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Speaker 1: Hello, a um, this isn't the start of the show.

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Speaker 1: This is just a surprise welcome to the first part

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Speaker 1: of two parter episode that you're going to get all

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Speaker 1: in one single week. That's right, crazy Town, that's right,

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Speaker 1: Friends and neighbors, the rumors are true. Stuff they don't

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Speaker 1: want you to know. Is officially coming out not once,

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Speaker 1: but twice a week every week, and this first entry

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Speaker 1: is a two parter, a wonderful conversation we have with

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Speaker 1: our pal Jonathan Strickland on cryptocurrency. But that's not necessarily

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Speaker 1: what we're gonna be doing with these We've got a

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Speaker 1: lot of surprising store gonna be All kinds of things

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Speaker 1: are gonna do with these second episodes, including just the

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Speaker 1: stuff you're used to and Friday, you're gonna get that

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Speaker 1: same episode you're always used to getting in your feed,

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Speaker 1: but with another special treat earlier in the week. This

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Speaker 1: two parter is coming out on Monday and Friday, but

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Speaker 1: from now on you will get episodes on Wednesdays and Fridays.

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Speaker 1: So at the end of the day, nothing is really changing.

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Speaker 1: You're just getting a little more conspiracy bang for your

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Speaker 1: conspiracy buck. Wait, the show is free, perfectly said Noel,

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Speaker 1: let's get on with the show. From UFOs to psychic

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Speaker 1: powers and government conspiracies, history is riddled with unexplained events.

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Speaker 1: You can turn back now or learn the stuff they

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Speaker 1: don't want you to know. M Welcome back to the show,

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Speaker 1: ladies and gentlemen. My name is Noel, and that feels

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Speaker 1: weird because that's Matt's part. But he's making a mad

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Speaker 1: dash for the studio right now and should be joining

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Speaker 1: us shortly. Yes, our compatriot will be here for the

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Speaker 1: second part of our two part episode. They call me

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Speaker 1: Ben you are you. We're here with our super producer

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Speaker 1: Paul Decans, and that makes this stuff they don't want

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Speaker 1: you to know. But that makes this a very special

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Speaker 1: episode of stuff they don't want you to know. Wherein

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Speaker 1: I promise I will not mention Ben Bucks too often.

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Speaker 1: We are diving into the strange, nascent world of cryptocurrency today, folks,

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Speaker 1: and to do so, we decided that we needed an expert.

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Speaker 1: We needed a Virgil for our collective Dante as we

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Speaker 1: venture into this darkness. And that is why we were

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Speaker 1: fortunate enough to persuade our friend Nemesis and returning guests

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Speaker 1: Jonathan Strickland to come on the show today. I'm so

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Speaker 1: tempted to say it's time, gentlemen, that that's that's the

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Speaker 1: wrong show. Uh yeah, thanks for having me on. I

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Speaker 1: hesitate to refer to myself as an expert subject, refer

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Speaker 1: to you as I appreciate that. I'll accept it, but

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Speaker 1: only begrudgingly. And it's not really a shameless plug because

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Speaker 1: everyone in the room right now is involved. But Jonathan

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Speaker 1: was referring to another show that Ben and I do

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Speaker 1: called Ridiculous History, where Jonathan makes a delightful, delightfully cringeworthy

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Speaker 1: appearance every every now and then as a version of himself.

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Speaker 1: It's called the quiz stere No, it's pretty much my

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Speaker 1: true self. I mean, let's let's be fair. So do

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Speaker 1: do check it out? You will? You want to listen

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Speaker 1: to a couple of different episodes, because if we could

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Speaker 1: provide you a peek behind the curtain, friends and neighbors.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes on the show, Noel and I are not completely

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Speaker 1: certain win or if Jonathan will show up. He just

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Speaker 1: kind of pops out of the wings. I have a

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Speaker 1: question to start, Ben buck Worth these days, I'm glad

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Speaker 1: you asked. If you're going into it really depends on

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Speaker 1: the market, because, as we know, all currency functions is

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Speaker 1: sort of an agreement, an article of faith or confidence.

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Speaker 1: How many badgers can I buy for a ben buck? Oh, badgers.

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Speaker 1: Badgers and ben bucks have a pretty solid history. You

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Speaker 1: can get a ton of badgers for one ben buck.

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm starting to be concerned that there might be

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Speaker 1: a bubble. Actually, you don't. You don't need no stinking badgers.

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Speaker 1: So that's that's a that's an interesting question. Thank you

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Speaker 1: for plugging ben bucks. No, of course I think that

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Speaker 1: should be the next big currency. But for now we're

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Speaker 1: just gonna have to settle for bitcoin, which today is

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Speaker 1: worth ten thousand, nine four U S. Dollars per bitcoin,

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Speaker 1: which is kind of crazy because it was not that

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Speaker 1: long ago that it was worth almost twice that it is. Uh.

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Speaker 1: That's one of the things about bitcoin in particular in

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Speaker 1: cryptocurrency in general that I'm sure we'll cover in this

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Speaker 1: discussion is it's volatility. Yeah, because the value that Noel

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Speaker 1: just provided us here at the top of the show

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Speaker 1: will almost certainly be different by the time the show publishes,

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Speaker 1: and may well be different by the time we're done recording. Absolutely. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: In fact, that's a big problem with cryptocurrency, but I'm

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Speaker 1: sure we'll get into that as well. Let's get right

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Speaker 1: into this shirt off. What's a what's a cryptocurrency? What's

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Speaker 1: this fancy term you're you're throwing at us? So you

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Speaker 1: guys know the concept behind crypto bography, right that You've

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Speaker 1: got essentially some method of encoding information. Someone else has

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Speaker 1: that method of decoding the information, and that way you

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Speaker 1: keep the information safe between the sender and the recipient.

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Speaker 1: If anyone intercepts it, they can't do anything useful with

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Speaker 1: it because they lack the ability to do that decoding. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Typically we do this with things called private and public keys.

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Speaker 1: Public key is something that you share with the entire world,

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Speaker 1: and any message they want to send to you, they

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Speaker 1: can encode with a combination of a public key and

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Speaker 1: a private key. You can then unlock it because you

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Speaker 1: also have that information. But it's to get more into detail,

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Speaker 1: gets super technical and it requires a lot of definitions

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Speaker 1: upon definitions. So rather than do that, will simply say

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Speaker 1: cryptocurrency is a method for sending a a record of

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Speaker 1: transaction between two entities. Uh. And record of transaction is

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Speaker 1: important because one thing you got to remember is that

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Speaker 1: bitcoins are not physical things at all. Right, there's if

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Speaker 1: you have quote unquote, if you own bitcoins, you don't

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Speaker 1: own anything. What you have is a record of transactions

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Speaker 1: that all terminate with your digital wallet. So it's essentially

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Speaker 1: just a record of transactions that all came to you.

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Speaker 1: And that is what we mean when we say I

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Speaker 1: own like seven bitcoin, What it really means is I

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Speaker 1: have a record of a accumulation of seven bitcoins that

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Speaker 1: all terminated with my account. I see. Okay, So typically

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Speaker 1: when we think of cryptocurrency, for most people, we think

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Speaker 1: of bitcoin R. It's the it's the windows or the

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Speaker 1: apple of the cryptocurrency world. But there are other kinds

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Speaker 1: out there, right, sure, Yeah, there's a theory Um, there's

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Speaker 1: light coin, there's a manarow, there's Ethereum Classic. You know

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Speaker 1: when they went to new Ethereum and it didn't go

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Speaker 1: so well, yeah, they just they want to go back. No,

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Speaker 1: there really is a cryptocurrency called Ethereum Classic. And then

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Speaker 1: there's also ethereum z cash, doge coin. I mean, there's

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Speaker 1: a ton of them, and Bitcoin is the one that's

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Speaker 1: best known because the the entity that that uh suggested

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Speaker 1: the creation of bitcoin is kind of looked at as

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Speaker 1: the person who laid out the basic rules for how

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Speaker 1: cryptocurrency works, because if you have a digital currency that

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Speaker 1: doesn't exist in any physical format whatsoever, and you have

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Speaker 1: to have you have to have a method of being

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Speaker 1: able to buy something with that cryptocurrency or at least

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Speaker 1: hand over that cryptocurrency to another person. Otherwise, what's the

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Speaker 1: point If you can't do anything with it, you just

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Speaker 1: have it, right, Like, it doesn't do you any good, Franklin,

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Speaker 1: right exactly. Don't mock them. They are they are going

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Speaker 1: to appreciate in value or hummels, they're adorable. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: if you can't, if you can't actually spend it, it's

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Speaker 1: not currency, it's not any good. Doesn't do you, doesn't

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Speaker 1: mean anything at all. So you have to I have

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Speaker 1: a question on that point. I mean, can't you still

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Speaker 1: invest in something that you you have to make it

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Speaker 1: liquid before you can spend it, Like you can't technically

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Speaker 1: spend stock, sure as you get your money back out

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Speaker 1: of it. And you could argue, and I think it

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Speaker 1: would be a very convincing argument that cryptocurrency, especially bitcoin,

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Speaker 1: represents more of a commodity like a stock, rather than

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Speaker 1: an actual currency. Because of those problems I mentioned. You know, Ben,

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Speaker 1: you talked about how the value of a bitcoin could

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Speaker 1: be drastically different by the end of this recording session

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Speaker 1: than it was the beginning of the recording session. That's

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Speaker 1: actually true. That could be true within the context of

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Speaker 1: an a single transaction, which makes it very difficult to

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Speaker 1: spend any currency if by the time the transaction is over,

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Speaker 1: the amount of currency is the worth of it is different.

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Speaker 1: How do you how do you reconcile that? But I

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Speaker 1: think we all understand how what makes a stock go

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Speaker 1: up or down? It's tied to something like tangible like

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Speaker 1: a company doing well, or or an acquisition or something

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Speaker 1: that you can say, oh, this company is doing well,

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Speaker 1: the stock is improving, going up in value. How does

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Speaker 1: that work for bitcoin? Like, what where does this volatility

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Speaker 1: come from? It's largely due to people's confidence or lack

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Speaker 1: of confidence in it, and that ends up being people.

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Speaker 1: Is is a really generic term, but it also means exchanges,

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Speaker 1: Bitcoin exchanges and companies that have come up around the

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Speaker 1: periphery of bitcoin. What we just call them, you know,

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Speaker 1: like players or stakeholders because they're they're not all individuals

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Speaker 1: as sure, right, some of them are represent conglomerates of

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Speaker 1: folks who have all kind of dedicated processing power to

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Speaker 1: the mining of bitcoins. Will get into that in a

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Speaker 1: little bit. What I'm excited about. Yeah, So it's it's

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Speaker 1: this crazy thing that you know. Faith is a very

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Speaker 1: powerful thing, right If I if I really believe that

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Speaker 1: that coin is going to be worth more in the

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Speaker 1: near future, and enough of other people also really believe that,

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Speaker 1: then that's what makes it worth more. Honestly, when it

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Speaker 1: comes down to it is the value of anything is

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Speaker 1: determined by how much people are willing to pay for it, right,

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Speaker 1: There's nothing intrinsic about anything. That belief is also what

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Speaker 1: makes fairies real. I mean, if we want to boil

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Speaker 1: down down knell, all cash is a lie, I would

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Speaker 1: prefer the termly an article of faith or a coupon.

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Speaker 1: It's just a coupon that can get you more things

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Speaker 1: than say coupon at that path and beyond. Yeah, but

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Speaker 1: I mean, okay, so if I if I give you

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Speaker 1: a piece of paper and I say this is good

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Speaker 1: for one BackRub which spoiler alert Valentin's days around the corner, Ben,

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Speaker 1: now you know what you're gonna get. So if I

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Speaker 1: give that to you. You know the value of that

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Speaker 1: piece of paper I gave you is one backrup. But

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Speaker 1: let's say instead I give you a dollar and you

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Speaker 1: look at this dollar and you say what and I

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Speaker 1: get for this dollar? The crazy thing is the value

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Speaker 1: of that dollar is completely dependent upon a huge number

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Speaker 1: of factors, right, And what you can get for a

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Speaker 1: dollar at one day is going to be different from

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Speaker 1: what you can get for a dollar ten years from now.

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Speaker 1: And so then the argument would be that with cryptocurrency,

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Speaker 1: we're seeing this at a much higher frequency, of incredible frequency,

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Speaker 1: to a point where I personally would be terrified to

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Speaker 1: spend any bitcoins because if I owned them, I do

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Speaker 1: not in the just for everyone to know, I don't

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Speaker 1: own any bitcoins, but if I did, I don't know

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Speaker 1: that I could use it as a currency. Because if

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Speaker 1: I were to go into a store and I say

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Speaker 1: I would like that candy bar, and the store owners says, well, Chap,

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Speaker 1: that candy bar is one dollar, and I slap a

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Speaker 1: dollar down, and I buy my candy bar, and I

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Speaker 1: go home and I eat my candy bar, and I'm

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Speaker 1: all happy. The next day, because of some sort of

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Speaker 1: calamitous event, I suddenly discover that a dollar would allow

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Speaker 1: me to buy five hundred candy bars, I would just

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Speaker 1: think I wasted that dollar I spent yesterday. Right, I

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Speaker 1: shouldn't have spent that dollar, because I could have. I

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Speaker 1: could have bought five hundred candy bars today with the

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Speaker 1: dollar I spent yesterday. Well, that's like bitcoin, except it's

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Speaker 1: happening every ten minutes. It's also happening in real life.

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Speaker 1: Early adopters of bitcoin used I think, used it to

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Speaker 1: buy a pizza famously gus here about that, and then

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Speaker 1: you know, you can see the very very depressing and

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Speaker 1: humorous calculation of how much the poor guy actually paid

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Speaker 1: for that pizza. And this leads us to another question.

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Speaker 1: So what are the nuts and bolts about how this

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Speaker 1: bitcoin transaction works. Let's say Noel is selling you the

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Speaker 1: candy bar, and you are buying the candy barbure buying

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Speaker 1: it with a bitcoin. How does that money move from

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Speaker 1: you to knowl and how eventually do you try to

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Speaker 1: get it out of the system? And then we'll have

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Speaker 1: another after that? Right, So this is starting to get

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Speaker 1: into the realm of what blockchain is all about. All right, uh,

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Speaker 1: And blockchain is in fact the technology the idea that

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Speaker 1: Satoshi Nakamoto was really talking about in the white papers

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Speaker 1: that he they she who whomever Satoshi Nakamoto really is

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Speaker 1: published back in the first decade of the two thousand's.

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Speaker 1: So what knell what I would do if I were

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Speaker 1: buying something, if I was giving NOL some amount of bitcoin,

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Speaker 1: is that there would be a transaction, and in that

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Speaker 1: transaction would be some pieces of data that would include, uh,

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Speaker 1: the public key, the private key, or I use my

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Speaker 1: private key to sign off on this transaction that kind

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Speaker 1: of creates this code. There would also be Nol's address

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Speaker 1: for his wallet, because there has to be a place

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Speaker 1: for this to go, and then that enters into a

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Speaker 1: shared ledger that is across the entire bitcoin network. So

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Speaker 1: when you think about bitcoin or any cryptocurrency, there is

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Speaker 1: a network of computers. It's it's you know, might be

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Speaker 1: using the Internet to send information back and forth, but

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Speaker 1: it's not the same thing as the Internet. It is

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Speaker 1: its own little network within the greater realm of the Internet.

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Speaker 1: Everyone running the the software is able to actually take

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Speaker 1: part in this. That transaction enters into a ledger of

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Speaker 1: all transactions of all bitcoins that have been generated so far. Ever,

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Speaker 1: and uh, then the various computers out in the network

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Speaker 1: are all working on a very very difficult math problem

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Speaker 1: in order to verify the transaction. This takes about ten

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Speaker 1: minutes per block of transactions. Once that ten minutes passes

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Speaker 1: and someone out there has solved the problem, they are rewarded. UH.

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Speaker 1: This is the mining process where there are bitcoins that

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Speaker 1: are actually generated in this process until the ultimate number

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Speaker 1: of bitcoins has been created. At that point, no more

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Speaker 1: bitcoins can be mined in that way. But that's the

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Speaker 1: that's the compensation that you get for mining. You you,

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Speaker 1: if you solve it, get those extra bitcoins. You also

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Speaker 1: have said, hey, I've just verified that transaction because I

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Speaker 1: solved this very difficult math problem that was created through

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Speaker 1: this record of transactions tracing all the way back to

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Speaker 1: the very first ones. And now this new block can

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Speaker 1: can be put on the end of this chain. So

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Speaker 1: that's why you have this technology called blockchain. Each block

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Speaker 1: is a block of transactions that have been verified by

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Speaker 1: the various computers running on this system. And once you

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Speaker 1: have solved that block, which takes on average ten minutes

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Speaker 1: to do, UH, it gets added to the chain, which

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Speaker 1: is again shared across all computers, so everyone knows, uh

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Speaker 1: that the transaction took place. Now, they don't know the

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Speaker 1: identities of the people who spent and accepted the money,

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Speaker 1: which is going to be important later, right, that's all anonymous,

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Speaker 1: But they know that the transaction happened, So in a way,

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Speaker 1: you could argue they know the accounts involved, they just

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Speaker 1: don't know who those accounts belong to. You hear a

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Speaker 1: lot of people losing bitcoin or like having bought it

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Speaker 1: on a lark, like years ago, and all of a

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Speaker 1: sudden they're like, oh, I got heard an NPR story

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Speaker 1: about a guy who's like, I bought this bitcoin and

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Speaker 1: now I realized it's worth the whole crap ton of money.

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Speaker 1: And the NPR reporter went with him and helped him

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Speaker 1: dig through his attic looking for a particular hard drive.

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Speaker 1: Why is it that specifically, Like, you know, when I

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Speaker 1: buy something, I would think there's a record in the cloud.

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Speaker 1: I would need a record on a physical drive. Well,

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Speaker 1: what's the deal there that that's part of the idea

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Speaker 1: of keeping this secure so that you and you alone

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Speaker 1: have access to that cash. Right, if it's something that

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Speaker 1: just exists in the in the cloud, then arguably with

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Speaker 1: the right kind of technology, you would be able to

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Speaker 1: access the information and be able to take advantage of

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Speaker 1: it and spend bitcoins that are not your own, right,

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Speaker 1: that's the That's one of the protections is you don't

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Speaker 1: There are two things the blockchain needs to protect against.

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Speaker 1: It needs to protect against you spending bitcoins you don't

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Speaker 1: actually have, or you spending the same bitcoin more than once.

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Speaker 1: So for example, if I send if I have one

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Speaker 1: bitcoin or the transaction record really of one bitcoin in

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Speaker 1: my personal wallet, and I set up a transaction with

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Speaker 1: you null, and I send that bitcoin to you, and

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Speaker 1: you accepted immediately before the trends, before the transaction can

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Speaker 1: be verified. And then I send a bitcoin to Ben,

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Speaker 1: a bitcoin I do not own, because I've already spent

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Speaker 1: it with you null, but because you've already you've already

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Speaker 1: accepted it before the transactions verified, there's no record that

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Speaker 1: the transaction has yet happened. And then I send one

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Speaker 1: to Ben, I could potentially try and spend the same

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Speaker 1: coin twice. That's a problem. We can't do that with

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Speaker 1: physical currency, right. If I give you a dollar, I

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Speaker 1: can't magically give that same dollar to Ben because I've

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Speaker 1: already given it to you know, how does it in

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Speaker 1: that time? How does the system know which one was

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Speaker 1: the legitimate transaction? And like it's not legitimate until the

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Speaker 1: verification occurs, not legitimate until the verification occurs, and it

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Speaker 1: takes ten minutes, which is why if you're making a

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Speaker 1: big purchase, typically the vendors will make you wait for

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Speaker 1: the transaction to have been verified before they will complete.

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Speaker 1: It happens with stocks as well, like if you're withdrawing

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Speaker 1: your stock into a fund, you do have a mandated

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Speaker 1: waiting period. I wouldn't go back to the We're gonna

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Speaker 1: go back to the question where we talked about generating

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Speaker 1: new bitcoin like in too far into mining Bye bye

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Speaker 1: block by solving these math problems. Ye block, bye block,

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Speaker 1: he said, until it reaches a threshold of the ultimate

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Speaker 1: amount of coins that can be created. That is not

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Speaker 1: an absolute ceiling, right, that's per block. Oh no, there

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Speaker 1: is eventually an absolute ceiling. That one. So those bitcoins

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Speaker 1: have been mind there will be no more bitcoins ever.

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Speaker 1: Mind that you get you get to a it's somewhere

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Speaker 1: in the twenty million range of bitcoins. Once you hit that,

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Speaker 1: that's it. But you might ask, well, if the trend

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Speaker 1: if verifying transactions is how you earn extra bitcoins, and

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Speaker 1: that's why people are interested in dedicating their computers to

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Speaker 1: doing this. Like they're earning money this way, right, They're

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Speaker 1: earning bitcoins and that represents wealth. That's an incentive to

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Speaker 1: be part of this group. If that all the bitcoins

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Speaker 1: are mind, why would you keep doing it? Right, why

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Speaker 1: would you keep supporting the system because you're no longer

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Speaker 1: getting that wealth. Well, in the future, what's going to

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Speaker 1: happen is you're going to see more and more transaction

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Speaker 1: fees attached to any transaction where a certain portion of

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Speaker 1: the amount of bitcoins that are being handed over are

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Speaker 1: gonna go to whichever computer or computer system verifies those transactions,

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Speaker 1: so that will perpet to wait the system even after

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Speaker 1: all the bitcoins have been mined. And this leads us

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Speaker 1: naturally to a couple of other questions, uh, namely what

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Speaker 1: these things are used for, because we have a candy

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Speaker 1: bar example which works to explain it, but that might

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Speaker 1: not be the reality we see on the digital ground.

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Speaker 1: And we'll explore this after a word from our sponsor.

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Speaker 1: And we've returned one of the questions that one of

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Speaker 1: the questions that we didn't quite get to. They just

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Speaker 1: want to plant in your head. Here is the idea

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Speaker 1: of taxation, which I believe governments are still trying to

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Speaker 1: figure out, like shoring this out and right now, there's

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Speaker 1: a practice called tumbling wallets, right where wherein someone wants

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Speaker 1: to avoid being associated legally with some kind of profit,

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Speaker 1: but they still to have the benefits of that. Right.

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Speaker 1: It's it's a yeah, it's kind of the digital equivalent

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Speaker 1: of Swiss bank accounts. Right. It's this idea of having

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Speaker 1: having a place where your wealth can exist that is

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Speaker 1: not easily tagged to the actual person, the identity, whereas

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Speaker 1: you could still in theory at least access that wealth

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Speaker 1: and perhaps liquefy it and then get access to the

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Speaker 1: actual dollars that you would use to buy and sell

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Speaker 1: or whatever. Um. It gets really really complicated. Uh, it's

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Speaker 1: it's a tricky thing to talk about because you're you know,

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Speaker 1: you're really you're talking about something that you've manufactured. Uh. Two,

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Speaker 1: have value. I mean that's the only purpose of bitcoin, right,

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Speaker 1: is that it has to have value? And why does

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Speaker 1: it have value? Because people buy into the fact that

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Speaker 1: it has value. People dedicate ridiculous amounts of processing power

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Speaker 1: to try and solve those difficult math problems. You know,

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Speaker 1: I said that it takes ten minutes to verify transactions.

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Speaker 1: That's by design. The math problems are only as difficult

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Speaker 1: as they need to be for the amount of computing

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Speaker 1: processing power there to solve them within about ten minutes.

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Speaker 1: So if you were to see a sudden drop off,

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Speaker 1: let's say people just realize, like, I'm losing more money

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Speaker 1: running this gear than I am getting in bitcoin. It's

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Speaker 1: actually more expensive for me to mind that I'm I'm

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Speaker 1: gaining in what I'm getting back, you would see a

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Speaker 1: lot of processing power drop off from the system. The

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Speaker 1: problems then would become easier to solve so that it

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Speaker 1: wouldn't require so much processing power, and the amount of

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Speaker 1: time it would take to verify transactions would remain ten minutes.

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Speaker 1: So on the flip side, if more and more processing

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Speaker 1: power comes onto the system, then the problems get more

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Speaker 1: and more complicated, which means that the average person running

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Speaker 1: bitcoin processing stuff on their little laptop computer has no

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Speaker 1: chance really of having the machine that actually solves these

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Speaker 1: math problems because elsewhere you have massive grid networks of

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Speaker 1: computers all doing it. So very complicated stuff. Meanwhile, you've

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Speaker 1: got the other people who are saying, I want to

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Speaker 1: use cryptic cryptocurrency in order to uh, to purchase things,

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Speaker 1: to to sell things, and to accumulate wealth without any

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Speaker 1: sort of central authority being involved whatsoever, because I don't

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Speaker 1: think that it has a place in that process. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So no, um, no central banking system, no governments, nothing

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Speaker 1: like that. Like in fact, that was one of the

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Speaker 1: key elements of the design of cryptocurrency was this decentralized approach.

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Speaker 1: You've you've actually democratized it across a network of computers

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Speaker 1: all running the bitcoin currency. But how is it illegal? U?

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Speaker 1: I mean, do you've if you come up to me

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Speaker 1: nol and you say, hey, Jonathan, I really like that

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Speaker 1: coffee mug. Would you accept this pen for that coffee bug?

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Speaker 1: And I say yes, who's gonna stop me? But I'm

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Speaker 1: just saying, like, how is it taxed? Like there's no way,

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Speaker 1: there's not. Really, there are a lot of countries out

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Speaker 1: there that are attempting to find ways to tax this

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Speaker 1: because when you're talking about very small amounts, like small

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Speaker 1: personal transactions, like if I'm like, hey, Ben, can you

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Speaker 1: spot me a five? You know, five dollars, so right,

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Speaker 1: you know something like that, No one cares, right, it's

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Speaker 1: it's tiny little stuff. Bitcoin, though, can represent enormous purchases

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Speaker 1: if you have enough of the currency and the thing

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Speaker 1: you want is available on one of the markets. Uh.

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Speaker 1: That's where people start to pay attention. And the fact that,

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Speaker 1: again the volatility of the value of the currency means

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Speaker 1: that someone who started off with a relatively small investment

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Speaker 1: early on could end up with what is much more

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Speaker 1: valuable a little bit later. And then you've got governments

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Speaker 1: saying how do I get to cut Yeah. Additionally, what

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Speaker 1: we're seeing, I would argue, is a common practice that

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Speaker 1: we've we've explored in the past, both on your show

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Speaker 1: tech stuff available wherever you get your podcast and on

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Speaker 1: stuff that once you know in past appearances. And it's

428
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:17,960
Speaker 1: this that technology is inherently disruptive, and legislation typically lags

429
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:22,480
Speaker 1: behind in terms of like we we invent as a species,

430
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:26,760
Speaker 1: We invent these astonishing things, and then we spend the

431
00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:31,600
Speaker 1: next few decades figuring out how to handle it for

432
00:25:31,800 --> 00:25:37,000
Speaker 1: the applications like we are we ready for television or

433
00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:43,600
Speaker 1: or a disruptive ride sharing service that completely undermines and

434
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 1: existing industry that sort of stuff. Well, in this case, also,

435
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 1: you've got to remember that bitcoin is a global currency, right,

436
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:54,800
Speaker 1: It's not something that's innately tied to a specific country.

437
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:58,600
Speaker 1: Even though it was created in the United States, it

438
00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:02,439
Speaker 1: could be used in you where. And that also brings

439
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:05,000
Speaker 1: up a host of problems because suddenly you're talking about,

440
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:08,400
Speaker 1: well how do it's it's like whenever anyone talks about

441
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:10,919
Speaker 1: taxing the Internet, well, how do you do that? The

442
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:15,640
Speaker 1: Internet isn't just a thing that resides in one geographic region.

443
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:19,840
Speaker 1: It is global in nature, and uh, and that's been

444
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,400
Speaker 1: something that's been a difficult problem to solve for lots

445
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:27,600
Speaker 1: of countries, even for just regular transactions that don't involve cryptocurrency.

446
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 1: You know, you talk about like how do we how

447
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:34,399
Speaker 1: do we legislate that for other types of goods and

448
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:40,080
Speaker 1: services that are going to cross international boundaries, It's it's tough.

449
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 1: Check this up, Johnathan. I just found this page that

450
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,679
Speaker 1: does a comparison of like there's these specialized pieces of

451
00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:49,439
Speaker 1: hardware for mining bitcoin, which is really interesting and it

452
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:51,480
Speaker 1: gives you like, so this one here is called the

453
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,639
Speaker 1: ant Minor S nine UM. It's two thousand bucks and

454
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:59,280
Speaker 1: supposedly will yield you about point three six oh three

455
00:26:59,320 --> 00:27:01,760
Speaker 1: bitcoin per month. And I just wanted to point out

456
00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:04,400
Speaker 1: too might be stating the obvious, but you can own

457
00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:06,639
Speaker 1: part of a bitcoin. Like, it's not at all or

458
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:09,560
Speaker 1: nothing thing. You can have a little fractions. It could

459
00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:12,680
Speaker 1: be divided way way way down, like to like to

460
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,600
Speaker 1: a millionth of a bitcoin. I think we're gonna save

461
00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 1: a lot of this this talk for the next episode.

462
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:19,640
Speaker 1: But this chart for this piece of hardware has these

463
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 1: stats about uh, you know, processing power. Power efficiency is

464
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:28,880
Speaker 1: a big thing because these tools running constantly, it cost

465
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 1: you money, cost you money, and they also use a

466
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:32,800
Speaker 1: lot of a lot of juice. Yeah, that's the thing

467
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 1: is that while you're spending, while you're running it, you're

468
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,879
Speaker 1: you're running up your electricity bill. I mean you so

469
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:39,879
Speaker 1: you start you actually do have to start looking at

470
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 1: that thinking what are the statistical odds that I will

471
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:46,359
Speaker 1: earn a bitcoin running this equipment? Because it's not a

472
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:48,720
Speaker 1: sure thing, right, even if you buy the stuff, there's

473
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:53,040
Speaker 1: no sure thing about you actually earning those bitcoins because

474
00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 1: if another entity out there does it first, you're out

475
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 1: a lot first past the post, right, And even if

476
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:01,520
Speaker 1: you were to somehow tie with someone else. Let's say

477
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:06,600
Speaker 1: that I'm running a massive bitcoin mining operation and Ben,

478
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 1: as my arch nemesis, you are also running a comparatively

479
00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 1: large bitcoin mining operation. I call it dark Blue. It's

480
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:17,560
Speaker 1: a supercomputer. It's not deep blue because I get sued.

481
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 1: I call it very blue jeans because I'm a big

482
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: fan of the Adventure Zone. And so we both are

483
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:26,600
Speaker 1: trying to solve this problem. And let's say that we

484
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:30,119
Speaker 1: both end up solving the transaction block at the same time.

485
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:33,920
Speaker 1: Within the world a bitcoin, both of those blocks will

486
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 1: exist simultaneously. Neither of us will be rewarded with any bitcoins. Yet,

487
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: what what will happen is then the systems looking for

488
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:48,520
Speaker 1: whichever chain gets the next block first, and whichever chain

489
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:51,479
Speaker 1: is the longest becomes the verified chain, and the other

490
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:55,480
Speaker 1: person loses out. So it's a constant race, and it

491
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:57,960
Speaker 1: might mean, I mean it's very unlikely to happen, but

492
00:28:58,000 --> 00:28:59,760
Speaker 1: it might mean you could see it happen a couple

493
00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:03,080
Speaker 1: of time times before someone is able to create the

494
00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:06,280
Speaker 1: longest chain before the other one, and that becomes the

495
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 1: one that the entire network accepts as the verified ledger,

496
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:13,320
Speaker 1: and then all those bitcoins would go to that particular

497
00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 1: mining operation. Uh. The other thing I want to mention

498
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 1: really quickly is that this has another consequence in the

499
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:23,040
Speaker 1: computing world, which is that it's getting real hard to

500
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 1: find graphics processors because graphics processors tend to be parallel processors,

501
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 1: and parallel processors are very good at trying to solve

502
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 1: the problems that uh, the bitcoin mining is all about

503
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 1: so tangible asset. Oh yeah, yeah, So if you are

504
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:44,000
Speaker 1: a gamer, you might hate bitcoin right now because so

505
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:48,800
Speaker 1: many bitcoin mining operations are buying up graphics processing cards

506
00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:51,840
Speaker 1: that it's hard to find them, and it's the demand

507
00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:54,600
Speaker 1: is so high that the prices are not coming down

508
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:58,000
Speaker 1: that fast either, so it's actually driving prices up. So

509
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 1: it's getting more and more expensive to be a gamer.

510
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:04,479
Speaker 1: That's going on, you know, the elite side of gaming,

511
00:30:04,480 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 1: like the professional side. It's hard to build a state

512
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:11,040
Speaker 1: of the art rig with the best equipment because the

513
00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:16,120
Speaker 1: bitcoin mining industry is and it's just jumping on those

514
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: graphics cards as soon as they're coming off the line.

515
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 1: So that's a disadvantage of this currency. So there are

516
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:22,840
Speaker 1: a lot of more if you want to talk, and

517
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:27,160
Speaker 1: it sounds like I think Noel really hit on some

518
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 1: of the advantages to uh this, this seems like sort

519
00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:35,880
Speaker 1: of a new beast for the human species. So yeah,

520
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:37,920
Speaker 1: what are what are some more of the disadvantages or

521
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 1: things people should watch out for? And then what what

522
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:45,440
Speaker 1: are people actually buying with this stuff? Excellent questions. So

523
00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:48,360
Speaker 1: we've hit on some of the disadvantages. The idea that

524
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:51,400
Speaker 1: the volatility and price makes it difficult to spend. People

525
00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,920
Speaker 1: are starting to treat it more like it's uh like

526
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 1: accumulation of wealth that they don't then liquefy. They just

527
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:03,560
Speaker 1: keep trying to accumulate. Well, ultimately, if it's just a currency,

528
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,640
Speaker 1: or if it's meant to actually be converted into some

529
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:12,320
Speaker 1: other form of currency, that that will eventually collapse in

530
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: on itself, right because you can't you can't sustain that indefinitely.

531
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:21,560
Speaker 1: If if no one is parting with anything, then at

532
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 1: some point you just say, well, now it's not oddly enough,

533
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:27,840
Speaker 1: it's worthless even though everyone's valuing it so highly because

534
00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 1: it's there's no exchange happening. This is momentum dependent. Yes,

535
00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:34,920
Speaker 1: so there's that part of it. One of the other

536
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:40,240
Speaker 1: disadvantages is again I mentioned that they transaction time can

537
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 1: be so long that the value can change, and that's

538
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,880
Speaker 1: creating difficulties when it comes down to actually trying to

539
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:49,960
Speaker 1: use the cryptocurrency for what it's intended purpose was. You know,

540
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:52,719
Speaker 1: when you hear currency, you're thinking that's a unit of exchange,

541
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 1: so that I can hand over something that we have

542
00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:01,400
Speaker 1: both agreed upon has a certain out of value for

543
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:04,760
Speaker 1: a product or service that is of an equivalent amount

544
00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:08,640
Speaker 1: of value, and then we can have that transaction. Uh,

545
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 1: if that value is fluctuating so quickly that by the

546
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:15,280
Speaker 1: time I finished saying thank you that it's worth a

547
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 1: different amount, that becomes an issue again. So big disadvantages there.

548
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:23,560
Speaker 1: On the advantage side, assuming that you've got a nice

549
00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:27,600
Speaker 1: stable value to it, if everything correct, if everything is

550
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:31,320
Speaker 1: working as it was intended to work, then it's uh,

551
00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:35,120
Speaker 1: it's you know, decentralized, and it's anonymous. So if you

552
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:37,400
Speaker 1: are concerned with your privacy and you want to be

553
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:41,680
Speaker 1: able to purchase something and whether the legality of it

554
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 1: can be set aside for now. But you want to

555
00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 1: purchase something, but you don't like the idea of that

556
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 1: being tracked to you personally for whatever reason, this is

557
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:51,960
Speaker 1: a great way of doing it. It's a great way

558
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 1: of being able to say, like, I want to take

559
00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:57,840
Speaker 1: all that other nonsense out of the equation. I don't

560
00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 1: want a third party, trusted third party involved in this,

561
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:03,479
Speaker 1: like a credit company. I don't want any of that.

562
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:05,560
Speaker 1: I don't want to bank involved in any of this.

563
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:08,959
Speaker 1: I just all I want is to be able to

564
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: have an agreement between two entities. Maybe it's two people,

565
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 1: maybe it's two businesses, it could be any combination thereof.

566
00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 1: I just want to have that transaction be as simple

567
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,400
Speaker 1: as possible. And we both agreed upon what the value is,

568
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 1: we both agreed upon how many units of this currency

569
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:27,680
Speaker 1: it should represent, and the transaction happens, and that's it

570
00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:31,360
Speaker 1: would love this. Yeah, And here's the thing is that

571
00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:33,880
Speaker 1: there's a record of that transaction, right because that's part

572
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 1: of the technology. It is completely shared across the entire network.

573
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:40,680
Speaker 1: Now it's not tied to your identity, but but you know,

574
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:44,440
Speaker 1: there's there is a ledger there, so it's not like

575
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 1: it's not like it's so super hush hush, it never happened.

576
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 1: In fact, it happened, and everyone knows it happened. They

577
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 1: don't necessarily know what you bought, and they don't know

578
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:55,000
Speaker 1: who you are, but they know that there was a

579
00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:58,640
Speaker 1: transaction because that's how the system works. Okay, I'm gonna

580
00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 1: hop in real quick and us that we take a

581
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:03,600
Speaker 1: quick ad break so that we can welcome our pal

582
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:14,759
Speaker 1: Matt into the studio. Here's where it gets crazy on

583
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:18,040
Speaker 1: a couple of different fronts because because I'm here now, Yes,

584
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:21,360
Speaker 1: some things changed during the ad breaks. Folks, Hi, I'm Matt,

585
00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 1: um Hi Matt. I'm usually here and now I am.

586
00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 1: I did your part at the beginning of the show.

587
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:29,600
Speaker 1: It was weird because I kind of did it in

588
00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:34,120
Speaker 1: your voice and I felt kind of hollow inside. It

589
00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:36,400
Speaker 1: also took about fifteen seconds to get him going. It

590
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: was kind of like starting a dead car. I just

591
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:42,480
Speaker 1: had the dead eyes. I was just like, what, Oh,

592
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:46,720
Speaker 1: welcome to the after ad break. So we're very glad

593
00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 1: you're here. Boy. So you came at the right time too,

594
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:54,880
Speaker 1: my guy, because we are now diving into one of

595
00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:57,400
Speaker 1: the things that off air. We had talked about the

596
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 1: three of us and planned to ask Jonathan today. Jonathan,

597
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:05,120
Speaker 1: we said, we've agreed that bitcoin is probably the most

598
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:10,560
Speaker 1: famous cryptocurrency out there, by far, the most market capitalized,

599
00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:15,160
Speaker 1: even fifty cent. Curtis Jackson recently found eight million dollars

600
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:16,759
Speaker 1: in bitcoin that you forgot he has just like in

601
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:21,800
Speaker 1: his digital couch cushions after the dropper, before the drop recently,

602
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:24,440
Speaker 1: So who knows how much it was, what time of

603
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:27,359
Speaker 1: day is it right now? That story was interesting because,

604
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:29,520
Speaker 1: like again we were talking about earlier, how you have

605
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,600
Speaker 1: to be able, you have to accept bitcoin for transactions

606
00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 1: for it to have value, and Mr Curtis Jackson totally

607
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:38,719
Speaker 1: did that for a record that he put out there.

608
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:41,680
Speaker 1: I don't think sold particularly well. Um, I think he

609
00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:45,400
Speaker 1: ended up with somewhere in the neighborhood of seven hundred

610
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:48,759
Speaker 1: bitcoin or something like that. And yeah, and now he's

611
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:50,880
Speaker 1: you know, and he was he had declared bankruptcy and

612
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:54,279
Speaker 1: now he's uh sitting pretty at least, you know as

613
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:57,520
Speaker 1: we record this podcast. Assuming that you can ever liquefy

614
00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:00,480
Speaker 1: your assets, then that's awesome. Is that a question like

615
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 1: is it possible that you couldn't? Yeah, it's absolutely possible.

616
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 1: It's absolutely possible that you could end up with an

617
00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:11,160
Speaker 1: amount of bitcoin and then you, uh, you try to

618
00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:13,360
Speaker 1: go and liquefy it, and then no one's willing to

619
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:16,719
Speaker 1: actually give you the cash that the market says that

620
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 1: bitcoin is worth. Yeah, no, we could. I want to

621
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:24,920
Speaker 1: save stuff for a part two, So I'm not gonna

622
00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna go in to talk about whales. We'll

623
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:30,680
Speaker 1: talk about whales later. Okay, great. For now, we need

624
00:36:30,719 --> 00:36:35,800
Speaker 1: to figure out who created bitcoin we talked about we've

625
00:36:35,840 --> 00:36:40,279
Speaker 1: we've heard the name listeners, Satoshi Nakamoto. But here's the

626
00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:45,400
Speaker 1: thing about Setoshi Nakamoto. People are pretty certain it's a

627
00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:48,440
Speaker 1: suited him. No one actually knows who this person is,

628
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,399
Speaker 1: or if this is just a monarch or used by

629
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 1: multiple people, and we have a real life Kaiser so

630
00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,279
Speaker 1: say esque figure in the world of cryptocurrency. Now, first

631
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:01,319
Speaker 1: of all, I would argue, at least one person does

632
00:37:01,400 --> 00:37:04,960
Speaker 1: know who he is. That is incredibly likely. But how

633
00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:07,799
Speaker 1: hilarious would it be if that person did not know

634
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:10,600
Speaker 1: that they were If you were to tell me that

635
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:15,680
Speaker 1: the white paper on blockchain currency was ghost written by

636
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:20,080
Speaker 1: some random code and that there is no Satoshi Nakamoto,

637
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:22,719
Speaker 1: I would have my brain melt out my ears. I

638
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 1: would also I would go see that movie and wetting

639
00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:29,719
Speaker 1: the script I think in fact trademark copyright. So so

640
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:32,960
Speaker 1: what do we know about this we know that this

641
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:37,000
Speaker 1: person's or people in Satoshi Nakamoto maybe the nom de

642
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 1: plume of actually a group of people. Uh, it's a

643
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 1: very very clever computer scientist, right, someone who really understood

644
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:52,720
Speaker 1: the potential for blockchain technology and to be clear, cryptocurrency,

645
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:55,359
Speaker 1: blockchain technology, all of this stuff. These these are all

646
00:37:55,400 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 1: basic building blocks that had pre existed the creation of

647
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 1: bitcoin by couple of decades. It was Satoshi Nakamoto who

648
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 1: kind of put all the pieces together and laid them

649
00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 1: out in a very compelling argument. In I think it

650
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 1: was a two thousand eight white paper that was originally

651
00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:16,320
Speaker 1: published just to kind of a a list of people

652
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:19,280
Speaker 1: who are interested in cryptography. Would have been a previous

653
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:22,239
Speaker 1: use for that technology. Well, there are all sorts of

654
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:25,600
Speaker 1: different uses for it. You talk about peer to peer network,

655
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:30,200
Speaker 1: so that that's how the Bitcoin operations work. Peer to

656
00:38:30,239 --> 00:38:32,600
Speaker 1: peer network is a way that you can transfer files

657
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:38,040
Speaker 1: across a group of computers and like napster napsters and

658
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:41,399
Speaker 1: or scour if you want to go old schools, more

659
00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:44,799
Speaker 1: like the swarm model though kind of like um, yeah,

660
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:47,200
Speaker 1: a bit torrent, you know where you have everyone has

661
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:48,680
Speaker 1: a piece of it, and it all kind of comes

662
00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:51,400
Speaker 1: together to create the whole. Well, yeah, where where like

663
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:54,640
Speaker 1: if I have started to download a file and someone

664
00:38:54,680 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 1: else wants to download that same file, they might start

665
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:00,759
Speaker 1: pulling some of the data that I'm beginning to accumulate

666
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:03,120
Speaker 1: in mind, as well as other parts from other parts

667
00:39:03,120 --> 00:39:06,279
Speaker 1: of the network. This speeds up the process overall. Uh,

668
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:10,680
Speaker 1: it's a It's a totally legitimate way to distribute files. However,

669
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:13,920
Speaker 1: it has been used extensively for the purposes of piracy,

670
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:15,799
Speaker 1: which is why he gets a bad name. But that

671
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:19,879
Speaker 1: that's one element, for example of bitcoin that pre existed, Uh,

672
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:25,880
Speaker 1: Satoshi Nakamoto's paper. Now as for Nakamoto, him, her or themselves, Uh,

673
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:29,000
Speaker 1: as you say, we don't really know the identity. There

674
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 1: was a story in two thousand and fourteen of a

675
00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:35,879
Speaker 1: guy in California, uh named Satoshi Nakamoto. He actually has

676
00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:38,040
Speaker 1: the name, and everyone was saying, is this is this

677
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:43,440
Speaker 1: is this the Satoshi Nakamoo? Poor guy? Can you imagine? Yeah?

678
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,040
Speaker 1: He said, uh, I am not that guy. He was

679
00:39:46,719 --> 00:39:51,680
Speaker 1: to complicate matters computer scientist living in California. Yeah, so

680
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:54,920
Speaker 1: a lot of people came up to him. He's like, no, Well,

681
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:58,080
Speaker 1: there was another computer scientist who was living not too

682
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:03,439
Speaker 1: far from the real uh world. Satoshi Dakamoto named Um

683
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:10,000
Speaker 1: how Finny, who also could have potentially created the cryptocurrency UH.

684
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 1: He was interviewed Finny however, Um it's difficult to communicate

685
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:18,800
Speaker 1: with him. He's he's locked in. He lacks the ability

686
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:22,600
Speaker 1: to to move and communicate the way the average person would.

687
00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 1: So also very koi with this um, very koi about

688
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:30,479
Speaker 1: his potential involvement. There have been people who have said

689
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:34,480
Speaker 1: that there are essentially three human beings in the world

690
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:38,120
Speaker 1: who potentially could have created bitcoin. Uh. There are, by

691
00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:40,920
Speaker 1: the way, more than three people who have been associated

692
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:43,919
Speaker 1: as possibly being Satoshi Nakamoto. But those three people would

693
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:49,960
Speaker 1: be Nick Sosbo, Uh way Die or how Finny. Uh.

694
00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:53,279
Speaker 1: So there's this belief that it could be one or

695
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:57,120
Speaker 1: more of those three. There's other folks. There was a

696
00:40:57,120 --> 00:41:00,640
Speaker 1: guy in Australia, Craig Wright, who for a while was

697
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 1: claiming to have to be Satoshi Nakamoto, saying, yeah, I'm

698
00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:06,279
Speaker 1: the one who came up with it. That's my pen name.

699
00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 1: And then he said I can even show you how

700
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:14,200
Speaker 1: those first uh, those first transactions happened, and he started

701
00:41:14,239 --> 00:41:16,680
Speaker 1: to demonstrate. But then people said, well, technically, if you

702
00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:19,080
Speaker 1: just have enough, no how you could probably just recreate

703
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:21,839
Speaker 1: this and make it seem like you were the one

704
00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:24,960
Speaker 1: behind it. But you're you're actually just replicating something. And

705
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:29,600
Speaker 1: then he kind of backed off. So this isn't hacking,

706
00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:32,440
Speaker 1: This isn't illegally, there's no reason to be anonymous other

707
00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:35,280
Speaker 1: than just to maintain the mystique or not want people

708
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:39,919
Speaker 1: to mess with you about Oh, there absolutely is. There

709
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:45,640
Speaker 1: absolutely is. Because Satoshi Nakamoto likely holds a significant number

710
00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:49,920
Speaker 1: of bitcoins, and so if you are the owner of

711
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:52,400
Speaker 1: a massive amount of wealth, one of the things you

712
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:54,319
Speaker 1: might not want to do is draw attention to the

713
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:58,760
Speaker 1: fact that you created wealth out of nothing, like Vladimir Putin. Yeah,

714
00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 1: so so if you if you go out and you

715
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 1: create shiny pecks and riding of horses, if you if

716
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 1: you create a cryptocurrency, which you know you could say,

717
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:12,879
Speaker 1: all right, well, if we take a big, big step back,

718
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:17,040
Speaker 1: Before you create bitcoin, there was no bitcoin. You created bitcoin,

719
00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:19,799
Speaker 1: people bought into the fact that it has value. You

720
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:24,879
Speaker 1: create value out of effectively nothing, and you made yourself

721
00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:29,000
Speaker 1: incredibly wealthy through the process of doing this. And you're

722
00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:32,000
Speaker 1: the one who understands how the whole system works, which

723
00:42:32,760 --> 00:42:35,600
Speaker 1: raises questions in some people's minds. They asked, well, is

724
00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:37,879
Speaker 1: there any way to game the system? Surely the person

725
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:41,560
Speaker 1: who created it would know a way of doing that. Um.

726
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:43,200
Speaker 1: The whole purpose of the system, by the way, is

727
00:42:43,239 --> 00:42:47,120
Speaker 1: to make it very very very difficult to game the system.

728
00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:48,960
Speaker 1: You would have to have fifty one of the computing

729
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:52,960
Speaker 1: power to do it, but so at the beginning there

730
00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:55,279
Speaker 1: was no one else doing it. Also not subject to

731
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:58,680
Speaker 1: any government regulation. Right, so you're you have no way

732
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:02,239
Speaker 1: of actually backing up or wealth in this system, and

733
00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:04,600
Speaker 1: if you get screwed then you just dis it's over then,

734
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:08,399
Speaker 1: and that has happened with exchanges going under. Right, Like

735
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:13,279
Speaker 1: the system itself is secure in that you don't have

736
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:18,279
Speaker 1: to worry about someone attacking the blockchain directly. It would

737
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:21,640
Speaker 1: just it's impractical because it's too much computing power. But

738
00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:25,719
Speaker 1: you could attack and exchange, and people have attacked exchanges.

739
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:30,440
Speaker 1: We've heard about, you know, essentially Oceans eleven style heists

740
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:34,800
Speaker 1: only on the digital scale, where thieves aimed at various

741
00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:38,560
Speaker 1: companies that were they essentially provided digital wallets. This is

742
00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:39,960
Speaker 1: the reason why you'd want to put it on your

743
00:43:39,960 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 1: own hard drive rather than on someone else's machine. Because

744
00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 1: you get enough bitcoins all in one place, that's a

745
00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:49,440
Speaker 1: prime target. So that that's where we see the weakness

746
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:52,320
Speaker 1: in the system. It's not it's not in the currency,

747
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,719
Speaker 1: it's not in the transaction process. It's in the storage

748
00:43:55,880 --> 00:44:00,560
Speaker 1: end of it. That's where the weakness is. So before

749
00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:03,359
Speaker 1: we lose too much about Nakamoto, we do know some

750
00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 1: of the claims that Nakamoto made themselves. Claimed to be

751
00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:12,320
Speaker 1: a male living in Japan born in nineteen seventy five.

752
00:44:13,200 --> 00:44:18,200
Speaker 1: That'd making my age the jerk. Wait are you dude?

753
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:21,520
Speaker 1: Would I be here? Yeah, we're great. We're a lot

754
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:23,759
Speaker 1: of fun to hang out with. Do we were going

755
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:25,960
Speaker 1: to invite you to go play laser tag later. That's

756
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:29,840
Speaker 1: a true story. Well, I mean, I appreciate the compliment,

757
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:33,000
Speaker 1: but I am definitely not Satoshi knock about it. Yeah right, Well,

758
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 1: I wish I could. I wish I could cop up,

759
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 1: you know, I'd say like, yes, uh, I'm I'm living

760
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:43,680
Speaker 1: a very under the radar lifestyle pretending to be Japanese

761
00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:49,799
Speaker 1: and my my caviar dreams stuff, at least not not openly. Yeah,

762
00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:53,959
Speaker 1: she allergy. I could probably have caviar and not die.

763
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:56,760
Speaker 1: It's not shellfish. What if you just like bathed? Okay,

764
00:44:56,800 --> 00:45:00,960
Speaker 1: this is a different Yeah, that's that's opulent right Tuesday night.

765
00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:03,680
Speaker 1: We do know that a lot of people don't believe

766
00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:08,879
Speaker 1: that Satoshi Nakamoto, whomever he or she or they are,

767
00:45:09,480 --> 00:45:12,719
Speaker 1: they don't believe this this entity is actually Japanese and

768
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:17,239
Speaker 1: origin due to some of the language used in forums, right,

769
00:45:17,480 --> 00:45:22,319
Speaker 1: the language that sounds British for lack of a better term,

770
00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:24,719
Speaker 1: the use of like the word bloody, and some of

771
00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:27,280
Speaker 1: the spelling, you know, like the extra L the PM.

772
00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 1: I think he's banksy. I think he's banksy. I remember

773
00:45:31,080 --> 00:45:36,320
Speaker 1: this conversation. We all We also know that some people

774
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:38,560
Speaker 1: say it was unlikely to be Japanese or they were

775
00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:43,600
Speaker 1: unlikely be Japanese because the software itself was not documented

776
00:45:44,000 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 1: or labeled in Japanese. Well, yeah, and there there's a

777
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:52,880
Speaker 1: lot there's a lot of circumstantial evidence that points to

778
00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:58,320
Speaker 1: it being someone outside most theories, you know, pen Satoshi

779
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:02,799
Speaker 1: Nakamoto's identity, assuming that there are there's just one, there

780
00:46:02,800 --> 00:46:04,920
Speaker 1: could like I say, there could be multiple people who

781
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:08,160
Speaker 1: all just use that as their group pen name. Uh.

782
00:46:08,280 --> 00:46:10,799
Speaker 1: The most people think that we're talking about a European

783
00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:18,720
Speaker 1: or American computer scientist who was ultimately responsible for putting

784
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:22,719
Speaker 1: together the whole shebang, or a time traveler or a

785
00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:24,840
Speaker 1: time travel it came back to begin the currency that

786
00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:27,760
Speaker 1: would one day they had two things to do, stop

787
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:31,520
Speaker 1: the large Hadron collider and launch a cryptocurrency. So we

788
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:36,560
Speaker 1: have a wealth of candidates for the real Satoshi Nakamoto

789
00:46:36,680 --> 00:46:40,080
Speaker 1: here and honestly, in some in some circles, I think

790
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:44,080
Speaker 1: people are just picking folks they think of as highly intelligent.

791
00:46:44,120 --> 00:46:46,320
Speaker 1: Like you see you probably we all saw the scuttle

792
00:46:46,360 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 1: butt about Elon Musk, and someone's like, you know, you know,

793
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:52,840
Speaker 1: who has enough time to do this? The guy who's

794
00:46:52,880 --> 00:46:56,200
Speaker 1: trying to build a space colony, the guy who's sending

795
00:46:56,360 --> 00:47:00,320
Speaker 1: his own sports car to Mars, which is cool. You

796
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:03,839
Speaker 1: could probably bust some sick donuts on Mars. Oh yeah, yeah,

797
00:47:03,960 --> 00:47:06,560
Speaker 1: those creators. Yeah, you gotta get the right tires. Do

798
00:47:06,640 --> 00:47:09,600
Speaker 1: you ever wonder though somebody like LM. Musk isn't fully

799
00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:12,640
Speaker 1: working on those I mean, Ela Musk has his hands

800
00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:16,600
Speaker 1: dirty and that stuff, but he's not every day working

801
00:47:16,640 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 1: on the code. They're working on the He's an entrepreneur,

802
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:24,560
Speaker 1: he's not. He's not the coder. He's not there. He's

803
00:47:24,600 --> 00:47:27,480
Speaker 1: not the guy in the chair, as Spider Man Homecoming

804
00:47:27,480 --> 00:47:30,239
Speaker 1: taught us. Yes, I guess I'm saying, maybe he does

805
00:47:30,280 --> 00:47:33,040
Speaker 1: have the time, but maybe nothing. Know how, I think

806
00:47:33,080 --> 00:47:36,840
Speaker 1: that's fair. Well, speaking of the time, it sounds like

807
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:39,640
Speaker 1: it's about time for us to close our first chapter

808
00:47:40,040 --> 00:47:45,279
Speaker 1: on cryptocurrency, and we have to thank you, Jonathan. Thanks

809
00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:48,560
Speaker 1: for coming on the show. Despite the fact that you

810
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:50,600
Speaker 1: and Nolan I are beefed up in a in a

811
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:54,840
Speaker 1: different show, we we appreciate you coming on and walking

812
00:47:54,880 --> 00:47:58,280
Speaker 1: all of us through what cryptocurrency is, how it works,

813
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:03,120
Speaker 1: and helping us try to figure out who this mysterious

814
00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:08,800
Speaker 1: person or people behind cryptocurrency actually might be. I mean this,

815
00:48:08,800 --> 00:48:11,840
Speaker 1: this is one of those legitimate mysteries out there. For

816
00:48:11,960 --> 00:48:14,560
Speaker 1: that then again, like a few people know the real answer,

817
00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:19,240
Speaker 1: but most of us are just left wondering. And ultimately,

818
00:48:19,400 --> 00:48:22,240
Speaker 1: I don't think it really matters, because what really matters

819
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:25,880
Speaker 1: is that people have uh the belief in the system

820
00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:28,399
Speaker 1: and as long as that works, As long as people

821
00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:31,560
Speaker 1: have that belief, then there is value there. The question

822
00:48:31,640 --> 00:48:33,959
Speaker 1: is will there one day be come a time where

823
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:39,240
Speaker 1: people just completely lose that belief and everything becomes valueless. Uh.

824
00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:42,840
Speaker 1: And then ultimately, by the end of it, has anyone

825
00:48:43,040 --> 00:48:46,400
Speaker 1: lost anything. These are like big, like philosophical questions that

826
00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:50,600
Speaker 1: are hard to answer. Yeah, as with all fiat currency,

827
00:48:50,680 --> 00:48:53,359
Speaker 1: eventually the people just stop believing in it. I mean,

828
00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:58,040
Speaker 1: you know, that's the only thing that keeps it going, right,

829
00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:01,759
Speaker 1: Like you could argue that the that state currencies are

830
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:05,120
Speaker 1: backed by a government, but then you're that just shifts

831
00:49:05,120 --> 00:49:12,480
Speaker 1: your belief from the currency to the government and the government. Yeah.

832
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:15,719
Speaker 1: By the way, did we discuss turning your gaming rig

833
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:18,239
Speaker 1: into a bitcoin mining system? We discussed the fact that

834
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:21,880
Speaker 1: it is now getting increasingly difficult to find graphics cards

835
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:25,439
Speaker 1: because they're all being put to use in bitcoin mining.

836
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:26,960
Speaker 1: I was gonna ask you about that. Was it tough

837
00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:29,440
Speaker 1: to find when you guys were assembling? Jonathan just let

838
00:49:29,440 --> 00:49:34,120
Speaker 1: everyone know, Um, Jonathan and r I t guy Israel

839
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:37,399
Speaker 1: put together an amazing gaming PC, and I was gonna ask,

840
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:39,920
Speaker 1: I know it has a cool parallel graphics processor. Was

841
00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:43,520
Speaker 1: that tough to find? It not? But that's because we

842
00:49:44,520 --> 00:49:49,000
Speaker 1: gutted some some slightly older Max and they happen to

843
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:52,960
Speaker 1: have graphics cards. One of the few that is compatible

844
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:55,239
Speaker 1: both with MAC and with PC, and we put all

845
00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:57,560
Speaker 1: three in parallel so that we got it's got three

846
00:49:57,560 --> 00:50:02,160
Speaker 1: parallel g p U s um. So I'm rich now,

847
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 1: but I still can't get a chicken dinner. Your graphics rich? Maybe, Yeah,

848
00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:12,560
Speaker 1: chicken dinner another thing that has been severely affected by bitcoin. Yeah,

849
00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:16,799
Speaker 1: so we so. I think it's interesting that you're you're

850
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:22,719
Speaker 1: arguing the identity of this creator doesn't matter, not ultimately.

851
00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:25,800
Speaker 1: I think I think that's an interesting argument. I would

852
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:30,960
Speaker 1: I would tend to disagree just because just because if

853
00:50:31,239 --> 00:50:35,279
Speaker 1: it were some group of people who are aiming to

854
00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:39,160
Speaker 1: manipulate a market, then it does matter very much because

855
00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:45,040
Speaker 1: there would be a motive that we would not understand,

856
00:50:45,120 --> 00:50:50,640
Speaker 1: which makes it and even um less secure investment. You

857
00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 1: could argue that, but at this point, I think the

858
00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:57,600
Speaker 1: machine is moving forward with so much momentum that anyone

859
00:50:57,680 --> 00:51:02,439
Speaker 1: with any particular motivation wouldn't really be able to bring

860
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:06,560
Speaker 1: it into full effect. I mean, unless you have a

861
00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:14,279
Speaker 1: plan to essentially sabotage multiple exchanges simultaneously, or if the

862
00:51:14,320 --> 00:51:18,080
Speaker 1: whales move all together, the system is going to be

863
00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:20,279
Speaker 1: nice and secure. But that's something we should say for

864
00:51:20,440 --> 00:51:24,560
Speaker 1: maybe the next episode, and folks, this concludes part one

865
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:30,760
Speaker 1: of our episode on cryptocurrencies. However, off air, we brought

866
00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:33,239
Speaker 1: up something that we haven't done in a while. Chat

867
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:38,880
Speaker 1: at Corners, Jonathan, this is an email especially for you.

868
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:42,120
Speaker 1: We thought it's something that you might enjoy. Yes, comes

869
00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:46,759
Speaker 1: from Keith Russell. Keith says, greetings, fellow conspirators. It's been

870
00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:49,440
Speaker 1: some time since I made contact. I'm a bit wiser

871
00:51:49,480 --> 00:51:52,440
Speaker 1: in sending this message, this time not using Gmail. I'm

872
00:51:52,520 --> 00:51:55,080
Speaker 1: using proton mail, brought to you by certain makers of

873
00:51:55,080 --> 00:51:59,600
Speaker 1: the Mandela Effect. Okay, this email and the incantations there

874
00:51:59,640 --> 00:52:03,120
Speaker 1: in is being typed on privately centered keyboard, hosted on

875
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:07,120
Speaker 1: encrypted servers, and being sent through encrypted packets via VPN.

876
00:52:08,160 --> 00:52:11,960
Speaker 1: Why am I taking such precautions because of advanced persistent threats.

877
00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:14,799
Speaker 1: We have known about the APT for some time, but

878
00:52:14,920 --> 00:52:17,279
Speaker 1: we now have a rare glimpse into the operations one

879
00:52:17,360 --> 00:52:23,600
Speaker 1: such APT Dark Kara Call Carackle, curasol c A r

880
00:52:23,719 --> 00:52:29,239
Speaker 1: A c A L Corackle, Dark Carackle Lookout and E

881
00:52:29,400 --> 00:52:31,840
Speaker 1: F F did a great rite up on Dark Coracle.

882
00:52:31,960 --> 00:52:34,319
Speaker 1: Oh I'm saying that so wrong. And operation out of

883
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:37,919
Speaker 1: Beirut Lebanon, of course, we know that Lebanon isn't only

884
00:52:37,960 --> 00:52:40,680
Speaker 1: player in this space. China and Russia are very active.

885
00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:44,040
Speaker 1: China has been responsible for many cyber espionage campaigns and

886
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:49,600
Speaker 1: Russia was most likely responsible for not Pay, Not Payta

887
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:56,040
Speaker 1: not Pathy. Is this something you're aware of, Jonathan? Okay?

888
00:52:57,560 --> 00:52:59,920
Speaker 1: But China and Russia aren't the only nation states with

889
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,879
Speaker 1: this capability. The shadow brokers and wiki leaks Vault seven

890
00:53:02,920 --> 00:53:05,080
Speaker 1: and Vault eight revelations show that the N s A

891
00:53:05,160 --> 00:53:07,200
Speaker 1: and c I A are very adept in this space,

892
00:53:08,080 --> 00:53:10,760
Speaker 1: though not enough to keep their secrets. And Stuck's net

893
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:13,200
Speaker 1: was probably a joint effort by the US and Israel.

894
00:53:13,640 --> 00:53:16,120
Speaker 1: And did you know that there's a company called zero

895
00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:19,279
Speaker 1: di Um which buys zero day exploits and brokers them

896
00:53:19,320 --> 00:53:22,680
Speaker 1: to the highest government bidder and then he's got links.

897
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:25,920
Speaker 1: They have offered a one million dollar bug bounty to

898
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:29,520
Speaker 1: any hacker who has discovered a zero day on signal Tour,

899
00:53:29,800 --> 00:53:33,880
Speaker 1: WhatsApp and other privacy tools. That's a bit scary anyway,

900
00:53:34,080 --> 00:53:37,680
Speaker 1: Dark Coracle and Zero Day Market should fill in an episode,

901
00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:41,960
Speaker 1: and Shannon Morse would be a great guest. Farewell for now.

902
00:53:42,320 --> 00:53:46,000
Speaker 1: This email comes to us from Mr venomous. Hey, your

903
00:53:46,000 --> 00:53:48,759
Speaker 1: pal Shannon Morris. Yeah, and she had morrise of Hack

904
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:51,719
Speaker 1: five Fame and and Tech Threat. Yeah, she's put in

905
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:53,120
Speaker 1: a good word. Maybe we can get her on the

906
00:53:53,160 --> 00:53:55,840
Speaker 1: show into that episode. I'll let her know. We should

907
00:53:55,880 --> 00:53:59,600
Speaker 1: absolutely look into Zero Day exploits. Maybe we can get

908
00:53:59,640 --> 00:54:03,040
Speaker 1: you a ship and back on the show in the future. Yeah.

909
00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:06,920
Speaker 1: I think that the this email has a lot in it,

910
00:54:07,200 --> 00:54:10,160
Speaker 1: and hopefully our super producer can chop it up a

911
00:54:10,160 --> 00:54:13,400
Speaker 1: bit to make a little more sense for everybody listening.

912
00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:16,160
Speaker 1: Um A p T S and all of that stuff

913
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:19,000
Speaker 1: they're in. Thanks, I have a really pressing one. That

914
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:21,480
Speaker 1: one was was super important, but this one really I

915
00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:24,239
Speaker 1: think takes the k um. It is from Nick love

916
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:27,200
Speaker 1: it uh, he says, Hey, guys, nearly an everyday listener

917
00:54:27,239 --> 00:54:29,160
Speaker 1: on Spotify at work and in the truck found you

918
00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:30,719
Speaker 1: about two months ago and started at the top of

919
00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 1: the list and just let it play, of course, in

920
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:36,480
Speaker 1: reverse chronological order. I just came across the May fifth episode,

921
00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:38,560
Speaker 1: The Collapse of Atlanta. At the beginning of the show,

922
00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:41,200
Speaker 1: Matt questions if the right chips from checks Mix are

923
00:54:41,239 --> 00:54:44,520
Speaker 1: sold individually. Well, y'all hadn't already discovered this by now.

924
00:54:44,760 --> 00:54:47,600
Speaker 1: It just so happens that I discovered in a convenience

925
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:50,920
Speaker 1: store a while back a bag of Just Ride chips,

926
00:54:51,400 --> 00:54:54,080
Speaker 1: So they are in fact available, Matt. That's amazing. I

927
00:54:54,160 --> 00:54:56,239
Speaker 1: told you it was important, Was it a QT because

928
00:54:56,239 --> 00:54:58,239
Speaker 1: I know where some of those are? Yeah, he didn't

929
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:01,120
Speaker 1: specify the store, but Nick, please write us back and

930
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:04,759
Speaker 1: let us know where to get these delightful snacks. Uh.

931
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:08,279
Speaker 1: And and we really appreciate the tip. And this concludes

932
00:55:08,360 --> 00:55:15,000
Speaker 1: ours but not our show. I am so glad we

933
00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:17,640
Speaker 1: decided to make this a two part episode because we

934
00:55:17,680 --> 00:55:21,600
Speaker 1: have not even scratched the surface of some of the

935
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:25,759
Speaker 1: strangest cryptocurrency conspiracy. So we're not the Joe Rogan Show.

936
00:55:25,760 --> 00:55:27,880
Speaker 1: We don't do nine hour episodes. We have to you know,

937
00:55:27,960 --> 00:55:30,920
Speaker 1: we like to keep things in little nuggets, digestible. M

938
00:55:31,480 --> 00:55:34,919
Speaker 1: Speaking of which, I want to eat lunch. Alright, Well,

939
00:55:34,960 --> 00:55:39,279
Speaker 1: if Jonathan is giving us the lunch signal, join us

940
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:42,440
Speaker 1: and wishing him luck on his continuing quest to find

941
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:46,000
Speaker 1: a decent chicken sandwich. In the meantime, you can find

942
00:55:46,040 --> 00:55:50,280
Speaker 1: Nol Matt Uh, super producer Paul and I on Instagram, Facebook,

943
00:55:50,320 --> 00:55:53,200
Speaker 1: and Twitter, where we are some variation of conspiracy stuff.

944
00:55:53,400 --> 00:55:55,960
Speaker 1: You can also find us on Instagram Conspiracy Stuff Show.

945
00:55:56,000 --> 00:55:57,520
Speaker 1: If you don't want to do any of that stuff,

946
00:55:57,520 --> 00:55:59,680
Speaker 1: just hit us up the old fashioned way. We are

947
00:56:00,120 --> 00:56:22,080
Speaker 1: conspiracy at how stuff works dot com