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Speaker 1: Joining us now Comel Hawash, chair of the Palestine Solve

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Speaker 1: darity campaign, which campaigns for an end to the Israeli

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Speaker 1: occupation of Palestine. We thank you so much for joining

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Speaker 1: with your perspective this morning. I want to start off

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Speaker 1: simply with the possible solutions. I mean, you have just

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Speaker 1: did a great job talking about the geopolitical conflict, the

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Speaker 1: massive international players here. What about internally, how do internally

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Speaker 1: the members of Palestine find a solution.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think looking to the future I wanted to

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Speaker 2: find a solution is the right way to look at this.

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Speaker 2: The problem is it's been seventy five years since Israel

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Speaker 2: was created.

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Speaker 3: From whence it should have.

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Speaker 2: Been the case that Israel withdrew from the occupied Palestinian

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Speaker 2: territories and allowed the Palestinians to set up their own

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Speaker 2: state and to live in peace. But Israel has chosen,

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Speaker 2: as leaders have and particularly this government that we have,

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Speaker 2: has chosen not to recognize the arts of the Palestinian

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Speaker 2: people on the country.

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Speaker 3: You you will have heard Belzens.

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Speaker 2: Motridge, one of the ministers finance ministers say the Palestinians

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Speaker 2: have three options.

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Speaker 3: Either they leave or they live here without and your rights,

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Speaker 3: or if they the occupation, then they would be killed.

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Speaker 2: Now that is not predude to peace, is it?

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Speaker 3: You also have?

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Speaker 4: All right, so Kevin, let's let's work with that. It's

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Speaker 4: use of here alongside Critty Kami. Run me through what

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Speaker 4: you're hearing from your sources on the ground in terms

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Speaker 4: of the dialogue between the Palestinian authority and Hamas, because

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Speaker 4: if we can get a breakthrough there, it will sure

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Speaker 4: help a lot where all the stakeholders sit down together

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Speaker 4: during this painful period.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean you and your viewers will be aware

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Speaker 2: that there's been an unfortunate division between Palestinians, you know,

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Speaker 2: for for nearly seventeen years that doesn't have There have

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Speaker 2: been a number of attempts to break through that, but

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Speaker 2: that hasn't yield resulted in in unity.

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Speaker 3: So unity is really important. We know. I think it's

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Speaker 3: clear that the.

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Speaker 2: Hamas rules in Gaza and the personal Authority or if

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Speaker 2: you like, fatah Ha rules in the West Bank and

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Speaker 2: the parasonal Authority would have had no involvement in what

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Speaker 2: started on the seventh.

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Speaker 3: Of this month.

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Speaker 2: But also listening to what real mansur in the in

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Speaker 2: the United Nations, the Ambassador for parastalilat nations. He is

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Speaker 2: reminding everyone that the problem lies in the international communities

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Speaker 2: and Israel's lack of real seriousness to deliver their arts

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Speaker 2: for the Palestinian people. And then on the Israeli side,

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Speaker 2: I would remind you, if I may just finish this point,

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Speaker 2: that in twenty eighteen, Israel passed a law, the Nation

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Speaker 2: State Law, which gave even its Palestinian citizens no rights

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Speaker 2: by saying only Jewish Israelis have the right self determination

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Speaker 2: in Israel, whose borders are not defined.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 1: Well, come on, let's talk a little bit about time

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Speaker 1: frame here. I think our financial audience will want to know,

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Speaker 1: from your expertise, how long do you think this lasts.

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Speaker 1: I've heard timelines going ashort as a couple more days,

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Speaker 1: to months, even years. What do you think?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's very difficult to judge.

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Speaker 2: I have to say, because we hear of escalations, particularly

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Speaker 2: the United States, you know, sending a barge supplying Israel

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Speaker 2: on the weapons at wants a commitment to that, A

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Speaker 2: lack of even mentioning the word Palestine or Palestinians by leaders,

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Speaker 2: including here in the United Kingdom, where the Foreign Secretary

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Speaker 2: has completely in his statements has not included the word Palestinians.

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Speaker 3: They do make up half.

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Speaker 2: The population that lives between the Riba Jordan and the

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Speaker 2: Mediterranean Sea, and it is that that is reducing the

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Speaker 2: chances for peace. I think clearly in the on the

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Speaker 2: Israeli side, they want to lash out, hit back and

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Speaker 2: if if armand the audience is unfortunately in the past,

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Speaker 2: the ratio and I don't like using this, but the

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Speaker 2: ratio of Palacinian skilled to Israelis has always been round

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Speaker 2: ten to one, so we really fear Yeah, I.

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Speaker 4: Mean, those those are you know, those are your numbers,

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Speaker 4: and we'll look into that Chemera. But I want to

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Speaker 4: shift to the to the road ahead and specifically focused

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Speaker 4: on you know, who can It's just, you know, it's

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Speaker 4: just in terms.

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Speaker 3: Of a number of casualties we're going to see, which.

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Speaker 4: Will not be hundred percent. And that takes me to

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Speaker 4: my next point, Kevin, which is who can bring influence

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Speaker 4: to the table here? Is it the Saudis, is it

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Speaker 4: the Qataris? Or is there a need for a rapprochmow

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Speaker 4: with Iran to move the needle in this Because every

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Speaker 4: life is a life too many, I.

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Speaker 2: Think it tends to fall on in the lapse of

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Speaker 2: the Egyptians. First that because they can speak to both

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Speaker 2: sides to try and calm the situation down. The Sadis

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Speaker 2: are in a in an interesting position because, as was

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Speaker 2: reported earlier, they've been the Crown Prince there said that

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Speaker 2: a normalization with Israel was nearing, So then they could

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Speaker 2: be in a position to say, you know, if unless

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Speaker 2: this is brought to an end quickly, then clearly that

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Speaker 2: particular deal would be.

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Speaker 3: Delayed four months.

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Speaker 2: So I think military depends on what the real age

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Speaker 2: of the Israelis are now if they want to go

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Speaker 2: to the extent that they always refer to of.

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Speaker 3: Basically ending the.

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Speaker 2: Power of hamas in in in this densely populated regions,

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Speaker 2: densely populated region in the world, and that will take

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Speaker 2: I think troops on the ground, and if they even

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Speaker 2: thought about doing that, that would result in many, many casualties.

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Speaker 2: And I've already seen Palestinians move two hundreds schools to

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Speaker 2: try and avoid being in the cross.

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Speaker 4: Ill leverage your expertise came and in terms of what

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Speaker 4: is going on on the ground in Gaza, in terms

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Speaker 4: of the basic supply of food, water and energy. Where

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Speaker 4: is that coming from, if at all, given all the restrictions.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean part of the reason that that we're

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Speaker 2: hearing from Palestinians who are, if you like, looking at

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Speaker 2: this operation saying you know, we've had enough is the

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Speaker 2: fact that Israel determines exactly what comes. In my understanding

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Speaker 2: from people on the ground, is that the electricity supply

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Speaker 2: has now been shut down by Israel.

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Speaker 3: The Gaza in.

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Speaker 2: Case, was predicted to be uninhabitable by the United Nations

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Speaker 2: in two thousand and twenty, and here we are in

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty three.

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Speaker 3: Any goods going in, food supplies, et cetera.

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Speaker 2: Are heavily controlled by Israel, so the situation on the

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Speaker 2: ground would worsen very very quickly. The economic situation is always.

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Speaker 3: In difficulty, so it's very it's.

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Speaker 2: Only going to get worse, and that is why it

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Speaker 2: is important to focus on the human beings in Gaza

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Speaker 2: and indeed on the other side, to try and bring

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Speaker 2: this to an end, because I personally don't want to

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Speaker 2: see anyone die in this war from either side, because

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Speaker 2: the families are the ones who would have to pick

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Speaker 2: up the pieces once that, once we have calm, but

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Speaker 2: also we don't want to be here speaking in two

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Speaker 2: years time, when there's another assault on the people.

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Speaker 1: Of Gharday, nobody wants to see continue. Come on, hallwish.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry. We are proveally out of time. He's the

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Speaker 1: chair of the Palestine Solidarity Campaign. We thank him for

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Speaker 1: joining the program, as well as, of course, the anchor

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Speaker 1: of Daybreak Middle East and Africa, Yusuf Gamaldi,