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Speaker 1: Hi everyone, I'm Kitty Kuric and this is next question.

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Speaker 1: Ava Duvernet has a new movie coming out this month.

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Speaker 1: It's called Origin, and it's really something special. It's based

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Speaker 1: on the book Cast by Isabelle Wilkerson, which had famously

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Speaker 1: been deemed unadaptable, but that wasn't going to stop Ava.

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Speaker 1: What was especially fascinating about this conversation was Ava's unusual

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Speaker 1: path to funding this film. Usually the team might go

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Speaker 1: to studios and streamers like Netflix for that, but it

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Speaker 1: wasn't quite working out the way Ava wanted when it

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Speaker 1: came to Origin, so she forged a new path, going

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Speaker 1: to philanthropic organizations and corporations and convincing them to fund

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Speaker 1: the movie. Those conversations also turned into an entire infrastructure

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Speaker 1: of social outreach around Origin, from community screenings to curriculum

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Speaker 1: for educators who might want to discuss the book or

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Speaker 1: movie in classrooms. So in this interview, which we recently

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Speaker 1: taped at Art Basel, Ava broke down how this remarkable

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Speaker 1: film came to be and her hopes for the movie's impact.

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Speaker 1: Then I sat down with some of her partners who

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Speaker 1: helped make her dreams a reality. I hope you enjoy.

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Speaker 1: There's so much I want to talk to Ava about,

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Speaker 1: and I tried not to pepper her with questions backstage

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Speaker 1: so we would be fresh. But I also want to

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Speaker 1: give you all a chance to ask Aba some questions

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Speaker 1: as well. But first, let's kind of start at the beginning. Ava,

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Speaker 1: have you always been a big fan of Isabelle Wilkerson's.

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Speaker 2: I'd read the first book, first of all, thank you

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Speaker 2: for being here.

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Speaker 3: Of course, Katie.

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Speaker 2: It's a big deal, so thank you, Katie. Course I'd

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Speaker 2: read the first book, The Warmth of other Sons, and

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Speaker 2: I was an admired of that work. And so when

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Speaker 2: Cast was published, I actually had gotten it in Galley's

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Speaker 2: before it was it was published, but I was shooting

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Speaker 2: and I didn't have a chance to read it. And

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Speaker 2: when it came out in the summer of twenty twenty,

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Speaker 2: in the middle of the pandemic, at the beginning of

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Speaker 2: the pandemic, I just couldn't read. I was just in

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Speaker 2: a daze. Yeah, So I didn't end up reading it

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Speaker 2: until about three months after it had been out, and

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Speaker 2: Oprah actually kind of convinced you to crack it open,

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Speaker 2: and you were asking me to read it since galleys

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Speaker 2: and several other people. You know, it was the Book

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Speaker 2: of the Summer, and I just I hadn't gotten to it.

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Speaker 2: So I would hear about it here or there. People

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Speaker 2: would suggest it to me or assume that I'd read it,

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Speaker 2: and so I finally, I finally did.

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Speaker 1: And what did you think when you read the book?

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Speaker 1: Because I know it was declared as unadaptable? What made

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Speaker 1: you determined to prove otherwise?

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Speaker 3: Eva?

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Speaker 2: Uh, well, I I think it's just my curiosity and

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Speaker 2: interest in the in the general, I won't even say

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Speaker 2: subject matter, just the the audacity of the argument. At times,

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Speaker 2: I wasn't even sure if I agreed with it, but

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Speaker 2: I was provoked by it, which I think is a

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Speaker 2: fantastic thing to be. Allow yourself to be provoked by

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Speaker 2: new ideas, but by things that jar you, by things

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Speaker 2: that that that that force you to think differently, and

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Speaker 2: so as long as that's a safe environment and environment

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Speaker 2: where there's respect, I think being a provocation of one's

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Speaker 2: imagination is a positive thing. And that's what happened to

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Speaker 2: me with the book. I was, you know, ignited by

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Speaker 2: the ideas, the thought that the primary lens through which

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Speaker 2: I see myself being a black woman, that those are

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Speaker 2: predicated uh, that those identities are predicate on something that's

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Speaker 2: very much animated by cast in our society, and that

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Speaker 2: those ideas of the isms racism, sexism, is laophobia, homophobia,

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Speaker 2: anti semitism, whatever it is, all sit on top of

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Speaker 2: something else called cast, and cast is the skeleton and

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Speaker 2: all of those other isms are the skin. You know,

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Speaker 2: cast is the wound, and everything else is kind of

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Speaker 2: on top of it. And so I just thought, what

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Speaker 2: a vibrant idea to help organize my thoughts. I wanted

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Speaker 2: to talk to folks about it, but I know that

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Speaker 2: from thirteenth and from when they see us that popular culture,

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Speaker 2: that putting these tough ideas in movies and TV shows

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Speaker 2: moves it into the culture faster than anything else. And

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Speaker 2: that's what I really wanted. So that's why I started

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Speaker 2: to think about could this be a movie?

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Speaker 1: And of course you had to transform and translate these

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Speaker 1: these thoughts from a pretty dense, fairly academic book into

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Speaker 1: a narrative, a story, and you turned it in and

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Speaker 1: to really Isabelle Wilkerson's journey. When did you have that

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Speaker 1: aha moment?

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Speaker 3: Eva?

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Speaker 1: You thought, this story is really the story of the

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Speaker 1: woman behind the writing.

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Speaker 2: Yes, well nothing is impossible, and so I knew I

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Speaker 2: was interested in the ideas in the book. But they

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Speaker 2: weren't a lot of characters in the book. There were

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Speaker 2: some though. There was Augustin Irma, the German couple, right,

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Speaker 2: she ends up in the camps, he doesn't hile there

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Speaker 2: was Alison Elizabeth Davis, the African American anthropologists, right who

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Speaker 2: In the book, Miss Wilkerson says that they were doing

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Speaker 2: their research primarily in Natchez, Mississippi, But she has a

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Speaker 2: couple of lines in there that says that they used

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Speaker 2: to they had studied in Europe. And I was like, wow,

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Speaker 2: they studied in Europe. Where so when I went and

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Speaker 2: did that research, it connected them to Germany. So the

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Speaker 2: characters started to come together. I thought, well, maybe it's

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Speaker 2: just about these historical characters. Then I said, I don't

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Speaker 2: want to make another history movie. I just didn't want

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Speaker 2: to make another one. So I was forcing myself to

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Speaker 2: look in the book and find a contempt very character.

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Speaker 2: And then one day I was reading a chapter in

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Speaker 2: the book and the author was recounting her research and

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Speaker 2: she was using the word I a lot, and I

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Speaker 2: was like, she's a character. She's the contemporary character. So

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Speaker 2: when I went to her and I said, I'd like

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Speaker 2: to adapt your book and there's a main character that

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Speaker 2: I'm really fascinated by, who.

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Speaker 3: You what did she say?

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Speaker 2: She she agreed rather quickly. She agreed rather quickly, and

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Speaker 2: she gave me the answers to all the questions that

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Speaker 2: I needed over a course of about two years, you know,

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Speaker 2: about a dozen and a half conversations, multiple hours.

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Speaker 1: I was going to say, because on Zoom there's so

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Speaker 1: many intimate details Isabelle's life and her losses and these moments,

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Speaker 1: I mean, how much creative license did you take ava?

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Speaker 1: For example, when she and her mom are looking at

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Speaker 1: the cloud at the nursing home or assisted living facility,

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Speaker 1: whatever it was, exactly and some of the conversations. Did

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Speaker 1: she say, you can expand upon our conversations and build

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Speaker 1: these characters as you see fit.

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Speaker 2: She did. She gave me the freedom, and she was

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Speaker 2: very gracious and telling me the stories about the losses

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Speaker 2: of her mother, her husband, and her cousin Marian and

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Speaker 2: then allowing me to go and interpret them. And so

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Speaker 2: stories like her and the Plumber are pretty much exactly

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Speaker 2: what she recounts in the book, but stories about things

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Speaker 2: that happened with Marian. None of that is in the book.

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Speaker 2: And so so it was a balance between being inspired

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Speaker 2: by the book the history, and the book going beyond

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Speaker 2: the book into her personal history that she told me,

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Speaker 2: and then other research historically that I brought to the pages.

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Speaker 1: It's such an effective mosaic, and I think, you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm a big fan of all your filmilms, but it

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Speaker 1: struck me that this kind of had elements. It had

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Speaker 1: elements of a documentary, it had elements of a feature film.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk about And it's such a vast, you know,

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Speaker 1: story to cover with so many different components. Talk to

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Speaker 1: us about how you were able to figure out the

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Speaker 1: structure of this and you know, going from the past

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Speaker 1: to the present to vignettes and almost like short films

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Speaker 1: about each of these characters that are placed in history.

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Speaker 2: The way I was able to do it really points

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Speaker 2: directly back to the financing model because I was free.

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Speaker 2: You know, I was free for the first time since

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Speaker 2: i'd made independent films when I was using my own

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Speaker 2: money and I was just starting out and no one

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Speaker 2: cared since I'd made one hundred million dollar films for

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Speaker 2: Disney and Netflix and all the Yonce videos and Apple

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Speaker 2: commercials and all of the things. But there's always someone

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Speaker 2: looking over your shoulder, you know, and there's always someone

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Speaker 2: saying are you sure about that? And we can't do.

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Speaker 1: That questions which probably causes you to question yourself.

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Speaker 2: It changes, you know, what you're making changes, The vision changes,

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Speaker 2: and it's okay, you're taking millions of dollars of these

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Speaker 2: corporations money and they should be involved. But if you

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Speaker 2: have a vision and an idea and you consider the

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Speaker 2: prospect of being able to fully birth that without someone

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Speaker 2: breathing down your neck or changing the vision or doubting

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Speaker 2: or fearful, fear based decisions, wouldn't you choose it? And so,

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Speaker 2: in venturing to finance this film outside of the studio system,

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Speaker 2: I gave myself the freedom to think about this storytelling

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Speaker 2: differently than I would if I was inside the studio system.

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Speaker 2: And that meant I'm going to blur the lines between

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Speaker 2: documentary and narrative, if I'm going to have historical and

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Speaker 2: contemporary and also a surreal element. Are there leaves falling

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Speaker 2: in the scene? Yeah, tell it? I thought, try, just

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Speaker 2: try it, you know, and and and and to throw

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Speaker 2: all of that into the pot and see what came out.

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Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought that up because I wanted to

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Speaker 1: ask you about sort of where the idea of the

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Speaker 1: falling leaves that you use repeatedly, you know, that is

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Speaker 1: really a motif in the film. Where did that come from?

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Speaker 3: And was it? I mean, how does that happen?

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Speaker 2: Yes, well, you know, and interpreting Isabelle Wilkerson the story

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Speaker 2: of the of the passing of her loved ones and

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Speaker 2: trying to interpret that visually, you know, and trying to

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Speaker 2: you know, kind of bring that to the heart of

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Speaker 2: the people who are watching. I went into my own

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Speaker 2: personal experience with loss and when my father passed away

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Speaker 2: quite unexpectedly, that's how I felt. I wanted to I

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Speaker 2: felt was in a black hole and I just wanted

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Speaker 2: to be buried with leaves so that people would look

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Speaker 2: out on the lawn and think, oh, well, maybe she

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Speaker 2: was here and now she's not and didn't matter because

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Speaker 2: he wasn't here. And that's how I felt. And so

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Speaker 2: trying to articulate her loss by connecting it to mine

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Speaker 2: was something that I tried to share. And that's what

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Speaker 2: filmmaking is you know, you can take the script, you

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Speaker 2: can take the book, but the best filmmaking is the

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Speaker 2: filmmaker imbuing themselves, putting their fingerprints on the experience and

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Speaker 2: leaving a bit of themselves behind in the scenes. And

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Speaker 2: so that was based on my own personal feeling.

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Speaker 1: I thought it was so beautiful and really effective, and

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Speaker 1: you I mean, there were so many the visual vocabulary

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Speaker 1: of the movie is so varied and rich, and some

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Speaker 1: of the scenes obviously were quite difficult to pull off,

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Speaker 1: you know, the scenes with the Nazi rallies for example,

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Speaker 1: and the scenes in India. I mean, talk about sort

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Speaker 1: of the challenges of shooting these stories and so many

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Speaker 1: different places.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so most films of this size that look around

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Speaker 2: this size would be I don't know, maybe ninety two,

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Speaker 2: one hundred days something like this. We shot this in

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Speaker 2: thirty seven days. I went to three continents, so we

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Speaker 2: were you know, in Delhi, in Berlin, in our domestic

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Speaker 2: base with Savannah, Georgia, and so, you know, really thinking

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Speaker 2: about the finite amount of money we had, I could

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Speaker 2: never go back to the studio and say we're a

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Speaker 2: little over, we need to pad that, or the crane broke,

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Speaker 2: no problem we'll send over another one. Or you know,

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Speaker 2: we're in India now, in the middle of the street

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Speaker 2: and there's no electricity and we thought there would be

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Speaker 2: a generator here. What should we do? It was Paul

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Speaker 2: Garns and me looking at each other saying, we're going

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Speaker 2: to figure it out. It's just the two of us,

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Speaker 2: the man who was on the stage at the top

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Speaker 2: of the and so you know what an adventure want

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Speaker 2: to ride? It's addictive. I want to do it again

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Speaker 2: and again.

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Speaker 1: You like to have to be really careful with money.

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Speaker 2: I like, I like to be able to spend the

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Speaker 2: money in service of the vision and not in service

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Speaker 2: of fear, you know what I mean, and not and

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Speaker 2: not to be thank you, and and I think so

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Speaker 2: much of in my industry, in a different industry than

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Speaker 2: many of you, but it is fear based. So many

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Speaker 2: of the decisions that are being made are being made

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Speaker 2: because a boss's boss or my boss won't like that,

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Speaker 2: or just everyone's doing their little bitty piece. And the

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Speaker 2: idea that we as filmmakers, as artists, as producers, as friends,

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Speaker 2: you know, catalyzed by the great work of Regina Miller

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Speaker 2: who raised the money and just like side by side

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Speaker 2: with me a partner, and in putting this model together,

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Speaker 2: we envisioned a new world, a new way to make

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Speaker 2: this kind of scalable. You know, a film that felt

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Speaker 2: intimate but also had epic pieces to it, that was international,

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Speaker 2: it was global in scope, that was about serious subject matter,

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Speaker 2: subject matter that you know is less attractive to studios

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Speaker 2: to make. Imagine the pitch. I go in and I say,

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Speaker 2: they say, hi, Eva, gosh, we haven't seen you in

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Speaker 2: a while. Miss you. Guys, how are you? And so

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Speaker 2: what are you thinking about? We just want to hear

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Speaker 2: we're going to work with you. Yeah, no, I want

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Speaker 2: to work with you all too. So my next piece,

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Speaker 2: I'm really interested in making a film about cast. Cast.

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Speaker 2: You want to have a cast in it? No, cast,

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Speaker 2: the social phenomenon of the hierarchy of human beings. Like

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Speaker 2: that's not They were like, I didn't, I didn't even

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Speaker 2: do it. That would have been the pitch. And so

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Speaker 2: we saved ourselves a year of going through and doing

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Speaker 2: that and try and we just spent the time instead

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Speaker 2: building something new.

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Speaker 1: Talk about the Trayvon Martin of it all. And you know,

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Speaker 1: as a black woman writing and directing this film, what

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Speaker 1: it was like, and I think you did that so

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Speaker 1: beautifully with the nine to one one tapes, and I

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Speaker 1: know that was choreographed exactly really how it happened with

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Speaker 1: George Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin. Can you just talk about

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Speaker 1: sort of the importance of that scene, eva, juxtaposed with

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Speaker 1: so many of the historical moments in the film.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yes, Well, in my conversations with the author, she

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Speaker 2: had shared that I asked, where did this idea of

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Speaker 2: cast count come from? A lot of it, she traced back.

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Speaker 2: Her early thoughts about it were around the Trayvon Martin case.

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Speaker 2: She was she was writing about it, she was thinking

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Speaker 2: about it, and so I was trying to, you know,

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Speaker 2: find a way to interpret that and put it in

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Speaker 2: the in the film. And it took me a while

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Speaker 2: to decide to actually show what happened. But what was

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Speaker 2: important is if I showed it, I had to show

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Speaker 2: from his perspective too, And I wanted you to see

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Speaker 2: him first. It's just a kid talking to a girl

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Speaker 2: on the phone. He went to get some candy. But

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Speaker 2: when you hear the killer's version, he was a sinister guy,

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Speaker 2: looked like he was on drugs, walking around the place.

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Speaker 2: What is he doing here? They always get away? That's

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Speaker 2: what George Zimbers and Zimmerman says on the tape. That

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Speaker 2: was the real tape that you heard on that tape

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Speaker 2: on the second nine one one tape where you hear

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Speaker 2: the woman and she's calling in the real woman, you

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Speaker 2: can hear Trayvon Martin screaming in the background, and so

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Speaker 2: you can hear the gunshot, right, and so you actually

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Speaker 2: have that murder caught on tape. And so to think,

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Speaker 2: how can I honor this Instead of just doing the tape,

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Speaker 2: I wanted to do the kid, the kid that he

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Speaker 2: was just before, so that when you hear the tape,

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Speaker 2: when you see what the reenactment of what had happened,

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Speaker 2: you know him already. You know what he was doing.

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Speaker 2: He was talking about breakfast, he was talking about whatever

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Speaker 2: they were talking about. His mother was kind enough to

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Speaker 2: I called her before I did anything, and I asked her,

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Speaker 2: I was so nervous to talk to her. She was like, girl,

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Speaker 2: are you nervous? You know, just talk to me. She

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Speaker 2: was so lovely, Sabrina Fulton, and she said, do it,

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Speaker 2: you know, do it.

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Speaker 3: I've interview.

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Speaker 2: Isn't she wonderful? Yeah, she said do it, and she

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Speaker 2: so you know that was done with her permission and

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Speaker 2: book ended. Now that you've seen it, you know the

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Speaker 2: first image of the film is him, and the last

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Speaker 2: image of the film is him. And there are many

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Speaker 2: parts of the film that are tough to watch and

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Speaker 2: that I've cried over, whether I was writing it, filming it,

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Speaker 2: or editing it. And I'm all cried out on the movie.

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Speaker 2: There's nothing that I cried anymore except his last look.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes when I'm doing a Q and A, if I

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Speaker 2: catch it, I get very emotional. His last look right

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Speaker 2: at her. It's a really shot where he's looking down

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Speaker 2: the barrel. The camera's always looking at you, and he's

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Speaker 2: just something about it that gets me every time. Now

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Speaker 2: I don't look at it because I will start to cry.

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Speaker 2: Unlike Katie, who was crying in the background, like literally

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Speaker 2: came out of our little holding areas in Katie Kirk

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Speaker 2: and she's just very much crying. And like I said, Katie,

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Speaker 2: who I know a little bit what is going on.

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Speaker 2: She's a out right the albright.

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Speaker 1: I think it's so honestly heartbreaking and upsetting and so beauty.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that little boy is so precious and the

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Speaker 1: man who's recounting the story. I didn't want to ask

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Speaker 1: Ava backstage because I wanted to hear her true response

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Speaker 1: is I wondered, you know this idea of the documentary

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Speaker 1: meets a feature if the man telling Isabelle's character in

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Speaker 1: the movie was actually his teammate. Was he Albright's redheaded

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Speaker 1: teammate or was he an How.

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Speaker 2: Many people think he was a real guy, okay, the

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Speaker 2: real man, and how many think he was an actor? Okay,

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Speaker 2: more people think he was real. Okay, he's somewhere in

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Speaker 2: the middle. Okay, he's not the real man. He is

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Speaker 2: not the real man. He's also not an actor. Okay,

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Speaker 2: let me tell you who he is. When Regina Miller

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Speaker 2: was talking before an answer to your question, Katie of

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Speaker 2: what are the ways in which you've included your ideas

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Speaker 2: about social justice and social impact into the filmmaking, one

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Speaker 2: of the ways is to try to eliminate as many

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Speaker 2: hierarchies as we could on set. So when I walk

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Speaker 2: through the set, I'm the boss, and the way it

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Speaker 2: usually goes is, no one talks to me unless you're

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Speaker 2: in my inner circle. And when I say me, I

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Speaker 2: mean the director. No one talks to the director unless

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Speaker 2: you're asked a question, or unless you're the DP or

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Speaker 2: the production designer in that top top circle. It's very

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Speaker 2: rare that folks are just coming up to you because

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Speaker 2: you're the director and you must see your unwalking leave

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Speaker 2: her bee, right, It's ridiculous. So one of the things

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Speaker 2: that I like to do, and when you look at

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Speaker 2: the who would be considered the bottom of the hierarchy

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Speaker 2: of a set, it's the extras. Okay, the extras who

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Speaker 2: I call background actors, but the extras they're put off

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Speaker 2: to the site. They have a different place where they eat,

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Speaker 2: they have a different place where they sit.

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Speaker 3: So there's a cast system, the cast.

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Speaker 2: System right on every single set. They're kept away from

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Speaker 2: the rest of the set. It's like bring them in

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Speaker 2: and they come in like cat and they're like, you

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Speaker 2: go over there, you go over there. They're not treated well.

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Speaker 2: They're not treated well. And I think the reason why

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Speaker 2: I have such empathy for them is because one day

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Speaker 2: my mother said, I want to try to be an extra,

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Speaker 2: and I was like, I don't think you're going to

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Speaker 2: like it, and she's like, I just want to. I

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Speaker 2: can make one hundred and fifty dollars for the day,

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Speaker 2: and I'm just gonna do it. She came back so devastated.

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Speaker 2: She was just so I was like treated like a

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Speaker 2: subhuman And so I thought, as we started to think

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Speaker 2: about the different ways to break down casts, the idea

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Speaker 2: of really talking to the actors and background actors and

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Speaker 2: really including them in the process became a part of

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Speaker 2: our process. So on this particular day, I'm walking across

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Speaker 2: the set where the pool is and one of the

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Speaker 2: background actors who had been free. I talk to them

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Speaker 2: all the time. I set up the scene with them.

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Speaker 2: They know what they're doing. They can eat regular food,

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Speaker 2: they can be with the regular people. Like we're trying

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Speaker 2: not to segregate the set. He stops me and he says,

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Speaker 2: Miss Duverne, I just want to tell you the scene

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Speaker 2: we're doing today. It really I feel emotional about it

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Speaker 2: because something like that happened to me when I was young,

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Speaker 2: And I stopped and I said, tell me, and he

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Speaker 2: told me a story that add some similarities to the

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Speaker 2: scene that we were shooting. Now, the background actors are

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Speaker 2: so segregated, they don't get a script, so they don't

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Speaker 2: ever know what we're doing. Because you can't give like

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Speaker 2: a thousand people the script end up on LinkedIn. I

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Speaker 2: don't know whatever you yeah, and so we just kind

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Speaker 2: of don't give them pages. But I like to at

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Speaker 2: least describe it to them. So he says, I'm not

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Speaker 2: sure what's going on here, but this reminds me of something.

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Speaker 2: He tells me what it reminds him of, and I said,

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Speaker 2: and he's almost has tears in his eyes as he's

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Speaker 2: telling me. I said, you know, if I give you

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Speaker 2: the pages of this script, you can go over there

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Speaker 2: and read them. Do you think that you could tell

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Speaker 2: the story of the pages with the same emotion that

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Speaker 2: you're telling me your own story? He said, I'll try.

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Speaker 2: So he goes over he's reading the script. I'll go

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Speaker 2: over to Andre Newellis. She's about to go to lunch.

401
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Speaker 2: I said, just give me one more second, just one

402
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Speaker 2: more second. She said, oh, did we forget a scene?

403
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Speaker 2: I said, it's a new scene. It's a new scene.

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Speaker 1: Just come here, and said, I was going to say,

405
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Speaker 1: what happened to the actor who was supposed to it

406
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Speaker 1: was never scripted?

407
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Speaker 3: Okay? Good felt that for no, No, that guy.

408
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Speaker 2: She sits down, he comes over. It was I said,

409
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Speaker 2: you think you can do it. He said, yeah, I'll try.

410
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Speaker 2: So he sits down and without a script, he's he's

411
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Speaker 2: he's interpreting the story of al Bright that he read

412
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Speaker 2: in the script, and he's saying he's putting himself in

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Speaker 2: the place, and he's saying, I was I was a

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Speaker 2: little boy. And he tells that story one take, Wow,

415
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Speaker 2: one take. He told that story with such love and

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Speaker 2: memory and just all that you see on the screen.

417
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Speaker 2: Real heck, tough. Grips on the set were like, I'm

418
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Speaker 2: not crying. It's fine, it's fine, it's no big deal.

419
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Speaker 2: Ange New starts to cry in the scene. She starts

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Speaker 2: to interview him. In the scene, they get to the

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Speaker 2: part where she says how old were you? And I'm like,

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Speaker 2: oh gosh, he's not gonna know how old. I didn't

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Speaker 2: put the age in the script. I know that Albright

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Speaker 2: was nine and the man said I was nine, nine

425
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Speaker 2: years old. Paul Garns is like, what's happening? And that's

426
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Speaker 2: what's there. A little maze, a little bit of actor,

427
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Speaker 2: a little bit of magic, a little bit of the unit.

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Speaker 3: That's such a great story.

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Speaker 1: We need to take a quick but when we come

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Speaker 1: back some audience, Q and A for Ava, and of

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Speaker 1: course I have some more questions of my own.

432
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:07,800
Speaker 3: We'll be right back.

433
00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:13,439
Speaker 1: If you want to get smarter every morning with a

434
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 1: breakdown of the news and fascinating takes on health and

435
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,120
Speaker 1: wellness and pop culture, sign up for our daily newsletter,

436
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:28,760
Speaker 1: Wake Up Call by going to Katiecouric dot com. We're

437
00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:34,159
Speaker 1: back with the one and only Ava DuVernay. I wanted

438
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:36,720
Speaker 1: to just have you say a couple of the acting

439
00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:41,600
Speaker 1: was so superb, So talk about Angeenue Ellis Taylor, who

440
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 1: played Isabelle.

441
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:44,960
Speaker 3: She was in King Richard, Right.

442
00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 2: She was nominated for the Wasn't she fantastic?

443
00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:48,959
Speaker 3: She played the Yeah, unbelievable.

444
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:52,119
Speaker 2: She was nominated for the Oscar Best Supporting Actress for

445
00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 2: King Richard Y Right, she played the Williams the wife.

446
00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 1: Yeah and all right, anything you'd like to say about

447
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,359
Speaker 1: her other then she was fantastic. I mean, she really

448
00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:03,480
Speaker 1: carried the whole movie.

449
00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 2: Right, he's her movie. You know, it's the first time.

450
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:09,400
Speaker 2: She's a woman close to my age, in her early fifties,

451
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:12,359
Speaker 2: and she'd been working Love Carecraft Country. She was in

452
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:16,640
Speaker 2: my film when they See Us, so many incredible parts

453
00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 2: and had never been the lead in the film, and

454
00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:22,760
Speaker 2: so it really speaks to the disparity and opportunity for

455
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:25,399
Speaker 2: black women actresses of a certain age, or of any age.

456
00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:29,399
Speaker 2: And so she took the She she took it, and

457
00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:31,760
Speaker 2: she ran with it. She was incredible to work with.

458
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,880
Speaker 3: She was amazing. John Burnhal, who played.

459
00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:37,240
Speaker 2: John Burnhal, who I had only known as the Punisher,

460
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 2: and had such a when I met with him, such

461
00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:46,560
Speaker 2: an intelligence behind his eyes, a real passion for the

462
00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:50,240
Speaker 2: subject matter. He really cares about this. We could have intelligent,

463
00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:54,480
Speaker 2: thoughtful conversations about the subject matter, about the world. And

464
00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 2: so we really connected. And he and I was looking

465
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:03,520
Speaker 2: for someone who had enough wagger to play that crossing

466
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:07,639
Speaker 2: the street scene of Hey, hey didn't did you? Didn't

467
00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 2: you hear her? She doesn't want to put the thing

468
00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:14,199
Speaker 2: in the front yard. I needed that guy and so

469
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:17,440
Speaker 2: and who could also say it's my birthday, Yeah, it's

470
00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:18,080
Speaker 2: my birthday.

471
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 4: You know.

472
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:20,120
Speaker 2: The guy who could do both of those.

473
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:22,240
Speaker 3: He was really He did it. Not as cute as

474
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 3: my husband John, but he.

475
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 1: Is really cute. I wanted to A fun fact though,

476
00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:33,399
Speaker 1: John Bernhal, which is so interesting, is the brother of

477
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:38,880
Speaker 1: Ryl Samberg's husband Tom. I think bumper anyway, little trivia

478
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:43,240
Speaker 1: for everyone. Niss Nash bets what I mean. Good lord,

479
00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 1: she was so great, so funny, so movie y.

480
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 5: Yeah.

481
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 2: She always says, when I gave you the script, I said, yeah,

482
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:53,399
Speaker 2: read the script, and I want you to bring a

483
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 2: little lightness, a little levity to it. She said, with

484
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:59,000
Speaker 2: this script, she's like, girl, I'm gonna have to go

485
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:01,600
Speaker 2: off book of places here or there. So she's one

486
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:05,400
Speaker 2: of one of my dearest, dearest friends. And she actually

487
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,960
Speaker 2: was shooting a television show that she's the lead on

488
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:11,040
Speaker 2: and at the same time that we were shooting the film,

489
00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 2: and she was able to get them to let her

490
00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:17,480
Speaker 2: be off every Friday, so she would work all week.

491
00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,400
Speaker 2: On Thursday nights, she'd take a red eye, she'd land

492
00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:23,200
Speaker 2: in Atlanta and then take a puddle jumper to Savannah.

493
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:27,199
Speaker 2: She'd get into Savannah, she'd work all day, late night

494
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:29,160
Speaker 2: until like three o'clock in the morning, and then she'd

495
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,679
Speaker 2: fly back on Saturday and do it all again. She

496
00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 2: did that for four weeks.

497
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:33,640
Speaker 3: She was amazing.

498
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:37,119
Speaker 1: And I asked David backstage, but she told me she

499
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:39,680
Speaker 1: would tell me out here about Nick Offerman, who's one

500
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:42,879
Speaker 1: of my favorite actors, because I thought in what was

501
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 1: the HBO series that he was in with the rest

502
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:49,520
Speaker 1: of us. Yeah, I thought that episode so incredible. It

503
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 1: was one of the best piece of pieces of acting.

504
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:54,639
Speaker 1: I've ever seen that episode, and if you all haven't

505
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 1: watched it, it's just amazing.

506
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:57,639
Speaker 3: I hope they won an Emmy for that.

507
00:27:57,680 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 2: But anyway, we'll find out in a couple of weeks.

508
00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:02,440
Speaker 1: What did what did he think about playing a guy

509
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:03,520
Speaker 1: I got plumber with him?

510
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:04,359
Speaker 3: Maga hat.

511
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:07,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, he had to tell this audience they're they're not

512
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,359
Speaker 2: like us where they know the details of who every

513
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:12,000
Speaker 2: actor is. You say, Nick.

514
00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:18,760
Speaker 1: Offerman, which Nick's Plumer? And how did he feel about

515
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:20,879
Speaker 1: that role? I actually loved that scene.

516
00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:22,440
Speaker 2: I know a lot of people love that scene. A

517
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:25,480
Speaker 2: lot of people really love that scene. He I'd worked

518
00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:27,560
Speaker 2: with him on a on a show I did for

519
00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:30,480
Speaker 2: Netflix called Colin and Black and White about Colin Kaepernick.

520
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:32,560
Speaker 2: He played the father. Thank you. The one person who

521
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:35,400
Speaker 2: watched it, thank you, thank you, ma'am. It was all

522
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:39,760
Speaker 2: for you, mam, thank you. And and I loved him

523
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:41,960
Speaker 2: and we got along so well. And the last thing

524
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:44,000
Speaker 2: he told me after we left the set on the

525
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:46,720
Speaker 2: last day of shooting Colin Black and White. He said, Hey,

526
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 2: if you ever need me, call me, and so he's like,

527
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 2: I'll be there, And so I called him. I said,

528
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 2: I need you, I need you one scene, just one scene.

529
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:56,280
Speaker 2: Will you come in and do it for me? So

530
00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:01,160
Speaker 2: he he came. He did the one scene. He was incredible.

531
00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:04,320
Speaker 2: He didn't really get that I was going to put

532
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:07,520
Speaker 2: the Maga hat on him until he had arrived and

533
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,640
Speaker 2: he said, do you really want me to wear this?

534
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:13,280
Speaker 2: I said, I really. I want to do some takes

535
00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:15,960
Speaker 2: with it and some takes without it. And he said,

536
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:19,280
Speaker 2: does do the letters have to be this big? He's

537
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:22,560
Speaker 2: very funny. He's very very funny. That is funny. It's

538
00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:25,160
Speaker 2: the next thing to say. And he put it on.

539
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:27,160
Speaker 2: He got a little bit uncomfortable about it, but he's

540
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:29,200
Speaker 2: an actor, so he figured it out.

541
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,960
Speaker 1: But I did love the interplay between, you know, between

542
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:38,800
Speaker 1: and Nick and they had a fun something really beautiful

543
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 1: that and how it brought everybody down to a level

544
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 1: just talking about parents and.

545
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 2: Talking about loss. Yeah, one thing we're all going to

546
00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 2: have in common.

547
00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:50,640
Speaker 1: Right, How about any questions from the audience. I have

548
00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 1: a few more, but I've gone way too long. But

549
00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 1: here's one right up there. Do you see it?

550
00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:56,200
Speaker 2: You all?

551
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:58,320
Speaker 3: Can you raise your hands so that people with the

552
00:29:58,360 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 3: mic can see you?

553
00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:01,240
Speaker 4: Thank you? My question.

554
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:04,600
Speaker 6: I don't know how involved you are with the fundraising process.

555
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:07,360
Speaker 6: I know we've talked a lot about the virtues and

556
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 6: how it allows you to do some of the great

557
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 6: work that you just displayed for us today. But to

558
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 6: the degree that you were involved, I wondered if you

559
00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:17,959
Speaker 6: can maybe tell us a little bit about the lessons

560
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 6: that you learned, maybe for others that might be considering

561
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:23,400
Speaker 6: going down a similar path, and anything that you might

562
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:24,160
Speaker 6: have done differently.

563
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 2: Thank you well. Like I say, I have to make

564
00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:30,080
Speaker 2: sure that I mentioned Regina Miller, who's the executive director

565
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,320
Speaker 2: of Ray Alliance, who's really you know, the architect, along

566
00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:39,960
Speaker 2: with with our colleague Erica of of bringing it in.

567
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 2: You know. The idea for this came very simply. I

568
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 2: always watch PBS documentaries and I see at the end

569
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 2: of the documentaries with the support of the Ford Foundation

570
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:53,320
Speaker 2: and the Da Da Da Da Da, and I always thought,

571
00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 2: since I was in college, I wonder if they would

572
00:30:56,040 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 2: ever fund something else, a narrative film, and so, in

573
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 2: wanting to veer away from the studio system. We just asked.

574
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 2: The first place we went was a Ford Foundation and

575
00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 2: we asked Darren Walker, who was one of our funders

576
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 2: at ARRAY, and he said, yes, we would consider that.

577
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 2: And that gave Regina and I the courage to continue

578
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:20,000
Speaker 2: and to ask other funders and other like minded individuals,

579
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 2: and the process began very personal. It was very one

580
00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:27,160
Speaker 2: to one. It wasn't a submission of grants. So that

581
00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 2: was a privilege that I enjoyed that a lot of

582
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:31,320
Speaker 2: people wouldn't and that I was able to reach in

583
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:33,920
Speaker 2: and speak with the women. Maverene, pal Jobs and Melinda

584
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 2: could speak with these people directly. But the paperwork and

585
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 2: the ninety thousand calls in ninety thousand meetings and it

586
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:48,920
Speaker 2: was actually ninety thousand I counted that Regina Miller and

587
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 2: her team did to bring that to a bank account

588
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,080
Speaker 2: that Paul Gardens could then write checks to make a

589
00:31:56,120 --> 00:32:00,480
Speaker 2: movie was an extraordinary amount of heavy lifting. I think

590
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 2: as we look back, we think it could have actually

591
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:05,760
Speaker 2: been about half of that in the future. We just

592
00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 2: didn't know what we were doing. We didn't know because

593
00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:11,160
Speaker 2: it hadn't been done, and the entities that we were

594
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:14,040
Speaker 2: dealing with had never done it, So everything had to

595
00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:16,520
Speaker 2: be thought of anew, how does this work? What is

596
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 2: the structure? Who do we even ask? Can we say

597
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:20,720
Speaker 2: yes to this? Did you say yes?

598
00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 3: No?

599
00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 2: I said yeah, no, he said yes, No. Run it

600
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:24,479
Speaker 2: through again, you know. I mean it was just a

601
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 2: lot throughout the companies, and so I think now we

602
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,239
Speaker 2: have much more of a handle on it. We can

603
00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:33,760
Speaker 2: probably cut down to forty five thousand calls. But it

604
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:35,440
Speaker 2: was a lot of back and forth. I would just

605
00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:38,840
Speaker 2: say it was personal relationships, you know, and it was

606
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,640
Speaker 2: cultivating those. And one of the things that I say

607
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,320
Speaker 2: is you have to be prepared, you know, you have

608
00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 2: to prepare the soil for when the moment comes that

609
00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:50,880
Speaker 2: you can ask and be so fully formed that the

610
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:56,200
Speaker 2: ask feels logical. Like I had a non profit making

611
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 2: films and distributing films for the last decade. I mean,

612
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:00,680
Speaker 2: we had the muscles. We were ready to do it.

613
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:02,160
Speaker 2: If anyone was going to do it, it was going

614
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,800
Speaker 2: to be us. And so when we asked or when

615
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:08,440
Speaker 2: we offered the opportunity, it was too a company that

616
00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 2: was strong, and so I wouldn't suggest that anyone just

617
00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:17,960
Speaker 2: jumps into what we did, but prepare the soil, and

618
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:21,320
Speaker 2: you know, maybe folks come up with another model that

619
00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:23,960
Speaker 2: I can use, but I think this is a model

620
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:27,320
Speaker 2: that eventually will get easier, and I think some of

621
00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:29,440
Speaker 2: the companies are even looking at ways to streamline it

622
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:31,000
Speaker 2: and offer more of the star artists.

623
00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:34,360
Speaker 1: Do you all mind if I asked two more quick questions?

624
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 1: Is everybody okay? Because I just have? Well three?

625
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:38,600
Speaker 2: Really?

626
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 3: So.

627
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:43,040
Speaker 1: One of the things that struck me, especially the second

628
00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:47,280
Speaker 1: time watching this, is how relevant so many of the

629
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:52,240
Speaker 1: scenes were and how they kind of how much they resonate.

630
00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 1: I was thinking about the book burning, and I was

631
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:56,760
Speaker 1: thinking about book banning.

632
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 3: You know.

633
00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:00,440
Speaker 1: Also when they were in the library in Berlin, I

634
00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:05,320
Speaker 1: was thinking about the anti semitism that was so you know,

635
00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:10,120
Speaker 1: heartbreakingly portrayed with the couple in Germany. I was thinking

636
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: about the Indian scholar. I'm sorry I forgot his name,

637
00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:17,879
Speaker 1: but Raj who was talking about sort of cast systems nationwide,

638
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:20,960
Speaker 1: he mentioned or worldwide, He mentioned the Palestinians, and I

639
00:34:21,040 --> 00:34:24,760
Speaker 1: was just thinking, did that strike you Ava as well?

640
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:31,080
Speaker 1: As these historical references had so much relevance today, all.

641
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:34,440
Speaker 2: Of them done before before our current times. I mean,

642
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:39,680
Speaker 2: we wrapped this film in till August, and so yes,

643
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:43,960
Speaker 2: I think it really you know, people say, oh, this

644
00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:46,000
Speaker 2: this film is coming out the perfect time. You know,

645
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:50,000
Speaker 2: it's meeting this moment. There's really not a moment. And

646
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 2: there's no moment. There's no time when we're not not

647
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:56,839
Speaker 2: treating each other well, you know what I mean, there's

648
00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:01,160
Speaker 2: no moment. There's not been a time traced in the

649
00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:03,560
Speaker 2: last one hundred years where there hasn't been a war

650
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:06,359
Speaker 2: happening somewhere in the world. Where there hasn't been there

651
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:09,719
Speaker 2: haven't been people who are being treated unfairly, people who

652
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:14,319
Speaker 2: are dying at the hands of terrible events and regimes.

653
00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:17,600
Speaker 2: So this work was going to meet I thought it

654
00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:19,640
Speaker 2: was going to be about the books, you know what

655
00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:22,120
Speaker 2: I mean. I thought, oh, this is about education and

656
00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 2: withholding of education. I really thought that was going to

657
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:28,759
Speaker 2: be the moment that it met, having no idea that

658
00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 2: references or things that were in a film about cast

659
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,560
Speaker 2: would meet another moment. And so I just feel, you know,

660
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:37,200
Speaker 2: we had a similar thing with Selma. We made Sema.

661
00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:39,280
Speaker 2: It was about a small black town that was fighting

662
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:41,799
Speaker 2: for their rights and at the same time Ferguson was

663
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 2: happening a small black town fighting for the rights. But

664
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:46,759
Speaker 2: there's always a small black town fighting for the rights,

665
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,040
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. And so it's just the

666
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 2: work is speaking to the culture, and the culture is

667
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:53,040
Speaker 2: speaking to the work.

668
00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:56,840
Speaker 1: Do you hope that this you know, I noticed both

669
00:35:56,920 --> 00:36:02,600
Speaker 1: times that Isabelle Wilkerson are on news character talked about

670
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:07,840
Speaker 1: how subjugation really isn't about race, which I have to

671
00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 1: think about some more because to me, I think in

672
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 1: many ways race probably exacerbates or amplifies that kind of

673
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 1: need for the fact that some groups try to dominate others.

674
00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 1: But I'm going to have to actually readcasts which I

675
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,040
Speaker 1: haven't read. But do you think this will open up

676
00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:31,160
Speaker 1: a different conversation about race in America? And how do

677
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:33,680
Speaker 1: you think it will will do that? Because this, to

678
00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:38,640
Speaker 1: me is about dominance and superiority, And how do you

679
00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:40,839
Speaker 1: think it will reframe these conversations?

680
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,920
Speaker 2: Ava, I think you're exactly right. It's about dominance, It's

681
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:47,440
Speaker 2: about power. It's about the hierarchy of human beings, so

682
00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 2: that some are dominant have power and some are subordinate

683
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 2: and don't. And that is goes far beyond race, you know,

684
00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 2: it goes far beyond race. You can apply that to gender.

685
00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:01,120
Speaker 2: You can apply that to sexual you can apply that

686
00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:04,640
Speaker 2: to physical ability, You can apply that to so many

687
00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:08,279
Speaker 2: ways that we create hierarchies for human beings based on

688
00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:12,000
Speaker 2: a random set of traits that we have no control over.

689
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:16,960
Speaker 2: If you have no control over the circumstances of your birth, none,

690
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:21,080
Speaker 2: but our society says, because you were born that way,

691
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:23,880
Speaker 2: you go in this box and I label that, and

692
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,120
Speaker 2: I know what you are and who you are inside.

693
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:28,000
Speaker 2: You would look at me as a black woman from

694
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:31,080
Speaker 2: Compton and wouldn't possibly think that I'm the world's biggest

695
00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:34,319
Speaker 2: you two fan. I mean, no one's bigger than me.

696
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:37,319
Speaker 2: There is no one who loves Bono in the Edge

697
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:40,839
Speaker 2: and Larry Moans Junior more than me. But you think

698
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,279
Speaker 2: you might know me because of who I am and

699
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:46,080
Speaker 2: where I'm from based on a random set of circumstances.

700
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:48,080
Speaker 3: That's cash and what you look up and what you

701
00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:48,600
Speaker 3: look like.

702
00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:49,960
Speaker 2: And what I'm looking like. I don't look like a

703
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:54,720
Speaker 2: YouTube fan. This is what it looks like. You look good, yes,

704
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:57,960
Speaker 2: but you know so. I hope to your question, I

705
00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:01,040
Speaker 2: hope that it opens up people's thoughts about way more

706
00:38:01,080 --> 00:38:04,040
Speaker 2: than race. Yes, absolutely, thinking about race and new ways

707
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 2: and thinking about the things that race is built upon.

708
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 2: Why haven't we been able to solve the race question?

709
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:11,320
Speaker 2: Are we asking the right question?

710
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 1: And the social constructs that maintain a cast.

711
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:17,480
Speaker 2: Stem absolutely across the board.

712
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,560
Speaker 1: Before we go, tell me about Seat sixteen, which is

713
00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:23,520
Speaker 1: the impact campaign that's happening alongside the film.

714
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:26,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, Seat sixteen is what that is up there, And

715
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:31,759
Speaker 2: basically it is, there's four million, four and a half

716
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:34,640
Speaker 2: million sixteen year olds in the country right now, I think,

717
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:37,239
Speaker 2: and I believe, and there's a lot of data that

718
00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:41,440
Speaker 2: suggests that sixteen is the sweet spot. That's the age

719
00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:45,279
Speaker 2: where you start to organize your thoughts about who you

720
00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:48,480
Speaker 2: are in the world and what your place in the

721
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:50,680
Speaker 2: world is, what the world means to you. You start

722
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,040
Speaker 2: to open up and it starts to become a little

723
00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:56,880
Speaker 2: less about only individual thoughts and more about, you know,

724
00:38:58,040 --> 00:39:01,000
Speaker 2: the way that society is organized. And so I feel like,

725
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:03,600
Speaker 2: if we can get that fifteen sixteen year old to

726
00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:06,719
Speaker 2: see the film and we can plant some of the

727
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:10,399
Speaker 2: seeds about cast and get this terminology, the language into

728
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:15,200
Speaker 2: their thinking, now the earth might tilt a little bit

729
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:18,480
Speaker 2: towards justice. If you have a whole generation of people

730
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:21,279
Speaker 2: who can speak about our ills in a different way.

731
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 2: So set up with things called seat sixteen, not sweet sixteen,

732
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:28,920
Speaker 2: isn't it cute? Seat sixteen? Because they're not going to

733
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:31,359
Speaker 2: pay for it on their own. So you can buy

734
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:34,040
Speaker 2: a ticket for a sixteen year old and we'll give

735
00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:36,000
Speaker 2: a free ticket to the kid and they can go

736
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 2: see the movie. It's really really simple. So it's sixteen dollars.

737
00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:43,400
Speaker 2: They get the ticket, they get a learning companion, and

738
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:46,880
Speaker 2: hopefully they have a new vocabulary to think about the

739
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:49,200
Speaker 2: things that we're leaving them with. You know, our generation

740
00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:54,840
Speaker 2: is leaving quite a mess. They're stepping into a lot,

741
00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:57,160
Speaker 2: and so I hope that this film can give some

742
00:39:57,280 --> 00:39:59,520
Speaker 2: organizing principles to young people as to how to think

743
00:39:59,560 --> 00:40:03,720
Speaker 2: about proceeding Set sixteen, Bye kids, sixteen dollar ticket.

744
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:05,240
Speaker 3: That's a great idea.

745
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:08,520
Speaker 1: Hey, simple, David DuVernay, thank you so so much.

746
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.

747
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 3: Congratulation, appreciate it.

748
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:18,840
Speaker 1: After this quick break, more from the amazing team that

749
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:22,440
Speaker 1: helped bring Origin to the big screen. That's right after this.

750
00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:35,000
Speaker 1: We're back with more from the amazing team that helped

751
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 1: bring Origin to the big screen. Please welcome to the stage,

752
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:44,279
Speaker 1: Paul Garnes. He's President of Array film Works, Tom Hall,

753
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:49,080
Speaker 1: Global head of Social Impact in Philanthropy for UBS, and

754
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:54,960
Speaker 1: Regina Miller, executive director of the Array Alliance, the nonprofit

755
00:40:55,800 --> 00:40:58,120
Speaker 1: arm of Array film Works.

756
00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:00,399
Speaker 3: So here they are welcome. Hi.

757
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:03,080
Speaker 1: All right, So Paul, let's start with you. I know

758
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:07,520
Speaker 1: that you have been working with Ava Dubernet since twenty eleven,

759
00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 1: and over the last twelve years you've witnessed some pretty

760
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:16,319
Speaker 1: significant shifts in the way Hollywood does business and the

761
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:20,040
Speaker 1: way films are financed. So can you set the stage

762
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:24,880
Speaker 1: and explain to everyone sort of the position that filmmakers

763
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:29,279
Speaker 1: are finding themselves in in the current streaming environment or

764
00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:31,960
Speaker 1: the entertainment environment rit large.

765
00:41:32,200 --> 00:41:34,520
Speaker 7: Sure, I mean, I'm sure many people here have heard

766
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:40,800
Speaker 7: about the recently resolved labor contract that crippled the entertainment

767
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:44,719
Speaker 7: industry for the last eight months. It's indicative of an

768
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:49,560
Speaker 7: overall trend as we've tried to figure out new ways

769
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:54,239
Speaker 7: and new business models to produce content deliver it to

770
00:41:54,280 --> 00:41:59,360
Speaker 7: an audience for a price, and streaming has really challenged it.

771
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:03,759
Speaker 7: It's really rode it away what has historically been the

772
00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:07,120
Speaker 7: independent film model, where in the past we would go

773
00:42:07,239 --> 00:42:09,560
Speaker 7: out raise money, make a movie and then you end

774
00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:12,800
Speaker 7: up in this marketplace where you're just kind of dealing

775
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:16,360
Speaker 7: with bidders and people try to get your product. Streaming

776
00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:19,759
Speaker 7: really has changed that because they don't buy just a

777
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:22,320
Speaker 7: bit of the rights. If you go to a streamer,

778
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:25,640
Speaker 7: they take all the rights forever. And so it makes

779
00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:29,600
Speaker 7: it very difficult for an independent film, which is usually

780
00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 7: make on pure speculation, to really make its money back

781
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:39,480
Speaker 7: and or give it an opportunity to move forward into

782
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:42,600
Speaker 7: another production right after that. And so a lot of

783
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:44,839
Speaker 7: times we end up in the studio system, which is,

784
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:48,280
Speaker 7: you know, the normal way to make movies. The challenge

785
00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 7: is when you want to make a movie that has

786
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:52,600
Speaker 7: a particular statement and you want to do it in

787
00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 7: a particular way. The strings that come along with that

788
00:42:56,320 --> 00:43:01,120
Speaker 7: process is that there's a lot of input on what

789
00:43:01,200 --> 00:43:04,600
Speaker 7: you show, who you hire to show it, who the

790
00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:06,960
Speaker 7: person that should be the one to say it. It's

791
00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:09,040
Speaker 7: all about the cooks in the kitchen, the cooks in

792
00:43:09,080 --> 00:43:09,520
Speaker 7: the kitchen.

793
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:14,240
Speaker 1: And also streamers currently are contracting, right they were buying, buying,

794
00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:15,920
Speaker 1: buying suddenly, yeah, and.

795
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:18,320
Speaker 7: The industry is shrinking right right now. Yeah.

796
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:21,480
Speaker 1: And I know initially this film was with Netflix, but

797
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:25,359
Speaker 1: you all decided you wanted to take it back at

798
00:43:25,400 --> 00:43:29,239
Speaker 1: full control, and you noticed that Netflix were kind of

799
00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:32,680
Speaker 1: that the folks at Netflix were slow moving. So what

800
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:35,919
Speaker 1: was the rationale and how much courage did it take

801
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,160
Speaker 1: for you all to say, wait a second, we're going

802
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:40,680
Speaker 1: to take this project back and we're going to run

803
00:43:41,200 --> 00:43:41,680
Speaker 1: run with it.

804
00:43:41,880 --> 00:43:43,920
Speaker 7: Yeah, when we first started, we thought it was going

805
00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:45,840
Speaker 7: to be a traditional like it's going to Netflix, and

806
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:49,399
Speaker 7: we had done projects with Netflix before and so as

807
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:51,360
Speaker 7: a partner, we thought this would be a good place

808
00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 7: for it. But as you mentioned, the industry started to

809
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:58,440
Speaker 7: slow down last year to a point where shows that

810
00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:01,240
Speaker 7: would have been greenlit, which means that they were given

811
00:44:01,239 --> 00:44:04,480
Speaker 7: to go to move forward, we're getting now the flashing

812
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:09,840
Speaker 7: yellow And from our standpoint, and what Avera really wanted

813
00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 7: for this film was for it to be out now,

814
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:16,040
Speaker 7: to be in the marketplace, to be in theaters for

815
00:44:16,160 --> 00:44:20,720
Speaker 7: people to see and talk about, far before the election

816
00:44:20,840 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 7: cycles and all those things.

817
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: So, Regina, I know that you all raised thirty eight

818
00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:30,560
Speaker 1: million dollars from philanthropists and various foundations to get this

819
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:36,040
Speaker 1: film made, And why did you think approaching these stakeholders,

820
00:44:36,080 --> 00:44:39,839
Speaker 1: if you will, would be your solution? To getting this

821
00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:41,600
Speaker 1: movie made.

822
00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:48,000
Speaker 5: First of all, philanthropy is changing, and the philanthropists of

823
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:53,400
Speaker 5: today are looking for innovative ways to invest, both through

824
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:59,920
Speaker 5: program mission related investments PRIs or MRIs through their endowments,

825
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:03,480
Speaker 5: and then they're also looking to put their philanthropic dollars

826
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:07,800
Speaker 5: to work in meaningful ways. And we have a visionary

827
00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:12,120
Speaker 5: and Ava DuVernay is extraordinary, and she had a clear vision.

828
00:45:12,760 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 5: And fundraising is easy when you can go to funders

829
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:20,400
Speaker 5: with confidence and clarity of what you want to achieve,

830
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:24,440
Speaker 5: and she was clear. And it was impact from the

831
00:45:24,520 --> 00:45:27,759
Speaker 5: beginning to the end, not just a marketing campaign for

832
00:45:27,840 --> 00:45:31,399
Speaker 5: two weeks. It was infusing that into everything we do,

833
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:34,319
Speaker 5: how we treat communities when we go in there, how

834
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:37,440
Speaker 5: we leave them better than we found them, and also

835
00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:42,160
Speaker 5: how to put philanthropic dollars into action to really have

836
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:44,319
Speaker 5: change immediately, because we can't wait.

837
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 1: And the film is really just the beginning. You know,

838
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:52,279
Speaker 1: it's community screenings, it's education conversations. Is this really that

839
00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:56,359
Speaker 1: new a business model or is this similar to what PBS,

840
00:45:56,400 --> 00:45:58,960
Speaker 1: for example, has been doing for decades.

841
00:46:00,560 --> 00:46:06,239
Speaker 7: Certainly, I think philanthropic relationships in creating documentaries has been

842
00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:09,200
Speaker 7: a very known model, but when you cross it over

843
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:13,840
Speaker 7: into the narrative feature world, it is unique, and so

844
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:16,440
Speaker 7: it's exciting to see kind of what the take is

845
00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:17,440
Speaker 7: from that experience.

846
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:21,120
Speaker 5: And also, when everybody comes out to see this movie

847
00:46:21,239 --> 00:46:24,040
Speaker 5: and the box office does well, not only WOUL the

848
00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:26,919
Speaker 5: social impact investors make their money back and then some

849
00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:30,759
Speaker 5: but philanthropy will be reinvested in through our grants that

850
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 5: we put into the movie. And now those grants can

851
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:37,640
Speaker 5: keep generating more and more towards impacting our mission. So

852
00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:40,960
Speaker 5: the way that the synergy between social impact investing and

853
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:45,480
Speaker 5: philanthropy is going to keep feeding the mission is beautiful

854
00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:47,200
Speaker 5: and it's continuous.

855
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:49,960
Speaker 1: It's like a virtual circle, right, And Tom, can you

856
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:56,080
Speaker 1: break down this concept of catalytic capital and what that

857
00:46:56,160 --> 00:46:57,040
Speaker 1: means exactly?

858
00:46:57,440 --> 00:46:59,360
Speaker 8: Yeah, maybe, just before I do that, I think just

859
00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 8: to kind of fried context to why UBS is sitting here.

860
00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:05,800
Speaker 8: And you know, we have a million oworth clients around

861
00:47:05,840 --> 00:47:08,840
Speaker 8: the world, and that's also a million philanthropists. We know

862
00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:12,480
Speaker 8: that ninety percent of our clients are already involved in philanthropy,

863
00:47:12,560 --> 00:47:14,919
Speaker 8: and in fact they say that they want to try

864
00:47:14,920 --> 00:47:18,840
Speaker 8: and solve the pressing social and environmental problems the world's facing.

865
00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:22,600
Speaker 8: But the reality is that philanthropy on its own can't

866
00:47:22,600 --> 00:47:25,480
Speaker 8: do that. Forbes estimated that philanthropy are about ten trillion

867
00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:27,120
Speaker 8: dollars by the mid twenty thirties.

868
00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 4: That's a really big number. That's five times what it

869
00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:29,680
Speaker 4: is today.

870
00:47:30,239 --> 00:47:32,480
Speaker 8: But if we take the sustainable development goals as a

871
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:35,759
Speaker 8: proxy for solving these big social environmental issues, we need

872
00:47:35,840 --> 00:47:38,759
Speaker 8: thirty trillion. So if we try and give people free

873
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:41,319
Speaker 8: healthcare or free education, the money is just going to

874
00:47:41,360 --> 00:47:43,399
Speaker 8: run out. So we have to use it catalytically, which

875
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:44,759
Speaker 8: is why I fully agree with you.

876
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:46,120
Speaker 4: Philanthropy is changing. It's innovating.

877
00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:50,440
Speaker 8: People want to see their capital innovating first and foremost,

878
00:47:50,920 --> 00:47:53,799
Speaker 8: but then those innovations going to scale, and there's really

879
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:55,120
Speaker 8: only two pathways to scale.

880
00:47:55,160 --> 00:47:56,520
Speaker 4: You can use your philanthropic dollars.

881
00:47:56,520 --> 00:47:59,600
Speaker 8: For example, many people might not know we're all sitting

882
00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 8: back here in this theater because the rn D for

883
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:07,160
Speaker 8: the vaccine development the COVID vaccines was done with philanthropic capital.

884
00:48:07,200 --> 00:48:09,319
Speaker 8: It was a risk that the market would never have

885
00:48:09,360 --> 00:48:11,919
Speaker 8: taken on its own, but that was then scaled through

886
00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:13,879
Speaker 8: investment capital at the right time for all of us.

887
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:16,600
Speaker 8: So that's one pathway that you can be truly catalytic.

888
00:48:16,960 --> 00:48:19,320
Speaker 8: The other is that you can also you know, idea

889
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:23,760
Speaker 8: new business models around maybe early child development or children

890
00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:26,480
Speaker 8: learning more efficiently, more effectively, and then you can get

891
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:29,359
Speaker 8: governments to adopt that. In fact, just earlier this week

892
00:48:29,480 --> 00:48:32,440
Speaker 8: we I was at cop and we had several global

893
00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:37,520
Speaker 8: governments agreeing to fund some treatments around neglected tropical diseases

894
00:48:37,520 --> 00:48:40,120
Speaker 8: that have been ideated with philanthropic dollars. Then we raised

895
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:42,040
Speaker 8: just under a billion dollars as announced last week. So

896
00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:44,520
Speaker 8: you can really move huge amounts of capital into things

897
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:48,920
Speaker 8: that work by thinking catalytically, thinking with scale in mind,

898
00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:51,120
Speaker 8: and that's what it's all about. And that's obviously very

899
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:54,920
Speaker 8: exciting for philanthropists to be part of really solving issues

900
00:48:54,960 --> 00:48:55,400
Speaker 8: at scale.

901
00:48:55,640 --> 00:48:58,560
Speaker 1: So you sort of start micro and then expand it

902
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:02,759
Speaker 1: to on a much scale. Paul, how do you measure success?

903
00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:06,759
Speaker 1: You know, when it comes to the impact of this film.

904
00:49:06,800 --> 00:49:10,480
Speaker 1: I mean Regina mentioned box office, but is that really

905
00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:13,600
Speaker 1: how you're going to measure success? I mean, how much

906
00:49:13,600 --> 00:49:16,680
Speaker 1: of it is returning capital and how much of it

907
00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:20,280
Speaker 1: is changing hearts and minds and just having a huge

908
00:49:20,680 --> 00:49:22,279
Speaker 1: impact on attitudes.

909
00:49:22,560 --> 00:49:26,960
Speaker 7: Sure, yeah, I think impact and success really go hand

910
00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:32,320
Speaker 7: in hand in this case. Obviously, the traditional successful conversation

911
00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:34,840
Speaker 7: after a movie comes out is how much money it makes.

912
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:40,000
Speaker 7: That's what everyone you know, focuses on. But at its core,

913
00:49:40,200 --> 00:49:42,560
Speaker 7: one thing that we are really excited about with this

914
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:45,680
Speaker 7: particular movie is this is a movie based on a

915
00:49:45,719 --> 00:49:51,799
Speaker 7: book called Cast that is banned in many states. And

916
00:49:51,840 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 7: so the idea that you also now can introduce a

917
00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:58,760
Speaker 7: movie that won't be banned, and kids in high school

918
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:00,719
Speaker 7: who go to a school whe they can't read the

919
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:05,640
Speaker 7: book Cast to understand the complexities of this conversation could

920
00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:07,160
Speaker 7: go to the movie and see it and still have

921
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:11,359
Speaker 7: that conversation. And so I think when you look at success,

922
00:50:11,640 --> 00:50:13,880
Speaker 7: it is really for us based on the impact the

923
00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:17,359
Speaker 7: film can have. And you either walk away thinking, you know, wow,

924
00:50:17,400 --> 00:50:20,399
Speaker 7: this really means something to it, or you walk away

925
00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:22,640
Speaker 7: and say, you know, not even realize that you've planted

926
00:50:22,680 --> 00:50:25,759
Speaker 7: a seed there. And when someone gets into a situation

927
00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:29,400
Speaker 7: where the idea of Cast comes up in their regular life,

928
00:50:29,440 --> 00:50:31,880
Speaker 7: it's there. It's planted, and it can come out and

929
00:50:31,920 --> 00:50:34,960
Speaker 7: hopefully grow into something useful to society.

930
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:39,480
Speaker 1: But how important is it, Paul that this film makes money?

931
00:50:39,640 --> 00:50:42,239
Speaker 7: It's very important that it makes money, you know, not

932
00:50:42,840 --> 00:50:45,240
Speaker 7: because I mean the good news is we've made the movie,

933
00:50:46,080 --> 00:50:49,319
Speaker 7: not because the return helps us make the movie, but

934
00:50:49,840 --> 00:50:53,200
Speaker 7: making money means that people are seeing it, and so

935
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:56,760
Speaker 7: for us really pushing it out there, it helps recoup

936
00:50:56,800 --> 00:50:59,720
Speaker 7: the investment for our investors, but it really does fulfill

937
00:50:59,840 --> 00:51:02,320
Speaker 7: the other side of it. They go hand in hand,

938
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:03,160
Speaker 7: the impact.

939
00:51:03,719 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 3: Tom, I'm curious.

940
00:51:04,719 --> 00:51:06,960
Speaker 1: You know, my husband and I started a media company

941
00:51:07,000 --> 00:51:10,320
Speaker 1: about five years ago, and we work with global purpose

942
00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:14,279
Speaker 1: driven brands. So it's not just sort of the philanthropists

943
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:17,800
Speaker 1: who are or the you know, the private wealth folks

944
00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:21,800
Speaker 1: in a bank like UBS or a financial institution like UBS.

945
00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:26,520
Speaker 1: Companies are now getting much more involved in putting their

946
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:31,440
Speaker 1: sort of mark on big, thorny social issues because consumers

947
00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:35,680
Speaker 1: are demanding it, their employees are demanding it. So do

948
00:51:35,719 --> 00:51:40,520
Speaker 1: you think that this model where corporations get more involved

949
00:51:40,719 --> 00:51:44,239
Speaker 1: in things like a film that has such an important

950
00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:49,400
Speaker 1: social message will continue and even grow in the marketplace.

951
00:51:50,239 --> 00:51:53,080
Speaker 8: I mean, I think it's essential that that's what corporations do.

952
00:51:53,239 --> 00:51:56,520
Speaker 8: And ultimately, you know, when we think about impact, you know,

953
00:51:57,080 --> 00:51:58,799
Speaker 8: it can sound like we're trying to talk about doing

954
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:00,200
Speaker 8: the right thing because it's the right thing do.

955
00:52:00,520 --> 00:52:02,000
Speaker 4: But actually there's another way to frame it.

956
00:52:02,280 --> 00:52:04,360
Speaker 8: If we meet the sustainable animal goals again, which I

957
00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:07,040
Speaker 8: use as a proxy for really addressing these issues around

958
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:10,160
Speaker 8: social and economic inequality and making sure people can achieve

959
00:52:10,200 --> 00:52:13,120
Speaker 8: their potential. We're talking about adding three hundred and eighty

960
00:52:13,200 --> 00:52:16,600
Speaker 8: million new jobs the global economy and twelve trillion of

961
00:52:16,760 --> 00:52:17,760
Speaker 8: global value.

962
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:18,040
Speaker 4: Right.

963
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:21,160
Speaker 8: The growth is going to come from us actually finding

964
00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:25,680
Speaker 8: ways to finance and really enable people to get something

965
00:52:25,719 --> 00:52:28,720
Speaker 8: like education. I mean, actually just really interested in the audience.

966
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:33,239
Speaker 8: Maybe raise your hand if you went to college or university. Yeah,

967
00:52:33,280 --> 00:52:35,880
Speaker 8: probably most of us would think that that was contingent

968
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:38,560
Speaker 8: on our success. And then again, maybe raise your hand

969
00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:40,359
Speaker 8: if you had to take some kind of student loan.

970
00:52:41,520 --> 00:52:43,600
Speaker 8: Did anyone pay more than twenty percent on their loan?

971
00:52:44,160 --> 00:52:46,320
Speaker 4: Anyone here? Just one person?

972
00:52:46,640 --> 00:52:52,000
Speaker 8: So today globally, right, there's about five one hundred million

973
00:52:52,040 --> 00:52:53,520
Speaker 8: people who can't.

974
00:52:53,280 --> 00:52:54,880
Speaker 4: Get access to basic student credit.

975
00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:58,719
Speaker 8: Their only option is to if they're not lucky enough

976
00:52:58,760 --> 00:53:00,000
Speaker 8: to be one on a million to get a scholarshi,

977
00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:02,279
Speaker 8: the only option is to take a loan that's priced

978
00:53:02,320 --> 00:53:05,600
Speaker 8: at forty percent APR. Young women from Rwanda maybe you know,

979
00:53:06,040 --> 00:53:08,239
Speaker 8: and we know that if she can get into not

980
00:53:08,280 --> 00:53:10,600
Speaker 8: even college, like a six month coding course, she's going

981
00:53:10,640 --> 00:53:11,800
Speaker 8: to ten exer income.

982
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:14,480
Speaker 4: This can be fixed by companies like UBS.

983
00:53:14,520 --> 00:53:16,560
Speaker 8: Our purpose is to reimagine the power of investing and

984
00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:19,880
Speaker 8: connect people for a better world. Connecting philanthropists like you

985
00:53:19,920 --> 00:53:23,120
Speaker 8: guys are doing with investors in these blended finance instruments,

986
00:53:23,120 --> 00:53:25,680
Speaker 8: you can solve this. We just did a fund recently

987
00:53:25,680 --> 00:53:28,720
Speaker 8: of small fund twenty two million dollars. Instead of doing

988
00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:31,480
Speaker 8: sixty scholarships, which is the traditional model, it's going to

989
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:33,799
Speaker 8: do ten thousand students in the next ten years. And

990
00:53:33,840 --> 00:53:36,360
Speaker 8: that capital will be repaid and recycled again and again.

991
00:53:36,520 --> 00:53:39,120
Speaker 8: And models like that are scalable. That would only require

992
00:53:39,120 --> 00:53:42,720
Speaker 8: about half a trillion dollars to give finance, fair price

993
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:45,040
Speaker 8: financing for education to every child in the world who

994
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:47,000
Speaker 8: needs it. And these are the kinds of big ideas

995
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:49,040
Speaker 8: that not just we as corporates need to have, but

996
00:53:49,360 --> 00:53:51,560
Speaker 8: as communities need to come together and build together.

997
00:53:51,880 --> 00:53:54,880
Speaker 1: Why has this film, Why does this film align so

998
00:53:55,080 --> 00:53:59,120
Speaker 1: well with UBS's values? You know, why was this you

999
00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:01,960
Speaker 1: know a good exam sample of this kind of partnership.

1000
00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:04,800
Speaker 8: Well, I think, ultimately, if you really want to solve issues,

1001
00:54:04,840 --> 00:54:07,200
Speaker 8: you're always going to end up in pockets of inequality

1002
00:54:07,200 --> 00:54:11,520
Speaker 8: and inequity, and in the US in particular, that has

1003
00:54:11,719 --> 00:54:16,440
Speaker 8: this kind of dimension around conversations around racial inequality and

1004
00:54:16,920 --> 00:54:19,480
Speaker 8: being able to and obviously I don't want to give

1005
00:54:19,480 --> 00:54:21,640
Speaker 8: it away. I've seen the film. It was a paradigm

1006
00:54:21,680 --> 00:54:25,279
Speaker 8: shifting experience for me. Gives us a new language to

1007
00:54:25,280 --> 00:54:27,000
Speaker 8: be able to talk about things perhaps we haven't been

1008
00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:29,560
Speaker 8: able to talk about, and dialogue is essential, right, I

1009
00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:32,960
Speaker 8: was a cop earlier this week. We're not going to

1010
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:35,360
Speaker 8: address the issues of global climate change without working with

1011
00:54:35,440 --> 00:54:39,239
Speaker 8: local communities well, helping them feed their families and really

1012
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:42,200
Speaker 8: understand what they're doing. We're not going to address issues

1013
00:54:42,200 --> 00:54:45,759
Speaker 8: around inequality without working with local communities, entrepreneurs, and this

1014
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:48,879
Speaker 8: is something you know, Jamie, who was applauded earlier, which

1015
00:54:48,880 --> 00:54:50,719
Speaker 8: she should be, has been working on this topic along

1016
00:54:50,719 --> 00:54:53,239
Speaker 8: with our social impact team for a decade because we've

1017
00:54:53,280 --> 00:54:56,399
Speaker 8: identified this as a key area that's critical to see

1018
00:54:56,400 --> 00:54:59,040
Speaker 8: both the economic and the social benefits. And we've been

1019
00:54:59,040 --> 00:55:02,320
Speaker 8: working with Black Innovation Alliance, for example, who we recommend

1020
00:55:02,360 --> 00:55:03,800
Speaker 8: to our clients. Of our clients give we do a

1021
00:55:03,840 --> 00:55:06,520
Speaker 8: ten percent match and it's not just about capital for

1022
00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:10,279
Speaker 8: black entrepreneurs. It's also about mentorship and about actually just

1023
00:55:10,280 --> 00:55:14,640
Speaker 8: trying to address some of the historic issues in this area.

1024
00:55:14,719 --> 00:55:17,520
Speaker 1: So this film will have a long tail, hopefully, and

1025
00:55:17,560 --> 00:55:20,920
Speaker 1: it's going to reverberate as you continue to show it.

1026
00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:24,080
Speaker 1: Hopefully it'll be on a stream or at some point

1027
00:55:24,520 --> 00:55:27,400
Speaker 1: so that even more people can have access to it.

1028
00:55:27,440 --> 00:55:30,160
Speaker 1: But Regina, can you just tell us briefly about some

1029
00:55:30,239 --> 00:55:33,280
Speaker 1: of the programs and Paul you too, that you hope

1030
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:36,680
Speaker 1: to implement that. Will you know it will have a

1031
00:55:36,760 --> 00:55:39,520
Speaker 1: ripple effect all across the land.

1032
00:55:40,480 --> 00:55:44,160
Speaker 5: Well, I already think it has because thousands of people

1033
00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:48,239
Speaker 5: and in different communities worked on this film. Literally, it

1034
00:55:48,280 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 5: feels like and it has changed hearts and minds. When

1035
00:55:52,200 --> 00:55:55,600
Speaker 5: people walk out of this movie, they're change agents. They

1036
00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:58,000
Speaker 5: want to even made the movie? Now, what are you

1037
00:55:58,040 --> 00:55:59,960
Speaker 5: going to do with it? And I hear that all

1038
00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:02,560
Speaker 5: the time, And I think I win the award at

1039
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:04,680
Speaker 5: Array for seeing the movie the most. I think I've

1040
00:56:04,719 --> 00:56:08,279
Speaker 5: seen it ten times, and every single time I walk out,

1041
00:56:08,360 --> 00:56:12,440
Speaker 5: I just love hearing the conversations. And this wonderful gentleman

1042
00:56:12,480 --> 00:56:15,320
Speaker 5: that's in the audience today came up to me and said,

1043
00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:17,520
Speaker 5: how do I do this in my community? I want

1044
00:56:17,560 --> 00:56:20,360
Speaker 5: to bring this to San Francisco. I want to people

1045
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:24,000
Speaker 5: want to gather, I think, especially around important issues, and

1046
00:56:24,040 --> 00:56:26,720
Speaker 5: they want to heal, and they want to have smart

1047
00:56:26,760 --> 00:56:30,239
Speaker 5: conversations and they want to be educated. And I think

1048
00:56:30,280 --> 00:56:33,560
Speaker 5: that with the work that we do our wonderful team

1049
00:56:33,560 --> 00:56:37,120
Speaker 5: at Array. Mercedes Cooper, who's here tonight, is our senior

1050
00:56:37,200 --> 00:56:41,520
Speaker 5: vice president of Programming. We host public, free programs around

1051
00:56:41,560 --> 00:56:44,800
Speaker 5: the movie that will be incorporated by the large release.

1052
00:56:45,120 --> 00:56:48,600
Speaker 5: Tammy Garnes, our director of A senior director of Education

1053
00:56:48,680 --> 00:56:53,160
Speaker 5: and Understanding, is launching a beautiful digital learning guide that

1054
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:56,920
Speaker 5: is a masterpiece that I actually think schools can use

1055
00:56:56,960 --> 00:57:01,040
Speaker 5: this learning guide for a year. It's a coursework. It's

1056
00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:04,360
Speaker 5: not just a couple of prompts. They're extraordinary. Go to

1057
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:06,279
Speaker 5: Array one oh one and look at some of our

1058
00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 5: other learning guides, but there's nothing like it out there

1059
00:57:09,120 --> 00:57:11,839
Speaker 5: in the education market. And then, of course, we have

1060
00:57:11,880 --> 00:57:15,080
Speaker 5: a podcast that's coming out that Paul is going to

1061
00:57:15,160 --> 00:57:21,680
Speaker 5: be moderating and leading, and we're constantly innovating creative partnerships

1062
00:57:21,720 --> 00:57:25,680
Speaker 5: with Expedia. How do we create travel experiences around this

1063
00:57:25,880 --> 00:57:28,800
Speaker 5: content and around the movie, how do we gather in

1064
00:57:28,880 --> 00:57:32,000
Speaker 5: small groups and have meaningful conversations with each other. So

1065
00:57:32,560 --> 00:57:36,360
Speaker 5: there's so many layers to array of how we approach impact.

1066
00:57:36,840 --> 00:57:39,240
Speaker 5: But the other thing that we're so proud of is

1067
00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:40,840
Speaker 5: you'll see it at the end of the movie. We

1068
00:57:40,920 --> 00:57:44,040
Speaker 5: got the highest seal for environmental justice on a movie

1069
00:57:44,800 --> 00:57:47,040
Speaker 5: that we also the way that the movie was made

1070
00:57:47,280 --> 00:57:50,080
Speaker 5: and the way we cared about the world and the

1071
00:57:50,120 --> 00:57:52,479
Speaker 5: community and the environment when we made it, So there's

1072
00:57:52,600 --> 00:57:56,280
Speaker 5: impact on every level. And I just also want to

1073
00:57:56,320 --> 00:58:00,640
Speaker 5: thank ubs because as a fundraiser, it's really really hard

1074
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:05,080
Speaker 5: to raise money and it's so beautiful when someone comes

1075
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:07,560
Speaker 5: to you and says, I have five donors that I

1076
00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:09,960
Speaker 5: want to introduce you to and you didn't have to ask,

1077
00:58:10,520 --> 00:58:13,800
Speaker 5: and that really shows the collaboration and leadership when you

1078
00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:17,200
Speaker 5: don't have to ask, but somebody gets your vision and

1079
00:58:17,440 --> 00:58:19,200
Speaker 5: Mark is like, we're going to get out there and

1080
00:58:19,240 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 5: do it.

1081
00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:20,360
Speaker 3: We're going to help you.

1082
00:58:20,600 --> 00:58:23,000
Speaker 5: So I just really want to thank you because not

1083
00:58:23,080 --> 00:58:26,600
Speaker 5: a lot of companies do that proactively, and it means

1084
00:58:26,600 --> 00:58:28,400
Speaker 5: the world to every single one of us that are

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Speaker 5: trying to make and fuel dreams. Because a lot of

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Speaker 5: people have dreams, but you have to fuel them, so

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Speaker 5: thank you for that.

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Speaker 1: I think that's a great way to end the conversation.

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Speaker 1: So ladies and gentlemen, Regina, Tom and Paul, thank you.

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Speaker 3: Thanks for listening. Everyone.

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Speaker 1: If you have a question for me, a subject you

1092
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Speaker 1: want us to cover, or you want to share your

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Speaker 1: thoughts about how you navigate this crazy world reach out.

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Speaker 1: You can leave a short message at six h nine

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Speaker 1: five P one two five five five, or you can

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Speaker 1: send me a DM on Instagram. I would love to

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Speaker 1: hear from you. Next Question is a production of iHeartMedia

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Speaker 1: and Katie Kuric Media. The executive producers are Me, Katie Kuric,

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Speaker 1: and Courtney Ltz. Our supervising producer is Ryan Martz, and

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Speaker 1: our producers are Adriana Fazzio and Meredith Barnes. Julian Weller

1101
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Speaker 1: composed our theme music. For more information about today's episode,

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Speaker 1: us at Katiecuric dot com. You can also find me

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Speaker 2: Two