1 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:29,080 Speaker 1: Welcome back to All the Smoke, New York City. Yes, yes, yes, 2 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:31,040 Speaker 1: our last and final show today. Man, we got a 3 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:31,600 Speaker 1: good one. Jack. 4 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:34,880 Speaker 2: I'm happy. This is somebody who I idolize. I've been idolized. 5 00:00:34,880 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 2: I tell him all the time. But I'm gonna let 6 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:36,640 Speaker 2: you introduce him. 7 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:39,520 Speaker 1: Before I introduced him. I when I thought of this show, 8 00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:42,040 Speaker 1: he was one of the first people I hit like, 9 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:44,479 Speaker 1: g I need you, and he's like that's when he 10 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 1: first started working on the book three years ago, years ago, 11 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 1: three years ago, and we finally got him. You see, 12 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 1: the book is out now, make sure you pick it up. 13 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:57,320 Speaker 1: But we got the one and only, my god big brother, 14 00:00:57,680 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 1: Rent Hill. 15 00:00:58,560 --> 00:01:01,639 Speaker 3: I appreciate you. Money is an honor and a privilege. 16 00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:06,400 Speaker 1: I appreciate you all. Patience, Come on the book. It 17 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:08,600 Speaker 1: took you five years to write. This would have waited 18 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:11,679 Speaker 1: for you. It's just an honor to have you on. 19 00:01:12,840 --> 00:01:15,600 Speaker 1: Let's get right to it. Talk about the book. What 20 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 1: it's about. 21 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:21,479 Speaker 4: It's by my life and my journey, you know, going 22 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:26,360 Speaker 4: back growing up Duke years Detroit, the injuries, going through 23 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:31,360 Speaker 4: that whole ordeal. I felt like getting in the Hall 24 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 4: of Fame. That's a moment when you're going to be 25 00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 4: naturally reflective. You know, we go through life and as 26 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:40,960 Speaker 4: an athlete, you gotta go and just like like next 27 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:43,119 Speaker 4: you gotta just you don't get a chance to really 28 00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:47,720 Speaker 4: reflect on what you're doing. But that moment, that celebration, 29 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 4: it was like, you know, I need to do this. 30 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 4: I need to write a book. And then you know 31 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:54,480 Speaker 4: it took a minute and the process and in COVID 32 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 4: and you know, whatever the case may be, but it 33 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:01,720 Speaker 4: was it was an incredible exercise. I think everybody should 34 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 4: go through the process. We all got a story. I 35 00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 4: think we get older, we go back and look at 36 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 4: our lives, we learn the lessons. We can see things 37 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:12,920 Speaker 4: from an older perspective. I think it's about being vulnerable, 38 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:18,079 Speaker 4: it's about being introspective. Like it to me, the process 39 00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:20,560 Speaker 4: of the book, like I learned. It might sound crazy, 40 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:23,840 Speaker 4: but I learned more about myself. And I think we 41 00:02:23,880 --> 00:02:27,200 Speaker 4: spend so much time, you know, we play, and you 42 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 4: got to stay in the moment and you keep every 43 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 4: day you fighting, you know, every day somebody's trying to 44 00:02:32,320 --> 00:02:35,440 Speaker 4: take your spot. And then you retire and you're like, hey, 45 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 4: what's next. We're all hustling trying to figure things out 46 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 4: and so we don't look back and we don't look 47 00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 4: back all the time and live in those moments. And 48 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:46,560 Speaker 4: so anyway, I don't want to get too deep on that, 49 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:53,120 Speaker 4: but like to me, it exceeded my expectations of what 50 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 4: I learned about myself and my growth and to share 51 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:58,800 Speaker 4: that and to be comfortable putting it all out there 52 00:02:59,240 --> 00:03:01,160 Speaker 4: was you know a lot. 53 00:03:01,639 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: It's opening that door, right, really opening that door. And 54 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:07,839 Speaker 1: like you said, y'all got the right. Yeah, y'all both 55 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: stories down the pipeline. Yeah, how do you think you 56 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:13,440 Speaker 1: would be in this era your game? 57 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:23,200 Speaker 4: You know, I think, I think with the spacing and 58 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:25,359 Speaker 4: then now they've taken a little bit of the physicality 59 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 4: out of the game, I think I could. It's just 60 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 4: more open. You think about it. Back in the day, 61 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:32,560 Speaker 4: you have big guys in the paint clogging up and 62 00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:33,079 Speaker 4: I like. 63 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:35,840 Speaker 1: That you were still dunking on them though. Yeah, so 64 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you know, g is so nice. 65 00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 1: You already know that like spacing, Like when you look back, 66 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 1: like we were in Detroit, we were having an eighty 67 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 1: one A game like we didn't run, we played methodical, 68 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 1: we didn't get up and down like it is now. 69 00:03:51,400 --> 00:03:55,360 Speaker 3: So yeah, man, and the money. 70 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 1: And the money sit the money crazy. 71 00:03:58,320 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 4: So but you know, I enjoyed my time. It was 72 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:04,200 Speaker 4: it was a different league. The games evolved, the shootings. 73 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:05,760 Speaker 4: But I mean there's a lot of things that are better. 74 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 4: There's some things I don't like about the current league. 75 00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:14,839 Speaker 4: But yeah, man, I mean, y'all right here in this era, 76 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:17,720 Speaker 4: I would have had some fun, no question. 77 00:04:19,640 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 1: Five. 78 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:23,440 Speaker 3: Man. You know, look, I'm sorry. I know you play 79 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:24,000 Speaker 3: with Draymond. 80 00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 4: Every time I see Draymond, I say this, but I'm 81 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:28,599 Speaker 4: like Draymond, you checked in the game, I would have 82 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 4: been dropped three posted you. 83 00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:31,599 Speaker 3: I don't know how he like. 84 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:35,599 Speaker 4: He's like a rim protector and he's in there big man. 85 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:36,320 Speaker 4: How tall is he? 86 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:37,480 Speaker 1: Six six? 87 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:40,720 Speaker 3: But he gets it done? Man, I don't you know. 88 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,960 Speaker 4: But anyway, it was a different league, man, But yeah, 89 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:44,680 Speaker 4: i'd have done all right. 90 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:46,720 Speaker 1: One player you think one player you would want to 91 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 1: play with today? 92 00:04:49,320 --> 00:04:51,839 Speaker 4: I mean right now, obviously he's getting up there and 93 00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:53,520 Speaker 4: things are a little bit crazy in l A. 94 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:55,400 Speaker 3: But I would have liked to play with Lebron. Yeah, 95 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:56,640 Speaker 3: and nice. 96 00:04:57,920 --> 00:05:00,359 Speaker 4: I don't know Lebron like that. I mean, we've always 97 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:03,080 Speaker 4: been good, but I don't I'm not in his circle 98 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 4: like that, but I think everybody that plays with him, 99 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:09,760 Speaker 4: he's like a glue guy. The guys that play with 100 00:05:09,839 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 4: him love him like he's inclusive. You know, he he 101 00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:19,280 Speaker 4: thinks the game at a high level. I also think 102 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:24,960 Speaker 4: no one's endured as much hate. 103 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,680 Speaker 1: We talked about that, Yeah, the hype and. 104 00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:31,400 Speaker 4: The hype and what he's done. But just you think about, 105 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:34,479 Speaker 4: like Jordan didn't have to experience that when we played 106 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:37,400 Speaker 4: in the nineties. It was talk radio, maybe the newspaper, 107 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:39,400 Speaker 4: but you didn't hear the noise. 108 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 3: You didn't hear the slander. 109 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:44,880 Speaker 4: And now for someone like him, the face of the franchise, 110 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:48,800 Speaker 4: who's been so good, man, he's got to endure so much. 111 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:51,480 Speaker 4: Just I mean, all we all get it. I'm sure 112 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:54,440 Speaker 4: you guys. So I just I got sorry about math. 113 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:58,400 Speaker 4: So I'm sorry, man, I'm getting off. So when Twitter, 114 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:01,160 Speaker 4: when Twitter first came out, I think we were in that. 115 00:06:01,279 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 4: Maybe it was Instagram, I can't remember. So Mad. You know, 116 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:10,719 Speaker 4: somebody might say something slick to Mad on Twitter, and 117 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:12,040 Speaker 4: Matt would come back at. 118 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:13,080 Speaker 3: Him like full speed. 119 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:15,479 Speaker 4: No, no, no, let me tell you we're gonna be 120 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:17,800 Speaker 4: in your city on this day And we're staying at 121 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:22,600 Speaker 4: this hotel, meet me at seven am in the lobby. 122 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 1: He pulled me to the side one day, like, Matt, 123 00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 1: you stop that. 124 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:29,159 Speaker 3: So he wanted all to smoke, but like literally, like 125 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 3: I was like, yeah, but you know. 126 00:06:31,279 --> 00:06:33,840 Speaker 4: Just it was around that time. The game is changing. 127 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 4: But we hear all that and we're adults, we're older, 128 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:39,719 Speaker 4: we're you know, I'm almost be fifty this year. But 129 00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 4: these young kids, man like, I think it does affect 130 00:06:42,400 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 4: them a little bit when they hear all that, and 131 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:47,040 Speaker 4: it's still impressionable, still trying to find their way. 132 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:48,640 Speaker 3: So I don't envy that. 133 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:51,080 Speaker 4: And I think Lebron has been sort of the poster 134 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:53,040 Speaker 4: boy of that, and so I admire that he's been 135 00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:55,600 Speaker 4: able to just you know, he don't always win. It 136 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 4: doesn't always do you know, but he he handles all 137 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 4: that and handles it well very well. 138 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:04,840 Speaker 1: Yeah. Uh. Born in Dallas, Texas. Uh, your dad was 139 00:07:04,880 --> 00:07:07,680 Speaker 1: a Pro Bowl Super Bowl champ with the running with 140 00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:10,000 Speaker 1: the Cowboys that the last time they won the Super Bowl. 141 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:14,520 Speaker 1: Do that? Don't do that? Mom was successful business. 142 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 3: Only child. 143 00:07:17,200 --> 00:07:18,960 Speaker 1: Football, you're always in the mix as a youngster. 144 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 3: Football. 145 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 1: Talk about those times growing up as an only child 146 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:22,720 Speaker 1: in that environment. 147 00:07:22,920 --> 00:07:25,480 Speaker 4: Yeah, so I was the only child of two only children, 148 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:30,360 Speaker 4: and so it was just us. And but you know, 149 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 4: football was my first love and grew up around it. 150 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 4: I was I was named by Roger Starbach. So my dad, 151 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:42,640 Speaker 4: my mom and dad were expecting a girl, and obviously 152 00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 4: I'm not a girl. So my dad can't make up 153 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:49,120 Speaker 4: his mind. And so I was baby boy Hill for 154 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 4: like three days and Starback came to the hospital and 155 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:55,040 Speaker 4: you know, came up with the name Grant, named after 156 00:07:55,080 --> 00:07:56,760 Speaker 4: my paternal grandmother's maiden name. 157 00:07:58,520 --> 00:07:59,680 Speaker 3: And so we moved to d C. 158 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:02,920 Speaker 4: And you know, that rivalry, particularly in the late seventies 159 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:05,120 Speaker 4: early eighties, it's always been intense, but it was the 160 00:08:05,160 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 4: Redskins were good cowboys coming off the seventies. So I 161 00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:12,119 Speaker 4: was a die like. I'm a cowboy fan like die Hard. 162 00:08:13,080 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 4: That was tough being in DC and being he's he's 163 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 4: not a come on all teams. That's our nemesis right there. 164 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 4: But look, I was on the I was on the 165 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:28,520 Speaker 4: parade on the float when the Redskins won I think 166 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:31,480 Speaker 4: it was eighty two eighty three, they beat the Dolphins. 167 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 3: So I was on the float. Dave Butts, who was 168 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 3: the Aligneman. 169 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 4: I went on the float with him and his family, 170 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:40,319 Speaker 4: and I remember how proud I was because underneath my 171 00:08:40,400 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 4: jacket I had a Cowboys shirt off, and so that 172 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:46,319 Speaker 4: was But but football was everything, man, and my dad 173 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:49,199 Speaker 4: wouldn't let me play. He wouldn't let me play till 174 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:52,800 Speaker 4: I got the high school and so that killed me. 175 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 4: And you know, I resented it and uh and so 176 00:08:56,880 --> 00:08:58,720 Speaker 4: I kind of got away from it. And by the 177 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:01,320 Speaker 4: time I was in high school, you know, I wanted 178 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 4: to play. I was in basketball. 179 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:05,040 Speaker 3: I was all in. But football was my first love, 180 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:05,600 Speaker 3: no question. 181 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 1: When did you realize basketball can take you places? 182 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 4: I first I first fell in love with basketball. Eighty 183 00:09:15,080 --> 00:09:19,120 Speaker 4: two Final four Jordan hit that shot, Jordan North Carolina Georgetown. 184 00:09:19,160 --> 00:09:22,280 Speaker 4: We bought a Beta Max. We taped that game, and 185 00:09:22,320 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 4: so that was when I fell in love. And then 186 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:27,240 Speaker 4: a couple of years later, my dad and I started 187 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:29,400 Speaker 4: going to Final four US. So when Georgetown won in 188 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:32,240 Speaker 4: eighty four and we went every year from eighty four 189 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:34,120 Speaker 4: to eighty eight, that was our little you know, father 190 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:37,880 Speaker 4: son bonding or whatever. And so I think for me 191 00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:43,679 Speaker 4: it was probably like AAU. I was thirteen and we 192 00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:47,360 Speaker 4: went to Saint Louis. First game we played, we played 193 00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:51,480 Speaker 4: Weber Jalen super Friends, and I talk about it in 194 00:09:51,559 --> 00:09:54,280 Speaker 4: the book, Like my dad he was he saw all 195 00:09:54,320 --> 00:09:56,640 Speaker 4: these guys, he saw us, and he was like, I'm 196 00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:59,320 Speaker 4: gonna get my speech ready for in case they lose. 197 00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 4: And we smacked them. We beat them a BYuT twenty 198 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:08,079 Speaker 4: five thirty. And so then that tournament we won the 199 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:11,400 Speaker 4: national championship. And so at that point, I'm like, you 200 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:14,320 Speaker 4: know what, like seeing myself gaging myself against other kids. 201 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 4: Alan Henderson was at Jamal Mashburn and these guys all 202 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 4: made it to. 203 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:20,199 Speaker 3: The NBA like thirteen year olds. 204 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 4: You say we were thirteen, But here's the thing I was. 205 00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:25,800 Speaker 4: I was young for my grade. So I started college 206 00:10:25,840 --> 00:10:28,320 Speaker 4: or high school at thirteen. I started college at seventeen. 207 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 4: I should have been probably a webinar, you know what 208 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 4: I'm saying. But I was going into high school and 209 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 4: so I played varsity as a freshman. Well, those guys 210 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:40,920 Speaker 4: were tenth grade, and so when I came back the 211 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:43,560 Speaker 4: next year, I was like, I was, I had surpassed 212 00:10:43,559 --> 00:10:45,680 Speaker 4: all of them. We lost in the finals. I still 213 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:50,800 Speaker 4: got the MVP. And so that was when around that time, 214 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:53,440 Speaker 4: it was like, Okay, I got a chance to I 215 00:10:53,559 --> 00:11:00,200 Speaker 4: wasn't thinking the NBA, but I got a chance in college. 216 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:03,000 Speaker 1: Gentlemen, Father's Day is around the corner, and our friends 217 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:05,880 Speaker 1: at Manscap are here to ensure all father figures are 218 00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:07,839 Speaker 1: out there looking daddy material. 219 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:11,960 Speaker 2: This June, Manscape's Performance Package four point zero, which includes 220 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:15,360 Speaker 2: their signature Lawnmower four point zero, is the perfect bundle 221 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:18,280 Speaker 2: to tackle in in all old man hair from the 222 00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:19,240 Speaker 2: head to toe. 223 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:22,280 Speaker 1: This right here is no dad joke. 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Like, you know, it was good? 265 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:11,920 Speaker 3: It was. 266 00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 4: You know, I mean for me, it was it was. 267 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:17,880 Speaker 4: It was Carolina Georgetown. Those were the two schools that 268 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,760 Speaker 4: I loved. Dad wanted you to go to UNC. Yeah, 269 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:23,360 Speaker 4: I'm gonna wanted you to go to Georgetown, man, that's right. 270 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 4: So we had we had we had, we had season 271 00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:29,599 Speaker 4: tickets so we would go to Georgetown games. And I 272 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:31,800 Speaker 4: don't know if you remember, Michael Jackson played it with 273 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:34,199 Speaker 4: point guard, so he went to my high school. He 274 00:13:34,280 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 4: used to work for my mother in the summers. My 275 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:40,640 Speaker 4: mom introduced Pat Ewing to his wife. So I was 276 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:43,240 Speaker 4: so I was entrenched with Georgetown, like I was all in, 277 00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:46,960 Speaker 4: like we all were. I think at that time black 278 00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 4: I thought it was I thought it was HBCU back then. 279 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:52,120 Speaker 4: I didn't realize it was like eleven, you know, I 280 00:13:52,120 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 4: didn't realize it was a private school. But so Georgetown, Carolina, Michigan, 281 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:03,520 Speaker 4: Virginia and Duke and I made my first visit and 282 00:14:03,559 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 4: it was to Duke, and Coach K just kind of 283 00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 4: blew me away. And I knew right then that I 284 00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:11,840 Speaker 4: wanted to be there. And the genius of coach K 285 00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 4: and I know, you know, love hate Duke and all that. 286 00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:16,720 Speaker 4: And obviously now he's had he had great success at 287 00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:20,560 Speaker 4: the end and coached the Olympic team. But his ability 288 00:14:20,600 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 4: to get people to buy in. He wasn't a great, 289 00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:27,480 Speaker 4: excellent old coach, but like if he sat, he looked 290 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:30,080 Speaker 4: you in the eye like you believed in him. And 291 00:14:30,120 --> 00:14:32,600 Speaker 4: that was his genius, getting everybody to kind of like 292 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:37,320 Speaker 4: buy in to him and buy into one another. And 293 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:41,280 Speaker 4: so Duke Duke really wasn't my fate, but like you know, 294 00:14:41,320 --> 00:14:44,480 Speaker 4: it just felt right, and you know, made that decision, 295 00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:46,720 Speaker 4: and you know, fortunately we made history. 296 00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:51,200 Speaker 2: You win titles in ninety one and ninety two, right, uh, 297 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:52,800 Speaker 2: the famous Christian Layton shot. 298 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:54,120 Speaker 1: How big was that moment? 299 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:55,880 Speaker 3: Man? 300 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 4: It's crazy, you know, it's crazy to think that was 301 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 4: thirty years ago and people still people still talk about it. 302 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 4: But Christian was a great college player. I mean Alonso Shaq, 303 00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:18,920 Speaker 4: I mean everybody he faced, he dominated Shack twice and 304 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,720 Speaker 4: he and we had a good team. I mean Bobby 305 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:23,560 Speaker 4: was a great college point guard. I was you know, 306 00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:25,920 Speaker 4: I was a good player. He had three he had 307 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:28,640 Speaker 4: three guys in the College Basketball Hall of Fame and 308 00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 4: so so those moments were incredible. I don't think we 309 00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:37,360 Speaker 4: realized while we were doing it the significance of what 310 00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:37,840 Speaker 4: was happening. 311 00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 3: We were just trying to win. 312 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 4: We were I was nineteen, I was a kid, and 313 00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:47,040 Speaker 4: but that passed the Layner. That shot Laydna didn't miss 314 00:15:47,040 --> 00:15:50,520 Speaker 4: a shot the whole game. Layden was cocky, lighten. It 315 00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 4: was like he talked trash. He also had a He 316 00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:57,920 Speaker 4: was a great teammate as well. I remember we had 317 00:15:57,920 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 4: a game I talked about in the book. We had 318 00:15:59,400 --> 00:16:02,920 Speaker 4: a game we went to Buffalo to play Concious and 319 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 4: it was a game for him going back to his hometown. 320 00:16:07,480 --> 00:16:09,800 Speaker 4: And halftime he had like one or two shots, and 321 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:12,000 Speaker 4: Coach k Is like, like, Christian, what's going on, Like 322 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:12,880 Speaker 4: this game's for you. 323 00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 3: You act like you. 324 00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 4: Don't want to play, and he's like, I want my 325 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:18,840 Speaker 4: hometown to see how good my teammates are. And so 326 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,520 Speaker 4: you know, you you coming back home, college player of 327 00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:23,320 Speaker 4: the Year, you wanna try to show out. But he 328 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 4: was trying to show us out and so you know, 329 00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 4: you don't hear about that side of Christian You just 330 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:31,080 Speaker 4: hear the you know, the crazy, and there was a. 331 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:31,880 Speaker 3: Lot of craziness. 332 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 4: But but he was he was a great competitor, you know, 333 00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 4: he he he and he did his work. 334 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:42,480 Speaker 2: He did his thing with all the noise and knowing 335 00:16:42,520 --> 00:16:45,960 Speaker 2: how everybody feel about Duke, is the brotherhood tight enough 336 00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:48,040 Speaker 2: to block out the noise and stay strong? 337 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:49,160 Speaker 1: You know? 338 00:16:49,520 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 3: Yeah? 339 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:53,320 Speaker 4: I mean it's funny, man, because I don't think we 340 00:16:53,320 --> 00:16:56,800 Speaker 4: were aware of what people's perceptions were back then a 341 00:16:56,920 --> 00:17:00,840 Speaker 4: Duke and I looked at Duke different than I looked 342 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:06,119 Speaker 4: at Wake Forest, Georgia Tech, Georgetown. These are pwy's that 343 00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:10,359 Speaker 4: have good basketball teams, and so I get it with 344 00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:12,920 Speaker 4: the you know us beating Vegas and the Fab five 345 00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:16,840 Speaker 4: and obviously Jalen's documentary and how they felt towards us. 346 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:21,520 Speaker 4: But I wasn't aware that, like honestly, like we we 347 00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 4: got along with every like, you know, web was my guys. 348 00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:25,840 Speaker 4: I talked some stories about Weber and there when we 349 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:28,159 Speaker 4: were in high school. He used to come visit me 350 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 4: in Virginia. You know, we didn't have social media and 351 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:36,359 Speaker 4: read the newspaper back then, so we were in Durham. 352 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:37,480 Speaker 3: We'd go to Durham, we go. 353 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:41,400 Speaker 4: To cookouts, barbecues, barbershop. Everybody showed love. So I don't 354 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 4: think I was aware. 355 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:44,160 Speaker 1: That there was this stigma. 356 00:17:44,320 --> 00:17:46,680 Speaker 4: Yeah, like this now, I should have known better, because 357 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:49,800 Speaker 4: I didn't like the Celtics for the very reason people 358 00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:52,679 Speaker 4: didn't like us. I was a Laker fan, and I 359 00:17:52,680 --> 00:17:54,120 Speaker 4: identified with the Lakers. 360 00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:55,400 Speaker 3: But I think. 361 00:17:55,240 --> 00:17:59,600 Speaker 4: Because we had really good white players and had a 362 00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:04,520 Speaker 4: fairy Latner pearly, maybe I fit this, like you know, 363 00:18:04,600 --> 00:18:07,440 Speaker 4: my parents, and you know, people thought what they thought 364 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:10,360 Speaker 4: about me. I think that might have contributed to the narrative. 365 00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 4: But at the time, like I was totally oblivious to 366 00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 4: that narrative. And and not until years later I even 367 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:21,000 Speaker 4: thought the hate towards Duke later on was because Duke 368 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 4: has success, like the Yankees or like you know, the Cowboys. 369 00:18:26,920 --> 00:18:28,879 Speaker 4: I didn't realize. I didn't really realize that you. 370 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:30,440 Speaker 1: Could have used a better example. But I feel you 371 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:31,359 Speaker 1: over the. 372 00:18:31,359 --> 00:18:34,479 Speaker 4: Forty nine ers, you know, you know, and so but 373 00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:36,439 Speaker 4: I get it now, like I understand, and it was 374 00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:39,919 Speaker 4: an interesting time and you know, and so I you know, 375 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:42,840 Speaker 4: I get the but had a brotherhood strong, coach k 376 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:47,879 Speaker 4: moved on. You know, Shires recruited, well, you know, we 377 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:49,080 Speaker 4: hope to stay relevant. 378 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:50,400 Speaker 3: Man. That's that's that's the main thing. 379 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:56,119 Speaker 1: Ninety four draft, you go number three overall to Detroit. 380 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:58,160 Speaker 1: What are you hearing leading up to the draft? I mean, 381 00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:01,400 Speaker 1: Glenn Robinson, Jason Kidd, You're self, what are you hearing 382 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:03,760 Speaker 1: leading up to there? You hear one, two, three? 383 00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 3: So this was this was crazy. So Glenn, Glenn was. 384 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:11,040 Speaker 4: Glenn was incredible in college thirty a game, like I mean, 385 00:19:11,080 --> 00:19:15,520 Speaker 4: he was. He was unreal, man, and I think he's underappreciated, 386 00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:18,480 Speaker 4: like people don't. He came into twenty one his first 387 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:21,560 Speaker 4: first year in the league, scoring twenty one a game. 388 00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:26,119 Speaker 4: So at the at the draft lottery, Mike Dunleavy, who 389 00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 4: was the coach at GM, puts up his jersey, So 390 00:19:29,840 --> 00:19:33,959 Speaker 4: that's the sign they gonna take him. So I figured, 391 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:36,479 Speaker 4: you know, Dallas had the number two pick, they had 392 00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:39,239 Speaker 4: Jimmy Jackson, Jamal Mashburn, so they gonna they're gonna take 393 00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:42,360 Speaker 4: Jay Kidds, which was the right, right decision. So Detroit 394 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 4: to me, they had Lindsay, they had Allen Houston. That 395 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 4: felt like the right fit. But Milwaukee wanted me to 396 00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:51,120 Speaker 4: come in and work out for him. I didn't want 397 00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:53,400 Speaker 4: to go, and my agent was like, that's the number 398 00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:56,280 Speaker 4: one pick. You got to go out of respect. So 399 00:19:56,320 --> 00:19:57,840 Speaker 4: I went there. I didn't want to be there. I 400 00:19:57,840 --> 00:19:59,080 Speaker 4: didn't want to be in Milwaukee. 401 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,400 Speaker 3: Yep, I don't blame I dogged the workout. Mike Dunley. 402 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:04,000 Speaker 4: He put me through this like he was. I was 403 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 4: doing laps and suicide, like he was killing me. And 404 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:09,200 Speaker 4: then he wanted to play me one on one. Mike 405 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,960 Speaker 4: did coach Dunley and so I'm like, so we checked 406 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 4: ball and I'm standing under the basket. He said the 407 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:16,400 Speaker 4: free He said, you're not gonna guard me. I said, 408 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:19,119 Speaker 4: I don't think you can make that. And man, he 409 00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:20,040 Speaker 4: hit like ten in a. 410 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:21,080 Speaker 3: Row on me. Man, like I would. 411 00:20:21,240 --> 00:20:23,720 Speaker 4: I wouldn't garden him, and uh, and I was like, 412 00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:26,280 Speaker 4: what is he doing? Like you know, but he wanted 413 00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:28,720 Speaker 4: to see me compete against him, which I didn't get. 414 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:31,719 Speaker 4: But did you No, I didn't guarden. I didn't even 415 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:35,720 Speaker 4: want to be there, and so, you know, yeah, exactly, 416 00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:38,880 Speaker 4: But but Detroit was where I wanted to be and 417 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 4: I felt like they had won recently and you know, 418 00:20:44,119 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 4: the colors red, white, and blue. I felt was good, 419 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:47,800 Speaker 4: you know, good for my feelers. 420 00:20:47,800 --> 00:20:54,320 Speaker 1: So I mean, right, you had a nice catalog of 421 00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:59,320 Speaker 1: Nikes over at Duke. What made you choose Felix because 422 00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:01,200 Speaker 1: they were obviously a lesser known brand. 423 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 3: An get that bag? So let let me say what happened, man? 424 00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:06,359 Speaker 3: So it was crazy. 425 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:08,560 Speaker 4: So I'll go out to Nike and you know, you 426 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:10,439 Speaker 4: go out there for your recruiting trip to take it 427 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,840 Speaker 4: through the store. You get all this stuff. So Phil Knight, 428 00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:17,320 Speaker 4: we obviously know his his genius. He was thinking about 429 00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:21,000 Speaker 4: the Far East in nineteen ninety four and he was like, man, 430 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:23,880 Speaker 4: if I can go into China and penetrate that market 431 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:25,800 Speaker 4: and there's a billion plus people that I can get 432 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 4: shoes on them, Like he was talking about this in 433 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 4: this meeting, and he wanted me to be via satellite 434 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:38,040 Speaker 4: at the Great Wall of China for the draft and 435 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:41,200 Speaker 4: like that would be a way to break into that market. 436 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:43,480 Speaker 4: And I was like, I want to be. I want 437 00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:45,440 Speaker 4: to be. I want to be with David Stern. You 438 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 4: know what I'm saying. Like that's a dream. We all 439 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 4: dreamed that to getting drafted and that whole thing. And 440 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:51,840 Speaker 4: so but I tell that story, like that's where his 441 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:57,200 Speaker 4: head was at. But when it's starting negotiating, the money 442 00:21:57,240 --> 00:21:58,879 Speaker 4: wasn't like it wasn't fit in the vision, you know 443 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:00,800 Speaker 4: what I'm saying. And so I went on over reluctantly 444 00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:04,560 Speaker 4: over to meet Fela, and I knew they had mash burned, 445 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:07,960 Speaker 4: but I know, we went through, we toured the facility 446 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 4: and we sat in the boardroom and they had this 447 00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:15,080 Speaker 4: this like proposal and on page two was the money. 448 00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:17,680 Speaker 4: And I turned that page and I was like, oh 449 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:20,000 Speaker 4: my god. I was like, you know, it was the 450 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:23,760 Speaker 4: money that they were offering, like the guaranteed base salary 451 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:24,520 Speaker 4: and the royalty. 452 00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:27,200 Speaker 3: I was like, like, you said, get that bag. 453 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:30,240 Speaker 1: You're not the type of person to talk about this, 454 00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 1: but I just kind of want to have context because 455 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:34,440 Speaker 1: it's nineteen ninety four. Can you explain like what kind 456 00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: of money it was at that time compared to maybe 457 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:38,199 Speaker 1: what some of the guys maybe getting today. 458 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:42,879 Speaker 4: So Nike was offering me about five hundred thousand, and 459 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 4: Phela was basically it was a five year, fifteen million 460 00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:50,119 Speaker 4: dollars deal, Go get that bag, So you know, like 461 00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:52,840 Speaker 4: fifteen million dollars a lot. It was more money in 462 00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:56,639 Speaker 4: nineteen ninety four, so that was a guaranteed royalty, and 463 00:22:56,720 --> 00:23:00,199 Speaker 4: the shoe ended up exceeding I think everyone's expectation. But 464 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:04,200 Speaker 4: I was like, hey, you know, to this day, still selling, 465 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 4: I still get a royal teacher. 466 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:12,720 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, first impression, it's in Detroit. It's the end 467 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:15,320 Speaker 1: of the bad boy era, and now you were coming 468 00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:17,399 Speaker 1: in to be the face of the franchise. 469 00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:22,560 Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, it was crazy, man, because the team 470 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:23,680 Speaker 4: had won twenty games. 471 00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:26,119 Speaker 3: I came in. 472 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 4: There was a void in the league. MJ had retired. 473 00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:34,159 Speaker 4: I think the league was looking for a face. I 474 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,200 Speaker 4: played in one hundred and twenty some of my games 475 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:39,760 Speaker 4: at Duke, and all but five of them on national TV, 476 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:43,879 Speaker 4: so people, I think knew who I was, and I 477 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,920 Speaker 4: came out the gate and I was like, I came 478 00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:50,640 Speaker 4: out to Gate, Like, oh, I came out to gate. 479 00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:52,760 Speaker 4: I think I got twenty five ten and five my 480 00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:55,719 Speaker 4: first game against the Lakers, and like my first ten 481 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 4: to fifteen games, I was twenty more than twenty a game, 482 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:02,760 Speaker 4: calling my boys like, man, the NBA is easy, man like, 483 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:05,639 Speaker 4: and like, you know, until they get a scottery report 484 00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:06,640 Speaker 4: on you and figure you out. 485 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:09,320 Speaker 3: But one thing that that helped. 486 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,879 Speaker 4: Me was that that summer before my freshman or my 487 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 4: rookie year, you played pickup ball and then pick up ball, 488 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:18,520 Speaker 4: and you know I used to I used to play 489 00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:20,840 Speaker 4: with it. You know, I'd come down. My My favorite 490 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:24,360 Speaker 4: guy was the Pearl Duane the Pearl. Kenny Anderson had 491 00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:26,840 Speaker 4: gray handles. I used to try to be like Tim 492 00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:30,240 Speaker 4: Hardaway Chris Jackson. So I would play with the ball, 493 00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 4: but when I played in the games, I would turn 494 00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:36,480 Speaker 4: my back like like magic and big guard and big guard, 495 00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 4: and so Quinn Snyder was like, man, you need to 496 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:41,200 Speaker 4: play like this in the league, like what you're doing 497 00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:43,320 Speaker 4: out here and pick up You need to play this way, 498 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:45,639 Speaker 4: not turning your back. And so I didn't, you know, 499 00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:47,560 Speaker 4: I didn't because I didn't see big guys doing that. 500 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,840 Speaker 4: So when I came in at six ' eight, I'm 501 00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:53,320 Speaker 4: playing small forward. You didn't have guys doing that, and 502 00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:56,440 Speaker 4: so they weren't used to having like Pippin could handle 503 00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:57,240 Speaker 4: the ball with pipping. 504 00:24:57,280 --> 00:24:58,520 Speaker 3: Didn't you come at you like that? 505 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,480 Speaker 1: You couldn't go full exact, couldn't go full spring across you. 506 00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:05,159 Speaker 4: Yeah, so that that I think the ball handling. I 507 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:07,520 Speaker 4: was never a great shooter at least early on. You know, 508 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:10,280 Speaker 4: I became a decent mid range, but the ability to 509 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:13,720 Speaker 4: get to my spot and at the small forward position, 510 00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,560 Speaker 4: I think that's really helped me early on, and they 511 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:18,960 Speaker 4: weren't you see more of that now, guys, you know 512 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:20,960 Speaker 4: everybody does that, but back then you didn't have a 513 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:22,280 Speaker 4: lot of threes playing like that. 514 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 1: As a rookie, you made the All Star Game and 515 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:29,479 Speaker 1: one cold Rookie of the year averaged twenty six and five. 516 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:33,199 Speaker 1: After that first year, if you said you called your 517 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:35,520 Speaker 1: homies after the first handful of games, were you surprised 518 00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:39,000 Speaker 1: that the actually what you did fresh out of college 519 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:40,600 Speaker 1: in the NBA? 520 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, I was surprised, And then I was 521 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 4: surprised at all the fans, Like I was like, because 522 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 4: they kept trying to make me like the face and 523 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:49,679 Speaker 4: I'm thinking, like I still like, like I'm trying to 524 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:51,320 Speaker 4: We won twenty eight games, my frint like, I you 525 00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 4: know what I'm saying. I'm still got a lot to learn. 526 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:56,840 Speaker 4: But that first year was crazy, man, Like it was 527 00:25:57,040 --> 00:26:02,080 Speaker 4: you know, you shoot, you got commercials endorse. They would 528 00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:04,320 Speaker 4: try to call me the next Jordan, but I thought 529 00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:07,879 Speaker 4: it was foolish. But I leveraged that. And what I 530 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,600 Speaker 4: mean by that is I monetize. I got turned down 531 00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:17,240 Speaker 4: the deals. But you know, it was hard because we 532 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 4: were losing and you go in college where every year 533 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:24,440 Speaker 4: you feel like you have a chance to win a 534 00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:27,320 Speaker 4: championship and and now all of a sudden, you're losing 535 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:30,040 Speaker 4: more games than you've you know, lost in a lifetime. 536 00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,359 Speaker 4: So that that first year was kind of bittersweet. But 537 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 4: I felt like with Allan Houston, with Lindsay that we 538 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,480 Speaker 4: had a promise in future and you know, just wanted 539 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 4: to get better the next year. 540 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:44,960 Speaker 1: What was your welcome to the NBA moven Obviously a 541 00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:46,760 Speaker 1: lot of success your first year, but what was your 542 00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:50,879 Speaker 1: kind of your welcome to the league moment? Was it 543 00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 1: a team? Was it a player? Was it a play? 544 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:55,680 Speaker 3: Yeah? 545 00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 4: I just think out the gates, man, like just you know, 546 00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:02,679 Speaker 4: coming in and like establishing myself, being able to do 547 00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 4: what I wanted. I felt like it was easier than 548 00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,280 Speaker 4: the college game. I think making then All Star Game 549 00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:10,480 Speaker 4: my first year like that was probably like like man, 550 00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:12,880 Speaker 4: like I'm here, you know, But there wasn't like one 551 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,800 Speaker 4: signature play or moment or game or anything like that. 552 00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:21,159 Speaker 4: I think just out the Gate, coming in and putting 553 00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:24,679 Speaker 4: up work and having success. 554 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 3: It's like a dream come true. You know, I didn't 555 00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:28,080 Speaker 3: you understand. 556 00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:31,679 Speaker 4: I talk about it in the book, like I lacked 557 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:35,200 Speaker 4: self confidence, Like I didn't have great confidence in myself. 558 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:40,400 Speaker 4: And I also didn't want to stand out growing up. 559 00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:42,919 Speaker 3: And I. 560 00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:47,520 Speaker 4: Had to get comfortable stepping into greatness. I had to 561 00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:51,080 Speaker 4: get comfortable with that kind of responsibility. And my last year, Duke, 562 00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 4: I think I really kind of got to that point, 563 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:55,280 Speaker 4: which helped me when I got to the league. But 564 00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,240 Speaker 4: so all that attention, like that wasn't something that I 565 00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:01,199 Speaker 4: that I coveted, you know what I'm saying. And so 566 00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,679 Speaker 4: it was a little bit you know, now you got money, 567 00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:06,879 Speaker 4: you got fame, you're young, you got a. 568 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:07,320 Speaker 3: Little bit, you know. 569 00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:09,240 Speaker 4: So it was it was a little it was a 570 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:15,159 Speaker 4: little wild that first year, and but you know it 571 00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:17,480 Speaker 4: was it was fun though. 572 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:18,600 Speaker 3: I mean, I can't lie. You know. 573 00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:22,119 Speaker 1: You recall your first game against so MJ was retired 574 00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:24,080 Speaker 1: your rookie year, right, he was. That was the year 575 00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:24,560 Speaker 1: he missed. 576 00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 3: He came back through the end of the year. 577 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:27,879 Speaker 1: End of the year. Yeah, so what was your first 578 00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:28,600 Speaker 1: match up with him? 579 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:30,160 Speaker 3: Like, man, I just wanted to go at him. 580 00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:30,280 Speaker 1: Man. 581 00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:32,879 Speaker 4: I played against him with the Dream Team, but I 582 00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:37,359 Speaker 4: didn't really go against him, and I crossed him up. 583 00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:40,719 Speaker 4: I remember, I was like geeked about that and we 584 00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,360 Speaker 4: lost the game. But you know, to go against Jordan 585 00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:46,120 Speaker 4: like that was that was. I'll tell this man, Jordan was. 586 00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:49,360 Speaker 4: It has always been good to me, like he always would, 587 00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:51,959 Speaker 4: you know, we go out, we go eat, you know. 588 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 3: He he. 589 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:56,760 Speaker 4: I think because he lost his dad, and I think 590 00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:00,160 Speaker 4: he liked my dad, my dad, and so you know, 591 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:01,400 Speaker 4: I don't know if it was me or what, but 592 00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:04,680 Speaker 4: he always and he talked trash about Duke Carolina and 593 00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:06,800 Speaker 4: all that, but he was always was good to me. 594 00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:09,440 Speaker 4: But yeah, you know, I mean I try to go 595 00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:10,959 Speaker 4: at you. I didn't guard him a lot. I'll tell 596 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:13,160 Speaker 4: you it was funny. So the summer after my rookie year, 597 00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 4: you you weren't at u C l A man, y'all 598 00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:25,120 Speaker 4: Chris Johnson man, they ran ran LA after y'all. 599 00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:25,720 Speaker 3: Won the championship. 600 00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:28,280 Speaker 4: So I'm out in l A and I'm filming Living 601 00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:31,680 Speaker 4: Single and they created that bubble and I go over 602 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:34,760 Speaker 4: there to play against Jordan's and I played the first 603 00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:38,120 Speaker 4: day and I'm giving him the business like I am killing, 604 00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 4: Like I'm not a shooter, but everything I'm shooting is 605 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:43,320 Speaker 4: going in. I'm like, I'm crossing him up. So we're 606 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 4: on the lot. They built this bubble. He's got a 607 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:49,240 Speaker 4: cord and I'm going at Jordan's and I'm giving he 608 00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:51,360 Speaker 4: wants to guard me, I'm giving him the building. 609 00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 3: Man. 610 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:53,360 Speaker 4: In fact, it was I had the shoes on my 611 00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:57,120 Speaker 4: my g H two's and he had his Jordan tens. 612 00:29:57,160 --> 00:29:58,880 Speaker 4: But the pattern we both had patent. 613 00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:00,239 Speaker 3: Level and up. 614 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,160 Speaker 4: Man, I'm killing them like I mean, like like after 615 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:05,920 Speaker 4: I'm calling my boys afterwards, like, man, I'm killing George, 616 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,680 Speaker 4: like he's too little, like all this stuff. And so 617 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:12,040 Speaker 4: the next day I come over and I'm confident now 618 00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:15,040 Speaker 4: you know, I'm man. He gave me the bit like 619 00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:18,560 Speaker 4: it was like the next the next day and I 620 00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:21,120 Speaker 4: couldn't get a shot off. He was all that footwork 621 00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:24,880 Speaker 4: and you know, he was just But that was the 622 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,680 Speaker 4: best runs, I mean not just in LA. Maybe the 623 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:31,080 Speaker 4: best runs in the country were in that bubble. And 624 00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:33,840 Speaker 4: you had Reggie, you had Reggie Miller, you want Howard, 625 00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:36,840 Speaker 4: you had a bunch of Dennis Robman, All the U c. 626 00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:37,160 Speaker 1: L a. 627 00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:37,920 Speaker 3: Guys were there. 628 00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:40,680 Speaker 4: Toby Bailey might have been the biggest celebrity in LA 629 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:44,640 Speaker 4: this summer. And but yeah, Jordan's that was that was 630 00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:48,160 Speaker 4: a fun, fun summer right there. And had had my 631 00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:50,560 Speaker 4: moment against him, Jay I'm talking about I'm talking about 632 00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 4: giving him business like yeah. 633 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:55,200 Speaker 1: Y'all, yeah, yeah, I know you Monest too, so you 634 00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 1: was really probably given him that ship. But he's not 635 00:30:58,600 --> 00:30:59,480 Speaker 1: gonna talk like that. 636 00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 2: We want to go in nineteen ninety six in the 637 00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,600 Speaker 2: Atlanta Olympics, How was it traveling and being with those 638 00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:07,880 Speaker 2: guys with that team Let's name that team because that Barkley, 639 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:11,760 Speaker 2: Penny Keen, Reggie, Pippin Stockton, all those guys. 640 00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:18,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, a lot of personality, Shack, Reggie, GP, Charles like 641 00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 4: it was. It was, but the best part with the 642 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:24,680 Speaker 4: practices and we didn't do much. We discrimmaged. So I 643 00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:27,720 Speaker 4: got a chance to go against Scotty every day and 644 00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:32,760 Speaker 4: you know that was that was crazy, Like Scotty was great, 645 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:36,240 Speaker 4: but I got I got confident playing against Scotty and 646 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:38,200 Speaker 4: to me, he was the gold standard. 647 00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:38,880 Speaker 3: At that point. 648 00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:41,480 Speaker 4: But it was crazy, man, Like it was. I was 649 00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:43,960 Speaker 4: there with Shaq when he left to go to LA 650 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,800 Speaker 4: and they had the article in the Sentinel on Orlando. 651 00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,840 Speaker 4: We were in Orlando practicing and they basically had a 652 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:54,120 Speaker 4: survey s should they pay Shack or not. I was 653 00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:55,720 Speaker 4: on the bus for Shack and he was in the 654 00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:57,400 Speaker 4: back and he was like, I can't believe that they 655 00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:00,640 Speaker 4: don't want me. And I was like, man, go out west, 656 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:02,560 Speaker 4: go to La Man, like, you know, we're trying to 657 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,440 Speaker 4: get that big one out the east, you know. But 658 00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 4: I couldn't believe that they would let Shaq go because 659 00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:09,760 Speaker 4: he was so dominant at the time. 660 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:13,080 Speaker 1: And they really voted not to pay him. They didn't 661 00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,320 Speaker 1: pass that was I know they didn't pay him, but 662 00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:16,640 Speaker 1: I'm saying there was a there was. 663 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:20,640 Speaker 4: The paper did a survey, right the Magic paid Shack 664 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:21,160 Speaker 4: or not? 665 00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:22,760 Speaker 1: It was supposed to be the first hundred million dollar 666 00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,000 Speaker 1: deal or something like that or. 667 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:26,920 Speaker 4: And Shaq's big thing was Alonzo got like one hundred 668 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 4: and ten, and he was like, if Alonzo's a BMW, 669 00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:32,400 Speaker 4: I'm a Porsche. And so if he's getting one hundred 670 00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:33,840 Speaker 4: and ten, I should get one hundred and twenty five. 671 00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:37,840 Speaker 4: And so fans there voted, I don't know the survey whatever, 672 00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:42,840 Speaker 4: but it was unanimous no. And and so that was crazy. 673 00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:45,400 Speaker 4: But so just being with those guys, man, it was good. 674 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:47,280 Speaker 4: I remember, you know, we went out a couple of times. 675 00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:48,760 Speaker 4: It was a little wild and you. 676 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:52,400 Speaker 1: Know, pre camera phones and pre camera so y'all was safe. 677 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,640 Speaker 4: Yeah, man, I look, I'm gonna just say that Scottie 678 00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:59,320 Speaker 4: I went out with him one night and they threw 679 00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:02,000 Speaker 4: a party in all Lando. Now I didn't drink at 680 00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 4: this point. I didn't drink till I met my wife. 681 00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:09,840 Speaker 4: But true story. But so I wasn't drinking and so 682 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:12,280 Speaker 4: we went out. We went to a Scotty's Hammer. You 683 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,400 Speaker 4: know he's drinking. We go back to his Uh we 684 00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:18,080 Speaker 4: go back and play cards all night until about six 685 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,280 Speaker 4: seven blu Ray till like six seven in the morning. 686 00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:24,480 Speaker 4: We got practice at ten. I get there. I'm the 687 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:25,720 Speaker 4: youngest guy on the team. 688 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:29,880 Speaker 3: I have nothing. Scotti is like this dude. 689 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:33,440 Speaker 4: Like I was like, I don't know how, but he 690 00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:36,680 Speaker 4: and MJ that's the roll man. So I had a 691 00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:37,560 Speaker 4: lot to learn. 692 00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:39,160 Speaker 3: But no, it was great. 693 00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:40,600 Speaker 4: It was you know, we went a gold medal and 694 00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:42,880 Speaker 4: play with those guys was was was a big thrill. 695 00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:47,000 Speaker 1: What international players caught your eye run the time. 696 00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:51,840 Speaker 4: Oscar Schmidt, he was older at that time, but he 697 00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 4: was giving me the business. You know, he was tall, 698 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:56,600 Speaker 4: he about six y nine and could shoot a quick trick, 699 00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:00,280 Speaker 4: big dude, and so he could play. But you know, man, 700 00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:03,840 Speaker 4: look we dominated everybody. I mean, it was a true story. 701 00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:07,360 Speaker 2: Did you play against Andrew Gays, Yeah, Australia. 702 00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:10,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, I wasn't worried about him. He was older at 703 00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:10,399 Speaker 3: that point. 704 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:15,719 Speaker 4: But in the Olympics, true story. Nobody wanted to be 705 00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:20,960 Speaker 4: the leading scorer because you got drug tests and so yep, 706 00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:23,640 Speaker 4: the only person that got drug tested every game was 707 00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 4: Karl Malone. It was Karl Malone and whoever the leading 708 00:34:27,040 --> 00:34:29,400 Speaker 4: scorer was. We figured it out after a couple of games. 709 00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:31,759 Speaker 4: So at the end of the games, everybody's passing to 710 00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:34,759 Speaker 4: each other because nobody wants to shoot, and it looks 711 00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,719 Speaker 4: like we're being like real unselfish, but nobody wanted to 712 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:41,320 Speaker 4: score because it took, you know, another hour of drug 713 00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:42,120 Speaker 4: testing and all that. 714 00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:45,160 Speaker 3: So but it was crazy. It was crazy. 715 00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:47,759 Speaker 2: I would have dodged that too. How and where did 716 00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:48,960 Speaker 2: you celebrate your goldmelo? 717 00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,200 Speaker 4: You know, that's when to me and I started. That's 718 00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:56,960 Speaker 4: when we kind of met before that. So after the 719 00:34:56,960 --> 00:35:01,200 Speaker 4: gold medal, I got a suite at the Bell Air 720 00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:04,880 Speaker 4: for five weeks and that's what we were for five weeks. 721 00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:07,800 Speaker 4: She was living in l A. And five weeks before 722 00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:09,480 Speaker 4: the season, now I was in la at the bell 723 00:35:09,719 --> 00:35:13,520 Speaker 4: Hotel telling had you open? 724 00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:17,560 Speaker 3: She had? I had her. 725 00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:25,879 Speaker 4: The books called game Yeah. 726 00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:28,399 Speaker 2: Yeah, ninety six the gold medal team or the Dream Team? 727 00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:29,600 Speaker 1: Who win it? 728 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:30,560 Speaker 3: Yeah? 729 00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:32,919 Speaker 4: I mean we had six guys from that original team. 730 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:33,839 Speaker 4: We didn't have MJ. 731 00:35:36,400 --> 00:35:38,759 Speaker 1: You practiced. Did you practice with the Dream Team as 732 00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:40,160 Speaker 1: a son two? 733 00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:40,440 Speaker 3: Yeah? 734 00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:50,600 Speaker 4: We been right, Web me Web Hurley, Penny Mash Rodney Rogers, Montrosse, 735 00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:53,680 Speaker 4: Allan Houston. So we played him the first game in 736 00:35:53,760 --> 00:35:56,880 Speaker 4: ninety two and La Joya Alan hit about ten threes. 737 00:35:57,280 --> 00:35:59,359 Speaker 4: Bobby was getting wherever he wanted. Penny and I were 738 00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:02,720 Speaker 4: dunking everywhere. In transition, where was a beast? 739 00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:03,160 Speaker 1: Like? 740 00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:04,080 Speaker 3: Where was just. 741 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:05,959 Speaker 4: Killing them dudes, Like to the point where Larry Bird 742 00:36:06,120 --> 00:36:09,040 Speaker 4: was like, if that's what's coming in the league, I 743 00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:11,480 Speaker 4: need to get out, damn. But then the next day, 744 00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:13,960 Speaker 4: the next two days they smacked us. We had no 745 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:17,800 Speaker 4: But that to me was a was a great gauge. 746 00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:19,680 Speaker 4: You know that I could play at that level. But 747 00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:22,560 Speaker 4: I like that you know, look, man, we competitors. Man, 748 00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:25,120 Speaker 4: you always feel like you can win, man, Like that. 749 00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:27,600 Speaker 4: That's the thing about sports man. You always feel we 750 00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:30,759 Speaker 4: had shocked. What were they gonna do with Shack? Yeah, 751 00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:34,799 Speaker 4: Penny was like right. People don't realize and appreciate how 752 00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:37,839 Speaker 4: good Penny and Shack alone, and so we you know, 753 00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:39,000 Speaker 4: we Veggie Mitch. 754 00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:41,719 Speaker 3: I mean, you know we would have held on. Yeah, 755 00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:43,200 Speaker 3: definitely held on. 756 00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:47,799 Speaker 1: Your run from ninety four to two thousand was unprecedented, 757 00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:51,359 Speaker 1: five consecutive of all NBA selections twenty one, eight and 758 00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 1: six over that span. Did you feel personally, and you 759 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:56,360 Speaker 1: just said, you're a competitor, you felt like you were 760 00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:57,640 Speaker 1: the best player in the league at that time. 761 00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:00,360 Speaker 4: Every time I stepped on the floor, probably after like 762 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,600 Speaker 4: around ninety six, I felt like I was the best player. 763 00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:07,560 Speaker 4: And I think, I don't think that's unusual. I know, 764 00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:11,319 Speaker 4: every time this guy stepped on the court, you felt like. 765 00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:13,000 Speaker 2: You were the best player, even if I if I 766 00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:15,000 Speaker 2: even if I knew I wasn't you finna see it 767 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:16,319 Speaker 2: all on me here, That's what I'm saying. 768 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:18,759 Speaker 4: Like you have like to me, like I went against MJ. 769 00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:23,319 Speaker 4: Like I'm thinking he got to guard me, and you 770 00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:24,680 Speaker 4: have to have that mentality. 771 00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:25,960 Speaker 3: You have to have it. 772 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,640 Speaker 4: And I think when you're top, when you just enderly, 773 00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:32,360 Speaker 4: you gotta like even me, man, you didn't score twenty 774 00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:35,239 Speaker 4: thirty points a game. But then when you're getting out there, 775 00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:38,120 Speaker 4: you competing, you gotta feel like I'm gonna shut this 776 00:37:38,120 --> 00:37:39,719 Speaker 4: guy down. I'm gonna bus is that like, you have 777 00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:45,480 Speaker 4: to have that mentality. So I did, and when I 778 00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:50,200 Speaker 4: got hurt, and in those four years, I lost that 779 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:55,040 Speaker 4: and y'all never got a chance to really see that 780 00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:59,040 Speaker 4: that player in person. But you go four years of hurt, 781 00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:00,319 Speaker 4: you know, I know we'll get in to it. We 782 00:38:00,360 --> 00:38:04,200 Speaker 4: get four years of injuries, you start to question yourself, 783 00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:10,640 Speaker 4: your abilities, your body's ability to stay healthy. And instead 784 00:38:10,640 --> 00:38:13,240 Speaker 4: of feeling like I'm the best player, I'm just happy 785 00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:16,400 Speaker 4: to be out here, which is a beautiful thing to 786 00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:17,400 Speaker 4: have that appreciation. 787 00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:19,560 Speaker 3: But I lost that edge. 788 00:38:19,760 --> 00:38:23,239 Speaker 4: I lost that like and physically I lost a whole 789 00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:26,800 Speaker 4: lot as a result as well. So four years it 790 00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:30,520 Speaker 4: just you know, you're like, I remember during that time, 791 00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:33,280 Speaker 4: it was back maybe an four. 792 00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:35,359 Speaker 3: I went. 793 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:38,600 Speaker 4: I was at Duke and Coach k it was a 794 00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 4: year I sat out. He was like, who are the 795 00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:43,640 Speaker 4: top five players in the league, and I was like, 796 00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:47,120 Speaker 4: shag kobe A, I'm naming guys. He said, okay, who 797 00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:50,440 Speaker 4: the next five? And I go through, I give me 798 00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:53,120 Speaker 4: the next ten, and so I started naming all these 799 00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:54,799 Speaker 4: guys and he's like, you name twenty guys. You didn't 800 00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:58,840 Speaker 4: name yourself. And so I didn't quite at the time 801 00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:01,960 Speaker 4: like understand. But looking back at it, like I had, 802 00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:06,399 Speaker 4: it was so demoralizing, like going through that that when 803 00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:09,560 Speaker 4: I came back, it was like, let me just like 804 00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:12,239 Speaker 4: get in where I could fit in. And like I said, 805 00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:15,200 Speaker 4: I enjoyed it. I was grateful to be able to play, 806 00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:19,400 Speaker 4: but I lost that mental that mental side. 807 00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:21,520 Speaker 1: Explained because like I said, it happened a while ago, 808 00:39:22,040 --> 00:39:24,839 Speaker 1: like you really explain your injuries and how bad your 809 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,320 Speaker 1: ankle situation really got, because I don't think people understand 810 00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:28,520 Speaker 1: the extent of your injury. 811 00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:32,000 Speaker 4: And he came back still dunking on people barely. I mean, 812 00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:33,759 Speaker 4: it's a long story and I get into it in 813 00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:41,000 Speaker 4: the book, but you know, I I got hurt in 814 00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:46,319 Speaker 4: Detroit and it was a comedy of errors, like it 815 00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:52,719 Speaker 4: was just it was mismanaged, the whole thing, and you know, 816 00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:58,560 Speaker 4: I got heard we didn't diagnose it correctly, I think, 817 00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:02,200 Speaker 4: and it was probably a hairline fracture. Got worse and 818 00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:05,000 Speaker 4: worse until I broke it, and then when I went 819 00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:06,120 Speaker 4: to Orlando. 820 00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:07,840 Speaker 1: Was see it. So that was the season before Orlando. 821 00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:09,560 Speaker 1: Correct that was my last year in Detroit. 822 00:40:10,360 --> 00:40:13,919 Speaker 4: Had surgery, But the surgery shouldn't have been It wasn't 823 00:40:13,960 --> 00:40:16,400 Speaker 4: a big deal, like every team was still coming after me. 824 00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:19,960 Speaker 4: I was healing when I got to Orlando. I was 825 00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:22,719 Speaker 4: supposed to be out till December January, but they brought 826 00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:25,920 Speaker 4: me back in September, and so there was some miscommunication. 827 00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:28,840 Speaker 4: I ended up getting what was called a non union. 828 00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:31,480 Speaker 4: So the best way to explain that is that if 829 00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:35,640 Speaker 4: these two fingers are one bone and they break, doctors 830 00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:38,520 Speaker 4: put the bones back together. They put plates in there 831 00:40:38,560 --> 00:40:41,600 Speaker 4: to hold it to let it heal. And what happened 832 00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:44,560 Speaker 4: with me. They healed, but they healed as two separate bones. 833 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:50,000 Speaker 4: That's called a non union. That becomes a problem. That 834 00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:54,360 Speaker 4: took three years to heal so and three more surgeries. 835 00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:57,759 Speaker 4: And so if we had just followed the protocol that 836 00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:01,839 Speaker 4: was established, maybe that would have been avoid I can't 837 00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:05,360 Speaker 4: say that with absolute accuracy, but so that's kind of 838 00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:11,680 Speaker 4: what happened now the fourth surgery in total, I got septic. 839 00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:14,520 Speaker 4: I thought I almost died. I had a hold of 840 00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:17,840 Speaker 4: my ankle from a staff infection. You've seen the ankles nasty. 841 00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,160 Speaker 4: The doctor said, if the if the skin the free 842 00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:25,439 Speaker 4: flap surgery, they took skin from my arm and sort 843 00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:27,400 Speaker 4: of used it as a patch over my ankle. If 844 00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:30,000 Speaker 4: it didn't take, they would have had to amputate the 845 00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:31,319 Speaker 4: leg and. 846 00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:33,759 Speaker 1: So not the ankle of the leg, yeah, like the 847 00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:34,719 Speaker 1: lower part of the leg. 848 00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:35,359 Speaker 3: And so. 849 00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:40,080 Speaker 4: We didn't have social media, we didn't have the ability 850 00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:42,080 Speaker 4: to tell what was going on. So I think a 851 00:41:42,080 --> 00:41:45,040 Speaker 4: lot of people didn't know how big it was, how 852 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:48,120 Speaker 4: serious it was. And so I go through all of 853 00:41:48,160 --> 00:41:50,280 Speaker 4: that in the book. It was four or five years 854 00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:54,440 Speaker 4: of just craziness. But so that's why you lose that, 855 00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:56,560 Speaker 4: you know what I'm saying. You just like man, I 856 00:41:56,560 --> 00:41:58,279 Speaker 4: almost died, Like at one point I didn't want to 857 00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:01,640 Speaker 4: come back, But you just like man, I'm just I'm 858 00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:02,359 Speaker 4: just happy to be. 859 00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:03,880 Speaker 1: What age are you? Not to cut you off? What 860 00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:04,879 Speaker 1: age are you at that time? 861 00:42:05,400 --> 00:42:09,520 Speaker 4: Two thousand, I'm twenty seven, damn righting your prime? And 862 00:42:09,560 --> 00:42:12,799 Speaker 4: you know what's crazy? Man, like writing this book, like 863 00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:15,000 Speaker 4: going through it all. And I talked to you earlier 864 00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:16,880 Speaker 4: about like you got to stay in the moment, like 865 00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:21,040 Speaker 4: you can't. I didn't deal with with all of the 866 00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:24,480 Speaker 4: baggage mentally, emotionally. I was just trying to fight to 867 00:42:24,560 --> 00:42:28,839 Speaker 4: keep playing, getting into the hall of fame in that 868 00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:34,480 Speaker 4: moment you reflect, you reflect writing your story. I dealt 869 00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:37,680 Speaker 4: with it then, and so like a lot of that, 870 00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:38,680 Speaker 4: like you know what I'm saying, A lot of that 871 00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:39,960 Speaker 4: that's heavy. 872 00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:40,840 Speaker 3: It was dark. 873 00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:44,320 Speaker 4: Even the hall of fame. The hall of fame should 874 00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:47,319 Speaker 4: be like the you know, the icing on the cake. 875 00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:50,719 Speaker 4: The ultimately, regardless of what happened or didn't happen, it 876 00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:51,560 Speaker 4: validates you. 877 00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:53,560 Speaker 3: And I was mad. 878 00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:57,080 Speaker 4: I was bitter because I'm thinking, y'all only got six years. 879 00:42:57,520 --> 00:42:59,200 Speaker 4: Y'all didn't get I didn't get a chance to see 880 00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:02,919 Speaker 4: this all the way through, right, And so I didn't 881 00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:07,160 Speaker 4: deal with that until after my career because you I'm fighting, man, 882 00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:08,680 Speaker 4: I'm just trying to stay on the court. 883 00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:09,319 Speaker 3: You can't. 884 00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:12,160 Speaker 4: You're not gonna really look back at the good and 885 00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:13,560 Speaker 4: the bad while you're in the midst of. 886 00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:15,120 Speaker 1: I say this because you are a big brother, like 887 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:17,879 Speaker 1: you're the biggest what if ever, like we all look 888 00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:21,759 Speaker 1: like you were the next prototype. They were fitting you 889 00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,480 Speaker 1: to be the next MJ because that's how talented you were, 890 00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:26,040 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And it's just like to 891 00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:28,799 Speaker 1: hear you kind of explain your story on what you 892 00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:32,080 Speaker 1: went through, like you were robbed, We were robbed, Like 893 00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:35,360 Speaker 1: you were going where no one has really been for 894 00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:37,799 Speaker 1: your size, your position and what you brought to the game. 895 00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:40,279 Speaker 1: So I always wanted to know, like, obviously we're cool 896 00:43:40,320 --> 00:43:41,719 Speaker 1: and I've known you for years and my big brother, 897 00:43:41,760 --> 00:43:43,920 Speaker 1: but we've never got that in depth, right, Like I 898 00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:46,640 Speaker 1: couldn't imagine, like you said, you finally unloaded that baggage 899 00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:49,960 Speaker 1: twenty plus years later. Yeah, because like you were on 900 00:43:50,040 --> 00:43:51,960 Speaker 1: pace to be want to be if not, you know what, 901 00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:53,919 Speaker 1: who knows one of the greatest players of all time 902 00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:57,120 Speaker 1: and to have injury derail that, Like it's just I 903 00:43:57,200 --> 00:43:59,279 Speaker 1: always That's why I'm definitely gonna read this, but just 904 00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:02,160 Speaker 1: to as fuck the basketball site. The mental side had 905 00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:04,000 Speaker 1: to be not only on the court, but off the 906 00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:05,959 Speaker 1: court in your personal life and all it just waited 907 00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:06,319 Speaker 1: on you. 908 00:44:06,520 --> 00:44:11,520 Speaker 4: It did, it did, and you know, everybody's got something 909 00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:15,560 Speaker 4: and everybody goes through something. And sometimes I don't want 910 00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:17,759 Speaker 4: to equate this because there's people who have far more 911 00:44:17,800 --> 00:44:21,680 Speaker 4: traumatic things in their life. But sometimes we suppressed that. 912 00:44:22,040 --> 00:44:27,279 Speaker 4: Sometimes you suppress it to survive, but ultimately you get 913 00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:29,840 Speaker 4: through it by acknowledging it and dealing with it. And 914 00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:34,960 Speaker 4: so I never unpacked it, and I didn't realize. I 915 00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:38,080 Speaker 4: didn't realize how much of it impacted me. Man Like 916 00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:39,919 Speaker 4: I didn't think that, like because I used to say 917 00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:44,520 Speaker 4: to myself, like coming back from the injury, playing nine 918 00:44:44,520 --> 00:44:47,680 Speaker 4: more years, that's far greater than anything I did privor 919 00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:51,520 Speaker 4: because I know what I went through, but I don't 920 00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:58,600 Speaker 4: think I really unpacked like how how hard that was 921 00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:01,120 Speaker 4: for me and how difficult that was to go through that, 922 00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:05,960 Speaker 4: and you know, genetics, hard work, whatever, But like I 923 00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:08,480 Speaker 4: had a chance, you know, you have a chance to 924 00:45:08,560 --> 00:45:11,040 Speaker 4: leave a legacy, and I and I think I did. 925 00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:13,759 Speaker 4: I mean, I had a great career, but I had 926 00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:17,680 Speaker 4: a chance to be really really special. And it's interesting, man, 927 00:45:17,719 --> 00:45:22,160 Speaker 4: Like I'm being honest here, Like when the NBA seventy 928 00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:27,160 Speaker 4: five came out, yes, thank you, tam mag you know 929 00:45:27,239 --> 00:45:30,160 Speaker 4: the events. I mean, there was a bunch of Dwight 930 00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:34,319 Speaker 4: come on to white man like Carrie, No, No. So 931 00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:36,520 Speaker 4: I kind of like and maybe this is a way 932 00:45:36,560 --> 00:45:38,680 Speaker 4: to like protect myself. But I was like, you know what, 933 00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:39,120 Speaker 4: I get it. 934 00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:40,399 Speaker 3: I got hurt. 935 00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:42,719 Speaker 4: You know, I didn't have I didn't see it. All 936 00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:45,880 Speaker 4: the way through the Hall of Fame is college and NBA. 937 00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:48,920 Speaker 4: So my college helped get me in. So my body 938 00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:51,719 Speaker 4: of work wasn't enough. So I kind of justified it. 939 00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:54,879 Speaker 4: But just tell me, I'm being honest. So I'm at 940 00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:58,319 Speaker 4: the All Star Game in Cleveland and I'm working that night, 941 00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:04,239 Speaker 4: I'm working the pregame, that the post game and all 942 00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:08,680 Speaker 4: that goes on, and it hit me then and that 943 00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:11,880 Speaker 4: was I got. I was emotional, and it was I 944 00:46:11,920 --> 00:46:14,000 Speaker 4: was surprised. I was emotional. You know, you're trying to 945 00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:17,399 Speaker 4: protect You're not trying to show it, but you're feeling like, like, fuck, 946 00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:18,000 Speaker 4: I should. 947 00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:18,279 Speaker 3: Be out there. 948 00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:21,160 Speaker 4: And I remember twenty five years ago, I was in 949 00:46:21,200 --> 00:46:23,440 Speaker 4: that building for the fiftieth and it was All Star 950 00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:26,040 Speaker 4: weekend and I said, you know what, if they ever 951 00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:28,520 Speaker 4: do this again, I'm gonna be on the next team. 952 00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:33,040 Speaker 4: And when I was there, and no disrespect to these 953 00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:35,000 Speaker 4: guys because they deserving to be on it. 954 00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:37,600 Speaker 3: I'm fans of this their brothers of mine. I love 955 00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:38,200 Speaker 3: them to death. 956 00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:40,560 Speaker 4: But when I saw people like you know, guys from 957 00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:44,040 Speaker 4: my era like Ray and Reggie, and I used to 958 00:46:44,080 --> 00:46:45,640 Speaker 4: be like, man, I used to get him the business, 959 00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:47,160 Speaker 4: like that's what I was thinking. 960 00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:49,360 Speaker 3: And so I had, you know, and and they're deserving it. 961 00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:51,640 Speaker 4: So I'm not trying to so that it like it 962 00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:54,080 Speaker 4: hit me and so like this still baggage, Like it's 963 00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:56,880 Speaker 4: still you know what I'm saying, and so, but it 964 00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:58,200 Speaker 4: kind of triggered me a little bit. 965 00:46:58,239 --> 00:46:59,120 Speaker 3: But you know what I mean. 966 00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:02,359 Speaker 2: Look, I mean, you're better than Danny Shad's bro. I'm 967 00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:07,440 Speaker 2: sorry man, when you said Shades, you're better than Dolph Shades. 968 00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:13,560 Speaker 2: I want to I was nicer than Dolph Shades. Look, 969 00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:14,960 Speaker 2: you got given respect for his time. 970 00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:16,600 Speaker 4: But look, I want to say something about y'all man, 971 00:47:16,640 --> 00:47:18,160 Speaker 4: because I know y'all interviewing me, but. 972 00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:20,040 Speaker 3: I played. 973 00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:22,120 Speaker 4: First of all, I remember, Matt, I watched you play 974 00:47:22,200 --> 00:47:25,440 Speaker 4: during the lockout and U c l A and I 975 00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:29,040 Speaker 4: remember hearing you a football player. And then fast forward, 976 00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:32,760 Speaker 4: I think it was old seven y'all had y'all running 977 00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:36,319 Speaker 4: at Golden State, and I'm like, who is this light 978 00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:41,520 Speaker 4: skinned crazy motherfucker ran the court and chaid Devin somebody, 979 00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:45,880 Speaker 4: and I was like, Yo, this dude is crazy, Like 980 00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:48,319 Speaker 4: you know what I'm saying. But then I played with 981 00:47:48,400 --> 00:47:51,880 Speaker 4: you and and people get to see the different sides 982 00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:55,520 Speaker 4: of you guys now. But the thing that that showed 983 00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:59,319 Speaker 4: me a lot about you was when our teammate Barbosa 984 00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:04,960 Speaker 4: and his mother passed and your mom had unfortunately from 985 00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:06,839 Speaker 4: can I'm not trying to bring it up, but like, 986 00:48:07,840 --> 00:48:10,400 Speaker 4: and I know that was hard for you, but to 987 00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:14,879 Speaker 4: see you there for him and he's crying, he's going 988 00:48:14,920 --> 00:48:17,000 Speaker 4: through it, and like I didn't know how to be 989 00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:20,880 Speaker 4: supportive because I hadn't really gone through it. But I 990 00:48:20,920 --> 00:48:23,279 Speaker 4: was like, Yo, this dude like mad, like all that 991 00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:26,040 Speaker 4: other stuff and all the stuff that you've gone through. 992 00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:28,560 Speaker 4: I played with you with the Clippers. You come into 993 00:48:28,560 --> 00:48:31,960 Speaker 4: the aid of a teammate, always all your stuff, all 994 00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:38,040 Speaker 4: your smoke. It was defending a teammate. And then this 995 00:48:38,160 --> 00:48:41,880 Speaker 4: dude right here, the same thing in the palace. You 996 00:48:41,960 --> 00:48:45,000 Speaker 4: come into the to the aid of coming to the 997 00:48:45,000 --> 00:48:48,000 Speaker 4: aid of a teammate. Everybody I didn't play with you stacked, 998 00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:51,520 Speaker 4: but everybody that's played with you that I know thanks 999 00:48:51,520 --> 00:48:53,879 Speaker 4: to the world of you, and so I was like, 1000 00:48:53,880 --> 00:48:57,000 Speaker 4: like as teammates and guys like I could be in 1001 00:48:57,040 --> 00:48:59,839 Speaker 4: the trenches with these two. Right here, I was with Mad. 1002 00:49:00,800 --> 00:49:02,880 Speaker 4: I didn't you know I played one. We was a 1003 00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:05,279 Speaker 4: little messed up in Phoenix, but in l A, I 1004 00:49:05,320 --> 00:49:05,759 Speaker 4: didn't play. 1005 00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:08,319 Speaker 1: I watched you imagined that real quick. In the Phoenix shit, 1006 00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:11,600 Speaker 1: they fired Terry Porter at All Star break, that was 1007 00:49:11,600 --> 00:49:13,960 Speaker 1: our coach. First of all, I'm going, I'm so, I'm 1008 00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:16,560 Speaker 1: going to come out that we believe season Nelly Mad 1009 00:49:16,600 --> 00:49:18,319 Speaker 1: I don't sign a three year deal, so he gets 1010 00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:20,440 Speaker 1: rid of me. I'm going in there and geez there 1011 00:49:20,440 --> 00:49:23,040 Speaker 1: and I'm telling I tell him, remember yo, Honor, You're 1012 00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:24,279 Speaker 1: my favorite play. I don't know if I made him 1013 00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:25,520 Speaker 1: feel old at the time, but I'm. 1014 00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:28,600 Speaker 4: Going to tell him that during the game Grant Hill, 1015 00:49:29,400 --> 00:49:31,000 Speaker 4: first of all, first of all, it was crazy and 1016 00:49:31,080 --> 00:49:32,759 Speaker 4: they fired him, and and yeah, we had too much 1017 00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:34,480 Speaker 4: town man. That was that we had so much. We 1018 00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:39,200 Speaker 4: should have been remember stat Cockta Cock, superhero Ja. 1019 00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:40,000 Speaker 3: We had. 1020 00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:40,680 Speaker 1: We had so much. 1021 00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:46,080 Speaker 4: But the crazy thing was with this dude right here. 1022 00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:50,239 Speaker 4: I don't know if you remember this. We played We 1023 00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:55,560 Speaker 4: played in Orlando, and I think after the whole thing 1024 00:49:55,600 --> 00:49:58,239 Speaker 4: in the past. That was O four oh five, and 1025 00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:00,680 Speaker 4: then six I got I had a it's Hernias. I 1026 00:50:00,680 --> 00:50:03,120 Speaker 4: don't know if we played against each other until six 1027 00:50:03,239 --> 00:50:07,560 Speaker 4: o seven and we're in Orlando and I'm guarding there 1028 00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:12,120 Speaker 4: and we're right on the sidelines and somebody yelled something 1029 00:50:12,160 --> 00:50:14,200 Speaker 4: slick out to you about you know too. 1030 00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:18,920 Speaker 3: I turned around and cursed him out. Yeah you remember that. 1031 00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:21,040 Speaker 3: I remember that I cursed him out. And I didn't 1032 00:50:21,080 --> 00:50:21,480 Speaker 3: know how. 1033 00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:25,160 Speaker 4: We didn't know each other, but because I'm I gotta 1034 00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:27,360 Speaker 4: guard this dude, and I don't need you know what 1035 00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:30,520 Speaker 4: I'm saying, But like, but I I and so and 1036 00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:34,160 Speaker 4: then we played the next year, I think at Golden 1037 00:50:34,239 --> 00:50:36,160 Speaker 4: State was in Phoenix, and. 1038 00:50:37,840 --> 00:50:40,920 Speaker 3: Man, y'all ran up and down the court like that year. 1039 00:50:41,600 --> 00:50:43,360 Speaker 1: I was like, I mean, I was fun. 1040 00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:45,560 Speaker 4: It was fun. But like I always said, he was 1041 00:50:46,239 --> 00:50:48,160 Speaker 4: top three four guys, I had to go. I could 1042 00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:51,840 Speaker 4: never figured him out. I couldn't figure Jack out. But 1043 00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:54,680 Speaker 4: I couldn't. I couldn't had a different game. You could 1044 00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:57,480 Speaker 4: shoot it, you played with it. You couldn't speed you up. 1045 00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:00,680 Speaker 4: You shot it, you know, behind your head it And 1046 00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:03,839 Speaker 4: I was I could not I could guard I had 1047 00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:06,799 Speaker 4: a you know, you couldn't guard guys, but you had 1048 00:51:06,840 --> 00:51:08,960 Speaker 4: a playbook for God, Like, Okay, I'm gonna you know, Lebron, 1049 00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:11,080 Speaker 4: I'm gonna try to do this, or Mellow, I'm gonna 1050 00:51:11,120 --> 00:51:11,239 Speaker 4: do that. 1051 00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:11,640 Speaker 1: Yeah. 1052 00:51:11,800 --> 00:51:14,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, I couldn't do anything with Kobe like I mean, 1053 00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:15,800 Speaker 3: I couldn't. 1054 00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:17,840 Speaker 4: You know. I'm out there with one leg and they 1055 00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:19,920 Speaker 4: gotta be out here thirty eight trying to guard Kobe. 1056 00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:23,200 Speaker 4: I'm looking at Matt like you was getting after it though. 1057 00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:27,560 Speaker 4: I mean, but but but I couldn't. It was I 1058 00:51:27,600 --> 00:51:30,919 Speaker 4: couldn't figure you out. Man. I pierced like I could. 1059 00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:32,759 Speaker 4: I had a game plan for and I actually did 1060 00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:35,960 Speaker 4: well against these guys. But people don't appreciate how good 1061 00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:39,600 Speaker 4: you were. I think those that know get a bucket. No, no, 1062 00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:41,640 Speaker 4: I've always told you that. 1063 00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:44,360 Speaker 1: I want to backtrack a little bit. So you go 1064 00:51:44,440 --> 00:51:48,840 Speaker 1: to Orlando. This is you T mac and a possibility 1065 00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:51,719 Speaker 1: of getting Tim Duncan at the time walk us through this. 1066 00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:53,680 Speaker 1: So you're going through injury and then and trying to 1067 00:51:53,719 --> 00:51:55,719 Speaker 1: get back on the court. You're teaming up with a 1068 00:51:55,760 --> 00:51:59,120 Speaker 1: young T mac uh and then there's whispers or rumors 1069 00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:02,200 Speaker 1: that you could possibly to get Tim So what. 1070 00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:04,240 Speaker 4: Happened was Tim and I went We had the same agent, 1071 00:52:04,360 --> 00:52:06,719 Speaker 4: so we went down together, and Tim, I think was 1072 00:52:06,800 --> 00:52:09,240 Speaker 4: more in at the time than I was. I was still, 1073 00:52:10,080 --> 00:52:11,919 Speaker 4: you know, I had New York, I had a couple 1074 00:52:11,960 --> 00:52:14,600 Speaker 4: of other teams I was looking at, but Tim wanted 1075 00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:16,640 Speaker 4: to be in Orlando if he were to leave. And 1076 00:52:16,760 --> 00:52:18,640 Speaker 4: so we were down there and they were hosting us, 1077 00:52:18,760 --> 00:52:22,480 Speaker 4: and they had just had a pretty good season Doc 1078 00:52:22,600 --> 00:52:25,200 Speaker 4: Rivers first year coaching. They were I think they were 1079 00:52:25,360 --> 00:52:29,120 Speaker 4: five hundred and so while we were there, like everything 1080 00:52:29,200 --> 00:52:31,040 Speaker 4: was going well, like it just felt like, Yo, this 1081 00:52:31,160 --> 00:52:33,640 Speaker 4: this could happen. And I know it's hard for people 1082 00:52:33,719 --> 00:52:36,200 Speaker 4: now to think of Tim Duncan anywhere else. He was 1083 00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:38,239 Speaker 4: after his thirty I think he won a championship in 1084 00:52:38,280 --> 00:52:41,759 Speaker 4: San Antonio. And I'm telling you, man, I remember it 1085 00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:46,160 Speaker 4: like it was yesterday. We're at dinner and Tim's girlfriend 1086 00:52:46,920 --> 00:52:51,920 Speaker 4: asked Doc a question, can wives and girlfriends travel on 1087 00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:55,920 Speaker 4: the team playing? And you got understand it back then 1088 00:52:56,000 --> 00:52:59,160 Speaker 4: that didn't happen. It happens now, but back then it 1089 00:52:59,200 --> 00:53:01,879 Speaker 4: didn't happen. So Doc said, no, it's a business trip 1090 00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:04,240 Speaker 4: that doesn't happen. I don't allow that now. I didn't 1091 00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:07,680 Speaker 4: know that San Antonio had started doing that. 1092 00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:10,040 Speaker 3: Yes, you know, and so that's. 1093 00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:12,080 Speaker 4: Why because I'm thinking that's a bold question, Like I'm like, 1094 00:53:12,120 --> 00:53:14,439 Speaker 4: why is she asking that question? So but I didn't 1095 00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:17,480 Speaker 4: pay much attention to it. So we got back to 1096 00:53:17,560 --> 00:53:20,800 Speaker 4: the hotel that night, and it was funny because to 1097 00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:23,080 Speaker 4: me and I, we we're in the hotel almost like 1098 00:53:23,120 --> 00:53:24,320 Speaker 4: the hotel room was bugged. 1099 00:53:24,640 --> 00:53:26,960 Speaker 3: So we're whispering to each other, like you know, and 1100 00:53:27,080 --> 00:53:29,719 Speaker 3: she's like, he ain't coming. I said, what do you mean. 1101 00:53:29,800 --> 00:53:34,440 Speaker 4: She's like when she asked that question, her whole body 1102 00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:38,000 Speaker 4: language changed with that response, and I. 1103 00:53:38,120 --> 00:53:39,600 Speaker 3: Was like, nah, nah, no whatever. 1104 00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:42,560 Speaker 4: So anyway, we get back, we get back to Detroit's 1105 00:53:42,600 --> 00:53:45,120 Speaker 4: funny story. So it was too much I'm gonna crutch us. 1106 00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:47,279 Speaker 4: So I ended up saying, you know what, have the 1107 00:53:47,360 --> 00:53:51,480 Speaker 4: teams come visit me in Detroit? So New York comes 1108 00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:54,120 Speaker 4: in and they bring they bring Starr Jones, they bring 1109 00:53:54,280 --> 00:53:57,040 Speaker 4: like all these actors and actresses in. They got this 1110 00:53:57,239 --> 00:54:00,440 Speaker 4: tape they play, they got like Seinfeld brooksh she is 1111 00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:03,719 Speaker 4: and all these people like you know, you think you 1112 00:54:03,760 --> 00:54:05,560 Speaker 4: look at Orlando's like wait see, wait till you come 1113 00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:07,440 Speaker 4: to New York, like, and I always wanted to play 1114 00:54:07,480 --> 00:54:11,279 Speaker 4: in New York. So Leon, you know, the actor Leon talked, 1115 00:54:12,160 --> 00:54:15,040 Speaker 4: So I asked him about this. So he's on the video. 1116 00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:18,600 Speaker 4: He's like, gee, you think the women are nice in Detroit, 1117 00:54:18,680 --> 00:54:19,919 Speaker 4: wait till you come to New York. 1118 00:54:20,600 --> 00:54:22,719 Speaker 3: And so to me it was like, oh hell now. 1119 00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:28,120 Speaker 3: And so to this day we talked. 1120 00:54:28,200 --> 00:54:29,880 Speaker 4: She's like, man, you think that New York would have 1121 00:54:29,920 --> 00:54:33,000 Speaker 4: watched the tape and so anyway, you know, New York 1122 00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:36,440 Speaker 4: didn't happen. But and by then I was probably going 1123 00:54:36,480 --> 00:54:39,560 Speaker 4: to Orlando. But so then t Mac like the but 1124 00:54:39,640 --> 00:54:41,920 Speaker 4: there was a chance. As Tim was trying to figure 1125 00:54:41,960 --> 00:54:45,080 Speaker 4: it out, Tam Mac you know, he's from down there. 1126 00:54:45,239 --> 00:54:47,640 Speaker 4: So it just it was coming together that like all 1127 00:54:47,719 --> 00:54:50,279 Speaker 4: three of us might play together. And I didn't know 1128 00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:53,000 Speaker 4: how good t Mac was at that time, and so 1129 00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:55,000 Speaker 4: I didn't know. I didn't know until he got to Orlando. 1130 00:54:55,000 --> 00:54:56,640 Speaker 4: I was like, oh my god, this guy right here 1131 00:54:58,080 --> 00:55:02,160 Speaker 4: is incredible. So not being able to be healthy to 1132 00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:05,239 Speaker 4: play with Mac, it's something that we talk, he and 1133 00:55:05,320 --> 00:55:07,920 Speaker 4: I talk about all the time, just like wishing that 1134 00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:08,440 Speaker 4: we could. 1135 00:55:08,280 --> 00:55:10,399 Speaker 3: Have could have been could have done a t Mac 1136 00:55:10,480 --> 00:55:10,719 Speaker 3: and g. 1137 00:55:12,600 --> 00:55:13,720 Speaker 1: Despite all the injuries. 1138 00:55:15,680 --> 00:55:17,920 Speaker 2: You know how me and Matt feel about you, right, 1139 00:55:18,920 --> 00:55:21,040 Speaker 2: A lot of people, a lot of people feel the 1140 00:55:21,160 --> 00:55:23,800 Speaker 2: same way about you. And even though the injuries, you 1141 00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:27,359 Speaker 2: still had a Kobs career in our minds. The way 1142 00:55:27,400 --> 00:55:31,120 Speaker 2: we look at you, how when you go back and 1143 00:55:31,200 --> 00:55:32,840 Speaker 2: look when you go back and look at all that, 1144 00:55:33,040 --> 00:55:33,720 Speaker 2: what's your thoughts? 1145 00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:35,560 Speaker 1: Like? How grateful are you? 1146 00:55:36,600 --> 00:55:38,800 Speaker 2: You know, to make it through all that, the injury 1147 00:55:38,840 --> 00:55:40,279 Speaker 2: and still be able to come back and finish on 1148 00:55:40,320 --> 00:55:40,799 Speaker 2: a good note. 1149 00:55:41,680 --> 00:55:43,879 Speaker 3: Yeah, that was special. I mean it was a good thing. 1150 00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:44,480 Speaker 1: You know. 1151 00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:49,239 Speaker 4: On one hand, I didn't appreciate how good I was, 1152 00:55:49,920 --> 00:55:51,920 Speaker 4: and that sounds arrogant, but I didn't appreciate how good 1153 00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:55,880 Speaker 4: I was in Detroit because we went winning. And so 1154 00:55:57,360 --> 00:55:59,560 Speaker 4: the one thing I learned from this process of writing 1155 00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:02,520 Speaker 4: a book is when we have success, we got to 1156 00:56:02,560 --> 00:56:07,960 Speaker 4: celebrate that. There's a story. Two thousand All Star Games. 1157 00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:10,680 Speaker 4: So ninety nine we had a lockout, so we didn't 1158 00:56:10,680 --> 00:56:14,680 Speaker 4: have an All Star Game. Two thousand San Francisco, we're there, 1159 00:56:14,880 --> 00:56:17,120 Speaker 4: we play or I guess in Oakland the old old 1160 00:56:17,160 --> 00:56:22,920 Speaker 4: co arenas such as such a stupid story. So I'm thinking, Okay, 1161 00:56:23,880 --> 00:56:26,600 Speaker 4: Jordan's gone because in an All Star Game with Joe. 1162 00:56:26,680 --> 00:56:28,319 Speaker 3: We had to defer to him, you know what I'm saying. 1163 00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:29,880 Speaker 3: I mean just no one said it, but you just 1164 00:56:29,920 --> 00:56:31,640 Speaker 3: felt like unspoken, we. 1165 00:56:31,840 --> 00:56:33,600 Speaker 4: Got to get the ball, especially in ninety eight when 1166 00:56:33,680 --> 00:56:36,560 Speaker 4: Kobe was there, like they're going they had to like 1167 00:56:37,560 --> 00:56:41,800 Speaker 4: which I got issues with the whole the documentary. It 1168 00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:43,800 Speaker 4: was a great documentary, but it made it seem like 1169 00:56:45,080 --> 00:56:47,640 Speaker 4: I was scared, like we were on the bench, and 1170 00:56:47,719 --> 00:56:51,359 Speaker 4: what happened was in that game. Penny was hurt that year. 1171 00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:54,240 Speaker 4: He sat out the whole year, came back for two games, 1172 00:56:54,280 --> 00:56:56,320 Speaker 4: played in an All Star Game. He had GP Garden. 1173 00:56:57,200 --> 00:57:01,359 Speaker 4: It was it was Kobe and MJ. And then people 1174 00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:04,239 Speaker 4: forget Garnet was a three early in his career. So 1175 00:57:04,400 --> 00:57:08,279 Speaker 4: Garnett and I are matched up. So Penny didn't want 1176 00:57:08,280 --> 00:57:10,400 Speaker 4: to handle the ball because he's not healthy and he's 1177 00:57:10,440 --> 00:57:12,480 Speaker 4: got to go against GP. So I'm bringing the ball out. 1178 00:57:12,480 --> 00:57:15,520 Speaker 4: I mean, I was point forward, so I'm always back 1179 00:57:15,600 --> 00:57:20,240 Speaker 4: in transition. We're farting around. It's three on one. GP 1180 00:57:20,440 --> 00:57:23,680 Speaker 4: got Kobe and Garnet. He throwing lives. I'm back, so 1181 00:57:23,800 --> 00:57:26,440 Speaker 4: I'm not trying to be in the frame on these alleys. 1182 00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:28,080 Speaker 3: So and the time out. I'm like, yo, y'all got 1183 00:57:28,160 --> 00:57:30,520 Speaker 3: to get back because I'm out here on the island. Man, 1184 00:57:30,560 --> 00:57:31,920 Speaker 3: what he's doing these young boys, you know. 1185 00:57:32,000 --> 00:57:34,120 Speaker 4: And so the way it looked, it looked like I 1186 00:57:34,280 --> 00:57:36,880 Speaker 4: was like scared of and I had great respect for Kobe, 1187 00:57:36,960 --> 00:57:40,400 Speaker 4: but I wasn't scared of him. Then, you know, so 1188 00:57:40,520 --> 00:57:43,840 Speaker 4: two thousand All Star, so you know, the trainers always 1189 00:57:43,880 --> 00:57:47,040 Speaker 4: would carry your I had contacts then, so my trainer, 1190 00:57:47,120 --> 00:57:49,680 Speaker 4: Mike Abden, I are in Detroit, would always keep contacts 1191 00:57:49,840 --> 00:57:51,440 Speaker 4: so if I ran out, I would just go get 1192 00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:54,480 Speaker 4: something from him. So I only had one pair of contacts. 1193 00:57:54,720 --> 00:57:57,040 Speaker 4: In the day of the game, my one contact ripped 1194 00:57:57,960 --> 00:58:01,200 Speaker 4: and so I'm like, do I play with no contacts? 1195 00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:04,480 Speaker 3: I put one in and now I'm all screwed up. 1196 00:58:04,520 --> 00:58:07,240 Speaker 3: During the game, I threw a live to Vince. I 1197 00:58:07,360 --> 00:58:07,760 Speaker 3: promised you. 1198 00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:10,200 Speaker 4: I threw it over the backboard even like and so 1199 00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:13,560 Speaker 4: you know, and I remember something I told Chip England, 1200 00:58:13,800 --> 00:58:16,120 Speaker 4: who's you know, you know Chip from San Antoni. I 1201 00:58:16,240 --> 00:58:19,160 Speaker 4: told Chip, I said, oh man, it's always next year, 1202 00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:21,560 Speaker 4: like I'll wear you know next year. 1203 00:58:21,720 --> 00:58:23,120 Speaker 3: And so next year didn't happen. 1204 00:58:23,680 --> 00:58:27,800 Speaker 4: And so I say all that to say that you 1205 00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:31,760 Speaker 4: got to celebrate when we have success and life's not guaranteed, 1206 00:58:31,880 --> 00:58:34,520 Speaker 4: and we got to celebrate each other and celebrate yourself. 1207 00:58:35,120 --> 00:58:38,240 Speaker 4: I didn't do that when I was in Detroit because 1208 00:58:38,400 --> 00:58:41,760 Speaker 4: to me, I was chasing Isaiah and until we won, 1209 00:58:42,360 --> 00:58:47,040 Speaker 4: I didn't give myself permission to celebrate. And so being 1210 00:58:47,080 --> 00:58:49,360 Speaker 4: able to go back now and like you know what, 1211 00:58:49,560 --> 00:58:52,440 Speaker 4: I actually was all right because I don't. Here's the thing, 1212 00:58:52,520 --> 00:58:56,440 Speaker 4: you guys, remember that I remember trying to guard Kobe 1213 00:58:56,640 --> 00:58:59,320 Speaker 4: at thirty eight with a bad wheel. I remember like 1214 00:58:59,520 --> 00:59:01,320 Speaker 4: standing in the corner waiting for the ball to come 1215 00:59:01,360 --> 00:59:03,680 Speaker 4: to me. Like that's what I remember. I don't remember. 1216 00:59:03,680 --> 00:59:06,480 Speaker 4: I didn't remember those those those those years. And so 1217 00:59:07,080 --> 00:59:11,400 Speaker 4: the exercise of not just the dark, but also the light, 1218 00:59:11,600 --> 00:59:14,920 Speaker 4: the good, the positive, and and just appreciating that. 1219 00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:17,080 Speaker 2: As you said, a lot of people remember them full 1220 00:59:17,160 --> 00:59:18,200 Speaker 2: speed crossovers. 1221 00:59:18,760 --> 00:59:22,320 Speaker 1: Trust me, pull Steve coming at you. 1222 00:59:22,320 --> 00:59:23,040 Speaker 3: With the crossover. 1223 00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:25,840 Speaker 1: I remember when he got pippt and banged on it. 1224 00:59:27,160 --> 00:59:29,200 Speaker 3: Pippin was too light, man, he was like two fifteen. 1225 00:59:29,320 --> 00:59:31,200 Speaker 3: I could just you came right at it. 1226 00:59:31,440 --> 00:59:38,240 Speaker 1: Got For all you young people, google him, no, google him. 1227 00:59:40,440 --> 00:59:43,000 Speaker 1: What was the twenty ten playoff experience? Like with Steve Nash. 1228 00:59:45,040 --> 00:59:46,600 Speaker 1: That was the Western Finals round. 1229 00:59:46,800 --> 00:59:50,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, you played you? Was in you in Orlando? 1230 00:59:50,760 --> 00:59:52,960 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, twenty we went to Orlando. 1231 00:59:53,960 --> 00:59:55,600 Speaker 4: We had a good year. You know, it was weird 1232 00:59:55,640 --> 00:59:59,320 Speaker 4: because we had as great as Shack was and his 1233 00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:04,400 Speaker 4: greatest Steve, where they didn't really mix. And so when 1234 01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:08,520 Speaker 4: Shaq left and Amari was healthy, and then Alvin Gentry 1235 01:00:08,600 --> 01:00:10,800 Speaker 4: was coaching us, we had a really good season. We 1236 01:00:10,920 --> 01:00:15,480 Speaker 4: were third seed and we beat Portland, we beat San Antonio, 1237 01:00:16,280 --> 01:00:17,280 Speaker 4: and then we faced that LA. 1238 01:00:17,600 --> 01:00:20,000 Speaker 3: They got us the first two games in LA. We 1239 01:00:20,040 --> 01:00:21,560 Speaker 3: beat him the first the next two. 1240 01:00:21,480 --> 01:00:25,760 Speaker 4: Games and in game five, man like we're right there 1241 01:00:25,800 --> 01:00:27,920 Speaker 4: on the ropes, ja Rich banks in the three to 1242 01:00:28,080 --> 01:00:32,200 Speaker 4: tie it. In overtime, Kobe gets a ball, a three 1243 01:00:32,280 --> 01:00:36,080 Speaker 4: pointer the one time he missed, the one time he missed, 1244 01:00:36,120 --> 01:00:39,200 Speaker 4: the shadow of me like in that situation, he air 1245 01:00:39,280 --> 01:00:41,480 Speaker 4: balled it. I'm right in his like, I'm right there 1246 01:00:41,520 --> 01:00:44,040 Speaker 4: in his face. He airballs it, but Metal World Peace 1247 01:00:44,080 --> 01:00:46,560 Speaker 4: gets the rebound. Jay Rich didn't box him out. He 1248 01:00:47,040 --> 01:00:51,640 Speaker 4: tip in and they win game five, and I don't 1249 01:00:51,680 --> 01:00:56,120 Speaker 4: know if emotionally we recovered. And then Kobe in game six, 1250 01:00:57,200 --> 01:01:02,520 Speaker 4: I mean he started cool, dude, and so here's the thing, man, 1251 01:01:02,600 --> 01:01:04,000 Speaker 4: so he you know he's doing he's doing this, and 1252 01:01:04,120 --> 01:01:07,120 Speaker 4: he always look with Kobe like like with Lebron. Like 1253 01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:09,400 Speaker 4: when I got it Lebron back then, my attitude was, 1254 01:01:09,680 --> 01:01:12,160 Speaker 4: I'm not gonna crash the offensive class and we shoot. 1255 01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:14,120 Speaker 4: I'm gonna find him. I'm not gonna let him get 1256 01:01:14,120 --> 01:01:16,840 Speaker 4: out in the open door full head of steam. So 1257 01:01:17,520 --> 01:01:19,320 Speaker 4: I'm not gonna let him turn the corner and go 1258 01:01:19,480 --> 01:01:21,800 Speaker 4: right and get to the rim. I'm gonna make him 1259 01:01:22,200 --> 01:01:26,520 Speaker 4: make contested jump shots. And I'm not gonna foul if 1260 01:01:26,560 --> 01:01:29,320 Speaker 4: he posts me up. Don't help because he beat you 1261 01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:31,520 Speaker 4: with his passing as much as so, like you know, 1262 01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:33,200 Speaker 4: he had a game plan and I actually did. Okay, 1263 01:01:33,200 --> 01:01:35,200 Speaker 4: I mean Lebron would have moments, but like you know, 1264 01:01:37,760 --> 01:01:39,840 Speaker 4: I didn't have a strategy for like, I didn't know 1265 01:01:39,880 --> 01:01:43,120 Speaker 4: what to do. And so sometimes man like I would 1266 01:01:43,200 --> 01:01:45,840 Speaker 4: just he go up a shot, I'll just hit his arm, 1267 01:01:45,960 --> 01:01:47,680 Speaker 4: like just hit his arm and just like you know, 1268 01:01:48,720 --> 01:01:50,760 Speaker 4: And the problem too is I couldn't go back at 1269 01:01:50,840 --> 01:01:54,480 Speaker 4: him because at my role, you know, in Phoenix, Nash 1270 01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:55,880 Speaker 4: had the ball in his hand. So I'm stuck in 1271 01:01:55,960 --> 01:01:57,800 Speaker 4: the corner and I'm not. You know, I'm not a 1272 01:01:57,880 --> 01:02:02,920 Speaker 4: spot up shooter, so he was hard to defend. But 1273 01:02:03,040 --> 01:02:05,919 Speaker 4: in that moment, man, like I a couple of times 1274 01:02:05,960 --> 01:02:08,800 Speaker 4: I guess right, Like, I'm like, like, he's gonna go right, 1275 01:02:09,120 --> 01:02:10,080 Speaker 4: he's gonna shot fake. 1276 01:02:10,640 --> 01:02:13,200 Speaker 3: I'm not, I know what he's gonna do. And I'm like, 1277 01:02:13,280 --> 01:02:14,520 Speaker 3: and then, you know, you know how hard it is. 1278 01:02:14,600 --> 01:02:16,560 Speaker 1: Saying this, and when you usually square it off agains him, 1279 01:02:16,560 --> 01:02:18,400 Speaker 1: you're saying that in your head as yours. 1280 01:02:19,040 --> 01:02:21,280 Speaker 4: I knew he wanted to go right, and I knew 1281 01:02:21,280 --> 01:02:24,040 Speaker 4: he had a great ball fake and I've seen him 1282 01:02:24,080 --> 01:02:27,440 Speaker 4: do it before. And so he at one shot right 1283 01:02:27,480 --> 01:02:29,400 Speaker 4: in front of our bench when he tapped Alvin on them, 1284 01:02:29,600 --> 01:02:32,160 Speaker 4: and so he hit a touch shot on me before that, and. 1285 01:02:33,640 --> 01:02:35,760 Speaker 3: I tried to denyme the ball, but he gets it. 1286 01:02:36,760 --> 01:02:40,520 Speaker 3: He goes right. I go with him. He shot faced. 1287 01:02:40,560 --> 01:02:41,320 Speaker 1: I don't go for it. 1288 01:02:41,640 --> 01:02:44,840 Speaker 4: I actually I get closer into him. I go up 1289 01:02:44,880 --> 01:02:46,840 Speaker 4: when he goes up. You know how hard it is 1290 01:02:47,080 --> 01:02:50,200 Speaker 4: to do a shot fate reload from. 1291 01:02:50,040 --> 01:02:51,400 Speaker 1: Three and somebody in your grip. 1292 01:02:51,440 --> 01:02:56,520 Speaker 3: And I couldn't be any closer to him without fouling. Man, 1293 01:02:56,600 --> 01:02:58,960 Speaker 3: this dude, Like I was like, I mean. 1294 01:03:01,480 --> 01:03:04,040 Speaker 4: I was actually proud of the defense I played, like 1295 01:03:04,120 --> 01:03:05,960 Speaker 4: I'm thinking I could have done anything other than just 1296 01:03:06,040 --> 01:03:08,560 Speaker 4: prevent him from getting the ball. But he was the 1297 01:03:08,640 --> 01:03:11,520 Speaker 4: best player I played against. And and I say this 1298 01:03:11,720 --> 01:03:14,880 Speaker 4: respectfully with Georgia, I didn't guard Jordan Pippen and I 1299 01:03:15,080 --> 01:03:18,560 Speaker 4: matched up, But the best player that I played against, 1300 01:03:18,720 --> 01:03:23,960 Speaker 4: hands down was Kobe. And one of my regrets, it's 1301 01:03:24,040 --> 01:03:26,320 Speaker 4: in the book and O seven. When I left Orlando, 1302 01:03:26,800 --> 01:03:29,640 Speaker 4: Phil Jackson called me three for him right, No, No, 1303 01:03:29,920 --> 01:03:32,920 Speaker 4: that was That was in Detroit. I don't know how 1304 01:03:32,960 --> 01:03:34,480 Speaker 4: true that was. I've heard that, but I don't know 1305 01:03:34,520 --> 01:03:37,959 Speaker 4: how true that was. But when I left Orlando, Phil 1306 01:03:38,080 --> 01:03:43,000 Speaker 4: called three times. I didn't call him back, and I'm thinking, oh, 1307 01:03:43,080 --> 01:03:45,320 Speaker 4: it's it's over in LA Kobe. You know, he's talking 1308 01:03:45,360 --> 01:03:48,360 Speaker 4: about buying them, and you know they you know they're 1309 01:03:48,360 --> 01:03:50,480 Speaker 4: imploding in the playoffs and all I got. I just 1310 01:03:50,560 --> 01:03:54,040 Speaker 4: thought the run was over in l A. And I 1311 01:03:54,160 --> 01:03:56,640 Speaker 4: ended up going to Phoenix in part to stay healthy. 1312 01:03:57,640 --> 01:04:01,400 Speaker 4: But I think Phil would have played me more more 1313 01:04:01,440 --> 01:04:04,880 Speaker 4: suited for my game. He liked tall guys that could handle, 1314 01:04:05,680 --> 01:04:07,240 Speaker 4: and I think he wanted me to come in and 1315 01:04:07,400 --> 01:04:10,400 Speaker 4: kind of be a primary ball handler or whatever. Me 1316 01:04:10,560 --> 01:04:13,080 Speaker 4: sitting in the corner was not my game, you know 1317 01:04:13,120 --> 01:04:14,440 Speaker 4: what I'm saying. I mean I played it, I did 1318 01:04:14,560 --> 01:04:17,560 Speaker 4: my role, but like that wasn't who I was. And 1319 01:04:17,720 --> 01:04:19,720 Speaker 4: so I think now, like, man, if I had just 1320 01:04:19,880 --> 01:04:23,000 Speaker 4: that would have been interesting. We were number one in 1321 01:04:23,120 --> 01:04:25,960 Speaker 4: the West. But then they traded for Gasol and then 1322 01:04:26,080 --> 01:04:28,720 Speaker 4: later that that season and that was a game changer 1323 01:04:29,080 --> 01:04:32,200 Speaker 4: for the Lakers and they you know, you went on 1324 01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:33,040 Speaker 4: and had a great run. 1325 01:04:33,360 --> 01:04:37,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, played with some great teammates. Anyone, who's your favorite 1326 01:04:37,720 --> 01:04:38,560 Speaker 1: teammate during your. 1327 01:04:38,520 --> 01:04:41,840 Speaker 4: Career, Damn man, nineteen years, Man, that's that's you got 1328 01:04:41,920 --> 01:04:46,680 Speaker 4: a hell of a run. I think in Detroit, Lindsey Allen, 1329 01:04:47,760 --> 01:04:50,520 Speaker 4: those are my guys. We came in together, you know, 1330 01:04:50,640 --> 01:04:53,960 Speaker 4: and in Orlando was tough because I didn't play a 1331 01:04:54,000 --> 01:04:54,320 Speaker 4: whole lot. 1332 01:04:54,320 --> 01:04:54,840 Speaker 3: In Orlando. 1333 01:04:54,920 --> 01:04:59,320 Speaker 4: Jamior was good people, JAMMI you know, actually it's crazy, 1334 01:04:59,360 --> 01:05:01,480 Speaker 4: you know, you know who bonded and I bonded a 1335 01:05:01,560 --> 01:05:03,840 Speaker 4: lot because we were rehabing all the Damn time was 1336 01:05:03,920 --> 01:05:07,920 Speaker 4: Pat Garretty, Like we were hurt two years, so we spent. 1337 01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:13,080 Speaker 3: A lot of time together. You know, I enjoyed play. 1338 01:05:13,080 --> 01:05:14,600 Speaker 3: I mean, we didn't hang out. We didn't. 1339 01:05:14,840 --> 01:05:19,240 Speaker 4: You know, I didn't partake, but I enjoyed bad man. 1340 01:05:19,320 --> 01:05:21,920 Speaker 4: Like that was I'm telling you, like just in terms 1341 01:05:21,960 --> 01:05:26,880 Speaker 4: of teammates doing whatever is needed, the ultimate teammates, you 1342 01:05:26,880 --> 01:05:29,000 Speaker 4: know what I'm saying, Like people don't get enough credit 1343 01:05:29,080 --> 01:05:30,640 Speaker 4: for that. I'll give you enough credit for that, but 1344 01:05:30,800 --> 01:05:33,400 Speaker 4: like you should have started in that like with the 1345 01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:36,160 Speaker 4: Clippers that year, you know, but he came off the bench. 1346 01:05:36,200 --> 01:05:38,680 Speaker 4: You never never made a I remember seeing I remember 1347 01:05:38,680 --> 01:05:42,600 Speaker 4: seeing you at the facility, like you didn't have I 1348 01:05:42,640 --> 01:05:43,680 Speaker 4: don't think you had a. 1349 01:05:45,160 --> 01:05:46,120 Speaker 3: It was like late too. 1350 01:05:46,120 --> 01:05:49,400 Speaker 4: It might've been like August September and you were unsure 1351 01:05:49,480 --> 01:05:51,720 Speaker 4: where you were gonna sign, and you were in there 1352 01:05:51,760 --> 01:05:53,920 Speaker 4: just playing pickup ball every day and then you playing 1353 01:05:53,960 --> 01:05:56,480 Speaker 4: so well they brought you in. But like just like 1354 01:05:56,600 --> 01:05:59,200 Speaker 4: whatever's needed, you know what I'm saying, didn't complain, just 1355 01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:02,600 Speaker 4: did what he had to do. If something popped off, 1356 01:06:03,760 --> 01:06:05,160 Speaker 4: he was always in it, like he was there for 1357 01:06:05,240 --> 01:06:07,560 Speaker 4: your teammate. Like it's so but it's so many man, 1358 01:06:07,560 --> 01:06:09,160 Speaker 4: I mean, you know, Nash was fun to play with. 1359 01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:11,800 Speaker 4: Barbosa was a good guy. Those Phoenish years were fun. 1360 01:06:13,240 --> 01:06:15,200 Speaker 4: I don't know if I had a favorite, but you know, 1361 01:06:15,400 --> 01:06:17,720 Speaker 4: Shack was fun man, Shack was crazy. 1362 01:06:17,800 --> 01:06:20,400 Speaker 1: Remember the Shack and lou Minton back and forth. Remember 1363 01:06:20,440 --> 01:06:23,080 Speaker 1: when Shack took his mouthpiece and put in his tights 1364 01:06:23,160 --> 01:06:23,880 Speaker 1: during shoot around. 1365 01:06:23,880 --> 01:06:25,680 Speaker 3: I was just talking with Shack about that last night. 1366 01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:29,240 Speaker 1: We talked about it on the show. 1367 01:06:29,440 --> 01:06:35,880 Speaker 3: It's the crazy man, Hey, man, Shock. I mean there's 1368 01:06:35,920 --> 01:06:38,680 Speaker 3: so many stories man, people. 1369 01:06:39,080 --> 01:06:42,040 Speaker 1: He writing on naked button naked, Remember writing on loose 1370 01:06:42,120 --> 01:06:42,880 Speaker 1: bike button naked. 1371 01:06:45,040 --> 01:06:46,880 Speaker 4: I'm an out of Shacked right here. But I remember 1372 01:06:46,960 --> 01:06:54,880 Speaker 4: one time week it's so bad man. Remember one time, man, Shack, 1373 01:06:57,200 --> 01:06:57,800 Speaker 4: It's so bad. 1374 01:06:57,880 --> 01:07:00,280 Speaker 3: Man. I don't even I can't repeat this. Man, Come on, 1375 01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:01,120 Speaker 3: you already started. 1376 01:07:02,480 --> 01:07:02,640 Speaker 1: Man. 1377 01:07:02,920 --> 01:07:04,720 Speaker 4: You know we're in the showers after practice and he 1378 01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:07,000 Speaker 4: goes to Jay Rich, Ja, Rich, you got a fat 1379 01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:07,520 Speaker 4: ass man. 1380 01:07:09,480 --> 01:07:16,360 Speaker 3: I'm like, I'm like, how do you come back? 1381 01:07:16,440 --> 01:07:16,480 Speaker 1: Like? 1382 01:07:16,760 --> 01:07:17,640 Speaker 3: Like, what does j Rich do? 1383 01:07:17,760 --> 01:07:17,920 Speaker 1: Man? 1384 01:07:19,400 --> 01:07:19,960 Speaker 3: You know what I'm saying. 1385 01:07:20,040 --> 01:07:25,360 Speaker 4: Shaq was just he was funny, He was nasty, crazy. 1386 01:07:26,480 --> 01:07:29,360 Speaker 4: He and we had poor Terry Porter. 1387 01:07:29,480 --> 01:07:32,000 Speaker 1: Man he had Remember we used to say the Bill 1388 01:07:32,040 --> 01:07:36,280 Speaker 1: Carr right average fifth what he used to break his status? 1389 01:07:37,640 --> 01:07:40,680 Speaker 4: So Terry Porter, we're in a film session and uh, 1390 01:07:41,920 --> 01:07:45,040 Speaker 4: we're watching film in the film room, and he stopped 1391 01:07:45,040 --> 01:07:47,200 Speaker 4: film saying shock, like, don't you think you could come 1392 01:07:47,280 --> 01:07:50,160 Speaker 4: over from the weak side and maybe block the shot 1393 01:07:50,280 --> 01:07:54,720 Speaker 4: right here? And Shaq would be like, TP, I'm top 1394 01:07:54,800 --> 01:07:57,200 Speaker 4: five all time in the NBA shot blocks. I think 1395 01:07:57,240 --> 01:07:58,479 Speaker 4: I know when I can block the shot. 1396 01:07:59,360 --> 01:08:02,640 Speaker 3: Like it was like the disrespect, the craziness, so calm, 1397 01:08:02,880 --> 01:08:04,840 Speaker 3: it's so calm. About a couple of times. 1398 01:08:04,640 --> 01:08:06,760 Speaker 4: He show up late. It's bad too, but he show 1399 01:08:06,800 --> 01:08:09,439 Speaker 4: up late for and nobody he was. It's just shot. 1400 01:08:09,520 --> 01:08:09,959 Speaker 3: It was shot. 1401 01:08:10,120 --> 01:08:14,600 Speaker 4: He shot late, and like, coach, I'm sorry, man. The 1402 01:08:14,680 --> 01:08:16,920 Speaker 4: passport truck tipped over on fifty one. 1403 01:08:16,960 --> 01:08:17,080 Speaker 1: Man. 1404 01:08:17,120 --> 01:08:20,000 Speaker 3: They were Mexicans everywhere. That's why I'm late. He was 1405 01:08:20,080 --> 01:08:22,640 Speaker 3: just like he was sings man. It was it was 1406 01:08:22,800 --> 01:08:26,559 Speaker 3: constant humor, man, and and uh, he just kept it light. 1407 01:08:27,040 --> 01:08:27,679 Speaker 3: He was fun. 1408 01:08:27,760 --> 01:08:30,920 Speaker 4: It was crazy. We didn't make the playoffs, but you 1409 01:08:31,000 --> 01:08:32,439 Speaker 4: know he was in the time. I can't believe I 1410 01:08:32,520 --> 01:08:37,760 Speaker 4: told us stories, man, every day, every day. Every Bill 1411 01:08:37,840 --> 01:08:40,439 Speaker 4: Cartwright used to coach the bigs. Bill, I average so 1412 01:08:40,600 --> 01:08:42,240 Speaker 4: and so and so and so and so will go 1413 01:08:42,320 --> 01:08:44,640 Speaker 4: against you in this game. And my career number from 1414 01:08:44,760 --> 01:08:47,240 Speaker 4: high school to college and the pros. He would break 1415 01:08:47,280 --> 01:08:49,840 Speaker 4: off of Jim. I'm seventy percent lifetime from the field. 1416 01:08:49,920 --> 01:08:54,720 Speaker 4: Give me the damn ball, middle school, high school. I 1417 01:08:54,800 --> 01:08:56,720 Speaker 4: can't get in the car, right, I have thirty ten 1418 01:08:56,760 --> 01:08:57,240 Speaker 4: against him? 1419 01:08:57,280 --> 01:08:59,960 Speaker 3: Like he just just unbelievable. He was. 1420 01:09:01,680 --> 01:09:05,519 Speaker 1: All right, just like he was a mumble under his breath. 1421 01:09:05,920 --> 01:09:06,719 Speaker 3: Sha was funny. 1422 01:09:07,240 --> 01:09:10,680 Speaker 1: Fast forward co owner with the Hawks. How did you 1423 01:09:10,760 --> 01:09:12,760 Speaker 1: happen to land that spot? Congratulations? 1424 01:09:12,800 --> 01:09:14,920 Speaker 3: By the way, appreciate that when we were in LA 1425 01:09:15,360 --> 01:09:16,639 Speaker 3: I wasn't playing. I was hurt. 1426 01:09:17,640 --> 01:09:20,439 Speaker 4: Matter of fact, it was that December when you guys, 1427 01:09:20,520 --> 01:09:23,599 Speaker 4: when we were undefeated. We had a great month I had. 1428 01:09:25,320 --> 01:09:27,120 Speaker 4: I figured I was in l A. My family was 1429 01:09:27,160 --> 01:09:29,559 Speaker 4: in Phoenix. So once a month I would have dinner 1430 01:09:29,840 --> 01:09:32,720 Speaker 4: with this duke alum, a guy named Bruce Karsh and 1431 01:09:32,880 --> 01:09:36,360 Speaker 4: Bruce actually one of the partners with the Warriors, and uh, 1432 01:09:36,479 --> 01:09:39,439 Speaker 4: he's a Duke grad. So we were talking about the 1433 01:09:39,479 --> 01:09:41,680 Speaker 4: Clippers and I was like, you know, I think they 1434 01:09:41,760 --> 01:09:44,920 Speaker 4: might they might be in play. They may I'm here 1435 01:09:44,920 --> 01:09:47,679 Speaker 4: and they may have to sell the team for state 1436 01:09:47,800 --> 01:09:50,920 Speaker 4: tax reasons. So we kind of concocted this whole, this 1437 01:09:51,320 --> 01:09:53,720 Speaker 4: plan that we knew Adam was going to be commissioner. 1438 01:09:53,800 --> 01:09:56,840 Speaker 4: The next year, all three of us duke grads. Let's 1439 01:09:56,880 --> 01:09:58,479 Speaker 4: meet with Adam and see if we can get in 1440 01:09:58,600 --> 01:10:01,800 Speaker 4: through you know, maybe by peace to the team with 1441 01:10:01,960 --> 01:10:04,400 Speaker 4: the chance to buy it all later down the road. 1442 01:10:05,439 --> 01:10:08,600 Speaker 4: And then the next year everything in plubs. And so 1443 01:10:09,280 --> 01:10:12,280 Speaker 4: Bruce brought in a guy, Tony Wrestler, because he knew 1444 01:10:12,360 --> 01:10:14,040 Speaker 4: now it was going to be an open auction when 1445 01:10:14,040 --> 01:10:17,519 Speaker 4: the team was for sale, and we bid one point 1446 01:10:18,439 --> 01:10:19,439 Speaker 4: two billion dollars. 1447 01:10:19,880 --> 01:10:22,599 Speaker 3: And funny story. 1448 01:10:22,760 --> 01:10:26,800 Speaker 4: So I'm in New York with Bruce carrs Tony's in 1449 01:10:27,000 --> 01:10:30,479 Speaker 4: LA We're all on speakerphone and we're on the phone. 1450 01:10:30,920 --> 01:10:32,720 Speaker 4: They're gonna get mad that I told the story. We're 1451 01:10:32,760 --> 01:10:35,000 Speaker 4: on the phone and we're like, okay, one point two 1452 01:10:35,000 --> 01:10:36,160 Speaker 4: billion is gonna be our deal. 1453 01:10:36,680 --> 01:10:38,000 Speaker 1: That's that's for the Clippers. 1454 01:10:38,160 --> 01:10:40,160 Speaker 4: That's to buy the Clippers, which we were out bid 1455 01:10:40,200 --> 01:10:41,719 Speaker 4: by eight hundred million Steve Balmer. 1456 01:10:42,520 --> 01:10:43,280 Speaker 3: But we're on the phone. 1457 01:10:43,320 --> 01:10:43,880 Speaker 1: They're like all right. 1458 01:10:44,320 --> 01:10:46,320 Speaker 4: So Tony says, I'll put it in half a billion, 1459 01:10:47,080 --> 01:10:48,880 Speaker 4: and then Bruce says, I'll put it in half a billion, 1460 01:10:49,080 --> 01:10:52,920 Speaker 4: and then they look at me. So I swear I 1461 01:10:52,960 --> 01:10:55,640 Speaker 4: said I got five on it, like you know, just 1462 01:10:55,880 --> 01:10:58,639 Speaker 4: you know, I was being funny, but I told him 1463 01:10:58,640 --> 01:11:00,600 Speaker 4: my mount and they just want to know that I 1464 01:11:00,880 --> 01:11:03,720 Speaker 4: that I was going to put something in and you 1465 01:11:03,840 --> 01:11:06,400 Speaker 4: have to put something in. So but that didn't work. 1466 01:11:07,840 --> 01:11:12,120 Speaker 4: The Hawks came up right after similar circumstances, some racial overtones, 1467 01:11:12,240 --> 01:11:16,519 Speaker 4: some emails, so on and so forth, and I ended 1468 01:11:16,600 --> 01:11:19,960 Speaker 4: up getting Tony and convinced him on Atlanta. You know, 1469 01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:23,280 Speaker 4: I think the perception of Atlanta historically the franchise was 1470 01:11:23,439 --> 01:11:25,040 Speaker 4: just way off. 1471 01:11:25,400 --> 01:11:26,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, it just wasn't good. 1472 01:11:26,439 --> 01:11:28,920 Speaker 4: You played there, so it was, and so I felt 1473 01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:31,400 Speaker 4: like for me, my selling point was, we got a 1474 01:11:31,479 --> 01:11:33,840 Speaker 4: chance to come in in that value. You got a 1475 01:11:33,920 --> 01:11:39,439 Speaker 4: great city, international airport, quality of life. Guys liked to 1476 01:11:39,520 --> 01:11:40,240 Speaker 4: be in Atlanta. 1477 01:11:40,400 --> 01:11:41,559 Speaker 1: They love the living. 1478 01:11:42,120 --> 01:11:44,040 Speaker 3: Cost, the livings low. You know what I'm saying. 1479 01:11:44,120 --> 01:11:46,240 Speaker 4: All of that, we got a chance to come in 1480 01:11:46,360 --> 01:11:49,600 Speaker 4: and change that narrative and build an emotional connection with 1481 01:11:49,720 --> 01:11:53,000 Speaker 4: the franchise. If you're from Boston and you're a basketball fan, 1482 01:11:53,160 --> 01:11:55,240 Speaker 4: there's a ninety nine percent chance you're a Celtics fan. 1483 01:11:56,000 --> 01:11:58,080 Speaker 4: But if you from Atlanta, you might be a Bulls fan. 1484 01:11:58,160 --> 01:12:01,040 Speaker 4: You might be so transient people really from there. So 1485 01:12:01,840 --> 01:12:03,400 Speaker 4: you know, we came in and you know, we do 1486 01:12:03,560 --> 01:12:07,400 Speaker 4: the arena practice facility, you know, try to create an atmosphere, 1487 01:12:07,520 --> 01:12:11,799 Speaker 4: try to understand Atlanta, embrace what Atlanta is. The previous 1488 01:12:11,880 --> 01:12:15,880 Speaker 4: ownership group, I thought it was too too much diversity, 1489 01:12:16,600 --> 01:12:18,840 Speaker 4: too black, you can say, I'll say too black. And 1490 01:12:19,000 --> 01:12:22,080 Speaker 4: so we've tried to embrace who we are. I love 1491 01:12:22,160 --> 01:12:23,720 Speaker 4: when you go to a game in Atlanta, you got 1492 01:12:23,800 --> 01:12:26,959 Speaker 4: people from all walks of life, you know, different political 1493 01:12:27,160 --> 01:12:32,400 Speaker 4: different ethnicities, different gender orientation, all there supporting the team. 1494 01:12:33,160 --> 01:12:35,320 Speaker 4: But we're building that. You know, we're trying to build it. 1495 01:12:35,439 --> 01:12:39,040 Speaker 4: And Trey Young having a young star is helpful. But 1496 01:12:40,479 --> 01:12:43,000 Speaker 4: but yeah, so we're changing that. We I don't know 1497 01:12:43,040 --> 01:12:44,760 Speaker 4: if you've been to a game in Atlanta, I know, 1498 01:12:45,000 --> 01:12:49,680 Speaker 4: I know you had. It's a party, man like man, 1499 01:12:50,000 --> 01:12:52,120 Speaker 4: it's a party at our game. We got concerts, we 1500 01:12:52,240 --> 01:12:55,160 Speaker 4: got to chains as a partner with the G League team. 1501 01:12:55,320 --> 01:12:56,920 Speaker 1: The food is unbelievable. 1502 01:12:57,439 --> 01:13:00,519 Speaker 4: For food, we got sweet sweet, we got amenity. We're 1503 01:13:00,600 --> 01:13:03,519 Speaker 4: trying to create an environment there. Barbershop we got to 1504 01:13:03,600 --> 01:13:05,479 Speaker 4: kill a mic. Got a barbershop. Let me tell you 1505 01:13:05,479 --> 01:13:08,120 Speaker 4: the genius of that. It's dead space that you could 1506 01:13:08,200 --> 01:13:11,160 Speaker 4: not sell. And so we said, let's make it a barbershop. 1507 01:13:11,760 --> 01:13:14,160 Speaker 4: We got a DJ in there. Just it's a whole 1508 01:13:14,360 --> 01:13:17,880 Speaker 4: energy in their whole vibe and so just embracing Atlanta. 1509 01:13:17,960 --> 01:13:19,720 Speaker 4: We try to reflect Atlanta and all that we do. 1510 01:13:19,880 --> 01:13:21,360 Speaker 4: And we got a lot more work to do, but 1511 01:13:21,760 --> 01:13:23,519 Speaker 4: excited about the progress we've made. 1512 01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:26,040 Speaker 1: Man, coming down the home stretch post career, you've been 1513 01:13:26,120 --> 01:13:29,160 Speaker 1: very successful. What are some other things you're into outside 1514 01:13:29,200 --> 01:13:31,519 Speaker 1: of ownership of that at Hawks. 1515 01:13:31,720 --> 01:13:33,280 Speaker 4: Yeah, I got a lot of my plate man, maybe 1516 01:13:33,320 --> 01:13:36,200 Speaker 4: a little too much, but I'm on this. I'm on 1517 01:13:36,280 --> 01:13:39,200 Speaker 4: the board of Campbell's Soup, so we you know, in 1518 01:13:39,320 --> 01:13:46,160 Speaker 4: our portfolio we have everything from Cape Cod Chips, Kettle Chips, obviously, 1519 01:13:46,240 --> 01:13:50,679 Speaker 4: Campbell Soup, Chunky Soup. I'm on the board of Empire 1520 01:13:50,720 --> 01:13:53,000 Speaker 4: State Realty Trust. We're on the Empire State Building. We 1521 01:13:53,120 --> 01:13:56,880 Speaker 4: love to have you guys come do a show Empire 1522 01:13:56,920 --> 01:13:58,720 Speaker 4: State Building. I personally host you that. 1523 01:14:00,200 --> 01:14:03,400 Speaker 3: We can make that happen. It's on me. We make 1524 01:14:03,479 --> 01:14:04,479 Speaker 3: that happen. We'd be honored. 1525 01:14:05,720 --> 01:14:09,679 Speaker 4: I managing director of USA Basketball, so I'll be picking 1526 01:14:09,720 --> 01:14:13,320 Speaker 4: the Olympic team. And you know, Steve Currz, our head 1527 01:14:13,360 --> 01:14:16,000 Speaker 4: coach for the next next cycle, what else am I doing. 1528 01:14:16,800 --> 01:14:19,840 Speaker 4: I'm on the board of Duke shoes coming back out, 1529 01:14:20,360 --> 01:14:23,200 Speaker 4: Shoes coming back out. Matter of fact, these this is 1530 01:14:23,240 --> 01:14:27,120 Speaker 4: a partnership right here with to State, So it's a partnership. 1531 01:14:27,240 --> 01:14:30,160 Speaker 4: These will be coming out. He wore these the g 1532 01:14:30,439 --> 01:14:37,000 Speaker 4: H two's on on all eyes on me. Yeah, and 1533 01:14:37,160 --> 01:14:39,400 Speaker 4: so so that really helped with the shoe. But yeah, 1534 01:14:39,479 --> 01:14:42,599 Speaker 4: just you know, keeping it busy man. We rebuilding downtown Atlanta. 1535 01:14:42,600 --> 01:14:46,240 Speaker 4: We're pointing four billion dollars into downtown Atlanta, and so 1536 01:14:46,640 --> 01:14:48,160 Speaker 4: trying to do like an l A live kind of 1537 01:14:48,200 --> 01:14:51,479 Speaker 4: in downtown Atlanta. So just staying busy man, you know, 1538 01:14:51,560 --> 01:14:53,120 Speaker 4: doing TV as well, trying to be. 1539 01:14:53,160 --> 01:14:54,160 Speaker 3: Like, y'all love it. 1540 01:14:54,640 --> 01:14:57,080 Speaker 1: Is it true? Anita Baker introduced you Intamya. 1541 01:14:57,520 --> 01:15:02,320 Speaker 4: Kind of yeah, yeah, kind of. So, so Isaiah has 1542 01:15:02,360 --> 01:15:08,320 Speaker 4: a jersey retired and Anita Baker sings the national anthem 1543 01:15:08,360 --> 01:15:11,160 Speaker 4: at the jersey at the game. So afterwards there was 1544 01:15:11,439 --> 01:15:14,560 Speaker 4: was a reception. I meet Anita Baker, so she and 1545 01:15:14,640 --> 01:15:16,840 Speaker 4: her husband. So she's like, you know, so I know 1546 01:15:16,960 --> 01:15:18,559 Speaker 4: you got a girl. I know you like breaking all 1547 01:15:18,560 --> 01:15:20,679 Speaker 4: the hearts and all this, and I mean I'm just like, yeah, 1548 01:15:20,760 --> 01:15:22,799 Speaker 4: I can't find you I'm struggling. 1549 01:15:22,800 --> 01:15:26,240 Speaker 3: I wasn't really struggle. I was like, I'm struggling. You know, this, 1550 01:15:26,360 --> 01:15:27,360 Speaker 3: that and the other, you know. 1551 01:15:27,520 --> 01:15:30,720 Speaker 4: And so so the next week she was at the 1552 01:15:30,760 --> 01:15:33,600 Speaker 4: Soul Train Awards and she met to Mia and to me, 1553 01:15:33,720 --> 01:15:35,639 Speaker 4: it was you know, from Windsor, which is right across 1554 01:15:35,800 --> 01:15:38,720 Speaker 4: the river from Detroit, big fan of Anita. So she 1555 01:15:38,880 --> 01:15:40,400 Speaker 4: was telling her this and he was, I got just 1556 01:15:40,479 --> 01:15:44,599 Speaker 4: the guy for you. So she kind of she planned 1557 01:15:44,640 --> 01:15:47,640 Speaker 4: at the seed I ended up connecting with to me, 1558 01:15:47,920 --> 01:15:50,479 Speaker 4: you know, a couple of months later. But yeah, you know, 1559 01:15:50,760 --> 01:15:52,800 Speaker 4: it's a good story to say Anita hook to say, 1560 01:15:53,439 --> 01:15:59,679 Speaker 4: it's largely true. Joy your oldest daughters. 1561 01:15:59,680 --> 01:16:03,599 Speaker 1: And as a father, what is that like watching your 1562 01:16:03,680 --> 01:16:06,240 Speaker 1: daughter punch people in the face and get punched in the. 1563 01:16:06,439 --> 01:16:09,320 Speaker 3: Dude, it's crazy. You have though you have girl? You 1564 01:16:09,520 --> 01:16:11,439 Speaker 3: two boys, but three boy? Excuse me. 1565 01:16:13,120 --> 01:16:16,760 Speaker 4: So she's you know, she started doing jiu jitsu, and 1566 01:16:16,880 --> 01:16:21,040 Speaker 4: as a parent, you think, okay, girl, young lady getting 1567 01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:23,120 Speaker 4: to go off to college learn self defense. 1568 01:16:23,200 --> 01:16:23,840 Speaker 3: That's a good thing. 1569 01:16:24,760 --> 01:16:27,680 Speaker 4: But that just kept going, kept going, and so right 1570 01:16:27,760 --> 01:16:31,360 Speaker 4: before COVID, she's like, Dad, I think I want to fight. 1571 01:16:32,439 --> 01:16:34,759 Speaker 4: So I got a buddy who's a general counselor at UFC. 1572 01:16:35,040 --> 01:16:36,840 Speaker 4: So I took her to a fight and we're sitting 1573 01:16:36,920 --> 01:16:39,799 Speaker 4: up close. I'm thinking, you know, she sees up close, 1574 01:16:40,200 --> 01:16:42,840 Speaker 4: she won't want to do it, you know. So we 1575 01:16:42,920 --> 01:16:44,960 Speaker 4: get this in North Carolina. We go to the fight, 1576 01:16:45,080 --> 01:16:47,000 Speaker 4: we fly home that night, we get into two am. 1577 01:16:47,040 --> 01:16:50,720 Speaker 4: I'm like, Milly, what do you think. She's like, Dad, 1578 01:16:50,760 --> 01:16:51,679 Speaker 4: I could be a champion. 1579 01:16:52,360 --> 01:16:56,760 Speaker 3: And I was like, backfight, like but play. It didn't work. 1580 01:16:57,200 --> 01:17:01,000 Speaker 4: But she kept going and she fought last. She fought 1581 01:17:01,120 --> 01:17:06,560 Speaker 4: last October. And I mean, she's passionate about it. And 1582 01:17:06,680 --> 01:17:08,479 Speaker 4: you know, like if somebody, if your parents tried to 1583 01:17:08,520 --> 01:17:11,400 Speaker 4: tell you couldn't play basketball anyway, you got to support 1584 01:17:11,479 --> 01:17:12,720 Speaker 4: your kids whatever they want to do. 1585 01:17:13,520 --> 01:17:14,760 Speaker 3: So let me tell you so to me and I. 1586 01:17:15,400 --> 01:17:17,200 Speaker 3: So she goes to the fight. She goes early. 1587 01:17:17,600 --> 01:17:20,719 Speaker 4: We drive from Orlando to Lakeland, Florida, by an hour drive. 1588 01:17:21,200 --> 01:17:23,280 Speaker 4: We don't say a word in a car. There's no music, 1589 01:17:23,920 --> 01:17:25,640 Speaker 4: no nothing on the rate. We're not saying it, but 1590 01:17:26,200 --> 01:17:29,880 Speaker 4: there's a nervous energy. We get to the fight. There's 1591 01:17:29,920 --> 01:17:34,559 Speaker 4: a bar man. We probably each had about eight rooming coaches. 1592 01:17:35,720 --> 01:17:38,640 Speaker 4: You just had to by the time she came on. 1593 01:17:38,840 --> 01:17:42,760 Speaker 4: She comes out her her walk out music was Rick Roksy' 1594 01:17:42,960 --> 01:17:45,400 Speaker 4: feeling good, The Devil was The Devil was a lie. 1595 01:17:45,520 --> 01:17:48,559 Speaker 4: So she comes out, you know, but we're like, now, 1596 01:17:48,640 --> 01:17:50,960 Speaker 4: we're like, this is your first time actually seeing it, 1597 01:17:51,120 --> 01:17:51,920 Speaker 4: first time seeing it. 1598 01:17:52,320 --> 01:17:53,360 Speaker 3: So she gets in the ring. 1599 01:17:53,520 --> 01:17:56,880 Speaker 4: She goes in first, the young lady she's fighting, who's 1600 01:17:56,880 --> 01:17:59,360 Speaker 4: fought before, who looks like she's been in some fights, 1601 01:17:59,840 --> 01:18:02,720 Speaker 4: you know, and so we're a little nervous about but 1602 01:18:02,840 --> 01:18:05,360 Speaker 4: like she gets she comes with studs in her ears 1603 01:18:05,720 --> 01:18:08,280 Speaker 4: and I said no, no, so they can't get him out. 1604 01:18:09,320 --> 01:18:11,120 Speaker 4: And so they're going through all this and trying to 1605 01:18:11,120 --> 01:18:14,000 Speaker 4: get him out. It's been ten minutes. So now we're 1606 01:18:14,080 --> 01:18:14,679 Speaker 4: kind of mad. 1607 01:18:15,479 --> 01:18:16,120 Speaker 1: It's the tactic. 1608 01:18:16,360 --> 01:18:17,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's stolling. 1609 01:18:17,720 --> 01:18:19,439 Speaker 4: So now to me, I won't repeat what to me 1610 01:18:19,560 --> 01:18:22,000 Speaker 4: it was saying, but it's what they say in Memphis 1611 01:18:22,040 --> 01:18:25,439 Speaker 4: a lot, and so and so anyway, she gets in 1612 01:18:25,479 --> 01:18:28,120 Speaker 4: the ring. She chokes her out with fifteen fifty seconds, 1613 01:18:28,560 --> 01:18:30,680 Speaker 4: and uh, you know, so she's into it, man, and 1614 01:18:30,920 --> 01:18:33,360 Speaker 4: you know, what do you do? 1615 01:18:33,520 --> 01:18:33,720 Speaker 3: Man? 1616 01:18:33,920 --> 01:18:36,080 Speaker 1: You know, but she was flig and fliging. 1617 01:18:38,040 --> 01:18:40,120 Speaker 4: But she and she and she you know, I mean, 1618 01:18:40,160 --> 01:18:44,200 Speaker 4: she's quiet sweet kind, like the last person you would think. 1619 01:18:44,720 --> 01:18:46,960 Speaker 4: But dude, she goes six days a week, she teaches it, 1620 01:18:47,120 --> 01:18:49,880 Speaker 4: she loves it. She's a brown belt like she's she 1621 01:18:50,000 --> 01:18:51,880 Speaker 4: wants to fight, she wants to try to go for it. 1622 01:18:52,000 --> 01:18:54,000 Speaker 4: She wants to open up gems down the road. So 1623 01:18:54,120 --> 01:18:56,639 Speaker 4: she's got a plan and you know, we'll see what happens. 1624 01:18:57,320 --> 01:19:00,760 Speaker 1: You were always forward thinking in basketball, so much that 1625 01:19:00,880 --> 01:19:01,719 Speaker 1: you didn't have an agent. 1626 01:19:01,880 --> 01:19:02,240 Speaker 3: What did that? 1627 01:19:02,360 --> 01:19:04,519 Speaker 1: Where did that idea come from? And you were able 1628 01:19:04,560 --> 01:19:05,280 Speaker 1: to be successful. 1629 01:19:06,560 --> 01:19:11,559 Speaker 4: I realized early on that the NBA is a global 1630 01:19:12,479 --> 01:19:16,000 Speaker 4: marketing and public relations firm that's disguise as a league. 1631 01:19:17,439 --> 01:19:19,560 Speaker 4: We went to China, man, we went to China, and 1632 01:19:19,800 --> 01:19:21,840 Speaker 4: we were over there and people knew who we were. 1633 01:19:22,280 --> 01:19:24,760 Speaker 4: We go places recognize us, and that's because that's what 1634 01:19:24,880 --> 01:19:30,559 Speaker 4: the NBA does. And so I felt like I needed 1635 01:19:30,600 --> 01:19:35,040 Speaker 4: an attorney who could negotiate my contracts. But all the 1636 01:19:35,160 --> 01:19:37,800 Speaker 4: marketing opportunities I was coming from the league that was 1637 01:19:37,840 --> 01:19:41,080 Speaker 4: coming from different, you know, because the league's pushing young 1638 01:19:41,160 --> 01:19:43,880 Speaker 4: players and I was delivering early on. So why am 1639 01:19:43,920 --> 01:19:47,519 Speaker 4: I going to pay somebody ten and then why am 1640 01:19:47,560 --> 01:19:51,120 Speaker 4: I going to let them own that relationship? And leverage it. 1641 01:19:51,720 --> 01:19:54,760 Speaker 4: I want to sit with Coca Cola spray, I want 1642 01:19:54,800 --> 01:19:57,200 Speaker 4: to sit with Nestle, I want to sit with and 1643 01:19:57,320 --> 01:20:00,640 Speaker 4: talk about marketing plays, sit with the ad agency. A 1644 01:20:00,720 --> 01:20:04,200 Speaker 4: lot of times agents might leverage that, you know, for 1645 01:20:04,320 --> 01:20:04,760 Speaker 4: another car. 1646 01:20:05,840 --> 01:20:07,599 Speaker 3: So you know, I got hurt. 1647 01:20:07,680 --> 01:20:09,720 Speaker 4: All that momentum kind of went away, but it was 1648 01:20:09,800 --> 01:20:15,000 Speaker 4: invaluable experience, like having an office, having employees doing evaluations, raises, 1649 01:20:16,840 --> 01:20:19,920 Speaker 4: sitting in meetings talking about strategy like I'm doing all 1650 01:20:20,000 --> 01:20:22,920 Speaker 4: this while I'm playing, and it just helped, you know, 1651 01:20:23,080 --> 01:20:25,760 Speaker 4: helped me think about and learn about other things. So 1652 01:20:26,000 --> 01:20:27,960 Speaker 4: you know, it was fun and I had a good time. 1653 01:20:28,080 --> 01:20:30,880 Speaker 4: And you know, maybe if I had the muscle of 1654 01:20:30,960 --> 01:20:33,160 Speaker 4: a big time marketing firm, maybe things would have been 1655 01:20:33,200 --> 01:20:33,840 Speaker 4: a little different. 1656 01:20:33,920 --> 01:20:35,960 Speaker 3: But I had pretty well. 1657 01:20:36,040 --> 01:20:38,080 Speaker 1: I had a lot of deals real quick. Before we 1658 01:20:38,160 --> 01:20:40,879 Speaker 1: get to quick hitters. The spreading situation. 1659 01:20:41,000 --> 01:20:43,560 Speaker 4: I thought you were going to ask about, uh, like 1660 01:20:43,720 --> 01:20:47,000 Speaker 4: Biggie oh ship, Yeah, because you remember you asked me 1661 01:20:47,000 --> 01:20:49,280 Speaker 4: about that in LA Yeah, I talk about in the book. 1662 01:20:49,400 --> 01:20:52,280 Speaker 1: So yeah, the night did the night Biggie pass? Yeah, 1663 01:20:52,479 --> 01:20:54,640 Speaker 1: talk to us about that. Damn, I totally forgot about that. 1664 01:20:55,160 --> 01:20:57,719 Speaker 1: We just had we just had the photographer that go ahead. 1665 01:20:58,080 --> 01:21:01,800 Speaker 4: Were in La so here March eighth, because he died 1666 01:21:01,840 --> 01:21:04,840 Speaker 4: on the ninth, my birthday and night that's right, March ninth. 1667 01:21:04,920 --> 01:21:08,559 Speaker 4: And so we played the Clippers. We beat the Clippers. 1668 01:21:08,600 --> 01:21:11,720 Speaker 4: I did work, I did my thing, and so to 1669 01:21:11,880 --> 01:21:15,479 Speaker 4: MIA's label is throwing a party. So after the game, 1670 01:21:15,560 --> 01:21:17,840 Speaker 4: I go with Tamiya and I don't know if you 1671 01:21:17,920 --> 01:21:20,920 Speaker 4: know Jay Brown, so Jay was at the label. We 1672 01:21:21,040 --> 01:21:24,240 Speaker 4: get in the limo. We go back to Tomya's manager's house. 1673 01:21:24,400 --> 01:21:25,800 Speaker 4: First of all, I was the night that the first 1674 01:21:25,880 --> 01:21:29,200 Speaker 4: night that was the first time I heard hypnotized. It 1675 01:21:29,320 --> 01:21:31,800 Speaker 4: wasn't on the radio yet, but they had this and 1676 01:21:31,840 --> 01:21:35,080 Speaker 4: they kept saying Detroit players. You know, pick gators, mighty 1677 01:21:36,240 --> 01:21:38,400 Speaker 4: run that back run that back in the limo every time, 1678 01:21:38,640 --> 01:21:39,439 Speaker 4: you know, hearing that song. 1679 01:21:39,520 --> 01:21:40,400 Speaker 3: So we go to the party. 1680 01:21:41,160 --> 01:21:43,400 Speaker 4: Now I understand t and I have been together almost 1681 01:21:43,439 --> 01:21:47,120 Speaker 4: a year those first time we had been out publicly, 1682 01:21:47,880 --> 01:21:51,879 Speaker 4: and so we walk in and everybody turns like everybody's 1683 01:21:51,880 --> 01:21:55,200 Speaker 4: looking at us because they hadn't seen us out. But 1684 01:21:55,320 --> 01:21:58,160 Speaker 4: everybody was there. We saw Biggie, we saw Puffy. 1685 01:21:58,280 --> 01:22:02,000 Speaker 3: We went there long. We might have been there ten minutes. 1686 01:22:03,160 --> 01:22:05,559 Speaker 4: We might have left five minutes before they left, because 1687 01:22:05,600 --> 01:22:07,439 Speaker 4: when we left they were kind of near the door, 1688 01:22:08,320 --> 01:22:11,000 Speaker 4: and by the time we got back to tim Min's place, 1689 01:22:11,240 --> 01:22:14,120 Speaker 4: it had already circulated that he got killed, and so 1690 01:22:14,240 --> 01:22:16,479 Speaker 4: it was it was crazy. 1691 01:22:17,560 --> 01:22:18,759 Speaker 3: It was a little weird. 1692 01:22:18,680 --> 01:22:21,439 Speaker 4: Thinking that they were out there because it was still 1693 01:22:21,560 --> 01:22:25,880 Speaker 4: all that East coast West coast stuff. And shoot that 1694 01:22:26,000 --> 01:22:28,960 Speaker 4: even happened with Tamia, like she got caught up. We 1695 01:22:29,040 --> 01:22:33,960 Speaker 4: got caught up in a situation. She was in the 1696 01:22:34,000 --> 01:22:37,479 Speaker 4: studio working on her album. Stevie J. Produced one of 1697 01:22:37,520 --> 01:22:42,120 Speaker 4: the songs, and so before I got there, I'm with 1698 01:22:42,240 --> 01:22:45,080 Speaker 4: Jay Brown. We're Benny Hannahs and we're doing sock bombs, 1699 01:22:45,680 --> 01:22:48,800 Speaker 4: and so we come to the studio. So before we 1700 01:22:48,920 --> 01:22:52,240 Speaker 4: get there, they were in the commons room, Stevie J 1701 01:22:52,479 --> 01:22:58,000 Speaker 4: and his bodyguard and the outlaws or in the other studio, 1702 01:22:59,080 --> 01:23:02,439 Speaker 4: and so I guess they had words in the in 1703 01:23:02,520 --> 01:23:06,240 Speaker 4: the common area. Somebody pulled out a gun. So this 1704 01:23:06,360 --> 01:23:08,760 Speaker 4: all happens before we get there. So I show up, 1705 01:23:09,120 --> 01:23:13,840 Speaker 4: We get there, and ten minutes after we get there, 1706 01:23:13,960 --> 01:23:17,000 Speaker 4: police come in, rifles drawn, paint. 1707 01:23:17,040 --> 01:23:19,040 Speaker 3: We're all on the wall. I'm thinking like this R 1708 01:23:19,040 --> 01:23:21,280 Speaker 3: and B session, Like I'm like man this ain't rap. 1709 01:23:21,640 --> 01:23:24,040 Speaker 4: And so anyway, I found out what happened, and you know, 1710 01:23:24,120 --> 01:23:28,800 Speaker 4: we we I don't know what ultimately happened, but I 1711 01:23:28,960 --> 01:23:31,680 Speaker 4: say that that was that was probably the summer of 1712 01:23:31,800 --> 01:23:34,720 Speaker 4: ninety seven. So but it was just still tension, you 1713 01:23:34,760 --> 01:23:36,920 Speaker 4: know what I'm saying. And so when we saw Biggie 1714 01:23:36,920 --> 01:23:39,240 Speaker 4: and them at the it was just like, I mean, 1715 01:23:39,240 --> 01:23:41,080 Speaker 4: I didn't think what happened would happen, but it. 1716 01:23:41,160 --> 01:23:44,040 Speaker 3: Was just it was it was weird. Energy was off. Yeah, 1717 01:23:44,120 --> 01:23:45,840 Speaker 3: it was a weird knight. It was a weird knight. 1718 01:23:45,920 --> 01:23:48,880 Speaker 1: Five real quick before we get the quick hitters. The 1719 01:23:48,960 --> 01:23:51,560 Speaker 1: Grant Hill Drinks Sprite I mean to me, you know 1720 01:23:51,760 --> 01:23:53,519 Speaker 1: that and Little Penny are kind of what I remember 1721 01:23:53,640 --> 01:23:56,160 Speaker 1: growing up from, like athletes and commercials. So how did 1722 01:23:56,200 --> 01:23:59,960 Speaker 1: that come about? In the idea and behind the actual commercial? 1723 01:24:00,479 --> 01:24:01,960 Speaker 3: The idea it was kind of genius. 1724 01:24:02,040 --> 01:24:02,200 Speaker 1: Man. 1725 01:24:02,320 --> 01:24:07,080 Speaker 4: It was basically, obey your thirst, don't let somebody tell 1726 01:24:07,120 --> 01:24:09,280 Speaker 4: you to drink it. And so we're making fun of 1727 01:24:09,360 --> 01:24:13,320 Speaker 4: Pitchment and uh and making fun of myself and so 1728 01:24:14,160 --> 01:24:19,479 Speaker 4: that was Sprite attaching himself, aligning himself with the NBA. 1729 01:24:20,360 --> 01:24:23,000 Speaker 4: You know, I got involved with that. So we had 1730 01:24:23,040 --> 01:24:25,120 Speaker 4: a We had a great run, did a lot of 1731 01:24:25,160 --> 01:24:30,680 Speaker 4: fun commercials. Even did a commercial with Kobe his second year. 1732 01:24:32,600 --> 01:24:36,000 Speaker 4: Crazy Story. We did a commercial together his second year 1733 01:24:37,479 --> 01:24:40,280 Speaker 4: during the season. I fly out to LA. Now I'm 1734 01:24:40,520 --> 01:24:42,000 Speaker 4: this point. I'm like, I'm the big you know what 1735 01:24:42,000 --> 01:24:44,960 Speaker 4: I'm saying. Yeah, He's like, it's like Midway, it's before 1736 01:24:45,000 --> 01:24:47,880 Speaker 4: the All Star break. But he's young, he's got a lot, 1737 01:24:47,960 --> 01:24:49,920 Speaker 4: he's having a great second year. I fly out to 1738 01:24:50,080 --> 01:24:54,639 Speaker 4: l A and we're gonna do this commercial where he's 1739 01:24:54,720 --> 01:24:57,080 Speaker 4: on He's on one shoulder, I'm on the other shoulder, 1740 01:24:57,160 --> 01:24:59,880 Speaker 4: and we're going back and forth with this kid. And 1741 01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:03,560 Speaker 4: and so when you do these commercials, you approve the 1742 01:25:03,680 --> 01:25:07,439 Speaker 4: script before you commit. So the script had been approved 1743 01:25:07,520 --> 01:25:10,479 Speaker 4: for a week. So I fly all the way out 1744 01:25:10,479 --> 01:25:14,320 Speaker 4: to LA on an off day. We get there and 1745 01:25:14,439 --> 01:25:17,360 Speaker 4: the director comes in and he says, Kobe wants to 1746 01:25:17,439 --> 01:25:18,200 Speaker 4: rewrite the script. 1747 01:25:19,400 --> 01:25:22,760 Speaker 3: And I'm like, he wants to what he wants to 1748 01:25:22,800 --> 01:25:24,720 Speaker 3: rewrite the script. I'm like all right. 1749 01:25:25,400 --> 01:25:27,680 Speaker 4: So they come back like thirty forty five minutes later. 1750 01:25:28,680 --> 01:25:33,000 Speaker 4: He got all the good lines. Now, he got all 1751 01:25:33,040 --> 01:25:36,160 Speaker 4: the good lines. And they're like and I'm like, look, nah, 1752 01:25:36,400 --> 01:25:38,240 Speaker 4: I said, man, look I come all the way out here, 1753 01:25:38,320 --> 01:25:41,000 Speaker 4: this is what I agreed to. If he wants to 1754 01:25:41,040 --> 01:25:42,840 Speaker 4: do this, I'm go looking back on the plane fly back. 1755 01:25:43,120 --> 01:25:45,960 Speaker 4: And so now meanwhile we're in trailers right next to week. 1756 01:25:45,960 --> 01:25:47,439 Speaker 4: You just could have gone and talked to each other. 1757 01:25:47,560 --> 01:25:51,320 Speaker 4: But that was cod Like, I kind of respect that 1758 01:25:51,479 --> 01:25:55,080 Speaker 4: he was bold enough to want to do that. And anyway, 1759 01:25:55,160 --> 01:25:57,200 Speaker 4: we went back. We did the script that we agreed to. 1760 01:25:57,320 --> 01:25:59,479 Speaker 4: But yeah, the Sprite stuff, man, that that was fun 1761 01:25:59,800 --> 01:26:05,320 Speaker 4: and and poking fun at people having pitchment was the 1762 01:26:05,360 --> 01:26:07,120 Speaker 4: whole premise behind the Spright campaign. 1763 01:26:07,560 --> 01:26:11,400 Speaker 1: So well, man, it's been a great interview. Quick hitters. 1764 01:26:11,439 --> 01:26:14,439 Speaker 1: First thing to come into mind. Let us know duke 1765 01:26:14,840 --> 01:26:17,920 Speaker 1: all time starting five including yourself, so you plus four 1766 01:26:18,600 --> 01:26:20,759 Speaker 1: all time dukes dukies. 1767 01:26:23,240 --> 01:26:25,479 Speaker 3: Man, I gotta go with Laden He did work, he 1768 01:26:25,640 --> 01:26:26,400 Speaker 3: was killed, a killer. 1769 01:26:26,560 --> 01:26:29,920 Speaker 4: He I think Lighton's top three, top five maybe all 1770 01:26:30,040 --> 01:26:33,839 Speaker 4: time in college just in terms of his accomplishments. Ladner, 1771 01:26:35,080 --> 01:26:37,599 Speaker 4: I gotta go with I gotta go with Johnny Dawkins 1772 01:26:37,680 --> 01:26:39,760 Speaker 4: because he kind of set it off. People don't people 1773 01:26:39,800 --> 01:26:44,519 Speaker 4: don't appreciate how talented he was. You gonna get me 1774 01:26:44,600 --> 01:26:45,240 Speaker 4: in trouble man. 1775 01:26:45,439 --> 01:26:46,080 Speaker 1: Two more. 1776 01:26:48,520 --> 01:26:51,240 Speaker 4: I'm gonna show the young fella some love. Jason Tatum. 1777 01:26:51,680 --> 01:26:53,120 Speaker 4: I think when it's all said and done, I think 1778 01:26:53,160 --> 01:26:55,760 Speaker 4: he's gonna be the best. And he might he might 1779 01:26:55,880 --> 01:26:58,360 Speaker 4: already be there. He I don't know if there was 1780 01:26:58,400 --> 01:27:02,200 Speaker 4: a more skilled guy coming in out of high school had. 1781 01:27:02,080 --> 01:27:07,640 Speaker 3: It all, you know, offensively that final spot. Kyrie, he was. 1782 01:27:07,640 --> 01:27:10,640 Speaker 4: Only there for nine days, and I know sometimes we 1783 01:27:10,760 --> 01:27:12,080 Speaker 4: claim him, sometimes we don't. 1784 01:27:12,200 --> 01:27:14,519 Speaker 3: Yeah, but talent, yeah he was. 1785 01:27:15,080 --> 01:27:22,240 Speaker 1: He was Kyrie, Kyrie Dawkins, yourself Latner Jason Tatum. 1786 01:27:22,360 --> 01:27:24,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's nice five, nice five right there? 1787 01:27:25,120 --> 01:27:28,200 Speaker 1: What album can you listen to with no skips? Can't 1788 01:27:28,240 --> 01:27:33,759 Speaker 1: have your wife? No Brownie points here, Biggie's first album? 1789 01:27:34,400 --> 01:27:36,240 Speaker 1: Mm hmm ready. 1790 01:27:37,520 --> 01:27:39,280 Speaker 3: Born, No it born? 1791 01:27:41,479 --> 01:27:43,599 Speaker 1: Yeah, the little Baby on the front. 1792 01:27:43,800 --> 01:27:46,320 Speaker 3: Yep, that's my first. That's my favorite one right there. 1793 01:27:46,400 --> 01:27:46,599 Speaker 4: Yeah. 1794 01:27:46,920 --> 01:27:48,240 Speaker 1: I mean you kind of already mentioned if you have 1795 01:27:48,280 --> 01:27:51,120 Speaker 1: a better story, but best Kobe or MJ's story off 1796 01:27:51,160 --> 01:27:51,519 Speaker 1: the court? 1797 01:27:52,520 --> 01:27:58,599 Speaker 4: Uh, Kobe probably like ninety eight. I go up one 1798 01:27:58,720 --> 01:28:02,799 Speaker 4: night to me is living. She's living on a wheelshow corridor, 1799 01:28:03,360 --> 01:28:07,720 Speaker 4: and I think we're engaged at this point and it's late, 1800 01:28:08,000 --> 01:28:09,439 Speaker 4: Like I go to the men's gym at u c 1801 01:28:09,640 --> 01:28:14,040 Speaker 4: l A maybe like midnight, and I'm I'm redoing my shots, 1802 01:28:14,040 --> 01:28:17,200 Speaker 4: so I'm changing my mechanics and I'm just going in 1803 01:28:17,280 --> 01:28:19,400 Speaker 4: there to douce, like just some set shots by myself. 1804 01:28:20,400 --> 01:28:22,000 Speaker 4: And I go in there and Kobe's in there and 1805 01:28:22,120 --> 01:28:28,000 Speaker 4: he's laughed up and he's got his guy, and so 1806 01:28:28,080 --> 01:28:32,160 Speaker 4: I'm down at the other end and he's like, you 1807 01:28:32,200 --> 01:28:36,479 Speaker 4: want to play one on one? And I didn't because 1808 01:28:36,479 --> 01:28:38,599 Speaker 4: I'm like, I'm changing my shot, like I'm not, I'm 1809 01:28:38,640 --> 01:28:41,560 Speaker 4: not there yet, but I'm like, I got it. 1810 01:28:41,720 --> 01:28:45,479 Speaker 3: I can't. I can't say no. And so we played 1811 01:28:45,520 --> 01:28:48,680 Speaker 3: one on one and I'm telling you, it was like 1812 01:28:48,720 --> 01:28:51,599 Speaker 3: a game seven in like late July. 1813 01:28:52,400 --> 01:28:52,760 Speaker 1: Like it was. 1814 01:28:52,880 --> 01:28:55,240 Speaker 3: I don't think I played that intense in the summer. 1815 01:28:55,920 --> 01:28:58,439 Speaker 1: And he was like, he was me, you know what, 1816 01:28:58,640 --> 01:29:01,519 Speaker 1: second year's coming off? Second year ninety eight, he's ninety 1817 01:29:01,520 --> 01:29:02,400 Speaker 1: six draft a year. 1818 01:29:02,400 --> 01:29:06,000 Speaker 4: For the second year, and so like the work ethic 1819 01:29:06,280 --> 01:29:10,680 Speaker 4: and how hard like up until then, man like I 1820 01:29:10,760 --> 01:29:13,080 Speaker 4: didn't really work on my game and I just hooped 1821 01:29:13,840 --> 01:29:16,840 Speaker 4: to play pickup ball. And that summer was when I started, Okay, 1822 01:29:16,840 --> 01:29:20,160 Speaker 4: I'm gonna start like working and getting better and trying things. 1823 01:29:20,240 --> 01:29:23,080 Speaker 4: And that was the hard part because I did it 1824 01:29:23,200 --> 01:29:26,240 Speaker 4: in ninety eight, I did it in ninety nine, and 1825 01:29:26,320 --> 01:29:28,360 Speaker 4: then after that, I never I never worked on my 1826 01:29:28,439 --> 01:29:30,240 Speaker 4: game in the summer because I was hurt. I was 1827 01:29:30,280 --> 01:29:33,760 Speaker 4: trying to get healthy, and it finally got healthy, and 1828 01:29:33,920 --> 01:29:35,560 Speaker 4: now I didn't touch the ball in the summer. So 1829 01:29:35,600 --> 01:29:37,759 Speaker 4: those Phoenix years, I didn't know. I'm trying to preserve 1830 01:29:37,840 --> 01:29:42,559 Speaker 4: my ankle. So you know, going through having a strategy, 1831 01:29:42,640 --> 01:29:45,519 Speaker 4: working on stuff, all of that, Like, I enjoyed doing that, 1832 01:29:46,680 --> 01:29:48,200 Speaker 4: and a lot of it I got from being like 1833 01:29:48,280 --> 01:29:51,960 Speaker 4: watching this kid, his kid younger than me, grinding, like 1834 01:29:52,080 --> 01:29:54,840 Speaker 4: getting after it by himself. It's like a Friday night, 1835 01:29:55,400 --> 01:29:58,080 Speaker 4: I'm wiped up, I'm telling you know. You know, I'm 1836 01:29:58,160 --> 01:29:59,920 Speaker 4: just wanting to go get some shots up late at night, 1837 01:30:00,560 --> 01:30:01,920 Speaker 4: and he's in the gym going at it. 1838 01:30:02,360 --> 01:30:05,840 Speaker 3: And and so that was. That was a moment that 1839 01:30:06,760 --> 01:30:09,599 Speaker 3: that that I remember. 1840 01:30:09,680 --> 01:30:11,960 Speaker 1: That was I was like, man, this kid, I remember 1841 01:30:11,960 --> 01:30:14,000 Speaker 1: my freshman year ucl Is ninety eight, so he used 1842 01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:15,920 Speaker 1: to be on campus all the time. We see him 1843 01:30:16,000 --> 01:30:19,200 Speaker 1: normally during the day, at night working out playing. 1844 01:30:19,280 --> 01:30:22,400 Speaker 3: It was and and you know, he impacted a whole generation. 1845 01:30:22,640 --> 01:30:25,840 Speaker 3: Now that they do that work. They put that like 1846 01:30:25,960 --> 01:30:27,280 Speaker 3: you know, back in the day, you might go. 1847 01:30:27,360 --> 01:30:31,080 Speaker 4: In five spots, five makes I got some shots up, 1848 01:30:31,080 --> 01:30:31,639 Speaker 4: you know what I'm saying. 1849 01:30:31,680 --> 01:30:34,639 Speaker 3: But like he put the work in it. For sure. 1850 01:30:34,960 --> 01:30:36,120 Speaker 1: It's crazy question. 1851 01:30:36,280 --> 01:30:38,880 Speaker 2: But I know your game and I didn't seen you 1852 01:30:38,960 --> 01:30:42,400 Speaker 2: play so much and idolajah. Would you rather cross someone 1853 01:30:42,520 --> 01:30:44,280 Speaker 2: to dunk on someone? But I've seen you do that 1854 01:30:44,360 --> 01:30:45,679 Speaker 2: too many times in the same play. 1855 01:30:47,280 --> 01:30:49,640 Speaker 1: It go hand in hand. Yeah, for you to go 1856 01:30:49,800 --> 01:30:53,240 Speaker 1: in there, but put the questions say no, maybe maybe 1857 01:30:53,280 --> 01:30:57,439 Speaker 1: the favorite someone you crossed up and dunked on like 1858 01:30:57,760 --> 01:30:59,160 Speaker 1: that was your that was the ship, that was your 1859 01:30:59,160 --> 01:31:00,760 Speaker 1: patting the things. So you got a lot of people 1860 01:31:00,840 --> 01:31:01,400 Speaker 1: on that list. 1861 01:31:03,760 --> 01:31:06,519 Speaker 3: It was always it was always fun dunking on the Kimbag. 1862 01:31:07,280 --> 01:31:07,479 Speaker 2: Yeah. 1863 01:31:07,520 --> 01:31:08,599 Speaker 3: I got him a couple of times. 1864 01:31:08,800 --> 01:31:09,760 Speaker 1: Very few people got it. 1865 01:31:10,000 --> 01:31:12,360 Speaker 4: And he I used to tell him, I'm a clown, 1866 01:31:12,400 --> 01:31:14,360 Speaker 4: I'm anna climb Mountain Tumbo, I'm coming. 1867 01:31:14,760 --> 01:31:17,960 Speaker 3: And you don't know, you ain't gonna get me, and 1868 01:31:18,320 --> 01:31:19,880 Speaker 3: uh and so that back and forth. 1869 01:31:20,920 --> 01:31:25,679 Speaker 4: The thing about my Tumbo in morning, they jumped for everything, 1870 01:31:26,320 --> 01:31:28,000 Speaker 4: and even if they got jumped, a lot of guys 1871 01:31:28,080 --> 01:31:32,600 Speaker 4: won't won't come over shack. They won't come over, you know, 1872 01:31:32,840 --> 01:31:35,040 Speaker 4: they don't want to get posterized. But like the Kimbag, 1873 01:31:35,160 --> 01:31:38,720 Speaker 4: he came every time, every time, and he got got. 1874 01:31:38,800 --> 01:31:43,880 Speaker 3: He got got. You know, no question, no question for sure. 1875 01:31:44,520 --> 01:31:47,920 Speaker 1: Uh five dinners dead or alive? Was that five dinner 1876 01:31:48,000 --> 01:31:50,479 Speaker 1: guests dead or alive? You know what? 1877 01:31:50,600 --> 01:31:52,240 Speaker 3: You know? I was thinking, man, for my for my 1878 01:31:52,360 --> 01:31:55,479 Speaker 3: fiftieth to get five, like. 1879 01:31:57,320 --> 01:32:00,720 Speaker 4: Five rappers that like I grew up and having them 1880 01:32:00,760 --> 01:32:05,320 Speaker 4: over for dinner, like rock Kim Krs One Caine. 1881 01:32:06,720 --> 01:32:08,560 Speaker 1: People don't know you make beats, bro all you that 1882 01:32:08,960 --> 01:32:10,439 Speaker 1: grand is nice on the keys. 1883 01:32:12,000 --> 01:32:16,519 Speaker 4: I used to say about beats that I retired, man, 1884 01:32:16,560 --> 01:32:18,280 Speaker 4: because you know, to me it said I was. She 1885 01:32:18,720 --> 01:32:28,120 Speaker 4: called me quincy bones, called me pissed beats. She was like, 1886 01:32:28,240 --> 01:32:30,360 Speaker 4: you know, because you know, she she's like, where's the melody? 1887 01:32:30,560 --> 01:32:33,840 Speaker 4: Like you know, I'm like, look, look it's not it's 1888 01:32:34,000 --> 01:32:36,800 Speaker 4: R and B is a different you know. But her 1889 01:32:36,880 --> 01:32:39,720 Speaker 4: thing was, you're spending too much time doing it for 1890 01:32:39,880 --> 01:32:42,519 Speaker 4: not getting a check, you know. But I just I 1891 01:32:42,640 --> 01:32:43,080 Speaker 4: love it, man. 1892 01:32:43,120 --> 01:32:43,840 Speaker 1: I love music. 1893 01:32:44,120 --> 01:32:46,280 Speaker 3: And when I listened to a song, I don't listen 1894 01:32:46,320 --> 01:32:46,800 Speaker 3: to the lyrics. 1895 01:32:46,840 --> 01:32:49,880 Speaker 4: I listen to the music. Like what's the drum track, 1896 01:32:49,960 --> 01:32:51,240 Speaker 4: What's what's the bassline doing? 1897 01:32:51,360 --> 01:32:52,360 Speaker 3: What's so? 1898 01:32:52,600 --> 01:32:54,600 Speaker 4: You know I retired from making beats, but you make 1899 01:32:54,640 --> 01:32:58,080 Speaker 4: a beef for Rhapsody, Yeah, Rhapsody dunk. In fact, I 1900 01:32:58,160 --> 01:33:00,439 Speaker 4: went to the studio with nine Wonder back in the 1901 01:33:00,560 --> 01:33:03,720 Speaker 4: day and I was trying to I was trying to 1902 01:33:03,800 --> 01:33:09,880 Speaker 4: chop to Charalam Shalamar climax song, and I was I 1903 01:33:09,920 --> 01:33:11,880 Speaker 4: couldn't get what I wanted, So I put on to me, 1904 01:33:12,400 --> 01:33:15,639 Speaker 4: put on still, and I chopped up the beginning part 1905 01:33:16,000 --> 01:33:17,200 Speaker 4: and put some drums over it. 1906 01:33:17,720 --> 01:33:19,400 Speaker 3: And she heard it. She was in the studio, and 1907 01:33:19,479 --> 01:33:22,320 Speaker 3: she went in and put it on her mixtape before 1908 01:33:22,360 --> 01:33:25,639 Speaker 3: she before she blew up. And so but I always 1909 01:33:25,680 --> 01:33:26,200 Speaker 3: loved music. 1910 01:33:26,360 --> 01:33:28,240 Speaker 1: So you're gonna get five legends to come to your birthday? 1911 01:33:28,680 --> 01:33:29,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, I gotta. 1912 01:33:29,120 --> 01:33:32,640 Speaker 4: I gotta figure out to get five rappers that I 1913 01:33:32,760 --> 01:33:35,360 Speaker 4: grew up that were like and I know those three. 1914 01:33:35,400 --> 01:33:37,200 Speaker 4: I gotta figure the other two. But it'd be fun 1915 01:33:37,240 --> 01:33:39,760 Speaker 4: to bring them in and just just chop it up 1916 01:33:39,800 --> 01:33:40,040 Speaker 4: with them. 1917 01:33:41,520 --> 01:33:49,280 Speaker 2: Trick question, Uh, who would you like to see on 1918 01:33:49,400 --> 01:33:52,400 Speaker 2: All the Smoke? But but who would I like to 1919 01:33:52,439 --> 01:33:56,040 Speaker 2: see on our show? But you have to help us 1920 01:33:56,479 --> 01:33:57,599 Speaker 2: get your answer on the show. 1921 01:33:58,200 --> 01:34:04,040 Speaker 3: Get get that person on the show, Obama, I think 1922 01:34:04,120 --> 01:34:04,679 Speaker 3: that'd be cool. 1923 01:34:05,160 --> 01:34:07,600 Speaker 1: You heard what I said, though, right, you have to 1924 01:34:07,720 --> 01:34:09,639 Speaker 1: help us get that person on the show. 1925 01:34:10,520 --> 01:34:11,400 Speaker 3: Let me take somebody else. 1926 01:34:11,520 --> 01:34:14,680 Speaker 1: Think of somebody else, if anyone could probably get over, 1927 01:34:15,080 --> 01:34:16,240 Speaker 1: probably great to get it. 1928 01:34:17,520 --> 01:34:21,640 Speaker 3: Silver's been on right yet, Adam, Yeah, I think we 1929 01:34:21,680 --> 01:34:22,240 Speaker 3: can get that done. 1930 01:34:22,760 --> 01:34:24,880 Speaker 1: I want to ask him, can I get some of 1931 01:34:24,920 --> 01:34:25,599 Speaker 1: my money back now? 1932 01:34:25,720 --> 01:34:27,519 Speaker 2: He looked at everything that's going on and looked at 1933 01:34:27,560 --> 01:34:30,120 Speaker 2: the brawl, like, do you really think should have took 1934 01:34:30,160 --> 01:34:30,519 Speaker 2: my money? 1935 01:34:30,600 --> 01:34:31,280 Speaker 3: We was at work. 1936 01:34:31,640 --> 01:34:32,839 Speaker 1: I want to ask him that seriously. 1937 01:34:32,920 --> 01:34:35,639 Speaker 4: But Adam always says that I'm repeating what Alan Adam says, 1938 01:34:35,720 --> 01:34:42,679 Speaker 4: but he works for me. He says that, so I'll repeat. 1939 01:34:44,040 --> 01:34:46,200 Speaker 4: We appreciate that, but that'd be nice, that'd be good. 1940 01:34:47,560 --> 01:34:48,479 Speaker 4: I think he would do it too. 1941 01:34:48,760 --> 01:34:52,280 Speaker 2: Got something, bron they'll let you leave empty handed. All 1942 01:34:52,320 --> 01:34:55,680 Speaker 2: the smoke gear from my new line that's dropping, or 1943 01:34:55,760 --> 01:34:58,080 Speaker 2: can they get that? All the smoke dots store if 1944 01:34:58,120 --> 01:35:00,320 Speaker 2: you didn't know, now you know, go grab some. You 1945 01:35:00,400 --> 01:35:01,840 Speaker 2: might not look as good as us in it. 1946 01:35:01,920 --> 01:35:03,040 Speaker 3: But you can you can try. 1947 01:35:03,120 --> 01:35:06,360 Speaker 1: You can try. Well, gee, man, we appreciate you We 1948 01:35:06,439 --> 01:35:08,240 Speaker 1: want to make sure you know how important you were 1949 01:35:08,360 --> 01:35:11,320 Speaker 1: to us man as a as a mentor, as an athlete, 1950 01:35:11,360 --> 01:35:13,120 Speaker 1: the way you live your life off the court as well. 1951 01:35:13,160 --> 01:35:15,920 Speaker 1: I mean, you've just been that dude, and we really 1952 01:35:16,000 --> 01:35:18,559 Speaker 1: feel like you know you're still one of the greatest 1953 01:35:18,600 --> 01:35:21,120 Speaker 1: players of all time, and so we really appreciate your 1954 01:35:21,160 --> 01:35:23,519 Speaker 1: time stopping bib and chasing your ass for three years. 1955 01:35:24,000 --> 01:35:26,240 Speaker 1: You finally got you. Make sure you check out this 1956 01:35:26,360 --> 01:35:28,280 Speaker 1: book out now where and make it the book. 1957 01:35:28,439 --> 01:35:33,960 Speaker 3: Get everywhere Amazon bookstores. It's a good story man game 1958 01:35:34,160 --> 01:35:35,639 Speaker 3: out now. Happy you finally. 1959 01:35:36,120 --> 01:35:38,280 Speaker 4: I appreciate y'all, man, and I admire with y'all are doing. 1960 01:35:38,320 --> 01:35:41,800 Speaker 4: Y'all y'all killing it man, and the feeling is mutual. 1961 01:35:41,960 --> 01:35:43,880 Speaker 3: So when you here, like I. 1962 01:35:43,880 --> 01:35:46,120 Speaker 1: Said, the fact that you got to unload, that's a 1963 01:35:46,160 --> 01:35:48,120 Speaker 1: heavyweight to carry saying. 1964 01:35:48,160 --> 01:35:50,240 Speaker 4: If you read and you guys need to write books 1965 01:35:50,680 --> 01:35:53,479 Speaker 4: at some point when the time is right. Tell y'all 1966 01:35:53,520 --> 01:35:56,160 Speaker 4: got stories complete everybody. 1967 01:35:56,240 --> 01:35:57,439 Speaker 3: You know what I'm saying. I'm telling you. 1968 01:35:57,920 --> 01:36:00,920 Speaker 2: Puzzle pieces together. G thank you man, appreciate sh me. 1969 01:36:01,360 --> 01:36:04,519 Speaker 2: This is how I know it's something some feelings expressed 1970 01:36:04,520 --> 01:36:06,840 Speaker 2: in here. You ain't getting no fresh cut on them 1971 01:36:06,880 --> 01:36:09,559 Speaker 2: on the cover. That was on purpose, trust me, I. 1972 01:36:09,600 --> 01:36:12,160 Speaker 4: Know, I know it was. 1973 01:36:12,600 --> 01:36:18,320 Speaker 3: It was a tension, you know, that symbolism with that. 1974 01:36:18,560 --> 01:36:20,519 Speaker 1: Yes, I can't wait for I'm telling y'a should write 1975 01:36:20,520 --> 01:36:21,599 Speaker 1: a book that's a wrap. 1976 01:36:22,120 --> 01:36:24,599 Speaker 3: See y'all next week. Period, Go get the book.