Speaker 1: On January in south central Los Angeles, Herman Atkins, a
Speaker 1: disciplined student athlete who enjoyed refurbishing low rider Chevy's, was
Speaker 1: paying a local mechanic for an engine rebuild when a
Speaker 1: robber snatched the money and took off on foot. Herman
Speaker 1: grabbed the mechanics gun and chased the robber, firing warning
Speaker 1: shots into the air. The robber turned a corner and
Speaker 1: Herman heard more gunshots. When he reached the corner, he
Speaker 1: happened upon another crime scene. There were cop cars and
Speaker 1: people wounded, and Herman, frightened, ditched the gun and retreated.
Speaker 1: After blanketing the area and questioning the mechanic, police wanted
Speaker 1: Atkins in connection with the shooting and wounding of three people,
Speaker 1: including two police officers, something Herman would be totally unaware
Speaker 1: of until authorities caught up with him while he was
Speaker 1: visiting family and Phoenix in November of that year. Fingerprints
Speaker 1: on the gun found at the crime scene did not
Speaker 1: match Herman, but with two newborn sons and prosecutors promising
Speaker 1: a guilty verdict and terribly long sentence if he went
Speaker 1: to trial, Herman pled no contest to the charges in
Speaker 1: exchange for a lighter sentence, but this was just the beginning.
Speaker 1: On April eighth, while Herman Atkins, this picture was being
Speaker 1: circulated by police in connection with the January incident, an
Speaker 1: armed man forced a twenty three year old store clerk
Speaker 1: into the back room of her shop to perform world
Speaker 1: sex on him in Lake Elsinore, California, a city Herman
Speaker 1: had never visited. During the rape, the assailant ejaculated and
Speaker 1: wiped his semen on her sweater, evidence that would later
Speaker 1: clear Herman's name. The armed robber and rapist fled with
Speaker 1: a hundred thirty dollars in cash and the victim's jewelry.
Speaker 1: The victim and two other store clerks in the strip
Speaker 1: Mall identified Herman as the assailant from his circulating wanted poster.
Speaker 1: With the prosecution relying on this ultimately mistaken eyewitness identification,
Speaker 1: an incentivized jailhouse snitch, and misleading prology five, Herman was
Speaker 1: sentenced to forty seven years plus eight months for a
Speaker 1: crime he did not commit. This is wrongful conviction with
Speaker 1: Jason Flamm Welcome back to wrongful conviction everyone. Today you're
Speaker 1: going to hear a story that has so many layers,
Speaker 1: so many twists and turns. It's a story that includes
Speaker 1: mistaken eyewitness identification, bad forensics, police misconduct, and in the
Speaker 1: end of the day, what it's got is redemption and
Speaker 1: forgiveness of a type that we have never covered and
Speaker 1: I've never heard of before. So I hope you're settled
Speaker 1: in because this is going to be an amazing ride.
Speaker 1: And uh, and with me is the star of our show,
Speaker 1: Herman Atkins. So Herman, welcome to the the Wrongful Conviction. Thank
Speaker 1: you for having me. And like I always say, I'm
Speaker 1: I'm sorry you're here, but I'm glad you're here. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know. It's Uh, it's been an interesting journey down
Speaker 1: a long road. It certainly has. And it all started
Speaker 1: on the morning of April six, a long time ago. Six.
Speaker 1: That's the year the Mets won the World Series. That's
Speaker 1: how long ago that is, um, And I'll just set
Speaker 1: the stage right. So, sometime around eleven thirty in the morning,
Speaker 1: a thin, young black man wearing a dark jacket, rebox shoes,
Speaker 1: and a gold ring went into a shoe store Lake Elson,
Speaker 1: or California, which coincidentally happens to be places you've never
Speaker 1: been to. We'll get into that. And he pretended to
Speaker 1: be interested in some merchandise and then he, being an
Speaker 1: only customer story, pulled a handgun and forced the clerk
Speaker 1: to perform moral sex on him, threatened to kill it
Speaker 1: a horrible crime, horrible crime. During the rape, the assailant
Speaker 1: ejaculated and he left his seamen on her sweater, so
Speaker 1: there was plenty of evidence to go on. And he
Speaker 1: took a hundred and thirty dollars, making it a robbery
Speaker 1: and a rape. He also took her engagement ringing another ring,
Speaker 1: so her sweater was preserved as evidence. And that's when
Speaker 1: things get really crazy, right, because you would seem like
Speaker 1: a very unlikely guy to be a suspect in this
Speaker 1: crime or any crime. And that's because of your stepfather.
Speaker 1: He was a highway patrol officer California, California Highway Patrol
Speaker 1: officer out of the Torrents Division. He raised me. He
Speaker 1: raised me in such a way. I grew up in
Speaker 1: a regiment type upbringing, where there was rules, there were structures,
Speaker 1: there was high expectations, and there was a lot of
Speaker 1: pride from him as well as my mother. We lived
Speaker 1: at the time in south central l A which would
Speaker 1: be considered middle class at the time, and you were
Speaker 1: the third of six kids, and you had ideas of
Speaker 1: becoming a patrol in yourself. Yes, I wanted to follow
Speaker 1: my father's footsteps. So my father went to the military.
Speaker 1: You come from Jackson, Mississippi, and you know, it's horror
Speaker 1: stories after horror stories, racism, the whole chabang when he
Speaker 1: grew up. So he was one of the first out
Speaker 1: of eleven kids, nine boys of as girls to leave Jackson, Mississippi.
Speaker 1: And so given the stories that he told us, I
Speaker 1: wanted to follow in his footsteps. He left Jackson, Mississippi,
Speaker 1: went into the military, and then come from the military
Speaker 1: into law enforcement. So my path was already cut from me.
Speaker 1: I distinctly remember when the man went through the police
Speaker 1: academy and how I had to shine shoes and belt
Speaker 1: buckles and anything that had brass or chrome or silver
Speaker 1: to it. And you were a star athlete as well.
Speaker 1: That comes back in the story later in a very
Speaker 1: unexpected way. Yes, Yes, my whole life long I spent
Speaker 1: time in sports. He kept me and my brother's will
Speaker 1: into the community and social activities. He felt that that
Speaker 1: was contribute to a strong foundation and to give us
Speaker 1: the opportunity of learning what it means to work as
Speaker 1: a team, to follow leadership and eventually become leaders. And
Speaker 1: so I took the sports and excelled at it, from
Speaker 1: Pop Warner all the way on up to high school football, baseball,
Speaker 1: the Holestan Bank. Yes. And then this story, like I said,
Speaker 1: has a really crazy twist right at the beginning of it, actually, because,
Speaker 1: as I said, you would seem to be an extremely
Speaker 1: unlikely guy to be a suspect in any crime. You
Speaker 1: were going to church, graduated high school, doing your thing,
Speaker 1: never been in trouble. And then one day, January six,
Speaker 1: a crazy thing happened. I was having a engine rebuilt
Speaker 1: for a nineteen seventy four K five Blazer, which was
Speaker 1: the in cars for teenagers at that time, just turned eighteen,
Speaker 1: and the guy wanted three hundred dollars to rebuild the engine.
Speaker 1: I had given him a hundred and fifty already when
Speaker 1: I took the engine to him, and he calls me
Speaker 1: up a week later and says, hey, the engine is complete.
Speaker 1: Come when you can't. I couldn't come into at night,
Speaker 1: and when I went to go pay the money, unbeknown
Speaker 1: to us, there was an individual watching us from across
Speaker 1: the street, and he approached to both of us, me
Speaker 1: and the auto mechanic, and the guy pulls out a
Speaker 1: gun and tells us we know what time it is,
Speaker 1: and took the money that I was given to the
Speaker 1: auto mechanic. He then took off headed or to the
Speaker 1: corner where two shots was fired, and the police were
Speaker 1: everywhere because they were up on the corner investigating a
Speaker 1: car accident. So everybody in the area fled, so that
Speaker 1: I period shortly after that, I don't think none of it.
Speaker 1: At the time, I didn't think none of it. Went home,
Speaker 1: and at that particular time, I was expected to have
Speaker 1: my first child being born. I had impregnated a young
Speaker 1: lady who came for the summer and she lived in Texas.
Speaker 1: So when she announced that the baby was about to
Speaker 1: be born, I went to Texas and I was there
Speaker 1: for three months, and while there, my first song was born.
Speaker 1: And so while I was in Texas, this rate that
Speaker 1: happened in April transpired, so I wasn't even in the
Speaker 1: state of California when it had happened. Then I came
Speaker 1: back and then I went to Arizona to visit family,
Speaker 1: members there while I was there. They have a project system,
Speaker 1: and so some guys inside the projects had caused harm
Speaker 1: to somebody else. Police were called and everybody who was
Speaker 1: in the area was lined up as usual and names
Speaker 1: were taken. When I gave him my name, they just
Speaker 1: ran the name and then came back and said, well,
Speaker 1: you're wanted in the city of Los Angeles and you're
Speaker 1: wanted in Lake Elsinore for to council rate two council
Speaker 1: or copulation, one count of robbery and one kind of kidnapped.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, wait a minute, yea, I got the
Speaker 1: wrong guy, stop it, you know. And so they was like, no,
Speaker 1: we're gonna extradite you back, no problem. They extradited me
Speaker 1: within days. When I got back to California, I was
Speaker 1: able to address the robbery incident and what have you.
Speaker 1: And the mistake I made at that particular time, I
Speaker 1: didn't tell them who was the perpetrator in the matter,
Speaker 1: because I actually knew the guy and it was gonna
Speaker 1: be one of those street justice things I catch up,
Speaker 1: which you're gonna give me my money back, that you're
Speaker 1: gonna get beat up, you know, And so that was
Speaker 1: what my thought process was so I wind up having
Speaker 1: to plead no low contender to that whole situation, meaning
Speaker 1: you can hold me responsible, but I'm not admitting to
Speaker 1: what she claimed I had done, and what have you.
Speaker 1: I was the victim in the matter, and so the
Speaker 1: mere fact that it was a two year of fence
Speaker 1: clearly tell you the weakness of the matter. So while
Speaker 1: we were addressing that, they then shipped me off to Riverside, California,
Speaker 1: where I learned about these charges. And so in April
Speaker 1: of nine six, a woman called out of Lake else,
Speaker 1: North California and said that she had just been raped
Speaker 1: and robbed. There was a police car in the vicinity,
Speaker 1: and she gave it a quick description of the perpetrator. Young,
Speaker 1: thin bill, black male, young, about sixteen years of age.
Speaker 1: He says, his teeth were small. I got big t
Speaker 1: She said that he didn't have no scars on his hands.
Speaker 1: I've had that scar on my hand since you see
Speaker 1: that scar right there. I used to box, you know,
Speaker 1: prize fight when I was young. I was an athlete,
Speaker 1: and so I had that scar there that ended the career.
Speaker 1: And she said that he had a ring on this
Speaker 1: exact finger, but she didn't describe the scar. She said
Speaker 1: that the perpetrator of the shoes he had on was
Speaker 1: actually a pair of rebox because it had a flag
Speaker 1: on it, and so she was able to identify this
Speaker 1: person to the nine one one operator who gave that
Speaker 1: information to the police officer who was raised there on
Speaker 1: the scene. He was like in the neighborhood. Two minutes
Speaker 1: he arrived at the scene of the crime. He said
Speaker 1: that they had combed the neighborhood looking for a mail
Speaker 1: of this description. And here's the problem in that area,
Speaker 1: it's all whites, predominant white. An African American man would
Speaker 1: have stuck out like a sword at eleven thirty in
Speaker 1: the morning and the out or a strip mall. This
Speaker 1: is a busy place. They couldn't find an individual. A
Speaker 1: detective was then called out. The detective took the young
Speaker 1: lady to the hospital where DNA rape kit was formed.
Speaker 1: They gathered all of the evidence and then they took
Speaker 1: her to the police station for further investigation. When they
Speaker 1: got her there, coincidentally, the one poster in the l
Speaker 1: A situation, the robbery incident where I was robbed, was
Speaker 1: laying on the table and she looked at it and said,
Speaker 1: this is the guy that raped me right here, and
Speaker 1: it was like, are you sure? She said yes, I'm
Speaker 1: real sure. And so when they were able to get
Speaker 1: me into the courtroom where I had an arrayment in
Speaker 1: Lake Elson, North California, a place I had never been in,
Speaker 1: never knew anything about. I was born and raised in
Speaker 1: south central Los Angeles until this very day. I knew
Speaker 1: nothing about this city. And having me to come there
Speaker 1: for arrayment, I am brought out into the courtroom with
Speaker 1: nothing but white guys. I'm gonna only black guy on
Speaker 1: his chain of white guys. But that the part that
Speaker 1: got me. He is is we're in a jury box,
Speaker 1: right and the d a's desk is about maybe three
Speaker 1: ft away from me. I mean, I can hear conversations
Speaker 1: being held with the d A and his party it's assistant,
Speaker 1: and they called my name up and an arrayment had
Speaker 1: taken place. Plead not guilty and what have you. He said, well,
Speaker 1: Mr Akin's attorney is not here yet, and so we'll
Speaker 1: put him on the back end and we will proceed further.
Speaker 1: And so once the judge decided to do that, he
Speaker 1: then got up went right into the audience. I'm looking
Speaker 1: at him. Sits next to a woman and says, do
Speaker 1: you see the man that raped you? She looked right
Speaker 1: over and said, yeah, that's him right there. I'm the
Speaker 1: only black guy. Now. You got de batiff in back
Speaker 1: of me, and de batiff tell me to look forward
Speaker 1: or when he gets me back in the back, he's
Speaker 1: gonna take his billy cub and bust my head if
Speaker 1: I didn't continue to look forward. And all the while
Speaker 1: I'm looking at this and I'm like, yeah, okay, So
Speaker 1: I can't wait for my attorney to get in so
Speaker 1: I can tell her about this in court identification. And
Speaker 1: so when she did come in, by then the bill
Speaker 1: had already been wrong. You can't unwring it. And I
Speaker 1: want to really dwell on this for a second, because
Speaker 1: you're the only one a sea of white guys. I mean,
Speaker 1: you're you're fucked. Yes, yes, And we went on with
Speaker 1: the arrayment and the date was set for preliminary hearing,
Speaker 1: at which time I then learned all the ins and
Speaker 1: out about the case and what have you. Now. Once
Speaker 1: the preliminary hearing came about, they had stated that they
Speaker 1: had three witnesses that could put me at the scene
Speaker 1: of the crime. They had a informant who allegedly stopped
Speaker 1: the detective as he was leaving the county jail and said, hey,
Speaker 1: I heard your addressing a rape case and and Lake Elsinore.
Speaker 1: I know something about it. I can help you with it.
Speaker 1: So the detective pulls this guy out and lo and behold,
Speaker 1: this informer was supposed to told him he knew me,
Speaker 1: that I had relatives in Lake Elsinore, and I was
Speaker 1: in Lake Elsinore around about the time that this rape
Speaker 1: had taken place. Then this is what the informant had
Speaker 1: told him, told him what kind of car I drove,
Speaker 1: told him where I actually came from, which was in
Speaker 1: the city of Los Angeles, and that he had relatives
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles, and that's how he was able to
Speaker 1: know me as well. Then when the detectives had came
Speaker 1: to l A County to see me for the first time,
Speaker 1: they had taken items that was in my property. At
Speaker 1: the time, I was off into hip hop, you know,
Speaker 1: rapping and things of that nature, and so quite naturally
Speaker 1: I fit the bill of what New York will call
Speaker 1: a b boy or what have you. With the big
Speaker 1: gold chain, the Rebok tennis shoes, I had a nugget ring.
Speaker 1: And so they took all of this and took it
Speaker 1: to the victim and showed it to the victim. The
Speaker 1: victim told him, no, none of that, He didn't have
Speaker 1: none of that. But what they did was is they
Speaker 1: put it all in the bag, and when we went
Speaker 1: to trial, they used it just saying we took this
Speaker 1: from Mr Atkins, this is what he had, This is
Speaker 1: what the victim originally said that the perpetrator had, and
Speaker 1: it's here in the bag, and so it was used
Speaker 1: as evidence. So they mixed your clothes with the clothes
Speaker 1: that might look like what she would have remembered. Yes,
Speaker 1: that's the police misconduct part of it. Then there was
Speaker 1: the prosecutorial misconduct of it, where Prosecutor Richard Bentley lines
Speaker 1: up with a prologist and manipulated numbers to tell the
Speaker 1: juries that I couldn't have been excluded from the crime,
Speaker 1: when in actuality I could have. They said that I
Speaker 1: had a rare blood type, and this blood type only
Speaker 1: five of the nation had this blood type, and because
Speaker 1: I fit into that five percent of the nation blood,
Speaker 1: I couldn't have been excluded, when in the actuality it
Speaker 1: was the other way around. I was in that could
Speaker 1: have excluded me right there from the spot. And that's
Speaker 1: all that Richard Bentley had to do was to be
Speaker 1: truthful with the matter instead of manipulating the matter. Because
Speaker 1: what the sorologists had done. It was proven in a
Speaker 1: civil trial that he had in fact conspired with Richard
Speaker 1: Bentley to misquote these numbers. And in the civil trial,
Speaker 1: which I loved, that came, you know, almost two decades later,
Speaker 1: and found that Danny Miller, the lead detective, was liable
Speaker 1: for his role that he played my being wrongfully convicted.
Speaker 1: Richard Bentley got to hide behind the badge of immunity
Speaker 1: where he couldn't be held responsible for what role he
Speaker 1: played in it. And James Hall, who was the horologist,
Speaker 1: he was able to escape because of an issue that
Speaker 1: the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals released him on. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's I was shocked to see how the pieces to
Speaker 1: the puzzle that came about as a result that led
Speaker 1: to my being wrongly convicted. I realized that there was
Speaker 1: in fact a conspiracy. I realized that there was prosecutorial misconduct,
Speaker 1: there was police misconduct, there was misidentification, there was a
Speaker 1: junk science involved that all led to my being wrongly convicted.
Speaker 1: First of all, before we even get to the jury
Speaker 1: and the verdict, there's an important thing which hurts me
Speaker 1: to even talk about it, and I can't imagine how
Speaker 1: it feels for you. But your father during this time,
Speaker 1: who you obviously looked up to tremendously. You wanted to
Speaker 1: follow in his footsteps, and he taught you so much,
Speaker 1: but he didn't stand by you. He took the side
Speaker 1: of the police over his own son. In his exact words,
Speaker 1: quote unquote, I went with the evidence instead of the
Speaker 1: love of the child. And on top of everything else
Speaker 1: that you were going through, I can't imagine how a
Speaker 1: young person like yourself at this time, barely out of
Speaker 1: your teenage years can process that um abandonment. It was
Speaker 1: an act of treason too, a father son relationship. The
Speaker 1: jury goes out, did you have any hope that you
Speaker 1: would be found innocent after you had watched this whole
Speaker 1: thing take place in front of your eyes? You were
Speaker 1: living in it, right. Did you think they were gonna
Speaker 1: come back and plind you guilty? No? I thought that
Speaker 1: the Yeah, the truth. See, my grandmother had a scene
Speaker 1: she said, a lie die, but the truth always live
Speaker 1: on and so I applied that to that situation. Unfortunately
Speaker 1: it didn't happen. Then it happened later on, but everything
Speaker 1: my father had ever taught me about the justice system
Speaker 1: it went out the window. Herman, America got the best
Speaker 1: justice system. It's not the worst in the world, but
Speaker 1: it needs a lot of improvement. And as I have
Speaker 1: grown and have matured and have walked through this journey,
Speaker 1: I realized what the justice is nothing wrong with Americans
Speaker 1: justice system. It's the people that work within the justice
Speaker 1: system that has given it a bad name. Right because
Speaker 1: in your case, if they would have followed the rules,
Speaker 1: you would have been examting, would have even been brought
Speaker 1: to trial. Yes, nobody would have proceeded this. They would
Speaker 1: have kept looking, they come back in and find you
Speaker 1: guilty on all counts. So that moment must have been
Speaker 1: the worst moment of your life. Oh yeah, can you
Speaker 1: imagine here in a sentence, we give you forty seven
Speaker 1: years and eight months in prison. I was devastated. I
Speaker 1: mean you have to understand. At the time, although I
Speaker 1: was aged twenty one, I was one of them late bloomers,
Speaker 1: So I still five eleven, I weighed maybe a hundred
Speaker 1: and forty five pounds wet. And when I went back
Speaker 1: to the sale while being housed at there was a
Speaker 1: police officer. He believed in me. And although I never
Speaker 1: talked to him about or anybody for that matter, about
Speaker 1: the case, he knew that I didn't commit that crime
Speaker 1: because he came on his shift and he had found
Speaker 1: out what had happened, and he racked the door and
Speaker 1: he said, I can, you know, step out, and he
Speaker 1: took me out, and he put me in a padded
Speaker 1: cell and gave me a roll of toilet paper and
Speaker 1: he said, I'll be back to check on you. And
Speaker 1: when he put me in that cell, I cried like
Speaker 1: a baby. I that's when I realized you can lose
Speaker 1: your you know, emotions, and just it just three hours.
Speaker 1: I just I just cried. I didn't have anybody to
Speaker 1: console me. My father wasn't there to say, you know, hey,
Speaker 1: with that motivational speech. My mother wasn't there too, you know,
Speaker 1: with her solutions to every problem, none of that. I
Speaker 1: was just you know, stepped down to nothing. That was
Speaker 1: just me right there. And I knew that at that
Speaker 1: moment I was about to go on the journey. I
Speaker 1: was right, but I didn't know what to expect, but
Speaker 1: it was just it just tore me apart. It and
Speaker 1: my father. When I was young, I was always willing
Speaker 1: to help people and whatever your My father star always
Speaker 1: say herman, you have a soft heart, but that's all right.
Speaker 1: Life were hardened it for you. And what he said
Speaker 1: he was right, because my heart became instantly hard. I
Speaker 1: developed hatred. Hatred in my heart. When I got to prison,
Speaker 1: my attitude was, I'm in here for something I didn't do.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give you a reason to kill me because
Speaker 1: I don't see a way out. And so my attitude
Speaker 1: was when it came from an authority figure, I can
Speaker 1: you need to let fuck you? Actin as you need
Speaker 1: to fuck you, I can come in. I became what's
Speaker 1: called a management problem. I can honestly say I kind
Speaker 1: of checked out mentally and emotionally. And you had grown
Speaker 1: by now into a big, tough guy. Um. I grew
Speaker 1: over a period of time. You know that by the
Speaker 1: time I had did uh my seventh year and a
Speaker 1: shoe program. Later, by the end, I'm six one and
Speaker 1: I'm winning every bit of two hundred pounds. I did
Speaker 1: a sixteen months shoe program and yeah, segregating housing unit
Speaker 1: and where you stayed in the sale twenty three hours
Speaker 1: out of a day, thirty minutes for shower and thirty
Speaker 1: minutes for yard. And seldom did you get both doing
Speaker 1: that right there and talking to a guy that was
Speaker 1: over in the sale who was doing an indetermined shoe program.
Speaker 1: He had been there eight years already, and he and
Speaker 1: I used to talk to event about that like that
Speaker 1: right there, except it was on the wall, and he
Speaker 1: told me something that was just registered to me. He said,
Speaker 1: if what you're telling me is true, then you need
Speaker 1: to get back out on the main line, get into
Speaker 1: the law books and figure out what happened to you
Speaker 1: and get up out of here. Made sense to me.
Speaker 1: I stayed up, did the shoe program, hit the main line,
Speaker 1: and kind of stayed to myself other than working and
Speaker 1: then law library and from there, I mean it took
Speaker 1: another five years to get out. What led you to that?
Speaker 1: Is this project? How did you get out? Okay? Well,
Speaker 1: in n when I got out of the shoot program,
Speaker 1: I went to the law books. I hit him hard.
Speaker 1: I studied everything that had to do about a rape case.
Speaker 1: And there was a guy who had came in he
Speaker 1: was doing a violation he did, like a nine month violation.
Speaker 1: He had been watching me from a distance, you know.
Speaker 1: He said, look, man, you're kind of young to be
Speaker 1: in the law books the way you you are, you know,
Speaker 1: And he said, what are the issues that you're fighting whatever?
Speaker 1: Because I know a little bit something about law, and
Speaker 1: in prison, you know, rapists and a child molest they're
Speaker 1: treated lower than the dirt they walk on. So I
Speaker 1: never told nobody about, you know, what I had been
Speaker 1: in for. But it was a calmness about this guy,
Speaker 1: and I told him. He said, well, what are the issues?
Speaker 1: And I told him that. He said, well, it seems
Speaker 1: as though that you have chopped down a tree and
Speaker 1: you're still dealing with the stump. He said, there's an
Speaker 1: organization that could help you get out of here. It's
Speaker 1: called an Innocent Project, and I'm more than sure if you,
Speaker 1: you know, asked them to help you, they'll take your case.
Speaker 1: You can be out of here in months. I went in,
Speaker 1: wrote a thirteen page letter, and Barry Scheck and Peter
Speaker 1: knew Felt sent me a letter saying we would be
Speaker 1: interested in your case. Can you send us your sentencing
Speaker 1: transcript to Sir Rod's report in your trial transcripts, and
Speaker 1: me and my family got together. We sent these documents.
Speaker 1: About two weeks after we had sent it off, I
Speaker 1: got a letter from Barry check Peter new Felt again
Speaker 1: telling me that they not only would they accept my case,
Speaker 1: they broke down how the Innocent Project work and the
Speaker 1: fact that a student would be assigned in my case
Speaker 1: and what the student job was, and if they were
Speaker 1: successful at finding the evidence for DNA testing, then it
Speaker 1: would be turned over to an in house attorney and
Speaker 1: that person would go and represent me. Now, from the
Speaker 1: time they told me that in the evidence was found
Speaker 1: in nine the problem was is that the Innocent Project
Speaker 1: was a fairly new organization and so they didn't have
Speaker 1: attorneys around the nation willing to do the work that
Speaker 1: they were doing, especially for a pro bono like they
Speaker 1: have now. And so took him another two years, with
Speaker 1: the assistance of my family as well, to find an attorney,
Speaker 1: and they found one guy named Douglas Myers. He stepped up.
Speaker 1: He argued successfully to have the evidence released and it
Speaker 1: was released in October, at which time it was tested
Speaker 1: and it proved that I was factually innocent of these crimes.
Speaker 1: The d A They just did not want to concede
Speaker 1: on the matter, so they wanted to be slick and
Speaker 1: asked very second courts to have a second DNA testing.
Speaker 1: They wanted to send everything to Berkeley, California for another
Speaker 1: testing and what have you, which would have cost me
Speaker 1: to be there even longer. But Barry said got smart
Speaker 1: and told him and said, let's get the FBI involved.
Speaker 1: And they sent it to the FBI. And while Barry
Speaker 1: Scheck and Peter Newfield, they had wrote a book and
Speaker 1: they were on the book tour, the FBI found out
Speaker 1: what the results were and tried to make it seem
Speaker 1: like they discovered that an innocent man was imprisoned, and
Speaker 1: they were the ones that pressed for my immediate release.
Speaker 1: And so the minute order came down February seventeenth of
Speaker 1: two thousand, demanding my immediate release because I have been
Speaker 1: proven by way of post conviction. Then they testing that
Speaker 1: I was factory innocent of the charges some twelve years later,
Speaker 1: but it was a total of fourteen because the moment
Speaker 1: they put handcuffs on you, that's when the clock starts. Yes,
Speaker 1: so it's a total of fourteen years. So fourteen years.
Speaker 1: Never received an apology from Richard Mentley and Hanny Miller,
Speaker 1: James Howe Norther victim for that matter. But in coming home,
Speaker 1: you can actually see me. Go to YouTube type in
Speaker 1: Herman Atkins DNA testing, and you're gonna see a video
Speaker 1: of my immediate release. What was it like walking out?
Speaker 1: Everything was new to me. I had lost touch with society.
Speaker 1: I had been gone over a decade. But as far
Speaker 1: as coming home, I was excited about that because I
Speaker 1: did make plans while I was in there. I knew
Speaker 1: one day you're gonna have to let me go, and
Speaker 1: they did. And so you walked out with the first
Speaker 1: thing you did when you it out. As far as eating, well,
Speaker 1: the first thing I did. My mother and my sister
Speaker 1: and her husband, and an auntie and my one of
Speaker 1: my sons who had been born before I went in.
Speaker 1: He was one years old when I went to prison.
Speaker 1: He was fourteen years old when I got out. And
Speaker 1: so we all stopped at ihop and one of the
Speaker 1: things I noticed is is I had eight prison food
Speaker 1: so alone, I couldn't keep nothing on my stomach. So
Speaker 1: we bypassed that and I had to actually go to
Speaker 1: a dollar store in California and buy stuff that they
Speaker 1: sold in the in the canteen, I had to make
Speaker 1: prison spreads in order to eat and survive out here
Speaker 1: for at least a month. And then they took me
Speaker 1: to a hometown buffet and something about their food set
Speaker 1: on my stomach. So I malled they food and we
Speaker 1: would drink coffee up in there, like four fold, just coffee.
Speaker 1: I went to Starbucks and brought some coffee from there.
Speaker 1: I stayed up for three days, literally three days. My
Speaker 1: sister so hermy, what's wrong with you? You're not are
Speaker 1: you all right? You're not what I said, yeah, start,
Speaker 1: but got some strong coffee. I don't mess with Start,
Speaker 1: but coffee did this very day because the prison coffee
Speaker 1: was so weak. I'm gonna that's gonna stick with me
Speaker 1: a long time. Everybody you eating prison food after you
Speaker 1: got out for a month, that's crazy. Um. And then
Speaker 1: so you went to college. Yeah, when I came home,
Speaker 1: work was not an option. I needed to be educated.
Speaker 1: I already had a high school diploma. I went and
Speaker 1: rolled in college, and once I got there, I went
Speaker 1: to the head coach and told him, hey, this is
Speaker 1: my story. I want to play football. And so when
Speaker 1: I came home, I still had that twenty one year
Speaker 1: old mentality, and I looked like I was about at best.
Speaker 1: And so although I was thirty four years of age,
Speaker 1: he said, well, if you can make the team, ye end.
Speaker 1: So spring training came around. It was a lot of conditioning, running,
Speaker 1: and we had to do this final test and then
Speaker 1: I made the team. And when I once I made
Speaker 1: the team, they gave us a helmets, show the paths,
Speaker 1: all of that, and I was able to show him
Speaker 1: what I was made up physically. At age thirty four,
Speaker 1: I was out there rocking these eighteen and nineteen year
Speaker 1: old kids who was coming out of high school, all
Speaker 1: American defensive end, all American linebacker, you know, and what
Speaker 1: happened And I'm like, yeah, okay. When I was out
Speaker 1: there tearing them apart, and I had hit a guy
Speaker 1: so hard one time, I knocked myself out and and
Speaker 1: Soda the coach, took my helmet, which was my prize possession.
Speaker 1: I had to sit out for a week for concussion
Speaker 1: purposes and what have you. But we got back at
Speaker 1: and I played college football for two years at that
Speaker 1: particular college. And then and then one of the more
Speaker 1: extraordinary things about what I'm gonna say about your story,
Speaker 1: but really about you is the aspect that deals with
Speaker 1: your father and how you dealt with this betrayal, this treason,
Speaker 1: active treason, Yeah, which is you know, as someone who
Speaker 1: I grew up, you know, my father was my hero
Speaker 1: and you know, and I can't even imagine on any
Speaker 1: level how empty and horrible that must have felt. But
Speaker 1: you did something that I think is extraordinary. And can
Speaker 1: you talk about that? I mean, what happened with you
Speaker 1: and your dad when you got out. Yes, it's one
Speaker 1: of the situations where like when I remember coming up
Speaker 1: and my father always demanded an explanation as to why
Speaker 1: I done something, and so all I remember during that
Speaker 1: time and coming home is that this man never came
Speaker 1: to visit me. He never wrote me, he never sent
Speaker 1: me money packages and none of that. So he was
Speaker 1: like he turned his back on me. But he did
Speaker 1: always tell us, you know, I don't go visit people
Speaker 1: in jail. I put people in jail. I'm like, okay.
Speaker 1: So that that was my thought then, and it wasn't
Speaker 1: until we did the documentary After Innocence with Mark Simon
Speaker 1: and Jessica Sanders, and they interviewed him, but they never
Speaker 1: told me what he had told them until the documentary
Speaker 1: was complete and it was down on the big screen,
Speaker 1: and I'm sitting in this theater and I'm watching him.
Speaker 1: And when they did his interview, out of his mouth
Speaker 1: came the explanation as to why he did what he did.
Speaker 1: He said, I went with the evidence instead of the
Speaker 1: love of the child. And I immediately got up after
Speaker 1: that registered with me. I got up why the documentary
Speaker 1: were still going. I went to the hallway. I called
Speaker 1: my father and I said, you know, I always wondered
Speaker 1: why you did what you did, but I just heard
Speaker 1: your explanation. And it was at that moment I forgave
Speaker 1: him because I understood that once you become a police officer,
Speaker 1: you are trained to think a certain way, and now
Speaker 1: that I'm going to law school, I'm being trained to
Speaker 1: think a certain way. He was trained to go with
Speaker 1: the evidence. I'm being trained to go with the facts
Speaker 1: and make sure that the evidence lines up with the facts.
Speaker 1: So I was able to forgive him right then and there.
Speaker 1: And this happened in oh five when I just really
Speaker 1: got my explanation, and I went to my father and
Speaker 1: I told him, I forgive you. I get it. I understand. However,
Speaker 1: since the day I came home, my father has been
Speaker 1: spending majority of our time, and I've been home in
Speaker 1: nineteen years. He has been spending the majority of that
Speaker 1: time trying to make it up to me for the
Speaker 1: decision that he made. And I've been spending my time
Speaker 1: showing him I forgive you. You're my father, I love you.
Speaker 1: I talked to him regularly, I go visiting. But now
Speaker 1: I have to do it more so now than I
Speaker 1: have done over the last few years, because now he's
Speaker 1: dealing with azheimer and it's creeping up on him fast,
Speaker 1: and and I'm forced to state meeting to the bitter
Speaker 1: end because my greatest fear is now about to confront me.
Speaker 1: One day. He's gonna forget who I am. He's gonna
Speaker 1: forget that decision he made. He's gonna forget every life
Speaker 1: lesson that he's taught me. He's going to forget everything. Yes,
Speaker 1: now you have a bunch of grandchildren. Yes, I got
Speaker 1: seven of them, so that's great. You'd be graduating law school, Yes, awesome.
Speaker 1: And then, um, California has never compensated you, and that
Speaker 1: is obviously completely unacceptable. Is ironic because you were one
Speaker 1: of the people that was really responsible for changing those
Speaker 1: compensations to California used to be Believe it or not,
Speaker 1: Ya'll let you tell it. Well, it used to be
Speaker 1: ten thousand dollars. If you can prove that you were
Speaker 1: wrong to be convicted, you can get ten thousand dollars. Well,
Speaker 1: first of all, we didn't even know that law was
Speaker 1: on the books. Somehow another A c. L. You found it,
Speaker 1: and a couple of more other sharp attorneys found it,
Speaker 1: and we went an address and meaning me several other
Speaker 1: Axonorees Natasha Misker for the A c. L. You, We
Speaker 1: went before a panel. We were able to get that
Speaker 1: change from ten thousand total to a hundred dollars a day.
Speaker 1: And when I double back to apply for it, they
Speaker 1: told me you get nothing because statue of limitations have
Speaker 1: ran out on you. I'm like, huh, really, California owe
Speaker 1: me a half a million dollars. Yeah, And I think
Speaker 1: even then a hunter holls a day, that's thirty six
Speaker 1: five a year, And I think you have a hard
Speaker 1: time going on in the streets and asking people if
Speaker 1: they want to go into the sixth sy presents a day.
Speaker 1: You're not gonna get a lot of takers for that
Speaker 1: they could give me. It would being the best interest
Speaker 1: to give me my money now, because once I become
Speaker 1: an attorney, then I'm gonna come get it another way,
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna keep getting in and getting in. And
Speaker 1: when they asked me, well, why are you these lawsuits
Speaker 1: and this that another well, hell, you should have gave
Speaker 1: me my money, right, and now you're gonna get it on.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get it. Yeah, it's ironic, you're being a
Speaker 1: football player. And then they were moving the goal posts
Speaker 1: on your right. But that's the way it goes. Um.
Speaker 1: So everything about your story is extraordinary. I'm really grateful
Speaker 1: that you shared your story with my audience and with
Speaker 1: me here on Wrathful Conviction. And then now comes my
Speaker 1: favorite part of the show. This is a part of
Speaker 1: the show where I get to actually just thank you
Speaker 1: as I just did, and then turn my microphone off
Speaker 1: and just listen, and I leave it to you for
Speaker 1: the last few minutes for closing thoughts of anything. You
Speaker 1: want to talk about anything, it's all it's all you.
Speaker 1: It's your stage. Okay, here's here's the thing. One of
Speaker 1: the I travel this nation, I speak on judicial reform
Speaker 1: I work closely with the Innocent Project. I have dedicated
Speaker 1: my life to the work that they do, and there
Speaker 1: are some things that I found that contribute to our
Speaker 1: justice system being seriously flawed. But I first present this
Speaker 1: to anybody to hear my story. I say, each one,
Speaker 1: teach one, teach one, each one, and I present that
Speaker 1: challenge to the person, meaning what you have heard here today,
Speaker 1: go out and educate the next person. Because awareness is
Speaker 1: very important to solving any situation, and in this case,
Speaker 1: people needs to be aware of the fact that we
Speaker 1: have a seriously flawed justice system. It has accounted for
Speaker 1: individuals being wrothly convicted. There's a few individuals that has
Speaker 1: been killed in the justice system as a result of
Speaker 1: being wrothly convicted and executed. And these are the things
Speaker 1: that needs to stop now. The solution is is let's
Speaker 1: start at the base of the problem. See, it's not
Speaker 1: the justice system. I've come to realize the justice system
Speaker 1: will work perfectly if we get the right people to
Speaker 1: operate within it. And the problem comes into play as
Speaker 1: is when you got corrupt prosecutors who's getting wrong for convictions,
Speaker 1: are causing growth for conviction because they want to be politicians.
Speaker 1: They want to be judges, they want to be you know,
Speaker 1: counselmants and what have you. And because of that, they're
Speaker 1: willing to do anything to get a conviction. Then you
Speaker 1: got these corrupt police officers. Lord not to mention how
Speaker 1: they're just out here killing black males like it is
Speaker 1: the thing to do, like it's perfectly legal. Okay, we're
Speaker 1: dealing with a psychological problem the police department. We need
Speaker 1: to do two things. We need psych evaluation on these
Speaker 1: police officers, get them out of the way. And those
Speaker 1: that has caused problems we need to buy way of
Speaker 1: pictures motions. We need to go into their background, figure
Speaker 1: out who they are and start protesting to get them
Speaker 1: up out of there. And when you have a d
Speaker 1: A that don't want to file a case, when they're
Speaker 1: clearly there has been a violation of the law on
Speaker 1: behalf of the police, they don't want to file the case,
Speaker 1: then we need to start looking at that d A
Speaker 1: and sht that person down. You know, when it comes
Speaker 1: down to elections and things of that nature. And we
Speaker 1: got to always remember who these people are because what
Speaker 1: you feel to realize is the very people who was
Speaker 1: hollering back in the eighties and the nineties tough on crime. Yeah,
Speaker 1: what these people has caused a serious problem to Americans.
Speaker 1: Justice system is busting at the scenes. Taxpayers is paying
Speaker 1: for it. And now the taxpayers is looking back on it,
Speaker 1: and they said, wow, we can't afford to keep inmates.
Speaker 1: To start letting them out, letting the one is what
Speaker 1: nonviolent offenses out? This? That another wise, so you can
Speaker 1: cut the costs. So you should have thought about that
Speaker 1: when these politicians was hollering tough on crime. So in fact,
Speaker 1: let's read them individuals out and get rid of them,
Speaker 1: get them out of office as well. We need to
Speaker 1: overhaul our justice system by removing the very individuals that
Speaker 1: are creating the problems. I would like to see laws change.
Speaker 1: I would like to see when it comes down to compensation,
Speaker 1: that every state in America follow suit. I like how
Speaker 1: Texas has set their compensation package up and every state
Speaker 1: in America should follow that. I think that should be
Speaker 1: a federal law that all states has to do one
Speaker 1: thing in all honor of compensation. One of the things
Speaker 1: that people fail to realize is is that a person
Speaker 1: who has actually committed a crime can get out in
Speaker 1: any state and go to government funded organizations and receive
Speaker 1: all types of helps and resources to acclimate themselves back
Speaker 1: into society. A person who has been wrongly convicted, such
Speaker 1: as myself, is told to go back out in society
Speaker 1: and function the best way you can. There is no
Speaker 1: conversation package wherever a person has been proven wrong for convicted,
Speaker 1: where he can go get an education, where he can
Speaker 1: go and get housing, where he can get transportation, where
Speaker 1: he can get psychological help, where he could turn around
Speaker 1: and be a productive citizen in society with some type
Speaker 1: of employment or what have you. There's nothing set up
Speaker 1: for that, and so I would like to see that change.
Speaker 1: I'd like to see laws like that change. But the
Speaker 1: biggest thing I want to see happen, and I pray
Speaker 1: to God that I live to see it happen, is
Speaker 1: have that badge of immunity removed from them. Prosecutors, if
Speaker 1: you violate the very law that you swore to uphold
Speaker 1: and protect, then you should be prosecuted by it if
Speaker 1: you have indulged in the taking of a person's life.
Speaker 1: Because when you put somebody in prison, be it for
Speaker 1: a day, be it for or a month, be it
Speaker 1: for a year, be it for a decade. You have
Speaker 1: killed that person. You have killed that person, and the
Speaker 1: person that did it, the people that's involved, be at
Speaker 1: the prosecutors, be at the police. They all need to
Speaker 1: be held accountable for their actions. So I want to
Speaker 1: see accountability. I want to see that badge of immunity removed,
Speaker 1: not in one state and all states, in all states
Speaker 1: and all cities, regardless of how big or small, of
Speaker 1: what have you. And I would like to see society
Speaker 1: as a whole start focusing on what's going on over
Speaker 1: in Kansas with this blue sky. Oh my god, that
Speaker 1: rate there is textbook corruption. And if it went on there,
Speaker 1: it's just like the same thing that went on in
Speaker 1: California with the Rampart Division scandal. This stuff right here
Speaker 1: is common. The only thing that's bringing it to light
Speaker 1: now is social media, I think God, because the regular
Speaker 1: media it's not gonna televise what a person holding a
Speaker 1: camera up to the situation will televis. That means it's
Speaker 1: a close in person. And I thank God that you
Speaker 1: have those that hold your camera. I advise that you
Speaker 1: hold them up high because it is your heart, is
Speaker 1: your courage in the face of these corrupt police officers
Speaker 1: that is bringing about the truth in the matter. Thank
Speaker 1: you dropping a lot of knowledge and if you want
Speaker 1: to learn more about the loopski, listen to the lamon
Speaker 1: McEntire episode of Wrongful Conviction. You'll hear all about it.
Speaker 1: Thank you again for being here, Herman Atkins, and thank
Speaker 1: you everyone for listening. And I'll see you next week
Speaker 1: on wrong from Conviction. Don't forget to give us a
Speaker 1: fantastic review wherever you get your podcasts. It really helps.
Speaker 1: And I'm a proud donor to the Innocents Project and
Speaker 1: I really hope you'll join me in supporting this burying
Speaker 1: partant cause and helping to prevent future wrongful convictions. Go
Speaker 1: to Innocence Project dot org to learn how to donate
Speaker 1: and get involved. I'd like to thank our production team,
Speaker 1: Connor Hall and Kevin Wardis. The music in the show
Speaker 1: is by three time OSCAR nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be
Speaker 1: sure to follow us on Instagram at Wrongful Conviction and
Speaker 1: on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast. Wrongful Conviction with Jason
Speaker 1: Flam is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts and
Speaker 1: association with Signal Company Number one