's not the same as strumming a guitar and singing, 0:22:09.800 --> 0:22:12.639 so you have to work it out basically. You know, 0:22:12.680 --> 0:22:15.119 it's like juggling, you know, doing one thing with the 0:22:15.240 --> 0:22:17.960 left hand and one thing both sides of the brain. 0:22:18.080 --> 0:22:20.960 So Jack Bruce obviously was a huge influence on me 0:22:21.040 --> 0:22:25.720 as a singer and a bass player. McCartney very much so. 0:22:25.920 --> 0:22:30.200 And the phil linnet from From Thin Lizzie. I admired 0:22:30.280 --> 0:22:33.360 that those guys who could you know, sing the top 0:22:33.440 --> 0:22:36.800 line and also be in the engine room um, which 0:22:36.840 --> 0:22:40.080 struck me as a very useful place to be the 0:22:40.119 --> 0:22:43.200 band leader for him, because the rest of the band 0:22:43.280 --> 0:22:46.240 is working within your bandwidth. Literally, you know, you sing 0:22:46.240 --> 0:22:50.520 the top line and you're controlling the harmony underneath. UM. 0:22:50.600 --> 0:22:54.800 Without being particularly flashy, You're just that's how you lead 0:22:54.840 --> 0:22:59.240 the band. The heartbeat my my high school jazz band 0:22:59.240 --> 0:23:02.080 directory stole we say the herdbeat. Yeah, we were you 0:23:02.119 --> 0:23:05.359 in the engine room. I love it. I mean speaking 0:23:05.359 --> 0:23:07.560 of leading the band, I mean getting back to the bridge. 0:23:07.960 --> 0:23:10.520 I imagine it was all recorded remotely because of COVID, 0:23:10.600 --> 0:23:14.359 which I believe the technology to record remotely has been 0:23:14.400 --> 0:23:16.480 in place for years, so I assume it wasn't a 0:23:16.520 --> 0:23:20.119 technical problem. But how did you keep it intimate with 0:23:20.119 --> 0:23:23.080 with the musicians when you in some cases worth thousands 0:23:23.080 --> 0:23:26.359 of miles apart. Yeah, that that is the problem. Although 0:23:26.400 --> 0:23:30.520 we've recorded remotely many many times before, it's yeah, giving 0:23:30.520 --> 0:23:35.879 it a warmth and intimacy, which really is about, you know, 0:23:36.200 --> 0:23:38.919 have it. Knowing the musicians already, I would find it 0:23:39.040 --> 0:23:41.760 very difficult to to to work with somebody remotely who 0:23:41.760 --> 0:23:45.280 had never met m But you know, the musicians on 0:23:45.320 --> 0:23:51.520 this record, Dominic Miller, Many cutch A Brampit, Marcellus, I've 0:23:51.600 --> 0:23:55.520 known for decades and they know my work process. They 0:23:55.640 --> 0:23:58.199 know what I want without me having to say very 0:23:58.280 --> 0:24:02.960 much at all. So um, it was kind of easy. 0:24:03.440 --> 0:24:06.439 But yeah, I want to get back into studio with 0:24:06.720 --> 0:24:09.920 musicians in the same room. It's it's much better that way. 0:24:11.080 --> 0:24:13.800 I mean, the Bridge is such an intimate record, not 0:24:13.920 --> 0:24:16.480 strictly dude, just like the lyrics, but just sonically, with 0:24:16.840 --> 0:24:20.040 the interplay between musicians and your voice. I feel like 0:24:20.040 --> 0:24:22.720 it's mixed so front and center. It seems so present 0:24:23.040 --> 0:24:26.040