1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:04,480 Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media. 2 00:00:04,720 --> 00:00:07,160 Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff, 3 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:10,280 Speaker 2: your weekly reminder that when there's bad things, there's people 4 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:14,760 Speaker 2: trying to do good things like podcast. Wait, no, that's 5 00:00:14,800 --> 00:00:19,280 Speaker 2: the thing that talks about the things like save thousands 6 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:23,520 Speaker 2: of people from Nazis. I'm your host, Marta Kiljoy. I've 7 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 2: only done one of those things, and it's not the 8 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 2: saving people thing. It's the podcast thing. But with me 9 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:32,479 Speaker 2: is my guest Caitlyn Durante, who is host of the 10 00:00:32,560 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 2: hit podcasts Sitting on my couch with Caitlyn Durante and 11 00:00:36,880 --> 00:00:40,160 Speaker 2: sitting in my bed with Caitlyn Durante. How are you well? 12 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:45,239 Speaker 3: Yeah, my most famous works. Also, I would argue that 13 00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 3: having a podcast has the potential to save thousands of lives. Okay, 14 00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 3: so maybe you are doing both. Yeah, personally saving everyone. 15 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 3: That's the Cool Zone Media motto. With our producer Sophie. 16 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 4: Hi, Sophie, I don't feel like saving everyone. 17 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:06,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fair. 18 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:11,520 Speaker 4: I'd save both of you though, Oh thank you. Yeah. 19 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:15,520 Speaker 2: Well, hopefully we won't enter a world in the next 20 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:16,760 Speaker 2: couple of years where that needs. 21 00:01:16,600 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 4: To happen, but yeah, you know, wishful thinking. 22 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 2: Also part of making this podcast is our audio engineer, Rory. 23 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:28,360 Speaker 2: Everyone say hi to Rory. Hi. Rory Hi, Ri Hi. 24 00:01:29,319 --> 00:01:31,400 Speaker 2: And our theme music was written for us by unwoman. 25 00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:35,120 Speaker 2: And this week I want to do something I probably 26 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:38,080 Speaker 2: haven't done enough of yet. I want to talk about 27 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:42,679 Speaker 2: someone who worked within the system. I'm going out of 28 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 2: my comfort zone here. I genuinely had a little bit 29 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:47,280 Speaker 2: of a crisis about it. It's worth it. It's so good. 30 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:49,760 Speaker 2: I want to talk about someone who worked within the 31 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 2: system to do that thing that we care so much 32 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:55,320 Speaker 2: about on this show, save people's lives from fascist violence. 33 00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:58,240 Speaker 2: I find this story really fascinating. I'll tell you what 34 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 2: it is in a minute. But I find ifascinating because 35 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:02,760 Speaker 2: it gets at the limits of what can be done 36 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:05,360 Speaker 2: working within the system, or rather it gets it how 37 00:02:05,360 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 2: we can get people, can get a lot done, and 38 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 2: then there's certain things that can't get done. And it's 39 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 2: a story about a woman who broke not only like 40 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 2: every glass ceiling, but actually non glass ceilings. I think 41 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:20,440 Speaker 2: the idea behind a glass ceiling is that it's like invisible. 42 00:02:20,480 --> 00:02:23,320 Speaker 2: You think you should be able to be whatever, but 43 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 2: you can't because you're a girl. Right, that's the I. 44 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 3: Actually don't know that I know what the metaphor means 45 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:33,160 Speaker 3: exactly now that I think about it. 46 00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 2: That's what I've always assumed, right, is that you're like, Oh, 47 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 2: no one's telling you you can't be CEO. You just 48 00:02:39,040 --> 00:02:42,919 Speaker 2: can't be CEO. Right. That's like the glass ceiling, I think, right. 49 00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 3: Because the boys won't allow it. 50 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, but this person broke not glass ceilings, but regular ceilings, 51 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 2: just probably plaster and lathe. I think drywall didn't get 52 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 2: popularized until after this. I really should have spent more 53 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 2: of my time researching different construction methods of ceilings in 54 00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:05,080 Speaker 2: the nineteen thirties, but I didn't. Women were not supposed 55 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:07,639 Speaker 2: to do what she did. Because today we are going 56 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 2: to talk about the longest serving Secretary of Labor of 57 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 2: the United States, who was the first woman to be 58 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:16,960 Speaker 2: secretary of anything in the US government. She was the 59 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:20,760 Speaker 2: woman for whom Madam's Secretary was coined as an honorific 60 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 2: and her name is Francis Perkins. Either of you ever 61 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:25,680 Speaker 2: heard of Francis Perkins? 62 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 3: I have not. 63 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:33,079 Speaker 2: Nope, I hadn't either. In certain circles, she's very popular 64 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 2: because of all the stuff we're going to talk about, 65 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:38,920 Speaker 2: but overall, for some weird reason women get left out 66 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:43,560 Speaker 2: of history, even when they are the first woman minister, 67 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 2: but also the longest or not minister secretary whatever, but 68 00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:51,680 Speaker 2: of a department of the government, as well as the 69 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:54,560 Speaker 2: longest serving secretary of labor the US has ever had, 70 00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 2: and no one ever talks about her. She is most 71 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 2: famous as the woman who brought us the New Deal, 72 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:07,760 Speaker 2: and she was heavily involved in the fight for Social Security. 73 00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:09,960 Speaker 2: You could honestly make the case that this is the 74 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:13,160 Speaker 2: woman who brought you the weekend. But we also like 75 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:15,360 Speaker 2: talking about how the labor unions brought us the weekend. 76 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 2: But like obviously, lots of different things happened in order 77 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:21,920 Speaker 2: to make things laws, and usually union striking people don't 78 00:04:21,920 --> 00:04:26,440 Speaker 2: make laws, but sometimes people like this do. But I'm 79 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:28,280 Speaker 2: going to talk about her not because of that work, 80 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 2: but because of how hard and endlessly she worked, with 81 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:38,080 Speaker 2: both success and failure, to rescue German Jews during Hitler's reign, 82 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:45,360 Speaker 2: which is a good thing to do, I'll say, especially kids, 83 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 2: and her whole thing was rescuing kids. 84 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 3: Nice. 85 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 2: So she was born Fanny Carly Perkins on April tenth, 86 00:04:56,279 --> 00:05:00,800 Speaker 2: eighteen eighty, in the South end of Boston to sort 87 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:04,760 Speaker 2: of middle class Protestant parents of the Republican variety. But 88 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 2: back when Republican meant like Abraham Lincoln's party, you know, 89 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 2: the like center left party. I even I think I 90 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 2: got a better understanding now of like when these two 91 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 2: parties switched than I ever have. 92 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 3: Ooh, please say. 93 00:05:20,040 --> 00:05:24,320 Speaker 2: It's basically during it's the beginning of the twentieth century. 94 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 2: But like the New Deal is kind of what did it? 95 00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:30,880 Speaker 2: It seems like so like FDR in the nineteen thirties. 96 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 2: So she was born into this Republican family and then 97 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:39,080 Speaker 2: they moved to not Worcester, Worcester, I. 98 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:41,479 Speaker 3: Believe Wooster, Yes, yes, yes. 99 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:44,760 Speaker 2: When she was two, and her family opened a stationary shop. 100 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:48,599 Speaker 2: And she lives most of her life like fairly wealthy, 101 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:50,640 Speaker 2: even though she was born on the wrong side of town, right, 102 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:52,720 Speaker 2: and there's a lot of like she kind of she 103 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:55,520 Speaker 2: kind of liked being upper middle class or like kind 104 00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:57,760 Speaker 2: of rich, and so she would always like when people 105 00:05:57,800 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 2: would claim that she was born in the rich part 106 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:01,159 Speaker 2: of Boston, did not correct people. 107 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:05,400 Speaker 3: Well, South End, I mean it's probably different than it 108 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:10,719 Speaker 3: was because South End and Southee are different neighborhoods. Southea 109 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:12,280 Speaker 3: is like the working class. 110 00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 2: Oh okay. 111 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:16,479 Speaker 3: And then the South End at least now again, it 112 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:19,000 Speaker 3: might have been different one hundred years ago or whatever. 113 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 3: South End is like the gighborhood. Oh interesting in Boston. Yeah, 114 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 3: I think, Oh my gosh, it's been ten years since 115 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:30,680 Speaker 3: I'm about to celebrate my ten year living in La anniversary. Wow, 116 00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:31,760 Speaker 3: brag to me. 117 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:33,200 Speaker 2: Are you from Boston? 118 00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:35,919 Speaker 3: I'm not from there, but I lived there for four years. 119 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:39,039 Speaker 3: I went to famously, but I would never mention this. 120 00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:42,520 Speaker 3: I went to grad school at Boston University, where I 121 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 3: got a master's degree in screenwriting. 122 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:46,480 Speaker 2: Wow. Again, never mentioned that. 123 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:48,719 Speaker 3: I would never mention that. But yeah, I lived there 124 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:55,000 Speaker 3: for four years. And you know, twenty ten, South End 125 00:06:55,480 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 3: was like a very expensive you had to have a 126 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:02,240 Speaker 3: pretty high income to be able to afford the rent there, okay, 127 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:07,480 Speaker 3: And it was like specifically gay men, Yeah, live there 128 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 3: because lesbians live in Oh my god, Jamaica plane. I 129 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,040 Speaker 3: want to say, is that the name of I don't 130 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 3: know it's again, it's been so long. 131 00:07:16,200 --> 00:07:18,200 Speaker 2: As one of the only neighborhoods I've spent any time 132 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 2: in Boston, so I want them to be full of lesbians. 133 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 3: Okay, Well, there you go. 134 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,480 Speaker 2: Okay, no. See. See, I haven't spent that much time 135 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 2: in Boston besides, of course jamake a plane hanging out 136 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:31,760 Speaker 2: with the lesbians, of course. And that's actually useful to know. 137 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 2: I like the book that I was reading about this 138 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 2: part of it was like kind of saying, how this 139 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 2: is sort of a humble beginning, right. But I don't 140 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:46,080 Speaker 2: know whether that's just as compared to where she ends 141 00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 2: up classwise when she gets married, because she marries up 142 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 2: in a little bit okay, or whether in the eighteen 143 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 2: eighties the South End was like a more heavily immigrant 144 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 2: neighborhood or something like that, or of working class neighborhood. 145 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 3: I'm sure it's something like that. 146 00:08:01,120 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, her parents were not immigrants. Her parents were wasps 147 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:08,560 Speaker 2: all the way down and like had come from Maine 148 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 2: to live in Boston. She went off to college at 149 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 2: Mount Holyoake in eighteen ninety eight. And this wasn't her 150 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:17,680 Speaker 2: family being like, oh, we're feminists. It's like, this is 151 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 2: her family being like, we're middle class, you know. And 152 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:25,880 Speaker 2: she was in Stem she studied chemistry, biology, and physics whoa, 153 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 2: and the liberal education had its effects on her. I 154 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:32,200 Speaker 2: think she was raised probably like kind of like raised 155 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:34,520 Speaker 2: right politically from the start anyway. 156 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:39,040 Speaker 3: But right as in like correct or right yea again right, sorry, 157 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:45,120 Speaker 3: that's correct, yeah, so left yeah, or progressive like I 158 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 3: would say that her politics are progressive. 159 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:51,000 Speaker 2: And she's one of the most progressive bureaucrats and in 160 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 2: power we've ever had in the United States. Certainly, by 161 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 2: today's standards, she's wildly progressive, and by her own her 162 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 2: year's standards, she was too. In college, she read a 163 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:03,080 Speaker 2: book that had an impact on her that's come up 164 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:04,920 Speaker 2: a bunch of times on this show before W E. 165 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:08,400 Speaker 2: De Boys is the Soul of Black Folks. And she 166 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:11,520 Speaker 2: went on tour with her school to the factories to 167 00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:15,880 Speaker 2: see how fucked up things were in the factories, and 168 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 2: she grew up with I've never had a positive impression 169 00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:22,240 Speaker 2: of like the Protestant work ethic, right, she grew up 170 00:09:22,280 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 2: with a version of the Protestant work ethic that I 171 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:27,439 Speaker 2: think has been lost to time, which is the work 172 00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:31,160 Speaker 2: really hard at your chosen vocation, not work really hard 173 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 2: to get rich and fuck everyone over. And her chosen vocation, 174 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 2: she stated very explicitly, she was like, my chosen vocation 175 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:43,560 Speaker 2: is social justice. Hell yeah, And then she worked into 176 00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 2: her fucking eighties. It's social justice and then you know 177 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:55,080 Speaker 2: stop because she died. After she graduated, she started teaching, 178 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:58,560 Speaker 2: first in New England and then in Chicago. In Chicago, 179 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 2: she changed her name from Fanny to Francis, which from 180 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:05,840 Speaker 2: my point of view just needs no defense, just sure, 181 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:08,439 Speaker 2: no offense to Fanny as a name, but it doesn't 182 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 2: hold up. 183 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 3: She was born like birth certificate says Fanny. Yeah, and 184 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 3: then she so she was born with the nickname, and 185 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:19,880 Speaker 3: then she gave herself the formal version of the name. 186 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 2: Basically I guess so right, like, is Fanny short for Francis? 187 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 3: I you know what, no one was either the name 188 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 3: Fanny or Francis. 189 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 2: I could not say, yeah, I know of Francis, but 190 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:37,880 Speaker 2: I think I would get in trouble if I call 191 00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:43,200 Speaker 2: them Fanny. I'm under the impression that she changed her 192 00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:46,080 Speaker 2: name specifically to Francis because she was into Saint Francis 193 00:10:46,080 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 2: of ASSISI the like Catholic and also Episcopal saint. Okay, okay, 194 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:54,160 Speaker 2: because around this time she left the Protestant she grew 195 00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:58,000 Speaker 2: up New England Congregationalists, which I know nothing about, to 196 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:00,840 Speaker 2: become an Episcopal, which is like the Anglican church, but 197 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 2: in America Catholic light, you get ritual and ceremony and 198 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 2: you still get to have Saint Francis. Okay, she took 199 00:11:09,800 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 2: the social justice thing very seriously, and soon she was 200 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:16,400 Speaker 2: volunteering at the Hull House in Chicago, which was founded 201 00:11:16,400 --> 00:11:18,120 Speaker 2: by this person who's probably gonna end up a future 202 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:21,120 Speaker 2: friend of the Pod, this social reformer named Jane Adams. 203 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: And this concept is real funny, like it doesn't hold 204 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:31,720 Speaker 2: up great, but it's interesting. These are called settlement houses, 205 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:35,960 Speaker 2: and the idea is that recent college graduates from like 206 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:39,480 Speaker 2: the middle class would go live in these impoverished neighborhoods 207 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:43,960 Speaker 2: in settlement houses to do social work within those neighborhoods. 208 00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 2: And so it's kind of a like learn how the 209 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 2: other half live internship. 210 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:52,600 Speaker 3: What's it teachers? Teacher for America? Is that sort of 211 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:53,320 Speaker 3: like that? 212 00:11:53,559 --> 00:11:56,920 Speaker 2: Yeah? Is that the thing that the movie with the 213 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 2: crap that the song is is about from the nineties? 214 00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:07,199 Speaker 3: Probably I almost called it Teachers without Borders, so it 215 00:12:07,240 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 3: shows you how much I know about it. But that's 216 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:13,200 Speaker 3: my understanding of teach for America. It's uh, I don't 217 00:12:13,200 --> 00:12:15,079 Speaker 3: think you necessarily even have to have any kind of 218 00:12:15,160 --> 00:12:19,120 Speaker 3: like teaching credentials or like a background in education, but 219 00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:24,560 Speaker 3: like they'll hire recent college grads in low income school 220 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:28,440 Speaker 3: districts and have them teach for a year I think, 221 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 3: or some short amount of time. But yeah, it sounds 222 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:31,920 Speaker 3: kind of like. 223 00:12:31,800 --> 00:12:35,559 Speaker 2: That, Okay, Yes, And then the song is called Gangster's 224 00:12:35,559 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 2: Paradise by Coolio and it was then it was in 225 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:43,760 Speaker 2: a movie Dangerous Minds. It was in the movie Dangerous Minds. 226 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:44,920 Speaker 3: Okay, I've never seen it. 227 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,080 Speaker 2: Okay, I think I watched it in the nineties when 228 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:49,920 Speaker 2: it came out, but I couldn't promise you. A white 229 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:51,920 Speaker 2: woman goes and teaches in a black school, and it's 230 00:12:51,920 --> 00:12:53,840 Speaker 2: like exploitation as best as I can tell, or at 231 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:56,440 Speaker 2: least like and so it's like, is this thing that 232 00:12:56,480 --> 00:12:58,920 Speaker 2: obviously like there's a lot of problems with like rich 233 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:01,400 Speaker 2: white people showing up until like migrant neighborhoods and stuff 234 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:03,360 Speaker 2: and being like I know how to help things, right 235 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:08,440 Speaker 2: mm hmm. But overall, everything I've personally read about these 236 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:11,040 Speaker 2: settlement houses is actually fairly positive. 237 00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:12,160 Speaker 3: Okay. 238 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 2: But her duties included, quote, helping the nurse with a 239 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 2: sick family, working in a political campaign, joining a picket line, 240 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:26,520 Speaker 2: compiling statistics on infant mortality, proofreading the magazine, browbeating employers 241 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 2: into paying wages unfairly withheld, or raising money to keep 242 00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:33,960 Speaker 2: the settlement going, all right, And so just like, all right, 243 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:35,880 Speaker 2: if you're down there on the picket line and you 244 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:40,080 Speaker 2: are browbeating employers into paying wages, okay. 245 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 3: Pretty good thing to do. 246 00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:46,319 Speaker 2: Yeahuh yeah. She moved back to the East Coast after 247 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:48,160 Speaker 2: she did that. For a couple of years, she went 248 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 2: to Philly. She worked full time with an organization that 249 00:13:52,120 --> 00:13:54,959 Speaker 2: seemed to be fighting sex trafficking as best as I 250 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:57,719 Speaker 2: can tell, but all the writing about it is super euphemistic, 251 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:01,559 Speaker 2: because no one is ever willing to say sex work 252 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:04,640 Speaker 2: or even prostitution in old timey stuff. 253 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:05,520 Speaker 3: Right. 254 00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 2: She was there for two years. She moved to New 255 00:14:08,440 --> 00:14:12,120 Speaker 2: York City. She got her master's at Columbia, and her 256 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 2: master's thesis me, I feel like this just gives you 257 00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 2: the idea of, you know, character, who she is is. 258 00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:20,480 Speaker 2: Her master's thesis was called a study of malnutrition in 259 00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 2: one hundred and seven children from public school fifty one 260 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:26,880 Speaker 2: mm hmm. And so she's just paying attention to and 261 00:14:26,920 --> 00:14:32,680 Speaker 2: studying and trying to alleviate the you know, impacts of poverty. Yeah, 262 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 2: she graduated in nineteen ten. She got a job running 263 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:39,240 Speaker 2: the New York City Consumers League, fighting for workers' protections. 264 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 2: Their whole big radical idea was what if women and 265 00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:46,040 Speaker 2: children only had to work fifty four hours a week? 266 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:53,680 Speaker 3: So radical, I too radical for me. I think I 267 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 3: think we should be working these as much as they 268 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:59,720 Speaker 3: wanted to do eighty hours a week at least. 269 00:15:00,360 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, how many hours are there, you know, yeah, figure 270 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 2: out always stick some more in there. 271 00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:11,200 Speaker 3: Because this was pre child labor laws, right. 272 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:15,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, which largely exists because of her and the 273 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:18,200 Speaker 2: forty hour work week. All right, So there's not federal 274 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 2: child labor laws. There's like individual, piecemeal child labor laws 275 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 2: that keep coming up every time, like enough children fall 276 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 2: down a shaft in a mind that people get upset 277 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 2: or whatever, you know. Yeah, And so she's this style 278 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 2: of person that isn't super common anymore. That was a 279 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:37,280 Speaker 2: really important part of the political landscape of the early 280 00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:41,440 Speaker 2: twentieth century, the social reformer. Most of these are white 281 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 2: women from middle class or upper class families, and some 282 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:47,360 Speaker 2: of them did really incredible things. Some of them did 283 00:15:47,400 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 2: a bunch of fucked up things, same as any group 284 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 2: of people with any ideology or practice. 285 00:15:52,880 --> 00:15:54,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, FRANSS. 286 00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 2: Perkins is one of the coolest social reformers I've ever read. 287 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:04,160 Speaker 2: Nice because she really did seem to mean it and 288 00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:08,280 Speaker 2: stuck up for things at great personal expense regularly. 289 00:16:08,960 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 3: Mm hmm. Yeah, I guess I don't know how long 290 00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:17,200 Speaker 3: the practice of virtue signaling has been happening, but I 291 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:21,680 Speaker 3: guess it wasn't like as advantageous to people back then 292 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:24,640 Speaker 3: as it is or could be now. 293 00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:28,960 Speaker 2: So Yeah, she like got called a kami Jew a lot, 294 00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 2: you know, like and not in like derogatory in parentheses, 295 00:16:35,880 --> 00:16:40,920 Speaker 2: you know right, despite not being either of those, uh 296 00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:45,200 Speaker 2: and M. Although whenever people will call her accuser being 297 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:48,000 Speaker 2: a Jews, she would write a thing being like, I 298 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 2: would not be ashamed to be a Jew. Jews are great, 299 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:54,160 Speaker 2: but I'm not one, which is the Tolkien approach. That's 300 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 2: what Tolkien did when the Nazis were like, hey, we 301 00:16:57,040 --> 00:17:00,520 Speaker 2: want to translate your work into German by we don't 302 00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:02,600 Speaker 2: know if you're Airyan enough. M. 303 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:04,720 Speaker 3: I did not realize that happened. 304 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:06,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, he kind of told them to fuck off. He 305 00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,480 Speaker 2: wrote like a polite fuck off. And a mean fuck off, 306 00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:11,879 Speaker 2: and he gave them both to his publisher and was like, 307 00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:13,680 Speaker 2: send them one of these. It's up to you. 308 00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:18,000 Speaker 3: Okay, all right, I have even more respect for Tolkien now. 309 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:22,199 Speaker 2: Yeah. So Parkins was living in New York City in 310 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:26,439 Speaker 2: nineteen eleven when a workplace mass murder took place. That 311 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:29,680 Speaker 2: usually gets called a tragedy, but I don't think it's tragic. 312 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 2: I think it's mass murder. The triangle shirtwaist fire. 313 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 3: You heard of this, I've heard of it. I know 314 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:38,800 Speaker 3: very little detail. 315 00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:40,879 Speaker 2: Well, let me tell you some details about it. 316 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:41,800 Speaker 3: Thank you so much. 317 00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:44,359 Speaker 2: It'll be one of the more horrific parts of this 318 00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:48,440 Speaker 2: week's episodes. But before I tell you something horrific, I'll 319 00:17:48,440 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 2: tell you something even more horrific. Did you know that 320 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:55,719 Speaker 2: in the middle of a show, someone's going to just 321 00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:58,200 Speaker 2: start talking to you in a different voice and try 322 00:17:58,240 --> 00:17:59,560 Speaker 2: and convince you to buy things? 323 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:00,280 Speaker 4: Hmm? 324 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:02,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, I did know about that, and that is truly 325 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:04,800 Speaker 3: the most horrific thing that could happen. 326 00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:09,119 Speaker 2: Well, brace yourselves and remember this podcast is brought to 327 00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:12,679 Speaker 2: you by medieval weaponry. Whenever you have a problem, you 328 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:16,000 Speaker 2: can solve it with a mace or a flail. Or 329 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:20,239 Speaker 2: a sword or a spear or a polearm. But they 330 00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:22,080 Speaker 2: didn't pay me enough money to read off the different 331 00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:24,280 Speaker 2: kinds of polearms because most of those sound French and 332 00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 2: I can't pronounce them. Here's other ads, ed, we're back, 333 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:39,679 Speaker 2: So which of those medieval weapons did you find? You 334 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:41,720 Speaker 2: know during the ads about different weapons? 335 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:45,239 Speaker 3: Well, I just googled flail because I didn't know what 336 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:47,720 Speaker 3: that was. And I mean, now that I'm looking at it, 337 00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:50,720 Speaker 3: I have definitely seen these, but I feel like, I mean, 338 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:54,840 Speaker 3: speaking of Tolkien, this is what the witch king of 339 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:58,840 Speaker 3: whatever the fuck tries to kill one of two women 340 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 3: in the whole French highs. Yeah, and also don't remember 341 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:02,600 Speaker 3: her name? 342 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:06,520 Speaker 2: A Win no, A Okay, See, now I'm going to 343 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:08,639 Speaker 2: lose all of my credit because I'm in a token 344 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:11,040 Speaker 2: themed black metal band and right now I can't remember. 345 00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:12,640 Speaker 2: I think it's the way it's King of Agmar. 346 00:19:13,359 --> 00:19:15,440 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, and he's trying to kill I think a 347 00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:20,639 Speaker 3: Win on the battlefield at the end of the third movie. 348 00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:22,119 Speaker 3: I haven't read the book, so I don't know if 349 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:23,880 Speaker 3: it lines up. I don't think. I don't think these 350 00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:25,240 Speaker 3: the women are in the books. 351 00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:29,560 Speaker 2: Really, no, this this thing is in the books. I've 352 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 2: heard that Tolkien's like daughter or something or someone was like, 353 00:19:33,520 --> 00:19:34,960 Speaker 2: what the fuck are you doing? Why are there no 354 00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:35,399 Speaker 2: women in this? 355 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:39,200 Speaker 3: And he was like, oh right, fine, final add one 356 00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:43,040 Speaker 3: in the book, and then a second one in the 357 00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:46,200 Speaker 3: appendices or something. But anyway, so the witch King of 358 00:19:46,240 --> 00:19:50,080 Speaker 3: Agmar is using something very similar to this weapon to 359 00:19:50,119 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 3: a flail to try to kit and she's like I 360 00:19:52,760 --> 00:19:55,760 Speaker 3: am no. And he's like no, living man can't kill me. 361 00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:59,320 Speaker 3: And she's like I am no. Man stabs him in 362 00:19:59,320 --> 00:19:59,760 Speaker 3: the face. 363 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:01,240 Speaker 4: Yeah. 364 00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:04,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, So that's your pick as a flail. 365 00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:05,560 Speaker 3: Yeah. 366 00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:13,720 Speaker 2: Cool, So the triangle shirtwaist fire. The garment industry is 367 00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 2: a big part of New York City. He still is, honestly, 368 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:19,639 Speaker 2: but the garment industry, the conditions were atrocious around that time. 369 00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:24,840 Speaker 2: In nineteen oh nine, the Yiddish speaking garment workers, about 370 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:28,960 Speaker 2: twenty thousand of them, had an uprising. It's called the 371 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:33,480 Speaker 2: Uprising of the twenty thousand, just both fairly literal and 372 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:37,960 Speaker 2: yet also evocative. We'll probably cover this more at some point, 373 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:39,760 Speaker 2: because I've always wanted to cover I have like this 374 00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:42,760 Speaker 2: like sort of master spreadsheet of topics that at some 375 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 2: point I swear I'm going to cover. And there's a 376 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:48,840 Speaker 2: Jewish labor organizer named Clara Lemlich who's been on that 377 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,199 Speaker 2: list since the very beginning, and she was one of 378 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:56,879 Speaker 2: the primary organizers of this. Okay, but that strike was 379 00:20:57,119 --> 00:20:59,720 Speaker 2: twenty thousand Jewish women on strike for eleven weeks and 380 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:02,800 Speaker 2: changed the way that labor organizing works in America. We're 381 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,000 Speaker 2: actually gonna do two. There's gonna be two strikes during 382 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:07,800 Speaker 2: this this week. That will change a lot of things, 383 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:11,720 Speaker 2: because we often on the show talk about how shitty 384 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:14,280 Speaker 2: the AFL, the American Federation of Labor, used to be, 385 00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:18,120 Speaker 2: and they hated the idea of organizing anyone who wasn't 386 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:20,879 Speaker 2: a white man from one of the approved of European countries, 387 00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 2: and so they were not organizing the Jewish women of 388 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:32,240 Speaker 2: New York City. Most of these workers weren't unionized, but 389 00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:35,240 Speaker 2: essentially a bunch of spontaneous strikes broke out at once 390 00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 2: over the conditions that they were living under. Traditional unions 391 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:42,360 Speaker 2: showed up and were like, oh, like maybe we should strike, 392 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:44,920 Speaker 2: maybe we shouldn't, And then folks were like, now we're 393 00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:48,000 Speaker 2: not fucking waiting for you, We're just doing it. By 394 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 2: the end of the first day, there was twenty thousand 395 00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:53,680 Speaker 2: people on strike. Ninety percent of these workers were Jewish 396 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 2: and seventy percent of them were women. In one month, 397 00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:00,760 Speaker 2: seven hundred and twenty three people were arrested or any strikes. 398 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:04,560 Speaker 2: Clara Lemlich, one of the main organizers, had her ribs 399 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:07,520 Speaker 2: broken and was arrested a total of seventeen times during 400 00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:11,639 Speaker 2: this month. Whoa you gotta like work at to get 401 00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:12,960 Speaker 2: arrested that many times. 402 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,359 Speaker 3: That's like one every other day in a month. 403 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:19,639 Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. You get let out the next morning, you 404 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:23,240 Speaker 2: take a day off, get some catch of breath, but. 405 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:25,640 Speaker 3: Then the day after that you're back at it getting arrested, 406 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,680 Speaker 3: I know, and h honestly good for her. 407 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,640 Speaker 2: Yeah. And my favorite is that a ten year old 408 00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 2: girl is convicted of assaulting a scab and I hope 409 00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:34,760 Speaker 2: she did it. 410 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:44,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, that well. I recently rewatched Newsy's Excellent, which yes, yes, yes, yes, 411 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:50,960 Speaker 3: and that invokes memories of just scenes of that movie. Yeah, 412 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 3: where you know you've got kids just like beating the 413 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:56,760 Speaker 3: crap out of scabs and stuff. Yeah. 414 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:00,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, And folks are interested, they can check out our 415 00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 2: two parter on the actual Newsy strike. After eleven weeks. 416 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,560 Speaker 2: The strike ended in something of a partial victory. The 417 00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 2: strikers won the fifty two hour work week and they 418 00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 2: no longer had to pay for their own tools. 419 00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:19,320 Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, I mean it again, sounds a little too 420 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 3: radical for me. 421 00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:24,720 Speaker 2: But yeah, totally, and they won a few other things besides. 422 00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:27,960 Speaker 2: It also won women the attention of the large like 423 00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:32,320 Speaker 2: moderate unions for better or worse, honestly, and more of 424 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:36,320 Speaker 2: them started being less afraid of unionizing women. Meanwhile, there's 425 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,119 Speaker 2: already the industrial workers of the world who are going 426 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:39,600 Speaker 2: to come up again in this episode later, who are 427 00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:42,440 Speaker 2: organizing with people of color and women and were started 428 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,680 Speaker 2: in part by a woman of color and things like that. 429 00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:50,159 Speaker 2: But the big moderate unions didn't bother with women. This 430 00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:53,560 Speaker 2: didn't turn everything around this strike, and it didn't stop 431 00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:57,639 Speaker 2: one of the largest workplace accidents. It gets called in 432 00:23:57,760 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 2: history the Triangle shirtwaist fire. The Triangle Shirtwaist Factory was 433 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:05,880 Speaker 2: this fucked up fire trap. It was the top three 434 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,439 Speaker 2: floors of a ten story building, and it was filled 435 00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:11,920 Speaker 2: to the brim with fabric. Because like when you'd finish 436 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,640 Speaker 2: making your shirt waist, you would just leave the scraps 437 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:19,200 Speaker 2: in a bin under your workstation had two shitty elevators 438 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:22,119 Speaker 2: that barely worked. There were no sprinklers. And then here's 439 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:25,680 Speaker 2: the most fun part. Workers were locked in all day. 440 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:30,320 Speaker 3: Oh okay, so trapped. Yeah it's not unlike the m 441 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:32,240 Speaker 3: Night Shamalan movie Trap. 442 00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:34,639 Speaker 2: I believe you, but have not seen this. 443 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:38,119 Speaker 3: I haven't seen it either, but I have seen the 444 00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 3: trailer and that's enough for me. 445 00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:40,280 Speaker 2: Yeah. Fair. 446 00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 1: We did a deep dive on the triangle shirtwaist fire 447 00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:44,440 Speaker 1: on bastards too. 448 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 2: Oh cool. Okay, yeah, that makes more sense. There's not 449 00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 2: really a I will present two heroes of the shirtwaist fire, but. 450 00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 4: It's mostly a bomber. 451 00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:57,840 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. So they were locked in to keep them 452 00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 2: from taking unauthorized breaks, which is stealing time from the 453 00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:07,080 Speaker 2: bosses or stealing things outright. And then on March twenty fifth, 454 00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 2: nineteen eleven, the place caught fire. The guy holding the 455 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:12,480 Speaker 2: key to the exit doors was one of the first 456 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:17,000 Speaker 2: people to escape, so the door stayed locked. He took 457 00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 2: the key with him. Wow, and this is mass murder 458 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 2: by the capitalist class. The flimsy fire escape fell like 459 00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 2: the fire just destroyed the fire escape, which meant that 460 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:30,359 Speaker 2: twenty people who were standing on it fell one hundred 461 00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:33,880 Speaker 2: feet to their death. The fire department didn't have ladders 462 00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:38,480 Speaker 2: tall enough to reach the eighth floor. The two heroes 463 00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 2: are the elevator operators, Joseph Zito and gasper Montereo. They 464 00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:49,719 Speaker 2: went up and down three times into the fire, and 465 00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,119 Speaker 2: one of them stopped because the elevator itself was disabled 466 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:55,600 Speaker 2: by the flames, and the other one stopped when the 467 00:25:55,680 --> 00:26:00,879 Speaker 2: elevator was disabled by people fall to their deaths on 468 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:05,080 Speaker 2: top of it. But they went three times up into 469 00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:07,520 Speaker 2: the fire and rescued as many people as they could. 470 00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:12,240 Speaker 2: So yeah, one by one, people, mostly women and girls, 471 00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,280 Speaker 2: jump to their death from a burning building while people 472 00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:17,760 Speaker 2: watched in horror. One hundred and twenty three women and 473 00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:20,800 Speaker 2: girls died and twenty three men died. It is one 474 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:24,639 Speaker 2: of the worst industrial workplace murders in US history. And 475 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:29,120 Speaker 2: in the crowd outside of this, Francis Perkins was standing 476 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 2: watching all of this happen, unable to help. And so 477 00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:35,960 Speaker 2: she'd already dedicated her life, right she was like, Oh, 478 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:39,840 Speaker 2: I'm going to go help people, you know, But obviously 479 00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:43,879 Speaker 2: this like double dedicated her. And actually, you know, she 480 00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:46,320 Speaker 2: later has a quote being like the New Deal was 481 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:52,439 Speaker 2: born while I watched this fire happen and it it 482 00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:54,520 Speaker 2: kind of you know, there are these things that happen 483 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:57,000 Speaker 2: all the time, and then there's sometimes there's just too 484 00:26:57,080 --> 00:26:59,440 Speaker 2: much and people are like, Okay, that's that's a step 485 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 2: too far, right, because people have been dying in these 486 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:04,560 Speaker 2: workplace quote unquote accidents for years to centuries, you know, 487 00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:09,679 Speaker 2: and the Triangle shortwaist fire was like too much for people. 488 00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a tipping point, I guess. 489 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,879 Speaker 2: Yeah. So lots of things came out of it. But 490 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:18,880 Speaker 2: one of the things that came out of it that 491 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,960 Speaker 2: involves Francis Perkins is that people formed a new citizens group, 492 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 2: the Committee on Safety, and Perkins was the executive secretary 493 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:28,960 Speaker 2: of this group, and they developed new fire codes and 494 00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 2: they basically like developed things to bring to legislature and 495 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:36,359 Speaker 2: be like, do this goddamn thing, Hey, please save people's 496 00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,240 Speaker 2: lives or whatever. And that's what she worked on for 497 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:41,320 Speaker 2: a long time. But she worked on something else too, 498 00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:45,240 Speaker 2: and this isn't an ad transition. She worked on moving 499 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:48,159 Speaker 2: up in class by marrying a rich guy, which is 500 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:49,960 Speaker 2: good work if you can get it. 501 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:57,920 Speaker 3: I mean I'm trying. Yeah, I've been applying to these jobs. Yeah, 502 00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:02,200 Speaker 3: for years you know, and so far haven't really landed one. 503 00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:06,639 Speaker 3: But one day I'm not going to give up hope 504 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:11,119 Speaker 3: that I will get the job of being partner to 505 00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:16,840 Speaker 3: a person much richer than me. Yeah not, because here's 506 00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:19,000 Speaker 3: what it is. I want to trick a rich man 507 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:24,480 Speaker 3: into marrying me to secretly redistribute his wealth. Yes, and 508 00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:26,560 Speaker 3: so that I can have a swimming pool. Those are 509 00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:29,119 Speaker 3: the two big things I would like in my life. 510 00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:31,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, like one nice thing for you and then share 511 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:33,240 Speaker 2: the rest. This is one for me, one for them. 512 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:34,000 Speaker 3: Yeah. 513 00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 2: I genuinely see no problem with this plan, Thank you 514 00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:39,640 Speaker 2: so much. 515 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:41,240 Speaker 1: So. 516 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 2: A couple of years after the shirtwaist fire, France has 517 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:47,120 Speaker 2: got married and this wasn't a big deal to her. 518 00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:49,240 Speaker 2: She she wasn't sure she ever wanted to get married 519 00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 2: at all. She married this rich asshole named Paul Wilson, 520 00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:55,120 Speaker 2: and I say asshole in the technical sense, and that 521 00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 2: he was a piece of shit. M She changed her 522 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,400 Speaker 2: name legally, but she never went by missus Wilson or 523 00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:04,720 Speaker 2: anything like that. She stayed Francis Perkins. And for years 524 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 2: this was like always used against her, like, oh, you're 525 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:09,280 Speaker 2: a communist because you didn't take your husband's name or 526 00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 2: whatever you know, so dumb. Yeah, this is the stupidest 527 00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:19,640 Speaker 2: thing ever heard. Yeah, okay, And so she marries his man, 528 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:21,360 Speaker 2: and she starts living in a more upper class life, 529 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:25,160 Speaker 2: like now she's like servants and shit. And then he 530 00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,280 Speaker 2: cheated on her and she was like, all right, well, 531 00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:29,320 Speaker 2: I'm gonna dump this man. But then she realized she 532 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:33,480 Speaker 2: was pregnant and she decided, probably due to whatever, for 533 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:35,720 Speaker 2: whatever reason, she was like, divorce is no longer an option. 534 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:39,239 Speaker 2: And he was at this point became physically abusive to her. 535 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:45,320 Speaker 2: Pretty soon though. He wound up institutionalized, and he spent 536 00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:47,480 Speaker 2: most of his life, the rest of his life in 537 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:51,800 Speaker 2: various psychiatric institutions. He like drank himself into oblivion and 538 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:53,880 Speaker 2: then started losing all of his money by sinking his 539 00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:56,120 Speaker 2: family fortune into gold. That would have been a good 540 00:29:56,160 --> 00:30:00,080 Speaker 2: ad transition, but it's still not one because if you 541 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,240 Speaker 2: you think all of your money into gold right before depression, 542 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:08,400 Speaker 2: you lose all of your money, despite what advertisers claim. 543 00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 2: And he kind of just lost track of reality, and 544 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:13,280 Speaker 2: he spent most of his time institutionalized, and she spent 545 00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:16,720 Speaker 2: most of her time sleeping alone in a twin size bed. 546 00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:22,360 Speaker 2: It is probable that Francis Perkins was queer. She had 547 00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:25,920 Speaker 2: that hallmark historically close friendships with a few women, like 548 00:30:25,960 --> 00:30:28,720 Speaker 2: one at a time where she lived with a woman 549 00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:32,400 Speaker 2: for decades and then later after that woman died, she 550 00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:36,520 Speaker 2: moved in with a different woman. Right. There's no direct 551 00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:40,480 Speaker 2: evidence of her having a sexual relationship with any women, 552 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:44,400 Speaker 2: but there likely wouldn't be. And it's one of the 553 00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:47,080 Speaker 2: sort of interesting quirks of queer history where like when 554 00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:50,920 Speaker 2: you look at like historically close friends that like you're like, oh, well, 555 00:30:50,920 --> 00:30:55,840 Speaker 2: they're lesbians. Sometimes that's true, and sometimes that just doesn't 556 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:59,720 Speaker 2: map to our modern conceptions of queerness, right, because like, hmm, 557 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,600 Speaker 2: she absolutely had a close and intimate sexual or not 558 00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:07,400 Speaker 2: relationship with these women, and you know, it was probably 559 00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:09,760 Speaker 2: the most important relationship in her life besides the relationship 560 00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:13,360 Speaker 2: with her daughter, and like what it looked like, we 561 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:15,960 Speaker 2: don't know. She was a very private person despite as 562 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:18,280 Speaker 2: she like got more and more higher up in the 563 00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:21,920 Speaker 2: government and stuff, and she also burned all of her 564 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 2: personal correspondence. 565 00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:27,720 Speaker 3: So okay, all right, well maybe there's some saucy things 566 00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:30,000 Speaker 3: in there and she just I don't want she had 567 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,640 Speaker 3: to protect herself. Yeah, that's the thing. About you know, 568 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:38,720 Speaker 3: queer history and speculations of whether or not people engaged 569 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:43,240 Speaker 3: in any manner of like queer romance or sexuality or 570 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 3: anything like that. Is that you know, most people do 571 00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:53,440 Speaker 3: sex in private, and and it leaves not that much 572 00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:58,280 Speaker 3: evidence behind. So yeah, there is, there's a lot of speculation. 573 00:31:57,800 --> 00:31:58,720 Speaker 2: Especially gay sex. 574 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:04,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's no pregnancies to show for it, so yeah, Yeah, 575 00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:09,040 Speaker 3: that's the tricky thing about confirming suspicions like that. 576 00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:14,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, And like she's sometimes considered a queer icon. I 577 00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:17,920 Speaker 2: think it's fair. Yeah, you know, but we can't like 578 00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:22,560 Speaker 2: confirm nor deny. Sure, and she kept her personal life 579 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:24,720 Speaker 2: out of the press as much as possible, and I 580 00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:27,800 Speaker 2: don't mind respecting her on that here. Okay, to be clear, 581 00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 2: if I had all the saucy details, i'd be telling 582 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:33,480 Speaker 2: you I have tose yeah, But instead, what I'll tell 583 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:37,479 Speaker 2: you about is that the flail our sponsor the flail 584 00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 2: there's several different versions of it. There's the one that's 585 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:42,960 Speaker 2: sort of you know, a ball and chain, right with 586 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:46,400 Speaker 2: spikes attached to a short handle, And these are fairly 587 00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:48,680 Speaker 2: effective at getting past someone who has a shield or 588 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:50,880 Speaker 2: other armor, right, because it goes over it you know, 589 00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:54,760 Speaker 2: these are not necessarily particularly historically accurate weapons. They were 590 00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:59,320 Speaker 2: sometimes only used in jousting. But the flail, as a 591 00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 2: peasant weapon, was a big two handed stick with a 592 00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:08,160 Speaker 2: small length of rope and then another piece of wood, 593 00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:12,120 Speaker 2: and this was used in agricultural work, and so these 594 00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:17,080 Speaker 2: became what peasant uprisings preferred to bring down mounted knights. 595 00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:22,320 Speaker 2: M okay, and you too can bring down mounted knights 596 00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:29,000 Speaker 2: by buying medieval weaponry from our sponsor, the village Blacksmith. 597 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:32,480 Speaker 2: Here's other ads, just in case. Other ads are part 598 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:43,760 Speaker 2: of it too, and we're back, Sophie. Which of those 599 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:45,520 Speaker 2: weapons did you find most appealing? 600 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:48,160 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm always going to go for an axe. 601 00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:51,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's classic, gets the work done. 602 00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:53,360 Speaker 3: Yeah right. 603 00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:57,720 Speaker 2: So Perkins continued on her career, and soon she was 604 00:33:57,720 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 2: appointed to New York's Industrial Commission, which put her into 605 00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:05,000 Speaker 2: negotiations with labor unions. If all liberals were like Perkins, 606 00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,960 Speaker 2: the world would be such a better place. She was 607 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,680 Speaker 2: working on this like negotiation with a bunch of miners 608 00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:13,600 Speaker 2: when it came out in court. I think in court 609 00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:17,440 Speaker 2: that the miners were planning on blowing up their bosses 610 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:21,600 Speaker 2: with dynamite, and like destroying their workplace. Hell, yeah, I 611 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,040 Speaker 2: know that would have gotten them onto this show. And 612 00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:27,839 Speaker 2: she is like the representative of the government here, right, 613 00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:31,680 Speaker 2: and she's like negotiating, and she manages to convince the 614 00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:35,680 Speaker 2: court to not put them on trial for conspiracy by 615 00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:40,000 Speaker 2: dredging up inflammatory letters from the employers that kind of 616 00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:42,239 Speaker 2: made it be like, yeah, well, I don't know, it's 617 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,640 Speaker 2: like would have been fine. 618 00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:47,759 Speaker 3: You know, they were gonna get what's coming to them. 619 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:50,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, And so she saves all these miners from a 620 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:51,560 Speaker 2: conspiracy trial. 621 00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:53,560 Speaker 3: Nice. 622 00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:57,279 Speaker 2: Franklin Roosevelt became Governor of New York in nineteen twenty nine, 623 00:34:57,760 --> 00:35:00,799 Speaker 2: and he appointed her Industrial Commissioner for New York State, 624 00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:03,840 Speaker 2: and this makes her the first woman in the governor's 625 00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:07,520 Speaker 2: cabinet in New York. As historian Rebecca Graham put it, 626 00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:11,680 Speaker 2: Perkins managed the largest and likely the most progressive state 627 00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:15,560 Speaker 2: level labor department in the nation. Together, they established a 628 00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:19,480 Speaker 2: State Committee for the Stabilization of Industry, which spearheaded jobs 629 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:22,640 Speaker 2: programs to curtail unemployment in New York between nineteen twenty 630 00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:28,080 Speaker 2: nine and nineteen thirty two. And obviously, the Great Depression 631 00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:32,040 Speaker 2: hits in nineteen twenty nine, Right, Yeah, and so everyone 632 00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:36,359 Speaker 2: is like, oh, us having jobs again would be kind 633 00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:39,640 Speaker 2: of cool. We don't like starving to death. What if 634 00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:42,280 Speaker 2: we had someone who could do that for the country, 635 00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 2: Like that guy's doing it in New York. Can he 636 00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:48,120 Speaker 2: do it for the whole country? And so in nineteen 637 00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:51,120 Speaker 2: thirty two, FDR won the presidential election by like an 638 00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:55,319 Speaker 2: overwhelming degree. It is the fourth least close election in 639 00:35:55,480 --> 00:35:59,319 Speaker 2: US history, with the other two like I think number 640 00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:03,919 Speaker 2: one and too or George Washington. Well makes sense, Yeah, 641 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:08,560 Speaker 2: he was sort of grandfathered in practically. Yeah, an FDR 642 00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:11,960 Speaker 2: ends up going on to become the US's longest serving president, 643 00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,480 Speaker 2: and he's like, I learned a lot of bad stuff 644 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:19,840 Speaker 2: about him during this episode, right, but a lot of 645 00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:23,400 Speaker 2: his good stuff comes from Francis Perkins, you know. 646 00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:27,520 Speaker 3: Okay, so the credit that he usually gets for doing 647 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:31,640 Speaker 3: good stuff is probably actually credit that is owed to her. 648 00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:34,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, right, And which is funny because she wrote one 649 00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:36,560 Speaker 2: of the first books on him, and she gives him 650 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:40,200 Speaker 2: credit for all of her own ideas. Oh man, because 651 00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:43,040 Speaker 2: she's so like, I'm just doing this for the public. 652 00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:47,040 Speaker 3: Yeah. Well she's humble, I guess. 653 00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:49,520 Speaker 2: And so there's like times that historians have had to 654 00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:52,839 Speaker 2: go back and debunk her own claims in which she's 655 00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:56,360 Speaker 2: claiming to not take credit for a bunch of stuff, huh. 656 00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:59,319 Speaker 2: And part of that is because she's so humble, right, 657 00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:02,239 Speaker 2: But part of it is she is a woman politician 658 00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:04,040 Speaker 2: in a place where you are not supposed to be 659 00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:08,800 Speaker 2: a woman politician, right, And so people are constantly attacking 660 00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:12,799 Speaker 2: her and constantly deriding her, and like she has to 661 00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:16,960 Speaker 2: play the political game of like, oh, this isn't my idea, 662 00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:18,120 Speaker 2: and like. 663 00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:21,960 Speaker 3: I'm a silly woman with a small woman brain. I 664 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:23,279 Speaker 3: didn't come up with any of this. 665 00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:29,439 Speaker 2: Yeah, And she like can't seem arrogant or her career 666 00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:34,280 Speaker 2: will be over, you know. And so FDR becomes president 667 00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:36,080 Speaker 2: and he immediately turns around's like, hey, you are my 668 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:37,520 Speaker 2: secretary of labor in New York. Do you want to 669 00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:40,399 Speaker 2: be my secretary of labor in the federal government even 670 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:46,280 Speaker 2: though that's never been done? And she's like, no, I don't, 671 00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:50,080 Speaker 2: and she turns him down. She's fifty two years old, 672 00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:53,640 Speaker 2: she's got sixteen year old daughter, her husband's in an institution, 673 00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:57,880 Speaker 2: and she just doesn't want the attention. I also, and 674 00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:00,120 Speaker 2: this is like subtext, this is like my inference, and 675 00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:03,759 Speaker 2: I'm not the world's expert on this person, right, I 676 00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:05,520 Speaker 2: think she might be a little bit too radical. I 677 00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:08,680 Speaker 2: think she might be like, the fuck is the government's 678 00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:09,799 Speaker 2: not gonna be able to do any of this shit, 679 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:14,160 Speaker 2: like the federal government. You know, she might be cynical, 680 00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:16,239 Speaker 2: and that might be my own like reading into it. 681 00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:17,480 Speaker 3: I don't know sure. 682 00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:20,560 Speaker 2: But then FDR gohoest tour and says what will it take? 683 00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:23,440 Speaker 2: And she's like, fine, I will do it if you, 684 00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:26,680 Speaker 2: and she writes this pie in a sky list. She's like, 685 00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:30,319 Speaker 2: I want minimum wage laws, I want unemployment insurance, I 686 00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:34,120 Speaker 2: want public works projects, I want general economic relief across 687 00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:35,120 Speaker 2: the entire country. 688 00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:35,879 Speaker 3: Hmmm. 689 00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:38,360 Speaker 2: She describes the new. 690 00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:42,560 Speaker 3: Deal mm hmm, thinking that like, oh this, he's never 691 00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:44,640 Speaker 3: going to go for it. And the way that like 692 00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:48,239 Speaker 3: if there's a job that I don't really want to do, 693 00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:51,919 Speaker 3: all like jack up my rate, right, be like what's 694 00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:54,040 Speaker 3: the most expensive I would be willing to do this 695 00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:55,840 Speaker 3: for thinking that no one's going to pay for it, 696 00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:57,719 Speaker 3: and I'm like this is my rate, and then people 697 00:38:57,760 --> 00:38:59,440 Speaker 3: will be like okay, and I'm like fuck now I 698 00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:02,399 Speaker 3: have to do this. Yeah, but I've been getting the. 699 00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:04,720 Speaker 2: Money for which explains your first three husbands. 700 00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:09,160 Speaker 3: Yeah right right, yeah, yeah, precisely. But it's still no pool. 701 00:39:09,239 --> 00:39:11,120 Speaker 3: I still don't have a swimming pool. So I have 702 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:12,840 Speaker 3: to keep going. 703 00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:16,879 Speaker 2: Keep trying. Yeah, And so he looks at this list 704 00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:18,600 Speaker 2: and he's like, yeah, okay, I'll back you in that. 705 00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,120 Speaker 2: So she agrees and she's sworn in and she's the 706 00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:25,839 Speaker 2: first Madam Secretary and it like literally people are like, well, 707 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:27,200 Speaker 2: we don't know what to call you, and like someone 708 00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:29,799 Speaker 2: who's like really versed in that book, Robert's Rules of Order, 709 00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:34,200 Speaker 2: was like, I think Madam Secretary. And so she becomes 710 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:35,080 Speaker 2: Madame Secretary. 711 00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:36,640 Speaker 3: Okay. Yeah. 712 00:39:37,160 --> 00:39:39,319 Speaker 2: Most of what's been written about her, which is worth 713 00:39:39,360 --> 00:39:41,120 Speaker 2: talking about, but is not what I'm going to focus on, 714 00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:43,160 Speaker 2: is her work fighting for the New Deal in the 715 00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:46,480 Speaker 2: nineteen thirties. She was instrumental to the Social Security Act 716 00:39:46,480 --> 00:39:50,040 Speaker 2: of nineteen thirty five. She drafted the Fair Labor Standards Act, 717 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:52,960 Speaker 2: which is what banned child labor in the United States, 718 00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:57,279 Speaker 2: setting up the minimum wage and cementing what thousands of 719 00:39:57,280 --> 00:39:59,520 Speaker 2: workers have been fighting for for like one hundred years 720 00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:04,120 Speaker 2: at this point, the forty hour work week. And I like, 721 00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:06,279 Speaker 2: I want to give her credit but I also want 722 00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:07,839 Speaker 2: to give credit to all the people who have been 723 00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:10,200 Speaker 2: fighting and dying for one hundred years to get to 724 00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:14,160 Speaker 2: this point. But like, absolutely a lot of this is 725 00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:19,080 Speaker 2: the wildest progressive in government, being like all right, we're 726 00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:23,320 Speaker 2: doing this, you know. So if you enjoy the Weekend, 727 00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:27,360 Speaker 2: thank Francis Perkins as well as all the labor people. 728 00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,600 Speaker 3: You mean, pop R and B star the Weekend. That 729 00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:33,000 Speaker 3: was her, She just coverd the Weekend. 730 00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:35,400 Speaker 2: Wow, yeah, totally, which I totally know. 731 00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:40,120 Speaker 4: It is from the famously worst show on television. 732 00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:41,040 Speaker 2: The Idol of the Weekend. 733 00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:45,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, oh man, a lot of time. 734 00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:50,680 Speaker 2: But more important to our story, the crux of our story. 735 00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:51,400 Speaker 3: What do you mean. 736 00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:56,640 Speaker 2: Is I don't know any TV show that could I 737 00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:59,360 Speaker 2: even know some TV shows I watch TV. I they 738 00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:02,640 Speaker 2: live under a and I don't remember actors' names. But 739 00:41:02,719 --> 00:41:06,840 Speaker 2: I watched a television I watched Over the Garden Wall 740 00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:07,480 Speaker 2: the other. 741 00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:09,520 Speaker 3: Wow, oh my gosh, the animated show. 742 00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:12,520 Speaker 2: Right, yeah, it's so good. It was so good. I 743 00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:14,640 Speaker 2: have like two episodes left, but I'm like so into 744 00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:16,200 Speaker 2: it just to you wait, it's probably what I'm gonna 745 00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:21,680 Speaker 2: do after after we finished recording. Nice. So the Department 746 00:41:21,719 --> 00:41:25,040 Speaker 2: of Labor that she's now in charge of, oversaw both 747 00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:28,919 Speaker 2: the Immigration Services and the Naturalization Services, which are two 748 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:32,759 Speaker 2: separate things in the United States. At that point. The 749 00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:35,560 Speaker 2: Department of Labor was reasonably new when she took over. 750 00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:39,720 Speaker 2: It was formed in nineteen thirteen, and the first heads 751 00:41:39,719 --> 00:41:44,200 Speaker 2: of the department had very explicitly anti immigrant labor stances. 752 00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:48,239 Speaker 2: Did you know that Herbert Hoover, the Quaker president of 753 00:41:48,239 --> 00:41:53,640 Speaker 2: the nineteen twenties, deported up to two million people to Mexico, 754 00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:56,440 Speaker 2: about half of whom were probably US citizens. 755 00:41:57,120 --> 00:41:58,239 Speaker 3: I did not know that. 756 00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:03,120 Speaker 2: No, either. It's not talked about much. It's pretty fucked up. 757 00:42:03,600 --> 00:42:05,319 Speaker 3: I also didn't know he was a Quaker. Is that 758 00:42:05,400 --> 00:42:05,879 Speaker 3: what you said? 759 00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:07,640 Speaker 2: Yeah? No, I think no one knows he's a Quaker, 760 00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:09,720 Speaker 2: which honestly, he doesn't deserve it, because he's a fucking 761 00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:11,240 Speaker 2: racist who deported two million. 762 00:42:11,400 --> 00:42:12,919 Speaker 3: Right. Quakers are pretty cool, right. 763 00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:15,800 Speaker 2: He basically just was like, Oh, all of the economic depression, 764 00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:22,480 Speaker 2: it's probably Mexican's faults, and then like just like deported 765 00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:24,360 Speaker 2: a ton of people, including US citizens. 766 00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:25,640 Speaker 3: Well fuck him. 767 00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:25,839 Speaker 1: Then. 768 00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:32,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, Anyway, immigration law in the US, so the heads 769 00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:36,160 Speaker 2: of the department before her had all been explicitly anti immigrant, 770 00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:39,200 Speaker 2: and it was weirdly worked out for her, like you 771 00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:42,000 Speaker 2: know how, like right now, especially when Trump looked like 772 00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:44,399 Speaker 2: he was likely to the next president. Whenever Biden would 773 00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:48,040 Speaker 2: do something to like bring power to the president, everyone 774 00:42:48,040 --> 00:42:49,359 Speaker 2: would be like, what the fuck are you doing. You're 775 00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:51,799 Speaker 2: gonna have a fucking Trump's gonna be after you. Why 776 00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:55,279 Speaker 2: would you put more power into his hands? Yeah, all 777 00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:58,399 Speaker 2: of these, like previous Department of Labor people who ran 778 00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:02,040 Speaker 2: immigration were all super right wing and assumed that everyone 779 00:43:02,080 --> 00:43:05,120 Speaker 2: else would forever be super right wing because both political 780 00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,319 Speaker 2: parties were entirely anti immigrant at this point, right right, 781 00:43:08,920 --> 00:43:13,160 Speaker 2: So they gave a lot of discretionary power to the 782 00:43:13,200 --> 00:43:14,680 Speaker 2: head of the Department of Labor. 783 00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:18,320 Speaker 3: Assuming that they would be anti immigrant. 784 00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:22,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, Immigration law in the US, this is going 785 00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:26,319 Speaker 2: to shock you, has always been racist as shit. What 786 00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:29,840 Speaker 2: I know, from the very first we can show up 787 00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:33,399 Speaker 2: and kill everyone we want pilgrims to the also, let's 788 00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:36,440 Speaker 2: own a lot of black people, folks. To the first 789 00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:39,600 Speaker 2: federal immigration law, which is called the Chinese Exclusion Act 790 00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:44,680 Speaker 2: of eighteen eighty two. Right, just you know, racist, which 791 00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:48,040 Speaker 2: is also particularly interesting because they had Chinese labor had 792 00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:52,280 Speaker 2: just built the railroads, like right, just crossed the fucking 793 00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:54,520 Speaker 2: continent with railroads, and then we were like, all right, 794 00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:56,279 Speaker 2: they built that for us. Fuck them. 795 00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:56,520 Speaker 1: Now. 796 00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:00,640 Speaker 2: By nineteen twenty five we had a border patrol. And 797 00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:03,279 Speaker 2: the general attitude of xenophobic Americans has been from the 798 00:44:03,280 --> 00:44:06,080 Speaker 2: start basically white Protestants are good and everyone else is 799 00:44:06,120 --> 00:44:09,960 Speaker 2: somewhere in a hierarchy of bad. And one of the 800 00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:13,120 Speaker 2: types of people that WASPS really really didn't like was Jews. 801 00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:16,839 Speaker 2: But anti immigration laws didn't start specifically with Jews, because 802 00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:18,759 Speaker 2: there wasn't a lot of Jewish immigration in the US 803 00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:22,120 Speaker 2: until like the Pograms in Russia and Eastern Europe like 804 00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:24,120 Speaker 2: really started kicking in in the eighteen eighties or so. 805 00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:29,040 Speaker 2: After banning Chinese people in eighteen eighty two, the eighteen 806 00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:32,000 Speaker 2: ninety one Immigration Act banned polygamists. I want to know 807 00:44:32,040 --> 00:44:33,799 Speaker 2: more about that. I want to know who the polygamists 808 00:44:33,800 --> 00:44:37,160 Speaker 2: were who were coming into the country. Yeah, because the 809 00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:40,240 Speaker 2: only polygamists I can think of are were from the US. 810 00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:44,040 Speaker 2: They live in Utah. Yeah, I don't know anyway. 811 00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:46,360 Speaker 3: Ooh, I'm intrigued. 812 00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:49,759 Speaker 2: I know. So the eighteen ninety one Immigration Act band polygamists. 813 00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:54,719 Speaker 2: People with contagious diseases, people with quote moral turpitude, and anyone. 814 00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:56,880 Speaker 4: Who might that's intentionally vague. 815 00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:01,879 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, and anyone who might need welfare. Like one 816 00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:03,640 Speaker 2: of the main things that they talk about all the 817 00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:08,279 Speaker 2: time is to like not become a public ward. Then 818 00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:11,759 Speaker 2: the next law the anarchists can claim because it was 819 00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:15,440 Speaker 2: a law specifically nineteen oh three law specifically bans anarchists. 820 00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:18,920 Speaker 2: To be fair, an anarchists had just shot at US 821 00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:24,200 Speaker 2: President's of death. The Immigration Act of nineteen seventeen banned 822 00:45:24,239 --> 00:45:26,920 Speaker 2: poor people, sick people, and disabled people. 823 00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:30,000 Speaker 3: Adding ableism to the mix. 824 00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:33,640 Speaker 2: I see, yeah, because they're basically like, well, we only 825 00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:36,759 Speaker 2: want people who make our country stronger on both a 826 00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:40,840 Speaker 2: like racial level and a like labor and economy level. 827 00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:43,360 Speaker 2: Has nothing to do with morality or making sure that 828 00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:45,080 Speaker 2: people can live or anything like that. 829 00:45:45,160 --> 00:45:48,640 Speaker 3: Right in the US has never been about that. 830 00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:52,240 Speaker 2: No, which is why it's so interesting when there's people 831 00:45:52,239 --> 00:45:54,200 Speaker 2: like Perkins who are part of the US government who 832 00:45:54,280 --> 00:45:56,520 Speaker 2: are about that. But then there's a lot of things 833 00:45:56,520 --> 00:45:59,440 Speaker 2: that they can and can't do because of who like 834 00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:02,360 Speaker 2: when they try and play these games, it gets really interesting. 835 00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:06,120 Speaker 2: And then in nineteen twenty four, the US passed like 836 00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:09,920 Speaker 2: probably the worst of all of these. The Immigration Act 837 00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:13,000 Speaker 2: of nineteen twenty four is sometimes called the National Origins Act, 838 00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:17,120 Speaker 2: and it set up quotas about how many people can 839 00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:19,360 Speaker 2: come from what countries. And you will be shocked to 840 00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:22,080 Speaker 2: know that those quotas were based on how white the 841 00:46:22,120 --> 00:46:26,759 Speaker 2: people were. All of this is happening during peak like 842 00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:32,480 Speaker 2: race science eugenics times, when it is considered established science 843 00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:37,359 Speaker 2: that Italians are prone to crimes of personal violence and 844 00:46:38,040 --> 00:46:41,240 Speaker 2: Jews are driven by profit and greed and are physically weak. 845 00:46:43,040 --> 00:46:47,720 Speaker 2: This is science for forty years until it is repealed 846 00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:49,920 Speaker 2: in nineteen sixty five, only a certain number of people 847 00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:52,080 Speaker 2: per country could come to the US. I'm going to 848 00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:54,919 Speaker 2: talk at the end about why refugees from Palestine can't 849 00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:56,719 Speaker 2: get to the US. But we'll talk about at the end. 850 00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:00,960 Speaker 2: If you're from the UK, people from the UK can 851 00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:05,040 Speaker 2: come Germany and Ireland. Those are like second best Eastern Europe, 852 00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:08,560 Speaker 2: not looking so great anywhere else in the world, Like, 853 00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:10,279 Speaker 2: I don't know what the fuck you're thinking. Sixty five 854 00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:13,600 Speaker 2: thousand people a year could come from the UK, thirty 855 00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:16,879 Speaker 2: three hundred from Sweden. Most countries in the world, from 856 00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:20,440 Speaker 2: like Japan to China to Iceland, India to Australia, to 857 00:47:20,520 --> 00:47:24,239 Speaker 2: Palestine to Nepall and all of those one hundred people 858 00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:24,600 Speaker 2: a year. 859 00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:28,000 Speaker 3: Whoa so much for a melting pot? 860 00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:36,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, not really. And the quotas themselves were you know, racist, 861 00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:38,359 Speaker 2: not just in terms of national origin, but they also 862 00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:42,239 Speaker 2: divided the world into seven different racial categories. And this 863 00:47:42,280 --> 00:47:45,040 Speaker 2: system was used for massive deportations. This is the system 864 00:47:45,080 --> 00:47:49,720 Speaker 2: by which Herbert Hoover deported somewhere between three hundred thousand 865 00:47:49,719 --> 00:47:53,200 Speaker 2: and two million people to Mexico, forty to sixty percent 866 00:47:53,239 --> 00:47:57,160 Speaker 2: of whom were United States citizens. I mean, it really 867 00:47:57,200 --> 00:48:00,840 Speaker 2: just sounds like it's just now hundred years ago. The 868 00:48:00,920 --> 00:48:04,319 Speaker 2: KKK and quote unquote cowboys patrolled the borders and like 869 00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:09,120 Speaker 2: would round people up, and they were like raiding weddings 870 00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:11,840 Speaker 2: and they were raiding like social centers and anywhere that 871 00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:16,800 Speaker 2: they thought that migrant labor might be. You know, Hitler 872 00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:19,960 Speaker 2: himself complimented the quota system of the US. 873 00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:23,080 Speaker 3: Yanks, and that's how you know it's the worst thing. 874 00:48:23,600 --> 00:48:28,160 Speaker 2: Yep. Ever, her yep, so Perkins is now in charge 875 00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:33,080 Speaker 2: of labor and therefore of the immigration services. She does 876 00:48:33,120 --> 00:48:35,840 Speaker 2: a number of things right off the bat First, she 877 00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:39,759 Speaker 2: combined immigration services and naturalization services into the i INS, 878 00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:43,160 Speaker 2: which is of course now the precursor to the modern 879 00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:46,279 Speaker 2: ICE Immigration Customs Enforcement, which is under the Department of 880 00:48:46,280 --> 00:48:50,160 Speaker 2: Homeland Security, but for her it was under Labor and 881 00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:53,160 Speaker 2: she shifted its focus from deportations to helping immigrants feel 882 00:48:53,200 --> 00:48:56,480 Speaker 2: welcome and get their feet on the ground underneath them. 883 00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:58,759 Speaker 2: She didn't have total control. She couldn't get rid of 884 00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:01,760 Speaker 2: these quota systems. For example, right Congress controlled the quotas, 885 00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:05,680 Speaker 2: and then like US, consuls in different countries controlled who 886 00:49:05,680 --> 00:49:08,120 Speaker 2: could apply, like who got visas? 887 00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:09,160 Speaker 3: Okay. 888 00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:13,239 Speaker 2: But what she did manage to do was be like, whoops, 889 00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:15,160 Speaker 2: we ran out of money and we have to lay 890 00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:17,200 Speaker 2: off the following fifty three people, who were all the 891 00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:18,920 Speaker 2: most xenophobic people in the agency. 892 00:49:19,640 --> 00:49:20,319 Speaker 3: Okay. 893 00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:23,560 Speaker 2: She brought social workers to Ellis Island and improve the 894 00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:26,640 Speaker 2: conditions in the waiting rooms there. She tried to ban 895 00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:30,000 Speaker 2: arresting immigrants without warrants, but this policy only lasted for 896 00:49:30,040 --> 00:49:33,400 Speaker 2: a few years before massive pushback from Congress and interest 897 00:49:33,440 --> 00:49:37,360 Speaker 2: groups reversed it. She appointed a Scottish immigrant to the 898 00:49:37,360 --> 00:49:42,440 Speaker 2: position of Commissioner of Immigration, and his whole idea was like, well, 899 00:49:42,440 --> 00:49:45,040 Speaker 2: we're going to do stuff until they find out that 900 00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:46,520 Speaker 2: we're not allowed to do this stuff. 901 00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:47,360 Speaker 3: Okay. 902 00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:52,759 Speaker 2: Yes, And she desegregated the Department of Labor because one 903 00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:54,759 Speaker 2: of the fun things is that the federal government was 904 00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:58,120 Speaker 2: actually desegregated, like shortly after the Civil War or whatever, right, 905 00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:01,360 Speaker 2: and then it was resegregated because we live in a 906 00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:03,719 Speaker 2: racist hellhole and progress is not linear, and every time 907 00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:06,759 Speaker 2: we advance causes through great effort, if we let down 908 00:50:06,800 --> 00:50:09,360 Speaker 2: our guard at all, things slip back into horrible fascist 909 00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:14,520 Speaker 2: hell whole. Yes, so that's what she did, and she 910 00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:16,520 Speaker 2: did an awful lot more, and specifically she did a 911 00:50:16,520 --> 00:50:19,520 Speaker 2: lot of work getting people away from the Nazis. But 912 00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:21,839 Speaker 2: that's not what we're going to talk about now, because 913 00:50:21,920 --> 00:50:23,600 Speaker 2: what we're going to talk about now is one we're 914 00:50:23,600 --> 00:50:25,160 Speaker 2: gonna make fun of everyone for having to wait till 915 00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:27,320 Speaker 2: Wednesday in order to hear the rest of the story. 916 00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:29,319 Speaker 4: Hah haha, losers. 917 00:50:29,760 --> 00:50:33,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, and we're going to talk about how people can 918 00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:36,359 Speaker 2: watch and listen to your podcast, including the ones that 919 00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:40,000 Speaker 2: aren't jokes, like sitting in on the couch with Kaitlin Dorante. 920 00:50:40,440 --> 00:50:45,680 Speaker 3: Yes, So if you want to consume that you can 921 00:50:45,680 --> 00:50:51,120 Speaker 3: follow me on Instagram at Caitlin Dorante and watch my stories, 922 00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:54,680 Speaker 3: which periodically. I used to do it a lot more, 923 00:50:55,040 --> 00:50:59,440 Speaker 3: but now most of my stories is me sharing things 924 00:50:59,520 --> 00:51:04,760 Speaker 3: about Palestine and Congo and Sudan and things of that nature. 925 00:51:05,800 --> 00:51:08,479 Speaker 3: But every once in a while I'll be like, hey, 926 00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:11,200 Speaker 3: it's another episode of sitting on my couch with Caitlin, 927 00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:15,440 Speaker 3: and it's usually to promote screenwriting classes that I'm offering. 928 00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:17,960 Speaker 2: I've heard you have a master's degree in screenwriting. 929 00:51:19,160 --> 00:51:22,400 Speaker 3: Well, again, I would never mention it, but I do 930 00:51:22,600 --> 00:51:26,759 Speaker 3: use it to teach screenwriting classes and I have a 931 00:51:26,800 --> 00:51:30,719 Speaker 3: whole cluster of them coming up in September, So if 932 00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:33,200 Speaker 3: you're interested in that, you can go to my website 933 00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:37,640 Speaker 3: Kaitlindronte dot com slash classes, and I have like an 934 00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:41,520 Speaker 3: intro class, so that's suitable for beginners or you know, 935 00:51:41,560 --> 00:51:43,920 Speaker 3: people who want a refresher, and then I also offer 936 00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:46,799 Speaker 3: workshopping classes, so if you already have a little bit 937 00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:51,040 Speaker 3: of a background and you're currently working on something that 938 00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:55,160 Speaker 3: you want to workshop and get feedback on, you can 939 00:51:55,200 --> 00:51:58,279 Speaker 3: take that class. So that's what I've got, and then 940 00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:03,080 Speaker 3: I also, of course the Bechdel Cast with my co 941 00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:06,359 Speaker 3: host Jamie Loftus, and we talk about movies through an 942 00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:10,560 Speaker 3: intersectional seminus lens. So that's all the places you can 943 00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:11,200 Speaker 3: find me. 944 00:52:12,239 --> 00:52:16,200 Speaker 2: Yay. You can find me by going to your bookstore 945 00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:18,560 Speaker 2: or library and being like, do you have The Sapling 946 00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:21,600 Speaker 2: Cage And they'll be like, it's not September twenty fourth, 947 00:52:21,760 --> 00:52:23,840 Speaker 2: how could we have it? It's not out yet, And 948 00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:26,520 Speaker 2: then you can say, well, I really want it when 949 00:52:26,520 --> 00:52:28,960 Speaker 2: it does come out, and then they'll say, oh, we know, 950 00:52:29,360 --> 00:52:32,759 Speaker 2: because everyone wants it. Hopefully it'll go like that. But 951 00:52:32,800 --> 00:52:34,439 Speaker 2: if it doesn't go like that, it's still worth doing 952 00:52:34,480 --> 00:52:36,400 Speaker 2: because I have a book called The Sapling Cage that 953 00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:39,040 Speaker 2: someone asked me for a three sentence pitch of it, 954 00:52:39,080 --> 00:52:40,799 Speaker 2: and I gave them a three word pitch in which 955 00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:45,239 Speaker 2: that's a transwitch ya hell yes, And that comes out 956 00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:48,120 Speaker 2: on September twenty fourth. Sophia You Got Anything. 957 00:52:49,640 --> 00:52:52,319 Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards is now on YouTube. You can look 958 00:52:52,320 --> 00:52:55,480 Speaker 1: at our phases if you so desire. That's YouTube dot 959 00:52:55,520 --> 00:52:59,799 Speaker 1: com slash at Behind the Bastards and Closing Media has 960 00:52:59,840 --> 00:53:02,160 Speaker 1: a brand new weekly show hosted by Molly Conger called 961 00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:03,080 Speaker 1: Weird Little Guys. 962 00:53:03,600 --> 00:53:05,160 Speaker 4: Check it out if you dare. 963 00:53:05,640 --> 00:53:08,640 Speaker 2: Hell yeah, all right, we'll see you all on Wednesday. 964 00:53:08,760 --> 00:53:13,920 Speaker 3: Oh babe. 965 00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:18,040 Speaker 1: Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production of 966 00:53:18,120 --> 00:53:21,200 Speaker 1: cool Zone Media. For more podcasts and cool Zone Media, 967 00:53:21,360 --> 00:53:24,600 Speaker 1: visit our website coolzonmedia dot com, or check us out 968 00:53:24,719 --> 00:53:28,080 Speaker 1: on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get 969 00:53:28,120 --> 00:53:28,920 Speaker 1: your podcasts.