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Speaker 1: JJ Valo and Tylie Ryan are dead. We may have

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Speaker 1: thought so all along, but now we know. We know

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Speaker 1: that their remains were destroyed and buried in the backyard

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Speaker 1: of cult Mom Laurie Valo's new husband's home. What now

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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace with me now a very

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Speaker 1: special guest. Her name, April Raymond. April is calt Mom

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Speaker 1: Laurie Valo's former friend from Hawaii. April, thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for being with us, thank you for having me,

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Speaker 1: and thank you for reprinting on this story. Did you

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Speaker 1: know JJ entirely? I did. I've known JJ entily and

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Speaker 1: their family since twenty fifteen. When you see the footage

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Speaker 1: of her in court, Now, is that the Lorie that

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Speaker 1: you knew? Not at all. I don't recognize that person.

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Speaker 1: Let's start at the beginning. April Raymond, Lorie Valo's friend

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Speaker 1: from Hawaii. You guys, at a twenty fifteen at the

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Speaker 1: local Mormon church there, are you a Mormon? I am?

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Speaker 1: I am LDS. Well, what do you make her questioning?

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Speaker 1: Are the children light or dark? And have they turned

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Speaker 1: into zombies? I from all of my friends that are Mormon,

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Speaker 1: from investigating and speaking to members of the LDS. I've

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Speaker 1: never heard anything like that in my life. I haven't either,

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Speaker 1: and I've been LDS my entire life. When she first

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Speaker 1: kind of brought those things up with me last spring,

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Speaker 1: I didn't even know what to think or where she

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Speaker 1: was coming up with her beliefs. Okay, hold, whoa wait?

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Speaker 1: She talked to you about zombies and light and dark?

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Speaker 1: She did. She started by telling me that Charles had

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Speaker 1: a demon living inside of him. That was the first

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Speaker 1: exposure I had to to these beliefs, and along with

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Speaker 1: her after she started telling me about Charles and the

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Speaker 1: demon that was inside of him. The demon even had

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Speaker 1: a name. His name was ned Snyder. Well, what about

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Speaker 1: the demon's name living in her now dead husband was?

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Speaker 1: What was a demon's name? She told me Ned Snyder

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Speaker 1: was the name that she used, Ned Snyder. I mean,

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Speaker 1: we're used to hearing about demons from hell, like Bill

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Speaker 1: Zebub and others, but I never really heard modern day

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Speaker 1: demon's named. Why does she say Charles Valo's body was

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Speaker 1: inhabited by a demon. Well, the way she explained it

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Speaker 1: to me is she said that Charles was already dead

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Speaker 1: and that there was a demon living inside of him,

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Speaker 1: and the demon was named ned Snyder, and I asked her, well,

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Speaker 1: how do you know that Charles is dead and you

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Speaker 1: know this ned Snyder has taken over his body. And

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Speaker 1: the explanation she gave was, well, the demon is shorter

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Speaker 1: than Charles and that's how I know it's not him.

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Speaker 1: And I just I thought she was having a nervous breakdown.

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Speaker 1: I thought, you know, she was going through a divorce,

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Speaker 1: she's just become a grandmother. Maybe she's having a midlife crisis.

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Speaker 1: I never thought that we would end up here or

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Speaker 1: be having this kind of a conversation months later, April.

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Speaker 1: I'm totally blown away by what you're telling me. So

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Speaker 1: were you in person with her or on the front

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Speaker 1: when she said this? We were in person, and she

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Speaker 1: was living back in Arizona, but she entirely came to

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Speaker 1: Kawai to visit me. It was when Charles kind of

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Speaker 1: started his divorce proceedings and she just needed to get away,

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Speaker 1: and she said she was going to start over on Kauai.

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Speaker 1: So once she kind of started telling me about this

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Speaker 1: demon and Charles, then she brought these lists of names

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Speaker 1: and next to them was a number and it would

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Speaker 1: say light or dark, and it was just pages and

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Speaker 1: pages of names. And I'm not sure exactly how they

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Speaker 1: or who all was involved in judging and raiding these people,

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Speaker 1: but they had a systematic way of deciding if somebody

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Speaker 1: was light or dark, if they were possessed. It was

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Speaker 1: very alarming. She even had a list with my name

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Speaker 1: on it, but my name was was handwritten in, So

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Speaker 1: there we were locked. I was. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: if she'd still probably have me in that category, but

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Speaker 1: she had me in light. But she had just handwritten

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Speaker 1: my name and she had crossed out somebody else's name.

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Speaker 1: I guess I took their place or something. What kind

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Speaker 1: of people were all the list? Who saw the list?

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Speaker 1: There were family members of hers. A lot of the

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Speaker 1: names I didn't even recognize. I don't know. They must

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Speaker 1: have been people that she knew, but they weren't names

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Speaker 1: that I recognized. That the name that whose place I took,

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Speaker 1: that she she handwrote, I didn't recognize the name. I

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Speaker 1: did recognize a few of her family members, but other

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Speaker 1: than that and myself, I didn't recognize any of the

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Speaker 1: names or the children on the list, not the list

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Speaker 1: that I saw. But she did tell me that Tyley

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Speaker 1: was dark. She didn't say anything about JJ at that time,

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Speaker 1: but she did tell me that Tyley was dark. What

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Speaker 1: in their world are you supposed to do someone is dark? See?

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Speaker 1: At the time, I didn't know what that meant. I

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Speaker 1: just thought that it was I didn't know where she

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Speaker 1: was coming up with it. I thought it was just

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Speaker 1: harmless or it was some kind of escape for her.

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Speaker 1: I never got the impression that it was going to

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Speaker 1: become a violent situation or a dangerous situation. I thought

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Speaker 1: it was just more of like a fantasy world that

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Speaker 1: she was living in. And I thought it was just,

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Speaker 1: you know, maybe brought on by some kind of you know,

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Speaker 1: emotional trauma or midlife crisis. I never thought that we

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Speaker 1: would end up here. But she told you, and you're

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Speaker 1: sure that Tylie was dark, Yes, she said Tylie is dark.

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Speaker 1: She's just like her dad. And her dad was really,

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Speaker 1: according to Laurie, was very dark. That would be Joe Ryan.

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Speaker 1: Now at this time, was Joe Ryan still alive? No,

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Speaker 1: he was not. He passed away I think in the

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Speaker 1: spring of twenty eighteen, because she had she entirely came

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Speaker 1: to visit me the fourth of July twenty eighteen, and

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Speaker 1: he had already passed away by then, but she says

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Speaker 1: he was also dark exactly, So did you know her

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Speaker 1: during the happy times? I did stay her. Laurie, What

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Speaker 1: was her relationship with her husband, Charles valid? Honestly, I

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Speaker 1: thought she and Charles had the perfect marriage of all

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Speaker 1: the friends that I had. I thought they had the

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Speaker 1: marriage that you'd want to emulate. I. In fact, when

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Speaker 1: she first told me last February that they were having

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Speaker 1: marriage problems, that they were going to be going through divorce,

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Speaker 1: I was completely blindsided because I never saw them argue.

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Speaker 1: She never complained about anything very significant in their marriage

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Speaker 1: other than she wanted more of a strong spiritual leader.

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Speaker 1: She didn't feel like she and Charles were spiritual equals,

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Speaker 1: but beyond that, it seemed like they had a raw,

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Speaker 1: good marriage, and I thought they had a really great life.

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Speaker 1: Why does she think she and Charles Valor were not

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Speaker 1: spiritual equals? Charles had converted to Mormonism, and so his

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Speaker 1: understanding of doctrine was maybe not as advanced as she

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Speaker 1: perceived her understanding to be. She's a lifelong you know,

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Speaker 1: born into Mormonism and were in race in Mormonism. So

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Speaker 1: I think that she just didn't think that he understood

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Speaker 1: maybe some of the deeper doctrines that she was really

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Speaker 1: attracted to. But he supported her in her role in

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Speaker 1: her religion. He did his part. He wasn't a passive participant.

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Speaker 1: He was very active. I think she just thought that

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Speaker 1: he wasn't her match spiritually. Time stories with Meancy Grace,

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Speaker 1: trying to get my mind wrapped around everything you're telling me.

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Speaker 1: And you thought when she was talking about people are

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Speaker 1: light or dark, that Tyley was dark just like her father.

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Speaker 1: You thought she was going through some kind of a crisis,

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Speaker 1: because by then she was in the midst of the

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Speaker 1: doors from drives Vella. Correct, right, that's correct, and this

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Speaker 1: was her fourth way happen. Next, I was Tylely there

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Speaker 1: to hear all this, Tyley was, Tyler was there, and

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Speaker 1: it didn't seem like it was something that Tylie was

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Speaker 1: hearing for the first time. I don't I don't think

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Speaker 1: Tyley was in the room when she said Tyle's dark.

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Speaker 1: But Tyle was around when she was talking about a

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Speaker 1: lot of her other beliefs, as far as being a

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Speaker 1: translated being, as far as being have living existed on

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Speaker 1: Earth several times, or having several past lives and she

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Speaker 1: would go into detail about who she was and all

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Speaker 1: of these past lives that she had experienced. Okay, I

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Speaker 1: need to hear that. That is something I want to hear.

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Speaker 1: What were her past lives? Sure, so you know, she

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Speaker 1: had a lot of random people that it didn't weren't

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Speaker 1: very significant, but a lot of the lives that she experienced,

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Speaker 1: she was connected to early founders of the Mormon Church.

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Speaker 1: So she would had said that she was Joseph Smith's grandmother.

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Speaker 1: She said that, you know, she had been. I can't

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Speaker 1: remember if it was the wife or the daughter of

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Speaker 1: James the just who was Jesus's brother. I mean, she

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Speaker 1: had so much information. Way, hold on again, I'm not

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Speaker 1: a biblical scholar, although I try my best to be

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Speaker 1: a Christian. Joseph Smith's grandfather. Now, Joseph Smith was a

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Speaker 1: founder of Mormonism. Correct, That's correct. Now did you just

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Speaker 1: mention James Christ's brother. She says she was the disciple

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Speaker 1: James right, Christ's brother, that she was his wife. That's

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Speaker 1: what I remember her saying. You're making the hair stand

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Speaker 1: up on my arm right now. I want you to

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Speaker 1: know that I know now I'm kind of understanding where

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Speaker 1: this is going. Okay, any other past lives I need

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Speaker 1: to know about. I don't remember anything specific about a

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Speaker 1: lot of the other lives that she talked about, but

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Speaker 1: I know that there were like close to a dozen

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Speaker 1: that she had shared with me. But it was just

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Speaker 1: so much information that I had nothing to connect it to,

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Speaker 1: and I was just kind of waiting for her to

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Speaker 1: just get it out of her system. It was something

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Speaker 1: I wanted to not really remember. Yeah, when you love

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Speaker 1: somebody a longtime friend and they come out with something bizarre,

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Speaker 1: you have the love and you're trying to reconcile this

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Speaker 1: thing that you're hearing or witnessing. Were there any other biblical,

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Speaker 1: biblically connected past lives other than with Joseph Smith and

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Speaker 1: Christ's brother James, not that I can recall specifically. During

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Speaker 1: this discussion, you're saying that Tyleie was in and out

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Speaker 1: and she had obviously heard all this before. Right. What

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Speaker 1: was her relationship with Tylie? Did they get along or

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Speaker 1: they having mother daughter problems? I never saw them have

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Speaker 1: mother daughter problems. I never saw the problems. I know

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Speaker 1: that Laurie would describe the problems. Tylie was a very

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Speaker 1: strong willed, independent young lady like most teenage girls aren't.

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Speaker 1: I didn't think any of their conflict was outside of

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Speaker 1: the ordinary mother daughter power struggle. Nothing stood out to

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Speaker 1: me that caused alarm. When she Laurie Vale occult mom

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Speaker 1: was talking about her past lives and being quote translated,

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Speaker 1: Tylie was coming in and out. She showed no alarm

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Speaker 1: because if I heard my mother say that she was

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Speaker 1: a goddess and she was leading us toward the end

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Speaker 1: of the world, I would certainly perk up and listen.

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Speaker 1: But Tylie was kind of blase. She found very unfazed

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Speaker 1: by it. It didn't seem like it was the first

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Speaker 1: time she was hearing it. It just seemed something like

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Speaker 1: something she was had been around or privy too for

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Speaker 1: quite a while. She didn't act surprised or even really

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Speaker 1: interested in anything that Laurie was saying. April, when you

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Speaker 1: first learned that the children were missing, what was your

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Speaker 1: first thought? I was physically sick it. I just could

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Speaker 1: not conceive of a scenario where there was a good

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Speaker 1: explanation as to why they would be missing, especially knowing

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Speaker 1: the circumstances around Charles Valo's death. That that had caused

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Speaker 1: alarm for me Back in July, of twenty nineteen explore Well,

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Speaker 1: when I found out about what had happened to Charles

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Speaker 1: in July, it was really alarming to me because of

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Speaker 1: the conversation that we had had in February where she's

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Speaker 1: saying Charles is already dead, there's a demon living inside

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Speaker 1: of him. And then a few months later he is

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Speaker 1: dead and her brother's the one that shot him. And

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Speaker 1: I had known that her brother Alex had attacked her

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Speaker 1: previous husband, Joe Ryan, and so it just seemed like

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Speaker 1: there's a lot more to this, There's something more to this,

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Speaker 1: And so then flashed forward to December when I first

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Speaker 1: find out that the children are missing, and then I

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Speaker 1: hear all of the other circumstances about Chad Daville's wife's

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Speaker 1: mysterious death, and just the behavior and the reaction of

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Speaker 1: Laurie and Chad. It caused even greater alarm for me.

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Speaker 1: Was Charles Valo, who is now dead. Ever, let to

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Speaker 1: your knowledge, you know, if anything, I would describe Charles

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Speaker 1: as a pushover. He was, you know, you never know

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Speaker 1: what's really going on behind closed doors. But I was

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Speaker 1: in their home quite a bit. Lorie and I were

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Speaker 1: close enough that we would tell each other just about anything.

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Speaker 1: I would think that if there was something that had happened,

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Speaker 1: or if he was violent, I would have thought she

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Speaker 1: would have had no problem bringing that up to me.

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Speaker 1: I never saw that. If anything, I saw Charles exhibit

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Speaker 1: an exorbitant amount of patients in most situations. What do

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Speaker 1: you make of the clining that, hey, Charles Valet became

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Speaker 1: violent and Alex Cox had to shade him. I don't

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Speaker 1: believe that, based on my experience with Charles and knowing

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Speaker 1: Alex's history, and you know, remembering the conversation I had

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Speaker 1: with Lorie in February. It just I have a lot

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Speaker 1: of questions because in February she told you Charles Valoe

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Speaker 1: was dark, possessed by a damon, and that he was

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Speaker 1: already dead, right, and then suddenly he is dead. Did

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Speaker 1: she ever talk to you about Chad Daybil. She did,

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Speaker 1: but it was more, you know, I knew that she

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Speaker 1: had read his books when she again in February. When

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Speaker 1: she came, she was talking about how she was part

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Speaker 1: of a podcast group that he was in, but she

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Speaker 1: also mentioned several of her other co hosts. She never

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Speaker 1: gave me any indication at that time that their relationship

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Speaker 1: was anything more than just professional, and that she just

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Speaker 1: respected him as an author and as a speaker. Do

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Speaker 1: you believe Charles was faithful to her? Was he cheating?

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Speaker 1: I don't think that he was cheating on her. Charles was,

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Speaker 1: to a fault, madly in love with her and did

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Speaker 1: anything to make her happy. People surprised you every day,

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Speaker 1: and you never know what's going on behind closed doors.

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Speaker 1: But I didn't see any indication of that. And she

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Speaker 1: did bring that up to me that he was had

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Speaker 1: been having an affair, but the evidence that she had

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Speaker 1: that was supposed to support that didn't make any sense,

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Speaker 1: and I felt like she was just her evidence. Well,

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Speaker 1: I asked, I said, well, where did he meet this woman?

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Speaker 1: And she couldn't give me a name of the woman.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the first thing you're going to do if

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Speaker 1: your husband's having an affair is you're going to find

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Speaker 1: out her name. You're gonna look her up up. You're

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Speaker 1: gonna want to know what this woman looks like. She

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Speaker 1: didn't have a name, She didn't really know what she

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Speaker 1: looked like. She just said, oh, he met her on LinkedIn,

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Speaker 1: and that the way that she knew he was having

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Speaker 1: an affair was that when he would go out of town,

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Speaker 1: his grocery bills would be very high. It just didn't

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Speaker 1: make any sense. I was like I, I just thought

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Speaker 1: she was feeling insecure. And that's the evidence. That's the

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Speaker 1: evidence that she shared with me crime stories with Nancy

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Speaker 1: Grace with me. Now a very special guest, her name,

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Speaker 1: April Raymond. April is cult Mom, Laurie Valo's former friend

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Speaker 1: from Hawaii. April, what can you tell me about Laurie

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Speaker 1: Valo believing that she is a quote chosen one that

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Speaker 1: is going to lead one hundred and forty four thousand

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Speaker 1: people to the knee Jerusalem at the end of the

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Speaker 1: world on July twenty two. I feel like she really

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Speaker 1: believes that. I don't think she's saying just saying that.

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Speaker 1: I feel like she's delusional, and I think that I

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Speaker 1: think that she wholeheartedly believes that. I think her behavior

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Speaker 1: and the behavior of her new husband, Chad, speaks volumes

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Speaker 1: to me. I cannot conceive of any reasonable explanation as

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Speaker 1: to why they would behave the way that they've behaved

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Speaker 1: since this began. April, did Yellowstone have any significance to

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Speaker 1: Laurie Valo? Not to my knowledge. I was actually surprised

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Speaker 1: that she had even taken a trip or a day

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Speaker 1: trip there. That didn't seem to say that that's interesting

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Speaker 1: to me. It's cold and Yellowstone in September, um, it's

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Speaker 1: off season. It Laurie wasn't at least the Laurie that

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Speaker 1: I knew. That wasn't the type of vacation that she

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Speaker 1: would enjoy. So I was just surprised that she was

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Speaker 1: even there, and it just it didn't fit in with

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Speaker 1: the person that I had known. Why are you telling

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Speaker 1: me that Yellowstone would not be the kind of vacation

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Speaker 1: Lorie Valley would take or trip well I would. I'm

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Speaker 1: just facing on what I had known of her, and

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Speaker 1: every trip that I'd known that she'd taken was to

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Speaker 1: Disneyland or to Hawaii or you know, somewhere warm and

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Speaker 1: somewhere kind of tropical. It just the Yellowstone just didn't

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Speaker 1: seem It just seemed out of the ordinary for her.

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Speaker 1: In my pinapon with the fact that's the last time

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Speaker 1: Tylie has ever been seen alive. Question to you regarding

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Speaker 1: her ordering her wedding dress on Amazon and her wedding

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00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:05,160
Speaker 1: rain before Timmy Daybille is dead, then Tammy Daybill dies

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Speaker 1: in her sleep. How does that strike you? You know

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Speaker 1: her better than any of us. It's very alarming to me.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I know Lourie is a master planner.

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Speaker 1: She's always ten steps ahead. You know, That's one of

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Speaker 1: the qualities I admired about her. But in this situation,

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Speaker 1: it just doesn't sit well with me. To me, it

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Speaker 1: implies foul play. What was your conversation with Lorie Valo

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Speaker 1: like when she told you she was a quote chosen One.

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Speaker 1: I was trying to be very compassionate towards her at

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Speaker 1: the time. I thought that again, that there was some

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Speaker 1: kind of a psychotic break or there was some kind

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Speaker 1: of mental crisis, and so I was almost embarrassed for

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Speaker 1: her by, you know, because of the things that she

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Speaker 1: was saying. And I just thought, if she just you know,

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Speaker 1: gets it out of her system, that she'll cycle through

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Speaker 1: whatever she's going through right now and she'll get back

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Speaker 1: to normal. And obviously I was very wrong. April, when

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Speaker 1: she's talking about being a chosen One, a goddess her word,

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Speaker 1: not mine, that has been selected by Christ to lead

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Speaker 1: the chosen one hundred and forty four thousand people worldwide

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Speaker 1: since the beginning of time to the quote New Jerusalem.

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Speaker 1: Was she going to be able to bring the children

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Speaker 1: with her? She didn't say anything about her children, but

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Speaker 1: she had told me that she was there to gather me.

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Speaker 1: She had been appointed as a gatherer by the angel

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Speaker 1: Morone and Jesus Christ apparently, and as a gatherer was

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Speaker 1: her responsibility to go and get the remaining one hundred

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Speaker 1: and forty you know, four thousand people so that they

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Speaker 1: could all be together. She was trying to gather you, yes,

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Speaker 1: and she said you would need to separate. You were chosen.

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Speaker 1: I was that is significant what you just said. She

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Speaker 1: told you you were chosen, you were one of the

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Speaker 1: one hundred and forty four thousand selected, and that you,

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Speaker 1: April Raymond, would have to separate from your children because

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Speaker 1: they weren't common right, that they had a different mission,

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Speaker 1: and in order to fulfill my mission, I would have

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Speaker 1: to separate from them. What did that mean? Did you

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Speaker 1: ask her? What do you mean separate? I didn't think

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Speaker 1: that at the time that it meant anything sinister, I

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Speaker 1: think I at the time, I just thought she meant,

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Speaker 1: you just need to come with me, and you know,

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Speaker 1: the kids will be fine, you know, with their father

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Speaker 1: and they they'll have their mission, and I got the

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Speaker 1: impression that eventually will all be together again based on

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Speaker 1: what she was saying, But she never specifically gave the

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Speaker 1: details of what the separation meant. I just I didn't understand,

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Speaker 1: and I should have asked more questions, but I almost

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Speaker 1: didn't really want it no more. Well, at the time,

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Speaker 1: I doubt you thought anything nefarious of it, not at all.

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Speaker 1: I did not. Was this in person or over the phone.

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Speaker 1: This was in person. She looked at you and told

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Speaker 1: you you were one of the one hundred and forty

359
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Speaker 1: four thousand chosen, and all of the one hundred and

360
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Speaker 1: forty four thousand would be gathered together for the end

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Speaker 1: of the world in July July twenty second, and you

362
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Speaker 1: would have to leave your children, or that you had

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Speaker 1: to leave now to prepare. I think what the way

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Speaker 1: I understood it was leave now to prepare and go

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Speaker 1: help gather the rest of the people, and in order

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Speaker 1: to do that, you'd have to separate from your children.

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Speaker 1: What did you say? I said, no, I don't believe

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Speaker 1: this in the way that you do, And I wanted

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Speaker 1: to be kind about it so that I didn't embarrass her,

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Speaker 1: and I just basically said, I understand that you really

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Speaker 1: believe this, but I haven't had these same experiences that

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Speaker 1: you've had or claim to have had, and so this

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Speaker 1: isn't something that resonates with me. How did she take it.

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Speaker 1: I think she was a little upset, but she kind

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Speaker 1: of made a comment that, oh, maybe you're just not

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Speaker 1: ready or you're not ready to hear the truth, or

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Speaker 1: something to that effect. She didn't show you any really

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00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 1: significant signs of being angry or upset, but I could

379
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Speaker 1: tell that, you know, she was a little frustrated. Where

380
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:45,400
Speaker 1: were the one hundred and forty four thousand's supposed to go?

381
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 1: She never said a location or even a date. This

382
00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:53,880
Speaker 1: was back in twenty nineteen and she had just said

383
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:57,280
Speaker 1: that it was the end was soon, but she never

384
00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:01,880
Speaker 1: gave a location of where everyone was supposed to gather too.

385
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:07,880
Speaker 1: But you were to physically leave where you were and

386
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:11,040
Speaker 1: go to a certain spot to gather with one hundred

387
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 1: forty four thousand once they were all found. And it

388
00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 1: was my understanding based on what she said, was that

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00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:21,359
Speaker 1: we would be traveling all over the world to find

390
00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:24,720
Speaker 1: all of these people because they were you know, there

391
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 1: were some in every country, or you know something to

392
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 1: that effect. They had to be gathered worldwide. They had

393
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:47,919
Speaker 1: to be gathered worldwide. Yes, crime stories with Nancy Grace,

394
00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:54,720
Speaker 1: When did you first feel her slipping away from you

395
00:27:55,040 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 1: and away from the established LDS. Last February is when

396
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 1: I saw it the most significantly and overtly, And when

397
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:11,239
Speaker 1: she was talking about these past lives, and when she

398
00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:15,919
Speaker 1: was talking about this light dark rating system, talking about

399
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 1: herself as a translated being and a gatherer, it was

400
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:25,320
Speaker 1: just these were foreign expressions, These were foreign concepts to me,

401
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:30,680
Speaker 1: and I could not understand where these were coming from.

402
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:34,120
Speaker 1: I could tell that there was some organization to it.

403
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 1: It wasn't just someone, you know, just ranting or spewing

404
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 1: off the top of their head. It was obviously something

405
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 1: that she had been exposed to or had learned, and

406
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:49,719
Speaker 1: it had been presented in a very organized way. But

407
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 1: I couldn't understand the source of it. None of it

408
00:28:54,480 --> 00:29:00,719
Speaker 1: connected with any warmon doctrine that I had I'm aware of.

409
00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 1: As she tried to contact to you at all since

410
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:09,200
Speaker 1: her marriage to day Bell. No. The last time that

411
00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:12,200
Speaker 1: we had any contact was June twenty seventh, so just

412
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:16,200
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks before Charles passed away April. I

413
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:22,440
Speaker 1: know that JJ had similarity issues, did she ever indicate

414
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 1: that that was overwhelming to her? Laurie was always a

415
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:28,720
Speaker 1: really good mom, and she was really good with JJ.

416
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:31,120
Speaker 1: But she always had a lot of help with JJ.

417
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,280
Speaker 1: So when they lived on Kawhi, she always had a nanny.

418
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:37,120
Speaker 1: Usually that nanny was live in nanny, and then once

419
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:40,680
Speaker 1: he went to school, he Charles was always there to

420
00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:44,840
Speaker 1: help her, you know, manage JJ. It wasn't something she

421
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:49,040
Speaker 1: could do on her own. And so when she came

422
00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:52,880
Speaker 1: to stay with me last February, she didn't have JJ

423
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 1: with her, and I asked where he was, and she

424
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:57,560
Speaker 1: said that he was with Charles, and Charles was going

425
00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 1: to go be with you know, with Kay. And then

426
00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:02,840
Speaker 1: we kind of talked about, well, what's going to happen

427
00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,280
Speaker 1: if you go through with this divorce or you know,

428
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:09,680
Speaker 1: what are the consequences for JJ? And she said, oh,

429
00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:12,040
Speaker 1: Charles is going to have to take care of JJ's

430
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:15,239
Speaker 1: it's his turn now. Basically not that she resented it,

431
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: but just kind of like, well, if we're not together,

432
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:20,920
Speaker 1: I don't need to take care of JJ anymore because

433
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:26,800
Speaker 1: that's Charles's responsibility. So she didn't express any resentment, just

434
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 1: more like it's his turn. Now I've done my time,

435
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 1: Ryan Jagger, it right, That's how I took it. Then

436
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 1: Charles Valo was shot dead and that leaves her with

437
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:44,880
Speaker 1: JJ and Tyley because she believes is dark. Who had

438
00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:48,120
Speaker 1: the money to pay for the nannies? I don't yeah,

439
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:50,520
Speaker 1: I don't think she had one after Charles passed away.

440
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:52,840
Speaker 1: And that was what was kind of concerning to me too,

441
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:55,760
Speaker 1: is when I learned that she had taken JJ out

442
00:30:55,800 --> 00:31:00,600
Speaker 1: of school in Rexburg to do homeschool. That makes sense

443
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 1: to me because she had always had a lot of help,

444
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,719
Speaker 1: and even with a lot of help, JJ requires a

445
00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:13,400
Speaker 1: lot of attention and time, and so her doing homeschool

446
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 1: with JJ by herself unheard of. That didn't make any

447
00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 1: sense to me. Was Tyley really planned on going to college?

448
00:31:23,920 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 1: I hadn't been told when they were staying there that

449
00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 1: Tyle had gotten her ged And that was you know,

450
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:35,720
Speaker 1: back in twenty nineteen. Tyley is a very intelligent girl.

451
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 1: I know she wanted to go to college. She never

452
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 1: expressed any interest at that time in a specific college.

453
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 1: Why didn't she get a JAD? Why didn't she just

454
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 1: go through school? The twelve grades. Tyley had a lot

455
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 1: of health issues and they could never really get to

456
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:56,720
Speaker 1: the bottom of them. So she had been missing a

457
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 1: lot of school in Arizona, and so they had just

458
00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:02,719
Speaker 1: decided that it was getting too complicated to try to

459
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:05,600
Speaker 1: work things out with the teachers to get makeup work.

460
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:09,200
Speaker 1: That they just decided for her to take her ged

461
00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:13,520
Speaker 1: what kind of health problems that the doctors couldn't figure out.

462
00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 1: She had some digestive issues or stomach issues. She was

463
00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: always having stomach aches, and they you know, did every

464
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 1: test they could think of, and never could really figure

465
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 1: out what the source of the problem was or what

466
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 1: the remedy would be. But the answer was to take

467
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:34,760
Speaker 1: her out of school and have her get her j D.

468
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 1: Right that was there, she took j J out of school. Curious,

469
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:45,520
Speaker 1: very curious to Tylely ever talk about her ailment to you.

470
00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:48,440
Speaker 1: I knew that she was sick a lot, so Tyley

471
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:52,520
Speaker 1: would often be kind of you know, even when Charles

472
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 1: and Laurie lived on quiet, Tylee was always sick and

473
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 1: she would be in her room, you know, resting or

474
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:01,840
Speaker 1: sleeping or recovering or just getting back from the doctor.

475
00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:04,280
Speaker 1: When she was younger, They told me that she had

476
00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:07,080
Speaker 1: had several surgeries to try to figure out what was

477
00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:11,440
Speaker 1: wrong and to try to fix things, and it never

478
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:21,920
Speaker 1: accomplished anything. Once Laurie Valoe primarily involved in Tyle's treatments. Yes,

479
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,040
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm certainly no doctor or a psychiatrist or

480
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 1: a shrink. But if a fleet of doctors in a

481
00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:36,240
Speaker 1: metropolitan city can't figure out what's wrong and called mom,

482
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:40,280
Speaker 1: Laurie Valo was the primary person taking care of her.

483
00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:45,320
Speaker 1: I'd be very, very curious to find the true nature

484
00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:52,320
Speaker 1: of tylely Ryan's ailments and if they were somehow inflicted

485
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 1: on her. I'm very curious, indeed, absolutely what was Laurie

486
00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 1: Valo's attitude toward Tyley's ailments. She seemed very, you know

487
00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:08,959
Speaker 1: what I perceived as very compassionate towards it, and just

488
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:12,600
Speaker 1: she came across as well, we'll do whatever it takes to,

489
00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:15,919
Speaker 1: you know, find out why this keeps happening to Tyle.

490
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 1: Hindsights happening? Would she throw up? Would she have pain,

491
00:34:21,640 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 1: stomach pains that were just like very unexplained stomach pains

492
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:31,600
Speaker 1: and issues when she would eat things, how she would

493
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:35,560
Speaker 1: feel reflecting back on those conversations. It'd be interesting to

494
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:39,719
Speaker 1: look at Tylie's medical history and see what really were

495
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:43,279
Speaker 1: her symptoms and what had been done, you know, to

496
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:47,920
Speaker 1: try to find out and the offit of the pain,

497
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:51,200
Speaker 1: And would Laurie Valor be there alone with her at

498
00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:54,239
Speaker 1: the time she began manifesting the pain and when the

499
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:57,120
Speaker 1: pain would go away? And what if any attention would

500
00:34:57,160 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 1: Laurie Valor receive when Tyley would be ill and a

501
00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:04,359
Speaker 1: doctor after doctor after a hospital after hospital. I'm very

502
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,960
Speaker 1: curious as to the answers to those questions. How Tyley's

503
00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:12,439
Speaker 1: ailment affected cult Mom Laurie Valo. This is the first

504
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: time hearing of this, and I'm very very distressed. What

505
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:23,000
Speaker 1: about JJ's issues, how did they affect Cult Mom Laurie Valo.

506
00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:26,319
Speaker 1: I would describe her as more of a martyr. She

507
00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:29,880
Speaker 1: was never never expressed any resentment or any anger towards

508
00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:34,840
Speaker 1: towards it, but she would come across more as a martyr.

509
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:41,879
Speaker 1: And I know that Charles was really trying to help

510
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:47,760
Speaker 1: JJ reach certain milestones in his development and progress, and

511
00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 1: every time he would reach a milestone, it would almost

512
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:54,399
Speaker 1: seem like Laurie would discount it and act as if

513
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 1: Charles was reading too much into JJ's progress. What kind

514
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 1: of milestone away talking of to read? Lauren? Yeah, like

515
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:03,200
Speaker 1: learning to read or learn you know, you know I

516
00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 1: knew him when he was a lot younger, so being

517
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:08,280
Speaker 1: able to say his alphabet or or recognize sight words.

518
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,359
Speaker 1: It was almost like there was something that she She

519
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:16,400
Speaker 1: didn't celebrate those accomplishments the same way that Charles seemed

520
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 1: to celebrate them. In my opinion, this is painting a

521
00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:31,239
Speaker 1: very very disturbing picture, you know that, right what's your

522
00:36:31,239 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 1: message to Laurie Valor now? If she could hear you? Honestly,

523
00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:40,040
Speaker 1: I don't think that I don't have anything to say

524
00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:41,799
Speaker 1: to her, and I don't think that she would listen

525
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,680
Speaker 1: to anything that anyone has to say. Right now, it

526
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:48,719
Speaker 1: seems like she's going to do what she's going to do,

527
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:51,800
Speaker 1: and it looks like she's not going to let anybody

528
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:55,360
Speaker 1: get in her way of whatever it is that she

529
00:36:55,480 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 1: wants to do. I pul Raymond, thank you beyond words

530
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:04,160
Speaker 1: for the insight you've given all of us today. Thank you,

531
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 1: thank you for the opportunity Nancy Grace Crime Story signing off,

532
00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:09,440
Speaker 1: goodbye friend