1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,320 Speaker 1: Welcome to today's edition of the Clay Travis and Buck 2 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:07,640 Speaker 1: Sexton Show podcast. Welcome in Clay Travis buck Sexton Show. 3 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:10,440 Speaker 1: Third hour of the program. Encourage you to go subscribe 4 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:15,280 Speaker 1: to the podcast as millions of you have been downloading 5 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:18,279 Speaker 1: this every single month. We appreciate all of you, and 6 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:20,200 Speaker 1: search out my name Clay Travis. You can search out 7 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:24,439 Speaker 1: Buck Sexton Boom. You'll also get podcast unique interviews that 8 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 1: we believe you will all love. We'll join now. There's 9 00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:32,040 Speaker 1: a battle of bruhaha going on right now out in 10 00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:37,839 Speaker 1: the state of Oklahoma over trans treatments for young children. 11 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 1: The governor of Oklahoma, Kevin Stitt, joins us. Now, Governor, 12 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,360 Speaker 1: appreciate the time. I know you're in the middle of 13 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:47,920 Speaker 1: a battle out there. What is so controversial? You walk 14 00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:50,240 Speaker 1: me through this. You can't get a tattoo most places 15 00:00:50,240 --> 00:00:52,559 Speaker 1: till you're eighteen. You can't drink a beer till your 16 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 1: twenty one, You can't rent a car till you're twenty five. 17 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:58,960 Speaker 1: Why is it controversial to say, especially for minor kids, 18 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:03,760 Speaker 1: that they can't have gender reassignment surgery. What's this battleground 19 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:07,600 Speaker 1: like and why is it even a battleground? At all. Well, 20 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:10,840 Speaker 1: first off, pretty common sense to us. We don't think 21 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:13,960 Speaker 1: it should be controversial. We're really just trying to protect kids. 22 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 1: We're not trying to go against any person. But we 23 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:20,120 Speaker 1: do not believe, like you said, that a miner that 24 00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:23,240 Speaker 1: can't buy alcohol, can't buy cigarettes, can't get a tattoo, 25 00:01:24,040 --> 00:01:27,320 Speaker 1: should go in and have a permanent gender altering surgery. 26 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:30,199 Speaker 1: It just makes no sense at all. So I've called 27 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:32,240 Speaker 1: the legislature to ban that. And then you've got some 28 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:35,959 Speaker 1: You've got some folks that are that are I don't know, 29 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:37,679 Speaker 1: you'll have to have them on there why they think 30 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 1: that's a good idea to do this to miners. But 31 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 1: you have a few protesters coming out, but overwhelmingly Oklahoma 32 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 1: and support this, and we're gonna get it across the 33 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: finish line. Governor State, it's buck, thanks for being with us. 34 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:53,560 Speaker 1: It seems that there's a number of bills at Bill 35 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 1: one twenty nine, the Millstone Act, and that would have 36 00:01:57,880 --> 00:02:01,360 Speaker 1: a ban on gender reassignment for those under twenty six. 37 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: I'm just wondering, is it already clear which one of 38 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:10,320 Speaker 1: these bills is the one that we'll get through the legislature. Basically, 39 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:13,680 Speaker 1: which one are you going to sign. Yeah, well, first off, 40 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:15,960 Speaker 1: I'm going to sign whichever one goes from our desk, 41 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:18,360 Speaker 1: but I'm working with the leadership of the House to Senate. 42 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 1: We think the cleanest way is just say eighteen years old. 43 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:23,839 Speaker 1: There's a there's a thought to go to twenty one, 44 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 1: but it's very clear that anybody under the age of eighteen, 45 00:02:29,120 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: we need to protect those young people. And listen, these 46 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:36,160 Speaker 1: are elective surgeries. We don't want tax dollars to go 47 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:38,760 Speaker 1: to these type of surgeries. If you want to do 48 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: this and in selective surgery after you're an adult, that's 49 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 1: one thing. But but again, we have a responsibility to 50 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:48,480 Speaker 1: protect our young people, protect our children, and uh, and 51 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:50,240 Speaker 1: we're gonna do it. I mean, this is the only 52 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:52,799 Speaker 1: type of a surgery that you know, somebody can come 53 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 1: into a doctor self diagnose themselves and also prescribe the 54 00:02:56,720 --> 00:02:59,960 Speaker 1: surgery that they want. And we just think that type 55 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 1: the surgery should be left to an adult after your 56 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:05,399 Speaker 1: brain is fully developed. And there's all kinds of studies 57 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:08,160 Speaker 1: that that that that kind of back that up that 58 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 1: that kids, you're not you're not able to make that 59 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 1: decision at that point. So let's just wait till your 60 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:18,880 Speaker 1: governor in your state in Oklahoma? What is the current procedure? 61 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 1: Is there one for uh? You know, because this law 62 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:26,000 Speaker 1: obviously would would address this. But prior to this law 63 00:03:26,200 --> 00:03:33,640 Speaker 1: or previous to this laws um signature and going into effect. Uh, 64 00:03:33,720 --> 00:03:37,720 Speaker 1: is there some baseline number of visits? Is there some 65 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 1: number of different professionals, like basically for a minor to 66 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 1: have transgender surgery as it exists right now in Oklahoma, 67 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 1: is there any defined process or is it just up 68 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:52,320 Speaker 1: to the individual medical practitioner? Well, that was that was 69 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:54,839 Speaker 1: the case. There was actually a clinic that we discovered 70 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:59,040 Speaker 1: in one of our big university hospitals that was that 71 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:01,720 Speaker 1: we're performing these type of surgeries and so they were 72 00:04:01,800 --> 00:04:05,000 Speaker 1: you know, basically promoting it or people that were coming 73 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 1: in and they could do this these permanent altering surgeries there. 74 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 1: And so I did an executive order last year to 75 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:13,880 Speaker 1: stop that from taxpayer dollars being used, and then I 76 00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 1: asked the legislature to codify that into law this year, 77 00:04:17,200 --> 00:04:20,960 Speaker 1: but not a ton had been done. So again, this 78 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:25,600 Speaker 1: is a very very small minority of of of folks. 79 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:29,599 Speaker 1: And uh, and again we're not against any any one person, 80 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:33,120 Speaker 1: and we believe in freedoms and personal responsibilities, but we 81 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 1: have a duty to protect young people and that's what 82 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:37,480 Speaker 1: we're talking about here. We're talking about kids that are 83 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:40,679 Speaker 1: under the age of eighteen, and that's what I'm calling 84 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:44,200 Speaker 1: for in legislation this year in Oklahoma. Where has this 85 00:04:44,279 --> 00:04:47,159 Speaker 1: come from, Kevin Um? I mean, you're a governor, but 86 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 1: let's just step it back, like you're also a dad. 87 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:53,520 Speaker 1: I'm a dad. We've got young kids. You're around my age. 88 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:56,640 Speaker 1: You grew up like there were people who were tomboys, 89 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:58,800 Speaker 1: right like seven eight year old girls. I mean we 90 00:04:58,839 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 1: had I've coach Little League base Paul, We've got girls 91 00:05:01,279 --> 00:05:05,240 Speaker 1: playing on the teams. This idea that you should be 92 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 1: treating kids who suddenly say, at eight years old like 93 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:12,720 Speaker 1: I'm in the wrong body. We're going to delay puberty, 94 00:05:12,880 --> 00:05:16,160 Speaker 1: We're gonna take i mean literally take off some of 95 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 1: their organs in an effort to make them a different gender. 96 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:24,600 Speaker 1: This is all way more substantial then where the transgender 97 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:27,600 Speaker 1: universe began, which, as you mentioned, is Hey, I'm an 98 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 1: adult and I've decided as an adult to make these choices. 99 00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 1: Where is this drop force of child treatment coming from? 100 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:39,600 Speaker 1: And are you as stunned to see it sweep the country, 101 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:41,719 Speaker 1: as both Buck and I have been, and many of 102 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:46,920 Speaker 1: our listeners are as well. I mean listen, I mean 103 00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:50,279 Speaker 1: people that are that are coming out of the woodwork. 104 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 1: The left just continues to move further and further away 105 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:59,800 Speaker 1: from mainstream and what is normal and reasonable and righteous. 106 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:03,280 Speaker 1: So again I can't tell you where it's coming from, 107 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:05,800 Speaker 1: but what I can tell you that people are starving. 108 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:08,440 Speaker 1: The most people around in America that we talk to, 109 00:06:08,839 --> 00:06:11,880 Speaker 1: they're starving for people to talk about traditional family values 110 00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:15,040 Speaker 1: where they're starving for people to talk about putting the fam, 111 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:18,760 Speaker 1: putting focus back on the family. And again, this isn't 112 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 1: against any one person, but to us, it's just common 113 00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 1: sense that we're going to protect our young people in 114 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:27,360 Speaker 1: the state of Oklahoma. We don't think that should be controversial. 115 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 1: But again, you're gonna have You're gonna have a few 116 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:32,679 Speaker 1: people complain, you know, if your ice cream's too cold. 117 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:36,160 Speaker 1: So you've always got these fringe folks that are gonna 118 00:06:36,160 --> 00:06:39,640 Speaker 1: come complain about something. And so we really we're gonna 119 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:41,600 Speaker 1: move forward with this. It's the right thing to do, 120 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:45,480 Speaker 1: and Oklahoma prewhelmingly support me, and I think most Americans 121 00:06:46,040 --> 00:06:48,360 Speaker 1: think that we need to protect minors as well. We're 122 00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 1: speaking of Governor Kevin Stitt of Oklahoma. Governor, there was 123 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:56,200 Speaker 1: that protest that made its way inside the Capitol. There 124 00:06:56,320 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 1: were there any arrests, And I'm just wondering if your 125 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 1: expectations are that these kinds of protests in and around 126 00:07:02,839 --> 00:07:07,200 Speaker 1: the capital are likely to continue. You know, there were 127 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:09,520 Speaker 1: no arrests, and for the most part, I mean they 128 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:11,560 Speaker 1: screamed and hollered a little bit. That they had a 129 00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 1: permit to protest on the second floor, they moved up 130 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:15,600 Speaker 1: to the fourth floor. So when I was going out 131 00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 1: to deliver my State of the State address, you know, 132 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:23,760 Speaker 1: they were screaming some profanities at me. But anyway, no 133 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:26,720 Speaker 1: big deal. It wasn't like they tore anything up or 134 00:07:26,760 --> 00:07:29,320 Speaker 1: broke into the capital or anything like that. But our 135 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:31,560 Speaker 1: police had it all under control. And I mean, in Oklahoma, 136 00:07:31,560 --> 00:07:33,800 Speaker 1: we're gonna arrest you if you get out of control 137 00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 1: in Oklahoma. So they immediately said, hey, you're going we're 138 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:39,240 Speaker 1: arresting you. They only had a permission to be on 139 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 1: the second floor if they didn't quiet down, So everybody 140 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:44,880 Speaker 1: immediately started quieting down. But we had a great show 141 00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:48,000 Speaker 1: of force, and we had our you know, our great 142 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 1: Highway Patrol. We're all over that situation and nothing, there 143 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 1: was never any danger for the citizens of the state 144 00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 1: of Oklahoma or the capital. We're talking to Governor of Oklahoma, 145 00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 1: Kevin Stitt, M Kevin shifting years off of the transgender issue. 146 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:07,240 Speaker 1: We just had a Chinese spy balloon float all over 147 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 1: the entirety of the United States. Now I don't believe 148 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:13,680 Speaker 1: it came through Oklahoma airspace, but one of the things 149 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 1: Buck and I talk Inaoma. So I mean, so that's 150 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: that's that's my question. Honestly, that's my question for you. 151 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:21,280 Speaker 1: I said, if I had been the governor of Tennessee, 152 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 1: and I think it kind of skirted Tennessee and you 153 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 1: know it went out in South Carolina, North Carolina. Whatever. Okay, 154 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:29,920 Speaker 1: let's say that you are the governor of Oklahoma, and 155 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 1: let's say that another Chinese spy balloon comes into the 156 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 1: United States again, which given what happened once, I mean, 157 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:38,800 Speaker 1: why would we not think they might do it again? 158 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:42,560 Speaker 1: Can you, as the governor of Oklahoma shoot this thing down? 159 00:08:42,640 --> 00:08:45,280 Speaker 1: I mean, I did you ask you your team like 160 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:48,200 Speaker 1: we haven't ever really to my knowledge, had a situation 161 00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 1: like this, it's without precedent. But the argument that I 162 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:53,360 Speaker 1: made on the radio show is, if it's in a 163 00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 1: state airspace and if the governor wants to call out 164 00:08:56,840 --> 00:08:59,560 Speaker 1: the state guard or someone that he's in charge of, 165 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:03,400 Speaker 1: could you shoot down that's five plane, that's five balloon? 166 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 1: Would you have done it? I mean, what should happen there? 167 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:09,760 Speaker 1: What should have governor do? Well? First? First off, you 168 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:11,719 Speaker 1: know I say that tongue in cheek a little bit, 169 00:09:12,480 --> 00:09:15,280 Speaker 1: but but absolutely this was so frustrating for I know, 170 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:18,640 Speaker 1: my Republican governor colleagues around the country. When we first 171 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:20,400 Speaker 1: saw that coming, we got on the phone, we got 172 00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 1: briefed by the d D in the White House on 173 00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:25,200 Speaker 1: this issue. And whyant wasn't ever shot down before it 174 00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:28,560 Speaker 1: made into the US airspace is a head scratcher. And 175 00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:31,200 Speaker 1: I did call my National Guard. I called my commander. 176 00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 1: I'm the commander in chief of the Oklahoma National Guard, 177 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:35,760 Speaker 1: and so I was talking to him if it did 178 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 1: make it down here, what we've got We've got an 179 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:41,839 Speaker 1: F fifteen F sixteen in our in our at our 180 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:45,240 Speaker 1: Tulsa National Guard, and so we had those conversations. Obviously 181 00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:47,240 Speaker 1: that's a bigger conversation that we would need to have 182 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:51,800 Speaker 1: with the Department of Offense. But like every American you know, 183 00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:54,360 Speaker 1: and my job is to protect the citizens of Oklahoma 184 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:57,640 Speaker 1: with our National Guard. So but that's a huge, huge 185 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:00,280 Speaker 1: issue that we obviously would be in consultation with the 186 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:03,960 Speaker 1: big army. But I guess the real question we need 187 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:06,319 Speaker 1: to ask ourselves is how did we let it let 188 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:09,559 Speaker 1: it get into the airspace a United States? And that's 189 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:12,079 Speaker 1: really the question that needs to be answered. And if 190 00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 1: the if the Pentagon did not brief the President, which 191 00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:17,480 Speaker 1: I'm heard they didn't, I think heads need to roll 192 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 1: there as well. Pentagon didn't break brief Trump or didn't 193 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:24,560 Speaker 1: brief Biden on this, didn't brief Biden if they go 194 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:27,680 Speaker 1: wow Biden until it was in uh, until it was 195 00:10:27,840 --> 00:10:30,600 Speaker 1: already inside the US airspace, And that's a big problem. 196 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 1: But yes, the President needed to make decisions before that 197 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:37,880 Speaker 1: thing came all across our continental United States and governors did. 198 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 1: What do you make of the reports that, oh, there 199 00:10:40,520 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 1: were a bunch of balloons under Trump too, but no 200 00:10:43,559 --> 00:10:47,440 Speaker 1: one told Trump something like that. I don't believe that 201 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:50,679 Speaker 1: at all. I mean, I know President Trump, and there's 202 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:53,040 Speaker 1: no possible way he would have let that happen, and 203 00:10:53,080 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 1: so we did not believe that there were spy balloons 204 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:59,840 Speaker 1: here in the continental US. Under Trump, all right, much 205 00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:04,000 Speaker 1: less serious. But I saw that Americans are gonna wager 206 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,679 Speaker 1: I don't know if you've seen this story. Americans are 207 00:11:06,679 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 1: gonna wager more money on the Super Bowl than Iran 208 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 1: spends every year on its entire defense department. So we 209 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:17,000 Speaker 1: got the Kansas City Chiefs and the Philadelphia Eagles. I 210 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:21,040 Speaker 1: know you're a big sports fan. Who's gonna win? Why, man, 211 00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:23,120 Speaker 1: I'm gonna go with I'm gonna go with the Chiefs. 212 00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:27,840 Speaker 1: Uh My Homes. I really like Mahomes Now. Now Hurts 213 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:31,199 Speaker 1: has a little connection to Oklahoma. He quarterback University of Oklahoma, 214 00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:33,400 Speaker 1: so little. But you're an Oklahoma State Cowboys. So I 215 00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 1: don't know if you want to back and knowe you guys, 216 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:38,920 Speaker 1: I am an Oklahoma State cowboy. But you know when 217 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:41,120 Speaker 1: when when when a local boy does well, you want 218 00:11:41,120 --> 00:11:43,280 Speaker 1: to you want to root for him too. But Mahomes 219 00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:45,120 Speaker 1: I watched him play when he was at Texas Tech 220 00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: and and as a big twelve guy, he's just been 221 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:52,199 Speaker 1: amazing good stuff. Governor. Well, we appreciate you what you're 222 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:54,800 Speaker 1: the fight. You're fighting out there over this what seems 223 00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:57,840 Speaker 1: like quite simple child abuse bill to try to protect 224 00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:01,120 Speaker 1: kids out there. And uh, hope if the Chinese spy 225 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:03,360 Speaker 1: balloon comes through the state of Oklahoma, you can take 226 00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:05,320 Speaker 1: it out and come on and talk about it with us. Oh, 227 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:08,320 Speaker 1: that'd be pretty cool. Well, listen, keep talking truth out there. 228 00:12:08,920 --> 00:12:11,680 Speaker 1: Americans love you guys. We'll keep it going. Thank you 229 00:12:11,720 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 1: so much, Governor. Okay, thank you, bye bye. He's great. 230 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: And the fact buck like we said that this could 231 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:23,280 Speaker 1: ever have been controversial. Hey, you can't have surgery on 232 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 1: minors to change their gender. I mean, I just I 233 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:29,080 Speaker 1: wonder how we ever got here? Right? How about you 234 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:32,000 Speaker 1: and me? On Friday and all of our listeners when 235 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:36,760 Speaker 1: the balloon's flying over our airspace were like, shoot it down, yeah, 236 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:39,640 Speaker 1: I mean immediate, and there were all the lives were, oh, 237 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:42,960 Speaker 1: it would cause an international conflagration. And then a couple 238 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:45,760 Speaker 1: of days later, Biden shoots it down. Okay, okay, talk, 239 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:48,199 Speaker 1: except she shoots it down over water and they're having 240 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:52,679 Speaker 1: difficulty salvaging all the pieces because it's over water. It's there. Look, 241 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: everybody's got great family memories, a lot of them, though, 242 00:12:56,760 --> 00:12:59,800 Speaker 1: maybe captured on an eight millimeter, Maybe they're on vhs. 243 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: Maybe they are out there on old slides, old pictures. 244 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:08,160 Speaker 1: Would you like to prepare your family to be able 245 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 1: to experience those memories for as long as you can 246 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:16,080 Speaker 1: possibly imagine by ensuring that all of your family's memories 247 00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:21,240 Speaker 1: are preserved on digital files. Probably in the back of 248 00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:23,440 Speaker 1: your mind you're thinking, yeah, I should do that. Coming 249 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:25,920 Speaker 1: up on Valentine's Day, maybe you want to give a 250 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:29,280 Speaker 1: gift to your family something really cool. How about checking 251 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 1: out legacybox dot com slash clay to get started preserving 252 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:37,200 Speaker 1: your family's memories Forever company headquarters. Guess where Chattanooga, Tennessee. 253 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:39,080 Speaker 1: It's where my mom grew up, so where I spend 254 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:40,400 Speaker 1: a lot of time growing up, where much of my 255 00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:44,280 Speaker 1: family is from. They are really right here in the 256 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:47,680 Speaker 1: United States. 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What are the facts? 266 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:28,640 Speaker 1: What is the state of the Union right now? Because 267 00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:31,280 Speaker 1: we're ready here it's great tonight, It's not great. I 268 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 1: mean people are worried. Every breakfast. People used to have 269 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 1: eggs and think it was they'll big deal, just some pote. 270 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:41,240 Speaker 1: Now it's almost a specialty because the price is so high. 271 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:44,360 Speaker 1: I mean, they're worried about the field. They're worried about 272 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: their jobs. As they go they see inflation time after again, 273 00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:49,080 Speaker 1: and then when you look at the latest pulling, they're 274 00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 1: worried about their government. So this is the moment, and 275 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:53,600 Speaker 1: this is the discussion I had with the President. It 276 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 1: shouldn't be that they're worried about the government their number 277 00:14:56,320 --> 00:15:02,160 Speaker 1: one issue. So that's Kevin parably talking about the state 278 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:03,720 Speaker 1: of the Union. There was that poll that said that 279 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:07,560 Speaker 1: people are very concerned about government. Also, really stunning play 280 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 1: is sixty sixty four percent of Americans living paycheck to Paycheck, 281 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 1: eighty two percent of middle income households say that they 282 00:15:17,440 --> 00:15:22,600 Speaker 1: are now cutting into savings dramatically. I think household savings 283 00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:26,640 Speaker 1: for middle income earners I should check this, but I'm 284 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:31,400 Speaker 1: pretty sure in the last year have dropped dramatically across 285 00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:33,000 Speaker 1: the board. I mean, I want to say it's gone 286 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 1: from like two trillion to a trillion or something. I mean, 287 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:38,120 Speaker 1: there's some there's been an enormous amount of expenditure of 288 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 1: savings that has gone on for middle income households of 289 00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 1: the last year. I'll check the numbers on that. Please 290 00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:48,600 Speaker 1: don't quote me on that, but but it's it's apparent 291 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 1: that the state of the Union is not strong. But 292 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:53,920 Speaker 1: it is also apparent that the Biden administration plant and 293 00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:57,040 Speaker 1: the speech isn't out already people are saying the speech 294 00:15:57,080 --> 00:16:01,560 Speaker 1: has leaked in advantage. The speech has evidently, so we 295 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:03,480 Speaker 1: know many of the things that Biden is going to 296 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:06,440 Speaker 1: talk about tonight at nine Eastern, and one of the 297 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 1: things that I think is going to be so dishonest. 298 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 1: You know, there's gonna be a lot of massaging of 299 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:14,920 Speaker 1: numbers and buck I'll mentioned one the amount of credit 300 00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:19,640 Speaker 1: card debt has skyrocketed that Americans are holding now that 301 00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:24,240 Speaker 1: is a sign obviously, as credit card balanced debt increases 302 00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:27,480 Speaker 1: that many people are doing what you just reference, that 303 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 1: is living paycheck to paycheck, sometimes just paying the interest 304 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:35,320 Speaker 1: on those credit card debts. But when you look at 305 00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:40,600 Speaker 1: what Biden is arguing, and Kamala Harris has been saying it, KJP, 306 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 1: who we just played on the View a little bit 307 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:45,080 Speaker 1: earlier in the show, is saying it. They are saying 308 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 1: that wages are up. And this is important because it 309 00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:52,960 Speaker 1: is true that wages are up, but wages are up 310 00:16:53,240 --> 00:16:57,440 Speaker 1: while the overall cost of living due to inflation, has 311 00:16:57,480 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 1: gone up more than wages. So you can't argue wages 312 00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 1: are up. And I'll just give you a simple one here. 313 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,119 Speaker 1: If wages are up, for instance, four percent, a lot 314 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 1: of you out there might be saying, well, four percent 315 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:10,439 Speaker 1: rays not really going to change your life one way 316 00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 1: or the other, okay, But if your wages are up 317 00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:17,120 Speaker 1: four percent and inflation is two percent, the overall quality 318 00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:20,359 Speaker 1: of your living would have increased because you would have 319 00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:24,400 Speaker 1: exceeded the rate of inflation when wages are up four percent, 320 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:28,359 Speaker 1: which is what the White House is bragging about. And simultaneously, 321 00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: buck we are living in inflation got all the way 322 00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:33,679 Speaker 1: up to nine percent. Right now it's at six and 323 00:17:33,680 --> 00:17:37,919 Speaker 1: a half percent. I believe your overall famili's quality of 324 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:41,960 Speaker 1: living has declined because your wages have not kept pace 325 00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:44,919 Speaker 1: with inflation. So if you're out there saying, boy, eggs 326 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:49,359 Speaker 1: are expensive and they are, one big reason why is 327 00:17:49,400 --> 00:17:53,359 Speaker 1: because they're not only more expensive in real dollars, they're 328 00:17:53,359 --> 00:17:56,680 Speaker 1: more expensive and inflation dollars, and all of these things 329 00:17:56,760 --> 00:17:59,359 Speaker 1: add up in a big way, which is why we 330 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:01,800 Speaker 1: started off the show saying, buck and I think it's 331 00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:05,320 Speaker 1: worth hammering home again and again. The numbers are really 332 00:18:05,359 --> 00:18:10,359 Speaker 1: bad when it comes to overall inflation and people's quality 333 00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:12,919 Speaker 1: of living, But your numbers can be really good. The 334 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:14,760 Speaker 1: next time you get out to the range. 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That's m 351 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:05,440 Speaker 1: A n tisx dot com. Welcome back in. I hope 352 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: all of you are having a fantastic Tuesday wherever you 353 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 1: may be. We are bringing in now our friend Gordon G. Chang, 354 00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:16,440 Speaker 1: who does an incredible job analyzing the situation of geopolitical 355 00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 1: struggle between the United States and China. His latest book 356 00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:22,520 Speaker 1: is The Coming Collapse of China. Sorry, his latest book 357 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 1: is The Great US Tech China Tech War at Gordon G. 358 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:30,480 Speaker 1: Chang on Twitter. So, Gordon, when you saw this story 359 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:34,320 Speaker 1: about the Chinese spy balloon, your thoughts in terms of 360 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:37,840 Speaker 1: analyzing why it happened? That is? The motive on China 361 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:41,680 Speaker 1: side was what and where do we go from here? Yeah, 362 00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 1: there were two things which I thought were possible explanations. 363 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:48,959 Speaker 1: One of them was that Cjin Ping was so bold, 364 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:51,760 Speaker 1: so aggressive, that he was going to try to humiliate 365 00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:54,280 Speaker 1: the United States, tell the world that the US was 366 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:58,119 Speaker 1: done as a power and that therefore they should ditch 367 00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:01,800 Speaker 1: us and obey China. The second thing is that the 368 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:06,640 Speaker 1: Chinese military, which we know is politically powerful, basically decided 369 00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:08,560 Speaker 1: it was going to do whatever it wanted to do, 370 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 1: and they were then going to fly this right across 371 00:20:13,119 --> 00:20:18,200 Speaker 1: our Air Force bases which had bombers, which had ICBMs, 372 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:20,919 Speaker 1: and the rest of it. I don't know which of 373 00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:24,359 Speaker 1: those two is correct, but neither of them is a 374 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:27,240 Speaker 1: good story, because they say that China is preparing to 375 00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 1: go to war, and unless something changes, that's probably where 376 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 1: we're going to end up. I mean, we can deter China, 377 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:38,120 Speaker 1: but we're not deterring China. Now, Gordon, do you see 378 00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 1: parallels between what China is doing here and the Cold 379 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:46,080 Speaker 1: War with the US and the Soviets YouTube flights and 380 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:51,640 Speaker 1: other spying and surveillance missions. Yeah. We had the ute 381 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:55,919 Speaker 1: incident in what nineteen sixty where Francis carry powers the 382 00:20:55,920 --> 00:21:00,480 Speaker 1: YouTube pilot was shot down. This is a little bit 383 00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:04,119 Speaker 1: different because it could very well mean that in China, 384 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:08,280 Speaker 1: this is a regime in turmoil right now. I think 385 00:21:08,320 --> 00:21:12,080 Speaker 1: Sejunping sees a closing window of opportunity to achieve what 386 00:21:12,160 --> 00:21:15,239 Speaker 1: he considers to be historic goals. So he's going to 387 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 1: roll the dice and do it while he can. And 388 00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:22,680 Speaker 1: if the second explanation is right about the military freelancing, 389 00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:26,200 Speaker 1: then we've got a different set of problems, but one 390 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:30,120 Speaker 1: which are equally difficult for us to do with. So 391 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:33,679 Speaker 1: in that sense, the Cold War had a stability to 392 00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:37,000 Speaker 1: it right now, I don't think we have that stability. 393 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:41,680 Speaker 1: Do you think the timing with Secretary Blinking? I'm really 394 00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:46,320 Speaker 1: intrigued by your analysis here, because if you are correct 395 00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:50,880 Speaker 1: and this was potentially a Chinese driven military move without 396 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:55,960 Speaker 1: necessarily Jijing Ping being involved in ordering this, then it 397 00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:00,880 Speaker 1: could have been timed to try to embarrass him associated 398 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 1: with the Anthony Blinken visit coming right. In other words, 399 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 1: they don't want there to be sort of a lessening 400 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:10,920 Speaker 1: of tensions potentially in China. Do you think how would 401 00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 1: you analyze the timing of the blink In meeting given 402 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:19,680 Speaker 1: your potential scenarios there. That's a great question. Some people 403 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 1: have thought that the balloon incident was time to actually 404 00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:27,359 Speaker 1: derail Secretary Blinkin's anticipated trip of February five and six. 405 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 1: Other people said no, they wanted b. Lincoln to come, 406 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:34,800 Speaker 1: but they wanted to give B. Lincoln a bargaining chip 407 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:39,120 Speaker 1: in a sense, basically saying, we'll stop the balloon flights 408 00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:43,440 Speaker 1: if you stop the reconnaissance along our coasts, which is 409 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 1: an even more arrogant way of looking at the Chinese 410 00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 1: right now. I don't know what the correct intensions were 411 00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 1: in the motivating reasons, but we do know that there 412 00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:02,760 Speaker 1: is trouble inside the regime and its portends, i think, 413 00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 1: increasing tension, especially because we have President Biden yesterday saying 414 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,880 Speaker 1: that this balloon incident is not going to weaken US 415 00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:14,800 Speaker 1: China relations. And really what Biden is saying is that 416 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:17,480 Speaker 1: the Chinese can do anything they want and we're still 417 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:22,200 Speaker 1: not going to impose costs. So that is extremely troubling 418 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:25,520 Speaker 1: when you think about the psychology of this and that 419 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:29,200 Speaker 1: attitude that the Chinese can do whatever they want. That 420 00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:33,760 Speaker 1: goes back to President George W. Bush, who imposed no 421 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:37,040 Speaker 1: costs on China for the EP three incident. So this 422 00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:40,959 Speaker 1: is a clear pattern. You've got Republicans, democrats, liberals, conservatives. 423 00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:44,440 Speaker 1: They have all had attitudes which have emboldened the worst 424 00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 1: elements in the Chinese political system by not imposing costs 425 00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:53,399 Speaker 1: for bad behavior. Gordon, So, do you think this is 426 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:55,840 Speaker 1: the big question? Right? Buck and I were debating it earlier. 427 00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:58,720 Speaker 1: Do you think we had that military general come out 428 00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:01,040 Speaker 1: in say, twenty twenty five is when he thinks this 429 00:24:01,119 --> 00:24:03,680 Speaker 1: is going to happen in terms of China invading Taiwan? 430 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,720 Speaker 1: Do you think this just continues to pour ten China 431 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:10,679 Speaker 1: invading Taiwan? And if so, what is that, Joe Biden? 432 00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 1: What is the United States response going to be? Yeah, 433 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 1: you're referring to General Mike Minihan, who is the Chief 434 00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:21,080 Speaker 1: of Commander of the Air Mobility Command of the Air Force, 435 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:25,520 Speaker 1: and that leaked memo said that his gut, as he 436 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:29,159 Speaker 1: put it, meant said that we'd be fighting quote in 437 00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five after this, you know, And everyone said, oh, 438 00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:36,640 Speaker 1: that's really close. Well after this balloon incident. I think 439 00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:39,800 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five is a long way off. It could 440 00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,600 Speaker 1: very well be before that, and it could be Taiwan, 441 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:46,000 Speaker 1: could be India, could be Japan or the Philippines. Remember 442 00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:50,280 Speaker 1: in December when China was going through those protests, China 443 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,200 Speaker 1: was very provocative with a large incursion into India's aeronatural 444 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:58,639 Speaker 1: prodession in the Himalayas. We had stepped up provocations in 445 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:02,480 Speaker 1: the South China Sea again, Philippines in the East China 446 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:06,480 Speaker 1: Sea against Japan, and of course the continuing air incursions 447 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:10,080 Speaker 1: against Taiwan, especially the one on Christmas Day. So as 448 00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:15,080 Speaker 1: China gets weaker, it gets more belligerent, and as I 449 00:25:15,119 --> 00:25:17,399 Speaker 1: think Cie Jim Ping sees, Biden is not going to 450 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:20,560 Speaker 1: stop him. So this is I think the most dangerous 451 00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 1: moment in history. Gordon, Well, we're speaking to Gordon Chang. 452 00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 1: Follow him on Twitter at Gordon g Chang and also 453 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 1: get a copy of The Great US China Tech War, 454 00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,480 Speaker 1: which is his latest book. What would be you brought 455 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:38,560 Speaker 1: up no cost in response to this, and clearly, flying 456 00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:41,720 Speaker 1: a big balloon in US airspace for days on end, 457 00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:46,120 Speaker 1: everybody knows that it's a surveillance or spying spying balloon, 458 00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:49,439 Speaker 1: so they're trying to get information about US defense and 459 00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:52,480 Speaker 1: military capabilities that we don't want them to have. What 460 00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:57,639 Speaker 1: would be appropriate costs to make the Chinese incur in 461 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 1: response to this, what is the the path you think 462 00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:03,880 Speaker 1: that would actually show the Chinese you can't get away 463 00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:06,439 Speaker 1: with this kind of stuff anymore. Yeah. I think that, 464 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:10,080 Speaker 1: first of all, the costs have to be disproportionate, in 465 00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:12,360 Speaker 1: other words, so much greater than what the Chinese did. 466 00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:15,080 Speaker 1: And so what I would do is I'd break off 467 00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: all communication with China. I would close their four consulates 468 00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,480 Speaker 1: in the US, strip their embassy staff just down to 469 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:25,439 Speaker 1: the ambassador. I'd start closing the Chinese banks which are 470 00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:30,120 Speaker 1: laundering fentinyl profits for those gangs that fentinyl is killing Americans. 471 00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:33,640 Speaker 1: There's a menu of things that we can do, but 472 00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: essentially we have to show China that the costs are severe, 473 00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:39,720 Speaker 1: and that those are would be severe costs for a 474 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,240 Speaker 1: balloon incident. Just imagine what it would be for something else. 475 00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:46,600 Speaker 1: There's a lot of things that China needs the US for. 476 00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: I don't think we should be providing them to the Chinese. 477 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,439 Speaker 1: So I'd like to see them all cut off. I 478 00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:56,200 Speaker 1: know that sounds drastic, but I think it is strategically wrong. 479 00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:59,879 Speaker 1: But even more important, it's morally wrong to build up 480 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:03,520 Speaker 1: the armed forces of an adversary that is planning to 481 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:06,960 Speaker 1: kill Americans and that's exactly what's happening right now. And 482 00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:09,000 Speaker 1: Gordon I have to ask. I mean, they've said that 483 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 1: there were a number, and it's tough to see what's 484 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:14,800 Speaker 1: true and what maybe the exaggeration is here from our 485 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:16,920 Speaker 1: own government. They said that there were balloons during the 486 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,640 Speaker 1: Trump administration, but maybe they didn't tell Trump about them. 487 00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:22,359 Speaker 1: We had Trump's acting Secretary Defense on he said he 488 00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:25,359 Speaker 1: had never heard anything about this, and the guy's secretary Defense, 489 00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 1: I feel like he could probably get a good read 490 00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:31,560 Speaker 1: on what the military knows. But is it your belief 491 00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:34,639 Speaker 1: then that if we don't have any kind of costs 492 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:37,159 Speaker 1: associated with this, it's China just going to keep flying 493 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: these balloons. I mean, it doesn't feel like why wouldn't they? Yeah, 494 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:43,120 Speaker 1: why wouldn't they? And you know, you go back to 495 00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:47,600 Speaker 1: George W. Bush not imposing any costs or stripping our 496 00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:50,880 Speaker 1: EP three first of all, clipping the wing, forcing it down, 497 00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:53,840 Speaker 1: imprisoning the crew, trying to hold it for a ransom, 498 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:57,639 Speaker 1: stripping the plane of its electronic gear, no costs on China. 499 00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:00,879 Speaker 1: So really what happened is George W. Bush told the 500 00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,080 Speaker 1: worst elements in the Chinese political system go right ahead 501 00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,240 Speaker 1: and do this. And what it did was it said 502 00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:08,960 Speaker 1: to the other elements of the Chinese political system, those 503 00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:11,960 Speaker 1: that would want a cooperative relationship with us, We told 504 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:14,720 Speaker 1: the cooperative people, you're wrong because we don't impose costs 505 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:18,639 Speaker 1: on being belligerent. So this has opened the door. And 506 00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:22,560 Speaker 1: if we don't change our attitudes towards this in our policies, 507 00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 1: this is only going to get worse. Now people they say, 508 00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:29,159 Speaker 1: you start cutting ties, it's going to be worse. But 509 00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:33,160 Speaker 1: the point is our policies would sound good to the ear, 510 00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:37,960 Speaker 1: have created a disastrous situation. Every option now going forward 511 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:43,360 Speaker 1: carries great risk and that's the result of misguided policies 512 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:46,840 Speaker 1: over the course of especially the last three decades. So 513 00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 1: what choice do we have. We got to try something 514 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:51,400 Speaker 1: new because if we don't try something new, we probably 515 00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:53,560 Speaker 1: are going to end up in the worst moment in history. 516 00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 1: Who do you think Ordinis administration has China policy the 517 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:04,240 Speaker 1: most in their hands or is there responsibility? Is it 518 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:06,800 Speaker 1: really because it feels like Biden these days they all know, 519 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,400 Speaker 1: you know, they're just trying to push him along. Is 520 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:12,959 Speaker 1: it Blinken? Is it somebody on the do D side? 521 00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:18,080 Speaker 1: Who is who is Biden's top China person right now. Well, 522 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,720 Speaker 1: on the National Security Council it is Kurt Campbell. But 523 00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,960 Speaker 1: you know, you have Blincoln, you have Jake Sullivan, the 524 00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:28,120 Speaker 1: National Security Advisor. I'm sure there's some people in the 525 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,400 Speaker 1: basement that we never hear about, you know, the proverbial 526 00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: Obama people. And of course it's Biden himself. I mean 527 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:39,200 Speaker 1: he forget about Hunter. Biden forget about the money issues, 528 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:43,000 Speaker 1: even if those aren't true. Biden has views about China 529 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:46,600 Speaker 1: that are seriously out of date, and his views are 530 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 1: those that have created this situation in the first place. 531 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:52,960 Speaker 1: Add in Hunter, adding the money, it just gets even worse. 532 00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:56,720 Speaker 1: So you know, I don't know who is making policy, 533 00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:00,560 Speaker 1: but I can tell you it's a disaster. Gordon, everybody 534 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 1: follow him on Twitter at Gordon Chee Chang and pick 535 00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:05,800 Speaker 1: up a copy of the Great US China Tech War. Gordon, 536 00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:08,160 Speaker 1: thanks for being with us. Oh well, thank you so much, 537 00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:12,840 Speaker 1: and guys, stay safe MoMA. Thanks to all of you 538 00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 1: out there, if we can, to each and every one 539 00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:17,080 Speaker 1: of you that has made a donation to the preborn 540 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:21,520 Speaker 1: pregnancy clinics nationwide. What they're accomplishing every day is life 541 00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:24,360 Speaker 1: changing and it's an ambitious program that they're expanding on. 542 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,280 Speaker 1: Preborn saves the lives of unborn children by providing pregnant 543 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:31,080 Speaker 1: mothers with the support and supplies they need after childbirth, 544 00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:35,560 Speaker 1: and most importantly, a connection with the unborn child they're caring. 545 00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:38,520 Speaker 1: They do that by providing an ultrasound experience, which allows 546 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:41,920 Speaker 1: moms to meet their unborn son or daughter. Once a 547 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,920 Speaker 1: mom sees that precious life, here's that heartbeat, she is 548 00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:48,520 Speaker 1: twice as likely to choose life. Donations like your own 549 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:52,040 Speaker 1: have allowed Preborn to rescue over two hundred thousand babies 550 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,800 Speaker 1: from abortion, and every day their clinics save about one 551 00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty babies lives. Using your cell phone, dial 552 00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:02,480 Speaker 1: pound two fifty and say the keyword baby. That's pound 553 00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:05,800 Speaker 1: two five zero, say baby, or you can go to 554 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:09,600 Speaker 1: their website Preborn dot com, slash buck, Preborn dot com, 555 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:14,880 Speaker 1: slash buc k sponsored by Preborn, download and used than 556 00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,200 Speaker 1: you Clay in buck app, listen to the program live, 557 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:20,480 Speaker 1: catch off on any part of the show you might 558 00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:24,000 Speaker 1: have missed. Find every podcast as they're released and listen. 559 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:26,480 Speaker 1: Find the Clay and Buck app in your app store 560 00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 1: and make it part of your day. This New York 561 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,840 Speaker 1: Times article. Listen, when Democrats want to kill each other, 562 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:35,160 Speaker 1: they have the New York Times on speed dial number one. 563 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:39,320 Speaker 1: And what this article is is every ambitious Democrat they're 564 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 1: looking at Joe Biden. I'm here to tell you Joe 565 00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:43,000 Speaker 1: Biden is not going to run in twenty four. I 566 00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:45,920 Speaker 1: do not believe he will be the Democrat nominee in 567 00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:49,000 Speaker 1: twenty four. And I think all the ambitious Democrats are 568 00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:52,040 Speaker 1: measuring the drapes. And I think you're looking at people 569 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 1: like Pete buotag Edge and Elizabeth Warren and Gavin Newsom, 570 00:31:56,280 --> 00:32:00,320 Speaker 1: who all see Kamala Harris in their way. And you're right, 571 00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 1: Hillary is seething with jealousy, and so these knives are 572 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 1: coming from every direction, and she's certainly given them a 573 00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:10,800 Speaker 1: lot to work with. Paging our friend Senator Ted Cruz here. 574 00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:15,880 Speaker 1: He coming out strongly there on the side of Biden 575 00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:20,960 Speaker 1: is not going to be the twenty twenty four nominee. 576 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:23,720 Speaker 1: I don't see it. So I don't know if Senator 577 00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 1: Cruz walts to put a steak bet on this one, 578 00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:30,160 Speaker 1: or maybe a game of one v one on the 579 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 1: basketball quarter, though I guess that wouldn't really be a bet. 580 00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:38,240 Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't see it, And Clay has come 581 00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:41,040 Speaker 1: around to mind thinking. I feel like if they were 582 00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:45,600 Speaker 1: to have anybody other than Biden step in at this stage, 583 00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 1: it would be giving up the power of the incumbency, 584 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:57,200 Speaker 1: which is substantial, and they perhaps even more importantly, it 585 00:32:57,240 --> 00:33:00,040 Speaker 1: doesn't seem that they have a good second option in 586 00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,000 Speaker 1: to run, because that's the same people that are writing 587 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:07,280 Speaker 1: the New York Times that Joe Biden is not, you know, 588 00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:09,720 Speaker 1: not not doing well. I think that Kamala is a 589 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 1: total disaster. So I think that's important for people to 590 00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:19,200 Speaker 1: understand here that Kamala is not the pick of the 591 00:33:19,360 --> 00:33:21,560 Speaker 1: elites in the media and in the establishment anymore. So. 592 00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,880 Speaker 1: I don't know, Senator Cruz, we heard you on that one. 593 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 1: You think that it won't be Biden. I think it 594 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:29,720 Speaker 1: still will be Biden. I might have to end up 595 00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:31,840 Speaker 1: eating some humble pie on this one, but I just 596 00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:34,920 Speaker 1: don't see it, you know what. I'm gonna put up 597 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,400 Speaker 1: a Twitter poll two on this one, just to see 598 00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:39,520 Speaker 1: where a lot of my followers are. I'm always curious 599 00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:42,760 Speaker 1: about that one. I can't imagine that it would be 600 00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:46,080 Speaker 1: anybody other than Joe Biden at this point, given the 601 00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:50,960 Speaker 1: realities of who else could possibly be involved. You know, 602 00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:53,680 Speaker 1: if he had a really strong VP, absolutely a really 603 00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:56,360 Speaker 1: strong VP that was pulling well, that would be the 604 00:33:56,360 --> 00:34:00,520 Speaker 1: obvious choice. But Kamala Harris, I think it is clear 605 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 1: to Democrats Kamala Harris would lose to Trump. To desantists, 606 00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:11,000 Speaker 1: I think Kamala Harris would lose the Yunkin or Nicky Haley. 607 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:13,719 Speaker 1: I just don't think she can win. And I think 608 00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:17,680 Speaker 1: they know that, and that to me means that it's 609 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:20,040 Speaker 1: just going to be Biden. He's got the name recognition, 610 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,200 Speaker 1: he's got the power of being an office right now, 611 00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:24,920 Speaker 1: and a lot of Democrats, I think, unfortunately, have become 612 00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:30,520 Speaker 1: very comfortable with having a figurehead presidency, which is Joe 613 00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:34,239 Speaker 1: Biden just kind of dotting around and no real vision, 614 00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:38,080 Speaker 1: no nothing. But there are so many people involved that 615 00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:43,640 Speaker 1: the Democrat machinery is so dense with different leftist activists 616 00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:49,440 Speaker 1: and policy manipulators of different kinds that they think doesn't 617 00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,320 Speaker 1: matter whether the president can even tie his own shoes, 618 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:54,960 Speaker 1: It doesn't matter if the president has any real ability. 619 00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:58,240 Speaker 1: All that matters is can you have a Democrat in office? 620 00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:01,360 Speaker 1: Can you get a Democrat elected? And then have the 621 00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:04,759 Speaker 1: machinery do the rest. So it's just about finding some 622 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:08,640 Speaker 1: way for whomever the occupant of the Oval office in 623 00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:11,120 Speaker 1: twenty twenty four will be finding some way that that 624 00:35:11,160 --> 00:35:14,000 Speaker 1: person is a Democrat, and then beyond that it doesn't 625 00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:17,080 Speaker 1: really matter. So to them, electability as a means to 626 00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:20,680 Speaker 1: power is the entire game. The skills of the individual, 627 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:24,920 Speaker 1: the leadership qualities, and that's all irrelevant. And that's why tonight, 628 00:35:25,120 --> 00:35:28,399 Speaker 1: going into this State of the Union address, you're going 629 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:32,000 Speaker 1: to see that Joe Biden will be rewriting history in 630 00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:35,360 Speaker 1: real time. He'll be saying things that you know to 631 00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,360 Speaker 1: be untrue. And at some level, I think Democrats like 632 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:43,080 Speaker 1: Biden take glee in lying to your face because it's 633 00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:48,080 Speaker 1: a means of demeaning your sense of what's really going on. 634 00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:50,279 Speaker 1: It's meant to disorient you. It's meant to make you 635 00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:52,560 Speaker 1: feel like, wait a second, that's crazy. Did he really 636 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:56,240 Speaker 1: just say that? And you know that the Democrat media 637 00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:57,960 Speaker 1: is going to go along with all of it. They're 638 00:35:57,960 --> 00:35:59,600 Speaker 1: going to support him, they're going to prop him up. 639 00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:02,880 Speaker 1: They're going to tell you that he's done a great 640 00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:06,120 Speaker 1: job and that he's exceeded. I can assure you of this, 641 00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:11,839 Speaker 1: There'll be a lot of Biden has exceeded expectations, exceeded them, 642 00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:13,600 Speaker 1: when for all the rest of us it's wait. Isn't 643 00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:16,320 Speaker 1: this the guy who talked about the Winter of Death 644 00:36:16,360 --> 00:36:18,840 Speaker 1: and forced people to get shots by the millions that 645 00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:22,160 Speaker 1: they didn't want, that didn't work anyway, and that subjected 646 00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:24,120 Speaker 1: them the risks that they weren't even allowed to talk about. 647 00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:27,200 Speaker 1: Isn't that the great unie her Joe Biden. Some of 648 00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:30,400 Speaker 1: us remember what the promises were and also what the 649 00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:33,879 Speaker 1: reality was for the last two years. But it's going 650 00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:36,440 Speaker 1: to be fun house mirror time. It's going to be 651 00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:39,840 Speaker 1: distortions and lies and nonsense to not the state of 652 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:42,520 Speaker 1: the Union. I will watch it, though, I will live 653 00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:46,200 Speaker 1: tweet it. I will bring you all of it tomorrow, 654 00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:48,600 Speaker 1: Clay and I will so looking forward to talking to 655 00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:51,759 Speaker 1: you all. Then, make sure you go and subscribe to 656 00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:54,680 Speaker 1: Clay and Buck podcast channel, by the way, which you 657 00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:56,880 Speaker 1: can do on the iHeart app or in the Apple 658 00:36:56,920 --> 00:37:00,399 Speaker 1: podcast Store. We're putting in specials there, law long form 659 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:02,680 Speaker 1: interview stuff you won't see anywhere else. So go subscribe 660 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:04,040 Speaker 1: to the podcast. Radio listeners