1 00:00:15,316 --> 00:00:27,436 Speaker 1: Pushkin previously on Deep Cover. It was the spring of 2 00:00:27,516 --> 00:00:31,156 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty five. Ned Timmins had been working undercover with 3 00:00:31,236 --> 00:00:35,316 Speaker 1: bikers in the Detroit area for roughly three years. He 4 00:00:35,356 --> 00:00:38,636 Speaker 1: thought he was close to finding something big to infiltrating 5 00:00:38,636 --> 00:00:43,316 Speaker 1: a smuggling ring. Supposedly it was importing huge amounts of marijuana, 6 00:00:43,596 --> 00:00:46,036 Speaker 1: and now he had a lead on someone who might 7 00:00:46,036 --> 00:00:49,516 Speaker 1: be directly involved, a part time car salesman who went 8 00:00:49,516 --> 00:00:55,396 Speaker 1: by the nickname Shine. We're looking at what he has, 9 00:00:55,436 --> 00:00:58,636 Speaker 1: a house and cars and everything, and no source of income. 10 00:00:59,676 --> 00:01:03,196 Speaker 1: And then we're pulling phone records, bank records and everything, 11 00:01:03,236 --> 00:01:07,036 Speaker 1: and huge deposits of fifty sixty thousand at a time. 12 00:01:07,956 --> 00:01:11,236 Speaker 1: Ned thought he might have enough to try and flip Shine. 13 00:01:11,956 --> 00:01:14,396 Speaker 1: The FBI knows a lot, but a lot of it 14 00:01:14,476 --> 00:01:18,796 Speaker 1: is a game to try to ferret out the information 15 00:01:18,836 --> 00:01:22,556 Speaker 1: you need. When you throw down the FBI badge and credentials, 16 00:01:23,476 --> 00:01:29,836 Speaker 1: it horrifies guilty people. What Ned needed was an inn 17 00:01:30,196 --> 00:01:34,116 Speaker 1: an introduction, and as Ned recalls it, another one of 18 00:01:34,116 --> 00:01:37,716 Speaker 1: his biker informants came up with the solution. They would 19 00:01:37,716 --> 00:01:40,876 Speaker 1: all get together and have a chili cookoff see who 20 00:01:40,876 --> 00:01:44,836 Speaker 1: could cook the meanest bowl of chili concarnate, because apparently 21 00:01:45,396 --> 00:01:48,556 Speaker 1: Shine love to cook, so this would be a sort 22 00:01:48,556 --> 00:01:52,796 Speaker 1: of informal iron chef competition. Ned says, this other biker, 23 00:01:52,916 --> 00:01:57,236 Speaker 1: his informant, set the whole thing up. Basically, he tells Shine, 24 00:01:57,676 --> 00:01:59,316 Speaker 1: and I was at this guy's house and he makes 25 00:01:59,316 --> 00:02:02,996 Speaker 1: the most incredible chili and it's better than nearest Shine. Well, Shines, 26 00:02:03,036 --> 00:02:05,796 Speaker 1: like bull fucking shit is better than mine. We'll have 27 00:02:05,836 --> 00:02:11,996 Speaker 1: a cookoff. This is also exactly how it all goes 28 00:02:12,036 --> 00:02:17,356 Speaker 1: down in the novel Shine and taking the chili challenge seriously. 29 00:02:18,436 --> 00:02:21,516 Speaker 1: Ned could smell the rich PEPPERI aromas from out in 30 00:02:21,556 --> 00:02:25,396 Speaker 1: a neatly trimmed front yard. Every man has something he's 31 00:02:25,436 --> 00:02:28,516 Speaker 1: proud of. The deck he built, the way he cooks 32 00:02:28,516 --> 00:02:32,836 Speaker 1: a steak, how well tuned his carburetors are for Shine, 33 00:02:33,356 --> 00:02:37,636 Speaker 1: it was his chili. In the novel, Ned describes Shine 34 00:02:37,716 --> 00:02:41,396 Speaker 1: as a jackal, a guy with bright, intelligent eyes and 35 00:02:41,436 --> 00:02:44,196 Speaker 1: a body that looked ready to bite fast and hard. 36 00:02:48,596 --> 00:02:51,676 Speaker 1: Ned knocks on the door of Shine's house. So we 37 00:02:53,676 --> 00:02:56,956 Speaker 1: get in there and bullshit around, and I see that 38 00:02:56,996 --> 00:03:01,716 Speaker 1: there in the kitchen is a regular sized shotgun. Shotgun 39 00:03:01,756 --> 00:03:05,836 Speaker 1: above the door. Air fifteen in one corner, guns all 40 00:03:05,836 --> 00:03:08,876 Speaker 1: over the place. At this point, Ned says he's still 41 00:03:09,156 --> 00:03:13,076 Speaker 1: very much in character, just playing the role of Ed Thomas, 42 00:03:13,116 --> 00:03:15,796 Speaker 1: the badass biker who just stopped by to cook some 43 00:03:15,876 --> 00:03:19,556 Speaker 1: chili and down some bruskies. He's just waiting for the 44 00:03:19,636 --> 00:03:24,516 Speaker 1: right moment when everyone is relaxed, guards down. We go 45 00:03:24,596 --> 00:03:31,356 Speaker 1: about an hour and we're sitting in a kitchen and 46 00:03:31,356 --> 00:03:34,236 Speaker 1: I said, well, it's time to make a move. I 47 00:03:34,356 --> 00:03:36,676 Speaker 1: just took my credits out of my pocket and laid 48 00:03:36,716 --> 00:03:38,836 Speaker 1: him on the table and said, Shine, I'm an FBI agent. 49 00:03:39,556 --> 00:03:41,836 Speaker 1: I'm going to send you away for life. I'm gonna 50 00:03:41,836 --> 00:03:45,076 Speaker 1: take this motherfucking house. I'm gonna take your cars. I'm 51 00:03:45,076 --> 00:03:47,236 Speaker 1: gonna take any money you got in the bank. You're 52 00:03:47,276 --> 00:03:51,396 Speaker 1: not gonna have a fucking penny, and you play ball 53 00:03:51,436 --> 00:03:54,436 Speaker 1: with me or all this has gone, all of it. 54 00:03:56,076 --> 00:03:58,836 Speaker 1: Ned says that it took Shine time to come around, 55 00:03:58,996 --> 00:04:02,676 Speaker 1: but eventually, after many hours of hemmying and hauing, he 56 00:04:02,756 --> 00:04:06,396 Speaker 1: agreed to cooperate to switch sides and start working for 57 00:04:06,436 --> 00:04:10,636 Speaker 1: the FBI. But not necessarily because Ned won him over 58 00:04:10,796 --> 00:04:14,396 Speaker 1: with his tough talk or his badge. Shine I found 59 00:04:14,396 --> 00:04:17,876 Speaker 1: out had his own agenda, and that agenda had everything 60 00:04:17,916 --> 00:04:21,756 Speaker 1: to do with one crucial detail. It was obvious if 61 00:04:21,756 --> 00:04:24,876 Speaker 1: he just looked at the guy. He'd been shot in 62 00:04:24,916 --> 00:04:29,796 Speaker 1: the right thigh and took a probably eight inch circular 63 00:04:29,876 --> 00:04:31,516 Speaker 1: chunk of meat out of his leg and some of 64 00:04:31,516 --> 00:04:33,076 Speaker 1: the bone, and so was shorter. He had to wear 65 00:04:33,116 --> 00:04:36,436 Speaker 1: a shoe with a big lift, and so he limped 66 00:04:36,556 --> 00:04:42,316 Speaker 1: quite a bit. So yeah, the jackal the wild predatory dog. 67 00:04:42,756 --> 00:04:46,916 Speaker 1: In real life, he was partially disabled because it turns 68 00:04:46,956 --> 00:04:51,196 Speaker 1: out someone had almost killed him. And when Ned showed up, 69 00:04:51,636 --> 00:05:02,316 Speaker 1: Shine was looking for an escape. I'm Jake Albern and 70 00:05:02,476 --> 00:05:37,716 Speaker 1: this is Deep Cover, episode three, El Dorado. Shine was 71 00:05:37,796 --> 00:05:41,556 Speaker 1: hurt badly in the shooting. He was in a coma intubated, 72 00:05:42,156 --> 00:05:46,076 Speaker 1: just lying there. Shine's son Adam, who was fifteen at 73 00:05:46,076 --> 00:05:49,236 Speaker 1: the time, still remembers at all. Every day after school 74 00:05:49,356 --> 00:05:51,956 Speaker 1: was kind of a death watch because he was in 75 00:05:51,996 --> 00:05:55,036 Speaker 1: an ostra for a long time. Mom, pick us up 76 00:05:55,036 --> 00:05:59,676 Speaker 1: from school, just it became routine, going your homework, sit 77 00:05:59,756 --> 00:06:03,516 Speaker 1: there for a couple hours, home, how was your day? 78 00:06:04,396 --> 00:06:06,996 Speaker 1: And that went on for a long time. His father 79 00:06:07,076 --> 00:06:09,716 Speaker 1: eventually came too, but he was in the hospital for 80 00:06:09,916 --> 00:06:13,956 Speaker 1: three months before he finally was ready to go home, well, 81 00:06:14,116 --> 00:06:18,076 Speaker 1: not home exactly. As Shine gets ready to leave the hospital, 82 00:06:18,356 --> 00:06:21,556 Speaker 1: he decides they can't go back to melvin Dale, the 83 00:06:21,636 --> 00:06:25,156 Speaker 1: working class factory town where they lived, and as Adam 84 00:06:25,196 --> 00:06:28,876 Speaker 1: remembers it, Dad had come up with a bold new plan. 85 00:06:30,396 --> 00:06:33,276 Speaker 1: We were better off getting out of there. That was 86 00:06:33,516 --> 00:06:35,756 Speaker 1: the way it was presented to us kids, like, hey, 87 00:06:35,796 --> 00:06:38,836 Speaker 1: it's you know. We know you're leaving all your friends 88 00:06:38,836 --> 00:06:41,796 Speaker 1: that you've known forever, but we need to get out 89 00:06:41,796 --> 00:06:45,396 Speaker 1: of here. So they decided to relocate. They found a 90 00:06:45,396 --> 00:06:48,316 Speaker 1: place where the family could lay low escape the trouble 91 00:06:48,356 --> 00:06:51,996 Speaker 1: that was brewing in Detroit. They moved to Clarkston, a 92 00:06:52,076 --> 00:06:56,356 Speaker 1: rural hamlet surrounded by lakes, about forty miles north of Detroit. 93 00:06:57,356 --> 00:06:59,596 Speaker 1: It would be great if we could ask Shine how 94 00:06:59,636 --> 00:07:03,516 Speaker 1: he remembers all of this going down, But remember he's deceased. 95 00:07:03,676 --> 00:07:07,116 Speaker 1: He got cancer in the nineties and passed away, so 96 00:07:07,276 --> 00:07:09,796 Speaker 1: we can't ask him. But we did get our hands 97 00:07:09,796 --> 00:07:13,516 Speaker 1: on about six hundred pages of court testimony, all Shine 98 00:07:13,836 --> 00:07:17,236 Speaker 1: under oath, telling his side of the story, and the 99 00:07:17,276 --> 00:07:21,436 Speaker 1: story that emerges, well, it's not entirely consistent with Ned's 100 00:07:21,516 --> 00:07:25,876 Speaker 1: version of events. Shine says he was actually looking for Ned, 101 00:07:26,316 --> 00:07:28,436 Speaker 1: that he had heard about an agent he could trust 102 00:07:28,596 --> 00:07:32,956 Speaker 1: from Toby Anderson, the violent country western singer. Remember that 103 00:07:33,076 --> 00:07:38,156 Speaker 1: Shine's older brother, and he vouches for Ned. In his testimony, 104 00:07:38,476 --> 00:07:41,436 Speaker 1: Shine says he was looking for Ned because he was scared, 105 00:07:41,876 --> 00:07:44,716 Speaker 1: scared of his bosses. He suspected it was one of 106 00:07:44,756 --> 00:07:48,636 Speaker 1: them who had him shot. Shine says in the court records, 107 00:07:49,116 --> 00:07:51,876 Speaker 1: it seemed to me like the group was out of control. 108 00:07:52,316 --> 00:07:55,436 Speaker 1: They were smuggling cocaine more and more frequently, and I 109 00:07:55,516 --> 00:07:57,956 Speaker 1: was afraid I was going to get shot again. That's 110 00:07:57,996 --> 00:08:00,476 Speaker 1: the reason I went to Ned Timmins, not because of 111 00:08:00,516 --> 00:08:05,116 Speaker 1: fear of going to jail. Slowly, Shine started to tell 112 00:08:05,196 --> 00:08:08,356 Speaker 1: Ned about the group, as he called it, the smugglers, 113 00:08:09,156 --> 00:08:12,276 Speaker 1: and said it was a large operation involving countless people 114 00:08:12,316 --> 00:08:15,556 Speaker 1: across many states, and he was in charge of security. 115 00:08:16,156 --> 00:08:19,196 Speaker 1: His job was to use that mysterious briefcase with the 116 00:08:19,396 --> 00:08:23,636 Speaker 1: voice stress analyzer, his portable lie detector to vet every 117 00:08:23,716 --> 00:08:27,316 Speaker 1: single would be employee. If this were true, Shine was 118 00:08:27,316 --> 00:08:31,756 Speaker 1: the lynch pin, the one guy who knew everyone. There 119 00:08:31,876 --> 00:08:36,116 Speaker 1: was just one problem. Shine hated being an informant. He 120 00:08:36,196 --> 00:08:40,676 Speaker 1: didn't films good about it. You know it was it 121 00:08:40,716 --> 00:08:42,996 Speaker 1: wasn't type of person that he was, but knew it 122 00:08:43,036 --> 00:08:47,996 Speaker 1: was what he had to do to stay alize the 123 00:08:48,316 --> 00:08:52,876 Speaker 1: Styckliss family. I was aware of the stress he was 124 00:08:52,916 --> 00:08:57,116 Speaker 1: going through. I was aware of how much it hurt him. 125 00:08:57,276 --> 00:08:59,516 Speaker 1: These were his friends. These are the guys that he 126 00:08:59,556 --> 00:09:02,156 Speaker 1: went to Texas and fish Bass with. These are the 127 00:09:02,156 --> 00:09:04,796 Speaker 1: guys he traveled with, and you know, they were like 128 00:09:04,836 --> 00:09:09,916 Speaker 1: a team. He's trading them in and he's getting you. Yes, 129 00:09:10,956 --> 00:09:14,356 Speaker 1: here his new best friend. That's what you had to do. 130 00:09:14,556 --> 00:09:17,356 Speaker 1: You had to get whatever information you could out of him. 131 00:09:17,396 --> 00:09:20,676 Speaker 1: And during this time with Shine, do you think that 132 00:09:20,756 --> 00:09:26,676 Speaker 1: he considers you his friend? Yeah? I think so. On 133 00:09:26,676 --> 00:09:30,756 Speaker 1: one hand, he was a total, crazy, drunken drug addict 134 00:09:30,796 --> 00:09:33,636 Speaker 1: wild man. On the other hand, he always wanted to 135 00:09:33,636 --> 00:09:36,036 Speaker 1: protect his family. Something happens to me, You got to 136 00:09:36,036 --> 00:09:42,916 Speaker 1: take care of my family. And did you take that seriously? Yeah. 137 00:09:42,956 --> 00:09:45,596 Speaker 1: One of the things that Ned was most curious about 138 00:09:45,756 --> 00:09:48,756 Speaker 1: was a rumor that somewhere in Detroit there was a 139 00:09:48,796 --> 00:09:52,636 Speaker 1: massive warehouse that smugglers were using to distribute their drugs. 140 00:09:53,156 --> 00:09:57,076 Speaker 1: The place sounded mythic, the El Dorado of stash houses, 141 00:09:57,396 --> 00:10:03,316 Speaker 1: and Shine basically tells Ned, Yep, that warehouse, it's ours. Yeah. 142 00:10:03,436 --> 00:10:06,516 Speaker 1: Shine discussed the warehouse with me and he said, here, 143 00:10:06,556 --> 00:10:09,956 Speaker 1: I'll show you in. We went and identified it. Shine 144 00:10:10,076 --> 00:10:13,156 Speaker 1: was quickly proving his worth. He knew all about this 145 00:10:13,276 --> 00:10:16,436 Speaker 1: warehouse because the guy who ran it was his boss. 146 00:10:17,316 --> 00:10:21,556 Speaker 1: You Shine tells me about this guy, Mike Vogel. You know. 147 00:10:21,596 --> 00:10:24,876 Speaker 1: Shines said that Vogel was controlling most of the weed 148 00:10:24,956 --> 00:10:28,676 Speaker 1: going into university in Michigan. Now Nen had a direct 149 00:10:28,756 --> 00:10:32,476 Speaker 1: lead on him, and he put him under surveillance. After 150 00:10:32,516 --> 00:10:36,516 Speaker 1: the break, I tracked down Mike Vogel, the mastermind behind 151 00:10:36,516 --> 00:10:42,156 Speaker 1: Detroit's legendary drug warehouse. Think about how would you feel 152 00:10:42,756 --> 00:10:46,356 Speaker 1: if you could buy anything he wanted to? There are 153 00:10:46,396 --> 00:10:50,476 Speaker 1: no rules for the wealthy, and none just all gets stupid. 154 00:10:58,676 --> 00:11:00,956 Speaker 1: I meet Mike Vogel at a house in a quaint 155 00:11:00,996 --> 00:11:04,396 Speaker 1: town outside of Detroit. Mike greets me at the door. 156 00:11:04,676 --> 00:11:08,156 Speaker 1: He's an older guy and moves slowly, almost seems like 157 00:11:08,236 --> 00:11:11,596 Speaker 1: he has a limp, but not meek, not at all, 158 00:11:12,236 --> 00:11:15,196 Speaker 1: more like an old bear. Not as fast as he 159 00:11:15,276 --> 00:11:18,716 Speaker 1: used to be, but hey, don't mess with him. Grabs 160 00:11:18,716 --> 00:11:23,116 Speaker 1: a cup of coffee, lights a cigarette and just starts talking, 161 00:11:23,956 --> 00:11:26,836 Speaker 1: but before we get into his life as a criminal mastermind, 162 00:11:27,076 --> 00:11:29,796 Speaker 1: he tells me that I have to understand where he 163 00:11:29,956 --> 00:11:36,036 Speaker 1: started out, not with marijuana, but with groceries. You gotta remember, 164 00:11:36,076 --> 00:11:39,396 Speaker 1: way before all this, I work for my father, Okay, 165 00:11:39,436 --> 00:11:47,156 Speaker 1: And I ran the frozen food and receiving docs for 166 00:11:47,316 --> 00:11:53,836 Speaker 1: his company. Okay, And that's when I learned about wholesale distribution. Yeah, 167 00:11:53,876 --> 00:11:56,836 Speaker 1: prior to being a big time drug distributor, he was 168 00:11:56,916 --> 00:12:02,476 Speaker 1: moving large quantities of frozen peas. And my father's warehouse 169 00:12:02,636 --> 00:12:07,996 Speaker 1: was like two and a half city blocks long, full 170 00:12:08,036 --> 00:12:12,476 Speaker 1: of drags, full of can goods, and a freezer that 171 00:12:12,676 --> 00:12:18,156 Speaker 1: was fifty thousand square feet. He was a grocery guy. 172 00:12:18,876 --> 00:12:22,156 Speaker 1: That's how he became an expert in inventory, specifically his 173 00:12:22,276 --> 00:12:26,956 Speaker 1: father's tracking system. They used paper receipts with carving copies, 174 00:12:27,156 --> 00:12:29,636 Speaker 1: you know, almost like what you'd get at the dry cleaners. 175 00:12:30,316 --> 00:12:33,276 Speaker 1: Mike grows up in the grocery business, one of ten kids, 176 00:12:33,756 --> 00:12:36,796 Speaker 1: goes to Catholic school. He says he was a reasonably 177 00:12:36,836 --> 00:12:40,116 Speaker 1: good student in college. Mike likes to party and hang 178 00:12:40,156 --> 00:12:43,756 Speaker 1: out with girls, smoke some pot. At heart, though he's 179 00:12:43,756 --> 00:12:46,756 Speaker 1: a business guy, he doesn't want to get caught, and 180 00:12:46,756 --> 00:12:49,276 Speaker 1: he wants to protect himself by learning more about who 181 00:12:49,436 --> 00:12:52,836 Speaker 1: might be up against, so he decides to do some homework. 182 00:12:53,156 --> 00:12:58,996 Speaker 1: He starts volunteering for the police. My job was to 183 00:12:59,076 --> 00:13:01,796 Speaker 1: watch to parking lots, quote unquote. I want to know 184 00:13:01,876 --> 00:13:05,356 Speaker 1: the codes. I wanted to see how they were, how 185 00:13:05,396 --> 00:13:09,876 Speaker 1: they acted. And police are not They're not as smart 186 00:13:09,916 --> 00:13:13,316 Speaker 1: as everybody thinks. You know, They're just doing their job. 187 00:13:14,196 --> 00:13:18,276 Speaker 1: This whole experience only builds Mike's confidence, makes him think 188 00:13:18,356 --> 00:13:21,476 Speaker 1: he can up his game start dealing on a larger scale. 189 00:13:22,036 --> 00:13:25,276 Speaker 1: Pretty soon, he's buying five hundred pounds of marijuana down 190 00:13:25,276 --> 00:13:28,596 Speaker 1: to Florida, loading it into the trunk of his Pontiac Bonneville, 191 00:13:28,876 --> 00:13:31,196 Speaker 1: and driving it up to Michigan, where he sells it 192 00:13:31,236 --> 00:13:35,596 Speaker 1: to smaller dealers. I knew him from high school, all 193 00:13:35,716 --> 00:13:40,436 Speaker 1: Catholic Central buddies, and he just keeps on expanding. I 194 00:13:40,516 --> 00:13:43,396 Speaker 1: knew how to build. You have to have the product 195 00:13:43,436 --> 00:13:45,436 Speaker 1: before you can do it. So what you have to 196 00:13:45,476 --> 00:13:48,156 Speaker 1: do is have a constant supply. And that's what I had. 197 00:13:48,636 --> 00:13:53,876 Speaker 1: There was a constant supply. Like any smart businessman, he 198 00:13:53,956 --> 00:13:58,356 Speaker 1: had multiple suppliers. Eventually big suppliers. Some would bring the 199 00:13:58,396 --> 00:14:01,196 Speaker 1: marijuana in by plane to a small airport in northern 200 00:14:01,236 --> 00:14:04,956 Speaker 1: Michigan or a grass strip down in Kentucky. Others brought 201 00:14:04,996 --> 00:14:07,676 Speaker 1: it in by boat to secret landing sites down south 202 00:14:07,796 --> 00:14:10,876 Speaker 1: and then brought it up north by truck. Then Mike 203 00:14:10,956 --> 00:14:13,956 Speaker 1: Loogal needed somewhere to put it. He would store the 204 00:14:13,996 --> 00:14:17,356 Speaker 1: product in the big warehouse out an eight mile Mike 205 00:14:17,716 --> 00:14:20,436 Speaker 1: the grocery guy. He understood that when it came to 206 00:14:20,476 --> 00:14:24,796 Speaker 1: selling produce, whether it was marijuana or you know, Brussels sprouts, 207 00:14:25,116 --> 00:14:31,516 Speaker 1: the key to profits was moving large quantities quickly and efficiently. Last, 208 00:14:31,556 --> 00:14:34,676 Speaker 1: but not least, he developed a network of trusted buyers 209 00:14:34,876 --> 00:14:38,556 Speaker 1: who each had their own territory, for instance, college campuses 210 00:14:38,636 --> 00:14:42,316 Speaker 1: like University of Michigan, and almost like a big retail chain. 211 00:14:42,716 --> 00:14:46,676 Speaker 1: He used his muscle to push out competitors. I had 212 00:14:46,676 --> 00:14:49,076 Speaker 1: it in such a way that I really control the 213 00:14:49,116 --> 00:14:52,036 Speaker 1: marijuana industry in Michigan and Iver and all the rest. 214 00:14:52,276 --> 00:14:54,596 Speaker 1: I'd hear of someone else bring in a loud, I'd 215 00:14:54,596 --> 00:14:57,756 Speaker 1: just bring in stuff and reduced my prices so they could. 216 00:14:58,076 --> 00:15:00,196 Speaker 1: One guy I heard he was selling his stuff for 217 00:15:00,236 --> 00:15:03,836 Speaker 1: three tan. I start saw mine at two eighty five, 218 00:15:04,716 --> 00:15:08,836 Speaker 1: and I always had good product. All of this sounds 219 00:15:08,876 --> 00:15:12,116 Speaker 1: like stuff out of a classic business school textbook. Right 220 00:15:12,676 --> 00:15:16,476 Speaker 1: sell large quantities, so even slim profit margins can pay off. 221 00:15:16,916 --> 00:15:21,196 Speaker 1: Keep your inventory moving. If competitors emerge, undersell them. Even 222 00:15:21,236 --> 00:15:23,636 Speaker 1: if you lose some money, it's worth it to maintain 223 00:15:23,716 --> 00:15:26,676 Speaker 1: control of the market. I mean, this guy could be 224 00:15:26,676 --> 00:15:31,356 Speaker 1: your classic Midwestern CEO, which he kind of was. But 225 00:15:31,676 --> 00:15:34,876 Speaker 1: all of this has to be done in complete secrecy. 226 00:15:35,436 --> 00:15:38,276 Speaker 1: For example, most buyers didn't even know where his big 227 00:15:38,316 --> 00:15:41,476 Speaker 1: warehouse was. When they came to make a pickup, he'd 228 00:15:41,516 --> 00:15:44,356 Speaker 1: have them go to a rendezvous point like some truck stop. 229 00:15:44,916 --> 00:15:47,996 Speaker 1: Then one of Mike's trusted drivers would take the buyer's 230 00:15:48,076 --> 00:15:51,276 Speaker 1: vehicle to the warehouse, loaded up with pot, and then 231 00:15:51,316 --> 00:15:56,236 Speaker 1: head back to the truck stop for the handoff. They 232 00:15:56,716 --> 00:15:59,236 Speaker 1: didn't have to know or my location when nobody needed 233 00:15:59,276 --> 00:16:02,156 Speaker 1: to know that unless you're a fucking thief and you're 234 00:16:02,156 --> 00:16:05,476 Speaker 1: going to try to steal it, which would have been 235 00:16:06,196 --> 00:16:10,956 Speaker 1: a tragedy on a lot of different levels. You can't 236 00:16:10,956 --> 00:16:15,676 Speaker 1: allow anybody to steal from you. Mike's business it was 237 00:16:15,756 --> 00:16:20,436 Speaker 1: going very well. His nephew, Matt Vogel, a teenager at 238 00:16:20,436 --> 00:16:24,236 Speaker 1: the time, remembers how he loved going to visit uncle Mike. 239 00:16:24,756 --> 00:16:29,716 Speaker 1: I bought a Francloyd Wright style house in Milford twenty 240 00:16:29,716 --> 00:16:33,116 Speaker 1: five acres thirty acres, But it wasn't just the classy 241 00:16:33,236 --> 00:16:36,836 Speaker 1: architecture that intrigued young Matt. One time, in one of 242 00:16:36,836 --> 00:16:38,716 Speaker 1: the back bedrooms, I remember opening the door. There was 243 00:16:38,756 --> 00:16:40,636 Speaker 1: so much money in there. It was just stacked in 244 00:16:40,716 --> 00:16:43,156 Speaker 1: boxes and twenties and hundreds, so you could smell it. 245 00:16:43,916 --> 00:16:46,916 Speaker 1: Money has a very distinct odor, and there was just 246 00:16:46,956 --> 00:16:50,476 Speaker 1: so much of it you could you could smell it 247 00:16:50,516 --> 00:16:53,476 Speaker 1: to a complete an adrenaline rush. Have you ever seen 248 00:16:53,476 --> 00:16:55,756 Speaker 1: that much money and you know it's just sitting there 249 00:16:56,036 --> 00:16:58,556 Speaker 1: and you could literally take it, and it'd be a 250 00:16:58,556 --> 00:17:01,676 Speaker 1: long time before somebody figured it out. Matt says that 251 00:17:01,796 --> 00:17:04,716 Speaker 1: hanging out with his uncle was always an adventure. You 252 00:17:04,796 --> 00:17:07,276 Speaker 1: never knew where he might take you. So I get 253 00:17:07,276 --> 00:17:09,396 Speaker 1: a call, We're gonna go to the Super Bowl. We're 254 00:17:09,436 --> 00:17:12,276 Speaker 1: thinking this was great, so my mom dropped me off 255 00:17:12,276 --> 00:17:16,436 Speaker 1: at the Pontiac Airport. In fact, they saw George Bush Senior, 256 00:17:16,596 --> 00:17:19,916 Speaker 1: who was vice president at the time, landed Pontiac Airport 257 00:17:19,996 --> 00:17:24,236 Speaker 1: and hop into his motor cap, causing an epic traffic jam. 258 00:17:24,316 --> 00:17:27,516 Speaker 1: But Mike, he wasn't gonna wait any traffic or deal 259 00:17:27,516 --> 00:17:30,756 Speaker 1: with parking. And I'm thinking, let's to deal. Well, we're 260 00:17:30,756 --> 00:17:33,716 Speaker 1: gonna take a helicopter. That's what you do. But that 261 00:17:33,836 --> 00:17:37,596 Speaker 1: was that lifestyle that they didn't care. I mean, who 262 00:17:37,676 --> 00:17:39,476 Speaker 1: flies to the super Bowl because you don't want to 263 00:17:39,516 --> 00:17:42,596 Speaker 1: deal with parking. Once they were at the game, Uncle 264 00:17:42,636 --> 00:17:46,316 Speaker 1: Mike he seemed to love having little Matt around. Go hey, Mike, 265 00:17:46,316 --> 00:17:47,836 Speaker 1: We're like, oh, give me a drinking Okay, give me 266 00:17:47,876 --> 00:17:50,076 Speaker 1: a hundred dollars bell. I'd literally go up to the 267 00:17:50,076 --> 00:17:52,636 Speaker 1: bar at sixteen and a silver down. There's always movie 268 00:17:52,636 --> 00:17:54,996 Speaker 1: stars walking around. It's the super Bowl. Buy him and 269 00:17:55,076 --> 00:17:56,956 Speaker 1: drink hour or whatever it costs. He never asked for 270 00:17:56,996 --> 00:17:59,076 Speaker 1: the change. I must have went home with two thousand 271 00:17:59,116 --> 00:18:02,476 Speaker 1: dollars in my pocket. Of course, two grand was nothing 272 00:18:02,516 --> 00:18:08,756 Speaker 1: to Uncle Mike. Nothing. Think about it. How would why 273 00:18:08,796 --> 00:18:12,196 Speaker 1: would you feel if you could buy anything you wanted to. 274 00:18:13,316 --> 00:18:15,036 Speaker 1: You could go buy a leer, jed, or you could 275 00:18:15,036 --> 00:18:17,836 Speaker 1: buy this or buy that, buy an island if you want. 276 00:18:18,036 --> 00:18:20,876 Speaker 1: You know, it's a great feeling. There are no rules 277 00:18:20,916 --> 00:18:26,476 Speaker 1: for the wealthy, and none. Just don't get stupid. This 278 00:18:26,956 --> 00:18:30,116 Speaker 1: is the guy the FBI and the US Attorney General 279 00:18:30,156 --> 00:18:35,076 Speaker 1: had conjectured about a marijuana tycoon, a man with closets 280 00:18:35,116 --> 00:18:39,396 Speaker 1: that literally looked like Scrooge McDuck's volt. But here's the 281 00:18:39,396 --> 00:18:42,956 Speaker 1: funny thing about Mike Vogel. Right for him, the money 282 00:18:42,996 --> 00:18:46,916 Speaker 1: came so fast and easy that eventually, he says, he 283 00:18:47,076 --> 00:18:49,676 Speaker 1: kind of grew tired of it. Jake, I'm gonna tell 284 00:18:49,716 --> 00:18:55,916 Speaker 1: you something. It was stressful, tough business to run on 285 00:18:56,076 --> 00:18:59,556 Speaker 1: my end because I basically was involved the smuggling, in 286 00:19:00,916 --> 00:19:03,316 Speaker 1: the distribution of it, and then having to get the 287 00:19:03,396 --> 00:19:07,196 Speaker 1: money back out. I mean, it took a lot from me. 288 00:19:07,276 --> 00:19:10,596 Speaker 1: I was I was sick of this fucking And it 289 00:19:10,636 --> 00:19:14,756 Speaker 1: wasn't just exhaustion. It was the paranoia too. He wondered 290 00:19:14,836 --> 00:19:17,796 Speaker 1: who might be stealing from him, who would rat on him, 291 00:19:18,196 --> 00:19:22,236 Speaker 1: because it would just take one one person for everything 292 00:19:22,316 --> 00:19:27,596 Speaker 1: to crumble. It was right around this time that Mike 293 00:19:27,636 --> 00:19:30,396 Speaker 1: got a call from his partner, the guy who actually 294 00:19:30,436 --> 00:19:34,036 Speaker 1: smuggled the dope into the US. He had very good news. 295 00:19:34,556 --> 00:19:38,676 Speaker 1: The next shipment, code named Bulldog, would be ten times 296 00:19:38,716 --> 00:19:44,196 Speaker 1: the usual amount, three hundred thousand pounds of marijuana. Mike Vogel. 297 00:19:44,596 --> 00:19:47,116 Speaker 1: He freaked out. I don't know, hell do you bring 298 00:19:47,116 --> 00:19:50,636 Speaker 1: out three hundre thousand pounds expect? How to distribute it, 299 00:19:50,836 --> 00:19:53,676 Speaker 1: how to get the money. It was just too much. 300 00:19:54,196 --> 00:19:57,396 Speaker 1: To compound his fears, Mike got a tip from a 301 00:19:57,436 --> 00:20:02,436 Speaker 1: trusted friend, another smuggler, a guy who knew things, and 302 00:20:02,556 --> 00:20:06,836 Speaker 1: this guy tells him the Bulldog shipment has been compromised. 303 00:20:07,276 --> 00:20:11,316 Speaker 1: The FEDS know about it. This suggested there was a rat. 304 00:20:12,996 --> 00:20:20,676 Speaker 1: I became really distrustful of Shine, Okay, really distrustful. Shine 305 00:20:20,676 --> 00:20:23,076 Speaker 1: and Mike Vogel had been working together for a while. 306 00:20:23,156 --> 00:20:27,036 Speaker 1: At this point, Shine betted everyone with his light detector machine, 307 00:20:27,396 --> 00:20:30,676 Speaker 1: so if there was a rat, he had somehow slipped 308 00:20:30,716 --> 00:20:36,796 Speaker 1: patch Shine, unless, of course, the rat was Shine. You know, 309 00:20:36,876 --> 00:20:39,676 Speaker 1: once you've been in that business and you're always worried 310 00:20:39,716 --> 00:20:43,356 Speaker 1: about what's going on around you. I'm not a dumb person, 311 00:20:43,956 --> 00:20:48,636 Speaker 1: and he just didn't fit. This bout of paranoia occurred 312 00:20:48,636 --> 00:20:51,636 Speaker 1: around the same time as Bulldog, well over a year 313 00:20:51,676 --> 00:20:55,756 Speaker 1: before Shine actually flips, So at the time, Shine was 314 00:20:55,876 --> 00:20:59,476 Speaker 1: not an informant and he basically tells his boss, look, 315 00:20:59,596 --> 00:21:03,356 Speaker 1: there's no way our smuggling ring has been compromised. Shine 316 00:21:03,356 --> 00:21:07,156 Speaker 1: remembered this conversation and actually recounted it at trial. I'm 317 00:21:07,156 --> 00:21:08,636 Speaker 1: just going to read you a bit from the court 318 00:21:08,676 --> 00:21:13,396 Speaker 1: trans Shine. I told him there was no way in 319 00:21:13,436 --> 00:21:16,156 Speaker 1: the world there could have been any type of infiltration. 320 00:21:16,836 --> 00:21:20,596 Speaker 1: I had tested everybody. And Michael said, you're either a 321 00:21:20,636 --> 00:21:22,916 Speaker 1: cop or they paid you off. And I said, well, 322 00:21:22,956 --> 00:21:26,836 Speaker 1: I'm neither. I told him they could test me. Prosecutor, 323 00:21:27,556 --> 00:21:34,036 Speaker 1: did he shine, Yes? Prosecutor did anyone interpret that test? Shine? Well, 324 00:21:34,156 --> 00:21:36,516 Speaker 1: he interpreted. I had to chart it for him, but 325 00:21:36,636 --> 00:21:41,116 Speaker 1: it did take place. Prosecutor, did you pass Shine, Yes, 326 00:21:41,556 --> 00:21:44,796 Speaker 1: I'm here. They told me. If I flunked, I was dead. 327 00:21:48,316 --> 00:21:52,116 Speaker 1: But it didn't matter. Mike Vogo couldn't shake off his suspicions, 328 00:21:52,396 --> 00:21:56,196 Speaker 1: and so he bailed on the operation. He walked away 329 00:21:56,236 --> 00:21:59,636 Speaker 1: from the three hundred thousand pound load what was arguably 330 00:21:59,716 --> 00:22:03,036 Speaker 1: one of the largest loads of marijuana in US history. 331 00:22:04,356 --> 00:22:07,236 Speaker 1: In the months to come, Mike Vogo continued to nurse 332 00:22:07,236 --> 00:22:10,796 Speaker 1: his suspicions about Shine. It was like, once this idea 333 00:22:10,916 --> 00:22:14,436 Speaker 1: had wormed its way into his mind, he just couldn't 334 00:22:14,516 --> 00:22:18,356 Speaker 1: let it go. And then one day towards the end 335 00:22:18,356 --> 00:22:22,116 Speaker 1: of nineteen eighty three, a member of Mike's outfit blasts 336 00:22:22,156 --> 00:22:27,316 Speaker 1: Shine with a shotgun at close range, almost kills him. 337 00:22:27,996 --> 00:22:30,476 Speaker 1: This is how Shine ends up in the hospital in 338 00:22:30,516 --> 00:22:33,756 Speaker 1: a coma with his son sitting by his side, and 339 00:22:33,916 --> 00:22:36,316 Speaker 1: this is why Shine walks with a limp for the 340 00:22:36,316 --> 00:22:39,996 Speaker 1: rest of his life. In reporting this out, I've heard 341 00:22:40,036 --> 00:22:43,236 Speaker 1: so many different versions of why Shine shot. No one 342 00:22:43,276 --> 00:22:46,076 Speaker 1: can agree. Some claim was just a stupid quarrel that 343 00:22:46,116 --> 00:22:49,716 Speaker 1: got out of hand. For his part, Mike Vogel denies 344 00:22:49,756 --> 00:22:52,396 Speaker 1: that he had anything to do with this, though he 345 00:22:52,436 --> 00:22:55,196 Speaker 1: did speak with the shooter and told him, well, the 346 00:22:55,236 --> 00:22:57,956 Speaker 1: problem with you is you're a bad fucking shot. Oh 347 00:22:57,996 --> 00:23:01,156 Speaker 1: she had killed the son of a bitch. You can 348 00:23:01,196 --> 00:23:03,796 Speaker 1: still hear a bit of rage in his voice all 349 00:23:03,836 --> 00:23:07,756 Speaker 1: these years later. It just kind of flares up. And 350 00:23:07,996 --> 00:23:12,156 Speaker 1: Shine talks about my temper too. Says that sometimes Mike 351 00:23:12,196 --> 00:23:16,636 Speaker 1: seemed to become unhinged, that he was acting irrationally. He 352 00:23:16,756 --> 00:23:20,396 Speaker 1: said that Mike was quote turning into a Doctor Jekyll 353 00:23:20,596 --> 00:23:26,476 Speaker 1: and mister Hyde character. There's still a little Jacqueline hide 354 00:23:26,476 --> 00:23:29,836 Speaker 1: in him. I caught a glimpse of this myself when 355 00:23:29,836 --> 00:23:32,156 Speaker 1: I visited Mike Vogel at his house. He was for 356 00:23:32,156 --> 00:23:36,316 Speaker 1: the most part, very cordial and welcoming consummate Doctor Jekyl. 357 00:23:36,956 --> 00:23:40,756 Speaker 1: And then one afternoon showed up with Matt Vogel, his nephew, 358 00:23:41,356 --> 00:23:44,836 Speaker 1: and I got kind of weird. Mike seemed to think 359 00:23:44,836 --> 00:23:48,476 Speaker 1: that me and Matt, his own nephew, were conspiring against 360 00:23:48,556 --> 00:23:54,676 Speaker 1: him somehow when we first arrived. Don't fuck with me seriously. 361 00:23:55,556 --> 00:23:57,916 Speaker 1: It's like, as I said, when you guys walked in 362 00:23:58,556 --> 00:24:01,756 Speaker 1: and you said that you guys have gotten together, and 363 00:24:01,796 --> 00:24:03,916 Speaker 1: I was thinking about the other night. I said, you 364 00:24:03,956 --> 00:24:07,196 Speaker 1: know what, in the olden days, I would have just 365 00:24:07,316 --> 00:24:12,316 Speaker 1: called Ale and another couple of bikers and explain to 366 00:24:12,356 --> 00:24:14,116 Speaker 1: you what happens if you keep on going the way 367 00:24:14,116 --> 00:24:19,756 Speaker 1: you're going. That's kind of disturbing. Why it would only 368 00:24:19,836 --> 00:24:23,196 Speaker 1: be disturbing if you were in the trunk of a 369 00:24:23,236 --> 00:24:29,356 Speaker 1: car and you're going to some other place field and 370 00:24:30,076 --> 00:24:32,076 Speaker 1: you get out and they beat the fuck out of 371 00:24:32,076 --> 00:24:37,516 Speaker 1: here and leave you there. Matt and I just kind 372 00:24:37,516 --> 00:24:41,236 Speaker 1: of looked at each other. Was Uncle Mike serious here? 373 00:24:41,756 --> 00:24:45,196 Speaker 1: I mean, didn't seem like he was joking. And then 374 00:24:45,836 --> 00:24:51,756 Speaker 1: just like that, Mike was back to being Doctor Jekyll, friendly, thoughtful, intelligent. 375 00:24:57,316 --> 00:25:00,476 Speaker 1: Mike may have been an intimidating figure. But Shine, it 376 00:25:00,556 --> 00:25:04,156 Speaker 1: turns out, had taken measures to protect himself. He had 377 00:25:04,276 --> 00:25:09,716 Speaker 1: dirt on his boss, incriminating evidence, rental car receides, hotel records, 378 00:25:09,996 --> 00:25:12,876 Speaker 1: and other evidence. He even bugged a hotel room in 379 00:25:12,956 --> 00:25:17,796 Speaker 1: Tampa and surreptitiously made recordings of Mike Vogel talking. Later 380 00:25:17,836 --> 00:25:20,436 Speaker 1: on at trial, Shine discussed this here he is in 381 00:25:20,516 --> 00:25:24,116 Speaker 1: the transcripts talking about all the evidence he had. Shine, 382 00:25:24,556 --> 00:25:26,516 Speaker 1: I refer to them as my ace and the whole 383 00:25:27,116 --> 00:25:29,236 Speaker 1: you know, in case Vogel made any more threats on 384 00:25:29,316 --> 00:25:32,276 Speaker 1: my life, and I told him I had documentation to 385 00:25:32,276 --> 00:25:35,756 Speaker 1: back up my credibility. I could corroborate certain times and 386 00:25:35,956 --> 00:25:42,956 Speaker 1: dates of smuggling. Prosecutor, you threatened Vogel that you had documentation, Shine, Yes. 387 00:25:45,596 --> 00:25:49,796 Speaker 1: In the end, Mike Vogel's paranoia it may have been justified. 388 00:25:50,476 --> 00:25:54,156 Speaker 1: Either that or it became a self fulfilling prophecy, like 389 00:25:54,276 --> 00:25:57,316 Speaker 1: he was so worried that Shine was an informant, so 390 00:25:57,396 --> 00:25:59,916 Speaker 1: certain that this was true, that he accused him of 391 00:25:59,956 --> 00:26:03,116 Speaker 1: being a rat, made him take his own my detector test, 392 00:26:03,516 --> 00:26:06,556 Speaker 1: even wished him dead in front of others, And all 393 00:26:06,596 --> 00:26:09,876 Speaker 1: of this seemed to spook Shine so badly it sent 394 00:26:09,996 --> 00:26:15,316 Speaker 1: him right into the open arms of the FBI. Coming up. 395 00:26:15,716 --> 00:26:19,116 Speaker 1: Ned discovers the Shine. He has far more secrets to tell, 396 00:26:19,596 --> 00:26:21,476 Speaker 1: secrets that will lead them both on a bit of 397 00:26:21,516 --> 00:26:37,556 Speaker 1: a wild goose chase very far from Detroit. Ned and 398 00:26:37,636 --> 00:26:41,396 Speaker 1: the FBI. They didn't go after Vogel right away. As 399 00:26:41,436 --> 00:26:44,636 Speaker 1: big as Vogel was, as impressive as he was, he 400 00:26:44,756 --> 00:26:47,916 Speaker 1: was just the distributor. And if you really wanted to 401 00:26:47,996 --> 00:26:51,076 Speaker 1: understand how drugs were coming into the country and try 402 00:26:51,076 --> 00:26:53,596 Speaker 1: to shut it down, then he didn't just go after 403 00:26:53,636 --> 00:26:58,956 Speaker 1: the distributor. He wanted the smugglers, the supply chain, the financiers, 404 00:26:59,516 --> 00:27:05,196 Speaker 1: the whole magilla. The FBI prides itself and working the 405 00:27:05,356 --> 00:27:09,556 Speaker 1: entire case, however long it takes to get everybody, not 406 00:27:09,676 --> 00:27:12,796 Speaker 1: just to grab a kilo or a bail or you know, 407 00:27:12,996 --> 00:27:15,916 Speaker 1: seize a couple of cars or something. Their game plan 408 00:27:16,116 --> 00:27:20,716 Speaker 1: is to get the whole organization. Plus, if Ned arrest 409 00:27:20,716 --> 00:27:23,236 Speaker 1: had Vogel, then that would tip off the other players 410 00:27:23,236 --> 00:27:27,436 Speaker 1: in the organization. Ned he was still an undercover investigation mode. 411 00:27:27,916 --> 00:27:31,116 Speaker 1: He had just begun to tap into what Shine knew. Remember, 412 00:27:31,476 --> 00:27:33,956 Speaker 1: Shine was the guy who used his lie detector machine 413 00:27:33,996 --> 00:27:36,956 Speaker 1: to vet everyone. I mean, basically he was the one 414 00:27:36,996 --> 00:27:41,676 Speaker 1: man HR department of a national drug ring. But getting 415 00:27:41,676 --> 00:27:45,156 Speaker 1: Shine to divulge all that information, well that was not 416 00:27:45,236 --> 00:27:51,116 Speaker 1: so easy. You'd ask him question and he'd be forthright 417 00:27:51,196 --> 00:27:53,836 Speaker 1: on it. But again you couldn't you know, you knew 418 00:27:53,876 --> 00:27:55,676 Speaker 1: you only had so long with him, and he would 419 00:27:55,716 --> 00:28:00,996 Speaker 1: just like overheat. Ned says he'd do whatever he could 420 00:28:01,036 --> 00:28:04,316 Speaker 1: to get inside of Shine's head. For example, he'd take 421 00:28:04,396 --> 00:28:07,996 Speaker 1: him fishing so Sein would relax. They'd have a few beers, 422 00:28:08,356 --> 00:28:10,876 Speaker 1: and sometimes Ned says he'd even try to speak with 423 00:28:10,916 --> 00:28:14,756 Speaker 1: a Texas drawl when they chatted, because Shine apparently had 424 00:28:14,796 --> 00:28:18,356 Speaker 1: a soft spot for Texans. You know, I just say, 425 00:28:18,716 --> 00:28:22,396 Speaker 1: I can't come on, Shine, you know, let's have another beer. 426 00:28:23,276 --> 00:28:25,716 Speaker 1: I think my bass was two inches bigger than yours, 427 00:28:25,796 --> 00:28:29,356 Speaker 1: and and he would he would get pissed. He's, no, 428 00:28:29,476 --> 00:28:33,196 Speaker 1: let me let measure that. Get the get the measuring 429 00:28:33,276 --> 00:28:35,516 Speaker 1: thing out. You know, we gotta measure that fish. I 430 00:28:35,556 --> 00:28:38,956 Speaker 1: think my fish was bigger from the outside. At least 431 00:28:39,316 --> 00:28:41,996 Speaker 1: Ned and Shine they seem like they were really tight. 432 00:28:42,516 --> 00:28:45,676 Speaker 1: Ned's partner at the office, Linnis, then a Lavicius. He 433 00:28:45,796 --> 00:28:51,076 Speaker 1: picked up on this he and Ned were probably fairly 434 00:28:51,116 --> 00:28:54,756 Speaker 1: identical to each other, had the same qualities and same 435 00:28:55,476 --> 00:28:58,036 Speaker 1: gift of gab. That's why probably Ned was able to 436 00:28:58,076 --> 00:29:02,116 Speaker 1: convince him to flip. The difference between one and the 437 00:29:02,156 --> 00:29:05,156 Speaker 1: other is ones involved in the legal activity and the 438 00:29:05,156 --> 00:29:09,116 Speaker 1: other ones involved in law enforcement activity. But the personalities 439 00:29:09,916 --> 00:29:16,756 Speaker 1: almost match identical. But Ned says he was just acting 440 00:29:17,076 --> 00:29:19,676 Speaker 1: that it was all fake. In other words, he was 441 00:29:19,716 --> 00:29:22,676 Speaker 1: just doing his job and doing it well, trying to 442 00:29:22,716 --> 00:29:25,396 Speaker 1: get as close to this guy as he could building. 443 00:29:25,676 --> 00:29:28,796 Speaker 1: I guess you'd call it intimacy, or maybe it was 444 00:29:28,916 --> 00:29:32,916 Speaker 1: more like emotional manipulation. In any case, Ned says that 445 00:29:33,036 --> 00:29:35,436 Speaker 1: the effort of doing this day in and day out, 446 00:29:35,916 --> 00:29:39,356 Speaker 1: it started to wear on him. I think it's almost 447 00:29:39,396 --> 00:29:44,916 Speaker 1: a form of PTSD. You're so psychologically involved with these people, 448 00:29:44,956 --> 00:29:47,836 Speaker 1: and I said, you know, you're solving problems for their family, 449 00:29:47,916 --> 00:29:51,156 Speaker 1: for their kids, for their relatives or whatever. You know, 450 00:29:51,236 --> 00:29:54,476 Speaker 1: they bring every problem to you and you have to 451 00:29:54,556 --> 00:30:00,556 Speaker 1: solve it within the rules of the FBI. These two guys, 452 00:30:01,316 --> 00:30:05,076 Speaker 1: they needed each other. Ned needed Shine to make his case, 453 00:30:05,516 --> 00:30:08,196 Speaker 1: and Shine, oh, you know, he needed Ned to help 454 00:30:08,316 --> 00:30:10,636 Speaker 1: him and his fa Emily find a way out and 455 00:30:10,876 --> 00:30:15,716 Speaker 1: escape in a way. It was your classic symbiotic relationship, 456 00:30:16,316 --> 00:30:19,796 Speaker 1: but honestly, I think it was more than this. Shine 457 00:30:19,796 --> 00:30:23,316 Speaker 1: and Ned shared something. There was a strange symmetry to 458 00:30:23,356 --> 00:30:26,396 Speaker 1: their lives. Ned was that dude living near the country 459 00:30:26,396 --> 00:30:29,316 Speaker 1: club who'd grown a Fu Manchu mustache, learned to ride 460 00:30:29,316 --> 00:30:32,236 Speaker 1: a Harley, and was passing as a biker with access 461 00:30:32,276 --> 00:30:36,076 Speaker 1: to meth. Shine was a clever criminal from the working 462 00:30:36,076 --> 00:30:39,196 Speaker 1: class streets of Melvyndale who was now laying low in 463 00:30:39,196 --> 00:30:42,756 Speaker 1: the suburbs, passing as just another guy with a dad bod. 464 00:30:43,556 --> 00:30:48,476 Speaker 1: They were both essentially undercover agents, but not identical. They 465 00:30:48,516 --> 00:30:55,836 Speaker 1: were mirror images of one another. And then one day 466 00:30:56,196 --> 00:30:59,596 Speaker 1: Shine really starts to talk. We got our hands on 467 00:30:59,636 --> 00:31:02,996 Speaker 1: an FBI report. They cataloged everything he told Ned. In 468 00:31:03,076 --> 00:31:07,596 Speaker 1: one session they had together, Shine charts out the whole network, 469 00:31:07,876 --> 00:31:10,836 Speaker 1: giving Ned an organized chart of the whole company. He 470 00:31:10,916 --> 00:31:15,556 Speaker 1: tells them locations Sheridan Hotels in Tampa, Florida, a house 471 00:31:15,636 --> 00:31:21,276 Speaker 1: and slide down Louisiana, places in Ohio, Kentucky, Boston, Detroit, 472 00:31:21,916 --> 00:31:24,116 Speaker 1: and he confirms the size of some of their loads 473 00:31:24,436 --> 00:31:28,756 Speaker 1: twenty seven thousand pounds, thirty five thousand pounds, three hundred 474 00:31:28,796 --> 00:31:33,396 Speaker 1: thousand pounds, and then he had names for Ned. Allegedly, 475 00:31:33,396 --> 00:31:38,356 Speaker 1: those involved included an American diplomat, a Texas billionaire, a 476 00:31:38,476 --> 00:31:42,676 Speaker 1: Teamster executive. The list went on and on. Shine knew 477 00:31:42,916 --> 00:31:45,836 Speaker 1: everyone from the ship captains to the guy working the 478 00:31:45,956 --> 00:31:50,556 Speaker 1: radios to the offloaders. Shine basically tells Ned, if you 479 00:31:50,596 --> 00:31:54,076 Speaker 1: can stop this organization, you're going to stop most of 480 00:31:54,076 --> 00:31:58,476 Speaker 1: the marijuana coming into the United States. I was excited. 481 00:31:59,396 --> 00:32:02,556 Speaker 1: I know it was a massive operation, and I knew 482 00:32:02,596 --> 00:32:07,916 Speaker 1: that we had the key to the safety deposit box 483 00:32:07,956 --> 00:32:12,116 Speaker 1: to open it all up. Shine also tells Ned in 484 00:32:12,156 --> 00:32:15,676 Speaker 1: so many words, I know how the smugglers did it. 485 00:32:16,396 --> 00:32:18,636 Speaker 1: I know what boats they used. I know where the 486 00:32:18,636 --> 00:32:21,756 Speaker 1: secret offload sites were. I know how it all works 487 00:32:21,876 --> 00:32:24,876 Speaker 1: because I was there on the ground when some of 488 00:32:24,916 --> 00:32:28,596 Speaker 1: these ships came in. I know the whole system. So 489 00:32:28,996 --> 00:32:32,756 Speaker 1: Ned and Shine they started taking some trips together, and 490 00:32:33,036 --> 00:32:36,436 Speaker 1: they go deep into the swamps of North Carolina to 491 00:32:36,516 --> 00:32:57,516 Speaker 1: the marshy inlets that pirates once used. Next time a 492 00:32:57,716 --> 00:33:02,556 Speaker 1: deep cover he called me up just to shoot the bull. 493 00:33:03,556 --> 00:33:09,476 Speaker 1: He said, Bob, place some of us boards because unleds pop. 494 00:33:10,796 --> 00:33:15,396 Speaker 1: I says, oh yeah, he was dressed for a disco 495 00:33:15,596 --> 00:33:18,196 Speaker 1: flat pants. He had a shirt that was silk and 496 00:33:18,236 --> 00:33:21,756 Speaker 1: it was open to his Sternham. He had gold chains. 497 00:33:22,156 --> 00:33:24,836 Speaker 1: All these items you don't wear on an open boat 498 00:33:24,876 --> 00:33:34,636 Speaker 1: and Carter at County. Deep Cover is produced by Jacob 499 00:33:34,716 --> 00:33:38,676 Speaker 1: Smith and edited by Karen Shakergie. Our story editor is 500 00:33:38,756 --> 00:33:42,436 Speaker 1: Jack hit. Original music and our theme was composed by 501 00:33:42,516 --> 00:33:46,636 Speaker 1: Luis Gara and Flawn Williams is our engineer. Fact checking 502 00:33:46,676 --> 00:33:51,836 Speaker 1: by Amy Gaines. Mia Lobell is Pushkin's executive producer. Ned's 503 00:33:51,876 --> 00:33:55,916 Speaker 1: novel is read by Walton Goggins. Special thanks to Julia 504 00:33:55,996 --> 00:34:00,716 Speaker 1: Barton had their Fame, Carly mcgliori, Leeta Mullatt, Maya Caning, 505 00:34:01,236 --> 00:34:06,356 Speaker 1: Eric Sandler, Aggie Taylor, Kadija Holland, Zoe Gwenn and Jacob 506 00:34:06,396 --> 00:34:10,596 Speaker 1: Weisberg at Pushkin Industries. Special thanks also to Jeff Singer 507 00:34:10,636 --> 00:34:13,876 Speaker 1: at Stowaway Entertainment. I'm Jake Calpern