1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:04,200 Speaker 1: And we have returned, fellow Ridiculous Historians with a classic 2 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:08,000 Speaker 1: episode for you this week. This comes with a very 3 00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:12,000 Speaker 1: special shout out to our one of our number one guys, 4 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:17,079 Speaker 1: nol our super producer, mister Max Williams, who will always 5 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:20,279 Speaker 1: know more about sports than either you or me. 6 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:24,799 Speaker 2: Agree, it's like a superpower, Max. 7 00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:24,799 Speaker 1: Do you? 8 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:27,200 Speaker 2: Uh No, I don't know. 9 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,480 Speaker 1: You hadn't quite joined the show yet, but you're familiar 10 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:32,839 Speaker 1: with the idea of football, right, Uh? 11 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:36,720 Speaker 2: I washed the game, or I've seen a game or 12 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 2: two in my day. 13 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 1: I know I got to stop sounding like an alien impersonating. 14 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:46,560 Speaker 2: Football before and even kicked it once. 15 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:50,560 Speaker 3: You've touched some pig skin, right, did they did? Lucy 16 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:52,640 Speaker 3: pull it out right at the last minute? 17 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,760 Speaker 2: It was football? 18 00:00:58,440 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 1: Yeah? 19 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:00,959 Speaker 2: Kick him in the ball head? Oh no, too far? 20 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:01,880 Speaker 4: Rude? 21 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:05,400 Speaker 1: Also, why is he the Lucy of our show? Anyway? 22 00:01:06,319 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 1: For this this episode is for fans of American football, 23 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:16,800 Speaker 1: so not soccer, and fans of president's past. It turns 24 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:21,759 Speaker 1: out that Teddy Roosevelt from earlier just may have been 25 00:01:21,800 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 1: the saving force of modern American football. 26 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:27,720 Speaker 2: Let's just jump right anyway, what do you say? 27 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:59,440 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. The following episode 28 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:03,080 Speaker 1: is going to be of you know, so it's going 29 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 1: to be about something ridiculous, but it's also going to 30 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 1: be a peak into US culture for a lot of 31 00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:15,880 Speaker 1: our fellow ridiculous historians listening outside of the United States. 32 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 1: We are today talking about football, American football, American football, 33 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:25,480 Speaker 1: and there's going to necessarily be some roughness in this 34 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 1: episode that maybe necessary roughness. 35 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:29,760 Speaker 2: No, what was necessary rough It was just. 36 00:02:29,639 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 3: A raunchy like nineties American football comedy. 37 00:02:33,080 --> 00:02:35,720 Speaker 2: I believe Who are you? Oh? 38 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:39,200 Speaker 3: I'm Noel and I am an aficionado of raunchy nineties 39 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:40,919 Speaker 3: football based comedies. 40 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, that's how we met. I did my 41 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 1: undergrad in that. Actually all facts. I am Ben, and 42 00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 1: this is ridiculous history. But it would not be ridiculous 43 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 1: history without our super producer, Casey Pegreb. 44 00:02:56,120 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 4: I just want to acknowledge that American football also a 45 00:02:58,639 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 4: great band. 46 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 2: YEP, kind of a what is it? What would you 47 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:02,200 Speaker 2: call them? 48 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:05,959 Speaker 4: This little emo emo, but way more on the tolerable 49 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:07,200 Speaker 4: side as far as I'm concerned. 50 00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:07,799 Speaker 2: No, they're good. 51 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:11,399 Speaker 3: They're kind of jangling, they don't like, they don't wind scream. Yeah, 52 00:03:11,560 --> 00:03:13,160 Speaker 3: it's kind of a little more low key, and the 53 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:16,160 Speaker 3: guitars are kind of jangly and arpeggioe, kind of I 54 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 3: dig it. 55 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:20,239 Speaker 4: And they have reunited after many years Dormance that was 56 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 4: a third album coming out. 57 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 3: I will say this though, for some reason, the name 58 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 3: American Football, it's just very bland sounding. It sounds like 59 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:28,960 Speaker 3: they'd be a very bland kind of vanilla band, and they. 60 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:29,440 Speaker 2: Sort of are. 61 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 1: I mean, it's an approachable emo. That's what I call it, 62 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:33,640 Speaker 1: approachable emo. 63 00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:34,840 Speaker 2: Casey on the case. 64 00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 3: Well, today's story actually has a pretty cool Atlanta connection, 65 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 3: which is where we find ourselves right now. Back in 66 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 3: eighteen ninety seven, there was a full back at the 67 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 3: University of Georgia named Richard von Gammon, and he was 68 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:58,240 Speaker 3: playing with his team against the Virginia team, which is 69 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 3: a college team. And in those days, it was quite 70 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:07,480 Speaker 3: common for players to be brutally injured, and this was 71 00:04:07,520 --> 00:04:12,080 Speaker 3: no exception. He was rushed and dogpiled on and was 72 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:15,520 Speaker 3: at the bottom of this heap of humanity and he 73 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 3: started he received this hit and then began to vomit blood, 74 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 3: and they realized that he was dying on this football field. 75 00:04:27,160 --> 00:04:33,200 Speaker 1: Right They eventually realized what happened. The team doctor popped 76 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:36,920 Speaker 1: the guy with a syringe full of morphine and then 77 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:40,919 Speaker 1: noticed the blood was coming from Richard von Gammon's head. 78 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:44,960 Speaker 1: Von Gammon, you see, had suffered a skull fracture and 79 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 1: a concussion. He was placed in a horse drawn carriage 80 00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:54,599 Speaker 1: headed for Grady Hospital and he died in the hospital overnight. 81 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 2: Yeah. 82 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:58,599 Speaker 3: In that scene that we're describing, a medic basically coming 83 00:04:58,640 --> 00:05:02,400 Speaker 3: out and stabbing up football player with a syringe full 84 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 3: of morphine sounds more like something akin to what you'd 85 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 3: see on a Vietnam battlefield, you know, I mean, this 86 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:11,480 Speaker 3: is this is a college sport for fun. 87 00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:17,280 Speaker 1: Right right, He was not wearing headgear. Today, football is 88 00:05:17,320 --> 00:05:21,400 Speaker 1: still hazardous. According to CDC estimates here in the US, 89 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:24,919 Speaker 1: one point six to three point eight million sports and 90 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 1: recreation related concussions occur each year in the US. Ten 91 00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: percent of all contact sports athletes sustain concussions each year. 92 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:40,120 Speaker 1: Brain injuries cause more deaths than any other sport injury, 93 00:05:40,200 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 1: and in American football, brain injuries count forget this, sixty 94 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:49,080 Speaker 1: five to ninety five percent of all fatalities. And this 95 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:51,440 Speaker 1: is with all the equipment that people have today. 96 00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, back in these days that we're talking about, they 97 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:56,479 Speaker 3: didn't have helmets, they barely had any padding. 98 00:05:57,240 --> 00:05:59,000 Speaker 2: A little later, there's a movie. 99 00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 3: Called leather Head that starts a guy played gym in 100 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:04,599 Speaker 3: the office in George Cleaney, where you can see the 101 00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:08,239 Speaker 3: relatively minor changes that were made in football by nineteen 102 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:10,680 Speaker 3: twenty five, and there were some pretty small helmets, a 103 00:06:10,680 --> 00:06:13,400 Speaker 3: little bit more shoulder padding. But in these days, when 104 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 3: this event, this death of this young man, really polarized 105 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 3: the nation against the sport, very little protective measures were 106 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:22,599 Speaker 3: put in place for these young men that were out there. 107 00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:26,839 Speaker 1: I am delighted because we know a lot about each other. 108 00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 1: This is news to me, folks. I am delighted, Noel, 109 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 1: by your fascination with these these like turn of the 110 00:06:36,279 --> 00:06:41,160 Speaker 1: twentieth century football films, you know, nineties to early two 111 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 1: thousands is at your wheelhouse. 112 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 3: Totally, Dude, did my dissertation on varsity blues. 113 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:49,159 Speaker 1: You know, looking back at all makes sense in retrospect, 114 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:54,599 Speaker 1: and that's something that we see today. You know, if 115 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 1: you've ever watched a US football game, you can see 116 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 1: the tremendous amount of damage these folks are dealing out 117 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:03,320 Speaker 1: to one another, and then you can look back at 118 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:08,839 Speaker 1: pictures of footballers of yesteryear and see that they were 119 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 1: doing the same thing with much less protection. This has 120 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:18,480 Speaker 1: been an ongoing debate in this country. Was football a 121 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:22,120 Speaker 1: proper pastime, people were asking in the wake of Von 122 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 1: Gammon's death, or was it as violent and deadly as 123 00:07:26,680 --> 00:07:32,560 Speaker 1: quote the gladiatorial combat of ancient Rome Ivy League. University 124 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:39,480 Speaker 1: presidents argued about this, along with reformists, muckraking, journalists, and politicians. 125 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:43,840 Speaker 1: As we learn through a great Smithsonian article called score 126 00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:50,320 Speaker 1: one for Roosevelt. President Theodore Roosevelt himself intervened because you see, 127 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:53,560 Speaker 1: in addition to being president, he was a huge football fan. 128 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 3: It had been from the start. And he even schooled 129 00:07:56,680 --> 00:08:00,360 Speaker 3: his young son who comes into play in this and 130 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:03,640 Speaker 3: saying that the very thing that makes us love football 131 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 3: is the very thing that makes it so utterly brutal 132 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:10,880 Speaker 3: and dangerous at the time. I'm not a football Okay, 133 00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:13,680 Speaker 3: now I'm showing I'm tipping my hand a little bit. 134 00:08:13,760 --> 00:08:15,840 Speaker 3: I am not an expert on the sport itself, just 135 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 3: more it's portrayal in cinema. 136 00:08:18,280 --> 00:08:21,880 Speaker 2: But they didn't even have the forward pass. It was 137 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:22,920 Speaker 2: all about the rush. 138 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 3: It was all about having an individual holding the ball 139 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 3: rushing it physically, not throwing the ball and having it 140 00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:31,960 Speaker 3: intercept it. You had to actually physically hold it, and 141 00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 3: that would open you up to much more potential to 142 00:08:35,679 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 3: be hit or dogpiled on. And that is how the 143 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 3: game was played in those days. 144 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 1: And this put Roosevelt in an interesting position because he 145 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 1: loved the game ever since he was a kid. He 146 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 1: publicly presented himself as a fan, but there was a 147 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:55,160 Speaker 1: little bit of what pr folks would call optics to 148 00:08:55,240 --> 00:09:00,360 Speaker 1: play here, because this bravado in his public presentation of 149 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 1: himself was meant to distract from his severe asthma, his 150 00:09:04,679 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 1: terrible eyesight, and the other physical challenges he had growing 151 00:09:07,679 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 1: up as a sickly child. He was too slender and 152 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 1: frail to play varsity football himself, but that did not 153 00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 1: diminish his love for the sport. Roosevelt called American football 154 00:09:18,880 --> 00:09:23,920 Speaker 1: the greatest exercise of fine moral qualities such as resolution, courage, endurance, 155 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:27,800 Speaker 1: and capacity to hold one's own and stand up under punishment. 156 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:31,200 Speaker 1: He also wrote that in life, as in a football game, 157 00:09:31,440 --> 00:09:34,360 Speaker 1: the principle should be don't foul and don't shirk, but 158 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 1: hit the line hard. Furthermore, he said, I will disinherit 159 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:42,240 Speaker 1: ady son who does not play college sports. 160 00:09:42,320 --> 00:09:44,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, and this comes into play in just a little bit. 161 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:46,000 Speaker 3: But he also was quoted as saying in a public 162 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 3: address in nineteen oh three that he didn't feel any 163 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:52,120 Speaker 3: sympathy for people who got battered, even a great deal, 164 00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 3: as long as it was not fatal. And the thing is, 165 00:09:56,000 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 3: these injuries that were happening, they didn't always result and death, 166 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 3: but they were gruesome and they had long lasting ramifications, 167 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:08,360 Speaker 3: even if it wasn't clear right away. It was this 168 00:10:08,679 --> 00:10:13,040 Speaker 3: death in clear view of everyone basically that really changed 169 00:10:13,040 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 3: the conversation. But we are talking about punctured lungs from 170 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:20,479 Speaker 3: ribs that are broken, We are talking about head injuries. 171 00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:25,280 Speaker 3: We are talking about wrenched spines, broken legs, all kinds 172 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:29,040 Speaker 3: of stuff because of the lack of safeguards in this sport. 173 00:10:29,400 --> 00:10:29,600 Speaker 2: Right. 174 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:32,360 Speaker 1: And we also have to consider that at this point 175 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:36,360 Speaker 1: in time, a lot of people were not aware of 176 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 1: the long term damage posed by concussions, you know what 177 00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:46,800 Speaker 1: I mean. They wouldn't notice something wrong necessarily until several 178 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:55,319 Speaker 1: years had passed. Historians will tell us that by the 179 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:58,360 Speaker 1: time Roosevelt entered the White House as president in nineteen 180 00:10:58,400 --> 00:11:03,000 Speaker 1: oh one, the grid iron had turned into a killing 181 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:09,360 Speaker 1: field because of these harsh rules. One Princeton player explained 182 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 1: to the journalist Henry Beach need him that we're coach 183 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 1: to pick out the most dangerous man on the opposing 184 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:18,840 Speaker 1: side and put him out in the first five minutes 185 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:19,880 Speaker 1: of the game. 186 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:21,080 Speaker 2: In nineteen oh. 187 00:11:20,960 --> 00:11:25,520 Speaker 1: Five, the Chicago Tribune reported that nineteen people died playing college, 188 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:31,079 Speaker 1: high school, and sandlot amateur football that year, and Roosevelt 189 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:34,719 Speaker 1: was getting unsettled. He didn't like this. He's president, so 190 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:37,200 Speaker 1: the press is always going to be, you know, at 191 00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:41,360 Speaker 1: least partially adversarial, right, And being a shrewd politician, he 192 00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 1: saw trouble on the horizon, and he didn't like these 193 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:53,199 Speaker 1: journalists talking bad, talking smack about football. He was determined 194 00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:56,480 Speaker 1: to save football somehow. He also knew on the on 195 00:11:56,520 --> 00:12:00,560 Speaker 1: the side of the Ivory Towers that several officials at 196 00:12:00,559 --> 00:12:06,199 Speaker 1: Harvard and other universities were determined to abolish the game altogether, 197 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:09,280 Speaker 1: at least ban it from their campuses. Roosevelt referred to 198 00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:12,480 Speaker 1: this as the Baby Act. In that period that Ben 199 00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:13,560 Speaker 1: you were just describing. 200 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:16,760 Speaker 3: In the nineteen oh five football season, the Chicago Tribune 201 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:18,720 Speaker 3: coined a pretty excellent expression for it. 202 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:22,719 Speaker 2: They called it the death Harvest. Yeah. 203 00:12:23,080 --> 00:12:26,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, So we see Roosevelt at a crossroads, right, the 204 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:31,959 Speaker 1: colleges want to end the game, the journalists are describing 205 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:37,480 Speaker 1: the horrors of physical injury in lurid detail. Maybe now 206 00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:41,920 Speaker 1: we reintroduce his son, Theodore Roosevelt Junior. 207 00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:45,360 Speaker 3: It was in that year of the Death Harvest that 208 00:12:45,920 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 3: Ted Roosevelt, as Theodore Roosevelt Junior was known, was playing 209 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 3: for his alma mater of Harvard against Yale, and that 210 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:58,760 Speaker 3: was when he got an illegal hit that left him 211 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:02,400 Speaker 3: with a broken nose and a pretty bloodied face, and 212 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:06,640 Speaker 3: some conjecture that they this was done to him on 213 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:09,559 Speaker 3: purpose because no one else had been seriously injured in 214 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:10,600 Speaker 3: that game. 215 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:13,880 Speaker 2: And in that But here's the thing. 216 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:17,400 Speaker 3: In that same afternoon, another football player by the name 217 00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:19,960 Speaker 3: of Harold Moore, who played for a Union college, he 218 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:23,720 Speaker 3: died of a cerebral hemorrhage when he was kicked in 219 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 3: the head while attempting to tackle an NYU player. And 220 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:33,400 Speaker 3: this was all during that year, and it was kind 221 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:36,920 Speaker 3: of an eye opening thing for President Roosevelt because he 222 00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 3: wasn't he certainly didn't want to give his son special treatment, 223 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:43,719 Speaker 3: But I think it opened his eyes to how there 224 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 3: needed to be some kind of change that wouldn't rob 225 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:49,560 Speaker 3: the sport of what made it good, but also would 226 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:52,240 Speaker 3: have some protections for these young men who were in 227 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:55,280 Speaker 3: Ivy League schools and had bright careers ahead of them 228 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:56,320 Speaker 3: outside of the sport. 229 00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:57,320 Speaker 2: You know, they didn't want to. 230 00:13:57,280 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 3: He didn't want them to have like brain injuries and 231 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:03,000 Speaker 3: be so seriously injured that they couldn't pursue their dreams. 232 00:14:03,040 --> 00:14:04,720 Speaker 3: I mean, I think, what do you think made it 233 00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:07,240 Speaker 3: click for him Ben, Because he certainly didn't seem someone 234 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 3: that would pamper his son. He wanted him to, you know, 235 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 3: be in this rough environment and kind of learn and 236 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:14,199 Speaker 3: you know, stand on his own two feet. 237 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:17,920 Speaker 1: There are multiple factors. We know that he was very 238 00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:22,040 Speaker 1: very close to his children, but he also expected a 239 00:14:22,160 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 1: lot out of them. We know that he wrote to 240 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:28,880 Speaker 1: his son and said that the very things that make 241 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 1: it a good game make it a rough game, referring 242 00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:36,120 Speaker 1: to football, and even then he seemed a little divided. 243 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:39,120 Speaker 1: He definitely wanted his children to play, but he was 244 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:43,120 Speaker 1: also as any father would be, concerned. And then you know, 245 00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:45,880 Speaker 1: you have the media angle, and then you have the 246 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:52,680 Speaker 1: inarguable fact that children are dying. They're dying preventable deaths, 247 00:14:53,480 --> 00:14:58,480 Speaker 1: and they're dying as a result of participating in this sport. 248 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:03,760 Speaker 1: On October, Roosevelt convenes a football summit at the White House. 249 00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 1: A lot of people are there, athletic directors, IVY League coaches, 250 00:15:08,160 --> 00:15:13,400 Speaker 1: Secretary of State Elihu Root and Roosevelt says football is 251 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:17,000 Speaker 1: on trial because I believe in the game. I want 252 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:19,480 Speaker 1: to do all I can to save it. And so 253 00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 1: I have called you all down here to see whether 254 00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: you won't all agree to abide by both the letter 255 00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:27,840 Speaker 1: and spirit of the rules, for that will help. 256 00:15:28,040 --> 00:15:31,000 Speaker 3: And Ben, if I'm not mistaken, this summit, or this 257 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 3: intercollegiate collective a conference, I guess would ultimately become what 258 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:38,720 Speaker 3: is now today known as the NC Double A. 259 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:44,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, the National Collegiate Athletic Association. This happens. So he 260 00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: makes this speech on nineteen oh five, same year as 261 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: the death Harvest. The next year, March nineteen oh six, 262 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:56,080 Speaker 1: sixty two institutions become members of the NC DOUBLEA. And 263 00:15:56,160 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 1: this included a codified set of rules. I've engaged meant 264 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:03,680 Speaker 1: much like any kind of international agreement between Nations on 265 00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:07,840 Speaker 1: what constitutes fair war tactics. I mean, this was very 266 00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:10,720 Speaker 1: much along those lines. They changed some of the rules. 267 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 3: Remember earlier I was talking about how they didn't allow 268 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:14,800 Speaker 3: the forward pass. You had to run with the ball. 269 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:18,160 Speaker 3: Now they allowed the forward pass, which would cut down 270 00:16:18,280 --> 00:16:22,720 Speaker 3: on the opportunities for runners to be tackled. And not 271 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:24,880 Speaker 3: to mention, they changed some more specific things. Then you 272 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:27,000 Speaker 3: might have a better grasp of this than me. I'm 273 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,840 Speaker 3: going to do my best to explain it. They changed 274 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:33,920 Speaker 3: they had a neutral zone between offense and defense, and 275 00:16:34,120 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 3: they actually so a neutral zone would be a zone 276 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:40,840 Speaker 3: where you are less likely to get hit? 277 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:41,960 Speaker 2: Is that right? So? 278 00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 1: In American football, and I had to look this up. 279 00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:49,280 Speaker 1: In American football, the neutral zone is the length of 280 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:51,960 Speaker 1: the football from one tip to the other when it 281 00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:55,480 Speaker 1: spotted placed on a certain spot on the field prior 282 00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:58,200 Speaker 1: to the snap of the ball during a scrimmage down. 283 00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:03,880 Speaker 2: Okay, so there's that again. I feel like you just 284 00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:06,320 Speaker 2: got woshed. I gotshed. They got wished big time. So 285 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:08,360 Speaker 2: legalize the forward pass. That one I understand. 286 00:17:08,920 --> 00:17:12,439 Speaker 3: Neutral zone, and then they also doubled the This is 287 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:14,879 Speaker 3: from a history dot com article about how Teddy Roosevelt 288 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:20,160 Speaker 3: saved football. They doubled the first down distance to ten yards, 289 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:25,440 Speaker 3: so I guess you didn't have to rush quite as far. Oh, 290 00:17:25,600 --> 00:17:26,960 Speaker 3: you know what, in the amount of time. 291 00:17:27,160 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 1: That makes sense. Also, I was getting two in the weeds. 292 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:33,600 Speaker 1: With that neutral zone definition. Let's just think of it 293 00:17:33,640 --> 00:17:36,480 Speaker 1: as an area where no members of either team can 294 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:38,720 Speaker 1: go other than the person holding the ball. 295 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:39,920 Speaker 2: That makes sense. 296 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:42,640 Speaker 1: That makes a little more sense. We're unwooshing ourselves big time. 297 00:17:47,240 --> 00:17:49,360 Speaker 3: And this didn't completely change the nature of the game, 298 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:51,879 Speaker 3: which was by design. They wanted to keep it rough. 299 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:53,760 Speaker 3: They didn't want to like I mean, it's a little 300 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:55,359 Speaker 3: bit of a pejorative, I mean very much as but 301 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:58,040 Speaker 3: Roosevelt said, they didn't want to make the game be 302 00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 3: played quote on two ladies like a basis. So it 303 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:04,639 Speaker 3: certainly wasn't become It certainly wasn't becoming touch football or 304 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:10,080 Speaker 3: flag football or something. But fatalities declined to eleven per 305 00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 3: year instead of the nineteen that we saw in that 306 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:13,960 Speaker 3: death harvest year, which. 307 00:18:13,920 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 2: To me isn't quite good enough. 308 00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 1: Still progress, I guess you could say that Harvard's football 309 00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:23,600 Speaker 1: coach at the time, William Reid, said that Roosevelt had 310 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:28,080 Speaker 1: helped save the game. A ban against the sport by 311 00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:32,280 Speaker 1: colleges and universities would have prevented most likely would have 312 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: prevented the development of professional football. And although this ends 313 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:40,879 Speaker 1: the main branch of our tail, and it is true 314 00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:44,560 Speaker 1: that if you are a football fan, you should ardently 315 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:49,239 Speaker 1: thank President Theodore Roosevelt. I have to say there is 316 00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:52,920 Speaker 1: one thing about football that always trips me out. More 317 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:57,120 Speaker 1: and more recently, it's the Super Bowl halftime show. Man, Yeah, 318 00:18:57,400 --> 00:18:59,840 Speaker 1: which is its own bag of Badgers, its own ball 319 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:04,240 Speaker 1: wax or weird string, or just a ball of lip 320 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:06,600 Speaker 1: sync abbreviated performances totally. 321 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:08,920 Speaker 3: We have these Super Bowl in Atlanta this last game, 322 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:11,720 Speaker 3: and people were talking more about the halftime show than 323 00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:13,639 Speaker 3: they were about the game. Apparently it was a bit 324 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:15,679 Speaker 3: of a snooze fest. But it was funny when there 325 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:18,160 Speaker 3: were things that happened as part of the game the telecast, 326 00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:20,720 Speaker 3: I could go outside and hear like the Blue Angel 327 00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:22,879 Speaker 3: Jets flying overhead. That was funny to be able to 328 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:24,520 Speaker 3: experience those things in real time. 329 00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:29,919 Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I know that there are amazing Super 330 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 1: Bowl halftime performances, and I know that there are people 331 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 1: who just tune in to watch that, But I gotta 332 00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:40,280 Speaker 1: say I the last one didn't really didn't really move me, 333 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: you know what I mean? 334 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 2: Who was that Maroon five? 335 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 3: Maroon five Adam Levine with his Adam Levine and his 336 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 3: TACKI tattoos. 337 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:50,119 Speaker 1: I heard the bigger controversy was him showing a nipple 338 00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:52,680 Speaker 1: and not getting nipples and not getting in trouble with 339 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:55,720 Speaker 1: multiple multiple nipples, yeah, for just the one. 340 00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:58,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely a bizarre double standard. 341 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:02,960 Speaker 1: So let us know what you think of American football. 342 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:06,760 Speaker 1: I'd especially love to hear what you think if you 343 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:10,679 Speaker 1: are not from this country, because here in the US 344 00:20:11,119 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 1: football is tremendously popular. It's a billion dollar industry, and 345 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:20,920 Speaker 1: for outsiders looking in, the rules of football can seem 346 00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: as inscrutable as the rules of cricket. 347 00:20:24,359 --> 00:20:26,880 Speaker 2: Do you know the rules of cricket? Absolutely not. Don't 348 00:20:27,119 --> 00:20:28,480 Speaker 2: bad neither do I. 349 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:32,639 Speaker 3: I know the bat's called the wicket right No? 350 00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:37,520 Speaker 1: No, sorry man, No, no, it's I don't know the 351 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:40,640 Speaker 1: name of the bat in cricket, but the wicket is 352 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:44,240 Speaker 1: one of the two sets of three stumps at either 353 00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:47,359 Speaker 1: end of the pitch, like no, like a wicket in croquete. 354 00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:49,080 Speaker 2: So what's a sticky wicket. 355 00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:54,439 Speaker 1: Sticky wicket. If I'm just speculating, here is a wicket 356 00:20:54,520 --> 00:20:59,720 Speaker 1: where it's tough to knock down the horizontal parts the bales. 357 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:03,080 Speaker 2: Okay, I give up, don't give all right, I won't 358 00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:03,959 Speaker 2: give up. I'll send you. 359 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,600 Speaker 1: I'm gonna send you a great sketch from Mitchell and 360 00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:09,240 Speaker 1: Webb by friends about cricket. 361 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:11,200 Speaker 3: I would really love that, Ben, because I love mitchellin 362 00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 3: Webb and I apparently am completely ignorant on the rules 363 00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 3: of cricket and American football because you know what, Ben, 364 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:18,719 Speaker 3: they don't really talked about the rules in the movies, 365 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:19,679 Speaker 3: the football movies. 366 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:22,080 Speaker 1: They just assume that you already know. And it's mainly 367 00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:24,120 Speaker 1: about the Oscar moment. Speeches right to. 368 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:26,080 Speaker 3: Me, it's about the Oscar moment. It's about it's about 369 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:28,399 Speaker 3: like Rudy is a good one. I like Rudy, you know, 370 00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:31,199 Speaker 3: the underdog story. I really like at mainstream for you. 371 00:21:31,520 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 3: I know, I know, I usually go for the deeper cuts, 372 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:35,920 Speaker 3: but it's it's an important one. 373 00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:39,040 Speaker 2: Remember the Titans, do you remember them? Remember those Titans? 374 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:42,200 Speaker 1: I don't remember those Titans. I know the name of 375 00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:43,960 Speaker 1: the film, but I haven't watched it. 376 00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:48,520 Speaker 3: It's a very very inspiring tale of underdoggedness. 377 00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 1: I'm more into weird presidential history and trivia, and I 378 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:56,320 Speaker 1: think this episode qualifies for that. 379 00:21:56,640 --> 00:21:59,920 Speaker 3: I think this episode is the beautiful ven diagram between 380 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:01,200 Speaker 3: those two disciplines. 381 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:02,360 Speaker 2: Ben right, right. 382 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:07,200 Speaker 1: I agree with you, Noel, and this ends our story today. Yeah, 383 00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:12,000 Speaker 1: let us know if American football is popular outside of 384 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 1: the US, it's probably never going to be as popular 385 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,119 Speaker 1: as soccer or you know what the rest of the 386 00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 1: world calls football. Furthermore, let us know what you think 387 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:28,280 Speaker 1: of the concussion controversy. A few years back, we got 388 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 1: together at work and did what I think is a 389 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:36,200 Speaker 1: pretty stand up video, a documentary on concussions. 390 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:37,760 Speaker 2: Do you remember that, Casey. 391 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 4: I do remember that we went to or I didn't go, 392 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:44,040 Speaker 4: but somebody went to like a conference or something about it, right, Yeah, yeah, 393 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:45,639 Speaker 4: Football Hall of Fame or something like that. 394 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: Maybe we can post that on our Facebook page, Ridiculous Historians. 395 00:22:52,119 --> 00:22:54,600 Speaker 1: It's an excellent way to learn a little bit more 396 00:22:54,680 --> 00:23:00,560 Speaker 1: about the current science combating concussions today. While you are 397 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:03,360 Speaker 1: on the internet, feel free to check us out on Twitter. 398 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 1: You can also find us on Instagram, and you can 399 00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:12,480 Speaker 1: check out some more of knowles. I'm a certain deep 400 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:17,920 Speaker 1: dive research into nineties era football films on his own Instagram. 401 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,879 Speaker 3: Yep, you can that is at Embryonic Insider, where you 402 00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:25,240 Speaker 3: know I'll post pictures and video clips of me at 403 00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:30,720 Speaker 3: various nineties pop culture conferences and you know symposiums, symposiums 404 00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:33,879 Speaker 3: and talks and you know Ted talks all the different 405 00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:34,639 Speaker 3: kinds of talks. 406 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:38,479 Speaker 1: And you can find me at Ben Bolin, where I 407 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:43,479 Speaker 1: am your faithful correspondent providing a visual travelogue of the 408 00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:49,159 Speaker 1: various strange countries that I that I get kicked into 409 00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:50,399 Speaker 1: and kicked out of. 410 00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:53,159 Speaker 2: North Korea. I'm looking at you. Here's looking at you, 411 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:55,240 Speaker 2: North Korea. I like that, Ben, I really got to go. 412 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 3: Thanks to super producer Casey Pegrim as always, Alex Williams, 413 00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 3: who composed our theme, Search associate Gabe Lozier, and Ben you. 414 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 1: Thanks Nolan and Hey, and thank you to thanks to 415 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:12,600 Speaker 1: Theodore Roosevelt for introducing us to the term rough riders, 416 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 1: for being president, for making football a little less lethal 417 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:19,679 Speaker 1: and allowing the game to continue for its millions of 418 00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:23,400 Speaker 1: fans across the country and the world. And thanks for listening. 419 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:26,440 Speaker 1: I have one last question and squeezing. One last question 420 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:29,440 Speaker 1: for everybody, what's the weirdest sport you know about? 421 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:32,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, let us know, folks. Talk to you soon. 422 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:43,879 Speaker 3: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 423 00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 3: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.