WEBVTT - BRYAN KOHBERGER VICTIM TERROR: SPOTS MAN IN TREES STARING BEFORE SLAUGHTERS 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:03.920 One thing we have to address in this theory that 0:00:04.040 --> 0:00:05.760 Brian Coburger did not act alone. 0:00:05.800 --> 0:00:06.600 I don't buy it. 0:00:07.040 --> 0:00:10.800 Nothing has convinced me otherwise yet. But believe me, if 0:00:10.800 --> 0:00:16.239 there is another assailant, I want them behind bars. Now. 0:00:16.400 --> 0:00:22.360 I'm hearing Brian Coburger can sue Sue who look. 0:00:22.160 --> 0:00:25.880 At the grub hub truck. They're hugging people. 0:00:25.640 --> 0:00:29.600 And talking to people. That's very, very easy to transfer 0:00:29.720 --> 0:00:36.280 DNA right there. Brian Coburger's casual conversation with a clerk, 0:00:36.920 --> 0:00:39.479 a conversation about the murders. 0:00:39.800 --> 0:00:44.960 He just committed, I'm forgetting harder and harder to commit 0:00:45.120 --> 0:00:49.600 because people are getting a really, really good at solving themes. 0:00:49.479 --> 0:00:52.159 And we're going to go help other families solve their cases. 0:00:52.400 --> 0:00:55.760 We'll close those gaps between funding and a lab that's 0:00:55.760 --> 0:00:58.120 sitting there waiting for funding or not just going to 0:00:58.160 --> 0:01:01.280 take back and just wait for stuff to happen. We're 0:01:01.280 --> 0:01:02.440 going to make things happen. 0:01:11.640 --> 0:01:16.000 Joining us Tonight, Crime Stories investigative reporter Dave Matt Dave, 0:01:16.640 --> 0:01:17.760 what's the latest. 0:01:17.480 --> 0:01:18.200 Book, Nancy. 0:01:18.240 --> 0:01:21.640 This is shocking information coming out of the documentary The 0:01:21.680 --> 0:01:25.440 Idaho Murders College Nightmare. It's on Netflix. Right now, directed 0:01:25.440 --> 0:01:28.480 by sky Boardman, and there's an interview with surviving roommate 0:01:28.560 --> 0:01:31.640 Bethany Funk. She's the woman who came eye to eye 0:01:31.720 --> 0:01:35.080 with the bushy haired stranger who is fleeing the scene 0:01:35.120 --> 0:01:38.360 of the massacre at four twenty in the morning. Okay. 0:01:38.959 --> 0:01:44.399 Bethany Funk tells police that Kayleie Gonzalvez got really weirded 0:01:44.400 --> 0:01:46.760 out when she took her dog Murphy out to do 0:01:46.840 --> 0:01:50.040 his business in the days prior to the murders. She 0:01:50.160 --> 0:01:53.760 tells Bethany Funk that while she's out there with Murphy alone, 0:01:54.080 --> 0:01:57.800 she saw a man in the tree line staring at her. Now, 0:01:57.840 --> 0:01:59.600 it's different. You know, you live in a neighborhood for 0:01:59.600 --> 0:02:01.720 a period time, Nancy. You go outside, you see a 0:02:01.720 --> 0:02:03.800 neighbor or whatever, you wave at him, right, Hey, how 0:02:03.880 --> 0:02:08.440 you doing that? Didn't happen? This encounter with this person, 0:02:08.560 --> 0:02:11.840 this man she described staring at her, happened in such 0:02:11.880 --> 0:02:15.720 a way that is so unnerved Kaylei Gonzavez that she 0:02:15.960 --> 0:02:19.720 shared this with Bethany Funk. Now at this point in time. 0:02:19.760 --> 0:02:24.360 The documentary presents this as it bothered Kayleie enough that 0:02:24.480 --> 0:02:27.400 she did report it before the murders. To her roommate, 0:02:28.000 --> 0:02:30.880 and now the possibility that she is being stalked or 0:02:30.960 --> 0:02:35.560 watched comes to the forefront. Who was the target of 0:02:35.720 --> 0:02:40.720 the attack by Brian Coburger? Was it Kaylee Gonzavez? Was 0:02:40.760 --> 0:02:43.839 Brian Coberger the bushy haired man staring at her while 0:02:43.880 --> 0:02:44.639 she walked her dog? 0:02:45.160 --> 0:02:47.680 Nate Eaton, He's director East Idaho News. 0:02:48.800 --> 0:02:52.000 Nate, what happens now, well, Nancy. 0:02:52.160 --> 0:02:55.840 Brian Coburger, of course we know, filed his motion for 0:02:55.919 --> 0:02:58.920 a new trial, saying that he is innocent, that he 0:02:59.000 --> 0:03:03.120 didn't obtain justice, that he was basically fooled into pleading 0:03:03.160 --> 0:03:06.160 guilty a year ago. The judge in the case has 0:03:06.200 --> 0:03:10.800 received the motion and has just recently this week ruled 0:03:10.960 --> 0:03:14.760 that Brian Coberger will now get a new attorney to 0:03:14.880 --> 0:03:19.280 assist him with the proceedings moving forward. So what will 0:03:19.360 --> 0:03:22.720 likely happen is a hearing will be scheduled. Coburger will 0:03:22.720 --> 0:03:27.160 appear there with likely the counsel he's had. He's claiming 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:29.720 that they've been ineffective, that they've been in effective counsel 0:03:29.800 --> 0:03:32.000 and he needs new attorneys. If they agree to that 0:03:32.080 --> 0:03:33.640 and decide not to fight it, which I don't know 0:03:33.680 --> 0:03:35.520 why they would fight it. They could say, you're right, 0:03:35.600 --> 0:03:37.600 We're going to let him go on his way. A 0:03:37.640 --> 0:03:40.360 new attorney comes on the case, then it becomes a 0:03:40.360 --> 0:03:44.120 matter of whether he has actual legal standing to carry 0:03:44.120 --> 0:03:47.920 this forward. And that's when Judge Stephen Hipler will have 0:03:47.960 --> 0:03:51.200 to decide, Okay, yeah, maybe he proves a point here 0:03:51.240 --> 0:03:55.040 here or here or not. He'll go through the plea 0:03:55.080 --> 0:03:57.720 agreement that was entered. He'll go through the things that 0:03:57.760 --> 0:04:00.400 Brian Coberger signed. I know we've talked about here on 0:04:00.440 --> 0:04:03.440 your program, Nancy. The plea agreement he signed a year ago. 0:04:03.720 --> 0:04:06.440 He verbally agreed to it. The judge was very specific 0:04:06.480 --> 0:04:12.520 in asking him, do you understand this? Are you accepting responsibility? 0:04:12.800 --> 0:04:15.160 You know, he very much laid out point by point 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:19.000 by point, and then the judge will ultimately decide, Okay, yes, 0:04:19.040 --> 0:04:22.320 there's enough to move it forward or no. I imagine Brian 0:04:22.360 --> 0:04:25.160 Coberger will appeal this. I imagine this will go all 0:04:25.160 --> 0:04:27.719 the way to the Supreme Court and then they will decide. 0:04:27.800 --> 0:04:31.119 And then once it's there, once the Supreme Court has decided, Nope, 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:32.240 it's not going to go any further. 0:04:32.640 --> 0:04:33.919 He's he's stuck. 0:04:33.920 --> 0:04:36.880 I mean, he can't do anything further unless a significant 0:04:36.960 --> 0:04:39.920 new evidence comes out down the line. If the Supreme 0:04:39.960 --> 0:04:43.200 Court or the Court of Appeals or the local judge decides, okay, 0:04:43.279 --> 0:04:45.640 he's got a point here, then it's a whole new game. 0:04:45.720 --> 0:04:48.400 Then we prepare for trial. Nancy, I have been to 0:04:48.440 --> 0:04:51.880 the prison where Brian Coburger is staying. There's a couple 0:04:51.920 --> 0:04:55.760 of different prisons. He's in the maximum security institution. Then 0:04:55.800 --> 0:04:59.400 there's the general population, you could call it institution. I've 0:04:59.400 --> 0:05:02.200 been through there. That is a normal, quote unquote normal 0:05:02.240 --> 0:05:05.800 prison where the inmates have jobs, they make license plates. 0:05:05.880 --> 0:05:07.680 There's a wood shop where they can actually go in 0:05:07.760 --> 0:05:10.480 and build things, and they can put in a wood floor. 0:05:10.520 --> 0:05:14.320 I mean, these are the average sort of inmates that 0:05:14.360 --> 0:05:17.400 don't cause any problems. And within that prison there's different levels. 0:05:17.440 --> 0:05:23.039 There's you know, minor security, medium and maximum. Brian Koberger 0:05:23.200 --> 0:05:25.920 is in a completely different facility down the road. This 0:05:26.000 --> 0:05:30.120 is maximum security. Because he is host so high profile, 0:05:30.880 --> 0:05:34.440 he is likely they haven't released much about him because 0:05:34.440 --> 0:05:37.279 everybody wants to know. But we assume he's in isolation. 0:05:37.839 --> 0:05:42.000 He is not out mingling with the other people in prison, 0:05:42.160 --> 0:05:45.880 he's not out working. We don't assume because these are 0:05:45.920 --> 0:05:48.000 some of the issues that he brought up in his 0:05:48.120 --> 0:05:52.000 filing that prison wasn't like what he was told it 0:05:52.040 --> 0:05:54.640 would be like. So if he was told, oh, it's 0:05:54.640 --> 0:05:56.800 going to be like this, you're making license plates, you're 0:05:56.839 --> 0:06:00.599 in the workshop, you're making wooden things, you're going to school, 0:06:00.640 --> 0:06:03.720 getting an education, maybe that's what he thought it would be. 0:06:04.080 --> 0:06:07.360 But this is the highest profile criminal in Idaho in 0:06:07.400 --> 0:06:09.720 the nation, one of the highest They're not gonna let 0:06:09.800 --> 0:06:13.000 him out because you would imagine that other inmates in 0:06:13.080 --> 0:06:15.760 this maximum security institute are gonna have something to say 0:06:15.800 --> 0:06:19.200 to him or perhaps something to do to him. So 0:06:19.680 --> 0:06:22.719 early on when he was first booked, that leaked prison 0:06:22.800 --> 0:06:27.120 security footage showed him in a cell walking around, pacing. 0:06:27.480 --> 0:06:29.799 He had his cot, his bed, he has a toilet, 0:06:29.839 --> 0:06:32.520 he's got a sink. He's able to order items from 0:06:32.520 --> 0:06:36.080 the commissary, which could be anything from soda to candy 0:06:36.120 --> 0:06:40.240 to crackers, whatever, a TV. But I would imagine he's 0:06:40.320 --> 0:06:42.800 in there by himself twenty three hours a day. He 0:06:42.839 --> 0:06:45.320 probably gets out one hour a day, maybe thirty minutes, 0:06:45.360 --> 0:06:47.120 to go out to the wreck yard, which would be 0:06:47.200 --> 0:06:51.200 a maybe a twelve x twelve fifteen by fifteen concrete 0:06:51.200 --> 0:06:53.560 walled area with a fence on the roof, and you 0:06:53.600 --> 0:06:55.920 get to walk around. There might be a ball out there. 0:06:56.040 --> 0:06:58.800 There might be a pole with a volleyball that you 0:06:58.839 --> 0:07:02.040 can hit around. I mean, very very simple type of things. 0:07:02.800 --> 0:07:05.280 Many would argue he shouldn't even get that. So there's 0:07:05.320 --> 0:07:08.159 that facility now if he were on death row, which 0:07:08.480 --> 0:07:11.680 if this goes to trial, and if he's convicted, and 0:07:11.720 --> 0:07:15.400 if he gets the death penalty, there's a separate area. 0:07:15.640 --> 0:07:20.200 Once the governor signs the order for it to put 0:07:20.240 --> 0:07:22.520 someone to death, that the inmates then go into a 0:07:22.560 --> 0:07:26.560 separate building. So for now he's in the maximum security prison, 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:30.480 not having much social interaction. He complained earlier that he 0:07:30.520 --> 0:07:33.440 wasn't getting the food he wanted, that people were taunting 0:07:33.480 --> 0:07:35.640 him through the events. They were able to yell things 0:07:35.680 --> 0:07:38.240 and say things to him. And I would imagine anytime 0:07:38.280 --> 0:07:40.680 he might have to walk through the area where other 0:07:40.720 --> 0:07:43.679 inmates see him, I would not doubt for one second 0:07:43.760 --> 0:07:46.520 if they have words to say to him. 0:07:47.440 --> 0:07:47.640 You know. 0:07:47.720 --> 0:07:50.400 The Netflix special has a lot of people talking about 0:07:50.560 --> 0:07:54.640 the Idaho Four, the four victims who tragically lost their 0:07:54.640 --> 0:07:57.560 lives in this I think that the timing they released 0:07:57.560 --> 0:08:01.280 this Netflix show basically a year after the plea agreement. 0:08:02.120 --> 0:08:05.520 I think there was some purposeful timing in that Brian 0:08:05.600 --> 0:08:08.840 Coberger also had a limited of time to file his 0:08:09.000 --> 0:08:12.720 motion for post conviction relief, and so he had to 0:08:12.720 --> 0:08:15.480 get that in. So the timing just happened to be 0:08:15.600 --> 0:08:18.760 there together. I will say that there are a lot 0:08:18.840 --> 0:08:22.440 of people here in Idaho who I've spoken with who 0:08:23.160 --> 0:08:25.920 just want him to go away. They're done, They're done 0:08:25.920 --> 0:08:29.040 with them. They realize that the families have a say, 0:08:29.120 --> 0:08:32.440 and obviously that is important. Some of the families don't 0:08:32.480 --> 0:08:35.680 want this to proceed. They want him to go away. 0:08:36.360 --> 0:08:39.160 Other people, though, that I speak with, say okay, yeah, 0:08:39.200 --> 0:08:42.680 if he wants a trial, sure let's have the trial. 0:08:43.200 --> 0:08:45.960 What evidence does he have? What more is there out 0:08:45.960 --> 0:08:49.080 there that we don't know about. I mean, in one aspect, 0:08:49.120 --> 0:08:51.600 if you do have the trial, at least at that point, 0:08:51.640 --> 0:08:54.520 the prosecution and the defense, whatever evidence they might have, 0:08:54.880 --> 0:08:58.040 they bring it all out. It's all there in one 0:08:58.720 --> 0:09:01.800 six week, two months, three month trial. It all comes out, 0:09:01.840 --> 0:09:04.840 so that it's not every four weeks new evidence, new 0:09:04.840 --> 0:09:08.000 phone calls, new recordings, whatever it is like how it's 0:09:08.040 --> 0:09:10.400 been the past year. I mean, this might continue for 0:09:10.440 --> 0:09:13.559 another five to ten years. Either way, if we get 0:09:13.559 --> 0:09:15.680 a trial, they're gonna have. If he gets new attorneys, 0:09:15.679 --> 0:09:17.560 the attorneys are going to have to go through all 0:09:17.800 --> 0:09:20.840 of the discovery, the state will have to prepare a 0:09:20.880 --> 0:09:23.280 case there wouldn't and if it's a death penalty, there 0:09:23.280 --> 0:09:25.680 wouldn't be a trial at least for another year or two. 0:09:25.800 --> 0:09:28.520 So you've got all those years the victims have to 0:09:28.559 --> 0:09:31.280 go through this all again. If there's not a trial, 0:09:31.480 --> 0:09:33.640 there will still be people out there saying that there 0:09:33.679 --> 0:09:36.600 needs to be. So it's kind of an interesting spot. 0:09:37.040 --> 0:09:40.920 It's just very sad about how this affects the true victims, 0:09:40.920 --> 0:09:46.320 the families of these poor students, and also you know 0:09:46.400 --> 0:09:49.200 the taxpayers. Eight million dollars plus is what has been 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:51.800 spent on this case so far, far more than that, 0:09:51.880 --> 0:09:55.640 I imagine, and it'll continue to be spent. So for now, 0:09:55.679 --> 0:09:58.600 we wait and see Nancy when the next tiering will 0:09:58.600 --> 0:10:02.520 be and what will happen. If Coburger will show up 0:10:02.520 --> 0:10:06.560 and actually speak read his brief, he might have more 0:10:06.600 --> 0:10:08.560 to say if he kind of takes upon the approach 0:10:08.600 --> 0:10:11.160 and I'm going to represent myself, which would be interesting 0:10:11.200 --> 0:10:13.840 to see, or if he's more quiet like how he 0:10:13.960 --> 0:10:17.280 has been at previous hearings, and he lets his attorneys, 0:10:17.360 --> 0:10:20.000 whether they're no longer his attorneys speak or the new 0:10:20.040 --> 0:10:23.000 attorneys we'll see, and then Judge Hipler will likely lay 0:10:23.000 --> 0:10:25.480 out a timeline and he could issue a written order 0:10:25.520 --> 0:10:28.800 after the fact saying denied, or he could decide to 0:10:28.840 --> 0:10:31.440 advance it further up and call for more hearings. 0:10:31.760 --> 0:10:36.600 Joining us now Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of 0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:39.559 Blood Beneath My Fate on Amazon, star of a hit 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:43.640 podcast Body Bags with Joe Scott Morgan, but for our purposes, 0:10:43.679 --> 0:10:47.480 he is a death investigator with over ten thousand death 0:10:47.520 --> 0:10:53.000 scenes of all sorts under his belt. Okay, Joe Scott. 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:53.720 What do you make of that? 0:10:54.600 --> 0:10:57.720 Nancy, I got to tell you, I'm not necessarily shocked 0:10:58.000 --> 0:11:00.959 by this news. I kind of felt like that it 0:11:01.120 --> 0:11:07.000 was going to be coming down the pike. It's I 0:11:07.000 --> 0:11:09.160 think that I don't know if it necessarily took us 0:11:09.200 --> 0:11:13.960 all by surprise. However, I didn't necessarily expect it to 0:11:14.000 --> 0:11:18.679 happen this soon, and so I'm wondering. I'm wondering exactly 0:11:18.720 --> 0:11:21.240 what kind of advice is being whispered in his ear 0:11:21.840 --> 0:11:24.760 right now or is it just him thinking about it 0:11:24.800 --> 0:11:27.960 as he's sitting around trying to understand what his next 0:11:28.000 --> 0:11:30.120 moves are in a place that he does not want 0:11:30.160 --> 0:11:34.720 to be. So I don't know if this is just 0:11:34.840 --> 0:11:37.000 a waste of time at this point in time. I 0:11:37.040 --> 0:11:42.360 can tell you this though, based upon just statements made 0:11:43.400 --> 0:11:48.240 by the Middlemans. We've heard a lot about DNA that 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:51.319 was found on the knife sheath, right, how many times 0:11:51.320 --> 0:11:55.520 have we heard that the Middlemans indicate that there is 0:11:55.720 --> 0:12:00.000 far more DNA and biological evidence that has been recovered. 0:12:00.720 --> 0:12:03.280 So yeah, I mean, he's sitting there cooling his heels 0:12:03.320 --> 0:12:05.920 at this point in time. But you talk about a 0:12:05.960 --> 0:12:08.680 tough hill to climb, because we're not just talking about 0:12:09.480 --> 0:12:15.000 just maybe a single point on that snap on that knife. Now, 0:12:15.160 --> 0:12:17.960 they're alluding to the fact that there are many more 0:12:18.040 --> 0:12:21.400 other samples from the scene, and you know, they're not 0:12:21.480 --> 0:12:24.199 just going to say this just to be saying something. 0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:28.120 What they're implying is that these items have been tied 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:31.760 back to him, however many there are. And the thing 0:12:31.800 --> 0:12:34.160 about DNA is that when you get results from that, 0:12:34.600 --> 0:12:39.559 those numbers suddenly become exponential, and that in and of 0:12:39.600 --> 0:12:43.320 itself is a problem for him, because that makes it 0:12:43.360 --> 0:12:44.760 tougher and tougher to defeat. 0:12:45.360 --> 0:12:45.840 Joining us. 0:12:45.880 --> 0:12:49.880 Now doctor Bethany Marshall where now it's psycho Alys out 0:12:49.920 --> 0:12:53.959 of the la jurisdiction. She is the author of deal Breakers. 0:12:54.000 --> 0:12:58.440 You can see on her on Hulu, on Peacock, on Netflix, 0:12:59.120 --> 0:13:02.800 brand new hit podcast on The Catch with Doctor Bethany Marshall. 0:13:03.160 --> 0:13:05.600 You can find her at doctor Bethany Marshall dot com. 0:13:05.640 --> 0:13:08.959 Okay hit at Bethany thoughts. 0:13:08.920 --> 0:13:12.360 Well, first of all, Coburger is obsessive. We know that 0:13:12.480 --> 0:13:15.680 from his history, from his actions. You know he kept 0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:19.240 a lot of contact information on his phone of other women. 0:13:19.880 --> 0:13:24.120 We know he probably stoked the Moscow for We know 0:13:24.320 --> 0:13:27.880 also that he surveiled the house. I mean, he's meticulous. 0:13:27.920 --> 0:13:30.280 He used gloves, he tried to get rid of the 0:13:31.080 --> 0:13:34.320 garbage from his home. So everything is thought out. Think 0:13:34.480 --> 0:13:40.160 about a perpetrator who actually goes to a criminal justice 0:13:40.360 --> 0:13:44.920 program as a precursor for committing a crime. Somebody who 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:49.760 actually sends out a survey asking how did you feel 0:13:49.880 --> 0:13:52.720 during the commission of the crime. This is somebody who 0:13:52.760 --> 0:13:55.320 lives in their heads. So what does that tell me 0:13:55.440 --> 0:13:58.480 about why he may have withdrawn the plea deal. It 0:13:58.600 --> 0:14:02.319 tells me that this gives him another opportunity to obsess, 0:14:02.920 --> 0:14:07.960 to perseverate, to tell his story. Also, he's been thinking 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:11.160 a lot now that he's in solitary confinement. He only 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:13.400 bays twice to day when he goes out, it's in 0:14:13.440 --> 0:14:17.400 a cage, he has access to the law library. That's 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.960 a lot of time to think. So this would be 0:14:21.160 --> 0:14:25.280 not only consistent with his baseline personality, but it's also 0:14:25.360 --> 0:14:29.800 consistent with the profile of somebody who's sociopathic. I've never 0:14:30.200 --> 0:14:34.440 met him or examined him, but sociopaths tend to convince 0:14:34.520 --> 0:14:37.480 themselves of their own reality. Whatever they think is true 0:14:37.520 --> 0:14:42.000 becomes true. So he might, you know, be telling himself, 0:14:42.040 --> 0:14:44.480 I didn't really do that, or I wasn't served up 0:14:44.680 --> 0:14:46.920 justice in court, and you know now is going to 0:14:47.000 --> 0:14:49.920 be my day in court. And the third factor, you know, 0:14:50.480 --> 0:14:53.920 we have this saying that you know, psychotics build castles. 0:14:54.440 --> 0:14:57.040 We have the saying neurotics build castles and the sky 0:14:57.480 --> 0:15:00.640 psychotics live in them. He may be living in his 0:15:00.680 --> 0:15:04.680 own delusional castle where he believes he has come up 0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:09.160 with a very reasonable defense, and he's grandiose. He's better 0:15:09.200 --> 0:15:13.480 than the attorneys and he's going to handle his defense himself. 0:15:13.800 --> 0:15:17.440 I find it fascinating that Coburger has withdrawn the police 0:15:17.600 --> 0:15:21.680 for two reasons. I believe he was a budding serial killer. 0:15:22.320 --> 0:15:25.480 And one of the things we know about serial killers 0:15:25.680 --> 0:15:29.080 is that they and people who commit homicide and domestic 0:15:29.080 --> 0:15:33.760 homicide in general, especially if there's a sexually motivated aspect 0:15:33.800 --> 0:15:38.000 of the crime, they want to relive the crime. They 0:15:38.040 --> 0:15:43.640 collect fetishes. Scott Peterson drove to the bay, they surveil 0:15:43.720 --> 0:15:46.120 the area where they dumped the body. I mean, there's 0:15:46.160 --> 0:15:50.000 a lot of reliving, and going to court would be 0:15:50.120 --> 0:15:55.720 yet another opportunity to relive the crime. Now, remember these 0:15:55.800 --> 0:16:00.600 crimes do tend to be sexually motivated. He can only 0:16:00.680 --> 0:16:04.720 sit in his solitary confinement and masturbate and live in 0:16:04.760 --> 0:16:09.320 his head metaphorically for so many hours a day. I mean, 0:16:09.320 --> 0:16:11.720 it's got to stop. In fact, one of the things 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:15.400 I see with sex addicts in my practice, especially if 0:16:15.400 --> 0:16:19.880 there's an aggressive component if they watch BDSM porn or 0:16:19.920 --> 0:16:27.200 sadism towards victims, is they like to prolong ejaculation as 0:16:27.240 --> 0:16:30.440 long as possible, and other words, to live in a 0:16:30.520 --> 0:16:34.880 state of arousal and there's only so much material in 0:16:34.920 --> 0:16:37.880 your own head, you know, if you're living in solitary confinement. 0:16:38.080 --> 0:16:42.040 So going to court might be another way to collect material, 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:44.960 you know, to see women sitting in the court, to 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:50.120 see people crying, which should be feed into sexual sadism, 0:16:50.280 --> 0:16:52.680 to go over the details of the crime. So he 0:16:52.800 --> 0:16:55.720 might be, you know, tired of his own fantasy world 0:16:56.120 --> 0:16:57.720 and needing to enter another. 0:17:00.040 --> 0:17:04.200 Mhm, ran downstairs, Yes, I can hear, you can hear everything. 0:17:04.359 --> 0:17:04.719 I'm not sure. 0:17:04.760 --> 0:17:09.280 I heard a run down stairs fast. And then I 0:17:09.320 --> 0:17:15.240 heard Murphy farking a lot, okay, And then I heard 0:17:15.240 --> 0:17:17.000 her going to the back I think it was the bathroom, 0:17:17.240 --> 0:17:19.840 and then remember her stopping, and I just freagard this 0:17:19.880 --> 0:17:22.240 guy's voice and I didn't recognize saying you're gonna be okay, 0:17:22.320 --> 0:17:24.480 to help you. But it wasn't like I don't know 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:26.680 how to explain it, like, it wasn't in like a 0:17:26.800 --> 0:17:28.880 nice way. It was like a weird wave, like a weird. 0:17:28.720 --> 0:17:34.320 Tone, You're gonna be okay, I'm gonna help you. Yeah, 0:17:35.080 --> 0:17:36.760 And you didn't hear anything from Kaylee anymore. 0:17:36.960 --> 0:17:42.720 No, I didn't hear anything. And then Nuddy about Murphy, and. 0:17:42.720 --> 0:17:44.400 Then Murphy's a dog. 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:48.439 Yeah, and then I went outside go to bed, and 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:53.199 she was so, you see what's happening here? All the 0:17:53.240 --> 0:17:57.520 speculation about the dog. He had been there before, and 0:17:57.600 --> 0:18:02.479 he had befriended the dog. He knew Murphy, and Murphy 0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:05.920 was part. Murphy the dog was part of the scenario 0:18:06.119 --> 0:18:08.240 that night. 0:18:09.000 --> 0:18:12.400 Uh, she's saying this money on floor. There's a guy 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:16.879 black man was in there. She recognized him. She and 0:18:17.000 --> 0:18:20.080 she heard girl screaming upstairs. She got scared and walked 0:18:20.119 --> 0:18:24.600 herself in the room and then screaming all stop. She's 0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:28.560 pretty sure that this masked person went out the back 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:34.160 and right out getting off the information. 0:18:34.359 --> 0:18:35.440 She knows only two girls. 0:18:35.280 --> 0:18:37.840 In the UK there haven't told her who's deceased or 0:18:37.840 --> 0:18:41.159 anything that they just have four people that are on 0:18:41.240 --> 0:18:43.080 account of slore right now, which. 0:18:45.560 --> 0:18:46.000 Okay? 0:18:47.040 --> 0:18:51.320 Who who's dog? Who owns a dog? 0:18:52.560 --> 0:18:55.320 And again, as Sidney told us earlier, we find out 0:18:55.320 --> 0:18:58.680 the only one that knew what had really happened was 0:18:58.760 --> 0:19:03.320 Hunter Johnson, the kid that has hands up over his 0:19:03.440 --> 0:19:05.160 head in anguish. 0:19:05.240 --> 0:19:07.200 Listen to Hunter Johnson. 0:19:08.720 --> 0:19:09.720 I forgot you're here, man? 0:19:10.760 --> 0:19:11.960 Do you still want to hang out here? 0:19:12.640 --> 0:19:13.840 I just want to know what's going on? 0:19:16.440 --> 0:19:18.960 Uh, I don't know how much. 0:19:19.800 --> 0:19:24.679 I don't want to disclose right now, we're we're processing 0:19:24.920 --> 0:19:27.879 what's going on in the scene. As soon as we 0:19:28.280 --> 0:19:30.879 know for sure we can tell you guys what's going on. 0:19:30.960 --> 0:19:31.880 We absolutely will. 0:19:32.200 --> 0:19:34.600 I know it sucks to be in the dark with this, 0:19:34.800 --> 0:19:50.560 but okay, and what's your what's your relationship again? Okay? Yeah, man, 0:19:50.600 --> 0:19:52.119 as soon as soon as I know we're able to 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:54.199 usually in on what's going on. 0:19:54.280 --> 0:19:57.440 Well, there's a back gad for you. 0:19:57.480 --> 0:19:58.560 I was gonna start taking it. 0:19:58.520 --> 0:20:03.359 All off outside off, Okay, pretty. 0:20:04.680 --> 0:20:06.520 Already, hasn't I gotten there? 0:20:07.600 --> 0:20:08.639 Shut the dog in there? 0:20:10.160 --> 0:20:15.160 You hear the officer trying to secure it, saying, I've 0:20:15.200 --> 0:20:18.280 got to I got to right here, talking about two 0:20:18.680 --> 0:20:24.399 dead bodies. I got two right here already. The house 0:20:24.480 --> 0:20:27.600 is clear. In other words, the suspect's not there. There's 0:20:27.640 --> 0:20:30.040 not a life suspect there. The house is clear to 0:20:30.119 --> 0:20:34.760 walk through. And they shut the dog, which is common 0:20:34.960 --> 0:20:37.359 because you don't know when the dog's gonna go crazy 0:20:37.359 --> 0:20:40.520 to start biting you shut the dog in there. I'm 0:20:40.560 --> 0:20:43.800 curious where he shut the dog. But before I analyze that, 0:20:44.000 --> 0:20:47.800 I want you to hear more from the survivors. 0:20:47.840 --> 0:20:49.520 This is Dylan Morton's listen. 0:20:49.480 --> 0:20:52.000 All right, now, what do you remember saying? I heard it? 0:20:52.359 --> 0:20:55.120 I remember I was in my room. Am I trying 0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:56.639 to go to bed? And they heard Kelley? 0:20:56.840 --> 0:20:59.800 Who dog? 0:20:59.840 --> 0:21:00.400 For real? 0:21:00.440 --> 0:21:00.680 Fast? 0:21:00.760 --> 0:21:02.000 Which one is your room? 0:21:02.359 --> 0:21:02.639 Kaylee? 0:21:02.920 --> 0:21:04.000 Which one is your room? 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:04.280 Oh? 0:21:04.520 --> 0:21:05.080 Room are you in? 0:21:06.480 --> 0:21:07.480 You were in that room? 0:21:07.840 --> 0:21:10.400 My room is in this room, my room and. 0:21:10.320 --> 0:21:11.800 Your room is here's the best one right here? 0:21:11.880 --> 0:21:12.360 Next day? 0:21:12.440 --> 0:21:14.400 Is that one second floor? 0:21:17.920 --> 0:21:18.240 Okay? 0:21:19.640 --> 0:21:21.919 All I heard was I heard hed go upstairs? And 0:21:21.920 --> 0:21:24.160 okay'm and then go to seat now because she's going upstairs. 0:21:24.280 --> 0:21:25.399 Oh you heard who go upstairs? 0:21:25.520 --> 0:21:25.840 Kaylee? 0:21:25.840 --> 0:21:26.919 And the dog Murphy. 0:21:29.200 --> 0:21:30.480 And upstairs to the very top. 0:21:30.800 --> 0:21:32.080 Yeah, that's where her room is. 0:21:32.880 --> 0:21:39.240 Sydney. What is probative about that body? Camp? We just showed. 0:21:39.440 --> 0:21:42.160 What does this prove, Sydney. 0:21:42.680 --> 0:21:44.960 So first we have to get in her mind that 0:21:45.440 --> 0:21:51.119 the entire time Dylan insists Haylee went upstairs, Kaylee screamed, 0:21:51.560 --> 0:21:56.200 Kaylee ran down the stairs. And the officer even points 0:21:56.240 --> 0:22:00.639 this out later. He says to another officer, she somehow 0:22:00.720 --> 0:22:03.800 knows she was somehow able to discern this with Kaylee. 0:22:04.520 --> 0:22:08.280 But we don't think that's actually true, So we have 0:22:08.400 --> 0:22:10.840 to think about the layout of the house. So Kaylee 0:22:10.880 --> 0:22:14.560 and Maddie were asleep upstairs. Xanna's room was on the 0:22:14.640 --> 0:22:18.280 second floor, where Dylan's room was, So the only thing 0:22:18.320 --> 0:22:21.000 that makes sense for somebody to have ran down those 0:22:21.040 --> 0:22:26.879 stairs is Xanna, not Kaylee, not Maddie. So we have 0:22:27.000 --> 0:22:28.840 to get that in our heads as we're listening to 0:22:28.920 --> 0:22:33.679 Dylan's recollection of events. But it just proves to me 0:22:33.800 --> 0:22:38.639 that someone was there. These women are correct, someone was 0:22:38.800 --> 0:22:39.560 in their house. 0:22:39.800 --> 0:22:43.840