WEBVTT - Ep. 134: An Object and Its Shadow 0:00:08.920 --> 0:00:13.280 This is me Eat podcast coming in you shirtless severely 0:00:13.440 --> 0:00:18.599 both bitten in my case underwear lessening podcast. You can't 0:00:18.600 --> 0:00:28.760 predict anything. A couple of quick questions, Dan, are those 0:00:29.520 --> 0:00:34.240 uh are those hippie prayer flags hanging in your window? Yeah? 0:00:34.280 --> 0:00:37.600 They are? Was that Is that really the message you 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:39.519 want to send to the outside world? Yeah? I had 0:00:39.560 --> 0:00:43.200 nothing to do with that. That was an art project 0:00:43.640 --> 0:00:47.560 of I believe my daughter at school. So they indoctrinate 0:00:48.200 --> 0:00:51.560 children open anchorage to hang to betan prayer flags in 0:00:51.600 --> 0:00:54.080 their windows. Yeah. Does you know what? Does you know 0:00:54.120 --> 0:00:57.360 what it means? I don't know what lesson came along 0:00:57.400 --> 0:00:59.200 with that, but that it's a Yeah, that was an 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:04.560 anchored public cool district art project. Yeah, m hmm yeah. 0:01:04.680 --> 0:01:09.800 Second question, real quick, how do you feel those bird featers? Uh? Karina? 0:01:09.920 --> 0:01:14.840 My wife walks out the window onto that roof right 0:01:14.880 --> 0:01:18.760 there every few days and pours bird seat in there. 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:24.640 She risked life and limb for those birds. Yanni, do 0:01:24.680 --> 0:01:32.280 you remember the song I wrote, Um Yanny your money 0:01:32.800 --> 0:01:36.160 King of the cast a Ray? Do you remember that? 0:01:38.560 --> 0:01:40.680 Had I known at the time, Had I not just 0:01:40.800 --> 0:01:45.280 learned the other day that you where that you chewed 0:01:45.400 --> 0:01:50.200 chewing tobacco, you dipped too dog. Yeah, as a listener 0:01:50.240 --> 0:01:53.240 wrote in you were a chaw dog, you chaw dogged 0:01:53.240 --> 0:01:56.560 it for seventeen years. I would have written it into 0:01:56.600 --> 0:02:01.320 the song because the song captures your whole life. Right. 0:02:02.440 --> 0:02:04.280 You almost would have had to. You couldn't have admitted 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:08.040 that important. It was brought up doing Latvian things, and 0:02:08.080 --> 0:02:11.400 now he wears the Latvian ring. I would have put 0:02:11.400 --> 0:02:17.560 a grandpa come from a lamp far away. Uh. I 0:02:17.560 --> 0:02:20.400 would have put in like a long passage bom about 0:02:21.720 --> 0:02:25.040 all that chewing tobacco and smoking. So why did you 0:02:25.040 --> 0:02:27.519 get out? Why did you get out of it? Why 0:02:27.520 --> 0:02:32.200 did you get away from chewing? For the health benefits? 0:02:33.240 --> 0:02:35.720 But there are no health negatives. Look at dirt, I 0:02:35.760 --> 0:02:38.600 feel great. I don't know. I feel it's like a 0:02:38.680 --> 0:02:41.799 thirty abuff thirty five year old. He should have easily 0:02:41.960 --> 0:02:47.000 beaten the senior in the arm wrestling contest yesterday, but 0:02:47.080 --> 0:02:51.600 it ended in a match draw, in a draw, and 0:02:51.639 --> 0:02:54.200 so I feel like he's a little he should be 0:02:54.240 --> 0:02:58.000 stronger than he is. You feel that the dip is 0:02:58.040 --> 0:03:01.440 what it was? Why you beat him? Armor assling was 0:03:01.480 --> 0:03:04.480 a draw that that wasn't slowed him down. I got 0:03:04.520 --> 0:03:09.440 him in the end. You guys, you guys quit a draw. Yeah, 0:03:09.760 --> 0:03:12.800 we're if you would have had a hat and turned 0:03:12.800 --> 0:03:16.360 it backwards like in Sylvester Stalloan's over the top. Either 0:03:16.400 --> 0:03:18.760 one of you, I think you would have. I don't know, man, 0:03:18.800 --> 0:03:22.240 that was help Chris, No, well, nothing would help me. 0:03:22.800 --> 0:03:27.720 I'm not I'm not putting anybody down. But no, both 0:03:27.720 --> 0:03:31.080 of you guys were turning purple. I haven't seen like 0:03:31.240 --> 0:03:38.720 dirt pulled the heart mustle. Yeah, a rassling sot. What 0:03:38.760 --> 0:03:41.560 age you to start? What did you start being a 0:03:41.600 --> 0:03:48.760 tobacco user? I probably started smoking cigarettes at I don't know, 0:03:49.280 --> 0:03:52.800 dabbling at twelve, and I certainly if you were running 0:03:52.840 --> 0:03:55.920 crettes by a time of like high school, I think 0:03:56.000 --> 0:03:59.320 I was smoking fairly regularly and you were distributing cigarettes 0:03:59.320 --> 0:04:01.800 at a young age. Yeah. I told you a story 0:04:01.800 --> 0:04:04.680 about how I got caught at Latvian Summer High School 0:04:05.040 --> 0:04:07.560 within the first two or three days of being there, 0:04:08.400 --> 0:04:10.280 because I had a couple of cards the cigarettes that 0:04:10.520 --> 0:04:13.080 some older kids bring in for me, and I got 0:04:13.120 --> 0:04:16.360 turned in. I got rad it out by a roommate 0:04:18.080 --> 0:04:21.760 for selling for selling cigarettes. Yeah, but I told my 0:04:21.839 --> 0:04:26.200 dad and the story. The funny part of the story 0:04:26.320 --> 0:04:28.640 is that we're Danny are talking about how it's you know, 0:04:28.680 --> 0:04:31.200 it's better to try to teach your kids, like gonna 0:04:31.240 --> 0:04:34.599 put everything on the table, you know, bring stuff to 0:04:34.640 --> 0:04:37.320 you as opposed to you know, finding it out and yeah, 0:04:37.320 --> 0:04:39.200 and then not get mad at him when they tell you, 0:04:39.600 --> 0:04:41.480 only get mad at him when they So I had 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:44.359 to write. Most kids parents lived you know, who knows 0:04:44.839 --> 0:04:48.119 days away or flights away from Laban summer high school. 0:04:48.120 --> 0:04:51.040 But we're only thirty minutes away, which is good and bad, 0:04:51.240 --> 0:04:53.240 you know, because I had access to things that got 0:04:53.320 --> 0:04:55.039 me into a lot of trouble, right because we could 0:04:55.040 --> 0:04:59.080 just zip home and get into trouble. I do happen 0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:03.719 to know where there's a bottle vodka? Yeah, exactly, I'll 0:05:03.720 --> 0:05:06.839 be back at sixty. But yeah, So instead of waiting 0:05:06.880 --> 0:05:09.160 for the letter to get to my dad, I just 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:11.600 told him and he's like, hey, well, you know, next 0:05:11.640 --> 0:05:13.440 time we want to sell something, you should sell like 0:05:13.560 --> 0:05:17.240 candy or something like that, not cigarettes. And he was off. 0:05:17.279 --> 0:05:20.200 So because you think I think he was, he must 0:05:20.200 --> 0:05:22.800 have been distracted because I was expecting a real talking to, 0:05:22.960 --> 0:05:25.560 real whooping, you know, but he kind of sluffed it 0:05:25.600 --> 0:05:28.960 off and left me kind of bewildered as he drove away. 0:05:30.279 --> 0:05:34.320 So you got out of smoking and then you transition. No, no, no, 0:05:35.760 --> 0:05:38.120 was there an overlap? Oh definitely No. I had a 0:05:38.200 --> 0:05:40.640 pro I had a program um because I sort of 0:05:40.720 --> 0:05:44.520 tried to remain an athlete even as through my like 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:47.320 heavy partying years in high school. And so I would 0:05:47.400 --> 0:05:51.120 chew all day so that I could, like if I knew, 0:05:51.120 --> 0:05:53.160 I had a volleyball game or some sort of sporting 0:05:53.200 --> 0:05:57.960 activity in the afternoon, and then smoke cigarettes as I 0:05:57.960 --> 0:06:00.000 partied after that, I knew you guys in high school. 0:06:00.120 --> 0:06:03.920 Was the move when they're trying to cut weight for wrestling? Yeah, 0:06:04.120 --> 0:06:07.599 oh my god. They walk around with a giant one 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:11.720 leader good friends of mine man wearing garbage bags around, 0:06:12.520 --> 0:06:16.560 filling bottles full of spin Johnny Merchant, Craig Christensen. That's 0:06:16.600 --> 0:06:21.240 not healthy for you dropping the weight bitness. Looks like 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:23.919 they're skinning bones by the time it's time for a match. 0:06:24.240 --> 0:06:26.640 This is you're hearing the voice of of for your 0:06:26.680 --> 0:06:29.400 your first time around the show. That's true, Levi, I 0:06:29.440 --> 0:06:31.800 don't even know your last name is Meyer. Levi Meyer, 0:06:32.800 --> 0:06:36.200 fresh out of the military, kind of kinda lay out 0:06:36.200 --> 0:06:39.000 your lay out your military deal real quick. Uh. Yeah. 0:06:39.000 --> 0:06:41.720 So I joined in two thousand nine um in the Army, 0:06:41.720 --> 0:06:45.560 became a medic. Uh. I went to airborne school. Yeah, 0:06:45.680 --> 0:06:49.760 right out of the gate. Um went from medic training 0:06:49.800 --> 0:06:53.240 to airborne school to Iraq within like a one month period. 0:06:54.400 --> 0:06:57.960 It was just quick then. And then hung around Afghanistan. Yeah. 0:06:58.120 --> 0:07:01.719 Later later in my military career in defghagstand and then 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:05.640 I got out of active duty the Army December of 0:07:06.839 --> 0:07:08.680 And you're having a chew right now. No, I spit 0:07:08.720 --> 0:07:13.400 it out for it doesn't bother me. Dirts, haven't you? 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:15.280 He's spitting into a Starbucks cup. Do you know I 0:07:15.280 --> 0:07:17.400 hang out with the guy that manufactures the sleeve on 0:07:17.440 --> 0:07:21.720 that cup. I went turkey hunting win that you know? Yeah? 0:07:22.840 --> 0:07:31.920 Thinks so Yanni, you dip for all those years? Didn't quit? Yeah? Yeah, 0:07:31.960 --> 0:07:34.040 I think I finally was able to kick it like 0:07:37.600 --> 0:07:44.240 probably like done done late twenties. Oh earlikay, what are 0:07:44.280 --> 0:07:46.280 you telling me? He relapsed though at one point like 0:07:46.320 --> 0:07:50.160 you quit for in that time period that you can't 0:07:50.200 --> 0:07:52.800 rem did you guys? See me have that dip the 0:07:52.800 --> 0:07:58.720 other day? About five seconds out of it so I said, 0:07:59.080 --> 0:08:00.760 I spit it out quick cause I was able to 0:08:00.760 --> 0:08:03.400 suck the Maryland and that of stuff, dirt. Can you 0:08:03.480 --> 0:08:05.480 can you share with us that I'd like to follow 0:08:05.520 --> 0:08:08.960 up with You asked me why I'm not talking about 0:08:10.160 --> 0:08:14.360 go ahead, follow up? I'm not. Another big reason I 0:08:14.440 --> 0:08:17.920 quit is that eventually, and you know everybody battles this, 0:08:18.120 --> 0:08:21.120 you know, when when you're trying to quit, right, it's 0:08:21.160 --> 0:08:25.800 just like it's it seems so impossible. And eventually I 0:08:25.840 --> 0:08:29.080 came to a point, right, you know, I have like 0:08:29.440 --> 0:08:32.160 I have to be stronger than the stupid little thing 0:08:32.240 --> 0:08:34.800 that's in this little tin, you know, like I just 0:08:34.880 --> 0:08:37.679 like I can't be so weak that this little thing 0:08:37.760 --> 0:08:40.920 is going to control me. And so I just said that, 0:08:41.000 --> 0:08:43.720 and that that almost became more important to me than 0:08:43.920 --> 0:08:46.480 the health benefits, just being like being able to say 0:08:46.640 --> 0:08:53.040 f you two to the addiction. You know, the dirt 0:08:53.040 --> 0:08:55.160 doesn't feel that way. Well, like I said, I'm not. 0:08:55.200 --> 0:08:57.520 I don't want to quit quite yet. And a half 0:08:58.800 --> 0:09:02.600 a month ago you wanted to quit. Uh yeah, maybe 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:05.640 the other day of dirt smoking up the mountainside, and 0:09:05.640 --> 0:09:10.120 I brought up, you know the way that the chew 0:09:10.200 --> 0:09:12.120 could impact that and he was saying that when they 0:09:12.160 --> 0:09:15.040 do start carving away pieces of his face, he's gonna 0:09:15.080 --> 0:09:19.239 have better air passed through, more row, be more aero dynamic, 0:09:19.440 --> 0:09:21.439 and won't have like all the wind resistance that his 0:09:21.520 --> 0:09:26.400 current facial structure gives him. Share with us what that 0:09:26.480 --> 0:09:28.240 lady was telling you who used to work on ski 0:09:28.320 --> 0:09:33.160 lifts with you. Oh, she said she was always she 0:09:33.320 --> 0:09:36.640 held cheers at a higher regard than smokers because all 0:09:36.679 --> 0:09:42.120 the cheers in her life were doers, like you know, ranching, fencing. 0:09:42.760 --> 0:09:48.240 What smokers are watchers. Smokers are watchers. That is so true, man, 0:09:48.280 --> 0:09:50.840 it never occurred me to you said it. Oh, yeah, 0:09:51.040 --> 0:09:54.960 it's so true. Dudes that dip are generally productive people 0:09:55.280 --> 0:09:58.800 because it's yeah, smokers are like watchers, and like, oh, 0:09:59.080 --> 0:10:01.319 you know the smoker, he's the kind of guys I 0:10:01.360 --> 0:10:06.000 would do it that way. That's never gonna work. Yes, 0:10:06.320 --> 0:10:09.360 that was you do that. I wouldn't do this, dipper. 0:10:09.559 --> 0:10:12.560 There is the anomaly though, of the guy or gal. 0:10:13.360 --> 0:10:15.360 They just can just lip it and just can like 0:10:15.559 --> 0:10:18.920 take that smoke going into their nose and eyeballs and 0:10:18.920 --> 0:10:21.040 it's like it's not even there, and they can work 0:10:21.240 --> 0:10:24.960 right next to you it's an anomaly. But I've seen them. 0:10:25.240 --> 0:10:27.120 They like they light it and it just stays between 0:10:27.160 --> 0:10:29.480 their two lips and they're just doing spodymine. Growing up, 0:10:29.520 --> 0:10:33.640 he'd viewed the whole world to one eye because he 0:10:33.679 --> 0:10:36.280 would working on his car. He would have a cigarette 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:39.040 and tip his head close the close the upper eye 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:42.520 or the down eye. I guess where he had a 0:10:42.559 --> 0:10:46.960 cigarette dangling off, just keep going. Yeah, you never hear 0:10:47.000 --> 0:10:51.120 of anybody taking a dip break, smoke break. Dipper can't 0:10:51.160 --> 0:10:56.160 afford to take a break. I really would like to 0:10:56.160 --> 0:10:58.000 get into it, and I would like to get into it, 0:10:58.840 --> 0:11:01.600 and no, I want to get into it. I'm afraid 0:11:01.640 --> 0:11:05.080 of I'm afraid of the transition period where you gotta 0:11:05.120 --> 0:11:08.000 throw up. But here's the deal. I went through that 0:11:08.040 --> 0:11:10.320 with alcohol without even thinking about that thing. Like if 0:11:10.360 --> 0:11:11.959 you say, like if you're younger, like hey, I want 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:14.520 to start drinking, people aren't like, oh man, you get 0:11:14.559 --> 0:11:17.200 so sick at first. No one says that. No, but 0:11:17.240 --> 0:11:19.040 it's true. When you learn to drink, you have to 0:11:19.040 --> 0:11:23.240 throw up a whole bunch. But they don't talk about it. 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:25.959 It's just a secret. It's like an open secret. With 0:11:26.040 --> 0:11:28.040 dip they scare you a boy being. Yeah, but you 0:11:28.040 --> 0:11:30.240 gotta get sick at first. I never did. You took 0:11:30.320 --> 0:11:33.440 right to it. Yeah, sam hool that was telling. Danny 0:11:33.520 --> 0:11:36.640 gave me my first two. I fished with him. Now, 0:11:39.240 --> 0:11:42.560 um to that point that we were talking about the 0:11:42.600 --> 0:11:46.839 memory loss of any type of suffrage, Like suffrage means 0:11:46.840 --> 0:11:51.600 the right to vote. That's the word I'm thinking of suffering, suffering. 0:11:54.679 --> 0:11:57.680 But like you know, like we're talking about like we're like, man, 0:11:57.720 --> 0:11:59.520 that was the craziest I we've ever done. It's like, 0:11:59.559 --> 0:12:01.800 oh no, was this one? That one? That one you 0:12:01.920 --> 0:12:06.559 forget and with someone brought up, oh you brought up childbirth. 0:12:07.920 --> 0:12:12.000 A lot of women will forget how painful the first 0:12:12.000 --> 0:12:15.120 one is rereminded when they have their number two or 0:12:15.160 --> 0:12:18.480 three year onward. And you're saying that you're learning to dip. 0:12:18.600 --> 0:12:23.280 Actually did cause pain, but other people you don't forget that. 0:12:23.679 --> 0:12:28.880 Drinkings and and maybe tobacco use initially had a rough start, 0:12:29.200 --> 0:12:34.720 was there system? Yeah. The only reason I'm drawn to dipping, uh, 0:12:34.920 --> 0:12:37.960 we would like to get involved in it, it's because 0:12:38.440 --> 0:12:42.760 there's no long problems and you know what, I gotta theory, 0:12:42.880 --> 0:12:44.880 it's just vanity. It's like do you want your face 0:12:44.880 --> 0:12:50.200 all carved up? Because the smoker not only is he 0:12:50.280 --> 0:12:52.640 useless because he's only got one hand and one of 0:12:52.640 --> 0:12:54.920 his eyes is blind all the time and can't be 0:12:54.920 --> 0:12:59.480 around flammable stuff. And yeah, and you gotta keep away 0:12:59.480 --> 0:13:02.680 from your amiables can't pump his own gas. Pretty soon, 0:13:03.240 --> 0:13:06.080 that same smoker can't do ship if he wants to 0:13:06.280 --> 0:13:09.079 because he's destroyed his lung. But you do, a dipper 0:13:09.120 --> 0:13:11.120 could keep on working, but you gotta watch your heart 0:13:11.200 --> 0:13:15.720 still with the dip. Yeah, restriction blood vessels, Well, there 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:18.040 is a downside to do no, no, but you have 0:13:18.040 --> 0:13:21.319 a theory about it. Yeah, I tell you. I mean 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:23.880 I've told you guys. I know I've told some other buddies. 0:13:23.920 --> 0:13:30.320 But I feel like, because I'm chewing often, yeah, my 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:32.840 blood vessels like they're having to work. But when I 0:13:32.960 --> 0:13:35.400 like go ski touring or when we go on big hikes, 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:38.520 I'm not chewing, and I like get that bonus regular 0:13:38.520 --> 0:13:41.120 blood vessels size. You know what I mean. It's like 0:13:42.400 --> 0:13:44.960 it's like training with the weight vest and then when 0:13:45.000 --> 0:13:47.360 you go actually do the activity, you don't have that 0:13:47.400 --> 0:13:50.360 weight vest and you're just like just ripping. Yeah, So 0:13:50.400 --> 0:13:52.880 when I don't have a chew in. I'm like, oh damn, 0:13:52.960 --> 0:13:55.120 this is what is it? Also like high altitude training 0:13:55.120 --> 0:13:58.240 with people, where are like exactly he's working out right now? Yeah? 0:13:58.400 --> 0:14:02.560 He is. He charged up the mountain man that one day. 0:14:02.720 --> 0:14:06.640 Just there's something to it because that man, that was 0:14:06.679 --> 0:14:10.600 the moment when I said, dipping, it's something I want 0:14:10.640 --> 0:14:15.160 to get involved because everything else is the same. Everything, 0:14:15.360 --> 0:14:18.640 all things are equal, except he dips the most. No. No, 0:14:18.760 --> 0:14:21.520 I brought up the point my time, I have much 0:14:21.560 --> 0:14:27.680 more spare time to be out doing cardio activities because 0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:30.600 I don't have a family or a house or pets 0:14:30.720 --> 0:14:33.400 or anything. Yeah, that's a good point. I think that's 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:35.520 the that's the main thing. I mean, you know, doing 0:14:35.560 --> 0:14:40.920 something every day. They're day when I was thinking about, uh, 0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:42.520 how you gotta throw up a lot when you want 0:14:42.560 --> 0:14:45.400 to start, when you want to get into drinking. Even 0:14:45.480 --> 0:14:48.560 long after, I remember coming on why you're hiking your 0:14:48.560 --> 0:14:51.040 mind kind of wanders. I remember the coming home once 0:14:51.120 --> 0:14:52.400 I had to somehow I came in. When I was 0:14:52.440 --> 0:14:55.320 living in Western Montana, Missoula. I had this banana tree, 0:14:57.040 --> 0:14:59.080 and I remember a couple of times over the years 0:14:59.120 --> 0:15:01.400 coming home from the bar aren't puking into that banana 0:15:01.440 --> 0:15:04.040 tree pot. It was a giant pot like oat to 0:15:04.120 --> 0:15:06.000 my bedroom and just getting nowhere there and puking in 0:15:06.000 --> 0:15:12.080 there and just composting it in man, into the soil, 0:15:13.120 --> 0:15:15.960 into the body soil. Man, just com posting it in 0:15:16.800 --> 0:15:18.480 rather than trying because it kind of you wouldn't get 0:15:18.480 --> 0:15:19.800 to it until the morning, you know, and then it 0:15:19.960 --> 0:15:22.080 kind of filter, right because all the liquids go through 0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:27.280 and whatever. You're right now, Yeah, you com posted in. 0:15:27.960 --> 0:15:29.880 And I remember having that banana plant. Man. I kind 0:15:29.880 --> 0:15:31.760 of love that banana tree. One time I was moving 0:15:31.800 --> 0:15:34.080 it was ten below zero outside and I got like 0:15:34.120 --> 0:15:37.120 my van all heated up, and I wrapped it in 0:15:37.200 --> 0:15:39.360 plastic and took that thing just long enough to go 0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:43.840 outside down put into a vehicle. It froze to death 0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:48.000 that fast, just yeah, and then the leaves froze, it 0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:51.760 wilted and died. Was that you were transitioning and you're 0:15:51.840 --> 0:15:54.160 trying to No, no, no, no, it wasn't like it 0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:58.720 wasn't feeling like. It wasn't like the psychological trauma didn't 0:15:58.720 --> 0:16:04.560 get to the plant. Interesting. You drank some funky stuff though, 0:16:04.640 --> 0:16:08.880 like in Mad Dog and or was that well, yeah, 0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:11.840 because you know, like most people at that age, we 0:16:11.840 --> 0:16:13.680 didn't have any like a lot of money to like 0:16:13.720 --> 0:16:16.880 to really be putting into that kind of stuff. So 0:16:16.960 --> 0:16:19.000 we you know, you go out to the bar, you 0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:23.040 always drink before you go to the bar. At that age, 0:16:23.040 --> 0:16:25.560 everybody does that, you still, because you can't be going 0:16:25.600 --> 0:16:30.240 down and getting the whole project taken care of at 0:16:30.280 --> 0:16:32.840 like such a high rate of pay. You know, like, 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:37.000 so you have drinks before. Yeah, yeah, we drink like 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:43.360 Boon's snowberry. What was that stuff? Ice fishing? Oh god, no, 0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:47.320 berry creek, it was flavor. I remember coming home from 0:16:47.320 --> 0:16:49.360 work and drinking a bottle of Boons in the shower, 0:16:50.520 --> 0:16:53.400 a whole bottle of it, just getting cleaned up, getting 0:16:53.400 --> 0:16:55.200 ready to go out and just go on the shower 0:16:57.040 --> 0:16:59.880 shower of cold bottle of Boons. Fire and drinking. Are 0:17:00.200 --> 0:17:02.880 love drinking that. It kind of amazed me that I 0:17:02.920 --> 0:17:06.400 don't drink at all now because I used to love it. Yeah, 0:17:06.920 --> 0:17:10.520 it's funny. You'd be like, banana plant, this is for you. 0:17:10.600 --> 0:17:14.040 I'm doing this for you. Feed you later. I don't 0:17:13.960 --> 0:17:16.840 say never, don't say I never fertilized. You're baby burning 0:17:16.840 --> 0:17:23.080 the banana plant any and he will say he wants 0:17:23.080 --> 0:17:26.560 to add on this. If you could go back and 0:17:27.200 --> 0:17:31.600 never ever have a drop of alcohol, not a chance, man, 0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:39.000 not a chance. Um for a handful of reasons. Oh 0:17:39.520 --> 0:17:41.840 what I shared, Like, I was always very suspicious of 0:17:41.840 --> 0:17:44.200 people that didn't drink. I feel like, what's wrong with 0:17:44.240 --> 0:17:47.719 that guy? And um, no I'm not, but I was, 0:17:47.920 --> 0:17:50.320 And so it kind of lead me into like all 0:17:50.359 --> 0:17:52.320 my friends that I'm still friends with, we used to 0:17:52.320 --> 0:17:55.800 just drink. We used to fish together, drink together, and 0:17:55.840 --> 0:18:01.280 hang out together. And so if I wasn't drinking, like 0:18:01.320 --> 0:18:02.720 I don't know what, I don't know who I would 0:18:02.760 --> 0:18:06.840 want up hanging out with. Ye, I mean like our 0:18:07.040 --> 0:18:12.240 bonds were all formed around like shared interests, which included alcohol. 0:18:12.359 --> 0:18:15.680 So if I had missed all the night time stuff, 0:18:16.280 --> 0:18:19.000 who would I be hanging out with now? Bunch of lamos? 0:18:19.000 --> 0:18:23.400 I don't know? Right, Like a Dardo Garcia says, you're 0:18:23.440 --> 0:18:26.680 forged by fire, man, I think that all that being 0:18:26.800 --> 0:18:30.639 hung over and trying to fish and that's the fire 0:18:30.720 --> 0:18:34.639 that forges. So that for that reason, and too in 0:18:34.680 --> 0:18:37.560 the writing world, like alcohol is a real problem in 0:18:37.560 --> 0:18:41.159 the writing world. Um, you know. I mean it's like 0:18:41.240 --> 0:18:43.080 it's just no joke that like there's a lot of 0:18:43.119 --> 0:18:48.479 alcoholism among writers. But by being a avid drinker, I 0:18:48.520 --> 0:18:53.800 was able to associate with and and hang out with 0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:56.920 and spend time with writers because they would all connect 0:18:56.960 --> 0:18:59.919 around the act of drinking. So I formed a lot 0:19:00.160 --> 0:19:03.919 like good relationships with writers by being a drinker. If 0:19:03.920 --> 0:19:06.359 you weren't a drinker, I don't know who you who 0:19:06.400 --> 0:19:08.000 you like? I just you know, I mean I can't 0:19:08.000 --> 0:19:10.840 picture any of the any of the people that had 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:13.520 a big influence on me. A look and what I think, 0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:15.480 like what was going on with like that was the 0:19:15.480 --> 0:19:19.200 whole thing. That's what you were doing. You're like going 0:19:19.240 --> 0:19:21.160 over so and Souls for drinks, going to the bar 0:19:21.240 --> 0:19:24.679 to drink, its ice fish, going ice fishing to drink. 0:19:25.040 --> 0:19:27.720 So it's like to say, like you never drank, It's like, okay, 0:19:27.720 --> 0:19:31.040 presumely that means you missed out on all of that 0:19:33.440 --> 0:19:35.120 and other people get in other places. But I don't 0:19:35.160 --> 0:19:39.480 know where I would have gotten it. You know, never 0:19:39.560 --> 0:19:43.719 drank in the woods ever, I mean an overnight backpacking trips, 0:19:43.840 --> 0:19:46.960 maybe like a little nip. Never went out on a 0:19:46.960 --> 0:19:50.360 backpacking trip around a backpack hunt and got drunk ever. Yeah, 0:19:50.480 --> 0:19:52.600 we are growing up, we always used to look down 0:19:52.640 --> 0:19:56.080 on the type of hunter that went to deer camp 0:19:56.119 --> 0:19:58.960 and just got sloppy, drunk every night, didn't get up 0:19:58.960 --> 0:20:01.400 in the morning and the on. You know, like there 0:20:01.440 --> 0:20:03.760 was like the beer drinking type of deer hunters, and 0:20:03.760 --> 0:20:06.199 then there was like the guys that are out there 0:20:06.240 --> 0:20:09.440 to shoot deer and when they were in town they 0:20:09.480 --> 0:20:15.639 got wasted, but not all the word's time and place. Yeah, 0:20:16.359 --> 0:20:19.919 so no, no regrets about it. I regret having quit it. 0:20:21.520 --> 0:20:25.520 We haven't quite equit me and I I do. I 0:20:25.600 --> 0:20:31.440 miss it. I miss it terribly, man, because everything's so funny, 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:35.000 you know what I mean, Like Stuf's not funny anymore. No, 0:20:35.200 --> 0:20:37.600 we've had a lot of laughs on this trip, sober. 0:20:37.960 --> 0:20:40.640 Remember one night we were drinking and Danny's kitchen laugh 0:20:40.680 --> 0:20:43.040 about how he was afraid to touch his dogs penis. 0:20:44.960 --> 0:20:47.960 Like now, he just didn't like that. He just didn't 0:20:48.000 --> 0:20:51.080 like the idea of it, right, Yeah, Like if we 0:20:51.080 --> 0:20:53.240 weren't drinking it and we were drinking, it wouldn't to 0:20:53.240 --> 0:20:57.119 come up. It just came up. Now He's like, I 0:20:57.160 --> 0:21:02.080 just feel like I'm invading his personally. He's like, I 0:21:02.119 --> 0:21:04.439 don't want someone grabbing me there, or that one spot 0:21:04.520 --> 0:21:07.080 just too low in a belly rub Man. Yeah, he's 0:21:07.119 --> 0:21:09.040 just like I thought. Yeah, he was just explained it. 0:21:09.400 --> 0:21:11.600 So that's like the kind of insight that you just 0:21:11.720 --> 0:21:15.520 miss out on when you're like when you're just same 0:21:15.640 --> 0:21:19.240 all day long. Well, I tell you my my older 0:21:19.280 --> 0:21:22.600 brother has been sober for seven years. And when someone 0:21:22.640 --> 0:21:24.640 says that, then I think that they had a drinking problem. 0:21:25.400 --> 0:21:29.600 Drinking enthusiasm. Yeah, he just wrong time, wrong place kind 0:21:29.600 --> 0:21:35.359 of drinking. But now he is madman NonStop. He's got 0:21:36.560 --> 0:21:38.960 a hundred projects going on all the time and always 0:21:38.960 --> 0:21:41.080 getting ship done. But he doesn't think anything's funny. I 0:21:41.119 --> 0:21:45.480 bet nah. Yeah, I mean it's different, like you said, 0:21:45.480 --> 0:21:48.000 the social aspects different. But that's something I noticed watching 0:21:48.080 --> 0:21:51.560 him not drink, is his time management like is way different. 0:21:51.560 --> 0:21:53.960 Because if you drink, you can kind of sit in 0:21:54.000 --> 0:21:56.600 the backyard and like bullshit and drink. But if you're 0:21:56.600 --> 0:21:59.440 not drinking, you're like, let's do something. Yeah, you want 0:21:59.440 --> 0:22:02.159 to go fick something exactly, And yeah I can't relax, 0:22:02.400 --> 0:22:06.040 Yeah exactly, I need it. If I'm gonna relax, I 0:22:06.080 --> 0:22:09.080 need it have a beverage or something. Usually, Yeah, like that. 0:22:09.080 --> 0:22:10.640 That used to be the other thing too. Even at 0:22:10.640 --> 0:22:12.879 home with my wife we'd have a couple of drinks 0:22:12.880 --> 0:22:15.119 and relax. But not neither of us can relax. We 0:22:15.240 --> 0:22:18.399 just work, which is a good thing, and we just 0:22:18.440 --> 0:22:21.119 work and not laugh at anything. Make sure not to 0:22:21.119 --> 0:22:29.200 start laughing, no fun um anything else on that subject. 0:22:30.240 --> 0:22:32.560 Lee by you good? Oh you know we haven't discussed 0:22:32.560 --> 0:22:34.920 with you at all though. LEVI are you're fixing the 0:22:35.000 --> 0:22:38.240 quit chewing? Yeah? I suppose. I mean, I'm not really 0:22:38.280 --> 0:22:39.960 like dirt over there. He had to bring like two 0:22:39.960 --> 0:22:41.800 logs out in the woods. I only brought two cans, 0:22:41.840 --> 0:22:44.119 and one of them got washed out. The other one 0:22:44.160 --> 0:22:46.960 is still good. You lost one to a creek. Oh no, 0:22:47.040 --> 0:22:50.720 I think got rained on that alder grabbed it, the 0:22:50.720 --> 0:22:56.240 one that grabbed your dipping enthusiasts. Not an addict, I 0:22:56.240 --> 0:22:59.920 suppose do all do all shaw dogs run it along 0:23:00.040 --> 0:23:02.240 the bottom, or you'd never run along the top loop. 0:23:02.320 --> 0:23:05.959 I've known some guys do this. Yeah, I told you that. 0:23:05.960 --> 0:23:10.080 That nurse told me keep keep the cancer guessing, can 0:23:10.160 --> 0:23:13.720 just move it moving around? Did you ever run a 0:23:13.880 --> 0:23:18.760 double horse? A double horse? Shoe? Just really good glass 0:23:18.760 --> 0:23:21.160 and spots after you might run a double horse shoe. 0:23:22.240 --> 0:23:24.240 Have you run a horse shoe? Yeah? I mean in 0:23:24.320 --> 0:23:27.280 college we kind of do the how much you could 0:23:27.320 --> 0:23:33.280 get into your mouth? Yeah, I don't make a man sick. Yeah. Yeah. 0:23:33.320 --> 0:23:35.399 I remember being in the kitchen and like when on 0:23:35.440 --> 0:23:38.480 a slow night you start thinking of ways like just 0:23:38.840 --> 0:23:42.480 mess with people, and so it would be like, kid, 0:23:42.520 --> 0:23:45.960 you do a half cup of cayenne pepper on your testicles, 0:23:46.040 --> 0:23:50.960 you know, and everybody, everybody would start pitching in money. 0:23:51.280 --> 0:23:54.439 At a certain point, someone would say, Okay, for sixty bucks, 0:23:54.920 --> 0:23:57.000 I'll try it. And then one of the other things 0:23:57.080 --> 0:23:59.760 would be like, okay, can you get a whole tenancy 0:24:00.560 --> 0:24:03.560 in your mouth and keep it in there for whatever 0:24:03.560 --> 0:24:05.359 it would be a minute or five minutes, you know. 0:24:05.720 --> 0:24:08.800 And I don't think anybody could ever pass that same 0:24:08.880 --> 0:24:12.080 exact experience. Yeah you had it, you did it. You 0:24:12.119 --> 0:24:14.160 don't know. But I've been in those scenarios and that 0:24:14.160 --> 0:24:17.560 that came up and the buddy you did it got sick. Yeah, 0:24:18.000 --> 0:24:22.440 it's hard. It's hard for me to reconcile. You're what 0:24:22.520 --> 0:24:28.359 you majored in photo journalism with the activities that you 0:24:28.400 --> 0:24:30.959 engaged in in college. I was I was different than 0:24:31.000 --> 0:24:34.520 most class me and one other guy kind of chummed around. 0:24:34.680 --> 0:24:37.160 Like you, it's hard for you to picture photo journalism 0:24:37.240 --> 0:24:40.440 majors getting together to try to fill a two leader 0:24:40.440 --> 0:24:43.440 bottle with you spit. Well, those guys weren't in my program. 0:24:43.600 --> 0:24:49.040 My roommates that we filled did our science project installation art. 0:24:49.240 --> 0:24:54.080 Yeah no that yeah, that wasn't with my classmate says, 0:24:54.080 --> 0:25:02.560 it's with buddies, Mile City Buddies. Yeah that picture. Yeah exactly. Um, 0:25:02.600 --> 0:25:05.040 moving on, do you yeah? Yeah, and you feel we 0:25:05.080 --> 0:25:07.080 should just come out and like right away, just say 0:25:07.440 --> 0:25:13.240 rather than creating a rather than creating um, any kind 0:25:13.240 --> 0:25:19.440 of any kind of tension or suspense. Oh yeah, yeah, 0:25:19.480 --> 0:25:22.320 I don't think it matters. Just what why don't you 0:25:22.359 --> 0:25:25.600 say what I'm talking about? I think what you're talking 0:25:25.640 --> 0:25:28.360 about is to say that we just finished up an 0:25:28.600 --> 0:25:36.760 unsuccessful hunt, unsuccessful dolls, she punt, no lesson to be learned. 0:25:36.760 --> 0:25:40.320 If you're looking at success as a dead sheet. Yeah, 0:25:40.359 --> 0:25:44.760 that's that's how I'm That's what I'm talking about. So yeah, 0:25:44.800 --> 0:25:47.000 well we can also look at it as successful as 0:25:47.040 --> 0:25:50.520 we made it in there and uh, you know, cover 0:25:50.640 --> 0:25:54.800 some serious train and came out without any injuries and 0:25:54.840 --> 0:25:58.800 without any you know, major problems. Yeah, I made a 0:25:58.800 --> 0:26:03.800 TV show, beautiful TV show. We don't know that. Yeah, 0:26:03.840 --> 0:26:07.120 and found found some sheep, found some sheep. But if 0:26:07.119 --> 0:26:10.040 someone said, hey, was you was you hunt successful? Yeah? 0:26:10.080 --> 0:26:12.199 And then you go like, well defined success and I 0:26:12.240 --> 0:26:14.760 just think you kind of like playing around you. Yeah, yeah, 0:26:14.800 --> 0:26:18.200 you're you're being a little bit. You'd have to say no. 0:26:18.920 --> 0:26:23.040 But it was great. Yes, Oh yeah, okay, so what 0:26:23.080 --> 0:26:29.080 we what we did when dolls sheep hunt in the 0:26:29.119 --> 0:26:37.560 Alaska Range? And uh, the last range is check me 0:26:37.560 --> 0:26:41.280 if I'm wrong on this, Danny. It's like a southern 0:26:41.320 --> 0:26:43.879 Alaska mountain range or sort of like might divide the 0:26:43.920 --> 0:26:49.159 south southern you'd call that the Western Alaska Range. I 0:26:49.200 --> 0:26:52.320 think that's, you know, everything south of all that cheap 0:26:52.359 --> 0:26:58.080 country that's south of Denali Park. People commonly referred to 0:26:58.119 --> 0:27:00.919 as the Western Alaska I mean Western Range, but the 0:27:00.960 --> 0:27:05.560 Alaska Range in general, it's a big speaking of horseshoe dips, 0:27:06.080 --> 0:27:10.359 it's a horseshoe shape, kind of a shallow horseshoe. The 0:27:11.760 --> 0:27:16.400 on its eastern edge kind of go feeds into the 0:27:16.960 --> 0:27:21.119 the coastal ranges. Ye consider wrangles coastal. But yeah, it 0:27:21.160 --> 0:27:23.560 kind of blends into the wrangles over on the far 0:27:23.640 --> 0:27:26.879 eastern side, and then the on the western side. They 0:27:26.920 --> 0:27:29.760 kind of toe off down towards the Alaska Peninsula. Yeah, 0:27:30.440 --> 0:27:34.960 blending into into the Allusians down there in the the 0:27:35.000 --> 0:27:37.480 top of the if you imagine the Alaska Range is 0:27:37.480 --> 0:27:40.560 a very shallow you, the top of the U is 0:27:41.040 --> 0:27:48.000 the no, a very shallow inverted you. Yeah, the top 0:27:48.040 --> 0:27:51.719 of you is the most northern portion. Yes, yeah, and 0:27:51.760 --> 0:27:54.040 that's that would be like the central Alaska Range. That's 0:27:54.119 --> 0:27:56.760 how Fishing Department Efficient Game refers to that area, Central 0:27:56.760 --> 0:27:59.480 Alaska Range. And it's not narrow and it's not like 0:27:59.520 --> 0:28:01.320 giving away a spot to say we're in the western 0:28:01.359 --> 0:28:03.840 Alaska Range, because the whole thing is five miles long, 0:28:06.359 --> 0:28:12.760 huge mountain range. Um, we had hunted doll sheet before 0:28:12.800 --> 0:28:16.000 and other portions of the Alaska Range. I'd be so 0:28:16.080 --> 0:28:21.359 specific as to say the Central Alaska Range in this trip, 0:28:21.440 --> 0:28:25.560 we're going into an area to hunt. Um, let me, 0:28:25.680 --> 0:28:30.040 let me they groundwork piece down. What Alaska has is 0:28:30.080 --> 0:28:34.000 they have there's several species in Alaska you're not allowed 0:28:34.040 --> 0:28:37.720 to hunt without a guide if you're a nonresident. Basically, 0:28:38.800 --> 0:28:45.840 if it's white or has great, big long clause. You 0:28:45.880 --> 0:28:52.520 cannot hunt it um if you're a nonresident without a guide, 0:28:52.600 --> 0:28:56.560 without a guide referring to mountain goats, doll sheep, and 0:28:56.600 --> 0:29:00.920 grizzlies and brown bears. So but the a there's a catch. 0:29:02.880 --> 0:29:10.640 A resident, a resident Alaska hunter can hunt those things 0:29:10.680 --> 0:29:15.960 with family of second degree kindred. So if you're a 0:29:15.960 --> 0:29:23.000 fella in Alaska, you can take nonresident relatives, cousins, uncles, 0:29:23.080 --> 0:29:26.080 I think, even brother in law. It's pretty loose. Yeah, yeah, 0:29:26.120 --> 0:29:28.120 I can never remember where the line is drawn. But 0:29:28.160 --> 0:29:31.240 that's because I only ever hunt with my two full 0:29:31.280 --> 0:29:34.479 blooded brothers, so it's kind of irrelevant. Yeah yeah, but 0:29:34.480 --> 0:29:38.280 but it includes cousins, uncles, I believe it includes in laws. 0:29:39.200 --> 0:29:42.360 I think then you can then then those people can 0:29:42.440 --> 0:29:44.840 hunt with that. There was a little movement a year 0:29:44.880 --> 0:29:47.440 ago or so to get rid of that. There's a 0:29:47.440 --> 0:29:50.760 group called the Resident Hunters of Alaska who got a 0:29:50.800 --> 0:29:55.520 real beef with non resident hunters and they had put 0:29:55.560 --> 0:29:59.840 together something for consideration which would have ended the rule. 0:30:00.120 --> 0:30:01.640 Is that what I'm are you sure that's who that 0:30:01.680 --> 0:30:06.080 was coming from. I thought you told me that. Yeah, yeah, 0:30:06.160 --> 0:30:07.920 check me on this, But that might have been coming 0:30:08.120 --> 0:30:10.560 maybe from the guide industry a bit too. I'm not 0:30:10.600 --> 0:30:13.880 I'm not okay, so scratch that. That might not be true. 0:30:13.920 --> 0:30:15.520 I don't want to put I don't want to put 0:30:15.520 --> 0:30:18.280 blame or praise however you view it in the wrong place. 0:30:18.520 --> 0:30:20.480 But there was trying to They were trying to roll 0:30:20.520 --> 0:30:23.360 it back a little bit and not. They wanted it 0:30:23.400 --> 0:30:27.080 to be okay. So so whoever it was, let's take 0:30:27.120 --> 0:30:31.080 this case. Danny's my brother. Danny's a resident of Alaska. 0:30:31.160 --> 0:30:34.400 He and I go sheep hunting together. We can both 0:30:34.440 --> 0:30:37.880 hunt sheep at the same time. What the what the 0:30:38.000 --> 0:30:41.000 rule change that was proposed would be that if we're 0:30:41.080 --> 0:30:48.200 hunting and I shoot a sheep, we both have to 0:30:48.240 --> 0:30:53.760 like notch the tag. Yeah, that was the meaning I 0:30:53.800 --> 0:30:59.440 get I get a ram, it counts against your mars. Yeah, 0:30:59.520 --> 0:31:02.640 my and you a limit of one ram. So we 0:31:02.640 --> 0:31:04.800 could go together and if I get one, basically you 0:31:04.880 --> 0:31:09.280 got one. But that that thing didn't go anywhere. So 0:31:11.040 --> 0:31:14.720 I'm able to go hunt doll sheep in Alaska as 0:31:14.720 --> 0:31:17.640 long as I'm within as long as I'm with you, 0:31:17.680 --> 0:31:20.880 And they spelled out like you gotta be together, you're 0:31:20.920 --> 0:31:23.720 hunting together, side of by side. Um, we've done it 0:31:23.800 --> 0:31:25.400 quite a few times over the years. Not quite a 0:31:25.440 --> 0:31:27.960 few times, but before I think we've gone cheap hunting 0:31:27.960 --> 0:31:32.440 four times together. That sounds about right. And uh, this 0:31:32.560 --> 0:31:35.160 time we went into an area we had really no 0:31:35.360 --> 0:31:40.000 prior experience in because of a friend who's an outfitter 0:31:41.480 --> 0:31:46.720 turned us onto a spot where he guides some clients 0:31:46.880 --> 0:31:49.440 and kind of cut us loose in there. So we're 0:31:49.480 --> 0:31:54.200 doing like a trip that would be how would you 0:31:54.200 --> 0:32:02.640 put in guide language, Johnny, all of our own gear, right, yeah, 0:32:02.800 --> 0:32:07.960 all our own equipment and gear. But someone's saying go here. Yeah, 0:32:08.000 --> 0:32:10.400 we just called it a drop camp basically when we 0:32:10.440 --> 0:32:14.360 did it. Yeah, and sometimes we would actually supply some 0:32:14.480 --> 0:32:17.040 stuff with drop camp and I guess you know, Buck 0:32:17.120 --> 0:32:20.760 did Bucks apply this a little bit, A few things 0:32:21.240 --> 0:32:24.360 big tarpa X yeah, which was Hey, it was really 0:32:24.480 --> 0:32:30.280 nice to have that tarp pre set up. You know. Um, Yeah, 0:32:30.400 --> 0:32:32.600 I call it a drop camp for the most part. 0:32:32.600 --> 0:32:33.960 I mean, most guys I think they're going to do 0:32:34.000 --> 0:32:36.560 a drop camp if they get anything from the outfitter. 0:32:36.600 --> 0:32:40.280 It might be a basic shelter, but you're pretty much 0:32:40.320 --> 0:32:42.360 you're you're gonna be bringing most of your own gear 0:32:43.160 --> 0:32:47.040 in this area is like, so you come into Anchorage 0:32:47.040 --> 0:32:48.920 and then the last of works in the bush. And 0:32:48.960 --> 0:32:52.479 Danny can speak this a lot better, but the way 0:32:52.480 --> 0:32:54.320 it last works in the bush, especially like kind of 0:32:54.360 --> 0:32:58.120 mountain hunting and stuff, you're you're always using your You're 0:32:58.200 --> 0:33:02.800 not always You're typically flying in on super cubs, which 0:33:02.800 --> 0:33:06.640 can land on gravel bars, ridge tops, you can land 0:33:06.640 --> 0:33:11.240 them anywhere, but a supercup can only hold a pilot 0:33:11.240 --> 0:33:13.960 and one passenger. So oftentimes, if you're flying in the 0:33:14.080 --> 0:33:20.240 remote hunting locations in Alaska, you're getting you get staged 0:33:20.360 --> 0:33:24.480 up somewhere on some remote large air strip and then 0:33:24.920 --> 0:33:28.040 use superclubs to do the last little leg of bringing 0:33:28.080 --> 0:33:31.040 you in Like that, that's fairly common, but it could 0:33:31.040 --> 0:33:33.760 be from a strip along the highway somewhere too, you know, 0:33:33.840 --> 0:33:36.479 the Hall Road or one of the you know other 0:33:36.560 --> 0:33:38.600 highways around the state. We've done that before, to where 0:33:38.600 --> 0:33:40.520 we've driven to a place and had a plane meet 0:33:40.600 --> 0:33:43.160 us there and shuttle us in. You know, that's closer 0:33:43.200 --> 0:33:46.120 to the hunting spot than say Anchorage or Fairbanks or 0:33:46.120 --> 0:33:48.480 wherever the pilots coming from. Yeah, it or gets elaborate 0:33:48.520 --> 0:33:51.240 like there's a there's anywhere you're hunting if you're hunting 0:33:51.240 --> 0:33:54.360 like the Western Brooks Range, so basically up towards the 0:33:54.440 --> 0:33:56.400 you know, the portions of Alaska that seemed to be 0:33:57.800 --> 0:34:02.360 looking over into Siberia. Um, there's an area there where 0:34:02.360 --> 0:34:08.080 you you go to Fairbanks, drive up to a lake, No, 0:34:08.200 --> 0:34:12.240 a strip, you drive up to a strip or Alaska 0:34:12.320 --> 0:34:14.520 pipeline road. And not just talking about one air carrier 0:34:14.520 --> 0:34:17.000 that we've used to hunt caribou. You drive up to 0:34:17.080 --> 0:34:22.560 an actual strip. Isn't it a strip? So a landing place, 0:34:24.400 --> 0:34:27.880 get on a plane there and go land at another 0:34:28.000 --> 0:34:30.920 strip in a bush community, and like an off the 0:34:30.960 --> 0:34:35.960 grid community, and they're gonna float plane and take the 0:34:36.000 --> 0:34:38.719 float plane to go land up on lakes up in 0:34:38.719 --> 0:34:43.160 the Cariboo Country in the North Slope, tons of different configurations. 0:34:43.680 --> 0:34:46.480 Or we've also hunted sheep where you lower your stuff 0:34:46.520 --> 0:34:50.680 from your truck into a supercubin. Yeah, fly up on 0:34:50.760 --> 0:34:52.960 that too, But this particular area is a little bit 0:34:52.960 --> 0:34:56.600 of a hall and bigger, like a greater distance than 0:34:56.600 --> 0:35:01.600 you're gonna cover, um efficiently in in super cubs. So 0:35:02.520 --> 0:35:08.880 we flew out to a remote military air strip. Do 0:35:08.960 --> 0:35:15.200 we name that one? Not yet? No, should be remote 0:35:15.280 --> 0:35:18.320 military air strip. It's not military. I think it was 0:35:18.320 --> 0:35:23.120 built by built by the military. Gravel strip. There's a 0:35:23.160 --> 0:35:26.239 lot of those in Alaska. Yeah, they're scattering, yeah for sure. 0:35:26.680 --> 0:35:28.320 And we're flying there. We're all six of us, So 0:35:28.320 --> 0:35:30.680 we've got two hunters and four guys in our crew 0:35:30.719 --> 0:35:33.279 and we we we fly out to this strip and 0:35:33.360 --> 0:35:37.560 it's like a real hub of activity because it's a 0:35:37.600 --> 0:35:40.879 big enough airstrip. You can get big aircraft in there 0:35:41.480 --> 0:35:46.760 and bring in quad runners, side by sides, all manner 0:35:46.800 --> 0:35:51.160 of vehicles. And then there's an elaborate road network that 0:35:51.280 --> 0:35:54.480 leads out from here, and so it's like a place 0:35:54.560 --> 0:35:59.960 to fly in stuff, set up a camp, and then 0:36:00.120 --> 0:36:03.759 cruise around like on this whole isolated road network and 0:36:03.800 --> 0:36:08.080 trail network, and cruise around hunt this vast area of 0:36:08.160 --> 0:36:12.080 like like Moose Caribou country. I got a quick question, 0:36:12.840 --> 0:36:15.279 is that is that road system attached to anything if 0:36:15.280 --> 0:36:19.080 you were wanting to drive in or is it totally 0:36:19.080 --> 0:36:21.600 independent outside of that air stream. I think the Mountain, 0:36:21.760 --> 0:36:23.560 I think the Alaska Rang because it's on the other 0:36:23.600 --> 0:36:25.279 side of the Alaska Range, and I don't think the 0:36:25.360 --> 0:36:28.160 right dangers. No, yeah, yeah, you couldn't drive there. I 0:36:28.160 --> 0:36:31.120 mean you could you could snow machine there in the winter. Yeah, 0:36:31.280 --> 0:36:36.680 but there's not there's not a road. So people come 0:36:36.719 --> 0:36:39.560 in there and in large aircraft sometimes and the can 0:36:39.560 --> 0:36:41.520 fly and stuff like we just had we just land 0:36:41.560 --> 0:36:43.080 out there, so you land in the strip as a 0:36:43.120 --> 0:36:45.840 gravel strip. There was a couple of outbuildings the Alaska Troopers. 0:36:45.840 --> 0:36:48.680 Here's not an interesting thing people should know about Alaska. 0:36:49.160 --> 0:36:51.320 In Alaska, you don't have what's called the game warden, 0:36:51.719 --> 0:36:55.799 so you have all your game laws. Fishery and game 0:36:55.880 --> 0:36:58.440 laws are all set by the state and the Department 0:36:58.480 --> 0:37:00.560 of what do they call it house? The Board of 0:37:00.600 --> 0:37:04.040 Fish and the Board of Game respectively make those laws 0:37:04.160 --> 0:37:07.160 the laws. And then what's your like dn R here, 0:37:07.280 --> 0:37:10.400 it's the Laska Fishing Game Department. Yeah, we have a 0:37:10.480 --> 0:37:13.040 d n R two but they handle land in minerals 0:37:13.040 --> 0:37:14.840 and that sort of thing. But lasta Department of Fishing 0:37:14.880 --> 0:37:20.000 Game regulates hunting and fishing. But all enforcement of fishing 0:37:20.040 --> 0:37:24.560 game laws comes down to State Troopers. Yes, yeah, yeah, 0:37:24.560 --> 0:37:28.360 there's a I guess it would be like the Wildlife 0:37:28.360 --> 0:37:31.200 Division of the State Troopers does enforcement do you know 0:37:31.239 --> 0:37:33.000 if people don't say you don't say, I'm gonna report 0:37:33.040 --> 0:37:36.960 you to the game warden. I'm calling the troopers at 0:37:37.000 --> 0:37:39.919 this strip. There's a trooper's shack too, like a little 0:37:39.920 --> 0:37:44.240 shack at this strip, and there's all manner of oil, drums, 0:37:44.480 --> 0:37:49.400 gas cans, quad runners and just like the sort of 0:37:49.520 --> 0:37:55.560 general called detritus, but is general like in Alaska, if 0:37:55.680 --> 0:37:58.560 you can land a plane, there is gonna be rusty 0:37:58.760 --> 0:38:01.560 barrels playing around, and it has its fair share of 0:38:01.600 --> 0:38:04.600 rusty barrels. Yeah, because what goes in does not go 0:38:04.680 --> 0:38:07.560 back out easily. Yeah, And we'll talk about that when 0:38:07.560 --> 0:38:12.080 we talk about the pilot that picked us off, his 0:38:12.440 --> 0:38:15.080 just dismay at something that we would be bringing back 0:38:15.120 --> 0:38:19.839 to town. Um. And you get there and you think like, oh, man, 0:38:19.960 --> 0:38:21.840 like you could say here days and nothing would happen. 0:38:22.160 --> 0:38:27.840 But it's just constant activity, planes landing people up to 0:38:28.520 --> 0:38:31.919 all manner of things. And just like like we land there, 0:38:32.760 --> 0:38:35.680 here comes a couple of dudes on a quad runner. Uh. 0:38:35.760 --> 0:38:37.760 A Norther plane comes in and we help some guys 0:38:37.920 --> 0:38:40.359 unload a quad runner out of the plane and they're 0:38:40.360 --> 0:38:42.560 taking off to go to their hunting camp which is 0:38:42.600 --> 0:38:45.520 thirty miles away. One of them runs off and the 0:38:45.560 --> 0:38:47.720 bushes in a while later comes back with another quad 0:38:47.800 --> 0:38:51.080 Runner and they both take off, one on the brand 0:38:51.120 --> 0:38:53.240 new quad Runner and one on the old quad Runner 0:38:53.840 --> 0:38:56.320 and head off to their thirty mile away hunting camp. 0:38:58.000 --> 0:39:00.560 And um, yeah, it's it's a it's a rest spot. 0:39:00.600 --> 0:39:02.759 But we get there and then we then we got 0:39:02.800 --> 0:39:05.000 another guy who fights the super Cup and it's got 0:39:05.000 --> 0:39:07.040 to fly. The super cub is gonna shuttle us into 0:39:08.640 --> 0:39:11.160 our spot up in the mountains. And it's funny, is 0:39:11.160 --> 0:39:14.600 you gotta do because of our crew. You gotta do 0:39:14.719 --> 0:39:19.200 six trips and each trip takes forty minutes or so, 0:39:19.200 --> 0:39:22.239 so it's twenty minutes up into the mountains, unloads and 0:39:22.320 --> 0:39:26.080 stuff come back, and you're dealing with small weather windows. 0:39:27.200 --> 0:39:28.440 So when you're doing this, you gotta make sure the 0:39:28.480 --> 0:39:32.000 first guy that goes has his camp and gear and 0:39:32.040 --> 0:39:35.319 everything he needs to survive for the night, and then 0:39:35.400 --> 0:39:38.719 that anyone left behind also has so that the that 0:39:38.840 --> 0:39:41.239 the Ford people have all the stuff they need to 0:39:41.280 --> 0:39:43.760 survive and the left behind person has to have stuff 0:39:43.800 --> 0:39:47.080 to survive because at any given time, the weather window 0:39:47.120 --> 0:39:49.360 is gonna close. And we'd already missed the day and 0:39:49.360 --> 0:39:53.000 a half because of bad weather. So sure enough, five 0:39:53.000 --> 0:39:56.799 of us get in and the weather window ends and 0:39:56.840 --> 0:39:58.720 there are five of us are up in the mountains 0:39:58.800 --> 0:40:01.680 right to humble. Some guys still hanging out at the Yeah, 0:40:01.680 --> 0:40:03.360 which is the first time that's ever happened to you, 0:40:03.920 --> 0:40:07.279 to have to have to hop in interrupted. But other 0:40:07.320 --> 0:40:09.640 guys we fly with will bring in three super cubs. 0:40:11.080 --> 0:40:13.000 That's true. They got like a little wolf pack of 0:40:13.040 --> 0:40:16.000 super cubs and they just get it done. Like when 0:40:16.040 --> 0:40:19.840 there was a window. They're going. This is much more 0:40:19.880 --> 0:40:25.040 just one dude cliff and back and forth, flying a 0:40:25.120 --> 0:40:29.319 hundred yards off the ground, three tops. Yeah, dude, those 0:40:29.320 --> 0:40:33.640 flights are so cool though. That Did you ask him 0:40:33.680 --> 0:40:36.839 why he did that low? Yeah? At first I thought 0:40:36.840 --> 0:40:38.680 it was because it was so foggy, but then it 0:40:38.760 --> 0:40:40.279 was clear and he was flying just as low. I 0:40:40.600 --> 0:40:42.560 think he likes to look for moose antlers. Well, there's 0:40:42.560 --> 0:40:46.240 a bunch of reasons. Yeah, that that is one. Another 0:40:46.280 --> 0:40:49.800 one was that, um, when it is foggy and the 0:40:49.880 --> 0:40:55.080 ceiling super low, because he knows every single cut bank 0:40:55.200 --> 0:40:57.799 and down log and the way the river turns and 0:40:57.880 --> 0:41:01.759 cliffs and whatnot. From lying low so much, he can 0:41:01.800 --> 0:41:04.560 fly low even when the ceilings low. And be comfortable 0:41:04.600 --> 0:41:06.680 in there where he's saying, yeah, it's a beautiful day. 0:41:06.719 --> 0:41:08.560 And if I fly go up to a thousand feet 0:41:08.640 --> 0:41:11.359 right now and buzz along, I'm not gaining anything from 0:41:11.440 --> 0:41:14.080 that beautiful flight up there. I need to be down 0:41:14.120 --> 0:41:17.480 here continuing to become intimate with what's down here. I 0:41:17.480 --> 0:41:20.239 need to know every single gravel bar where when, if 0:41:20.520 --> 0:41:22.840 possibly the ship hits the fan, I can land, I 0:41:22.840 --> 0:41:24.960 can make a move. I'm looking for spots where I 0:41:25.000 --> 0:41:28.560 can drop people in the future. You know, he might scout. 0:41:28.760 --> 0:41:33.760 He's scouting, yeah, constantly, Yeah, bringing in information and and hunts. 0:41:33.800 --> 0:41:37.160 And he's a big shed hunter and hunts moose sheds 0:41:37.200 --> 0:41:39.680 from his plane. And he said that takes a special 0:41:39.680 --> 0:41:44.000 skill set because you need to fly along and you 0:41:44.120 --> 0:41:47.319 know where all the sheds are. And then eventually got 0:41:47.400 --> 0:41:49.080 to find a place of land and you gotta be 0:41:49.120 --> 0:41:53.880 good enough you can walk and pick. You can spend 0:41:53.880 --> 0:41:56.920 your time then walking and retrieving all the ones you found, 0:41:57.080 --> 0:42:01.560 and again landscape, knowing the landscape. Was he saying that 0:42:01.560 --> 0:42:04.760 he picked thirteen hundred or thirteen thousand pounds of these sandlers. 0:42:05.400 --> 0:42:09.800 I didn't catch that. Wow, Yeah, thirteen hundreds is impressive. 0:42:09.840 --> 0:42:12.960 Until you think how much moose antler ways. He might 0:42:13.000 --> 0:42:15.560 have said he picked thirteen thousand pounds and moved sandlers, 0:42:15.560 --> 0:42:20.680 but just just it must have been hundred pounds. Well, 0:42:20.719 --> 0:42:24.759 I think he said thirty aside thirty pounds aside on 0:42:24.800 --> 0:42:32.880 the big ones. Um, that's a lot of moves. He 0:42:32.960 --> 0:42:35.200 flies a ton. I can't remember the hours he was 0:42:35.239 --> 0:42:37.480 saying he does. But yeah, but he's probably picking him 0:42:37.560 --> 0:42:41.000 up in the spring because he's not flying and when 0:42:41.000 --> 0:42:43.960 he's when he's flying hunters, he doesn't have time for that. Yeah, 0:42:44.000 --> 0:42:46.279 he was ripping us, you know, like, yeah, he was go, 0:42:46.400 --> 0:42:48.799 go go, and then he finished shuttling us, and he 0:42:48.840 --> 0:42:51.200 had a bunch more guys, you know, in other places. 0:42:51.280 --> 0:42:53.880 So Mark kennyon walking around picking up those deer landers 0:42:54.440 --> 0:42:59.279 his pants. This style of shed hunting man shed hunting 0:42:59.280 --> 0:43:01.120 out of airplane. So he likes to do that. And 0:43:01.200 --> 0:43:05.000 he was saying that he also hunts snowshoe hairs because 0:43:05.000 --> 0:43:06.960 when he turned white in the ground the snow melts, 0:43:06.960 --> 0:43:09.400 he can go out and locate little pockets of white rabbits. 0:43:09.440 --> 0:43:11.040 And in fin a place Land is playing and go 0:43:11.120 --> 0:43:14.000 snowshoe hunting, and it's pretty cool. That's a cool dude. 0:43:14.040 --> 0:43:16.800 I didn't realize I asked him. He's going a hundred 0:43:16.880 --> 0:43:20.160 ten miles when he's empty. That's with the tail wind 0:43:20.360 --> 0:43:24.080 with it. I think eight is what the top speed. 0:43:24.280 --> 0:43:26.560 This dude's super Cup is stripped down so light like 0:43:26.600 --> 0:43:28.000 he likes to keep it real light so you can 0:43:28.080 --> 0:43:32.000 land on super short strips and carry more ship. We've 0:43:32.160 --> 0:43:35.000 never put in so much stuff into a super Cup 0:43:35.080 --> 0:43:37.440 like we did with John. He has the hands start, 0:43:37.560 --> 0:43:39.000 so he has to be like the old World War 0:43:39.000 --> 0:43:41.000 One flying aces who got to go out and yell 0:43:41.080 --> 0:43:43.440 contact and turn the prop because he tore out his 0:43:43.560 --> 0:43:48.680 starter in the battery. So he starts his super Cup 0:43:48.719 --> 0:43:50.839 by going out. He's gotta get the throttle just right 0:43:51.000 --> 0:43:53.960 inside to start it, and in one fluid motion it 0:43:54.000 --> 0:43:57.200 takes him like three or four turns, grabs the prop 0:43:58.160 --> 0:44:01.360 he called the prop right, Yeah, grabs a prop, turns 0:44:01.360 --> 0:44:04.640 the clockwise hand from big kicks, and he's got a 0:44:04.880 --> 0:44:07.160 fly back around. We'll put up a video of him 0:44:07.160 --> 0:44:09.319 doing this in the show notes. He's got a fly 0:44:09.400 --> 0:44:13.280 back around and then hit the throttle and pull himself 0:44:13.360 --> 0:44:14.759 up in the plane. Every time, I'm like, why in 0:44:14.840 --> 0:44:16.160 the world you do that, and he said, I cut 0:44:16.239 --> 0:44:19.120 seventy pounds out of the plane. He also got rid 0:44:19.160 --> 0:44:20.800 of the back seat and just put a little carbon 0:44:20.880 --> 0:44:23.719 fiber piece there. And he took a piece of took 0:44:23.719 --> 0:44:25.440 a piece of ridge rest and cut it out for 0:44:25.480 --> 0:44:29.640 a pad. So like that seat is ounces the paint 0:44:31.320 --> 0:44:33.480 a super cup has forty pounds of paint on it. 0:44:33.760 --> 0:44:39.520 What Yeah, forty pounds of paint. His paint his his 0:44:39.760 --> 0:44:44.640 plane is painted the same color as most the landscape. Yeah, 0:44:44.680 --> 0:44:49.200 the same color like a slate gray, same color as 0:44:49.200 --> 0:44:51.359 all the shale. And I told him, said, man, when 0:44:51.360 --> 0:44:55.239 you eventually buried this burled is playing a new mountainside, 0:44:56.040 --> 0:44:59.600 They're never gonna find you. And he said, well, that's 0:44:59.600 --> 0:45:02.839 not my tent for that to happen. But he said, 0:45:02.880 --> 0:45:04.640 but kind of, because I don't like the people know 0:45:04.640 --> 0:45:07.440 where I'm laying on my plane. Yeah, so I'd like 0:45:07.480 --> 0:45:09.719 to keep a camouflage. If that means they don't find me, 0:45:09.719 --> 0:45:13.560 That means they don't find me. Do you remember when 0:45:13.560 --> 0:45:16.560 we flew in on that that moose float on the 0:45:16.640 --> 0:45:19.320 in the north study lasta range. Remember that second pilot 0:45:19.360 --> 0:45:22.839 that helped shuttle he had that little tailwheel Sessna where 0:45:22.840 --> 0:45:24.880 he stripped the paint off of it. Remember this, No, 0:45:24.960 --> 0:45:27.480 I remember flying in a helio courier. I thought that 0:45:27.560 --> 0:45:29.480 was cheap hunting. That was cheap onunting. But this is 0:45:29.480 --> 0:45:33.880 on that moose float. Trip Um done that float anymore? 0:45:34.360 --> 0:45:36.040 You know? A friend of mine did it last year 0:45:36.080 --> 0:45:39.320 and he went up in that same hanging valley there 0:45:39.440 --> 0:45:41.000 he shot a bully so that that they're running all over 0:45:41.040 --> 0:45:44.760 in there. Yeah, we killed three bulls, didn't me. Yeah, 0:45:45.000 --> 0:45:48.960 But anyway, that one of our pilots had just stripped. 0:45:48.960 --> 0:45:54.880 He had a little Cessna maybe and he had no anyway, 0:45:54.920 --> 0:45:57.560 I don't know planes very well, but he Um had 0:45:57.680 --> 0:46:00.960 stripped the paint off of his plane and it and 0:46:01.000 --> 0:46:04.319 he had forty pounds he made it forty pounds lighter, 0:46:05.080 --> 0:46:07.920 and he had forty pounds more payload. Yeah, and it 0:46:07.960 --> 0:46:10.799 was just a it looked like a you know, it's 0:46:10.800 --> 0:46:15.120 a bare aluminium just like tinfoil plane. You know, it's nice, 0:46:15.400 --> 0:46:17.680 wasn't he saying? I'm just gonna say, if you want 0:46:17.680 --> 0:46:20.239 to look this guy up and fly with him, I 0:46:20.239 --> 0:46:22.880 don't do that. No, No, I don't like that's smart. 0:46:23.239 --> 0:46:28.360 Really No, No, I'll tell you later why Okay, he 0:46:28.719 --> 0:46:32.799 mentioned something about paint that slides better, right, wasn't he? 0:46:33.080 --> 0:46:38.840 On the thinking put on this boat bottom? What's that 0:46:38.880 --> 0:46:41.920 paint called bottom? I gets a few different kinds, but 0:46:42.040 --> 0:46:45.120 I the one, the one that I brand turned me 0:46:45.160 --> 0:46:47.920 onto it. It's called Gator Glide. It's just just really slick. 0:46:47.960 --> 0:46:49.800 But you know how grippy that aluminum is. Man on 0:46:49.840 --> 0:46:53.319 the rocks so grippy. So it's like a truck bedliner 0:46:53.400 --> 0:46:57.239 that slicks for the bottom of your boat. It's like 0:46:57.280 --> 0:46:59.799 it's it's like taplon coating the bottom of your boat. Yeah, 0:46:59.800 --> 0:47:01.479 and like the one of the you know, the rivers 0:47:01.480 --> 0:47:03.200 we run are super shallow. When you run up on 0:47:03.200 --> 0:47:05.759 a sandbar or grapple bar or whatever, like I can 0:47:05.800 --> 0:47:07.239 just go out there one finger now and pull my 0:47:07.280 --> 0:47:09.879 boat off. Makes that much of a different huge Yeah, 0:47:10.000 --> 0:47:13.480 Gator glide. Yeah, a lot of that technology comes out 0:47:13.480 --> 0:47:16.680 of the Southeast, I bet you. Oh yeah, my whole boats, 0:47:17.040 --> 0:47:19.400 My whole boats like a Louisiana setup, you know, but 0:47:19.440 --> 0:47:22.040 they work well, flat bottom, air cooled engine. You can 0:47:22.120 --> 0:47:26.480 run it across wet grass. Yeah yet boat out here 0:47:27.520 --> 0:47:30.080 yeah yeah, No, it's not jet it's a mud motor. 0:47:30.160 --> 0:47:33.720 You know like I think it inspired by the Southeast Asia, 0:47:34.040 --> 0:47:38.400 you know, cool long shaft and then that minds a 0:47:38.520 --> 0:47:41.760 particular ones a Go Devil, and that company was started 0:47:41.760 --> 0:47:44.800 by I think I'm pretty sure it is a Vietnam 0:47:45.000 --> 0:47:47.560 war Vett that came back from Southeast Asia and thought, 0:47:47.600 --> 0:47:50.480 oh man, that's a slick setup. Is this in Louisiana 0:47:50.480 --> 0:47:53.920 and started making them places that make them down. It's 0:47:54.080 --> 0:47:56.520 got like a Briggs and Stratton engine, like a five 0:47:56.560 --> 0:48:01.719 foot prop like if I have foot chaft. Yeah, it's 0:48:01.719 --> 0:48:04.560 just it's just an air cooled like a riding lawnmower engine. 0:48:04.600 --> 0:48:06.759 You know, my mind's twenty four horse and it's got 0:48:06.760 --> 0:48:10.440 a it's just a you joint and a drive shaft 0:48:10.520 --> 0:48:13.680 and there's no there's no clutch, there's no gears. It's 0:48:13.719 --> 0:48:15.800 just when you start the molder, the prop is spending 0:48:17.000 --> 0:48:18.480 and you lower that prop into the water and it 0:48:18.520 --> 0:48:22.640 goes and that's that's all. Because people don't dick around motors. 0:48:22.680 --> 0:48:25.120 What like Jenlly and outboard is water cooled, so you 0:48:25.160 --> 0:48:27.680 gotta have enough water where the lower units down and 0:48:27.680 --> 0:48:30.480 there's an intake thing in there and it's taken water 0:48:30.640 --> 0:48:32.919 up cycles it through the system and pisces it back out, 0:48:34.320 --> 0:48:37.759 so it takes some water to run it. Um. Their 0:48:37.840 --> 0:48:41.320 thing is these things you rocks and stuff, don't hurt them. 0:48:41.640 --> 0:48:43.640 They're they're starting to take a toll. I've been running 0:48:43.640 --> 0:48:47.520 that thing for he's fifteen years and rivers, you know, 0:48:47.640 --> 0:48:50.200 and and my my skegs getting pretty beat up. And 0:48:50.320 --> 0:48:54.279 it starts the skegs actually starting to unweld from the Yeah. Yeah, 0:48:54.360 --> 0:48:56.080 it's not going to take it apart and get somebody 0:48:56.080 --> 0:48:57.840 to reweld it, you know. But now that's taking a 0:48:57.920 --> 0:48:59.800 lot of abuse. Remember going duck hunting with you and 0:48:59.840 --> 0:49:01.799 the arc out here one time, going through a hole 0:49:01.840 --> 0:49:05.480 and feeling the boat as that thing hits Sam And yeah, 0:49:05.520 --> 0:49:09.560 that's an awful feeling, like a pot of sandwich. Yeah, 0:49:10.360 --> 0:49:12.960 I hate that. It only happened a couple of times. 0:49:13.200 --> 0:49:15.480 That's gonna happen no matter what motor you run. Yeah, 0:49:15.640 --> 0:49:18.920 depending on what's going on. Where were we the pilot, 0:49:18.920 --> 0:49:21.480 I messed up the paint thing, but we're breaking down. 0:49:21.560 --> 0:49:23.080 So I'm glad he brought up because dudes, I want 0:49:23.080 --> 0:49:25.800 to know about that, right, Gator Glade put it on 0:49:25.840 --> 0:49:29.319 the bomb of your boat. Um he was trimmed down though, 0:49:29.360 --> 0:49:33.520 our pilot trimmed down. Dude. He could. Like the one 0:49:33.520 --> 0:49:35.560 time he took off to go pick up another dude, 0:49:35.560 --> 0:49:39.440 he just like what looked like thirty and he was airborne. 0:49:39.800 --> 0:49:41.840 It was almost like a helicopter. Man, it was crazy. 0:49:42.080 --> 0:49:46.480 His rig is just super cool. Man. Those things got 0:49:46.520 --> 0:49:51.480 a way to crashing. Yeah, what's eating crazier is that 0:49:51.520 --> 0:49:53.520 when we got there, I looked at him like, man, 0:49:53.880 --> 0:49:57.840 I know that. Yeah. Yeah, he and I worked together 0:49:57.880 --> 0:50:02.040 for maybe three months. You in Colorado, right, Yeah, in 0:50:02.200 --> 0:50:07.240 Edward's car Autumn Ptarmigan Sports. He was a mountain guide. 0:50:09.320 --> 0:50:10.719 I'm I don't know for sure if he was a 0:50:10.719 --> 0:50:12.719 mountain guid him guessing he's done some guiding, but he 0:50:12.800 --> 0:50:17.960 was just a professional climber. Um. So we get to 0:50:18.000 --> 0:50:20.560 the spot and basically like the spot we start out 0:50:20.560 --> 0:50:22.800 where we land and we're just laying on a gravel 0:50:22.800 --> 0:50:25.319 bar in the river and we're about to get a 0:50:25.360 --> 0:50:30.440 sense of this. We landed probably not probably then we 0:50:30.520 --> 0:50:35.560 landed at thirty five ft above sea level the surrounding 0:50:35.600 --> 0:50:40.880 peaks or seven or so, the very very highest. Yeah, 0:50:40.920 --> 0:50:49.640 and we're about five, well six to seven river miles 0:50:49.760 --> 0:50:52.000 to what would be the head of this stream we 0:50:52.120 --> 0:50:54.799 land on the streaming landing has a big wide gravel bar. 0:50:54.880 --> 0:50:57.879 What do you call that, dan, big white gravel bar 0:50:58.440 --> 0:51:01.120 like the whole bed. How do you describe that bed? Oh, 0:51:01.200 --> 0:51:04.279 I'd like a braided river bed. Braided river bed that's 0:51:04.280 --> 0:51:10.240 a couple hundred yards wide. Um, and usually the it's braided. 0:51:10.320 --> 0:51:13.000 I mean usually the channel is occurring in multiple places. 0:51:13.280 --> 0:51:16.360 So it's got this big, like this big broad gravelly 0:51:16.400 --> 0:51:18.720 thing and everything's very shallow and just kind of meanders 0:51:18.719 --> 0:51:22.080 across and changes constantly, Like the channel gets rewritten every 0:51:22.160 --> 0:51:26.680 year from in most places that you know, any most 0:51:26.719 --> 0:51:29.560 spots along that river, the channels in you know, two 0:51:29.680 --> 0:51:32.200 or three places at once. You know, it's never in 0:51:32.239 --> 0:51:36.080 as rarely is it in a single channel. And to 0:51:36.120 --> 0:51:39.160 get a sense for it, like you'd cross it. When 0:51:39.200 --> 0:51:41.200 you got across, it's about hip deep and hall and 0:51:41.239 --> 0:51:44.920 ass knee deep and haul and ass. Yeah, when you 0:51:44.920 --> 0:51:48.080 got across the main channel. It fluctuates a lot though. 0:51:48.160 --> 0:51:52.400 That surprised me. Yeah, it's like someone it's like God 0:51:52.520 --> 0:51:57.200 dicking with the water belve in a shower because like 0:51:57.440 --> 0:52:01.880 over today, the glaciers are melting fast tons of water. 0:52:02.400 --> 0:52:05.440 It rains somewhere but not here, tons of water, and 0:52:05.480 --> 0:52:08.360 the silt load goes up and down where it looks 0:52:08.400 --> 0:52:14.200 like chocolate milk. Then it's clear chocolm milk, clear chocolate milk, clear, 0:52:14.280 --> 0:52:18.799 up down, up, down, changes constantly. UM. And we're like 0:52:18.840 --> 0:52:20.520 seven miles from the head of this thing. And this 0:52:20.640 --> 0:52:27.000 thing's headed by this probably has like three heads. Right, 0:52:27.600 --> 0:52:30.800 you go kind of like two two main channels of 0:52:30.880 --> 0:52:33.840 feed into it, and we're we get dropped off about 0:52:33.920 --> 0:52:36.200 seven miles from the head of these from the head 0:52:36.200 --> 0:52:38.600 of these two things. And the first day here here's 0:52:38.600 --> 0:52:40.520 another rule in Alaska. It gets thrown out a lot. 0:52:40.680 --> 0:52:45.480 You can't hunt with some exceptions. There are exceptions to this. 0:52:45.920 --> 0:52:51.200 Most of the exceptions are around deer in southeast Alaska 0:52:51.440 --> 0:52:55.399 and some caribou units. You can't hunt in the same 0:52:55.480 --> 0:53:01.040 day you fly in Alaska, preventing you um on a 0:53:01.120 --> 0:53:05.880 non scheduled flight. If you fly in a jet into 0:53:05.920 --> 0:53:08.400 somewhere you know that's a or even a smaller plane. 0:53:08.400 --> 0:53:11.920 If it's a scheduled flight you know, into wherever. Uh, 0:53:12.000 --> 0:53:14.520 that doesn't count. But but a charter or your own 0:53:14.520 --> 0:53:16.600 plane or whatever, the same day you've been airborn, you 0:53:16.600 --> 0:53:20.919 cannot hunt, and that speaks to um, what they're trying 0:53:20.960 --> 0:53:23.920 to prevent one from being able to do is I 0:53:23.960 --> 0:53:26.759 didn't find an animal from the air and land a 0:53:26.800 --> 0:53:29.640 plane and go shoot it. Instead, you got to find 0:53:29.640 --> 0:53:32.960 it from the air, land a plane, wait until what 0:53:33.040 --> 0:53:37.160 three am? Wait until three am, and then you can go. 0:53:37.880 --> 0:53:41.000 And the reason, like a lot of states have legal 0:53:41.040 --> 0:53:46.120 shooting hours, um, legal hunting hours, but you know, because 0:53:46.160 --> 0:53:49.400 of the peculiarities of at this latitude, the peculiarities of 0:53:49.480 --> 0:53:53.759 day length. Alaska doesn't do legal shooting hours with sunset 0:53:54.320 --> 0:53:57.840 sunrise except for waterfowl. Yeah, that's I think I assume 0:53:57.920 --> 0:54:03.239 that's federally mandated. When you land, you gotta wait, like 0:54:03.520 --> 0:54:05.440 because even if you're hunting, you could be hunting the 0:54:05.520 --> 0:54:08.240 very early season when it's twenty four hours a daylight. 0:54:08.320 --> 0:54:09.759 So it's not like you gotta wait till it gets 0:54:09.840 --> 0:54:13.080 dark and lighting or whatever. It's like three am. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 0:54:13.120 --> 0:54:17.520 that which darkest, even though it could just be dusky 0:54:17.560 --> 0:54:19.840 all night, like you can still see like when you 0:54:19.880 --> 0:54:21.320 wake up, even just now, when you wake up in 0:54:21.360 --> 0:54:24.400 the middle of night to go take a leak, you 0:54:24.400 --> 0:54:28.359 can check around for bears. Yeah, it's not that dark Matt. 0:54:28.440 --> 0:54:30.640 Matt and I have watched sheep all night long. We've 0:54:30.680 --> 0:54:33.319 kept tabs on sheep throughout the night, and never, you know, 0:54:33.400 --> 0:54:34.839 he would leave the spot ands go up on him. 0:54:34.840 --> 0:54:37.520 It never got so dark that you couldn't tell that 0:54:37.600 --> 0:54:40.080 they were there. Yeah, Mber that time caribou hunting. Matt 0:54:40.080 --> 0:54:43.880 went wandering way off and shot a bowl way off somewhere. Oh, 0:54:44.080 --> 0:54:46.520 he's gone late, butcher's it, he says. It starts to 0:54:46.520 --> 0:54:48.680 get kind of dark. He sits down for a while, 0:54:48.719 --> 0:54:51.880 it gets light. He said, Well, I guess it just 0:54:51.960 --> 0:54:55.760 stayed out all night and it comes wandering into camp 0:54:55.800 --> 0:54:58.040 three thirty in the morning. I think I do this 0:54:58.120 --> 0:55:00.799 out overnight. We kept the ripper could the big old 0:55:00.840 --> 0:55:03.080 fire going for him to thinking he was lost out, 0:55:03.320 --> 0:55:05.120 thinking he was lost out in the tundra. I'm so 0:55:05.280 --> 0:55:10.800 worried about him. Um, that was pretty like having GPS 0:55:10.920 --> 0:55:13.759 units and one yeah, and in reaches and no. I 0:55:13.760 --> 0:55:16.560 think he might have had GPS was before I remember 0:55:16.880 --> 0:55:19.880 his navigation thing was this. That's right. We were camped 0:55:19.880 --> 0:55:24.200 at the confluence, so he knew he was going up 0:55:24.560 --> 0:55:27.520 with water flowing back towards camp on the right side, 0:55:27.520 --> 0:55:29.640 and water flowing back toward the camp on the left side, 0:55:29.640 --> 0:55:31.759 and they eventually met at a V and he was 0:55:31.840 --> 0:55:34.719 canceled that V. So he said he knew he could 0:55:34.719 --> 0:55:40.440 wander around anywhere as long as he followed water, he 0:55:40.480 --> 0:55:42.640 would not as good. As long as he didn't cross 0:55:42.680 --> 0:55:44.440 the river and followed the water, he knew that he 0:55:44.480 --> 0:55:47.360 would come back and land back and camp. That's safe. 0:55:48.040 --> 0:55:50.640 Remember that same trip, Remember that grizzly come up the 0:55:50.640 --> 0:55:54.200 other bank and starts waiting across the river. Oh yeah, 0:55:54.440 --> 0:55:56.640 And Matt went out in his waiters and tried to 0:55:56.680 --> 0:56:00.160 scare it back up, scared back up in the air bank. 0:56:00.400 --> 0:56:05.160 What happened? Bear took off. Um, that was my good 0:56:05.160 --> 0:56:08.320 optics epiphany that I've talked about many times. Where we 0:56:08.360 --> 0:56:10.200 had a dude who had just come off a guide 0:56:10.200 --> 0:56:12.400 and our body chunk could just come off a guide 0:56:12.400 --> 0:56:15.719 and for moose on the peninsula or something, or had 0:56:15.760 --> 0:56:18.040 the year before and had been given some good spotting 0:56:18.080 --> 0:56:22.160 scopes and binoculars, and I've always had shitty ones. And 0:56:22.200 --> 0:56:24.160 we were watching the grizzly coming up, and I'm looking 0:56:24.160 --> 0:56:25.719 through his spot and sculpe and you can see the 0:56:25.760 --> 0:56:28.840 wind hit its side and make this little colic that 0:56:28.920 --> 0:56:30.920 kind of drifted around on his body and the breeze 0:56:30.920 --> 0:56:35.359 and I'm like, I'm getting some of these sons. Uh. 0:56:36.200 --> 0:56:38.000 And we landed. So we lent this river like what 0:56:38.520 --> 0:56:42.480 I think about six miles to the head of this thing. Then, Oh, 0:56:42.560 --> 0:56:44.200 I was getting how you can't hunt the same day fly? 0:56:44.719 --> 0:56:49.160 So because LEVI was the six guy in, he couldn't. 0:56:50.200 --> 0:56:52.279 A careful reading of the rule would be that he 0:56:52.320 --> 0:56:55.799 can't even hunt with us. I can't assist. Yeah, but 0:56:55.920 --> 0:56:58.520 by hanging out, by hanging out if he's like, hey, 0:56:58.560 --> 0:57:03.040 what's that white thing? Yeah, yeah, so he's ineligible to 0:57:03.160 --> 0:57:06.600 hunt the first day we get in. So we do 0:57:06.680 --> 0:57:10.279 like a little short John short being relevant, I feel 0:57:10.320 --> 0:57:13.120 like it was a John. We decided to hit a tributary, 0:57:13.200 --> 0:57:16.080 the first tributary upstream from our camp. We decided to 0:57:16.120 --> 0:57:19.600 explore out the tributary, and so we walked it from 0:57:19.680 --> 0:57:22.600 thirty five the mouth of that tributaries three thousand, five 0:57:22.680 --> 0:57:26.480 hundred feet and we started this tributary in the rain 0:57:28.320 --> 0:57:31.840 and climb maybe a thousand feet and then you can't 0:57:31.840 --> 0:57:38.520 see anything where your visibility is hundred yards um now, 0:57:38.560 --> 0:57:40.160 and then you get a little pockets where you can see, 0:57:40.160 --> 0:57:41.520 and I think we sat there. We set up a 0:57:41.520 --> 0:57:44.800 tarp in the rain, and there's no sets of plowing 0:57:44.880 --> 0:57:46.600 through a place you haven't seen yet. When you're in 0:57:46.600 --> 0:57:48.360 the right kind of country, you can't just plow through 0:57:48.400 --> 0:57:50.160 in the fog because you're not doing yourself any good. 0:57:50.200 --> 0:57:53.360 And we sat there for four hours. I think took 0:57:53.360 --> 0:57:56.800 a napp shivered, sat there under a tarp for four hours. 0:57:58.360 --> 0:58:00.920 Event she started to get a little bit clear, and 0:58:01.000 --> 0:58:07.440 we climbed up to a saddle that was att waited 0:58:07.440 --> 0:58:10.120 a while, got a couple of open windows in the 0:58:10.160 --> 0:58:12.440 fog to look down the next valley. I feel like 0:58:12.440 --> 0:58:18.920 we should plug the try that Sam Bartiya, Dude, I 0:58:18.920 --> 0:58:20.680 love that freaking tea man. Remy turned me out of 0:58:20.760 --> 0:58:27.360 that tea. Yeah, yeah right. There's a tea company talk 0:58:27.360 --> 0:58:30.520 about giving away the goods for free. Man, it's a 0:58:30.560 --> 0:58:34.160 tea company called Kobak. Not even for freaking charge a 0:58:34.200 --> 0:58:37.520 lot of money for that damn t Kobak something tea 0:58:37.600 --> 0:58:40.959 company you're giving away to plug for free to them. 0:58:41.240 --> 0:58:45.120 But I feel like you're sharing value. I'm sharing valuable information, 0:58:45.160 --> 0:58:46.640 but I'm only I'm doing it with the only the 0:58:46.640 --> 0:58:48.920 one hesitation that it just doesn't make sense how much 0:58:48.920 --> 0:58:52.760 they charged for the decaf version. Oh, sand bar stuff 0:58:52.760 --> 0:58:56.520 you guys are drinking was caffeinated, No, caffeinated as normal. 0:58:56.560 --> 0:58:59.360 Price decalf is twice as much. But I'd like to 0:58:59.400 --> 0:59:03.400 drink it at night as my hot drink. What's the 0:59:03.440 --> 0:59:06.720 process that makes it? Why they washed it with chemicals? 0:59:07.120 --> 0:59:13.240 Mhm danger, Yeah, yeah, don't eat it. Danny got swollen 0:59:13.360 --> 0:59:18.840 uvla maybe from eating the teeth. Yeah, Sandbar teeth from 0:59:18.880 --> 0:59:21.160 cobal Tea called me is the best ship in the world. Man, 0:59:21.200 --> 0:59:24.280 good man, Um, it's like, I don't know. It's like 0:59:24.600 --> 0:59:26.520 it's got all kinds of stuff in it. Man, it's 0:59:26.560 --> 0:59:30.720 got cloves in it, cinnamon, cinnamon in it. Oh my god, 0:59:30.760 --> 0:59:32.520 this is good. You had a spicy thing when you 0:59:32.600 --> 0:59:34.360 bit into it that one time you'd like a pepper 0:59:34.400 --> 0:59:36.680 corn or some well, someone from the Thai restaurant must 0:59:36.720 --> 0:59:38.040 have been over there, and it's like one of the 0:59:38.080 --> 0:59:42.560 little freaking peppers there just to screw somebody. It was. 0:59:42.680 --> 0:59:44.520 It was had a cinnamon flavor to it, but it 0:59:44.560 --> 0:59:47.000 was way hotter than eating like a pizza cinnamon. So 0:59:47.560 --> 0:59:50.880 I don't know what that was. You practically broke a 0:59:50.880 --> 0:59:53.720 sweat and I can handle some hot food. But that 0:59:53.800 --> 0:59:56.240 was insane. I don't even know what's in that ship man. 0:59:56.560 --> 0:59:58.840 But you buy at the Anchorage airport and up top 0:59:58.920 --> 1:00:00.920 they got the caffey and don low they got a 1:00:00.920 --> 1:00:02.920 little air with the decap. They charged too much for 1:00:02.920 --> 1:00:06.320 the decap to the point where to the point where 1:00:08.160 --> 1:00:10.720 after I got turned onto it, I went online and 1:00:10.920 --> 1:00:14.480 on their website to buy something and was so insulted 1:00:14.520 --> 1:00:18.080 by the price that I didn't because I'm like, what 1:00:19.320 --> 1:00:22.360 am I like growing up? When I was growing up, 1:00:22.600 --> 1:00:27.120 someone said to me, someday you will buy really expensive 1:00:27.160 --> 1:00:32.439 te online, I would be like bullsh Well, I'm saying 1:00:32.440 --> 1:00:34.480 they're drinking a bottle of Boone's fire from the shower, 1:00:35.840 --> 1:00:40.120 coming back from coming back from Weldon Weldon raw iron 1:00:40.240 --> 1:00:43.640 droppers to hang like conveyor lines on um. If you 1:00:43.640 --> 1:00:48.200 had told me someday, Sonny, you'll be buying little several 1:00:48.240 --> 1:00:51.200 three oun bags of tea for thirteen bucks online, out 1:00:51.200 --> 1:00:56.040 of punching the face. So I'll buy in the airport. 1:00:56.160 --> 1:00:58.919 Because if someone said, like, someday you'll buy a bag 1:00:58.960 --> 1:01:02.600 of tena airport, I've sure I don't know that's okay. 1:01:02.920 --> 1:01:05.520 I wouldn't have been I wouldn't have been like nervous 1:01:05.600 --> 1:01:09.400 about that revelation. So I can't bring myself to buy 1:01:09.400 --> 1:01:19.200 it online. Um, but yeah, that's it's good. Hits the spot. Yeah, 1:01:19.760 --> 1:01:23.640 up on this saddle. We're trying to weigh out, um, 1:01:23.840 --> 1:01:28.160 whether to sleep there or head back down? Sleep there, 1:01:28.200 --> 1:01:30.000 thinking in the morning you might get a better view. 1:01:30.360 --> 1:01:32.960 It wasn't like nine o'clock or ten. It's late. Yeah, 1:01:33.000 --> 1:01:34.959 it doesn't get dark til ten thirty, doesn't get dusky 1:01:35.080 --> 1:01:37.320 till ten thirty at night. And then but yeah, I 1:01:37.320 --> 1:01:38.680 can't tell what the hell time he gets light in 1:01:38.680 --> 1:01:41.360 the morning. Yeah, six, I guess it gets light at six. 1:01:42.320 --> 1:01:44.440 I felt like you had to use the headlamp from 1:01:44.440 --> 1:01:48.800 about ten thirty and till five, depending on what you're doing. Yeah, 1:01:48.840 --> 1:01:50.440 if you need it. Yeah, here's what I got to 1:01:50.480 --> 1:01:52.840 grab a ball. You didn't need it, but like fidget 1:01:52.960 --> 1:01:58.240 around camp and looking at your backpack. Yeah, um, no 1:01:58.360 --> 1:02:03.120 sign of sheep up there. Not that day. I couldn't 1:02:03.120 --> 1:02:06.959 really see that well though, right, But also signed, Yeah, 1:02:07.320 --> 1:02:09.520 those ridge often on those ridge we saw him in 1:02:09.720 --> 1:02:12.240 a few places. But on those ridge lines was you'll 1:02:12.240 --> 1:02:14.920 see a little beds where they kick out a little bowl, 1:02:15.040 --> 1:02:19.280 you know, and didn't see any beds, didn't se any 1:02:19.320 --> 1:02:24.360 fresh tracks, decided not to sleep up there, um drop 1:02:24.400 --> 1:02:27.560 back down and then walked in that that's said, which 1:02:27.560 --> 1:02:32.480 said was fifty ft back down to our little base camp. 1:02:32.560 --> 1:02:34.560 And Levi had come in that day so he was 1:02:34.680 --> 1:02:37.000 eligible to be out with us the next morning. The 1:02:37.120 --> 1:02:41.080 next morning we headed up to go explore the headwaters 1:02:41.160 --> 1:02:45.920 of this river that we're on. Dirtmth river, dirt, it's unnamed, 1:02:46.400 --> 1:02:48.320 no joke, I'm not being like, I'm not being cooit. 1:02:48.480 --> 1:02:52.320 The river has no name. This It's amazing that there 1:02:52.360 --> 1:02:57.080 are rivers in Alaska, Like any river that size in 1:02:57.120 --> 1:02:59.919 lower forty eight would have a road on it during 1:03:00.000 --> 1:03:02.280 thes No river that size and lower forty eight that 1:03:02.320 --> 1:03:05.280 doesn't have a roadhould say, know, but very few rivers 1:03:05.320 --> 1:03:07.640 that size and lower forty eight would not be would 1:03:07.640 --> 1:03:09.280 not have a road in the bottom of them, dude, 1:03:09.280 --> 1:03:11.880 even like little trickles have got names down in the 1:03:11.960 --> 1:03:14.720 forty eight. You know, here there's rivers in Alaska big 1:03:14.800 --> 1:03:17.479 enough to take a boat down with no name. Yeah, 1:03:17.600 --> 1:03:21.680 and those a lot of the smaller rivers that do 1:03:21.760 --> 1:03:24.280 have a name, they're all like mine related, you know, 1:03:24.480 --> 1:03:32.480 like mother Load Creek or or uh gold Finger flu Creator, 1:03:33.840 --> 1:03:41.360 bankrupt Creem, Yeah, hard Luck Creek, so uh um dirt Yeah, 1:03:41.360 --> 1:03:43.840 we go up Dirtmith Creek and we decided to explore 1:03:44.000 --> 1:03:48.640 first the right branch and that day that that's the 1:03:48.760 --> 1:03:51.800 day you know, we saw using lambs that day. So 1:03:51.920 --> 1:03:54.240 think about yeah by camps, I think about doll sheep 1:03:54.360 --> 1:03:57.320 is maybe maybe Danny knows what the answer to this is. 1:03:58.080 --> 1:04:02.800 Lands and us get the good spotts, they get the 1:04:02.920 --> 1:04:07.840 rich feed, you know, yeah, I mean they get the 1:04:07.880 --> 1:04:10.760 cush location. Yeah. I don't think they're excluding the rams. 1:04:10.880 --> 1:04:13.680 I I you know, I assume it's that those Is 1:04:13.760 --> 1:04:18.000 that that the that the lambs, you know, growing so 1:04:18.160 --> 1:04:20.800 rapidly at that point in their life, need that you know, 1:04:20.960 --> 1:04:28.080 highly digestible, high protein, really green diet. That's that's that 1:04:28.280 --> 1:04:30.360 doesn't require a lot of effort to get. You know, 1:04:30.480 --> 1:04:33.760 it's stick, it's lush, and and you know, the the 1:04:33.840 --> 1:04:36.439 rams can afford to be you know, a higher where 1:04:36.480 --> 1:04:39.040 there's just not as much food because they're not actively 1:04:39.040 --> 1:04:42.520 growing so fast, so they're taking the security. I'm just 1:04:42.600 --> 1:04:44.960 intuning that. Well. I heard a guy one time, stay 1:04:44.960 --> 1:04:46.720 this and I don't like because it makes the rams 1:04:46.720 --> 1:04:50.360 sound altruistic. But first of all, I say this so 1:04:50.360 --> 1:04:54.120 so running for dollsheet. Ovis Dolly. I think it's how 1:04:54.120 --> 1:04:56.520 you say it, like Salvador Dolly the painter, but it's 1:04:56.560 --> 1:05:02.439 Ovis And Doll was a natural US and explorer got 1:05:02.440 --> 1:05:07.160 the sheep named after himself. Um. Interestingly, Doll named the 1:05:07.200 --> 1:05:10.520 Alaska Range. He named the Alaskan Range and it became 1:05:10.560 --> 1:05:13.880 the Alaska Range. But the dude whose name was given 1:05:13.920 --> 1:05:16.880 to the doll sheet is the guy that named the 1:05:16.920 --> 1:05:20.960 Alaska Range. And the doll sheep is a pure white 1:05:21.240 --> 1:05:25.120 mountain sheet, big curly horns like a big horn. Um. 1:05:25.200 --> 1:05:30.800 You know. They run late actorally November, hang out up 1:05:30.840 --> 1:05:33.640 around the glaze like they're like in the imagination. They're 1:05:33.640 --> 1:05:38.880 associated with the rockiest, nastiest, highest, most glaciated stuff, Like 1:05:39.000 --> 1:05:45.200 they there's the highest mammal on the mountain, the highest 1:05:45.200 --> 1:05:49.440 hooved right. Well, you see caribou up in there sometimes too, Yeah, 1:05:49.560 --> 1:05:52.480 I mean, like for a year round living though. They 1:05:52.480 --> 1:05:55.640 eke out an existence up there, and they don't migrate 1:05:55.640 --> 1:05:58.760 down to the low country when the snow flies. They 1:05:58.760 --> 1:06:00.960 gotta beyond the wind swept they stay up in the windswevery. 1:06:01.080 --> 1:06:02.760 They they don't find they don't wind up living down 1:06:02.760 --> 1:06:05.680 in some dudes alf alpha field or like down in 1:06:05.720 --> 1:06:08.040 the valley bottoms. They stay up and they're just they 1:06:08.080 --> 1:06:11.240 live up. Yeah, yeah, but there's some interesting exceptions too though. 1:06:11.280 --> 1:06:13.120 I mean they're always on you know, they need to 1:06:13.160 --> 1:06:15.360 have escape covered nearby. They're always in rocky, you know, 1:06:15.400 --> 1:06:17.640 craggy terrain. But like you know, you drive down turning 1:06:17.680 --> 1:06:19.640 an arms off the anchorage and you know you're at 1:06:19.640 --> 1:06:21.240 sea level and you can look up a few hundred 1:06:21.320 --> 1:06:23.840 yards sometimes on the highway there at Dollar Sheep there, 1:06:23.920 --> 1:06:26.000 you know, and so in that in that circumstance, you're 1:06:26.000 --> 1:06:29.160 not high up, but you got the rocky nous and 1:06:29.160 --> 1:06:33.240 the cragginess that they Yeah, so they don't care about 1:06:33.240 --> 1:06:36.120 the number that they don't necessarily care about the elevation number. 1:06:36.120 --> 1:06:39.720 It's just like what you go hand in hand, where 1:06:39.760 --> 1:06:43.760 is that where they're preferred habitat happens to exist in 1:06:43.800 --> 1:06:48.320 those areas. Um, but we see a bunch of using lambs, 1:06:48.320 --> 1:06:51.480 and using lambs are kind of predictable because like if 1:06:51.520 --> 1:06:54.400 you see like a whole yo, you see like a 1:06:54.440 --> 1:06:59.160 dozen animals laying in kind of a meadow meadowy bowl 1:06:59.320 --> 1:07:01.400 up on a mountain side. You just know like like 1:07:01.520 --> 1:07:04.240 that's lambs and us. Yeah, it's real green and lush 1:07:04.360 --> 1:07:09.200 like there. Like that gives it away. And also the 1:07:09.240 --> 1:07:11.360 whole the number of them, because you can find big 1:07:11.360 --> 1:07:13.120 groups of rams. But like when you see like a 1:07:13.160 --> 1:07:15.480 dozen of something laying in a really green patch, like 1:07:15.520 --> 1:07:18.280 that's lambs and news um. But as we and we 1:07:18.320 --> 1:07:19.960 saw some lambs used in the morning. But as we 1:07:20.040 --> 1:07:25.200 press up, we see a single sheep way ahead of us, 1:07:25.920 --> 1:07:30.120 and I'm thinking ram only because he's by himself. He's 1:07:30.200 --> 1:07:33.480 laying in a U spot. But there's only one of them. 1:07:33.520 --> 1:07:35.320 And eventually we get up there and find that it's 1:07:35.320 --> 1:07:41.120 a way not legal ram, a legal RAM in Alaska. 1:07:43.720 --> 1:07:49.360 Is this universal or are there still any RAM units? Yeah, 1:07:49.400 --> 1:07:52.400 there's at least Yeah, part of a big chunk of 1:07:52.400 --> 1:07:57.520 the chewcatch a few years back went to from from 1:07:57.560 --> 1:08:01.000 you know, basically over the counter to a lottery and 1:08:01.000 --> 1:08:03.960 and in that unit they went to that lottery tag. 1:08:04.040 --> 1:08:06.840 Now they went to any RAM. Tell us why, because 1:08:06.880 --> 1:08:11.280 I was, yeah, that's interesting stuff. But there's this hypothesis. 1:08:11.320 --> 1:08:14.240 I guess it probably is or maybe there's don't say 1:08:14.240 --> 1:08:17.960 that yet, Okay, layout what illegal ramas and then talk 1:08:18.000 --> 1:08:22.880 about the hypothesis. So, yeah, so legal ramas is a well, 1:08:22.960 --> 1:08:26.920 it's a full curl ram. And so that's a ram 1:08:26.960 --> 1:08:30.160 whose horn has grown three sixty degrees from the base 1:08:30.400 --> 1:08:36.679 to the tip um or is eight years of age. 1:08:37.080 --> 1:08:40.960 So you would see eight growth annually that are formed 1:08:41.040 --> 1:08:44.880 each winter of the rams life um or if the 1:08:45.040 --> 1:08:49.759 both horns are broken off um I mean substantially broken 1:08:49.920 --> 1:08:52.920 such that the whole the whole lamb tip the first 1:08:52.960 --> 1:08:55.840 year of growth is absent from the horn and they grind, 1:08:55.880 --> 1:08:58.720 they scrape them off and break them off. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 1:08:58.720 --> 1:09:00.960 but that's the mark of an old ram am. And 1:09:01.080 --> 1:09:03.280 you know it's so you know, a ram with two 1:09:03.360 --> 1:09:06.400 broken horns is certainly is well, it's very unlikely to 1:09:06.439 --> 1:09:08.559 be full curl, but it's certainly going to be old. 1:09:08.640 --> 1:09:11.760 So they've kind of um that. That's another way you 1:09:11.760 --> 1:09:14.080 can and those are those are still pretty rare though. 1:09:14.800 --> 1:09:17.439 Double broomers I haven't laid eyes on a double broom do. 1:09:18.680 --> 1:09:21.599 And then like big horns, virtually all of the double 1:09:21.640 --> 1:09:25.280 broom they get to a certain size. So those are 1:09:25.280 --> 1:09:27.439 the three ways to make a legal ram the most 1:09:27.600 --> 1:09:30.000 the most reliable ways, it is a full curl. You 1:09:30.040 --> 1:09:32.200 look at the side, the horn should form a six 1:09:32.240 --> 1:09:34.920 degree circle. Yeah, from the from the right angle, so 1:09:34.920 --> 1:09:37.920 when when when you're at the right angle, yeah, that 1:09:37.920 --> 1:09:41.719 that horn should be perfectly round. If you're too high 1:09:41.840 --> 1:09:44.280 or too low, it should be more of an oval 1:09:44.640 --> 1:09:47.360 oblong shape. As your sort of perspective on the horn changes, 1:09:47.400 --> 1:09:49.360 So when you're looking at exactly you know, think of 1:09:49.360 --> 1:09:51.439 it as a helix. And when you're looking straight down 1:09:51.439 --> 1:09:56.679 that helix, the perimeter of the horn should be perfectly round, 1:09:57.880 --> 1:10:00.240 and the tips should come swing all the way around 1:10:00.280 --> 1:10:01.840 and meet the base or exceed the base, and that 1:10:01.880 --> 1:10:04.519 would be the mark of full curl ram. There was 1:10:04.600 --> 1:10:06.640 cool tips that you pointed out as far as the 1:10:06.680 --> 1:10:10.599 angle and stuff of it coming out of this goal. 1:10:10.920 --> 1:10:14.599 Because looking dead on at you, yeah or no, no, 1:10:14.640 --> 1:10:17.920 when we when our perspective was elliptical, and it looked 1:10:17.920 --> 1:10:21.639 like a full curl maybe, and looking from down looking 1:10:21.680 --> 1:10:24.639 from down below, they look for the not full curl. 1:10:24.720 --> 1:10:26.720 Lamp ram looks for a curl when you're looking from 1:10:26.720 --> 1:10:29.320 down below. But you pointed out the angle at which 1:10:30.439 --> 1:10:35.519 the curl starts can be somewhat uh a clue at 1:10:36.560 --> 1:10:40.680 older that they look on a younger ram, it's not 1:10:40.720 --> 1:10:45.680 as like it looks more swept back up top, you know, 1:10:45.840 --> 1:10:47.160 I think I think that probably has something to do 1:10:47.160 --> 1:10:50.120 with the mass. But it looks like it like sweeps 1:10:50.160 --> 1:10:53.360 back in a more abrupt fashion. I because it just 1:10:53.400 --> 1:10:55.719 hasn't got as like heavy up top yet or something. 1:10:56.840 --> 1:10:59.240 You know, it hasn't achieved like its biggest diama because 1:10:59.240 --> 1:11:02.120 that's where it's growing from. So it seemed to have 1:11:02.280 --> 1:11:05.400 like it's like like he's been running real fast and 1:11:05.439 --> 1:11:08.800 it kind of mashes horn. The angle of the tip 1:11:08.920 --> 1:11:11.320 is telling too, because you know, the younger ram it's 1:11:11.360 --> 1:11:14.680 pointing more forward and as that curls more, it's you know, 1:11:14.720 --> 1:11:19.599 eventually it's pointing you know, more backwards or out, depending 1:11:19.600 --> 1:11:22.599 on the sort of configuration of the horn. So talking 1:11:22.600 --> 1:11:24.519 about talking about this area, they went any ram like 1:11:24.560 --> 1:11:27.680 talk about the thinking that might guide that. Yeah, I 1:11:27.680 --> 1:11:29.760 don't know all the you know, the details on up, 1:11:29.760 --> 1:11:37.280 but there's um, you know, there's there's this notion and 1:11:37.320 --> 1:11:40.639 it applies to you know, fish and wildlife and any 1:11:40.800 --> 1:11:46.760 managed species that if you are non randomly harvesting animals 1:11:46.800 --> 1:11:49.040 that you can potentially you know, he had the potential 1:11:49.080 --> 1:11:52.240 to drive sort of artificial selection, you know, against her 1:11:52.240 --> 1:11:55.360 for some natural feature, right and so, and some people 1:11:55.360 --> 1:11:58.439 think this is a laughable idea. Is really you know, 1:11:58.439 --> 1:12:01.920 there's there's certainly said. They think it's thousands of years. Well, okay, 1:12:01.920 --> 1:12:04.040 I know the fish literature a lot better. But you know, 1:12:04.400 --> 1:12:07.400 uh like size at maturity and fish, you know, a 1:12:07.400 --> 1:12:10.240 few a few generations in the lab of of artificially 1:12:10.280 --> 1:12:14.000 selecting the smallest breeders, you can drive size of maturity 1:12:14.000 --> 1:12:17.080 down and just a few generations. Yeah, I was saying, 1:12:17.200 --> 1:12:19.479 not me, I don't know if about it to have 1:12:19.479 --> 1:12:22.240 a good opinion by saying some people I'm they're talking 1:12:22.280 --> 1:12:26.000 about like do you are by by just picking big bucks? 1:12:26.360 --> 1:12:35.599 There's about white tails? Are you driving down white tail size? If? 1:12:36.600 --> 1:12:40.800 But to the extent, to the extent that it's genetic 1:12:41.439 --> 1:12:46.240 and not environment the potentials there, Yeah, but no, I 1:12:46.240 --> 1:12:48.360 think I don't think anyone. I don't think anyone argues 1:12:48.400 --> 1:12:50.680 the potential. But I think you'll say to effect, you 1:12:50.680 --> 1:12:55.519 would it would take thousands of years to affect that change. 1:12:57.000 --> 1:12:59.240 I think people are starting to realize a lot of 1:12:59.400 --> 1:13:02.160 evolution have it's a lot faster than I mean, this 1:13:02.240 --> 1:13:04.840 is an instance of evolution. And I think I think 1:13:04.880 --> 1:13:07.040 that you know, in recent years, people are starting to 1:13:07.080 --> 1:13:10.519 realize that evolution happens a lot faster than potentially than 1:13:10.600 --> 1:13:14.240 what you know, like the former sort of gradualism notion 1:13:14.320 --> 1:13:17.120 of evolution is. You know, that's what I crack up 1:13:17.120 --> 1:13:19.639 when people like are like, I don't believe in evolution, 1:13:19.800 --> 1:13:22.200 Like so you don't believe that if I went killed 1:13:22.240 --> 1:13:24.840 every adult that was over five feet, then you would 1:13:24.840 --> 1:13:28.920 see a movement towards shorter adults over time. Or you 1:13:28.920 --> 1:13:30.880 don't believe that corn us to be real small now 1:13:30.880 --> 1:13:35.000 it's big, or how about how about how about pesticide 1:13:35.080 --> 1:13:44.760 resistant uh insects? And yeah, yeah, so anyway, there's this 1:13:44.920 --> 1:13:49.200 notion that by you know, having a full curl regulation 1:13:49.280 --> 1:13:53.880 and effect, that you're selectively cropping off the rams with 1:13:53.920 --> 1:13:57.880 the greatest horn growth potential or those that have a 1:13:57.920 --> 1:14:03.440 horn configuration that tends to grow and a full curl. Um. 1:14:03.479 --> 1:14:05.400 You know, there are plenty of mature rams running around. 1:14:05.400 --> 1:14:08.840 They just and their horn grows in such a way 1:14:08.840 --> 1:14:12.439 that it doesn't curl into a curl. And I think 1:14:12.479 --> 1:14:16.719 the first three doll rams I don't know. The first 1:14:16.760 --> 1:14:19.160 of like the first gang of doll rams that you, 1:14:19.360 --> 1:14:22.360 me and Matt killed were all eight, none were full curl. 1:14:22.680 --> 1:14:26.080 That Matt's had a full curl. Matt's had one full 1:14:26.080 --> 1:14:31.360 curl horn that broke when it fell. Um My very 1:14:31.360 --> 1:14:33.519 first ram had one full curl horn. But you, yeah, 1:14:33.520 --> 1:14:36.160 you and I when we shot two rams together, they 1:14:36.200 --> 1:14:40.599 were both eight or older, and neither of them were 1:14:40.680 --> 1:14:42.760 full curl. And then really the guy that checked mine 1:14:42.760 --> 1:14:46.360 in wrote it down as full curl. Interesting, obviously not 1:14:46.439 --> 1:14:48.720 full curl, but obviously eight years. Yeah, there's there's some 1:14:48.760 --> 1:14:51.320 interesting judgment costs we made there to excessing people down 1:14:51.360 --> 1:14:54.519 at department fishing game haggling over age and full curl 1:14:54.640 --> 1:14:57.000 or not. And you know when you skip those horns 1:14:57.120 --> 1:15:00.400 checked and they're they're having a very hard time coming 1:15:00.439 --> 1:15:05.360 to consensus on some of those attributes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 1:15:05.680 --> 1:15:07.400 So the Onny way, there's this notion that yeah, if 1:15:07.439 --> 1:15:09.720 you are, if you're you know, if you're cropping off 1:15:09.720 --> 1:15:12.280 all the horns that are growing to a full curl, 1:15:12.320 --> 1:15:15.320 that you're started driving the genetic genetics away from that 1:15:15.320 --> 1:15:18.960 type of horn configuration. And so, um, my understanding is 1:15:19.040 --> 1:15:22.519 that that that helps you catch any RAM. Uh set 1:15:22.600 --> 1:15:24.800 up was and and sort of an experiment to see, 1:15:24.880 --> 1:15:27.200 you know what the fact that's having and so giving 1:15:27.240 --> 1:15:28.720 a second, are you doing okay over there? It's like 1:15:28.720 --> 1:15:34.200 you're generating so much noise over there? You're right? Do 1:15:34.400 --> 1:15:40.880 you do unplug? You go ahead? So when they yeah, 1:15:40.880 --> 1:15:43.040 so when they when they went to that lottery, when 1:15:43.040 --> 1:15:45.439 they went to that lottery system, they just said, okay, 1:15:45.520 --> 1:15:50.160 let's just have a lottery and because let's let's try 1:15:50.160 --> 1:15:55.240 in any RAM scenario to alleviate that selective pressure um 1:15:55.280 --> 1:16:00.880 against a full curl or horn configuration. But then the 1:16:00.880 --> 1:16:02.880 harvest rate is gonna go way up, so we're gonna 1:16:02.880 --> 1:16:05.600 need to limit the amount of participation. And so they 1:16:05.800 --> 1:16:09.920 put a lottery on. Yeah. Yeah, And so I haven't 1:16:09.920 --> 1:16:11.800 been following that. I don't know what the you know, 1:16:11.840 --> 1:16:14.320 they're just certainly people at Laska Department Efficient Games looking 1:16:15.920 --> 1:16:19.040 talk very intelligently about that. Here, here's the here's the 1:16:19.120 --> 1:16:24.000 case example from the frank Church area and Idaho with bighorns. 1:16:24.640 --> 1:16:28.960 And again, like a regulation change will happen, and oftentimes 1:16:28.960 --> 1:16:32.360 they don't, like a state department will change a regulation 1:16:32.439 --> 1:16:34.799 and they don't say, here's why we're changing the regulation. 1:16:35.680 --> 1:16:39.120 Just the regulation changes and people are left to speculate 1:16:39.320 --> 1:16:42.599 about why it was the regulation. That's that's poor outreach there, 1:16:42.680 --> 1:16:44.519 I know, but it happens in like the case example 1:16:44.520 --> 1:16:46.680 of the guy a guy. We often get questions about this, 1:16:47.280 --> 1:16:52.920 why is it illegal for a nonresident to hunt in 1:16:52.920 --> 1:16:57.240 a wilderness area in Wyoming for big game without a guide? Okay, 1:16:57.560 --> 1:16:59.280 so if you're a nonresident Whoming you want to hunt 1:16:59.280 --> 1:17:01.320 a wilderness there, you have to hire a guide. I 1:17:01.400 --> 1:17:04.120 recently was asking some people that work at the state, 1:17:06.400 --> 1:17:09.080 like state employees, for like, hey, how did this rule 1:17:09.160 --> 1:17:13.040 come to be and what are sort of the decisions 1:17:13.040 --> 1:17:15.040 that were made? And they were demonstrating to me that 1:17:15.680 --> 1:17:17.439 or the stuff I looked at. And also what everybody 1:17:17.439 --> 1:17:21.639 says is it's like it's a service. The guiding industry 1:17:21.760 --> 1:17:25.720 has been driven by the guiding industry, right I could 1:17:25.720 --> 1:17:28.160 I could see jumping to that conclusion. Yeah, but there's 1:17:28.200 --> 1:17:31.280 no articulation of it anywhere as do they talk about safety. 1:17:33.000 --> 1:17:37.320 Same here. Yeah, that's that's I think that's the sort 1:17:37.320 --> 1:17:41.120 of the stated rationale for the guide requirement for grizzlies 1:17:41.240 --> 1:17:43.639 mountain goat mountain chief. But it has me to protect 1:17:43.640 --> 1:17:46.360 the industry, which is fine. But here's the thing with 1:17:46.400 --> 1:17:50.880 the Frank Church is they felt that they had a 1:17:50.880 --> 1:17:53.160 three quarters There was a big horn unit and it 1:17:53.200 --> 1:17:55.360 had to be a three quarter curl. So on a 1:17:55.360 --> 1:17:57.680 big horn, a way to tell three quarter curls you 1:17:57.800 --> 1:18:00.800 gotta take from the base of the horn and draw 1:18:00.800 --> 1:18:03.519 a line through the corner of the eye and if 1:18:03.560 --> 1:18:07.639 that line hits horn, that's a three quarter curl ram. 1:18:07.680 --> 1:18:12.000 They felt and is very very rugged, very very remote area, 1:18:12.479 --> 1:18:14.840 that there were too many cases of people in the 1:18:14.880 --> 1:18:21.000 back country making a bad call in killing rams that 1:18:21.160 --> 1:18:24.960 weren't legal and then not reporting it. This is what 1:18:25.040 --> 1:18:27.960 I heard, And so they just went to any ram 1:18:28.000 --> 1:18:32.000 thing to try to cut back on unreported mortality of 1:18:32.120 --> 1:18:35.400 rams because it was areas just too hard to police, 1:18:35.400 --> 1:18:39.200 too hard to monitor. Yeah, so that they presumably had 1:18:39.280 --> 1:18:42.519 looked restrict the number of permits at the point, but 1:18:42.600 --> 1:18:44.840 it was that's what I heard, like a problem, and 1:18:44.880 --> 1:18:46.599 I heard dad from a guy who guided the area 1:18:46.760 --> 1:18:48.559 that was his that was his understanding of what was 1:18:48.560 --> 1:18:51.160 going on. They fell as putting people in too much 1:18:51.160 --> 1:18:58.519 of a bind. So we walk up this thing and 1:18:58.600 --> 1:19:03.320 find this ram would be good on obviously not illegal 1:19:03.400 --> 1:19:09.960 ramp um does that morning we run it spent the 1:19:10.000 --> 1:19:14.919 night ran into a grizzly blonde, blond blonde, grizzly blonde, 1:19:15.040 --> 1:19:20.320 long hair, gorgeous, we're so long and shaggy. She looked 1:19:20.800 --> 1:19:23.519 almost What did I say? I thought it looked like 1:19:23.600 --> 1:19:26.600 something dead when it was sleeping. Yeah, I thought it 1:19:26.600 --> 1:19:28.800 looked like a old rotten because it was hagley like 1:19:29.080 --> 1:19:35.679 it was yack like, yeah, a blow in the wind. Yeah, 1:19:35.880 --> 1:19:38.719 it looked like I think our initial I guess was 1:19:38.560 --> 1:19:40.760 it was a dead caribou laying there inside of the hill. 1:19:40.880 --> 1:19:43.360 When Yanni told me he sees something, but it was 1:19:43.360 --> 1:19:45.200 funny because he's like, I see something like two little 1:19:45.200 --> 1:19:48.040 black things bobbing around by it. And I looked through 1:19:48.040 --> 1:19:52.439 my binocular is and I think I'm looking at something 1:19:52.800 --> 1:19:55.720 dead and mostly decayed, just because the way that was 1:19:55.720 --> 1:19:59.040 so disheveled. And he says, yeah, there's two black things 1:19:59.040 --> 1:20:00.880 moving around on it. And in my head, I'm like, well, 1:20:00.880 --> 1:20:08.160 it's gotta be those ravens feeding on some long dead 1:20:08.200 --> 1:20:10.040 caribou carcass. And it's kind of like looks like a 1:20:10.040 --> 1:20:12.400 bunch of hair scattered around, when in fact, it's a 1:20:12.520 --> 1:20:19.040 blond sow with two little very dark almost black cubs, 1:20:20.479 --> 1:20:25.840 which I hadn't seen that color difference. Yeah, striking. That's 1:20:25.840 --> 1:20:29.080 the thing people saying judging grizzlies like an interior ones 1:20:29.960 --> 1:20:36.600 is uh, Oftentimes the bigger males are darker brown and 1:20:36.640 --> 1:20:39.000 the female. That's not true in all cases. It's like 1:20:39.040 --> 1:20:41.640 it's like with with grizzlies, everything's like tends to right, 1:20:41.760 --> 1:20:45.080 tends to this, tends to that that. Oftentimes you find 1:20:45.600 --> 1:20:49.439 that the big males are darker brown, and oftentimes you 1:20:49.520 --> 1:20:54.240 find those real blond ones or females when you get 1:20:54.240 --> 1:21:01.000 the maturity. But she was blond, beautiful. Man just chow 1:21:01.240 --> 1:21:05.280 and the blueberries party mode. They eat them like they're 1:21:05.320 --> 1:21:08.680 pissed at them. They eat them like they're going to 1:21:08.720 --> 1:21:13.519 get away, like their exacting revenge on blueberries. Man and 1:21:13.720 --> 1:21:16.879 wash over. Quite a while feeding around, cubs were sleeping. 1:21:17.280 --> 1:21:19.519 Cubs kept taking naps, and they just take naps wherever 1:21:19.560 --> 1:21:22.080 they see fit Man, And then she took a nap 1:21:23.000 --> 1:21:26.840 short power naps. Yeah, they take power naps just wherever. Man. 1:21:27.680 --> 1:21:29.000 But I think they were napping too because it was 1:21:29.040 --> 1:21:32.479 like a little break in the weather and they were 1:21:32.520 --> 1:21:35.200 just like curl up. They'd kind of snuggle, they'd like spoon, 1:21:36.680 --> 1:21:39.120 and that's hour. She would take a little nap now 1:21:39.120 --> 1:21:41.080 and then just lay down wherever she happened to be, 1:21:41.160 --> 1:21:44.760 just lay down midstride and kind of doze. Me and 1:21:44.800 --> 1:21:47.679 Chris were saying it was cool observing that scene because 1:21:47.720 --> 1:21:50.160 that was the first grizz we've seen since a fog nack. 1:21:50.920 --> 1:21:55.360 Just kind of a nice, peaceful cleansing. Man. Yeah, I 1:21:55.360 --> 1:22:00.240 can appreciate grizzlies again and not be terrified. Yeah. Good. 1:22:00.240 --> 1:22:01.559 It's like when I get all mad at my kids 1:22:01.560 --> 1:22:03.000 and I'm yelling at them all the time, and I'll 1:22:03.000 --> 1:22:05.439 feel bad later and I'll go and give them big snug. Yeah, 1:22:05.640 --> 1:22:09.240 I got snug by that. It was a cute scene. Man, 1:22:09.320 --> 1:22:12.759 those clubs napping and that sud is kind of cruising around. 1:22:13.320 --> 1:22:16.720 It's hard to picture that. They just have such a ferocity. Yeah, 1:22:17.160 --> 1:22:19.160 you can picture, dude, if you walked up, If she's 1:22:19.160 --> 1:22:22.080 sleeping and those cubs are sleeping fifty yards away and 1:22:22.080 --> 1:22:23.880 you watched up, you walked up and grab one of 1:22:23.920 --> 1:22:26.400 those things, you can imagine her response. Man. Well, if 1:22:26.400 --> 1:22:30.080 we were on that side of the drainage, the wind, 1:22:30.120 --> 1:22:31.880 the wind was blowing in such a way that we 1:22:31.920 --> 1:22:34.800 could have popped up on him unexpectedly. I feel like 1:22:35.240 --> 1:22:38.360 they have been a good move man in this area 1:22:38.479 --> 1:22:40.800 is just pock marked with where they're digging up ground 1:22:40.840 --> 1:22:42.960 squirrels ship when they put a lot of energy and 1:22:43.080 --> 1:22:44.840 oh my god, dude, some of the ground that they 1:22:44.960 --> 1:22:47.720 dug up was insane. The sun little that they're just like, 1:22:48.080 --> 1:22:50.000 they'll dig holes big enough for you to climb into. 1:22:50.360 --> 1:22:52.720 The most surprising thing was the altitude that they were 1:22:52.720 --> 1:22:54.439 digging those things up at you. You know, you're like 1:22:54.439 --> 1:22:57.040 six thousand feet and they're still throwing boulders and it's 1:22:57.080 --> 1:22:59.519 just little snacks like they're up there for like it's 1:22:59.520 --> 1:23:01.599 like they got other for no really, no other reason 1:23:02.840 --> 1:23:05.240 to dig up marmots and dig up ground squirrels and 1:23:05.280 --> 1:23:07.680 dig holes like like I said, like foxholes. You can 1:23:07.720 --> 1:23:09.920 climb down into him. Can you imagine being that ground 1:23:09.920 --> 1:23:15.600 squirrel and I got nothing, nothing, dude. If you could imagine, 1:23:15.720 --> 1:23:21.400 if like a Peter person, right, you could witness that 1:23:21.600 --> 1:23:25.599 spectacle that they'd be so anti grizzly because the horror 1:23:25.680 --> 1:23:29.240 of that little ground squirrel family. Oh yeah, tucked away, 1:23:30.720 --> 1:23:32.680 keep his corner and they know that that thing just 1:23:32.720 --> 1:23:35.280 out there like throwing out head sized boulders and then 1:23:35.360 --> 1:23:38.519 eats them all alive. Yeah, that little squirrel family is 1:23:38.560 --> 1:23:42.719 just living out a children's story at children's fairy tale, 1:23:42.800 --> 1:23:45.479 laying in a little beds and the next thing, you know, 1:23:45.600 --> 1:23:51.120 it's just the roof of the house comes off them, 1:23:51.520 --> 1:23:53.680 swallows them all. And we watched them eat them. They 1:23:53.680 --> 1:23:57.519 eat them alive. They just grab them and throw their 1:23:57.520 --> 1:24:01.320 head back. Yeah, and that thing alive down the belly 1:24:01.439 --> 1:24:09.040 be like digested juices. Yeah, it's like Jonah the whale man. 1:24:11.400 --> 1:24:14.400 You know what Jonah Whale is there? Yeah. I don't 1:24:14.400 --> 1:24:17.000 know if you had Bible learning now, I was raised Catholic. 1:24:17.160 --> 1:24:23.160 Good for you. Um, yeah, she was eating berries though. 1:24:24.640 --> 1:24:30.000 We slept for the night tented out, and the next 1:24:30.080 --> 1:24:35.679 day I look up above camp and lo and behold 1:24:36.479 --> 1:24:41.120 a bunch of rams, but no freaking legal rams. Was 1:24:41.320 --> 1:24:44.160 four or three? That was two, three, four or five 1:24:44.240 --> 1:24:49.680 and six number one being the one youngster, the one 1:24:49.760 --> 1:24:53.280 youngster that was living on the u Lamb patch. Yeah, 1:24:53.680 --> 1:24:59.920 did he really liked And then five separate two four, 1:25:00.000 --> 1:25:02.479 and they later picked up a fifth. Yeah, two three, two, three, 1:25:02.520 --> 1:25:06.080 four and five rams number two, three, four five came 1:25:06.200 --> 1:25:11.680 rolling up above camp and we gave those good scrutinizing, 1:25:11.600 --> 1:25:15.040 and uh, they were kind of like really spread out 1:25:15.040 --> 1:25:18.479 in the age thing, you know, a few years old 1:25:18.560 --> 1:25:22.679 up to probably like seven enough for his ram looking 1:25:22.680 --> 1:25:25.240 from down below seems legal, but he's just like not 1:25:26.320 --> 1:25:28.080 you could. And I was like to give everything the 1:25:28.120 --> 1:25:30.559 band for the doubt, Like one time we talked about 1:25:30.520 --> 1:25:32.439 this for one time, me and you were hunt Mulder 1:25:32.520 --> 1:25:34.559 and here comes military that just gotten hit by a car. 1:25:35.280 --> 1:25:39.280 So as antler is, one of his antlers has busted off, 1:25:39.280 --> 1:25:42.760 but flopping down by his face. And when I first 1:25:42.800 --> 1:25:44.400 saw that, first thing out of my mouth was a 1:25:44.439 --> 1:25:47.840 buck of a lifetime because I give everything avant for 1:25:47.880 --> 1:25:50.080 the doubt. And I saw those times and I thought 1:25:50.120 --> 1:25:52.360 this must be a gigantic bus just and I realized, no, 1:25:52.439 --> 1:25:56.439 he's just a forky with I just saw. I saw 1:25:56.520 --> 1:25:59.240 he even had times by his jaw. You know. It's 1:26:00.160 --> 1:26:01.720 then I was like, oh, just a little buck to 1:26:01.760 --> 1:26:04.920 get hit by a car. Do doll sheep ever growing 1:26:04.960 --> 1:26:07.840 a non typical way or is it like you see 1:26:07.880 --> 1:26:13.240 something totally crazy, like just like a straight horn. Yeah, 1:26:13.600 --> 1:26:17.320 just some weird I've never seen anything besides the fact 1:26:17.320 --> 1:26:20.519 that they snap them off and braid them off they 1:26:20.600 --> 1:26:25.360 like or some of them. Some of them kind of 1:26:25.400 --> 1:26:27.599 spiral out from the head and some of them, know, 1:26:27.960 --> 1:26:30.880 some swing more into the jaws. There was some asymmetry 1:26:31.040 --> 1:26:35.120 between left and rock. They seem to be even though 1:26:35.240 --> 1:26:39.519 scene one that was very like funky deformed didn't even 1:26:39.600 --> 1:26:41.840 have like a curl at all. It just kind of 1:26:42.000 --> 1:26:44.479 really came out and just down. It's just like this big. 1:26:44.560 --> 1:26:47.639 It could have been damaged at some point. Yeah, it's 1:26:47.720 --> 1:26:51.440 a big mass of horn, and so a photo of it. Yeah, 1:26:51.800 --> 1:26:54.160 would that be sought after, just like you know shirt 1:26:54.240 --> 1:27:01.400 non typical sought after by me? The other side's legal. Yeah, 1:27:01.439 --> 1:27:05.280 the uh I killed the second one I got um 1:27:05.640 --> 1:27:08.640 was broomed on one side and full spiral on the 1:27:08.640 --> 1:27:13.840 other side. Room because it broke. It's a braided I 1:27:13.920 --> 1:27:17.160 was not snapped. I got another one that snapped, but 1:27:17.200 --> 1:27:19.200 it didn't snap all the way. But you can grab 1:27:19.280 --> 1:27:21.479 the end. You can grab the end and wiggle it. 1:27:21.840 --> 1:27:24.120 But it wasn't an abrasion. I bess they probably always 1:27:24.160 --> 1:27:26.799 maybe not always, but I think they may might snap 1:27:26.840 --> 1:27:29.240 them and intebrate them. But it seems that they don't 1:27:29.280 --> 1:27:31.599 like is they don't like it in some rams don't 1:27:31.640 --> 1:27:33.600 like it in their peripheral vision, it seems, and so 1:27:33.680 --> 1:27:39.120 they'll work on them. I've even seen big horns scraping there. 1:27:39.560 --> 1:27:42.280 I've seen big horns on you know, the wild Horse 1:27:42.320 --> 1:27:45.080 Island with a new world record one came from. I've 1:27:45.120 --> 1:27:49.479 seen big horns out there, just scraping, scraping his horn. 1:27:50.040 --> 1:27:51.880 I also watched one but a tree I was, I 1:27:51.960 --> 1:27:54.360 was out there. I can't remember. I think I think 1:27:54.400 --> 1:27:56.760 he if I remember right, he rammed a tree. He 1:27:56.840 --> 1:28:00.920 rammed the Ponderosa pine seventy two times in a row. Yeah, 1:28:01.400 --> 1:28:03.320 bad day. I was just counting how many times he's 1:28:03.360 --> 1:28:09.120 doing it. I even went down and examined that pine 1:28:09.120 --> 1:28:11.920 when he got done and plucks some hairs out of it. Nice. Yeah, 1:28:11.920 --> 1:28:13.519 he just kept he just was ramming the tree. It 1:28:13.560 --> 1:28:16.960 was like he's like in an insane asylum. Man, he 1:28:17.120 --> 1:28:19.800 stuck out. He's training. Is that what it is? It's 1:28:19.800 --> 1:28:22.479 just practiced for Then one time we were floating, we 1:28:22.520 --> 1:28:24.719 were floating the river hunting muled heer and I kept 1:28:24.720 --> 1:28:27.519 thinking someone shooting twenty two. I'm not, but you kept 1:28:27.640 --> 1:28:29.920 kept being like why what are they shooting at twenty 1:28:29.960 --> 1:28:33.560 two off up there? And then she realizes big horns. 1:28:34.240 --> 1:28:37.080 It was late October big or maybe early November and 1:28:37.080 --> 1:28:38.920 big they were in rout and the big horns are 1:28:38.960 --> 1:28:41.559 up there cracking heads. It sounds like we're going going off. 1:28:43.360 --> 1:28:45.439 That's story like a story always telling. My brother drew 1:28:45.439 --> 1:28:47.960 a big horn tag and we kept going down in 1:28:48.040 --> 1:28:50.599 this area to try to find sheep and couldn't find sheep. 1:28:50.680 --> 1:28:52.880 And I got to be like dismissive where I look 1:28:52.920 --> 1:28:54.759 up on this hill and I'm like, oh, it's Mulder 1:28:55.640 --> 1:28:57.599 way off on this mountain side. I'm like, oh, it's 1:28:57.600 --> 1:28:59.599 cut Mulder up there. And all of a sudden, two 1:28:59.600 --> 1:29:01.639 of these mules their stand up on their back feet, 1:29:02.120 --> 1:29:04.519 talk their front arms up, run at each other and 1:29:04.600 --> 1:29:08.880 smack heads. I'm like, oh my god, I want to 1:29:08.960 --> 1:29:11.080 see that bad. Yeah they do. They tuck their arms 1:29:11.120 --> 1:29:16.880 and remember that Mountain Dew commercial where there's a there's 1:29:16.920 --> 1:29:19.040 a dude who takes was it searched maybe it was 1:29:19.120 --> 1:29:22.160 surge and he takes a big goal of this soda 1:29:22.240 --> 1:29:27.519 pop and it Now you guys, uh, you like to dip, 1:29:27.840 --> 1:29:31.280 you like to spit juicepit in du bottles. No, I 1:29:31.320 --> 1:29:34.200 don't drink do because most guys dip. I noticed they 1:29:34.280 --> 1:29:36.439 really have a tendency to want to spit into a due. 1:29:36.439 --> 1:29:38.680 B just came up when we were talking about the 1:29:39.040 --> 1:29:41.760 redneck call guys they have to drink them mountain do 1:29:41.840 --> 1:29:45.160 and then they do the redneck and the rednecks come 1:29:45.280 --> 1:29:51.400 running in their direction. Uh where were we on sheet seeing? Yeah, 1:29:51.479 --> 1:29:53.519 so the band of rams man and I look at like, 1:29:53.560 --> 1:29:55.120 I said, I give everything the benefit of the doubt, 1:29:55.160 --> 1:29:58.240 you know, like I wanted to be legal, but it's 1:29:58.280 --> 1:30:00.559 just not legal. We got pretty close to him too. 1:30:00.800 --> 1:30:02.760 Later we got yeah, no, there's no doubt in my 1:30:02.840 --> 1:30:05.200 mind that we like. It's not one of those things 1:30:05.240 --> 1:30:08.320 where I'm like, man, I feel haunted. I remember hunt 1:30:08.400 --> 1:30:10.280 hunting dolls, sheep, but d any One time we'rehump with 1:30:10.320 --> 1:30:12.040 another buddy of ours and he put a stock on 1:30:12.120 --> 1:30:13.840 a ram, like we determined a ram, or like that 1:30:14.000 --> 1:30:16.240 ram is legal. He put a stock on the ram, 1:30:16.360 --> 1:30:19.320 got within rifle range, and comes back down the mountain. 1:30:19.360 --> 1:30:22.160 There's no shot. He's like, I don't think it's legal. Man. 1:30:22.479 --> 1:30:25.439 He had to leave, he had to take off, and 1:30:25.520 --> 1:30:27.760 we went and refound the thing all over again. We 1:30:27.840 --> 1:30:30.439 did a bunch of hunting first, couldn't couldn't find a 1:30:30.479 --> 1:30:32.320 bigger one, and like, oh, let's go back. And when 1:30:32.520 --> 1:30:35.120 we found that one and shot in those full ram 1:30:36.479 --> 1:30:39.439 so you found it, second guessed it, didn't think it 1:30:39.479 --> 1:30:42.439 was legal, and then someone else second guessed it. We 1:30:42.520 --> 1:30:46.600 were pretty convinced. It was harder than I expected. To 1:30:46.680 --> 1:30:49.280 be fair, that was a small ram. Yes, it's very 1:30:49.320 --> 1:30:52.360 small horned ram. Yeah, but he had a full crow horn. Yeah. 1:30:52.880 --> 1:30:55.439 So if you if you put one down, that is 1:30:55.520 --> 1:30:58.120 kind of right on the line of like legal, and 1:30:58.200 --> 1:31:00.479 then you go do you get it checked? Like what's 1:31:00.479 --> 1:31:03.560 your content? What are the consequences away from you? And 1:31:04.520 --> 1:31:08.760 I'd probably find you. Yeah. The last ram, the last ram, 1:31:09.439 --> 1:31:11.240 so I've only got like I've gotten too, So I 1:31:11.320 --> 1:31:13.760 say the last one, I mean the second doll ram 1:31:13.840 --> 1:31:16.720 I got was out of a special management area that 1:31:16.800 --> 1:31:19.519 has really big rams, and so there I was that 1:31:19.560 --> 1:31:22.559 had the luxury of a ram that was like well 1:31:22.640 --> 1:31:24.640 and excessive folk. I mean just you look at them, 1:31:24.680 --> 1:31:28.040 He's like that's some bitch way full curl right. Um, 1:31:29.040 --> 1:31:30.640 So then you all cocky when you go down to 1:31:30.720 --> 1:31:34.880 fishing game. So go down there and not having any 1:31:34.960 --> 1:31:37.240 apprehension about what you know, not having like even in 1:31:37.320 --> 1:31:39.040 the back of your head. There's no like, man, what 1:31:39.120 --> 1:31:42.479 are they gonna what if they write? And we get 1:31:42.520 --> 1:31:46.040 there and there's a dude checking a ram and they 1:31:46.240 --> 1:31:49.519 hold his ram and I come in the door. I'm 1:31:49.520 --> 1:31:52.720 thinking that think is that full curl? They hold his ram. 1:31:54.080 --> 1:31:59.240 A trooper comes in with another ram that he had confiscated. 1:31:59.760 --> 1:32:01.640 We're He goes to check a guy at an airstrip 1:32:02.360 --> 1:32:04.240 and he's like, do you get one? Yeah, I got one. 1:32:04.320 --> 1:32:05.799 Let me see the head. Oh, it's in the bottom 1:32:05.800 --> 1:32:09.280 of my pack, at which point he gets really interested 1:32:09.320 --> 1:32:12.600 to see the ramps. Not even kind of like this 1:32:12.760 --> 1:32:18.840 one's like, no argument you made for it. Finished check 1:32:18.880 --> 1:32:21.519 in my sheep. It's mandatory checker. You have to bring 1:32:21.560 --> 1:32:23.439 the head down to have a check. Finished check in 1:32:23.520 --> 1:32:26.080 my sheep. Here comes another couple of guys. They pull 1:32:26.120 --> 1:32:29.200 out a ram. I'm like, the way is that ram legal? 1:32:30.800 --> 1:32:33.280 And then the guys were already kind of getting like, 1:32:34.479 --> 1:32:35.960 you know, I didn't see where that one led, but 1:32:36.040 --> 1:32:38.680 they were already sort of in the seconds we had 1:32:38.760 --> 1:32:43.760 to look at it. They had you tell it wasn't 1:32:43.760 --> 1:32:47.160 gonna go well. For that guy. So it happens more 1:32:47.240 --> 1:32:52.000 often than you think. There was. I saw counting mine. 1:32:52.080 --> 1:32:55.840 There were four and three of them. Three of them 1:32:56.240 --> 1:32:59.240 one was not even under consideration. Two of them were 1:32:59.320 --> 1:33:01.080 like any I looked and I'm like, there's no way, 1:33:01.560 --> 1:33:04.200 And the and the guy in the biologists were definitely 1:33:04.560 --> 1:33:08.280 sort of on one head said we're holding it, one 1:33:08.360 --> 1:33:10.840 had already been confiscated, and one it wasn't going well 1:33:10.920 --> 1:33:14.000 for the guy. When they take that plug, that's that's 1:33:14.040 --> 1:33:17.840 the definitive like age thing, right, No, that plug is 1:33:17.920 --> 1:33:23.240 to market for uh, legal trafficking. When they plug it, 1:33:23.360 --> 1:33:25.280 they drill a hole and drive a plug into a 1:33:25.400 --> 1:33:29.439 metal what is that thing? A shell casing almost that 1:33:29.520 --> 1:33:33.120 they drow a hole and pounded in there. Yeah, just screen. 1:33:33.160 --> 1:33:34.280 You always got to look for it when you go 1:33:34.400 --> 1:33:35.639 to find it. Yeah, they put in a spot where 1:33:35.640 --> 1:33:37.160 it's kind of hard to see, but it's got a 1:33:37.240 --> 1:33:39.040 number on it. Yeah. Think he's just proving that you, 1:33:39.040 --> 1:33:41.320 you know, had your rams and field and if you 1:33:41.439 --> 1:33:45.000 have you know, a fresh ram head in your possession 1:33:45.000 --> 1:33:47.240 about that plug in it, then that's trouble for you. 1:33:47.800 --> 1:33:50.519 So if they if they confiscated, what happens to the meat, 1:33:50.640 --> 1:33:54.200 they auction the they auction the heads off, and then 1:33:54.280 --> 1:33:55.840 the meat does go to waster. What do they do 1:33:55.920 --> 1:34:00.920 with it? I don't know what they do with that food? Banquit? 1:34:02.240 --> 1:34:05.120 Do you get any like hunting right restrictions if you 1:34:05.600 --> 1:34:08.519 shoot an illegal ram? Like? Do they like? Yeah, there's 1:34:08.560 --> 1:34:12.200 a system, there's a there's a system in place that's 1:34:13.120 --> 1:34:17.240 people should know about. Um, there's a cooperative of states 1:34:17.320 --> 1:34:20.200 and it grows all the time where when you lose 1:34:20.280 --> 1:34:23.559 your hunting rights in one state. Yeah, for a while, 1:34:23.600 --> 1:34:26.280 it's like seven states in the West had this cooperative 1:34:26.280 --> 1:34:28.320 where if you lose your hunting rights in one state, 1:34:28.520 --> 1:34:30.240 you lose your hunting rights in the whole. And I 1:34:30.280 --> 1:34:32.720 think that that cooperative, you lose your rights in all 1:34:33.360 --> 1:34:35.840 states that are involved in the cooperative. And Yanni can 1:34:35.840 --> 1:34:37.080 maybe check us. I feel like it's up to like 1:34:37.160 --> 1:34:40.160 forty two states a lot, man, And I feel like 1:34:40.200 --> 1:34:42.320 I think I remember seeing that Texas isn't one of them. 1:34:42.920 --> 1:34:44.840 Texas isn't one of them. I think I've ever seen that. 1:34:44.920 --> 1:34:46.360 I could be wrong. We should check to make sure 1:34:46.360 --> 1:34:53.400 you might checking out? Yess that's interesting? So then all right, um, yeah, 1:34:53.600 --> 1:34:57.439 I think so, yes, But when you hear someone losing 1:34:57.439 --> 1:35:01.240 their hunting rights, it's agregious stuff. Oh so you could 1:35:01.320 --> 1:35:03.000 make a slip up and shoot like a seven year 1:35:03.000 --> 1:35:05.599 old ram, even if you think that you're not doing 1:35:05.640 --> 1:35:10.240 anything wrong. Bring it in and bring it in, right, 1:35:10.760 --> 1:35:12.640 You guys that lose their hunt rights, it's usually like 1:35:12.880 --> 1:35:17.840 like jit poaching, serial poachers, or you just did something, 1:35:18.400 --> 1:35:20.320 not like you made a mistake, but you did something 1:35:20.400 --> 1:35:23.479 like So I do remember a guy. I do remember 1:35:23.520 --> 1:35:28.720 a guy killing a grizzly. Did he mistook for a 1:35:28.800 --> 1:35:30.920 black beverybody? I think there was an attempt to cover up. 1:35:31.960 --> 1:35:35.719 I remember he had a ten dollar fine, seven years 1:35:35.920 --> 1:35:42.840 revocation of his hunting privileges. He was from Pennsylvania but 1:35:43.000 --> 1:35:45.639 lost his hunting privileges in a western state. And I remember, 1:35:45.680 --> 1:35:48.840 if I remember it was right when when Pennsylvania joined 1:35:48.880 --> 1:35:52.560 that that cooperative and I remember thinking, like, man, he 1:35:52.640 --> 1:35:55.160 came hunt at home? Noow man. But I think in 1:35:55.240 --> 1:35:59.000 that case too, I think that it involved some deception. Yeah. 1:35:59.320 --> 1:36:01.519 So is it fair to say that if you call yourself, 1:36:01.720 --> 1:36:05.280 you make a mistake, call in, report yourself, they're going 1:36:05.320 --> 1:36:08.559 to be more lenient on you. Or is that totally Yeah, 1:36:08.760 --> 1:36:12.160 like more lenient being. Yeah, just in terms like like 1:36:12.400 --> 1:36:14.960 in a relative sense, I would say, like yes, because 1:36:14.960 --> 1:36:17.760 there still has to be some punitive action, but you know, 1:36:17.960 --> 1:36:22.479 confiscation for sure, you might not get hit with finer. Yeah, 1:36:22.560 --> 1:36:24.720 you know, I can't really speak. I'm sure there's plenty 1:36:24.760 --> 1:36:28.120 of case scenarios look at. But I've had the conversation 1:36:28.200 --> 1:36:30.400 with quite a number of people, and everyone has always 1:36:30.439 --> 1:36:34.479 expressed to me that, um that that when you self report, 1:36:35.320 --> 1:36:37.519 it's a lot better for you, right the one you don't. 1:36:37.760 --> 1:36:39.920 And so like this dude that tried to hide the ram, 1:36:40.320 --> 1:36:42.120 and we actually got to talk to that trooper for 1:36:42.120 --> 1:36:44.120 a while. The guy that tried to hide the ram 1:36:44.240 --> 1:36:46.920 from the dude was seriously annoyed. Oh yeah, did you 1:36:47.000 --> 1:36:49.280 had to play that little game? I bet and he 1:36:49.560 --> 1:36:51.160 and we even I think I even asked him at 1:36:51.200 --> 1:36:53.040 the time. I'm almost certain I aske him at the time, 1:36:53.280 --> 1:36:56.200 Um if that like colors his impression of the case. 1:36:56.280 --> 1:36:57.960 And he was like absolutely, Man, when I got to 1:36:58.040 --> 1:37:00.680 like force you to let me look in backpack is 1:37:00.680 --> 1:37:03.120 a lot different than you let me look in your backpack. Right, 1:37:04.920 --> 1:37:07.400 there was a poacher at our around where we have 1:37:07.439 --> 1:37:12.240 a family cabinet, Seelye Swan night sniping big neely Bucks. 1:37:12.600 --> 1:37:15.479 I think I heard about this guy. He's from Pennsylvania. Okay, 1:37:15.560 --> 1:37:17.360 I didn't hear about this, but he got jail time. 1:37:17.880 --> 1:37:21.000 I mean it was bad enough, it was crazy. What 1:37:21.160 --> 1:37:25.800 states are trying to do now is since they're trying 1:37:25.840 --> 1:37:28.400 to do now, a thing that states do, and I 1:37:28.439 --> 1:37:32.120 think it's becoming a more popular idea, is trying to 1:37:32.200 --> 1:37:35.880 apply the right economic value to the resource that you've taken. 1:37:36.479 --> 1:37:39.639 Because it used to be that that you could shoot 1:37:39.680 --> 1:37:42.560 like a trophy bull elk, and it wasn't as you 1:37:42.600 --> 1:37:45.479 could poach a trophy bull elk, and the punishment would 1:37:45.520 --> 1:37:48.040 be worse if you stole someone's lawnmower out of their garage. 1:37:49.000 --> 1:37:52.680 Like so you can steal three lawnmower and it's you know, 1:37:52.800 --> 1:37:55.120 like this misdemeanor of fence that could come with potential 1:37:55.160 --> 1:37:59.599 a jail time. Right, But you can shoot a trophy 1:37:59.640 --> 1:38:02.599 bullell and we're just treating it like it's nothing. We're 1:38:02.640 --> 1:38:05.160 treating like it's just like essentially valueless entity. And you 1:38:05.200 --> 1:38:06.760 get like there's some of little slap on the wrist. 1:38:07.280 --> 1:38:11.679 So now when you're like there are several states possibly 1:38:11.720 --> 1:38:14.639 more that have gone in and said, like they apply 1:38:14.800 --> 1:38:17.559 the Boone and Crockett scoring system or take another scoring 1:38:17.640 --> 1:38:20.519 system and apply it to poached animals. And if you 1:38:20.680 --> 1:38:23.360 turn out to be like and it's trying to differentiate 1:38:23.439 --> 1:38:27.320 like your pot hunter from me from like someone who's 1:38:27.320 --> 1:38:30.000 like really going out to try to like harvest high 1:38:30.080 --> 1:38:32.719 end trophy animals and then coming in with a fine 1:38:32.840 --> 1:38:35.280 system if you're shooting like really valuable animals, like what 1:38:35.400 --> 1:38:38.280 does that animals value to the hunting community and what 1:38:38.400 --> 1:38:40.960 exactly have you stolen? You might have stolen something that's 1:38:40.960 --> 1:38:45.080 worth well that dude, that it should be treated as such, 1:38:45.280 --> 1:38:48.200 rather than you shot a cottontail rabbit out of season 1:38:48.240 --> 1:38:52.080 because it was getting into you know, yeah, just like that. 1:38:52.200 --> 1:38:55.240 It's not all the same thing that that guy in 1:38:55.360 --> 1:38:58.719 cuy Swan I was told or read that he poached 1:38:58.840 --> 1:39:02.880 enough big bucks that have did that entire regions genetics 1:39:04.560 --> 1:39:07.400 not genetics. But you know, they weren't breathing like he was. 1:39:08.000 --> 1:39:09.519 He was putting it. Put a hit on the who 1:39:09.560 --> 1:39:12.160 put a hit on the hunt? Yeah? Yeah, there was 1:39:12.160 --> 1:39:15.640 an interesting situation you're for Campbell in Kentucky where these 1:39:15.680 --> 1:39:19.040 guys were sneaking into the closed off areas on the base, 1:39:19.120 --> 1:39:21.880 like the impact areas, So like you know on any 1:39:21.960 --> 1:39:25.120 big military installation where you've got ranges and you know, 1:39:25.360 --> 1:39:28.559 aircraft ranges and things like that, we're shooting live ammunition. Basically, 1:39:28.640 --> 1:39:31.960 the backstops of those areas are just codd and like 1:39:32.520 --> 1:39:34.760 unexploded ordinance, and you just don't want to go back there. 1:39:34.800 --> 1:39:37.680 They're just completely closed off areas. So it ends up 1:39:37.720 --> 1:39:40.719 happening is he's you know, deer will never get hunted, 1:39:40.960 --> 1:39:42.960 and they live in those areas and they're licking like 1:39:43.040 --> 1:39:47.360 the sulfur off the rounds and stuff. They get huge, yeah, giant, 1:39:47.400 --> 1:39:50.080 giant racks with these guys who weren't in the military. 1:39:50.080 --> 1:39:51.880 They're just living outside the base. They were able to 1:39:52.000 --> 1:39:54.000 drive in through like one of the back gates, and 1:39:54.040 --> 1:39:57.200 they were sneaking into those areas that are full of 1:39:57.320 --> 1:40:01.840 like unexploded bombs and poaching year year round, and they 1:40:01.920 --> 1:40:04.679 got busted. They had like, you know, forty heads sitting 1:40:04.680 --> 1:40:07.400 in a barn somewhere in Kentucky with really interesting that 1:40:07.400 --> 1:40:11.240 they had like like parachutes um like flares, you know 1:40:11.280 --> 1:40:13.479 what I mean, Like like stuck in their antlers, stuck 1:40:13.520 --> 1:40:15.439 in there stuck in their antlers and stuff. There's you know, 1:40:15.520 --> 1:40:18.479 photographs in the newspaper. They're just these really unique heads, 1:40:18.520 --> 1:40:21.280 bomb range bucks, all kinds of stuff all over their heads. Yeah, 1:40:21.280 --> 1:40:22.680 and they got them all. I want to say, they 1:40:22.760 --> 1:40:26.720 got the seven year band. There's there's a I was 1:40:26.760 --> 1:40:29.639 talking to do a concert or like a game warden 1:40:29.800 --> 1:40:32.920 one time who was given a presentation and it was 1:40:32.960 --> 1:40:35.960 about his idea that the same he had this idea 1:40:36.040 --> 1:40:39.760 that was like there there's like cereal well put us 1:40:39.760 --> 1:40:43.000 a different way. He was adopting something that's well known 1:40:43.040 --> 1:40:48.639 in criminal criminology and applying it to poaching. What should 1:40:48.640 --> 1:40:51.320 be that you have serial criminals. So like like most 1:40:51.400 --> 1:40:54.600 law enforcement agencies, the FBI, they're they're focusing on like 1:40:54.720 --> 1:40:58.000 serial criminals, thinking that you could reduce by removing ten 1:40:58.080 --> 1:41:00.320 percent of the criminals, you could affect ninety scent of 1:41:00.360 --> 1:41:02.400 the crime. So that's why you put so much emphasis 1:41:02.439 --> 1:41:05.320 into like organized crime rings, because it winds up being 1:41:05.360 --> 1:41:09.200 there's like a ring of individuals and they're involved in extoration, prostitution, 1:41:09.320 --> 1:41:12.840 drug trafficking, auto theft, right, and if you can find 1:41:12.960 --> 1:41:16.599 these these core groups and take those groups down, you're 1:41:16.640 --> 1:41:18.599 doing more to eliminate theft than you are by going 1:41:18.600 --> 1:41:21.639 after all the petty individuals who are doing like onesies, twosies. 1:41:22.280 --> 1:41:24.519 And this guy had come to this opinion. He had 1:41:24.520 --> 1:41:27.080 all this data to back it up, the nine the 1:41:27.200 --> 1:41:30.519 ten percent of your poachers are doing your poaching, and 1:41:30.800 --> 1:41:33.240 and and he got into he was into this idea 1:41:33.280 --> 1:41:35.640 of like who are these individuals, what are their motivations, 1:41:35.680 --> 1:41:39.160 and what are their markers? And he was given presentations 1:41:39.200 --> 1:41:41.640 the other state agencies to try to describe what he 1:41:41.640 --> 1:41:46.080 would call super poachers, like what is their motivations? And 1:41:46.280 --> 1:41:49.000 um a thing he found again and again, it's like 1:41:50.080 --> 1:41:55.200 that they the garages and the sheds that they don't 1:41:55.240 --> 1:42:00.400 tell anyone about. They're just full of trophy animals, and 1:42:00.520 --> 1:42:03.599 they're motivated by the they're they're One of their main 1:42:03.720 --> 1:42:07.479 motivations is they have some criminal background. And one of 1:42:07.520 --> 1:42:09.719 their main motivations is a funk you to the state, 1:42:10.960 --> 1:42:15.240 like Freeman type, don't you you're not gonna be telling me? 1:42:15.960 --> 1:42:17.880 And they usually come out of some kind of that 1:42:17.960 --> 1:42:21.680 they usually have in their past, some kind of situation, 1:42:21.800 --> 1:42:25.639 they felt wronged, they've been in trouble with the cops, 1:42:26.720 --> 1:42:31.280 anti social and it's just like a point of pride 1:42:31.360 --> 1:42:35.880 for them to stick to. The man, I got all 1:42:35.920 --> 1:42:37.800 this stuff, don't you tell me what I'm gonna do. 1:42:38.560 --> 1:42:42.640 I hate those type of people. Yeah, the ground and 1:42:42.640 --> 1:42:45.719 he had a lot of pictures the garages and storage 1:42:45.800 --> 1:42:52.200 sheds packed with antlers, like a weird form of little 1:42:52.240 --> 1:42:55.760 trophy room, the secret trophy room. The only I know 1:42:55.840 --> 1:42:58.439 about me and my brother or whatever know about you know. 1:43:00.240 --> 1:43:04.640 Quick update on the Interstate Wildlife Violator Compact. That what 1:43:04.800 --> 1:43:08.880 it's called, and now there are forty eight members, including sex. 1:43:09.640 --> 1:43:14.840 The two that are not um Hawaii and Massachusetts. Massachusetts 1:43:14.880 --> 1:43:18.519 is working to join right now. It doesn't say anything 1:43:18.560 --> 1:43:21.600 about what Hawaii's got going on. What are you hunting Massachusetts? 1:43:22.040 --> 1:43:25.040 White tails? Yeah, I mean there's a lot of stuff 1:43:25.040 --> 1:43:27.680 you hunt there for for big game. I don't know 1:43:27.680 --> 1:43:29.800 if Massachusetts. I won't be surprised here that they do 1:43:29.960 --> 1:43:35.320 not have a bear season. Definitely white tails and then 1:43:35.360 --> 1:43:43.479 all manner of small game foul upland waterfowl. Um, where 1:43:43.520 --> 1:43:46.880 were we on this whole thing? Oh? Why you can't 1:43:46.880 --> 1:43:50.439 go killing on the rams that aren't legal? And I'm 1:43:50.479 --> 1:43:56.000 telling you, man, um, it's hard to judge them. It's 1:43:56.040 --> 1:43:57.920 hard and when I say judge, you might be like, oh, 1:43:58.520 --> 1:44:00.559 you know, if you talking about judging the yielder, there's 1:44:00.560 --> 1:44:02.720 no legal ramification. It's just you want to find a 1:44:02.760 --> 1:44:05.080 big one. But with a ram it's like a tremendous 1:44:05.080 --> 1:44:07.880 amount of pressure to get to make the right call. 1:44:08.479 --> 1:44:10.240 And the handful of times I've been in a situation 1:44:10.320 --> 1:44:12.960 where you're like shooting, you're walking over there, it's extremely 1:44:13.040 --> 1:44:16.400 stressful because you're doubting your own decision making, even on 1:44:16.520 --> 1:44:18.680 the case of one where was like so clearly mass like, 1:44:18.800 --> 1:44:21.880 it's nerve racking. It's not fun. Oh there's nerve racking. 1:44:22.640 --> 1:44:24.880 The minutes that passed between you touch the trigger and 1:44:24.880 --> 1:44:29.640 you're getting over there is a not fun bunch of minutes. Man. Uh. 1:44:30.160 --> 1:44:32.640 And then we like that drainage up to the glaciers 1:44:33.600 --> 1:44:36.599 at the head of it. It's like a beautiful start 1:44:36.720 --> 1:44:39.200 kind of situation when you get up there where the 1:44:39.280 --> 1:44:42.880 ice is ripping the mountainto shreds, and there's spots you 1:44:42.920 --> 1:44:44.960 can stand where it's just like you can just stop 1:44:45.040 --> 1:44:50.600 and listen and just rock raining down everywhere around you. 1:44:51.760 --> 1:44:54.320 Big rock, small rock. It's just it's it's constant though 1:44:54.400 --> 1:44:56.360 the sound of it like the mountain getting ripped apart 1:44:56.439 --> 1:45:00.040 by the ice. It was. I had a few on 1:45:00.160 --> 1:45:02.800 a doom up that first drainage. It was like a 1:45:02.880 --> 1:45:05.639 death zone. Man. There wasn't anything living up there. Yeah, 1:45:06.040 --> 1:45:08.360 it was weird when you get the head of it. 1:45:08.680 --> 1:45:10.840 He came back and I saw green for the first time. 1:45:10.880 --> 1:45:14.160 I was like, Okay, it makes sense now, I feel better. 1:45:15.040 --> 1:45:17.200 But that was weird. We found a drop moose antler, 1:45:18.120 --> 1:45:20.920 not up in the glaciers, but way higher than any willow, 1:45:21.000 --> 1:45:25.280 you know. And he had somehow wand up there or 1:45:25.280 --> 1:45:26.880 it fell out of or it fell out that duds 1:45:26.880 --> 1:45:28.720 who hunts shed out of his airplane. I think he 1:45:28.800 --> 1:45:32.120 might have dropped. Bear in mind that that was that 1:45:32.479 --> 1:45:36.600 he shed that antler and what December January, that was 1:45:36.640 --> 1:45:40.000 crazy about it. A little later, sometimes February, our pilot 1:45:40.080 --> 1:45:44.280 was saying that the moves hang out out there in 1:45:44.320 --> 1:45:47.200 the flask right, and they hang out there until the 1:45:47.280 --> 1:45:49.719 snows get too deep and the wind piles up the snow, 1:45:49.960 --> 1:45:52.519 and then they'll actually move into that high country to 1:45:52.640 --> 1:45:56.479 find the wind swept places. Yeah, he was so high 1:45:56.520 --> 1:45:59.200 there wasn't any brows up there though, right, Yeah, he 1:45:59.280 --> 1:46:01.920 might not know because he's just digging to the snow. 1:46:01.960 --> 1:46:04.280 I don't know he was. He was a half mile 1:46:04.320 --> 1:46:09.080 above any willow. That was interesting. But yeah, you get 1:46:09.160 --> 1:46:10.920 up around the glaciers and it's like it's like the 1:46:11.000 --> 1:46:14.960 earth at work. Man. What was that Leopold quote you 1:46:15.040 --> 1:46:18.599 guys mentioned that was cool? You kind of Yanni should 1:46:18.600 --> 1:46:21.960 look at it. I want to hear that. Eldo Leopold's son, 1:46:22.280 --> 1:46:24.800 the author of Sand County Almanac, had a son who 1:46:24.840 --> 1:46:28.960 became a hydrologist. Who's got to be still alive. I 1:46:29.000 --> 1:46:34.760 don't know. I think it's his son, Luna Leopold. I'm 1:46:34.760 --> 1:46:36.040 gonna tell you what I think it is, and then 1:46:36.120 --> 1:46:39.760 Yanni's gonna tell us what it is. Rivers are the 1:46:39.880 --> 1:46:47.040 gutters through which run the ruins of continents. What's your 1:46:47.120 --> 1:46:51.320 guests that's pretty pretty spot honest fear as I know. Yeah, yeh, 1:46:51.479 --> 1:46:53.519 he's gonna tell us all that. So I think he 1:46:53.640 --> 1:46:59.000 was a he was a fluvial geo morphologist, So fluvial 1:46:59.040 --> 1:47:04.760 geo morphologist. He studied how rivers, you know, create landscapes, 1:47:05.120 --> 1:47:07.719 maintain landscapes. You have a good time up there, obviously 1:47:08.880 --> 1:47:11.000 you can't, Yeah, you can't have a fluvial g and 1:47:11.040 --> 1:47:14.360 more foulges that spends time around rivers. Yeah, what's interesting 1:47:14.360 --> 1:47:18.240 about the glaciers is, uh, it's like huge tall packs 1:47:18.320 --> 1:47:20.360 of ice, but they're filled all the way through rocks. 1:47:22.200 --> 1:47:24.840 It was like a giant rocks grow string to that one. 1:47:25.360 --> 1:47:28.560 All the sediment and the different freezing levels where you 1:47:28.640 --> 1:47:31.200 guys kind of stop. Yeah, I know you can see 1:47:31.240 --> 1:47:35.840 the accumulations and the melt accumulations. You're not find any annie. 1:47:37.120 --> 1:47:40.000 Rivers are the dre the gutters down which flow the 1:47:40.160 --> 1:47:47.040 ruins of continents. Okay, compared again, I said, rivers are 1:47:47.160 --> 1:47:51.600 the gutters through which flow the ruins of continents. But 1:47:51.680 --> 1:47:55.839 it's actually down, so you just missed. You just swapped 1:47:55.920 --> 1:48:01.040 through for down. It's pretty good, not bad. So from there, 1:48:01.200 --> 1:48:04.880 so at that point we've seen uh bandy using lambs, 1:48:05.479 --> 1:48:15.719 sal grizz, two cubs, six rams, yeah, some number rams. 1:48:16.479 --> 1:48:18.600 Then we running around to explore the other fourk of 1:48:18.680 --> 1:48:21.519 that thing and then drive eventually made our way day 1:48:21.640 --> 1:48:24.960 or two later, made our way up into saw those 1:48:25.040 --> 1:48:28.160 rams again. Considerable weather delay. Oh yeah, that's right. We 1:48:28.280 --> 1:48:31.360 got up, I went into another valley and saw the 1:48:31.400 --> 1:48:33.960 same batch rams and the rams kind of drift around 1:48:33.960 --> 1:48:35.560 in weird ways. Man, they're sort of like in the 1:48:35.640 --> 1:48:37.720 same area, but they're using different stuff. And this time 1:48:37.760 --> 1:48:40.080 they were down to the bottom of a big hanging valley. 1:48:40.160 --> 1:48:41.920 Got a real good look at them, but we saw 1:48:41.960 --> 1:48:45.439 the skyline. Yeah, they're hanging out on the ridge, but 1:48:45.640 --> 1:48:47.519 at the same the same ridge we initially saw them on. 1:48:47.640 --> 1:48:49.960 But then eventually they just popped over the other side. 1:48:50.120 --> 1:48:52.080 So you know, they're only you know, maybe what a 1:48:52.120 --> 1:48:54.439 quarter half mile from where we had seen them, but 1:48:54.479 --> 1:48:56.400 they're just in a different valley now, dropped down to 1:48:56.439 --> 1:48:58.880 a different place to feed. They like to go up 1:48:58.920 --> 1:49:00.960 to lay down and like to lay down on I 1:49:01.000 --> 1:49:02.479 don't know, man, it's hard to describe what it like 1:49:02.560 --> 1:49:06.599 to lay down. They love ridge tops, ridge tops, even 1:49:06.680 --> 1:49:12.080 to send finger ridges, rock piles on finger ridges, or 1:49:12.240 --> 1:49:16.680 just like the highest like flat spot, you know, the one, 1:49:16.800 --> 1:49:18.360 you know, I think a spot you'd say, like it's 1:49:18.400 --> 1:49:21.040 like two that's kind of the perfect spot where you 1:49:21.080 --> 1:49:24.759 have two rivers come together and like the ridge rises 1:49:24.840 --> 1:49:27.080 up out of that thing. It gets like real high 1:49:27.120 --> 1:49:28.559 and craggy, and he sits out there and he can 1:49:28.640 --> 1:49:31.120 look down and he can kind of monitor what's going on. 1:49:32.360 --> 1:49:34.880 And the two drainages blown. Yeah, I spent a lot 1:49:34.920 --> 1:49:38.080 of time looking down valley and laying a down valley 1:49:38.120 --> 1:49:40.760 direction because they know that nothing's coming from above. The 1:49:40.840 --> 1:49:43.920 primary predator. Though for the lambs, one of the primary 1:49:43.960 --> 1:49:46.480 predators does come from above, because one of the primary 1:49:46.840 --> 1:49:52.280 causes of land mortality is golden eagles. Eagles. Yeah, we 1:49:52.360 --> 1:49:56.120 saw fair fair number golden eagles all and they're always 1:49:56.240 --> 1:49:59.200 go soaring around those ridge tops. You know. Golden eagles 1:49:59.240 --> 1:50:02.200 grab the baby or knock them off and pick the 1:50:02.240 --> 1:50:05.000 carcasses up her feet on the car because after they 1:50:05.080 --> 1:50:07.160 knock them off and make them fall out of their death. 1:50:07.880 --> 1:50:09.800 I had a pilot one time told me that she 1:50:09.960 --> 1:50:16.599 saw a golden eagle carrying on the wing carrying a lamb, 1:50:17.040 --> 1:50:21.280 a doll ram. Golden eagles are hard on mountain goats. Lamb, 1:50:21.600 --> 1:50:27.040 lamb lamb. There's a a bill just wrote a there's 1:50:27.080 --> 1:50:29.479 a bill just wrote like Natural History of Alaska, and 1:50:29.560 --> 1:50:32.960 he had an eyewitness account of a lynx killing a 1:50:33.040 --> 1:50:37.800 doll ram. Oh wow. He eye witness account from another 1:50:37.880 --> 1:50:40.479 biologists of a lynx that ran a doll ram down 1:50:40.520 --> 1:50:44.360 a gully, jumped on its back, bit the back of 1:50:44.479 --> 1:50:49.320 its head and a single linx killing a ramn mean 1:50:49.439 --> 1:50:56.840 links and then wolverines kill them obviously, wolves kill them. Chris, Yeah, 1:50:57.000 --> 1:51:00.880 they kill him. Black beaters, you know black, I'm sure, dude, 1:51:00.920 --> 1:51:03.440 But they don't make the list as much as wolverines. 1:51:04.320 --> 1:51:07.960 I think the top are wolverines and brown bears from 1:51:08.040 --> 1:51:10.880 one area. Tony Rust talks about it in his books 1:51:10.920 --> 1:51:16.200 about hunting Dollar Sheet that they're pretty weak animals. Like 1:51:16.600 --> 1:51:19.800 you know, he's talking about it from like a projectile standpoint. 1:51:20.000 --> 1:51:22.760 You know, arrows hitting them in funny places, bolts hitting 1:51:22.800 --> 1:51:24.920 them in funny places. But it's not like an elk 1:51:25.720 --> 1:51:27.960 that soaks up the lead and then like two days 1:51:28.040 --> 1:51:31.320 later you're still tracking it. You know, three ridges five 1:51:31.400 --> 1:51:35.160 miles away. It's like a ram. Once he takes a hits, 1:51:35.680 --> 1:51:39.400 he's not going far. He's gonna lay down. Not tough, 1:51:40.360 --> 1:51:44.280 not tough in that regard. So you know, maybe a 1:51:44.360 --> 1:51:46.240 bite to the back of the head from the lynx, 1:51:46.880 --> 1:51:48.680 it just slowly starts to take the blood out of 1:51:48.720 --> 1:51:51.639 him and it weakens him enough. Yeah, I should say, 1:51:51.640 --> 1:51:52.840 I kept saying back in the head of the neck, 1:51:53.000 --> 1:51:56.639 but him on the neck killed him. Links We saw 1:51:56.800 --> 1:52:00.479 links print ye saw links tracks, but they're snowsh your 1:52:00.479 --> 1:52:05.680 hair specialist, man Grouse snows your hairs arm again, that's 1:52:05.680 --> 1:52:08.320 what they specialize in. Surprising to see you know that 1:52:08.400 --> 1:52:09.960 he would do that. Man, He's got a square meal 1:52:10.040 --> 1:52:13.439 laid out ahead of him after doing that. He's got 1:52:13.600 --> 1:52:15.800 protected though. He's like to dude with a nice car 1:52:15.920 --> 1:52:21.720 and a shitty neighborhood, just worrying about his Yeah, man, 1:52:21.840 --> 1:52:24.400 you dis imagined how stressed out he is. He's like something, 1:52:24.680 --> 1:52:27.400 someone's gonna take this from him. What am I gonna 1:52:27.439 --> 1:52:32.800 do now? Yeah, hopefully he did it in the Winner. 1:52:32.880 --> 1:52:34.439 One of the main things they're gonna take it from 1:52:34.479 --> 1:52:37.920 him aren't around when all the bears are underground. And 1:52:37.960 --> 1:52:40.120 then we worked out in the area that Dirt Dirt 1:52:40.200 --> 1:52:44.519 dubbed God's Penthouse as beautiful other head of the valley 1:52:44.600 --> 1:52:47.760 like nothing I've ever seen. Dude. At first when he 1:52:47.800 --> 1:52:50.000 said that, I thought you were being profane because I 1:52:50.040 --> 1:52:53.760 associate penthouse with the magazine, But then I remember, did 1:52:53.840 --> 1:52:56.439 its um actually like a type of room, like a 1:52:56.600 --> 1:53:05.880 nice room and hotel? Yeah, real, myth that's right. Yeah. 1:53:07.080 --> 1:53:09.519 And the color we're talking about, the colors like of 1:53:09.640 --> 1:53:13.680 the tundra that's like it's crazy, just variations like God, 1:53:13.720 --> 1:53:17.320 it was beautiful man, huge spires covered in snow. Yeah, 1:53:17.600 --> 1:53:20.720 and just huge, like you think it's like, wow, this 1:53:20.880 --> 1:53:25.400 area is huge, but then beyond it there's so you're 1:53:25.439 --> 1:53:28.840 trying to understand the infinity of space and you're thinking like, well, 1:53:28.880 --> 1:53:32.640 some wight there's a brick wall, but then beyond that 1:53:32.720 --> 1:53:35.800 there's something. Yeah, I mean if there wasn't. Right when 1:53:35.800 --> 1:53:37.800 you're there, like you sort of go like woh, you know, 1:53:37.840 --> 1:53:40.600 look all the space. You go like, but then but 1:53:40.720 --> 1:53:43.920 then up there it's like tens of miles. Well, Chris 1:53:44.040 --> 1:53:46.400 had an interest you could go without running into anything. Yeah, 1:53:47.120 --> 1:53:49.080 that point about if you could, if you could lay 1:53:49.160 --> 1:53:56.240 down a city block in that landscape perspective, Yeah, you 1:53:56.320 --> 1:53:58.960 just see so much country. When you're up high in there, 1:53:59.040 --> 1:54:01.360 you just see so much it's like hard to take 1:54:01.439 --> 1:54:03.680 in what you're really looking at. I remember taking a 1:54:03.720 --> 1:54:07.160 guy caribou hunting, and he hadn't had a lot of 1:54:07.160 --> 1:54:10.639 experience hunting like open country. Yeah, yeah, and we asked 1:54:10.680 --> 1:54:12.760 him how far Carriby Way. It was a way He 1:54:12.840 --> 1:54:19.880 expressed it in blocks, you know, three blocks. The way 1:54:19.880 --> 1:54:21.800 I've ever think of it it's gonna be a hard trip. 1:54:26.200 --> 1:54:29.320 Uh yeah, man, that place is pretty magical. But again, 1:54:29.400 --> 1:54:33.640 no rams using lambs. And by this point we're days 1:54:33.680 --> 1:54:35.800 into the trip. We've lost a lot of time to 1:54:35.880 --> 1:54:39.080 sit in and bad weather. A lot of time to 1:54:39.120 --> 1:54:41.560 sitting in bad weather because when it when it's foggy, 1:54:41.680 --> 1:54:45.040 just can't see cloudy. I kept debating, is it fog 1:54:45.200 --> 1:54:48.000 or clouds? What do you think fog is a cloud 1:54:48.040 --> 1:54:50.040 at ground level? Right? So is that what it is? 1:54:51.000 --> 1:54:52.200 That'd be a good thing for you. I need to 1:54:52.240 --> 1:54:56.320 look up. I think it's the same. I feel like 1:54:56.400 --> 1:55:01.200 it is some of the water man just yeah, because 1:55:01.440 --> 1:55:03.600 it we'd be like we're up in the clouds or 1:55:03.600 --> 1:55:05.360 will be like, oh, we're in the fog by the way, 1:55:05.480 --> 1:55:07.640 just like when when you can't see you just shut down. 1:55:07.680 --> 1:55:11.080 It's not like a lot of stuff where you just 1:55:11.120 --> 1:55:13.520 gotta plow ahead, right, or just wait for one to 1:55:13.560 --> 1:55:16.080 come along, yeah, or just wait because like a thick 1:55:16.160 --> 1:55:19.240 cloud of tiny water droplets suspended in the atmosphere at 1:55:19.440 --> 1:55:24.080 or near the Earth's surface that obscures or restricts musibility. Okay, 1:55:24.560 --> 1:55:30.000 so chemically they're the same clouds sitting in the clouds 1:55:30.120 --> 1:55:32.680 and there's nothing you can do. There's nothing you can do, 1:55:33.400 --> 1:55:35.280 at least that one when we woke up in the 1:55:35.520 --> 1:55:39.840 in God's penthouse, it was clear, blow freezing. It's just 1:55:40.080 --> 1:55:43.160 nice because you get to look at it all and go, yep, 1:55:43.360 --> 1:55:45.480 we've seen it all, We've cleared it. There are no 1:55:45.640 --> 1:55:48.040 rams in here. Let's move on. Yeah, it's nicer. You 1:55:48.080 --> 1:55:50.440 can have that thirtitude because a lot of times you're 1:55:50.440 --> 1:55:52.520 walking through and you're like, I don't know, Like we 1:55:52.560 --> 1:55:54.480 would just travel when it was when it was cloudy. 1:55:54.560 --> 1:55:56.640 We would also just travel like you're gonna walk three, 1:55:56.760 --> 1:55:59.320 four or five miles into a new zone and then 1:55:59.440 --> 1:56:01.960 sit there hoping that it clears up. Or you have 1:56:02.040 --> 1:56:03.800 to just kind of sit there as the clouds blow 1:56:03.920 --> 1:56:06.200 through and now and then you sort of keep a 1:56:06.280 --> 1:56:09.000 mental picture of a mental map of what you've seen 1:56:09.160 --> 1:56:12.360 or not as the clouds have come through, and you'd 1:56:12.360 --> 1:56:14.000 be like, man, I still haven't seen over in that area. 1:56:14.040 --> 1:56:16.200 Then also in that area clear up enough, you look, 1:56:16.240 --> 1:56:18.040 but it just doesn't feel definitive because you're trying to 1:56:18.080 --> 1:56:21.120 find a white animal in white clouds. You lose a 1:56:21.200 --> 1:56:24.600 lot of time. Danny was telling us something interesting, Uh, 1:56:25.080 --> 1:56:28.320 explain what you've read about the things that factor into 1:56:28.400 --> 1:56:32.480 hunter success rates. Oh yeah, that that The The Efficient 1:56:32.520 --> 1:56:35.320 Game has a cool publication now read before this hump. 1:56:35.360 --> 1:56:38.160 But one of the interesting things in there was that, uh, 1:56:39.560 --> 1:56:42.800 the number you know, they fly annual surveys to index 1:56:43.120 --> 1:56:46.480 cheap abundance And apparently it's not a relationship between the 1:56:46.560 --> 1:56:48.440 number of rams and a given area and hunter success 1:56:48.560 --> 1:56:50.080 that it has more to do with just the weather 1:56:50.160 --> 1:56:52.400 in any given hunting season. Like if you've got if 1:56:52.400 --> 1:56:57.520 you've got clear weather and good visibility, then you gotta 1:56:57.560 --> 1:57:01.360 hire success rates. Yeah, that's gotta be something that's that's 1:57:01.400 --> 1:57:03.760 gonna be something that's applicable in a lot of places, 1:57:03.840 --> 1:57:07.760 but probably nowhere is severe Like you think like weather, 1:57:07.960 --> 1:57:11.160 I think well not waterfowl is huge man like weather 1:57:11.240 --> 1:57:15.160 for waterfowl in some areas where you don't have local birds, right, 1:57:15.440 --> 1:57:20.160 the weather can like ruin the harvest for a particulars. Yeah, yeah, 1:57:20.480 --> 1:57:22.880 but in in sheep on it's just like so kind 1:57:22.920 --> 1:57:26.280 of it's so stark, right, either you're hunting or you're not. Yeah, 1:57:26.400 --> 1:57:28.160 it can be that you just there's nothing you can do. 1:57:28.560 --> 1:57:31.080 There's nothing you can do. Ducks would be like, man, 1:57:31.120 --> 1:57:32.760 it would have been a lot better had the weather 1:57:32.840 --> 1:57:35.400 been bad. We got a few right at daylight, but 1:57:35.440 --> 1:57:38.040 then they shut down because there's no birth moving through Becau. 1:57:38.040 --> 1:57:40.200 There's no there's no clouds, so they're flying too high 1:57:40.320 --> 1:57:42.760 or whatever it winds up being. But this is like, 1:57:43.080 --> 1:57:45.440 this is yeah, it's just like it's kind of almost 1:57:45.480 --> 1:57:48.440 like on or off to some degree being able to 1:57:48.520 --> 1:57:51.400 hunt and also up in God's penthouse there's care we 1:57:51.560 --> 1:57:55.160 run around. It's funny because like the thing about cares 1:57:55.200 --> 1:58:03.520 think about is how sort of um disorganized and like 1:58:03.840 --> 1:58:08.040 and not not deliberate. They seem like at one point 1:58:08.080 --> 1:58:10.320 in time when we were trying to go through that 1:58:10.360 --> 1:58:12.400 I remember we try to go above that canyon. Couldn't 1:58:12.400 --> 1:58:14.600 have to abort mission and go and sleep and then 1:58:14.640 --> 1:58:19.840 try another route through. Three bulls are trying to come 1:58:19.880 --> 1:58:22.400 down this hillside and they can't see us. The smells 1:58:22.400 --> 1:58:24.600 their way away. We watched three bulls and they come 1:58:24.640 --> 1:58:26.840 and they kind of get confused and they're clearly trying 1:58:26.840 --> 1:58:30.160 to go somewhere in a hurry, and then all of 1:58:30.200 --> 1:58:33.360 a sudden they're down feeding back kind of where they 1:58:33.400 --> 1:58:35.360 came from. And then they were there twenty four hours 1:58:35.440 --> 1:58:37.480 later it was like, so, what was it when you ran? 1:58:37.680 --> 1:58:39.680 They were doing the scene. They were trying to come 1:58:39.800 --> 1:58:41.760 down through the same stuff we were trying to go 1:58:41.960 --> 1:58:44.960 up through, and they realized it was too steep at 1:58:45.000 --> 1:58:47.560 the same time we realized it was too steep. They 1:58:47.640 --> 1:58:50.280 backed off and spent the night uphill, and we backed 1:58:50.320 --> 1:58:53.000 off and spent the night downhill. And then we and 1:58:53.040 --> 1:58:55.040 then we crossed paths with him again the next day 1:58:55.120 --> 1:58:57.680 on the other side of the valley where we could travel. 1:58:57.720 --> 1:58:59.320 I think they were doing the same thing we were doing. 1:58:59.760 --> 1:59:01.760 It's so because they seemed like, I want to h 1:59:01.840 --> 1:59:06.880 there's like the so the largest land mammal migration on 1:59:07.000 --> 1:59:11.520 the continent caribou. Right, they can pull off some really 1:59:11.680 --> 1:59:16.600 astounding feats of navigation. But when you're looking at a caribou, 1:59:16.720 --> 1:59:19.080 particularly up in the moullas, it's like, do you have 1:59:19.280 --> 1:59:23.360 any plan? He's just like, you know what I'm gonna do, man, 1:59:23.520 --> 1:59:25.840 he says, But I'm just gonna run, like holy hell 1:59:26.760 --> 1:59:28.760 over that way. In a while later I'll run back. 1:59:30.000 --> 1:59:34.000 It's so weird watching them. It's weird, what are they thinking? 1:59:34.120 --> 1:59:37.600 They also don't get as scared as other animals of people, 1:59:37.680 --> 1:59:40.200 like because we ran up on them just to film 1:59:40.320 --> 1:59:43.160 and just see them quite curious. And then yeah, they 1:59:43.200 --> 1:59:44.880 came towards us. And then you guys were down at 1:59:44.920 --> 1:59:46.600 camp and me and Danny were still up high and 1:59:46.600 --> 1:59:49.240 then that one bowl just like almost like it spotted 1:59:49.280 --> 1:59:51.640 you guys and then rent them running away. It started 1:59:51.720 --> 1:59:54.200 running uphill towards camp, and then it got really close 1:59:54.400 --> 1:59:56.480 through my range finder. He was twenty nine yards away 1:59:56.520 --> 1:59:57.920 when he finally changed his mind. He was like, oh, 1:59:57.960 --> 1:59:59.760 wait a minute, this isn't my crew. I can pick 1:59:59.760 --> 2:00:02.280 it out. He came to us looking at us. He's 2:00:02.320 --> 2:00:04.800 because I think that they're you know, they're so gregarious, 2:00:05.680 --> 2:00:10.080 and they're such they have such a herd mentality. Uh. 2:00:10.880 --> 2:00:13.600 I feel that when they see something that's like kind 2:00:13.600 --> 2:00:16.080 of the right shape, they think it's another cariboo that 2:00:16.320 --> 2:00:18.240 they're like, I'm not gonna go so close that it 2:00:18.320 --> 2:00:20.640 could pounce on me and kill me, but I'm gonna 2:00:20.680 --> 2:00:22.680 go under the assumption that I'm looking at a caribou. 2:00:22.920 --> 2:00:24.440 It's the only thing I think is especially like out 2:00:24.480 --> 2:00:26.440 on the Arctic, like out on the Arctic slope, where 2:00:26.480 --> 2:00:31.120 you see huge distances most caribou, that you're coming across landscape. 2:00:31.480 --> 2:00:34.440 Most carebl when they see something then in some way 2:00:34.920 --> 2:00:37.680 kind of skirt then in some way want to kind 2:00:37.720 --> 2:00:40.040 of come to you. To they're going, they have to 2:00:40.080 --> 2:00:42.160 be thinking, like I'm gonna rule out that it's a caribou. 2:00:43.520 --> 2:00:46.440 This is the first thing on their mind. And also 2:00:46.440 --> 2:00:48.880 I just think that they the way they travel move, 2:00:48.960 --> 2:00:50.640 I think a lot of them go through life having 2:00:50.680 --> 2:00:54.640 no experience with people. You know, it's not like like 2:00:54.720 --> 2:00:56.440 a like a white tail box to gets me five 2:00:56.520 --> 2:00:58.400 years old, and all that thing has done. His whole 2:00:58.520 --> 2:01:01.680 life is dodged getting killed, and he learns that when 2:01:01.680 --> 2:01:04.400 you see that shape, get out of there. You want 2:01:04.600 --> 2:01:07.600 nothing to do with it. Man, Because I've seen sixteen 2:01:07.720 --> 2:01:12.040 and my friends killed by those things. I think that 2:01:12.280 --> 2:01:15.520 I think that the caribool just for whatever it's like, 2:01:15.560 --> 2:01:19.360 it's more beneficial for them to find other caribou than 2:01:19.440 --> 2:01:21.040 it is to run the risk of that you're running 2:01:21.120 --> 2:01:22.840 up on something that's gonna do it. And I think 2:01:22.880 --> 2:01:25.120 a lot of them haven't don't have any human experience. 2:01:25.200 --> 2:01:28.440 That's pretty cool. I think in that country, I think 2:01:28.480 --> 2:01:30.920 a ten year old doll ramp has to have probably 2:01:31.000 --> 2:01:36.000 accrued some human experience. Yeah, we saw tracks in a 2:01:36.120 --> 2:01:39.800 lot of the drainages. We were in human tracks. I 2:01:39.840 --> 2:01:42.200 think that they at that age, I think that they've 2:01:43.440 --> 2:01:46.879 have had exposure or they just learned to be paranoid 2:01:46.880 --> 2:01:51.240 about anything, you know. But like caribou, it seems like 2:01:51.280 --> 2:01:53.880 there's like their success as a species has so much 2:01:53.920 --> 2:01:56.040 more to do with it's just like high fore coundity 2:01:56.120 --> 2:02:01.160 than it does anyone individual. Um becoming a real caging 2:02:01.200 --> 2:02:02.840 and wildly because I just never seen one that was 2:02:02.920 --> 2:02:07.680 like real caging Wiley, Well it hasn't hasn't worked its 2:02:07.720 --> 2:02:12.520 way into their geno, my guess. Yeah. Um, they'd like 2:02:12.600 --> 2:02:14.880 to land the snow a lot because they get away 2:02:14.880 --> 2:02:17.640 from bugs. And that's the thing I know, Like before 2:02:17.680 --> 2:02:20.840 hunting cariboo, you would see him now and then run. 2:02:20.960 --> 2:02:22.560 But you could tell because they would run when the 2:02:22.600 --> 2:02:26.040 wind died. Yeah, because when the wind died, the bugs 2:02:26.040 --> 2:02:28.960 are too bad. And so then they'd run and stop 2:02:29.120 --> 2:02:31.240 and feed and then you'd see you could watch it 2:02:31.400 --> 2:02:34.160 happened enough minutes would go by that they'd pick up 2:02:34.160 --> 2:02:36.960 their swarm of black flies and mosquitoes, and then they'd 2:02:37.080 --> 2:02:39.240 run and stopping, feed and run, and that was just 2:02:39.320 --> 2:02:42.360 there grazing off into the wind. To their grazing pattern 2:02:42.480 --> 2:02:45.640 was just like to get clear of your cloud. Eat, 2:02:46.520 --> 2:02:48.640 Get clear of your cloud and eat. And you'd sit 2:02:48.720 --> 2:02:51.120 there and I remember getting up in the good glasses 2:02:51.120 --> 2:02:54.080 about hunting cariboo out on the Arctic slope, and you 2:02:54.160 --> 2:02:58.400 get up in your good glass about nothing's happening. And 2:02:58.440 --> 2:03:00.840 then mid day of eleven o'clock start to get warm 2:03:01.000 --> 2:03:02.760 and started to get real buggy. And also in the 2:03:02.840 --> 2:03:06.080 lamb would just come alive with caribou because all those 2:03:06.120 --> 2:03:08.640 carribore just nestled into their little dips and valleys and 2:03:08.680 --> 2:03:11.160 stuff where there was good lush feed. And the mosquitoes 2:03:11.240 --> 2:03:13.200 get bad and he starts seeing rolling over all the 2:03:13.280 --> 2:03:15.080 ridge tops as they're trying to run away, and then 2:03:15.120 --> 2:03:17.120 it'd be like good, then the hunting is good because 2:03:17.120 --> 2:03:19.360 you can also see them all around. Then it cool 2:03:19.440 --> 2:03:21.880 off or to get windy, and the amount of movement 2:03:22.040 --> 2:03:30.200 activity would die down. Strange animals, man, I like to 2:03:30.280 --> 2:03:31.640 hunt them, but it's like generally if you get on 2:03:31.720 --> 2:03:35.480 when you're gonna get them. Well, the one broadsided itself 2:03:35.560 --> 2:03:38.760 at like fifty yards maybe to us, and I was like, dude, 2:03:38.800 --> 2:03:41.120 you're just what are you doing? Man, you're just asking 2:03:41.200 --> 2:03:44.280 for it. Yeah, yeah, we could have. We could have 2:03:44.320 --> 2:03:46.880 got Carriban that area. Yeah, I wouldn't want to carry 2:03:46.920 --> 2:03:51.160 one that far. That would have been along. So hunted 2:03:51.200 --> 2:03:57.360 out God's penthouse. Um, Triple Nip, went to Triple Nipple. 2:03:58.440 --> 2:04:02.560 That looks spectacular. No one shot at a tarm again 2:04:02.640 --> 2:04:05.080 on the way to triple that. Yeah, he shot out 2:04:05.120 --> 2:04:10.280 a tarm. We're getting using rat shot, Uh, which isn't 2:04:10.680 --> 2:04:13.320 You said that they're working on a better version of that. Well, 2:04:13.400 --> 2:04:16.120 I I picked up a box that was bigger. I 2:04:16.200 --> 2:04:19.400 mean that's slightly bigger. Shot was like maybe nine shot 2:04:19.840 --> 2:04:22.520 number nine. Yeah, it looks bigger. We're talking about the 2:04:22.520 --> 2:04:25.280 shotgun shells you can shoot out. So you got a 2:04:25.320 --> 2:04:27.920 bear protection you got a bear protection pistol. Just talk 2:04:28.000 --> 2:04:31.000 about what everybody what you have for bear protection? Yeah, 2:04:31.960 --> 2:04:36.680 Smith and Western mile twenty nine. I think that is. 2:04:36.880 --> 2:04:38.920 I don't know we got the exact same one. But 2:04:40.000 --> 2:04:43.000 it's the air Light p D super lightweight. It like 2:04:43.160 --> 2:04:46.280 doubles in weight when you load it with I think 2:04:46.320 --> 2:04:49.680 it more than doubles, but really rounds. It's got a 2:04:49.720 --> 2:04:54.000 bunch of aluminumous titanium. I think yeah, um, but Anyways, 2:04:54.040 --> 2:04:57.280 it's a real popular bear side arm. I think it's 2:04:57.320 --> 2:05:01.040 kind of made for that, right, what the so yeah 2:05:01.240 --> 2:05:08.080 hurts like holy hell sheet, definitely, man hurts your hand. Yeah, 2:05:08.360 --> 2:05:11.560 but they make a shotgun show or because it rat shot. Yeah, 2:05:13.080 --> 2:05:14.720 you're not getting many in there. And you know, we 2:05:14.800 --> 2:05:17.160 were talking about why why it's hard, Why it's hard, 2:05:17.240 --> 2:05:18.760 why you get to be a point blank ranging for 2:05:18.800 --> 2:05:21.560 it to work. And it's not really the velocity or 2:05:21.560 --> 2:05:24.280 anythink it's got to be the fact that there's no choke, 2:05:25.400 --> 2:05:28.680 you know, to that round. And so even at ten 2:05:28.840 --> 2:05:32.440 feet barrel, who knows what that pattern looks like. It 2:05:32.520 --> 2:05:36.120 could be spread out to five feet already. It's ridiculous 2:05:36.160 --> 2:05:38.840 that we don't know what the pattern looks like. Good, 2:05:40.800 --> 2:05:42.360 we're gonna pattern in the strip, but we didn't have 2:05:42.360 --> 2:05:44.560 a piece of paper. I kind of forgot about it. 2:05:44.560 --> 2:05:46.920 I never thought, dude, I just know that I've been. Um, 2:05:48.240 --> 2:05:50.560 I don't know, I've been. We had a lot of 2:05:50.560 --> 2:05:54.400 shot opportunities one time hunting. She remember just sometimes being like, 2:05:54.480 --> 2:05:56.560 how in the world did I not get that thing? Yeah, 2:05:56.840 --> 2:05:58.840 I think it's it comes down to luck. Eventually that 2:05:58.960 --> 2:06:01.840 patterns will lose. Remember, we're a time we were out 2:06:01.840 --> 2:06:03.320 in the weather was really nice and we weren't even 2:06:03.320 --> 2:06:05.600 setting up tents. We're just laying out into laying out 2:06:05.640 --> 2:06:07.680 in the tund or to sleep. I remember waking up 2:06:07.680 --> 2:06:09.360 in the middle of the night. Remember it was two 2:06:09.360 --> 2:06:11.080 in the morning, but it was earlier in the season. 2:06:11.120 --> 2:06:12.440 There was two in the morning. I remember waking up 2:06:12.480 --> 2:06:13.720 two in the morning. There was a group of time 2:06:13.960 --> 2:06:17.600 in amongst our sleeping bags. They're really active at night, Yeah, 2:06:17.760 --> 2:06:19.960 moving around in amongst our sleep bags. I remember shooting 2:06:19.960 --> 2:06:21.400 one of those of the rat shot but it was 2:06:21.520 --> 2:06:24.280 point blank you know. Um, But other times you shoot, 2:06:24.320 --> 2:06:26.960 you like, what in the world happened? I think the 2:06:27.040 --> 2:06:29.160 effective range of that, it's like stuff is maybe like 2:06:29.520 --> 2:06:32.760 tential feet. You're pretty pretty good. Outside of that, it's 2:06:33.200 --> 2:06:39.640 real hitting this. Uh So we tried that. That didn't work. Um. 2:06:42.040 --> 2:06:46.320 I went to a drainage called triple Nipple. Then went 2:06:46.440 --> 2:06:51.120 around finally and had all kinds of walking, all kinds 2:06:51.120 --> 2:06:54.520 of weather problems. Our eighth the day, I think it 2:06:54.600 --> 2:06:58.480 was our eighth day of hunting. Yeah, our eighth day 2:06:58.520 --> 2:07:02.960 of hunting. The weather got broke and got beautiful, and 2:07:03.000 --> 2:07:04.640 we happened to be in a valley where we could 2:07:04.680 --> 2:07:07.600 get up on a ridge. Got up on the ridge 2:07:07.640 --> 2:07:10.840 and it was like the like the perfect the world's 2:07:10.920 --> 2:07:15.120 most perfect ridge where you could look down into multiple 2:07:15.240 --> 2:07:17.600 drainages if you kept going along this ridge, and it 2:07:17.720 --> 2:07:20.480 was like just like you expected to be, and everything's great. 2:07:21.440 --> 2:07:23.840 We see a band of lambs across the valley. Far 2:07:23.880 --> 2:07:28.839 away use or bandy Use later watched the grizzly stumble 2:07:28.880 --> 2:07:30.840 into those us. I think he's just minding his own business, 2:07:30.880 --> 2:07:33.240 feeding on berries, but scared the ship out of those things. 2:07:33.760 --> 2:07:37.840 They left left the drainage in a single file running 2:07:37.920 --> 2:07:40.120 line on that thing showed up. I look out and 2:07:40.120 --> 2:07:42.440 there's just like sheep running and I'm like, if they 2:07:42.520 --> 2:07:46.840 winded us from two miles away, that's impressive, but it was. Yeah. 2:07:46.920 --> 2:07:49.280 Then I looked more carefully, and there's a grizzly feed 2:07:49.360 --> 2:07:51.400 on blueberries right in the little patch they'd been in. 2:07:51.520 --> 2:07:52.920 So I think, I don't I don't know that I 2:07:52.960 --> 2:07:54.960 didn't see what happened. Maybe he does. She's like, what 2:07:55.040 --> 2:07:56.480 the hell, I'm gonna run after him and see if 2:07:56.480 --> 2:07:59.760 anybody's injured. But I didn't see what happened. But they 2:07:59.800 --> 2:08:04.040 were not happy with that situation and totally left like gone, 2:08:04.920 --> 2:08:07.600 um and then Danny sure enough like kind of like 2:08:07.840 --> 2:08:10.760 I felt like, what happened when conditions are so good 2:08:11.000 --> 2:08:19.400 is finds a ram clearly legal? What horn was? It 2:08:20.320 --> 2:08:24.600 left a left horn that was curved in such a way. 2:08:24.640 --> 2:08:30.120 It was like that brand like no stressful, walk over there, 2:08:31.480 --> 2:08:34.360 it's still be stressful. Yeah, it was a solid ram 2:08:34.400 --> 2:08:37.000 as a really nice ram. Yeah. And he's perched up 2:08:37.640 --> 2:08:41.280 in a rock pile just like you described, man on 2:08:41.320 --> 2:08:44.840 a sub bridge that divided a valley in center ridge 2:08:44.880 --> 2:08:48.880 between at the confluence of two streams. That he's up, yeah, 2:08:49.040 --> 2:08:51.560 posted up on that center ridge line and a little 2:08:51.760 --> 2:08:53.280 and he knew what he was doing. Man, not far 2:08:53.400 --> 2:08:57.520 off the bottom, not for off the bottom, tucked into 2:08:57.640 --> 2:09:00.520 a little like it a little cubby that he had 2:09:00.560 --> 2:09:02.920 there with a bunch of rock around him, hard to 2:09:02.960 --> 2:09:04.640 spot from most of you kind of did what like 2:09:04.720 --> 2:09:06.560 white tails like to do. Man, I didn't went to 2:09:06.680 --> 2:09:09.400 most of my life not knowing this, but Ken you 2:09:09.480 --> 2:09:12.920 always talks about this too. Is like those like mature 2:09:13.080 --> 2:09:18.760 bocks like to lay with something with a backdrop. They 2:09:18.880 --> 2:09:21.200 like to lay where they can see out and where 2:09:21.280 --> 2:09:24.600 something can't see him. Good from behind to back up 2:09:24.640 --> 2:09:28.640 into something. He's like, I can see this way. Usually 2:09:28.640 --> 2:09:30.560 if it's if there's a bit too we can cover 2:09:30.600 --> 2:09:33.640 about to seventy and there's it rolls off on three 2:09:33.720 --> 2:09:36.760 sides and they're behind him. There's a log or a 2:09:36.880 --> 2:09:40.600 real thick, dense stand of You know, he wants to 2:09:40.640 --> 2:09:42.200 be obscured from where he can't he wants to be 2:09:42.280 --> 2:09:45.560 hidden from what he can't see, but then you know, 2:09:45.880 --> 2:09:48.040 within clear view site for what he can't see, and 2:09:48.120 --> 2:09:50.480 that's that dude had it dialed and that little spot 2:09:50.520 --> 2:09:56.600 he had. Man, there was very difficult approach. Yeah, I 2:09:56.720 --> 2:09:58.480 bet you a lot of rams and laid over it, 2:09:58.600 --> 2:10:01.600 laid there over a long and if you could somehow 2:10:01.720 --> 2:10:04.920 kill off every rand that lived there and then repopulate it, 2:10:05.000 --> 2:10:08.080 it would be like one's probably gonna find that. He's 2:10:08.080 --> 2:10:10.040 probably gonna be like, yeah, it's a sweet spot. Lay down, 2:10:12.160 --> 2:10:14.640 hard to approach. Yeah, So we're on the ridge. What 2:10:15.280 --> 2:10:16.880 what was I don't I don't even know what our 2:10:16.920 --> 2:10:20.720 elevation was. We topped out it, we tapped out again 2:10:20.920 --> 2:10:23.480 that like it was fifty where we topped out and 2:10:23.520 --> 2:10:24.880 I don't know. We did some up, we did some 2:10:25.000 --> 2:10:27.920 down but somewhere around that mark, and he was maybe 2:10:28.200 --> 2:10:33.880 six ft below us. Yeah, I think he's six feet 2:10:33.880 --> 2:10:36.520 below us. A couple of drainages. Yeah, he was at 2:10:36.560 --> 2:10:38.240 forty you know what he was at forty five? He 2:10:38.360 --> 2:10:43.720 was at forty feet. But just no, there's no you 2:10:43.760 --> 2:10:47.920 can't come from it was impossible to come from behind him. Um, 2:10:49.400 --> 2:10:52.320 little been no way to come from behind him. So 2:10:52.600 --> 2:11:00.560 the first thing, he's ways away and we spot him. Yeah, mile, Well, 2:11:01.080 --> 2:11:06.800 I say, a couple of thousand yards away. Um, And 2:11:07.880 --> 2:11:12.640 we realized that. So Danny watches the Ram through a 2:11:12.680 --> 2:11:14.320 spot because the first thing we gotta do is like, 2:11:14.440 --> 2:11:17.000 we gotta move somewhere, because we had gotten where we 2:11:17.080 --> 2:11:19.720 were in the fog and sat in the fogged way 2:11:19.760 --> 2:11:21.640 for the fog to clear, and all of a sudden 2:11:21.640 --> 2:11:24.600 it clears and there's a ram there. So we didn't 2:11:24.640 --> 2:11:26.880 know if we could move because we've gotten where we 2:11:26.920 --> 2:11:29.840 got obscured by fog. And then the first thing is like, 2:11:29.880 --> 2:11:31.800 well can we even move from where we are without 2:11:31.920 --> 2:11:34.280 him taking notice of us moving where we are? So 2:11:34.440 --> 2:11:37.120 Danny's watching him through the spot scope and I just 2:11:37.200 --> 2:11:40.400 start skirting down to the nearest goalie to get into 2:11:40.520 --> 2:11:44.120 to go downhill out of sight, and I moved across 2:11:44.160 --> 2:11:47.960 the hillside, not even a hundred yards, but just moved. 2:11:48.080 --> 2:11:50.080 And Danny watches him to see if he like takes 2:11:50.160 --> 2:11:52.360 interest in what I'm doing, but he doesn't take any 2:11:52.480 --> 2:11:56.680 He doesn't he can't see us. Then one time I 2:11:56.760 --> 2:11:58.840 told you to stop is because if he was pointed 2:11:58.840 --> 2:12:01.800 in our direction, like oriented toward us. And the one 2:12:01.840 --> 2:12:04.680 time I told you to stop, it's because he stopped 2:12:04.720 --> 2:12:09.800 chewing his cut. Oh ship, something's up, and he went 2:12:09.840 --> 2:12:12.000 back to human. I'm like, okay, we're good. He repacked. 2:12:14.000 --> 2:12:18.240 So we're getting this goalie that's gonna kind of like 2:12:18.400 --> 2:12:20.720 deliver us down into his zone, knowing that there's still 2:12:20.720 --> 2:12:23.160 gonna be a lot to figure out. But the cliff 2:12:23.200 --> 2:12:25.720 face he's on. You can see these bands, these discolored 2:12:25.800 --> 2:12:28.680 bands in the rock, and so you know he's like 2:12:28.840 --> 2:12:31.360 I just remember memorizing he's like blow the third band. 2:12:32.040 --> 2:12:33.880 No matter where you go, you can find that the 2:12:34.000 --> 2:12:36.080 cliff he's on and count the bands and kind of 2:12:36.160 --> 2:12:39.480 know like his little zone and start trying to go down. 2:12:39.560 --> 2:12:44.400 This goalie's very treacherous, scary in places there's a lot 2:12:44.440 --> 2:12:46.000 of player You spent a lot of time hunting dollar 2:12:46.000 --> 2:12:52.480 sheet in places where um, if he fell, Like let's say, 2:12:52.520 --> 2:12:54.080 if you like, if you're not gonna like people don't 2:12:54.080 --> 2:12:56.560 just fall all of a sudden, but like if you 2:12:56.720 --> 2:13:00.200 fell in some sort of you would die if you 2:13:00.280 --> 2:13:05.360 felt but it was not like some places you die 2:13:05.400 --> 2:13:07.080 if you fell and you could really pick youre falling. 2:13:07.440 --> 2:13:09.320 A lot of places you realize, Man, if you fell, 2:13:09.440 --> 2:13:12.720 you die, But why would I fall? It's usually that one. 2:13:14.400 --> 2:13:16.400 It's like yeah, if but like, how would you like 2:13:17.080 --> 2:13:21.360 people don't just fall over a fall over rolling down hill. 2:13:21.400 --> 2:13:24.200 It's usually like different where you sort of slip. Yeah, 2:13:24.240 --> 2:13:26.080 you kind of slip and cling down, But if you 2:13:26.200 --> 2:13:29.680 got rolling, there's no end of the role. I had 2:13:29.680 --> 2:13:30.840 it in the back of my mind when we were 2:13:30.880 --> 2:13:33.400 sidehilling and all that stuff, that like if for some 2:13:33.680 --> 2:13:36.360 reason with like the pack or whatever, if I just 2:13:36.480 --> 2:13:40.200 tipped the wrong way and you didn't fall into the hill, 2:13:40.440 --> 2:13:44.600 you fell, man, Yeah, that was the only time. Like 2:13:44.680 --> 2:13:47.280 if I slipped and like tripped and then you end 2:13:47.360 --> 2:13:50.080 up falling the bad way, that's when that's when you're 2:13:50.080 --> 2:13:51.360 not having a good time. And that's the thing I 2:13:51.480 --> 2:13:53.480 was telling myself, when you do when it does occur 2:13:53.560 --> 2:13:54.840 to you. It's hard to get out of your head. 2:13:55.280 --> 2:13:57.200 But I think, like, but all the times I spent 2:13:57.320 --> 2:14:01.120 walking where that's not true. I've never were falling that way. Yeah, 2:14:01.200 --> 2:14:06.520 I've never fallen away from the hill. It only takes once. Yeah, 2:14:06.720 --> 2:14:09.320 you fall into the hill when you fall. Yeah. Yeah. 2:14:09.360 --> 2:14:11.520 I think your natural inclination too, is to just air 2:14:11.600 --> 2:14:13.800 in that direction so much with your center of gravity 2:14:13.840 --> 2:14:16.720 that you lean into it. Yeah. I was trying to 2:14:16.800 --> 2:14:18.880 figure out also, like how I was going to self 2:14:18.960 --> 2:14:22.120 arrest with the camera if I did start sliding. I 2:14:22.200 --> 2:14:24.800 was just gonna be like, Bam, don't do that to 2:14:24.840 --> 2:14:28.240 our gear. I would expect that you set it. You'd 2:14:28.280 --> 2:14:29.920 find a place on the way down to set it 2:14:30.200 --> 2:14:32.600 above a rock or something, and then you just go 2:14:33.320 --> 2:14:37.120 unlook your cord and just go. You know, Steve and 2:14:37.160 --> 2:14:40.800 I were Steve and I were crossing. Uh uh you see, guy, 2:14:41.000 --> 2:14:44.880 was that shoot or an avalanche had ripped through right 2:14:45.200 --> 2:14:47.440 and it all went down to the bottom watching avalanches 2:14:47.480 --> 2:14:49.360 all that day was that wet snow. We're mountain go 2:14:49.520 --> 2:14:52.440 hand was wet snow laying out wet grass, and I 2:14:52.680 --> 2:14:56.000 had and Steve was below me. He had crossed that 2:14:56.480 --> 2:15:00.560 snowy shoot and headed down and I was above him crossing, 2:15:00.720 --> 2:15:02.640 and I slipped and I was going down, but I 2:15:02.720 --> 2:15:06.640 had ice axe and it was fumbling loose behind me, 2:15:06.720 --> 2:15:08.920 and I got the ice axe in both hands, and 2:15:09.000 --> 2:15:11.360 I was just starting to dig that thing into the 2:15:11.400 --> 2:15:13.360 snow like it was a pretty clear slope that I 2:15:13.440 --> 2:15:15.120 wasn't about to go off cliff or anything. I was 2:15:15.120 --> 2:15:18.120 just gonna go for a long ride. And oh there's 2:15:18.160 --> 2:15:20.120 one rollover that I couldn't see what was in there, 2:15:20.440 --> 2:15:23.240 but then it was clear again below that, and I've 2:15:23.320 --> 2:15:26.720 got my you swept by me. I kind of tried 2:15:26.760 --> 2:15:29.080 to grab Here's what happened, though. I don't know if 2:15:29.080 --> 2:15:30.320 I told you this at the time or not, but 2:15:30.600 --> 2:15:32.840 I had my ice axe in both hands. I was 2:15:33.080 --> 2:15:35.760 just starting to press that thing into the snow. And 2:15:35.840 --> 2:15:39.680 I see Steve running out and his ice axes dangled 2:15:39.720 --> 2:15:43.560 from his wrist and and all I can see is 2:15:43.600 --> 2:15:48.040 that ice acs like going into my face. I had 2:15:48.080 --> 2:15:52.760 to drop my ice axe to deflect your ice axe, 2:15:54.480 --> 2:15:57.400 and I totally lost my self arrest and rowed down 2:15:57.480 --> 2:16:00.680 for another I don't know what you got hurt. I 2:16:00.760 --> 2:16:02.560 got banged up, Yeah, I mean, it could have been 2:16:02.560 --> 2:16:04.480 a lot worse. But I got banged up. You could 2:16:04.520 --> 2:16:09.680 have died there. I'm saying, like that sort of sort 2:16:09.720 --> 2:16:11.120 of thing, if that's sort of thing where all of 2:16:11.120 --> 2:16:15.400 a sudden you're just going, yeah, yeah, that's certain that 2:16:15.560 --> 2:16:18.560 that circumstance was a relatively benign you know, it was 2:16:18.600 --> 2:16:20.600 a scary ride down the mountain. But if yeah, that 2:16:20.720 --> 2:16:23.520 was over a cliff or into a rock face, I 2:16:23.560 --> 2:16:25.360 mean it could have been. That's what I meant. I 2:16:25.400 --> 2:16:29.800 could have died like that kind of fall where you 2:16:29.880 --> 2:16:32.800 know there's an abyss below you. I had. I was 2:16:32.879 --> 2:16:38.560 totally real interesting example of risk management. And like, you know, 2:16:38.640 --> 2:16:41.080 we're all in the mountains a lot, so we can 2:16:41.120 --> 2:16:44.320 do that, like I said, safely and outside of like 2:16:44.440 --> 2:16:49.600 some freak, you know, weird fall, you're gonna be fine. 2:16:49.760 --> 2:16:52.560 And I was talking to this YOSAR guy Yosemity Search 2:16:52.600 --> 2:16:56.120 and Rescue about big wall climbing and people are always like, 2:16:56.200 --> 2:16:58.360 how can you do that? It's so dangerous and you know, 2:16:58.400 --> 2:17:00.800 how do you're not dying? He's like, well, if if 2:17:00.800 --> 2:17:05.080 you're good at do well, yeah they do, they all die. Well. 2:17:05.160 --> 2:17:06.840 His point that it was like he's like, if you're 2:17:07.120 --> 2:17:12.160 you know, you you're comfortable in your environment. Then it's 2:17:12.400 --> 2:17:14.320 it's an example of like I tell him, if you're 2:17:14.320 --> 2:17:17.320 walking down the sidewalk and you fall into traffic, you're 2:17:17.320 --> 2:17:20.000 gonna die, but you just don't fall into traffic. Yeah, 2:17:20.200 --> 2:17:22.320 that's a good point. Yeah, yeah, when you're walk into 2:17:22.360 --> 2:17:27.360 the man if I fell in, Well, dude, every time 2:17:27.360 --> 2:17:28.840 you drive on a two lane road with like a 2:17:28.920 --> 2:17:32.960 fifty five speed limit, you're passing another car within five 2:17:33.000 --> 2:17:40.200 feet of death a velocity of so you don't focus 2:17:40.280 --> 2:17:43.680 on you like, jeez, if I some in traffic to 2:17:43.720 --> 2:17:47.000 be dead, I do think that all time. Yeah, no, 2:17:47.320 --> 2:17:49.400 and then you do have this kind of thing I think. Yeah, 2:17:49.440 --> 2:17:51.520 I watched my kid, one of my kids recently sort 2:17:51.560 --> 2:17:54.000 of have the idea of the cooperation it requires for 2:17:54.080 --> 2:17:58.200 highway driving. He was like asking questions about you know 2:17:58.280 --> 2:18:00.200 that everyone needs to be on the same page out 2:18:00.280 --> 2:18:05.480 here driving, but we need to be abiding by the 2:18:05.600 --> 2:18:10.240 same rules and we all want to be alive self preservation. 2:18:10.879 --> 2:18:13.920 But all that said, man, there is like now and 2:18:14.040 --> 2:18:16.600 then there are some moments what we a boarded a hillside, 2:18:17.720 --> 2:18:23.040 we didn't do a hillside because the gap below you 2:18:23.280 --> 2:18:25.640 was there was like a high consequence. It be like 2:18:25.720 --> 2:18:28.320 you it's not like, oh, you're gonna get banged up. 2:18:28.320 --> 2:18:30.720 It's like you're done. Yeah, if you go, there's no 2:18:30.800 --> 2:18:34.400 way to stop. And then there's a then there's a canyon. 2:18:34.600 --> 2:18:37.520 And it was wet, raining and the hillside was coming 2:18:37.520 --> 2:18:45.320 apart and were and we were cold and tired and 2:18:45.400 --> 2:18:47.640 around here like these are new mountains, man, they're like 2:18:47.879 --> 2:18:53.520 very new sharp mountains and they're just falling apart. Uh. 2:18:53.560 --> 2:18:57.320 There's a term in geology, angle of repose. It's like 2:18:57.400 --> 2:19:00.960 when a hill relaxes mm hmm, like everything on the hill, 2:19:01.120 --> 2:19:03.440 like the hills achieved an angle that everything on the 2:19:03.480 --> 2:19:06.480 hill is going to kind of stay where these hills 2:19:06.480 --> 2:19:09.800 are not at their angle of repose. No, to demonstrate 2:19:09.879 --> 2:19:12.600 that farther, when we were coming back the next day 2:19:13.000 --> 2:19:17.320 on the easy slope side, looking across, you could see 2:19:17.520 --> 2:19:22.240 where boulders rocks you know, who knows what kind of size. 2:19:22.280 --> 2:19:24.680 We didn't see the boulders themselves, but where they had 2:19:24.760 --> 2:19:27.720 fallen off the mountain. They'd be on shale and screen 2:19:27.840 --> 2:19:29.760 for a while and then they would hit where there 2:19:29.840 --> 2:19:34.840 was actually grass gripping, and it looked like, um, I 2:19:34.879 --> 2:19:37.040 guess it would look like a golf DVD, you know, 2:19:37.280 --> 2:19:39.280 with someone kind of shanks and you get like a 2:19:39.480 --> 2:19:43.400 two to three term. Yeah, shank, it's not I guess 2:19:43.520 --> 2:19:45.120 it's not a what is it? When you make it? Did? 2:19:45.240 --> 2:19:48.520 What do you do wrong? You just dig into but 2:19:48.560 --> 2:19:52.400 you basically make like a big scar in the turf. 2:19:52.560 --> 2:19:56.200 It's a great example. And it was like hundreds of 2:19:56.320 --> 2:19:59.360 yards of this going down the mountains, so there's so 2:19:59.440 --> 2:20:02.520 much lo sitting speed and mass because it's just so 2:20:02.720 --> 2:20:06.199 steep and moving that is just ripping these giant divots 2:20:06.240 --> 2:20:12.560 as it's moving down the hill and skipping some big sections. Yea. Yeah. 2:20:13.600 --> 2:20:16.800 We saw several places where they were very fresh landslide, 2:20:16.879 --> 2:20:18.760 some of them big enough that there was like a 2:20:18.879 --> 2:20:23.480 whole new like side drainage that had just released and 2:20:23.840 --> 2:20:26.320 and all that settlement went down to the valley floor 2:20:26.400 --> 2:20:29.160 and all of a sudden, there's like a new valley, 2:20:29.520 --> 2:20:33.360 you know, catastrophically formed. I asked about that lake we saw. 2:20:33.520 --> 2:20:35.640 There was a lake on a very peculiar lake in 2:20:35.680 --> 2:20:37.920 a very peculiar place in the bottom of these drainages, 2:20:37.920 --> 2:20:39.800 and you can see where the whole hillside gave away, 2:20:40.520 --> 2:20:42.560 came down and formed a lake. And I was asking 2:20:42.600 --> 2:20:45.000 the pilot and he said, sometimes within the last third years. 2:20:45.120 --> 2:20:48.000 Because of the last few years. Yeah, the a landslide 2:20:48.040 --> 2:20:50.280 had just slept all the way to the valley floor 2:20:50.360 --> 2:20:53.080 and damned up the creek and uh yeah, and then 2:20:53.120 --> 2:20:55.400 there's a obviously a brand new lake there, not a 2:20:55.480 --> 2:20:58.880 lick of vegetation. Yeah, brand new. Yeah. Yeah. And the 2:20:58.959 --> 2:21:00.920 landslide was a different color. You know, all the other 2:21:01.080 --> 2:21:03.800 all the other rock around there had kind of a 2:21:03.879 --> 2:21:06.400 rusty orange color to it, and that new slide was gray. 2:21:06.560 --> 2:21:09.480 And I assume the ones that oxydizes turn to that 2:21:09.560 --> 2:21:13.800 same orange color. It gets a patina, sure, yeah, it 2:21:13.840 --> 2:21:18.400 gets pat neated. Um start on this goalie like trying 2:21:18.440 --> 2:21:20.720 to get in the ram zone not like clear kind 2:21:20.760 --> 2:21:25.760 of like obvious what the what the possible shooting perchase 2:21:25.879 --> 2:21:30.240 might be. But because you can't it the ram was 2:21:30.280 --> 2:21:32.440 too far to hit him with a range finder, and 2:21:32.560 --> 2:21:37.600 so you couldn't get you couldn't measure other points. Yeah, 2:21:37.920 --> 2:21:39.720 because if you're looking at like let's say you're sitting 2:21:39.720 --> 2:21:42.200 there and you're looking at you're looking directly at something 2:21:42.240 --> 2:21:45.160 you're trying to sneak up on, and you're like and 2:21:45.240 --> 2:21:47.560 then before you see like a little rise or like 2:21:47.600 --> 2:21:49.240 a little ridge, and you're like, man, I wonder if 2:21:49.240 --> 2:21:52.680 I could shoot from that ridge and you range find 2:21:52.720 --> 2:21:54.600 the object you're trying to get to, damn, and you're like, 2:21:54.640 --> 2:21:57.520 okay that you know it's eleven yards away. And then 2:21:57.560 --> 2:22:01.280 you range the hill or little knob or something your 2:22:01.360 --> 2:22:03.920 side of it, and you hit that thing and that 2:22:04.080 --> 2:22:06.680 thing is yards away. You're like, money, when I get 2:22:06.720 --> 2:22:09.640 to that spot, I'm in range. I can make my shop. 2:22:10.959 --> 2:22:14.240 But you couldn't hit the ram with a range finder. 2:22:14.800 --> 2:22:17.680 So there's a lot of questions about what needs to happen. 2:22:17.760 --> 2:22:19.640 And I was even saying, like this ram like I'm 2:22:19.680 --> 2:22:22.120 definitely not getting the old gut knife out and getting 2:22:22.160 --> 2:22:24.800 it ready yet. But we start down this this we 2:22:24.840 --> 2:22:30.000 start down this shoot. It's really steep and you're kind 2:22:30.000 --> 2:22:31.600 of like on this open screen side. But there's these 2:22:31.720 --> 2:22:34.080 rock bands, these a little like many Chinese walls that 2:22:35.320 --> 2:22:37.600 are crossing, and every one of those is a cliff 2:22:38.840 --> 2:22:40.680 and you kind of pick your way around one like 2:22:40.800 --> 2:22:43.240 dropping the next drainage you go down, it's another cliff, 2:22:43.240 --> 2:22:44.800 and then it's then as you go down it picks 2:22:44.840 --> 2:22:46.160 up where it's got a lot of flow. There's a 2:22:46.160 --> 2:22:48.080 lot of water coming out everywhere, and so then it's 2:22:48.080 --> 2:22:53.360 like these waterfalls. It just it just becomes like it 2:22:53.520 --> 2:22:57.400 just became hard to picture it working out. And eventually 2:22:57.440 --> 2:22:59.920 we get to one spot where you can kind of 2:23:00.000 --> 2:23:01.840 get up and look at the ram and he's over 2:23:01.959 --> 2:23:05.760 six hund yards away, bedded down. It took us almost 2:23:05.800 --> 2:23:09.400 three hours to make it to that spot. Three hours 2:23:09.480 --> 2:23:11.800 to drop down. That did not feel like that long. 2:23:12.160 --> 2:23:14.240 It felt like an eternity. I thought, man, dude, I 2:23:14.280 --> 2:23:17.520 thought it was like I couldn't believe he's still laying there. Yeah, 2:23:17.840 --> 2:23:20.320 because I was watching those using lambs and they're up 2:23:20.360 --> 2:23:22.640 feeding away. They were bedded when we found them, but 2:23:22.680 --> 2:23:24.560 eventually they're up feeding him. Like he's probably up feeding 2:23:24.600 --> 2:23:28.400 by now because they're upfeeding. But three hours later there 2:23:28.440 --> 2:23:31.280 he is still hanging out. And the wind had been 2:23:31.640 --> 2:23:34.600 like in the gully bottoms, the wind had been going 2:23:34.800 --> 2:23:39.160 up the slope, and we pop up on this little 2:23:39.240 --> 2:23:41.560 subridge where you're looking across, and we just go out there. 2:23:41.560 --> 2:23:43.440 We're up there long enough to even like really get 2:23:43.520 --> 2:23:45.800 serious about making playing that some bit stands up, which 2:23:45.840 --> 2:23:48.440 is never a good sign. Yeah, and I think he 2:23:48.520 --> 2:23:50.360 winded us at six hundred yards. He never looked in 2:23:50.440 --> 2:23:52.600 our direction. Yeah, at that moment, the wind was going. 2:23:52.680 --> 2:23:54.360 You know, we're sort of in the straight in the 2:23:54.480 --> 2:23:56.600 wind of the main valley at that point, and that 2:23:56.760 --> 2:24:00.400 was going, that's a good point the gully. Yeah, there's 2:24:00.400 --> 2:24:03.480 a little sub winds going up the gullies, but the 2:24:03.560 --> 2:24:06.959 main valley also has its wind direction. And you pop 2:24:07.080 --> 2:24:09.360 up on the ridge out of the gully and I'm like, 2:24:09.480 --> 2:24:11.120 and you hit. I feel that wind the back of 2:24:11.160 --> 2:24:13.080 my neck wheel so far away. I didn't think it mattered. 2:24:13.760 --> 2:24:15.440 And all of a sudden never looked at us. Somebody 2:24:15.480 --> 2:24:17.240 stood up and there's a look to him like they 2:24:17.280 --> 2:24:21.120 don't do anything fast. They don't do anything. Everything they 2:24:21.160 --> 2:24:24.880 do is leisurely and deliberate. And he got up, and 2:24:25.200 --> 2:24:27.760 I was like, I'm out of here, bro, I'm gonna 2:24:27.760 --> 2:24:32.600 get out here very slowly. Yeah, I'm not gonna go 2:24:32.680 --> 2:24:35.560 breaking my leg, but I'm getting out of here. And 2:24:35.680 --> 2:24:38.039 he got out of there. I don't think it helped 2:24:38.080 --> 2:24:42.080 that you had six no, six dudes who haven't showered 2:24:42.120 --> 2:24:46.560 for nine days, six hundred yards out, six hundred yards 2:24:46.680 --> 2:24:50.039 up wind. No, it's like a it's the thing. Man, 2:24:50.240 --> 2:24:53.040 it's like, uh, it's the camera crew effect, you know, 2:24:53.120 --> 2:24:54.840 and you can never measure it. I mean sometimes you 2:24:54.879 --> 2:24:57.280 can measure it, like sometimes you see something happen where 2:24:57.280 --> 2:25:00.240 you like, I'll be like, I'm facing forward and something 2:25:00.360 --> 2:25:02.400 happens where I know I wasn't the one that did it. 2:25:03.080 --> 2:25:05.320 We're all a sudden gets something, gets really interested in 2:25:05.360 --> 2:25:07.680 what's going on in our area. And now, my dude, 2:25:07.720 --> 2:25:11.400 I've been sitting here, man, I haven't moved a moving. 2:25:12.440 --> 2:25:20.080 That's when you get to, yeah, you're damn it, someone moved. Um. 2:25:21.000 --> 2:25:24.040 I feel like it's like a kid that did something wrong. 2:25:24.920 --> 2:25:26.560 That's the only thing that makes me mad. Man. And 2:25:26.600 --> 2:25:30.879 I feel like I've done like clinics and workshops and everything. 2:25:31.240 --> 2:25:34.720 I'm trying to be like, here's how to approach game. 2:25:34.840 --> 2:25:38.000 It doesn't matter because even Triple Nipple, we're growing up 2:25:38.040 --> 2:25:41.920 a little box canyon and we get through the last 2:25:42.040 --> 2:25:44.680 box canyon and all of a sudden, the whole Triple 2:25:44.760 --> 2:25:48.640 Nipple Valley and your sons of bitches run out. You guys, 2:25:48.680 --> 2:25:50.879 like run out like a couple like opening the door 2:25:51.000 --> 2:25:54.440 for a couple of dogs in the morning. You guys 2:25:54.600 --> 2:25:56.800 run out of that Box Canyon. I'm like, what are 2:25:56.800 --> 2:26:00.320 you doing? The whole point was this moment. This is 2:26:00.480 --> 2:26:05.040 why we've come up here, was to get here. And look, 2:26:06.200 --> 2:26:08.840 I think it's like what is going on? That goes 2:26:08.920 --> 2:26:11.440 back to your argument of like turning a hunter. Is 2:26:11.480 --> 2:26:13.440 it better to turn a hunter into a cameraman or 2:26:13.480 --> 2:26:16.360 a cameraman into a hunter, you know, because like in 2:26:16.480 --> 2:26:18.240 that moment, I was like, Oh, this is this cool 2:26:18.360 --> 2:26:20.120 thing and like this cool feature, and like it'll be 2:26:20.200 --> 2:26:22.240 a super cool shot if I'm out here and get 2:26:22.320 --> 2:26:25.640 the dudes coming around. But in your mind, both of 2:26:25.720 --> 2:26:29.360 your minds, you're like, this is our like secret zone 2:26:29.400 --> 2:26:32.560 to sculpe this whole thing out. Nobody moved, you know, 2:26:32.800 --> 2:26:35.440 So like the mindset is just you just gotta make 2:26:35.480 --> 2:26:37.800 that switch. Yeah, we're peering out from this little gate 2:26:37.920 --> 2:26:41.000 where we're hidden and tucked away, and it's like if 2:26:41.040 --> 2:26:43.200 there's something here at this point, it would not know 2:26:43.400 --> 2:26:46.560 that we're here. Yeah. Meanwhile, I'm thinking, like, oh, that's 2:26:46.560 --> 2:26:51.560 a cool wide. I was just reading an article. I 2:26:51.640 --> 2:26:57.119 was reading along article about when these uh white supremacist 2:26:57.160 --> 2:27:02.720 dudes were going to give a lecture at Berkeley, Like 2:27:02.800 --> 2:27:04.920 they've been invited by some student club to give a 2:27:05.480 --> 2:27:10.600 you know, one of their white supremacis Yeah, there's an 2:27:10.720 --> 2:27:13.760 article about how Berkeley was handling this, what they're gonna do, 2:27:13.959 --> 2:27:17.760 and um, one of the people who's in charge of 2:27:17.840 --> 2:27:19.800 one of the people that one of the administrators at 2:27:19.800 --> 2:27:22.360 the university is discussing this sort of dilemma. And she 2:27:22.480 --> 2:27:25.640 realized that the way that these people manipulate the lead 2:27:25.720 --> 2:27:28.960 up to the event and turn it into like a 2:27:29.120 --> 2:27:33.320 news event in a social media event, like all the 2:27:33.480 --> 2:27:36.160 lead up and it becomes more about the response. And 2:27:36.280 --> 2:27:38.640 she was saying, like, this person is saying that. The 2:27:38.760 --> 2:27:42.000 metaphor I'm starting to see is like I traditionally viewed 2:27:42.280 --> 2:27:48.240 a lecture and the digital recording of the lecture as 2:27:48.280 --> 2:27:52.080 being an object in its shadow m And I thought 2:27:52.200 --> 2:27:54.000 that this person is gonna come give a lecture, and 2:27:54.040 --> 2:27:56.080 the lecture that they're going to give is the object, 2:27:56.760 --> 2:27:58.680 and then out of this will come a recording that 2:27:58.760 --> 2:28:02.040 people consume, and that's the shadow of the object. What 2:28:02.200 --> 2:28:03.720 you said, what I've come to see when dealing with 2:28:03.800 --> 2:28:11.959 these people is the object is the digital the digital 2:28:12.040 --> 2:28:15.560 portion that's the object. The actual thing is just a 2:28:15.640 --> 2:28:18.520 shadow of it. And I was reading out there day 2:28:18.520 --> 2:28:21.600 at the airstrip, and it occurred to me, like there's 2:28:21.640 --> 2:28:25.279 this thing in recording hunting and making like a hunting 2:28:25.320 --> 2:28:30.040 show is is you like, in a perfect world, you 2:28:30.120 --> 2:28:33.720 imagine that the hunt is the object, okay, and the 2:28:33.840 --> 2:28:36.920 thing that we create is its shadow. But in a 2:28:37.000 --> 2:28:38.440 lot of ways, just out of the reality of it, 2:28:38.520 --> 2:28:42.800 becomes that the thing we're creating is the object, right, 2:28:44.280 --> 2:28:46.800 Like there were times when we were we had we 2:28:46.920 --> 2:28:50.040 sat still because there's no way that the cameras could 2:28:50.560 --> 2:28:53.760 withstand that monterrange, so like there's no sense of going, 2:28:53.840 --> 2:28:55.440 so we can't feel in that way, and so you're 2:28:55.440 --> 2:28:58.160 in this struggle where also the thing we're creating, the 2:28:58.240 --> 2:29:00.960 digital impression we're creating, becomes the objects and the hunt 2:29:01.000 --> 2:29:04.600 itself becomes its shadow. And you're always pushing and pulling 2:29:04.640 --> 2:29:06.960 on those two ideas, you know, So what is the 2:29:07.000 --> 2:29:09.320 object and what's the right It was like it was 2:29:09.320 --> 2:29:11.160 a good thing to read at the right moment. It 2:29:11.280 --> 2:29:13.440 was a good expression. That's a good metaphor for that's 2:29:13.480 --> 2:29:15.280 a good way to put it, for sure, and for 2:29:15.360 --> 2:29:18.720 the greater good. I think the object being the story 2:29:19.320 --> 2:29:24.600 digital digitally does does more for people than a successful 2:29:24.680 --> 2:29:28.840 hunt for you without the story. So that's why you 2:29:28.879 --> 2:29:31.200 make that call. But you're right, and it's it's like 2:29:31.280 --> 2:29:33.240 there's no end to it. It's an it's like this 2:29:33.400 --> 2:29:36.120 wrestling match that constantly occurs in your head. Yeah, And 2:29:36.200 --> 2:29:38.720 when I get pissy and frustrated in my head, I 2:29:38.800 --> 2:29:42.720 often think to like that the doing of this enables 2:29:42.879 --> 2:29:48.920 so much of the mean. But it's it's a it's 2:29:48.959 --> 2:29:51.720 a tricky thing that and I'm sure that anyone that turns, 2:29:52.120 --> 2:29:57.200 anyone that turns a passion into an occupation, And it's 2:29:57.200 --> 2:30:00.480 a situation you guys are in in as can because 2:30:00.520 --> 2:30:03.640 here you are. It's like when you come out with us, 2:30:03.840 --> 2:30:06.840 you're working. You work eighteen hour days, you work twenty 2:30:06.879 --> 2:30:11.440 four hour days. Yeah, there's no escaping it. Just sleeping 2:30:11.480 --> 2:30:13.440 in a tent in the mud. Even sleeping is a 2:30:13.440 --> 2:30:17.200 little work. You're burning calorie sleeping. It's hard when you 2:30:17.320 --> 2:30:20.200 gotta go like dig out, when you got to dig 2:30:20.320 --> 2:30:23.560 out the place to sleep. But when your passion is 2:30:23.959 --> 2:30:26.440 is doing that, yeah, that it makes it easy. That's 2:30:26.440 --> 2:30:27.760 what I mean. But you're like, it's am I at 2:30:27.800 --> 2:30:33.920 work or not at work? Working eight days ship one 2:30:34.040 --> 2:30:37.240 big long me and my younger brother, who's a photographer 2:30:37.280 --> 2:30:40.080 as well, went to our older brother who's a carpenter's 2:30:40.160 --> 2:30:43.360 house and was helping to move some dirt, and you know, 2:30:43.480 --> 2:30:45.720 like just manual labor. And we both looked at each 2:30:45.720 --> 2:30:47.520 other like, Damn, We're glad we do what we do. 2:30:48.920 --> 2:30:52.480 We're not out here doing a grind. You know, this 2:30:52.640 --> 2:30:55.240 is hard, and I've done those grinds too. That's why 2:30:55.240 --> 2:30:57.520 I appreciate what I do now so much. I remember 2:30:57.560 --> 2:31:00.560 in high school I worked for this late high school, 2:31:00.560 --> 2:31:04.360 I worked for this industrial painting outfit called Quality main 2:31:04.520 --> 2:31:07.599 Well two of them Pennington Brothers and Quality Maintenance contractors. 2:31:07.640 --> 2:31:11.480 And one time we were, um, I mean, this dude 2:31:11.520 --> 2:31:14.800 from high school, Craig Camp, had to like de grease 2:31:14.920 --> 2:31:18.800 all the like roof trusses in the auto parts manufacturing 2:31:18.879 --> 2:31:21.560 place so they could come in and paint them. I 2:31:21.640 --> 2:31:23.720 remember being up there and we were on these like 2:31:23.800 --> 2:31:26.119 scissor lifts, you know. I remember being up like working 2:31:26.240 --> 2:31:29.439 with the just this endless pile of rags and degrease. 2:31:29.520 --> 2:31:30.920 They're trying to get the stuff so it could be 2:31:30.959 --> 2:31:33.840 cold with paint. And when we showed up, like the 2:31:33.920 --> 2:31:37.200 first shift dudes were there. I me and Craig were 2:31:37.200 --> 2:31:38.640 out there. It was like such a tight deadline that 2:31:38.680 --> 2:31:40.200 were up there, and I'm still in high school. Man, 2:31:40.200 --> 2:31:43.840 It's like a weekend thing organic chemical degrease or press. Eventually, 2:31:44.360 --> 2:31:48.000 those sons of bitches were back again. The first shift 2:31:48.080 --> 2:31:50.840 guys were back, like I recognized that guy from me, 2:31:50.879 --> 2:31:53.840 and Craig started, that's how long we've been up there 2:31:53.920 --> 2:31:56.280 de greasing these things? And I'm like, the whole damn 2:31:56.360 --> 2:31:59.560 shift came through. And then one probably said to Craig like, 2:32:00.040 --> 2:32:02.040 gonna make it through. As if crazy Train comes back 2:32:02.080 --> 2:32:05.000 on the radio. I started playing like a radio and 2:32:05.120 --> 2:32:09.440 like crazy like it wasn't even a new song. We're 2:32:09.520 --> 2:32:11.800 there so long degrease and ship that crazy Train got 2:32:11.840 --> 2:32:15.440 played twice. So I was like, man, I don't know. 2:32:17.920 --> 2:32:20.320 I don't know about shift work. I don't know if 2:32:20.360 --> 2:32:24.440 I'm gonna making this occupation. That's that what was Edd's quote, 2:32:24.480 --> 2:32:28.520 that's that fire that forms us, forged by fire. We 2:32:28.600 --> 2:32:31.760 had another job. Danny worked this job, remember having a 2:32:31.879 --> 2:32:35.400 handship paint off a rail around a sewage treatment tank 2:32:36.120 --> 2:32:38.520 because they couldn't get You couldn't sand blasts or soda 2:32:38.560 --> 2:32:40.640 blasts because they couldn't have the sand or bacon soda 2:32:40.680 --> 2:32:42.960 getting into the sewage because mess up the sewage treatment. 2:32:43.240 --> 2:32:45.320 So you had to read up this little plastic tarp 2:32:45.320 --> 2:32:48.880 from bang out with a ball peen hammer. God dude, 2:32:48.959 --> 2:32:50.480 this is a huge tank and it was the three 2:32:50.640 --> 2:32:53.480 It was a three wrong guard rail around up vertical supports. 2:32:53.920 --> 2:32:56.240 We had to bing off every square inch of that paint. Man, 2:32:56.280 --> 2:32:58.640 we'd come back. We can after we can. And you 2:32:58.640 --> 2:33:01.600 guys like let them play crazy train on the Latin 2:33:02.720 --> 2:33:05.280 just tinking it off with hammers. That's so hard to 2:33:05.879 --> 2:33:07.400 that's so hard to the adend of the medal, but 2:33:07.480 --> 2:33:09.760 just hard enough to knock, just hard enough to knock 2:33:09.800 --> 2:33:14.480 off a chip of paint by half size your pinky nails. Yeah. 2:33:14.520 --> 2:33:16.640 Then when you're up there like your biggest problem is 2:33:16.680 --> 2:33:18.840 your camera, guys keep busting out into the open. You're like, 2:33:19.120 --> 2:33:25.920 I can live with it. I can live with this. Yeah, Man, 2:33:26.000 --> 2:33:30.400 that's all I gotta say about that sheep hunt. He 2:33:30.480 --> 2:33:34.920 got away, he got away, he's still out there. He's lucky. 2:33:35.000 --> 2:33:37.880 He'll be getting bigger. He's gonna be a real nice 2:33:37.959 --> 2:33:40.840 one like Doug during Nice Buck next year, Nice Ram 2:33:40.959 --> 2:33:45.240 next year. Yeah, maybe maybe a dead ram before before 2:33:45.280 --> 2:33:47.120 the end of winter. Yeah, they don't get old. Yeah. 2:33:47.360 --> 2:33:50.360 We found uh, yeah, we found it. We found a 2:33:50.480 --> 2:33:54.520 ram skull, a winter kill, presumably right right by camp. 2:33:54.680 --> 2:33:56.680 So yeah, when they get that age, they don't last 2:33:56.760 --> 2:34:00.440 a real long time, even in an unhunted population. Um, 2:34:01.760 --> 2:34:05.760 they just drop off like flies after ten. Yeah. Yeah, 2:34:05.760 --> 2:34:07.960 I think part of it, right, is that is that 2:34:08.080 --> 2:34:11.760 they're just not They work so hard during the rut, right, 2:34:12.280 --> 2:34:14.480 and they're not putting weight on, and they go from 2:34:14.520 --> 2:34:17.080 top of the heat to dead. They get up where 2:34:17.080 --> 2:34:20.000 they're the man and they rut in November and expend 2:34:20.040 --> 2:34:23.200 it's a tremendous, tremendous amount of injury and expose themselves 2:34:23.280 --> 2:34:26.440 to a lot of risk. Yeah, and they go into 2:34:26.600 --> 2:34:28.440 and then they go into the and they go into 2:34:28.480 --> 2:34:30.880 the winter not kicking ass. So you get these used 2:34:30.920 --> 2:34:33.080 it will be twenty and stuff, right, but then you 2:34:33.120 --> 2:34:35.120 get these rams and they and and like I said, 2:34:35.120 --> 2:34:37.640 even this unhunted population that they were doing that. Like, 2:34:37.800 --> 2:34:39.840 I think that when a ram gets thirteen, he's got 2:34:39.879 --> 2:34:42.320 a percent chance of not being alive in a year, 2:34:43.640 --> 2:34:47.120 and that ten, it really drops off. Yeah, they go 2:34:47.200 --> 2:34:49.880 from being the man and nothing, not like us. We 2:34:50.000 --> 2:34:52.560 have this long forty year period of watching ourselves go 2:34:52.640 --> 2:34:59.920 to ship Danny got the final things you want to 2:35:00.879 --> 2:35:02.960 Um yeah, we well we got we started talking about 2:35:03.000 --> 2:35:05.320 it yesterday, but um yeah we should find a time 2:35:05.360 --> 2:35:09.400 and try try giving it their go. So yeah, every 2:35:09.480 --> 2:35:11.480 time I'm hunting the last I come away just like 2:35:11.640 --> 2:35:13.840 obsessing about what I'm gonna do it again. Oh I know, 2:35:13.959 --> 2:35:16.320 you know, yeah, I was thinking about this morning. We're 2:35:16.360 --> 2:35:19.080 trying to go on a moose and caribou trip here 2:35:19.160 --> 2:35:23.120 and uh, hunting partners having boat trouble and everything else, 2:35:23.160 --> 2:35:29.240 and man, maybe we should just go back out pounder. 2:35:30.440 --> 2:35:35.160 Uh as a camera person, don't skyline yourself or bust 2:35:35.240 --> 2:35:39.480 out in the open at inopportune times. That yeah, getting 2:35:39.520 --> 2:35:43.280 the mindset of the hunt, that's right, the object and 2:35:43.959 --> 2:35:49.840 act in the shadow, not the cameraman. This outline the 2:35:49.879 --> 2:35:52.720 skyline shots to one of the better. It's a good shot, man, 2:35:53.320 --> 2:35:59.040 that's a good shot. Dirt myth um. I was thinking 2:35:59.040 --> 2:36:03.360 about all. It was really cool watching you guys as 2:36:03.440 --> 2:36:06.760 brothers hunt because I'm really close to my brothers and 2:36:06.840 --> 2:36:09.760 like you guys stories and that was just kind of neat, 2:36:10.480 --> 2:36:13.440 you know, different. Yeah, my other guests, I guess you guys. 2:36:13.640 --> 2:36:16.240 My first exposure to you and your brothers was being 2:36:16.400 --> 2:36:20.040 at your dad mom's house in my city and there 2:36:20.080 --> 2:36:22.160 was a picture of you and both your brothers on 2:36:22.200 --> 2:36:27.920 a mountaineering trip. Damn. Was like some interesting dude. You 2:36:28.000 --> 2:36:30.480 were right, you were right? So that Yeah, it was 2:36:30.560 --> 2:36:34.160 really fun hanging out with you guys and watching you 2:36:34.240 --> 2:36:40.359 hunt together and reminding me yea, my good times, my bros. Janice. 2:36:41.840 --> 2:36:44.240 I just had to reiterate, man, what a pretty pretty 2:36:44.280 --> 2:36:47.920 place that was. I don't We've been a lot of 2:36:48.000 --> 2:36:51.240 places the last five years together, and this one m 2:36:51.560 --> 2:36:57.119 topic first scenery, it's pretty dramatic. It is just yeah, 2:36:57.520 --> 2:37:00.280 every views, you know, brother taking when you get to 2:37:00.320 --> 2:37:03.119 see it. You know, we only had two real bitch 2:37:03.160 --> 2:37:06.440 and weather days out of eight in the field. In 2:37:06.520 --> 2:37:09.800 those two days, man was of something special. I'm really 2:37:09.879 --> 2:37:13.400 drawn to those glaciers, man. Yeah, Like looking at him, 2:37:13.440 --> 2:37:15.280 I mean yeah, you're kind of like you don't want 2:37:15.320 --> 2:37:20.320 to hang out near him for too long. Killed by 2:37:20.440 --> 2:37:24.119 rock or just lifeless too, you know, like lifeless from 2:37:24.200 --> 2:37:27.200 not lifeless. Yeah, it is. It's intimidating, man, But I 2:37:27.320 --> 2:37:30.320 like being where you look up and you're like, oh, 2:37:30.440 --> 2:37:32.800 there's like then there's like the n that's where this 2:37:33.000 --> 2:37:35.720 river starts, and the weather is so much squirrelier by him, 2:37:35.800 --> 2:37:39.000 too windy. Yeah, because the ice makes its own way. 2:37:39.160 --> 2:37:42.680 Definitely not lifeless. I mean really, it's the beginning of 2:37:42.840 --> 2:37:45.359 it all, is what you're looking at a good perspective. 2:37:47.840 --> 2:37:50.600 It's the beginning of its cold when you get up 2:37:50.640 --> 2:37:53.000 in there, there's no shaking it. Man, it's a cold. 2:37:53.120 --> 2:37:55.760 It's just going to your bone. Yeah, like they kick 2:37:55.840 --> 2:37:58.080 off their own little weather. They kick off, and they 2:37:58.160 --> 2:38:00.320 kick off a wind, like all that cool in air 2:38:00.520 --> 2:38:02.440 just rushing down off the ice and a lot of 2:38:02.560 --> 2:38:06.360 moisture condensing and that cold air around him. We've got 2:38:06.400 --> 2:38:10.080 snow down August. Yeah, that's the weird thing about Alaska's 2:38:10.080 --> 2:38:13.400 getting snowed out in August. But I already heard was 2:38:13.800 --> 2:38:15.360 my wife was just telling me a little snow in 2:38:15.480 --> 2:38:20.520 the mountains around our new house there. Yeah, alrights, Angeles 2:38:23.200 --> 2:38:28.960 Levi conclus I'm glad to tag along much appreciate it. 2:38:29.200 --> 2:38:30.760 Did you like that more? You like when they make 2:38:30.800 --> 2:38:32.680 you march all around in the military. No, that was 2:38:32.680 --> 2:38:36.080 a lot more fun. No, I had a good time. 2:38:36.320 --> 2:38:38.720 I appreciate the chance to come out and hang out, 2:38:39.480 --> 2:38:41.560 fun hanging with you, Levi. Yeah, that was good having 2:38:41.560 --> 2:38:45.480 you man. Thanks for the puke and rally especially. Yeah. Yeah, 2:38:45.520 --> 2:38:47.600 that was really to go up from puke and to 2:38:47.680 --> 2:38:50.000 better that fast, and it wasn't a drinking puke and 2:38:50.040 --> 2:38:52.920 it was a sick Yeah. So I went to bed 2:38:53.000 --> 2:38:54.640 one night and then woke up in the middle of 2:38:54.640 --> 2:38:56.560 the night and had to run outside the tent and 2:38:56.720 --> 2:38:59.240 trying not to peek on your honest, I wonder what 2:38:59.360 --> 2:39:01.240 you're doing out there. Yeah, it ran out they were 2:39:01.280 --> 2:39:03.520 having night tears and never thought that someone was throwing 2:39:03.600 --> 2:39:06.119 up outside tent, which is never a good sign. Ran out, 2:39:06.280 --> 2:39:08.760 and you know, I chucked up my dinner and then uh, 2:39:08.920 --> 2:39:11.720 Johnnie and I did a mega hike to book up 2:39:11.800 --> 2:39:14.640 three hours later and down another ten miles. You know, 2:39:15.360 --> 2:39:16.760 I had to run back to base camp for some 2:39:16.840 --> 2:39:19.879 batteries more than ten miles. Yeah, it was a long Johnt. 2:39:19.959 --> 2:39:21.280 It was a good it was a good huff, but 2:39:21.520 --> 2:39:24.880 definitely worth it. And uh, yeah, what we hope to 2:39:24.920 --> 2:39:26.920 have you back again when you're depending on what you 2:39:27.000 --> 2:39:29.680 got going on. I'd love to for sure. All right, 2:39:31.080 --> 2:40:11.640 thank you for joining us as always, assssssssssssssssssssss