1 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace Buried Alive? Is there anything 2 00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:22,880 Speaker 1: more terrifying than that? We often see it on movies 3 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:27,360 Speaker 1: and mystery movies, adventure movies, and in those movies, somehow 4 00:00:27,680 --> 00:00:31,360 Speaker 1: the person always manages to scramble back out. That is 5 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:35,800 Speaker 1: not always the case. And what kind of a mind 6 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:41,280 Speaker 1: does it take for a perp to bury a victim alive? 7 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:44,879 Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories, Thank you for 8 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:46,960 Speaker 1: being with us here at Fox Nation, in series like 9 00:00:47,479 --> 00:00:52,960 Speaker 1: one eleven. Buried Alive is exactly what happened to this 10 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 1: young victim? First of all, take a listen to our 11 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 1: friends at King five Muse. Right now, Lancy and police 12 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:00,920 Speaker 1: are looking for a woman believe to be kidnapped. Take 13 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 1: a look, please say Young Sukanne, who see right here, 14 00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:06,880 Speaker 1: was taken from her home in a light blue two 15 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:10,920 Speaker 1: thousand and six Dodge Grand Caravan. Officers believe he took 16 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:13,919 Speaker 1: the victim from her home and she is in danger tonight. 17 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:16,560 Speaker 1: They say, if you see either of them, call nine 18 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:31,920 Speaker 1: one one. Can you hear me? Woom? What's going on there? Okay, 19 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:35,399 Speaker 1: I'm gonna get help started you You can hear muffled 20 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: screaming as if someone has been duct taped. What we 21 00:01:42,160 --> 00:01:47,920 Speaker 1: learn is spine chilling. You were hearing our friends at 22 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:52,840 Speaker 1: King five as well as the victims nine one one 23 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 1: call she managed to make. Now take a listen to 24 00:01:57,240 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 1: our friens a k I R seven chilling new audio 25 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: now of a nine one one call from a woman 26 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 1: who was kidnapped, then bound and gagged with duct tape. 27 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:09,240 Speaker 1: She was able to call nine one one amazingly with 28 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 1: her Apple Watch, but she had duct tape over her mouth, 29 00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 1: so she could only mumble noises to the operators. Can 30 00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:31,360 Speaker 1: you hear me? What's going on there? Okay, I'm gonna 31 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:34,960 Speaker 1: get help started to a poor woman. That call goes 32 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 1: on for more than ten minutes and you can hear 33 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 1: she can't make out or enunciate anything about where she is, 34 00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 1: if she even knew where she was. With me and 35 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:46,480 Speaker 1: all star panel to make sense of what we know 36 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:52,560 Speaker 1: right now. Somehow this woman manages to think of calling 37 00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:56,280 Speaker 1: from her Apple Watch with me an all star panel 38 00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:59,079 Speaker 1: to make sense of this first too. Lisa daddy O, 39 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:03,880 Speaker 1: former police Loluke in Newhaven, PD, now Senior lecturer at 40 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:08,880 Speaker 1: the Director for Advanced Policing and Graduate Program coordinator at 41 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:12,480 Speaker 1: University Newhaven at Leasta, thanks for being with us. Explain 42 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: how that nine one one call was made from an 43 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 1: Apple Watch. Thank Nancy for having me. Technology is one 44 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: of those things it's constantly evolving and actually helping both 45 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:28,920 Speaker 1: those that use it and also enforcement when something this 46 00:03:29,000 --> 00:03:33,960 Speaker 1: horrific has happened. So the victims somehow manage to actually 47 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:38,960 Speaker 1: activate her watch to qual authorities, and there's an app 48 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:43,120 Speaker 1: that they can use if you're in crisis. It notifies 49 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 1: police departments, it notifies kind of who you identified to 50 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 1: be contacted if there's an emergency, and it keeps sending 51 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 1: out alerts along with approximate locations of where you are 52 00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 1: to help find you if something horrific has happened. And 53 00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 1: in this case, you have a female victim beaten, brutalized, 54 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 1: duct taped, her mouth, duct taped, and even buried alive. 55 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:15,480 Speaker 1: This woman, trying to keep her wits about her, manages 56 00:04:15,760 --> 00:04:21,560 Speaker 1: to call nine one one from the Apple her Apple Watch. 57 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:26,720 Speaker 1: It's amazing and you can hear her as she's desperately 58 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 1: trying to save her own life. So how does this 59 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:37,560 Speaker 1: lady end up buried alive? First of all, I want 60 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:40,599 Speaker 1: you to hear the sound we just play from KI 61 00:04:40,920 --> 00:04:43,680 Speaker 1: r O. Take a listen again as she tries to 62 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:47,360 Speaker 1: enunciate killing new audio now of a nine one one 63 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:50,600 Speaker 1: call from a woman who is kidnapped, then bound and 64 00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 1: gagged with duct tape. She was able to call nine 65 00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 1: one one amazingly with her Apple Watch, but she had 66 00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:59,440 Speaker 1: duct tape over her mouth, so she could only mumble 67 00:04:59,520 --> 00:05:16,359 Speaker 1: noises to the operators. Can you hear what's going on there? Okay, 68 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 1: I'm gonna get help, started to a poor woman. That 69 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 1: call goes on for more than ten minutes. Take a 70 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:25,159 Speaker 1: listen again to our friends at k I r O. 71 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 1: Of course, when someone makes a call from any phone, 72 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:34,360 Speaker 1: practically you just call our ID, and especially the number 73 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:38,640 Speaker 1: can be traced when an an Apple Watch is used, 74 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:42,359 Speaker 1: and that should be connected to the victim's name for 75 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:47,440 Speaker 1: billing purposes. But finding it in time to save a 76 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:52,160 Speaker 1: life is an altogether different matter. But here we do 77 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:56,279 Speaker 1: learn based on that a little bit of how she 78 00:05:56,400 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 1: comes to be buried alive, our friends at KRON This 79 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:03,080 Speaker 1: happened in a wooded area in Lacy, where the woman 80 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:06,920 Speaker 1: was buried in a shallow grave. What happened is incredibly disturbing. 81 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:10,560 Speaker 1: It started in this Lacy neighborhood, hunched her in the 82 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 1: head and threw her to the ground, before duct taping 83 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:16,560 Speaker 1: her arms behind her back, her ankles, and duct tape 84 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:18,920 Speaker 1: over her mouth and eyes. Then he put her into 85 00:06:18,960 --> 00:06:21,920 Speaker 1: a van and drove south to a wooded area. At 86 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 1: this point, cops are racing against the clock to try 87 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: and find a woman they believe to be incapacitated, not 88 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 1: realizing yet that she is under the dirt. What can 89 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,840 Speaker 1: they do? They now know where she lives, they know 90 00:06:41,320 --> 00:06:45,159 Speaker 1: possibly her name. The search is on. First they do 91 00:06:45,279 --> 00:06:50,119 Speaker 1: something really smart. They go to neighbors and they look 92 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 1: for ring doorbell video. Take a listen to our friends 93 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:58,839 Speaker 1: at Inside Edition. Here he is on a neighbor's ring 94 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:03,200 Speaker 1: camera after allegedly throwing her into the minivan and driving 95 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:06,800 Speaker 1: off to what he thought was her grave seven miles 96 00:07:06,839 --> 00:07:10,400 Speaker 1: away in Lacey, Washington. He's then accused of dragging her 97 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:14,720 Speaker 1: into the woods, digging a shallow grave, and burying her alive. 98 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 1: Now I'm trying to figure out what mind frame would 99 00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: bury someone alive with me the Psychoanalyst to the Stars, 100 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:28,080 Speaker 1: doctor Bethany Marshall, joining us from La Doctor Bethany, thank 101 00:07:28,080 --> 00:07:30,560 Speaker 1: you for being with us. She's a starving Netflix series 102 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:34,600 Speaker 1: Bleeding Empire. Bethany, You and I've talked about a lot 103 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 1: of murders, but burying someone alive, I mean, this is 104 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 1: not the first time that phenomena has happened. Take a 105 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 1: listen to you'll all remember this case. I referred to 106 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:52,280 Speaker 1: her as the girl in pink. It's Jessica Lunford from 107 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:55,040 Speaker 1: our friends. At AP, prosecutors started to lay out their 108 00:07:55,080 --> 00:07:58,120 Speaker 1: case against John Evander Cooey, accused of murdering nine year 109 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 1: old Jessica Lunford in two thousand and five. Prosecutors say 110 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:05,440 Speaker 1: DNA and other forensic evidence will show that Cooey, a 111 00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 1: convicted sex offender, took the third grader and her stuff Dolphintoy, 112 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 1: then buried her alive. She was put into plastic bags 113 00:08:13,640 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 1: with her dolphin, put in a hole. They're in the 114 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:23,800 Speaker 1: door with only the dolphin. She's suffocated. The evidence will 115 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:27,800 Speaker 1: show that the one man responsible for all of these 116 00:08:27,800 --> 00:08:31,200 Speaker 1: acts sitting right there. One of the first witnesses was 117 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 1: Jessica's father, Mark Lunsford, who told jurors he had spent 118 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 1: that fateful February night at his girlfriend's house and then 119 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:41,240 Speaker 1: came home to make a shocking discovery. That's right. Our 120 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:44,840 Speaker 1: friend Mark Lunsford came home to discover his little girl 121 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:47,520 Speaker 1: was gone. He hadn't just left her alone. He had 122 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:51,199 Speaker 1: left her with relatives. They were babysitting, and little did 123 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:56,400 Speaker 1: they know that Cooey, who was secretly living Caddy cornered 124 00:08:56,440 --> 00:09:00,960 Speaker 1: to their home, was back back with relatives. He wasn't 125 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,440 Speaker 1: supposed to be there. They had no idea he was there, 126 00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:09,440 Speaker 1: a convicted child predator just yards away from nine year 127 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:14,080 Speaker 1: old Jessica Lunsford, and she ended up being buried alive. Hey, 128 00:09:14,120 --> 00:09:16,360 Speaker 1: you know, doctor Bethany Marshall, hold on just a moment. 129 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:21,559 Speaker 1: I have a forensic question for doctor Jan gorneyac medical Examiner, 130 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:25,840 Speaker 1: Clark County Board Certified Forensic pathologist. And when I say 131 00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:29,040 Speaker 1: Clark County, there's a lot of Clark counties in the US, 132 00:09:29,280 --> 00:09:33,480 Speaker 1: but this one is in Vegas and there's never a 133 00:09:33,559 --> 00:09:36,320 Speaker 1: lack of business there. Doctor Gorneyak, thank you for being 134 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:40,280 Speaker 1: with us. How can you look at a body and tell, 135 00:09:41,840 --> 00:09:45,960 Speaker 1: of course they're asphyxiated, they're suffocated, But how can you 136 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:48,719 Speaker 1: tell that they were buried a lot of it? They 137 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: died buried down in the dirt. Oh, that's a fantastic question. 138 00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 1: So what we look for is any I mean, if 139 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:00,560 Speaker 1: they're buried alive, any dirt or any foreign to breathe 140 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 1: within their airway. I know that this lady was was gagged, 141 00:10:05,600 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 1: so it might have been unable to see that. But 142 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:14,320 Speaker 1: based on other signs on their body, as if they 143 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:17,800 Speaker 1: were fighting any of their injuries, dirt underneath their fingernails 144 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:21,880 Speaker 1: because they're trying to claw their their way out, that 145 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:23,920 Speaker 1: would be a sign that they were alive at the 146 00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 1: time they were buried. Time Stories with Nancy Grace, I 147 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 1: was thinking about Jessica Lunsford and it reminded me of 148 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:48,679 Speaker 1: the very first murder trial I ever had. I had 149 00:10:48,760 --> 00:10:52,400 Speaker 1: no idea what I was doing. The victim's name was Mary, 150 00:10:52,760 --> 00:10:56,920 Speaker 1: and she was asphyxiated with one of those clear plastic 151 00:10:57,160 --> 00:10:59,679 Speaker 1: laundry bags. She was bluntened, but that didn't kill her. 152 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:03,079 Speaker 1: And when I went to the medical examiner, there was 153 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: no mention of this doctor, Jeanne Gorniac in the autopsy report. 154 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:11,600 Speaker 1: But when wait, yes there was a mention of it, 155 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:14,160 Speaker 1: but it was just a line and it didn't make 156 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 1: any sense to me. And when I looked at her 157 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 1: autopsy photo, the one taken just before the postmortement begins. 158 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 1: She was lying there and there were dots all over 159 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:31,480 Speaker 1: her face and mouth, and I asked the medical examiner, 160 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:35,880 Speaker 1: what is that, and he told me it was where 161 00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 1: she had tried so desperately to breathe. She had inhaled 162 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:46,240 Speaker 1: the clear plastic laundry bag and there were tiny dots 163 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:49,280 Speaker 1: all around her mouth and nose. And there was one 164 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:54,240 Speaker 1: line in the autopsy report that said particles were removed 165 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:56,800 Speaker 1: from her mouth and nose. That I didn't know what 166 00:11:56,840 --> 00:11:59,680 Speaker 1: that meant. Then I saw the picture. Then I asked 167 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 1: the question and learned. And I'm just wondering. For instance, 168 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:06,160 Speaker 1: Jessica Lansford was put in the trash bag before she 169 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:11,520 Speaker 1: was buried alive, about the plastic actually going into her 170 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:15,080 Speaker 1: mouth and knows that she tried to breathe would be 171 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:18,200 Speaker 1: one thing that I believe I would note if I 172 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:22,240 Speaker 1: were a medical examiner like yourself. But you're saying that 173 00:12:22,520 --> 00:12:29,720 Speaker 1: precluding the burial in a bag or other covering, you 174 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:35,320 Speaker 1: would find microscopic debris in the lungs and the throat 175 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:38,960 Speaker 1: and the nasal passageway from dirt. That is correct. We 176 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:41,480 Speaker 1: might even see what we say grossly with the naked 177 00:12:41,520 --> 00:12:45,440 Speaker 1: eye as we open up the airway, because during a 178 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 1: postmortem examination we're looking at everything, so we might see 179 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:54,080 Speaker 1: it not only in the airway, but like you also mentioned, 180 00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 1: microscopically underneath the microscope in the lungs because they're they're inhaling. 181 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 1: You know you're you're inhaling, and in a case like 182 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:07,559 Speaker 1: this stands a garbage bag over somebody's face, there's plenty 183 00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:12,120 Speaker 1: of opportunity for particles to go in the mouth up 184 00:13:12,160 --> 00:13:15,240 Speaker 1: to nose and be able to see once again in 185 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,280 Speaker 1: the in the airway and microscopically in the lung But 186 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:21,960 Speaker 1: then it's also becomes there's so many different ways. When 187 00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:25,000 Speaker 1: you say asphyxiation, right, you have smothering and have suffocation. 188 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:27,480 Speaker 1: So in a case like this, it will be a 189 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:31,000 Speaker 1: combination of a lot because you have a clusion from 190 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 1: the outside of your nose and mouth, so you know 191 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,400 Speaker 1: someone is being smothered so from the outside, so you 192 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 1: have smothering from the outside and then choking from the inside. 193 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: So essentially, when you get for material into your airway, 194 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:46,360 Speaker 1: you're choking. Okay, hold on, I gotta take in what 195 00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:49,240 Speaker 1: you're saying, doctor, gourney called on just a moment, I 196 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:52,240 Speaker 1: gotta digest what you're saying. I'm sorry, I hadn't thought 197 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:54,840 Speaker 1: of it. I hadn't thought. No, no, no, no, you're 198 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:57,800 Speaker 1: just about up warp speed ahead of the rest of us, 199 00:13:58,160 --> 00:13:59,959 Speaker 1: or at least ahead of me. Everybody else call me 200 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 1: understands that. Just I've never thought about that, maybe because 201 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:07,400 Speaker 1: I didn't want to about the choking aspect of this 202 00:14:07,559 --> 00:14:12,400 Speaker 1: scenario where the victim is actually choking. They're trying desperately 203 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 1: to breathe and they're choking on the dirt. Correct. So, 204 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:20,480 Speaker 1: like I said, you have the smothering, which is you know, 205 00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:22,920 Speaker 1: you're you're covering up the nose in the mouth so 206 00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:27,000 Speaker 1: air can't get in. So sometimes the air can get in. 207 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:29,400 Speaker 1: And then while you're getting the air in, you're also 208 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 1: bringing foreign materials into your airway. And so once you 209 00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:37,840 Speaker 1: occlude or close off your airway inside in your in 210 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:40,600 Speaker 1: your neck and your throat, then that becomes a choking. 211 00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:43,920 Speaker 1: And I add another layer to that. It's just doctor 212 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 1: Besianie Marshall. Yes, yes, yes, Well, in order to be 213 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:50,320 Speaker 1: able to breathe, you have to be able to expand 214 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,680 Speaker 1: your chest to bring air into your lungs and dirt 215 00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:58,000 Speaker 1: is very heavy, so correct and just six six inches 216 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:00,800 Speaker 1: of dirt on your body is to preclude you for 217 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:03,840 Speaker 1: being able to expand your ribcage, and so that would 218 00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:07,960 Speaker 1: be yet another desperate feeling this woman was supposed to that. 219 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: That's a great We also consider that. We call it 220 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:15,120 Speaker 1: positional asphixiation or mechanical asshixiation, where you have something heavy 221 00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: that's on your body, in this case dirt limbs from trees, 222 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 1: and you can't expand you can't take adequate breaths, so 223 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,080 Speaker 1: you're going to suffocate that way because you can't expand 224 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:28,560 Speaker 1: your your diaphragm in your law. Okay, doctor Bethany Marshall, 225 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 1: Now I know why I hadn't really thought it through 226 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:36,440 Speaker 1: because it's horrible. And everybody on our palel right now 227 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:40,240 Speaker 1: sees these type of crime, sees murder every day, but 228 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:46,000 Speaker 1: you don't see a burial alive every day. It's actually 229 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:48,320 Speaker 1: pretty rare. Have you heard of it that much? Jackie? 230 00:15:48,360 --> 00:15:52,360 Speaker 1: I am not. I mean I've had it, I've investigated it, 231 00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 1: I've worked it. But you know, doctor Bethany Marshall, when 232 00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:59,640 Speaker 1: you take the victim out of the ground, of course, 233 00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:01,800 Speaker 1: they're all covered with dirt, and it's in their hair, 234 00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:04,480 Speaker 1: it's in their mouth, their ears, their nose, their eyes. 235 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:09,000 Speaker 1: But it's only when, is doctor Jean Gorniak, Vegas Medical Examiner, 236 00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 1: as she described, you look into the air passages. That's 237 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:16,360 Speaker 1: when you find out they're buried alive. Now, my question 238 00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 1: to you, doctor Bethany Marshall, is killing is one thing, 239 00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:25,720 Speaker 1: and that's bad enough, okay, but burying someone alive is 240 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:30,640 Speaker 1: just no mercy. That is one cold s O B 241 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:34,000 Speaker 1: that would do that to this lady, Nancy. There's another 242 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:36,760 Speaker 1: burying a life that we don't consider, although we see 243 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:39,440 Speaker 1: it all the time and we cover it on your show. 244 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 1: And that is instance who are either flushed down the 245 00:16:42,520 --> 00:16:45,440 Speaker 1: toilet's round or throw them in the trash. That's a 246 00:16:45,440 --> 00:16:48,440 Speaker 1: different kind of bearing alife. Waite a minute, White a 247 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:52,400 Speaker 1: minute it wait wait wait wait, okay, you're saying a baby, Yes, okay, 248 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:57,240 Speaker 1: a baby. It may not be mesodical thought out in 249 00:16:57,320 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 1: quite the same way, but I think the psychology might 250 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:04,160 Speaker 1: be similar. So a woman who has an unwanted baby, 251 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:06,720 Speaker 1: she never bonds to the baby. Your way out in 252 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:10,120 Speaker 1: the weeds, Bethany, no offense, but you really really are, 253 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:13,359 Speaker 1: Can I just get the bus back in the middle 254 00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:19,000 Speaker 1: of the road. We're talking about a grown woman buried, 255 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:24,720 Speaker 1: bound and gagged and buried covered up with dirt, and 256 00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:28,120 Speaker 1: the poor thing tries to call nine one one from 257 00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:32,840 Speaker 1: her Apple watch. Okay, Now you can just percolate about 258 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:37,320 Speaker 1: infants and toilet bowls for a moment, but I'm gonna 259 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:39,560 Speaker 1: get us back on. Tryp in this case and what 260 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:44,680 Speaker 1: happened to this victim and similar victims buried alive victims. Now, 261 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:47,199 Speaker 1: I talked to you about Jessica Lunford, a case that 262 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 1: I know very very well and personally went to Florida 263 00:17:52,720 --> 00:17:57,399 Speaker 1: and investigated. But there are others. Take a listen to 264 00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:01,960 Speaker 1: our cut twenty nine. Listen to these these oh man, 265 00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:07,240 Speaker 1: this is from for Jax. Reggie and Carol Sumner were 266 00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:11,000 Speaker 1: reported missing from their home. They've been buried alive. Prosecutors 267 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:13,800 Speaker 1: said the couple was kidnapped from their Saint Nicholas home, 268 00:18:13,920 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: forced to make cash withdrawals from ATMs, then buried alive 269 00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:21,480 Speaker 1: in Charlton County, Georgia. Shovels and crime scene photos were 270 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:24,760 Speaker 1: shown at trial. Other evidence were photos of the defendants 271 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:27,959 Speaker 1: posing with money and drinking champagne in the back of 272 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:32,919 Speaker 1: a limo. Okay, Troy Slayton, dare I conjure that name up? 273 00:18:33,240 --> 00:18:37,920 Speaker 1: Troy Slayton, high profile LA criminal defense attorney at Slate Lawyers. 274 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:40,640 Speaker 1: You can find them on Twitter at Troy Slayton. Now, 275 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:43,919 Speaker 1: Troy Slayton, I'm sure you always have a comeback for 276 00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:47,679 Speaker 1: everything I throw at you. But buried alive? And what 277 00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:52,560 Speaker 1: about these these two listen drinking champagne and posing with 278 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 1: the victims money in the back of a limo right 279 00:18:56,640 --> 00:18:59,880 Speaker 1: after they bury them alive. They're down, they're trying to breathe, 280 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 1: and they're posing with champagne and money in the back 281 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,200 Speaker 1: of a limo. What do you do with that? Slaton? Well, 282 00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:09,680 Speaker 1: that's pretty tough, Nancy. And you know we're not in 283 00:19:09,720 --> 00:19:13,720 Speaker 1: the business of criminal defense because things are easy. Why 284 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:16,080 Speaker 1: are you in it for the money? Because I would 285 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:21,720 Speaker 1: charge them a lot of money. I mean, hey, slat, 286 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:24,240 Speaker 1: let me ask you a question, just a little detour here. 287 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:29,360 Speaker 1: Most criminal defense attorneys that I know that handle murder cases, 288 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 1: they're like, you got to pay me up front. I 289 00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:33,800 Speaker 1: wouldn't touch this with a ten foot poll unless you 290 00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 1: throw down one hundred grand right now. I mean, with 291 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:39,800 Speaker 1: a case like this, I guess you get paid up front, 292 00:19:39,920 --> 00:19:42,480 Speaker 1: right the money aside, Nancy, I know you are going 293 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 1: to answer. Prosecutors like you are thrilled when they can 294 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:52,240 Speaker 1: show a depraved indifference to human life, when they can 295 00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:57,440 Speaker 1: show that not only did the person do something wrong, 296 00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:00,800 Speaker 1: but that they did it with such an evil heart 297 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:05,240 Speaker 1: that it makes the jury, it prays on the jury's 298 00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:09,719 Speaker 1: passions and prejudice, and wants to throw the person away forever. 299 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:13,199 Speaker 1: How about the hard evidence. Speaking of hard evidence, you 300 00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 1: know those two there in the back of the limo, 301 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:17,640 Speaker 1: drinking champagne and showing off to all the money they 302 00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:20,680 Speaker 1: just stole from the victims that are gagging and trying 303 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:24,440 Speaker 1: to breathe and dying underground taking listen to first coat 304 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 1: and knees. There's more. Thirty three year old Tiffany Cole 305 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,480 Speaker 1: was one of three people convicted in the crime. Alan 306 00:20:29,520 --> 00:20:32,560 Speaker 1: Wade and Cole's boyfriend Michael Jackson, the man identified as 307 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:35,400 Speaker 1: the mastermind, also sit on death row. A third man, 308 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:38,520 Speaker 1: Bruce Nixon, testified against the others and is serving forty 309 00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:42,879 Speaker 1: five years in prison. Prosecutors said the four conspirators kidnapped, robbed, 310 00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:45,679 Speaker 1: and buried this couple, sixty one year old Carol and 311 00:20:45,760 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 1: Reggie Sumner, burying them alive in Charlton County, Georgia. Tiffany 312 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:53,400 Speaker 1: Cole and the three others were arrested and charged with murder. 313 00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 1: According to police, Cole knew the Sumners and had even 314 00:20:56,560 --> 00:20:59,439 Speaker 1: bought a car from them. They say she provided the 315 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:02,920 Speaker 1: link the couple was kidnapped and robbed. Their bodies found 316 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:06,359 Speaker 1: in a shallow grieve in Georgia, and during her trial, 317 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:10,439 Speaker 1: Cole pointed the finger at her boyfriend, Michael Jackson. But 318 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:13,480 Speaker 1: please remember that I didn't do this. I'm not the 319 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:16,760 Speaker 1: monster that created this, but I'm sorry I met him. Okay, 320 00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:18,600 Speaker 1: wait a minute, Jackie. Wasn't she the one posing in 321 00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:21,960 Speaker 1: the back of the limo with a ship? Okay yeah, yeah, 322 00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:24,919 Speaker 1: not steel, Yeah, big smile on her face. Yeah, he 323 00:21:25,040 --> 00:21:27,720 Speaker 1: made me drink that champagne and count all that money 324 00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:30,359 Speaker 1: in those photos. Well listen to this one. Here's a 325 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 1: guy who buries his daughter alive as punishment and ps, 326 00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:41,399 Speaker 1: she's just six years old. Our cut thirty one from CBS. 327 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:44,960 Speaker 1: A Green County man behind bars facing child abuse charges 328 00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:48,160 Speaker 1: after police say he assaulted his six year old daughter 329 00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:51,679 Speaker 1: According to a criminal complaint, the victims stated to a 330 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:55,160 Speaker 1: CYS worker that her father, fifty year old John Kraft, 331 00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:58,520 Speaker 1: would hit her with his hands, belt, and arm which 332 00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:02,000 Speaker 1: had a metal plate inside. Her older brother also reporting 333 00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:05,320 Speaker 1: to CYS he witnessed Kraft bury his sister in the 334 00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:08,760 Speaker 1: yard on one occasion, leaving her outside in the freezing 335 00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:12,480 Speaker 1: cold all night. Paperwork says the child reported to CYS 336 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:15,840 Speaker 1: Kraft did this as punishment when he thought she was lying. 337 00:22:16,280 --> 00:22:19,680 Speaker 1: Police say the child stepmother interviewed at least once when 338 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:22,280 Speaker 1: Kraft was assaulting to six year old, and gave her 339 00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:25,080 Speaker 1: a bath one night after she was buried alive. Oh, 340 00:22:25,119 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 1: dear Lord in heaven. Okay, let's get back to this 341 00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:32,640 Speaker 1: case right here. Who would bury a woman alive, bait 342 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:37,480 Speaker 1: her a duct taper and bury her alive? Well, the 343 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 1: police are on it. Take a listen hour cut twelve 344 00:22:39,960 --> 00:22:42,760 Speaker 1: from Keen five. Their daughter told police the two were 345 00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 1: going through a divorce and On would come by their 346 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:49,160 Speaker 1: home in Lacy to do laundry. Security camera footage shared 347 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 1: by a neighbor shows a man who authorities say was 348 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:55,919 Speaker 1: identified as On, pulling a minivan into the garage. The 349 00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:59,320 Speaker 1: van is later seen speeding out of the neighborhood. Those 350 00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:03,879 Speaker 1: probable documents alleged On attacked his wife, tying her up 351 00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:06,600 Speaker 1: with duct tape. He then drove her into the woods 352 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:10,119 Speaker 1: not far from their home, dug a hole, and placed 353 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:14,199 Speaker 1: her in the ground. Her husband, that's who. Isn't that 354 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:16,960 Speaker 1: right with me? Dave Matt, investigative reporter with a crime 355 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: online dot com Her husband that she had a tro 356 00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:25,119 Speaker 1: temporary straining order against which was not worth the paper 357 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:28,600 Speaker 1: it's written on apparently, but she was letting him come 358 00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:31,400 Speaker 1: by and do his laundry there. I'm not blaming her, 359 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:35,440 Speaker 1: I'm blaming him. But that's who we're saying, who would 360 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:40,760 Speaker 1: do this? What kind of creepy, sadistic stranger predator would 361 00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:43,480 Speaker 1: do this? It's her husband, you know, Nancy, that t 362 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:47,639 Speaker 1: R had actually expired. And again yeah, just as a 363 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:52,080 Speaker 1: point of reference here, he came over, okay, to her house, 364 00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:54,399 Speaker 1: and this is the part that gets me, because she 365 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:56,959 Speaker 1: had the wherewithal to use her Apple watch. You know, 366 00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:01,120 Speaker 1: he pounded her in the head, beat the crap out 367 00:24:01,119 --> 00:24:03,879 Speaker 1: of her book before he was able to put the 368 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:08,320 Speaker 1: tape on her face, and so she actually had, you know, 369 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:10,720 Speaker 1: in a real fight It's not like in the movies 370 00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:13,080 Speaker 1: are on TV. Now, when you hit in the head 371 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 1: you go dizzy. You know, when you get hit in 372 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:18,960 Speaker 1: the head, you really do kind of come unraveled a bit. 373 00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,959 Speaker 1: But she was able to keep her mind about her 374 00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 1: to use that Apple Watch. And hey, kudos to the 375 00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:30,360 Speaker 1: nine one one operator for trying to get information so 376 00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:33,439 Speaker 1: that she could identify where this call was coming. You 377 00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:35,920 Speaker 1: know what else, Dave mac Normally we light into the 378 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:40,800 Speaker 1: nile on operators because they're like, okay, what are you wearing? 379 00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:46,119 Speaker 1: Just like stopp This one operator was incredible, So the 380 00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:49,840 Speaker 1: police are on it. Now what unfolded that day? How 381 00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:52,919 Speaker 1: does she end up buried alive? Taking listen to our 382 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,359 Speaker 1: friends at crime Online. Young suk On returns home from 383 00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 1: church to find her estranged husband at the home. As 384 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:02,840 Speaker 1: the to discuss their pending divorce, Young Szukan sent her 385 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:06,920 Speaker 1: children to another area. Shayon allegedly says he would rather 386 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:10,040 Speaker 1: kill his wife than give her his retirement money. He 387 00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:13,159 Speaker 1: then reportedly ties her hands behind her back with duct tape. 388 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:16,320 Speaker 1: He also ties her at the thighs and ankles, and 389 00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:20,000 Speaker 1: puts tape over her eyes. Young Sukon was however, able 390 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,119 Speaker 1: to call nine one one using her Apple Watch. She 391 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:27,000 Speaker 1: also sends an emergency alert to her trusted contacts, including 392 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:30,360 Speaker 1: her eldest child. Though nine one Dispatch could not make 393 00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:32,760 Speaker 1: out what was happening on the call since young Szukan 394 00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:36,200 Speaker 1: was gagged, they did track the call. When police arrived 395 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:39,560 Speaker 1: at the home, Shayon allegedly had already left, with his 396 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: wife captive in his van. Okay, Doctor Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst, 397 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:48,520 Speaker 1: joining us out of Beverly Hills. It's not as if 398 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 1: it's any better. He's not even saying I can't live 399 00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:53,919 Speaker 1: without you. He's saying, I'm not going to give you 400 00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:56,639 Speaker 1: half my retirement money, so I'm going to beat you, 401 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:01,200 Speaker 1: duct tape you, and bury you a lot for his 402 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:04,000 Speaker 1: retirement money. I don't even believe that. You know, these 403 00:26:04,040 --> 00:26:07,280 Speaker 1: criminals come up with all kinds of explanations for why 404 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 1: they do what they do, but usually the real reason, 405 00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:13,640 Speaker 1: deep down is something totally totally different. And I think 406 00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:17,920 Speaker 1: people who perpetrators who bury somebody alive, they have such 407 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:20,520 Speaker 1: disregard for life. But by that, I mean it's not 408 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:22,959 Speaker 1: that they just want to kill the person, but the 409 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:26,879 Speaker 1: idea that that person free, that person sees, that person loves, 410 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:31,160 Speaker 1: that person is a sentient human being, is not really 411 00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:33,480 Speaker 1: so much on their radar. I mean, I mean often 412 00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:38,760 Speaker 1: we think of chealousy and the resentment, simmering resentment as 413 00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:42,880 Speaker 1: being motivations for homicide. In this case, I almost think 414 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,400 Speaker 1: that he didn't see her as a real human being, 415 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,320 Speaker 1: and so I think this is just a low functioning 416 00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:52,200 Speaker 1: jerk who's lurking around her house just thinking about how 417 00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:54,679 Speaker 1: to get her out of the way for whatever reason. 418 00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:58,560 Speaker 1: Who knows, whatever reason is kind of percolating in his mind. 419 00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:01,919 Speaker 1: So the police are on it, and that call us 420 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:06,040 Speaker 1: actually made from her Apple Watch after he hits her 421 00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,919 Speaker 1: in the head, like Dave Matt was telling us, she's 422 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:12,560 Speaker 1: bound and gagged, duct tape across her mouth at the home. 423 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:16,680 Speaker 1: That's when she makes that apple Watch call. Then we 424 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:21,520 Speaker 1: have the miracle take a listen to k The victim 425 00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:23,480 Speaker 1: says she was put into a hole in the ground 426 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:25,239 Speaker 1: with a tree put on top of her before her 427 00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 1: husband started burying her with dirt. She told police she 428 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,439 Speaker 1: was in the ground for a few hours and feared 429 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:33,919 Speaker 1: she would die. Eventually, she was able to get her 430 00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 1: hands free as well as her feet free from that 431 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,720 Speaker 1: duct tape and managed to get out of the shallow grave. 432 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,159 Speaker 1: Documents say she ran through the woods for about thirty 433 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:44,680 Speaker 1: minutes before finding a road in a house just after 434 00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 1: midnight on Monday, and begged them to call nine one 435 00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:52,680 Speaker 1: one and more from KROO seven. Probable cause documents tell 436 00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:55,480 Speaker 1: us that man came back in the room, found her 437 00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:58,200 Speaker 1: apple watch, and he smashed it with a hammer while 438 00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:01,280 Speaker 1: it was still on her wrist, but the call continued. 439 00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:04,040 Speaker 1: She told police he drove her to the woods. He 440 00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,560 Speaker 1: stabbed her in the chest and buried her alive, but 441 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,280 Speaker 1: she was eventually able to regal through the dirt, get 442 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:12,399 Speaker 1: out of that hole and run away. That woman amazingly 443 00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:14,919 Speaker 1: ran through the woods for half an hour. She found 444 00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:17,520 Speaker 1: a house where the owner called nine one one. Sheriff's 445 00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:22,000 Speaker 1: deputies responded for help. Police say her estranged husband's motive 446 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,199 Speaker 1: was losing money in their upcoming divorce. Young sook On 447 00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:28,200 Speaker 1: escape the shallow grave. Her estranged husband put her in. 448 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:31,200 Speaker 1: She said. Shay On attacked her, doug the grave and 449 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:34,200 Speaker 1: put her inside. He placed a heavy tree on her 450 00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:37,480 Speaker 1: and then threw dirt on her. Detectives say the whole 451 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:40,440 Speaker 1: Young soooked On was buried in was sixty five inches long, 452 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:44,680 Speaker 1: thirty inches wide, and nineteen inches deep. Inside there was 453 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:48,160 Speaker 1: loose dirt, duct tape, and hair consistent with young soook 454 00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:50,680 Speaker 1: On to Lisa, Daddy a joining me for a police 455 00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:55,160 Speaker 1: lieutenant at new Haven PD now at University new Haven 456 00:28:55,240 --> 00:29:01,120 Speaker 1: in a center for advanced policing. Lisa sounds as if 457 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:05,400 Speaker 1: it was very well planned, if he dug that hole 458 00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:13,840 Speaker 1: ahead of time, sixty five anches long like a burial spot. Yeah, 459 00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:17,080 Speaker 1: I mean it's it was definitely premeditated and pre planned. 460 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:19,280 Speaker 1: I mean, you just don't wake up one day say hey, 461 00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:22,000 Speaker 1: I'm gonna, you know, assault my wife and then I'm 462 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 1: going to find somewhere to put her, and then while 463 00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:25,520 Speaker 1: she's there, I'm going to dig a grave. It's something 464 00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,440 Speaker 1: that he's been planning for god knows how long, and 465 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:32,600 Speaker 1: investigators will find that out. They'll be able to get 466 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:36,840 Speaker 1: a pretty good timeline on when he started this thing 467 00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:40,080 Speaker 1: by looking at a lot of different things, credit card usage, 468 00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:46,760 Speaker 1: video footage, possibly even cell phone his cell phone method 469 00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:49,240 Speaker 1: to kind of try to figure out how long he's 470 00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 1: been planning. This not going to change the facts of 471 00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:54,720 Speaker 1: the case, because it doesn't but it just shows that 472 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:57,560 Speaker 1: this wasn't just like you know, there's premeditation here no 473 00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:59,760 Speaker 1: matter which way you look at it, just a matter 474 00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 1: of how how long he's been planning this. To you, 475 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 1: Dave Matt Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, it seems 476 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:11,479 Speaker 1: like the motive is very clear. It's not a love crime, 477 00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:16,200 Speaker 1: which does not make it any less horrible, but it's 478 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:20,520 Speaker 1: about his money. They're getting a divorce and he does 479 00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:23,600 Speaker 1: not want her to get half his retirement money. That's 480 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:27,600 Speaker 1: what it's all about about money. This is a money 481 00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:42,760 Speaker 1: motivated crime solved down right down to the nitty gritty 482 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 1: time stories with Nancy Grace. TROYE Layton, You know, I 483 00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:54,760 Speaker 1: see a lot of homicides, a lot of them, but 484 00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,360 Speaker 1: there's something about the money motive. And of course the 485 00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:00,800 Speaker 1: state doesn't have to prove why he did it, but 486 00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:04,719 Speaker 1: I think juries like to hear what's the motive. You know, 487 00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:10,240 Speaker 1: that is why murder for pecuniary gain is an aggravating 488 00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 1: circumstance for the death penalty because it is so cold 489 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:19,600 Speaker 1: and so calculated. Wouldn't you agree, Troy that most murders, 490 00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:24,000 Speaker 1: most homicides are not well thought out. There's not a 491 00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:26,920 Speaker 1: long plan, like I'm going to poison them every week 492 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:29,920 Speaker 1: with arsenic until they kill over six months from now. 493 00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 1: It's not like in the movies at all, just bam, 494 00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:38,360 Speaker 1: they're They're dead, just like that. But a motive, a 495 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:44,760 Speaker 1: money motive, murder has a whole another layer of coldness. Yes, Nancy, 496 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:48,960 Speaker 1: most murders happen in spur of the moment, but this 497 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 1: was a case that involved a lot of planning. The 498 00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:59,239 Speaker 1: suspect here is a former military intelligence and you know 499 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,640 Speaker 1: he tried. He had the wherewithal to smash the apple 500 00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,400 Speaker 1: watch that kept working even though he smashed it with 501 00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 1: the hammer. And so in this case, the death penalty 502 00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,160 Speaker 1: is not going to be on the table because this 503 00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 1: was an attempted murder. There wasn't, thank goodness, it wasn't 504 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:19,760 Speaker 1: a completed crime. But then there's also domestic violence, kidnapping, 505 00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:24,080 Speaker 1: domestic violence, assault, and so there's going to be a 506 00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:26,640 Speaker 1: lot of charges that can be piled up to keep 507 00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 1: him behind bars for a very long time. But I 508 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,960 Speaker 1: don't think this is even necessarily presumptive life sentence without 509 00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:37,880 Speaker 1: the possibility of parole. You know, thinking about that money 510 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,440 Speaker 1: motive and the fact to you, doctor Bethany Marshall that 511 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,600 Speaker 1: she would steal and this guy's in military intelligence. I'd 512 00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:48,040 Speaker 1: like to hear what role that plays in this, if any, 513 00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:51,960 Speaker 1: maybe as to his personality or who is where withal 514 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 1: to pull off a murder. And the fact that she 515 00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:58,320 Speaker 1: would let him come over and do the laundry. You 516 00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:00,600 Speaker 1: know what, you remember the war the Roses. I still 517 00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:04,480 Speaker 1: remember that it was Michael Douglas and Kathleen Turner in 518 00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:08,840 Speaker 1: their heyday and they were either getting a divorce or 519 00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:11,240 Speaker 1: the property settlement or something, and they were sharing this big, 520 00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:14,600 Speaker 1: huge mansion and they ended up killing didn't They both 521 00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:16,120 Speaker 1: die in the end? I hate to be a spoiler, 522 00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:19,000 Speaker 1: but it was twenty years ago, so that's your problem. Okay, 523 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:21,400 Speaker 1: that's on you. So they both die in the inn, 524 00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:24,960 Speaker 1: in the middle of a struggle. That's the whole point. 525 00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:30,600 Speaker 1: There's a reason somebody's inn. X. Don't let him come 526 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,719 Speaker 1: over and do the laundry. But Nancy, you know this 527 00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:37,840 Speaker 1: is the plight of the abused woman, and that it's 528 00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:40,880 Speaker 1: easy for her to feel guilty, to become confused, to 529 00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:44,480 Speaker 1: blame herself, and then to let the perpetrator back in. 530 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:47,680 Speaker 1: You were talking about money as a motive. Forty four 531 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:52,719 Speaker 1: percent of all crimes are over property disputes and or money. 532 00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:56,680 Speaker 1: I mean is it is a very common motivator. The 533 00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:58,640 Speaker 1: guy that the fact that the sky was in the 534 00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:02,240 Speaker 1: armed services or military, I would guess that he was 535 00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:08,080 Speaker 1: homicidal first, and then being around maybe guns weapons people 536 00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:12,879 Speaker 1: who are strategizing maybe stimulated this latent tendency in him. 537 00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,040 Speaker 1: But I want to stay one more thing, and that 538 00:34:15,160 --> 00:34:20,120 Speaker 1: is about the dirt being buried. Duck taping her and 539 00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:23,440 Speaker 1: throwing her in the earth. It's as if he wanted 540 00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 1: her gone, but he was too squeamish to do it himself, 541 00:34:28,520 --> 00:34:30,600 Speaker 1: so he was going to let the earth do it 542 00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:33,400 Speaker 1: for him. I know that sounds strange, but it's like 543 00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:36,360 Speaker 1: he attacked her from behind. He did not want to 544 00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:39,920 Speaker 1: be seen. He threw her in the pack of his suv. 545 00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:42,120 Speaker 1: He put her in a shallow grape. Didn't he put 546 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:45,279 Speaker 1: a big like a tree limb on top. It's like 547 00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:48,160 Speaker 1: he wanted to walk away and just hoped the dirty 548 00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:51,560 Speaker 1: deed would be done. But he didn't want to look, 549 00:34:51,920 --> 00:34:54,040 Speaker 1: in a sense at the whites of her eyes as 550 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:55,719 Speaker 1: he was doing it. You know, we see life was 551 00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:58,800 Speaker 1: stabbing and choking and all of these kinds of crimes, 552 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:01,920 Speaker 1: those are off and crimes of passion where the guy 553 00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:05,080 Speaker 1: is getting out a lot of negative aspect or emotion 554 00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:07,680 Speaker 1: as he's killing the wife. I mean, I know he 555 00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:10,080 Speaker 1: stabbed her in the chest, but he did let the 556 00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:12,000 Speaker 1: dirt do it for him. He just hoped that it 557 00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:14,560 Speaker 1: would happen and that he could just not think about 558 00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,480 Speaker 1: it anymore. You know, I see a whole thesis paper 559 00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:22,240 Speaker 1: for you, doctor Bethany Marshall, on the aspects of burying 560 00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:27,480 Speaker 1: someone alive, not having the guts to carry through and 561 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:31,839 Speaker 1: actually murder them, but to let them die in the 562 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:35,319 Speaker 1: most horrific way, one of the most horrific ways I 563 00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:39,120 Speaker 1: can think of. And he left a trail a mile wide. 564 00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:42,600 Speaker 1: Take a listen to Komo. Neighbors didn't want to talk 565 00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:46,400 Speaker 1: on camera, but shared surveillance video of the terrified victim 566 00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:49,880 Speaker 1: walking up to their door for help. Surveillance also captured 567 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:53,240 Speaker 1: officers looking for signs of the suspect and other evidence. 568 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:55,360 Speaker 1: We had found a tape in the home and we 569 00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:58,120 Speaker 1: believe that he used it to bind her hands, and 570 00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:02,520 Speaker 1: she infected that her hands were bound and more from 571 00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:06,760 Speaker 1: our friend Less an inside edition, It sounds like something 572 00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:10,799 Speaker 1: from a movie. The terror of being buried alive. Imagine 573 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:14,120 Speaker 1: it happening for real. Somehow, the brave mom of two 574 00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:16,439 Speaker 1: shoved and kicked her way out of that nineteen inch 575 00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:19,400 Speaker 1: grape and ran through the wood for about thirty minutes 576 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:22,879 Speaker 1: before she found a house and raised the alarm. Her 577 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:28,240 Speaker 1: strange husband, identified as chay On, was captured. His traumatized wife, 578 00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:32,280 Speaker 1: young On begged the court not to release him on bail. 579 00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:36,799 Speaker 1: These are her words, Please no bail. I am really 580 00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:40,040 Speaker 1: afraid from my life. I just want to emphasize that 581 00:36:40,120 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 1: I fear him so much and he will kill me 582 00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:46,480 Speaker 1: again if he is out to you, Doctor Jan Gorniac, 583 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:51,080 Speaker 1: Medical Examiner, Clark County in Vegas, how often do you 584 00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:55,640 Speaker 1: see it's called a domestic homicide, which to me makes 585 00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 1: it fat sound way too warm and fuzzy. Where these 586 00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:03,719 Speaker 1: women have gotten tps temporary protective orders, restraining orders, and 587 00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:08,440 Speaker 1: yet they end up dead in your office on your table. US, 588 00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:12,600 Speaker 1: it's happened, you know more than we want to acknowledge, 589 00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:17,279 Speaker 1: and it's it's unfortunate, um. And it said that you 590 00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:21,240 Speaker 1: know you have these protective orders, um, and either party 591 00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:24,960 Speaker 1: you know it could be the woman that says, you know, 592 00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:26,879 Speaker 1: even though I have this protection order, I must still 593 00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:30,200 Speaker 1: allow him to come to the laundry or habit and 594 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:35,120 Speaker 1: then dropt the charges or the male subject doesn't care. 595 00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:36,920 Speaker 1: I mean, it's just a piece of paper, you know 596 00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:38,360 Speaker 1: what I mean. And by the time I do what 597 00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:40,680 Speaker 1: I do, you know what I mean, the paper is 598 00:37:40,719 --> 00:37:43,840 Speaker 1: not going to protect either one of us. So we 599 00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,920 Speaker 1: do see those those cases, and those are those are heartbreaking, 600 00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 1: especially when the female victim is doing everything they can 601 00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:53,960 Speaker 1: to stay safe, to protect themselves and or their children. 602 00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:57,279 Speaker 1: I don't know if you guys remember our case. We 603 00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:02,319 Speaker 1: just covered a gorgeous young mom, Kiara, and she had 604 00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:07,560 Speaker 1: a protective order Kiara Hudson against her husband, Adam Benefield. 605 00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:12,560 Speaker 1: She was so afraid of him she would wear a 606 00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:18,120 Speaker 1: bulletproof vest that didn't work. He stalked her and rammed 607 00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:22,080 Speaker 1: into her suv while she was dropping their children off. 608 00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:26,279 Speaker 1: Three children in the backseat rammed into her to get 609 00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:29,600 Speaker 1: her to stop, then went over and fired directly into 610 00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:33,160 Speaker 1: her vehicle and killed her, even though she was wearing 611 00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:37,440 Speaker 1: a vest. She was so afraid of him. Then there 612 00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:43,680 Speaker 1: are emotional or mental machinations. For instance, in this case, 613 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:47,320 Speaker 1: Doctor Bethany. He had her so twisted around with guilt, 614 00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:50,560 Speaker 1: she let him come do the laundry, and she ends 615 00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:55,160 Speaker 1: up buried a lot. I mean, there's just so much 616 00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:58,680 Speaker 1: to say about this. I mean, obviously he you know, 617 00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:01,040 Speaker 1: if she wanted to do the laundry her house, he's 618 00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:06,480 Speaker 1: already making her feel guilty. He can't afford the laundry. Matt. Seriously, 619 00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:12,160 Speaker 1: military intelligence, what a line of bs that poor woman. 620 00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:15,880 Speaker 1: And she knew something was going down, doctor Bethany, because 621 00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:18,560 Speaker 1: she sent her other child. She sent the children, look, 622 00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:20,440 Speaker 1: go in the other room, let me talk to your father, 623 00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:24,600 Speaker 1: and then this happens to her. Praise the Lord she lived, 624 00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:27,960 Speaker 1: Dave Matt. What did I hear? She's begging no bond? 625 00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:30,280 Speaker 1: Please do not tell me some idiot judge is granting 626 00:39:30,280 --> 00:39:33,360 Speaker 1: a bond, not granting bond, Nancy. And she did she begged. 627 00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:35,480 Speaker 1: She said, if he gets out, he will kill me. 628 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:38,760 Speaker 1: So yeah, no bond they're holding. When is this POC 629 00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,839 Speaker 1: going to trial? November sixteenth is their next day in court. 630 00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:45,480 Speaker 1: We'll be ready, Dave Matt. We wait as justice unfalse. 631 00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:46,880 Speaker 1: Goodbye friend,